Latest / Muppet Fan Podcasts with ToughPigs.com / Fraggle Talk Episode 4: "The Glow" with Dave Goelz ("Boober")

Transcript

Fraggle Talk Episode 4: "The Glow" with Dave Goelz ("Boober") · Muppet Fan Podcasts with ToughPigs.com

0:17
Hello and welcome to fraggle, talk.
0:20
The Unofficial Fraggle, Rock podcast brought to you by tough
0:23
pics.com. This is the podcast where we
0:25
cover Fraggle, Rock back to the Rock Episode by episode along
0:28
with the town's of producers. Performers, writers and
0:30
Builders, who helped put it together.
0:32
I'm your host. Silly creature Johannes.
0:35
Today, we're talking about episode for the glow in which
0:39
boobers tale begins to light up and he has a proper boober style
0:42
freak out today. We are chatting with a muppet
0:45
performer who needs no introduction, but we're going to
0:47
try to give him one anyhow, you know him as the performer behind
0:51
Gonzo's Zoot and Bunsen Honeydew over the Muppets.
0:54
But he originated Fraggle, Rock characters like boober
0:57
traveling. Matt and the world's oldest
0:59
Fraggle. All and several more, we are
1:02
extremely excited to welcome the great Dave goals to the podcast.
1:06
Hello, Dave. Hi, it's nice to talk to a
1:10
fellow silly creature. Yes, it's not often that a silly
1:14
creatures get together over over, zoom over podcasts.
1:18
It's true. It's true.
1:20
So Dave you're back. You're back on, Fraggle Rock,
1:23
that's pretty exciting. It's unbelievably exciting for
1:27
me. I am so thrilled to be a part of
1:29
it. It, I was, I knew the show was
1:33
developing and I didn't know, I had no idea what were they were
1:37
really interested in having to be a part of it, but they
1:40
brought in me and also caring / L as Co EPs.
1:44
And so we got to be a part of the whole process of everything.
1:48
You know, the the writing, every draft, every puppet, every
1:53
hairdo, every costume and was a lot of work, but it was really,
1:58
really great to see the team. That they pulled together this
2:01
new group is right on this right on the correct page, you know
2:06
they are all dedicated. I think I think many of them are
2:10
not most had Fraggle Rock in their childhood and they are
2:14
just thrilled to be a part of it.
2:16
And so everybody is protective of what it is, which is a great
2:23
thing to have on a production. Absolutely, it must be difficult
2:27
to work with people who Weren't necessarily a part of the
2:31
original production but they have an idea as fans of what
2:35
they think Fraggle Rock should be.
2:37
Is that, is that something that you ever came up against?
2:41
I have run into it more on The Muppet Show side.
2:45
Mmm. Yeah, sure.
2:46
A lot of times somebody will love the show and they'll think,
2:49
well, I love it. I can ride it and then it turns
2:52
out that they can't you know they don't know enough or they
2:55
don't fully appreciate the ethos of it.
2:58
But on this Project. I was amazed at how quickly
3:02
everybody got on the same page, you know, we also had Jocelyn
3:06
Stevenson involved in the, in the writers room for three
3:08
weeks. So she, of course, had a huge
3:11
part in the original show, one of the actual formulators of the
3:15
show, one of the creators of the show, and that was a great
3:19
asset, you know, to have her around.
3:22
But everybody was interested. They all just wanted to protect
3:25
it and nurture it and grow it, you know?
3:27
So it was a fantastic group. Who could be involved with
3:31
really was? That's terrific.
3:32
Yeah, I love that and to have, you know, some of your
3:35
colleagues from the original Fraggle Rock there as well.
3:38
Must have been just a tree time. Even feel like you were alone,
3:41
kind of carrying the whole the whole ship from from the the
3:44
original days. No, it was really nice to be
3:48
around. Karen and Joseline and also, one
3:51
of the puppeteers who joined us in the last, I think was the
3:54
last season of the original Fraggle.
3:55
Rock was a guy, a Canadian guy named Frank mesh Collider And in
4:00
this in this series Frank performed three of my characters
4:04
on the set while I stayed home and watched covid go by, right.
4:10
He's a wonderful collaborator. Just a great guy and because we
4:15
knew each other a long time ago and had had, I think really, no
4:19
contacted between. But ironically, we did a show in
4:24
Germany called The Secret Life of toys.
4:28
I think it was called for Sure. Yeah, yeah.
4:31
It was really, really a fun thing to work on and there was a
4:36
woman working as one of the Wranglers on the set one of the
4:39
Muppet Wranglers, but she was German and she wound up.
4:42
Marrying marrying. Frank.
4:46
Oh really? Yeah.
4:48
And so that's a really exciting happy ending.
4:50
So she lives in Toronto with him now.
4:53
And Dina is her name and so she was wrangling on this show as
4:59
well. I didn't Studio.
5:01
But gosh, it was just this wonderful home coming from that
5:06
little group to because I was funny because I remember her,
5:09
even though she wasn't actually a part of our company.
5:12
At the time, we worked in Germany, the 1993 on Student
5:17
Life toys. And I just remember her because
5:20
she was so good. She was such a great person to
5:25
have around the studio, and so helpful, and so dedicated.
5:28
And then to find out, Out that somehow the two of them match,
5:32
he met Frank mesh collider, and they, and now they're married
5:34
with think it's one child. It's amazing.
5:39
So it's amazing how small the that puppetry Community really
5:43
is in the end. You know what I mean?
5:45
Constantly amazes me. Yes, the way we constantly
5:49
around each other is is so weird because we all live in different
5:53
places and then when we come together do something it's a
5:57
it's sort of a sort of a grab It's a surprise to see.
6:01
Oh, who's working on this? Who are these other performers
6:04
that have worked with before? And who is who are these
6:07
Wranglers and workshop, guys? You know, it's because we love
6:10
them and they're the best in the world, you know, it's always
6:13
great to see who's going to be on a project.
6:16
Yeah, we have a lot of people who work back at in New York and
6:20
New Jersey, and, you know, we'd go to shoot something.
6:23
We don't know, which one's of them are coming out.
6:26
So it's always a wonderful reunions and a wonderful
6:29
surprise. Prize all of that and talk about
6:31
reunions. I mean this new Fraggle Rock is
6:33
just a huge huge reunions and itself.
6:36
So you you mentioned you were a co-executive producer on the
6:39
show and even before anyone set foot on the set, there was a lot
6:45
of work to be done. I know you kind of alluded to
6:48
this but I'd love to know a little bit more about what kind
6:50
of prep work you ended up being responsible for?
6:54
Well, there were seven producers, including Lisa
6:59
Henson. Ali.
7:00
Stanford, John, oh, what's his name?
7:05
John tartaglia and Karen and myself.
7:10
I think that's seven. And so we were involved in in
7:13
reviewing everything that went on the show, everything, you
7:17
know, including the sets and the doozerdom vehicles.
7:21
And you know as those things were all being created, it was
7:23
an interesting vantage point for me because I usually, I'm just
7:27
concerned with whatever characters I'm doing and Getting
7:30
in and getting those done, and giving them an ark for each
7:32
episode and so forth. This was kind of a macro view of
7:36
the whole thing that was really, really interesting.
7:40
It's that is really interesting, especially, because your, you of
7:43
all of all the people that you just mentioned are coming out
7:45
from so many different directions because you are a
7:48
performer on the original series, it wasn't like Karen.
7:52
Pearl was also such a huge fan of the series.
7:55
I think that she comes at it from a direction that maybe I,
7:58
someone like me would be thinking of the show, but you
8:01
probably had a more of a, that's true.
8:04
But yeah. You probably more like a
8:05
technical I and, you know, a different type of Of creative
8:09
ights, kind of Lent to those decisions.
8:12
So that your I think everybody has their own Windows, you know,
8:15
we all have things that were looking through.
8:19
Yeah, because I started at The Muppets working in the workshop,
8:21
so I had that experience of Designing and building
8:25
characters and making them and building some mechanisms and so
8:29
forth. So, you know, I'm familiar with
8:32
that side of it and then as a performer I get a lot of.
8:37
Well, in fact, I did a lot of work with the writers.
8:39
Original like, whenever they had an open-door policy and whenever
8:43
one of our characters was involved, the performers were
8:46
invited to come in and join the meetings and help shape the show
8:50
and they welcomed our input. It was a really wonderful
8:55
welcoming environment, very warm.
8:58
And and of course, I think that well, I don't, I didn't work
9:03
exactly the same way this time because because it's all
9:06
organized from at a distance. But if we were all in the same
9:10
place, I'm sure the performers would be welcome to come.
9:13
See the writers and hang out and figure out.
9:15
Yeah. Additional business for their
9:17
characters for sure. Yeah.
9:21
Was there ever a time while you were planning all of these
9:25
various details where you kind of said, like the thing that you
9:28
guys want to do it? Really, really doesn't work or
9:32
it really wasn't how we would have done it back in the day or
9:34
or something where you felt strongly enough to, to argue the
9:37
point. Yeah, sure, sure.
9:40
Because even on the original show there was a lot of it was
9:43
fairly contentious, you know, we were all had opinions about it
9:47
and I think it's just the nature of getting creative people
9:50
together and working together, that Collision of people, is
9:56
what really makes things better and the philosophy that Larry
9:59
Merkin. The original producer had on the
10:01
title was with the, we're all working in service of the best
10:05
idea. Yes.
10:06
And, you know, if you really have that spirit But no matter
10:10
how good your idea is, somebody has something that's better,
10:14
it's kind of clear. You know, you can't defend your
10:18
original idea, you just have to say, you know what, that's
10:21
better. Let's do that.
10:22
And yeah, as a result and this apply to everybody in the room,
10:27
you know, Joe everybody in the room was treated the same way.
10:31
So any employee who was in on that set, felt comfortable going
10:36
to gym and suggesting something. Jim would always stop and talk
10:40
with him and consider it and he would decide whether to use the
10:44
idea or not but they knew they were a part of it.
10:47
Everybody in the room knew they were a part of it and boy that
10:51
just that made all the difference people remained,
10:55
dedicated to this show. I mean Pat Hamilton who was our
10:58
editor on the original series flew to New York for a reunions.
11:02
You know, the Henson company had events and Legacy had back in
11:06
the garden when it was A while back.
11:10
But you know that's how connected people are.
11:13
We literally had a reunions and ex-employees from London to
11:19
Canada Los Angeles. They all, they all came.
11:23
It was remarkable, you know? Yeah.
11:25
It was a bond that forms when you get to work that way.
11:28
Yeah, yeah that's terrific. And it definitely seems like
11:33
this cast and crew. For the new series is bonding
11:37
along the same lines because See you can really see how everyone
11:41
is, just kind of working well together.
11:43
This well-oiled machine to make such a great show.
11:48
It's funny because there are, you know, sometimes performers
11:51
have meshing chemistry like two performers as well.
11:55
Just find that they can work really easily together with is
11:57
by talking and shorthand and working out business for teens.
12:01
And whereas, in the original show, a boober and Wembley had
12:04
that because Steve and I were rarely on the same wavelength,
12:07
when we work, But on this show, John tartaglia had it with
12:13
Jordan Lockhart, who's doing willing?
12:14
So this time Gobo and Wembley, you're a little closer, but
12:18
these are things, you might not notice as a viewer there, just
12:22
based on you know, how everybody, how everybody
12:25
cooperates. Although you say that and this
12:28
episode in particular has a terrific boober and Wembley
12:31
pairing, which we could just jump right in and start talking
12:35
about this episode and about it a little bit.
12:38
Let's see. See what happens if we just talk
12:40
about the glow. This episode starts with the
12:43
fraggle five, playing a game called pop and pop which is like
12:46
a ball passing game but it's actually not the fraggle five.
12:50
It's the fraggle for because boober is missing.
12:53
He is in his cave steaming laundry with hot coals which
12:56
actually I really love that visual.
12:57
We've seen boober. Do his laundry on the old show
13:00
so many times, but this is usually just hanging laundry and
13:04
probably a barrel filled with with, so, Of suds.
13:09
But here we see him. Actually take a hot coal and
13:12
hold it underneath the clothing. To get the wrinkles out.
13:16
You can't stop technology. Yeah.
13:22
True Wembley notices, that boobers tail has begun to glow
13:27
and naturally boober panics. As I think any of us would have
13:30
a piece of our body would begin to Glow.
13:34
Although Wembley thinks it's pretty cool and boober forces
13:38
Wembley to not tell anyone. So now when we as to keep this
13:41
secret which as we all know, he's pretty good at keeping
13:43
secrets. Very, very cool and calm about
13:47
the whole thing. How did they do the the glowing
13:51
belubius to do? Have a remember that?
13:54
Well, yeah, it was LEDs place in the belubius of the tail and
14:00
just attached to a battery. I believe I wasn't there for the
14:03
shoot. I should clarify for you clarify
14:05
for you for your listeners. That because of covid.
14:09
I stayed home in the Bay Area, California and to duck.
14:15
Go to Calgary to shoot the show. So that's that's where Frank
14:19
measure light came in and he performed three of my characters
14:22
and the other three were performed to completely by other
14:26
people. But in the case of the ones,
14:28
Frank did I replaced voice after work?
14:32
So he would do is he would do the whole performance and then I
14:35
would replace the voice. But the other three characters I
14:37
sort of, I guess gave away, because there was going to be so
14:41
much overlap in the audio dialogue that To be hard to hard
14:46
to re-record, everything, you know, to replace me, it would
14:49
have required. A whole bunch of other people
14:51
coming in, who were in the scene and redo their voices.
14:55
So it was kind of a daunting Prospect.
14:57
So let's, let's talk about a little bit more, so your
15:02
characters specifically with like boober world's oldest, you
15:07
know, the like there's so much that feels like there's fun
15:11
ad-libbing going on. Was that all Frank?
15:14
And then you just came Afterward or were you like on the phone
15:17
with him saying, like, it'll be funny is if he kind of had this
15:19
little reaction something that well, I, you know, I got we I
15:24
had a way to to connect to the production could go like,
15:29
essentially a zoom call with a wide shot of what was going on
15:32
in the studio and so I could watch and see how things were
15:36
going. But what happened early on is
15:38
that I would I would check in. And, of course, nothing be going
15:41
on because usually usually nothing's going on and then all
15:44
the same. You record something.
15:46
So it would have met me sitting and watching the screen for 12
15:49
hours a day. And so what I did, I would I
15:52
would check in, I would get a sense of how close they were to
15:55
shooting and I would check back later.
15:58
And, and then Tim O'Brien, our producer associate producer
16:02
called me after a while. He said, you know, we have, we
16:06
get cars every time you log in to the studio and so you logging
16:12
in five times a day. I said, oh I did.
16:15
Know that I thought it was just an open line.
16:18
So as a result, I ended up logging in less and so Frank was
16:24
Frank was kind of on his own. We talked, we had conversations
16:27
ahead of time about some of the shows and where the characters
16:31
are coming from but we got varying results.
16:35
You know I mean he did an amazing job with traveling Matt
16:39
and the world's oldest was good but boober was I had a hard time
16:46
doing the voice-over again. You know I do but that's not the
16:49
additional dialogue recording. That's a Dr. What that's called?
16:52
I just because the rhythm is were different and he was I
16:57
wanted to play more emotions, more oscillation between fear
17:02
and confidence, which yeah, part of Hoover's reality.
17:06
So even within a single speech, he might be afraid and then
17:09
confident for a second and terrified again.
17:11
So I was looking for more of that Dimension and We
17:16
unfortunately, it all got recorded and I did the best I
17:19
could with the dialogue and then we got Frank gone for one of the
17:22
Ada, our sessions. So he could see that next year,
17:26
we have to find a way to keep closer eye on boober.
17:29
If I don't go there, you know, right?
17:31
When I go there then I'll do it myself but so it's that kind of
17:38
process but you know from there couldn't be a better
17:40
collaborative than Frank, he's just fantastic.
17:43
And I'm confident that if we have to do that again it'll work
17:48
out. Yeah he did an incredible job.
17:51
It was it was pretty is pretty close to seamless for as you
17:55
know, as close as we could potentially get with something
17:57
like that. What kind of tips did you give
18:00
him before? Performing that may have helped
18:04
him, we'll talk specifically about boober but you know,
18:08
something about your puppetry style or like, well boober would
18:10
do this with his hands or not that or any tips like that.
18:15
Well, it's funnily enough. I usually play boober
18:19
emotionally, I play him. I don't do a lot of fancy stuff
18:23
with his hands but Frank actually did.
18:25
He had an assistant working with him all the time and so they
18:30
they did more elaborate hand stuff than I than I usually do.
18:34
I usually am focused on trying to make that internal dance
18:38
work. You know where he's afraid and
18:40
he's confident in his afraid and he's confident that kind of
18:43
thing. Or he's suspicious or he's
18:47
fearful, you know, he's got all these emotions that happen, the
18:50
hands only added, you know, all the handwork that Frank did just
18:54
added into all that. But like one thing that happened
18:57
was a Frank talked faster than I can talk in boobers voice.
19:01
No way back here. And it's like hard to get her to
19:05
talk fast. And so I was having trouble
19:07
keeping up with the pace of the lines.
19:10
So we finally figured out near the end of all my ADR work.
19:15
We will communicate more closely if we do it again and and we
19:20
will plan those things in advance with more closely,
19:24
right? You know it I can't complain.
19:27
It worked. It worked amazingly?
19:28
Well yeah yeah I completely agree.
19:31
Yeah. So our next scene features Dock
19:34
and sprockets, she's concerned about picking up stuff on the
19:40
beach and she gets a package for go Bo, she has a moment.
19:45
That's pretty funny where she says, what if I'm Gobo like?
19:49
It's a nickname. Like, someone's sending her
19:51
sending her mail to the nickname that she has.
19:54
Not yet received inside the package, is a plastic bottle and
19:59
who sent it. It was Uncle traveling Matt's
20:02
and we get this episode's traveling, Matt, segments this
20:06
one, he's on the beach and the way he describes it as he says,
20:10
not to bog you down with scientific jargon.
20:12
But it's where hard stuff meets wet stuff?
20:15
It's pretty good. It's pretty funny.
20:18
I mean, it was interesting. We were talking about artifacts
20:23
to send back and I went up to our master bathroom and I
20:27
brought down my soap dispenser. This is on the meeting.
20:30
I've had on, I have this soap dispenser, there's a brand of
20:34
clear hand soap that you can buy big bottles up.
20:38
And I got this thing when we move to our house which was like
20:42
1994 1995. 5:00 somewhere in there.
20:45
I got this little bottle of this particular slope and that at
20:48
Costco. I found the replace the so you
20:50
don't have to replace involved. Well, yeah, I have that bottle.
20:54
It goes with our house. It's a plastic bottle.
20:56
It won't break. I won't break it, and then cut
20:59
my foot in the bathroom. So I love that thing.
21:02
And I brought it to the meeting and I just said, this is part of
21:06
my Decor, it's actually fits the architecture of our house.
21:10
I I think it's amazing. I mean, 100 years ago, if you
21:15
handed somebody a plastic bottle, they would be in awe,
21:18
would become a family heirloom because, ya know, they had glass
21:22
but they had nothing, that was squishy that you could see
21:24
through. I just thought that was
21:27
fascinating and I think that's how it wound up being a plastic
21:31
bottle that he sent back. Because obviously, was also a
21:33
plastic in the oceans microplastics, right?
21:36
And and but then the curse from the fraggles perspective, I'm
21:41
not sure they have glass in there so it may not have been
21:46
quite as remarkable to them as it would be to us and silly
21:49
creatures. You know?
21:51
Well, it definitely was still remarkable to them.
21:53
They want to put it in a museum so yeah whether it whether they
21:56
have glass or not. Yeah.
21:58
And I thought a very clever touch was that Matt thought it
22:01
was a place to put Secrets? Yeah.
22:03
So he, you know, he put, He said, I'm afraid of my mustache
22:07
and he's filled in the bottle and then later on in the show,
22:10
they opened the The words came out.
22:13
I love that really for so many reasons, the fact that he's
22:17
afraid of his mustache and yet, he's kept it for so very long.
22:21
I know, I know he sleeps with it.
22:23
God crazy. He's just he's very good at
22:27
facing his fears on his face. His fears on his face.
22:31
Yes. Well, he nicknames that the
22:34
Bizzle because, of course, he has to name everything and
22:38
there's a another funny moment in this scene where He someone
22:43
like a maintenance person takes the the bottle away from him and
22:46
he thinks it has disappeared. And so he says like, of course,
22:49
you know, didn't frighten me at all and then immediately we see
22:52
him on his knees sobbing uncontrollably.
22:56
Well, this is, this is, you know, I you probably know this
22:59
already but traveling Matt was hard to do in the beginning
23:02
because he just misperceived the things his way back in the 80s.
23:06
Yeah, I would go out to shoot with these remotes and humans
23:09
didn't notice him. So there was nobody to Cliff.
23:12
And, you know, I learned really quickly that it's great to have
23:17
two characters in order to build character.
23:20
And it really is important because then you start to have
23:23
to conflicts and starts to get interesting, but out there, I
23:26
had no, I was all by himself and he was just misunderstanding
23:29
things and it was an intellectual flaw and so just
23:33
because I wanted to try to make them funnier, I started having
23:37
him be clumsy, so he had a physical flaw that he would,
23:41
didn't look where he was going and he was always stumbling and
23:43
falling. And and then as I got into that,
23:47
I thought well, what other kinds of flaws are, there are
23:50
Emotional flaws and it's so I thought, well, how can I use the
23:54
arrogance here? Yeah, his natural.
23:58
Arrogance, and obliviousness. And that's when I originally had
24:03
the idea and I took it to Jerry juhl saying, well, I think that
24:07
in his postcard, he would brag about an accomplishment.
24:10
But in our view of him, we can see what actually happened.
24:15
So we actually see that his, his little Adventure was a disaster.
24:20
Her even though what Gobo thinks is that it was successful.
24:24
So the voiceover for the postcard had to be very
24:27
positive, and the picture had to be very negative anyway, now I
24:32
had a character, right? So I'm out there, right?
24:34
Misunderstanding and misrepresenting, and in falling
24:38
over things and I had more fun with it.
24:40
And it was funnier. And then they rode him.
24:43
Coming back to the mat into the Rock in 22 episodes that we had
24:47
in the original series and that was the most fun of all.
24:50
Because of course, Global revered, his uncle and it was
24:56
one of those awkward things, like when you're a kid and your
24:58
parent, you're embarrassed by your parent.
25:01
Well Matt would come back and he would do something colossally
25:04
stupid and red of course right through it and she was just on
25:08
Gobo like that saying. Oh yeah, some Explorer he is and
25:12
it was just, it was so much fun because it all that building of
25:16
character out there paid off when he came back.
25:19
So we try to incorporate all that stuff in this one and you
25:24
know, it's hard to write that way.
25:26
It's very hard to write on. What is it?
25:28
Like three levels at once again, for sure.
25:30
Yeah, figure out. But it's, you know, it's you're
25:33
saying one thing and doing another and and in the meanwhile
25:36
we're seeing stuff that the character isn't even aware of
25:40
it. So it's very multi-level.
25:42
Hard to write those Maps. Very hard but we have a good
25:45
one. Absolutely.
25:47
I had some some of my favorite Fraggle Rock moments are all old
25:50
traveling Matt postcards and and hopefully maybe season 2 you
25:55
guys will get them back into back into the Rock for an
25:57
episode or two which would be sort of a good homecoming for
26:00
you as well. To be back on set that would be
26:03
great fun. I mean I just love having met on
26:06
the Rock. Matt Gobo and red are just so
26:09
much fun to do together, it's a great combination, I adore, Reds
26:14
disdain for traveling Matt's but I think that You know, and
26:31
it's true. It's true.
26:32
And red was kind of right about the whole thing.
26:35
Like, he's, I just looked like that was something I think we
26:43
all experience. Yes.
26:46
Come pick me up a Bono. I hope they don't get out of
26:49
this day. You know, not just through
26:51
puberty like I still am very embarrassed by my parents.
26:56
That's that's maybe a topic for another podcast.
26:59
Well in our in our therapy session well yes Lon break, that
27:03
one open. So Matt wants Gobo to start a
27:08
museum being called something understated, like the uncle
27:11
traveling, Matt Museum, her a uncle traveling, Matt, I like
27:15
that a lot. And it turns out Matt is also
27:18
selling postcards to other fraggles, which I never knew
27:21
because the he says, he's also sent one to the archivist and
27:26
invited the archivist to come and help Christian this new
27:28
Museum. It's a new thing.
27:31
I think he has a long-lost love for the archivist.
27:35
Is something that we didn't know about.
27:37
I mean, there we did. Have we did have cross currents
27:40
in the original episode 2 of the Storyteller.
27:43
Was in love with Matt and the original, right?
27:45
Yeah, you know. Terry Angus was doing this story
27:48
teller and she would just Swoon when he came in because he just
27:52
idolized so much. There's no standards.
27:56
It's all, you know, there's there's a pot for every lid.
27:59
Yeah, yeah. We got our first glimpse of the
28:03
archivist here. She's kind of flowing through
28:05
the gorgs garden past the trash Heap.
28:08
I do want to mention the Trashy very quickly because this is the
28:11
only glimpse of her that we get in this episode because you were
28:15
the original file. Whoa, right.
28:17
Not gonna do or Philo, right? Milo hard to remember which
28:19
ones, which? Yeah, he first Inc.
28:22
P fiber. P4, pink, and G4 gray.
28:24
Well, she is also goals, which doesn't go with your pee for
28:28
like you should have played gunge to keep that that mnemonic
28:32
device in my or in my head but that doesn't work so well.
28:34
Yeah. You've got to go easier on
28:36
yourself. Yeah.
28:37
Right. So as you said you did not
28:41
perform file oh you did not reprise your your performances
28:44
Philo for this production. Was that mainly just because of
28:48
all the ad-libbing and all of the like the natural
28:51
performances that need to come out with those characters?
28:54
Yeah yeah yeah. Just gives you less Freedom when
28:57
you're shooting as makes post-production harder.
29:00
Yeah, I loves me follow. No, I mean I I've said it before
29:05
you may have heard of before but when, when we were figuring out
29:09
what to do for following guns, we were rehearsing in New York
29:12
before going to Toronto to shoot the show.
29:15
Richard came in with his car. Kind of Jersey voice because
29:18
Richard was raised in New Jersey and, and the, in this kind of
29:23
little wise guy attitude. Anyway.
29:24
Yeah. And I just thought he's got it.
29:27
I'm copying. I just did I just try to do the
29:32
same thing? And so we just became too.
29:35
Little Jersey. Guys who were chilling for the
29:37
Trashy? Yeah, I love it.
29:40
I love those guys. I mean, I'm sad that you are not
29:42
a part of it now, but of course like it too.
29:46
Keep that Cadence and that relationship as funny as it as
29:51
it is. I guess that was.
29:53
It was always fun. It's really fun to do those
29:55
guys. I loved it.
29:57
Yeah. Did you have any advice for who
29:59
does that? Is that Dan Gars?
30:02
Maybe what is this? Yeah, right.
30:11
Yes. And Dan's a great guy.
30:13
He just brings so much heart to Junior gorg.
30:16
I mean I'm segueing off of Philo and gunge because when I think
30:21
of Dan, I think how did he manage to do it?
30:24
He's got yeah, it's a Richard hunts affection for the
30:27
character, you know, and Richard face Junior gorg on a guy that
30:32
we all knew who was connected with the Muppets and Richard
30:37
just always thought of that guy. When you did Junior, And I won't
30:41
say the name because it, you know, out of respect for the
30:45
guy. He might he might not want to be
30:47
Associated but right but he's a wonderful guy.
30:50
Is a guy that we all loved and Richard just thought that's that
30:55
to Junior gorg is doing that character and has really gotten
31:00
so close to the spirit of what Richard was doing, but I just
31:04
love it. Yeah, he does a fantastic job
31:07
and he's doing a great job is phyllo as well.
31:10
At least it's a it was a good choice for a recast we interrupt
31:15
this podcast for a special postcard from our uncle
31:18
traveling, John's Heart A glia and A fraggle fast fact.
31:23
Today's fraggle fast fact is traveling Matt really does
31:26
travel yes we decided very quickly that we wanted Uncle
31:30
traveling Matt to continue his adventures in outer space and
31:33
send him back out into our world just because Much has changed
31:37
since the 80s and there were new adventures for him to have but
31:39
also because it's one of the most beloved parts of the
31:41
original series and it was so much fun thinking about what can
31:45
we do with Uncle traveling Matt? And you know we were inside of a
31:49
Sound Stage for the majority of our time filming a back to the
31:52
rock. It gave several of our crew and
31:56
our puppet Wranglers and and traveling that the chance to
31:59
leave the soundstage and go out and find Adventures.
32:01
Not only in Calgary where we shot back to the Rock but also
32:05
in Los Angeles. This we shot in both places and
32:08
we would have taken him beyond that, but of course, we were
32:10
filming during the pandemic. So we were a bit Limited in what
32:13
we could do with international travel and getting Matt around
32:16
the world. I still have dreams for for, you
32:19
know, future episodes where Uncle traveling Matt literally
32:21
goes up into space or, you know, is under under the ocean and the
32:24
submarine wouldn't that be incredible?
32:26
But it was so much fun to think about all the wacky physical
32:29
Adventures. He could be on shooting at the
32:32
ice skating rink in Calgary and the dog park and then here in
32:35
Los Angeles. Us.
32:36
We shot him in the beach and in the park with the bubbles.
32:40
And then, of course, with the Foo Fighters who, by the way,
32:43
are huge Fraggle, Rock Fans. And I think we're just as
32:46
excited to see, Uncle traveling Matt, as we all were to see the
32:49
Foo Fighters. But what's really cool is when
32:51
you take a puppet out in the real world, especially a puppet
32:54
as beloved as Uncle traveling, Matt watching everyone's
32:57
reactions and there was so much love and it was so much fun and
33:01
we hope you enjoyed all those segments.
33:02
Alright, back to the podcast. So the fraggles are trying to
33:10
figure out where they want to put this new Museum.
33:13
Read first suggest the cave of everlasting darkness and we get
33:16
one of those classic Muppet moments where it's completely
33:19
blank screen. You just see their eyes.
33:22
Yeah, I love it. And of course boobers there but
33:25
we don't see him because you don't see his eyes ever.
33:29
That would've been interesting. If the lights go out and
33:30
suddenly we were his eyes wouldn't.
33:36
Oh yeah. With the cap was just like A
33:38
mesh maybe yeah just what it is. It's a knit cap you could put a
33:43
couple of slots in there maybe you'd have it now there you go,
33:47
maybe season 2, they suggest sticky for caves to key.
33:52
For cave is too sticky, boober suggest Rock shelf cave and
33:56
which makes a lot of sense because shelves, you need that
33:58
for a museum. And it's this beautiful set with
34:01
these big like cylindrical stalagmites hanging from the
34:05
ceiling and it's just I I'm always just blown away by the
34:10
set design on this show. The fact that everything is
34:13
practical and real not not just computer animated Yeah, I would
34:18
I would go back to what you said about the caves that they tried
34:22
to set the museum in because they were really great puppetry
34:26
ideas and this is where it shows that the writers are really
34:30
understanding the power of puppetry that you have a place
34:35
that's dark. And so, you just have the eyes
34:37
and that's a kind of a funny, little bit that you can do more,
34:40
you really, with puppets and you couldn't give people.
34:43
And then the sticky floor one. Is it a great mime kind of
34:46
Sighs. And it's just, it's absolutely
34:51
it really enhances things when the writers understand that this
34:54
is puppetry and we it has its strengths and that's one of
34:58
them. No that's just to show these
35:00
environments. Absolutely.
35:02
Yeah and a way to do it cheaply which is also a nice thing that
35:08
true puppets can do some really impressive things that don't
35:11
actually cost you know a ton of money to like put up the right
35:14
rig and get the Other stuff going on in the background and
35:18
whatever, just just cool puppetry tricks, it's all takes.
35:22
Oh, yeah, I mean II know, we're talking about the new show, but
35:25
back one episode of the old show and boober met his alter ego,
35:29
who was uninhibited inside bottom.
35:34
Sidebottom made boober dress up as an old gypsy lady.
35:38
Yeah. And so I was thinking about how
35:42
can I make this funnier? And I said, well what could she
35:44
have a peg leg? And so she did.
35:47
She got a foot and a peg leg. So we were getting close to
35:51
shooting and then I thought well, what if the what wonderful
35:55
egg that has the foot on? It has a squeeky shoe.
35:58
And so the sound guys had so much fun because it was caps
36:01
quick Taps, quick Taps, Creek, and There's one time where he
36:04
went skidding across the screen and you heard this alternating
36:07
is tap and squeak as he went by. And you know, it's just kind of
36:13
fun to bring all the all the disciplines together and sort of
36:18
use everything to enhance the impression of a character.
36:21
Fantastic. And and we don't even think his
36:24
viewers like I don't think I ever saw that Peg Leg.
36:26
How come you never saw that squeaky shoot?
36:28
We just assumed it was all there.
36:30
I think it came up once I think I kicked it up during a song.
36:33
Oh that sounds right? Yeah yeah I think I did but that
36:38
was an intense day. I could be wrong.
36:41
Yeah. Still still impressive.
36:44
So boobies to let me throw in a comment about that reminds me of
36:48
something that happens when you're performing like a song,
36:53
can have a lot of choreography or a scene can too.
36:57
Sometimes characters are moving through sets and so there's a
37:00
lot to think about a lot of mechanics like You think, but
37:04
once I pass under this Arch and I have to switch to another
37:07
monitor and I also have to hand another character, something.
37:11
And so you do it a few times and then you start to get it right
37:15
and you've maybe you're doing takes now but there's a point
37:20
Beyond which G open beyond that that you can go to it.
37:23
Like you can say, okay now I trust that I have a mechanic's,
37:27
let's just not think about them and just trust that they'll
37:31
happen and I'm Run that Boomer song, the Gypsy song I I did
37:36
that. And I asked for one more take,
37:39
then I wanted to just forget all the stuff I was trying to
37:41
remember and just let it go. And you can do that with
37:44
puppetry and any kind of Performing you can do that, you
37:47
know, you can just you can just transcend and yeah, that's
37:51
that's often times the best performance.
37:55
Absolutely. There's so much life in it at
37:57
that point. Yeah and I see a lot of that
37:59
here. I see a lot of what the other
38:01
guys are doing and girls the other Farmers are doing that.
38:04
Is is like that. They'll they'll they'll actually
38:07
take it Beyond getting it, right and make it great.
38:11
Yeah, that's the secret. Yeah, don't just get a right.
38:14
Get a great beginner, great boobers.
38:18
Got this. Great glowing tail and it starts
38:20
glowing again and trying to hide it just as the archivist shows
38:25
up. We act, we actually get to meet
38:26
the archivist for the first time, voiced by the the greats,
38:30
Cynthia areevo. Did you work with sin?
38:33
At all on the show. Did you say you did not even
38:38
speak to her? Wow, no, no, no, never.
38:40
I never crossed paths because a lot of the guests voices were
38:44
done afterward. Hmm.
38:46
Interesting. I don't know who met them.
38:47
You know? They were weird in the studio,
38:49
right? I think.
38:50
Yeah. How do I know I wasn't there?
38:52
I'm just collection. Is that most of them were
38:57
brought in for a Dr? I think, or they recorded music
39:01
ahead of time and that sort of And how the character would talk
39:05
and whoever was performing to get doctor, would follow follow
39:08
that whatever degree they could. But no, I never ran into her and
39:17
That's a death sentence just has no ending it just Trails off.
39:20
Well if you ever if you ever run into on the red carpet, now you
39:24
least you have an opening so, you know, you know I we have
39:27
glowing blue pieces together, you can say that's anyone, they
39:32
wouldn't know you're talking about but maybe Cynthia will
39:34
remember. It gives me a sense of how it is
39:37
for animation voices. You know people who visited
39:40
animation usually do them by themselves which makes it really
39:44
hard to play a scene when you don't know.
39:46
What the other one is doing, you know.
39:49
Yeah. So that the animation really
39:50
depends on the director for that unless they can schedule a both
39:54
voices of the same session, you know?
39:57
Well, it's come, I've heard a story about.
40:00
I think it was Carrie Fisher meeting James Earl Jones for the
40:03
first time in, like, the early 2000s.
40:07
It was like they did all these Star Wars movies together, but
40:09
like, you, what handset, he was just doing doing the Darth Vader
40:12
voice later on. They just went decades without
40:15
ever Crossing pads. Yeah.
40:17
It better happen. Yeah.
40:21
So when bleah sticks, the the Bissell onto boobers.
40:28
Belubius this is a very interesting sentence.
40:31
I'm saying out loud. Of course.
40:33
It gets it gets stuck. And so now, when we move our
40:38
need to find a way to sneak the Bizzle back into the museum and
40:40
Wembley has this grand plan that we get to see where he disguises
40:44
himself as the world's oldest Fraggle.
40:46
Wait until the world's oldest fraggle take snap tunnels into
40:50
the museum. Henchy will show up and then
40:53
make him prove that he's the world's oldest fraggle.
40:56
And wimbly will just say I'm so old and then Bob's your uncle.
41:01
I guess boobers plan is just stick it under your shirt and
41:04
put it back on the Shelf, which is a admittedly, a better plan.
41:08
So this is the first Glimpse that we get of the world's
41:11
oldest fraggle. It's a very brief Glimpse and
41:14
you know again like we were talking about with Philo
41:17
earlier. They easily could have just
41:18
recast this character, but we were able to thankfully to bring
41:21
you back as the voice of world's oldest.
41:24
So was there talk of recasting or were you just putting your
41:28
foot down? Like nope, I love this guy.
41:30
I want to be the world's oldest fraggle again.
41:33
Well, I didn't put my foot down. It was just collaborative.
41:35
We least least it was concerned about the ADR.
41:39
So, I gave up Philo and large, Marvin, and somebody else, I
41:44
can't remember who it was. But yeah, it was all just
41:48
friendly and collaborative, and I was really happy to do world's
41:52
those because I love him. But in this series, we're
41:54
searching for his stick because it was felt that his stick in
42:01
the earlier earlier. Frontal Rock was abusive and the
42:04
way he treated him cheap and see what I was popping on the head.
42:07
I forgot his cartoony and I thought it was funny but we're
42:12
much more socially, you know, correct right now.
42:14
And so we can't do that. Is it?
42:16
Correct and socially. Correct.
42:17
We can't we can't do that and so we have struggling if I'd been
42:21
on set would have been easier to work out how he deals with his
42:26
new hand. She right?
42:28
But you know because it was long distance and little bit
42:33
disconnected in that way. We don't know that we're quite
42:36
there with the two of them yet. Okay, well we'll just have to
42:40
make sure that we get more of them next season so they could
42:42
play. But yeah, I think world's oldest
42:46
Fraggle. Is one of the funniest
42:47
characters on the show and I'm really grateful that we get to
42:49
hear your voice through him and there's all these little like,
42:52
this is why it's surprising to me that you're a Deering
42:57
completely after the fact. Because he has so many
43:00
hysterical, little ad-libs, and, you know, offside lines that I
43:06
feel like came right out of your brain, but maybe they came from
43:09
Frank. Maybe they came from the script.
43:10
I don't know. It was probably a, it was a
43:13
combo, I think. But mostly those guys, I just
43:16
Tried to fit, what was on the screen?
43:20
And I think we Frank and I worked really well together on
43:24
on world's oldest. But again, the struggle was just
43:27
try to figure out what he gets mad at, you know.
43:30
Yeah. Because his whole thing is, he's
43:32
always wrong and he blames something else or somebody else.
43:36
And right. And I thought that was just a
43:38
fun thing to do on a bunch of levels in the original show up,
43:42
just because he's there is really past it is past.
43:46
Prime if he ever was in a prime and it's it's a sense of
43:51
powerlessness that even kids can relate to like when you just
43:55
yeah it just you just haven't gotten together and you're
43:57
exposed in front of everybody that you did something wrong and
44:01
now you're embarrassed and you try to over correct by covering
44:04
it up or blaming somebody else. I just think that's kind of a
44:07
universal thing and yeah I love it and so we're just trying
44:11
we're still casting around trying to find out how to
44:14
express that in this episode. It's like for example, there was
44:18
an episode where the horns. Scary mm bunch of horns come in
44:22
and Blair. He's conducting a meeting and in
44:27
and then they would disappear and what I would have advocated
44:31
for. If I'd been there was don't have
44:33
them disappear, have him know that they're there so that you
44:36
can play the tension between him and the horns as to when they're
44:41
going to go next. Like in then he can expect it
44:43
and be ready and then they don't do it, you know.
44:46
There are lots of variations that you miss, when I'm on the
44:49
horns disappear. So things like that, I would
44:52
really look forward to working more on to try to find out
44:55
exactly how he How he could be more of an idiot
45:13
idiots, it sounds like I do. I love it now.
45:16
I just feel like that's it. A lot of us are idiots.
45:32
Statistically speaking, a certain percentage of Fraggle
45:36
Rock viewers are idiots and they're going to love this guy
45:38
that can see so much of themselves in him.
45:40
Well, speaking of the World At Large, not, not Fraggle Rock,
45:45
no, not the brilliant. Yeah, Fraggle Rock, viewers who
45:48
are very smart people, who who made terrific choices in there
45:52
are what they want to watch on Apple TV plus.
45:55
Yeah, they're just watching idiots.
45:57
Play correct. Yeah, so next up, boober sings
46:03
the song glow away, which is a new song for this series.
46:08
And I have to say, you sang it beautifully, boober was a great
46:13
voice for this song so I've done hanging in my closet here.
46:19
Is that where you do all your ADR?
46:20
You just you cleared out a closet for it?
46:23
No, I didn't. I went to San Francisco because
46:25
it was a little safer by then. Then at that stage but you
46:31
wouldn't believe what we went through to record music, like,
46:34
for my mother's stuff. I record on GarageBand in my
46:38
little studio, and I'll whole works great.
46:40
And I said that all the tracks to our music director in LA, and
46:44
he collects them from all of us and does the mix.
46:47
And he thinks it worked beautifully, but in this case,
46:51
permeation jr. Wanted to use, we didn't want me
46:55
to be doing the engineering because You know, I would, I
46:58
would do for a new garage band for a bunch of music and then
47:01
two or three months would go by and I forget how to use it, you
47:05
know. Yeah.
47:06
You know, and then I would start again.
47:08
So that's what we were when I started doing it and hardly said
47:11
we're going to send you some equipment, we're going to have a
47:13
engineer in La. So the way we recorded the music
47:16
for fraggle was every time we recorded music a guy came and
47:20
delivered a whole bunch of cartons, you know, shipping
47:24
containers of equipment. I had a laptop Op, I had a 1967
47:30
tube microphone. Only valuable microphone, sure
47:34
they sent me a, you know, amount for stand, for the microphone,
47:38
all but the whole bunch of stuff and I would disinfect it because
47:41
that was when we were disinfecting everything and then
47:43
I would set it up and took like two hours to go through all
47:47
that, and then I was ready to record the next day.
47:49
And so, at that point there was an engineer in Burbank Harvey
47:53
Mason, Junior was a his house and I was here.
47:57
Our musical director was up in Calgary listening in helping me
48:02
with a singing. And then read a Peru G or Tim
48:07
O'Brien who are two of our producers associate producers on
48:10
the show. Well, I just slurred producer
48:13
and a sodium produce. I just didn't want to say all
48:16
those words. I just thought I'm going into
48:18
too much detail and it's I'm falling down a hole here of
48:22
detail, but I love the detail, even if you were slurring
48:26
through Italy, It read it read as our producer and and and Tim
48:32
it's I said comes Jim. O'Brien was associate producer.
48:37
So one of those two would be on the recording session to.
48:39
So now we've got like five people all over the Northern
48:43
Hemisphere and and then I would just record the music and and
48:48
Harvey is a terrific producer in that, he marks what he likes as
48:53
you're going. So you're going to take and
48:56
you'll say that's I just need to pick it up for such-and-such a
48:58
line that was weak. So let's do that.
49:01
Let's do that line again, or it go all the way through.
49:03
So it went pretty quickly. The recording process was quite
49:06
quick', quite easy and and Harvey's a pleasure to work with
49:12
great. But I don't like all the
49:13
disinfecting because then I would disinfect all the
49:16
equipment and put it back in the case, just and the guy would
49:18
come and take it away. And then like, five days later,
49:21
he bring it back again. We go through all that again, if
49:23
right. It sounds like a peanut no, you
49:26
know. Right.
49:27
Yeah, the Glamorous side of Hollywood.
49:30
Yeah. So Uber still has this thing
49:34
stuck on his on his belubius Mochi and red and Gobo
49:37
eventually find out that the that he's got this thing on them
49:41
and there's a great puppetry moment where red is trying to
49:46
get it off of boobers tail and they're swinging around in a big
49:49
circle which was really impressive.
49:52
It looks like they must have been on some sort of lazy Susan,
49:56
type of rig to get them to spin that way.
50:00
Yeah. Yeah.
50:01
And they even take it to the Doozers to help get it off.
50:06
This is another one of those glimpses of one of your old
50:08
characters. We see in the background is
50:10
Wrench doozer. It was one of your guys in the
50:13
original series. Oh yeah.
50:14
That's the third one that I didn't do on this cherries.
50:17
Yeah, yeah. Did you miss do in the Doozers?
50:20
Was that fun for you? You know, I didn't focus on in
50:23
the original series, I just did Ranch as a little guy who always
50:26
repeated the last word of what somebody said to him.
50:29
Ah, Hi. So he would just repeat whatever
50:33
your last thing was my life and I didn't really put a lot of
50:38
effort into him. Other just trying to performing
50:41
cleanly but I was thinking more about all the other characters
50:44
that I was doing because they were.
50:45
Yeah, they were just more complex and more fleshed out.
50:49
So the fact that ranch went to somebody else, it doesn't even
50:54
matter in the first place. So it may have just created a
50:59
new identity for him. That's fine.
51:01
Yeah, that is fine. Still, nice to see those guys.
51:05
Those leave the old. The old Doozers back again and
51:08
not just, you know, faceless faceless little Doozers but but
51:12
named characters that we know from the old Series.
51:15
Yeah. Uber volunteers to sit at the
51:19
Museum so people can see the Bissell because that thing's not
51:22
coming off his tail. The archivist shows up.
51:25
They have this really lovely moment where she sees that He's
51:31
hiding his belubius because it glows, she tells him about how
51:34
she used to feel like she had to hide her belubius as well.
51:39
You know, where she grew up, there weren't a lot of people
51:40
with glowing blue pieces. She thought she was the only one
51:43
and now, you know, her belubius clothes every time she feels at
51:47
ease with herself. It's something that she feels a
51:49
lot of pride in and looking back.
51:52
The, those were all the moments where boobers tail would glow as
51:55
well. You know, when his friends were
51:58
praising him when he was doing laundry, I felt really good
52:01
about himself and that that belubius was just going off.
52:04
And it's a really nice moment in a great metaphor for, you know,
52:09
accepting ourselves for our differences and you know, how
52:12
they don't actually separate us but they can bring us together.
52:16
Yeah, it really is. It's a wonderful message of that
52:19
show and It was a good choice for boober, I guess, because
52:25
he's the most inhibited of the bunch.
52:29
He wouldn't see this as a novel thing, which is an anomaly.
52:32
It makes him even more different than he already is.
52:35
So it would be a problem for him and so, that was true.
52:38
Yeah, nice choice for this. Well, it feels like a deliberate
52:42
choice to not have him immediately.
52:45
Think, you know, this is a sign of death and pestilence, like,
52:48
he might have been the old show because we're obviously making a
52:51
direct And metaphor to, you know, kids who might be, you
52:55
know, growing up lgbtq and you know it's not necessarily a
52:59
death sentence. It's just something that makes
53:01
us different that we don't quite understand until we you find our
53:05
community. Yeah, exactly.
53:08
Exactly, this is where we get our second song.
53:12
The song is Chase. The wind.
53:13
This was originally heard in the original Fraggle.
53:16
Rock series episode playing till it hurts.
53:20
It was sung by red and that episode and this moment is
53:24
fantastic with with boober and the archivist singing together.
53:28
You got to sing a duet with Cynthia Revo.
53:30
That's pretty cool. Even if you weren't in the same
53:32
room with her, they're flying around the ceiling.
53:36
Going there, there's glitter everywhere.
53:38
It's a lovely moment of Pride and acceptance.
53:43
Yeah, II thought of a comment there and I forgot it before
53:47
before you get done with the question was about Cynthia Revo
53:51
and getting to know and some form with her.
53:52
So it was it was going to be about Dennis.
53:54
And Phil I was going to say something no certain who wrote
53:57
the original songs in fraggle and we always love songs.
54:01
The their process is worth mentioning.
54:06
It's and I think that the Excellence of their work is, why
54:10
are those songs are, are present in the Episodes each episode has
54:15
a new song and one of the classic songs and the way they
54:19
worked was they started with the music, the spirit could be
54:23
written and then there would be an indication of what the song
54:25
has to say. And Dennis, who did the music?
54:29
Dennis would. So I'm sorry, I filled it to the
54:32
music would play on his guitar, into a cassette recorder and
54:37
record some music, and then he would take it over to Dennis.
54:43
His house and it is, as I say, take a little gaudy and I said,
54:48
oh, and then it makes me play it and right words to it.
54:51
And of course, Dennis later became the poet laureate of
54:54
Canada. His lyrics are in a whole
54:57
different place from most of the lyrics you ever hear.
55:00
Oh, absolutely. And then he would send it back
55:03
to Phil, who would do a demo of the finished song and he would
55:07
come to the studio with that cassette and deliver it, or give
55:10
it to the ended up the Don Gillis or the producers.
55:13
Every hand off to and and then it would be orchestrated in
55:18
recorded and those little dentists fill a demo, the felt
55:22
the ones that feel recorded are just genius.
55:25
They just, it's just him with his guitar usually and he does a
55:30
great rendition of every song and it just get captured, the
55:32
spirit and even the phrasing of the song, too.
55:35
It's what other first learned about phrasing?
55:37
One day. He was in the studio when I was
55:39
recording, something one of his songs and he said, well, you
55:42
know, go Don't just say it like this emphasize this word and all
55:47
of a sudden I thought oh my God, the world of phrasing I never
55:50
thought about that before. Yeah I'm sort of like an
55:55
untrained person in this field. Anyway it was really lovely to
55:59
have their songs back and to have their presence on the show
56:03
because they always mean so much.
56:07
I'm curious. Do you happen to know if if
56:08
those audio cassettes still exists is because I would love
56:12
to hear some That's a few wooden wall.
56:14
He's not so great. I don't know where they would
56:17
be. That would be a good question
56:18
for Larry mirka? Yeah we're okay.
56:20
Well, do some digging I mean, you know right?
56:25
Yeah. Well we'll do some digging
56:26
because, yeah, that stuff is, I mean, those fraggles songs are
56:29
from the original series are just gold to me and it makes me
56:34
very grateful that that they're back.
56:37
A few of them are back in this series because we can get the
56:40
best of both worlds. New songs.
56:42
It is You, I mean, you know, the value.
56:45
The wonderful thing about Harvey is that he's capable of so many
56:48
genres and he can, you know, he and his team can do the lyrics
56:52
and music and, and get a sound. That is more contemporary, but
56:59
there is something just a beautiful love as was a songs.
57:03
And I will say that Dennis is demos were amazing, because he's
57:08
a terrific singer. And here, in fact, he appears in
57:12
one of the original episodes. He's about to throw on the
57:14
street. Yes.
57:15
Yeah and just playing his guitar and singing.
57:20
I don't know, it's just those demos would be a real fine, but
57:24
there are American and I guess Phil Balsam would be the
57:28
starting points for her. Yes, sir.
57:30
Okay, what we're going to do a little detective work.
57:32
When you see what happened, right.
57:34
Stay tuned to that. So this this episode basically
57:38
ends with Uber finally gets the Bissell off of his tail, his
57:43
friends come in, they see that his tail is glowing and they all
57:46
immediately accept him because of course they do.
57:48
They love him. At this great scan across the
57:52
Great Hall in Fraggle Rock. As we see blue pieces, kind of
57:56
light up, one by one that Uber is not alone.
57:59
There's a lot a lot of fraggles out there like him who have this
58:03
really special thing about them so terrific episode really as
58:07
well. That was that was very
58:09
intentional to apply to all sorts of people who might feel
58:12
marginalized or or alone and yeah.
58:16
You know, the series has the benefit of Of being Stream So
58:21
that we have a season Arc as well.
58:23
This is really nice as well as arcs within each show.
58:28
Good stuff. Really good stuff.
58:31
Completely agree. Well, now that we've reached the
58:34
end of the glow, do you have any other memories of this episode
58:38
or fun observations about the the production as a whole that
58:41
you want to share? Well, I again this is a writing
58:45
a new do I think that it was really a brilliant idea to you,
58:49
put the Sizzle on the belubius and give it because it's
58:54
transparent. And so, it doesn't really
58:56
accomplish anything, right? Of course, the stock goes on
58:59
after that. But again, it's the use of
59:02
puppetry in the use of physical comedy, and, and physical
59:06
predicament. That is a wonderful metaphor.
59:09
You know, it just works on a meta level, you know, For to
59:15
represent other things that people might feel.
59:17
So again to me, that's using white space.
59:20
I always think of it as you would in art where you leave
59:23
white space on the page. You just indicate part of
59:26
something you drawing something to indicate part of it, you
59:30
render another part of it and our brain just fills it in its
59:34
present in lyrics to wear. Well, I just, I'm reading a book
59:38
by Paul McCartney, you know, about all of the songs he wrote.
59:41
And one of the things he consciously did was he I could
59:44
find the words that had multiple meanings.
59:46
Hmm. Because it allowed room for
59:49
people to interpret and make up their own story to go along with
59:53
what they saw. And that's true in a lot of a
59:57
lot of that, a lot of songwriters actually pretty
59:59
rare. Paul Simon is another guy who
1:00:02
does that, you don't know quite what he means, but somehow it's
1:00:05
evocative and it fits you and you make up your own story to
1:00:09
it. So the, you know, the Dizzle and
1:00:12
the glowing belubius Is a way of doing that and it's I find it's
1:00:16
really hard doing art. How do you, how do you say
1:00:18
something without actually saying it?
1:00:21
You know, how do you, how do you say just enough that it will
1:00:24
make people identify and participate but not too much
1:00:30
Ryan. And try writing, lyrics
1:00:32
sometime, you know, you'll usually end up.
1:00:34
Well, I always find is what I tried.
1:00:36
I end up being too literal. Yeah, I know I just don't get up
1:00:40
to that other level where it's just a symbol and an indicator
1:00:43
and a hint. So that's why I think the
1:00:46
writers have done a great job with this show and this
1:00:48
particular episode I completely agree and this is also something
1:00:52
I've noticed about puppets is in general, is because puppets tend
1:00:56
to have more static faces. People tend to put their own
1:01:01
emotions and identities on to a lot of these characters.
1:01:05
And so we have a specifically we're talking about fraggles
1:01:07
fraggles. This is a design-wise are very,
1:01:11
very simple puppets. And of course there's a lot of
1:01:13
molding that you can do, you know, as a performer but any of
1:01:17
us can look at boober and see ourselves in him because he
1:01:22
could look like anyone and no one of the same time.
1:01:24
Yeah, I mean that's sort of started on Sesame Street before
1:01:29
I even joined, they had the anything Muppets which were all
1:01:31
different colors and so they could represent different
1:01:34
ethnicities without being specific.
1:01:37
So it was, it was early form of this kind of indication that,
1:01:42
that, that is really nice to be able to use when we get to, This
1:01:50
particular episode, I think that using the tail glowing.
1:01:55
Is a wonderful abstract symbol of being a way of being
1:01:59
different. So a lot of people who feel that
1:02:02
way I can watch this and, and identify.
1:02:05
Yeah, absolutely. I've had so many people called
1:02:08
to me and say about Gonzo that when they were young, he gave
1:02:13
him permission to be different. And I'm not kidding, I get that
1:02:17
comment a lot and I think if you know, I probably would have
1:02:22
played a Buhler to, you know, they would say, you know, I
1:02:26
always felt kind of scared of this or that would be a lot of
1:02:29
people. I don't hear that as much but
1:02:31
usually I guess I think it's just because I'm doing events
1:02:34
and meeting people in connection with the Muppets rather than
1:02:37
fraggle. You know, I'd have done it in
1:02:38
them as many there. But I know that, I know that I
1:02:41
would get that comment from Fraggle viewers as well.
1:02:44
I'm sure you have. I mean It's hard because Gonzo
1:02:46
is, you know, an international movie star and you know, boober
1:02:51
you laugh but he is and you know, boobers was the star of a
1:02:55
TV show on HBO, you know, 30 years ago.
1:02:58
So it's a little bit of a different audience.
1:03:01
Yeah. You know what?
1:03:02
It was. Such a brilliant idea that it's
1:03:04
stuck. I mean I think at that time
1:03:05
HBO's audience, I think their subscriber ship was eight
1:03:09
million, we thought, oh gee, we're working for this place
1:03:12
that you know, not many people will see this show but then it
1:03:14
was Old worldwide to a global audience and people who saw it
1:03:20
grew up with it, really remember it and they they would come to
1:03:24
events like 15, 20 years ago, we do a screening of a Fraggle Rock
1:03:28
episode. I was just surprised that it was
1:03:30
always packed, you know? And that even with a relatively
1:03:34
small audience compared to a network show at the time, we it
1:03:38
just meant a lot of people. It's just an idea that's a good
1:03:40
idea. It's true.
1:03:43
Yeah, it's Universal. The original Who's Jim and to
1:03:49
Michael, for being back on, Fraggle,
1:04:02
Rock, and for bringing back some of your iconic characters.
1:04:07
It's such a treat to see you back on.
1:04:10
On our TVs again with these characters, it's just, the new
1:04:14
show is so good. And it wouldn't be the same
1:04:16
without you. And well, that's very kind.
1:04:20
I would say it's an honor to be there.
1:04:23
Yes. Well, I'm sure it was an honor
1:04:24
to be there virtually and I hope that if there's a season 2, you
1:04:26
get to be there in person this time around and Dave, thank you.
1:04:32
So, so very much for being here on this podcast, this was such a
1:04:36
treat to really dive in to the back to the rock with you for
1:04:40
the rest of you folks, listening in.
1:04:42
That is the end of another fraggle Talk podcast, but stay
1:04:45
tuned as tough big Zone. Beth cook talks more about the
1:04:48
themes of this episode in our dive deeper segment coming up
1:04:51
right now. Welcome to dig deeper.
1:05:04
This is Beth cook and I am joined once again by executive
1:05:06
producer and president television, at the Jim Henson
1:05:09
company Hallie Stanford. And we are talking about episode
1:05:12
104, the glow. This is a really important
1:05:15
episode. This is an incredible episode.
1:05:17
This is like a, a It will be a future classic.
1:05:22
I hope that it one day from now, you know maybe maybe like what
1:05:28
we say 20 years in the future. They'll be a generation of kids
1:05:31
saying oh that moment in Fraggle Rock were boober comes out and
1:05:38
shows everybody, his glowing tail, he's proud of it and
1:05:40
they're excited for him. Is the day that I decided I'm
1:05:45
not going to be afraid to reveal this part of my identity to the
1:05:49
world. So anyway, it was It was a big
1:05:51
topic and we did a lot of thinking about who should this,
1:05:56
who should be the character, whose tail glows, and we decided
1:06:00
on boober. And that, you know, I'll tell
1:06:03
you talking with Dave goals, you know, this is a, this is a cat,
1:06:06
you know, like day goes the still plane Boomer, you know,
1:06:09
like he is booyah hallelujahs, right.
1:06:12
And so, you know, you have to get Dave's by off on this and
1:06:16
see what he thinks and it's a lot of conversations about what
1:06:19
does this mean? And What will happen?
1:06:21
And I mean, I feel like even I feel like even the song Blow
1:06:25
Away, which is such a beautiful song, like kind of reflects a
1:06:29
little bit of like the back-and-forth we all had about.
1:06:31
Like, this being Boomer, you know, like, do we want this to
1:06:34
happen? Do we know what this is is going
1:06:36
to change everything about Fraggle Rock.
1:06:38
Like, we actually experience what boober was experiencing as
1:06:40
we were putting the show together, but it was so
1:06:43
important and I love again another visual representation of
1:06:48
the messaging, right? That It's like it's glowing,
1:06:52
which means it's beautiful, it's a beautiful thing.
1:06:54
But also it's like you can't miss it, right?
1:06:57
And we put it on the belubius and he wants to hide it.
1:07:01
And then his friends trying to help him hide it.
1:07:03
And we all know there's no use in hiding, it comes out in such
1:07:06
a Joyful Way and so, you know, I think for the lgbtq community,
1:07:12
there is some very strong message in here, but I think
1:07:15
we're any child that has something that they don't share
1:07:19
with others. I'll never forget when my son's
1:07:23
best friend came out to his friends and he said I have ADHD
1:07:28
and it was a big deal and one of the kids turn back and said, oh
1:07:30
that's so cool. So does Dave pelkey who wrote
1:07:32
Captain Underpants it was like that moment when boober tells
1:07:37
the friends, I believe he is lights up and Red's.
1:07:40
Like I wish mine would light up to write, you know.
1:07:42
So it's an important moment to share and it was a lot of fun to
1:07:48
figure out how And who did we get to advise?
1:07:53
We had so many amazing queer writers, performers, directors,
1:07:59
you name it. We were all there supporting
1:08:03
this this messaging and you know, truly a lot of I'm sure in
1:08:08
the writers room, sharing of their own stories of coming out
1:08:12
and what does that feel like? So I ate it all gets translated
1:08:15
into the shelves so it's very exciting.
1:08:18
And I want to talk about the person who helps them the Frog,
1:08:21
excuse me, who helps him chase the wind and and find a find joy
1:08:29
in his polybius. And that is the archivist and we
1:08:33
amazing I cannot play by Cynthia Revo and credible.
1:08:36
Like right, her singing voice her grace.
1:08:39
She is the archive that she likes floats in the room.
1:08:42
When we were recording with her, she floated in the room and I
1:08:45
will tell you, she designed to look at that character, really?
1:08:48
Eric's be like mine, very short cropped and we talked about the
1:08:51
kind of dress she wanted and everything.
1:08:53
So in the glasses, so love that, yeah, she was a big part of it,
1:08:58
um, but I level so the celebration of an archivist and
1:09:03
teasing everybody at home, particularly kids what that
1:09:06
means and why it's important. Why is it important that we that
1:09:10
we archive and have museums and libraries and save knowledge?
1:09:16
Right knowledge information. Culture and she is the most
1:09:22
revered of all, which I love. We have an incredible incredible
1:09:26
archivist, ourself at the Jim Henson company Karen fall.
1:09:29
So, I, it was really important to me and like we have to call
1:09:33
her the archivist. I know, it doesn't sound that
1:09:36
graceful, but it must be called that.
1:09:39
So anyway, she is the one. She also has her tail glow and
1:09:43
she's able to share a story with boober and she's the coolest of
1:09:47
the cool. So if Coolest of the cool, it's
1:09:49
okay with it and maybe boober can find a little courage to be
1:09:53
okay with it as well, which really speaks to.
1:09:56
Again, the parents are watching, if teenagers are watching, if
1:10:00
people would know kids are watching, just looking to those
1:10:03
mentors. And those Heroes who also are
1:10:07
brave enough to share their stories and you and give you the
1:10:11
strength share yours as well. And to kind of hold on to them
1:10:14
even if you don't know them, even if you don't meet the
1:10:16
archivist and fly in the air. And sing a song with her, you
1:10:20
can still on your own feel that kind of inner strength to to
1:10:23
come out with who you are. Absolutely and the fact that
1:10:27
boober is finally ready to accept and embrace his glowing
1:10:32
when he realizes that, he's not alone, he's not alone and then
1:10:36
how about that last shot in the end where you see her leaving
1:10:40
and she's giving a lovely monologue about snow being
1:10:43
yourself and you see all the little Tails light up and
1:10:48
probably because they took strength from boober, right?
1:10:51
Like he did it. Well, I guess we'll do it too,
1:10:53
so I think that's a beautiful moment.
1:10:55
As well. I like wow.
1:10:56
All Fraggle Rock is filled with glowing.
1:10:58
Belubius is how wonderful. Fraggle, talk The Unofficial
1:11:08
Fraggle Rock podcast is brought to you by tough pics.com
1:11:11
produced written and hosted by Johannes fraggle fast facts,
1:11:14
segment presented by special guest.
1:11:16
John tartaglia dig deeper segment hosted by Beth cook with
1:11:19
special. Guest Hayley Stanford fraggle,
1:11:21
talk art by Dave whole King jr. The Fraggle Rock Mark and Logo
1:11:24
characters and elements are trademarks of Jim Henson
1:11:26
company, All Rights. Reserved Fraggle Rock theme song
1:11:29
written by Philip Balsam and Dennis Glee is used with
1:11:31
permission special, thanks to the Jim Henson company, Apple
1:11:34
TV. Plus in the entire Fraggle, Rock
1:11:36
back to the Rock Family. For more from topics, please
1:11:38
find us at tough pigs on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram and
1:11:41
patreon. Thanks for listening and we'll
1:11:43
see you next time down at fraggle talk.