Latest / The Lone Gunman Podcast : JFK Assassination / JFK ASSASSINATION - EP. 407- Fair Play For Joe Borellay

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JFK ASSASSINATION - EP. 407- Fair Play For Joe Borellay · The Lone Gunman Podcast : JFK Assassination

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: What triple b on the doll yet.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: The Long gun Man podcast cole PA's talked, he died.
• 0:27
  Speaker 3: Let's ride people in.
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: The blood, troop in the fire, fair play.
• 0:31
  Speaker 3: For Joe Brella.
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: Triple B got the fire, got the map, got the names,
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: one shot, one frame, but the story never sang coaract
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: turned quiet, and the whole town.
• 0:42
  Speaker 3: Shook Portrail's dirty.
• 0:44
  Speaker 4: Every page got a little resting.
• 0:46
  Speaker 2: Over roomors, backroom smoke, stand on the evidence. The people
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: still spoke, deal in the shadows, handshakes in the dark.
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: Every official wis and got a crack in the mark
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: Miami to Dallas.
• 0:56
  Speaker 5: Here the whispers roll?
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: Who pulled strings? Who played god?
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: Who brought the So we don't chase ghosts, We chase
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: what's real.
• 1:03
  Speaker 5: In the Low gun Man or cove, every.
• 1:05
  Speaker 3: Line gets deal over that line, check that.
• 1:08
  Speaker 6: Tape, one more clue, one more break tle be say
• 1:13
  Speaker 6: the name gets loud when we bring the.
• 1:15
  Speaker 4: Flavor play foot.
• 1:18
  Speaker 7: Headline said all day play fotol be.
• 1:24
  Speaker 3: We don't play it.
• 1:27
  Speaker 7: Our lang, keep it live, keep it bread.
• 1:33
  Speaker 6: Constitracy in the grain, well said he was a paint
• 1:37
  Speaker 6: was in more than one was the whole board seller
• 1:40
  Speaker 6: for the day begun, file's gold missing.
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: When the pression gets high, twenty hands in the bar,
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: too many eyes in the sky, witness got nervous, and
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: the witness got.
• 1:48
  Speaker 5: Gone on comeline for me. Put the tape kept on.
• 1:51
  Speaker 3: At the old heads. That's the ones who know. That's
• 1:53
  Speaker 3: why the Glenn story never to the whole show brings.
• 1:57
  Speaker 6: The noise, brings the facts, brings the steal.
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: When the truth gets ferry, that's when we feel no
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: fairy tale and it just the puzzle in the box and.
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: Every new wheels to mix the old one rock. Fair play.
• 2:07
  Speaker 7: Fo Lesayla said, all day, fo volet triple ba. We
• 2:15
  Speaker 7: don't play play a leg, keep alive, keep.
• 2:20
  Speaker 6: The breadele, conspiracy in the grave, hold up, listen close,
• 2:30
  Speaker 6: who profited?
• 2:31
  Speaker 5: Who let go?
• 2:32
  Speaker 3: New names?
• 2:34
  Speaker 7: Oh smoke saint dog groom, same strange joke, fair play foto.
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: All this say Love said, all day, all that triple ban.
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: We don't play all that you belved giggle bade, conspiracy.
• 2:56
  Speaker 8: In the grave, Cuban flavor in the building tonight, it's
• 3:17
  Speaker 8: fair play for Joe Brella.
• 3:20
  Speaker 9: Hey, happy buddy.
• 3:23
  Speaker 5: Thank you man.
• 3:23
  Speaker 3: I appreciate it. And it will be Sunday and just
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: just in time for my birthday. My USA Hockey jersey
• 3:35
  Speaker 3: came in with eighty six Jack Hughes, who scored the
• 3:40
  Speaker 3: winning goal. Ironically, where's my number? So I thought that
• 3:46
  Speaker 3: was kind of cool and I'm debuting the jersey for
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: this episode. But how are you, sir?
• 3:53
  Speaker 5: And fantastic. I'm happy it's Friday. I'm glad we're here.
• 3:57
  Speaker 5: I've been looking forward to this episode all week long. Yeah,
• 4:00
  Speaker 5: and real quick, folks, make sure you're tuning in tomorrow morning,
• 4:04
  Speaker 5: ten am Eastern Standard Time. Quick Hits be coming at
• 4:08
  Speaker 5: you live in the morning. But that's tomorrow. This is tonight.
• 4:12
  Speaker 5: This is the lonecoming podcast. I'm the Triple B. He's
• 4:16
  Speaker 5: Joe Borelli, and tonight we're gonna be getting into about
• 4:19
  Speaker 5: the FPCC, little ed Stucky, a little Oswald of course,
• 4:25
  Speaker 5: then maybe some other things. But yeah, exciting times, Joseph, Yes.
• 4:33
  Speaker 3: They are, indeed, And you know, just before we start
• 4:38
  Speaker 3: a little funny birthday drama. But I told you about
• 4:44
  Speaker 3: a little bit after the show on Wednesday. Members only,
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: if you're not a member.
• 4:48
  Speaker 5: Do that. Yeah, and I believe you can also sign
• 4:52
  Speaker 5: up for a free trial of the membership.
• 4:55
  Speaker 3: So what are you doing right. You have access to
• 4:59
  Speaker 3: how many backups?
• 5:01
  Speaker 9: Yeah?
• 5:02
  Speaker 5: A lot? A lot makes you get early access to
• 5:04
  Speaker 5: the book review, early access to Rob's or random research
• 5:07
  Speaker 5: ramas with Rob.
• 5:11
  Speaker 3: The quadruple aar yes, but yeah, so you know, I,
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: you know, everyone's trying to like do these birthday things
• 5:22
  Speaker 3: with me, fucking barbecues, all this gay shit. Sorry, and
• 5:29
  Speaker 3: not that there's anything wrong with that, and and I
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: just want to be by myself. And I know you
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: can relate to that, just like chill.
• 5:43
  Speaker 5: I'm by myself all the time, so and I love it.
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's great.
• 5:48
  Speaker 9: I'm alone. I'm not lonely.
• 5:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there's different. I'm not trying to blow out birthday
• 5:54
  Speaker 3: candles and that's type of stuff. So my cousin, you know,
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: some of you know our family has a property in
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: the Catskills, and my cousin is up there a lot,
• 6:09
  Speaker 3: and he unfortunately lost his wife to a brain tumor
• 6:12
  Speaker 3: a few years ago. And I noticed he was up
• 6:15
  Speaker 3: there by himself, So I said, why don't I go
• 6:18
  Speaker 3: up there tomorrow morning? Of course, Pod takes precedence right,
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: and just like have a quiet weekend. We go to
• 6:33
  Speaker 3: the farmer's market on Sunday morning, and we buy this
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: really authentic grass fed beef and other chickens and stuff,
• 6:47
  Speaker 3: and it's actually fed by the hay that is harvested
• 6:50
  Speaker 3: from our property. Is kind of like a cool concept,
• 6:53
  Speaker 3: I guess, right, you know where it's coming from. And
• 6:58
  Speaker 3: then some family members decide to try to hijack our weekend.
• 7:04
  Speaker 3: But I don't have a problem with that. I have
• 7:08
  Speaker 3: a problem with their dog because their dog is like
• 7:11
  Speaker 3: a husky wolf dog. Like he tried to attack me
• 7:16
  Speaker 3: and I'm a dog person. He trampled my old dog
• 7:23
  Speaker 3: last time, and after Ruby's recent attack, I didn't want
• 7:31
  Speaker 3: like now I can't bring up Ruby. So a bunch
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: of drama ensued. Of course, because you know, you have
• 7:40
  Speaker 3: three co owners, you have seven or eight grandchildren, you
• 7:43
  Speaker 3: have multiple great grandchildren, and like blah blah blah.
• 7:48
  Speaker 5: Once I have like a DIB system, like hey, this
• 7:51
  Speaker 5: is this is our weekend, y'all.
• 7:54
  Speaker 3: We have a calendar system. He has Google calendars.
• 7:58
  Speaker 4: And but we didn't say us only, so we shouldn't
• 8:07
  Speaker 4: have to, right, I mean, I don't know think.
• 8:11
  Speaker 3: Our birthday, to be honest, our birthday weekends. So anyways,
• 8:16
  Speaker 3: after a bunch of drama. I guess they're not coming anymore.
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: So I'm going to go up tomorrow morning at about
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: eight am, leave and with the Ruby and have a
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: nice relaxing weekend. So I'm looking forward to that. And
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: you know, we'll do whatever dinners or barbecues later in August.
• 8:38
  Speaker 3: I guess there you there's my birthday.
• 8:43
  Speaker 5: All right. Now, let's get down to business, shall we
• 8:47
  Speaker 5: we shall? All right, So the Fair Play for Cuba Committee,
• 8:55
  Speaker 5: I believe, came about somewhere in nineteen sixty range, and
• 9:03
  Speaker 5: it was founded by a dude who had some pretty
• 9:06
  Speaker 5: substantial wealthy Cuban contacts, shall we say, he managed to
• 9:14
  Speaker 5: meet with Fidel Castro and secure, I believe, and this
• 9:20
  Speaker 5: is nothing really to sneeze at from back then. I
• 9:25
  Speaker 5: believe it was five thousand dollars from Fidel Castro or no, no,
• 9:30
  Speaker 5: fifteen thousand, I'm sorry, which is a good bit. You know,
• 9:35
  Speaker 5: in today's money, you're talking at one hundred and fifty
• 9:37
  Speaker 5: thousand or more, right, you know, to start this committee
• 9:42
  Speaker 5: to promote fair play for Cuba. You know, they were
• 9:46
  Speaker 5: against the blockades, the neutrality laws, the treaties and and
• 9:53
  Speaker 5: all of this stuff.
• 9:57
  Speaker 10: You know, just.
• 10:00
  Speaker 5: Play fair with Cuba. You know, don't mind the fact
• 10:04
  Speaker 5: that Castro is a Communist now and he's in bed
• 10:06
  Speaker 5: with the Russians, but we still want you to treat
• 10:08
  Speaker 5: him like family, you know, type of thing, which, of course,
• 10:12
  Speaker 5: as you can imagine, you know, didn't go over very well.
• 10:17
  Speaker 10: Now.
• 10:17
  Speaker 5: Of course they were well, the United States had its
• 10:22
  Speaker 5: fair share of communist sympathizers back in the day. You know,
• 10:27
  Speaker 5: there was the American Communist Party and various other entities
• 10:34
  Speaker 5: such as the Fair Play for Cuba Committee, you know,
• 10:37
  Speaker 5: not quite as big, but of course something like this
• 10:42
  Speaker 5: drew the attention of the FBI, of course, you know,
• 10:48
  Speaker 5: and they were going to want to know what these
• 10:51
  Speaker 5: guys are doing, what's going on, what are they about?
• 10:55
  Speaker 5: And well, for part two next Wednesday night, for members only,
• 11:00
  Speaker 5: I'm gonna go more into the story of Harry Dean
• 11:03
  Speaker 5: and how he became an FBI informant for the Fair
• 11:07
  Speaker 5: Play for Cuba Committee to the FBI and so on
• 11:10
  Speaker 5: and so forth, and his and his jfk assassination connections,
• 11:14
  Speaker 5: if you will, But that will be for part two.
• 11:19
  Speaker 5: There's just a lot there to unpack. To throw him
• 11:23
  Speaker 5: in here tonight, but it seemed like a good part too.
• 11:29
  Speaker 5: But let's talk a little bit about the FPCC. So
• 11:31
  Speaker 5: let me let me share my screen with you, all right.
• 11:38
  Speaker 5: What we have here is a copy of Oh hold on, Joe,
• 11:45
  Speaker 5: ah ah, who is it?
• 11:51
  Speaker 3: You're muted, Mike the library Man, Happy birthday, Joe. Thank
• 11:58
  Speaker 3: you so much, Mike. I appreciate it. You are one
• 12:05
  Speaker 3: of our most valued members and I appreciate it.
• 12:11
  Speaker 9: Yeah, man, that's awesome.
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you. Ohia.
• 12:19
  Speaker 9: All right, So what we have here, folks, is.
• 12:24
  Speaker 5: Part of a pamphlet that Oswald was handing out in
• 12:29
  Speaker 5: front of the International Trademark, okay, and I believe the
• 12:35
  Speaker 5: date was August nineteenth or twentieth, after the fracas post fracas,
• 12:44
  Speaker 5: as they say, and as you can see down here
• 12:50
  Speaker 5: in the corner, you have the infamous FPCC five forty
• 12:56
  Speaker 5: four Kent Street, New Orleans, Louisiana.
• 12:59
  Speaker 3: I'm trus right.
• 13:02
  Speaker 5: Now. This is a big problem, okay, for loan nutters
• 13:07
  Speaker 5: and other folks, because the Fair Play for Cuba Committee
• 13:16
  Speaker 5: allegedly did not have an office at five forty.
• 13:19
  Speaker 9: Four Camp Street.
• 13:21
  Speaker 5: This is, of course an address that was above Guy
• 13:26
  Speaker 5: Banister's office around the corner, but part of the same building.
• 13:32
  Speaker 9: And the interesting thing.
• 13:33
  Speaker 5: With this address is this used to be the address
• 13:36
  Speaker 5: for the Cuban Revolutionary Council, right, but it ceased being
• 13:43
  Speaker 5: that sometime in nineteen sixty two, right, yep. So here's
• 13:51
  Speaker 5: the age old question, Joe, How in the hell did
• 13:54
  Speaker 5: Oswald know that that address specifically used to be for
• 14:01
  Speaker 5: the Cuban Revolutionary Council, which is a group of anti
• 14:04
  Speaker 5: Castro Cuban exiles.
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: Well did he know?
• 14:13
  Speaker 5: I mean, well, he either had an office at five
• 14:16
  Speaker 5: forty four Camp Street or that. Okay, well, there's only
• 14:20
  Speaker 5: one or two options here. So either he had an
• 14:23
  Speaker 5: office there, or he's trolling them by using this address.
• 14:28
  Speaker 3: Correct, or he's actually someone who's pretending to be pro Marxist.
• 14:37
  Speaker 9: Right, I wouldn't think so.
• 14:42
  Speaker 5: How would he know the Cuban Revolutionary Council had an
• 14:46
  Speaker 5: office there? He didn't come back from Russia until midway
• 14:50
  Speaker 5: through nineteen sixty two, and by then they were already
• 14:53
  Speaker 5: out of five forty four Camp Street, right.
• 14:57
  Speaker 3: Juvene was when he arrived at New York City?
• 15:00
  Speaker 11: Right?
• 15:02
  Speaker 5: Yeah, So how would os Well know that the CRC
• 15:06
  Speaker 5: ever had an office in this building?
• 15:09
  Speaker 9: I do not know, hearsay, but I mean what's the point,
• 15:17
  Speaker 9: is what I'm getting at.
• 15:17
  Speaker 5: If they hadn't had an office there in over a
• 15:21
  Speaker 5: year by the time he's handing these leafless out.
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know the answer. I mean, Grapevine, maybe
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: I don't know, but I don't have a good explanation
• 15:35
  Speaker 3: to how we would know that.
• 15:37
  Speaker 5: So you're under the impression that this is a troll maneuver.
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: No, I didn't say that. I haven't quite made up
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: my mind yet.
• 15:48
  Speaker 5: Okay, fence sitter, Joe, everybody here we go. He's right,
• 15:53
  Speaker 5: have an opinion. Okay, here's my opinion. He's trolling him.
• 16:02
  Speaker 5: I think it's safe to say that he didn't have
• 16:04
  Speaker 5: an office there in that building, and likely from talking
• 16:08
  Speaker 5: to some of his contacts such as Dave Ferry and
• 16:14
  Speaker 5: a couple of these other anti Castro Cuban exiles, maybe
• 16:17
  Speaker 5: even Guy Banister himself, who knows that they that the
• 16:21
  Speaker 5: CRC had an office at this address in this building
• 16:26
  Speaker 5: at one time, or or Joe. There is another possibility,
• 16:37
  Speaker 5: and I don't know how much I believe it, But
• 16:41
  Speaker 5: let's take another look at it, and let's blow it.
• 16:45
  Speaker 5: Let's blow it up a little bit here.
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: But but wasn't his like he didn't have an office
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: there for as long as people liked to think he did.
• 16:55
  Speaker 3: But wasn't it like about a week and he was
• 16:58
  Speaker 3: kind of maybe paying by the week or something like that.
• 17:02
  Speaker 5: He wrote that in a letter, But the owner of
• 17:04
  Speaker 5: the building said he never rented a space to Oswald.
• 17:07
  Speaker 3: When did the owner of the letter say that after
• 17:12
  Speaker 3: the assassination the owner of the letter the owner of
• 17:16
  Speaker 3: the building. Oh yeah, okay, plausible deniability, but continues, I
• 17:28
  Speaker 3: don't know.
• 17:29
  Speaker 9: I don't know either, Devil's time.
• 17:32
  Speaker 5: I'm just saying because if you look at the stamp
• 17:35
  Speaker 5: very closely, you know, some folks have alleged that, well,
• 17:40
  Speaker 5: maybe this literature was stamped with just the five forty
• 17:44
  Speaker 5: four Camp Street and then Oswald added the FPCC later.
• 17:49
  Speaker 5: But if you look very closely at the C in
• 17:53
  Speaker 5: Camp Street and the C and the two c's and FPCC,
• 17:59
  Speaker 5: I think they look pretty damn similar. So my guess
• 18:03
  Speaker 5: is this is all part of one rubber stamp, you know,
• 18:06
  Speaker 5: that hit from Oswald's little stamp kit that he made,
• 18:10
  Speaker 5: which tells me he purposefully put this address inside the
• 18:16
  Speaker 5: back cover of this corless Lamont pamphlet. Okay, and let's
• 18:27
  Speaker 5: see here now, the way the FBI got their hands
• 18:35
  Speaker 5: on this stuff is because of somebody that we talked
• 18:39
  Speaker 5: about on a previous show. His name was Jesse Corr,
• 18:43
  Speaker 5: and he worked at the International Trademark and he was
• 18:46
  Speaker 5: very disturbed about Oswald handing out hands off Cuba pamphlets
• 18:54
  Speaker 5: and the Corless Lamont pamphlets, and he he collected them,
• 19:06
  Speaker 5: he took copies and he sent them to the FBI
• 19:12
  Speaker 5: on August well, they got him on August twentieth. I'm
• 19:16
  Speaker 5: not sure when he sent them. Let's see, right, and.
• 19:36
  Speaker 3: Remember, folks, a lot of things are happening between the
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: August ninth fracas or the August sixth encounter with Bregnier
• 19:46
  Speaker 3: right going into Kosa Roka of the August sixteenth, then
• 19:53
  Speaker 3: the court appearance, then the August sixteenth, another hand out leaflets,
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: which was you know, filmed by what is it, w
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: DSU whatever they call it, and then the radio thing,
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: which I believe was on the twenty first. I have
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: that informational later. But you know, these are a packed
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: week and a half.
• 20:23
  Speaker 9: Yeah, a lot of thing we can have.
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: Yeah, a lot of things are going on, and again
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: Oswalt does not have a job at this point. Who
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: knows what he's up to. I mean, we kind of
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: know what he's up to, but it's it's packed.
• 20:39
  Speaker 5: Yeah, sorry, all right, this is a little repetitive with
• 20:49
  Speaker 5: the with the envelopes and things. But here's what the
• 20:52
  Speaker 5: front of it looked like. The Crime against Cuba by
• 20:55
  Speaker 5: corlis Lamont, and it says right here, there's a note
• 20:58
  Speaker 5: inside the back cover, and that's referring to the stamp,
• 21:02
  Speaker 5: the rubber stamp. Okay, and he sent all this stuff
• 21:08
  Speaker 5: over to the FBI in New Orleans again Jesse Corps.
• 21:17
  Speaker 5: Here are some of the inside of the pamphlet. Other
• 21:21
  Speaker 5: Basic pamphlets by corlis Lamont, the Civil Liberties Crisis, the
• 21:26
  Speaker 5: Humanist tradition, effects of a foreign American policy, back to
• 21:30
  Speaker 5: the Bill of Rights, challenged to McCarthy, the Congressional Inquisition,
• 21:33
  Speaker 5: the assault on academic freedom, the right to travel, to
• 21:36
  Speaker 5: nuclear bomb tests, a peace program for the USA, and
• 21:40
  Speaker 5: My trip around the World. They're all ten cents each.
• 21:43
  Speaker 5: Sends your order to Basic Pamphlets in New York. Interesting
• 21:47
  Speaker 5: and you can get bulk copies. Now, this is a
• 21:57
  Speaker 5: letter going back to May the fifth, nineteen sixty one,
• 22:02
  Speaker 5: and well underneath this, What can I.
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: Ask you a question, Lamont? Is he part of the
• 22:11
  Speaker 3: FPCC or is he just a communist sympathizer.
• 22:18
  Speaker 5: Or he's just a communist sympathizer at times. But I
• 22:24
  Speaker 5: mean you can see from his other pamphlets he's he's
• 22:29
  Speaker 5: kind of a scurrilous, uh, you know, basic rights Freedom's
• 22:35
  Speaker 5: type of guy, you know, no matter what it is.
• 22:39
  Speaker 5: But here we have a letter goes back to nineteen
• 22:42
  Speaker 5: sixty one where we have a guy, okay, who is
• 22:49
  Speaker 5: the Supreme Council of the thirty third Degree of the
• 22:52
  Speaker 5: Ancient and Accepted Scottish Writer Freemasonry of the State of Louisiana,
• 22:58
  Speaker 5: Grand Orient of New Ork. And then it has the
• 23:03
  Speaker 5: latitude of it and then I guess the time zone
• 23:08
  Speaker 5: or meridian Greenwich basically the coordinates, which is kind of weird.
• 23:15
  Speaker 5: And that's got the double headed eagle up here up
• 23:17
  Speaker 5: top with the crown, It's got the Masonic pyramid with
• 23:21
  Speaker 5: the thirty three. You know, this is all not weird
• 23:25
  Speaker 5: at all, right, I mean, but it's a letter addressed
• 23:30
  Speaker 5: to the Fair Play for Cuba Committee in New York
• 23:33
  Speaker 5: and it says, dear Sirs, kindly send me an information
• 23:36
  Speaker 5: in literature, for we would like to learn more about Cuba.
• 23:39
  Speaker 5: Yours truly, George Long, thirty third degree, and you can
• 23:44
  Speaker 5: see his name up here up at the top as well.
• 23:47
  Speaker 5: He must be the HNI c down there at the
• 23:51
  Speaker 5: Grand Orient of New Orleans, thirty third degree Mason, so
• 23:56
  Speaker 5: he wants to learn more about Cuba.
• 24:03
  Speaker 3: Is thirty third degree of high up ranking on the
• 24:06
  Speaker 3: MESA the highest.
• 24:09
  Speaker 9: It's the highest.
• 24:14
  Speaker 5: So here's a letter from an associate of somebody. We're
• 24:17
  Speaker 5: gonna be talking more about this evening. And this goes
• 24:19
  Speaker 5: back to April of sixty two, so this is before
• 24:22
  Speaker 5: Oswald even returns from Russia. And this is of course
• 24:27
  Speaker 5: an FBI memorandum with the subject being fair Play for Cuba.
• 24:33
  Speaker 5: And it says William Stuckey of the New Orleans States Item,
• 24:36
  Speaker 5: which is a newspaper, at three pm on four sixty
• 24:41
  Speaker 5: sixty two, telephonically contacted the New Orleans office and asked
• 24:44
  Speaker 5: if we could advise him whether or not there was
• 24:46
  Speaker 5: a chapter of the fair Play for Cuba a subversive
• 24:51
  Speaker 5: organization located in New Orleans. He was advised that we
• 24:56
  Speaker 5: cannot furnish him any information concerning this, and then he
• 25:00
  Speaker 5: should not draw a conclusion from this that we did
• 25:02
  Speaker 5: or did not have anything concerning this, which is an
• 25:05
  Speaker 5: odd way to answer a pretty simple question. But okay, right, but.
• 25:15
  Speaker 3: Oswalt wasn't even back then, so he was the one
• 25:19
  Speaker 3: that supposedly created that chapter, if.
• 25:23
  Speaker 9: You will, right.
• 25:26
  Speaker 5: But I'm just saying it's a weird way for the
• 25:28
  Speaker 5: FBI to answer such a straightforward question like is there
• 25:33
  Speaker 5: a fair play for Cuban committee chapter in New Orleans?
• 25:36
  Speaker 5: You know, this is coming from a member of the press,
• 25:39
  Speaker 5: And they say, well, we can't tell you, but you
• 25:43
  Speaker 5: shouldn't draw a conclusion from the fact that we can't
• 25:45
  Speaker 5: tell you, you know, because there may or may not
• 25:50
  Speaker 5: be anything.
• 25:50
  Speaker 9: Concerning It's just weird. It's weird to me, right, right, all.
• 25:57
  Speaker 5: Right, So this is this is an interesting date eleven
• 26:02
  Speaker 5: twenty three, sixty three. Of course, another FBI document concerning
• 26:06
  Speaker 5: Lee Oswald. An anonymous mail telephonically contacted the New York
• 26:11
  Speaker 5: office at five eleven PM. This is the day after
• 26:14
  Speaker 5: the assassination folks, and stated that quote, he was an
• 26:18
  Speaker 5: old friend of the Bureau, and the following information he
• 26:22
  Speaker 5: was about to supply is against regulations, and that is
• 26:26
  Speaker 5: the reason he will remain anonymous. The anonymous mail had
• 26:29
  Speaker 5: in his possession a telegram to a London newspaper offering
• 26:34
  Speaker 5: for sale a tape recording which consists of thirty seven
• 26:38
  Speaker 5: minutes of the interview with Lee Oswald, which contains his
• 26:41
  Speaker 5: outlook on life in his personal history. In telegram, sender
• 26:46
  Speaker 5: claims to be a prize winning reporter and the aforementioned
• 26:49
  Speaker 5: material is for sale to the highest bidder. The center
• 26:53
  Speaker 5: of the telegram is one Bill Stuckey, who resides at
• 26:57
  Speaker 5: two three one seven State Street, New Orleans. Uh so, yeah,
• 27:03
  Speaker 5: what do you think about this, Joe? This guy's ready
• 27:05
  Speaker 5: to has you know, hey, he still has a tape
• 27:09
  Speaker 5: from Oswald, thirty seven minutes long. He's ready to sell
• 27:13
  Speaker 5: it to the highest bidder, and he's selling to telegrams
• 27:15
  Speaker 5: to uh London, London newspapers. Yeah, you're muted, probably can't
• 27:23
  Speaker 5: see you, but you muted.
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: Sorry about that. No, I was just going to ask
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: you if that person was Stucky, Bill Stucky who famously
• 27:41
  Speaker 3: interviewed Oswalt on the radio, And we were going to
• 27:44
  Speaker 3: get into that later in my segment. But sus London,
• 27:51
  Speaker 3: I don't know. It sounds like mockingbird shit one oh one, Well.
• 27:56
  Speaker 5: What's weird? Is okay? An anonymous mail telephonically contacted the
• 28:02
  Speaker 5: New York office and stated that, quote, he was an
• 28:04
  Speaker 5: old friend of the Bureau, and the following information is
• 28:08
  Speaker 5: about to supply is against regulations, and that is the
• 28:10
  Speaker 5: reason will been anonymous. And then so apparently there's two
• 28:16
  Speaker 5: anonymous males here, okay, that we're talking about. One is
• 28:20
  Speaker 5: the person that contacted the New York office of the
• 28:22
  Speaker 5: Bureau saying he was an old friend and that the
• 28:26
  Speaker 5: following information is about supply is against regulations. And apparently
• 28:32
  Speaker 5: the information he had was that an anonymous mail had
• 28:35
  Speaker 5: in his possession a telegram to a London newspaper offering
• 28:38
  Speaker 5: for sale tape blah blah blah blah blah. The center
• 28:41
  Speaker 5: of the telegram is Bill Stucky. So apparently is another
• 28:45
  Speaker 5: anonymous person who is dropping a dime on what Bill
• 28:49
  Speaker 5: Stucky is doing, which is odd.
• 28:54
  Speaker 3: Well, any idea if you had to guess who that
• 28:57
  Speaker 3: could have been?
• 28:59
  Speaker 5: Yeah, okay, maybe somebody will talk about it a little later.
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: Okay, I think I agree because I have the same thoughts.
• 29:08
  Speaker 5: Okay, moving right along here, here's an interesting one. This
• 29:19
  Speaker 5: is from April nineteen sixty, right after the inception of
• 29:23
  Speaker 5: the fair Play for Cuba Committee. All right, you're talking
• 29:29
  Speaker 5: about it. And again, this is a CIA memo, folks,
• 29:35
  Speaker 5: and they're sending this memo to the FBI to hoover attention,
• 29:41
  Speaker 5: mister Sam pappage the fair Play for Cuba Committee. So
• 29:44
  Speaker 5: the CIA is letting the FBI know about the fair
• 29:49
  Speaker 5: Play for Cuba Committee. This agency has derogatory information on
• 29:55
  Speaker 5: all individuals listed in the attached advertisement. It is assumed
• 29:59
  Speaker 5: that the Buro has the same information. This matter is
• 30:02
  Speaker 5: being brought to your attention with the possible thought that
• 30:04
  Speaker 5: violation of the Registration Actor or other statues may be involved.
• 30:08
  Speaker 5: It would be appreciated if this agency can be informed
• 30:11
  Speaker 5: of any action taken for the Deputy Director of Plans.
• 30:16
  Speaker 9: Sincerely, William K. Harvey, Joe Wow, Bill Harvey.
• 30:23
  Speaker 5: Yeah, well in and knowing about and an eyeball on
• 30:30
  Speaker 5: the fair Play for Cuba Committee going back to nineteen sixty.
• 30:35
  Speaker 3: Right, which is essentially when they were.
• 30:38
  Speaker 9: Yeah, their interception.
• 30:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and.
• 30:44
  Speaker 5: Here's an old photo you see back here in the back, right,
• 30:50
  Speaker 5: mister Kennedy, Cuba is not for sale, right and right
• 30:55
  Speaker 5: in front of him is somebody with a fair Play
• 30:57
  Speaker 5: for Cuba sign yep right. I'm not sure what this
• 31:02
  Speaker 5: one says. Something real good neighbors don't worship.
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: I am not Wasteland. I don't know.
• 31:18
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I can't really tell. But you know, this is
• 31:21
  Speaker 5: the kind of stuff that's going on. I'm assuming this
• 31:23
  Speaker 5: is like New York or somewhere Chicago. So now we
• 31:34
  Speaker 5: can do. A guy named Richard Thomas Gibson.
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: Yes, who I don't know much about, so I'm very
• 31:43
  Speaker 3: interested in hearing about this rot.
• 31:47
  Speaker 5: Yes. Well, let's just say I think he was second
• 31:55
  Speaker 5: in charge of the Fair Play for Cuba committee for
• 31:58
  Speaker 5: a number of years and very involved, and then all
• 32:04
  Speaker 5: of a sudden decides to up and move to Sweden. Okay,
• 32:11
  Speaker 5: it says, if deemed advisable, the Bureau is requested through
• 32:14
  Speaker 5: liaison to determine if the subject was interviewed by the
• 32:17
  Speaker 5: CIA and if he is working for the CIA at
• 32:19
  Speaker 5: the present time. Now they're again, they're talking about Richard
• 32:23
  Speaker 5: Thomas Gibson. Now the SBI is basically asking the CIA, hey,
• 32:30
  Speaker 5: is this guy working for you? Because right here in
• 32:33
  Speaker 5: the third paragraph, it says, in the view of the
• 32:35
  Speaker 5: above it appears possible the subject may have been contacted
• 32:37
  Speaker 5: by CIA and may be in fact working for the CIA.
• 32:41
  Speaker 3: Okay, right, and they kind of say, oh, we don't
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: know old Chuck.
• 32:48
  Speaker 5: Well, they say right here in brackets Austin Horn. CIA
• 32:51
  Speaker 5: advised that his agency did not contact subject and doesn't
• 32:55
  Speaker 5: plan to do so.
• 32:58
  Speaker 9: But that's a lie.
• 33:00
  Speaker 3: That's ambigue of this, right, like he could have contacted them.
• 33:05
  Speaker 9: That's a lot.
• 33:08
  Speaker 5: We'll find out more about that a little later. M hm.
• 33:18
  Speaker 5: So I mean that they're keeping an eye on these
• 33:21
  Speaker 5: guys for sure. M see. I has no objection to
• 33:27
  Speaker 5: the bureau talking to Rice or Haggart and indicated they'd
• 33:30
  Speaker 5: be willing to contact Gibson in New York and arrange
• 33:32
  Speaker 5: a meeting with him in Montreal. The bureaus their desires
• 33:35
  Speaker 5: blah blah blah blah blah. Dick find Dick mm hmm,
• 33:46
  Speaker 5: Dick Gibson. They're just talking about setting up a meeting
• 33:54
  Speaker 5: with him in Montreal for some reason. I don't know why.
• 34:00
  Speaker 9: I guess they don't want to do it in New York.
• 34:02
  Speaker 10: M hm.
• 34:11
  Speaker 9: But yeah, this file is just about cooked.
• 34:20
  Speaker 3: So Gibson was like kind of number two in the
• 34:24
  Speaker 3: FPCC yes, or like one of the executives for he was.
• 34:32
  Speaker 9: Like the vice president or something along those lines.
• 34:37
  Speaker 5: And there's a story, a very interesting story and h
• 34:41
  Speaker 5: Oswald and the CIA by John Newman about Richard Gibson
• 34:46
  Speaker 5: and June Cobb. Apparently he met with June Cobb in
• 34:52
  Speaker 5: Cuba and it said they drank three quarters of a
• 34:58
  Speaker 5: bottle of Scots together and he was trying to bang
• 35:02
  Speaker 5: June Cobb.
• 35:06
  Speaker 9: She she's pretending to be a reporter. The c i
• 35:09
  Speaker 9: A is in the next room.
• 35:11
  Speaker 5: They have that room wired for down there, listening to
• 35:13
  Speaker 5: the whole conversation. So she's basically honey potting Richard Gibson
• 35:19
  Speaker 5: and he's just talking, talking, talking, talking, talking.
• 35:22
  Speaker 3: Buddy yapping like six barbers.
• 35:25
  Speaker 5: Yeah, trying to stab that thing. And she doesn't let him.
• 35:30
  Speaker 5: And finally she's like, you gotta go, dude.
• 35:36
  Speaker 10: Mm hmm.
• 35:37
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 35:38
  Speaker 12: Very interesting stuff there. Good lord, All right, let me
• 35:51
  Speaker 12: pull this one up.
• 36:14
  Speaker 5: All right, now, this is a United States Secret Service document,
• 36:19
  Speaker 5: which you don't run into many of these out there,
• 36:21
  Speaker 5: but this is from November twenty sixth, nineteen and sixty
• 36:24
  Speaker 5: three in New York an investigation by Special Agent Joseph
• 36:32
  Speaker 5: Murphy so they detailed their investigation of the Fair Player
• 36:39
  Speaker 5: Cuba Committee. In New York City, Special Agent Kennedy at
• 36:44
  Speaker 5: the New York Office Federal FBI was interviewed with respect
• 36:47
  Speaker 5: to the Fair Play for Cuba Committee and therb Oswald.
• 36:50
  Speaker 5: He stated that the FPCC is on a national basis,
• 36:53
  Speaker 5: has a little activity. Agent Kennedy further stated that the
• 36:56
  Speaker 5: Communist Party and the Socialist Workers Party attempted to gain
• 36:59
  Speaker 5: control of the FPC, but we're alienated by its head,
• 37:02
  Speaker 5: Vincent Theodore Lee. That's VT Lee, and no longer have
• 37:07
  Speaker 5: a strong affiliation with the FPCC.
• 37:14
  Speaker 9: All right.
• 37:15
  Speaker 5: The president as of April sixty three, the John Rosson
• 37:19
  Speaker 5: was the president. We lost the chairman of the Chicago
• 37:22
  Speaker 5: chapter and is inactive on a national basis now. The
• 37:27
  Speaker 5: vice president is Richard Dick Big Dick Gibson, who currently
• 37:31
  Speaker 5: lives in Lausanne, Switzerland. He is a writer and works
• 37:36
  Speaker 5: for a new publication entitled Africa Latin America, Asia Revolution.
• 37:41
  Speaker 5: And they give his address there. So again Richard Gibson
• 37:48
  Speaker 5: bounces from America to Switzerland, the old good neutral Switzerland.
• 37:54
  Speaker 3: He's going on the lamb.
• 37:56
  Speaker 9: Yeah, he's getting out of dodge.
• 37:58
  Speaker 3: As he say, Yes.
• 38:03
  Speaker 5: A report from the New Orleans Field Office of the FBI,
• 38:06
  Speaker 5: submitted on October twenty fifth, sixty three, states that the
• 38:10
  Speaker 5: office received information on August ninth that Lee Harvey Oswell
• 38:14
  Speaker 5: had been arrested that date for disturbing the peace. He
• 38:17
  Speaker 5: was handing out handbills for the Fair Play for Cuba Committee, YadA, YadA, YadA,
• 38:22
  Speaker 5: no mention of Ajhidel And then on August twenty first,
• 38:28
  Speaker 5: Oswell was a guest on the radio program in New
• 38:30
  Speaker 5: Orleans and engaged in a debate against two anti Castro persons.
• 38:35
  Speaker 5: At this time, Oswald denied that the Fair Play for
• 38:38
  Speaker 5: Cuba Committee was Communist controlled. However, he admitted he was
• 38:41
  Speaker 5: a Marxist. Right, so they go on and give the
• 38:45
  Speaker 5: old spiel.
• 38:47
  Speaker 3: The summary, Yeah, so it.
• 38:49
  Speaker 5: Detective Frank Bianco, a Bureau of Special Services, New York
• 38:54
  Speaker 5: City Police Department, was interviewed with regard to the Fair
• 38:56
  Speaker 5: Play for Cuba Committee, and he stated that the FPCC
• 38:59
  Speaker 5: was a found in nineteen sixty, reached its peak of
• 39:02
  Speaker 5: strength in sixty one and sixty two, and there were
• 39:05
  Speaker 5: about twenty meetings held in New York by the Fair
• 39:07
  Speaker 5: Play for Cuba Committee.
• 39:08
  Speaker 9: In each of these years. In nineteen sixty.
• 39:11
  Speaker 5: Three, however, the organization held not more than three meetings
• 39:14
  Speaker 5: in New York, with an attendance ranging from eighty five
• 39:17
  Speaker 5: to one hundred and fifty people. The organization is currently
• 39:20
  Speaker 5: classified as relatively inactive.
• 39:24
  Speaker 3: And you know what, Rob, I was gonna say that,
• 39:27
  Speaker 3: like when we talk about these alleged anti operations or
• 39:33
  Speaker 3: operations against the FPCC, like how relevant were they really?
• 39:40
  Speaker 10: Not?
• 39:40
  Speaker 5: Really in sixty three, like in this summer they you know,
• 39:43
  Speaker 5: they were still I think, hanging on by a thread.
• 39:46
  Speaker 5: But by the end of sixty three as well, as
• 39:48
  Speaker 5: we'll get to here in a second, you'll see that
• 39:51
  Speaker 5: it was pretty much done Ski, especially after the connection
• 39:57
  Speaker 5: with oz Wald, after the Nation they were you were done.
• 40:01
  Speaker 3: You took the words out of my mouth. I was
• 40:03
  Speaker 3: going to say, how much did the Oswald connection have
• 40:05
  Speaker 3: to do with the folding of that even though it's
• 40:08
  Speaker 3: probably on the downturn since sixty one sixty two? Right?
• 40:14
  Speaker 5: Yeah? Now, these are lists of some people that have
• 40:18
  Speaker 5: been alleged to be still actively connected with the Fair
• 40:21
  Speaker 5: Play for Cuba Committee. A Marjorie Speace, and she is
• 40:28
  Speaker 5: alleged to have lived with VT Lee. If you know
• 40:31
  Speaker 5: what I'm saying as recently as August nineteen sixty two.
• 40:34
  Speaker 5: Goodmar Okay, Yeah, side piece, you know maybe main piece?
• 40:39
  Speaker 5: Who knows?
• 40:40
  Speaker 3: Who knows.
• 40:41
  Speaker 5: William Worthy Junior a brother residing in Baltimore in several
• 40:48
  Speaker 5: left wing groups. He is a writer in the bulletins
• 40:53
  Speaker 5: of the FPCC and was arrested in July sixty two
• 40:56
  Speaker 5: for illegal entry into the United States after defying the
• 41:01
  Speaker 5: United States State Department on travel to Cuba. He said,
• 41:04
  Speaker 5: fuck you, I'm going anyway. Worthy is a foreign correspondent
• 41:08
  Speaker 5: of a Baltimore newspaper entitled The Afro American. Joe Yes,
• 41:17
  Speaker 5: Berta Green aka Berta suck Off.
• 41:24
  Speaker 3: There's a joke there in there somewhere, but yeah, we
• 41:28
  Speaker 3: won't go there.
• 41:29
  Speaker 5: Well, looks you make your own up.
• 41:31
  Speaker 9: Yeah, right.
• 41:32
  Speaker 5: And her husband, Morris suck Off, apparently had a party
• 41:40
  Speaker 5: for Fidel Castro at the Hotel Teresa in September of
• 41:44
  Speaker 5: nineteen sixty and demonstrated at the un you know, conducted
• 41:51
  Speaker 5: by the FPCC. Probably part of the picture we saw
• 41:53
  Speaker 5: earlier in New York City. Let's see Waldo Frank, an
• 42:02
  Speaker 5: honorary co chairman of the FECC and a writer on
• 42:04
  Speaker 5: Latin American Affairs. He was a speaker at a meeting
• 42:07
  Speaker 5: at Carnegie Hall in New York City by the Committee
• 42:11
  Speaker 5: to Secure Justice for Martin Soble. In April nineteen sixty
• 42:17
  Speaker 5: he was chairman of an FPCC meeting held at the
• 42:20
  Speaker 5: Community Church in New York City, at which he was
• 42:23
  Speaker 5: the principal speaker. Numerous references to Waldo Frank appear in
• 42:27
  Speaker 5: The Daily Worker, which of course was a newspaper that
• 42:30
  Speaker 5: Oswald subscribed to. Robert Tabor this is a name as
• 42:43
  Speaker 5: the easy editor of fair Play, a publication of the
• 42:46
  Speaker 5: fair Play for Cuba Committee. He was on the guest
• 42:49
  Speaker 5: list at the reception held for Fidel Castro at the
• 42:51
  Speaker 5: Hotel Theresa, also at one time the head of the
• 42:58
  Speaker 5: fair Play for keeb Comit and a bunch of people
• 43:05
  Speaker 5: you never heard of before.
• 43:08
  Speaker 3: Of course, I thought that was Gebra Gill. What it
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: was ge Rat Hill.
• 43:13
  Speaker 5: So now they're looking into August August thirtieth, nineteen sixty two,
• 43:17
  Speaker 5: Vincent Theodore Lee had purchased numerous small arms, including an
• 43:21
  Speaker 5: Infield Deluxe Bolt Action three zero three rifle. This weapon
• 43:26
  Speaker 5: was manufactured by the Golden State Arms Corporation. They even
• 43:29
  Speaker 5: have the serial number Lee was also heard the state
• 43:33
  Speaker 5: that he owns a German Luger, a German P thirty
• 43:35
  Speaker 5: eight automatic automatics of unknown origin, and a thirty eight
• 43:39
  Speaker 5: calibre Ivan Johnson.
• 43:44
  Speaker 3: And we are talking about Vt.
• 43:45
  Speaker 9: Lee, Yes, we are talking about Vt.
• 43:48
  Speaker 3: Lee, not Lee Ry Osweald. Just to clarify, Lee.
• 43:52
  Speaker 5: Was in possession of these weapons while he was in Florida,
• 43:54
  Speaker 5: but it has not been established that he transported them
• 43:56
  Speaker 5: to New York or has his purpose for obtaining the
• 43:58
  Speaker 5: weapons been determined. But he liked his guns, Joe OLDVT.
• 44:05
  Speaker 5: Lee for Shortsey.
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: Can't blame him for that.
• 44:13
  Speaker 9: No, No, I can't blame the man for trying, all right,
• 44:19
  Speaker 9: not like.
• 44:20
  Speaker 3: He's starting a revolution or anything.
• 44:22
  Speaker 5: So well, legit, all right, let's bounce back here. This
• 44:31
  Speaker 5: is an FBI document note to date eleven twenty nine
• 44:35
  Speaker 5: sixty three. No information regarding the channelization of funds from
• 44:41
  Speaker 5: the Cuban government to the FPCC has been developed subsequent
• 44:44
  Speaker 5: to the reference report. What they're worried about here is
• 44:48
  Speaker 5: direct funding from Castro to the Fair Play for Cuban
• 44:51
  Speaker 5: Committee to Lee Harvey Oswald.
• 44:53
  Speaker 9: This is what they're trying to rule out here.
• 44:55
  Speaker 3: Okay, I don't think Castro would be very interested in
• 45:06
  Speaker 3: funding these cafuzas. I mean, I don't know. Maybe initially, yeah,
• 45:17
  Speaker 3: I mean, I mean, but to the two and how
• 45:19
  Speaker 3: much I don't know.
• 45:21
  Speaker 9: Well, I just told you fifteen thousand dollars.
• 45:24
  Speaker 3: Oh okay, that was that. Yeah, But he probably washed
• 45:28
  Speaker 3: his hands after that and was like, that's all I'm
• 45:31
  Speaker 3: gonna do. I'm not sure how involved he was in
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: the FPCC, but I honestly don't know.
• 45:40
  Speaker 5: Well, what do they call it when you know, you
• 45:43
  Speaker 5: give a company money to startup business?
• 45:48
  Speaker 3: Kind of like capital investment? I don't know, I don't know.
• 45:51
  Speaker 9: You're the fintech guy and you don't even know, but.
• 45:55
  Speaker 5: Capital, No, it's it's a name for it, money you
• 46:00
  Speaker 5: give as a startup to get to get off the ground. Anyway,
• 46:06
  Speaker 5: That's basically what Castro did because again, this company or
• 46:10
  Speaker 5: this entity was designed to be dispersed between numerous amounts
• 46:17
  Speaker 5: of cities, even countries. They had chapters in different countries,
• 46:21
  Speaker 5: all the major cities it's about in the United States,
• 46:26
  Speaker 5: and you know, these these these committees were set up,
• 46:31
  Speaker 5: you know, to charge memberships, fees, the charge fees for paraphernalia, pamphlets,
• 46:40
  Speaker 5: handouts all that stuff.
• 46:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, maybe it's seed money that.
• 46:45
  Speaker 9: Yet there you go, thank you MK. That's exactly what
• 46:48
  Speaker 9: I was talking about.
• 46:49
  Speaker 3: Okay, Yes, a venture capital someone else said said, but
• 46:55
  Speaker 3: I don't think venture capital. I don't think that was
• 46:59
  Speaker 3: a term. Back.
• 47:00
  Speaker 5: I was thinking about seed money. Seed money, yes, yes,
• 47:05
  Speaker 5: and not that kind of seed folks, you dirty minded people.
• 47:09
  Speaker 9: That comes from David Ferry. Nothing.
• 47:15
  Speaker 3: No, I just was going to go there.
• 47:19
  Speaker 9: Okay, here we go.
• 47:21
  Speaker 5: Now again, this is at the end of November nineteen
• 47:24
  Speaker 5: sixty three. They're looking into the Fair Play for Cuba
• 47:27
  Speaker 5: Committee hard Okay, so they got their eyeball on. Vincent
• 47:32
  Speaker 5: Theodore Lee is the only functioning officer of the Fairplay
• 47:37
  Speaker 5: for Cube Committee at this time, and he intends to
• 47:40
  Speaker 5: resign Joe by twelve one sixty three.
• 47:45
  Speaker 9: I wonder why convenient?
• 47:49
  Speaker 5: Yeah, you think Albert Baker of New York City, who
• 47:53
  Speaker 5: appears to sympathize with the Communist Party, reportedly to replace
• 47:57
  Speaker 5: Lee as the chief officer of the FPC. So what
• 48:02
  Speaker 5: happened at some point Joe in nineteen sixty three? The
• 48:07
  Speaker 5: founder goes a wall, the president goes a wall, the
• 48:11
  Speaker 5: vice president goes a wall, or stops taking his calls
• 48:16
  Speaker 5: and letters.
• 48:17
  Speaker 9: You have the other guy, Big Dick Gibson going to see.
• 48:26
  Speaker 5: So basically, Vincent Theodore Lee is the only man left
• 48:29
  Speaker 5: standing and he's like the national secretary or whatever, but
• 48:34
  Speaker 5: now he's functioning as the you know, the president because
• 48:38
  Speaker 5: he's the only one left that's actually involved in doing
• 48:41
  Speaker 5: anything right and running things yeah, and running things yeah,
• 48:45
  Speaker 5: operations right. So in April sixty three, Lee stated that
• 48:54
  Speaker 5: the Affair Play for Comunity Committee had about fifteen hundred
• 48:56
  Speaker 5: members you know, company wide or committee wide.
• 49:02
  Speaker 3: Which is not that much.
• 49:04
  Speaker 5: Not that much when you're in all these major cities
• 49:07
  Speaker 5: and countries all throughout the world. I mean, the world's
• 49:10
  Speaker 5: a big place, like nothing nothing. So during October sixty three,
• 49:18
  Speaker 5: this is of course preassassination, Lee described the FPCC financial
• 49:23
  Speaker 5: situation is very poor, and an informant advise that FPCC
• 49:29
  Speaker 5: bank balance as of October twenty fourth, nineteen sixty three,
• 49:34
  Speaker 5: was now down to a measley paltry one hundred and
• 49:37
  Speaker 5: seventy three dollars and fifty two cents.
• 49:40
  Speaker 13: Stop it, I'm reading, I know, but that's like, you know, yeah,
• 49:49
  Speaker 13: they went from fifteen thousand dollars seed not to mention
• 49:53
  Speaker 13: the money they raised from selling memberships and paraphernalia and
• 49:58
  Speaker 13: pamphlets and all that stuff.
• 50:01
  Speaker 5: To you know, three years later, pissed all the way
• 50:06
  Speaker 5: through it down to one hundred and seventy three dollars
• 50:08
  Speaker 5: and fifty two.
• 50:09
  Speaker 3: Cents right to about like a grand a little more.
• 50:12
  Speaker 5: Yeah, they go from one hundred and fifty thousand to
• 50:14
  Speaker 5: one thousand in today's money, which is pretty bad.
• 50:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah, maybe why some of them just tucktailed and ran.
• 50:24
  Speaker 5: Yeah, they probably took most of the seed money and
• 50:26
  Speaker 5: said te ya.
• 50:29
  Speaker 10: Right.
• 50:29
  Speaker 3: Another grift we talked about that.
• 50:33
  Speaker 5: Lee stated that the FPCC exists to get the absolute
• 50:36
  Speaker 5: truth of the Great Cuban Revolution out to the American people,
• 50:39
  Speaker 5: and that the FPCC supports the renewal of diplomatic relations
• 50:42
  Speaker 5: with Cuba and has called upon the administration to risk
• 50:48
  Speaker 5: I don't know, I don't know what that word is,
• 50:52
  Speaker 5: rescind sorry, the US ban on travel at Cuba. The
• 50:57
  Speaker 5: September of sixty three, Lee described the Fair Play for
• 50:59
  Speaker 5: Cuban Committee as the largest attribute of Cuban propaganda in
• 51:04
  Speaker 5: the US, if not the world, excluding the Cuban government.
• 51:08
  Speaker 5: On June twenty fourth, Lee received three packages from the
• 51:11
  Speaker 5: Cuban Mission to the UN in May of sixty three,
• 51:15
  Speaker 5: and informant advised that FPC leadership had minimized the role
• 51:18
  Speaker 5: of the Communist Party and the SWP during the past year,
• 51:24
  Speaker 5: and that the influence of outside organizations was then negligible.
• 51:29
  Speaker 3: Okay, I can I ask a question here? Lee received
• 51:34
  Speaker 3: three packages from the Cuban Mission to the UN. Is
• 51:39
  Speaker 3: that not FPCC?
• 51:43
  Speaker 9: It's different, right, that's basically coming from castro Okay.
• 51:58
  Speaker 5: Lee advised the arrangements for the Communist Party to take
• 52:01
  Speaker 5: over the FPCC had not materialized at all for whatever reason.
• 52:09
  Speaker 5: FPCC office equipment was entirely up to him. He stated
• 52:11
  Speaker 5: that John Rosen, an officer, had not answered any of
• 52:14
  Speaker 5: his letters, and Gibson, another officer, was unavailable. But that's
• 52:18
  Speaker 5: because he's out of the.
• 52:18
  Speaker 3: Country's on a European vacation.
• 52:23
  Speaker 5: Yes, yeah, so. Lee stated that he therefore believed that
• 52:27
  Speaker 5: he could do whatever he wanted to with the organization. Interesting, weird,
• 52:35
  Speaker 5: So he basically involuntarily inherited the flair fair play for
• 52:40
  Speaker 5: Cuba Committee.
• 52:41
  Speaker 3: Right, but are really trying to like sell off assets
• 52:44
  Speaker 3: like copiers or whatever? The hell?
• 52:47
  Speaker 10: Oh?
• 52:47
  Speaker 5: Yeah, they had an office they had to rent in
• 52:50
  Speaker 5: New York City, right, which is of course not cheap. Right.
• 52:54
  Speaker 5: Plus VT Lee, as we'll see here in a minute,
• 52:56
  Speaker 5: was taking a salary, which is interesting. But we'll get there,
• 53:03
  Speaker 5: I promise. Let's see beginning. They got informants everywhere, everywhere.
• 53:22
  Speaker 5: So I got one more set of documents where we'll see.
• 53:29
  Speaker 3: Just a little more.
• 53:31
  Speaker 5: Now, what's interesting about VT Lee? His salary, Joe, was
• 53:41
  Speaker 5: one hundred and seventy dollars a week. All right, you're
• 53:44
  Speaker 5: the financial guy here.
• 53:45
  Speaker 3: Okay, so that's like, you know what, like thirty four
• 53:51
  Speaker 3: hundred dollars a month in today's terms.
• 53:58
  Speaker 5: Well, I want to put it more to a to
• 54:00
  Speaker 5: an hourly rate. Okay, So one hundred and seventy dollars
• 54:05
  Speaker 5: a week? Can we can we figure out an hourly
• 54:11
  Speaker 5: rate for that?
• 54:11
  Speaker 3: Oh oh, I was thinking bi weekly, So seventeen thirty
• 54:16
  Speaker 3: four sixty seventy, like about eight grand a month.
• 54:26
  Speaker 5: Not a monthly salary, an hourly rate. If you break
• 54:29
  Speaker 5: it down by what this motherfucker was making an hour
• 54:33
  Speaker 5: a week one hundred and seventy divided about forty.
• 54:40
  Speaker 9: Mm hm, that's the question. One hundred and seventy divided
• 54:46
  Speaker 9: about forty what's that equal.
• 54:54
  Speaker 3: Forty two dollars an hour? I guess m hmm, Well
• 55:02
  Speaker 3: tell you of the math room.
• 55:05
  Speaker 9: Yeah, I can take Joe over here.
• 55:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah, right, one hundred and seventy divided by what forty
• 55:19
  Speaker 3: by forty hours? Yeah, that's about four dollars an hour.
• 55:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah it is, I'll watch you.
• 55:37
  Speaker 9: Allegedly.
• 55:39
  Speaker 5: Now, contrast that by the fact that Oswald was making
• 55:42
  Speaker 5: a dollar twenty five an hour to school with depository, right.
• 55:48
  Speaker 3: Which is kind of equivalent to minimum.
• 55:50
  Speaker 5: Wage if you will, right, So vtt VT. Lee wasn't
• 55:54
  Speaker 5: doing very bad in his position with a fair Play.
• 55:59
  Speaker 9: For Cubic Committee.
• 56:02
  Speaker 5: I mean, he had an office, he had a nice salary,
• 56:06
  Speaker 5: but you know, eventually he just got left to him
• 56:08
  Speaker 5: and the money started to run out. And that's when
• 56:10
  Speaker 5: he was like, all right, time to go, Especially after
• 56:13
  Speaker 5: all this Oswald nonsense, bad publicity and all that shit, right,
• 56:17
  Speaker 5: having to deal with the Feds and everything else, He's
• 56:19
  Speaker 5: probably like, all right, I'm done, I'm done, Ski done, Zoe. Yeah,
• 56:30
  Speaker 5: so here we haven't lame them, and interesting.
• 56:36
  Speaker 3: Everyone else had tough tailed and ran by that point anyway, right,
• 56:40
  Speaker 3: So he's like, why am I going to stay around
• 56:42
  Speaker 3: and deal with this shit.
• 56:45
  Speaker 5: All right. So this is dated August sixteenth, which is
• 56:52
  Speaker 5: when Oswald was handing out these pamphlets in front of
• 56:55
  Speaker 5: the trademark.
• 56:56
  Speaker 3: Okay, Joe yep sixteen.
• 57:00
  Speaker 5: Now this is a New Orleans Police Department.
• 57:05
  Speaker 9: Report.
• 57:09
  Speaker 5: The complainant is a guy by the name of Hernandez,
• 57:12
  Speaker 5: Joe Ramone Hernandez to be exact, who lives in on
• 57:20
  Speaker 5: Eden Street in New Orleans. Okay, address of the subject
• 57:24
  Speaker 5: care of as well. They have fair play for Cuba
• 57:26
  Speaker 5: Committee because it is stamped on the pamphlets, right L. H.
• 57:30
  Speaker 5: Oswald four nine oh seven Magazine Street and violation of
• 57:34
  Speaker 5: the Registration Act, Okay is the complaint. Now whoever this
• 57:41
  Speaker 5: guy wrote, Ramone Hernandez is Again back then there was
• 57:47
  Speaker 5: two races, white and black, or white and Negro or
• 57:55
  Speaker 5: whatever they called it back then, but even latinos Ramon
• 58:00
  Speaker 5: Hernandez was considered white, all right.
• 58:04
  Speaker 9: And this is a young guy twenty three, twenty three.
• 58:08
  Speaker 5: Years old, male five ten, one seventy five, brown hair,
• 58:12
  Speaker 5: brown eyes, shocker, medium bill, medium complexion, born in Havana, Cuba,
• 58:19
  Speaker 5: in nineteen forty all right, So we have ourselves at
• 58:23
  Speaker 5: Cuban exile here COMPCT to the New Orleans Police Department
• 58:29
  Speaker 5: about a violation of the Registration Act concerning the fair
• 58:32
  Speaker 5: play for comp committee and Lee Oswall. Okay, this guy
• 58:36
  Speaker 5: knows his laws, okay to specifically talk about violating the
• 58:43
  Speaker 5: Registration Act. He is currently a student at Loyola an
• 58:47
  Speaker 5: Accounting Evening Division. He is employed by Spillsbury Sydney j
• 58:55
  Speaker 5: At Perdido. There's the phone number complaint brought in a
• 59:01
  Speaker 5: handout being distributed in front of the Trademark Camp Street
• 59:09
  Speaker 5: by five white males eighteen to twenty years in age,
• 59:14
  Speaker 5: wearing shorts. Okay, so real quick, Joe, why in the
• 59:24
  Speaker 5: Warren report do we have only that Oswald and two
• 59:28
  Speaker 5: other people were handing out these pamphlets. But this guy
• 59:33
  Speaker 5: is saying there was at least five to six of
• 59:35
  Speaker 5: them and they were all wearing shorts, like they were
• 59:38
  Speaker 5: all dressed alike.
• 59:40
  Speaker 3: Well, my best guess would be to protect their identities.
• 59:47
  Speaker 5: Right. We get Charles Steele who was one of them,
• 59:51
  Speaker 5: and I forget who the other guy was, but I
• 59:55
  Speaker 5: believe he was from a Latin extraction. But Charles Steele
• 59:58
  Speaker 5: was a white guy. Right, So it's interesting that this
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 5: person is saying that there was five or six people
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 5: handing out these pamphlets in front of the trademark on
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 5: Camp Street. The complainant stated that the five appear to
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 5: be college students and Americans. Hand out stated in part
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 5: hands Off Cuba joined the Fair Play for Cuba Committee.
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 5: Hernandez stated that he was imprisoned in Cuba for anti
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 5: Castro feelings, so obviously he's going to have a little
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 5: bit of an attitude about this, Joe, don't you think Yeah,
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 5: Now tell me if this next little bit sounds a
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 5: little familiar to you. He volunteered to attend lectures and
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 5: obtain literature, as stated on the handout at L. H.
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 5: Oswald four nine oh seven Magazine Street in New Orleans.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 5: Hernandez was advised that this office would not advise or
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 5: direct him in this matter, and any action taken by
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 5: him was of his own choice and responsibility. So, now,
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 5: if you remember, Joe carlos kirogo Okay, went to this
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 5: address met with Lee Oswald concerning joining the Fair Play
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 5: for Cuba Committee. It's kind of an undercover agent type.
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 3: Deal right, sent by Bring.
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 5: But Brigna also asked the FBI, Hey, you know, I
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 5: got a guy, we're gonna send to infiltrate the fair
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 5: Play for Cube Committee, And they told him the same thing. Look,
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 5: you do what you want, but we ain't a part
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 5: of it, which is odd to me, because the FBI,
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 5: at least on a national level, was very interested in
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 5: the fair Play for Cube Committee. Maybe not so much
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 5: by this date, you know, nineteen sixty three, but you know,
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 5: in the early sixties they were definitely cointelpro and the
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 5: shit out of this organization, right sending in undercover folks,
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 5: getting people to informal what the committee was doing. They
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 5: knew who all the officers were, they knew where they lived,
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 5: they knew all kinds of stuff about the members, what
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 5: they were all about. But by this date it kind
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 5: of seems to me like the FBI is like, eh, cares,
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 5: We're not telling you to do it. We don't want
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 5: your information go f off.
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 3: Right, And you talk about how irrelevant they were at
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 3: that point, maybe you kind of wonder why other than
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 3: Lee Oswalt's alleged participation in it, would be of any interest.
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 5: Yeah, And what's also interesting to me is this name here,
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 5: Hernandez Joe, that somebody named Hernandez has been linked to
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 5: Oswald in New Orleans. In Texas, I supposely he was
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 5: with somebody named Hernandez when he visited Robert McCown, Castro's
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 5: personal gun runner. And again in New Orleans he was,
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 5: you know, accuse of being around somebody named Hernandez at
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 5: the Banda Bar and things of this nature. So that
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 5: and of course that last name is not, you know,
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 5: by any means a unique Latino last name. But it's
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 5: interesting that this name pops up again. So maybe you
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 5: could ask yourself, well, maybe this guy did go talk
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 5: to Oswald kind of undercover, right.
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 3: Like a second attempt, and well maybe.
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 5: You got in Oswald's ear about some things and was
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 5: used by the folks, the former CRC members. Uh in
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 5: New Orleans, he's anti cast Cuban exiles to set hit
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 5: set him up for all this ship mm hmm. Just
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 5: a thought, yeah, just a thought, something to keep in
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 5: the back of your brains. But uh, yeah, that's all
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 5: I got on the Fair Play for Cuba Committee. You know,
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 5: of course, there's we're going we'll get into a ton
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 5: more in part two, you know, with Harry Dean and
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 5: and all of that. But you know, they were you
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 5: could see immediately after the assassination, they were setting out
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 5: to make sure that Castro could not be tied directly
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 5: to Oswald through the fair Play for Cuba Committee. So
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 5: that's what they were trying to do. And again at
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 5: this point in time, the fair Play for Community Committee
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 5: was dying on the vine right VT lead already planned
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 5: on being with it at the beginning of November. The
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 5: process just got accelerated, of course after Oswald and his
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 5: affiliation with the Fan Play for Cuba Committee, So that
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 5: pretty much stamped out the organization as a whole put
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 5: dun Ski type of thing. So I don't know, I
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 5: just thought it was interesting, you know, to see the
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 5: other side of things, you know, about exactly what this
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 5: fair Play for Cbe Committee was created to do, what
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 5: their insight was, their reach, who's running it type of thing.
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 5: And to touch on Richard to go back to Big
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 5: Dick Gibson and the CIA's denial of affiliation. Well he
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 5: would go on to be not necessarily an agent or whatever,
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 5: you know, an official CIA agent, but he was definitely
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 5: used as an asset, uh for him.
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 11: Right.
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 5: Yeah, in the mid sixties moving forward, he had he
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 5: had very deep roots in Africa, I believe he met
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 5: with Patrice Lamumba.
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 3: Really.
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 5: Yeah, so he had met with La Mumbo and Castro,
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 5: and that just happened to be two of the people
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 5: that the CIA were trying to kill, okay, to replace
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 5: their regimes, which is odd. Uh but yeah, it's it's uh.
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 5: He's an interesting character and I think, uh hell, maybe
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 5: even Doug might have a little more on him in
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 5: the morning on quick Hits. But you know what I
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 5: saw came out of John Newman's book, Oswald and the CIA.
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 5: Very interesting information. Like I said, he was he was
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 5: caught by the CIA trying to whine and I'm sixty
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 5: nine June Cobb in a hotel room and get her drunk.
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 5: But she got him drunk and he started talking to
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 5: and then she booted him out. The CEEWA recorded the
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 5: whole conversation. Yeah, very interesting stuff.
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, listen, this is my these are my thoughts.
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 3: I think there was definitely operations against the FPCC. I
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 3: think they might be overstated. In the sixty three years
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 3: this has happened, right, I'm not sure how much of
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 3: a factor they were. And as we're gonna get to
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 3: and I'm gonna play some parts or maybe robbers from
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 3: the radio interview. When Oswald talks about the FPCC, doesn't
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 3: sound extremely radical, sounds like, you know, progressive a little
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 3: part of.
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 5: You know, Look, they weren't a violent organization. They were
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 5: more of a protesting organization, like a loose collection of
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 5: people that you could pull together and throw a protest
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 5: in front of the UN or whatever's going on type
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 5: of whatever. Yeah, hand out some leaflets. A propaganda tool, uh,
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 5: you know, for the Cuban government at the most, that's
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 5: what they were. And you know, when you're trying to
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 5: impress upon a nation as big as the United States,
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 5: you know, the good points of you know, a communist
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 5: country in the middle of the Cold War, who's in
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 5: bed with the Russians ninety miles off your shore. Good luck.
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 5: You know, you might get some weirdos to join up
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 5: and be a part of your cause, or you know,
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 5: some people with money who, for whatever reason, figure they
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 5: can nagle a grift out of this whole thing.
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 3: Right, and we're talking about fifteen hundred people worldwide, worldwide,
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 3: that is not that significant. And even the one hundred
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 3: and fifty thousand dollars adjusted for inflation, isn't that much
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 3: when you think about the millions of the billions and
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 3: whatever the hell we we do these days, Right, it's
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 3: not like that's significant. Okay, they're gonna print some flyers whatever.
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 3: And I'm not defending them or Castro or anything, but
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 3: I'm just saying it seems like their efforts were overstated.
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 3: And I think you said something like FBI was like yeah, whatever,
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 3: like we don't really care. But the CIA was like
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 3: very focused on this.
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 5: Well they were, yeah, well they were. They were focused
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 5: in part on some of the individuals affiliated with it
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 5: and watching them and what they were doing, because you know,
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 5: you had you had some of these folks, like I said,
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 5: in Cuba meeting with Castro and you know, guys like
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 5: Richard Gibson they had their eye on. Obviously, they had
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 5: June Cobble and him, you know, questioning him and getting
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 5: him drunk in a hotel room to get the information
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 5: out of him. And you got him meeting with Castro
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 5: and La Mumba prior to the lamma's actual assassination.
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 3: And of course.
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 9: You know Castro was on the list.
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 5: They never got to him, but they wanted to allegedly,
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 5: so he was definitely somebody that they were keeping their
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 5: eye on for sure, right.
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 3: And it wouldn't make sense that they would. But I
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 3: don't know. I feel like a lot of the JFK
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 3: assassination community like over hypes the significance of the FPCC.
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 3: And it's mainly because of Oswalt And we're gonna hear
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 3: what he says about it in a couple of minutes.
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 3: So I get it, But like, don't you have better
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 3: things to do?
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, especially with a bunch of white people,
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 5: you know, getting together and you know, because it's not
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 5: like the Fair Play for Cuban Committee was being run
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 5: by Cubans, you know what I mean.
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 9: Yeah, there's not many, very very There's not very many.
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 5: Castor as sympathizers that they came to America, you know
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 5: what I mean.
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 3: Right, I'm guessing Gibson was not Cuban either, right now,
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 3: he was American, all right, So you have Gibson Steel,
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 3: not American, VT Lee.
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 9: Not American, not.
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 3: Not Cuban, not Cuban there, you know what I mean.
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 5: Like it's weird, you know, I could I look, I
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 5: get it. You know, you want Kumbai Yah and ship
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 5: you know, and fair trade and and the blockage the end.
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 5: People want to travel to Cuba, you know, people want
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 5: their cigars, People want to go there to gamble, people
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 5: want to go there to have a good time with
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 5: some even hookahos probably, uh that type of thing, you know,
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 5: lots of beaches, you know, because it was a fairly
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 5: popular destination vacation spot before Castro took over and kind
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 5: of got rid of the casinos and and you know, yeah,
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 5: just basically all the revenue away from the country and
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 5: put it in his own pocket, right.
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 3: Right, and uh, I just want to highlight this combat
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 3: by it boombada, Gibson said to Cobb, I don't know
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 3: if this is true. It is true on the telephone
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 3: the day after, Okay, thank you, after his visit. I'm
• 1:13:09
  Speaker 3: always awkward around pretty girls, which June Cobb definitely was.
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 3: And Cobb filed this remark on October nineteen sixty, So
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 3: this must have been just at the very beginning of
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 3: the FPCC.
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 9: April of nineteen sixty November.
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I think Gibson missed an opportunity to smash.
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 9: I would have he tried. She missed the opportunity to smash.
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 3: She didn't want to. She that wasn't her objective.
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 5: He could not get in them drawls, Joseph, is he saying, yes,
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 5: all right, let's talk a little bit about some other
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 5: subs folks in New Orleans, if you will again.
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 3: Yes, let's talk a little bit about mister ed Butler.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 3: And then we're gonna get into a couple of timestamps
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 3: of when he was on the radio show with Stucky
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 3: and I believe Bregner, although that might have been the video.
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 3: So if you want to share this, Rob, I'm just
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 3: going to read a little summary from Spartacus about Edwards Scannal.
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 5: Paul blow Go ahead, Scannal reading some twenty year old,
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 5: out of date information. Go ahead.
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 3: Well, that's just a good summary of who he was.
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 3: Edward Butler was born in New Orleans nineteen thirty four.
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 3: He went to the Army Management School fifty seven fifty nine,
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 3: Fort Belvoia, Belleview, Virginia. After completing the course, he was
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 3: employed as an account executive with Brown, Friedman and Company,
• 1:15:11
  Speaker 3: an advertising firm. Butler became friendly with your boy Clay
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 3: Shaw and Lloyd Cobb of the International Trademark and persuaded
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 3: these men to help fund his anti communist campaigns. This
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 3: included the establishment of tour organizations the Free Voice of
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 3: Latin America FVLA and the American Institute of Freedom Project AIFP.
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 3: Butler employed former FBI agent Guy Banister to work for
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 3: the ai FP allegedly, but he was friends with a
• 1:15:51
  Speaker 3: lot of big Swing Dixon and Nollins Robert, including Alton Kushner,
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 3: and apparently got some financial help with Clint from Clint Murchison,
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 3: who helped establish the INCA, which of course is the
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 3: Information Council of the Americas, which he helped co found.
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 3: Butler in April sixtye the hold, let me just skip
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 3: some of the filler here. So the Fair Play for
• 1:16:46
  Speaker 3: Cuba or Fair Play for Cuba Committee INCA was founded
• 1:16:56
  Speaker 3: on May fifteenth, nineteen sixty one by public real professional
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 3: Edward Butler. From the beginning, its agenda was narrowly focused
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 3: on communism as an issue. Inc in fact, sought support
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 3: from liberal as well as conservative anti communist, asking liberal
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 3: and anti communist people to speak at functions. And Butler had,
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 3: prior to the takeover le plans for an anti communist organization,
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 3: but when Castrop took over in Cuba and New Orleans
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 3: expressed growing anxiety over the new Latin dictator. He was
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 3: only twenty seven at the time of this. The public
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 3: relations man Butler was handed a searing issue in an
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 3: alarmed constituency. And Butler had an interest in both public
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 3: relations and psychology. And this is going to become relevant
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 3: because some say he engaged in propaganda, and I tend
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 3: to believe it. So in a real sense, his organization
• 1:18:09
  Speaker 3: was not ideologically based, even though his public relations man
• 1:18:14
  Speaker 3: uh said, so, let's see. Along with Ed Butler, the
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 3: most important member of INCA was famed physician doctor Alton
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 3: Oschner HM. So, like I said, he's hanging out with
• 1:18:36
  Speaker 3: the BSDs thirty eight years. Butler Senior formed a partnership
• 1:18:41
  Speaker 3: with his younger colleague which would last twenty years. Ed Butler,
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 3: who didn't have a great knowledge of Latin American affairs,
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 3: benefited substantially from the association with the celebrated doctor. Again
• 1:18:58
  Speaker 3: maybe another grift herem Ago Alton Oshner had a international outlook.
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 3: Blah blah blah. INCA continued until nineteen eighty one, which
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 3: is twenty years. I believe from sixty one to eighty one.
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 3: Its final demise attributed to the death of doctor Alton
• 1:19:20
  Speaker 3: Oshner that year. Then Oshner's son Alsner Junior go Figure,
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 3: helped start another organization similar to INCA. The Caribbean Commission
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 3: was formed in nineteen eighty two and several influential New
• 1:19:45
  Speaker 3: Orleans and Orleans. While INCA directed its energies on the
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 3: Cuban Revolution, the Caribbean Council focused on Nicaragua. So very interesting. Uh,
• 1:20:04
  Speaker 3: let me finish a couple of pages of PowerPoint before
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 3: we go into the audio, which you should have them
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 3: the private chat and I have the time stamps. I
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 3: don't know. Listen, I'm not saying it's it's just a summary. Okay, Paul, Okay,
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 3: Paul's my middle name.
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 9: That's what I'm referencing.
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 10: I know what.
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 3: I know what you're referencing.
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 9: Let's not be like Paul.
• 1:20:46
  Speaker 3: Yes, can you put back out the PowerPoint for a second.
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 5: Well, I'm getting tired of looking at that picture.
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 3: Okay, I have a couple more.
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 5: I can only look at Carlos bring A for so long.
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 5: Well it appears Joe froze.
• 1:21:29
  Speaker 3: So these are and Rob you are frozen there? Jee
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 3: all right, I know it happens when I bring up
• 1:21:36
  Speaker 3: my powerpoints. Sometimes these are some of the documents that
• 1:21:41
  Speaker 3: I scanned, well at NARAH. Maybe they're available, maybe they're not.
• 1:21:46
  Speaker 3: There's like a few hundred on Butler, on the ed
• 1:21:49
  Speaker 3: or on the very feral.
• 1:21:52
  Speaker 5: But there are any of those bodies parts that may
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 5: be included in these scans, well.
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 3: I included some just for your pleasure. Office of Security
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 3: has and this is sixty five, so we're talking about
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 3: two years after has coordinated this case with the components
• 1:22:09
  Speaker 3: having prior interest. There is no objection to CD slash
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 3: use of subject. This is gonna be fucking hard to
• 1:22:21
  Speaker 3: read here. This is on October first, nineteen sixty five.
• 1:22:30
  Speaker 3: In August sixty five, Edward scanal Butler of the INCA.
• 1:22:39
  Speaker 3: So he's making a movie here of a motion picture.
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 3: It's called Hitler in Havana, and it's available to us
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 3: as soon as other prints were made. Upon receipt of
• 1:22:55
  Speaker 3: your memorandum, we contacted someone and I determined that both
• 1:23:01
  Speaker 3: sixteen and something milime or prints are now at the
• 1:23:06
  Speaker 3: hand of INCA headquarters and that we will ship the
• 1:23:13
  Speaker 3: things to you. This is a CI document. We have
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 3: an appointment to call mister Butler on October four, sixty five,
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 3: at which he will I don't know tell us about
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 3: this shit. Maybe send us an advanced copy. I'm sorry
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 3: my scanning, first day scanning. What do you want from me?
• 1:23:39
  Speaker 3: This is another CIA document in the seventh nineteen seventy
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 3: Interesting here. I had never had the occasion to brief
• 1:23:54
  Speaker 3: mister Butler, except on the mission of the Domestic Context Service.
• 1:24:03
  Speaker 3: But let's get a little clearer thing here. While mister
• 1:24:07
  Speaker 3: Butler was executively president and staff director at INCA, he
• 1:24:11
  Speaker 3: was an excellent source of intelligence information on the locations, equipment,
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 3: and personnel of certain broadcasting, radio and TV stations in
• 1:24:22
  Speaker 3: Latin America. He was later made Vice President for Mass
• 1:24:26
  Speaker 3: Communication of INCA and was granted a leave of absence
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 3: to pursue certain matters of concern to INCA and to himself,
• 1:24:34
  Speaker 3: during which he moved to West Los Angeles to reside.
• 1:24:41
  Speaker 3: He still maintains contact with INCA. Blah blah blah. After
• 1:24:44
  Speaker 3: he took up residents in LA Butler established his own
• 1:24:48
  Speaker 3: public relations firm, Scannel Associate. Oh what have we got here?
• 1:24:57
  Speaker 5: That will being gift in five memberships?
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 10: Oh?
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 5: Thank you, congratulations. South to West even died. Chris called
• 1:25:11
  Speaker 5: Carl Ellis and the APEX. Congratulations, folks.
• 1:25:16
  Speaker 3: Good I was hoping you were hoping You're work in
• 1:25:20
  Speaker 3: the same way name.
• 1:25:21
  Speaker 9: Thank you, Brandon, Thank you, sir.
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 3: He currently has a weekly TV program entitled The Square World.
• 1:25:31
  Speaker 14: Of Ed Butler. So he's now going on TV. He's
• 1:25:34
  Speaker 14: writing books, he's making movies. So listen, dude, it is
• 1:25:39
  Speaker 14: obviously involved in propaganda. I don't think that's up.
• 1:25:42
  Speaker 3: For debate, right. Butler is a very cooperative contact and
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 3: has always welcomed an opportunity to assist the CIA. Of course,
• 1:25:55
  Speaker 3: and of course this is a couple of years after
• 1:25:57
  Speaker 3: the assassination, but you can imagine, you know, his ties
• 1:26:02
  Speaker 3: go way back.
• 1:26:05
  Speaker 9: It didn't start after the assitation, right.
• 1:26:12
  Speaker 3: Uh. Mister Butler is a very cooperative source and seems
• 1:26:17
  Speaker 3: to understand the intelligence collection function and to welcome any
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 3: opportunity to assist the CIA. He is intelligent, animated, articulate,
• 1:26:29
  Speaker 3: algoing individual. His only fault, which may hinder his association again,
• 1:26:36
  Speaker 3: which may hinder my association, but which can of course
• 1:26:41
  Speaker 3: be circumvented in his laziness and tendency to procrastinate.
• 1:26:47
  Speaker 9: Ah, oh, it's your birthday. Thank you, Trey.
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 3: Thank you, Trey. I appreciate it, buddy.
• 1:26:59
  Speaker 5: Oh yeah, report strong.
• 1:27:04
  Speaker 3: Butler. Yes, yes, Butler is aware of the sensitivity of
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 3: agency activities and is appropriately discrete. He is cleared for
• 1:27:19
  Speaker 3: the use of secret material as of sixty five, which,
• 1:27:25
  Speaker 3: of course you know CIA in their dates.
• 1:27:32
  Speaker 15: You know, I don't trust him obviously, since another component
• 1:27:39
  Speaker 15: of the agency apparently had or still had an interest
• 1:27:43
  Speaker 15: in using him in its operations.
• 1:27:45
  Speaker 3: The Office of Security, which again BSDs of the CIA,
• 1:27:54
  Speaker 3: checked with that component and determine that there was no
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 3: objection to domestic contact service use of mister Butler on
• 1:28:02
  Speaker 3: a continuing basis in the future. INCA is primarily concerned
• 1:28:08
  Speaker 3: with the preparation and dissemination of taped recordings of anti
• 1:28:14
  Speaker 3: communist material written are edited by mister Butler to a
• 1:28:18
  Speaker 3: selected group of broadcasting stations in Latin America North America
• 1:28:25
  Speaker 3: for use as a weapon against communist penetration and the
• 1:28:29
  Speaker 3: Americas translation propaganda. Yes, these tapes are called the Truth Tapes,
• 1:28:40
  Speaker 3: and mister Butler is the officer charged with their preparation
• 1:28:44
  Speaker 3: and distribution and field. In this effort. He has assisted
• 1:28:49
  Speaker 3: by his wife from one to four other paid employees.
• 1:28:55
  Speaker 5: So what is that I thought A great T shirt though, Yeah,
• 1:28:59
  Speaker 5: what's the penetration by propaganda?
• 1:29:07
  Speaker 3: Who are you gonna put on the image?
• 1:29:09
  Speaker 5: Oh me? Of course.
• 1:29:17
  Speaker 9: Agency.
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah. So interesting thing that uh mister Gaston was asking
• 1:29:30
  Speaker 3: mister uh Beckham about was Ed frequent? Was a frequent
• 1:29:38
  Speaker 3: visitor to mister Banister? You don't recall meeting him? I
• 1:29:42
  Speaker 3: might have, but I don't cool. I don't know unless
• 1:29:45
  Speaker 3: they see a picture of him. Can you recall if
• 1:29:47
  Speaker 3: you ever met leear Val as well?
• 1:29:49
  Speaker 10: No?
• 1:29:50
  Speaker 3: I never met the guy blah blah blah. But so
• 1:29:53
  Speaker 3: Ed Butler is running around with Oshner allegedly Clay Shaw
• 1:29:59
  Speaker 3: and Guy Banister in New Orleans and he's a three
• 1:30:04
  Speaker 3: generation wealthy New Orleans and person, you know what I mean. So,
• 1:30:16
  Speaker 3: and of course his appearance on you can take that
• 1:30:19
  Speaker 3: down now round his appearance on the radio and the
• 1:30:31
  Speaker 3: video with debate with Lee Hervey Oswalt is very intriguing
• 1:30:37
  Speaker 3: because it's like, why are you gonna include this skafuza
• 1:30:42
  Speaker 3: in this debate? Right in theory should be against Butler.
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 3: I mean you have Stucky kind of like moderating, right
• 1:30:52
  Speaker 3: at least in the radio one. You have Brignier and
• 1:30:56
  Speaker 3: you can have Oswalt. Why do you need to have
• 1:30:58
  Speaker 3: a butler there? I don't know, well, propaganda is my guess.
• 1:31:06
  Speaker 5: He knows it all.
• 1:31:08
  Speaker 3: He knows.
• 1:31:13
  Speaker 10: Well.
• 1:31:13
  Speaker 3: The thing is that, you know, I listened to this
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 3: whole interview, and even though Oswalt was like trapped or
• 1:31:24
  Speaker 3: they tried to trap him at every point, he just
• 1:31:29
  Speaker 3: holds his own he really does. So why don't we,
• 1:31:34
  Speaker 3: on that segue there bring up some of this interview
• 1:31:41
  Speaker 3: and you could start at one minute rob into it
• 1:31:47
  Speaker 3: and it is into a quactoral momentos.
• 1:31:55
  Speaker 16: Okay, we have with us a representative of probably the
• 1:32:08
  Speaker 16: most controversial organization connected with Cuba in this country, the
• 1:32:12
  Speaker 16: organization the Fair Play for Cuba Committee, the person Lee Oswald,
• 1:32:17
  Speaker 16: secretary of the New Orleans Chapter to the Fair Play
• 1:32:19
  Speaker 16: for Cuba Committee. This organization has long been on the
• 1:32:23
  Speaker 16: Justice Department's blacklist and is a group which is generally
• 1:32:25
  Speaker 16: considered to be the leading pro castro body in the nation.
• 1:32:29
  Speaker 16: As a reporter of Latin American affairs in the city,
• 1:32:31
  Speaker 16: for several years and now your colonist has kept the
• 1:32:34
  Speaker 16: lookout for local representatives of this pro castro group. None
• 1:32:37
  Speaker 16: appeared in public view until this week when young Lee
• 1:32:40
  Speaker 16: Oswald was arrested and convicted for disturbing the peace. He
• 1:32:45
  Speaker 16: was arrested while passing out pro Castro literature to a
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 16: crowd which included several violently anti Castro Cuban refugees. When
• 1:32:52
  Speaker 16: we finally at tracked mister Oswald down today and asked
• 1:32:54
  Speaker 16: him to participate in Latin listening posts, he told us
• 1:32:57
  Speaker 16: frankly that he would because it may help his organism
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 16: attract more members in this area. With that in mind,
• 1:33:04
  Speaker 16: and knowing that mister Oswell must have had to demonstrate
• 1:33:06
  Speaker 16: a great skill in dialectics before he was entrusted with
• 1:33:09
  Speaker 16: his president post, we now proceed on the course of
• 1:33:11
  Speaker 16: random questioning of mister Roswell. Mister Roswell, uh, if I may, uh,
• 1:33:17
  Speaker 16: how long has the Fair Play for Cuba Committee, Uh?
• 1:33:20
  Speaker 16: I had an organization in New Orleans.
• 1:33:22
  Speaker 10: We have had members in this area for several months now.
• 1:33:26
  Speaker 10: Up until about two months ago, however, we have not
• 1:33:29
  Speaker 10: organized our members into any sort of active group until,
• 1:33:33
  Speaker 10: as you say, this week, we have decided to feel
• 1:33:36
  Speaker 10: out the public uh what they think of our organization,
• 1:33:40
  Speaker 10: our aims, and for that purpose we have been, as
• 1:33:43
  Speaker 10: you say, distributing literature on the street UH for the
• 1:33:46
  Speaker 10: purpose of trying to attract UH new members and feel
• 1:33:49
  Speaker 10: out the public.
• 1:33:52
  Speaker 16: Do you have any other activities rather than distributing literature
• 1:33:55
  Speaker 16: at the present time?
• 1:33:56
  Speaker 10: Well, I assume you mean do I have any organizational
• 1:34:00
  Speaker 10: duties myself?
• 1:34:01
  Speaker 3: Yes? Yes.
• 1:34:02
  Speaker 10: As secretary, I am responsible for the UH, the keeping
• 1:34:08
  Speaker 10: of records, and the protection of the member's names so
• 1:34:12
  Speaker 10: that undue publicity or our attention will not be drawn
• 1:34:16
  Speaker 10: to them if they do not desire it. My duties
• 1:34:20
  Speaker 10: are or as the duties of a secretary of any organization.
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 10: Our Our organization has a president, a secretary, and a treasurer.
• 1:34:28
  Speaker 10: The duties of those people would be more or less
• 1:34:31
  Speaker 10: self evident those than are my duties. I do not, however,
• 1:34:34
  Speaker 10: belong to any other organization at all.
• 1:34:38
  Speaker 16: Are you a liberty to reveal the membership of your organization?
• 1:34:41
  Speaker 3: No, I'm not.
• 1:34:42
  Speaker 16: For what reason?
• 1:34:44
  Speaker 10: Well, as secretary, I believe it's standard operating a procedure
• 1:34:48
  Speaker 10: that organization consisting of a political minority protect the names
• 1:34:53
  Speaker 10: and addresses of its members, and I have every UH
• 1:34:57
  Speaker 10: that is my duty and I have every reason to
• 1:34:59
  Speaker 10: do that.
• 1:35:00
  Speaker 16: Mister Oswell, there are many commentators in the journalistic people
• 1:35:03
  Speaker 16: in this country. That are quite the Fair Play for
• 1:35:05
  Speaker 16: Community for Cuba Committee with the American Communist Party.
• 1:35:09
  Speaker 3: What you're feeling about this?
• 1:35:10
  Speaker 16: And are you a member of the American Communist Party?
• 1:35:13
  Speaker 2: Well, the.
• 1:35:19
  Speaker 9: Aw's your time stamped, Joe.
• 1:35:23
  Speaker 3: Where are we at? Four minutes? Yeah, okay, go to
• 1:35:28
  Speaker 3: twenty forty twenty minutes forty.
• 1:35:30
  Speaker 16: Seconds Play for Cuba Committee. Have any opinion about the
• 1:35:39
  Speaker 16: suppression of democratic liberties in Hungary in nineteen fifty six?
• 1:35:43
  Speaker 16: Are the poverty in any of the Eastern Bloc countries today?
• 1:35:46
  Speaker 10: Officially no, but of course we have our own opinions
• 1:35:49
  Speaker 10: about such situation. We consider that Russian imperialism it is
• 1:35:56
  Speaker 10: a very bad thing. It was a bad thing in Hungary.
• 1:35:59
  Speaker 10: We certainly do not support dictatorship or the suppression of
• 1:36:04
  Speaker 10: any people's anywhere. But as I say, and as I
• 1:36:07
  Speaker 10: must stress, we are preoccupied only with the the problem
• 1:36:11
  Speaker 10: of Cuba.
• 1:36:12
  Speaker 16: Officially, we'll returned from more questions after this message.
• 1:36:25
  Speaker 3: It comes back in the second mister.
• 1:36:27
  Speaker 16: Oswell, you have the title of secretary of the New
• 1:36:30
  Speaker 16: Orleans chapter of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee. However,
• 1:36:33
  Speaker 16: you've just said that you've never been to Latin America
• 1:36:35
  Speaker 16: except for a few ventures in New Mexico. In that case,
• 1:36:38
  Speaker 16: just exactly how do you get your information concerning Latin
• 1:36:40
  Speaker 16: American affairs or Latin American conditions.
• 1:36:44
  Speaker 10: Well, as I say, we are preoccupied with the problem
• 1:36:47
  Speaker 10: of Cuba.
• 1:36:48
  Speaker 3: There are.
• 1:36:50
  Speaker 10: Correspondents, uh, people who correspond with the headquarters in New
• 1:36:54
  Speaker 10: York from Cuba, directly from Cuba. That is where they
• 1:36:58
  Speaker 10: get their information about Cuba. Now, in regards to Latin
• 1:37:02
  Speaker 10: and Central America, you do not have to be a
• 1:37:06
  Speaker 10: you do not have to have your own correspondent there.
• 1:37:09
  Speaker 10: The AP and the UP covered very well, and they
• 1:37:12
  Speaker 10: certainly give a very clear picture of the situation in
• 1:37:15
  Speaker 10: certain countries Nicaragua and so forth, as I mentioned, which
• 1:37:19
  Speaker 10: have very undemocratic regimes, dictatorships, and as I say, these
• 1:37:24
  Speaker 10: things are well known by everyone and.
• 1:37:26
  Speaker 3: They accepted it as truth.
• 1:37:28
  Speaker 10: For instance, you will you will not be able to
• 1:37:30
  Speaker 10: find any official or any person who knows about Latin
• 1:37:32
  Speaker 10: America who will say that Nicaragua does not have a dictatorship.
• 1:37:38
  Speaker 16: Very interesting that you should mention dictatorships in Nicaragua, because we, naturally,
• 1:37:43
  Speaker 16: from reading your presers, have heard about these dictatorships for
• 1:37:45
  Speaker 16: many many years. But it's curious to me as to
• 1:37:50
  Speaker 16: why I knew Nicaraguans fled to the United States last year,
• 1:37:52
  Speaker 16: whereas we had possibly fifty or sixty thousand Cubans fleeing
• 1:37:55
  Speaker 16: from Cuba to the United States. What is the Cuba.
• 1:38:02
  Speaker 3: As you can see, very composed, very I got self
• 1:38:07
  Speaker 3: taught on geopolitical matters and whether it's Hungary. And he
• 1:38:13
  Speaker 3: even disavows the Soviet Union and some of what they
• 1:38:19
  Speaker 3: were up to. You know what I mean. Doesn't sound
• 1:38:22
  Speaker 3: like a radical.
• 1:38:23
  Speaker 5: To me, No, but I mean he's talking out of
• 1:38:30
  Speaker 5: both sides of his mouth here, really. I mean, he's
• 1:38:33
  Speaker 5: disparaged in these countries with dictatorships, but he's supporting Cuba,
• 1:38:39
  Speaker 5: who has an obvious dictatorship and not just one way
• 1:38:48
  Speaker 5: to dictatorship, you know, I mean communist dictatorship. Yes, that's
• 1:38:54
  Speaker 5: a little odd to me. You know that he wants
• 1:38:55
  Speaker 5: to down all these other countries being dictatorships, but he's
• 1:38:59
  Speaker 5: supporting Astro and his dictatorship in Cuba.
• 1:39:04
  Speaker 3: Yes, And I believe we talked about this in the past.
• 1:39:08
  Speaker 3: He went to Russia, he was interested in Marxism, allegedly,
• 1:39:14
  Speaker 3: he was then very put off by their system of socialism, communism, Marxism,
• 1:39:22
  Speaker 3: whatever you want to call it, and maybe he put
• 1:39:26
  Speaker 3: his hopes in Cuba and it might be in one
• 1:39:31
  Speaker 3: of these next timestance go to thirty one forty seconds
• 1:39:36
  Speaker 3: he talks about how the United States and he actually
• 1:39:41
  Speaker 3: mentions Dulles, which is interesting, how they kind of pushed
• 1:39:45
  Speaker 3: Castro towards.
• 1:39:49
  Speaker 4: Too with my family, sorry no to having to like
• 1:39:54
  Speaker 4: you know, ally with the Soviet.
• 1:40:00
  Speaker 10: With my wife and my child.
• 1:40:03
  Speaker 16: What a particular event in your life I made you
• 1:40:06
  Speaker 16: decide that the Fairy Player for Cuba committee had the
• 1:40:08
  Speaker 16: correct answers about Cuba and the US relations.
• 1:40:13
  Speaker 5: Well.
• 1:40:13
  Speaker 10: Of course, Americans in general have only begun to notice
• 1:40:16
  Speaker 10: Cuba since the Cuban Revolution.
• 1:40:19
  Speaker 5: That's very true.
• 1:40:19
  Speaker 10: I think I became acquainted with it at about the
• 1:40:22
  Speaker 10: same time as everybody else in nineteen sixty. Beginning in
• 1:40:26
  Speaker 10: nineteen sixty, I always felt that the Cubans were being
• 1:40:31
  Speaker 10: pushed in to the Soviet block by American policy. I
• 1:40:35
  Speaker 10: s don't feel that way our policy if it had
• 1:40:38
  Speaker 10: been handled differently, and many others much more informed than
• 1:40:43
  Speaker 10: I have said the same thing. If that situation had
• 1:40:46
  Speaker 10: been handled differently, we would not have the big problem
• 1:40:49
  Speaker 10: of Castro's Cuba now the big international political problem. Although
• 1:40:55
  Speaker 10: I feel that it's a just and a right development
• 1:40:59
  Speaker 10: in Cuba, still we could be on much friendlier relations
• 1:41:03
  Speaker 10: with them, and had the government of the United States
• 1:41:07
  Speaker 10: its government agencies, particularly a certain covert covert undercover agencies
• 1:41:14
  Speaker 10: like the now defunct the CIA, and absolutely well its
• 1:41:18
  Speaker 10: leadership is now defunct, Alan Dalls is now defunct, that
• 1:41:23
  Speaker 10: I believe that without all that meddling, with a little
• 1:41:26
  Speaker 10: bit different humanitarian handling of the situation, Cuba would not
• 1:41:31
  Speaker 10: be the problem it is today.
• 1:41:33
  Speaker 16: Is there any particular act of the US government do
• 1:41:35
  Speaker 16: you feel.
• 1:41:36
  Speaker 3: That forty three fifty seven last one?
• 1:41:47
  Speaker 10: How many television sets and how many radios and all that? This?
• 1:41:52
  Speaker 10: I do think is a subject to be discussed tonight.
• 1:41:56
  Speaker 10: The Fair Play for Cuba Committee, as the name implies,
• 1:41:59
  Speaker 10: is concerned and primarily with Cuban American relations.
• 1:42:03
  Speaker 11: How many people do you have in your committee?
• 1:42:04
  Speaker 3: Here in your orders, I.
• 1:42:06
  Speaker 10: Cannot reveal that a secretary of the Fair Play for
• 1:42:09
  Speaker 10: Cuba Committee. Is it a secret society, No, mister Butler,
• 1:42:14
  Speaker 10: it is not. However, it is a stanate operating procedure
• 1:42:18
  Speaker 10: for a political organization consisting of a political minority to
• 1:42:23
  Speaker 10: safeguard the names and the number of its members.
• 1:42:25
  Speaker 17: Well, the Republicans are in the minority. I don't see
• 1:42:28
  Speaker 17: them hiding their membership. The Republicans are not a well.
• 1:42:32
  Speaker 17: The Republicans are.
• 1:42:34
  Speaker 10: Established political party representing a great many people. They represent
• 1:42:38
  Speaker 10: no radical point of view. They do not have a
• 1:42:41
  Speaker 10: very violent and sometimes emotional opposition.
• 1:42:44
  Speaker 3: As we do.
• 1:42:45
  Speaker 17: No, I see. But would you say then that the
• 1:42:49
  Speaker 17: Fan Point for Cuba Committee is not a communist front organization.
• 1:42:53
  Speaker 10: The Senate subcommittees who have occupied themselves with investigating the
• 1:42:58
  Speaker 10: fair Play for Cuba Committe he have filed that there
• 1:43:02
  Speaker 10: is nothing to connect the two committees. We have been
• 1:43:05
  Speaker 10: investigated from several points of view, that is points of
• 1:43:08
  Speaker 10: view of taxes, allegiance, subversion, and so forth. The findings
• 1:43:14
  Speaker 10: have been, as I say, absolutely zero.
• 1:43:16
  Speaker 17: Well, I have the Senate hearings before me, and I
• 1:43:18
  Speaker 17: think what I have in front of.
• 1:43:20
  Speaker 3: Me refutes precisely every statement that you just made. For instance,
• 1:43:24
  Speaker 3: who is.
• 1:43:24
  Speaker 17: The honorary chairman of the fad Place for Cuba Committee, Uh,
• 1:43:28
  Speaker 17: the honorary chairman of this committee.
• 1:43:31
  Speaker 10: The name of that person, I certainly don't know.
• 1:43:34
  Speaker 3: Well, let me tell you in case you don't know.
• 1:43:36
  Speaker 17: About your own organization, No, I know about it.
• 1:43:38
  Speaker 3: His name is Waldo Frank, and.
• 1:43:40
  Speaker 17: I'm quoting from the New Masses of September nineteen thirty two.
• 1:43:44
  Speaker 17: The title of his article is how I Came to
• 1:43:47
  Speaker 17: Communism A symposium Waldo Frank, Where I stand and how
• 1:43:51
  Speaker 17: I got that?
• 1:43:53
  Speaker 10: Now, let me ask you a second question.
• 1:43:56
  Speaker 17: Who is the secretary of the fab Place for Cuba Committee?
• 1:43:58
  Speaker 10: The national secretary, Well, we have a national director who
• 1:44:01
  Speaker 10: is mister V. T.
• 1:44:02
  Speaker 3: Lee, who has recently.
• 1:44:04
  Speaker 10: Returned from Cuba, and because of the fact that the
• 1:44:08
  Speaker 10: United States government has imposed restrictions on travel with Cuba,
• 1:44:11
  Speaker 10: he is now under indictment for his traveling to Cuba. This, however,
• 1:44:16
  Speaker 10: it's very convenient for rtist organizations to drag out this
• 1:44:20
  Speaker 10: or that literature of reporting to show a fact which
• 1:44:24
  Speaker 10: has not been established in law. I've said that the
• 1:44:27
  Speaker 10: fair Play for Cuba Committee has definitely been investigated.
• 1:44:31
  Speaker 3: That is very true. I've also said that the total.
• 1:44:34
  Speaker 10: Result of that investigation was zero. That is, the fair
• 1:44:38
  Speaker 10: Play for Cuba Committee is not now on the Attorney
• 1:44:41
  Speaker 10: General's subversive list. And the other material you may have
• 1:44:45
  Speaker 10: is a super florist.
• 1:44:48
  Speaker 11: Mister Oswald, I may break in a moment. I believe
• 1:44:51
  Speaker 11: it was mentioned that you at one time asked to
• 1:44:53
  Speaker 11: renounce your American citizenship and become a.
• 1:44:57
  Speaker 3: Citizen of the Soviet Union. Is that correct?
• 1:45:00
  Speaker 10: Think that has a particular import to this discussion. We're
• 1:45:04
  Speaker 10: discussing a Cuban American.
• 1:45:06
  Speaker 11: Well, I think it has a bearing to this extent.
• 1:45:11
  Speaker 11: Apparently that Cuba is not dominated by Russia. And yet you,
• 1:45:16
  Speaker 11: apparently by your own past actions, have shown that you
• 1:45:19
  Speaker 11: have an affinity for Russia and perhaps communism, although I
• 1:45:23
  Speaker 11: don't know that you admit that you either are a
• 1:45:25
  Speaker 11: communist or have been. Could you straighten out that point?
• 1:45:28
  Speaker 11: Are you or have you been?
• 1:45:29
  Speaker 3: A communist?
• 1:45:30
  Speaker 11: Well?
• 1:45:30
  Speaker 10: I had answered that prior to this program on another radio.
• 1:45:34
  Speaker 3: Programs Are you a Marxist?
• 1:45:37
  Speaker 10: Yes, I am a Marxist.
• 1:45:38
  Speaker 3: What's the difference?
• 1:45:40
  Speaker 10: Well, the difference is that primarily the difference between a
• 1:45:43
  Speaker 10: country like Ghana, Guyana, Yugoslavia, China or Russia, very very
• 1:45:49
  Speaker 10: great differences, differences which we appreciate by getting the let's say,
• 1:45:54
  Speaker 10: to Yugoslavia in the sum of one hundred million.
• 1:46:01
  Speaker 9: What are your thoughts I mean, dude, ghana Ena.
• 1:46:10
  Speaker 3: I mean, listen, he was obviously like ganged up on
• 1:46:15
  Speaker 3: by you know, Stuckley Butler, bring A, et cetera. And
• 1:46:21
  Speaker 3: I think he helps his own and he doesn't come
• 1:46:24
  Speaker 3: off to me as some like crazy radical. I think he's.
• 1:46:33
  Speaker 5: He's definitely read up on shit right right, and self
• 1:46:36
  Speaker 5: taught well. And this is what leads me to, you know,
• 1:46:42
  Speaker 5: down the path of coming to the realization of who
• 1:46:46
  Speaker 5: Lee Oswold actually was. You know, at one point in
• 1:46:49
  Speaker 5: time I believed he was, you know, this sheep dip
• 1:46:51
  Speaker 5: guy working undercover for our government pretending to be pro
• 1:46:56
  Speaker 5: pro castro, when in fact I think he was procastro legitimately.
• 1:47:05
  Speaker 5: I mean, you don't. You don't go through this much
• 1:47:09
  Speaker 5: trouble just to pretend to be somebody for some kind
• 1:47:13
  Speaker 5: of a reason for so long a period of time.
• 1:47:16
  Speaker 5: I mean, this is a long con if it is
• 1:47:20
  Speaker 5: in fact a con. I mean we're talking about a
• 1:47:24
  Speaker 5: four to five year grift con. Whatever you want to
• 1:47:28
  Speaker 5: call it wasn't even formed then, right.
• 1:47:35
  Speaker 10: But you have.
• 1:47:37
  Speaker 5: In the Marines, you know, studying Russian and then defecting
• 1:47:41
  Speaker 5: to Russia pretty quickly, getting it after getting a early
• 1:47:46
  Speaker 5: dismissal from the Marines, and you know, if it is
• 1:47:50
  Speaker 5: a con, it's an extremely long.
• 1:47:52
  Speaker 3: Con, extremely well played one.
• 1:47:56
  Speaker 5: For whatever purpose, you know. But and when you hear
• 1:47:59
  Speaker 5: this talk, you know, you can.
• 1:48:04
  Speaker 9: Hear the passion in his voice.
• 1:48:06
  Speaker 3: Right if you could feel his enthusiasm into these.
• 1:48:10
  Speaker 5: Subjects, right, Like he's all in, he's getting pamphlets made up,
• 1:48:13
  Speaker 5: he's handing the shit out on the street, he's ready
• 1:48:15
  Speaker 5: to talk to people about it. He goes on the radio,
• 1:48:18
  Speaker 5: goes on television. I mean, he's doing all this stuff.
• 1:48:21
  Speaker 5: And to me, it seems legitimate, you know, you and
• 1:48:28
  Speaker 5: you contrast that with, like, you know, the signature of
• 1:48:30
  Speaker 5: analysis that we've been doing of a certain documents that
• 1:48:32
  Speaker 5: he was signing, and what he was doing.
• 1:48:35
  Speaker 9: The purpose of the trip to Mexico.
• 1:48:37
  Speaker 5: And all of that, I don't know. To me, it
• 1:48:45
  Speaker 5: seems like if he was truly legitimate, this is what
• 1:48:50
  Speaker 5: incensed and pissed off the anti Castro Cuban exiles, right
• 1:48:57
  Speaker 5: that were around Oswald enough to make this guy turn out.
• 1:49:03
  Speaker 5: And I'm not saying just because he was legitimately pro Castro,
• 1:49:06
  Speaker 5: he took out Kennedy, right, but he pissed off and
• 1:49:09
  Speaker 5: of these anti Castro Cuban exiles. I think they wouldn't
• 1:49:15
  Speaker 5: have any problems setting up this fool to take the
• 1:49:19
  Speaker 5: rap for killing Kennedy. And it would appear to everyone,
• 1:49:26
  Speaker 5: at least on the surface, that this guy would have
• 1:49:29
  Speaker 5: been capable of it.
• 1:49:30
  Speaker 9: Given his viewpots right and his you.
• 1:49:33
  Speaker 3: Know, ability to be articulate and self taught. You could
• 1:49:38
  Speaker 3: see how they thought this could be a threat. And
• 1:49:41
  Speaker 3: then when you compound not with the fact that he
• 1:49:45
  Speaker 3: tries to infiltrate alleged.
• 1:49:50
  Speaker 5: Could he spell?
• 1:49:51
  Speaker 11: No?
• 1:49:51
  Speaker 5: Does his punctuation suck? Yes? You know, I don't think
• 1:49:54
  Speaker 5: he had passed a tenth or eleventh grade education. And
• 1:49:58
  Speaker 5: that's after switching schools like fifteen times in ten years,
• 1:50:03
  Speaker 5: you know what I mean.
• 1:50:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah, true, Yeah, he wasn't.
• 1:50:07
  Speaker 5: The best at at school, you know, but he read books.
• 1:50:12
  Speaker 5: We have his library records from when he came back
• 1:50:15
  Speaker 5: from at least from when he came back from Russia.
• 1:50:18
  Speaker 9: He was an avid reader, yeah, a good a variety
• 1:50:21
  Speaker 9: of books.
• 1:50:22
  Speaker 3: Good vocabulary as well.
• 1:50:25
  Speaker 9: Yeah.
• 1:50:26
  Speaker 5: I mean he was using some big words there in
• 1:50:27
  Speaker 5: that interview, That's what I'm saying.
• 1:50:30
  Speaker 3: You know, And he's being ganged up on in this interview,
• 1:50:34
  Speaker 3: and you know, he's not like prepping, He's not reading
• 1:50:36
  Speaker 3: from notes or anything. It's very interesting when when you
• 1:50:43
  Speaker 3: consider all this. So, but they obviously kind of, I
• 1:50:52
  Speaker 3: don't know, stuck the dogs on them, I don't know
• 1:50:54
  Speaker 3: if that's the right term, with with Butler and and
• 1:50:58
  Speaker 3: Stuck Lee, Stucky and bring although Oswald kind of initiated
• 1:51:05
  Speaker 3: that part, you know, and propaganda was was just flying
• 1:51:12
  Speaker 3: in Knowleans And I'm not saying that propaganda. You know
• 1:51:16
  Speaker 3: ed Butler knew about the assassination or something like that.
• 1:51:19
  Speaker 3: But was this an anti FPCC operation? Were they that
• 1:51:26
  Speaker 3: concerned that this young man was going to rile more
• 1:51:32
  Speaker 3: people up to the cause.
• 1:51:34
  Speaker 5: M Maybe because when you we i mean, think about
• 1:51:38
  Speaker 5: it for a second. So the people suspected, Okay, Oswall's
• 1:51:42
  Speaker 5: we're going to either undercover for the FBI or the
• 1:51:44
  Speaker 5: CIA something like that. Right, And you can suppose that,
• 1:51:51
  Speaker 5: you know, it's been a popular theory for a long time,
• 1:51:55
  Speaker 5: well you were sheep dipping Oswald and blah blah blah
• 1:51:57
  Speaker 5: blah blah. Right, And what people forget is that there
• 1:52:06
  Speaker 5: was a lot of anti Castri Cuban exiles, not just
• 1:52:10
  Speaker 5: in Miami, not just in New Orleans or Dallas who
• 1:52:13
  Speaker 5: were informing to the FBI. I mean, they didn't need
• 1:52:19
  Speaker 5: Oswald to pretend to be somebody to get intel on
• 1:52:23
  Speaker 5: the anti Castro Cuban exiles.
• 1:52:25
  Speaker 10: Right.
• 1:52:25
  Speaker 9: They were telling on themselves, right.
• 1:52:28
  Speaker 3: They were all like, they were all like grifters in
• 1:52:31
  Speaker 3: a sense.
• 1:52:33
  Speaker 5: Right, But they were all telling on themselves. They didn't
• 1:52:35
  Speaker 5: need to send Oswald in there to pretend to be
• 1:52:39
  Speaker 5: somebody's not in order to gain intel, right, they were
• 1:52:43
  Speaker 5: already telling on themselves of the FBI. And oh, by
• 1:52:46
  Speaker 5: the way, the CIA was funding all these damn anti
• 1:52:48
  Speaker 5: Castro Cuban exile groups. All these groups had handlers CIA handlers,
• 1:52:54
  Speaker 5: So the CIA didn't need to send in Oswald undercover
• 1:52:57
  Speaker 5: to do anything, you know what I mean, They the
• 1:53:00
  Speaker 5: CIA and the FBI already knew everything that was going
• 1:53:02
  Speaker 5: on with the Cuban exile community. Yeah, CIA was funding him, okay,
• 1:53:10
  Speaker 5: and the FBI knew everything already. So I just don't
• 1:53:18
  Speaker 5: buy the fact that Oswald is pretending. I'm not buying
• 1:53:21
  Speaker 5: that he sheep dip. I think he's legitimately everything that
• 1:53:26
  Speaker 5: he says he is, which he's me believe this too, Joe, Okay, whoa.
• 1:53:36
  Speaker 5: You know, everybody wants to believe Oswald on November twenty
• 1:53:40
  Speaker 5: second when he says, I'm just a patsy, I didn't
• 1:53:43
  Speaker 5: shoot anybody, right, But they're quick to dismiss him when
• 1:53:49
  Speaker 5: he's saying that he is a pro Castro supporter that
• 1:53:53
  Speaker 5: wants fair play for Cuba, fair treatment for Cuba from
• 1:53:58
  Speaker 5: our government.
• 1:54:01
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 1:54:02
  Speaker 5: So y, you know you can't have it both ways, right,
• 1:54:09
  Speaker 5: And I one.
• 1:54:09
  Speaker 3: Hundred percent agree, And I urge everyone who is kind
• 1:54:13
  Speaker 3: of questioning this to go listen. I believe it's on
• 1:54:18
  Speaker 3: David von Payn's just a YouTube channel, and I mean
• 1:54:26
  Speaker 3: I listened to all fifty minutes of it, like almost
• 1:54:31
  Speaker 3: an hour or something along those lines. His passion comes
• 1:54:40
  Speaker 3: out really obviously. Unless he's the biggest actor in the world,
• 1:54:47
  Speaker 3: I believe him. I believe he was looking for you know,
• 1:54:53
  Speaker 3: he puts down Russia, but he's thinking Fidel Cashow could
• 1:54:57
  Speaker 3: be somewhat different.
• 1:54:59
  Speaker 5: I mean, look, the thing with Cuba is it's different, right,
• 1:55:06
  Speaker 5: It's different than like a a Hitler or a Stylin
• 1:55:11
  Speaker 5: or somebody like that. It's in power for years and
• 1:55:14
  Speaker 5: years and years and years and years. Well, Castro would
• 1:55:19
  Speaker 5: do one to be that. But at the beginning, right
• 1:55:23
  Speaker 5: before Castro, there was Batista, who was very unpopular people, right,
• 1:55:30
  Speaker 5: he was corrupt, but you know what, the United States
• 1:55:35
  Speaker 5: government had him in their pocket, right.
• 1:55:37
  Speaker 9: He played Paul right, but he's he was bad for Cuba.
• 1:55:43
  Speaker 5: So when Castro up you know that Castro uprising the revolution,
• 1:55:49
  Speaker 5: you know, ousted Batista and he took over. Everybody was
• 1:55:53
  Speaker 5: happy in Cuba, not so much to United States government, right,
• 1:56:00
  Speaker 5: But things kind of changed relatively quickly once Castro assumed
• 1:56:07
  Speaker 5: power and he converted to communism and befriending the Russians
• 1:56:13
  Speaker 5: and all of that. Right, then the Cuban people changed
• 1:56:17
  Speaker 5: on him, right, and no longer supported him. He was
• 1:56:21
  Speaker 5: worse than Batista right now. You know, they got fooled,
• 1:56:25
  Speaker 5: which pissed him off.
• 1:56:28
  Speaker 3: Hey we've gotten fooled recently. No more comments on that.
• 1:56:33
  Speaker 9: Yeah, won't get fooled again.
• 1:56:38
  Speaker 3: No, No, I completely agree. It wasn't like so caught
• 1:56:42
  Speaker 3: and dry. And I think what Oswald was saying in
• 1:56:44
  Speaker 3: one of those clips was the US policy kind of
• 1:56:52
  Speaker 3: pushed them towards aligned with Russia. And it's it's very nuanced,
• 1:57:02
  Speaker 3: you know what he says, And Sally said hold, what
• 1:57:06
  Speaker 3: would she say. True, I don't believe he was a communist.
• 1:57:12
  Speaker 3: I don't think he was for dictators at all, neither
• 1:57:14
  Speaker 3: do why. I think he like was like towing the
• 1:57:18
  Speaker 3: line between like a socialist and a Marxist and whatever.
• 1:57:25
  Speaker 3: And he wasn't thrilled with capitalism, but he wasn't a
• 1:57:29
  Speaker 3: straight communist. Like maybe he subscribed to a magazine or two,
• 1:57:35
  Speaker 3: but that could have been just to keep up with,
• 1:57:38
  Speaker 3: you know, modern discussion whatever. I don't know. I think
• 1:57:44
  Speaker 3: he was very much in search of the best political system,
• 1:57:50
  Speaker 3: and I think he walked into a really bad situation
• 1:57:55
  Speaker 3: with a bunch of dangerous characters, and I think he
• 1:57:58
  Speaker 3: was framed.
• 1:58:01
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, and Oswald got a taste of it,
• 1:58:04
  Speaker 5: right because over here, Yeah, capitalism can suck for people
• 1:58:11
  Speaker 5: that just can't get ahead. They can't catch a break.
• 1:58:15
  Speaker 5: You're not born into wealth, come from poverty. There's a
• 1:58:18
  Speaker 5: cycle that keeps repeating itself and repeating itself. Right, So
• 1:58:23
  Speaker 5: at that point, to Oswald, communism looked good because everybody
• 1:58:27
  Speaker 5: gets treated the same. Everybody gets three potatoes and a
• 1:58:30
  Speaker 5: bottle of vodka and a loaf of bread, and you
• 1:58:34
  Speaker 5: make the same amount of money. You're given the same
• 1:58:36
  Speaker 5: shitty apartment whatever, and you know, you go there, but
• 1:58:42
  Speaker 5: you don't have the freedoms that you do here, to
• 1:58:46
  Speaker 5: be more outspoken, to do what you want, to go
• 1:58:50
  Speaker 5: where you want when you want, and.
• 1:58:56
  Speaker 9: You know, to own what you want.
• 1:58:57
  Speaker 1: You can't.
• 1:58:57
  Speaker 5: I mean, you're just another gray person in a gray society, right, right.
• 1:59:04
  Speaker 3: And he grew very disillusioned with it pretty quickly, right,
• 1:59:07
  Speaker 3: That's why he came right And you're talking about it
• 1:59:12
  Speaker 3: like the only dude who staged a protest at the
• 1:59:16
  Speaker 3: radio factory or whatever he worked out in Minsk, right.
• 1:59:20
  Speaker 5: I mean, give a fucking dude, shut the fuck up.
• 1:59:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah, all the Russians were like, what are you doing?
• 1:59:28
  Speaker 3: He was like, I don't care like protest, So like
• 1:59:33
  Speaker 3: the fact that he would be protesting relations with Cuba
• 1:59:38
  Speaker 3: isn't that surprising to me?
• 1:59:44
  Speaker 5: Yeah?
• 1:59:44
  Speaker 9: I agree.
• 1:59:44
  Speaker 5: I mean again, I think he was just a disillusioned dude, right,
• 1:59:50
  Speaker 5: and he was trying to find a happy place that
• 1:59:54
  Speaker 5: he could exist in, but nothing was working for him, right, right,
• 2:00:00
  Speaker 5: And you know it was getting to Cuba and.
• 2:00:04
  Speaker 9: Is Castro the answer for him?
• 2:00:06
  Speaker 5: I mean, he'd already been to Russia, didn't like it
• 2:00:09
  Speaker 5: in the United States didn't like it, like it?
• 2:00:12
  Speaker 9: So what's the next You're gonna track Cuba? Hey, I
• 2:00:17
  Speaker 9: don't know.
• 2:00:18
  Speaker 3: I don't think that's far off, man, I really don't,
• 2:00:22
  Speaker 3: I think. And you got to remember this is a
• 2:00:24
  Speaker 3: twenty three, twenty four year old kid, right and granted,
• 2:00:31
  Speaker 3: you know, thirty four is the new twenty four, Right,
• 2:00:36
  Speaker 3: people were more I don't know, they were more what's
• 2:00:45
  Speaker 3: the word mature then? But yeah, I think he was
• 2:00:53
  Speaker 3: looking for something. I think he was having problems with
• 2:00:56
  Speaker 3: his marriage, and I think he fucked around and found
• 2:01:02
  Speaker 3: out f O F a f O as the gids
• 2:01:06
  Speaker 3: call it.
• 2:01:07
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, you know, the fact that he couldn't
• 2:01:09
  Speaker 5: find an ally in in the United States, right, Like,
• 2:01:16
  Speaker 5: it's hard to find somebody that of the same opinion
• 2:01:23
  Speaker 5: as you here in the United States in a.
• 2:01:25
  Speaker 3: Free country, especially southern Yes.
• 2:01:29
  Speaker 5: It's never experienced living in a communist country like he did, right.
• 2:01:35
  Speaker 5: You know, people can't just put their mind in that
• 2:01:37
  Speaker 5: way of life unless they've actually done it. Well, he
• 2:01:39
  Speaker 5: actually did it, and I think that's why he was
• 2:01:44
  Speaker 5: somewhat alienated in his thought.
• 2:01:46
  Speaker 9: And you know, as a.
• 2:01:48
  Speaker 5: Loner whatever you want to call him, I mean of
• 2:01:51
  Speaker 5: course he had the opportunity, he had the he had
• 2:01:54
  Speaker 5: the means and opportunity to make friends. He did in Russia,
• 2:01:59
  Speaker 5: he did in Dallas, Uh, you know with Michael Payne
• 2:02:03
  Speaker 5: and George and Mornshield and people like that. Wesley Frasier.
• 2:02:07
  Speaker 5: I mean, it wasn't like he was, you know, a
• 2:02:10
  Speaker 5: social retard if you will, But he was one of
• 2:02:15
  Speaker 5: these guys who had just weird ideas that were not
• 2:02:17
  Speaker 5: popular with other people because they couldn't understand where he
• 2:02:21
  Speaker 5: was coming from.
• 2:02:22
  Speaker 9: And I think that was a problem for him.
• 2:02:24
  Speaker 5: Nobody really understood him, you know, and trying to do
• 2:02:27
  Speaker 5: these things and and and be so politically ambitious and
• 2:02:32
  Speaker 5: involved and trying to change policies and all this when
• 2:02:37
  Speaker 5: you can't get any more than a lousy, shitty job,
• 2:02:43
  Speaker 5: you know, making minimum wage, and now you're toting around
• 2:02:48
  Speaker 5: your Russian wife and your two kids.
• 2:02:50
  Speaker 9: You know, it's it's hard to do, right.
• 2:02:55
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And uh, let's see here in am or two
• 2:03:00
  Speaker 3: before we sign off here, Sorry not agreeing, and you
• 2:03:04
  Speaker 3: don't have to agree. I implore you to listen to
• 2:03:09
  Speaker 3: his full radio interview and decide for yourself on if
• 2:03:14
  Speaker 3: he's genuine or not. I listened to it and I
• 2:03:19
  Speaker 3: decided sounds pretty fucking genuine to me.
• 2:03:22
  Speaker 9: Well, that's just my thoughts and my thoughts.
• 2:03:25
  Speaker 5: If it's a con, it's long. It's a long con
• 2:03:29
  Speaker 5: for somebody who barely finished eleventh grade and then went
• 2:03:33
  Speaker 5: immediately into the Marine Corps and you know, had in
• 2:03:38
  Speaker 5: his mind then at the tender age of seventeen, you
• 2:03:44
  Speaker 5: know that he wants to start studying Russian with the
• 2:03:46
  Speaker 5: eventual mentality that he wants to move to Russia and
• 2:03:52
  Speaker 5: then you know, come back. Because all this kind of
• 2:03:54
  Speaker 5: starts when he's it doesn't happen like he doesn't do
• 2:03:58
  Speaker 5: this as soon as he comes back from Russia, when
• 2:04:00
  Speaker 5: he comes back to like Fort Worth in Dallas right
• 2:04:04
  Speaker 5: in sixty two. You don't see this kind of interest
• 2:04:08
  Speaker 5: or activity in the Fair Play for Cuba Committee until
• 2:04:12
  Speaker 5: nineteen sixty three, and especially when he gets back to
• 2:04:16
  Speaker 5: New Orleans and he's around all these anti Castro Cuban
• 2:04:19
  Speaker 5: exiles and he sees, you know, what these guys are doing,
• 2:04:24
  Speaker 5: how many of it. You know, they're very prominent in
• 2:04:26
  Speaker 5: the community. Dallas is kind of more you know, southern
• 2:04:32
  Speaker 5: white people. You know, there were there were Cuban exiles there,
• 2:04:37
  Speaker 5: but they were more secretive in their communities than more
• 2:04:40
  Speaker 5: out in the open. Like I think that anti cast
• 2:04:44
  Speaker 5: Cuban exiles were very comfortable in New Orleans. It was
• 2:04:48
  Speaker 5: a comfortable atmosphere, like everybody was on the same page,
• 2:04:51
  Speaker 5: even white people. You know, you had Guy Banister and
• 2:04:54
  Speaker 5: all these other white people you know, interested in the cause,
• 2:04:58
  Speaker 5: you know, and and anticipating in these in these groups
• 2:05:02
  Speaker 5: against Cuba. So would he have went this far in
• 2:05:09
  Speaker 5: this whole fair play for Cuba thing if he hadn't
• 2:05:11
  Speaker 5: went back to New Orleans and in April, Joe, I
• 2:05:17
  Speaker 5: don't know, because that's when it really started up, writing
• 2:05:21
  Speaker 5: the VT le, getting his membership card, forming a branch,
• 2:05:26
  Speaker 5: you know, and all this stuff, right, and then eventually
• 2:05:32
  Speaker 5: into August with the fracas and the more letters and
• 2:05:35
  Speaker 5: this that and the other. And I think, you know, yeah,
• 2:05:40
  Speaker 5: he was building a legend for himself, But I don't
• 2:05:44
  Speaker 5: think he was building a legend to incriminate himself. I
• 2:05:50
  Speaker 5: think he was building a legend so he could do
• 2:05:53
  Speaker 5: what he did when he went to Mexico, which has
• 2:05:55
  Speaker 5: lay all this shit on the table and say look,
• 2:05:58
  Speaker 5: I'm trying to get to Cuba. I'm a Fidel Castro supporter.
• 2:06:02
  Speaker 5: This is everything I've done. I am a part of
• 2:06:05
  Speaker 5: the fair Play for Cuba committee. I've been arrested for,
• 2:06:10
  Speaker 5: you know, supporting Castro. Right, I've went on TV and
• 2:06:14
  Speaker 5: radio supporting Castro. This is all the things that I've done.
• 2:06:17
  Speaker 5: I need an immediate visa to Cuba, like right now.
• 2:06:21
  Speaker 5: And they were like, yeah, sorry, Bud, not good enough
• 2:06:26
  Speaker 5: to talk to the Ruskies over there. They got to
• 2:06:28
  Speaker 5: say okay, first.
• 2:06:29
  Speaker 3: Right, and Tiny said that he wasn't a kid. And
• 2:06:37
  Speaker 3: I'm not saying he was a kid. Listen, he had
• 2:06:41
  Speaker 3: two kids, he had traveled the world for what since
• 2:06:47
  Speaker 3: fifty nine when he joined the Marines or whatever.
• 2:06:52
  Speaker 5: I'm just saying he got out of the Marines. He
• 2:06:55
  Speaker 5: joined at seventeen.
• 2:07:00
  Speaker 3: Fifty seven, right, fifty six fifty six. But my point
• 2:07:06
  Speaker 3: being is that I think, as a younger individual, he
• 2:07:11
  Speaker 3: was searching for something, not that he wasn't a grown
• 2:07:18
  Speaker 3: ass man or whatever, you know what I mean, Like
• 2:07:21
  Speaker 3: he was searching for some type of asylum, you know,
• 2:07:27
  Speaker 3: some type of system that would that he could live
• 2:07:34
  Speaker 3: in and be happy with. I don't think he found
• 2:07:36
  Speaker 3: it in Russiana. I don't think he found it in Dallas.
• 2:07:39
  Speaker 3: I don't think he found it in New Orleans. And
• 2:07:44
  Speaker 3: I think he was like, well, maybe fuck it all,
• 2:07:48
  Speaker 3: try to Cuba.
• 2:07:50
  Speaker 5: I don't know.
• 2:07:53
  Speaker 3: Food for thought, food for thought.
• 2:07:57
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it's a very interesting food for thought for sure,
• 2:08:05
  Speaker 5: And I know it's a controversial hot take.
• 2:08:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but.
• 2:08:13
  Speaker 5: We're not alone in this thinking. You know, some very
• 2:08:17
  Speaker 5: smart folks are along the same lines and thinking here.
• 2:08:23
  Speaker 5: When you actually take a look at what he was doing,
• 2:08:27
  Speaker 5: there's no evidence whatsoever of the hidden hand of the
• 2:08:32
  Speaker 5: you know, of the CIA maneuver in this guy around.
• 2:08:37
  Speaker 5: That's what's missing, right. You know, you can throw a
• 2:08:40
  Speaker 5: bunch of names at the velcrow wall and see what sticks,
• 2:08:44
  Speaker 5: and you can assume all these nefarious CIA people like
• 2:08:49
  Speaker 5: Bill Harvey and David Morales and whoever, Joe and Need
• 2:08:53
  Speaker 5: he's you know, we're running this guy. And like I said,
• 2:08:56
  Speaker 5: you gotta remember they didn't need somebody like Oswald. They're
• 2:08:59
  Speaker 5: funding these anti Castro exiles, they have their groups, have handlers,
• 2:09:06
  Speaker 5: and the FBI had more informants than they knew what
• 2:09:09
  Speaker 5: to do with, more information than they knew what to
• 2:09:11
  Speaker 5: do with with all these groups, they didn't need somebody
• 2:09:14
  Speaker 5: like Oswald to infiltrate and pretend to be somebody who wasn't.
• 2:09:18
  Speaker 9: They just didn't need that.
• 2:09:21
  Speaker 5: And sure there was a false defective program, I get it.
• 2:09:26
  Speaker 5: You know, our CIA wanted to know what was going
• 2:09:28
  Speaker 5: on behind the Iron curtain. But you gotta, if we're
• 2:09:31
  Speaker 5: being honest, admit that there is some scuffozas who in there.
• 2:09:38
  Speaker 5: After the way Oswald grew up in that environment with
• 2:09:40
  Speaker 5: his overbearing fucking mother and being left alone all the
• 2:09:44
  Speaker 5: time and moved around from house to house and school
• 2:09:47
  Speaker 5: to school to school, no father, no father, it is
• 2:09:51
  Speaker 5: going to be searching for something different in his life,
• 2:09:56
  Speaker 5: you know, to get as far away from that bitch
• 2:09:57
  Speaker 5: as possible. You know, there had to be some legitimate
• 2:10:03
  Speaker 5: defectors who weren't always you know, it didn't always have
• 2:10:10
  Speaker 5: to be a CIA undercover mission, is what I'm saying, right, And.
• 2:10:15
  Speaker 3: It doesn't mean that his file wasn't used in some
• 2:10:19
  Speaker 3: ways by kind of intelligence or whatever.
• 2:10:23
  Speaker 5: Of Course, his name would have been flagged, of course,
• 2:10:26
  Speaker 5: you know he's acting weird. Of course they would create
• 2:10:29
  Speaker 5: reports about him. They could have even used him in
• 2:10:31
  Speaker 5: a mole hunt, you know, who knows. But it doesn't
• 2:10:35
  Speaker 5: mean he had to be a knowing widling participant in
• 2:10:38
  Speaker 5: some undercover false defector program. I mean, I know it's
• 2:10:45
  Speaker 5: not a popular sentiment, but you know, if you believe,
• 2:10:52
  Speaker 5: you know, look, and I've been up, down, left, right,
• 2:10:55
  Speaker 5: on every side of this argument in the past thirty
• 2:10:58
  Speaker 5: five forty years looking at this thing. Me too, I've
• 2:11:01
  Speaker 5: been a big believer, you know, nine ways from Sunday
• 2:11:04
  Speaker 5: about Oswald. And this is just where I'm at now
• 2:11:06
  Speaker 5: because nothing else really makes sense, right, It's always been
• 2:11:10
  Speaker 5: the popular du genie away of thinking. Now he's been
• 2:11:12
  Speaker 5: cheap dipped and you know all this and.
• 2:11:17
  Speaker 3: Right, everything goes back to the CIA and Dallas.
• 2:11:20
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it's been part of this canon for all these
• 2:11:23
  Speaker 5: years that you know what, if Oswald's a patsy and
• 2:11:26
  Speaker 5: Oswald wasn't shooting, then he had to be this and
• 2:11:29
  Speaker 5: he had to be that.
• 2:11:30
  Speaker 9: Well, not necessarily, you know, he could have just been
• 2:11:35
  Speaker 9: fucking Scafuza.
• 2:11:39
  Speaker 10: You know.
• 2:11:40
  Speaker 3: It's Opham's razor to me at this point, man. But yeah,
• 2:11:47
  Speaker 3: I agree with you. And like I said, Rob, if
• 2:11:54
  Speaker 3: you want to use that link, I set you in
• 2:11:56
  Speaker 3: the private chat of the David von Payne this thing
• 2:12:00
  Speaker 3: and link it to the description so people can listen
• 2:12:04
  Speaker 3: and decide for themselves. I think that'd be cool, because
• 2:12:07
  Speaker 3: the do does not come off as a fucking radical
• 2:12:11
  Speaker 3: at all, comes off as a very tempered individual.
• 2:12:18
  Speaker 9: He's very knowledgeable.
• 2:12:19
  Speaker 5: It doesn't sound like he's pretending or fishing for information.
• 2:12:23
  Speaker 3: Right, So listen to it for yourselves, ladies and gentlemen,
• 2:12:27
  Speaker 3: and make up your own minds. We're just giving you
• 2:12:30
  Speaker 3: our thoughts, as we like to do here on the
• 2:12:33
  Speaker 3: Lone Government.
• 2:12:34
  Speaker 5: You know, if Oswald was undercover and doing this and
• 2:12:37
  Speaker 5: doing that, they would have been paying this guy, right.
• 2:12:40
  Speaker 5: And there's absolutely no evidence in this guy any fucking
• 2:12:43
  Speaker 5: money whatsoever other than what little bit that he was
• 2:12:45
  Speaker 5: earning here there. He was so worried about the unemployment
• 2:12:48
  Speaker 5: commissioning and get his checks from there.
• 2:12:50
  Speaker 9: He's tight. He's a tight ass, you know what I mean.
• 2:12:54
  Speaker 5: Where is the evidence that he's some so called you know,
• 2:12:59
  Speaker 5: FBI and mormant or CIA operative.
• 2:13:02
  Speaker 9: I just don't see it monetarily for him.
• 2:13:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah. But and and like you said, my thoughts have
• 2:13:11
  Speaker 3: changed on this issue from when I first got into it, yeah,
• 2:13:15
  Speaker 3: to where I am now. And that's what it's all about.
• 2:13:19
  Speaker 3: It's all about the journey and keeping your mind open
• 2:13:21
  Speaker 3: and you know, not telling you what to think or anything, but.
• 2:13:27
  Speaker 5: Just be open minded about it because look, like I said,
• 2:13:30
  Speaker 5: at one time I could, I would have got Well,
• 2:13:32
  Speaker 5: I'm sure if you go back an older episode, I
• 2:13:34
  Speaker 5: was like, oh yeah, informed that S one seventy two,
• 2:13:38
  Speaker 5: you know, wagging her car. Uh, you know, FBI getting
• 2:13:43
  Speaker 5: paid two hundred dollars a month, blah blah blah blah blah. Well,
• 2:13:46
  Speaker 5: there's there's absolutely no real evidence of anything like that,
• 2:13:51
  Speaker 5: not concrete. The FBI weren't paying these informants like that.
• 2:13:57
  Speaker 5: If they were, it was meager, cash on the table
• 2:14:00
  Speaker 5: type of thing. And like I said, they wouldn't need to.
• 2:14:05
  Speaker 5: They wouldn't need to. They had a gazillion anti Castro
• 2:14:09
  Speaker 5: Cubans telling them themselves.
• 2:14:13
  Speaker 3: Every almost every anti Castro Cuban was an informant to
• 2:14:19
  Speaker 3: either CI.
• 2:14:22
  Speaker 9: Yeah, well, you know, the CIA was running all these.
• 2:14:26
  Speaker 3: Them.
• 2:14:27
  Speaker 5: They all had handlers, they were funding them. They knew
• 2:14:29
  Speaker 5: what they exactly, what they were doing exactly, So they
• 2:14:34
  Speaker 5: didn't need Oswald for their bullshit, you know what I mean?
• 2:14:38
  Speaker 16: Mm hmm.
• 2:14:40
  Speaker 5: And who the hell is he anyway? He's I mean,
• 2:14:42
  Speaker 5: he's not He's nobody special. So I'm just not buying
• 2:14:48
  Speaker 5: the fact that, you know, the long con theory of
• 2:14:55
  Speaker 5: Oswald as the operative.
• 2:14:59
  Speaker 9: Pay off for him.
• 2:14:59
  Speaker 5: He's he gets everywhere which way he turned, job wise, monetarily,
• 2:15:06
  Speaker 5: relationship or bastard. Can't get a leg up.
• 2:15:09
  Speaker 9: For anything anywhere he goes. Yeah, and the best he
• 2:15:15
  Speaker 9: had it was when he was in Russia.
• 2:15:17
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I should have stated in Minsk man and just
• 2:15:21
  Speaker 3: banged Russian batties.
• 2:15:25
  Speaker 9: Yeah, he said, knocking up Marina.
• 2:15:27
  Speaker 5: He's made a mistake, bro, But I think that's the
• 2:15:30
  Speaker 5: only thing that actually kept him in country longer than
• 2:15:33
  Speaker 5: what he would have been had he not been married
• 2:15:37
  Speaker 5: and had a kid to a Russian citizen. But you know,
• 2:15:42
  Speaker 5: I'm sure she was in his ear the whole time.
• 2:15:44
  Speaker 5: You Bill, you take me to America, You take me
• 2:15:47
  Speaker 5: to America. I want white picket fence.
• 2:15:48
  Speaker 9: I want to watch the machine.
• 2:15:50
  Speaker 5: I want to know.
• 2:15:53
  Speaker 9: I went to real shoes.
• 2:15:56
  Speaker 3: With It's true she wanted out as well. I think
• 2:16:01
  Speaker 3: that's well.
• 2:16:02
  Speaker 9: Documented, and I think you want it out, Joe.
• 2:16:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think you have a situation of two kind
• 2:16:09
  Speaker 3: of I don't want to call him misfits, but I
• 2:16:15
  Speaker 3: guess that's script word.
• 2:16:17
  Speaker 5: He wanted in. He wanted in really bad, and she
• 2:16:20
  Speaker 5: wanted out really bad, which is a bad combination.
• 2:16:24
  Speaker 3: Well, he wanted in that he wanted out.
• 2:16:27
  Speaker 9: He only want it out because she wanted out.
• 2:16:31
  Speaker 3: Oh, I think he was disillusioned as well.
• 2:16:34
  Speaker 9: Yes, he had it.
• 2:16:36
  Speaker 3: Right, but he didn't know that would have hindsight's twenty twenty.
• 2:16:42
  Speaker 3: He would not have known that that was the best
• 2:16:44
  Speaker 3: He had it right, or he would have had it
• 2:16:50
  Speaker 3: I guess that is my point.
• 2:16:51
  Speaker 5: But well, no, he couldn't have predicted how things would
• 2:16:54
  Speaker 5: go once he went home, right, But he didn't have
• 2:17:00
  Speaker 5: it bad over there. But Marina, you know it's clear.
• 2:17:04
  Speaker 5: I mean, look, Russia is a big country, right, and
• 2:17:08
  Speaker 5: if you're some nineteen year old pharmacy technician, honeypot or right,
• 2:17:17
  Speaker 5: you don't meet three American defectors, right date two of them,
• 2:17:25
  Speaker 5: have relations with two of or you know, have relations
• 2:17:28
  Speaker 5: with one of them. She met three, three American defectors,
• 2:17:33
  Speaker 5: they did, all three, had relations with two out of three,
• 2:17:37
  Speaker 5: carried one out of three. Yeah, so that happened organically
• 2:17:45
  Speaker 5: in a bubble folks.
• 2:17:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and then you got the allegations of her with
• 2:17:50
  Speaker 3: like what was it some like Afghan minister or something
• 2:17:54
  Speaker 3: like that. I don't know.
• 2:17:56
  Speaker 5: There's some rockan named Charlie who she was in love with.
• 2:18:01
  Speaker 5: It's it's a crazy story with Marina, you know, and
• 2:18:06
  Speaker 5: poor Oswald knocked her up.
• 2:18:10
  Speaker 3: You ever heard about pulling out bro.
• 2:18:17
  Speaker 5: There's too much vodka that night though it could not
• 2:18:22
  Speaker 5: she would not get off of me.
• 2:18:24
  Speaker 10: Y uh.
• 2:18:28
  Speaker 4: Well, I bomb had.
• 2:18:32
  Speaker 5: Bombs.
• 2:18:36
  Speaker 9: Oh, that was probably the first piece he had in
• 2:18:39
  Speaker 9: his life, allegedly.
• 2:18:43
  Speaker 3: I mean, I think he probably had a couple of
• 2:18:46
  Speaker 3: like minor flames in Russia. Right, he tried to propose
• 2:18:49
  Speaker 3: to the other girl. He might have smashed. He might
• 2:18:52
  Speaker 3: have not.
• 2:18:54
  Speaker 5: I doubt it, but.
• 2:18:58
  Speaker 3: It would have been very few.
• 2:19:00
  Speaker 5: David Ferry doesn't count in New Orleans.
• 2:19:05
  Speaker 3: All right, guys, is that is a tremendous ending rent
• 2:19:09
  Speaker 3: for this episode. Whether you agree or not, you know,
• 2:19:15
  Speaker 3: we'll we'll post that in the description hopefully, and you
• 2:19:20
  Speaker 3: decide for yourself. Because I didn't listen to it in
• 2:19:24
  Speaker 3: a long time, and it really.
• 2:19:28
  Speaker 5: I'll tell you, why were they trying to go back then?
• 2:19:31
  Speaker 5: Because things weren't working out here and they realized how
• 2:19:33
  Speaker 5: good they did have it in the Russia, Right, that's
• 2:19:36
  Speaker 5: why they were trying to go back.
• 2:19:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, do you do you know? People and
• 2:19:42
  Speaker 3: I've done this myself right back when I was younger.
• 2:19:49
  Speaker 3: Who's trying to change there? What's the word like situation
• 2:19:58
  Speaker 3: or their thoughts or their hopes based on geography. Well,
• 2:20:02
  Speaker 3: I'll move here, I'll be better, I'll go to Colorado
• 2:20:05
  Speaker 3: and things will be great. Now I'm gonna come back
• 2:20:08
  Speaker 3: because things have been great. Like it's kind of just
• 2:20:11
  Speaker 3: like human nature.
• 2:20:12
  Speaker 5: Yeah, you hear about, you know, growing up, you hear
• 2:20:14
  Speaker 5: about how cool California is. Right, That's where all the
• 2:20:17
  Speaker 5: hot tips are, all the hot guys, you know, your Hollywood.
• 2:20:20
  Speaker 3: You just see the movies.
• 2:20:23
  Speaker 5: Everybody wants to move to California, start a band, get laid,
• 2:20:26
  Speaker 5: you know whatever, for all the good drugs are you know,
• 2:20:31
  Speaker 5: you know you want to go to California, right, you know?
• 2:20:34
  Speaker 5: And some people do. They just they pack up and
• 2:20:36
  Speaker 5: they go with a dream to get in a band,
• 2:20:39
  Speaker 5: or to become an actress or an actor or whatever
• 2:20:42
  Speaker 5: the case may be. They get out there and realize,
• 2:20:48
  Speaker 5: you know, it's a lot harder to do than just
• 2:20:50
  Speaker 5: showing up in town as a pretty face with no
• 2:20:52
  Speaker 5: connections and trying to get into the industry without compromising
• 2:20:57
  Speaker 5: yourself and your integrity and your moral than everything else
• 2:21:01
  Speaker 5: involved in all of this, And some people get stuck there,
• 2:21:05
  Speaker 5: and some people are like, man, I really really want
• 2:21:09
  Speaker 5: to go back home, but bumbuck West Virginia where I
• 2:21:12
  Speaker 5: came from.
• 2:21:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and end up working at Starbucks, aulting less common.
• 2:21:21
  Speaker 5: Or becoming homeless, or be becoming prostitutes or moving home
• 2:21:26
  Speaker 5: yeah America or worse.
• 2:21:30
  Speaker 3: But like, everyone's always looking for something, And I think
• 2:21:33
  Speaker 3: this is kind of the trend of their relationship, and
• 2:21:36
  Speaker 3: specifically Lee's in regards to Cuba.
• 2:21:42
  Speaker 17: I don't know.
• 2:21:43
  Speaker 3: I just see it as more of a human issue
• 2:21:46
  Speaker 3: more than like a big conspiratorial intelligence appreciate operation.
• 2:21:55
  Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, all right, now we need you to move
• 2:21:58
  Speaker 5: you here, We need you to do do this. Now,
• 2:22:00
  Speaker 5: we need you to go here.
• 2:22:01
  Speaker 9: Now, you need to do this right right.
• 2:22:06
  Speaker 3: Now. I'm not saying he didn't have help getting into
• 2:22:08
  Speaker 3: Helsinki or figuring out that instant visa route or those
• 2:22:13
  Speaker 3: file wasn't used. But I'm saying for the most part
• 2:22:16
  Speaker 3: he was pretty much UNWI.
• 2:22:18
  Speaker 5: Or did he just get lucky with a dirty ass
• 2:22:21
  Speaker 5: Russian operative and he'll sinky who would do things on
• 2:22:26
  Speaker 5: the slide for a couple of extra bucks and expanate
• 2:22:29
  Speaker 5: the process for you.
• 2:22:31
  Speaker 3: Sure you know? All right, let me see if I
• 2:22:39
  Speaker 3: could grab the damn doggy here. I'm gonna mute myself
• 2:22:44
  Speaker 3: as I said.
• 2:22:46
  Speaker 5: All right, man, all right, that's it for another controversial
• 2:22:51
  Speaker 5: episode of podcast. You're glad you hung out with it
• 2:22:56
  Speaker 5: and uh up with it for this long.
• 2:22:59
  Speaker 9: We appreciate the hell out of you. You know, it's
• 2:23:01
  Speaker 9: Friday night.
• 2:23:02
  Speaker 5: We get out there, half the fun. Start the weekend,
• 2:23:04
  Speaker 5: right party, party, Have one for your boys, Have one
• 2:23:08
  Speaker 5: for Ruby. It's gonna get eaten this weekend by a tuskey.
• 2:23:14
  Speaker 5: Gonna come in with another couple of wounds. The next page, Like.
• 2:23:22
  Speaker 3: Father, like daughter. Right scars, Ruby.
• 2:23:25
  Speaker 9: Scars, Ruby scars.
• 2:23:29
  Speaker 5: All right, folks, that's it for us.
• 2:23:31
  Speaker 9: Slam the like bunting on your way out the door.
• 2:23:33
  Speaker 9: We'd appreciate it there and uh let it be heard
• 2:23:38
  Speaker 9: off through the world.
• 2:23:41
  Speaker 5: All the boys and girls. No USA, yes, allegedly America first.
• 2:23:51
  Speaker 5: I will be on next week with a c CCP Jersey.
• 2:24:00
  Speaker 5: All right, folks, we'll look out for quick hits in
• 2:24:03
  Speaker 5: the morning. Yeah, standard time, be on the lookout for
• 2:24:08
  Speaker 5: a random research random Rob. Be on the lookout for
• 2:24:11
  Speaker 5: another book review, and then we'll be back next Wednesday
• 2:24:14
  Speaker 5: for part two of this. Well, we're gonna get into
• 2:24:16
  Speaker 5: more fair play for Cuba fukery and some Harry Dean for.
• 2:24:21
  Speaker 3: You sounds good, buddy, and I will be listening to
• 2:24:25
  Speaker 3: Quick Hits on my drive up to the Caskills tomorrow morning.
• 2:24:29
  Speaker 5: So I'm looking for I've got a crazy story for
• 2:24:32
  Speaker 5: Quick Hits and it's got nothing to do with anti
• 2:24:34
  Speaker 5: cast Cuban exiles. So yeah, yeah, other skuffour that is
• 2:24:43
  Speaker 5: for sure, all right, folks. Well then we'll see you.
• 2:24:47
  Speaker 3: We love you, Thank you for thank you,