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Bloomberg Money: Premium Travel, Fast Fashion, Luxury at the US Open & The Cost of College · Bloomberg Intelligence

• 0:02
  Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios. Podcasts.
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  Speaker 4: Bloomberg Money. This is the Bloomberg Money Podcast. I'm Tom
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  Speaker 4: Keen with Scarlett Fu. Join us each week for a
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• 0:55
  Speaker 5: Good noon, everyone.
• 0:56
  Speaker 4: A special edition of Bloomberg Money on personal finance, retirement,
• 1:00
  Speaker 4: wealth management, the joys of Labor Day, the children go
• 1:03
  Speaker 4: back to school. We're going to talk to Lisa Mateo
• 1:05
  Speaker 4: about that.
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: There were tears.
• 1:07
  Speaker 5: She took the offer to go to school.
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: Yes, I know. But you know what? We'll get through it.
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: We'll be right there.
• 1:12
  Speaker 5: We'll somehow survive.
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: What do you do on Labor Day? I mean, when
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: we're done here, what are you doing?
• 1:16
  Speaker 6: I'm actually obsessed with this trial, the Lindsey Clancy trial.
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: Oh, you're the celebrity load. So why did I know this?
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: One hour delay for defense to appeal. So it could
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: happen any minute now.
• 1:24
  Speaker 4: It's happening right now. Breaking news here on Bloomberg Money.
• 1:27
  Speaker 4: Of course, again, it's on personal finance, retirement and wealth management.
• 1:30
  Speaker 4: We've got a really, really interesting show for you today.
• 1:34
  Speaker 4: Coming up, we thought we'd do it. He was so
• 1:36
  Speaker 4: kind to come in. Brian Kelly will be with us,
• 1:39
  Speaker 4: who changed the way all of us travel. All of
• 1:42
  Speaker 4: us use our charts. The guy is absolutely foundational. to
• 1:46
  Speaker 4: each and every one of us in our personal finance.
• 1:48
  Speaker 6: He actually wrote the book on it. We're also going
• 1:50
  Speaker 6: to continue the conversation on how we spend our money.
• 1:53
  Speaker 6: Dana Telsey, the authority on specialty retail, on the affordability
• 1:57
  Speaker 6: crisis in your closet, in apparel.
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: Is fast fashion dead?
• 2:01
  Speaker 4: Well, finish in his dad, but also, like, what are
• 2:04
  Speaker 4: they wearing at the tennis tournament?
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: I mean, they're draped in Tiffany and draped in this.
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: I don't know how you can play tennis with all that.
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: I don't understand. I don't get it.
• 2:12
  Speaker 5: We'll have to see on that.
• 2:14
  Speaker 4: That's Dana Telsey to be with us. We're really looking
• 2:16
  Speaker 4: forward to that. We've got a great lineup in a
• 2:18
  Speaker 4: few moments as well. I think we've got a stagger
• 2:21
  Speaker 4: of stocks right now. And look at what's going on
• 2:25
  Speaker 4: in the stock market.
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: And he answers, we can do this quickly. Down 300 points.
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: Pulling back.
• 2:30
  Speaker 4: McKee's going to explain why. Good jobs report, stocks go down.
• 2:34
  Speaker 4: I don't get it.
• 2:35
  Speaker 6: Yeah, President Trump doesn't like to see this dynamic, and
• 2:37
  Speaker 6: he's made that very clear. Let's look at the cross-asset
• 2:40
  Speaker 6: board as well. Stocks are a little changed on the week,
• 2:42
  Speaker 6: we should note. The 10-year yield, not doing a whole lot,
• 2:45
  Speaker 6: but sitting near the highest in one month. The dollar
• 2:47
  Speaker 6: is slightly higher, but it is down for the week.
• 2:50
  Speaker 6: And the big mover, of course, the yen, strengthening. Oil prices,
• 2:53
  Speaker 6: you can see, down for the first time this week. However,
• 2:56
  Speaker 6: still above $ 90 a barrel.
• 2:58
  Speaker 5: Very good.
• 2:58
  Speaker 4: We've got a great lineup of people, the only three
• 3:01
  Speaker 4: people at.
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: Bloomberg that came into the office today. Stacey Vanek-Smith is
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: with us.
• 3:06
  Speaker 4: We're thrilled she's with us with everybody's business and all
• 3:09
  Speaker 4: of her good work.
• 3:09
  Speaker 5: She has to work with Max.
• 3:12
  Speaker 6: I think it's a privilege that they get to do
• 3:15
  Speaker 6: this podcast and that they're both in today.
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: I mean, we're just grateful.
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  Speaker 5: McKee with us as well. We'll cover the Red Sox
• 3:20
  Speaker 5: Orioles here in a bit.
• 3:21
  Speaker 4: But Mike McKee, of course, importantly on a jobs report,
• 3:25
  Speaker 4: the state of the American economy. And what a special treat.
• 3:28
  Speaker 4: Jeffrey Mason with us. Jeff Mason covers the White House
• 3:31
  Speaker 4: and is in this weekend for David Gurra. Bloomberg this weekend.
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  Speaker 4: I mean, it's going to be interesting to say the least.
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  Speaker 7: Yeah, we've got a good show coming up.
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  Speaker 2: And we'll see.
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  Speaker 4: We'll talk about the convention here in a moment. Let
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  Speaker 4: me get right to it. Mike McKee, first to you
• 3:44
  Speaker 4: on the job economy. Down last time.
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  Speaker 2: Up this time, you just blend them together and say,
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: state of play? Well, essentially, that's what economists are going
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: to do.
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  Speaker 8: They're going to look at the three-month moving average, which
• 3:55
  Speaker 8: is about 77,000, which is a good number, considering you
• 3:58
  Speaker 8: only need somewhere between 30 and 50 to keep the
• 4:01
  Speaker 8: unemployment rate from rising, essentially, now that we have a
• 4:05
  Speaker 8: much smaller labor force. Although the labor force did grow
• 4:08
  Speaker 8: this last month by quite a bit, and that has
• 4:11
  Speaker 8: kept the unemployment rate at 4.1%.
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: I've got eight.
• 4:14
  Speaker 5: Ways to go here.
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  Speaker 4: There's just so much to talk about. But the bottom
• 4:17
  Speaker 4: line is there's a wage and there's this inflation. 100%
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  Speaker 4: of the people I talk to say, I'm losing ground
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  Speaker 4: every single month.
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  Speaker 5: Where's the real wage right now?
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  Speaker 2: Well, they are losing ground every single month.
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  Speaker 8: Basically, average hourly earnings are running below and have been
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  Speaker 8: for a couple of months, the inflation rate. And so, yes,
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  Speaker 8: you're losing ground. Now, not every measure shows that. And
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  Speaker 8: I had an interesting discussion with the chairman of the
• 4:43
  Speaker 8: Council of Economic Advisors who wants to look at average
• 4:46
  Speaker 8: weekly wages because he says those are still low.
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  Speaker 2: Outpacing inflation. But basically, the American people are right.
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  Speaker 8: They're losing ground because the level of prices isn't going down.
• 4:58
  Speaker 8: We may see a slowdown in the change, the monthly change,
• 5:02
  Speaker 8: but the level of price is still high.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's proven to be very sticky.
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  Speaker 6: Now, speaking of sticky inflation, Stacey, you've been monitoring gas prices,
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  Speaker 6: and in particular, diesel prices, because that is the engine
• 5:13
  Speaker 6: of how we move things, move goods around this country.
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  Speaker 9: Yes, this is apparently going to be the most expensive
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  Speaker 9: Labor Day ever in terms of gas prices, but diesel
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  Speaker 9: especially is at a.
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  Speaker 10: Record high for all time, $ 5.
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  Speaker 5: 85 a gallon.
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  Speaker 11: It's up.
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  Speaker 9: Almost 60 percent over just last year, but also average
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  Speaker 9: gas prices of about 30 percent. If you're for people
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  Speaker 9: who are traveling this weekend, it's going to be the
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  Speaker 9: most expensive Labor Day ever.
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: But diesels, it's a huge deal and it's not in
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  Speaker 4: the political discussion.
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  Speaker 6: No, because the truckers deal with it and people in
• 5:45
  Speaker 6: Europe deal with it. But it just means that every
• 5:47
  Speaker 6: time you buy something, it becomes more expensive because of
• 5:49
  Speaker 6: the transport.
• 5:50
  Speaker 4: Yeah, but I mean, it's $ 5.
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  Speaker 11: 85.
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  Speaker 4: I think in London it's $ 9 something with the tax
• 5:55
  Speaker 4: override as well. Jeff Mason with us, and what he's
• 5:58
  Speaker 4: going to see next week, I guess, is simply the
• 6:02
  Speaker 4: great commonwealth of Massachusetts, the home of Adlai Rutschman, who
• 6:07
  Speaker 4: hit homers against his Orioles.
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  Speaker 5: It's not a convention. Stop it. It's not a convention, right?
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  Speaker 7: Well, they're calling it a convention, Tom, but it's not
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  Speaker 7: an actual convention. You're absolutely right, because there's no one
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  Speaker 7: being nominated. The president is not running for anything, but
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  Speaker 7: they're calling it a convention basically to use a word
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  Speaker 7: that people understand to have a gathering. And they're going
• 6:29
  Speaker 7: to have a gathering and it's going to be as
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  Speaker 7: big sales pitch.
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  Speaker 5: For the Republicans.
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  Speaker 2: Will there be a Vance or Rubio sighting?
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  Speaker 7: There will certainly be a Vance sighting. He's speaking on
• 6:37
  Speaker 7: Wednesday night. The president is speaking on both nights. I
• 6:39
  Speaker 7: think you'll hear a lot from him. I think you'll
• 6:42
  Speaker 7: also hear a lot about Ken Paxton, who's running for
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  Speaker 7: Senate from Texas and not doing very well in terms
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  Speaker 7: of fundraising.
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  Speaker 6: Is the president losing support among the GOP constituents and
• 6:52
  Speaker 6: even the GOP leadership? Because you had the Congressman Pat
• 6:56
  Speaker 6: Harrigan admitting that when it comes to Iran, very clearly, militarily,
• 7:01
  Speaker 6: we are stalled.
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: And a lot of candidates don't want him there when
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: they're campaigning.
• 7:05
  Speaker 5: It depends on where they are.
• 7:06
  Speaker 7: So the base is still very supportive of President Trump,
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  Speaker 7: for sure, and he knows that. But there are places,
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  Speaker 7: swing districts, swing states, where they probably don't want to
• 7:15
  Speaker 7: campaign with President Trump, whose poll ratings broadly across the
• 7:19
  Speaker 7: country are pretty low.
• 7:20
  Speaker 5: Scarlett, Mr. McKee would like the floor.
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  Speaker 2: I was just going to point out that you said
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  Speaker 2: you will hear from.
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  Speaker 8: I don't think very many people are going to hear
• 7:29
  Speaker 8: from the Republican meeting down in Dallas because we're always
• 7:33
  Speaker 8: talking about how can they say how can they do this?
• 7:36
  Speaker 8: They scheduled their meetings up against the opening of the
• 7:40
  Speaker 8: National Football League season. First night, Patriots and Seahawks Super
• 7:44
  Speaker 8: Bowl rematch. Second night, Rams and 49ers rematch. I suspect
• 7:50
  Speaker 8: that the ratings for the extravaganza in Dallas are.
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: Going to be very low.
• 7:54
  Speaker 8: Perhaps the only good news is that the Cowboys are
• 7:56
  Speaker 8: not playing or nobody in Texas would watch.
• 7:59
  Speaker 7: And the president, as we all know, is a former
• 8:01
  Speaker 7: reality TV host who likes to talk about ratings. So
• 8:03
  Speaker 7: that's going to be a challenge for him.
• 8:05
  Speaker 4: Can we juxtapose the world of everybody's business, which is
• 8:08
  Speaker 4: a hipster thing? I mean, you guys are doing such
• 8:11
  Speaker 4: a great job capturing a zeitgeist of a group of
• 8:14
  Speaker 4: people disassociated from me and McKee. In his world of
• 8:19
  Speaker 4: fancy people in suits and ties and Chanel dresses. I mean,
• 8:23
  Speaker 4: it's like, Stacey, it's like two worlds apart in America.
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  Speaker 10: It is very much two worlds apart.
• 8:29
  Speaker 9: And I think that's probably one of the challenges that's
• 8:31
  Speaker 9: going to come up at the convention is I think
• 8:33
  Speaker 9: a lot of people feel like there are an increasingly
• 8:36
  Speaker 9: separated world in the U.S. There are people who are
• 8:39
  Speaker 9: struggling for their wages to keep up with inflation. And
• 8:42
  Speaker 9: then there are people who are making a lot of money,
• 8:45
  Speaker 9: like almost unimaginable amounts. And I think that divide is
• 8:48
  Speaker 9: certainly a major political issue right now.
• 8:50
  Speaker 7: And the president, I think, he likes to talk about wealth.
• 8:54
  Speaker 7: He likes to talk about presiding over a bunch of
• 8:56
  Speaker 7: stock market highs. But he also has been very dismissive
• 9:00
  Speaker 7: of the word affordability. He's called that a democratic hoax.
• 9:03
  Speaker 7: And yet he and his people are very aware that
• 9:06
  Speaker 7: that's probably the key issue in.
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: The midterm elections.
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  Speaker 6: I mean, even places like Ohio, North Carolina, Michigan, and Pennsylvania,
• 9:12
  Speaker 6: property prices and property taxes have been rising so rapidly
• 9:15
  Speaker 6: that they are starting to benefit from SALT tax breaks
• 9:18
  Speaker 6: that were once upon a time just the province of
• 9:20
  Speaker 6: the Northeast in California.
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: Super interesting.
• 9:23
  Speaker 7: And you're seeing some increased support in those places for
• 9:25
  Speaker 7: those SALT taxes, which is fascinating.
• 9:28
  Speaker 5: Around the table, round table, how many miles do you have?
• 9:31
  Speaker 9: How many miles do I have to travel?
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: Like the miles, the charge card miles, you add them up,
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: airline miles.
• 9:37
  Speaker 9: Credit card points. I'm not so great about credit card points,
• 9:39
  Speaker 9: but I do have quite a few saved up on
• 9:41
  Speaker 9: my change.
• 9:42
  Speaker 5: Mickey, how many do you have?
• 9:43
  Speaker 8: Well, in terms of what I could spend right now
• 9:47
  Speaker 8: on airlines, a little over $ 100, 000 because my kids use
• 9:50
  Speaker 8: them all.
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: The kids use them all the time. It's a scam.
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: But I'm close to two million total.
• 9:55
  Speaker 5: It's two million miles. Jeff, how many miles do you have?
• 9:58
  Speaker 7: I'm doing something wrong because I don't know and I
• 10:02
  Speaker 7: don't think I have anywhere near that many.
• 10:04
  Speaker 5: The Foo, how many miles do you have?
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: 70,000 on one card, 40,000 on the other.
• 10:08
  Speaker 4: I have 500,000 total, and I'm with McKee, they all
• 10:11
  Speaker 4: go to the kids.
• 10:12
  Speaker 5: It's a racket.
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly.
• 10:14
  Speaker 4: It's Brian Kelly's fault. Thank you, you three, for showing
• 10:17
  Speaker 4: up on Labor Day. Really appreciate it. Brian Kelly changed
• 10:21
  Speaker 4: our world. He's the one that figured out charge cards
• 10:25
  Speaker 4: and miles. We're going to talk to Brian Kelly here,
• 10:27
  Speaker 4: the points guy, the founder of the website.
• 10:31
  Speaker 5: Stay with us. This is Bloomberg Money.
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: It's a special edition, a Labor Day edition. Around the table, quick. Hot, hot,
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: cold lobsters. Cold lobster.
• 10:41
  Speaker 4: Cold.
• 10:41
  Speaker 12: Hot.
• 10:42
  Speaker 13: Hot.
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: It's un-American. Hot.
• 10:50
  Speaker 4: Special edition Bloomberg Money, the Labor Day edition. It's Gardner
• 10:53
  Speaker 4: Fu and Tom Grumman. A lot of fun here. It's
• 10:56
  Speaker 4: a lighter show on personal finance, on retirement, wealth management,
• 11:00
  Speaker 4: and you don't have enough miles. Joining us now, without question, one, two,
• 11:04
  Speaker 4: maybe three people who seriously changed. personal finance. Brian Kelly
• 11:09
  Speaker 4: did it with the Points Guy. How did the website start?
• 11:13
  Speaker 4: What was the first week like, the first month.
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: Of the Points Guy? The first week, June of 2010,
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: I was working at Morgan Stanley. I was a corporate
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: recruiter going to all the college career fairs and a
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: I was so good with my points because I would
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: put all of the career fairs on my corporate Amex.
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: And you could call and for $ 95 a year, you
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: could get all the points. So I became the guy,
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: the expense guy at Morgan Stanley. I put all the
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: career fairs on my credit card. So I was raking
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: in the points. So I started the points guy as
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: just like a way to share my tips as a
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: corporate traveler. And within 11 months, it just blew up. So-
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: It took off.
• 11:46
  Speaker 6: Your book, How to Win at Travel, came out in
• 11:48
  Speaker 6: 2025 in which you really lay out your thesis that
• 11:50
  Speaker 6: points are real and non-liquid assets.
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: They are a currency.
• 11:54
  Speaker 6: My question to you is how much devaluation have we
• 11:56
  Speaker 6: seen in this currency after the pandemic ended and the
• 11:59
  Speaker 6: world embarked on revenge travel?
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So loyalty, the airlines are just planes. They're banks
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: masquerading as airlines. The loyalty business is bigger than ever.
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: It's what's driving all the profit. You see Delta and
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: United are just doing incredibly because of their co-brand portfolio.
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: So yes, there is an increase in inflation, how many
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: miles it takes to get a flight in general. But
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: the foreign frequent flyer programs, that's where the value is.
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: So for example, Flying Blue, which is Air France's They
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: have 60,000-mile business class awards all throughout the year. That's
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: unheard of. The same flight using Delta SkyMiles can be
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: 500,000 points. So the real experts, there's still many deals
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: to be had, but all the value is mostly with
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: the foreign frequent flyer programs.
• 12:42
  Speaker 5: Right, right.
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: For partners of Amex, Chase, Citi, Cap One, so... The.
• 12:46
  Speaker 4: Racket here is you came up with this, it's your fault,
• 12:49
  Speaker 4: and we're all going to be doobies and pay down
• 12:51
  Speaker 4: our charge cards every month. Bloomberg money, it's on personal finance.
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: What percent of people actually do the Brian Kelly formula
• 12:59
  Speaker 4: and zero out their charge cards every month?
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: A huge amount. And the banks want them because in
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: the United States, we have a large fee, about 2%
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: every time you use a card. So even if you're
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: paying your balances off, Amex wants that. They certainly still
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: make money on interest, but- That interchange fee is still
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: very lucrative and they get you on other products. So
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: this whole rewards ecosystem is very lucrative for banks. All
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: the banks are doing well. The airlines who have leaned
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: into it are doing well. And I argue in my
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: book that consumers can do well, too, as long as
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: you know how to play the game, pay the bills off,
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: avoid interest and then maximize the redemption of those points.
• 13:33
  Speaker 6: However, right now in this economy, a lot of consumers
• 13:35
  Speaker 6: are not doing that well. And it's a sign of
• 13:37
  Speaker 6: the times that people are increasingly using the points that
• 13:39
  Speaker 6: they accumulate to pay for food and gas rather than
• 13:42
  Speaker 6: trips to Italy, for instance. Are you seeing more people
• 13:46
  Speaker 6: use their points for daily necessities?
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: No. I actually think in the airline space, we're seeing
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: airlines all retrofit their planes to have more business class,
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: more premium economy. So while the broader economy, you know,
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: there are sectors struggling.
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: The premium travelers are driving. What did you do?
• 14:01
  Speaker 5: Read her script. Bring it up, Luigi. Come on.
• 14:04
  Speaker 4: Kelly's way out front here. The money mustery with Brian Kelly.
• 14:08
  Speaker 4: This is from his website. He was traveling somewhere for $ 58.
• 14:12
  Speaker 5: And didn't write this.
• 14:13
  Speaker 4: How many first class seats is too many? Delta, a
• 14:16
  Speaker 4: whopping 44 recliners, 11 rows, almost half the aircraft. They
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: expect to offer 8% more premium seats. When's the economy die?
• 14:26
  Speaker 11: Yeah.
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: I mean, economy, they keep making economy tighter and tighter
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: because there are still, you know, cost focused travelers. But
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: as we saw with Spirit, the purely economy budget airline
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: model does not work in the U.S. with expensive oil,
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: with expensive airports. You know, Ryanair is the model that
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: works in Europe. That's because they go to these third
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: rate airports. We don't have those in New York City.
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: We don't have those across the U.S. So The airlines,
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: you know, we just saw JetBlue is putting first class.
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: They just announced Frontier. You know, everyone is going premium.
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: That is how you win in travel.
• 14:58
  Speaker 6: Southwest has its new lounge network that it's launching with
• 15:00
  Speaker 6: Chase as well. Is there a ceiling to credit card
• 15:03
  Speaker 6: annual fees? Because we're rapidly approaching four figures. We're not
• 15:06
  Speaker 6: there yet. Amex Platinum is $ 895. Is there a level
• 15:09
  Speaker 6: that you see at which consumers would just resist paying
• 15:12
  Speaker 6: that fee?
• 15:13
  Speaker 5: It depends.
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: I mean, we've seen last year was big increases with
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: Sapphire Reserve, Amex Platinum. My understanding, if you look at
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: the public results of those companies, they're doing quite well.
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: And certainly, they'll have a drop-off. Not everyone wants to
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: pay $ 900 or $ 800. But then what happens is they
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: go to the other products, the Amex Gold Card. is
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: Forex on dining and groceries at a much lower annual fee.
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: That's actually a better points card for most people. So
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: some people might realize, hey, platinum might not be for me, but,
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: you know, so they still stay within the Amex family.
• 15:42
  Speaker 4: You wanted to run from this because you're such a
• 15:43
  Speaker 4: premium guy.
• 15:45
  Speaker 5: What's the biggest flight you've ever done where you went
• 15:47
  Speaker 5: for $ 48 to the moon?
• 15:49
  Speaker 4: What was the biggest Brian Kelly, you know, wealth management fight?
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: You know, I redeem all the time. I love, I mean,
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: the Air France example, because it still exists. Anyone can
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: book these Air France 60,000 mile rewards. Yeah, I've done it.
• 16:04
  Speaker 5: Full disclosure.
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: And I love Air France La Premiere. So if you
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: have elite status. Oh, please. They pick you up at
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: the plane in Paris. Are you kidding me? So that's
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: 350,000 points. That's a splurge. But when you think about it,
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: I can redeem for Air France La Premiere for less
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: than what Delta charges business class.
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: Quick question. What's more valuable, points or cash back?
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: Points, in my opinion.
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's more fun for you, but cashback is.
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: But if you don't want to travel, get cashback. What
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: I dislike is when people have premium credit cards and
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: then redeem them for gift cards or statement credit. That
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: is a losing strategy. If you want gift cards, just
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: get a 2% cashback card. Don't pay to have a
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: fancy credit card and then... Redeem those points for Saks
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: gift cards.
• 16:44
  Speaker 4: In terms of personal finance, as Scarlett mentioned earlier, Ed
• 16:47
  Speaker 4: Duffner shops, power shop here at Bloomberg. If he's in
• 16:50
  Speaker 4: aisle four buying Wagyu beef, he's not using points, you said?
• 16:54
  Speaker 4: They're not using points for groceries and bases?
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: Well, I don't think enough. There's a lot of people
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: on your, you know, there's a lot of points hoarders
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: out there. I know billionaires with, you know. 20 million
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: points in an increasing, I would argue to them, just
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: get a cash back card because there are a lot
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: of people who hoard points. There is a certain mentality
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: of let me save them for later.
• 17:12
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: And they will devalue.
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: They will devalue. So if you have too much of
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: a currency, you're not using switch to cash because 2%
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: cash back is King. And there are bank of America
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: has a product. You can get almost 3% back. So,
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: you know, I think for wealthy travelers, they want to
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: have that fancy credit card, but a cash back card
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: would be better financially.
• 17:30
  Speaker 14: Yeah.
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: All right, Brian, stay with us.
• 17:31
  Speaker 6: And later on in the show, we're going to talk
• 17:33
  Speaker 6: about how teens are starting to invest sooner. And according
• 17:35
  Speaker 6: to a survey, the top reason is because they just
• 17:37
  Speaker 6: want to get started as soon as possible.
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: Compounding. It's all about compounding.
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: All right.
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Money.
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: Does Sephora count as investment?
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: Not for you. Not for me.
• 17:52
  Speaker 4: You're listening to Bloomberg Money. Stay with us with more
• 17:55
  Speaker 4: to come after this.
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: Yes, the fish are real.
• 18:05
  Speaker 5: Somebody emailed me and said, they're fake fish. I said, no,
• 18:08
  Speaker 5: they're not.
• 18:09
  Speaker 4: We have like 400 aquarium around the world or whatever.
• 18:13
  Speaker 4: Bloomberg Money on Labor Day, a special edition with Scarlett Fu.
• 18:17
  Speaker 5: Thrilled that you're.
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: With us today.
• 18:18
  Speaker 4: And what's so important is after her tearful Olymp-mondieu, her
• 18:23
  Speaker 4: Olympic coverage at Paris Olympics, Celine Dion's doing it again,
• 18:27
  Speaker 4: and only Brian Kelly could fly La Premier to Paris
• 18:31
  Speaker 4: to see Celine.
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: Celine, you're really doing it. Celine is, funny story, when
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: I wanted to start The Points Guy, all my friends,
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: even my parents were like, you can't quit Morgan Stanley.
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: And I believed in it, I knew I was onto something,
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: and Celine Dion has a song called Taking Chances, and
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: I was walking through Times Square.
• 18:46
  Speaker 13: Oh.
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: And I listened to the song and I went straight
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: to my boss and I was like, you know, I
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: need to take a chance. And I quit my job.
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: So Celine Dion is the reason why the points guy
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: is what it is today.
• 18:54
  Speaker 11: Okay.
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: You paid for the Celine Dion concert in cash, right?
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: You didn't use points.
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: Well, I used a credit card. Always use credit cards.
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: I never pay cash.
• 19:02
  Speaker 5: Okay.
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: Credit cards. And also the Sapphire Reserve has a StubHub credit.
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: So I've used it twice.
• 19:07
  Speaker 11: Yes.
• 19:08
  Speaker 5: Thank you.
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: Yes. Alex.
• 19:10
  Speaker 11: Yes.
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: So, yeah. So, Celine, I will pay all my flights
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: and hotels are free. So, yeah, I spent big to
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: be front row center because, you know, this is my
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: this is my Olympics.
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: This is your score.
• 19:22
  Speaker 6: So in 2025, I think you had 28 credit cards.
• 19:25
  Speaker 6: How many do you have in your wallet?
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: I have about 30 now. I'm keeping it. I'm keeping it,
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: you know. I'm not going too crazy. There are people
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: with over 100 credit cards, by the way.
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: Do you have a default card?
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: I do. The Bilt Palladium card. So Bilt, you can
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: now earn points on your mortgage. I have two mortgages.
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: And the Bilt Palladium, you get 2X on everything plus
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: rent or mortgage payment.
• 19:47
  Speaker 5: Was that through Wells Fargo?
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: It was. Now it's through... a company called Cardless. Because
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: when you think about your everyday spend, most credit cards
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: only give you one point.
• 19:56
  Speaker 6: Yes.
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: Back to the whole inflation thing. There are now credit cards...
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: that allow you to earn so many more points than before.
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: So the Bill Playdam at 2x on everything is like
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: my solid go-to.
• 20:07
  Speaker 4: Not to be Debbie Downer, but I'll be Tom Downer.
• 20:09
  Speaker 4: Is there a downside to this thing?
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: I mean, what's your annual fees on 28 credit cards?
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: Is there a downside where people screw up the Brian
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: Kelly formula? The downside would be, you know, on your
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: cards like the Amex Platinum that comes with all these
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: different credits is if you're not taking advantage. And I
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: will admit, even with the Sapphire, you get free Apple Music.
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: And you actually have to go in and click a
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: single button to link everything. your different accounts, which I
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: hadn't done. So I hadn't for a couple of the
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: credits that I thought I was getting. So it takes
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: a little bit. Um, but I, you know, the 795
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: on the Sapphire card, I get way more than that
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: in value a year from the stub hub, from the
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: travel credit. So, uh, I actually think no annual fee
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: cards are huge waste. My dad always said cheap is expensive.
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: So for the people out there who with no annual
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: fee cards and who are spending a lot, you're actually losing, um, value.
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: Um, When was the last time you paid full fare
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: for an airplane flight?
• 21:05
  Speaker 2: I just, you know, it's funny because I can through,
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: you know, and I pay for all my travels when
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: I review airlines. Even though I can, I just still
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: am like, it's against, but I mean, domestic flights all
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: often pay, but I'm using the travel portal points, like
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: Amex points.
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: You're still gaming it.
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but yeah.
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: It goes against your grain.
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: To pay for it, yeah.
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I get it.
• 21:24
  Speaker 6: All right, Points Guy, Brian Kelly, thank you so much.
• 21:26
  Speaker 6: A real pleasure to have you here right before Labor Day,
• 21:29
  Speaker 6: the three-day weekend. He is a founder of the Points
• 21:32
  Speaker 6: Guy and author of How to Win at Travel.
• 21:37
  Speaker 4: I'm on the phone with Dana Telsey. We're checking the
• 21:39
  Speaker 4: Saturday schedule.
• 21:41
  Speaker 5: At the U.S.
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: Open.
• 21:42
  Speaker 5: So we can see who's wearing Tiffany at the U.S.
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: Open.
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: Look at how they can play tennis and wear jewelry.
• 21:47
  Speaker 4: And some of it's very big. It's not the Tiffany
• 21:49
  Speaker 4: mortals would buy. It's like big time. But we're both
• 21:52
  Speaker 4: waiting for the Saturday schedule to come out.
• 21:54
  Speaker 5: And it hasn't come out yet. It's an outrage.
• 21:56
  Speaker 10: We're still waiting.
• 21:58
  Speaker 6: In due time, it will come. Let's get a check
• 22:00
  Speaker 6: on where things stand. We had a big jobs report today,
• 22:02
  Speaker 6: much stronger than anticipated. That sent stocks lower because good
• 22:07
  Speaker 6: bad news or I should say good news is bad
• 22:08
  Speaker 6: news in the stock market.
• 22:09
  Speaker 5: Jeff Mason earlier said, why is that, Mike McKee?
• 22:12
  Speaker 6: Well, the president doesn't understand why that is. And it's
• 22:15
  Speaker 6: because people think that the Federal Reserve will. perhaps increased
• 22:18
  Speaker 6: interest rates later this month. You can see the S &
• 22:21
  Speaker 6: P down about.
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: A third of 1%.
• 22:23
  Speaker 6: Consumer discretionary that covers retailers are among the worst.
• 22:26
  Speaker 4: On that cross asset, the VIX 14.01 is a bull
• 22:30
  Speaker 4: market statistic just across the equity base.
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: You know, that's the way it is today. The dollar
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: 99.10 as well.
• 22:36
  Speaker 4: It'll be interesting to watch hydrocarbism, particularly as Stacey Vanek-Smith said,
• 22:40
  Speaker 4: that price of diesel.
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: In America and worldwide in the next week.
• 22:45
  Speaker 5: As well.
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: This is a treat.
• 22:47
  Speaker 4: It's a special edition, which means only Dana Tulsi can
• 22:50
  Speaker 4: show up.
• 22:51
  Speaker 5: CEO, Chief Research Officer.
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: Tulsi Advisory.
• 22:54
  Speaker 5: More than anyone I know with her childhood.
• 22:57
  Speaker 4: She is viscerally attached to 57th Street at Fifth Avenue.
• 23:02
  Speaker 4: I mean, I just can't say enough about the family
• 23:05
  Speaker 4: tieback to Bergdorf Goodman and all that. How you doing
• 23:08
  Speaker 4: and how's American retail doing? How's our aspiration?
• 23:12
  Speaker 13: Doing well in American retail, frankly, pivoting along, but doing nicely.
• 23:16
  Speaker 13: We saw some great results out of Victoria's Secret yesterday.
• 23:20
  Speaker 13: At the same time, Lululemon is obviously falling a lot
• 23:23
  Speaker 13: today as they have work to do. And then you
• 23:25
  Speaker 13: saw terrific results out of Abercrombie & Fitch. You have
• 23:28
  Speaker 13: companies like Oxford Industries who are still working to improve Lulipulitzer.
• 23:33
  Speaker 10: So for the most part, companies are managing inventory.
• 23:36
  Speaker 13: They're using marketing and social marketing to drive new customer growth.
• 23:41
  Speaker 13: And you have companies like Tapestry and Ralph Lauren that
• 23:44
  Speaker 13: are continuing.
• 23:45
  Speaker 10: To see more new customer growth and AUR increases.
• 23:47
  Speaker 2: I've got to give you a victory lap.
• 23:49
  Speaker 4: The Australian Financial Review magazine wrote an article on the
• 23:53
  Speaker 4: new Hermes store in London. which is the Dana Telsey story.
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: Let's bring it up here right now. First of all,
• 23:59
  Speaker 4: Hermes is struggling now. The stock down, it used to
• 24:02
  Speaker 4: be it cost five Hermes scarves, and now the price
• 24:05
  Speaker 4: of a share is three Hermes scarves. But this is
• 24:07
  Speaker 4: Florian Crane writing up here. In 2011, our point was saying,
• 24:13
  Speaker 4: if people go to a store, that will be for
• 24:15
  Speaker 4: a reason. It's not to get the product. The product
• 24:18
  Speaker 4: will be available on a click. He took that from you.
• 24:21
  Speaker 4: He stole that concept. You're the one I know who said,
• 24:25
  Speaker 4: stop panicking. Stores won't die.
• 24:27
  Speaker 10: Exactly.
• 24:28
  Speaker 13: And they're not dying. If anything, stores are more relevant
• 24:31
  Speaker 13: than ever before. You're seeing companies reinvest. Look at companies
• 24:34
  Speaker 13: like Aritzia, the beautiful stores they have here in New York.
• 24:38
  Speaker 13: Look at, frankly, look what Bloomingdale's has done. And it's
• 24:40
  Speaker 13: like a reinvention of what Bloomingdale's used.
• 24:43
  Speaker 10: To look like.
• 24:44
  Speaker 13: Social interaction happens in stores. And post-COVID, people want that
• 24:49
  Speaker 13: more than ever.
• 24:50
  Speaker 6: The reinvention, though, often pivots to focusing on a premium
• 24:54
  Speaker 6: customer who wants a premium experience because that premium customer,
• 24:57
  Speaker 6: their spending is more resilient and that's where the growth is, frankly.
• 25:00
  Speaker 6: Does that mean that the selection, the opportunities, the options
• 25:03
  Speaker 6: for the higher income consumer just grows and the options
• 25:07
  Speaker 6: for the lower income consumer just shrivels?
• 25:09
  Speaker 10: Well, a couple things.
• 25:10
  Speaker 13: I mean, I think you're seeing options for even lower-income
• 25:13
  Speaker 13: consumers in physical retail expand. Look what just opened here
• 25:16
  Speaker 13: in May. We had the first Primark in New York
• 25:19
  Speaker 13: City open, and that is a value retailer. The fastest-growing
• 25:24
  Speaker 13: number of store openings is coming out of.
• 25:25
  Speaker 10: The off-price retailers. Ross Stores, TJX, Burlington.
• 25:29
  Speaker 13: You look at Walmart remodeling nearly 600 stores a year.
• 25:33
  Speaker 13: So I think the pivot point is every type of
• 25:36
  Speaker 13: retailer is figuring out new ways to capture more traffic.
• 25:40
  Speaker 6: I want to ask about Shein and fast fashion because
• 25:44
  Speaker 6: there's a legitimate question here about whether fast fashion is dead.
• 25:47
  Speaker 6: Shein went public, but it definitely did not time it
• 25:50
  Speaker 6: right because it should have been a couple of years
• 25:51
  Speaker 6: ago when the growth was at its peak.
• 25:54
  Speaker 13: Well, also, I think you have competition. You look what
• 25:57
  Speaker 13: Zara and Zara's done so well. H & M is
• 26:00
  Speaker 13: trying to get its groove back. And there are privately
• 26:02
  Speaker 13: held companies like Addicted, E-D-I-K-T-E-D.
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: How do you keep track of this?
• 26:06
  Speaker 10: That's opening stores.
• 26:07
  Speaker 13: They have one here in the old Scrivener's Bookstore on
• 26:09
  Speaker 13: Fifth Avenue near Saks on 49th Street that just opened.
• 26:12
  Speaker 10: We're seeing a ton of traffic.
• 26:14
  Speaker 4: Within personal finance, retirement, and particularly wealth management, what spans
• 26:20
  Speaker 4: that is this crazy thing, aspiration. I want to own,
• 26:25
  Speaker 4: as we mentioned earlier, the Hermes scarf. I'll never own one,
• 26:28
  Speaker 4: but boy, they're beautiful. I think I'll look at it.
• 26:30
  Speaker 4: Or people that say, I'm never going to own one
• 26:32
  Speaker 4: at all, but I'm fascinated. Is our aspiration now the
• 26:37
  Speaker 4: same as it was 10 years ago or 30 years ago?
• 26:40
  Speaker 13: I think there will always be aspiration, but what you
• 26:42
  Speaker 13: aspire is something different.
• 26:44
  Speaker 10: Today, you just had the points guy on. What are
• 26:47
  Speaker 10: people doing? Look at the prices at the US Open.
• 26:50
  Speaker 13: They are very high. So people are basically paying up
• 26:54
  Speaker 13: for experiences. because experiences create memories. And it could be
• 26:58
  Speaker 13: memories with purchases, it could be memories with doing. And
• 27:01
  Speaker 13: I think there's a lot of interest in doing these days.
• 27:04
  Speaker 6: Which specialty retailers are doing a good job delivering on
• 27:07
  Speaker 6: that experience, providing that experience to the customer?
• 27:10
  Speaker 13: I think there are a couple that are doing some
• 27:11
  Speaker 13: interesting things. Frankly, you look at Ralph Lauren and, frankly,
• 27:14
  Speaker 13: Ralph's Coffee, you have lines there. They're creating that experience
• 27:18
  Speaker 13: that's exciting. Frankly, you look at Zara, which has something
• 27:21
  Speaker 13: new all the time, it creates a destination. Sephora, there
• 27:25
  Speaker 13: are crowds to get in the Sephora stores. So it
• 27:28
  Speaker 13: blends product and experience at the same time.
• 27:31
  Speaker 4: A joke at the house is the daily Sephora. What
• 27:34
  Speaker 4: they do is they bring the price down and go
• 27:36
  Speaker 4: every day. And I see it on the Visa run. Okay,
• 27:39
  Speaker 4: let's go to the open because you and I are fans.
• 27:41
  Speaker 4: We're getting scarlet into this as well. The dream is
• 27:44
  Speaker 4: to get Alex Ayala. to play Coco, and there you've
• 27:48
  Speaker 4: got Nike playing New Balance, and who in God's name
• 27:51
  Speaker 4: knows what jewelry they're wearing. Talk about the aspirational luxury
• 27:57
  Speaker 4: of most of the women, to be honest, draped at
• 28:00
  Speaker 4: the US Open.
• 28:01
  Speaker 5: The money's, it's millions, right?
• 28:03
  Speaker 13: It is millions, but also you're creating style trends. Look
• 28:06
  Speaker 13: what Sabalenka's wearing. Everyone looks every day. What is Osaka
• 28:11
  Speaker 13: wearing every day when she walks in the match? It's
• 28:13
  Speaker 13: something new and different. So yes, it's become fashion and
• 28:17
  Speaker 13: function at the same time.
• 28:18
  Speaker 5: Is Arno winning at that?
• 28:20
  Speaker 10: I think he plays a big game in it. He wins.
• 28:22
  Speaker 13: Ralph Lauren wins at it. Frankly, Nike also wins at that, too.
• 28:27
  Speaker 6: So when Tom said you were out front and saying
• 28:29
  Speaker 6: that stores were not dead, it's not just stores anymore.
• 28:31
  Speaker 6: It's the venue for people to see the products available.
• 28:35
  Speaker 6: But it's also at events like the U.S.
• 28:37
  Speaker 9: Open.
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: Exactly.
• 28:38
  Speaker 10: It is at events. And frankly, you look at what
• 28:40
  Speaker 10: stores are doing these days.
• 28:41
  Speaker 13: Whether they're creating styling sessions and bring your friend, whether
• 28:45
  Speaker 13: they're introducing you to a new designer, there's a.
• 28:48
  Speaker 10: Reason to go.
• 28:50
  Speaker 13: And frankly, every time you have a reason to go,
• 28:52
  Speaker 13: it's a click, click, because you're buying one thing, but oh,
• 28:55
  Speaker 13: I didn't know I needed that, I'll buy that too.
• 28:57
  Speaker 5: Your heart and soul is Bergdorf.
• 28:59
  Speaker 11: Yes.
• 29:00
  Speaker 5: How does Bergdorf survive?
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: Out of the world.
• 29:03
  Speaker 5: London, Bergdorf, Printemps, and Paris. How do they survive?
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: Service.
• 29:08
  Speaker 13: The service that they have is differentiated than others. They
• 29:11
  Speaker 13: build relationships with their customers. They know their closets. And
• 29:15
  Speaker 13: they can talk to them first, talk to them fast,
• 29:17
  Speaker 13: and get them to the store.
• 29:19
  Speaker 4: You just heard there, folks, is classic Dana Telsey back
• 29:22
  Speaker 4: to Bear Stearns.
• 29:23
  Speaker 5: Scarlett, they know their closets.
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: They know.
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: They know their customers, too.
• 29:29
  Speaker 6: I'm curious as to these frictionless payment systems that have
• 29:32
  Speaker 6: been introduced and rolled out, Apple Pay, Google Pay, all
• 29:34
  Speaker 6: of that. How do you see that changing consumer spending habits,
• 29:37
  Speaker 6: the way we spend?
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: What are retailers doing?
• 29:40
  Speaker 6: To adapt to these new payment methods, and do we
• 29:43
  Speaker 6: actually spend more because it's frictionless?
• 29:45
  Speaker 10: Some of that, but the other thing it gives retailers, data.
• 29:48
  Speaker 13: It gives them data on what the customer is buying,
• 29:51
  Speaker 13: when they're buying, where they're buying, so they know more
• 29:54
  Speaker 13: about their customer that they can curate the assortments. Frictionless
• 29:57
  Speaker 13: payments is becoming standard right now. Look at how we all,
• 30:01
  Speaker 13: whether you take a train, whether you pay for something,
• 30:04
  Speaker 13: it's just tap and go.
• 30:06
  Speaker 10: And that's become, frankly, normal cost of business.
• 30:10
  Speaker 4: Joseph Feldman emails in. He says, ask a Joe Feldman question.
• 30:15
  Speaker 4: Joe's wonderful. He works with Dana on the big box.
• 30:18
  Speaker 4: Why is Walmart trading at 40 times earnings? I still
• 30:21
  Speaker 4: don't get it.
• 30:22
  Speaker 13: Well, why Walmart trades that way is because look at
• 30:24
  Speaker 13: the growth opportunities. Walmart's become a modern technology company, too.
• 30:28
  Speaker 13: Look at their ability to capture all income levels. And frankly,
• 30:33
  Speaker 13: you look at what they have, a global space in
• 30:36
  Speaker 13: order to be able to.
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: And the other thing in.
• 30:37
  Speaker 4: Terms of Bloomberg money and personal finance, how many millionaires
• 30:42
  Speaker 4: has Bentonville made?
• 30:43
  Speaker 10: A lot of millionaires. And Bentonville is a nice place
• 30:46
  Speaker 10: to live.
• 30:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 30:48
  Speaker 6: How's Walmart doing with capturing the premium customer as well
• 30:51
  Speaker 6: as holding on to.
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: Its core customer?
• 30:53
  Speaker 13: Look at the biggest growth for Walmart is coming from
• 30:55
  Speaker 13: higher income consumers. And that ability for them to see
• 30:58
  Speaker 13: relevance there is exciting.
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: All right, Dana Telsey, thank you so much.
• 31:03
  Speaker 10: Thank you for having me.
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: Really appreciate it.
• 31:04
  Speaker 6: Dana Telsey, CEO and Chief Research Officer at Telsey Advisory Group.
• 31:09
  Speaker 6: All right, Labor Day weekend means end of summer, which
• 31:11
  Speaker 6: means back to school here in New York. I visited
• 31:14
  Speaker 6: the campus of SUNY Purchase and spoke with a student
• 31:16
  Speaker 6: on just how he's paying for college.
• 31:19
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 31:20
  Speaker 14: Originally, it was like 30K a year. I got it
• 31:25
  Speaker 14: down to like $ 1, 500. It took a lot of time.
• 31:30
  Speaker 14: Financial aid and working at the same time. It was
• 31:34
  Speaker 14: very tough.
• 31:39
  Speaker 4: You're listening to Bloomberg Money. Stay with us with more
• 31:42
  Speaker 4: to come after this.
• 31:52
  Speaker 6: Bloomberg Money is your new destination for personal finance. It's
• 31:55
  Speaker 6: a cross-platform effort that extends beyond television because it's our
• 31:58
  Speaker 6: new digital hub at Bloomberg.com slash money. And one of
• 32:02
  Speaker 6: the stories featured this week is about parents opening brokerage
• 32:05
  Speaker 6: accounts for their teens to learn the basics of investing. Fidelity,
• 32:09
  Speaker 6: Schwab and other firms have noticed and they're rolling out
• 32:11
  Speaker 6: products to target this demo to lock in a new
• 32:14
  Speaker 6: generation of customers and investors. Josiana Joshua reported on this
• 32:18
  Speaker 6: and joins us now to discuss. You talked to a
• 32:20
  Speaker 6: bunch of these parents and teens. What did they tell you?
• 32:23
  Speaker 12: Yeah, so the teens are excited to get into it.
• 32:26
  Speaker 12: They're very excited to get invested. They're very excited to
• 32:28
  Speaker 12: do the research. They're excited to see the gains as well,
• 32:31
  Speaker 12: of course. And the parents are kind of worried about
• 32:33
  Speaker 12: what the economy is going to look like when they
• 32:35
  Speaker 12: get older. So they're like nice, excited to have this
• 32:38
  Speaker 12: as a backbone for them.
• 32:39
  Speaker 2: This is separate from day trading with a.
• 32:41
  Speaker 5: Laptop off a couch.
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: Yes, it's much separate.
• 32:44
  Speaker 4: Lisa Mateo's kids, they're just power. They're like the president,
• 32:48
  Speaker 4: a thousand trades a day.
• 32:49
  Speaker 6: It feels like they're a little bit ahead on this.
• 32:51
  Speaker 6: But the motivation for a lot of parents wanting to
• 32:54
  Speaker 6: start their kids on investing early is because they feel
• 32:57
  Speaker 6: like they didn't.
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: Do that themselves.
• 32:59
  Speaker 12: Yeah, so it's really trying to get the time, behind
• 33:01
  Speaker 12: the time. Like the time is what they want to
• 33:03
  Speaker 12: get on. Parents feel like they didn't have the time
• 33:05
  Speaker 12: as well.
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: They kind of started a little bit late.
• 33:07
  Speaker 12: So they're trying to get that compounding interest to grow
• 33:10
  Speaker 12: and make sure their kids have the best head start
• 33:11
  Speaker 12: that they can.
• 33:12
  Speaker 6: And are these kids investing in big tech names and ETFs?
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: What are they buying?
• 33:16
  Speaker 12: Yeah, so according to Schwab, I spoke to Schwab's Fisher
• 33:19
  Speaker 12: for the story, they're mostly focusing in on single stocks.
• 33:23
  Speaker 12: Some of them are also going into ETFs, but the
• 33:25
  Speaker 12: big tech names are really attractive to them. It's Apple, Amazon, Google,
• 33:28
  Speaker 12: all the ones that you hear on the headlines every day.
• 33:30
  Speaker 4: Did you and your research do anything on the joy
• 33:33
  Speaker 4: of learning to lose money?
• 33:35
  Speaker 5: To me, that's the number one gift.
• 33:37
  Speaker 3: The joy?
• 33:38
  Speaker 5: The joy of losing money.
• 33:40
  Speaker 4: I lost money on Westinghouse options when I couldn't shave
• 33:43
  Speaker 4: once a week.
• 33:44
  Speaker 5: Interesting.
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: And you learn how to lose money.
• 33:46
  Speaker 12: Yeah, we talked to a financial therapist who was like,
• 33:48
  Speaker 12: it's really important for them to learn the difference between
• 33:51
  Speaker 12: losing money and making a bad choice.
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: It's part of their identity.
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: Lisa Bramowitz is my financial therapist.
• 33:59
  Speaker 6: My cousin is my financial advisor. Josiana, thank you so
• 34:02
  Speaker 6: much for bringing us this story. Josiana Joshua of Bloomberg News. Now,
• 34:05
  Speaker 6: one of the biggest expenses for families is, of course, college.
• 34:09
  Speaker 6: Last August, or I should say late August and early September,
• 34:11
  Speaker 6: is all about move-in day. So I visited the campus
• 34:14
  Speaker 6: of SUNY Purchase, known for its drama and performing arts program.
• 34:17
  Speaker 6: And I spoke with the president, Michael Stiper, along with
• 34:19
  Speaker 6: students and parents about the challenges they all face.
• 34:23
  Speaker 3: So right now, some of the biggest issues facing higher
• 34:26
  Speaker 3: education relate to the value proposition that students and their
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: families are really considering when they're choosing a college and
• 34:33
  Speaker 3: even choosing to go to college at all.
• 34:36
  Speaker 6: Choosing to go to college at all, that comes up
• 34:37
  Speaker 6: a lot. A lot of families, students in particular, are saying,
• 34:41
  Speaker 6: is a four-year college degree worth it?
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: How do you talk them through that?
• 34:45
  Speaker 5: Sure.
• 34:45
  Speaker 3: So for the vast majority of students, it is very
• 34:49
  Speaker 3: worthwhile for them to complete a four-year degree. Now, a
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: key word there is complete that four-year degree because it's
• 34:55
  Speaker 3: essential when students start college that they finish college. Because
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: students with a degree in hand, they perform better in
• 35:01
  Speaker 3: the job market, they live longer, healthier lives, and they're
• 35:05
  Speaker 3: engaged citizens. So we think for those reasons, it's a
• 35:08
  Speaker 3: great choice to go to college. But again, the most
• 35:11
  Speaker 3: important thing to do is to go to a college
• 35:13
  Speaker 3: that fits you and a college that you will complete.
• 35:17
  Speaker 6: And also a big consideration is a college that you
• 35:19
  Speaker 6: can afford. How are you seeing rising costs impact your campus?
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: Well, what I see is.
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: That more and more parents and families are considering public
• 35:29
  Speaker 3: higher education. We see across the SUNY system increases in
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: enrollment year over year over year. And I think that's
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: indicative of people deciding that cost is a big consideration.
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: And I see more students and their families talking about
• 35:43
  Speaker 3: the cost and how SUNY Purchase, which has a very,
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: very affordable price point, how that is a big part
• 35:51
  Speaker 3: of their choice. And what we're able to do here
• 35:54
  Speaker 3: is say that you don't have to choose a campus
• 35:58
  Speaker 3: with an expensive price tag to get a fantastic experience.
• 36:02
  Speaker 6: So the rising cost of a college education has been
• 36:05
  Speaker 6: something that people have been grappling with for a decade now,
• 36:08
  Speaker 6: if not more. How has that evolved during your time
• 36:11
  Speaker 6: in leadership in higher education?
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: Yeah, definitely it continues to be a challenge. At SUNY,
• 36:16
  Speaker 3: we've kept tuition pretty flat for quite a few years,
• 36:20
  Speaker 3: but more and more parents are looking more widely at
• 36:24
  Speaker 3: different campus options. You know, one of the things that's
• 36:27
  Speaker 3: fantastic about American higher education is there are so many
• 36:31
  Speaker 3: different options, so many different choices, public, private, two-year schools,
• 36:34
  Speaker 3: four-year schools throughout the nation. And it used to be
• 36:38
  Speaker 3: just about the most selective, the best. And now I'm
• 36:41
  Speaker 3: seeing more parents consider different factors that play into that,
• 36:45
  Speaker 3: along with academic excellence. Part of it that families need
• 36:49
  Speaker 3: to consider more is how much debt their students will
• 36:51
  Speaker 3: be leaving college with. And I think that is a
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: factor that people need to consider because A lot of
• 36:58
  Speaker 3: students today are planning not only on just a four-year degree,
• 37:02
  Speaker 3: but on further degrees, whether it's medicine or law or
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: graduate school or something of that sort. So thinking about
• 37:10
  Speaker 3: how much debt you're leaving your four-year degree with, and
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: here at SUNY Purchase, it's typically less than $ 25, 000.
• 37:15
  Speaker 6: That's the view from the college president, but I also
• 37:19
  Speaker 6: wanted to hear directly from the students and parents at
• 37:22
  Speaker 6: Move-In Day. Everyone I spoke with had a different plan
• 37:25
  Speaker 6: on how to pay for college.
• 37:27
  Speaker 11: Out-of-state tuition is definitely a lot. So I took out
• 37:31
  Speaker 11: some student loans and was able to do that pretty easily.
• 37:35
  Speaker 11: And I also put on like my own fundraising show.
• 37:39
  Speaker 11: Like I produced my own show to raise money to
• 37:42
  Speaker 11: come to college.
• 37:43
  Speaker 4: So yeah.
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: How much did you raise from that? About $ 3, 500.
• 37:47
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 37:47
  Speaker 11: Is this something.
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: You're going to be doing regularly, you think?
• 37:51
  Speaker 11: Yeah, I'm planning actually on doing it every year in
• 37:53
  Speaker 11: my hometown since it was so successful. So it like
• 37:56
  Speaker 11: kind of helps me like build my own scholarship fund
• 37:58
  Speaker 11: a little bit.
• 37:59
  Speaker 15: I have a love for art and love for sculpture,
• 38:01
  Speaker 15: but I just know it wasn't feasibly possible for me
• 38:04
  Speaker 15: to do that as a career since I am low income.
• 38:09
  Speaker 15: So that's why I chose political science and law and
• 38:11
  Speaker 15: justice because I could go down that law school track.
• 38:14
  Speaker 16: I'm a teacher, so very big on education. So it's
• 38:18
  Speaker 16: worth it for me to spend your money on that.
• 38:21
  Speaker 16: So you have to start planning early. and try not
• 38:25
  Speaker 16: to put yourself in too much of a hole debt-wise,
• 38:27
  Speaker 16: but you do the best you can.
• 38:30
  Speaker 17: About 18,000 or so just to live on campus. So that,
• 38:35
  Speaker 17: I think the tuition, state tuition is about seven. So altogether,
• 38:38
  Speaker 17: it's like 32,000 majority of that is boarding. So that
• 38:42
  Speaker 17: did make, it was just like a wow factor to
• 38:44
  Speaker 17: see how much it costs to board and the eating packages,
• 38:48
  Speaker 17: 3,700 and some change, you know, per semester just to
• 38:52
  Speaker 17: be able to feed your kids.
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: I'm a first-generation student.
• 38:56
  Speaker 18: I get free housing being an RA, so because of that,
• 39:00
  Speaker 18: now I don't have to pay for anything in school
• 39:02
  Speaker 18: at all with FAFSA and TAP.
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: Did you have to take out any loans to attend school?
• 39:08
  Speaker 18: For my first year, I did, but once I became
• 39:10
  Speaker 18: an RA, I didn't have to take out any more loans,
• 39:13
  Speaker 18: so now I've been paying them back.
• 39:15
  Speaker 2: We've been saving for a while.
• 39:16
  Speaker 7: We have an education savings program, and the balance we're
• 39:21
  Speaker 7: paying for is okay.
• 39:23
  Speaker 1: Has that affected your retirement plan? We're never going to retire.
• 39:27
  Speaker 10: That's madness.
• 39:28
  Speaker 6: That was my conversation with SUNY Purchase President Michael Saper
• 39:33
  Speaker 6: along with some parents and students on move-in day. They're
• 39:36
  Speaker 6: still dealing with the sticker shock of tuition.
• 39:38
  Speaker 4: That was a breath of fresh air because we do
• 39:40
  Speaker 4: all this Bloomberg elite stuff that we do every single day.
• 39:43
  Speaker 4: Personal finance, retirement, all in SUNY Purchase is $ 24, 000, maybe $ 26, 000.
• 39:50
  Speaker 4: And there's so many people that can't make that nut.
• 39:53
  Speaker 4: And it's like the old days when our parents, I mean,
• 39:56
  Speaker 4: you're too young to remember this, but they worked their
• 39:59
  Speaker 4: way through college.
• 40:00
  Speaker 6: Yeah, that's not possible anymore when you have tuition and
• 40:03
  Speaker 6: boarding going up to almost $ 100, 000 a year.
• 40:04
  Speaker 5: You look at the fancy.
• 40:06
  Speaker 4: People, the idiocy of 90, 100,000 a year. And the
• 40:10
  Speaker 4: real world is what you just did at Purchase. I mean,
• 40:13
  Speaker 4: that's the real world.
• 40:14
  Speaker 6: I mean, what the universities will say is that the
• 40:17
  Speaker 6: sticker price is different from what people actually pay, but
• 40:20
  Speaker 6: there's no people paying the sticker price.
• 40:21
  Speaker 5: People are still paying. We used to call that in
• 40:23
  Speaker 5: the old days, dear, full boat.
• 40:25
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 40:26
  Speaker 5: Full boat.
• 40:26
  Speaker 6: Well, a lot of international students were paying the full boat,
• 40:28
  Speaker 6: and they're not coming into the country anymore.
• 40:31
  Speaker 4: And then there's the misty-eyed look of dropping the offspring
• 40:36
  Speaker 4: off to school. The photos are out on social media
• 40:39
  Speaker 4: and it's the father who can barely contain himself.
• 40:43
  Speaker 2: The daughter's like, when is mom leaving?
• 40:46
  Speaker 6: That's Lisa Mateo right there dropping off her daughter at
• 40:49
  Speaker 6: school this past weekend.
• 40:50
  Speaker 5: It's just too emotional.
• 40:52
  Speaker 4: Bloomberg Money, a special edition, which means Lisa Mateo's here.
• 40:55
  Speaker 4: What's going to be interesting here, SUNY purchased with your
• 40:58
  Speaker 4: wonderful package you just.
• 40:59
  Speaker 5: Did, $ 30, 000, $ 40, 000, $ 50, 000.
• 40:59
  Speaker 2: Scranton, $ 75, 000 all in, which is only $ 25, 000 under.
• 41:01
  Speaker 5: Say, NYU or high above Cayuga's waters.
• 41:10
  Speaker 6: It was, and Lisa Mattel lived to come back and
• 41:13
  Speaker 6: tell us about it. You dropped off your daughter at school.
• 41:15
  Speaker 6: That must have been a hard goodbye.
• 41:17
  Speaker 19: It was hard, but she's not too far, which makes
• 41:20
  Speaker 19: it a little easier. But you're talking about the college,
• 41:23
  Speaker 19: like the college tuition, how much everything costs.
• 41:26
  Speaker 2: It's ridiculous.
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: It's incredible.
• 41:29
  Speaker 19: And what parents are trying to do to do this.
• 41:31
  Speaker 19: I mean, we had an article out today about how
• 41:33
  Speaker 19: more parents and kids, they're joining the military in order
• 41:37
  Speaker 19: to help pay for some of this. I mean, this
• 41:38
  Speaker 19: is something that I'm living. I have a son in
• 41:40
  Speaker 19: the National Guard. My daughter's deciding to join ROTC. Like,
• 41:43
  Speaker 19: these are the measures that we're going to. And it's
• 41:46
  Speaker 19: hard as a parent to take that into consideration because
• 41:49
  Speaker 19: of the atmosphere that we're living in now.
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 41:52
  Speaker 19: But it just goes to show you what families are
• 41:55
  Speaker 19: doing in order to be able to pay for this.
• 41:57
  Speaker 4: You got a multi-million dollar study on University of Alabama sororities.
• 42:03
  Speaker 4: We did that with Lisa a couple weeks ago. Is
• 42:06
  Speaker 4: young Miss Mateo going to join a sorority?
• 42:08
  Speaker 10: Here's the good news.
• 42:10
  Speaker 19: Scranton does not have sororities.
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: So you don't have to pay a consultant.
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: No, I don't have to pay that.
• 42:15
  Speaker 10: But what you do have to pay the room is
• 42:17
  Speaker 10: for the dorm room.
• 42:18
  Speaker 19: Girls go out of their mind to decorate their dorm rooms.
• 42:21
  Speaker 10: Can I just tell you?
• 42:23
  Speaker 19: Between the bedding and the decorations and all, because they
• 42:26
  Speaker 19: need the new beauty products.
• 42:27
  Speaker 1: They can't use the old ones.
• 42:29
  Speaker 10: So they need all new stuff. I mean, it's incredible
• 42:31
  Speaker 10: all the stuff that you can forget.
• 42:32
  Speaker 1: This is where Wayfair and Bed Bath & Beyond come
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: into the picture. It is crazy.
• 42:36
  Speaker 10: It is crazy.
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: It is crazy.
• 42:38
  Speaker 10: But it's been a journey, and it's a fun one, too.
• 42:40
  Speaker 2: All right.
• 42:40
  Speaker 1: Well, congratulations to you.
• 42:41
  Speaker 14: Yes.
• 42:41
  Speaker 6: And I know you have now some time to spend
• 42:44
  Speaker 6: on other things. Are you going to be going to
• 42:46
  Speaker 6: the U.S.
• 42:46
  Speaker 5: Open?
• 42:47
  Speaker 19: I wish I could, but I can't afford that right now.
• 42:51
  Speaker 10: Well, you know what?
• 42:51
  Speaker 19: The ticket's on top of that. But the price of
• 42:53
  Speaker 19: the food and the drinks, and that is what is...
• 42:56
  Speaker 19: going crazy out there. I mean, you have people going
• 42:58
  Speaker 19: to these, right? It's not just tennis fans, it's foodies,
• 43:01
  Speaker 19: it's influencers.
• 43:02
  Speaker 10: It's all these people who.
• 43:03
  Speaker 19: Want to get their hands on, you know, the honeydews.
• 43:06
  Speaker 19: It's 23 bucks. They sold hundreds of thousands of them
• 43:10
  Speaker 19: last time. It's basically vodka, lemonade, and three melon balls
• 43:14
  Speaker 19: kind of in a glass there. It looks good, but
• 43:17
  Speaker 19: that's not the only thing.
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 43:19
  Speaker 19: So that one's been going, you have Taylor Swift, holding
• 43:21
  Speaker 19: them that's tom's friend you know just going out and
• 43:24
  Speaker 19: taking pictures with them all these celebrities bruce springsteen um
• 43:27
  Speaker 19: then they have the merch to go with it so
• 43:29
  Speaker 19: you can't just get the merch you got to get
• 43:31
  Speaker 19: the towel it's a t-shirt you have to get the
• 43:33
  Speaker 19: honey deuce sweatshirt you have to get the honey deuce
• 43:35
  Speaker 19: melon baller it's a whole thing and the food tom
• 43:39
  Speaker 19: you're gonna love this 100 gluten-free chicken nuggets with caviar.
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: Those I missed. Those you missed.
• 43:47
  Speaker 10: It's from Cocoa Dot.
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: You can make it up this weekend.
• 43:49
  Speaker 2: We're hoping Alexiala against Cocoa Grift. That would be great.
• 43:54
  Speaker 6: Lisa Mateo, thank you so much, of course. And be
• 43:56
  Speaker 6: sure to watch Bloomberg this weekend. Lisa is on every
• 43:59
  Speaker 6: Saturday and Sunday morning starting at 7 a.m.
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: Eastern time.
• 44:03
  Speaker 2: That is it.
• 44:03
  Speaker 4: It's a special edition for your long weekend as the
• 44:06
  Speaker 4: nation celebrates Labor Day.
• 44:09
  Speaker 5: Bloomberg Money.
• 44:14
  Speaker 4: This is the Bloomberg Money Podcast, bringing you a smart
• 44:17
  Speaker 4: look at the forces shaping your financial life. I'm Tom
• 44:21
  Speaker 4: Keen with Scarlett Fu. You can watch the show live
• 44:25
  Speaker 4: on Bloomberg TV every Friday at noon Wall Street time.
• 44:29
  Speaker 4: Subscribe to the podcast on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen.
• 44:33
  Speaker 4: And as always, on the Bloomberg Terminal and the Bloomberg
• 44:37
  Speaker 4: Business app.
• 44:43
  Speaker 11: Thank you.