Latest / Pharmacy Podcast Network / The New Pharmacy Playbook: Workforce Strength, AI Clarity, and 340B Reform | TWIRx

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The New Pharmacy Playbook: Workforce Strength, AI Clarity, and 340B Reform | TWIRx · Pharmacy Podcast Network

0:01
Speaker 1: Hey there.
0:02
Speaker 2: Today on twerks, the new Pharmacy Playbook, we're talking about
0:06
Speaker 2: workforce strength, AI clarity, and three forty B reform. You're
0:13
Speaker 2: not gonna want to miss this trks. Hey, welcome to
0:37
Speaker 2: this Weekend Pharmacy. I'm your host, Todd Uriy, founder of
0:40
Speaker 2: the Pharmacy Podcast Network. And it is cold in Pittsburgh.
0:45
Speaker 2: It's been bouncing between the mornings of twenty two to
0:48
Speaker 2: twenty six, it maybe gets up to thirty six. Now
0:52
Speaker 2: winter is here. It can't be argued anymore. I've been
0:57
Speaker 2: pushing and screaming and kicking because I didn't want to
1:00
Speaker 2: give into winter.
1:01
Speaker 1: Our winter's here.
1:03
Speaker 2: In southwestern Pennsylvania are not like maybe my family down
1:07
Speaker 2: in Florida or you people out in Arizona or even California.
1:13
Speaker 2: It's like one of those wet colds and you can't
1:15
Speaker 2: get you can't get warm no matter what you do.
1:18
Speaker 2: So we have a special episode in segment today. We
1:22
Speaker 2: don't do much of this on this week in Pharmacy
1:24
Speaker 2: because we're so pharmacy centric, but there's lots of other
1:27
Speaker 2: things happening, and as business owners and as entrepreneurs people
1:31
Speaker 2: out there listening that you dig into workforce management and
1:37
Speaker 2: people time management in keeping people motivated. I mean, if
1:42
Speaker 2: you can't build a strong team, you can't build your business.
1:48
Speaker 1: I know what that feels like.
1:49
Speaker 2: I know what that's like of having a small team
1:51
Speaker 2: of my own, and leadership comes into that. I am
1:55
Speaker 2: excited about today's leadership because we don't get enough time
1:59
Speaker 2: with pharmacy executives. But this person and a friend of
2:04
Speaker 2: mine now now knowing her for some a number of years,
2:08
Speaker 2: Crystal Leonards is with us today from McKesson.
2:11
Speaker 1: So excited to have you here. Crystal.
2:14
Speaker 2: Just in case people don't know, you, introduce yourself quickly
2:16
Speaker 2: to the listeners and we got a lot to talk about.
2:19
Speaker 3: Yeah, thanks so much, Pat, I appreciate you having me today.
2:22
Speaker 3: Crystal Leonard's president of Healthmart, which is mckusson's independent pharmacy franchise,
2:28
Speaker 3: and health Mart Atlas, which is our pharmacy services administrative organization.
2:33
Speaker 3: And really our goal is to support independent pharmacy owners
2:37
Speaker 3: on their business of pharmacy so they can focus on
2:40
Speaker 3: what they do best, which is taking care of their patients.
2:43
Speaker 1: Well, thank you for being here at Crystal.
2:45
Speaker 2: It's so good to always see you at the conferences
2:47
Speaker 2: and I want to just say thank you so much
2:49
Speaker 2: for making time for us. You've always been open with
2:52
Speaker 2: your time, and I know how busy you are, especially
2:55
Speaker 2: at those conferences as things make my head spin.
2:58
Speaker 3: Well, thanks so much for having.
2:59
Speaker 1: Me absolutely all right, let's get into this.
3:02
Speaker 2: So closings of big chain pharmacies and churn and ownership
3:10
Speaker 2: and the strife and the issues that we know our
3:13
Speaker 2: independence are going through with the factors of what's going
3:18
Speaker 2: on in pharmacy and how it's changing. So when I
3:21
Speaker 2: think of workflow, workforce management, when I think of keeping
3:27
Speaker 2: my talent and my team motivated and inspired, and then
3:31
Speaker 2: of course our shortages kind of give us your insight
3:34
Speaker 2: because you get to see this from a macro perspective,
3:37
Speaker 2: and I don't think our pharmacy owners, pharmacists out there,
3:40
Speaker 2: even people maybe even health system really get to hear
3:44
Speaker 2: from people that are able to have that kind of vision.
3:47
Speaker 1: So what do you think is going on?
3:49
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say workforce management and staffing is definitely
3:53
Speaker 3: a struggle across the pharmacy space, regardless of the setting
3:57
Speaker 3: that you might practice in. And I've seen just many
4:00
Speaker 3: contributing factors over the past really decade. Community pharmacies in
4:05
Speaker 3: particular are operating in a really complex reinveorsement and overall
4:10
Speaker 3: healthcare environment right now, so it can make it difficult
4:13
Speaker 3: to manage balancing profitability with offering the competitive wages and
4:19
Speaker 3: that are needed to really recruit and retain talent. So
4:23
Speaker 3: from a health martin MCUSSM perspective, we're focused on supporting
4:27
Speaker 3: pharmacies to help them manageer operations more efficiently, be able
4:32
Speaker 3: to free up some resources, to be able to support
4:35
Speaker 3: a strong labor force, and I would say helping to
4:40
Speaker 3: attract and retain talent as well. When you think about
4:45
Speaker 3: offering training, the technician is often the heart of the pharmacy,
4:50
Speaker 3: so we have basic and comprehensive accredited technician training, continuing
4:55
Speaker 3: education opportunities, and then also just overall support for the
5:01
Speaker 3: pharmacies in terms of tools and resources. But it can
5:04
Speaker 3: definitely be difficult to not only attract, but be able
5:08
Speaker 3: to appropriately train and retain talent in today's environment.
5:14
Speaker 1: Absolutely.
5:15
Speaker 2: I like how you mentioned pharmacy technicians because we've talked
5:19
Speaker 2: with so many recently through the NPTA, for example, National
5:25
Speaker 2: Pharmacy Technician Association. Mike Johnston's been on the show several times,
5:29
Speaker 2: and he's sharing how now there are career opportunities for
5:34
Speaker 2: physicians that are really interesting internal to the operations, internal
5:39
Speaker 2: to helping with pre authorizations or customer service or even
5:45
Speaker 2: the front ends in growing almost like a mini education
5:50
Speaker 2: sessions for our patients or people that are in the
5:52
Speaker 2: aisles of our pharmacies and make helping our owners and
5:58
Speaker 2: people out there running these operations to think about this.
6:01
Speaker 2: Let's also talk about the shift from dispensing to clinical
6:06
Speaker 2: advisory from the pharmacist perspective, how do you see that
6:10
Speaker 2: kind of changing workforce a little bit in bringing in
6:13
Speaker 2: talent that really can dial into the specifics diabetes or
6:17
Speaker 2: hypertension or something that is giving us a big opportunity.
6:21
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say we're really seeing pharmacies and all
6:25
Speaker 3: of the pharmacy team, whether that be the pharmacists or technicians,
6:29
Speaker 3: embrace being clinically ready to best serve their communities. And
6:34
Speaker 3: a majority of our pharmacies are located in medically underserved areas,
6:38
Speaker 3: whether that be rural or urban, so we're seeing them
6:42
Speaker 3: go beyond dispensing, offering services like immunizations, medication therapy, management,
6:48
Speaker 3: point of care testing. And I think these services not
6:52
Speaker 3: only improve the patient access to care and health outcomes,
6:56
Speaker 3: but also from a pharmacy health perspective, can help in
7:00
Speaker 3: terms of financial viability as well. And then from a
7:05
Speaker 3: health mark perspective, we view our role to really help
7:08
Speaker 3: to enable so whether that be solution support, training, technology,
7:14
Speaker 3: solutions that they might need to be able to streamline
7:16
Speaker 3: those services. And as pharmacists continue to practice at the
7:20
Speaker 3: top of our licenses, we're going to need educated and
7:24
Speaker 3: informed support staff and technicians. So it's been exciting to
7:28
Speaker 3: see that role really expand.
7:31
Speaker 2: And grow as well, Crystal, because you have that very
7:36
Speaker 2: special access to so many pharmacy owners and friendships and
7:42
Speaker 2: buying groups that you support and you've built relationships with.
7:45
Speaker 2: There's a lot of data there, and there's a lot
7:48
Speaker 2: of operational data there that could become a blueprint or
7:53
Speaker 2: a map for our owners to say, hey, listen, here's
7:57
Speaker 2: best practices internal the pharmacy of what to do next
8:03
Speaker 2: in certain in certain instances including you know, revenue growth
8:08
Speaker 2: or revenue challenges. There was a recent report that came
8:11
Speaker 2: out just last week from the Chief Talent Officer. You
8:14
Speaker 2: can find it at Chief Talentofficer dot co and it
8:18
Speaker 2: was a white paper study on the future Proofing of
8:21
Speaker 2: workforce the key takeaways from the twenty twenty five State
8:25
Speaker 2: of Talent Management and Human Resource Report. And the follow
8:31
Speaker 2: up question I want to make, and this is a
8:33
Speaker 2: this is a curveball. Crystal two did not have this
8:37
Speaker 2: on our outline, So just throw on this at you,
8:40
Speaker 2: and that's how is AI?
8:43
Speaker 1: How is artificial intelligence in this?
8:45
Speaker 2: You might not have the answer, because I certainly don't,
8:47
Speaker 2: and I'm not even sure any of our listeners have
8:50
Speaker 2: the answer, And that is how can we see it
8:52
Speaker 2: become a tool and a positive support element to different
8:58
Speaker 2: facets of workforce?
8:59
Speaker 1: Manager?
9:00
Speaker 2: I think of the tech first, because you were saying
9:04
Speaker 2: like texts can become operational pivoters to really help things boom,
9:10
Speaker 2: especially with the rise of long term care, pharmacy at home,
9:15
Speaker 2: counseling people on nutritional supplements. I mean, so, what's your
9:18
Speaker 2: thoughts around how AI is going to be disrupting our
9:21
Speaker 2: workforces or become a tool to our workforces.
9:25
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think there's always going to be that human
9:27
Speaker 3: in the loop, whether it be the pharmacy or the technician.
9:31
Speaker 3: But AI can help with so much and technology overall
9:34
Speaker 3: can help with process improvement From a health Mark perspective,
9:40
Speaker 3: we have solutions that are part of our health Mark
9:42
Speaker 3: Perks program, and I've been impressed with one tool in
9:46
Speaker 3: particular that embeds AI and helps to really wrap around
9:51
Speaker 3: the pharmacy management system and support interaction with the patient
9:56
Speaker 3: so that the patient can engage in a way that
9:59
Speaker 3: makes sense for them, whether that be text or chat
10:03
Speaker 3: or a phone call, and then the pharmacy team can
10:07
Speaker 3: focus on those patient interactions that matter most with less
10:12
Speaker 3: of the administrative burden of the phone ringing or having
10:16
Speaker 3: to wait for the patient. And I've also seen this
10:18
Speaker 3: help with an extension of care when the pharmacy is closed,
10:23
Speaker 3: and that can help in terms of additional support for
10:29
Speaker 3: staffing when it might be tight, or in hours when
10:33
Speaker 3: otherwise the pharmacy staff may not be reachable. There's really
10:37
Speaker 3: endless opportunities. I think technology will continue to evolve and
10:41
Speaker 3: it's definitely a hot topic, but when I bring it
10:44
Speaker 3: back to the human in the loop, I think about
10:47
Speaker 3: the pharmacy technician in particular and just making an investment,
10:52
Speaker 3: whether that's technology or education that can expand the role
10:57
Speaker 3: that they have. So we're seeing, as you mentioned, technicians
11:01
Speaker 3: embedded in operations, but also trained to administer vaccines. We're
11:06
Speaker 3: seeing them as community health workers and that's been an
11:09
Speaker 3: area where McKesson has invested in technicians in particular and
11:14
Speaker 3: scholarships to get more technicians trained up as community health
11:18
Speaker 3: workers and extensions in their community. So I think it's
11:21
Speaker 3: a variety. You know, it's technology enabled, but there's also training,
11:26
Speaker 3: career advancement, recruitment, all those things kind of tie together.
11:31
Speaker 2: I just want to shout out to the pharmacy owners
11:34
Speaker 2: listening operators, Hey, this is your time. It's on the
11:38
Speaker 2: eve of twenty twenty five. It's time to go into
11:42
Speaker 2: a new year. Obviously, the rush of insurance changes is
11:46
Speaker 2: a crazy experience for any technician or pharmacist in January February,
11:53
Speaker 2: but take time to think about this workforce talent, workforce
11:59
Speaker 2: management ideas around career path development. There is a website
12:08
Speaker 2: section of McKesson that digs into the focus areas for
12:11
Speaker 2: health Mart franchises and what you provide financial strength and
12:15
Speaker 2: patient care, business operations, marketing support.
12:19
Speaker 1: Take advantage of this. If you're a pharmacy owner and you.
12:23
Speaker 2: Have curiosity, you kind of want to dig into how
12:28
Speaker 2: to set the barometer and the Pathway for twenty twenty six. Crystal,
12:33
Speaker 2: thank you so much. It's always good talking to you.
12:36
Speaker 2: Make sure you tell your PR team and your marketing
12:39
Speaker 2: team anytime you want to come on twerks and talk
12:41
Speaker 2: with us about issues impacting our community pharmacies. You have
12:46
Speaker 2: are gong at your disposal anytime that you want, So
12:49
Speaker 2: thank you so much for this.
12:50
Speaker 3: Well, thank you so much, Tad. I appreciate it, and
12:53
Speaker 3: thank you and all the independent pharmacy owners and pharmacy
12:57
Speaker 3: teams out there. You're the true difference makers and we're
12:59
Speaker 3: just thankful to be able to support the work that
13:01
Speaker 3: you do.
13:02
Speaker 2: And happy holidays, Crystal. Hey, stay warm, it's cold here
13:06
Speaker 2: in Pittsburgh. You ever comes to Pittsburgh, don't come in
13:09
Speaker 2: the next next two or three months. To stay out
13:13
Speaker 2: of Pittsburgh for now.
13:15
Speaker 3: Sounds good. Well, thank you so much. I appreciate it.
13:17
Speaker 3: Happy holidays.
13:19
Speaker 1: Hey, We'll be more.
13:20
Speaker 2: We'll be right back with more twers.
13:41
Speaker 4: This episode is sponsored by Independent Pharmacy Cooperative, widely known
13:45
Speaker 4: as IPC. Established in nineteen eighty three, IPC is the
13:49
Speaker 4: nation's largest group purchasing organization owned by independent pharmacy with
13:54
Speaker 4: a mission of maximizing the success of community pharmacists. IPC
13:58
Speaker 4: works to provide members with access to effective programs and
14:01
Speaker 4: services designed to enhance profitability for independent pharmacy. Read more
14:06
Speaker 4: about our mission by checking out our website at ipcrx
14:09
Speaker 4: dot com. That's ipcrx dot com.
14:30
Speaker 2: Alrighty, alrighty, alrighty. We have twork's news coming up and
14:37
Speaker 2: it's kind of my favorite part, tell you the Truth.
14:41
Speaker 2: I want to give a shout out to our Pharmacy
14:44
Speaker 2: podcast network teams and people that are contributing to our network.
14:50
Speaker 2: I want to shout out to the g RX Marketing Group,
14:54
Speaker 2: Finch Marketing, Nicole mcclaurin team just put out a new
14:58
Speaker 2: episode in their Pharmacy Marketing Vitals podcast. A great podcast,
15:03
Speaker 2: take a look. Shout out to Cardinal Health, thanks so
15:07
Speaker 2: much for your work on the network. The value of
15:11
Speaker 2: community and a really interesting interview with Jesse Stout. Do
15:17
Speaker 2: not miss this on the network. Shout out to Bruce
15:20
Speaker 2: Nealan Skincare. How that can impact your independent community pharmacy,
15:26
Speaker 2: How that can bring in new profits? Do not sleep
15:29
Speaker 2: on Skincare. Take a listen to Pharmacy Crossroads with Bruce
15:33
Speaker 2: neelan in Mike Carrigan. Don't miss the episode if you're
15:38
Speaker 2: if you're a pharmacy owner. We also released the last
15:41
Speaker 2: episode of the Explore coverage. This was the first conference
15:46
Speaker 2: that primar x put out their user conference. It was amazing.
15:50
Speaker 2: We loved being a part of it. We thank you
15:53
Speaker 2: for making us a part of it. This is a wonderful,
15:59
Speaker 2: wonderful upper tunity to leverage technology and what that means
16:03
Speaker 2: and what that means for our future as pharmacy operators,
16:07
Speaker 2: regardless of what space you're in, and I would just
16:11
Speaker 2: want I want to thank you guys for all your work.
16:15
Speaker 2: We're seeing such an increase in participation within the network.
16:19
Speaker 2: We are excited about what's happening to the network and
16:23
Speaker 2: the growth. If you want to be a part of it,
16:25
Speaker 2: if you want to be a part of the Pharmacy
16:28
Speaker 2: podcast network, please reach out to me.
16:31
Speaker 1: Let me know what you'd like to cover.
16:33
Speaker 2: If you want to come on twerks, it's the easiest
16:34
Speaker 2: way to get involved. Let's go over the news together,
16:37
Speaker 2: let's figure out bringing things to our attention. We have
16:40
Speaker 2: this is this is your platform. You bring what you
16:43
Speaker 2: want and I want to want to go through some
16:47
Speaker 2: twork's news.
16:47
Speaker 1: It's my favorite.
16:51
Speaker 5: Thanks Todd. Hope you get warm. It's cold out there
16:53
Speaker 5: in Steelers Country. Okay. Now for Twork's news. First up
16:57
Speaker 5: is an article from chainstoreage dot Com reports how Walgreens
17:02
Speaker 5: is doubling down on automation to reshape pharmacy operations. The
17:06
Speaker 5: retail pharmacy giant is dramatically expanding its network of robot
17:10
Speaker 5: powered micro fulfillment centers, facilities that dispense maintenance medications for
17:15
Speaker 5: chronic conditions like diabetes and hypertension. The goal serve five
17:19
Speaker 5: thousand plus stores by the end of the year, up
17:22
Speaker 5: from earlier coverage of around forty eight hundred stores.
17:26
Speaker 6: Tud your Pittsburgh Steelers are done, my man, give it up.
17:30
Speaker 6: There's always next to your buddy. Okay. Next on Twerqu's news,
17:33
Speaker 6: an article just came out today from Pharmacy Times. There's
17:36
Speaker 6: a new migraine therapy raises key practice questions for pharmacists. Simbravo,
17:40
Speaker 6: a fixed dose oral tablet combining meloxicam and recytriptan, has
17:44
Speaker 6: been approved for the acute treatment of migraine with or
17:47
Speaker 6: without aura, offering a dual mechanism targeting both inflammation and
17:51
Speaker 6: serotonin mediated pathways. Importantly, the product's label specifies that Simbravo
17:55
Speaker 6: is non substitutable, meaning a pharmacist cannot legally swap it
17:59
Speaker 6: with standalone lif loxacam or recite triptan. This makes it
18:02
Speaker 6: essential for pharmacies to dispense exactly what's prescribed and to
18:05
Speaker 6: counsel patients appropriately. Pharmacists now play a critical role. They
18:09
Speaker 6: must identify patients at risk from medication over use, headaches,
18:12
Speaker 6: screen for contraindications e g. Cardiovascular disease, GI risk or
18:17
Speaker 6: nsave triptan interactions, and advocate for comprehensive migrain management beyond
18:21
Speaker 6: just pain relief, including lifestyle adjustments and referrals when needed.
18:25
Speaker 6: Head on over to Pharmacytimes dot com for the full article.
18:28
Speaker 6: Go pack Green Bay Packers all the way.
18:35
Speaker 7: I am a Mavericks fan. We're hurting right now. I
18:38
Speaker 7: have no dog in the football fight. But speaking of
18:40
Speaker 7: Mark Cuban, our last segment on Tork's News is about
18:42
Speaker 7: mister Cuban and the potential partnership with Humana. From Bloomberg
18:45
Speaker 7: dot com. There's a report that Mark Cuban could be
18:47
Speaker 7: forming a potential pharmacy partnership, a development that could shake
18:50
Speaker 7: up how prescriptions are delivered and disrupt traditional middleman models.
18:54
Speaker 7: The collaboration would leverage Cuban's innovative approach to drug pricing
18:57
Speaker 7: and distribution, potentially creating a new channel for medication access
19:01
Speaker 7: that bypasses traditional pharmacy benefit managers and large chain dispensaries.
19:05
Speaker 7: If executed, the partnership could increase competitive pressure on legacy
19:08
Speaker 7: players and reshape the pharmacy supply chain. For independent pharmacies
19:12
Speaker 7: and pharmacy leaders, this signals a possible shift in how
19:14
Speaker 7: drugs are sourced, price and distributed, highlighting the growing influence
19:18
Speaker 7: of alternative pharmacy models and urging traditional pharmacies to adapt
19:21
Speaker 7: or risk being left behind.
19:25
Speaker 8: By the way Todd. One more thing we'd like Tork's
19:26
Speaker 8: listeners to know. Next week in Washington, d C. There's
19:29
Speaker 8: a whole bunch of pharmacy people meeting up to roll
19:31
Speaker 8: out the Pharmacists Fight Back Act. If you want to go,
19:33
Speaker 8: listen up, you'll be joining pharmacists and pharmacy owners from
19:36
Speaker 8: more than seventeen states, all calling for meaningful pharmacy reimbursement reform.
19:40
Speaker 8: Now your presence at the news conference will send a
19:42
Speaker 8: strong message to your congressional delegate. We're serious about passing
19:45
Speaker 8: legislation that protects and keeps pharmacies in business. The news
19:48
Speaker 8: conference is scheduled for Thursday, December eleventh at nine thirty
19:51
Speaker 8: am on the Capitol Hill Lawn. Meet up with Pharmacists
19:54
Speaker 8: United for Truth and Transparency. Check out trutharx dot org.
19:57
Speaker 8: We put a link in todays show notes. Check it
19:59
Speaker 8: out or reach out to Todd on LinkedIn.
20:03
Speaker 2: All right, if you're going to that, just let me know.
20:07
Speaker 2: Reach out to me like on LinkedIn, send me an email.
20:11
Speaker 2: Last name Urie eu r Y at pharmacypodcast dot com.
20:17
Speaker 2: Once again, that's eu r Y at pharmacypodcast dot com.
20:20
Speaker 2: If there's anything I can do for you, let me know.
20:24
Speaker 2: This week, it's been a it's been a crazy week,
20:26
Speaker 2: it's been a crazy year. This week coming up is
20:29
Speaker 2: going to be filled with activity. We're going to be
20:32
Speaker 2: extremely busy and we're looking forward to it. But if
20:35
Speaker 2: we can work together, let's work together our x. Thanks
20:40
Speaker 2: so much for listening to twrqu's news. Stay tuned for
20:44
Speaker 2: our next segment.
20:47
Speaker 4: Fueling lost with the complexities of pharmacy accounting and.
20:50
Speaker 9: In pharmacy today. There's so many different variables and issues
20:56
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21:00
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21:03
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21:07
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21:27
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21:32
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22:11
Speaker 1: This week in pharmacy. Lots going on.
22:14
Speaker 2: I hope you've had a great week back from the
22:18
Speaker 2: crazy holiday of Thanksgiving. Thanksgiving used to be my I
22:25
Speaker 2: don't know, like second or third favorite holiday, but it's
22:28
Speaker 2: definitely become my most favorite for a couple of reasons. Selfishly,
22:34
Speaker 2: I get two Thanksgivings every year because we have our
22:37
Speaker 2: own Thanksgiving and then we have it the Saturday before
22:41
Speaker 2: the actual holiday, and then we get another Thanksgiving. I
22:45
Speaker 2: get to go to somewhere else's house and drink their
22:48
Speaker 2: wine and eat their food and not.
22:50
Speaker 1: Have to clean up. And that's what I like about it.
22:52
Speaker 1: I like being able to go somewhere else and not
22:54
Speaker 1: have to clean up. All right, hey, let's get back
22:57
Speaker 1: to business here on twerks.
23:00
Speaker 2: I want to talk about artificial intelligence. So I know
23:03
Speaker 2: you hear about that all the time. You probably just
23:05
Speaker 2: rolled your eyes as you're in your car or you're jogging.
23:07
Speaker 2: You're like, oh no, here we go with the AI again.
23:10
Speaker 2: But the reason why I want to talk about it
23:12
Speaker 2: is because I've been reading a lot of Marketer messages
23:16
Speaker 2: and public relation firms messaging and a shout out to
23:21
Speaker 2: Vince Grippy If you don't follow Grippy Media, you should
23:25
Speaker 2: because he's just a freaking bible stories of advice on
23:31
Speaker 2: public relations and media and marketing. But I want to
23:35
Speaker 2: talk about being paralyzed by AI because of you not
23:40
Speaker 2: necessarily leveraging it the right way depending on what you're doing.
23:44
Speaker 2: Are you taking an analysis of a bunch of data
23:48
Speaker 2: of financial data? Are you doing reporting, are you doing
23:52
Speaker 2: creative marketing? Are you doing just general writing? And what
23:58
Speaker 2: does that mean for farharmacy operators? What does that mean
24:02
Speaker 2: for developers? And I couldn't think of a better person
24:07
Speaker 2: than one of our pharmacy fifty most influential influencers in
24:11
Speaker 2: our pharmacy markets, my friend Sean Jensen from JB Consulting.
24:16
Speaker 1: Welcome back to twerks.
24:19
Speaker 10: Hey Todd, great to see you and thanks for having
24:21
Speaker 10: me appreciate it. Happy Thanksgiving, Happy belated. I don't know
24:24
Speaker 10: if that's a thing, but.
24:27
Speaker 1: I'm still saying it.
24:28
Speaker 2: I'm like, you know what, one more week of wishing
24:30
Speaker 2: each other happy Thanksgiving and then next week we gotta
24:33
Speaker 2: we gotta get ready for the race, next two weeks
24:36
Speaker 2: before Christmas disrupts everything. And that's like why it's no
24:40
Speaker 2: longer my favorite holiday because it's just it's just so disruptive.
24:45
Speaker 10: Yeah, as a fellow favorite holidays Thanksgiving too, so I
24:48
Speaker 10: appreciate it. But now we're back to cleaning up after ourselves.
24:51
Speaker 1: I guess exactly exactly.
24:53
Speaker 2: An article on LinkedIn just came out, and it's about
24:57
Speaker 2: pharmacy owners pharmacy operators being paralyzed by AI integrating AI
25:03
Speaker 2: into a pharmacy practice. It's almost like, if you're not
25:07
Speaker 2: doing it now, you're probably feeling like you're being left behind.
25:12
Speaker 2: Let's review this article a little bit give listeners just
25:15
Speaker 2: in case they haven't read it. I'm gonna have a
25:16
Speaker 2: link to this LinkedIn article down in the show notes,
25:21
Speaker 2: but give us an overview of what you wrote about
25:24
Speaker 2: why you wrote it.
25:25
Speaker 10: Yeah, I mean it's basically it's it's the same question
25:28
Speaker 10: that's always been there. It's build versus by and as
25:30
Speaker 10: a custom software guy and as an advisor, you know,
25:33
Speaker 10: it's what we've been looking at for twenty years with AI.
25:37
Speaker 10: Though certainly the buy decision of just what's off the shelf.
25:42
Speaker 10: I mean, you saw this year at all the trade shows,
25:44
Speaker 10: we were at all the ones anyone it's AI is
25:46
Speaker 10: all the hype you know, all the panels are filled
25:48
Speaker 10: with AI you know, founders and people talking about their products.
25:51
Speaker 10: The exhibit hall was at least you know, one in
25:54
Speaker 10: every three was an AI startup, so you know, just
25:57
Speaker 10: even understanding you know who pick in there. I mean,
26:00
Speaker 10: it it's getting it's hard, it's a crowded space.
26:03
Speaker 11: It's all new. There's not like your best in breed
26:06
Speaker 11: safe choices.
26:06
Speaker 10: You know, the companies that have been doing it for
26:08
Speaker 10: twenty years, you go with them or you try something new,
26:10
Speaker 10: like everyone's new. I mean, being a veteran is what
26:13
Speaker 10: three five years in business like making money doing AI.
26:16
Speaker 10: So really just there's so much choice out there, and
26:19
Speaker 10: with a discipline that's you know, I'm not.
26:21
Speaker 11: Gonna say AI is new.
26:22
Speaker 10: It's been around since the forties or fifties, but you know, recently,
26:25
Speaker 10: the deep learning of like the last five seven years,
26:28
Speaker 10: the expansion of the resources, computing capacity. I mean, so
26:32
Speaker 10: many things are converging right now where obviously we'ren't a
26:34
Speaker 10: new era or new age of AIS, especially as you know,
26:37
Speaker 10: as it comes to pharmacy, so I think even the
26:40
Speaker 10: buy decision is more complicated and the build decision. You know,
26:45
Speaker 10: it's not like Hey, you need a seven figure budget.
26:48
Speaker 10: You need to build this huge team. Like for years
26:50
Speaker 10: you can't build serious commercial software, you know, for fifty
26:53
Speaker 10: grand one hundred grand, But nowadays, you know, maybe you can.
26:58
Speaker 11: AI is enabling more with less.
27:00
Speaker 10: You know, they're certainly proto typing and MVPs and people
27:03
Speaker 10: are developing, which is small teams and showing really really
27:06
Speaker 10: interesting things. You know. The flip side is, you know,
27:09
Speaker 10: building something you're taking on a lot of liability.
27:11
Speaker 11: Now you're a software company, you know, like it or not.
27:13
Speaker 10: By definition, you're a software company that's you know that's
27:17
Speaker 10: underestimated every day, no one really so few people understand
27:20
Speaker 10: like just how much goes into that add AI now
27:23
Speaker 10: you know, to add the data, add the security, the privacy.
27:26
Speaker 11: You know, it's lyyering it. You can't just be a
27:28
Speaker 11: good tech company. You have to be a good AI
27:31
Speaker 11: tech company, which is you know, no small feet.
27:33
Speaker 10: And the companies that are doing it well, they're being rewarded.
27:35
Speaker 10: They're out there, you know, changing things to doing great job.
27:39
Speaker 10: But you know, it's really hard to separate the fact
27:41
Speaker 10: from the fiction and like the real the real people
27:44
Speaker 10: from the kind of vaporware as you put it, so
27:46
Speaker 10: that's kind of what we're all trying to figure out
27:48
Speaker 10: here together, and that's what a lot of my focus
27:49
Speaker 10: this year has really been on this trend towards like
27:52
Speaker 10: what do people do with this choice overload. It's like
27:55
Speaker 10: going on a streaming service at night. You know, what
27:56
Speaker 10: are you gonna pick? There's too many choices, and I
27:59
Speaker 10: just find that, like you said, the operators, they're paralyzed
28:02
Speaker 10: by not knowing what to do. It's hard to just
28:04
Speaker 10: kind of follow the leader because you don't want to
28:06
Speaker 10: be left behind. You want to be the leader, but
28:09
Speaker 10: it's scary being out there on your own trying to decide,
28:11
Speaker 10: you know, which way to go.
28:13
Speaker 2: I think that there's so much parallel to something that
28:18
Speaker 2: starts out as trend. Trendy might start out as something fun,
28:23
Speaker 2: people trickle into it, but then all of a sudden,
28:25
Speaker 2: when it starts being really leveraged as actual tools that
28:29
Speaker 2: are making differences in business. Let's back up two three
28:33
Speaker 2: years ago. And by the way, what I'm about to
28:35
Speaker 2: give this comparison, it's the same thing with freaking podcasting.
28:40
Speaker 2: I've asked the NCPA, I've asked the APHA, I've asked
28:44
Speaker 2: big companies I've asked pharma. I ask people that I
28:48
Speaker 2: get to have meetings with. Are you a podcasting company?
28:53
Speaker 2: Are you a publisher? And do you is that what
28:56
Speaker 2: you do? And there, of course they're like, well, of
28:58
Speaker 2: course not. And I'm like, well, then why aren't you
29:01
Speaker 2: joining forces with us so that we do all the
29:04
Speaker 2: silly work we do, all the connection, we do, all
29:07
Speaker 2: the distribution, the marketing, because we know how to do this.
29:10
Speaker 2: I've been doing it for sixteen years so that I
29:12
Speaker 2: can jett us in you and leapfrog you from zero
29:16
Speaker 2: listeners to thousands of listeners and getting you in touch
29:20
Speaker 2: with the right people and creating conversations that move the
29:23
Speaker 2: needle for business development. That's the exact same reason that
29:27
Speaker 2: I have you here today, Sean, is because you're going
29:31
Speaker 2: to ask these specialty pharmacy companies. You're going to ask
29:34
Speaker 2: the long term care pharmacy operators or even the small
29:38
Speaker 2: change You're going to say, are you guys an AI company?
29:41
Speaker 2: And the answer is no, you are not an AI
29:43
Speaker 2: design company? So why not partner with an organization who's
29:48
Speaker 2: been saturated and soaking in pharmacy, business metrics and data
29:54
Speaker 2: and design before AI was even a thing. And now
29:57
Speaker 2: JB Consulting in your team is adding a onto the
30:02
Speaker 2: common denominators and the infrastructure and the CRM systems and
30:06
Speaker 2: the custom stuff that's built. I remember Mike Agostino who
30:11
Speaker 2: ran Amber Pharmacy.
30:13
Speaker 1: A shout out to Mike.
30:14
Speaker 2: He's a freaking godfather of so many things in what
30:18
Speaker 2: he's doing in.
30:19
Speaker 1: Healthcare to this day.
30:20
Speaker 2: But he had to build a pharmacy management system because
30:24
Speaker 2: there wasn't a pharmacy management system that really fit the
30:27
Speaker 2: way that things were.
30:28
Speaker 1: And this is fifteen years ago.
30:30
Speaker 2: So now I'm thinking there's Pioneer, and there's Framework LTC,
30:36
Speaker 2: and there's Innovalon technologies, and there's all these technologies. What
30:42
Speaker 2: if you have a very specific thing that you need
30:45
Speaker 2: done in a myriad of things, data analysis or sell
30:49
Speaker 2: structure or marketing or curating best pathways to getting things
30:56
Speaker 2: paid for these expensive specialty meds, And now you get
30:59
Speaker 2: to bring in you and your team and say, we
31:03
Speaker 2: need AI to do this, and we really don't have
31:06
Speaker 2: any idea of how to actually make it happen because
31:09
Speaker 2: we don't want to. We don't want to push out
31:11
Speaker 2: the millions of dollars or all the infrastructure that we've
31:14
Speaker 2: developed and we've built over the years.
31:16
Speaker 1: We just want it to enhance. And that's exactly.
31:19
Speaker 2: What I believe the smart operator and the one that
31:24
Speaker 2: isn't paralyzed is going to do. They're going to reach
31:27
Speaker 2: out to an organization that is in pharmacy, in operations,
31:31
Speaker 2: in healthcare, speaks the language, understands it, and then and
31:35
Speaker 2: then rises the unicorns, uh sean, because there's very few
31:39
Speaker 2: organizations that I know of that have all of those
31:43
Speaker 2: you know, tweaks and in bits to be able to
31:47
Speaker 2: make it fit and be able to get something out
31:50
Speaker 2: of it without spending millions of dollars instead and being
31:55
Speaker 2: able to do something streamlined. And you and I have
31:58
Speaker 2: started out slow with our own system. You've created a
32:00
Speaker 2: metric system for the Pharmacy Podcast Network, and we've taken
32:04
Speaker 2: in in stages on purpose because it was new to us,
32:07
Speaker 2: it was new to our clients and new to our hosts.
32:10
Speaker 1: So I think it's the right way to approach it.
32:13
Speaker 2: In a shout out to operators out there that are
32:15
Speaker 2: listening right now, what is your software as a service solution,
32:20
Speaker 2: What is your CRM system? What is your marketing service
32:23
Speaker 2: and software? How could you bring that all together by
32:26
Speaker 2: layering AI. How can you make it all work?
32:30
Speaker 11: I mean it's just for like the operators out there too.
32:33
Speaker 10: I mean you've got to look at the types of
32:34
Speaker 10: companies that are that are getting in the space and
32:37
Speaker 10: sort of you know, you need to know their origin story.
32:39
Speaker 10: You know, some of these companies it's you know, like Mike,
32:42
Speaker 10: who also has a good friend, you know, great guy
32:43
Speaker 10: shout out to Mike, like you said, you know someone
32:47
Speaker 10: who knows this stuff so well, who's like, look, if
32:49
Speaker 10: I could just wave my wand and build this thing,
32:52
Speaker 10: here's exactly what it would do, and it would work
32:53
Speaker 10: great because that person knows exactly what needs to be done.
32:57
Speaker 10: You know. You get entrepreneurial folks who have seen the
32:59
Speaker 10: issue in the problems firsthand forever and they're like, you know, I.
33:02
Speaker 11: Know, there's got to be a better way to do this,
33:04
Speaker 11: so they form a team they build something. And there's
33:06
Speaker 11: also companies that kind of just come out of left field,
33:08
Speaker 11: like in every industry. They're tech guys.
33:10
Speaker 10: You know, they kind of read from afar like oh,
33:12
Speaker 10: you know, healthcare they struggle with prior offs. They read
33:16
Speaker 10: a little bit like, oh, if you could automate sending facts.
33:18
Speaker 10: I could write that, and it's like they think they
33:19
Speaker 10: can solve prior off because they can automate sending faxes
33:23
Speaker 10: or they can you know, read documents with AI and
33:26
Speaker 10: you know there's a lot of stuff that you know,
33:28
Speaker 10: it gets the nuance of what needs to really be
33:30
Speaker 10: done to build the right solution is it takes a
33:34
Speaker 10: huge combination of skills, Like you said, a unicorn. You know,
33:37
Speaker 10: you need the right folks and you know what goes
33:40
Speaker 10: into that team that you would really need to build something.
33:42
Speaker 10: You know, whether you're taking it to market for the masses,
33:44
Speaker 10: which is even more challenging, or trying to build something
33:47
Speaker 10: for yourself to improve your own operation and your own
33:50
Speaker 10: you know, niche workflow that you have. Either way, you
33:53
Speaker 10: know it's a big undertaking, but you know it's not
33:56
Speaker 10: to be intimidated by it.
33:57
Speaker 11: Like like I.
33:58
Speaker 10: Said, with AI and just with the current way programming
34:02
Speaker 10: is now compared to the nineties and in the you
34:04
Speaker 10: know two thousands, early two thousands, you know, it's way
34:06
Speaker 10: more accessible, Like smaller teams can do a lot more
34:09
Speaker 10: than they could before.
34:10
Speaker 11: You don't need a consultant like JB.
34:12
Speaker 10: If you don't know someone you know, certainly we can
34:14
Speaker 10: be that unicorn for you, and we could come in
34:17
Speaker 10: with the twenty five years of experience. And you know,
34:19
Speaker 10: programming is as much an art as it is a science.
34:21
Speaker 10: I actually say it's probably more of an art than
34:22
Speaker 10: a science. You know, it's not the perfect way to
34:25
Speaker 10: do everything. There's more than one way to skin a cat.
34:27
Speaker 10: And you know, there's really everything's a trade off in software.
34:30
Speaker 10: I mean, you know that's todd like every single decision
34:32
Speaker 10: you make is a trade off. So you got to
34:34
Speaker 10: come in and see what works best for yourself for
34:36
Speaker 10: your operation. And you know, if you need some help
34:40
Speaker 10: shepherding you through kind of making decisions, you need a consultant.
34:43
Speaker 11: That you can trust. It could obviously be us, that'd be.
34:45
Speaker 10: Great because we've been around for a long time, but
34:47
Speaker 10: you know, really you just need someone who has the
34:49
Speaker 10: perspective and that unique skills of data privacy. They understand,
34:53
Speaker 10: you know, how to protect this stuff. They underst like
34:56
Speaker 10: you know, privacy officer, they're a CTO. They understand all
35:00
Speaker 10: the technology out there, all the emerging trends, like everything
35:02
Speaker 10: that AI is doing behind the scenes, and they know healthcare,
35:05
Speaker 10: you know, pharmacy and health tech. They have to know
35:07
Speaker 10: it inside and out. You can't just stumble in the
35:09
Speaker 10: field with a technology background and expect to have everyone
35:12
Speaker 10: teach you how to do it.
35:13
Speaker 11: I mean that's one of the things that we see.
35:15
Speaker 10: Vendors come in with these low price points and it's
35:18
Speaker 10: like interesting because they know they can solve any problem.
35:21
Speaker 10: They're like, look, if you sit me in a room,
35:22
Speaker 10: teach my guys here, Like, what's the problem, show us
35:25
Speaker 10: like over your shoulder, we can solve that. Well, Like,
35:27
Speaker 10: of course you can. That's what technologists do all day long.
35:29
Speaker 11: It's pretty easy to do.
35:31
Speaker 10: You got to wonder, like what happens once they've solved
35:33
Speaker 10: that problem, Like you know, you're helping them help you,
35:36
Speaker 10: but for what and at what cost? And like, once
35:38
Speaker 10: they've solved that problem, do they go and bring it
35:41
Speaker 10: to your competitors or bring it to the whole market?
35:44
Speaker 10: And what happens if they're successful? You know, hopefully they are,
35:47
Speaker 10: but like if they are, your costs could go up astronomically.
35:50
Speaker 10: As they're going up. They might be taking a loss
35:52
Speaker 10: just to get in the door with you get a
35:53
Speaker 10: footprint in the industry. Say they have a client also
35:56
Speaker 10: sit and work with.
35:57
Speaker 11: You for cheap. You're like, wow, this is a great
35:59
Speaker 11: you know, win win. It's like, well, yeah, it is.
36:01
Speaker 10: They're sitting in there and you're investing your time in
36:03
Speaker 10: their product. You're teaching their team stuff that they don't
36:06
Speaker 10: even know.
36:06
Speaker 11: How to do.
36:07
Speaker 10: It works in a lot of cases, it's not. You know,
36:09
Speaker 10: you got to watch your secret sauce a little bit.
36:11
Speaker 10: But also you know, you're kind of renting their capabilities
36:15
Speaker 10: if you want to put it that way, rather than
36:17
Speaker 10: building and investing in your own.
36:19
Speaker 11: So when people.
36:20
Speaker 10: Say like let's just start small, let's bring in a vendor,
36:24
Speaker 10: let's see how they do it, kind of observe firsthand,
36:26
Speaker 10: like how the pros do it. You know, mind you
36:28
Speaker 10: a pro is someone who's been doing it for two
36:29
Speaker 10: or three years, not you know, two or three months.
36:32
Speaker 11: There's not much of a pro. And then you're just
36:34
Speaker 11: gonna kind of do it on your own and learn
36:36
Speaker 11: from them. But it's like it goes both ways.
36:38
Speaker 10: Like I said, it's a trade off, and like you
36:39
Speaker 10: got to see what you're giving up potentially, And again
36:41
Speaker 10: it comes down to trust. You got to trust your
36:43
Speaker 10: consultants that they're in your best interest. You got to
36:45
Speaker 10: you gotta trust your vendors that they're doing the right thing,
36:49
Speaker 10: just like everywhere in life.
36:50
Speaker 2: Those are those are excellent points, Sean. I also want
36:54
Speaker 2: to encourage the listener to not pigeon a whole your
37:00
Speaker 2: specific department with tools that then squeeze out the rest
37:06
Speaker 2: of the departments. If you gathered up, if you gathered
37:11
Speaker 2: up operations, you gathered up marketing, you gathered up the
37:14
Speaker 2: executive team, the CFO, the reimbursement consultant, the patient care manager.
37:22
Speaker 2: Definitely sprinkle in pharmacists in there, get them all together
37:26
Speaker 2: and ask them, Hey, in twenty twenty six, we want
37:29
Speaker 2: to roll out a management ERP like HubSpot like system
37:37
Speaker 2: that can really utilize all of our existing technology but
37:41
Speaker 2: bring us all together with a lot more automation, a
37:44
Speaker 2: lot more customization of our forms and of our policies.
37:50
Speaker 2: And the only way we're going to be able to
37:53
Speaker 2: do that is a we kind of sprinkle or overlay
37:56
Speaker 2: a custom software system on top of it, bringing everything together,
38:00
Speaker 2: leveraging AI and doing it the right way. That's where
38:03
Speaker 2: JB Consulting steps in and says, Okay, we see the
38:07
Speaker 2: outline that you've built from different perspectives. We saw it
38:10
Speaker 2: from sales and marketing. We saw it from client management,
38:15
Speaker 2: account management, the CFO, we saw it from operations, from reimbursement.
38:21
Speaker 2: This is how we can bring it all together. And
38:23
Speaker 2: I think when you guys can start connecting the dots
38:26
Speaker 2: for the client, the lights and creativity are going to
38:29
Speaker 2: go off, and then they can bring those additional ideas
38:32
Speaker 2: back to you and execute and finally use AI without
38:37
Speaker 2: it being paralyzing and scary and realizing, hey, I don't
38:42
Speaker 2: really know what we're doing.
38:45
Speaker 11: Yeah, I mean that's exactly. Every team is unique.
38:48
Speaker 10: Every team has different strengths and weaknesses and different people
38:51
Speaker 10: in it, and that's what makes everything different. So you know,
38:54
Speaker 10: if you bring in a company like us, the first
38:56
Speaker 10: thing I do is take an assessment and see, you know,
38:59
Speaker 10: what's there and what could be helped out. And you know,
39:02
Speaker 10: really the cast of characters involved is going to determine
39:04
Speaker 10: the solution. And you know, the goal and the patience
39:07
Speaker 10: you're serving and your unique workflow and there are so
39:09
Speaker 10: many things that are case to case that you know,
39:12
Speaker 10: just bringing the right talent together, the right experience together,
39:15
Speaker 10: you know companies will succeed with that. And you know,
39:17
Speaker 10: like you said, we can all walk before we run,
39:19
Speaker 10: just like we're doing with the metric system. You know
39:21
Speaker 10: already a lot of cool stuff that you've built and designed,
39:23
Speaker 10: but like you.
39:24
Speaker 11: Know, phase two, phase three, you know is going to
39:27
Speaker 11: make it even better.
39:27
Speaker 10: But there's no reason to wait and be overwhelmed by
39:30
Speaker 10: you know, all those phases like we're starting, Your customers
39:32
Speaker 10: are already benefiting from it, and it's only going to
39:34
Speaker 10: get better from here. I think pharmacy owners and operators
39:37
Speaker 10: can take the same.
39:37
Speaker 2: Approach absolutely, So reach out to Sean. He's very active
39:44
Speaker 2: on LinkedIn. He's also going to be at You're gone
39:47
Speaker 2: to Assembia twenty twenty six in April, right of course, yep, hotfully,
39:52
Speaker 2: so we have time there with Sean. Uh, get together, brainstorm,
39:58
Speaker 2: do things out to the ASSEMBIA team. I love this
40:02
Speaker 2: conference and everything that they do to position leaders and
40:06
Speaker 2: specially pharmacy to do business together. But Jeohn, I always
40:10
Speaker 2: appreciate your insights on twerks. Promise me that you're going
40:13
Speaker 2: to come back and let's dig into specific case studies.
40:17
Speaker 2: Let's bring on one of your clients and dig into
40:20
Speaker 2: the challenges that they face and demystify artificial intelligence and pharmacy.
40:26
Speaker 11: That sounds great, Todd.
40:26
Speaker 10: I appreciate it and looking forward to doing that and
40:28
Speaker 10: thanks for having me.
40:29
Speaker 2: Enjoy the holidays absolutely, Hey, we'll be right back with
40:33
Speaker 2: Mark towerks hang on.
40:40
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40:44
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41:36
Speaker 1: Hey, welcome back to twers Hey.
41:38
Speaker 2: One of the things that's been confusing to me for
41:41
Speaker 2: a number of years. There was a company that I
41:44
Speaker 2: worked with back in my long term care days when
41:48
Speaker 2: three forty B really started to kind of bubble up
41:51
Speaker 2: and several pharmacies really started to differentiate their inventory from
41:56
Speaker 2: general inventory to three.
41:58
Speaker 1: Forty B inventory.
42:00
Speaker 2: Starting on January first, twenty twenty six, the three forty
42:03
Speaker 2: B program is going to see significant changes, which is
42:06
Speaker 2: going to include implementation of a three forty B rebate
42:09
Speaker 2: model pilot program and for specific drugs, and then new
42:14
Speaker 2: drug acquisition cost surveys and outpatient hospital questionnaire. And additionally,
42:21
Speaker 2: there's going to be a site neutral payment adjustment to
42:24
Speaker 2: certain drug administration services, although the broader three forty B
42:29
Speaker 2: remedy offset will remain and I guess half a percentage.
42:34
Speaker 2: I mean, I could keep going on, but I'm confusing
42:36
Speaker 2: myself just even listening to myself try to do these
42:39
Speaker 2: cliff notes. So that's why I've invited Allison a Rant
42:44
Speaker 2: to the show today. Welcome to Twerks, Allison. It's great
42:47
Speaker 2: to have you here.
42:49
Speaker 12: Hey Todd, thanks for having me all right.
42:51
Speaker 2: You got to tell our listeners a little bit about
42:53
Speaker 2: your background and what you do at Clearway Health because
42:57
Speaker 2: we're excited to have you here today.
42:58
Speaker 11: Yeah.
42:59
Speaker 3: Thanks, I did to join you.
43:00
Speaker 12: I am Alison A. Rant I am senior vice president
43:04
Speaker 12: at Clearway Health and I lead all of our client development,
43:08
Speaker 12: client success, and marketing efforts. And what that means, especially
43:12
Speaker 12: for today's topic, is that we help to digest really
43:16
Speaker 12: hard complex things and specialty pharmacy, and we are a
43:19
Speaker 12: partner to our clients to help them navigate the hard things.
43:22
Speaker 12: And so we're building specialty pharmacy programs for hospitals and
43:26
Speaker 12: health systems, and when industry and regulatory changes like these happen,
43:31
Speaker 12: we help to navigate them successfully to ensure optimal, optimal
43:35
Speaker 12: care and financial performance.
43:38
Speaker 2: Well, thanks for being here. We love seeing it. At the
43:40
Speaker 2: NASP meeting that happens every year. I shout out to
43:44
Speaker 2: the NASP team. I don't know if you'd say NAS
43:47
Speaker 2: or NASP. I rattle off NASP because it's easier to
43:50
Speaker 2: remember the alphabet Soup's.
43:54
Speaker 1: Let's get into this because I have some questions.
43:56
Speaker 2: So first of all, there's like a rebate model light,
44:00
Speaker 2: a pilot.
44:01
Speaker 1: Program that's going to be launched.
44:02
Speaker 2: There's like nine specific drugs included in kind of like
44:06
Speaker 2: the list. Can you kind of make sense of that
44:08
Speaker 2: for us?
44:09
Speaker 3: Yeah?
44:10
Speaker 12: Absolutely, So this has really been talked about for the
44:14
Speaker 12: last twelve months. But when it really started to matter
44:17
Speaker 12: was in July this year when the Health Resources and
44:21
Speaker 12: Services Administration HERSA announced that the three forty B Rebate
44:27
Speaker 12: Model pilot program would go into effect in January for
44:30
Speaker 12: the very first time. And so initially this is going
44:34
Speaker 12: to apply to nine drugs with identified manufacturers, and the
44:39
Speaker 12: big change is that they're selected for Medicare's maxim of
44:43
Speaker 12: their Price program.
44:45
Speaker 3: And this program is going to go.
44:46
Speaker 12: For at least a year. So instead of a hospital
44:49
Speaker 12: being able to buy those drugs at a discounted three
44:52
Speaker 12: forty B price, they're going to have to buy them
44:55
Speaker 12: at wholesale acquisition cost, submit a claim, and then wait
45:00
Speaker 12: ten days to be reimbursed to the difference in the
45:04
Speaker 12: whack wholesale acquisition cost and the three forty B press.
45:08
Speaker 12: So in all, they're floating a lot more cash up
45:11
Speaker 12: front instead of really gaining the benefit of a three
45:14
Speaker 12: forty B program to help them buy drugs at a
45:17
Speaker 12: discount and price to create accessible care for their patients.
45:21
Speaker 2: So I can never define why something is changed as
45:26
Speaker 2: it is. When there's changes, there's disruptions. If you start following,
45:30
Speaker 2: you pour water down a hill and sometimes water goes
45:34
Speaker 2: where you don't intend it to go. So your organization,
45:38
Speaker 2: the data, analytics, the insights you have enough going to
45:42
Speaker 2: probably help us understand this. But who's this going to
45:45
Speaker 2: disrupt right out of the gate? Like who January first comes?
45:49
Speaker 2: What organizations are going to be like I can't afford
45:52
Speaker 2: to front X number of thousands, if not millions of dollars?
45:56
Speaker 1: Like who's this going to impact before.
45:58
Speaker 2: We figure out the real path? Maybe they'll make changes
46:02
Speaker 2: in the next quarter or the next year. But regardless,
46:07
Speaker 2: who's worried about this right now?
46:10
Speaker 12: Who's worried about it now is every hospital and health
46:14
Speaker 12: system in the US that is a three P forty
46:17
Speaker 12: V eligible entity who is writing prescriptions and filling them
46:21
Speaker 12: in their own pharmacy for these identified drugs. Who it's
46:25
Speaker 12: going to impact after January one are the providers who
46:30
Speaker 12: are having to wait longer and jump through hoops with
46:32
Speaker 12: their administration to get access to the drugs, and ultimately
46:36
Speaker 12: for the patients who are going to be hamstrung if
46:39
Speaker 12: a hospital doesn't have the cash up front to buy
46:42
Speaker 12: these drugs down and wait for the rebate to come through. So,
46:45
Speaker 12: when you think about it from a regulatory perspective. We
46:48
Speaker 12: have manufacturers and we have administration who's making decisions that
46:53
Speaker 12: ultimately are impacting the care in the financial stability of
46:57
Speaker 12: hospitals and of patients.
47:00
Speaker 2: So I think of our independent community pharmacies out there
47:03
Speaker 2: who might be attached to healthcare clinics in counties or
47:08
Speaker 2: in states that are receiving funding. I'm thinking of small
47:13
Speaker 2: hospital systems, medium sized hospital systems. There's listeners right now,
47:19
Speaker 2: they're listening in. They're like, Oh, I didn't even realize this.
47:21
Speaker 2: What should they be thinking about? It's Friday, November? What
47:27
Speaker 2: is today on Friday? It's easy, So what do they
47:32
Speaker 2: gotta do to shift and make adjustments to prepare for
47:36
Speaker 2: January first?
47:37
Speaker 12: Yeah, there to think about and it is possible. So
47:42
Speaker 12: while it is a lot, there is a path to
47:44
Speaker 12: success to make sure that you're ready for January first,
47:47
Speaker 12: and it's going to take a lot of work. The
47:50
Speaker 12: first is understanding that there is a technology requirement for
47:54
Speaker 12: all of this, where when you submit the claims it
47:57
Speaker 12: has to go through Beacon, which is the technology partner
48:00
Speaker 12: that has been selected for this program. So every hospital
48:04
Speaker 12: and health system that's a covered entity is going to
48:06
Speaker 12: have to register with Beacon to submit that data to
48:09
Speaker 12: flow through to the manufacturer and back to Beacon ten
48:13
Speaker 12: days later to get that rebate. So you've got to
48:15
Speaker 12: work on the technology component. You also have to look
48:18
Speaker 12: at the impact. If you haven't already started sizing the impact,
48:22
Speaker 12: take a look at that list of drugs and understand
48:25
Speaker 12: how many of those prescriptions are your providers prescribing and
48:29
Speaker 12: what are the dollars that you're looking at, what's the
48:31
Speaker 12: difference in that number of prescriptions and paying for those
48:35
Speaker 12: drugs at whack versus three point forty b and then
48:38
Speaker 12: starting to work with revenue cycle to make sure that
48:41
Speaker 12: you've got the right folks set up to look at
48:43
Speaker 12: the impact that's going to have on cash flow, to
48:46
Speaker 12: make sure that you're prepared for that impact and that
48:49
Speaker 12: wait time of ten days. You have to figure out
48:52
Speaker 12: how often you're going to submit those claims and it's
48:54
Speaker 12: a very people dependent process, especially to get started. So
48:58
Speaker 12: asking those questions in internally is going to be really
49:01
Speaker 12: important to make sure that you're prepared. And the other
49:04
Speaker 12: thing is, you know today's Friday, Monday morning, start looking
49:07
Speaker 12: at can I buy down some of these drugs now?
49:11
Speaker 12: Over the next couple of weeks. Can I go ahead
49:13
Speaker 12: and buy down some at three point forty B pricing
49:15
Speaker 12: so that I have a little bit of a stock
49:17
Speaker 12: ready so that it minimizes that disruption come January one,
49:21
Speaker 12: when you're going to have to start buying them that
49:23
Speaker 12: wholesale acquisition cost.
49:26
Speaker 2: Work with your buying groups, or work with your wholesalers,
49:31
Speaker 2: or ask a lot of questions, what about Clearway. Are
49:35
Speaker 2: you open to taking questions from hospital systems at this point?
49:39
Speaker 2: And what would you do if a hospital kind of
49:43
Speaker 2: reached out to you and said, hey, can you help
49:45
Speaker 2: us out with this?
49:47
Speaker 12: Absolutely? Yeah, we are eager to be av source. Clearway
49:50
Speaker 12: Health partners hospitals and health systems across the country. We
49:54
Speaker 12: are in the throes of preparing and supporting them as
49:57
Speaker 12: they're getting ready for January one. Please reach out to
50:01
Speaker 12: us info at clearwayhealth dot com.
50:04
Speaker 3: You can connect with.
50:04
Speaker 12: Us through our website and ask us for help. We
50:08
Speaker 12: would certainly be willing and able to engage, to ask
50:12
Speaker 12: you the questions and to support you on this journey.
50:15
Speaker 12: One of the biggest things that I think we can
50:16
Speaker 12: do is we navigate this change is support each other.
50:19
Speaker 12: We have advocacy groups just this week, you know, supported
50:22
Speaker 12: a conversation with America's es Central Hospitals connected with America
50:27
Speaker 12: Hospitals Association in the lawsuit that they filed just earlier
50:31
Speaker 12: this week to try to stop moving this forward.
50:34
Speaker 3: So please use Clearway, use.
50:36
Speaker 12: Your peers, and use these advocacy groups as a resource
50:40
Speaker 12: to help support through this change.
50:43
Speaker 2: Yeah, listeners, you're driving in a car, jogging, doing something
50:46
Speaker 2: where you're not watching us on YouTube or on video,
50:49
Speaker 2: and you're listening to this after the fact. If you
50:52
Speaker 2: can't get a hold of Alison, you can't reach somebody
50:55
Speaker 2: at Clearway Health, which I'm sure you can, you reach
50:57
Speaker 2: out to Pharmacy Podcast Network and I'll connect with Alison
51:00
Speaker 2: directly and we'll get you some answers. But yeah, Alison,
51:04
Speaker 2: thank you for demystifying this in some ways, because I
51:07
Speaker 2: think we need a whole series on strategies around three
51:11
Speaker 2: forty b and twenty twenty six.
51:14
Speaker 12: Absolutely, it's a monumental shift and getting ready for it
51:17
Speaker 12: is tough to appreciate the time to talk about it.
51:20
Speaker 2: Absolutely, well, we appreciate your time here on twerks. Just
51:24
Speaker 2: hold on for one second. A quick message from our sponsor.
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Speaker 2: Thank you so much for what you do. Thank you
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Speaker 2: so much for listening to all of our forty plus
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Speaker 2: podcasts that's part of the Pharmacy Podcast Network. I am
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Speaker 2: so proud to be involved in this profession and support
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Speaker 2: this profession. I hope you have a great week and
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Speaker 2: we will talk to you next week on This Week
53:36
Speaker 2: in Pharmacy.