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Snakes Territory reacts to Zac Gallen re-signing with Diamondbacks · Foul Territory

0:13
Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to another episode of Snake's Territory, part
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Speaker 1: of the Foults Territory Network. Be sure to like this video.
0:20
Speaker 1: If you're joining us on YouTube, subscribe to our channel,
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Speaker 1: maybe leave us a five star review wherever you get
0:26
Speaker 1: your podcasts. I am Jesse Friedman alongside the one and
0:29
Speaker 1: only Jack Summers, and we do not go live often
0:33
Speaker 1: in the off season, Jack, but this felt fitting that
0:36
Speaker 1: we do this for this moment as the Diamondbacks they
0:40
Speaker 1: continue their trend of bringing back familiar faces. Zach Gallon
0:44
Speaker 1: is back on a one year, twenty two point zero
0:47
Speaker 1: two five million dollar deal, the exact same amount of
0:51
Speaker 1: money that he would have gotten if he accepted the
0:54
Speaker 1: qualifying offer from the Diamondbacks a few months back. Jack,
0:58
Speaker 1: your initial thoughts on this move for the d Backs?
1:02
Speaker 2: Baseball is a humbling sport, and first and foremost I
1:06
Speaker 2: feel humbled, because, you know, since whenever the beginning of
1:12
Speaker 2: the season, talking about Zach Gallon and his walk year
1:15
Speaker 2: and what's he going to get and what's going to
1:17
Speaker 2: be the value, and whether or not they'll get the
1:20
Speaker 2: qualifying offer after the rough start, and then whether or
1:23
Speaker 2: not they should give it to him, and then it
1:25
Speaker 2: became a foregune conclusion they would and then would he
1:28
Speaker 2: would the Dbacks get a high draft pick, And everything's
1:31
Speaker 2: come back full circle to essentially him getting the qualifying
1:36
Speaker 2: offer value in a in a in a contract. And
1:40
Speaker 2: I just nobody predicted things to go the way they went.
1:44
Speaker 2: And we're pretty well informed, and we're pretty insightful, you know,
1:48
Speaker 2: And we are I mean, I took pretty you know,
1:52
Speaker 2: and so it just shows how clueless we are. And
1:54
Speaker 2: of course humbling for Zach, right, I mean, you know,
1:56
Speaker 2: this has been had to have been a tough pill
1:58
Speaker 2: for him to swallow, that his market deteriorated to this
2:02
Speaker 2: degree and so on all things. Baseball is just a
2:05
Speaker 2: humbling sport. That's the primary thought that's going through my
2:08
Speaker 2: mind tonight.
2:10
Speaker 1: Yeah. I absolutely feel you there. Yeah, I mean this
2:14
Speaker 1: is somewhat surprising for us, there's certainly no question about that.
2:18
Speaker 1: But I think this is also surprising for Zach Gallen
2:21
Speaker 1: in his camp. I mean, you don't reject the qualifying
2:23
Speaker 1: offer in November if you think this is the way
2:27
Speaker 1: that things are going to end up. There are deferrals
2:29
Speaker 1: in this contract we'll get into at a little bit more.
2:33
Speaker 1: The net present value in all those details. But there
2:36
Speaker 1: are deferrals in this deal, which means even though the
2:39
Speaker 1: sticker price is twenty two point zero two five the
2:42
Speaker 1: exact same numbers that qualifying offer, it's actually it's actually
2:46
Speaker 1: less money when you consider the time value of money.
2:49
Speaker 1: Zach Gallen would have been better off financially if he
2:52
Speaker 1: had just accepted the qualifying offer several months ago. And
2:56
Speaker 1: I remember down the stretch, Jack, when Zach really started
3:00
Speaker 1: to pitch well, he finished the season strong. As we
3:04
Speaker 1: discussed down the stretch, I thought he was gonna do
3:08
Speaker 1: all right in free agency. I really did. I mean,
3:10
Speaker 1: I didn't think it was going to be one hundred
3:12
Speaker 1: plus million. But you know, for a guy who has
3:15
Speaker 1: the track record that Zach Gallen has is not all
3:18
Speaker 1: that far removed from being one of the better pitchers
3:20
Speaker 1: in baseball and finishing the season strong at thirty years old,
3:25
Speaker 1: you figure there was going to be a team that
3:27
Speaker 1: was going to be willing to go out and take
3:30
Speaker 1: a chance on him, give him, you know, not a
3:32
Speaker 1: seven year deal, but maybe a three or four year deal,
3:35
Speaker 1: and give him a decent chunk of change. And as
3:38
Speaker 1: we saw over the course of the offseason, it just
3:40
Speaker 1: felt like no team was willing to do that. And
3:43
Speaker 1: I think you and I see where those teams are
3:46
Speaker 1: coming from. I mean, again, I did not expect it
3:49
Speaker 1: to come to this, But if you're really hesitant to
3:51
Speaker 1: give Zack Gallen a four year, five year contract, whatever
3:54
Speaker 1: it was, I see where you're coming from. I mean,
3:57
Speaker 1: the trend has been in the wrong direction for the
3:59
Speaker 1: past couple of years. You look at his numbers since
4:02
Speaker 1: he started the All Star Game in twenty twenty three,
4:06
Speaker 1: not all that long ago. He's basically been a league
4:09
Speaker 1: average pitcher ever since then, and it just feels like
4:12
Speaker 1: teams are not really buying in to him returning to
4:17
Speaker 1: form at some point in the future.
4:20
Speaker 2: It's notable, I guess. John Hammond reported that there were
4:23
Speaker 2: multi year offers out there that he rejected, or at
4:26
Speaker 2: least a multi year offer he rejected in order to
4:29
Speaker 2: take this deal. I think a little bit about the
4:31
Speaker 2: comments he made out of the golf tournament. You know,
4:33
Speaker 2: he's recently married. His wife is from Arizona, and you
4:38
Speaker 2: know that very much. You know, personal stuff can play
4:41
Speaker 2: a big role here. I mean, if you decide you
4:43
Speaker 2: just want to do a one year deal and try
4:45
Speaker 2: the market again next year, unencumbered by that qualifying offer,
4:50
Speaker 2: you may as well stay where you're comfortable. And you know,
4:53
Speaker 2: for Zach clearly, you know he said over and over
4:56
Speaker 2: this is home. Now you know his wife from here.
4:58
Speaker 2: I'm sure that goinging forward, he's probably going to be
5:01
Speaker 2: making his offseason home here, regardless of who he pitches for.
5:05
Speaker 2: So you know, all those things factor in is like, Okay,
5:08
Speaker 2: well screwed. If I'm going to do a one year deal,
5:10
Speaker 2: I'm definitely going back to Arizona. At one point I thought, well,
5:13
Speaker 2: if he's only going to do a one year deal,
5:15
Speaker 2: if there was a team out there that maybe appeared
5:18
Speaker 2: to be in a better position to compete for the postseason,
5:22
Speaker 2: that might be an enticement away from here. But ultimately,
5:26
Speaker 2: you know, he probably has confidence that this team will
5:28
Speaker 2: do better, especially with him on it, and I'm sure
5:31
Speaker 2: he believes in himself and he's betting on himself. That's
5:33
Speaker 2: what athletes do.
5:36
Speaker 1: Part of the narrative that is compelling to me is
5:38
Speaker 1: like Zach Gallen's career has been trending in the wrong
5:41
Speaker 1: direction the past couple of years, as we said, but
5:45
Speaker 1: this deal, to me, says Zach Gallen does not think
5:49
Speaker 1: the Dbacks are at fault for that, Like he does
5:52
Speaker 1: not view this organization as being, you know, some kind
5:57
Speaker 1: of place where pitchers just can't succeed. If you did
6:01
Speaker 1: think that this Diamondbacks organization was a place where pitchers
6:05
Speaker 1: were not in good position to succeed, like there would
6:08
Speaker 1: be evidence for that. I mean, this organization from a
6:10
Speaker 1: pitching standpoint, has really struggled for the past couple of years,
6:15
Speaker 1: and I would understand if somebody felt that way, but
6:18
Speaker 1: clearly that's not where Zach Gollans stands. He would not
6:20
Speaker 1: have returned to this team and you know, continued to
6:23
Speaker 1: say all the positive things about his time in the
6:25
Speaker 1: organization if that's how he really felt. So it's fascinating
6:30
Speaker 1: to me that it's come to this. I mean, once again,
6:32
Speaker 1: like if you told me at the beginning of the
6:34
Speaker 1: off season that Zach Gallen and Merrill Kelly were both
6:39
Speaker 1: coming back to the Diamondbacks, I would have thought you
6:41
Speaker 1: were crazy. But here we are. I Mean, we've said
6:45
Speaker 1: it before with Ken Kendrick Jack, Like, these are the
6:48
Speaker 1: moments that Ken Kendrick lives for. When when a player's
6:51
Speaker 1: market falls, when there's a unique opportunity he is, He's
6:55
Speaker 1: willing to spend a little bit more money, And you
6:59
Speaker 1: could make the case like, maybe it'd be nice if
7:01
Speaker 1: ken Kendrick would open up the wallet a little more
7:03
Speaker 1: on the front end. Maybe maybe, as you've said before,
7:06
Speaker 1: like you'd rather have allocated this money in a different way.
7:10
Speaker 1: But at the very least you have to respect that
7:12
Speaker 1: Ken Kendrick is opportunistic and he's shown that separal off
7:16
Speaker 1: seasons in a row.
7:17
Speaker 2: Now. Yeah, you know, it's funny. I've been One other
7:21
Speaker 2: thought I was having is like I wonder how this
7:22
Speaker 2: offseason would have played out had Zach just accepted the
7:26
Speaker 2: offer right up front, Yeah, you know, and whether or
7:30
Speaker 2: not that would have precluded them at that point from
7:33
Speaker 2: bringing back Meryl, or if they still would have done
7:35
Speaker 2: it anyway.
7:36
Speaker 1: You know, I think it would have. Honestly, I think
7:39
Speaker 1: it would have.
7:41
Speaker 2: I mean it just a lot of questions there about
7:43
Speaker 2: how all that would have played out. But you know,
7:45
Speaker 2: this came down to the wire. You know. I guess
7:48
Speaker 2: as we move into the contract portion of the discussion,
7:51
Speaker 2: we can kind of get into some of the nuts
7:53
Speaker 2: and bolts here. That'll probably help us get into a
7:56
Speaker 2: little more clarity as to why this may have happened
7:59
Speaker 2: in the sequence that.
8:02
Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's one year, twenty two point zero two
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Speaker 1: five million dollar deals twenty two point zero two five
8:08
Speaker 1: million dollar deal. We don't know the exact nature of
8:11
Speaker 1: the deferrals. There's some conflicting reports out there. As of
8:15
Speaker 1: right now, it seems most reporters are talking about Gallon
8:20
Speaker 1: receiving two point eight million dollars. I know this is
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Speaker 1: what Gambo has said. It's two point eight million dollars
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Speaker 1: per year from year six to year ten, so starting
8:30
Speaker 1: starting paid out in year six and then through year ten,
8:34
Speaker 1: and then the other portion of the money is just
8:36
Speaker 1: up front, so it's fourteen million deferred then and then
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Speaker 1: the rest of the money is paid out as normal.
8:41
Speaker 1: At least that's what we think this contract is. So
8:44
Speaker 1: we certainly talked Jack about the dbacks needing to get
8:48
Speaker 1: creative in order to make this happen. You don't often
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Speaker 1: see deferrals on a one year contract, especially not to
8:54
Speaker 1: this degree. And that's why I thought this wasn't going
8:57
Speaker 1: to happen. But apparently Zach Gallon was willing to take
9:02
Speaker 1: a bit of a take a bit of a hit
9:04
Speaker 1: coming back to the d Backs. As you said before,
9:07
Speaker 1: he had multiple he had offers for you know, multi
9:11
Speaker 1: year deals from other teams that he chose to turn
9:14
Speaker 1: down and take what is really a bizarre contract with
9:17
Speaker 1: the Arizona Diamondbacks.
9:20
Speaker 2: Right, So keep in mind with deferrals, the amount deferred
9:24
Speaker 2: has to be deposited in the escrow account by July
9:26
Speaker 2: one of twenty twenty seven. Okay, So a lot of
9:30
Speaker 2: people forget that with deferrals, it's not like they get
9:33
Speaker 2: to hold on in the money and let it burn
9:34
Speaker 2: a hole in their pocket or whatever investments they're in.
9:37
Speaker 2: They have to put it. I mean, those accounts are
9:39
Speaker 2: in interest. But there's rules around what kind of accountcilos
9:42
Speaker 2: can be. They have to be pretty conservative accounts. There
9:44
Speaker 2: can be much risk to them. And so you know,
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Speaker 2: if the dbacs are deferring fourteen million out of twenty
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Speaker 2: twenty six, now fourteen million has got to be deposited
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Speaker 2: in the bank or in the escrow account by July
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Speaker 2: one of twenty twenty seven, and then however, many years
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Speaker 2: out and however, the money is then doled out two
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Speaker 2: point eight million per year over five year period starting
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Speaker 2: I guess in twenty thirty one or whatever it is.
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Speaker 2: You know, then that's that's where they'll decrease the net
10:17
Speaker 2: present value. I think you did see a few different
10:21
Speaker 2: numbers out there of what the net present value of
10:24
Speaker 2: this is, but it's probably going to be what eighteen
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Speaker 2: eighteen and a half million jesse. Is that correct?
10:31
Speaker 1: That's that's what I estimated it to be. We also
10:34
Speaker 1: got this tweet from John Becker, who does great work
10:37
Speaker 1: at Fangrafts working on their roster resource stuff that we
10:40
Speaker 1: reference all the time. He estimated just under eighteen point
10:44
Speaker 1: seventy five million dollars for luxury tax purposes. So that
10:48
Speaker 1: sounds that sounds pretty reasonable to me, somewhere in the
10:52
Speaker 1: you know, four to five million dollar range under the
10:55
Speaker 1: sticker price of twenty.
10:57
Speaker 2: Two listeners of our last well, remember we kind of
11:01
Speaker 2: joked a little bit about Chris Bassett money, yes, because
11:06
Speaker 2: see Chris Bassett, the thirty seven year old signed for
11:09
Speaker 2: just over eighteen million, and you know, we were wondering, like,
11:13
Speaker 2: does the age factor for Bassett offset the qualifying offer
11:18
Speaker 2: factor for Zach Gallon and the apparently it did because
11:22
Speaker 2: net present value they got the same deal they effectedly.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, assuming that that's right, I know Gambo tweeted out
11:28
Speaker 1: a different number, and Nate Cleveland is mentioning fourteen million
11:32
Speaker 1: deferred over three years in the chat. I know that's
11:35
Speaker 1: what Bob Nightingale reported. So there's some conflicting reports out there.
11:39
Speaker 1: We'll see, we'll see where the where the dust ultimately
11:42
Speaker 1: settles with this. But in terms of Zach Gallon the pitcher, Jack,
11:46
Speaker 1: I think if you're a Diamondbacks fan who is disappointed
11:50
Speaker 1: by this after the season, Gallan just had like, I
11:55
Speaker 1: see where you're coming from. To an extent, I mean
11:57
Speaker 1: a four eight three RAS, a four eight three RAS,
11:59
Speaker 1: Zach Gallan not have a good season in twenty twenty five.
12:02
Speaker 1: But if you think that Zach Gallen is a four
12:04
Speaker 1: eight three er caliber pitcher moving forward, I think there's
12:08
Speaker 1: a pretty good chance you're going to be pleasantly surprised.
12:11
Speaker 1: Like the underlying numbers, we have the XCRA, the FIP,
12:14
Speaker 1: the x FIP on the screen here, not that those
12:17
Speaker 1: numbers are the end all be all, but across the board,
12:20
Speaker 1: Zach Gallen's underlying metrics suggested he's a better pitcher than
12:24
Speaker 1: a four point eight three er. On the other hand,
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Speaker 1: if you're looking at this and you're expecting Zach Gallen
12:31
Speaker 1: to return to form and to go out and have
12:34
Speaker 1: a three to three er or something like that. I
12:36
Speaker 1: don't think that's impossible. I mean, I acknowledge the upside
12:39
Speaker 1: is there, given Zach Gallen's history, but I think if
12:43
Speaker 1: if that's your mindset, I think you're probably likely to
12:45
Speaker 1: be disappointed. As is as is often the case, and
12:48
Speaker 1: I know it's maybe boring to have this take, but
12:51
Speaker 1: as is often the case in baseball, like the truth
12:53
Speaker 1: probably lies somewhere in between. Zach Gallen is kind of
12:57
Speaker 1: hovered around a low four er if you look at
13:01
Speaker 1: at much larger samples going back the past few years,
13:04
Speaker 1: and that's kind of my baseline expectation. And is that
13:08
Speaker 1: super exciting. It's not. But I also at the same
13:11
Speaker 1: time would say the Diamondbacks are better. They're a better
13:14
Speaker 1: team with Zach Gallen, even if he is a low
13:17
Speaker 1: four er pitcher. I mean, we know what the pitching
13:20
Speaker 1: for this team was like in twenty twenty five. You
13:23
Speaker 1: never can have too much starting pitching, and you certainly
13:25
Speaker 1: cannot given where this Diamondbacks team has been recently.
13:31
Speaker 2: Yeah, so looking at the projections, if you go over
13:33
Speaker 2: to fangraphs, you can see Zips has a projection of
13:37
Speaker 2: three point eight one era, Steamer has a projection of
13:41
Speaker 2: four point two two. It's a pretty big gap there.
13:43
Speaker 2: So their fangraphs depth chart, which averages those two comes
13:47
Speaker 2: in at four point zero two and at one hundred
13:50
Speaker 2: and ninety one innings, that's a two point four war
13:53
Speaker 2: pitcher according to fangraphs. Some of the other projections atc
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Speaker 2: is at four point one eight is a four two three,
14:01
Speaker 2: and the bat X is four point one four. So
14:04
Speaker 2: I think there's fairly large consensus in the projections world
14:09
Speaker 2: that he's looking at, you know, a low for his er.
14:14
Speaker 2: That's that's how he projects. Now, remember, projections are not predictions, right,
14:19
Speaker 2: it's just how it lines out on paper. I mean,
14:22
Speaker 2: I'm sure as heck didn't project him to have a
14:25
Speaker 2: four eight three RA and his projections were for the
14:28
Speaker 2: high threes, you know. Coming into twenty twenty six, I
14:32
Speaker 2: think he was projected for like a three eight something
14:35
Speaker 2: era and a lot of people saw those projections and said,
14:38
Speaker 2: no way, he's going to be that high. But you know,
14:41
Speaker 2: as it turned out, he was a full run worse
14:43
Speaker 2: than his projections. So again, humbling, right. We can't predict anything.
14:48
Speaker 2: All we can do is project and analyze and kind
14:51
Speaker 2: of take a look at it once. Mileage may vary
14:54
Speaker 2: how much value there is in that. I like to
14:57
Speaker 2: look at the projections and study them simply so I
15:01
Speaker 2: have a baseline of expectation, but I'm always fully cognizant
15:06
Speaker 2: that they're not a prediction. I don't expect guys to
15:08
Speaker 2: come in on that number on the nose or anything
15:11
Speaker 2: close to it, so you know what they get. Who knows,
15:14
Speaker 2: maybe Zach bounces back, maybe he figures out some things,
15:17
Speaker 2: and you know, he drops in under three point five.
15:21
Speaker 2: You never know what's going to happen in this wonderful
15:24
Speaker 2: game of ours.
15:26
Speaker 1: Just to dig a little deeper on kind of what
15:28
Speaker 1: has happened with Zach the past few years, I don't
15:32
Speaker 1: know if I would say the stuff is way different
15:35
Speaker 1: than it was a few years ago when he was
15:37
Speaker 1: at his peak. But as we look at the stuff
15:39
Speaker 1: plus numbers here from Fangrafts, just to get kind of
15:41
Speaker 1: a rough idea. Again, these numbers are not the end
15:44
Speaker 1: all be all, we acknowledge that, but you can see
15:46
Speaker 1: his overall stuff plus kind of near the far right
15:50
Speaker 1: side of the screen here. In twenty twenty it was
15:53
Speaker 1: one oh six, with one hundred being league average, so
15:55
Speaker 1: one o six. I know it doesn't seem huge, but
15:57
Speaker 1: that's a pretty impressive number for a pitcher starting pitcher's
16:01
Speaker 1: overall stuff plus In twenty twenty one, it was similar
16:04
Speaker 1: at one oh two. In twenty twenty two, the best
16:06
Speaker 1: season that we've ever seen Zach Gallon have it was
16:09
Speaker 1: one oh five, and then the past three years ninety
16:13
Speaker 1: eight in twenty twenty three, so it dropped off there,
16:15
Speaker 1: although he was still he was still effective, kind of
16:19
Speaker 1: wasn't as good in the second half in twenty twenty three,
16:21
Speaker 1: but was still was still quite good for the Diamondbacks overall.
16:25
Speaker 1: And then in twenty twenty four stuff plus was ninety two,
16:28
Speaker 1: and in twenty five pretty similar at ninety three, So
16:30
Speaker 1: both of those numbers coming in a little bit below average.
16:34
Speaker 1: So it's it's not a huge drop off, Jack, but
16:38
Speaker 1: there has been a drop off, and I think the
16:40
Speaker 1: two key pitches that stand out you can see the
16:43
Speaker 1: fastball stuff plus numbers on the far left of the
16:46
Speaker 1: screen that has dropped into the below average range the
16:49
Speaker 1: past couple years. And then I'm closer to the far
16:53
Speaker 1: right side of the screen you could see the knuckle
16:54
Speaker 1: curve stuff plus numbers ninety and ninety one. At the
16:58
Speaker 1: past couple of seasons, those members have dropped off fairly
17:02
Speaker 1: significantly as well. So you know, again, these numbers are
17:06
Speaker 1: not the end all be all. It's not like there's
17:08
Speaker 1: a huge difference in stuff from Gallon a few years ago.
17:11
Speaker 1: It's not like he was throwing ninety seven miles an hour.
17:14
Speaker 1: From a velo standpoint, He's held relatively steady, but it's
17:18
Speaker 1: just been a little regression with the fastball, a little
17:21
Speaker 1: regression with the curveball. The command I think has also
17:25
Speaker 1: been a part of this, Especially in twenty twenty five,
17:28
Speaker 1: it felt like he just hung a curveball at the
17:30
Speaker 1: wrong like at the worst moment in the game a
17:33
Speaker 1: few too many times led to some three run homers
17:36
Speaker 1: that really inflated his ra. So it's not a huge
17:39
Speaker 1: drop off, Jack, but there's under the hood you can
17:42
Speaker 1: see that Zach Gallen is not the pitcher that he
17:45
Speaker 1: was a few years ago.
17:47
Speaker 2: I've just wanted to acknowledge some of the good folk
17:50
Speaker 2: that are making some comments and asking some questions at
17:54
Speaker 2: Joe grap a grap is that conection with all the
18:00
Speaker 2: new defense pieces, no idea how they factor that stuff.
18:04
Speaker 2: That's a great question. I thought that was interesting. So
18:08
Speaker 2: they do have defense projections for each player's defense is projected,
18:15
Speaker 2: and that goes into their war projection, but I'm not
18:18
Speaker 2: sure exactly how fine tuned and how quickly they catch
18:21
Speaker 2: up now Zach's Zach's projections that I just read off
18:26
Speaker 2: certainly do not account for Nolan Arnatto playing third and
18:31
Speaker 2: Carlo Santana playing first because they haven't updated it yet. Now.
18:36
Speaker 2: I also don't know what stadium they're pegging him to,
18:38
Speaker 2: probably Chase Field, so once the deal is official and
18:42
Speaker 2: Fangrass updates, those might change a little bit. So if
18:46
Speaker 2: you're curious about that, what I would suggest is go
18:50
Speaker 2: to his Fangrass page, screenshot the projections portion, and then
18:55
Speaker 2: circle back in a few days and see if they
18:57
Speaker 2: changed it all. They may not, but that's a really
19:00
Speaker 2: great question, and I was wondering about that as well,
19:03
Speaker 2: whether or not, you know, the improved infield defense should
19:06
Speaker 2: help him. We'll see how much improved it ultimately is
19:11
Speaker 2: once the season gets underway.
19:14
Speaker 1: Ryan referenced your your Twitter poll, Jack on who the
19:18
Speaker 1: opening day's starter will be, so maybe we hit that
19:21
Speaker 1: topic real quick. You put this out about an hour ago.
19:27
Speaker 1: Who will be the Diamondbacks opening day starter? The option
19:30
Speaker 1: Zach Gallon, Mary Kelly, or someone else. This is fascinating
19:33
Speaker 1: to me. Thirty seven point nine percent said Zach Gallen,
19:36
Speaker 1: fifty six point one percent Mary Kelly, and then six
19:40
Speaker 1: point one percent someone else. I slightly leaned toward Mary
19:45
Speaker 1: Kelly here because even though Zach Gallen has kind of
19:50
Speaker 1: been the guy over Mary Kelly for most of their
19:54
Speaker 1: Diamondbacks tenure. I think the d Backs also are looking
19:59
Speaker 1: at numbers from twenty twenty five and like, are they
20:02
Speaker 1: going to start a Guyn opening day who just had
20:03
Speaker 1: an ERA almost of almost five.
20:05
Speaker 2: I don't.
20:06
Speaker 1: My guess is they won't. My guess is they'll start
20:09
Speaker 1: Meryll Kelly on opening day. Of course, there's a case
20:11
Speaker 1: for Ryan Nelson too. I don't think it's gonna be
20:14
Speaker 1: Ryan Nelson, though, it's probably one of these two guys.
20:16
Speaker 1: And I think I leaned toward Meryll Kelly.
20:19
Speaker 2: Yeah. By the way, the polls updated, We're up to
20:21
Speaker 2: three hundred and sixty seven votes since fifty Meryll thirty
20:26
Speaker 2: eight point four percent Sack and six point five percent
20:29
Speaker 2: someone else.
20:31
Speaker 1: So so get in on the poll, everybody, let us
20:33
Speaker 1: let us know what you think, or just tell us
20:35
Speaker 1: in the chat. That works too. We're curious, what what
20:38
Speaker 1: do you think?
20:39
Speaker 2: Jack? I think he'll they'll go with Meryl, but it's
20:44
Speaker 2: impossible to say. I mean, who knows. With Tory and
20:46
Speaker 2: some of the ways he does some of this stuff.
20:49
Speaker 2: I defend him a lot, but that was pretty annoying
20:51
Speaker 2: last year. He did that whole thing with Burns and
20:54
Speaker 2: Gallon and so hopefully you know, he won't put himself
20:58
Speaker 2: and everybody else through it or nonsense this year, and
21:03
Speaker 2: look to look to the early you know, set up
21:06
Speaker 2: and we'll start counting the days. I don't know if
21:09
Speaker 2: this deal is going to be official by tomorrow. I
21:10
Speaker 2: mean it's pending physical. Tomorrow's Saturday. We may have to
21:13
Speaker 2: wait until Monday or something for this to be official.
21:17
Speaker 2: It would be nice if it was official before Sunday,
21:21
Speaker 2: because you know, the Sunday's full squad workouts and we're
21:25
Speaker 2: all going to be out there Sunday, so you know,
21:28
Speaker 2: we'll get to talk to to Mike and Tory and
21:31
Speaker 2: kind of figure out what's going on. Hopefully Zach's going
21:34
Speaker 2: to be in there. Our good friend Alex Weiner said,
21:36
Speaker 2: come to think of it, there was an empty locker
21:39
Speaker 2: in the locker room, so that's that's good stuff. And so,
21:43
Speaker 2: you know, well, we'll see how how long this takes.
21:45
Speaker 2: They still haven't made the Paul Seawald signing official, so
21:50
Speaker 2: you know, we'll we'll just have to see how quickly
21:53
Speaker 2: the doctors can work through this. I think the team
21:56
Speaker 2: is probably going to push to get it done because
21:59
Speaker 2: I think that they're going to want everybody out there.
22:02
Speaker 1: I mean, we were talking about it earlier this week,
22:04
Speaker 1: Jack that we thought Zach Gallon would sign soon, and
22:07
Speaker 1: that we thought he should sign soon because the last
22:10
Speaker 1: thing he needs is to be delayed in spring training.
22:13
Speaker 1: We've seen that really not work out well for some
22:15
Speaker 1: pictures in recent years. So I don't know if that
22:18
Speaker 1: has anything any impact on the urgency when it comes
22:22
Speaker 1: to the physical and everything. But yeah, you figure that
22:24
Speaker 1: dbacks probably want to probably want to get that done
22:27
Speaker 1: as soon as possible.
22:28
Speaker 2: You know, now that I'm thinking about it, this probably
22:31
Speaker 2: gives Tory his out right because the other guys have
22:33
Speaker 2: already thrown you know, plenty of bullpens. I think Merrill's
22:37
Speaker 2: already thrown two two bullpens, you know, since camp opened
22:41
Speaker 2: officially opened. So you know, although Zac has probably been
22:45
Speaker 2: throwing on the side, you know, probably gives Tory some
22:49
Speaker 2: cover to be able to like push him down to
22:52
Speaker 2: fourth or fifth starter to start the season because he's
22:55
Speaker 2: getting in a little late.
22:57
Speaker 1: That's fair, Yeah, like that.
23:00
Speaker 2: Kind of well, you know, he's a little bit behind,
23:01
Speaker 2: so you know, he's got a little Tory's probably got
23:04
Speaker 2: a little cover.
23:04
Speaker 1: Here from a pr standpoint, I'm sure, yeah, that would
23:08
Speaker 1: be that would be nice for him. Well, of course,
23:11
Speaker 1: there are other angles to get into here as well.
23:13
Speaker 1: We referenced Ryan Nelson earlier, and I think we should
23:16
Speaker 1: have the conversation of is Ryan Nelson gonna wind up
23:19
Speaker 1: in the bullpen again? I don't think so. I don't
23:21
Speaker 1: think that's a serious concern that people should have, but
23:24
Speaker 1: somebody theoretically could could wind up in the bullpen, and
23:28
Speaker 1: we definitely will we'll touch on that before we get there, though.
23:33
Speaker 1: We would really appreciate it if all of you who
23:36
Speaker 1: are here in the chat with us, which there's almost
23:38
Speaker 1: one hundred of you, we really appreciate you all hopping
23:41
Speaker 1: in here late on a Friday night being with us.
23:44
Speaker 1: But if all of you would consider hitting that like
23:47
Speaker 1: button for us, that really does does us a huge favor.
23:50
Speaker 1: We'd really appreciate that. And as I said from the
23:52
Speaker 1: top of the show, be sure to subscribe to the channel,
23:55
Speaker 1: hit the bell icon for notifications so you never miss
23:58
Speaker 1: an episode. As well, if you're listening after the fact
24:02
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Speaker 1: you would leave us a five star review there as well.
24:08
Speaker 1: So thank you in advance to all of you for
24:11
Speaker 1: doing those things. And now Jack, we'll dive into the
24:14
Speaker 1: inevitable question of who gets bumped from the starting rotation
24:18
Speaker 1: if anyone. I guess the rooster in the chat just
24:21
Speaker 1: floated the idea of a six man rotation. I don't
24:23
Speaker 1: expect that that will be the case, but I guess
24:26
Speaker 1: it is possible. But of course there are six guys
24:30
Speaker 1: that we have here. Jack, it's basically the same five
24:33
Speaker 1: as last year with Gallen, Kelly, e Rod Fott, Nelson,
24:38
Speaker 1: and then plus Michael Soroka, who was the first move
24:41
Speaker 1: the Diamondbacks made this offseason several months back. Certainly sounded
24:46
Speaker 1: like they wanted to use him in the starting rotation.
24:49
Speaker 1: But at least my starting point in this conversation Jack
24:52
Speaker 1: is if everyone stays healthy through spring training, which I
24:55
Speaker 1: will say is a big if. I don't know if
24:57
Speaker 1: that is a given, but if everyone stays healthy through
24:59
Speaker 1: spring train, it feels like Michael Soroka is probably had
25:02
Speaker 1: to be the bullpen in a swingman swingman sort of role.
25:07
Speaker 2: Yeah, unless they decide they want Ryan Nelson to be
25:09
Speaker 2: the closer.
25:11
Speaker 1: That would be something. I mean, They're not really gonna
25:14
Speaker 1: do that though, right I have trust. I mean, there's
25:20
Speaker 1: there's a case that, like I think Ryan Nelson could
25:24
Speaker 1: be a pretty good closer. I mean, the Diamondbacks before
25:27
Speaker 1: the Corbyn Burns injury, like they were ready to move
25:29
Speaker 1: him into the bullpen, and I don't know if they
25:31
Speaker 1: were gonna have him closed immediately, but I think he
25:33
Speaker 1: could have grown into that role. But even if Ryan
25:36
Speaker 1: Nelson could be a good closer, and for as much
25:39
Speaker 1: as the Diamondbacks need that, I still maintain that. I mean,
25:43
Speaker 1: if a guy can give you a three five ERA
25:45
Speaker 1: for thirty starts, like you would rather have that than
25:49
Speaker 1: a good closer. Even if Ryan Nelson could be could
25:52
Speaker 1: be good in that role as well.
25:54
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, look Mike has said over and over again,
25:57
Speaker 2: and Jesse and I were talking about this as I
25:59
Speaker 2: was driving home. You know, although last year, basically they
26:03
Speaker 2: went into the season with their top six guys all intact.
26:07
Speaker 2: We won't include Jordan Montgomery in the top six. I
26:10
Speaker 2: think he was seventh or eighth anyway, and was slated
26:13
Speaker 2: to be traded had he gotten through spring training healthy.
26:16
Speaker 2: For whatever financial relief they could have gotten. Jordan Montgomery
26:20
Speaker 2: wasn't going to be a diamondback even if he was
26:22
Speaker 2: fully healthy. He wasn't definitely not going to be in
26:24
Speaker 2: the rotation. Anything you heard otherwise was just to keep
26:28
Speaker 2: leverage so that they could, you know, maybe get a
26:31
Speaker 2: decent trade. So, you know, they ended up going with
26:36
Speaker 2: Ryan Nelson to the bullpen last year. After all, they
26:39
Speaker 2: had just extended Brandon Fought and everybody else was getting
26:42
Speaker 2: paid a lot more and there was nobody else to move.
26:44
Speaker 2: So as much as I hated and didn't like that
26:46
Speaker 2: at all, I understood why that happened. This situation is
26:50
Speaker 2: a little bit different. I mean, obviously, you know, look
26:52
Speaker 2: when they signed Michael Soroka, they signed him to be
26:55
Speaker 2: a starting pitcher. The incentives in his deal are tied
26:58
Speaker 2: to you know, I think starts and innings or whatever,
27:02
Speaker 2: and so he's not going to get there. You know,
27:05
Speaker 2: if he's pitching out the bullpen, he's not going to
27:08
Speaker 2: earn those incentives. So he's not going to be a
27:10
Speaker 2: happy camper if he's the one cent to the bullpen.
27:12
Speaker 2: But it certainly seems logical that he would be the
27:15
Speaker 2: one sent I know a lot of people are enamored
27:18
Speaker 2: with the six man rotation idea, but that's not going
27:20
Speaker 2: to happen. We talked about this a lot last year
27:24
Speaker 2: with Mike. You know, the combination of off days sometimes,
27:28
Speaker 2: you know, it's not like with a six man rotation
27:30
Speaker 2: doesn't mean that guys are automatically on you know, five
27:35
Speaker 2: days rest instead of four and all of that. It
27:38
Speaker 2: can turn out to be six or seven or even
27:41
Speaker 2: sometimes eight days. If you ever actually take a spreadsheet
27:44
Speaker 2: and the schedule and try to work out a six
27:46
Speaker 2: man rotation where you don't skip anybody, it gets really
27:52
Speaker 2: messy and pretty quick. So you know, they're not going
27:56
Speaker 2: to do a six man rotation. They don't want to
27:57
Speaker 2: take these guys out of their routines and The only
28:00
Speaker 2: time they'll quote unquote have a six man rotation is
28:03
Speaker 2: sometimes midseason, when guys are tired and everybody needs a
28:07
Speaker 2: few extra days. Sure, they'll insert somebody in there and say, yeah,
28:10
Speaker 2: we're going with a six man rotation, and then two
28:13
Speaker 2: weeks later there's no such thing. So you know, just
28:17
Speaker 2: it's not gonna happen. There's no six man rotation in
28:20
Speaker 2: the only way you're going to have a six man
28:22
Speaker 2: rotation in MLB at this point is if teams just say,
28:26
Speaker 2: all right, screw it. You know, starting pitchers go three
28:28
Speaker 2: four innings and it's to the bullpen.
28:30
Speaker 1: Yeah, we may say, sorry to interrupt, I will say
28:35
Speaker 1: just just real quick that there are certain guys where,
28:38
Speaker 1: if you sign them from Japan, I think teams maybe
28:41
Speaker 1: feel more comfortable with a six man rotation just to
28:44
Speaker 1: give those guys the extra day that they're used to.
28:47
Speaker 1: We've seen that at times. But yeah, by and large,
28:49
Speaker 1: I totally agree with you. It's just not something we
28:51
Speaker 1: see in baseball, and it's particularly not something we've really
28:55
Speaker 1: ever seen the Diamondbacks do you know, maybe one or
28:57
Speaker 1: two turns through the rotation at times, but it's not
29:02
Speaker 1: something that we really see the Diamondbacks do ever beyond that.
29:07
Speaker 2: And I mean they flat out said that they wouldn't.
29:09
Speaker 2: You know, they looked into it, they studied it last year,
29:11
Speaker 2: and they had plenty of good reason to do so,
29:14
Speaker 2: you know, considering all that, almost everybody, the top six
29:18
Speaker 2: guys got through spring training healthy and they didn't do it.
29:21
Speaker 2: So if they weren't going to do it, then they're
29:23
Speaker 2: not going to do it now.
29:25
Speaker 1: I in general, when it comes to the question of
29:28
Speaker 1: who gets bumped, and I recognize that Ryan Nelson has
29:31
Speaker 1: been the odd man out a couple of times now,
29:33
Speaker 1: and it's hard for people to forget that. I acknowledge that,
29:36
Speaker 1: But I think in general it is true. We say
29:40
Speaker 1: it so often, but it is true that you can
29:41
Speaker 1: never have too much starting pitching, particularly with this Diamondbacks
29:45
Speaker 1: team that's really struggled in that area. And it's just
29:49
Speaker 1: not a question while well, I don't know exactly how
29:51
Speaker 1: it will work out, it's not a question that I
29:54
Speaker 1: would be overly worried about if I was a Diamondbacks fan.
29:57
Speaker 1: I mean, if if they have six darting pitchers who
30:00
Speaker 1: are healthy and effective at the same time, like I mean,
30:05
Speaker 1: that's like a thought that's very hard to imagine. Frankly,
30:08
Speaker 1: I mean, with the struggles that Brandon Fott had last year,
30:11
Speaker 1: with the struggles that Wardo Rodriguez has had, you know,
30:14
Speaker 1: the injuries that some of these guys have had, Merrill
30:16
Speaker 1: Kelly aging, Edwardo Rodriguez aging a little bit, with an
30:20
Speaker 1: injury track record. We've talked about Michael Soroka and his
30:23
Speaker 1: injury track record, like, I don't think you're getting two
30:26
Speaker 1: hundred innings from him this year. And I know Corbyn
30:29
Speaker 1: Burns is another factor in this, like you expect to
30:31
Speaker 1: get him back later in the year. But I just
30:34
Speaker 1: wouldn't be worried if I was a fan of this
30:36
Speaker 1: team about like, oh no, now we have too many
30:38
Speaker 1: starting pitchers. It just does not tend to be a
30:41
Speaker 1: real issue. These these things have a way of working
30:44
Speaker 1: themselves out. And as much as I hate to say it,
30:47
Speaker 1: I mean it could be as simple as someone goes
30:49
Speaker 1: down in spring training. You hate to see that, You
30:52
Speaker 1: certainly would hate to see that happen, but you know,
30:55
Speaker 1: you look at the past several years of spring training,
30:58
Speaker 1: like last year, Jordan Montgomery goes down. The year before,
31:01
Speaker 1: Merril Kelly and e Rod go down, Like, we've been
31:05
Speaker 1: doing this long enough to know it's not all that
31:08
Speaker 1: likely to make it through spring training with all your guys,
31:11
Speaker 1: and if somehow you do, like that's great and you'll
31:14
Speaker 1: kind of figure it out from there.
31:17
Speaker 2: For sure. Hey, by the way, Ryan, don't feel bad
31:20
Speaker 2: I missed at Rinjifo signed with the Brewers as well.
31:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, apparently that is a thing which I don't really
31:31
Speaker 1: understand what the Brewers are doing with the Caleb Durbin trade.
31:34
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't really ever understand what the Brewers
31:36
Speaker 1: are doing, and yet they win ninety games a year
31:38
Speaker 1: after year. So I'm sort of done. I'm sort of
31:41
Speaker 1: done questioning them at this point. Although yeah, I didn't
31:43
Speaker 1: really understand the Luis rang GIFA move. But one other
31:48
Speaker 1: thought on this Gallon situation, Jack, is it time to
31:52
Speaker 1: just like stop having payroll conversations at the beginning of
31:57
Speaker 1: the off season, because it feels like, I mean, I
32:00
Speaker 1: know this move when you factor in the deferrals, it's
32:02
Speaker 1: not like the Dbacks are going forty million over what
32:05
Speaker 1: we expected them to spend or anything like that. But
32:08
Speaker 1: I still think we're probably we're probably above the range
32:12
Speaker 1: that we thought this team would end up in or
32:14
Speaker 1: at least I don't know. Maybe I'm wrong with that, Jack,
32:17
Speaker 1: Do you think it's fair to say that at this
32:19
Speaker 1: point that it's that their payroll is a little higher
32:22
Speaker 1: than we thought it would be after this move.
32:24
Speaker 2: Oh, sure, it's a little higher. I mean, look, you
32:26
Speaker 2: know there was always a well maybe they only cut
32:29
Speaker 2: it ten million. There was that, you know, what's reducing payroll? Mean,
32:34
Speaker 2: you know, and in this case they've cut it about
32:36
Speaker 2: ten million at the end of the day. I mean,
32:39
Speaker 2: it depends on how you want to count it, right,
32:41
Speaker 2: are you counting eight million he's getting this year or
32:43
Speaker 2: are you counting all twenty two? Like when I do
32:46
Speaker 2: my charts, even though we have ten million deferred out
32:51
Speaker 2: from corbyn Burns contract, I show the thirty one point seven.
32:55
Speaker 2: So you know, it just really depends on how you
32:58
Speaker 2: want to line it out. I think we still need
33:00
Speaker 2: to track it. I think it's still relevant. We just
33:03
Speaker 2: need to always understand that come the end of the
33:07
Speaker 2: off season, can made, you know, write an extra check
33:10
Speaker 2: that we just didn't see coming. He's consistently done that,
33:14
Speaker 2: and again we go back to that conversation like why
33:16
Speaker 2: not just do that at the beginning, so that Mike
33:19
Speaker 2: has a little bit clearer picture of how he can
33:21
Speaker 2: best allocate his resources. You know, I don't know where
33:25
Speaker 2: he was at this year. I do know that, you know,
33:30
Speaker 2: last year, had they not signed Corbyn Burns, he was
33:33
Speaker 2: probably going to sign a fairly expensive reliever. That that's
33:38
Speaker 2: that was my understanding, you know, That's what I the
33:41
Speaker 2: scuttle butt that I heard from within. I don't know
33:43
Speaker 2: which one, probably one of the ones that got.
33:45
Speaker 1: Hurt, but you know, or was just terrible one one
33:49
Speaker 1: of the two.
33:50
Speaker 2: You know, I think he was going to invest in
33:53
Speaker 2: a higher ticket reliever last year, and then the Corbyn
33:56
Speaker 2: Burns signing came came to fruition, and so that went
33:59
Speaker 2: by the wayside. You know, I don't know if again
34:03
Speaker 2: we go back to sequences, right, you know, if you
34:06
Speaker 2: look at the sequence of events here, I don't think
34:10
Speaker 2: any of it was predictable. If Zach had accepted the
34:13
Speaker 2: qualifying offer right out of the gate, things would have
34:15
Speaker 2: looked different, for.
34:16
Speaker 1: Sure, on that note of the sequence of events. And
34:21
Speaker 1: I know we talked about Ken Kendrick earlier and you know,
34:24
Speaker 1: kind of tip of the cap to him in a
34:25
Speaker 1: situation like this, is the DBACS kind of surprised some people.
34:29
Speaker 1: Yet again, there is this element that we referenced earlier
34:33
Speaker 1: of you know, could Ken Kendrick maybe come out at
34:37
Speaker 1: the beginning of the off season and instead of waiting
34:39
Speaker 1: for situations like this where a player's market falls there's
34:44
Speaker 1: some special circumstance. You know what if he kind of
34:48
Speaker 1: changed his approach and was a little more aggressive on
34:50
Speaker 1: the front end and gave Mike Caysen a little bit
34:53
Speaker 1: more money to spend. I mean, again, I don't want
34:56
Speaker 1: to be like critical of Ken Kendrick in a situation
34:59
Speaker 1: like this, but you could at least imagine a world
35:01
Speaker 1: where he he shifts and operates that way instead. And
35:06
Speaker 1: I guess I'm curious, Jack, like, could the Diamondbacks be
35:11
Speaker 1: a much better team in that world? Like if they
35:13
Speaker 1: knew they had this money from the beginning, could they
35:15
Speaker 1: have played their pieces in a different way to wind
35:18
Speaker 1: up with a much better roster. I don't know if
35:20
Speaker 1: I would say a much better roster, But maybe there's
35:24
Speaker 1: a world where you actually get a closer and you know,
35:28
Speaker 1: you feel a little better about your your bullpen situation.
35:32
Speaker 2: Oh, I'm absolutely Look, if you know what you have
35:34
Speaker 2: to spend. I mean, you know, when it comes to
35:37
Speaker 2: financial and resource allocation, the more accurate information you have upfront,
35:43
Speaker 2: the better job you're going to be able to do.
35:44
Speaker 2: It just goes without saying, Yeah, I'm sure that Mike
35:48
Speaker 2: would prefer that, But at the same time, he's not
35:50
Speaker 2: going to complain about it because at the end of
35:53
Speaker 2: the day, Ken has spent enough money to put a
35:55
Speaker 2: winning team on the field.
35:58
Speaker 1: Yeah, And Mike Kyson has said that year after year
36:02
Speaker 1: after year. He's never really been one to, you know,
36:06
Speaker 1: talk about payroll publicly as a limitation, which, granted, from
36:10
Speaker 1: a pr standpoint, like you can't really do that as
36:12
Speaker 1: a GM, you know, you can't really put your your
36:15
Speaker 1: owner on blast even if you wanted to. But I
36:18
Speaker 1: genuinely think that's like where Mike Kyson stands is the Diamondbacks.
36:22
Speaker 1: They're not spending as much as other teams, certainly not
36:25
Speaker 1: the Dodgers, which have been a big topic around the
36:28
Speaker 1: game here in recent days. But yeah, they're I mean,
36:31
Speaker 1: they're spending, They're they're holding their own when it comes
36:33
Speaker 1: to to spending and you know, being able to put
36:36
Speaker 1: a decent product on the field.
36:38
Speaker 2: Yeah. So last year, you know, I had them about
36:41
Speaker 2: one hundred and ninety five give or take opening day,
36:46
Speaker 2: and they were at one hundred and seventy two as
36:48
Speaker 2: of just a little bit ago, and then they signed
36:51
Speaker 2: Paul Seawald, bring up to about one hundred and seventy three,
36:56
Speaker 2: you know, just to give or take. So if you
36:58
Speaker 2: just take the eight million that Zack skidding this year,
37:01
Speaker 2: then that's that's one hundred and eighty one. If you
37:05
Speaker 2: want to count the full net present value of eighteen,
37:09
Speaker 2: then it's right up around on one ninety one ninety one,
37:11
Speaker 2: so just barely under last year. So just depends on
37:15
Speaker 2: how you want to count it. You know, they're the
37:17
Speaker 2: ones that said that they were going to spend less,
37:20
Speaker 2: and you know, they looks like they spent a little
37:23
Speaker 2: bit less, but at most they reduced it only about
37:26
Speaker 2: ten million, and they're not done yet.
37:29
Speaker 1: Yeah. I was just going to say, we got a
37:33
Speaker 1: tweet from Gambo earlier today. Is a great, great segue.
37:37
Speaker 1: A tweet from Gambo earlier today that said the Diamondbacks
37:39
Speaker 1: are working towards adding a utility player to replace recently
37:43
Speaker 1: traded Blaze Alexander, with that player most likely coming via
37:47
Speaker 1: trade and using minor league depth, and we you and
37:53
Speaker 1: I think have been following Gambo's reporting long enough to
37:56
Speaker 1: know that when he speaks in these terms, it you
38:00
Speaker 1: feel very confident, something like I feel quite confident something
38:03
Speaker 1: is going to happen when Gambo uses, you know, using
38:08
Speaker 1: their their minor league depth. It was maybe a little
38:11
Speaker 1: easier earlier to figure out who the d Backs were
38:15
Speaker 1: going to trade. We sort of were able to do
38:17
Speaker 1: that with Blaize Alexander compared to Tim Tawa or Jordan Lawler.
38:22
Speaker 1: We had a sense they had some depth when it
38:25
Speaker 1: came to utility players, and so it felt like Blaze
38:28
Speaker 1: Alexander was the trade candidate that made the most sense there.
38:32
Speaker 1: But here Gambo is a little more vague in just
38:34
Speaker 1: his minor league depth. So my guess, if I had
38:37
Speaker 1: to guess, was they're maybe willing to trade a pitcher.
38:41
Speaker 1: Not that the d Bacs have an excess of starting pitching,
38:45
Speaker 1: certainly not, but you feel a little better about your
38:48
Speaker 1: starting pitching depth after getting Zach Gallen, and they do
38:52
Speaker 1: have more depth of young starters who are relatively close
38:55
Speaker 1: to the majors than they've had before. And not that
38:58
Speaker 1: you ever really want to deal with those guys, but
39:01
Speaker 1: you got to give something to get something, and you
39:04
Speaker 1: can talk yourself into that being an area of depth
39:07
Speaker 1: that they could trade from.
39:09
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you know, if you look in spring training camp,
39:11
Speaker 2: I mean, how many guys are there that are legit
39:16
Speaker 2: possibilities to play shortstop behind Heraldo Padomo Because you have
39:20
Speaker 2: to have a guy that's at least capable of playing
39:23
Speaker 2: a few games here and there. I mean Podomo, Yeah,
39:25
Speaker 2: you played one hundred and sixty one games. Say you
39:27
Speaker 2: can't count on that every year, and they really shouldn't
39:30
Speaker 2: grind him into the ground quite that hard in my opinion.
39:35
Speaker 2: So you know, you have Jordan Lawler can play shortstop,
39:38
Speaker 2: and you have Eldemar Vargus, who's not even on the
39:40
Speaker 2: forty man roster play shortstop. I mean a few other guys,
39:43
Speaker 2: a couple other NRIs non roster invitees that can play
39:48
Speaker 2: a little shortstop too. But I would have to think
39:51
Speaker 2: that if they're trading for a utility player, it's got
39:54
Speaker 2: to be somebody that they feel confident can play back
39:57
Speaker 2: up shortstop. I mean, if it's not, then the and
40:00
Speaker 2: I guess it's just Jordan is the guy, you know
40:03
Speaker 2: to back up Pedomo and which case, Like, so are
40:07
Speaker 2: we really concentrating on putting him in center field? Like
40:10
Speaker 2: it just seems like another recipe for confusion and not
40:14
Speaker 2: putting Jordan in the best situation to succeed. So I
40:19
Speaker 2: don't really want to see that. Like, I think that
40:22
Speaker 2: if they want Jordan Lawler to play in the outfield,
40:25
Speaker 2: then make him an outfielder. Let him focus on that.
40:27
Speaker 2: I know that they're going to split some time on
40:29
Speaker 2: the dirt in spring training, but they said most of
40:32
Speaker 2: his time would be in the outfield. Of course, if
40:34
Speaker 2: he needs to step into the infield in an emergency situation,
40:38
Speaker 2: but he should not be the primary backup shortstop if
40:41
Speaker 2: they want him to play center field, I mean, give
40:45
Speaker 2: the guy a chance. Yeah, stop scrolling with him.
40:50
Speaker 1: That's a fair point. I hadn't really thought of it
40:52
Speaker 1: that way. I kind of figured, like, hey, Perdomo can
40:55
Speaker 1: start ninety five percent of games, and if you need
40:59
Speaker 1: someone to just step in every once in a while,
41:01
Speaker 1: Jordan Lawler could do it if he had to. But
41:04
Speaker 1: you're right, like, if you're really wanting to invest in
41:07
Speaker 1: Jordan Lawler as an outfielder and make his life as
41:10
Speaker 1: simple as possible, there's a case to be made that
41:12
Speaker 1: you should just kind of forget the shortstop thing and
41:15
Speaker 1: make it more of an emergency situation than anything else,
41:18
Speaker 1: and go find you someone else can who can play
41:21
Speaker 1: that position. It's hard for me to know. The rooster says,
41:26
Speaker 1: please don't trade Daniel Egan. My guess is this wouldn't
41:29
Speaker 1: the d Bacs wouldn't go there. Again. Gambo used the
41:33
Speaker 1: phrase minor league depth, which, yeah, I guess. I don't
41:36
Speaker 1: know if that means like guys who are right on
41:38
Speaker 1: the verge of the majors, or maybe he's talking about
41:41
Speaker 1: depth that at like the lower levels of the miners.
41:44
Speaker 1: So yeah, I would be pretty surprised if they traded
41:47
Speaker 1: a pitching prospect the caliber of Egan. But the they
41:50
Speaker 1: have a number of guys, including the guys they got
41:53
Speaker 1: in the Merrill Kelly trade in in July, that you
41:56
Speaker 1: know they have. They have some guys in that camp
41:59
Speaker 1: who are who are close and that would have some
42:01
Speaker 1: value for other teams that that they could they could
42:04
Speaker 1: maybe deal away.
42:06
Speaker 2: Yeah, so Alex down here at the bottom of the chat, No,
42:11
Speaker 2: Tommy Troy is not an option shortstop.
42:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, not anymore. It doesn't seem like they've been really
42:16
Speaker 1: into that for for a little while now. Yeah, I
42:22
Speaker 1: guess another another storyline that that came out today. Jack
42:26
Speaker 1: Gambo tweeted about Lordis Guriel Junior and the fact that
42:30
Speaker 1: he could spend significant time at d H, which is
42:33
Speaker 1: something I hadn't I hadn't thought about too much, which
42:36
Speaker 1: I mean, it makes sense, right, you're coming off a
42:39
Speaker 1: pretty significant injury with with the a c L. Maybe
42:42
Speaker 1: you want to just not have him be on his
42:44
Speaker 1: feet all that often. And the DBAC certainly at d H,
42:47
Speaker 1: I mean, they have they have questions there, right, We've
42:50
Speaker 1: we've kind of made the assumption that Peven Smith maybe
42:53
Speaker 1: would would get some time at at d H. Adrian
42:56
Speaker 1: Delcasto's well, but certainly when it comes to facing left
43:01
Speaker 1: handed pitching, Lordis Garyel Junior could could totally slide in
43:05
Speaker 1: a DH. He's hit left these pretty well throughout his career,
43:08
Speaker 1: and even in twenty twenty five as well, he had
43:11
Speaker 1: left these. He had left these pretty well, even though
43:13
Speaker 1: it was kind of a kind of a down season
43:15
Speaker 1: for him.
43:16
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, it's funny. As you were talking, I
43:18
Speaker 2: popped open my spreadsheet that I haven't gone back to
43:21
Speaker 2: for a few weeks because I need to update it, obviously,
43:24
Speaker 2: but I kind of track where I think the playing
43:27
Speaker 2: time is going to shake out. And I originally had
43:31
Speaker 2: lordis starting about eighty seven games, actually getting starts in
43:34
Speaker 2: the eighties. That doesn't include pinch hit opportunities and so
43:37
Speaker 2: forth like that. So, you know, based on the fact
43:41
Speaker 2: that he looks to be coming back earlier than I
43:43
Speaker 2: had projected, I mean, I figured he would be out
43:46
Speaker 2: the first two months of the season and come back
43:49
Speaker 2: in June, you know, and things seem to be trending
43:52
Speaker 2: for a mid or late April return. I mean, you know,
43:56
Speaker 2: he's like, I'm going to be ready opening day and
43:58
Speaker 2: Tori's like, you know, hold the phone here, guys know
44:00
Speaker 2: that's not going to happen. But you know, maybe he's
44:03
Speaker 2: back by May one the way things are trending for him.
44:06
Speaker 2: We'll see. But I had eighteen games at d H
44:11
Speaker 2: amongst his eighty seven started, so I was already thinking that,
44:15
Speaker 2: you know, a not insignificant number of starts for him
44:18
Speaker 2: would be at d AH. Now, based on what Gambo's saying,
44:22
Speaker 2: you know, it seems like that would be more of
44:24
Speaker 2: like an early on situation like the first month, three
44:28
Speaker 2: or four times a week, he's going to DH and
44:30
Speaker 2: then eventually transition to the outfield. So you know, the
44:34
Speaker 2: next time I do my playing time projection, I'll probably
44:38
Speaker 2: bump orders up to one hundred hundred and ten games started,
44:41
Speaker 2: and I'll probably put thirty of those games at Dhe
44:44
Speaker 2: I think he's still going to play outfield, but they'll
44:47
Speaker 2: they'll be in a position to slow play it if
44:49
Speaker 2: they need to.
44:51
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I think that makes a lot of sense. Here,
44:54
Speaker 1: here's a random question for a jack, and then at
44:57
Speaker 1: some point we'll end this stream and get out of here.
44:59
Speaker 1: But you mentioned earlier that Chris Bassett got basically the
45:04
Speaker 1: same contract as Zach Gallen. Right, Gallen is one and
45:07
Speaker 1: a little over twenty two, but with the deferrals, it's
45:10
Speaker 1: basically one in around eighteen we think, and Bassett got
45:14
Speaker 1: one in eighteen with with some incentives which I think
45:18
Speaker 1: could bring it up to eighteen point five something like that.
45:20
Speaker 1: So basically the same contract. Would you rather have Chris
45:24
Speaker 1: Bassett than bring back Zach Gallen? Chris Bassett again the
45:28
Speaker 1: last few years has been sin I accidentally make Jack
45:33
Speaker 1: smaller on the screen. This is the wonderful world of technology.
45:39
Speaker 1: All Right, there we go. Jack is back to back
45:41
Speaker 1: to normal size. All right. As I was saying, Chris
45:45
Speaker 1: Bassett has been kind of the model of consistency the
45:48
Speaker 1: past few years. He had a much better twenty twenty
45:50
Speaker 1: five season than Gallon, with a three nine six ERA
45:53
Speaker 1: four one six the year before and one hundred and
45:55
Speaker 1: seventy one innings three six zero ERA in twenty twenty
45:58
Speaker 1: three in two innings. Uh So, Jack, what do you
46:02
Speaker 1: what do you think would you have preferred the DBAC
46:04
Speaker 1: spend basically the same money on Chris Bassett instead.
46:10
Speaker 2: I mean, that's an interesting question. I don't have an
46:13
Speaker 2: answer for that at the moment because fancrasts won't come up.
46:19
Speaker 2: I wanted to look at his projection. I was just
46:21
Speaker 2: curious what it came up to. I mean, you know,
46:24
Speaker 2: he look he looked pretty good in the postseason. You know,
46:26
Speaker 2: sometimes he looked pretty pretty DWN effective And you know
46:31
Speaker 2: it was up and down with Zach last year, right,
46:32
Speaker 2: so familiar reality sometimes for his contempt And I hate
46:36
Speaker 2: to use those words, but the point being is, you know,
46:39
Speaker 2: when a guy's going great, we tend to overrate them.
46:42
Speaker 2: He's our guy. When a guy's struggling. We tend to
46:44
Speaker 2: underrate them. He stinks. Get him out of here. You know,
46:47
Speaker 2: everybody kind of has that a little bit of that
46:51
Speaker 2: going on. The one thing, you know, I just want
46:53
Speaker 2: to reiterate, and we talked about this at the end
46:57
Speaker 2: of last season, is Zach that's a stand up guy,
47:01
Speaker 2: right Like, you know, he's been a good teammate, he's
47:03
Speaker 2: been a good Arizona diamondback. And every time we went
47:08
Speaker 2: to his locker and talked to him, he never ducked
47:10
Speaker 2: a question. You know, he never like he talks about
47:14
Speaker 2: what's going on, but he's not making excuses. He took
47:17
Speaker 2: ownership when he didn't go well, that speaks for a lot.
47:21
Speaker 2: You know. They know the character of the man, and
47:25
Speaker 2: so I think that that counts for something here. I
47:28
Speaker 2: don't know anything about Chris Bassett. I do know the
47:31
Speaker 2: character of Zach, and so in this case, I think
47:34
Speaker 2: it's probably the right move for them to just bring
47:36
Speaker 2: him back. And I think that they got a good
47:39
Speaker 2: chance of getting a really effective season out of him.
47:41
Speaker 2: He's certainly going to be motivated, you know, to go
47:44
Speaker 2: get his bag next year. And you know, with the
47:47
Speaker 2: comfort level of being in an organization he knows, and
47:49
Speaker 2: the stadium he knows with pardon me, with fans he knows,
47:54
Speaker 2: you know, and with his wife and family here, I
47:58
Speaker 2: think a lot of things line up well for him, So,
48:00
Speaker 2: you know, best for luck to him. You know, it
48:03
Speaker 2: would be great if he has just a kick ass
48:05
Speaker 2: season and pitches the Dbacks back into the postseason. You know,
48:10
Speaker 2: nobody wants to see that more than us. And again,
48:13
Speaker 2: I just Zack's been a good guy and so I
48:16
Speaker 2: think we all need to acknowledge that.
48:19
Speaker 1: I think for me, I would probably also say Zach.
48:22
Speaker 1: And it's because Chris Bassett might have a higher chance
48:27
Speaker 1: of giving you, you know, like a sub four er
48:32
Speaker 1: just given his recent track record. Maybe I'm not totally
48:35
Speaker 1: convinced of that, but Chris Bassett has been steadier the
48:38
Speaker 1: past few years. But Zach Gallen has the higher ceiling,
48:42
Speaker 1: certainly at this stage in his career. Like I could
48:44
Speaker 1: imagine Zach Gallen going out and having a you know,
48:49
Speaker 1: ace like sort of season. I don't think it's likely. Again,
48:52
Speaker 1: it's not the baseline expectation for him, but I can
48:55
Speaker 1: envision a world where that happens, where he goes out
48:57
Speaker 1: and just has an awesome year and is able to
49:00
Speaker 1: really get paid next offseason. It's hard to imagine that
49:03
Speaker 1: with Chris Bassett. I mean, Chris Bassett is thirty six
49:06
Speaker 1: years old going on his age thirty seven season, and
49:09
Speaker 1: if you're the d Backs right now, like, yes, you
49:12
Speaker 1: do need stability as well. That also is a good thing,
49:15
Speaker 1: but you also need some breakouts. Like the only way, frankly,
49:20
Speaker 1: the only way this Diamondbacks team is gonna get where
49:23
Speaker 1: they want to go is if a few guys kind
49:25
Speaker 1: of come out of nowhere and are just awesome, right Like,
49:28
Speaker 1: You're gonna need a few of those to happen. Not
49:31
Speaker 1: everyone on the roster, but you're gonna need a few
49:32
Speaker 1: of those. And so I think for this team in
49:35
Speaker 1: this situation, it makes sense for them to chase ceiling
49:39
Speaker 1: for them, for them to chase a guy who has
49:41
Speaker 1: a chance to go out there and be really, really good,
49:44
Speaker 1: even if you're not necessarily expecting that. So that's where
49:48
Speaker 1: that's where I stand on this. I also did find
49:50
Speaker 1: the Fangrafts projection for Bassett looks like looks like Zips
49:54
Speaker 1: has him at a four oh five ERA and Steamer
49:56
Speaker 1: has him at four point three zero. So pretty pretty
50:00
Speaker 1: similar to Gallen in that regard.
50:02
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I finally got mine to pull up too.
50:04
Speaker 2: So four point one eight on the average one point
50:08
Speaker 2: nine WAR versus two point four for Zach, So you know,
50:12
Speaker 2: point zero point two runs in point five War. That's
50:15
Speaker 2: the difference of their projection, which is reasonable. I mean,
50:19
Speaker 2: you know, it's fewer innings. I mean, they're projecting Zach
50:22
Speaker 2: one hundred and ninety one innings in Bass at one
50:24
Speaker 2: hundred and seventy one seventy four.
50:28
Speaker 1: So yeah. The fact that Zach Gallen only got a
50:33
Speaker 1: one year contract though Jack is still just I mean,
50:36
Speaker 1: it is a thirty year old pitcher, right, I mean,
50:38
Speaker 1: this just doesn't happen. I know he's coming off a
50:40
Speaker 1: rough season, certainly that played an enormous impact, but a
50:44
Speaker 1: thirty year old was Zach Allen's track record, even coming
50:48
Speaker 1: off a down year. The fact that he took a
50:50
Speaker 1: one year contract is this is gonna blow my mind
50:53
Speaker 1: for for a little while.
50:56
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, he's you know, he's got the opportunity to
50:59
Speaker 2: turn around and have a good season and still going
51:02
Speaker 2: to fre free agency at the age of thirty one
51:05
Speaker 2: and go get a five year, two hundred million dollar
51:07
Speaker 2: deal if he has a great season, so you know,
51:10
Speaker 2: go for it, Zach, you can do it.
51:13
Speaker 1: Well. Happy Gallantine's Day to all of you, all of
51:16
Speaker 1: you in the chat. I've been waiting to pull that
51:18
Speaker 1: pun out this whole time Grant did. It was also
51:21
Speaker 1: on the thumbnail if you're joining us on YouTube, so
51:23
Speaker 1: maybe maybe you've already seen it, but but yes, we
51:27
Speaker 1: appreciate all of you for being here in the chat,
51:30
Speaker 1: interacting with us, sticking around throughout the duration of this episode.
51:35
Speaker 1: As always, we'd really appreciate it if you would hit
51:38
Speaker 1: the like button here on YouTube, subscribe to our channel,
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Speaker 1: hit the bell icon, get notifications, make sure you never
51:45
Speaker 1: miss an episode. If you're joining us on an audio
51:47
Speaker 1: only platform after the fact, we'd also really appreciate it
51:51
Speaker 1: if you would leave us a five star review. You
51:53
Speaker 1: can find us on social media. I am at Jesse
51:55
Speaker 1: and Friedman on Twitter. Jack is at sho Wizard fifty nine.
51:58
Speaker 1: The show is at same territory, and of course Jack
52:02
Speaker 1: does a great job covering the Arizona Diamondbacks over at
52:05
Speaker 1: Arizona Diamondbacks on SI Jack any final thoughts here as
52:09
Speaker 1: we close out this emergency edition of Snake's Territory.
52:15
Speaker 2: I've got some work to do. I gotta go rework
52:18
Speaker 2: some projections and payroll numbers and playing time numbers. I
52:22
Speaker 2: think we're getting pretty close to dial in a few
52:24
Speaker 2: things in.
52:25
Speaker 1: Well, we've said it before, expect the unexpected when it
52:28
Speaker 1: comes to the Arizona Diamondbacks, and they did it once
52:32
Speaker 1: again as Zachallen returns to the Diamondbacks on a one
52:34
Speaker 1: year deal for a little over twenty two million dollars
52:37
Speaker 1: little under twenty million when you factor in the deferrals.
52:40
Speaker 1: Fascinating move from them. Be good to see Zach Gallen
52:43
Speaker 1: out at the ballpark, hopefully here in a few days
52:46
Speaker 1: when you and I are both out there. And of
52:49
Speaker 1: course we'll be back with with more coverage here soon
52:52
Speaker 1: on Snake's Territories. I said before, be sure to hit
52:54
Speaker 1: the like button on your way out, subscribe to our channel.
52:56
Speaker 1: We really appreciate your support and we'll be back another
53:00
Speaker 1: edition of Snake's Territory very very soon.
53:14
Speaker 2: Hm.