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DDH - The Lincoln County War · Plausibly Live - The Dave Bowman Show Podcast

• 0:00
  History is strange, it's alien, and it won't give us what we
• 0:04
  would like to have. Dave, you're talking about an
• 0:10
  all-encompassing, overpowering government here and what happens
• 0:15
  when that's what you have. And you weren't describing the
• 0:18
  last, you know, 10 or 15 years of the United States.
• 0:21
  Well, and that's, you know, that's Dave's second law.
• 0:24
  People don't change. They do the same things for the
• 0:26
  same reasons with the same results throughout history.
• 0:29
  The only thing that changes is technology, and we see that over
• 0:34
  and over again. I love westerns.
• 0:39
  Yeah. Especially movies, television.
• 0:41
  In fact, the only reason I have Disney Plus is so I can watch
• 0:43
  Davy Crockett, which is a ridiculously fake version of
• 0:50
  what actually happened. But it's so much a part of my
• 0:53
  childhood that that that I love watching it.
• 0:55
  I don't even know if it's really a Western.
• 0:57
  I guess technically it isn't, but, but I enjoy it.
• 1:00
  I like John Wayne movies. I love the Clint Eastwood
• 1:02
  movies, but it's, it's hard to imagine for us that what we see
• 1:09
  on our on our screens isn't what it really was.
• 1:15
  You know, it's, it's, it's a different era, It's a different
• 1:18
  time. If I had a time machine, if I
• 1:20
  had the DeLorean and people say, where would you go?
• 1:22
  It would not be the Old West. It was.
• 1:26
  Not for your creature comforts anymore.
• 1:27
  That's why I like the series like Lonesome Dove and those
• 1:30
  they're grittier. The streets are always muddy and
• 1:33
  and full of horse poop or whatever else is out there.
• 1:36
  It it it was not a an especially sanitary it.
• 1:40
  Was it was not. And I, I don't really want any
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  part of that. I'm glad, I'm glad to read about
• 1:45
  it, but I'm not not particularly enamored with going there.
• 1:49
  But we get this mindset, this Disney versus reality mindset.
• 1:55
  It was actually an episode of the Brady Bunch.
• 1:57
  Remember this when little Bobby, or maybe it was Peter, I don't
• 2:00
  remember, had a had a fascination with Jesse James.
• 2:03
  And we had to have this morality play where because it was in the
• 2:07
  1960s, there was some grandson or something of, of one of the
• 2:12
  people that Jesse James killed or something that had to come
• 2:16
  tell Bobby that he was a criminal.
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  And you know, we had to have that shoved down our throat as
• 2:21
  well. But we got to ask the question,
• 2:25
  Bill, about today's topic. What is it that pushes a person
• 2:30
  down a certain path? We ask the question about the
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  quote, he who saves his country breaks no law.
• 2:40
  But what is what is it that pushes a person down a path that
• 2:45
  that person thinks that they're saving their country?
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  150 years later we say, well, that person was an outlaw, but
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  at the time, what did that person actually think about
• 2:57
  themselves? That they were a freedom
• 3:00
  fighter, That they were writing an injustice.
• 3:03
  We were asked that question about what if there was a
• 3:05
  government that was so absolutely corrupt that ruled
• 3:09
  the land with an iron fist? You had to go through them for
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  everything. You couldn't even get a bank
• 3:14
  loan without this government's approval.
• 3:17
  You couldn't eat, you couldn't put food on your table.
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  You couldn't hunt. You couldn't have a living
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  without this government's approval.
• 3:24
  And all of a sudden a new guy comes in and says, let's do it a
• 3:28
  different way. Let's save you some money, let's
• 3:30
  save you some time. Let's break up the power of this
• 3:34
  corrupt government. And you might think we're
• 3:37
  talking about Napoleon. You might think we're talking
• 3:39
  about Trump. But reality is we're talking
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  about the Lincoln County, New Mexico in 1878 when a guy by the
• 3:47
  name of John Terstal showed up and said, you know what?
• 3:52
  It's time to do things. Differentlytheheadline@billmc.com
• 3:57
  Today is Trump and tactics. If you click on that, you'll see
• 4:00
  at the top of the post 3 links, the Dave Bowman show, what the
• 4:03
  frock and Dave does history. If you want to keep up with
• 4:06
  everything Dave Bowman's doing, you can do it right there on
• 4:09
  those links at billmc.com. So this Lincoln County War 1878
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  New Mexico Dave set the stage for us man.
• 4:17
  So at the heart of Lincoln County's economic and political
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  structure is a group called The House.
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  Now this is a political and economic structure.
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  It's run by a guy by the name of James Dolan and his partner
• 4:29
  Lawrence Murphy. They have a business called LG
• 4:33
  Murphy and Company. If you've ever seen the movie
• 4:35
  Pale Rider, which of course you have, think Lahood.
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  That's who these people are. They are the same kind of people
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  running everything. They control every financial
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  transaction, cattle sales, dry goods, banking, government
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  contracts. They own the law.
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  Their local sheriff, William Brady, deep connections to them
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  and and with the infamous Santa Fe Ring, a group of politicians,
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  lawyers and businessmen who use their influence to maintain
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  control over the land and all the commerce in New Mexico.
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  And they do this for years. They run Lincoln County like
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  they're feudal Lords. If you need a loan, you got to
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  go through them. You want to sell your cattle?
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  You sold it to them and they dictated the price.
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  They told you what you were going to get for if you dared to
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  oppose them, Bill, you found yourself in legal trouble.
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  The sheriff would show up and arrest you.
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  They'd ruin you financially or even worse.
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  But in 1876, guy by the name of John Tunstall arrives in town.
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  Now John Tunstall is a well educated, business savvy
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  rancher. He saw Lincoln County as a land
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  of opportunity. He ends up partnering with a
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  lawyer and another cattle guy, John Chisholm.
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  You probably heard of the Chisholm Trail and together they
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  open a store, a rival store and a rival bank in town.
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  This plan is simple. He's going to offer better
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  prices, fairer business practices, and he's going to try
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  to break up the monopoly that the House has with Murphy and
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  Dolan. It's not just about making
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  money. It's about dismantling a corrupt
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  government system which had kept Lincoln County under its thumb
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  for years. But that doesn't necessarily,
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  you know, play well in the heart of a corrupt government, does
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  it? People showing up in town to go,
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  well, we should do this doesn't always get received well.
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  Challenging that status quo could come with deadly
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  consequences. Dolan Murphy.
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  They were not about to just let this happen.
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  They responded with a a mix of legal maneuvers and just
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  absolute brute force. They ordered their sheriff
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  Brady, to begin filing bogus lawsuits to seize Tunstall's
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  property. When that didn't work, they
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  turned to more violent means, hiring the ruthless Jesse Evans
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  gang you may have heard of. You may not have to intimidate
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  and harass him. On February 18th, today, 1878, a
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  posse of Brady's men, including Jesse Evans and William Morton,
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  which are big names in the Old West, tracked down Tunstall and
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  his his group. They were going to, they were
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  supposed to just arrest him, continue their harassment and
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  that sort of thing. But as you can predict, things
• 7:34
  didn't quite go that way. And as I said, on February 18th,
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  1878, in front of his own cattle hands, they executed John
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  Tunstall in cold blood. They just put a bullet in his
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  head and said, we're not going to let you bring down this
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  corrupt government. The dust kind of settles over
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  Tunstall's body. His loyal ranch hands swear
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  revenge. Now, we asked the question
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  earlier, does he who saves his country break any law?
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  If you're going to respond to this, this corrupt government,
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  this corrupt ideology, this corrupt just filthy system, are
• 8:31
  you really breaking the law when the law is already technically
• 8:36
  been broken? And what if amongst these young
• 8:42
  men who watched their employer, John Tunstall, be murdered by
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  the sheriff, be murdered by the the houses hired guns, is a
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  young man, very young man. He's he's probably 14, maybe 15
• 9:00
  years old. He's very young.
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  He sees what's happening, Bill, and he says this ain't right.
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  And this begins what will become known as the Lincoln County War.
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  And over the next few weeks, the next few months, a dozen people
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  are going to be killed. There's going to be a great deal
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  of brouhaha and argument and debate and flat out violence.
• 9:30
  But again, we asked that question, does he who saves his
• 9:35
  country, or at least tries to save his country, break the law?
• 9:39
  Well, at. What point does it become?
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  Defense of the people of the of the community there.
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  At this point, would you argue that?
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  At this point, would you argue, well, they murdered our man.
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  They murdered our our our employer.
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  At this point, do you still see it as self-defense?
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  Do you still see it as justifiable response in an era
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  when the law is pretty much owned by the house?
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  Makes it tough. Makes it tough, doesn't it?
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  Now. What if I told you that this
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  young man's name will go down in history as very simply Billy the
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  Kid? Oh.
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  Does he who saves his country break the law?
• 10:35
  We'll find out, I suppose, as we continue with Dave Does History
• 10:38
  on Bill Mick Live? This is Dave does History.
• 11:03
  On Filmic Live. The McPherson Financial Group
• 11:07
  bringing you this hour of the show as we jump in the Way Back
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  Machine and go to February 18th of 1878.
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  Dave laying out for us that Billy the Kid becomes part of
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  the Lincoln County Ward. Dave, I'll kick it back over to
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  you, Sir. So after the death of John
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  Tunstall on February 18th 1878, his his staffers, his his people
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  form a group called the Regulators.
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  Now the Regulators is one of those names that repeats itself
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  throughout our history all the way back to pre Revolutionary
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  War times. Anytime someone wants to oppose
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  an oppressive government, they tend to choose that name.
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  The Regulators include Billy the Kid, Dick Brewer and a few
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  others and they swear revenge. They're going to get revenge for
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  the murder of their their beloved leader, John Tunstall,
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  who was bringing openness and viability to Lincoln County's
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  government by April the 1st, 1878.
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  A few weeks later, they are actually going to ambush Sheriff
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  Brady, who again was the leader of who's the the own law for the
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  house. And they actually kill him on
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  April 1st. And this of course, now you
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  know, now it's getting really serious it now we don't just
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  have a bunch of ruffians running around going and we're the
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  regulators. We're going to oppose this
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  government now we got people taking potshots at and I'm doing
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  the air quote thing here. The law, which is fully owned by
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  by the House. This, this is going to really
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  set off the Dolans and, and they are going to form their own
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  counter group, which is going to create even more violence bill,
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  because violence tends to be get violence.
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  And as this thing kind of grows, it's going to get even worse.
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  It's going to lead to what's known as the battle of Lincoln,
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  which is going to run for four days in July.
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  Now again, it all starts today, but in July it's going to hit
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  its climax and that is where things are really, really going
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  to get well, violent. But again, if you're saving your
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  country, if you're saving your your people, are you really
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  violating the law? We don't know yet, but now we're
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  probably about to find out. Let's jump back in the Dave does
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  history. So this thing really heats up in
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  July. This has been a long ongoing
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  thing. Is it like weekly skirmishes,
• 14:00
  Dave or weekly? Events.
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  This goes on again, you know, you kind of started before
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  February 18th with just some scuffles and and the likes of
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  that. But after February 18th it
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  really heats up. You've got you've got a murder
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  that takes place instead of of Sheriff William Brady on April
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  1st. On April 4th, you have a
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  gunfight at a mill results in multiple deaths and by the
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  middle of July, by by July 15th, the the house has has responded
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  by forming its own counter group to the regulators.
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  They're led by a guy by the name of Jesse Evans, who is known for
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  being extraordinarily violent. He's known for being, you know,
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  just an absolute it's it's right out of a western bill.
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  It's right out of the sheriff that Lahood calls in in in pale
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  rider. I mean, it's that kind of of
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  level of of counter stuff and he what?
• 15:01
  Sounds like they scripted young guns with this story.
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  They're all the same story, aren't they?
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  It it really is and, and if I'm not mistaken, isn't Young Guns
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  the story of this? Of Billy the Kid.
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  Yeah, I think it is. It's been a while since I've
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  seen it, now I've got to go watch that again.
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  Yeah. So we both it was good.
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  So they end up and Evans's group ends up surrounding the
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  regulators in a house and for five days, Bill, they lay siege
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  to the house. So not the house the the group
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  that's running Lincoln County, but this this home that the the
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  regulators are are laid up in Billy the Kid and others.
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  And this thing gets shoot. You know, they're shooting at
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  the house they're shooting back. Nobody seems to be able to get
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  anywhere until on July 19th, the the the house people set the
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  home on fire. They managed to get the house
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  set on fire and this of course, causes the regulators to have to
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  run. So Billy the Kid, few others
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  escape, but one of their numbers, a guy by the name of
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  Mcsween is killed. And it seems at this point like,
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  you know, the Dolan group has has won this over, but there's
• 16:12
  still some violence. And it's at this point that
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  federal troops, United States troops actually arrived to start
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  restoring, quote UN quote, order such as it is.
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  You bring in the US cavalry and they start, you know, putting
• 16:32
  things back to look, the problem with that, of course, is that
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  what they're putting back into order is the House, it's the
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  Dolan Mcmurphy group. It's, it's the, it's the same
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  corrupt government that's been running things.
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  So have they, has the US government really accomplished
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  anything here? Have they really, I don't know,
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  upheld and defended the Constitution of the United
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  States, or are the people in Lincoln County, New Mexico,
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  still subject to this? Moreover, I guess the question
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  you got to ask is, did the people of Lincoln County not see
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  any other alternatives? You know, we're kind of stuck
• 17:14
  with this. We maybe we should, we should
• 17:18
  vote for somebody else. Maybe we should do some other
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  thing. But the bottom line is by July
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  19th, the Regulators, Billy the Kid and others have been
• 17:29
  essentially beaten. And for all practical purposes,
• 17:35
  the Lincoln County War is now over.
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  But the status quo has been restored.
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  And we're still asking that question, did they do the right
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  thing? Did they not do the right thing?
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  I mean, if this was a Hollywood Western, who's your sympathy
• 17:52
  with? Who's the sympathetic character?
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  Billy the Kid and the Regulators, which of course, you
• 18:00
  know, Ben and I have this conversation all the time about
• 18:02
  villains. The best villains are the ones
• 18:04
  who think that they aren't villains, right?
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  But Billy the Kid has a long history prior to this long.
• 18:10
  He's very young. He has a history prior to this
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  of murder, robbery, you know, skullduggery.
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  He's not a good guy, is not a good guy, being on the right
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  side, redemption. Every now and then you need a
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  not a good guy to handle the stuff that your regular folk
• 18:32
  can't handle anyway. That's one, yeah, that's one
• 18:36
  literary trope, isn't it? Yeah.
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  But now we're left with, OK, the regulators have been beaten, the
• 18:44
  House is back in charge. What do we do now?
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  Well, we can't stay around here because there's no reason to
• 18:52
  stay here anymore. The guy that was employing us is
• 18:54
  dead. Half of our group is dead.
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  We might as well go somewhere else.
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  And of course Billy the Kid is going to go on to more
• 19:02
  notoriety. But what happens to that corrupt
• 19:05
  government in New Mexico? Yeah.
• 19:08
  Did it ever turn around? Those are questions we'll look
• 19:11
  at when we get back. Bill McPherson Financial Group
• 19:33
  are our sponsor is Dave does history on Bill Mclive looking
• 19:37
  at the Lincoln County War of 18. What was it again?
• 19:42
  Dave, 78? Wow.
• 19:45
  And Billy the Kid, a prominent part of this.
• 19:47
  That's cool. Right, which is of course, as
• 19:50
  we've been discussing off air basically the the film Young
• 19:54
  Guns, so which we've determined is also available on Amazon
• 19:58
  Prime. So if you have Amazon Prime, you
• 20:00
  might want to watch that today. That's my plan for when I get up
• 20:04
  from my nap today. That's what that's going to be
• 20:06
  TV today. I remember being a very good
• 20:08
  movie. I don't remember how
• 20:10
  historically accurate it is, but I guess I'll find out because I
• 20:14
  will do the same thing after the after the war ends, the federal
• 20:20
  troops re establish order, which is I I guess in a way that's
• 20:26
  sort of AI don't know how to feel about that bill because OK,
• 20:33
  law and order has been. Back to the status quo.
• 20:35
  Well, for a while now in the process of all this, the house
• 20:40
  Dolan ends up taking over things and the unfortunate side effect
• 20:46
  of this Lincoln County war is it really drained their resources
• 20:50
  of the House. It really, it cost them a lot of
• 20:53
  money to hire these people to come in here and beat the
• 20:56
  regulators. It doesn't seem like it should
• 20:58
  have, but it did. It cost them a lot of political
• 21:01
  capital. It cost them a lot of money.
• 21:04
  And they end up having a lot of financial struggles after that
• 21:08
  because people all of a sudden are seeing maybe, maybe we don't
• 21:11
  have to use them. Maybe we can go somewhere else.
• 21:15
  Dolan actually decides to move into politics himself.
• 21:18
  He runs for the sheriff of Lincoln member Sheriff Brady has
• 21:22
  has been killed. So he becomes the sheriff and
• 21:26
  then later he becomes a state legislator.
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  But the problem is once you get into those positions, now you're
• 21:34
  a political, you know, you you're owned by somebody else.
• 21:40
  You don't own yourself anymore. And so he has to make those
• 21:43
  deals and those cost him money. So eventually the house pretty
• 21:46
  much just fades away and it just kind of fades out into history
• 21:52
  and is eventually replaced by a legitimate government in Lincoln
• 21:57
  County, New Mexico. Billy the Kid, of course, goes
• 22:00
  on to his infamous acts, most of which occurred before he did all
• 22:04
  this anyway. But during the Lincoln County
• 22:07
  War, he really becomes famous for his actions.
• 22:12
  He is accused of being the triggerman for the murder of
• 22:16
  Sheriff Brady. And in fact, this is the only
• 22:19
  crime for which he will be convicted, even though we don't
• 22:22
  actually know that he's the one that did that, but he will be
• 22:27
  convicted of that. Accept the credit?
• 22:28
  Did he take the credit? I don't remember.
• 22:31
  I don't remember if he did or not.
• 22:33
  I'm sure he said no, but I mean, why would you plead guilty to
• 22:36
  that? Oh no, I'm, I'm saying among his
• 22:39
  friends, I fired the shot. Yeah, it's possible, but that's
• 22:44
  the only crime for which he will be convicted.
• 22:47
  And so in this in this lengthy list of his his actions, you
• 22:52
  know, stealing food, stealing clothing, stealing a horse,
• 22:57
  killing a blacksmith, horse, wrestling cattle, wrestling, all
• 23:01
  this stuff, He continues to he also murders a guy in 1880,
• 23:05
  killed him after the dude threatened him and he just
• 23:09
  killed him. Well, maybe he should be
• 23:10
  murdered for that. But he's eventually caught and
• 23:14
  sentenced to death in the murder of Sheriff Brie.
• 23:17
  Course this leads to the famous escape in April of 1881 where he
• 23:21
  shoots 2 deputies and manages to escape from jail and beat the
• 23:26
  hangman as it were. But he doesn't last, you know
• 23:29
  very long on that one because the famous Pat Garrett chases
• 23:34
  him down and puts an end to the life of Billy the Kid in 1881.
• 23:40
  Jesse Evans, the guy that ran things for the house, is
• 23:43
  arrested in 1880. He goes to prison in Texas, but
• 23:47
  he manages to escape that prison in 1882 and we have no clue what
• 23:53
  happened to him whatsoever. So a successful escape and and
• 23:57
  vanish into nothingness. Well, there are rumors that he
• 24:00
  went to South America. There are stronger rumors, Bill,
• 24:04
  that he went to, dare I say it, Florida, where he continued to
• 24:10
  live, as you know, changed his name and all those which which
• 24:14
  was much easier to do back in that era.
• 24:18
  You know, you could you could hide stuff from from Elon Musk
• 24:21
  in those days and he wouldn't be able to get it.
• 24:24
  The ultimate lesson here, though, is what does all this
• 24:27
  mean? The war, this war, the Lincoln
• 24:31
  County War kind of marks a transition in the West.
• 24:36
  It it goes from lawless cattle wars to increasing federal
• 24:42
  oversight. Now, this is going to take time.
• 24:44
  If you think about it later on, you're going to have the the
• 24:46
  Wild Bunch with Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid.
• 24:50
  They're going to continue this stuff into the early almost
• 24:53
  1900s. But there's more federal
• 24:56
  oversight of things. There's more federal control.
• 25:02
  Now, is that a good thing or a bad thing?
• 25:06
  The Murphy Dolan monopoly fades. Lincoln County becomes, you
• 25:11
  know, more reasonably governed and becomes more socially
• 25:16
  acceptable. I guess Billy the Kid becomes a
• 25:19
  legend. And like so many like I go back
• 25:23
  to that Brady Brady Bunch episode.
• 25:27
  Is he a hero or is he a criminal?
• 25:31
  Was what he did in the Lincoln County wars justifiable?
• 25:35
  Possibly. Was what he did after the
• 25:37
  Lincoln County Wars and before that justifiable?
• 25:40
  No. Did he just happen to have that
• 25:43
  moment, that one moment in time when he was on the right side of
• 25:47
  things? It's something we can argue
• 25:49
  about all day long if we really will really want.
• 25:53
  Can't bad people commit good acts and and for the right
• 25:56
  reasons, right? And does he who saves his
• 25:59
  country violate the law? It was a violent error of folks
• 26:06
  and it and it symbolized this whole war, symbolized the greed
• 26:11
  and the corruption of the Old West.
• 26:13
  It wasn't Disney, so stop thinking of it in those terms.
• 26:18
  It did set the stage for the infamous legacy of Billy the
• 26:21
  Kid, but it also set the legacy for the growth and change of the
• 26:28
  American West into what it would eventually become part of the
• 26:32
  United States as New Mexico would go on to become a state
• 26:36
  finally in 1912, but would never forget the legacy of the Lincoln
• 26:41
  County War. And we pick it up in 30 seconds,
• 26:45
  321-768-1240 if you want in. And if you're listening on the
• 26:49
  iHeartRadio app, make sure and set WMMB as your first preset on
• 26:53
  the app. And then you can jump in with
• 26:55
  Bill Mick Live, Dave Does History, The Dave Bowman Show
• 26:58
  and What the Frock, all the stuff that Dave does every week.
• 27:01
  And good to keep up with there. We'll get to your phone calls in
• 27:05
  a moment, Dave. This was a a time of transition,
• 27:09
  but it wasn't an easy transition at all.
• 27:11
  Look at what they went through here.
• 27:13
  And how many times has this story repeated, whether it's
• 27:15
  over water or grazing rights or anything else throughout the
• 27:19
  West? Mining taxes right down to
• 27:22
  today. I mean, you could in some ways
• 27:25
  change the characters in the story and it would be similar.
• 27:28
  By the way, Billy the Kid never actually admitted to shootings.
• 27:31
  He admitted to being part of it and he was wounded during the
• 27:35
  ambush, shot in the thigh. But he, I, I knew this was in my
• 27:38
  notes. I just couldn't remember.
• 27:41
  But he never admitted to to actually shooting Sheriff Brady.
• 27:44
  Interested. All right, very good.
• 27:47
  Let's get to the call. See what you folks are thinking
• 27:49
  this morning. Line one, you're up on Bill Mick
• 27:50
  live. Good morning.
• 27:53
  Good morning, this is Sandra from Melbourne.
• 27:56
  Yes, Sandra, go ahead. You all keep talking about Young
• 28:00
  Guns and watching all the movies.
• 28:02
  Well, you need to watch the John Wayne movie, Chisholm.
• 28:05
  That's the same story. Oh, he did it a lot earlier than
• 28:08
  Young Guns did it. But all the characters are
• 28:10
  there. All the results are there.
• 28:14
  The good movie. Need to watch that one too.
• 28:16
  Yeah, well, hey, not a bad one to go with.
• 28:18
  Appreciated. Sandra Lyon two.
• 28:19
  You're on Bill. Mick live.
• 28:20
  Good morning. Morning, Bill.
• 28:24
  So who's this? Yeah.
• 28:26
  I mean, it's that. This is Erica Brevard.
• 28:30
  Yeah. So, I mean, this all sounds like
• 28:31
  it's linked to earlier discussions and all.
• 28:34
  And, you know, what do you do when you're having living under
• 28:39
  a government that that's acting tyrannically?
• 28:43
  I mean, we've, we've said for a while that, you know, the, the
• 28:48
  revolutionaries of, of the United States or of the colonies
• 28:52
  would have not tolerated what we tolerate today.
• 28:55
  And I think what the story that they've been telling here is
• 28:59
  showing that, you know, there was a lot of toleration for what
• 29:02
  was going on there in Lincoln County.
• 29:04
  So do we want to let the federal solution come into play or do we
• 29:09
  want to have the grassroots solution?
• 29:11
  And I think that I think that what we're seeing going on with
• 29:15
  the USAID, it's just pointing out all of the rhinos, all the
• 29:20
  people that have been in government that have been making
• 29:24
  money off of this. If they're if they're
• 29:26
  complaining about what's going on with the transparency and
• 29:30
  revealing all this stuff, I think they're putting their
• 29:33
  future in doubt. I think you make a good point,
• 29:37
  Eric, and it does tie back to we get the governments we deserve,
• 29:41
  the people we elect who are running those things.
• 29:43
  And if we just capitulate and don't do anything to change it,
• 29:46
  where does it take us? Line three, you're on Bill Make
• 29:48
  live. Hello Mario, Cape Canaveral.
• 29:51
  Yeah, Mario. The by the way, by the way, this
• 29:57
  is, this is the narration is, is captivating, very captivating.
• 30:01
  The the initial group, the regulator now they were
• 30:07
  initially, as far as I can tell, were basically a legal body in a
• 30:15
  broader philosophical sense. And but the, the, the people who
• 30:22
  came, the government people, the federal people came to restore
• 30:27
  order, all that, that kind of like if we're looking for, if
• 30:31
  we're looking for, for analogies here, that that kind of looked
• 30:35
  to me like, like what Donald Trump is doing, he's coming to
• 30:38
  restore order. And so anyway, I like this
• 30:41
  story. Interesting thought, Mario.
• 30:44
  Line one. You're up next.
• 30:45
  Good morning, caller. Hello.
• 30:50
  Bill, it's it's Matt in West. Melbourne.
• 30:53
  Yeah, Matt, go ahead. Oh, hey, yeah, just a quick
• 30:55
  follow up. It's had a chance to go out
• 30:58
  there years ago. There's a there's ability really
• 31:01
  the kid casino in Rio Doso and the there's a museum there
• 31:06
  called them is be called the Museum of the horse, but it's
• 31:08
  it's named after some guy by the name of Harvard, I think.
• 31:11
  But it's fantastic the place to visit and but but Billy the Kid
• 31:16
  lives on in in the form of a casino out there.
• 31:19
  So it's a but thanks, thanks for a great, great story.
• 31:22
  And it's a great, it's a great trip out there.
• 31:24
  But it's it's it's a very eye opening time when you go down
• 31:28
  and look at the, the the you know, just the just the
• 31:31
  geographical settings of those places.
• 31:33
  You know, it's a, it's a rough looking, rough looking area, so.
• 31:37
  I don't know if anybody caught the Tyler Sheridan Bass Reeves
• 31:42
  story, which was also amazing but also showing the gritty
• 31:46
  times that those times were. Dave and I think this was a good
• 31:50
  picture of it today. Yeah, and I, I really like New
• 31:53
  Mexico. I don't care for their politics,
• 31:55
  but New Mexico is one of those places that I personally think I
• 31:58
  could, I could settle the food there is fantastic.
• 32:02
  But if you like, if you like green chilies, New Mexico is the
• 32:06
  and they do, I think they do a thing called Christmas.
• 32:10
  When you when you order your Mexican food, you can get it
• 32:12
  green, red or Christmas. Always get it Christmas.
• 32:16
  It's fantastic. There you go.
• 32:19
  Have you looked ahead the next week?
• 32:20
  I've looked ahead but I haven't settled on anything.
• 32:23
  Sorry, we'll figure it out as we get closer to next Tuesday.
• 32:25
  Thank you, Dave, it was a great hour.
• 32:27
  Go get some rest, will you? I'm going to all.
• 32:30
  Right, we'll talk to you next week.
• 32:31
  See you then. Check out more stories from
• 32:37
  History.