Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / WARNING PARENTS! Girl, 10, DIES During Dangerous TikTok Challenge

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WARNING PARENTS! Girl, 10, DIES During Dangerous TikTok Challenge · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Greece warning to parents, warning a
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Speaker 1: ten year old little girl, Absolutely beautiful little girl is dead.
0:27
Speaker 1: Not from a car crash, not from an accident on
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Speaker 1: the playground, not from some drive by shooting at the mall.
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Speaker 1: She is dead, a ten year old little girl. And
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Speaker 1: all I can think about is my little girl and
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Speaker 1: my little boy at age ten. She is dead because
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Speaker 1: of a TikTok challenge. May they wrought in hell is
0:54
Speaker 1: the nicest way I can put it. And now, to
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Speaker 1: top it all off, we're finding out that this little
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Speaker 1: girl and others like her were allegedly specifically targeted through
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Speaker 1: an algorithm. You know how when you're online and you're
1:13
Speaker 1: reading an article and suddenly, let's see, I get a
1:16
Speaker 1: pop up for boys crocs because I was just on
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Speaker 1: Amazon searching for crocs from my son weird chue size
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Speaker 1: fourteen and a half. And at first I thought, wow,
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Speaker 1: how do they know I'm interested in crocs? Well, then
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Speaker 1: the next time popped up Easter dresses because I've been
1:34
Speaker 1: looking for Easter dresses for my daughter. They target you.
1:39
Speaker 1: This ten year old child was targeted, and she was
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Speaker 1: sent info on this TikTok challenge and now she's dead,
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Speaker 1: a ten year old little girl. Let's see if you
1:53
Speaker 1: start schooling at seventy, start at seven or six. Let's
1:56
Speaker 1: go at six, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, first, second, third, fourth,
2:00
Speaker 1: fifth grade, fifth grade. Dead. I Nancy Grace. This is
2:08
Speaker 1: Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here at
2:11
Speaker 1: Fox Nation and Serious X one eleven. First of all,
2:14
Speaker 1: take a listen to this. It is almost impossible to
2:17
Speaker 1: fathom what this family from Chester is enduring. This is
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Speaker 1: the latest child death to be linked to a social
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Speaker 1: media dare dubbed the blackout challenge. This is where you
2:26
Speaker 1: hold your breath until you pass out. Here's what this
2:29
Speaker 1: young victim's mother wants you to know. It happened to her, good,
2:33
Speaker 1: smart kid, and it happened under her own roof while
2:37
Speaker 1: the family was at home. She was a butterfly, She
2:42
Speaker 1: was every pain. She was a happy child. Ten year
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Speaker 1: old Nila Anderson has described as fun and bright. She
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Speaker 1: spoke three languages. Like most tweens, She was on social
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Speaker 1: media and participated in the recently popular, viral and extremely
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Speaker 1: dangerous blackout challenge to see sort of how long almost
3:02
Speaker 1: you can be breathless or you know, hold your breath.
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Speaker 1: But it can result in a strangulation, a blackout challenge
3:13
Speaker 1: leaving a ten year old little girl dead in her
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Speaker 1: own home. How many times in the night if I
3:21
Speaker 1: wake up, do I check on the twins? Make sure
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Speaker 1: they're okay when they go to bed. In the morning,
3:29
Speaker 1: when they're back there doing their homework, I check on them.
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Speaker 1: Can you imagine going in to check on your little
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Speaker 1: girl or boy in finding them dead. That is the
3:39
Speaker 1: horror that this family is living through. With me an
3:43
Speaker 1: all star panel to make sense of what we know
3:45
Speaker 1: right now. Jeff Goodman a high profile lawyer representing the
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Speaker 1: victim's family. He's a partner at Salzmjaluzi Bundeski PC and
3:55
Speaker 1: at makesocial Media safe dot com. He's practiced all over,
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Speaker 1: but he is located in Philly. Jeff Goodman joining US.
4:04
Speaker 1: Doctor Jorry Crawlsen, Psychologists faculty Saint Leo University, research consultant
4:09
Speaker 1: and author of Operations. Glenn Bard joining us from Pennsylvania
4:16
Speaker 1: State Trooper first Class and he is a computer crime investigator,
4:21
Speaker 1: also a veteran of Desert Storm. Doctor Michelle Duprey joining
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Speaker 1: me forensic pathologists, medical examiner, detective and author of homicide
4:31
Speaker 1: investigation field guide. But first to Dave Mattcrime online dot
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Speaker 1: Com investigative reporter, Dave, where did this happen? And this
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Speaker 1: happened in Nila Anderson's home with her mother downstairs in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.
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Speaker 1: It's hurtful to think this happened in their own home.
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Speaker 1: To you, Jeff Goodman, high profile lawyer helping the victim's family.
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Speaker 1: Does the family still live in the same place where
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Speaker 1: their little girl died, where Nila lost her life, Yes,
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Speaker 1: they do. The family was downstairs that afternoon while Nilo
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Speaker 1: was up they thought taking a nap. She was instead
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Speaker 1: participating in this challenge when the family had the horror
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Speaker 1: that no family should ever see, when her mother found
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Speaker 1: her daughter asphyxiated in her room. I don't know how
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Speaker 1: they keep on. Tell me how the family is doing.
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Speaker 1: It is a struggle every day for Tauana and her children.
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Speaker 1: One of the ways that they keep on is by
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Speaker 1: trying to help make sure this doesn't happen to other families,
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Speaker 1: trying to help to spread the message of the dangers
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Speaker 1: that can come with these challenges, and the dangers that
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Speaker 1: can come when social media giants like TikTok don't behave
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Speaker 1: responsibly and safely. Dave Matt, tell me exactly what happened, Nappy,
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Speaker 1: as you just heard. Nila Anderson was upstairs. Her family
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Speaker 1: thought that she was laying down, but Nilo was actually
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Speaker 1: online on her phone and was on TikTok. The blackout
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Speaker 1: challenge on TikTok was there on her phone while she
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Speaker 1: tried to do this challenge. In this particular case, while
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Speaker 1: her family was downstairs. Her mom is downstairs. Nyla took
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Speaker 1: her the strap from her mother's purse and based on
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Speaker 1: instruction she got via TikTok, she used that strap around
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Speaker 1: her own neck in her mother's closet and hung herself,
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Speaker 1: not intentionally. Her intention was not to hang herself. Her
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Speaker 1: intention was to play the blackout challenge, and she did.
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Speaker 1: She blacked out. Take a listen to our cut three
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Speaker 1: our friends at wp z I doctor Zay. Nyla was
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Speaker 1: at home when she tried the trend. She happened to
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Speaker 1: be in her own bedroom of her house with her
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Speaker 1: family at home, but no one was in the bedroom
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Speaker 1: with her when this happened, so there was no one
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Speaker 1: there to save her. NILA's family is in a state
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Speaker 1: of shock. They rushed her to No Moore's Children's Hospital,
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Speaker 1: but she didn't make it. I'm sworn if a payment
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Speaker 1: don't go away. This is Tubby, he said. It's happy
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Speaker 1: and though that was so worried. Medical authorities say the
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Speaker 1: lack of oxygen can lead to cardiac arrest and other
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Speaker 1: medical dangers, significant organ damage, including brain damage, which really
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Speaker 1: is one of the most vulnerable organs to lack of oxygen,
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Speaker 1: and even death. To doctor Michelle Duprey joining us, Doctor Duprey,
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Speaker 1: thank you for being with us, explained to me what
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Speaker 1: we were just hearing from our friends at WPPI. Well, Nancy,
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Speaker 1: the lack of oxygen actually causes the brain to swell.
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Speaker 1: And as you know, the brain is inside our bone skull,
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Speaker 1: and so when it swells, it can't really expand, and
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Speaker 1: that causes the brain to shift, and when it does this,
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Speaker 1: it often presses down onto our restiratory center, which is
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Speaker 1: in the medulla of our brain, and it causes us
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Speaker 1: to then stop breathing. This is a trend all across
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Speaker 1: the country, and it's not just this little girl, Nyla
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Speaker 1: that has passed away. Take a listen to our cut eight.
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Speaker 1: I don't know if the name Lateria Smith Junior rings
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Speaker 1: a bell to you take a listen to our friends
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Speaker 1: WRG the family of Laterias Smith Junior remembers how talkative,
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Speaker 1: how outgoing the nine year old little boy was. All Roman.
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Speaker 1: You've always seen that instead of the boy looking forward
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Speaker 1: to a summer full of activities, his relatives now prepare
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Speaker 1: for his funeral, to see that pebe laying in that
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Speaker 1: casket hasn't even had an opportunity to grow up. You know,
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Speaker 1: his life has ended because of some people putting stupid
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Speaker 1: things on various sites. Terius, whose family calls TJ, was
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Speaker 1: familiar with social media sites. He was discovered unresponsive in
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Speaker 1: his room last week. They saw the built was around
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Speaker 1: his neck and gave rush into the hospital, but he
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Speaker 1: didn't survive. It wasn't until later on that we found
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Speaker 1: out that there was some type of video on TikTok.
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Speaker 1: TJ just nine years old when he saw this TikTok
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Speaker 1: challenge and now he's dead. Hear more about TJ from
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Speaker 1: our friends at w R EGR Cut nine. There was
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Speaker 1: some type of video on TikTok, you know, letting kids
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Speaker 1: know you know how to what is it? Strangle yourself?
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Speaker 1: But you gotta get out. The challenge is to get
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Speaker 1: out of it. But he's nine years old. He's nine
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Speaker 1: years old, so how was he going to get out
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Speaker 1: of it? Over the last few years throughout the country,
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Speaker 1: various social media trends like the passout challenge or choking
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Speaker 1: games have been blamed for the deaths of young people.
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Speaker 1: I nine year old nephew. I mean, he's gone as
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Speaker 1: a result of this, and the family is just devastated.
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Speaker 1: This family doesn't want others to endure the pain they're experiencing.
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Speaker 1: Their message to parents tonight, as we approach the summer,
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Speaker 1: when children will have even more free time monitor everything.
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Speaker 1: They encourage parents to block various social media sites as
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Speaker 1: well as educate themselves. But what could be lurking behind
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Speaker 1: your child's screen? I know you can't watch them, you know,
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Speaker 1: twenty four hours, but that in which you can do,
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Speaker 1: just have to save a line. A nine year old
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Speaker 1: little boy TJ dead, now ten year old Nyla dead.
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Speaker 1: They're not the only ones. Take a list an hour
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Speaker 1: cut ten kfo R talking about a twelve year old boy.
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Speaker 1: Police are warning right now that kids are spending a
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Speaker 1: lot of time alone and board. They say it's leading
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Speaker 1: to especially pre teens taking part in a so called
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Speaker 1: blackout challenge. His family's devastated, of course, on something just
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Speaker 1: nonsense that happened. Police say they found the twelve year
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Speaker 1: old boy dead in a breeze way of this Bethany
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Speaker 1: apartment complex just after midnight. They say there were marks
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Speaker 1: on his neck. This was not a suicide attempt, but
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Speaker 1: just an accident based on a possible TikTok challenge. It
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Speaker 1: goes by different names, blackout challenge, pass out challenge, speed dreaming,
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Speaker 1: the fainting game. Kids asphyxiating themselves, either choking themselves out
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Speaker 1: by hand or using some sort of a ligature like
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Speaker 1: a rope or a belt or something like that, just
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Speaker 1: so they can get the euphoria when they start to
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Speaker 1: wake up. Speed dreaming, the fainting game. That is certainly
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Speaker 1: airbrushing the horrible truth of what this TikTok blackout challenge is.
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Speaker 1: It's a surefire way to kill yourself unwittingly. Time stories
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Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace straight up to Glenn bard Form in
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Speaker 1: Pennsylvania State Trooper first class Computer Crime Investigations. He is
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Speaker 1: at pat Tech pat c Tech Digital Forensics. Glenn, thank
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Speaker 1: you for being with us. What is wrong with TikTok?
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Speaker 1: Why would they? Now, I've got to tell you, Glenn,
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Speaker 1: both John David and Lucy and my children, now fourteen,
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Speaker 1: have done TikTok challenges, both of the same nature, on
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Speaker 1: two separate occasions, one with John David and one with Lucy.
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Speaker 1: I was working in the den minding my own business,
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Speaker 1: and John David appeared in the kitchen. He's pouring all
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Speaker 1: these different things together. I don't even remember what they
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Speaker 1: all wore that. He was getting out of the kitchen
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Speaker 1: and I said, Son, are you actually cooking something? I
13:21
Speaker 1: am in shock. He knows how to make cereal and ramen,
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Speaker 1: so I was stunned. Here's no mom, I'm doing a
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Speaker 1: TikTok challenge. I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa what TikTok challenge?
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Speaker 1: It was harmless. And then Lucy's was similar. She was
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Speaker 1: doing a TikTok challenge in the kitchen, pouring a bunch
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Speaker 1: of stuff together, and it was supposed to react some way,
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Speaker 1: Glen Bard, is there no oversight at TikTok? Well, the
13:49
Speaker 1: thing about it is that first off, they do have
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Speaker 1: certain settings, like they try to say they have these
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Speaker 1: thirteen years or older to have an account, but that's
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Speaker 1: not verified obviously. Oh please, if that's the work that works,
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Speaker 1: I mean, that's like all the dating sides where you're
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Speaker 1: supposed to put how old you are and sending the
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Speaker 1: picture of yourself. That's all bs. So you're telling me
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Speaker 1: a child won't go on to an inviting side that's
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Speaker 1: targeted at them and lie about their age. Of course
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Speaker 1: they all lie about their age. Well, that's exactly it. Again.
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Speaker 1: It claims you have to be thirteen to have an
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Speaker 1: account or be a TikTok user, but there is no
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Speaker 1: age verification. So that is one way where they're saying
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Speaker 1: that they're trying to make sure children don't get access
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Speaker 1: to this, but there's no way to actually confirm or
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Speaker 1: verify any of that. The other thing is that these
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Speaker 1: different challenges go viral, and they go viral based off
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Speaker 1: an algorithm. They tell people that they should be watching
14:51
Speaker 1: these videos based on their past history, location, and different
14:55
Speaker 1: things like that. So it kind of if a person
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Speaker 1: looks at one challenge and makes comments and watch those
15:02
Speaker 1: videos over and over sort of to start seeing more
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Speaker 1: challenges come into there. For your page, what can you
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Speaker 1: tell me about claims that TikTok has an algorithm like
15:13
Speaker 1: the one I was describing. Obviously, I've been targeted to
15:16
Speaker 1: buy stuff that specifically targets certain age children. Well, what
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Speaker 1: the algorithm is, simply enough, an algorithm is nothing more
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Speaker 1: than a set of rules to complete a task in
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Speaker 1: this class, this instance, a task of telling people who
15:33
Speaker 1: what to watch on there for you page. And it's
15:36
Speaker 1: based off two different things, two different brackets, you could say.
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Speaker 1: The first one is going to be things like your location,
15:42
Speaker 1: the language you're using, and so on, so the basic
15:45
Speaker 1: comment stuff woly think of. The second set of rules
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Speaker 1: is based off of things like the likes, shares, and
15:52
Speaker 1: comments and even videos that are being completely watched for
15:56
Speaker 1: rewatched again. So what it's doing is if you have
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Speaker 1: a person who likes and comments on a certain hashtag
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Speaker 1: or on videos that do include these different challenges, they're
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Speaker 1: going to be recommended to watch more of these similar videos. Okay,
16:13
Speaker 1: let me ask you, doctor Georgy, do you understand what
16:15
Speaker 1: he just said? I kind of do, and I kind
16:17
Speaker 1: of don't. Let me just say they didn't teach me
16:19
Speaker 1: that at law school. All right, now, you put a
16:22
Speaker 1: crime scene type around it, I will run circles around you.
16:25
Speaker 1: But whatever he just said, what yeah, let me took
16:29
Speaker 1: from the psychological perspective, there's a science or a new study.
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Speaker 1: It's called cyberpsychology, okay, And there's things that have been
16:38
Speaker 1: developed and understood through the research over the last ten
16:41
Speaker 1: fifteen years in social media and the algorithms that can
16:46
Speaker 1: really be fine tuned. Also, he talked about two broad categories,
16:52
Speaker 1: but once they're logged in then they can be even
16:57
Speaker 1: further fine tuned to kick out, you know, likes and dislikes,
17:03
Speaker 1: and that comes into the marketing area of it. One
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Speaker 1: thing in cyberpsychology is the um addictive quality that social
17:15
Speaker 1: media has. My stars hold on. I'm writing that an
17:19
Speaker 1: addicted quality because we our family, we don't have devices
17:26
Speaker 1: at the supper table or if we're we're we're in
17:28
Speaker 1: the car riding somewhere and we're all talking. They are
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Speaker 1: like monkeys with a toy. John David and Lucy to
17:39
Speaker 1: my children, I have to like take it out of
17:42
Speaker 1: their hand and then that's an h l l of
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Speaker 1: a fight right there to get it, or we'll be
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Speaker 1: in a rustaurant. Ill look over and John David is
17:49
Speaker 1: staring right at it and you know who else does it?
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Speaker 1: My husband and I said, are you addicted? What is
17:55
Speaker 1: wrong with you? Which is I know, not a good
17:58
Speaker 1: way to start a subject by saying is wrong with you.
18:01
Speaker 1: He's long since learned to just say everything, everything is
18:04
Speaker 1: wrong with me, and I'm well, I can't fight about that.
18:07
Speaker 1: But it's it's like alcohol or drugs. Yeah, because it's
18:12
Speaker 1: a positive reinforcement. It's the opportunity to express your personality.
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Speaker 1: That's the other thing that comes out in cyberpsychology is
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Speaker 1: that algorithms, anything that you post is going to be
18:25
Speaker 1: reflective of your personality. So if there's a devian personality,
18:29
Speaker 1: it's going to come out in you know, your social profile,
18:34
Speaker 1: anything that you put out there. Okay, just hold on,
18:38
Speaker 1: doctor Jory, Jeff Goodman, doctor Dupre, davemac now joining me,
18:43
Speaker 1: a very good friend, Titania from Bark. I still don't
18:48
Speaker 1: get and I understand that it happens like I've never
18:52
Speaker 1: really tried to figure out how the TV works or
18:54
Speaker 1: how the phone works. I just know that it does.
18:56
Speaker 1: I also know that when I go on my iPad
18:59
Speaker 1: of my computer, I get a barrage of advertisements similar
19:03
Speaker 1: to things I've been shopping four. All right, so let
19:07
Speaker 1: me ask you to Tania Jordan joining me from our
19:11
Speaker 1: friends at BARK. I've got Bark on the twins phones
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Speaker 1: and it's very sensitive. It picks up if somebody sends
19:18
Speaker 1: them a text with a curse word in it. I
19:21
Speaker 1: remember John David. Let me bore you for one moment
19:24
Speaker 1: to Tania, because you've heard the story before. He's the
19:27
Speaker 1: goalie on the soccer team and he dove through the
19:30
Speaker 1: net one time to stop a goal, and he was
19:32
Speaker 1: so proud, and he was showing off his bruise that
19:34
Speaker 1: he got from saving you stopping a goal. And Bark
19:38
Speaker 1: sent me an alert about self harm because he had
19:43
Speaker 1: a bruise. It's very sensitive. What I don't understand, Titania
19:49
Speaker 1: joining us from BARK the chief parent officer at BARK
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Speaker 1: Parental Controls. Would Bark pick up something like this TikTok
19:58
Speaker 1: challenge where now I've got not one, but multiple little
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Speaker 1: children dead. The short answer is yes, Bark is alerting
20:09
Speaker 1: so many families to so many things that they have
20:11
Speaker 1: no idea is even happening, not only TikTok challenges, but
20:15
Speaker 1: teen text slang emoji usage that some of you probably
20:20
Speaker 1: would be blown away by, for example, the possible emoji.
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Speaker 1: If your child is sending that around, they're probably not
20:27
Speaker 1: excited about Italian dinner tonight. It's short hand for nudes,
20:32
Speaker 1: because noodles, send nudes, send nude photos. Oh please stop
20:36
Speaker 1: right there. I've said the Philadelphia Airport coming home, and
20:40
Speaker 1: my son loves all sorts of Asian food where forever
20:44
Speaker 1: it's sushi at ramen. I saw a T shirt that
20:49
Speaker 1: had a bowl of ramen and it said send nuds
20:52
Speaker 1: in ods. I said, oh, that's perfect for John David.
20:56
Speaker 1: He wore in several Facebook posts that I did stuff
21:00
Speaker 1: and Twitter before some guy wrote, hey, love the T
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Speaker 1: shirt and Nancy and I thought, wow, he must like
21:06
Speaker 1: Asian foot two and I went, sin needs say, oh yeah,
21:10
Speaker 1: that was like two years ago, and I get it.
21:13
Speaker 1: It's just I would never have thought of it if
21:16
Speaker 1: I hadn't read that Twitter response. I just didn't think
21:19
Speaker 1: anything of it. And I remember we were going somewhere.
21:21
Speaker 1: I said John David, send your sin wear your Sin
21:24
Speaker 1: Moves T shirt. He went, you want me to wear that? Mom?
21:26
Speaker 1: I'm like yeah, because I didn't get it. He got it,
21:28
Speaker 1: but I didn't get it. Okay, go ahead, flash his heart. Yeah, kids,
21:33
Speaker 1: kids are special. I've got a thirteen year old and
21:36
Speaker 1: their sense of humor is next level, but their decision
21:39
Speaker 1: making prowessed, is not that of an adult. Their brains
21:43
Speaker 1: are not fully formed until they're in their early twenties.
21:46
Speaker 1: And so you mix the addictive nature with the peer
21:50
Speaker 1: pressure with their inability to have full comprehension of good
21:55
Speaker 1: choices and bad choices, and TikTok can be a recipe
21:58
Speaker 1: for disaster. And yeah, as Bark can alert you when
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Speaker 1: your child is encountering dangerous content and dangerous people across
22:06
Speaker 1: over thirty social media platforms, text message and emails. And
22:09
Speaker 1: believe me, I am not getting a percentage from Bark.
22:12
Speaker 1: I'm not an ambassador or a salesperson, the worst salesperson
22:16
Speaker 1: in the world, but I know that it works. I'm
22:18
Speaker 1: just trying to figure out a way to protect people
22:22
Speaker 1: from things, children from things like this TikTok challenge you
22:25
Speaker 1: earlier heard from our friends at WGIV. But now take
22:29
Speaker 1: a listen to our cut five, a lawyer on this case.
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Speaker 1: And twenty twenty one reports began to emerge from throughout
22:41
Speaker 1: the world that children were dying as a result of
22:47
Speaker 1: participating in TikTok blackout challenges. So what did TikTok do
22:56
Speaker 1: once they learned of this? Did they use their technology
23:01
Speaker 1: to protect children? Sadly, they didn't. What TikTok did was
23:09
Speaker 1: to use their app and algorithm to forward a blackout
23:15
Speaker 1: challenge video to ten year old Nila Anderson. That video
23:23
Speaker 1: was essentially a how to how to video how to
23:30
Speaker 1: asphyxiate yourself. That is what they sent to a child.
23:36
Speaker 1: To you, high profile lawyer Jeff Goodman joined me out
23:40
Speaker 1: of Philly and he is representing NILA's family. You were
23:43
Speaker 1: just hearing your partner, Bob Mangalouzy. I want to follow
23:47
Speaker 1: up on what your partner was saying. Are you telling me,
23:51
Speaker 1: Jeff Goodman that TikTok was alerted to what was happening
23:56
Speaker 1: and they have done nothing. TikTok head warning if or
24:00
Speaker 1: warning that this challenge was being posted on their platform.
24:04
Speaker 1: That this challenge was being spread on their platform. All
24:09
Speaker 1: of the features of the algorithm could have enabled TikTok
24:13
Speaker 1: to identify it as dangerous, flag it and stop it. Instead,
24:18
Speaker 1: the algorithm identified that users wanted to see it, and
24:21
Speaker 1: therefore it's sent it to more and more users. Through
24:25
Speaker 1: their for You page. Two of the other guests use
24:28
Speaker 1: the magic word here, and they said addictive when talking
24:32
Speaker 1: about the qualities of TikTok and social media. That's the
24:36
Speaker 1: goal of TikTok, the way it spreads these challenges, to
24:40
Speaker 1: have users addicted so that they stay engaged, so that
24:43
Speaker 1: they continue to watch, because that's where their profits are
24:46
Speaker 1: driven from. Big tech is the big tobacco of the
24:50
Speaker 1: modern era when it comes to spreading addiction for the
24:53
Speaker 1: purpose of promoting their products, and that's exactly what TikTok
24:56
Speaker 1: did here. I don't know if you guys remember my
25:00
Speaker 1: old friend Larry King who really helped me. I had
25:07
Speaker 1: been a guest on Larry's show many many times and
25:10
Speaker 1: then was fortunate enough to be named his permanent guest host.
25:15
Speaker 1: And I got to do that for several years. And
25:17
Speaker 1: I remember sitting in on a meeting with him and
25:21
Speaker 1: his staff was very informal, and they were pitching ideas
25:25
Speaker 1: and somebody had pitched something and Larry said no, and
25:30
Speaker 1: they said why all rate? And he went, well, yeah,
25:33
Speaker 1: if we put people fornicating on air, that'll rate. But
25:36
Speaker 1: I'm not going to do it. I mean, there is
25:39
Speaker 1: a line it's a moral line of what you think
25:44
Speaker 1: is right or wrong. And sure you might make more
25:49
Speaker 1: money doing feeling the blank it whatever it is, but
25:52
Speaker 1: that doesn't make it right. And what I am hearing
25:57
Speaker 1: from Jeff Goodman, who was representing I was family. I mean,
26:02
Speaker 1: think about the mother going in and finding her ten
26:04
Speaker 1: year old child dead. They have been alerted and they're
26:10
Speaker 1: still doing it. Is that right, Glenn Bard? Obviously I
26:15
Speaker 1: don't believe it is. No. Anytime you have anything could
26:18
Speaker 1: be dangerous, especially to our younger children, I don't think
26:21
Speaker 1: it's right, and I think they do have some sort
26:24
Speaker 1: of diligence to try to protect people using it. Of course,
26:29
Speaker 1: that's for someone like Jeff and you to make an
26:32
Speaker 1: argument about the courts. But you know, from my perspective
26:35
Speaker 1: of it as an examiner, when I see these things,
26:37
Speaker 1: it is truly heartbreaking, and I do think that there
26:40
Speaker 1: has to be some way that we can start protecting
26:42
Speaker 1: our children a little bit better. Well, you said to
26:45
Speaker 1: make that argument, You're absolutely correct, Jeff Goodman. I think
26:49
Speaker 1: Glenn Bard, our former Pennsylvania state trooper who is now
26:53
Speaker 1: at pactech dot com, is talking about the First Amendment.
26:59
Speaker 1: But let me find everybody and agree or disagree. Jeff,
27:02
Speaker 1: I mean, the First Amendment is not unfettered. For instance,
27:06
Speaker 1: here's a great law school example. You can't run into
27:09
Speaker 1: a theater and you'll fire and cause a stampede. Certain
27:15
Speaker 1: materials that are reviled, certain types of pornography. There's not
27:23
Speaker 1: free speech for everything. And that's the argument I would
27:28
Speaker 1: make against TikTok here. You don't have unfettered access to
27:32
Speaker 1: our children's minds. I couldn't agree more Nancy. The example
27:36
Speaker 1: you gave a fire in a crowded theater. The reason
27:40
Speaker 1: is because it can cause danger, and free speech is
27:42
Speaker 1: limited where it can cause danger. And that is never
27:45
Speaker 1: more necessary than when it comes to protecting children by
27:49
Speaker 1: making sure they do not see dangerous content. Your television
27:54
Speaker 1: has had parental controls for almost thirty years for this
27:57
Speaker 1: exact purpose. Yet far more sophisticated technology that the social
28:02
Speaker 1: media companies do continues to shun any movement in that direction.
28:08
Speaker 1: And now we are hearing that there is going to
28:11
Speaker 1: be essentially a department of truth in the White House. Okay,
28:18
Speaker 1: And we see how other big social media decides who
28:24
Speaker 1: is going to be banned and who is not going
28:26
Speaker 1: to be banned, but they can't control TikTok blackout challenges. Really,
28:34
Speaker 1: let's bring it all home. Take listen to our cut six.
28:38
Speaker 1: This is Nyla's mother, Tawana. We lived a happy life
28:42
Speaker 1: the two these numbers seven, two thousand, twenty way when
28:47
Speaker 1: our lives changed favor from this terrible tragedy. I cannot
28:51
Speaker 1: stop replaying this thing in my head. The unbreakable bide
28:56
Speaker 1: in our family is now shattering boy and that was
29:00
Speaker 1: now neither remains. And following this tragedy, I had discovered
29:06
Speaker 1: that Nila was not the only victim to this horrible
29:08
Speaker 1: challenge or TikTok. I have learned that it has taken
29:12
Speaker 1: many children's life. I want to hold this company accountable.
29:16
Speaker 1: It's time that these dangerous challenges come to an end,
29:20
Speaker 1: that other families don't experience the heartbreak we live every day.
29:25
Speaker 1: I accepted that my daughter's voice is going forever, so
29:29
Speaker 1: I'm gonna speak for her in the message her today.
29:32
Speaker 1: And something has to change. Something has to stop, because
29:35
Speaker 1: I wouldn't never want to know other parents to go
29:39
Speaker 1: through what I'm gonna through. Every Since December seventy time
29:58
Speaker 1: Stories with Nancy Grace. We lived a happy life and
30:05
Speaker 1: two these simmers seven two and twenty wife when our
30:10
Speaker 1: lives changed forever from this terrible tragedy. I cannot stop
30:14
Speaker 1: replaying this day in my head. The unbreakable bind in
30:19
Speaker 1: our family is now shattering going and that was now
30:23
Speaker 1: neither remains. And following this tragedy, I had discovered that
30:29
Speaker 1: night it was not the only victim to this horrible
30:31
Speaker 1: challenge or TikTok. I have learned that it has taken
30:34
Speaker 1: many children's life. I want to hold this company accountable.
30:39
Speaker 1: It's time that these dangerous challenges come to an end,
30:43
Speaker 1: that other families don't experience the heartbreak we live every day.
30:47
Speaker 1: I accepted that my daughter's voice is going forever, so
30:52
Speaker 1: I'm gonna speak for her in the message here today.
30:55
Speaker 1: It's something has to change, something has to stop, because
30:58
Speaker 1: I wasn't never, nope of the parents to go through
31:02
Speaker 1: what I'm going through. Ever, he says December to you,
31:05
Speaker 1: Jeff Goodman, high profile lawyer representing NILA's family, that the
31:11
Speaker 1: raw pain and her mother's voice, I'm surprised she could
31:15
Speaker 1: be so well spoken, so articulate through her tears and
31:21
Speaker 1: just choking down the pain she has suffered. What I
31:27
Speaker 1: feel very much like David and Goliath right now. For you,
31:32
Speaker 1: How are you, Jeff Goodman and Tawanna Anderson, NILA's mom,
31:40
Speaker 1: how are you going to stop TikTok? I mean, when
31:45
Speaker 1: I think about it, I think of David with his
31:48
Speaker 1: sling and a stone and Goliath, huge warrior, obviously a
31:57
Speaker 1: giant of some sort. How are you going to do that?
32:02
Speaker 1: We're going to do that because we're right and because
32:04
Speaker 1: it's important for child safety. And that's a message that
32:07
Speaker 1: everybody understands that protecting children must always come first. And
32:13
Speaker 1: the courts have countless stories of the David and Goliath
32:17
Speaker 1: battles where the Goliath corporations have been taken down by
32:22
Speaker 1: victims like Tawanna Anderson, who stepped up, who had her
32:26
Speaker 1: voice heard, and who ultimately convinced either jurors or judges
32:32
Speaker 1: that we were right here and that something needs to change.
32:37
Speaker 1: And when it comes to big corporations, the courts are
32:40
Speaker 1: one of the best ways to make that happen. Well,
32:41
Speaker 1: here's an example of taking on a giant corporation and winning.
32:48
Speaker 1: Take a listen to our cut twelve, our friend Lisa
32:50
Speaker 1: Niko at KUTV. For years we have known that children
32:54
Speaker 1: and the elderly might mistake these for candy or mints,
32:58
Speaker 1: but now it's getting out of hand. In fact, now
33:00
Speaker 1: it's determined. It's developed into a dangerous dare for teenagers.
33:06
Speaker 1: We've get a lot of calls about them. The Utah
33:09
Speaker 1: Poison Control Center says these are a deadly threat. Typically
33:13
Speaker 1: the call when they are concerned or they're scared. Kids
33:16
Speaker 1: and teens are now daring one another to ingest the
33:19
Speaker 1: poisonous pods. I don't think anyone I know would is
33:25
Speaker 1: stupid enough to do the tide pod challenge. Liquid detergent
33:29
Speaker 1: all wrapped up in a tight, bright package. So this
33:32
Speaker 1: is not something you want to flirt with. So far
33:34
Speaker 1: this year, I think it's funny. Multiple teens in Utah
33:39
Speaker 1: are among the nearly fifty Americans who reported being exposed
33:43
Speaker 1: to the toxic tinture. It's like scary and funny in
33:47
Speaker 1: a horrible way. Half of those exposures were on purpose,
33:51
Speaker 1: like people will do like the most stupid stuff. Ever,
33:56
Speaker 1: Yes they will. And it was brought to the attention
34:00
Speaker 1: and a proctor and gamble the danger of these pods.
34:04
Speaker 1: They're tiny, they look like candy, they look edible, children
34:08
Speaker 1: were aiding them inadvertently, and there were teens and twains
34:13
Speaker 1: aiding them as part of a challenge. So what did
34:16
Speaker 1: Tide do? Let's our cut thirteen KUTV. Tide's parent company,
34:21
Speaker 1: Procter and Gamble say they're now changing the design to
34:24
Speaker 1: make it harder for kids to abuse. We've worked diligently
34:28
Speaker 1: with industry, making the film on that packet even more
34:33
Speaker 1: tough so that it is easy to puncture, and reducing
34:36
Speaker 1: the toxicity and the strength of the laundry detergents. While
34:40
Speaker 1: only a couple exposures have been reported here in Utah,
34:43
Speaker 1: Poison Control believes the many more teens are trying the challenge.
34:47
Speaker 1: They're warning to parents they're bandests associated with the pods.
34:51
Speaker 1: There have been serious eye injuries. Don't be blind to
34:53
Speaker 1: the Tide pod challenge about the likes. It's about the
34:58
Speaker 1: no views on Instagram, the followers a false sense of popularity,
35:04
Speaker 1: you know. That is the way Tide responded. But according
35:08
Speaker 1: to Jeff joining us right now, the lawyer for Nihili's family,
35:12
Speaker 1: Jeff Goodman joining side of Philly TikTok is basically saying
35:17
Speaker 1: screw you and doing nothing. How many more deaths will
35:23
Speaker 1: it take to you to Tarnya Jordan joining us from
35:27
Speaker 1: bark any ideas? I mean, Jeff's already I've got the
35:30
Speaker 1: lawsuit right now, right in front of me. He has
35:34
Speaker 1: filed is filing an incredible lawsuit against TikTok to try
35:40
Speaker 1: to make them change what they are doing. Any ideas
35:45
Speaker 1: to Tanya what else can be done? Well, that's a
35:47
Speaker 1: great question, you know, and not speaking on behalf of TikTok,
35:52
Speaker 1: but in their defense, they do have a trust and
35:55
Speaker 1: safety team that's composed of humans who do care about
36:00
Speaker 1: other humans, and so imploring them to do the right
36:04
Speaker 1: thing for children and for families over profits is what
36:08
Speaker 1: we as a society have to continue to do. You know. Obviously,
36:13
Speaker 1: as a large corporation with billions of dollars at play,
36:17
Speaker 1: they have liability, they have processes, they have a lot
36:19
Speaker 1: of things that they need to go through to protect
36:21
Speaker 1: their company. But at the end of the day, we
36:23
Speaker 1: have to prioritize the health and safety of children that
36:27
Speaker 1: are knowingly on their platform over the profits of the corporation. Well,
36:32
Speaker 1: I agree with you, I don't know how much I
36:34
Speaker 1: trust the TikTok Trust and Safety team. Well, because the
36:38
Speaker 1: Trust and Safety Team has already been a prize of
36:42
Speaker 1: NILA's death as well as I've got a stack of
36:44
Speaker 1: papers right here on my desk is so thick I
36:46
Speaker 1: can't even get through them, all of all the children
36:48
Speaker 1: that have died because the TikTok challenges. But you can
36:52
Speaker 1: report on TikTok. Reported on TikTok. Go listen, click on
36:58
Speaker 1: the WHI arrow the right of the video, tap the
37:02
Speaker 1: icon that says report when the flag symbol tap suicide,
37:06
Speaker 1: self arm, dangerous acts, and report the content. Not only that,
37:11
Speaker 1: not just reporting to TikTok, because that keeps it internal.
37:15
Speaker 1: You have to think about it from a pr play
37:17
Speaker 1: of they don't want this negative press out there, and
37:21
Speaker 1: if nobody else knows about it, we're not going to
37:24
Speaker 1: get mad about it and do anything about it. So
37:26
Speaker 1: we have got to also let our local law enforcement know.
37:29
Speaker 1: Good idea. We've got to let our local legislators know.
37:32
Speaker 1: I always say the first place to start is calling
37:34
Speaker 1: your rep and calling your senator. First place to start.
37:39
Speaker 1: Do they care? Maybe maybe not? Do they care about reelection?
37:44
Speaker 1: You darn right they do. Jeff Goodman, tell me about
37:47
Speaker 1: the lawsuit in a nutshell The lawsuit focuses on the
37:51
Speaker 1: problem at TikTok of how their algorithm functions and the
37:55
Speaker 1: fact that this algorithm would send a how to asphyxiate
37:59
Speaker 1: your self guide to a ten year old. That algorithm
38:04
Speaker 1: could just as easily be used to take advantage of
38:07
Speaker 1: the technology to screen dangerous content. Instead, the algorithm was
38:12
Speaker 1: used to send dangerous content. That algorithm, in the simplest form,
38:16
Speaker 1: is a product, and this is a product liability lawsuit
38:20
Speaker 1: about the defective nature of that algorithm and that it
38:22
Speaker 1: could ever function in such a matter. You know when
38:25
Speaker 1: it comes to algorithms, and I may need you and
38:28
Speaker 1: Glenn and to Wanta to explain a little bit better.
38:32
Speaker 1: I remember when I first left CNN HLM and launch
38:38
Speaker 1: Crime Online dot Com and Crime Stories, and we were
38:42
Speaker 1: constantly sending out missing children, unsolved homicides all day every day.
38:47
Speaker 1: And then I found out they weren't reaching all of
38:49
Speaker 1: our Facebook followers and Twitter followers and instat followers. And
38:53
Speaker 1: I remember asking our managing editor Wilson, I'm like, why
38:57
Speaker 1: aren't these missing children notice is going out and these
39:02
Speaker 1: Amber alerts? Why all of our followers getting them? He said,
39:06
Speaker 1: the algorithm all of your posts don't go through to
39:09
Speaker 1: all of your followers. And I mean, my life has
39:13
Speaker 1: been representing crime victims. I didn't know anything about algorithms,
39:17
Speaker 1: and when I found out, it struck me wrong. And
39:21
Speaker 1: now I'm hearing this. How can it be, Jeff Goodman,
39:25
Speaker 1: that a ten year old little girl is targeted my TikTok.
39:31
Speaker 1: It certainly shouldn't be. One of the algorithm also understands
39:35
Speaker 1: its users. TikTok conducts surveillance on the users through what
39:40
Speaker 1: they are looking at, and it's not just what they like,
39:44
Speaker 1: it's also how long their eyes remain on the screen
39:47
Speaker 1: in watching a video, and it uses all of that data.
39:53
Speaker 1: That data can and should be used to help make
39:57
Speaker 1: social media safe, and instead that data seems to be harnessed,
40:01
Speaker 1: directed and almost exclusively at the goal of corporate profits.
40:05
Speaker 1: That needs to change and to you Dodge, Michelle Dupree,
40:10
Speaker 1: this challenge is extremely dangerous, even if it doesn't result
40:15
Speaker 1: in death, because time is brain cells. Any time you
40:20
Speaker 1: are without oxygen or blood supply, you are risking permanent
40:25
Speaker 1: damage to part of your brain. Isn't that true? Absolutely, Nancy,
40:30
Speaker 1: And every time that this is done, then more and
40:33
Speaker 1: more and more brain cells are affected, so every time
40:36
Speaker 1: someone plays this game and survives, they are still causing injury.
40:41
Speaker 1: If you want more information, call Safe Kids Worldwide at
40:46
Speaker 1: two zero two six six two zero six hundred repeat
40:51
Speaker 1: two zero two six six two zero six hundred, and
40:56
Speaker 1: then do something. Pick up your phone, call your senator,
41:01
Speaker 1: call your rep. If you don't know their numbers, google them.
41:05
Speaker 1: I've done it many a time. Just pick up the phone,
41:09
Speaker 1: let your voice be heard, and do not let giant
41:12
Speaker 1: corporations like TikTok ruin your child's life. Nancy Grace Crime
41:21
Speaker 1: Story signing off, Goodbye friend