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This Feminist ‘Equality’ Study Proves Men Right and Feminism Wrong · Honey Badger Radio

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hello everybody, and welcome to Honey Badger Radio. My name
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: is Brian, who with Alison, and this is maintaining frame.
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: This feminist equality study proves men right and feminism wrong. Well,
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: Alson wanted you tell us what we're doing today.
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: Okay, So I've been looking at the study. It's called
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: Harder One and Easier Lost testing the double standard in
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: gender rules in sixty two countries. And what's just to
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: give you guys a really quick overview of what this study.
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: What happened with the study? So feminist's investigated reality, found
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: out that feminist framework like reality doesn't actually support feminist framework,
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  Speaker 2: and then they took the data and they jammed it
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: into their framework, broke the entire thing, and then presented
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: it and said it sort of worked if you don't
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: look at it closely, but we're going to look at
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: it closely. So essentially, the overall finding of this is
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: that around the world people I'll let me just give
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  Speaker 2: the most the strongest finding, people do not like weak men.
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: That is the central finding of this thing. You wouldn't
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: notice that from its publications, the articles on it, or
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: how it frames its result, but its most central and
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  Speaker 2: strongest finding is that people do not like weakness in men.
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  Speaker 2: They don't like vulnerability in men. They don't like men
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: having needs. They just don't like it. Sam, I am
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: not with green eggs, not with ham, They just don't
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: like it. And around the world this is their strongest finding.
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: Of course, what they ended up promoting as the important
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: finding was the thing that they could sort of squint
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: and squeeze and break and shove into their framework, which
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: was there is a small, a smaller, inconsistent difference in
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: how what they term gender equal nations and non gender
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  Speaker 2: equal nations see men in the positive like the like
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: men being courageous, being hardworking, being sacrificial, being strong, being
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: a competitive you know that kind of thing that the
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: positives of being strong. In gender neutral nations, they don't
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: like saying that about men. So in gender neutral nations,
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: gender neutral big quotes, they are still fine with shaming
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  Speaker 2: the hell out of men if they show any kind
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: of weakness. But in the interests of so called gender neutrality,
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  Speaker 2: they no longer want to recognize that holding men to
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: a higher standard of strength actually makes them stronger than women. No, no,
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  Speaker 2: we don't do that anymore. We hold when to the
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  Speaker 2: same standard of strength, but we never recognize that they
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: actually occupy that standard. So that's the difference, that's the difference.
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: And they said, oh, look at that, look at that.
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  Speaker 2: Gender egalitarian or gender equal cultures don't recognize that men
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  Speaker 2: are stronger. Therefore they hrpider more pressure. Somehow male privilege
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: patriarchy backfiring. Our results are entirely accurate. It's not. It
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: really isn't much better than that. But we'll go through
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: all of the steps of how they justify everything that
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: they say and how it is all fundamentally wrong. So again,
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: in summary, feminism investigated reality, found that reality doesn't support
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: feminism's premises, and then they broke the data and shoved
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: it into their framework and said, see, it still is
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: valid except in any other context, with any other scientific
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  Speaker 2: endeavor at this point, at this point, they would be
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  Speaker 2: having to go back to the drawing board and change
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: some fundamental aspects of their premises because this does not
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: support them. But of course that's not the world we're
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: living in. The world we're living in is a is
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  Speaker 2: a softest game where feminists hide their prem their conclusions
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: in their premise, and pride hide their premise in their
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: conclusion so that they feel completely unassailable, and of course
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  Speaker 2: academia keeps supporting them and being so. But we don't run.
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: We don't. We don't run with that crowd. We don't
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: abide by the rules of academia. So let's uh, shall
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: we just get into it or shall I do the things?
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: All right? Yeah, do the things and we'll get into it.
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah. If you want to yell at me because you
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: think I'm stupid, well actually, probably won't do this. If
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: you want to actually give reasonable commentary, you want to
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: have your voice heard, feed the Badger dot com slash
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  Speaker 2: this at the same time. So feed the Badger dot
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• 5:20
  Speaker 2: giving you guys a break. Probably do it in like
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: a Friday or something, and maybe we'll do like a
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: pre pregame fundraiser on Sunday. But whatever. Not ready yet,
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  Speaker 2: don't go there. There's nothing there. So feed the Badger
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: dot com slash just the Tip. I am not pleased
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: with this item. I should probably thank the person who
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: sent it in a little distracted because voidcat is probably
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: sensing my my mild mild uh irritation, and she's decided
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: that she wants to soothe the savage beast or something.
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: I don't know, but anyway, let's let's get started with
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: the abstract, Brian.
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll start the abstract.
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: Uh.
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  Speaker 1: Do you want me to do the voice with it?
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: The high Yeah? Yeah, all right, read the abstract and
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: that we'll start with you.
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  Speaker 3: Yes, I are one and easier loss testing the double
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  Speaker 3: standard and gender rules in sixty two countries.
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: You have to do the tonal affectations too. Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: Precarious manhood theory posits a double standard and gender rules
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  Speaker 3: such as such that prescriptions should and proscriptions should not
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  Speaker 3: are endorsed more strongly for men than for women. Here
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  Speaker 3: repected the hypothesis by asking whether people view agency is
• 6:48
  Speaker 3: more desirable in men than communion is in women, and
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  Speaker 3: we as less desirable in men than dominance is in women.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, So essentially there's saying prescriptive is something you shouldn't do,
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  Speaker 2: prescriptive is something you should do, and they're looking at
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  Speaker 2: the shoulds and shouldn'ts for men and women, and they
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  Speaker 2: they they used to say, oh, gender roles are more
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  Speaker 2: strict towards women, but of course that didn't fit reality.
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  Speaker 2: So feminism then pivoted to, of course, gender roles are
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  Speaker 2: more prescriptive or prescriptive proscriptive when it comes to men.
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  Speaker 2: That is, there's a whole bunch of things that men
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  Speaker 2: shouldn't do. That's because they're trying to maintain their privilege.
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  Speaker 2: They didn't actually say, you know what, if our confabulation
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  Speaker 2: didn't didn't actually predict something in this situation, maybe we
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: should go back and reconsider the essential components of our bullshit. No,
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: they never did that. They they never do it, never don't.
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  Speaker 2: Feminism will never be proven wrong. It will only destroy
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  Speaker 2: its host country and host society. That's the only way
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: you're gonna get It's gonna destroy its host because it
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: will never be proven wrong even though it is wrong.
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: It will never be proven wrong or accepted to be wrong.
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: But anyway, instead of going back and changing their premisses
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  Speaker 2: and saying, maybe something's wrong here, maybe something's rotten in Denmark,
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  Speaker 2: they just went on with their bad selves and cave
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: throughout another epicycle. Right, another feminist epicycle. Oh it's patriarchy backfiring.
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  Speaker 2: And also men. The privilege is so delicious that they
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  Speaker 2: have to constantly be destroying each other to maintain it.
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: That's how they put each other first. That's perfect sign it,
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  Speaker 2: stamp it, throw it into the presses. And they keep
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: doing this because they can't allow their fundamental questions or
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: fundamental premisses to even be questioned or even be framed
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  Speaker 2: as questions. This is the this is the thing that
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  Speaker 2: I've been stumbling over for years. They don't even have
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  Speaker 2: a falsifiable question in relation to feminism, so it's not
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  Speaker 2: even in a position where it's done the first step
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  Speaker 2: of being falsifiable. So, in sentence, this is all a
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  Speaker 2: belief system we've all collectively decided to buy into that
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  Speaker 2: has no actual empirical validity. Oh god, okay continue Brian.
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  Speaker 3: Data from college undergraduates in sixty two countries indicated that
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  Speaker 3: one measures of agency, communion, weakness, and dominance are psychometrically
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  Speaker 3: comparable across countries. Two prescriptions agency for men communion for
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  Speaker 3: women are variable across countries, whereas proscriptions weakness for men
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  Speaker 3: dominance for women appear universal. Three double standards in prescriptions
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  Speaker 3: men's agency as more desirable than women's communion are larger
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  Speaker 3: in countries' lower in gender equality in human development, whereas
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  Speaker 3: double standards in proscriptions men's weakness as less desirable than
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  Speaker 3: women's dominance do not covery with country level factors, and
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  Speaker 3: for these patterns are moderated by participant gender in nuanced
• 10:06
  Speaker 3: ways and I robust to control by individual level gender beliefs.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, this is.
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  Speaker 3: Dissension considers the theoretical and practical significance of these findings
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  Speaker 3: for understanding how young adults as cultural agents of gender
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  Speaker 3: socialization all land to asymmetrically rigid gender roles.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's really a bunch of like this is
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  Speaker 2: such a dense, dense bunch of academic ease. But just
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  Speaker 2: simply they found well, they're trying to massage this into
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: their framework even though it doesn't go, and even in
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: their conclusions they admit it doesn't go. But so they
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: latched on to the one finding that could plausibly continue
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: to support feminism, which is that in less egalitarian, less egalitary.
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  Speaker 2: I'm cringing because this is the idea that this has
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  Speaker 2: anything to do with gender egalitarianism or gender equality is insane.
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  Speaker 2: But in what they're terming gender equal countries, they are
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  Speaker 2: just more reluctant to recognize that if you hold men
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  Speaker 2: to a standard of strength and tell men not to
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  Speaker 2: be weak and you don't hold women to the same standard,
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  Speaker 2: that men are going to end up being stronger, or
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  Speaker 2: even that men inherently lean towards seeing themselves in terms
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  Speaker 2: of agency and strength than women. So you have those
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  Speaker 2: cultures that are willing to admit the consequences of their
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  Speaker 2: own expectations on men, and then you have the cultures
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  Speaker 2: who are in deep denial, deep deep, deep denial, and
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  Speaker 2: insist that even though men be held to a higher
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  Speaker 2: standard of strength and avoiding weakness, we cannot recognize that
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  Speaker 2: they occupy a position of higher strength and lower weakness
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  Speaker 2: than women. So, in other words, they found that the
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  Speaker 2: West is really delusional and it's really delusional along the
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  Speaker 2: lines that we decided to be really delusional about, which
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: was feminism. But they can't say that, so they say, oh, well,
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  Speaker 2: I sort of found that less gender delusional countries have
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  Speaker 2: less gender delusion. I guess therefore the feminist model is correct. Okay,
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  Speaker 2: do you want to start with the I did find out.
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  Speaker 2: Who have to do a shout out to thank you
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: to dough boy for giving me bringing this to my attention,
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: because it was I just was originally going to read
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: it and be like, okay, well that's and then it
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: basically was. Feminism investigates feminism, feminism finds feminism as complete bullshit.
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  Speaker 2: Feminism reports another win for feminism. So thank Yeah, we
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: got to talk about this, all right, keep going, Brian.
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  Speaker 1: All right, So well that was the end of the abstract.
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  Speaker 1: So should I get into yeah, give this this part here,
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  Speaker 1: this first section, we'll discuss that. Okay, all right, here
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  Speaker 1: we go.
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  Speaker 3: Gender theorists have long proposed that the male versus the
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  Speaker 3: female general comprised the seat of relatively rigid rules, and
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  Speaker 3: yet no research tactic assumption directly by comparing the strength
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  Speaker 3: with which persone receivers endorse gender rules for men versus women.
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  Speaker 1: So can I just add right right off the bat,
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: I just want to say to me gobbledygoog well no,
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: just when it would use Okay, first of all, gender
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  Speaker 1: theorists like this is, in my opinion, gender is made up,
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: like the word is a made up word, and they
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: actually literally made up jobs to wrap around those words.
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: So I'm already again like pushing back against this in
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  Speaker 1: my opinion, like the the you know, the milk's gone
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: bad bitches, Like the actual root of the argument rests
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  Speaker 1: on the foundation of this whole paper, rests on the
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  Speaker 1: concept of gender, and I just don't think gender is real.
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: I used to accept that as an idea. Now to me,
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: there's just sex male and female, and within that there's
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: behaviors and there's a range. But we're not gonna call
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: that gender, you know, Like just because a guy says
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: my favorite color is pink, doesn't mean that he's a
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: different gender. Like I'm not going with that. That's that
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: is gobbledygook right off the bat in my opinion. But
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: and then of course there they use this first sentence.
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: Gender theorists have long proposed that the male versus female
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: general comprises a set of relatively rigid rules. That first
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: sentence is like one of the baseline presumptions of feminism,
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: which is unproven. No one makes them rigid, like the
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: roles they were. Let's say, what worked throughout all of history,
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: like that, if there were any behaviors or habits or
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: tendencies or jobs or activities that men and women did
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: that were different. It was probably because they were unique
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: to those people for the most part, like bearing children
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: or you know, men dying basically making themselves expendable. That
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: that's not a gender role and that's not like something
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: that's enforced or socializing the people in my opinion. But anyway, you.
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: Know, it's we got we got some interesting people in
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: the special chat as usual.
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I see that.
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: Missy Elks twenty thirty nine says nothing better than a
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: woman with their own show speaking out against feminism. Did
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: HOWB you give you prom? All right, Well, here's the
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: funny thing. I'm speaking out about feminism and I'm still
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: able to do this stuff. QD. Your entire belief system
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: is nonsense, like you don't need feminine We never needed feminism, right,
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: never needed it. In fact, I remember this is something
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: I've said before on this channel. My mother died of
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: lung cancer two thousand and seven, and she had a
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: whole bunch of feminist professional friends, and at her funeral
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: they said she was a woman who didn't need feminism
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: and no woman does, right, because she was a person
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: who just decided to do what she wanted to do,
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: and she did it, and if people didn't like it,
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: they could lump it.
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: That was the kind of person she was. She didn't
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: need feminism. But if she didn't need feminism, then no
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: woman does. All right, let us continue.
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: Okay, let's see where do we leave off here? All right? Yeah?
• 17:09
  Speaker 3: Here, Using precarious manhood theory as a frame, we text
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: the double standard in gender rules by asking whether people
• 17:17
  Speaker 3: endorse based gender prescriptions and proscriptions, i e. Rules conveying
• 17:23
  Speaker 3: the traits that people of different genders should and should
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: not have more strongly for.
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: Men than women.
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: So again this is I don't know, like there's no
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: objective way to measure this stuff, because it says we
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: test the double standard in gender rules by asking whether
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: people enforse trait based gender prescriptions and proscriptions more strongly
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: for men than women, that the traits of people of
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: different genders should and should not have. Like all you're
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: you're trying to measure is basically somebody's subjective judgment of
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: somebody else. And of course men are more harshly judged.
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: That's what the found, right mm hmmm, yeah, yep, yep,
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: And maybe that's why men are better. I don't know, Like,
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: I know people want to say, well, men shouldn't be
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: getting judged, but I mean like maybe that was like
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: making them more resilient, and maybe us, like pretending like
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: women should never be judged is making them into weak people,
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: like just the weak period.
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that weak people like the person in the in
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: the special chatty. Let's let's feminism be her, be her
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: personality and her intelligence for her, do her thinking and
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: provide her a backbone. Well, I have my own ability
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: to think and I have my own backbone, so I
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: don't need anything to provide it for me. Thank you. Yeah, No,
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: this is this is that's entirely true. We could be
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: looking at something that maybe women should be held to
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: I or standard. Maybe there should be more what is
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: it proscriptive don'ts for women?
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: Maybe that's maybe the fact that around the world women
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: don't get as many prescriptive don'ts. Apparently, according to the study,
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: is the actual problem not that men get too many.
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: That maybe we should just give women more. Maybe that's
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: what we should be doing. But no, that's never entertained,
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: and it's also never entertained that this is actually something.
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: Now I know that you don't want to talk about
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: gender and maybe not look at the burdensomeness of this.
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: But it's never entertained that this might be a unique
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: burden placed on men, and you might want to put
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: that unique burden into your analysis on who is quote
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: unquote oppressed. That's never entertained at all. In fact, this
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: sum this paper is uh the glow from the global
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: gender gaps and the Global Gender Gap Index has a problem.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: And what the problem is is that their main equality
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: metric is defined as indexing the sides of women disadvantage
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: relative to men in economic, education, health, and political arenas.
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: I'm sure they're quietly dropping health right now and also
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: education because women are already superseding men on those factors.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: But the problem is it only records gaps where women
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: are behind. Gaps where men are behind are truncated at
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: parity and do not lower the score. So, in other words,
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: if men are vastly behind women on any of these factors,
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: that's considered parity. And also they don't even look at
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: the factors that men generally predominant and probably predominated since
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: the beginning of when they started this, which is workplace death, suicide,
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: homeless side deaths in war homelessness, among childhood homelessness, will
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: adult homelessness, and around the world men are all have
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: also been found in at least some surveys, men and
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: boys predominate in adverse childhood experiences that is neglect, sexual abuse,
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: physical abuse, and like emotional torture, like high degrees of
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: emotional abuse. Men and boys dominate as victims of all
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: of them as children, So none of that is put
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: into this equation. The Global Gender Gap Index looks at
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: no situation where it knows it will find that men
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: are worse off, and those situations where you know it's
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: more of a toss up, they only look at They
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: only consider it to be inequality if women are worse off.
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: So this is cooking the books, a lot of book
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: cooking in order to get these findings. And then in
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: these cooked books they look at which sex has pressure
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: placed on it to perform its role, right, so they
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: will not look at the negatives of the male role.
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: And then when we look at the pressure placed on
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: men and women to perform their role, they justify that
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: pressure as not, you know, not a pressure, not burdensome,
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: not something that you would put into the column of
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: maybe not oppressed, but maybe sacrifices that men make. Right.
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: The reason why they don't do that is they reframe
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: it as men maintaining their privilege because they have removed.
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: So if you think of men running a race, right,
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: they've removed all of the men who fail, maybe through
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: no fault of their own. Maybe it's because of affirmative
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: action or a society that's decided that it doesn't want
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: to recognize men's unique strengths while insisting they have them,
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: you know, and they've they've washed out, they're homeless, suicides,
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: they end up in violence, crimes, you know, like anything negative.
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: They don't look at that. They only see the men
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: who win the race, and then they divorce course that
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: from all of the effort the men did to win
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: the race, all of the men who failed to win
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: the race and earned themselves death, destruction, social ostracization, homelessness, poverty,
• 23:12
  Speaker 2: and everything else. They ignore all of that. So they
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: ignore the costs of running the race, and they look
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: only at the winter circle and say, hey, that's privilege.
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: So when they look at the pressure to run the
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: race put on men, they only look at the winner's
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: circle and they say, well, the pressure to run this
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: race is to maintain the privileges that men get at
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: the end of it. And then they never consider that
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: maybe the extra competence and status that men get at
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: the end of the race is not a result of
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: some undefinable privilege that men are just anointed by, you know,
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: like the privileged ferry comes to them and wink, you know,
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: with their little wand privilege. Maybe the so called privileges
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: are actually a result of having run the race. So
• 24:05
  Speaker 2: they've actually attained competencies, they've actually attained knowledge through high
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: stakes at these high stakes activities that they're expected to
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: do right, They've actually attained respect from their fellow men
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: because of what they've run. No, we can't, we can't know.
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: It all has to be privileged, it all has to
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: be divorced from the process, and it's it's infuriating, all right.
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: So using this as a measure of gender equality, it
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: guarantees male type disadvantage, shorter healthy lifespans, higher suicide and
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: workplace deaths, conscription, higher sentencings never count as inequality. There
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: never are. They don't even look at those like the
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: gender gap in Global Gender Gap Index never looks at
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: a single index that could possibly show men at a disadvantage,
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: Those are right out from the start. Any remaining male
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: tilted advantage is automatically read as suspect privilege, while male
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: burdens are structurally invisible in their models. So if women
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: ever superseded men economically, that would be considered equality. If
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: they ever superseded men politically, that would be seen as equality.
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: They're already superseding men in health and education. Now we've
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: got equality. So if men are a permanent, grinding, third
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: class group, the global gender gap Index would look at
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: that and say, look at all the fields of equality
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: that we've had, look at the as far as you
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: can see equality, equality, and they would never see the
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: problems that men have. They would never bring that into
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: the equation. So, no matter what how well women, every
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: single woman is treated, that is only ever equality. No
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: matter how better women are treated than men, that is
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: only ever equality. Okay, I have a lot to say
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: about this, It's yeah, sure, all right.
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: Specifically, this pre registered study examines the universality of trade
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: based binary gender prescriptions and proscriptions among college students in
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: sixty two countries, compares the strength of endorsement of these
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: rules for men versus women, and test whether the double
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: standard in gender rules is larger in less gender equal countries.
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I just get I think I covered that. Yeah,
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: keep reading.
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: Precarious Manhood and the double standard and gender rules. Precarious
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: manhood theory states that manhood, relative to womanhood, is widely
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: conceptualized as a social status that it's hard to win,
• 26:59
  Speaker 3: easy to lose, and must be proved repeatedly via action evidence.
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: Some diverse cultures indicate that people around the world recognize
• 27:08
  Speaker 3: the belief that real men are made, not born. In contrast,
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: in many cultural contexts, womanhood it is conceptualized more readily
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: as a biological certainty that need not be earned or
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: proved as regularly as manhood.
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: Okay, so if manhood is something you earn, then manhood
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: isn't a male privilege. Like maybe you could say men
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: are allowed to earn this, I wouldn't actually say men
• 27:38
  Speaker 2: are allowed to earn this. I think that it's more well,
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: it's probably a combination of men are more inclined to
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: this kind of status seeking, high stakes cooperation, and competition.
• 27:51
  Speaker 2: So I mean it's an element of that, but in
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: some places it is quite coercive like the things that
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: we talk about, like conscription and other stuff like that.
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: But if you're saying that men men is something men earn,
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: then you have to contend with the fact that it's
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: not a male privilege, right, it's something men earn. How
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: is that a privilege? It's either earned or it's granted.
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: If it's granted, it can be a privilege, Like it's
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: a privilege to have the social value of being a
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: woman because you just exist as a woman. Right. If
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: that isn't the case for men, then that's how is
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: that a privilege? Maybe maybe you can enlighten me, Brian.
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: I was, I, how is it a privilege that men
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: have to earn manhood while women just get it biologically?
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Why is how women?
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: In a way? Like I said, the only the only potential,
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: I guess, the only potent. I wouldn't even call it
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: a privilege, but the only thing I could just you
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: could possibly argue is that again, because we do treat
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: manhood as something men earn, they get something out of it.
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: Women don't don't, Like they can act like children until
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: they're seventy and we just let them and that's not
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: good for them, Like it's you know, but even then,
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: I wouldn't call that privilege.
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, okay, let's keep going. Maybe maybe let's uh
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: not do the voice.
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: Though, all right, I'll just read it.
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah uh.
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: Let's see. Boys and men presumably learn about the precarity
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: of manhood status via socialization experiences, including pressures to internalize
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: and uphold relatively strict gender rules. Gender rules are injunctive
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: aspects of gender stereotypes. Whereas gender stereotypes describe qualities associated
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: with people of different genders, gender rules indicate traits that
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: people of different genders should and should not display. What
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: do they call them rules? Did we call them roles
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: or they call gender roles for the longest time?
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we're evolving, We're evolving, the convos.
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: The kami language is evolving. Okay.
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: Let's see.
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: Although all culture of socialized children to follow gender rules,
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: precarious manhood theory posits a double standard, such that rules
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: for boys and men are stricter than rules for girls
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: and women. Yes, yeah, this assumption reflects the higher social
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: status that men versus women enjoy in most societies.
• 30:36
  Speaker 2: You see how we just jumped the huge chasm here.
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: So we hold because we hold men to higher standards
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: and stricter roles. They have privilege.
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: Yes, okay, yeah, no, you see, if you're held to
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: a higher standard before you're given social value, you have privilegedes.
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: I mean, you know, you're you're more discardible if you
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: don't attain that standard. But that's a privilege, guys. You know,
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: women just get you know, women they get a glass
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: of water. Just just give a glass of water to
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: a woman for no, you know, just because she's a woman.
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: But men have to run a marathon to get a
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: glass of water. That is a privilege. Guys, that's your
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: privilege that you have to work harder to get the
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: same thing. You see how I'm saying that that feminism
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: investigates reality, It finds reality doesn't resemble its framework, and
• 31:36
  Speaker 2: then it takes its data and just sort of shoves
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: it in and it's like, yeah, it works, it works.
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: It worked, really, it works like a like a very
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: very fat woman squeezing into a bikini. Yeah it works
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: almost sort of if you squint. A lot of flesh
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: being shown here, but but anyway, yeah, to keep going.
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: All right, Although all cultures socialized children to follow gender rules,
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: precarious manhood theory posits a double standard, such that rules
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: for boys and men are stricter than rules for girls
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: and women. Yeah, I already read that part. Sorry, I
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: should market membership. Membership in a higher status gender group
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: grants men more respect, esteem, and social influence. But these
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: advantages come with a cost. The boundaries protecting.
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: These advantages come with the cost we just we just
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: went through. Okay. Men are more likely to be treated
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: as expendable if they don't live up to a standard.
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: But if they live up to a standard, people are like, hey,
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: you know, you overcame the expendability of being a man. Bravo. Bravo.
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: Men you endured the ball kicking machine. Yay. And then
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: they're saying that's a privilege.
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well because they get according to this, yeah, they
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: get more respect, esteem, and social influence circle right.
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, But also they're also looking at their big finding
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: is that so called gender equal cultures don't grant men disrespect. Right,
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: they don't actually recognize that men, uh, you know, they should,
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: they should be recognized as occupying these positions of strength
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: relative to women. Right, those are gender unequal cultures actually
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: recognize that In gender equal quote unquote cultures, men don't
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: get that privilege. They don't get that status. So they
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: just get don't be weak. If you're weak, will kick
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: you to the curb. Unlike your sister her his her
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: weakness is called action to make sure she's taken care of.
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: Your weakness is a call to kick you out, kick
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: you to the curb, and get rid of you like.
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: That's that's what we say in the West. We just
• 34:07
  Speaker 2: don't say. That's because as a man you should be strong,
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: right that that's that's what makes a man a man,
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: and as a as a man, as a man in
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: train and about to become a man, a boy begot
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: to become a man. This is the standard that you
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: are aiming for and you are uniquely capable of attaining
• 34:25
  Speaker 2: because you're a man. They say that in gender unequal
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: societies and gender equal societies is just don't be weak
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: and the and of course gender equal societies are the
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: better societies. And of course men do this. Men maintain
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: this strict uh gender pressure, gender punishment, like gender filter
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: because at the end of the day, they get to
• 35:00
  Speaker 2: be called, be said to be respectable as men. So
• 35:04
  Speaker 2: they maintain this gender filter in order to get the
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: asymmetrical respect as men. You see what I'm saying, That's
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: why they do it. That's why they run all of
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: this hardship is in order to be like, you know, oh,
• 35:18
  Speaker 2: you're the man that this is what this paper is proposing.
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: And yet even though all of the hardship is still
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: in the gender equal countries, but they just don't get
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: that you're the man thing at the end, you get
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: what I'm saying. Yeah, they're saying that. They're saying that
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: the respect is why men do this, not protecting and
• 35:40
  Speaker 2: providing for their families, for just like men.
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: Go to war for glory, not because they're writing for
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: a country or they're conscripted.
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah right, yeah, yeah, yeah, but.
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: Even that's delusional for sure. But even that assumption again,
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: that assumption about men do those things, only looks at
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: the outcomes of the men who are who come back
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: alive and get medals. So like they're looking at those
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: men and they're saying, oh, that's what like not the
• 36:13
  Speaker 1: dead men, the ones that never come home, but like
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: the few who do and are decorated for it, and
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: you know, have PTSD and like whatever else, and and
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: but that's not we're not gonna talk about that, right,
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: So even then they're looking at like, you know, it's
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: the apex foulacy. They're looking at the guys at the top,
• 36:33
  Speaker 1: and they're not They're ignoring their problems, whatever those might be.
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: They're ignoring how hard it was to get there. They're
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: ignoring whatever struggles, whatever injuries or failings they had, whatever
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: they're going through, whatever they're you know, whatever that is,
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: because they want to make the case that they're getting respect. Like, yes,
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: if you went to Vietnam and you watch your friends
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: like get killed, you know, and you come back and
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: you got shit on by protesters that hated the war
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: and and everybody come after you, but you still wore
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: your veteran hat or whatever, and then people would like
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: give you, you know, accolades for what it is, which
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: isn't really much when you think about it. Oh, you
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: get to park a little bit closer to the restaurant,
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: You get like, you know, free meals at certain places,
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: and people will tell you, but.
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: What that their their proposal is that's why men went
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: to Vietnam.
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they went to Vietnam for that, right exactly, ye spots.
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And they also don't recognize that maybe running this
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: gauntlet of greater steaks, basically, greater pitfalls and greater expectations
• 37:46
  Speaker 2: is the reason why men get the respect, right, Like
• 37:51
  Speaker 2: they've told like that the mentality that they're bringing to
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: this is bizarre because they think that simultaneously men have
• 38:02
  Speaker 2: this massively difficult race in order to get the respect
• 38:07
  Speaker 2: at the end, and that's the only reason why they
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: do it. And they think that they're enforcing the difficulty
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: of the race for the respect at the end, right,
• 38:18
  Speaker 2: And they're doing all of this for no reason except
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: I guess, to give each other back pats at the end,
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: butt pats at the end. And it's like this is
• 38:29
  Speaker 2: so divorced from reality, like feminist conjecture is so divorced
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: from reality. In trying to understand why men do this,
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: it's actually sort of hilarious. We construct this gigantic obstacle
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: course before men will get basic human respect or even
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: respect for their skills and covering the obstacleurse. And we
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: did it completely arbitrarily. We just did it so women
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: couldn't do it to exclude from it. It's completely arbitrary
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: when we just did it because we wanted at the
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: end to be able to pat each other on the
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: back for running the obstacle course. That's what we do
• 39:09
  Speaker 2: as men. We have absolutely no interest in making sure
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: men are capable of protecting and providing for the women
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: and children in their lives. We just have this arbitrary
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: obstacle course that only exists so we can pin little
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: stars on each other and say, hey, you're a man,
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: you ran through the obstacle course.
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: So fucking stupid, this entire framework, it's so up its
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: own ass. Okay, all right, next part.
• 39:41
  Speaker 1: So, but these advantages come with the cost. The boundaries
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: protecting group membership are policed more heavily for high status
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: than low status groups. In this sense, manhood relative to
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: womanhood is harder, one easier lost.
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: Okay, So the boundaries protecting group memberships are least more
• 40:00
  Speaker 2: heavily for high status than low status groups. They're also
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: policed more heavily for groups that are expected to sacrifice
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: for nothing, like the boundaries for like slave classes are
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: policed much more heavily, like the the the the movements
• 40:20
  Speaker 2: of slaves. The identities of slaves are policed much more
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: heavily than that of slave owners, like this is this
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: is this is a very It's like, oh, we're looking
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: at this thing that sort of resembles this other thing.
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: Therefore it they're identical. See what I'm saying, Yeah, like
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: harder one and the other thing is that high status
• 40:41
  Speaker 2: and low status groups. Right. If manhood is harder one, okay,
• 40:48
  Speaker 2: so one, it's high status an easier lost lower status
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: than women. So if you don't win the status as
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: a man, you don't end up in the status of
• 40:58
  Speaker 2: a woman. You end up in the status of failed man,
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: which is a man who is not deserving of not
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: only respect, but also any kind of the support and
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: resources of society. So you end up being in a
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: much lower status than women. Right. So, by their own definition,
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: man as a category incorporates both high status winners and
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: low status losers, lower than women status losers by what
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: they're saying right here, And then they're saying that the
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: category man is policed more harshly because it's higher status
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: than the category women. But they're ignoring the fact that
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: usually that's between categories. So what I mean is, say
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: you got the sumptuary laws for royals, right, and what
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: that is is, well, there's a lot more than sumptuary laws.
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: There's also the prohibitions against owning weapons. So royal families
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: and aristocratic families could wear certain colors, they could wear
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: a certain factors that were more expensive and elaborate and beautiful,
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: and they could have weapons, right, and the peasants weren't
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: allowed to have those things. So those were genuine ways
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: of policing the aristocratic identity and making it exclusive to
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: them and excluding peasants. But that's between two groups, right, Okay,
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: So what they're doing here is they're saying that men
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: police their identity more, right, because do you have the
• 42:32
  Speaker 2: high status men policing that high status identity and saying
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: low status men aren't allowed to have it, even though
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: it's actually a race that all men win or all
• 42:42
  Speaker 2: men run and some men win. But that's not what's
• 42:46
  Speaker 2: happening with the peasant versus the aristocratic. The aristocrat is
• 42:50
  Speaker 2: preventing the peasant from having access to the identity. In
• 42:55
  Speaker 2: the direct parallel that they're making, or they're trying to make,
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: it would be men policing women to prevent them from
• 43:03
  Speaker 2: having access to the male identity. And that's not what
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: they're found. They found that the policing on women is
• 43:12
  Speaker 2: less and men don't police women in fact, women are
• 43:17
  Speaker 2: the only ones who really even police women at all
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: a little bit, at least in terms of the expectation
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: that women be warm and communal. Right, yes, it's like,
• 43:27
  Speaker 2: but men aren't policing women at all, really anywhere. So
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: the analogy that they're using, the aristocrat versus peasant policing
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: of identity doesn't imply here. But they're trying to make
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: it apply inside the identity of men. Right, so, because
• 43:47
  Speaker 2: men police the identity of man, you have to be
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: useful in order to be a man. They're saying that
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: it is the aristocratic identity. It's identical because aristocrats police
• 43:58
  Speaker 2: their identity against peasants, but ben don't police their identity
• 44:01
  Speaker 2: against women. This is this is so there's no actual
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: thing they're making. They're trying to make a comparison here
• 44:08
  Speaker 2: that doesn't exist, and they're trying to make it. It's
• 44:12
  Speaker 2: a legal term. They're trying to make parts become a whole.
• 44:19
  Speaker 2: They're trying to say, oh, well, aristocratic identities are police harder.
• 44:24
  Speaker 2: Male identities are policed harder. Therefore their high status identities
• 44:28
  Speaker 2: relatives to women. But the aristocratic policing isn't necessarily within
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: at least, it's not as powerfully within it's between the
• 44:36
  Speaker 2: two classes. And this is fundamentally flawed. Hopefully I explained
• 44:43
  Speaker 2: it in a way that people understand. But this is
• 44:46
  Speaker 2: like sophistry right here, and it isn't completely false, Like
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: you can't make these equivalences. You are trying to make
• 44:54
  Speaker 2: take parts of things and make a whole. All right,
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: let's keep going.
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: All right. Assiduous policing of group boundaries in turn, functions
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: to protect men's privileged status and justify their advantage social position.
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: So it functions to protect men's privileged status and justify
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: their advantage social position. So men use this to keep
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: other men out of I said, the limelight, or could
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: create hierarchies with some men at the top and other
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: men beneath them. And that's not something that's earned according
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: to this, this is just something that is used by
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: privilege to justify and advantage social position. So well, I
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: don't know, I don't think men have a problem with
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: hierarchies that are fair and just and based in meritocracy.
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: So if a man knows another man is a better
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: suited to something, he's most likely to be like, Okay, well,
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: you know that's okay, right, They compete as a means
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: to test the weaknesses. Like, if there is like an
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: opportunity to make a system stronger by putting a better
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: qualified person there, they will compete in that in those areas.
• 46:18
  Speaker 1: But if they're like, you know, psychologically healthy men that
• 46:22
  Speaker 1: are not anti social and want to like be a
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: part of some project with other men, they're generally going
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: to like realize, you know, they're going to know their
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: role as it were, right, Yeah. So, but these people
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: who don't see they see hierarchies as just bad, flat
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: out That's why they're criticizing this. They're saying, oh, these
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: men are you know, you're as deserving as any other
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: person to be in this position. But of course women
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: are even more deserving to be in these positions.
• 46:49
  Speaker 2: And or maybe they're flat out saying that the male
• 46:53
  Speaker 2: obstacle course is designed to exclude women and men who
• 46:57
  Speaker 2: don't live up. Of course, I don't know. It doesn't
• 47:01
  Speaker 2: make any sense assiduous policing of group boundaries and turn
• 47:04
  Speaker 2: functions to protect men's privileged status. Yes, they're trying to
• 47:07
  Speaker 2: say men are aristocrats, but the problem is that men
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: aren't actually policing the boundaries of in the way that
• 47:15
  Speaker 2: aristocrats policed it against peasants. Like really, they aren't, Like
• 47:21
  Speaker 2: men aren't complaining about trans women or transmen. You notice
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: that men aren't complaining about transmen. No, No, it's women
• 47:29
  Speaker 2: who are complaining about trans women because they are policing
• 47:32
  Speaker 2: their boundaries. So right there, men are not policing the
• 47:37
  Speaker 2: boundaries against women. In fact, what the hell are gender
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: equal countries. If men really police the boundaries against women
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: to any degree, feminism would never have occurred to the
• 47:47
  Speaker 2: level that it did, right, So they don't. Men just
• 47:51
  Speaker 2: don't act like in aristocratic class experiencing an incursion from
• 47:57
  Speaker 2: a peasant class. They just don't. If anything, they're happy
• 48:02
  Speaker 2: to share their space with women who aren't obnoxious and
• 48:05
  Speaker 2: trying to take it over and turn it into something else.
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: It isn't right. So this is not There is no
• 48:12
  Speaker 2: actual and even the results in this find that men
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: don't police the boundaries for women. They don't. So even
• 48:21
  Speaker 2: what they found here doesn't support what they're saying, and
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: yet they're trying to make it support it. Because men
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: police boundaries intersectionally, that means that men police or they
• 48:33
  Speaker 2: police expectations on other men. So they're trying to make
• 48:37
  Speaker 2: men policing other men evidence that men are oppressing women.
• 48:45
  Speaker 2: And it doesn't work because men police other men in
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: order to make sure that those men are capable of
• 48:53
  Speaker 2: protecting and providing for their women and other vulnerable members
• 48:56
  Speaker 2: of the community. That's why they do it. Of course,
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: they won't acknowledge it in this paper, so they have
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: all of this incoherent like sophistry that they're doing. They're
• 49:06
  Speaker 2: trying to make parts be a whole as they are here,
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: and it's and it's ridiculous. They're trying to say that
• 49:14
  Speaker 2: men's identity is contingent, but it's also male privilege, even
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: though it's not conferred simply because you're a man. You
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: have to earn it. But earning it doesn't actually create it.
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: That's the other thing. There's no concept that earning going
• 49:29
  Speaker 2: through the obstacle course makes men better able to go
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: through obstacle courses, because isn't just like you just go
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: through this arduous obstacle course and they're at the end saying, well,
• 49:40
  Speaker 2: the reason why you went through that, it's just because
• 49:42
  Speaker 2: your male privileged. No, they just went through an obstacle course.
• 49:46
  Speaker 2: They went through a genuine adverse experience and figured out
• 49:50
  Speaker 2: how to do it and overcome their own you know
• 49:53
  Speaker 2: whatever might stop a person from being able to do it.
• 49:56
  Speaker 2: Like so there's no there's no of any kind of
• 50:01
  Speaker 2: reality that this might Men might be doing this because
• 50:06
  Speaker 2: of reality, not just because they want to pin stars
• 50:11
  Speaker 2: on each other, but only only sometimes Like yeah.
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: Well even then, like a lot most guys know that
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: that's not even like a good reason. They reject the
• 50:26
  Speaker 1: idea of making themselves exposable for the you know, hope
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: that maybe they'll get like you know, their gravestone will
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: have like a start marking on it or something that
• 50:36
  Speaker 1: shows that they serve their country or whatever. Like there's
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: a recognition and it's like a complete Like these people's
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: perception is completely divorced from that reality. Yes, and none
• 50:47
  Speaker 1: of this happens without risk, and that on average men
• 50:51
  Speaker 1: know the risk. I don't know that, you know, there
• 50:52
  Speaker 1: are guys just like, yeah, I'm gonna go kill one
• 50:54
  Speaker 1: hundred guys and come back with like a killed kill
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: death ratio of whatever, like going to get my call
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: of duty score. Like they don't, they don't think like that,
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: but these people do. Like you've never had like to
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: do make these difficult kinds of choices or being.
• 51:11
  Speaker 2: Asked to do anything like this. I probably haven't even
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: asked to have a job, but like a real job
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: where it's uh, it impacts your health, but like this
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: is it's just something came up when you were thinking
• 51:28
  Speaker 2: you were talking about this. The more a man has
• 51:31
  Speaker 2: to sacrifice in the service of whatever aim it is,
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: the less, in my experience, less likely he's going to
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: really appreciate a star, because usually that means that he's
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: had to watch other men make the ultimate sacrifice, like
• 51:47
  Speaker 2: the people. The men who seem to be most resistant
• 51:51
  Speaker 2: to being awarded are soldiers because it reminds them of
• 51:58
  Speaker 2: all the men who failed to come back or you
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: know that this is what I'm taking from their own
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: testimony or survivor's guilt, or they don't feel like they're
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: worthy of it, and yet they've made the most sacrifices
• 52:12
  Speaker 2: and they've seen men make the most sacrifices, and they
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: tend to be the ones that are least likely to
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: really want to get a gold star, like so this
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: did this? Do they people ever actually like, you know,
• 52:25
  Speaker 2: they occupy the same space as men, But do they
• 52:28
  Speaker 2: ever actually talk to them, like, all right, let's let's
• 52:35
  Speaker 2: try to get through this.
• 52:37
  Speaker 1: All right, let's see. Oh shit, I lost my place
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: here you were, I moved up ahead. That's I moved ahead.
• 52:49
  Speaker 1: That's why. Yeah, okay, so.
• 52:55
  Speaker 2: I think you're at noted at Ye.
• 52:59
  Speaker 1: People in the world recognize a notion that manhood is
• 53:02
  Speaker 1: a relatively precarious social status. Illustrating this a four item
• 53:05
  Speaker 1: scale of precarious manhood beliefs. Other people often question whether
• 53:09
  Speaker 1: a man is a real man. It is fairly easy
• 53:11
  Speaker 1: for a man to lose his status as a man
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: displayed adequate psychometric isomorphism, indicating that scores collected at the
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: individual level reflect a meaningful country level attribute. And yet
• 53:23
  Speaker 1: no studies have examined whether people also endorse trait based
• 53:26
  Speaker 1: gender rules more strongly for men than women. However, some
• 53:30
  Speaker 1: findings from predominantly Western cultures offer indirect evidence of a
• 53:34
  Speaker 1: double centered in broadly defined gender rules. For instance, boys
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: report being feeling more external pressure to exhibit gender typical
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: behaviors and to avoid gender atypical behaviors than girls.
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: Do women most depressed?
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, women free to live, However, they want women most
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: affected moreover, boys compared to Girls who flout gender rules
• 53:58
  Speaker 1: encounter more rejection, bullying, and negative evaluations from peers and adults,
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: and more censure and punishment from parents. In adolescents, gender
• 54:09
  Speaker 1: nonconformity is more strongly associated with peer victimization among young
• 54:14
  Speaker 1: men than women. These findings indicate that boys and men
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: versus girls and women face harsher sanctions for violating general rules,
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: but they do not demonstrate that perceivers themselves necessarily endorse
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: this double standard. After all, it is possible that boys
• 54:30
  Speaker 1: and men who violate gener rules face relatively harsh sanctions
• 54:34
  Speaker 1: because their rule violations are particularly transgressive or disruptive, and
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: not because perceivers and other socializing agents desire or expect
• 54:43
  Speaker 1: more rigid gender rule adherence from them.
• 54:46
  Speaker 2: Okay, nowhere is there a sense that the men's gender
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: role is probably a non negotiable because if you can't
• 54:59
  Speaker 2: defend your space where you're trying to construct all of
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: the woke utopia you could possibly eat, you can't defend it,
• 55:11
  Speaker 2: you don't have it, and i'm you know, just based
• 55:15
  Speaker 2: on evolutionary factors, men are much more prone to occupy
• 55:20
  Speaker 2: positions of defense and much more capable, so there's no
• 55:25
  Speaker 2: sense that that maybe that men's gender role is policed
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: because if men leave their gender role, bad things happen. Yes,
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: I mean if women leave their gender role, bad things
• 55:36
  Speaker 2: also happen. But they seem, yeah, they seem to be
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: so divorced, you know, like you let women leave the
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: gender role and it doesn't immediately cause a complete collapse,
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: so you're like, oh, okay, we're okay, and then three
• 55:50
  Speaker 2: generations later you're all drinking out of puddles and living
• 55:55
  Speaker 2: in yurts again. But that's the you know, so it's
• 55:59
  Speaker 2: a little bit forced from its cause. And uh so,
• 56:03
  Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, both may be the case. But if
• 56:06
  Speaker 2: men leave their gender role tomorrow, we won't have heating lighting,
• 56:14
  Speaker 2: we won't have electricity, we won't have sewers, you know,
• 56:19
  Speaker 2: we won't have gas delivery, we won't have a society.
• 56:27
  Speaker 2: All right, So men's need to continue to occupy that role,
• 56:30
  Speaker 2: need to be expected not to be weak, or our
• 56:35
  Speaker 2: society fails to continue to work. And the difference between
• 56:40
  Speaker 2: our society is that, I guess we're prosperous enough that
• 56:43
  Speaker 2: we can pretend like we can still hold men to
• 56:47
  Speaker 2: those standards because we still need them. Please don't bite me,
• 56:49
  Speaker 2: please stop, please stop, ow out, please let go out. Okay,
• 56:55
  Speaker 2: I'm being attacked. I'm being attacked. I just have to
• 56:59
  Speaker 2: go lamp. Okay, so I will try to continue my
• 57:05
  Speaker 2: thought while I'm being being attacked by my cat. Okay,
• 57:08
  Speaker 2: she ceased, all right. So if men don't continue their
• 57:13
  Speaker 2: standard like men don't continue, then everybody's totally screwed. Yes,
• 57:20
  Speaker 2: and maybe that's why they're policed more. Okay, let's keep going.
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: Uh yeah, so let me just see if anyway in
• 57:31
  Speaker 1: the chat. By the way, shout out to the chat.
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: Night Motorcyclist, Tree Surgeon, Jim Bottle, Missy licks or ILKs how,
• 57:41
  Speaker 1: Tony Palmer, Selectrovert. That's a funny name. Night Motorcyclist, Serene Soul.
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: Let's see who else, Fracus Maximus, Jim Bottle. I think
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: I already read yours, but whatever. Not related to Bacon,
• 57:59
  Speaker 1: Not Kevin Bacon. We're all related to Kevin Bacon, Tony Palmer,
• 58:04
  Speaker 1: Murder of Crows, Frank Blaskowitz, Last Independent Thinker, Mahaboo, mab
• 58:11
  Speaker 1: mob book Ma Bob Nor. Okay, hello to all of y'all,
• 58:16
  Speaker 1: thank you for joining us.
• 58:17
  Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, get those super challenging.
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I get the super chest contribute to the conversation,
• 58:24
  Speaker 1: yell at us if you want to. I guess I
• 58:27
  Speaker 1: get Missy Lcks left.
• 58:30
  Speaker 2: Ye, so craziness much for her?
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, she wasn't. Well, it's a little it's you know,
• 58:39
  Speaker 1: you're disrupting your worldview. She did say something about like
• 58:42
  Speaker 1: you should think feminism about the nineteen twenties. But that's
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: we're not going to go down the rabbit hole. How
• 58:46
  Speaker 1: about just how about new how about that?
• 58:49
  Speaker 2: Yes, so yeah, we're not doing okay, Yeah, let's let's
• 58:55
  Speaker 2: keep going. I think it's more germane. Yeah, you got it, You.
• 58:58
  Speaker 1: Got it all right, yourmine to the current investigation. One
• 59:02
  Speaker 1: set of studies examined the number and strength of male
• 59:04
  Speaker 1: and female prescriptive and proscriptive gender rules across different age
• 59:08
  Speaker 1: groups and found that gender rules for men were generally
• 59:11
  Speaker 1: more restrictive than gender rules for women. While these findings
• 59:15
  Speaker 1: are consistent with the assumption of a double standard in
• 59:17
  Speaker 1: gender rules, the study lacked a direct comparison of the
• 59:20
  Speaker 1: strength with which receivers endorsed gener rules for men versus women. Moreover,
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: the samples were limited to US respondents, thereby limiting the generalizability.
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: The generalizability is a big one of the findings. Okay, um, yeah,
• 59:39
  Speaker 1: so well, I don't know. I don't like the wording.
• 59:43
  Speaker 1: I don't know that gender rules are like bad necessarily.
• 59:48
  Speaker 1: I don't think that they're a thing either, though. I
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: don't think that there's a man book out there or
• 59:53
  Speaker 1: a woman book. I think people, when you allow them
• 59:57
  Speaker 1: the freedom to behave however they want, are going to
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: generally fall into certain patterns that can be observed in nature,
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 1: whether they are humans or animals. So I'm sorry, but
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 1: to call it gender roles, we have to shatter them
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 1: that that all operates under this I guess this idea
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 1: that all things are socialized and taught and then therefore
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 1: can be unlearned. And I.
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 2: Why, yeah, well, I mean, ultimately, I think you're getting
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 2: a little sucked into the bullshit. The truth is that
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 2: this doesn't change anything. We're just giving things to women, yeah,
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 2: like we always have, and we're giving things to women
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 2: at the expense of men like we always have. There's
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: no change here, except now we're teaching men an extremely
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 2: toxic way of viewing themselves that's destroying them and also
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 2: our society. Ultimately, because we have less healthy men to
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: rely on to actually do things that men need to do.
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 2: All right, let's let's keep going.
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 1: Contents of gender prescriptions and proscriptions. The current study fills
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 1: a gap in our knowledge by directly comparing the strength
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 1: with which college age educated perceivers in sixty two countries
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 1: endorse trait based gender prescriptions agency for men versus communion
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 1: for women, and proscriptions weakness for men versus dominance for women.
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 1: Note that gender prescriptions and proscriptions are not mirror images,
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 1: but instead reflect distinct dimensions of evaluation. Prescriptions i e.
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: Agency and communion reflect two broad dimensions underlying many social evaluations.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 1: Whereas agency includes trades signifying independence and mastery, communion includes
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 1: trades signifying connectedness and warmth. Mapping these dimensions onto binary gender,
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 1: men are prescribed agentic qualities such as leadership, ambition, and competitiveness,
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 1: and women are prescribed communal qualities such as helpfulness, nurturance,
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 1: and sensitivity to others.
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 2: How come women never really show those qualities?
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well, this whole thing, there's like a bunch of
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 1: bullshit baked into these, into these Uh, I guess you
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 1: could say these creating.
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 2: Maybe they do in a sort of a shallow sense.
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 1: I think that. I think it's it's possible, but I
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 1: don't think it's encouraged in women. Like like at my church,
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 1: I see it, like I see the women there, they
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 1: like they plan meals together, they bring food, they look
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 1: out for you. You know, they're like scheduling each other's
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 1: baby showers and like weddings and they're helping out and
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 1: there's a lot of that. There's a lot of that
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 1: they look out for each other, that whatever. But I
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 1: don't think that that's modern women are like that. No,
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 1: I don't think they're incuraged. I think actually when they
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 1: talk about it's basically just like operating in the space
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 1: of the social Okay, so obviously men do that too,
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: but women it's where they excel. It's like why I say,
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 1: you know, social media's call of duty for women because
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 1: it can become like a battlefield. And I think that
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: often is because I think it's the way that women
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 1: are there. There is no encouragement to be all these
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 1: good qualities that they talk about, like connected and warm
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 1: to other people in their community. So instead they're just
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 1: like hostile and competitive and they they try to you know, uh,
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 1: engage in mate suppression and mate suppressive behavior on other
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 1: women online. And so I think it's just what gets
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 1: encouraged and what is promoted, and also what's rewarded, So
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 1: they act on what rewards them, and I think that
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 1: that does Did you hear about this thing that happened
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 1: on Groc Allison, This is this viral trend on Grock.
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 1: Do you know about this? You know at the yeah,
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 1: the bikini trend? So like on X. I don't know
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: how it started, but a woman posted her, you know,
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 1: like a picture of herself at like a outdoor gathering
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 1: and she was wearing like a low cut shirt and somebody,
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 1: we don't know if it was male or female, but
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 1: somebody basically replied and said, Groc, can you put her
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 1: in a bikini? And Grock put her in a bikini
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 1: and she got all up in arms. She was like,
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 1: how is this legal? Somebody she had to do something about.
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 1: Of course, it's an AI image. I mean it's Grock,
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 1: so it's a pretty solid it looks just like her,
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 1: but it's just like a different body, and she's like
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 1: losing her mind, right, And of course because of that,
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 1: a bunch of feminists came out and they were all
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 1: talking about how something needs to be done, we need
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 1: systemic change, this is rape culture, all these other things.
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 1: And I noticed because I would go on x every
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 1: so often, and what I noticed was really interesting is
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 1: that a slew of women were all posting their images
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 1: and they were saying, groc I hope nobody puts a
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 1: bikini on this one, you know, and it's like a
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 1: picture of herself with like her legs spread or her
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 1: like ass out, and of course, you know, because it's
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 1: the Internet, people were like responding and they were doing that,
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 1: and some of it was humorous. They weren't all just
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 1: doing bikinis. Some of them were like, let you know,
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 1: make her to Shrek or on her and they would
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 1: and of course Rock would oblige almost anything. But what
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 1: I noticed was is that when the women were going
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 1: on there and doing it, then other women would go
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 1: into their comments and reply to them, and they would engage.
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 1: They would like, you know, tear them down. They were like, well,
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: you have my picture is gonna look better than your picture,
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 1: like and they would go it was like the stepsisters
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: from Cinderella. And I just watched this. I thought it
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 1: was really fascinating because you know there obviously there were
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: some men in there like having fun, and there was
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 1: a lot of trolling going on, but it was like
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: the way it got kind of serious was when other
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 1: women were getting AI generated bikinis to respond to women
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 1: who had AI generated bikinis. So it's like this big
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 1: thing going on. Groc put Groc in a bikini. You
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 1: should look that up. It's funny. It's funny. There's a
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 1: lot of it out there if the internet's full of
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 1: and of course there's like you know, most of the
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 1: conversation is just women saying. There's women that are for
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 1: it because they're using it to sell their OnlyFans or
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 1: like promote their profile or get views on their on
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 1: their posts or send people to their Instagram whatever. Right,
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 1: and then there are women who are just like trying
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 1: to get everything censored and they're you know, totally against it.
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 1: And then you have like some thirsty dudes that are
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 1: having fun, and you got trolls that are like turning
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 1: putting women in burkas. I remember one one chick I
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 1: thought it was really funny. She I think she was
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 1: like an OnlyFans girl or whatever, but she like put
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 1: some pictures of herself out there, and you know, was
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 1: basically getting people to put her in bikinis and like
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: scotch tape and stuff. But then one guy said, can
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 1: you put this girl put some clothes on her and
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 1: put her with a father, and then it's a picture
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 1: with them with like a dad. Other that was great.
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 1: But anyway, yeah, I said that because like this this
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 1: whole thing about like what they're what they're calling, Uh,
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 1: they're sort of like already framing it like in a
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 1: way that I think is you know, like kind of
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 1: like showing their bias right where they're basically like, here
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 1: are some qualities that women have that are positive. Here
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 1: are some qualities that men have that are expected, So
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 1: they could they they because like women's warmth and communion
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 1: and their helpfulness and nurturance are probably like they wouldn't
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 1: see those as bad traits, but they would see agency
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 1: and independence and competitiveness as bad because the thing is
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 1: that in a in a positive environment, men are more
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 1: likely to be cooperative than competitive because they're building something together.
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 1: But this is the way they're freemaking. I don't know
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 1: if you guys see what I'm saying, but it's it's
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 1: already it's already framed poorly. So everything that comes after
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 1: the base assumptions I think are are gonna well, they're
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 1: gonna affect the results, probably in a way that these
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 1: people want, which is why they're doing so.
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 2: Okay, So let's go to the next paragramic contrast.
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 1: Prescriptions of weakness for men and dominance for women map
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: onto a third dimension called potency or dominance that is
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 1: distinct from agency and communion. Potency includes traits such as
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 1: strength versus weakness and heavy handedness versus gentleness, that convey
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 1: how much control and influence a person can exert. Although
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 1: excuse me, although potency correlates positively with agency and negatively
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 1: with communion, it captures a specific subset of traits with relevance.
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 1: For gender prescriptions, men are proscribed low potency traits such
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 1: as weakness and naivete, and women are proscribed high potency
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 1: traits such as dominance and arrogance. According to the status
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 1: incongruity hypothesis, this is because potency traits directly implicate status. Thus,
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 1: men ought not display weakness and women ought not display
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 1: dominance because such traits are incongruous with men's and women's
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 1: placement within the gender hierarchy. So the theory is what
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 1: they're assuming is is that women who behave dominant are
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 1: seen negatively because they are basically not operating within the
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 1: gender hierarchy, which is that women are beneath men according
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 1: to these people, and that when men act weak, then
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 1: they are also not operating in their correct position they
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 1: should be dominant over women. So they're not saying this
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 1: as an ought though. They're saying this as you know.
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 1: This is like they're they're trying to, I think, frame
• 1:10:08
  Speaker 1: the thing they're criticizing. So they yeah, you know what
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 1: I'm saying.
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, let's let's finish this off because I want to
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 2: get to the discussion, all right, little bit.
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, here, we apply a precarious manhood lens to the
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 1: literature on based trait based gender prescriptions and proscriptions by
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 1: testing whether people endorse a double standard in gender rules.
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 1: We expect people to report that agency is more desirable
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 1: for men than community is for women, and that weakness
• 1:10:38
  Speaker 1: is less desirable for men than dominance is for women.
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 2: Okay, let's go to the discussion. Do the scrolling music
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 2: doo look at all of this. Okay, Okay, all right,
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 2: look at all of that right here there. We discussion, Yeah,
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 2: all right.
• 1:11:03
  Speaker 1: We sought evidence of a double standard and trait based
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 1: gender rules stronger endorsement of prescriptive and proscriptive rules for
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 1: men and women among college undergraduates in sixty two countries,
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 1: and tested whether this double standard is larger and less
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 1: gender equal countries. Findings generally supported the hypotheses, with some exceptions. Focusing. Okay,
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 1: I just.
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 2: Want to point out again, when you have an aristocratic
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 2: versus like and I'm using that as an example of
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 2: a high status versus low status, the high status polices
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 2: the norms that single signal high status. The low status
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 2: might want to adopt those norms, but doesn't. They're trying
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 2: to propose that men occupy the position of aristocracy, policing
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 2: their high status from But in order for that analogy
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 2: to hold, they would have to be policing women, not men.
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 2: Like aristocrats. They may backbite, but they don't stop other
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 2: aristocrats from wearing aristocratic colors and aristocratic jewelry, and having
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 2: aristocratic weapons, and going to aristocratic events and marrying other aristocrats.
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 2: You see what I'm saying. They don't stop aristocrats from
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 2: doing those things. In fact, they encourage it because they're
• 1:12:23
  Speaker 2: part of a class and those are the class markers
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 2: of their status. So they would encourage other aristocrats to
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 2: engage in the class markers of being an aristocrat, but
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 2: they would discourage peasants from doing so. Right, they're trying
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 2: to say that men are an aristocratic class. They're a
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 2: high status class that is discouraging like that is policing
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 2: its class, like it's class markers, right, But they're not
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 2: policing the class. They're not saying women can't have these
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 2: class markers at all. Right, they're not. So they're not
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 2: actually doing what aristocrats do when they police their high
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 2: status class markers. They're in fact policing other aristocrats from
• 1:13:17
  Speaker 2: being seen as aristocratic. That makes sense, So it's incoherent
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 2: they did throughout history. Aristocrats may have policed the boundaries
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 2: of aristocrat. But if you were an aristocrat, if you
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 2: were part and you were recognized as part of that group,
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 2: you were expected and you were encouraged, and you weren't
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 2: prevented from showing the markers of your group. Right, you
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 2: weren't prevented from showing the status of your group. You
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 2: prevented peasants from doing that. So they're trying to pretend
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 2: that that model holds for men and women. And they're
• 1:13:56
  Speaker 2: trying to they're doing a little slight of hand, you know,
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 2: like uh, the cups they're hiding, you know, they're like, oh,
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 2: you didn't see that, did you. They're trying to pretend
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 2: that men policing each other is the same as aristocratics
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 2: policing peasants, and it doesn't work because they are not. Okay,
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 2: all right, let's keep going.
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 1: Okay. Focusing first on gender prescriptions, college students overall rated
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 1: agency as more desirable for men than communion is for women.
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 1: But this double standard was not evident universally, and only
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 1: fifty eight percent of countries in our sample was men's
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 1: agency rated as more desirable than women's communion. However, the
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 1: magnitude of double standards in prescriptions correlated with country level
• 1:14:43
  Speaker 1: gender equality GGGI, as predicted, such that people in less
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 1: gender equal countries want men to be competent, determined, and
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 1: independent more strongly than they want women to be compassionate, understanding,
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 1: and warm. They're holding men to higher standards, yes, in
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 1: these countries.
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so you see how this is has This is
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 2: nothing like they're trying to make this as men or
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 2: high status, women are low status. And this all maps
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 2: to because men police their status amongst themselves, that means
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 2: that they're identical to aristocrats policing their status against you know,
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 2: preventing peasants from adopting that adopting their status. That's what
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 2: they're trying to do. And yet it fails, And so
• 1:15:32
  Speaker 2: they're trying to assert something that the evidence doesn't show. Again, right,
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 2: then you cannot say that men as a whole occupy
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 2: a higher status if the point is that men have
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 2: to show that they deserve that status. Aristocrats don't have
• 1:15:54
  Speaker 2: to prove you know, they can have to prove their bloodlines, sure,
• 1:15:58
  Speaker 2: but they don't have to prove other things. Is to
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 2: occupy their status, right, And it's not. The policing isn't
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 2: top down with aristocrats. I mean to a degree, it's
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 2: like there's social things happening. It's class between groups, it's
• 1:16:13
  Speaker 2: towards peasants anyway. So they're trying to say that men's
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 2: policing of each other is equivalent to aristocrats policings of peasants,
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 2: and it doesn't work.
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 1: Okay, I hear you. They're they're trying to apply they're
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 1: trying to take sex differences and turn them into class difference. Yes,
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 1: by essentially only looking at like the most successful men
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 1: or the highest status men in comparing them to the well,
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 1: everybody else. I guess Albatross gave us a super chow
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 1: for five. Didn't say anything. I don't know if you
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 1: meant to say something else, but yeah, if you did,
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 1: just bad life streams in a comment, but I got
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 1: five from him. So Carl Heines says, Hi, Hi, Carl Heines,
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 1: welcome to the stream. Okay, should do that in the verticals,
• 1:17:09
  Speaker 1: because in the vertical when when you come across them,
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 1: you have to hit a button to join the live
• 1:17:14
  Speaker 1: so you see it in your feet, then you hit
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 1: a button to join, and then when you do, I
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 1: think it says high in there so that the person
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 1: watching and see. So hello, Carl Hines, I just like
• 1:17:25
  Speaker 1: the glasses, he says, So there you go, Alison, thank you.
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 2: Somebody actually likes them. That's great. Most of the time
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 2: you say I look like an idiot or something, it.
• 1:17:36
  Speaker 1: Just plays cyberpunk music over it and it's you know,
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 1: ye do do do do do do? Do.
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 2: No, it looks like there's no comment for albatross. But
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 2: if you did intend to send a comment that, just
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 2: send it through uh.
• 1:17:50
  Speaker 1: Or or rumble and I'll be able.
• 1:17:53
  Speaker 2: To look out for it all right next month.
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 1: More Over, women compared to men showed smaller double standards
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 1: and prescriptions and more under equal countries. Turning next to
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 1: gender proscriptions, we found evidence of a near universal double standard.
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 1: In ninety five percent of country studied, college students rated
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 1: men's weakness as less desirable than women's dominance. However, findings
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 1: did not support the hypothesis that double standards in proscriptions
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 1: would correlate with GGGI. We also found no evidence that
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 1: participate in binary gender interacts with GGGI to predict double
• 1:18:28
  Speaker 1: standards in proscriptions. Thus, college undergraduates almost universally want men
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 1: to avoid weakness, fearfulness, and uncertainty more strongly than they
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 1: want women to avoid dominance, arrogance, and aggressiveness.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and what they've actually found this is the strongest finding.
• 1:18:46
  Speaker 2: Of course, they don't report on that. They don't report
• 1:18:49
  Speaker 2: on the strongest finding, which is across the world, people
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 2: really don't want men to show weakness. That's the strongest
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 2: finding of this, and the difference between so called gender
• 1:19:06
  Speaker 2: neutral and a gender galitarian and other cultures is that
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 2: gender galitarian cultures don't recognize that men are stronger than women,
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 2: so they still demand that men be stronger than women,
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 2: or they still condemn men for being weak, but they
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 2: don't recognize that that results in men being stronger. So
• 1:19:36
  Speaker 2: it's less gender equality because nobody, no one is allowing
• 1:19:41
  Speaker 2: men to be vulnerable. Nobody's talking about men's issues except us. Right,
• 1:19:48
  Speaker 2: They're all holding men to an expectation that they be strong,
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 2: that they that they not have needs, not be fear
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 2: a full and not be uncertain. Right, we all hold
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 2: them to these standards. But the differences in the gender
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 2: de Lulu countries, we don't recognize that holding men to
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 2: higher standards mean men are being held to higher standards
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 2: and thus probably our living would would assume be living
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 2: up to them. So we expect men not to be weak,
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 2: We allow women to be weak, but we do not
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 2: acknowledge that that makes men strong are stronger because we
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 2: are Delulu countries, but non Delulu countries do. They do
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 2: acknowledge the effects of this. That's the difference. That's the
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 2: difference that they found and they are trying to plug
• 1:20:40
  Speaker 2: into their framework. And because we can't recognize the harms
• 1:20:45
  Speaker 2: that men face, the harms that men endure to be
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 2: recognized as strong, they're seeing this all as privilege. So
• 1:20:55
  Speaker 2: they're terming the double standard that in the Nondo Lulu
• 1:21:01
  Speaker 2: countries that recognize that if you hold men to a
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 2: standard of strength, that means that men are stronger than women,
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 2: like that you want men to be stronger than women,
• 1:21:11
  Speaker 2: And then you're like, oh, yes, men are stronger than women.
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 2: Even though those men, those males who fail to be
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 2: stronger or sort of wash out, we don't talk about them, right,
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 2: but they still recognize that if you men live up
• 1:21:22
  Speaker 2: to a standard of greater strength than women, that means
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 2: they're stronger than women. They recognize that reality. They are
• 1:21:29
  Speaker 2: capable of recognizing it, right, That is a privilege that
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 2: men have. So in these cultures where men have to
• 1:21:40
  Speaker 2: play the man killing game, you know, the deadly race,
• 1:21:43
  Speaker 2: they have to run the deadly race and then they win.
• 1:21:46
  Speaker 2: And those cultures that are like, hey, you ran the
• 1:21:49
  Speaker 2: deadly race. You are a man, and as a man,
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 2: you occupy a position of greater respect for your strength
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 2: because you ran the deadly men, right, those cultures, that's
• 1:22:02
  Speaker 2: men's privilege to be recognized. Right, And then they say,
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 2: that's why men put the pressure on other men not
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 2: to be weak. And yet right here we see a
• 1:22:15
  Speaker 2: massive problem, a massive hole in that because the gender
• 1:22:20
  Speaker 2: do lulu cultures, the gender equal cultures, they're nothing of
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 2: the sort. They're only gender equal because we don't look
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 2: at men's situation. Those cultures still expect men to run
• 1:22:32
  Speaker 2: the deadly man race, but the end they get a
• 1:22:36
  Speaker 2: punch in the face and being told that they're privileged
• 1:22:38
  Speaker 2: if they win. But that's the reason why we force
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 2: men to run the deadly man race is because at
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 2: the end they get to be in the winter. Well,
• 1:22:48
  Speaker 2: what's the reason why we get men to run the
• 1:22:51
  Speaker 2: deadly man race in cultures where there is no winner
• 1:22:54
  Speaker 2: circle for them? What's their reason? What's our reason for
• 1:22:58
  Speaker 2: doing it? Like, if that's the reason why men enforce
• 1:23:01
  Speaker 2: these norms on other men, see, that's their that's their logic, right,
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 2: this is what they've presented at the beginning. Men forced
• 1:23:09
  Speaker 2: these norms, the norm of running the deadly man race
• 1:23:13
  Speaker 2: on other men because they get the benefit of putting
• 1:23:16
  Speaker 2: gold stars on each other at the end, right, right,
• 1:23:20
  Speaker 2: But that benefit doesn't exist in like half the countries
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 2: that they surveyed. So why are men forcing other men
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 2: to run the deadly men race when there's no putting
• 1:23:31
  Speaker 2: gold stars on each other at the end?
• 1:23:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no answer, no, no, not even.
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 2: Walking out? Did you see?
• 1:23:45
  Speaker 1: No?
• 1:23:45
  Speaker 2: Okay, I don't think they're looking. I'm just okay, I'm
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 2: gonna quietly walk out.
• 1:23:49
  Speaker 1: What's going on.
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 2: I'm just quietly walking out so I don't get questioned
• 1:23:54
  Speaker 2: on the gigantic hole in my feminist confabulation. Don't worry about.
• 1:23:59
  Speaker 2: I'm just doing a physical demonstration of quietly evading the question.
• 1:24:03
  Speaker 1: Bryan, Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's just.
• 1:24:06
  Speaker 2: More chaos with me and the voidcat all right, just
• 1:24:10
  Speaker 2: like just went quietly walking out. Don't don't ask, don't ask? Well, no, no,
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 2: oh Jesus as a giant hole, isn't it all? Okay?
• 1:24:21
  Speaker 2: Male privilege? Yeah, okay, let's keep going.
• 1:24:29
  Speaker 1: Well, that was the that was the page. Okay. Writing
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 1: also replicated and extended past studies on gender prescriptions and
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 1: proscriptions in two important ways. First, we found near universal
• 1:24:41
  Speaker 1: evidence for agency and communion as gender prescriptions for men
• 1:24:45
  Speaker 1: and women respectively, and weakness and dominance as gender proscriptions respectively. Second,
• 1:24:51
  Speaker 1: we established the measurement invariants of four brief scales for
• 1:24:54
  Speaker 1: measuring gender prescription and proscriptions. Thus, these scales can be
• 1:24:58
  Speaker 1: used by cross cultural gender researchers to draw meaningful comparisons
• 1:25:02
  Speaker 1: across countries and world regions. A practical contribution of this
• 1:25:07
  Speaker 1: research that double standards in trade prescriptions are larger and
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 1: less or that double standards in trade prescriptions are larger
• 1:25:18
  Speaker 1: in less gender equal countries, is consistent with the logic
• 1:25:21
  Speaker 1: that men's agentic traits are especially desirable in places where
• 1:25:25
  Speaker 1: they face stronger pressures to fill traditional protector provider roles.
• 1:25:30
  Speaker 2: I wonder why, I wonder why they face stronger pressures. Now,
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 2: the argument that they're making is that they just arbitrarily
• 1:25:39
  Speaker 2: face stronger pressures. They're just for whatever reason, men in
• 1:25:42
  Speaker 2: these cultures are just like, yeah, the deadly man race
• 1:25:47
  Speaker 2: is just really important to us.
• 1:25:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:25:50
  Speaker 2: It just so happens that these these cultures correspond with
• 1:25:54
  Speaker 2: cultures with high degrees of conflict over resources. So they
• 1:25:59
  Speaker 2: haven't secured They may be very resource uh, resource rich,
• 1:26:03
  Speaker 2: but they haven't really secured the infrastructure to exploit them
• 1:26:07
  Speaker 2: to the same level that our cultures have. They tend
• 1:26:09
  Speaker 2: be less prosperous. There's a lot more conflict over resources.
• 1:26:13
  Speaker 2: You know, it's they're they're emerging, emerging economies, that kind
• 1:26:16
  Speaker 2: of thing. I wonder why there's a greater emphasis on
• 1:26:23
  Speaker 2: provider and protector men occupying the role of provider and
• 1:26:27
  Speaker 2: protector in those cultures. But here's the other caveat, right, Actually,
• 1:26:36
  Speaker 2: let's let's keep I will get to the caveat because
• 1:26:39
  Speaker 2: we're about to. And they don't recognize any kind of
• 1:26:42
  Speaker 2: external factor to this. Everything is always arbitrary. It's arbitrary
• 1:26:46
  Speaker 2: that men force other men to run the deadly Man race.
• 1:26:50
  Speaker 2: It's just completely arbitrary. And it's only because they want
• 1:26:53
  Speaker 2: to put gold stars on each other afterwards, hold a
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 2: gold gold star party, maybe some glitter, you know, like this.
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 2: This infantile thinking on the part of these researchers, a
• 1:27:05
  Speaker 2: complete lack of actual Oh, is there any kind of
• 1:27:09
  Speaker 2: physical circumstance that might make these cultures emphasize protection and
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 2: provision and men more. No, we can't look at that, Okay,
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 2: keep going.
• 1:27:20
  Speaker 1: Albatross sent a comment to go with his super child
• 1:27:23
  Speaker 1: from earlier, he says, My comment was, quote, did this
• 1:27:28
  Speaker 1: article just admit that women are privileged because there's less
• 1:27:31
  Speaker 1: pressure on them to stick to traditional trappings? End quote Yes, yes,
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 1: And now we're gonna now like this is just the
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 1: normal feminist way of like, Okay, I'm going to accept
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 1: all of these things as true. But behold, as I
• 1:27:45
  Speaker 1: ween nothing in my nothing up my sleeve here, nothing
• 1:27:48
  Speaker 1: up my sleep here, watch me turn this into something
• 1:27:50
  Speaker 1: that actually victimizes women or at least brings men, you know,
• 1:27:55
  Speaker 1: so that we can still go after patriarchy.
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, just keep going.
• 1:28:01
  Speaker 1: That double standards in trade prescriptions are longer or larger
• 1:28:05
  Speaker 1: in less gender equal countries is consistent with the logic
• 1:28:08
  Speaker 1: that men's agentic traits are especially desirable in places where
• 1:28:12
  Speaker 1: they face stronger pressures to fill traditional protector provider roles.
• 1:28:16
  Speaker 1: Endorsing especially strong prescriptions for men in more patriarchal contexts
• 1:28:21
  Speaker 1: presumably assists in socialization by preparing boys to compete for
• 1:28:25
  Speaker 1: leadership positions, embrace challenges, and fulfill physically risky roles. As
• 1:28:32
  Speaker 1: Gilmour notes notes, the roles expected of men in more
• 1:28:36
  Speaker 1: traditional cultures are often more acutely dangerous and risky like hunting, warfare,
• 1:28:41
  Speaker 1: or physical labor than those expected of women, which is
• 1:28:44
  Speaker 1: infant caregiving, domestic tasks, emotional labor, emotional labor.
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 2: No, no, they don't not in cultures.
• 1:28:52
  Speaker 1: Making shit up and men's successes in such roles is
• 1:28:56
  Speaker 1: less assured than women's success.
• 1:28:59
  Speaker 2: What, okay, they need They're only going to cotton men
• 1:29:05
  Speaker 2: who can live up to a higher standard of provision
• 1:29:07
  Speaker 2: and protection. Any man who washes out, washes out of
• 1:29:10
  Speaker 2: society and goes get to die in a ditch, goes
• 1:29:13
  Speaker 2: to get to die in a ditch and get killed
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 2: in a conflict or whatever. Right, that's what's happening here.
• 1:29:21
  Speaker 2: And they're saying that the implication is that this isn't
• 1:29:25
  Speaker 2: result for a result of dealing with external pressures. It's
• 1:29:30
  Speaker 2: just something patriarchy did for shits and giggles. Because if
• 1:29:36
  Speaker 2: you recognize that this is a result of dealing with
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 2: external pressures, you have to recognize that what they're doing
• 1:29:44
  Speaker 2: is they're making boys live up to or gain the
• 1:29:48
  Speaker 2: tools necessary to deal with those external pressures, win the resources,
• 1:29:53
  Speaker 2: win the protection for their social group. Right, and if
• 1:29:57
  Speaker 2: the boys can't do it, they're gone. They're excluded, right,
• 1:30:03
  Speaker 2: And how if you actually recognize all of those factors,
• 1:30:08
  Speaker 2: how can you argue that women are oppressed by that
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 2: when women are the beneficiaries of it without having to
• 1:30:18
  Speaker 2: actually run the deadly man race. And that is the
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 2: reality that they are tap dancing around, which is which
• 1:30:26
  Speaker 2: is why they can't recognize the externals. They can't recognize
• 1:30:32
  Speaker 2: the external things these men and boys are dealing with
• 1:30:34
  Speaker 2: in these cultures. Nor can they recognize who is benefited
• 1:30:38
  Speaker 2: by these boys men and boys dealing with them. Nor
• 1:30:41
  Speaker 2: can they recognize that men and boys manifestly demonstrate that
• 1:30:45
  Speaker 2: they can't deal with them. They are removed, They're not
• 1:30:48
  Speaker 2: they're disposable to society, right. They can't contend with any
• 1:30:52
  Speaker 2: of this, So they just tap dance around it, try
• 1:30:56
  Speaker 2: to nobody, hope that nobody goes in there and draw
• 1:30:59
  Speaker 2: that starts connecting the dots in all of this, and
• 1:31:04
  Speaker 2: then they continue to assert that's somehow the motive for
• 1:31:08
  Speaker 2: doing all of this. Isn't protecting and providing for your
• 1:31:11
  Speaker 2: social group. Isn't being just like, isn't proving yourself worthy
• 1:31:16
  Speaker 2: of being part of that social group as a boy
• 1:31:18
  Speaker 2: or a man. It's because at the end of the day,
• 1:31:20
  Speaker 2: all of these men just at arbitrarily did this so
• 1:31:22
  Speaker 2: they can pin gold stars on each other. And because
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 2: anything else you have means you have to reckon with
• 1:31:31
  Speaker 2: the truth the reality, yep, which is it's the pinning
• 1:31:36
  Speaker 2: gold stars on each other is not why men create
• 1:31:38
  Speaker 2: the deadly man race. The respect is not why men
• 1:31:45
  Speaker 2: create the deadly man race. The glory is not why
• 1:31:51
  Speaker 2: men create the deadly man race.
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 1: It's almost like these people don't know, like how we
• 1:31:57
  Speaker 1: have the advanced civilization and we have they no, I
• 1:32:02
  Speaker 1: know they're they're not obviously being there lying, but I'm
• 1:32:05
  Speaker 1: just saying like they're pretending, like no one else pretending.
• 1:32:08
  Speaker 2: It is just it was just no, no, no, no no.
• 1:32:13
  Speaker 2: It was stolen from women, Brian.
• 1:32:15
  Speaker 1: It was stolen from women. Yes, that's right.
• 1:32:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, even though men today make most of the major
• 1:32:22
  Speaker 2: sacrifices to keep everything running in the past, men somehow
• 1:32:27
  Speaker 2: stole it from women. They are they prevented women from
• 1:32:30
  Speaker 2: making it themselves. That's how they stole it from them.
• 1:32:34
  Speaker 1: Mm hmmm.
• 1:32:35
  Speaker 2: It doesn't like when you lay it out, it makes
• 1:32:37
  Speaker 2: no sense because it doesn't. Okay, let's let's finish this off.
• 1:32:42
  Speaker 1: Moreover, men's into group competition for status and resources, especially
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 1: fierce in more patriarchal contexts, whereas women's outcomes in terms
• 1:32:51
  Speaker 1: of survival and reproduction have been less variable than men's
• 1:32:55
  Speaker 1: throughout evolutionary history.
• 1:32:57
  Speaker 2: Okay, larger, let's put these two concepts together. Men's intro
• 1:33:02
  Speaker 2: group competition for status and resources especially fierce. Okay. That
• 1:33:09
  Speaker 2: means that men win, right, and they gain the status
• 1:33:13
  Speaker 2: and resources. So if you have a very conflict orientated region,
• 1:33:18
  Speaker 2: then they do it through military. If you have a
• 1:33:20
  Speaker 2: less conflict, then they do it through organizing centralized resources,
• 1:33:23
  Speaker 2: whatever however they do that you businessmen versus moarrior model. Right,
• 1:33:29
  Speaker 2: So men take the risks to gain the resources, and
• 1:33:33
  Speaker 2: the outcome just happens to be that more women survive comfortably.
• 1:33:41
  Speaker 2: And they're not making the connection between these two things.
• 1:33:45
  Speaker 2: Men taking the risks acquiring the resource and the outcomes
• 1:33:49
  Speaker 2: being they say less variable, but what they mean is
• 1:33:53
  Speaker 2: more women survive, more women are comfortable, and more women reproduce.
• 1:33:59
  Speaker 2: So they don't make the connection between the sacrifices men
• 1:34:01
  Speaker 2: are making and the comfort and security that meant women get.
• 1:34:07
  Speaker 2: You notice that, mm hmm, it's completely It's all status.
• 1:34:10
  Speaker 1: It's all isolated, it's.
• 1:34:13
  Speaker 2: All status games, which is how they managed to say
• 1:34:18
  Speaker 2: that men pitning gold stars on each other at the
• 1:34:22
  Speaker 2: end is the privilege that makes them run the deadly
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 2: man race. That's why they're doing it. You see, they're
• 1:34:28
  Speaker 2: maintaining the gold star pinning privilege even at the expense
• 1:34:33
  Speaker 2: of other men's lives. Okay, let's keep going.
• 1:34:38
  Speaker 1: Thus, larger double standards and trade prescriptions in more patriarchal
• 1:34:43
  Speaker 1: contexts perhaps reflect the additional social pressure required to push
• 1:34:48
  Speaker 1: men into grueling, high risk, and competitive activities and occupations.
• 1:34:55
  Speaker 1: Larger double standards in more patriot contexts reflects, well, they say,
• 1:35:00
  Speaker 1: perhaps they're trying to give themselves in out here. The
• 1:35:03
  Speaker 1: more the additional social pressure. What if, like they men
• 1:35:09
  Speaker 1: do the grueling, high risk and competitive activities and occupations,
• 1:35:12
  Speaker 1: specifically occupations because no one else is going to do
• 1:35:15
  Speaker 1: it and it has to get done. Like what these
• 1:35:21
  Speaker 1: these societies that are more patriarchal, Are these like not
• 1:35:26
  Speaker 1: first world countries?
• 1:35:27
  Speaker 2: Yes?
• 1:35:28
  Speaker 1: Like how are they so they're like like second and
• 1:35:30
  Speaker 1: third world countries? Yes, So they're basically where survival is
• 1:35:34
  Speaker 1: like at the like higher up on the list of
• 1:35:36
  Speaker 1: things that need to get done.
• 1:35:38
  Speaker 2: Okay, but still they're like first world countries still expect
• 1:35:43
  Speaker 2: men not to be weak.
• 1:35:44
  Speaker 1: Of course, Yeah, they just don't.
• 1:35:46
  Speaker 2: Recognize that the result of expecting men not to be
• 1:35:49
  Speaker 2: weak and allowing women to be weak is that men
• 1:35:51
  Speaker 2: are stronger. They just won't recognize that. That's the point. Yes, okay,
• 1:35:57
  Speaker 2: keep going all right. Uh.
• 1:36:00
  Speaker 1: Moreover, as noted, the links between gender equality and double
• 1:36:04
  Speaker 1: standards and prescriptions were moderated by participant binary gender. Specifically,
• 1:36:10
  Speaker 1: college women in more gender equal context hold men and
• 1:36:13
  Speaker 1: women to similar prescriptive rules, whereas college men in such
• 1:36:17
  Speaker 1: contexts find men's agency more desirable than women's communion. This
• 1:36:23
  Speaker 1: pattern fits with other findings obtained largely in Western.
• 1:36:28
  Speaker 2: Huh they say that really strangely, it just means that
• 1:36:31
  Speaker 2: they police women. They they don't. They don't think that
• 1:36:38
  Speaker 2: women necessarily need to be it's not as important that
• 1:36:41
  Speaker 2: they be communal. That they don't police women as hard.
• 1:36:44
  Speaker 2: It's basically what they're saying. Yes, try to say it,
• 1:36:49
  Speaker 2: I can't say it like that. So they say things like, oh,
• 1:36:52
  Speaker 2: men being in this way is more desirable than women
• 1:36:55
  Speaker 2: being in that way. Well that what that means is,
• 1:36:59
  Speaker 2: well it means that women are not expected or they
• 1:37:04
  Speaker 2: aren't necessarily rewarded for occupying a traditional gender role in
• 1:37:09
  Speaker 2: the saint to the same degree, which means that they
• 1:37:13
  Speaker 2: aren't that particular gender role isn't as incentivized, which means
• 1:37:17
  Speaker 2: it's not as policed. It's neither as policed either way. Like,
• 1:37:25
  Speaker 2: so okay, keep.
• 1:37:26
  Speaker 1: Going, all right. This pattern fits with other findings obtained
• 1:37:32
  Speaker 1: largely in Western, more egalitarian contexts, indicating that men are
• 1:37:36
  Speaker 1: especially harsh critics of other men's gender nonconformity. Mirroring these findings,
• 1:37:41
  Speaker 1: perhaps men in more or gender equal countries are also
• 1:37:45
  Speaker 1: especially enthusiastic endorsers of other men's conformity. To agentic prescriptions,
• 1:37:51
  Speaker 1: such a pattern might reflect a defensive response to increasing
• 1:37:54
  Speaker 1: gender equality, as members of the dominant gender group men
• 1:37:59
  Speaker 1: relative to women in more gender equal context may desire
• 1:38:02
  Speaker 1: greater gender conformity from other men as a way of
• 1:38:05
  Speaker 1: reinforcing in group slash out group boundaries. So now they're
• 1:38:10
  Speaker 1: trying to claim that men are the ones policing other men.
• 1:38:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but do you see what they just did. Yeah,
• 1:38:18
  Speaker 2: men are the ones policing other men. They've complained this
• 1:38:20
  Speaker 2: from the beginning. Yeah, Brian. But what they just did
• 1:38:24
  Speaker 2: right there was they said that in group outgroup, right,
• 1:38:32
  Speaker 2: So they're trying to say that men police like it's
• 1:38:35
  Speaker 2: that the aristocratic versus present thing again. They're trying to
• 1:38:38
  Speaker 2: say that men because men police their own more, that
• 1:38:43
  Speaker 2: means they feel like they are higher status, right like
• 1:38:48
  Speaker 2: the aristocrats. The aristocrats didn't police them the their own
• 1:38:51
  Speaker 2: more than the peasants, at least not the markers of
• 1:38:53
  Speaker 2: their of their class. And men don't police, don't police
• 1:38:58
  Speaker 2: women like aristocrats police peasants. They police each other. And
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 2: they're trying to say, well, they're trying to use the
• 1:39:05
  Speaker 2: word policing, right, They're trying to just say, well, aristocrats police,
• 1:39:13
  Speaker 2: therefore men police, you know, other men. Aristocrats police peasants,
• 1:39:19
  Speaker 2: therefore men police other men. Therefore the policing means that
• 1:39:23
  Speaker 2: they occupy a high status group.
• 1:39:26
  Speaker 1: No, yes, right, probably police.
• 1:39:31
  Speaker 2: Peasants probably policed each other a lot more on working
• 1:39:36
  Speaker 2: and being stoic and doing your job, yeah, right, like
• 1:39:42
  Speaker 2: and aristocrats police peasants a lot more on uh, looking
• 1:39:48
  Speaker 2: like an aristocrat. Okay, let's keep going, well what if what?
• 1:39:55
  Speaker 1: Okay, So they're framing it one way where they're saying, like,
• 1:39:57
  Speaker 1: men are especially harsh critics of other men's gender nonconformity.
• 1:40:02
  Speaker 1: But what if that isn't because those men are trying
• 1:40:05
  Speaker 1: to hurt those other men or they're trying to like,
• 1:40:07
  Speaker 1: you know, enforce some kind of strict gender conformity on
• 1:40:12
  Speaker 1: other men. What if they're looking out for them in
• 1:40:15
  Speaker 1: a way, like like the way that men look out
• 1:40:18
  Speaker 1: for each other. Because like, I don't think I'm sorry,
• 1:40:21
  Speaker 1: but I don't think that anyone is a harsher critic
• 1:40:24
  Speaker 1: or judge of a man's masculinity than women are. Women
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 1: are the harshest judges, and you see it everywhere all
• 1:40:32
  Speaker 1: the time. So what if men are aware of that
• 1:40:36
  Speaker 1: and they're trying to help other men by saying, hey, man,
• 1:40:39
  Speaker 1: like you know you're gonna get bullied or whatever, so
• 1:40:41
  Speaker 1: they they they approach it in a way that is
• 1:40:45
  Speaker 1: not in the same way that a woman might give
• 1:40:48
  Speaker 1: that advice, but they are looking out for them. It's
• 1:40:51
  Speaker 1: like it's like the bright side of bullying in a way,
• 1:40:55
  Speaker 1: Like what if the purpose of it is to sort
• 1:40:58
  Speaker 1: of like help those men, you know, to protect them
• 1:41:02
  Speaker 1: in the future. Right, And also, if you're if you're
• 1:41:06
  Speaker 1: like in a group activity you're working with other men,
• 1:41:09
  Speaker 1: like you're it's military, or it's hunting, or it's some
• 1:41:13
  Speaker 1: kind of like project that's like gonna involve a lot
• 1:41:17
  Speaker 1: of hard work, some risk. You want to make sure
• 1:41:20
  Speaker 1: that the men that you're with are gonna like be
• 1:41:22
  Speaker 1: there for you. Right, So there's gonna be some say
• 1:41:26
  Speaker 1: like testing that's gonna happen. And I don't think that,
• 1:41:30
  Speaker 1: like because I guess what they're they're trying to put
• 1:41:32
  Speaker 1: a value on it, and I don't think it's bad.
• 1:41:34
  Speaker 1: I don't. I don't think it's bad. And I think
• 1:41:36
  Speaker 1: I'd rather get it from men than women. Anyways.
• 1:41:40
  Speaker 2: Okay, you know, yeah, there's there's a bunch of stuff
• 1:41:43
  Speaker 2: that's happening. First of all, men are policing other men
• 1:41:46
  Speaker 2: towards a goal, right, yeah, generally, and we need men
• 1:41:51
  Speaker 2: to do that because we need those we need as
• 1:41:54
  Speaker 2: a society, We need those goals met.
• 1:41:56
  Speaker 1: What does leadership look like? You know?
• 1:41:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, And you know, and also they you will
• 1:42:03
  Speaker 2: say to the young men, if you want a particular outcome,
• 1:42:05
  Speaker 2: you have to do the work. That's another form of policing.
• 1:42:08
  Speaker 2: But there are other forms of policing. They're actually absolutely
• 1:42:11
  Speaker 2: vital like men policing criminal men and also criminal women.
• 1:42:17
  Speaker 2: Men do that, right, So this entire paper is presenting
• 1:42:22
  Speaker 2: policing as a negative thing when it's not. And the
• 1:42:27
  Speaker 2: other thing it's doing, which is very sly, is it's
• 1:42:31
  Speaker 2: actually not. First of all, women do police each other
• 1:42:35
  Speaker 2: in this paper, but it's presenting that as being an
• 1:42:39
  Speaker 2: expression of virtue, like it's gender equality. These women are
• 1:42:44
  Speaker 2: gender equal, and because men police other men more, that
• 1:42:47
  Speaker 2: makes them patriarchal and something something right. But the thing
• 1:42:53
  Speaker 2: is that they aren't really looking at where women police
• 1:42:56
  Speaker 2: each other most, which is around resources and resource allocation
• 1:43:04
  Speaker 2: and access to resource resources and social standing. Like I
• 1:43:12
  Speaker 2: would honestly say that this is completely like, this doesn't
• 1:43:16
  Speaker 2: capture at all how women police other women. If you
• 1:43:20
  Speaker 2: want to see how women police other women, you need
• 1:43:22
  Speaker 2: to go on Twitter, or you need to be someone
• 1:43:24
  Speaker 2: like me who gets constantly called a pick me, because
• 1:43:26
  Speaker 2: I'm challenging the current women the current extraction regime for
• 1:43:32
  Speaker 2: women in terms of resources, in terms of men's resources, right,
• 1:43:36
  Speaker 2: and I'm challenging the fairness of it and also the
• 1:43:39
  Speaker 2: longevity of it, you know, because I don't think that
• 1:43:43
  Speaker 2: telling men not to be weak but then not acknowledging
• 1:43:46
  Speaker 2: that makes them stronger is a functional thing long term.
• 1:43:50
  Speaker 2: I think it's a horrible thing to do to men,
• 1:43:53
  Speaker 2: But I got, you know, like I constantly get hit
• 1:43:56
  Speaker 2: with women's policing. Women don't police other women when it
• 1:44:00
  Speaker 2: comes to achieving goals. They don't police other women when
• 1:44:03
  Speaker 2: it comes to being criminal. They police other women when
• 1:44:06
  Speaker 2: they think that those women are a threat to their
• 1:44:09
  Speaker 2: access to resources or competition. Right. So this, this paper
• 1:44:14
  Speaker 2: doesn't capture that at all. So it can't even really
• 1:44:18
  Speaker 2: say that women don't or women equally police men and
• 1:44:22
  Speaker 2: women because it doesn't capture how women police women. It
• 1:44:27
  Speaker 2: just captures how men policemen and then says, well, look
• 1:44:30
  Speaker 2: at this, men police men more. Oh that's ah, how
• 1:44:35
  Speaker 2: are they framing this as bad? Oh? Yeah, that is
• 1:44:40
  Speaker 2: that's evidence that women have it worse somehow. You know,
• 1:44:43
  Speaker 2: it's like you get sucked into these mental traps and
• 1:44:46
  Speaker 2: it's like, how did they get you there? How did
• 1:44:49
  Speaker 2: I find myself in this place? Okay, let's keep going.
• 1:44:56
  Speaker 1: As members of the dominant gender group, men and relative
• 1:45:00
  Speaker 1: to women in more gender equal contexts, may desire greater
• 1:45:03
  Speaker 1: gender conformity from other men, as a way of reinforcing
• 1:45:07
  Speaker 1: in group outgroup boundaries.
• 1:45:08
  Speaker 2: That's how, because they're trying to allege that men's policing
• 1:45:12
  Speaker 2: of men indicates that they're in a higher status group
• 1:45:15
  Speaker 2: and women are lower status than men. Yes, and that's
• 1:45:23
  Speaker 2: why it's patriarchal privilege. That's how. That's how we got here. Okay,
• 1:45:31
  Speaker 2: all right.
• 1:45:33
  Speaker 1: However, this explanation cannot illuminate why participant gender failed to
• 1:45:38
  Speaker 1: interact with gender equality to predict double standards and gender prescriptions.
• 1:45:42
  Speaker 1: This question must thus await further investigation.
• 1:45:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, what they mean is that they found the exact
• 1:45:48
  Speaker 2: opposite of what they expected. Yeah, and they found the
• 1:45:52
  Speaker 2: exact opposite of what they expected, And this is really critical.
• 1:45:55
  Speaker 2: Listen to me. They found the exact opposite of what
• 1:45:58
  Speaker 2: they expected. Along the vec that applies more actual social force. Right, So,
• 1:46:05
  Speaker 2: if you have a society in which men are shamed
• 1:46:10
  Speaker 2: for being weak, for having uncertainties, for expressing fear, that
• 1:46:16
  Speaker 2: is the access of social pressure. Okay, not being like,
• 1:46:21
  Speaker 2: oh yeah, I think men should be strong. That's not
• 1:46:25
  Speaker 2: that doesn't apply the same pressure as shame, humiliation, ostracization,
• 1:46:31
  Speaker 2: and like toxic abuse. When a man expresses any fear
• 1:46:35
  Speaker 2: uncertainty or doubt. Okay, very different, different amounts of social pressure.
• 1:46:41
  Speaker 2: So the most powerful vector of social pressure everybody does
• 1:46:46
  Speaker 2: it to men. Women do it to men. Men do
• 1:46:49
  Speaker 2: it to men. Western cultures do it to men. Global
• 1:46:54
  Speaker 2: self culture cultures do it to men. Everybody does it.
• 1:46:58
  Speaker 2: Everybody applies this pressure to me. That's what they found,
• 1:47:02
  Speaker 2: and that is not accounted for in any of their theories.
• 1:47:06
  Speaker 2: That's not what they were looking for. What they were
• 1:47:08
  Speaker 2: looking for was a clean sweep of the board. Oh look,
• 1:47:12
  Speaker 2: gender equal cultures, everybody's free to do what they want. No, No,
• 1:47:18
  Speaker 2: men are still expected to occupy their traditional gender role
• 1:47:21
  Speaker 2: without the respect of recognizing their doing. So that's the difference.
• 1:47:28
  Speaker 2: That's what they found. All right. You know, I don't
• 1:47:33
  Speaker 2: know if we need to uh go much further in
• 1:47:38
  Speaker 2: this because I can just actually I'm going to read this.
• 1:47:41
  Speaker 2: This is This is some of my analysis that I
• 1:47:44
  Speaker 2: did beforehand. Okay, so this is this is what I asked, perplexity,
• 1:47:51
  Speaker 2: How the fuck do men navigate? It's extremely bad to
• 1:47:55
  Speaker 2: be for men to be weak when it's not desirable
• 1:48:00
  Speaker 2: with with it's not desirable for men to be competent, confident,
• 1:48:04
  Speaker 2: and dependent determined, or courageous. That's this is what This
• 1:48:07
  Speaker 2: is the framework that we've presented in this This is
• 1:48:10
  Speaker 2: what we've found. In Western cultures, men are told it
• 1:48:14
  Speaker 2: is extremely bad to be weak. You are a piece
• 1:48:17
  Speaker 2: of shit. If you're weak, you are a non man.
• 1:48:19
  Speaker 2: If you're weak, you can just walk out the door,
• 1:48:22
  Speaker 2: keep going, and die in a ditch. If you're weak,
• 1:48:24
  Speaker 2: men are shamed for being weak, for being afraid, for
• 1:48:27
  Speaker 2: having uncertainties, for having any issues. They're constantly shamed for that. Now,
• 1:48:33
  Speaker 2: but in the same cultures they say it is not desirable,
• 1:48:38
  Speaker 2: not desirable for men to be competent, confident, independent, determined,
• 1:48:43
  Speaker 2: or courageous. So men can't be weak, but they also
• 1:48:47
  Speaker 2: can't be competent, confident, independent, determined, or courageous, and they
• 1:48:53
  Speaker 2: can certainly can't be recognized as such. So how the
• 1:48:57
  Speaker 2: fuck do men navigate that? That's the question I pose
• 1:48:59
  Speaker 2: to perplex And this is how Perplexity answered. Men are
• 1:49:03
  Speaker 2: being handed a double bind. Never be weak, and increasingly
• 1:49:08
  Speaker 2: don't act like a strong man either. Right, so you
• 1:49:12
  Speaker 2: can't be weak, but you cannot act strong. The study
• 1:49:17
  Speaker 2: shows that across sixty two countries, people almost universally judge
• 1:49:21
  Speaker 2: male weakness, fearful, dependent, insecure as much less acceptable than
• 1:49:26
  Speaker 2: female dominance. So we're not even talking about female weakness.
• 1:49:30
  Speaker 2: Women have an automatic past to be weak, which is
• 1:49:33
  Speaker 2: a problem they shouldn't and but we are comparing male
• 1:49:40
  Speaker 2: weakness to female dominance. It is far more acceptable in
• 1:49:44
  Speaker 2: all of the cultures studied, that is, the global self cultures,
• 1:49:48
  Speaker 2: the emerging economies for a woman to be a boss
• 1:49:51
  Speaker 2: babe than it is for a man to be weak.
• 1:49:54
  Speaker 2: Wrap your mind around that. But in the most gender
• 1:49:58
  Speaker 2: equal countries and men, competent, confident, independent, determined, courageous is
• 1:50:03
  Speaker 2: not rated as more desirable than communion and women, And
• 1:50:07
  Speaker 2: in several such countries, agency is actually less desired in
• 1:50:10
  Speaker 2: men less desired. So if you look like you're competent, confident, independent, determined,
• 1:50:17
  Speaker 2: and courageous, if you look that way, you're a privileged fuck.
• 1:50:22
  Speaker 2: You're a privileged piece of shit. But if you express
• 1:50:26
  Speaker 2: any weakness, fearfulness, dependency, or insecurity, you're a useless, shameful schmuck.
• 1:50:39
  Speaker 2: So the implicit message becomes, you absolutely can't be weak,
• 1:50:43
  Speaker 2: or you will be punished and discarded. But we're also
• 1:50:46
  Speaker 2: uncomfortable explicitly valuing masculine strength, competence, or leadership in you.
• 1:50:51
  Speaker 2: So you have to watch this little tightrope. Right, you
• 1:50:54
  Speaker 2: can't ever be weak, But you also can't be strong, right,
• 1:50:58
  Speaker 2: you can't. You have to somehow be not fearful but
• 1:51:05
  Speaker 2: not courageous. You have to be not incompetent but not competent.
• 1:51:11
  Speaker 2: You have to be not strong but not weak. You
• 1:51:16
  Speaker 2: have to be you have to not be unsure, but
• 1:51:21
  Speaker 2: you can't know things. That's what the Western world is
• 1:51:25
  Speaker 2: telling men. You are also uncomfortable with explicitly valuing masculine strength, competence,
• 1:51:32
  Speaker 2: or leadership in you. There's no stable way to navigate that.
• 1:51:35
  Speaker 2: It is structured to generate guilt and anxiety. No matter
• 1:51:38
  Speaker 2: what men do, the only saying response is to reject
• 1:51:41
  Speaker 2: the frame. Treat toughness and competence is intrinsically good from
• 1:51:45
  Speaker 2: you when used for good ends, and stop letting a
• 1:51:48
  Speaker 2: hostile culture define your virtues as suspect while still demanding
• 1:51:52
  Speaker 2: the benefits. This is perplexity. Wow, these aids, they can
• 1:51:57
  Speaker 2: actually have insights with you if you frame it in
• 1:52:00
  Speaker 2: the right way. Right, and yes, this is a bit,
• 1:52:04
  Speaker 2: this is he perplexity is taking it off of my
• 1:52:07
  Speaker 2: questions about this document and also my approach to things.
• 1:52:12
  Speaker 2: But if that was completely incorrect, it would also say so,
• 1:52:17
  Speaker 2: And honestly it is correct. We don't even have to ask,
• 1:52:21
  Speaker 2: We don't even need perplexity stamp of approval. That is
• 1:52:25
  Speaker 2: one hundred true. If you are in a position where
• 1:52:28
  Speaker 2: you are expected to be not be weak, but don't
• 1:52:31
  Speaker 2: be strong, not not be confused, but don't know things right,
• 1:52:38
  Speaker 2: not be fearful, but don't be courageous, not be uncertain,
• 1:52:44
  Speaker 2: but don't mansplain right, what where is the where is
• 1:52:50
  Speaker 2: the place to stand?
• 1:52:53
  Speaker 3: Right?
• 1:52:53
  Speaker 2: Where is it? That's what Western cultures are doing to men,
• 1:52:59
  Speaker 2: giving them absolutely no place to stand, giving them contradictory.
• 1:53:04
  Speaker 2: And this freaking feminist paper found that out. It found
• 1:53:11
  Speaker 2: that out, and then somehow it turned that into well
• 1:53:15
  Speaker 2: men policemen more. And and what's actually happening is that
• 1:53:21
  Speaker 2: men in certain countries where it's really critical that men
• 1:53:24
  Speaker 2: not be collapsing mentally because they're needed to protect and
• 1:53:28
  Speaker 2: provide in a much more immediate way, still we don't.
• 1:53:33
  Speaker 2: It's not that men are not needed in our cultures.
• 1:53:35
  Speaker 2: They one hundred percent are. But we have all of
• 1:53:38
  Speaker 2: these government structures that extract all of the benefit from
• 1:53:41
  Speaker 2: those hard men that are needed and give it to
• 1:53:44
  Speaker 2: the women who need it. We have all those lovely
• 1:53:47
  Speaker 2: government bureaucracies to do that. They don't have it in
• 1:53:50
  Speaker 2: those all those lovely government bureaucracies in these emerging countries,
• 1:53:54
  Speaker 2: which probably is like that the functional difference. They don't
• 1:53:57
  Speaker 2: have a giant, complex bureaucracy that extracting use out of
• 1:54:02
  Speaker 2: men who are expected not to be weak and giving
• 1:54:05
  Speaker 2: it to the needs of women. They don't have that.
• 1:54:07
  Speaker 2: So women need to actually, you know, men need to
• 1:54:10
  Speaker 2: have these traits on an individual level, and they need
• 1:54:13
  Speaker 2: to be recognized or they don't engage in it. They can't.
• 1:54:15
  Speaker 2: There's no extraction mechanism there, right. And also they need
• 1:54:19
  Speaker 2: these men sane like our culture. I guess we don't
• 1:54:22
  Speaker 2: need sane men. We can just beat the shit out
• 1:54:26
  Speaker 2: of them mentally and just hope for the best bold strategy.
• 1:54:30
  Speaker 2: I wonder if it'll play out for us. But yeah,
• 1:54:32
  Speaker 2: So they need sane men in these cultures because they're
• 1:54:36
  Speaker 2: at the razor's edge of survival. They can't afford a
• 1:54:39
  Speaker 2: whole bunch of guys who can't pull their weight. They
• 1:54:42
  Speaker 2: can't afford this kind of very expensive messaging towards men.
• 1:54:47
  Speaker 2: They can't afford it, so they don't do it. They
• 1:54:49
  Speaker 2: just they say, yeah, you got to be stronger, and
• 1:54:51
  Speaker 2: we're going to recognize that you're stronger as opposed to
• 1:54:55
  Speaker 2: our system. I don't even think we can call it
• 1:54:58
  Speaker 2: a system. It's just a series of parasitic loops. Looks
• 1:55:04
  Speaker 2: very complex, just like a you know, I'm sure a
• 1:55:07
  Speaker 2: tapeworm looks very complex on an X ray, but it
• 1:55:10
  Speaker 2: really is just a simple thing. The only complexity is
• 1:55:12
  Speaker 2: that it's inside a more complex organism that's basically our society.
• 1:55:17
  Speaker 2: It's a series of parasitic loops. But yeah, so how
• 1:55:22
  Speaker 2: are men supposed to deal with this? All right? I
• 1:55:29
  Speaker 2: have some thoughts on and I mean, you guys can
• 1:55:35
  Speaker 2: read this paper. I'm sure Brian linked it in the
• 1:55:37
  Speaker 2: low Bar. I'm I'm you can read it and are.
• 1:55:41
  Speaker 1: Talking about the perplexity or the or the original article,
• 1:55:45
  Speaker 1: the original article. Yeah, yeah, maybe Missy.
• 1:55:49
  Speaker 2: Will come back and read that article and she'll come
• 1:55:51
  Speaker 2: back with an actual argument. I have doubts, yeah, you know,
• 1:55:58
  Speaker 2: or or this new person, Jill, I think it's Jill.
• 1:56:02
  Speaker 2: Maybe this individual will come back with an actual will
• 1:56:04
  Speaker 2: read the paper as we have done, and come back
• 1:56:07
  Speaker 2: with an actual argument. No, they won't because get this,
• 1:56:11
  Speaker 2: the people who wrote this paper are probably the smartest
• 1:56:14
  Speaker 2: feminists in the room. I said feminists, not the smartest
• 1:56:17
  Speaker 2: people in the room. The smartest feminists in the room,
• 1:56:20
  Speaker 2: and the random commentators in our special channel are not
• 1:56:23
  Speaker 2: even as smart as these people. And all of these
• 1:56:26
  Speaker 2: people can do is the softest shuck and jive when
• 1:56:30
  Speaker 2: the data does not fit their framework. It just doesn't.
• 1:56:35
  Speaker 2: All right, let us let me, let me go into
• 1:56:38
  Speaker 2: the uh, let me bring up my final summations. Okay,
• 1:56:46
  Speaker 2: what the paper actually shows. Manhood is described as earned
• 1:56:49
  Speaker 2: and fragile, a social status that is hard to win,
• 1:56:52
  Speaker 2: easy to lose, and must be proved repeatedly by action.
• 1:56:55
  Speaker 2: Real men are made, not born. This is not a
• 1:56:58
  Speaker 2: sex based birthright. It is a precarious achievement role. Right.
• 1:57:04
  Speaker 2: So men get a ticket into a precarious achievement role.
• 1:57:08
  Speaker 2: They get a ticket to the deadly man race. Men
• 1:57:13
  Speaker 2: are held to a stricter, more punitive rules. Stricter, more
• 1:57:16
  Speaker 2: punitive rules. Rules for boys and men are stricter than
• 1:57:18
  Speaker 2: rules for girls and women. Boys and men who violate
• 1:57:21
  Speaker 2: rules face more rejection, bullying and navigate negative evaluations and
• 1:57:25
  Speaker 2: more censure and punishment from parents. And these are just
• 1:57:28
  Speaker 2: these rules. What about the rules around domestic violence and
• 1:57:32
  Speaker 2: sexual coercion which just don't apply to women apparently, right?
• 1:57:38
  Speaker 2: What about the rules around criminality, which apparently only apply
• 1:57:41
  Speaker 2: to boys but not girls. What about the rules about sharing,
• 1:57:44
  Speaker 2: again apparently apply to boys and not girls. And if
• 1:57:50
  Speaker 2: you are going to apply all of these things asymmetrically,
• 1:57:53
  Speaker 2: how can you complain that maybe men should be allowed
• 1:57:58
  Speaker 2: to see themselves if stronger, if they have to constantly
• 1:58:00
  Speaker 2: demonstrate greater strength than women and girls, boys and men
• 1:58:05
  Speaker 2: who violate rules, Okay, men are put through a harsher
• 1:58:09
  Speaker 2: behavioral filter than women. The core pattern no weakness for
• 1:58:14
  Speaker 2: men everywhere. Prescriptions agency for men competent, confident, independent, determined, courageous,
• 1:58:21
  Speaker 2: communion for women compassionate, warm, supportive, devoted. Proscriptions weakness for
• 1:58:27
  Speaker 2: men weak, timid, fearful, dependent, insecure, dominance for women bossy, dominant, arrogant.
• 1:58:32
  Speaker 2: Across sixty two countries, prescriptions vary, but proscriptions appear universal.
• 1:58:37
  Speaker 2: Weakness is more strongly forbidden for men than for women.
• 1:58:40
  Speaker 2: In fifty nine of fifty two countries. The size of
• 1:58:43
  Speaker 2: this proscription double standard does not shrink in countries rated
• 1:58:48
  Speaker 2: more equal by the Global Gender gap Index. The one
• 1:58:52
  Speaker 2: stable rule is men absolutely cannot be weak, even in
• 1:58:57
  Speaker 2: the most gender equal societies. Remember I talked about at
• 1:59:00
  Speaker 2: length in the last episode, how women still they don't
• 1:59:05
  Speaker 2: let men are still expected to occupy their traditional gender role. Yeah, yeah,
• 1:59:12
  Speaker 2: who polices whom? In more gender equal countries, college women
• 1:59:15
  Speaker 2: hold men and women to similar to prescriptive rules. College
• 1:59:18
  Speaker 2: men still rate agency is more desirable in men than
• 1:59:20
  Speaker 2: communion and women. So men in college are actually recognizing
• 1:59:26
  Speaker 2: that the results of holding men to a higher standard
• 1:59:30
  Speaker 2: of strength means that men tend to be stronger. So
• 1:59:33
  Speaker 2: that's a good thing for men to be whereas that's wrong. Right,
• 1:59:39
  Speaker 2: according to this framework, we have to hold men to
• 1:59:42
  Speaker 2: a higher standard of strength. But if we say that
• 1:59:45
  Speaker 2: it's good for men to be strong, no, no, no,
• 1:59:51
  Speaker 2: that's not right. The size of this prescriptive double standard
• 1:59:56
  Speaker 2: does not okay for prescriptions both sex is almost uni
• 2:00:00
  Speaker 2: diversely want men to avoid weakness more strongly than they
• 2:00:03
  Speaker 2: want women to avoid dominance. With no robust participant gender interaction,
• 2:00:07
  Speaker 2: men slightly outpace women in endorsing male agency and high
• 2:00:11
  Speaker 2: global gender gap index countries. But everyone polices male weakness
• 2:00:15
  Speaker 2: more than female dominance. This was the primary finding. How
• 2:00:20
  Speaker 2: the authors spin this is the cost of male privilege,
• 2:00:23
  Speaker 2: This is the tap dance. They assert the stricter rules
• 2:00:27
  Speaker 2: for men reflect the higher social status that men versus
• 2:00:30
  Speaker 2: women enjoy, not men that fail to earn it. Though,
• 2:00:35
  Speaker 2: so that I said, they're trying to make the idea
• 2:00:38
  Speaker 2: that aristocrats police the expression of their class mean that
• 2:00:44
  Speaker 2: men have a higher standard. But aristocrats police the expression
• 2:00:50
  Speaker 2: of their class not among other aristocrats, but among peasants,
• 2:00:54
  Speaker 2: which is the outgroup, and men do not police the
• 2:00:58
  Speaker 2: expressions of their class among women. So this is fundamentally flawed. Okay.
• 2:01:07
  Speaker 2: They write that membership in the higher status gender group
• 2:01:10
  Speaker 2: gives men respect and influence, but these advantages come with
• 2:01:13
  Speaker 2: the cost yes earning them. Stricter boundary policing making manhood harder,
• 2:01:19
  Speaker 2: one easier loss, assidious policing functions to protect men's privileged
• 2:01:24
  Speaker 2: status and justify their advantage, but not social position, but
• 2:01:27
  Speaker 2: not against women against other men, So it's not in
• 2:01:31
  Speaker 2: plain language. They look at a system that gang prince's
• 2:01:33
  Speaker 2: men into higher stakes tournament. You can't be weak or
• 2:01:36
  Speaker 2: you'll be severely punished, and reinterpret the selection process as
• 2:01:39
  Speaker 2: the maintenance cost of pre existing male privilege, not as
• 2:01:43
  Speaker 2: the mechanism that produces men's status and competencies at all.
• 2:01:49
  Speaker 2: Like so that they're just saying that the deadly man
• 2:01:52
  Speaker 2: race is useless or we don't need to do it.
• 2:01:54
  Speaker 2: We don't need to run it, we don't need the
• 2:01:57
  Speaker 2: competencies that result in it. In fact, they're no competencies result.
• 2:02:01
  Speaker 2: There's nothing good that comes of it. It's it's just
• 2:02:04
  Speaker 2: an excuse to exclude women from the from you know,
• 2:02:07
  Speaker 2: pinning men pinning gold stars on each other. At the end,
• 2:02:11
  Speaker 2: the global gender Okay, it's already covered this one. Where
• 2:02:14
  Speaker 2: ideology trips over their own data, they downplay the strongest
• 2:02:18
  Speaker 2: result they clearly find strong near universal support for men
• 2:02:21
  Speaker 2: must not be weak with no meaningful moderation by global
• 2:02:25
  Speaker 2: gender gap index or participant gender. Yet they center a
• 2:02:30
  Speaker 2: much weaker, inconsistent prescriptive effect men's agency versus versus women's
• 2:02:35
  Speaker 2: communion as the key double standard and treat the proscription
• 2:02:39
  Speaker 2: result as background. So the key double standard here is
• 2:02:46
  Speaker 2: that non Western countries recognize that men when men are
• 2:02:53
  Speaker 2: held to a standard of strength, that's good that they
• 2:02:56
  Speaker 2: they actually become strong or are strong. Right, that's a
• 2:03:00
  Speaker 2: good thing. Men being strong is a good thing. And
• 2:03:03
  Speaker 2: when we hold them to a stihre strandard of strength,
• 2:03:05
  Speaker 2: men being strong is a good thing. Right, Whereas in
• 2:03:09
  Speaker 2: Western countries we hold men to a higher standard of strength.
• 2:03:12
  Speaker 2: Don't be weak men, but we don't recognize men being
• 2:03:15
  Speaker 2: strong as good And that's a double standard that harms women.
• 2:03:23
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 2:03:24
  Speaker 2: I think I maybe we all need a moment to
• 2:03:27
  Speaker 2: just process that. And yet and they and they and they,
• 2:03:35
  Speaker 2: and in order to focus that, they just ignore. It's
• 2:03:39
  Speaker 2: just like they have this huge finding, this gigantic double
• 2:03:43
  Speaker 2: standard throughout all of humanity that they studied that men
• 2:03:49
  Speaker 2: cannot be weak. And that's even that's even worse for
• 2:03:52
  Speaker 2: men to be weak than women to be strong, right,
• 2:03:54
  Speaker 2: this huge double standard, prescriptive uh per prescriptive double standard
• 2:04:00
  Speaker 2: that men labor under, and they just ignore it. They're
• 2:04:05
  Speaker 2: just like, oh, yeah, that's a that's that's that's for
• 2:04:08
  Speaker 2: a later date. Somebody else has to figure out what
• 2:04:10
  Speaker 2: to do with that. And that's not a double standard
• 2:04:15
  Speaker 2: we need to worry about, guys. No, oh, the giant
• 2:04:19
  Speaker 2: double standard that they found out. Don't look at that.
• 2:04:22
  Speaker 2: That's don't look behind the curtain. We don't need to
• 2:04:27
  Speaker 2: deal with that one. That's not that's not important. They
• 2:04:31
  Speaker 2: treat the prescription as background noise, inverting motives for men,
• 2:04:37
  Speaker 2: ignoring material conditions inventing motives. They claim double standards and
• 2:04:41
  Speaker 2: trade prescriptions are larger and less gender equal countries, which
• 2:04:45
  Speaker 2: is consistent with the logic that men's agentic traits are
• 2:04:49
  Speaker 2: especially desirable in places where they face stronger pressure to
• 2:04:52
  Speaker 2: fit traditional protector provider roles. They further suggest that as
• 2:04:56
  Speaker 2: members of the dominant gender role, because of course policing it,
• 2:05:02
  Speaker 2: not policing women out of it, but just policing men
• 2:05:05
  Speaker 2: in it, men in more gender equal contexts defensively enforce
• 2:05:11
  Speaker 2: conformity from other men and to protect in group boundaries,
• 2:05:16
  Speaker 2: but not in group boundaries again like, not women, right,
• 2:05:19
  Speaker 2: they don't. They don't police women in this way, just
• 2:05:21
  Speaker 2: other men. So they're protecting there in group of men
• 2:05:26
  Speaker 2: by policing men, not the outgroup women. Does that? Like,
• 2:05:33
  Speaker 2: what's it sounding is that this gets published and peer
• 2:05:35
  Speaker 2: reviewed and then people aren't like, wait, you're directly contradicting
• 2:05:40
  Speaker 2: the thing that you're saying here. How can men have
• 2:05:45
  Speaker 2: greater in group policing when they don't police the outgroup
• 2:05:49
  Speaker 2: at all?
• 2:05:50
  Speaker 1: Like?
• 2:05:50
  Speaker 2: How can they have greater like outgroup policing? How can
• 2:05:52
  Speaker 2: they police women? How can they be seen to be
• 2:05:56
  Speaker 2: policing their group men more if they do nothing to
• 2:06:00
  Speaker 2: police women, being you know, occupying them the status markers
• 2:06:05
  Speaker 2: of men. Right, they only do it on men. How
• 2:06:08
  Speaker 2: does anyway? But they never model. Obvious material drivers poverty
• 2:06:15
  Speaker 2: conflict informal economies are how much families depend on individual
• 2:06:19
  Speaker 2: men's income and physical protection. That to explain why in
• 2:06:24
  Speaker 2: societies where they also say men can't be weak, they
• 2:06:27
  Speaker 2: concede that if men are expected to be stronger than women,
• 2:06:32
  Speaker 2: that it's good that they be stronger than women, unlike
• 2:06:34
  Speaker 2: Western societies that also expect men to be stronger than women,
• 2:06:37
  Speaker 2: but consider it be very bad that men actually be
• 2:06:40
  Speaker 2: stronger than women because we are the smart ones in
• 2:06:47
  Speaker 2: harsher environments. The more parsimonius story is that life is
• 2:06:50
  Speaker 2: tougher in the cost of male failure is higher. Cultures
• 2:06:54
  Speaker 2: recognize and value male agency more, while the underlying no
• 2:06:57
  Speaker 2: weakness rule is already universal, so they just value it.
• 2:07:01
  Speaker 2: But I think what they're actually valuing is not playing
• 2:07:05
  Speaker 2: silly buggers with their men's brains. Like we're okay with that.
• 2:07:10
  Speaker 2: We're all like sitting on piles of cash and comfortable surroundings.
• 2:07:15
  Speaker 2: So we're just like, yeah, let's play a little game
• 2:07:17
  Speaker 2: of gas lettings with our men. Let's just gaslight the
• 2:07:20
  Speaker 2: fuck out of them. Let's let's just do that. Wow,
• 2:07:24
  Speaker 2: it's gonna be funny. Yeah, And they're like, no, we
• 2:07:31
  Speaker 2: don't want to do that because we want our men functional. No,
• 2:07:34
  Speaker 2: thank you. Maybe that's why a lot of these places
• 2:07:37
  Speaker 2: are like kicking us out. No, no, it's so you know.
• 2:07:41
  Speaker 2: But even Afghani women, if you can believe it, they
• 2:07:44
  Speaker 2: were like the they when we were OCCU when the
• 2:07:48
  Speaker 2: US and Canada because we were part of that, when
• 2:07:51
  Speaker 2: we were occupying Afghanistan, they were saying, can we, you know,
• 2:07:56
  Speaker 2: also help our men, can you do something for them
• 2:08:01
  Speaker 2: as well? And we were like no, just just gaslighting
• 2:08:07
  Speaker 2: and mental fuckery for those bastards.
• 2:08:12
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 2:08:12
  Speaker 2: Maybe that's one of the reasons why women were like
• 2:08:14
  Speaker 2: just you know what, fuck off, We'll take the burkas, okay.
• 2:08:21
  Speaker 1: So I got a rumble rant or not I got
• 2:08:26
  Speaker 1: I'm almost a super chow. I meant to say from
• 2:08:30
  Speaker 1: laptop to fifteen for five, and he says, the fact
• 2:08:33
  Speaker 1: that people are trying to argue you, albeit weekly, is
• 2:08:36
  Speaker 1: a good sign. It means you're making some in ways
• 2:08:39
  Speaker 1: into the public consciousness. Thank you, laptop. Yeah, yeah, I agree.
• 2:08:47
  Speaker 2: All right, So I'm gonna I'm getting to the end.
• 2:08:50
  Speaker 2: It's not much more, all right. And then at the end,
• 2:08:52
  Speaker 2: I'm also going to be talking about how we push
• 2:08:55
  Speaker 2: back mentally on this bullshit. I mean we're already doing that, right, Yeah,
• 2:09:00
  Speaker 2: we're already learning to be machines here. How you push
• 2:09:06
  Speaker 2: back against the ridiculous gaslighting as a man assuming dominant
• 2:09:11
  Speaker 2: gen dominant group policing without evidence. The only place that
• 2:09:16
  Speaker 2: data show men doing more policing men then women is
• 2:09:19
  Speaker 2: on male agency prescriptions and high global gender gap index contexts.
• 2:09:24
  Speaker 2: So everybody's policing men, women included, and they don't address
• 2:09:28
  Speaker 2: that at all. Right, From that, they spin a broad
• 2:09:32
  Speaker 2: narrative about men as a dominant in group harshly enforcing boundaries,
• 2:09:35
  Speaker 2: despite their own finding that the strongest rule men must
• 2:09:39
  Speaker 2: not be weak is jointly enforced by men and women
• 2:09:42
  Speaker 2: on men, right, So they're like they're just they just
• 2:09:46
  Speaker 2: skirt around the giant elephant in the room and they's
• 2:09:49
  Speaker 2: so giant, like you got like i know, a foot
• 2:09:51
  Speaker 2: of room, and they're just like, oh, look that's the
• 2:09:54
  Speaker 2: real there's the mouse. That's the big thing that we
• 2:09:56
  Speaker 2: need this focus on bound the mouse. From that they
• 2:10:02
  Speaker 2: spend abroad. Okay, they never show that men policemen more
• 2:10:05
  Speaker 2: than women on that do on that core rule, they
• 2:10:09
  Speaker 2: simply reassert the dominance narrative and ignore the symmetry. So
• 2:10:12
  Speaker 2: on the most important, most coercive rule, which is shaming
• 2:10:16
  Speaker 2: men for being weak, men and women do that equally.
• 2:10:22
  Speaker 2: Allegedly they might be more. You know, we can't get
• 2:10:24
  Speaker 2: into the fine grain details of who does it more, really,
• 2:10:27
  Speaker 2: but they basically do it equally, and that's the finding.
• 2:10:31
  Speaker 2: And they don't want to they don't want to touch
• 2:10:34
  Speaker 2: that because it completely destroys their narrative that men are
• 2:10:39
  Speaker 2: policing each other more because herpidert they're a high status group,
• 2:10:44
  Speaker 2: even even though a lot of them end up being
• 2:10:47
  Speaker 2: lower status because of the policing. Yeah, that's the thing
• 2:10:52
  Speaker 2: like when okay, you know what, I'll keep going, I'm
• 2:10:56
  Speaker 2: not gonna be labor, the peasants versus aristocrats thing. It
• 2:10:59
  Speaker 2: just doesn't make what the results look like without the
• 2:11:05
  Speaker 2: ideological filler, which is what you all should have been
• 2:11:08
  Speaker 2: waiting for, stripped to the frame the data supports this.
• 2:11:11
  Speaker 2: Manhood is not a free benefit of being male. It
• 2:11:16
  Speaker 2: is an earned, precarious status that can be lost. Boys
• 2:11:20
  Speaker 2: and men face stricter rules and Harsher sanctions for nonconformity
• 2:11:25
  Speaker 2: than girls and women, especially around weakness. Across cultures. The
• 2:11:30
  Speaker 2: central messages not men must be powerful, but men must
• 2:11:34
  Speaker 2: not be weak. This does not ease in gender equal
• 2:11:37
  Speaker 2: countries where explicit valuing of male agency is diluted, even
• 2:11:41
  Speaker 2: though the ban on weakness remains. So men cannot be weak,
• 2:11:46
  Speaker 2: but it's not good if they're strong. In Western countries,
• 2:11:49
  Speaker 2: that's our equality that we've created. Are you feeling the equality, guys?
• 2:11:55
  Speaker 2: Doesn't it feel good? Isn't that some great equality? In
• 2:12:01
  Speaker 2: Harsher's society, stronger prescriptions for male agency function as a
• 2:12:05
  Speaker 2: psychological buffer. They openly honor the tough, toughness and competence
• 2:12:10
  Speaker 2: men are expected to display under risk. In gender equal contacts,
• 2:12:14
  Speaker 2: the costs remain. Don't be weak, men while recognition and
• 2:12:18
  Speaker 2: honor fade the worst of both worlds for men. In
• 2:12:23
  Speaker 2: other words, this is a high stake selection regime. Men
• 2:12:27
  Speaker 2: are forced into a competition where losing carries severe penalties.
• 2:12:31
  Speaker 2: Those who survive and succeed gain status that is overwhelmingly earned,
• 2:12:37
  Speaker 2: not bestowed by the privileged ferry. It's earned, while many
• 2:12:44
  Speaker 2: men are discarded. Calling that payoff unearned privilege while ignoring
• 2:12:49
  Speaker 2: the selection and casualties is an ideological move, not a
• 2:12:53
  Speaker 2: scientific conclusion. Oh, that's being really polaite. It's bullshit, all right.
• 2:13:01
  Speaker 2: So how do we neutralize this framing, and in particular,
• 2:13:05
  Speaker 2: how do you do it internally? Because I know that
• 2:13:07
  Speaker 2: there are points in this where I almost get sucked
• 2:13:10
  Speaker 2: into the logic and then I have to drag myself out,
• 2:13:14
  Speaker 2: kicking and screaming. There is a here's here's a heuristic
• 2:13:19
  Speaker 2: you can apply first right when when? When? When trot
• 2:13:24
  Speaker 2: this shit out? Feminists, trot this shit out? When you
• 2:13:27
  Speaker 2: hear this, apply this heuristic first number one, separate earn
• 2:13:32
  Speaker 2: status from sex based privilege. Ask is this thing men
• 2:13:37
  Speaker 2: supposedly have attached to their sex or to is it
• 2:13:44
  Speaker 2: attached to their sex or to their performance under threat.
• 2:13:48
  Speaker 2: So if somebody trots out male privilege, ask yourself, is
• 2:13:52
  Speaker 2: this something I just get by virtue of being a man?
• 2:13:55
  Speaker 2: Or do I have to earn it often under considerable steaks.
• 2:14:01
  Speaker 2: If it is clearly operate, depends on the sustained effort,
• 2:14:04
  Speaker 2: risk or harsh standards i e. Protect or provider roles,
• 2:14:07
  Speaker 2: leadership under pressure. File it as earned status, not pre
• 2:14:12
  Speaker 2: existing privilege. And let me tell you that means that
• 2:14:15
  Speaker 2: when men have no privileges, they only have things they've earned.
• 2:14:20
  Speaker 2: And I think that's the point. Always ask at what cost?
• 2:14:25
  Speaker 2: Whenever you see claims of mail advantage, force yourself to
• 2:14:28
  Speaker 2: list the associated costs risk of injury, death, social disposability,
• 2:14:33
  Speaker 2: legal burdens, emotional suppression, sanctions for weakness. If the costs
• 2:14:38
  Speaker 2: are high and unavoidable. Refuse to accept unearned privilege as
• 2:14:43
  Speaker 2: a neutral descriptor. Okay yoink? Oh no, that's not yoink,
• 2:14:48
  Speaker 2: that's yeat, yeat yoink. Is what you're trying to do
• 2:14:56
  Speaker 2: with your self esteem, or at least maybe self esteem
• 2:14:59
  Speaker 2: is the right wa were is the wrong word? Trying
• 2:15:01
  Speaker 2: to do with your sense of peace? In her peace?
• 2:15:05
  Speaker 2: Joink it back from this bullshit. Three check whether the
• 2:15:09
  Speaker 2: metric is one sided. When you hear more equal country,
• 2:15:12
  Speaker 2: ask what's being measured? Is it something like Global Gender
• 2:15:16
  Speaker 2: Gap Index that only registers women's disadvantages. Remember, male burdens
• 2:15:21
  Speaker 2: literally do not exist in that number. Do not let
• 2:15:23
  Speaker 2: your moral intuitions be seared by one sided gauge. I've
• 2:15:27
  Speaker 2: called this for years orphan statistics, statistics that only look
• 2:15:31
  Speaker 2: at the situation for women in terms of victimhood and
• 2:15:35
  Speaker 2: only look at the situation for men in terms of
• 2:15:39
  Speaker 2: villainy perpetration. Always make sure, whatever statistics, if a feminist
• 2:15:46
  Speaker 2: comes at you with two hundred and fifty seven billion
• 2:15:49
  Speaker 2: percent of women are raped and then seeing a moment
• 2:15:52
  Speaker 2: every instance of the universe, that just say what's the
• 2:15:54
  Speaker 2: rape for men? And if she doesn't come out back
• 2:15:57
  Speaker 2: with anything, say, well, that's an orphan statistic. Yink, no yoink,
• 2:16:03
  Speaker 2: no yeat. I'll get those two eventually. Okay, flip the
• 2:16:08
  Speaker 2: sexes and see if the story would be called depression.
• 2:16:11
  Speaker 2: Take their pattern and imagine it applied to women. Women
• 2:16:14
  Speaker 2: must not show weakness in ninety five percent of countries,
• 2:16:17
  Speaker 2: and this doesn't ease with equality. Women must constantly prove
• 2:16:20
  Speaker 2: womanhood under threat of expulsion.
• 2:16:23
  Speaker 1: Oh.
• 2:16:23
  Speaker 2: Also, women can't be weak, but they also can't it's
• 2:16:27
  Speaker 2: not good for women to be strong. Women can't be uncertain,
• 2:16:31
  Speaker 2: but they can't seem to know too much. Women can't
• 2:16:35
  Speaker 2: be fearful, but they also shouldn't be brave. If we
• 2:16:39
  Speaker 2: made women walk this line, feminism would explode and it
• 2:16:44
  Speaker 2: would be like it would be like a nuclear bomb
• 2:16:47
  Speaker 2: in human history of like they would just they would
• 2:16:50
  Speaker 2: just be just you could just imagine this gigantic explosion
• 2:16:54
  Speaker 2: of incoherent rhysteric, hysterical screeching that reaches Pluto. It's like
• 2:17:01
  Speaker 2: you see like a bunch of aliens in their ship
• 2:17:04
  Speaker 2: out in like the ort cloud, right, and they're just like, WHOA,
• 2:17:07
  Speaker 2: what the hell was that? It would be feminists reacting
• 2:17:11
  Speaker 2: to if this double standard was applies to women. Okay,
• 2:17:18
  Speaker 2: women must constantly prove womanhood owunder threat of expulsion. If
• 2:17:22
  Speaker 2: everyone would call that oppression or exploitation for women, but
• 2:17:25
  Speaker 2: cost of privilege for men. Treat the original framing as
• 2:17:29
  Speaker 2: ideological not factual. Okay, I got seven of these and
• 2:17:33
  Speaker 2: we're on five. Five treat men is privileged as a hypothesis,
• 2:17:37
  Speaker 2: not a law. At this point, I don't even think
• 2:17:39
  Speaker 2: you need to treat it as a hypothesis. But if
• 2:17:41
  Speaker 2: it helps you keep in a state of cool detachment,
• 2:17:45
  Speaker 2: then do so. When you see circular moves, men have
• 2:17:48
  Speaker 2: power because patriarchy. Patriarch exists. Patriarchy exists because men have power.
• 2:17:53
  Speaker 2: Label them mentally as story not explanation, and a very
• 2:17:57
  Speaker 2: convenient circulatory circular story as well. Yes, ask what evidence
• 2:18:03
  Speaker 2: would falsify the claim? If nothing could downgrade it to dogma,
• 2:18:08
  Speaker 2: you're gonna be doing a lot of downgrading to dogma.
• 2:18:11
  Speaker 2: Just just maybe just practice a kind of a okay,
• 2:18:16
  Speaker 2: yeat kind of move next time somebody tries to bring
• 2:18:20
  Speaker 2: this shit to you, just just.
• 2:18:22
  Speaker 1: Follow this year is getting rid of it and is
• 2:18:26
  Speaker 1: taking it. So just get.
• 2:18:29
  Speaker 2: Yeat, okay. Anchor your own narrative and recipercosity, uh replace,
• 2:18:37
  Speaker 2: Men are guilty, women are owed with men, and women
• 2:18:40
  Speaker 2: owe each other for different kinds of risk and labor.
• 2:18:43
  Speaker 2: That's if you need to go you know, you're trying
• 2:18:46
  Speaker 2: dealing with some black pill stuff, right, if you need
• 2:18:50
  Speaker 2: to step away from that, then women can you know,
• 2:18:56
  Speaker 2: essentially this is judge women by their behavior and extend
• 2:19:03
  Speaker 2: protection and provision based on that. Right, If they are
• 2:19:06
  Speaker 2: good women, perhaps they deserve your protection and provision if
• 2:19:10
  Speaker 2: they are willing to be grateful for it. Right, But
• 2:19:14
  Speaker 2: that's entirely your choice. Remember remind yourself regularly. Men have
• 2:19:18
  Speaker 2: paid heavily for the roles that they fill. Acknowledging that
• 2:19:22
  Speaker 2: cost is basic honesty, not betrayal of women. Yes, yeah, right,
• 2:19:29
  Speaker 2: it's not betrayal of women. And a lot of men
• 2:19:31
  Speaker 2: struggle with this, right. They think that understanding these things
• 2:19:36
  Speaker 2: and integrating them in their life means that they're going
• 2:19:38
  Speaker 2: to be betraying women or not caring about women. It is.
• 2:19:44
  Speaker 2: I think it's almost impossible to make men not care
• 2:19:46
  Speaker 2: about women. I mean, women have really pushed it to
• 2:19:49
  Speaker 2: the point where I don't think it's that men don't
• 2:19:52
  Speaker 2: care about women. It's just that they're distancing themselves from it, right,
• 2:19:57
  Speaker 2: more than anything. So it's really hard to make men
• 2:20:01
  Speaker 2: not care about women. And I think a lot of
• 2:20:03
  Speaker 2: this is self protective for men, because they're concerned that
• 2:20:07
  Speaker 2: they will stop caring about women. It's unlikely to happen.
• 2:20:10
  Speaker 2: It's like I say, saying that you care about women
• 2:20:14
  Speaker 2: is like male feminists are constantly self stemming over stuff
• 2:20:18
  Speaker 2: like that, Oh we care about women. Yeah, that's the baseline, dude, right,
• 2:20:22
  Speaker 2: caring about women every most men do. Okay, it's like
• 2:20:27
  Speaker 2: sort of built into the beast. So really, the point is,
• 2:20:32
  Speaker 2: don't worry about that. Worry about making sure that the
• 2:20:35
  Speaker 2: women you care about are worth it. Notice why you're jumping.
• 2:20:41
  Speaker 2: I've never attacked you, and you're like jumping every time
• 2:20:44
  Speaker 2: I put my head fits down. Notice I'm being a
• 2:20:48
  Speaker 2: little bit. It's because she attacked me today. I'm a
• 2:20:51
  Speaker 2: little salty. Notice when guilt is being used as a
• 2:20:55
  Speaker 2: control tactic. If an argument leaves men with total responsibility
• 2:20:59
  Speaker 2: and no legitimate way to be good except through endless atonement,
• 2:21:03
  Speaker 2: flag it as a manipulative frame, not a moral truth.
• 2:21:07
  Speaker 2: Consciously withdraw your emotional buy in. I can evaluate evidence
• 2:21:11
  Speaker 2: and ethics without accepting inherited guilt use consistently. These checks
• 2:21:16
  Speaker 2: make it harder for pre existing male privileged story to
• 2:21:19
  Speaker 2: hijack your understanding. You're not denying that men must sometimes
• 2:21:25
  Speaker 2: misuse power. Okay, this is just for the guys who
• 2:21:29
  Speaker 2: are worried that, oh my god, I'm you know you're
• 2:21:32
  Speaker 2: you're you're allowing men to be evil. No, nobody's saying
• 2:21:36
  Speaker 2: that men aren't capable of doing this stuff. We're saying
• 2:21:38
  Speaker 2: women are also capable of doing it, and do it
• 2:21:41
  Speaker 2: a lot. That's it. Yes, right, and this this manipulation
• 2:21:44
  Speaker 2: is wrong one of the big and also this freaking,
• 2:21:49
  Speaker 2: this freaking study is trying to make men policing men,
• 2:21:52
  Speaker 2: which is the basis of the justice system and all
• 2:21:54
  Speaker 2: the protections that women enjoy, even from their own violence.
• 2:21:58
  Speaker 2: The violence of other women's a bad thing. No, you're
• 2:22:05
  Speaker 2: refusing a framework that erases male sacrifice and treats any
• 2:22:08
  Speaker 2: earned status under threat as an original sin. Okay, So
• 2:22:13
  Speaker 2: those are the seven things you have to ask yourself
• 2:22:16
  Speaker 2: when someone comes at you with any allegation of male privilege,
• 2:22:21
  Speaker 2: especially based on this piece of shit that we just read. Okay,
• 2:22:27
  Speaker 2: all right, Brian, do you want to add anything to that?
• 2:22:31
  Speaker 1: No, I think you covered it. I mean it's pretty
• 2:22:34
  Speaker 1: uh in depth. I guess I would just say, like,
• 2:22:36
  Speaker 1: another thing I think you should be asking yourself is
• 2:22:39
  Speaker 1: why are they doing this?
• 2:22:41
  Speaker 2: Like?
• 2:22:41
  Speaker 1: What do they want? I know they want to make money,
• 2:22:44
  Speaker 1: and I know they want to get a power, But
• 2:22:46
  Speaker 1: what is like what would be another side effect of
• 2:22:49
  Speaker 1: them if they got their way, if they were like
• 2:22:52
  Speaker 1: able to say, you know, we got to remove like
• 2:22:55
  Speaker 1: we got to defeat patriarchy by essentially like removing men's
• 2:23:00
  Speaker 1: gender roles too, like patrigar hurts men too, Like how
• 2:23:03
  Speaker 1: would they see that addressed? And what does that look like?
• 2:23:07
  Speaker 1: And do we want that? That's all I would just
• 2:23:10
  Speaker 1: pose it, you know, out there for you guys to
• 2:23:13
  Speaker 1: think about. So I saw somebody said in the chat,
• 2:23:18
  Speaker 1: what let me see where it says here? Did somebody
• 2:23:22
  Speaker 1: take it down? Oh no, here we go murder of process.
• 2:23:25
  Speaker 1: Seems like the average man is in a Mexican standoff
• 2:23:28
  Speaker 1: with masculinity on one side and women and their feminists
• 2:23:31
  Speaker 1: on the other. I don't see it that way, Like
• 2:23:33
  Speaker 1: masculinity is not your enemy, That's what I'm saying, Like,
• 2:23:37
  Speaker 1: don't let these people create the framing of what masculinity is.
• 2:23:40
  Speaker 1: Don't let anybody do that. Okay, but you know what
• 2:23:43
  Speaker 1: it is. It's in you. It's it's inside of you instinctively,
• 2:23:47
  Speaker 1: and there's nothing wrong with it, Like there's it's not
• 2:23:50
  Speaker 1: it's not bad to be a man. This is you know,
• 2:23:53
  Speaker 1: it's okay to be male, right, And that's what I'm
• 2:23:56
  Speaker 1: I want to because I think that I don't want
• 2:24:00
  Speaker 1: to like tell people how to live. And I don't
• 2:24:02
  Speaker 1: want to make a prescription about like how your life
• 2:24:05
  Speaker 1: should be. I want to allow people the freedom to
• 2:24:09
  Speaker 1: choose to live how they want. But I do that
• 2:24:11
  Speaker 1: with a recognition that most people are going to fall
• 2:24:15
  Speaker 1: into the general like box of what it is to
• 2:24:19
  Speaker 1: be a man or what it is to be a woman,
• 2:24:21
  Speaker 1: and that there's no shame to that. And people who
• 2:24:23
  Speaker 1: want to shatter that open they do that under the
• 2:24:26
  Speaker 1: guides of liberty, but they're really trying to control you
• 2:24:29
  Speaker 1: in a different way. It's like a reverse control. I
• 2:24:32
  Speaker 1: guess where they're saying, well, we just want you to
• 2:24:34
  Speaker 1: feel like you don't have to be a man, But
• 2:24:36
  Speaker 1: they don't want you to be a man because if
• 2:24:37
  Speaker 1: you say, well, what if I want to be a man,
• 2:24:39
  Speaker 1: what if I want to lift weights? What if I
• 2:24:41
  Speaker 1: want to eat healthy? What if I want a nice car,
• 2:24:44
  Speaker 1: what if I want to earn some money, what if
• 2:24:45
  Speaker 1: I want to start my own business? Right, No, they
• 2:24:49
  Speaker 1: call all those things toxically masculine traits. They literally write
• 2:24:53
  Speaker 1: articles about how going to the gym, eating meat, you know,
• 2:24:57
  Speaker 1: wanting a nice car, buying a house, like building your
• 2:25:01
  Speaker 1: own business, all of these things are like bad things,
• 2:25:04
  Speaker 1: so like, well, okay, then what do they want? And
• 2:25:06
  Speaker 1: I think that I think that, like the it's a
• 2:25:11
  Speaker 1: good thing to think about. It's all I'm asking, so anyway,
• 2:25:16
  Speaker 1: and I don't I don't see it the way that
• 2:25:18
  Speaker 1: you are. You you seem to see it. So but anyway,
• 2:25:23
  Speaker 1: that's all. That's all I would add to that is
• 2:25:26
  Speaker 1: ask yourself why they're doing this?
• 2:25:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, so let's see. The final thing I wanted
• 2:25:38
  Speaker 2: to point out is definitely don't like the ear of
• 2:25:41
  Speaker 2: the serious problems with this and how they fail as
• 2:25:47
  Speaker 2: serious academic research. They ignore their strong own stronger finding.
• 2:25:52
  Speaker 2: They fixate on a relatively small pattern in prescriptions men's
• 2:25:55
  Speaker 2: agency versus women's communion, and never integrate the much stronger,
• 2:25:59
  Speaker 2: nearly universe pattern in proscriptions men must not be weak,
• 2:26:02
  Speaker 2: even though their own models show gender equity does not
• 2:26:05
  Speaker 2: equality does not change that, so they don't actually address
• 2:26:10
  Speaker 2: their findings. They just go with the weaker and more
• 2:26:16
  Speaker 2: inconsistent finding that works sort of with their ideology motives
• 2:26:20
  Speaker 2: assumed alternatives ignore. They automatically interpret men's higher endorsement of
• 2:26:25
  Speaker 2: Maile agency as a defensive move to protect dominance and
• 2:26:28
  Speaker 2: in group boundaries, rather than considering non pathologizing explanations, for example,
• 2:26:33
  Speaker 2: men knowing from experience that other men need to be
• 2:26:36
  Speaker 2: competent and agentic for things to work, especially under high expectations,
• 2:26:41
  Speaker 2: inconsistent use of gender. When men are harsher on male
• 2:26:44
  Speaker 2: non conformity, it's taken as evidence of dominant group boundary policing.
• 2:26:48
  Speaker 2: When women are similarly harsh, including in other literatures, that
• 2:26:52
  Speaker 2: possibility is not exploited at all. Admitting the theory doesn't
• 2:26:56
  Speaker 2: actually fit the data, they can see the defensive response
• 2:26:59
  Speaker 2: to equalities theory story cannot illuminate why participant gender does
• 2:27:04
  Speaker 2: not interact with gender equality for prescriptions like men cannot
• 2:27:07
  Speaker 2: be weak, But instead of re examining the dominance in
• 2:27:11
  Speaker 2: group premise, they just park it thus must wait further investigation.
• 2:27:15
  Speaker 2: Herp Herb. This is bad science. This is phenomenally bad science,
• 2:27:23
  Speaker 2: and it is a perfect example of all of the
• 2:27:27
  Speaker 2: science like this is. This is not like you could pull.
• 2:27:30
  Speaker 2: I mean, honestly, this is not the worst. Some of
• 2:27:33
  Speaker 2: the worst is the female semiotics of the water lily,
• 2:27:37
  Speaker 2: the feminist semiotics of the water lily. But this is
• 2:27:40
  Speaker 2: not the worst. But it is. If you just randomly
• 2:27:44
  Speaker 2: pull out a bit of feminist scholarship, you will find
• 2:27:48
  Speaker 2: stuff just like this. And I see, uh, Nick Redding
• 2:27:56
  Speaker 2: is in the in the chat. Yeah, I apparently he's
• 2:28:04
  Speaker 2: he's still upset because we're crypto fa crypto feminists or something.
• 2:28:10
  Speaker 1: Buh okay.
• 2:28:14
  Speaker 2: So I've come up with a formula. As Allison has
• 2:28:17
  Speaker 2: rented a second house, the likelihood that some good will
• 2:28:19
  Speaker 2: happen for men approaches one. Well, actually, this the Bajor
• 2:28:24
  Speaker 2: Badger Cave, was purchased like ten years ago now, and
• 2:28:27
  Speaker 2: it did actually underwrite the International Conference for Men's Issues
• 2:28:31
  Speaker 2: twenty nineteen, so it could be in a hotel which
• 2:28:33
  Speaker 2: I didn't get to go to because I was stopped
• 2:28:36
  Speaker 2: at the border because probably I'm on a blacklist with
• 2:28:38
  Speaker 2: Homeland Security. So yeah, I mean you can, you can
• 2:28:44
  Speaker 2: bitch and wine about what we are aren't doing, but
• 2:28:47
  Speaker 2: we have done a lot of in person stuff and
• 2:28:50
  Speaker 2: we continue to do in person stuff, but unfortunately there's
• 2:28:55
  Speaker 2: a lot of forces arrayed against us doing it. But
• 2:28:59
  Speaker 2: you know, and if you want to take part in
• 2:29:01
  Speaker 2: any kind of activism that is taking action in terms
• 2:29:07
  Speaker 2: of men's issues, we're going to be putting on another
• 2:29:11
  Speaker 2: event in Calgary this year in September, so you know,
• 2:29:15
  Speaker 2: mark September down on your calendars, probably the first week
• 2:29:19
  Speaker 2: and get out there and we'll have the discussion and
• 2:29:23
  Speaker 2: we'll talk about how we can go forward in public
• 2:29:27
  Speaker 2: with men's issues. All right. So there you go, remember, guys,
• 2:29:31
  Speaker 2: first week September market on your calendars. If you want
• 2:29:35
  Speaker 2: to start making this more public and bringing into the
• 2:29:38
  Speaker 2: real world, then you start planning to come and take part,
• 2:29:43
  Speaker 2: all right. So I'm gonna hand that back to Brian.
• 2:29:47
  Speaker 2: All right, I have nothing left to say.
• 2:29:51
  Speaker 1: All right, Well, yeah, no problem. If you guys like
• 2:29:55
  Speaker 1: this video, please hit like subscribe if you're not already subscribe.
• 2:29:59
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• 2:30:02
  Speaker 1: leave us a comment, let us know you guys think
• 2:30:04
  Speaker 1: what we discussed on the show today, and please share
• 2:30:06
  Speaker 1: this video because Sharry is caring. Thank you guys so
• 2:30:09
  Speaker 1: much for coming on today's episode of Maintaining Frame and
• 2:30:11
  Speaker 1: we will talk to you all in the next one.