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Thomas Nagy and Paul Meenan on the latest with EV... · The Electrical Show

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  The Electrical Show with Thomas Najie sponsored by BOSH Professional Powerful power Tools to measuring
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  tools and experts accessories. Welcome to the Electrical Show here on Fixed Radio with
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  none other than BOSH Professional on Thomas Najie and joining me in the studio once
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  again is old friend Paul Meenan, I mean not physically old, just old
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  friends in you know, the offenses. Paul is well known, as you
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  know in the industry. His knowledge is second to none. We just we
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  bask in his knowledge. So today we are going to talking on the show
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  about e V and we're going to be talking about the rollout of EV charge
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  points across country, some of the missteps that have already been made, and
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  what kind of money essentially you can make from installing these charge pods, and
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  just talking also generally whether we think it's actually as environmentally friendly as we it's
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  touted to be. Brace yourself, this give me a contravert fy. We
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  don't thinking sa environmentally friendly. The Electrical Show on Fixed Radio. I am
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  Thomas Nagie with Paul mean And on the Electrical Show, and today we are
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  looking at the rollout of ev across the UK and how well it's gone so
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  far. Now, Paul, remind everyone what are the government's aims here long
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  term? It's good to be back, by the way, that's a good
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  question. What is the government aim It's more of a sort of target range,
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  you know. Yeah, well, obviously we've got this by twenty twenty
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  five. The goal is to try and divert more efforts into green technology than
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  oil or carbon based technology. So then we've got our net zero and twenty
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  thirty and twenty fifty targets, which at the moment, I think it's fair
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  to say we're behind, but we are seeing this massive uptake in electric vehicle
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  technology electric vehicle installs. Weirdly enough, a lot of the cynical sparkis in
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  the industry will just say that the common comment, which is the networks can't
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  take it, but they are trying their best to upgrade. But I think
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  at the moment it's a it's a bit of a gold rush to want to
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  shive you. And with every industry gold rush, like the ICR to the
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  bottom, it's the race to the bottom. And I know more electricians who
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  don't want to touch it than I do are installing it. What about some
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  of the glaring issues in in sort of EV as a whole. I think
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  the one elephant in the room that the industry doesn't want to talk about is
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  the whole compliance of these products. We have obviously a new technology, it's
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  come out from multiple manufacturers, which is freedom of trade for evenom a movement,
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  but we've now got incidents where there are EV chargers which I've just recently
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  purchased my first one, which turns out is potentially suffering a recall in Europe,
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  which obviously they sell across Europe, and lots of arguments between the manufacturers
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  and what is a compliant charger and obviously the safety of them given some of
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  the technology monitors the supply network. That's a whole nother podcast in itself.
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  We're going to try and keep this on track here because this is it's a
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  massive topic which we could try and create about drift into a rant. Yeah,
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  we could. We could drift into about three different shows of this.
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  So we're going to try and keep it on track. But how about the
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  impact in the electrical sector in terms of because like you said, there's a
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  lot of arguing between manufacturers about what is actually the right joan that the right
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  technology to have in the right way that it should be done, which I
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  guess we'll smooth out as years go on. I think the biggest change in
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  the last twelve months is the City and Gills acknowledgement of mean because they've altered
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  all of that. Well, yeah, I did the two nine one two
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  course, which was the EV installer course, and I thought, great,
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  I'm now qualified to install same and and then about four months later I've got
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  an email gan throw it in the bin. There are three new courses coming
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  out of three different levels and difficulties for domestic, commercial, industrial and design,
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  and so now I'm of the view of I now need to retrain because
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  maybe the training wasn't suitable and sufficient. They're obviously doing it for a reason.
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  If they've introduced three new seating gills to replace one, there is a
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  massive problem out there. And you've only got to look at the government audits
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  that are done yearly to see the amount of defects on installations that are independently
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  assessed to see there is still a problems getting better, but there's still some
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  very poor installs going on out there. Well, let's talk about some of
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  what's gone Well, if any so far and also what opportunities there are for
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  sparks out there to make money if any from EV The Electrical Show with Thomas
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  Naji. You're listening to The Electrical Show Thomas Naji and if you've just tuned
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  in, me and my good friend here, Paul Men and we're back here
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  in the seats in the hot seats talking about the rollout of EV here in
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  the UK and essentially whether we're on the right track to meet the government's aims
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  of making smart charging commonplace in the home, in the Workyardada by twenty twenty
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  five. Paul, what do you expect we're going to achieve I guess by
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  twenty twenty five because I don't think we're on track. But when you just
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  said that, do you remember when you were a kid and you had to
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  scale electrics and you could pull the trigger and it was a little electric car,
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  and the more you pulled on the trigger, the more it went faster
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  and it went off the track. I can see the more we heavily push
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  EV, the more we're eventually going to have. Instance. One of the
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  biggest challenges I know of EV at the moment is it's being rolled out at
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  such a pace, which I'm not against EV and the rollout and electric vehicles
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  in general, but it's rolled out in such a pace. We're not considering
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  that the other side of the coin, which is the fire safety. So
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  you go around in London you see loads and loads and loads of a basement
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  garages and stuff. And I've even spoke to the London five Brigade about this.
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  There are more and more EV fires in London now in garages and these
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  things ain't easy to put to put out, we know you have to pick
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  them up and dunk them in a tank, yeah, just to move them.
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  They're changing. I was in was at West Hampster the other day and
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  I was there. If you go past West Hampstead Station, they have their
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  trucks outside and I was lucky enough to talk to one of them. They're
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  kitting out some of their trucks and it's just like for EV because they've got
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  to do something when they turn up to these car fires and stuff. A
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  normal water bowser isn't it's not going to work. If we applied a percentage
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  to EV rollout, we could say weird. I don't know forty percent rolled
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  out fire safety we're about four percent. We're running ahead of a new technology.
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  And it's the same with scoot as all these other battery driven systems.
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  Electricians. If you're going to do this and you don't want to come back,
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  you may need to consider a lot more on the fire safety side of
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  things. All right, I know we're giving this a very sort of dark
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  being honest. Yeah, what's gone, salesman, what's gone? Well,
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  well, that was a quick conversation the parlement to keep it is balanced here
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  because I've also got my own opinion. I'll be honest. I'm not sold
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  that EV is as green. I just not sold that this is green.
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  It is made out to be, but it's going to be a very buyers
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  show if we just say it's not. Let's put it into context. Electric
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  vehicles have been around for decades. Look at your old milkfloat when you're a
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  kid. That was a battery driven cart with with milk bottles on the back,
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  an old in I've got images in nineteen when they started to get rid
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  of horses to do distribution, they actually had electric vehicles. So I've got
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  images from Saint Pancras station with a fleet of battery charged vehicles. EV is
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  not new battery storage is not new. It goes back to the late eighteenth
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  century. The troubles is the modern technology and the way stuff is mass produced,
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  the quality of it, and our inability to handle it, and consider
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  fire safety, and consider where we're parking things. And you now you can
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  easily google just battery fires and just be overwhelmed by so how much there are
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  but the benefit of certain I'm not going to knock the people who've got an
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  ev and go. Do you know what this has benefited me? This has
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  benefited my business and my domestic life. There are lots of people who love
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  ev car and they benefit them. But I ain't rich. I can't afford
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  an EV car to anessoe. And I think at the moment a lot of
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  people are being priced off of the roads, whether it be u Les or
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  some other, charge out of their petron and diesel into a technology that to
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  me still isn't proven, especially not for tradesmen. What about opportunities then,
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  because for electrical contractors there is still room to make money in this. But
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  obviously in new build homes they get fitted as standards to whoever the part of
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  the electrician is wiring that they fit that as standard, But what other opportunities
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  are we looking at? So I think from a growth perspective, I mean,
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  every domestic installer will always have the opportunity to at least passively put a
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  cable in and sell when they're doing a bore change in evy install I think
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  the domestic market has got a good growth to it. There is still that
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  race to the bottom. But for me, commercial in industrial, what excites
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  me about these new city and guilds is the opportunity for people to go in
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  work for a main contractor and actually start doing some commercial stuff where you can
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  get all the groundwork done and you can do the fix it, bolt it,
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  cable it, test it, etc. So I think there is a
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  market in the commercial industrial, but again it's the appetite of the installers whether
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  they want to grow out of the domestic market into the commercial and industrial world.
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  But I think they need to have the qualifications. There's evidently a problem.
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  These qualifications would not come out if there wasn't a problem. I mean,
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  it does the fact that they've stopped that the qualification we both took and
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  they've introduced these ones does indicate that there is obviously the powers that be a
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  concerned there is a lack of I was qualified and competent for many months and
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  now I'm not because that course isn't deemed good enough by the City and Guild.
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  So well, look, coming up, let's talk about how the public
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  charge points setup is working. The Electrical Show with Thomas Najie on fixed Radio
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  the Builders Station. This is the electrical show here on fixed radio with Bosch
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  professional Thomas Najie with Paul Meanan here, and we are talking about the rollout
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  of EV across the country this afternoon. Now in the last link, if
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  you were listening, we were talking about the or we're just talking about EV.
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  And I just want to drop this into conversation because I just it's bugging
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  me. You try why I mentioned I'm trying to keep this balanced, but
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  I mentioned that I'm not convinced that EVA is quite as green as as it's
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  made out to be. Because if you look at any billboard for any manufacturer,
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  any vehicle brand, you'll always see, you know, there's a husband,
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  a wife and a kid and they're looking at the sky and there's clouds
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  and fluffy sheep and stuff, and it all looks beautiful, and there's an
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  EV perfectly balanced at the very front, and it gives you the illusion that
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  it's super green and that's what we need to drive one. You try scrapping
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  an EV if you have an accident, and you try scrapping one because like
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  you look at a car now, I can't say car brands here, but
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  you take a major electric vehicle brand, you try and scrap that vehicle.
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  Scrapyards don't want them a because of they will take them, but under PROTESTA
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  they haven't really got a choice because the world is going this way. But
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  like twenty years ago, when you had a car, you just took it
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  to the scrapyard, engine out, gearbox out, and then they just took
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  the seats out, crushed it done. But now there's so much teching cars.
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  It's such a complex. The operation to scrap one is absolutely phenomenal.
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  And also they have to have qualified people to remove these batteries and stuff,
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  and the scrap yards don't want to get involved in that because they've got loads
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  and loads of lithium sat in their scrap yards and they don't want it.
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  It's hazardous material handling. Now, whereas recycling a car was about scrap spares,
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  you could make money out of the metal and the spares and all the
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  other bits. Now you're effectually handing handling hazardous materials. You know, I
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  agree with you that the I would love somebody somewhere to come and have a
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  debate on this show that is balanced, that gives a proactive view on how
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  EV is carbon friendly, because if let's put it out there, the ethical
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  question that we know the public information out there on these lithius minds with small
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  children abroad, we are kidding ourselves if we think that our carbon footprint starts
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  when we drive off the lot. It's absolutely The trouble is and the encounter
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  argument, to be fair and balanced is we use lithium. We use all
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  these carbon rich technologies and various other stuff chemicals in the current manufacturing of current
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  cars. But the EV is just going to push up that consumption to the
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  point where it negates any benefit it ever will have. And the fact that
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  we have you look at solo wind farms, carbon blades can't be recycled get
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  buried chemicals. They're only now saying that they potentially can be recycled battery storage.
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  You're right, you're paying for that. I don't want a car that
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  after eight years doesn't perform, and then I have to beg someone to take
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  it back because you're effectively going from owning a car to car swap every decade.
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  It's an economic stimulus, and I don't think it's a positive one.
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  This net zero is not what people think it is. Everybody thinks we're reducing
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  our emissions. We can increase our emissions tenfold. All we've got to do
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  is offset that. And what we're doing at the moment, everything's done abroad,
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  it's all getting offset. It's morally and ethnically very very wrong. No,
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  it's true. And it's also like I'm just going back to that car
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  scrappage thing. Like when you look at manufacturers, they will brand it in
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  a way that makes you buy it, but nowhere anywhere do they talk.
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  No one ever talks about the end of life of a vehicle, what happens
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  to it. No one ever discussed, No manufacturer will ever go out of
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  the way to discuss that bit. No offense to evoners. In three to
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  four years, they intend to swap it for a new one. So we're
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  not doing our part, are we really? Because I'd like to own a
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  calf for ten to fifteen years like my dad did, and then save up
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  the money for a new one. Now it's all about, well, you
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  can't get rid of it. You're gonna have to come back to us and
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  we'll give you a trading. Yeah. I don't know what the answer is
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  here texting eighty one four hundred and like I say, I will openly have
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  you know, a fair balanced debate over you know, anybody who thinks that
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  this is no fighting? Yeah, fix radio. That's it for today's electrical
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  show, where I've been joined by Paulmina from the five Group to talk about
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  the government's goal to making smart charging the norm at home and the office by
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  twenty twenty five. And it did just occur to me. You know,
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  hydrogen technology. It's been poo pooed that it can't be done, and we
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  will ignore the fact of toy to basically created a hydrogen vehicle which actually runs
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  and does work. But it does make you wonder why the push for EV
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  and it makes sense when you think about it, because if we have hydrogen
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  tech here, you build a hydrogen vehicle, you sell it. Okay,
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  you have to build hydrogen petrol filling stations, but essentially that's the end of
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  the journey. You build the car, you build the filling stations, that's
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  it. If you build an electric car, you then have to have charge
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  points. With charge points, you then need smart automation. There's all these
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  things that roll off the back of it, which builds money and infrastructure and
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  all of these things with hydrogen, and you don't really get that. Actually,
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  you built a car where you could top it up from your tap,
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  you would effectively destroying half of our economy. Yeah, so do we want
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  to save the planet or we keep making money? That was kind of what
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  I'm saying, but not quite quite as bluntly as that. But yeah,
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  it does make you wonder, because that's for me, is how I see
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  it. With electric you get all of the roll on effect of it,
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  all of the you know, tens and tens of billions of pounds of installation
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  work and all that stuff. With hydrogen, you don't get that. So
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  it does make your question if that's sort of the reason there's pooh pood.
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  Yeah, there is a bit of controversy around hydrogen. There's a lot of
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  people for it. I'm I'm happy to look at any new technology. I
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  just don't want to make a very expensive or safety drive mistake. Right,
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  So let's get back on the back on track here public charge points. Now,
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  how the main issues with public charge points ultimately terrorist housing. That's always
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  going to be a that's always going to be a finicity issue there and most
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  of East London, in fact, about ninety eight percent of it is all
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  terrorist housing. So I'm not entirely sure how public charging is going to work
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  there. I can see petrol stations being converted into rapid charging pod sort of
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  little arenas, but that's not gonna I'm sure we'll see some sort of architectural
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  with an arm to be able to chuck a cable over, and then all
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  it will be as an advert for please come and rob this house because they're
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  very rich. There is going to have to be something like that for terrorist
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  housing, because there's there's a problem there which has got to be fixed.
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  I'm I'm not convinced on that yet, but there's going to be I'm guessing
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  something in the next I don't know, next few years there potentially Yeah,
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  any other public charging for me, again, it's quite hazardous thing because you
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  could go to let's say a multi story car park, plugy car in,
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  leave it for eight hours to go to work, come back, and it's
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  got less charger when you arrived. Please Google vehicle to grid. You'll have
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  no say of it. The life cycle of your battery gets worn away and
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  realistically you have a car for less time than what you actually thought. All
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  to support the electricity networks. So EV for the electricity networks, it's in
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  their interest to say yes, yes, yes, absolutely. I'm not sure
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  what to add on to that, because that would perfectly put They've got a
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  long journey to go ahead, and I'll tell you that now. I think
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  it's going to be a very interesting journey for EV in the next couple of
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  years. And it's not that I'm against it. Just before anybody starts jumping
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  on the bandwagon. It's new technology and I do embrace it. I'm just
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  politely asking some questions. Trust to put verify simple at what he said, Yeah,