Latest / Most Things Kenobi - A Star Wars Podcast / Episode 120: Our review of the EPIC, INSANE, BEAUTIFUL, BRILLIANT "Ahsoka" Episode 5

Transcript

Episode 120: Our review of the EPIC, INSANE, BEAUTIFUL, BRILLIANT "Ahsoka" Episode 5 · Most Things Kenobi - A Star Wars Podcast

0:00
Hello there, it's time for most things.
0:02
Kenobi. Hi everyone, welcome to another
0:23
episode of Most Things Kenobi, a podcast about Obi Wan Kenobi and
0:26
all things Star Wars. I'm your host, Leanne, and I'm
0:30
barely holding it together. I'm so excited.
0:33
I'm your host, Lauren, and I wish you all could have heard
0:36
the voice message Leanne sent me after the last Asoka episode
0:42
that came out because it was epic.
0:46
This is what we're talking about.
0:47
This episode is Asoka Episode 5, otherwise known as Everything
0:53
I've ever dreamed of. Also known as.
0:56
Every scream. I left you on that.
0:59
Actually, you know what? I have that.
1:01
Let's put it in right here. Oh my God.
1:08
I don't even know what I'm watching right now.
1:10
I am so fucking here for this. Oh my God, it's so good.
1:20
Yeah, So that was my reaction. That was me in the middle of
1:26
watching episode 5, and I paused it enough to send Lauren and I
1:31
think Derek that reaction. So truly.
1:36
It was not spoilery. No, no, I didn't.
1:40
I honestly, it gave me expectations that I wasn't.
1:45
I wasn't even sure anymore. Like, your reaction made me
1:49
like, well, what? What is it going to be exactly?
1:54
I was. What did we even witness besides
1:59
greatness? I was blown the fuck away.
2:03
It was so well done. I know we've been sitting on
2:07
this show and asking for, like, some of the things we got in
2:10
this episode. I never would have thought it
2:13
would come in such a spectacular package.
2:18
It was. I don't even.
2:21
I couldn't even process it. I literally couldn't.
2:24
Yeah, I kind of just sat there dumbfounded.
2:27
Afterwards. I wasn't even.
2:29
I wasn't even able to, like, scream or have.
2:33
Well, first of all, I was like 2 in the morning and the rest of
2:35
my family was asleep. So the benefits of living alone,
2:39
me and having to go to bed wasn't allowed to scream.
2:45
My cat straight up left. He left.
2:48
I was kicking my legs like crazy in in bed.
2:51
I watched it in bed. My first mistake.
2:53
But like it was a scene. But yeah, I understand.
2:58
You couldn't scream. I screamed for you and everyone
3:00
else. I did.
3:00
You scream for me for sure, but I don't know.
3:03
I like my brain still. I'm.
3:05
I'm not even sure what we saw. Like I'm.
3:08
I'm a little confused. Honestly.
3:10
I'm coming away. Really confused.
3:13
But also, like you said, this is something we've always wanted
3:18
and they did it so well. Hayden is.
3:22
I just want to like bow at his feet.
3:24
He was so beautiful and perfect and just.
3:30
I do have chills. I wondered if I would get the
3:33
chills. Yeah, I feel happy for him.
3:34
Let's let's honor the GOAT, Hayden Christensen yes.
3:38
Hayden. You you watched Clone Wars.
3:42
I'm proud of you. I'm proud of you.
3:44
He had it down. Oh my God.
3:47
I don't know where to start. It was here I go with no words.
3:54
This is the trouble with the podcast and not having words.
3:59
I OK. First off, let's go shallow and
4:02
go deep and then then go deeper shallow right off the bat.
4:06
He looks fantastic. They got the hair down like
4:09
young Clone Wars, Anakin curl the.
4:12
Girls, the armor. The fucking blue and maroon
4:16
armor. I was.
4:17
So This is why I was screaming, because it's like you said the
4:21
dumbfounded thing. I knew what I was seeing, but I
4:25
didn't know what I was watching. It was some kind of mind fuck
4:30
like. I was missing some of the
4:32
dialogue because my own inner dialogue was like, God, he looks
4:36
good. Oh my God, he has the voice
4:37
down. Oh, he's got the stands down.
4:39
Oh, look at young Asoka. Oh, she's got her little Padawan
4:43
jiggly thing, you know, All these things are like and and
4:46
then fucking racks, motherfucking racks, yo, they
4:52
threw it all at us and I was eating it up, you know, I was.
4:56
I was so distracted by the fact that we were finally getting
4:59
live action Clone Wars that I barely could understand what was
5:02
happening because I wasn't listening to them.
5:05
Yes. It was like, it was like the two
5:07
halves of my brain weren't functioning together.
5:10
Yeah. Yep, pretty much.
5:14
Look, look, there's something about the way that Hayden and
5:18
this. I'm giving full fucking credit
5:19
to this man. If it wasn't obvious in the
5:22
Kenobi show. It is obvious in the I can't
5:25
even believe we're saying this the way he can turn from Vader
5:31
to Anakin facially in the blink of an eye.
5:36
Props, dude, props. He I'm here for it.
5:40
He freaks me out and then turns me on all in like split second.
5:47
I know when he turns into Vader and she says I don't want to
5:51
fight you I think is what she said and he says incorrect.
5:54
I was just like. That creepy.
5:58
So good. It's so good.
6:00
Oh my God, there's that like that Anakin that you get on the
6:04
Mustafar platform where he's trying to like, pad me, trying
6:08
to reason with him and he can't be reason with is it.
6:11
It made me feel so sorry for Asoka.
6:16
She's coming up against a brick wall of a human being,
6:19
basically. So what he is at that point.
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He's so stubborn and scary. The wild part is, is that she's
6:27
now battled him as Vader. You know in in rebels like that
6:32
has happened and and remember what does she say?
6:39
I choose life. I choose to live, yeah.
6:43
Choose to live. And I think that's the lesson in
6:45
all of this, is the fact that you can fight, you can survive,
6:49
but are you living? You have to make that choice.
6:52
And how are you actually living? Because, I mean, it kind of
6:55
boils down that like Vader was existing, but he wasn't living.
6:59
Not until he gave up all of that for Luke.
7:05
I was very confused by the messaging.
7:08
Honestly, yeah, I thought it was contradictory.
7:12
And maybe that's on purpose, because we are walking
7:15
contradictions. As human beings, we think one
7:18
thing and do another. We lie to ourselves about what
7:21
we are. But I I don't know.
7:26
I I came away feeling like I'm not sure what this message was.
7:30
I really am not. And Asoka came out of it being
7:33
so enlightened that I was like, I must have missed it because it
7:38
was weird to me that Anakin kept telling her these weird kind of
7:42
like messed up ideas that he said things like here I have him
7:49
written down. So he said things like she said,
7:54
I don't understand. And he said that's your problem.
7:57
She said what about my training? And he said this is your
7:59
training and she's in war, she's a child in combat and she's.
8:03
Well, the training is, is this vision that she's in because
8:06
it's just like the Luke in The Cave and Ray in the mirrors,
8:10
right? But it's not because she's
8:12
really referencing that. This is not what I signed up
8:14
for. I wanted to be a Jedi.
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You're training me to be a warrior.
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I was raised in battle, you know, And he keeps saying you're
8:23
a warrior now, like I taught you to be.
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Like if you don't fight, you'll die.
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Which is not Jedi. This is not Jedi at all.
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But. But that's what Anakin was
8:35
worried about. But like, why?
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Because he wasn't that way. Like as Anakin Skywalker, he.
8:41
Well, I I think he was so worried about losing people that
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he taught Asoka how to survive partially so that he wouldn't
8:52
lose her. And he ended up losing her
8:53
anyway, right in, in one way or another.
8:58
So I think Obi Wan is the teacher for.
9:03
You have to be a Jedi, not a warrior.
9:05
Anakin is the teacher of be a warrior over anything else,
9:09
right? Not not over a Jedi, but like
9:11
this is battle stuff like this is, this is shop talk, you know.
9:16
So I feel like I was waiting for Obi Wan to show up, just a
9:19
flicker. Somebody in the background, a
9:21
body double with a beard. I don't care.
9:23
I was waiting for him to just kind of run by.
9:26
Didn't get it, I know. I thought he'd be in the
9:29
background, hovering. I am satiated.
9:31
I'm fine. It's just a flicker.
9:34
I was just like one more and we got the trio.
9:36
But I can understand your confusion because I don't know
9:39
if it has to do with because he asked her about the padawan.
9:45
Don't you want a padawan of your own?
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And she she doesn't really want Sabine.
9:49
My question is, why isn't she training Jason?
9:54
Yeah, I had the same thought. Maybe Hera doesn't want her to.
9:57
I don't know. Yeah, I.
9:59
You can't. You can't quell that though.
10:02
Look at him. He's brilliant.
10:03
He obviously has can't. I'm getting I'm getting so high
10:06
tangent. I'm sorry.
10:08
She just needs to abandon Sabine personal personal opinion and
10:13
and pick up with Jason. I think she'd have an easier
10:15
time. Yeah.
10:17
I She seems to have more of an emotional connection, at least
10:21
to hear us. Family and all of that.
10:23
Yeah. Yeah.
10:24
OK. So I guess I don't understand
10:26
why the lesson is live or die. I really don't.
10:29
Because if she chooses, if she chooses to die, then she's not
10:33
going back to the real world. Yeah, but that's not a bad thing
10:36
necessarily. Like Jedi are supposed to be OK
10:38
with that. And being one with the Force, I
10:40
don't see that as like, I don't know.
10:43
That lesson seemed weird to me, especially since Filoni said in
10:48
Tales of the Jedi, Asoka's mother is the one who taught her
10:51
to be comfortable from birth, basically with death.
10:55
That's true. True.
10:57
But she her story's not finished yet.
10:59
It's not. So that's why I kind of want to
11:00
come back to this episode of once the season is finished and
11:05
see if I get more context to kind of see what they're, what
11:08
they're doing. Well, I think it's like one of
11:10
those things where he's trying to teach a lesson, but she has
11:14
to answer it. She has to come to it herself,
11:16
and I think she has to want to live in order to be sent back
11:21
alive. But it didn't imply that Asoka
11:24
was like, kind of done with being alive, like she's been
11:28
going about her. Like, This is why I have the
11:30
conflict here, because in the episodes of a soca so far, there
11:35
is nothing that has implied that she has lost the will to live.
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If the larger question in this, the lesson is like, everything I
11:45
am is what you are, that's what Anakin says to her.
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And so that's when Vader comes out is like a soca afraid that
11:52
she has that potential darkness inside herself.
11:56
What does that have to do with live or die?
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I'm very I I find the messaging really confusing and I just, I
12:04
don't know that that is where I got hung up on on it.
12:09
And it's not that it's bad. I feel like I'm just like
12:11
there's another card they haven't turned over yet to
12:15
connect all these ideas. I think it was absolutely
12:18
beautiful and and absolutely brilliant.
12:21
And I do kind of wonder if this was Asoka's Cave.
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It, and this is not really Anakin at all.
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It could be just that her greatest fears come out in.
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That's what Luke's force cave showed him, you know, and so
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this could just be showing her her greatest fears.
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It could that very well could be because the beautiful.
12:46
The absolutely brilliant and beautiful imagery of Anakin
12:50
walking away and it flickering with Vader and when he comes
12:53
back towards her and it flickers into Vader, that was that is
12:59
Chef's fucking kiss. It is.
13:04
That was some beautiful I just and there's no better way and I
13:10
can see if it's her greatest fear.
13:13
She doesn't know who. Is talking to her who is
13:17
fighting? Is it the dark side of him?
13:19
Is it the light side that she knew and trusted?
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You know, because remember her and malls, you know,
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conversation. Yes.
13:29
About Anakin and and what's funny is, is that they chose
13:33
Rylath at the beginning, which is their first kind of into the
13:37
fray. And then he, Anakin walks up and
13:41
it's essentially season seven. And he's like, I don't remember
13:44
this battle. And she has to explain to him
13:47
that that's where she finally talked to mall and like it
13:50
dawned on her, and this is before Order 66.
13:53
Like that moment hits her on the ship.
13:55
Yeah, but like while this is happening, Anakin's off turning
13:59
yeah, to the dark side. So I write.
14:01
I like that that finally actually overlapped in her
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timeline. Quote UN quote.
14:06
Totally so I can see how this would be her fighting the demon
14:12
that has haunted her. Again, I'm I'm with you.
14:18
I don't know how it translate into translates into a soak of
14:21
the white right? Because this.
14:23
Is like Gandalf the White. So I started looking into the
14:27
name of the episode of Shadow Warrior.
14:29
Right. And yes, I was like, OK, yes,
14:31
What does this mean? Who is the Shadow Warrior?
14:33
I have a I have a theory. I want to see what you come up
14:36
with because OK. I want to talk about it.
14:39
So at the very beginning, their little recap has Baylin saying
14:44
to her, your legacy, like your masters, was one of death and
14:48
destruction. This is OK?
14:51
Yes, yes, yes. So I love this part.
14:55
To say what? No, no, you keep going.
14:57
But I forgot about this part. Yeah, the legacy.
15:00
So he's yes, right. So he's seating her mind right
15:05
there that her legacy is death and destruction.
15:07
Then she dies, right? Falls off the Cliff.
15:09
So that's the last thought she takes with her.
15:11
OK, so there are two different ways you can approach this,
15:15
right? There is the there's an idea of
15:18
the death shadow, and that's something that's talked about in
15:22
like the Old Testament and other parts of mythology, The Warrior
15:26
Wash, where you like, carry the deaths that you've been near.
15:32
It's like often described as soldiers have a death shadow
15:36
where they carry a shadow on them from all the deaths they've
15:42
been around. And you need, like you're so
15:44
purified. But then there's a more literal
15:47
thing. The Kegemusha, which I'm sure
15:52
I'm mispronouncing it, is a Japanese word that means Shadow
15:58
Warrior. It is the name of a Kira Sao
16:00
film. Oh, well, that has to be, yeah.
16:04
And so the the Shadow Warrior in Japanese is a political decoy,
16:13
but it also can be somebody who is not in the public eye but is
16:19
influencing what is happening. So Anakin is her Shadow Warrior.
16:25
He is kind of like not controlling her, but his lessons
16:30
have created her and she feels that like she's carrying that,
16:35
that kind of influence maybe even against her will because he
16:39
had that darkness in him. So that's that's as deep as I
16:44
got into it before, you know, we had to record, which is why I
16:49
think we could do like a deeper episode on this subject alone.
16:54
But yeah. Well, doesn't this just tie into
16:57
my theory? What is?
16:59
Please tell me what is there? So if anyone out there practices
17:04
mindfulness meditation, maybe you've heard of it.
17:07
Have you ever heard of shadow Work?
17:09
Oh yeah. And for those who don't know, I
17:14
have the definition. I'm just going to read it
17:15
straight, working with your unconscious mind to uncover the
17:19
parts of yourself that you repress and hide from yourself.
17:23
This can include trauma or parts of your personality that you
17:26
subconsciously consider undesirable.
17:30
So in essence, if Anakin is her shadow warrior, OK, and it is
17:38
kind of influencing behind the scenes, she has to go into
17:43
herself through the world between worlds and work with
17:46
this part of her in her, you know, this, this.
17:50
The death shadow that she's carrying, which is also Anakin,
17:54
you know and and well, just everyone down the line, if you
17:57
will. But she has to uncover this and
18:00
and deal with this before she can move on and finish whatever
18:05
her job is back in the Galaxy and back in the here and now,
18:09
and the work is done in this like weird plane of the world
18:12
between worlds, and she's got to go through it.
18:17
To get through it, she's in water, when water is often a
18:20
symbol of the subconscious or the unconscious mind.
18:24
So yeah. So Shadow work and Shadow
18:28
Warrior were too close to me and I was like I need to double
18:30
check and make sure I'm thinking of the right thing and and I and
18:32
I was the shadow work it's very hard to do because you have to
18:36
do. Work on parts of you you don't
18:39
want to deal with and it's it's often times stuff that you're
18:43
not even aware of, cuz it's in your subconscious, it's not even
18:47
necessarily in your your active consciousness.
18:50
So addressing it can be very difficult, but maybe if you near
18:55
your death that might bring it to the surface, I don't know
18:59
yet. You got to get over this in
19:01
order to go back. I mean you got to finish this
19:03
one more lesson cuz she's she's always kind of harped on the
19:06
fact that. I mean, they say it right off
19:08
the bat in this series, like Anakin never got to finish my
19:12
training and she blames herself because she walked away from
19:14
him. You know, it's he was the one
19:18
person that defended her during that entire ordeal, she said to
19:22
him when she saw him. He said, I'm here to finish your
19:24
training and she's like, it's a little late for that.
19:26
Kind of like almost like where have you?
19:29
Been like he abandoned. Yeah.
19:30
Yeah. And I was like, I mean, I get
19:33
it, cuz the Jedi did. Did for sure.
19:35
Yeah, yeah. I don't know.
19:37
There were things about, I think it was really good.
19:39
But there were things that I was like, I'm did I miss an episode
19:43
of Rebels or something that explain this?
19:46
Like, I don't recall Asoka ever explicitly talking about the
19:51
burden, the psychological burden of being a warrior.
19:56
She always seemed to be quite comfortable with it.
19:58
Even in Clone Wars as a kid. Yeah.
20:01
Yeah, yes. There were a few episodes, yeah,
20:05
where she kind of learned, like when her squadron got killed
20:08
when she was very young, she kind of like, but it seemed like
20:11
she learned that and got comfortable and like understood
20:14
her position. But that that's not to say if
20:19
this is a subconscious thing, that there is something she's
20:21
been repressing all this time and it's finally it's coming to
20:24
the surface now. I don't know.
20:27
It was. I think there's a lot more and I
20:31
that's why I think we can come back to this once the show is
20:33
over. I I hope there will be more
20:35
context because she was clearly reborn, right?
20:39
She had the baptism and came out of the water, Yes, correct.
20:44
And then was Gandalf the White? Yes, I loved her new outfit.
20:49
I am here for her new outfit. Her little half punch.
20:53
You know, like I said, oh there it is, the Star Wars poncho.
20:57
But it was 1/2 ponch and it was only like 1 shoulder.
21:00
We finally got to see like an orange arm.
21:02
They have her so covered up. Same with Hera, because it's too
21:05
much paint. Her like, headband wasn't on
21:08
anymore. OK, I'm.
21:09
I'm not comfortable with seeing. It was weird, right?
21:12
It was weird. It's a little bit.
21:15
I couldn't stop looking at it. It seemed indecent.
21:19
It did. You know what I mean?
21:21
Yeah, like she didn't have a bra on and I didn't want to see
21:24
that. It's Soca, you know.
21:29
I agree. No, I agree.
21:31
It's kind of it's a little jarring when female to Gruda
21:35
don't have the, I don't know, headband, headdress, whatever
21:39
you want to call it. Not not even just to Gruda.
21:41
Like the what? Does Hera help me?
21:45
I was just gonna say a twilight. Yes, thank you.
21:47
Yeah, the men are very not cute with those Bony things in the
21:53
front, you know what I mean? Like, I guess if you have things
21:58
sticking, I guess. I mean it's an alien race.
22:01
I just, I guess there's are they like selfconscious of it?
22:06
Is that why they always have like some sort of headband on?
22:09
I don't know. I don't know if it's just if
22:12
it's an you know how some cultures it's an you adorn
22:15
yourself or if it has to do with.
22:20
You know what I really think it is practically for Well, she's
22:24
got a hairline, she's got to hide.
22:26
Well, that, but I also think there might be like headphones
22:31
in there so she can hear through the Styrofoam.
22:34
I never thought of that. Because I it's not Styrofoam.
22:38
It's got to be silicone, right? Because they get they, they, I
22:41
almost said. They giggle.
22:43
They wiggle. They wiggle.
22:47
I just imagine like. Hera and Asoka and even the the
22:52
inquisitor, the like lead inquisitor.
22:54
And you know he had those things just over his ears.
22:58
You would be deaf, Deaf on set, Val Kilmer said as Batman, he
23:03
couldn't hear a thing the whole time.
23:05
He said he felt really isolated because he couldn't hear anybody
23:08
talking because he had a grubber on his head.
23:12
I just imagine it must be very uncomfortable.
23:14
But yes, I agree it was very shocking, actually.
23:18
It was actually. She was so pure in that moment.
23:21
She was so at peace and the light shined in on her and it
23:26
was this grand awakening, you know, and this moment of peace.
23:30
And I wish for that every night when I go to bed and wake up and
23:33
I'm, I get no sleep and no peace.
23:36
So I was envious of her. Maybe it's jealousy, but it was
23:41
very they did a good job because I literally could not tell where
23:45
it was Montreal from Forehead. Yeah, it was very seamless.
23:50
And also kudos to young Asoka, the actress.
23:54
She played young Gamora in The Avengers.
23:58
That I was like, she looks familiar.
24:00
She played young Gamora. Now.
24:01
I can't remember her name. Do you mean it's Ariana
24:04
Greenblatt? And I hope I'm pronouncing that
24:07
correctly. But yeah, she did a fantastic
24:10
job. She sounded like Ashley, a
24:12
little bit like I. Found it very jarring, honestly.
24:16
I was just distracted by how she looked and didn't hear her
24:19
dialogue for a while. Cuz Asoka the animated Asoka is
24:24
so real to me. I know that my.
24:27
Brain. Same thing.
24:28
It was trying to like connect synapses and I didn't think she
24:31
did a bad job. My just my brain was trying to
24:33
like rationalize someone else's voice coming out of.
24:38
To be completely honest, I'm going to sound like such a
24:44
bitch. I still don't think Hayden is as
24:51
good as Matt Lanter when it comes to Young.
24:57
And this is the bias, right? We're used to these characters
25:02
in this timeline, in this Clone Wars timeline being Ashley and
25:09
James and Matt and it's so hard to like your like I said my
25:18
brain. That's why when I screamed at
25:21
you I said what am I even watching?
25:23
Cuz I knew what I was watching, but what am I actually fucking
25:26
watching? Like it was kind of weird and
25:30
and divine all at the same time. The tip can coexist, right?
25:34
100%, I agree with that. Yes, it was both.
25:37
No one's going to hate me for saying that out there, Are they?
25:39
Because I. Don't know, There's some crazy
25:41
Hayden stands out there. But I like, I loved it.
25:46
But like you, my brain is trained.
25:49
Now when I see Anakin in that armor, it's Matt Lanter's voice.
25:53
It's going to come out of yes. You know what this actually
25:57
means is we're not used to it, which means we need to get used
26:01
to it, which means we need more. If this is a matter of just
26:06
getting used to it, I can. Get used to it.
26:09
Absolutely. I give me more.
26:11
Listen, please give me some Gobi One and Quinlan boss.
26:14
Also, just throw that out there. Again, not asking for much.
26:20
Listen to us. We just got what we were fucking
26:22
begging for. No, and we're already asking for
26:25
more. I was a little disappointed, I'm
26:27
gonna be honest, a little disappointed.
26:29
Opie. What wasn't there?
26:30
But I get it. He's not part of this story, I
26:33
know. And I I kept thinking like just
26:36
a little drive by him running by, you know, and by the white.
26:40
Maybe Cody's with them. We could get all of the gang
26:43
together. Oh my God.
26:45
But I know it's not the focus. I mean, at least we got Rex,
26:47
right? For like literally 1.8 seconds
26:51
we had Rex. Well, it's also for the people
26:54
who don't watch any of this and don't know.
26:57
Yeah, like, to them it's probably just another clone.
27:00
But to us, it's our boy. We he could, we could still get
27:04
live action that that could have been the like original, like dip
27:09
your toes in and then he shows up in the series at another
27:12
time. Yeah, absolutely.
27:13
He's still potential. Absolutely could.
27:16
So I'm not giving up hope on helmetless Rex in the flesh with
27:23
Tim being him all the way. So I want to talk about the line
27:31
and what you interpreted it as. When Asoka says to Anakin I will
27:40
not fight you. And he says I've heard that
27:43
before, right? I thought two things.
27:47
The first thing I thought was, ah, because she already fought
27:50
Vader and she said that. But it's also Luke's line.
27:59
Did you did you think that? I did.
28:02
It's. I know, Return of the Jedi so
28:04
well. I even have Mark Hamill's
28:06
intonation memorized that I will not fight you when he's hiding
28:11
under the stairs, later says You cannot hide Forever, Luke.
28:16
I really liked that. And I'm going with Luke's
28:19
because it would be so much more meaningful that that this
28:24
Anakin, let's say. It's not like a projection of
28:28
Asoka. It's not Asoka's like deepest
28:30
fears or whatever. The thing we said earlier, let's
28:34
pretend it is like Anakin kind of existing in this plane and
28:39
helping because he owes a debt basically.
28:42
I mean for a while and it's kind of a not a tongue in cheek but
28:49
like a little nod to yeah, I've heard other people.
28:52
I love to say that before, you know what I mean?
28:56
Oh, I would love that so much. I'm sure it's the other.
29:00
Well, it could also be that a lot of people said that they
29:03
weren't going to fight him. You know, like Obi Wan.
29:06
Obi Wan didn't All the people you would never imagine fighting
29:11
him, Obi Wan, his son, his wife, They've Asoka.
29:15
They've all ended up in Anakin slash Vader's clutches.
29:20
And who, who's the guy that was hitting on Padme that he fist
29:25
fought? Rush Clovis him to add him to
29:29
the list. And like Matt Lantern says,
29:34
Anakin doesn't even use the force on him.
29:36
He just beats him up. He straight beats his ass.
29:41
Anakin's been waiting to do that his whole life, and Rush was the
29:44
perfect scapegoat for his fist anyway.
29:50
No, I just. I kind of These are the things
29:52
that were going through my head and why I missed half the damn
29:54
dialogue and can't remember it. And I need to.
29:56
I need you with your written down close to help me because.
29:59
Write it. Yeah.
30:00
Because it was just like, what are they saying?
30:03
Like because because like you, I wasn't.
30:05
It wasn't that I wasn't listening.
30:06
It was that, like, my brain could not process that much all
30:10
at once because it was like, Oh my God, she's falling.
30:13
Oh, it's pink and Missy oh. Is she a child?
30:17
Is that a clone? Is that Anakin?
30:20
Is that Rex? And then I died.
30:23
That was it. And then I died.
30:25
Yes, I at first, for a second I thought it was freaking
30:31
geonosis, that they were point rain.
30:35
But then I quickly realized that she was much younger than that.
30:38
So. It's just, yeah, I know so damn
30:41
good they can't not have Obi Wan if if they go to freaking
30:45
gianosis, if you point rain flashbacks, we need to have a
30:50
stunt double or somebody. James, can you stand in?
30:55
Give James a fucking chance to be on camera.
30:59
He did say in in his interview with us that he might get a
31:02
chance to work on screen, but he he of course wasn't implying
31:06
anything. But wouldn't that be nice?
31:09
I mean, if not in the Kenobi series, then when I know, I mean
31:16
at the end of all this like you said, we're going to have to
31:18
revisit this one way or another. I would love.
31:24
I can totally see and it can kind of coming back maybe as a
31:27
force Ghost to like wrap it up like way to go snip she learn
31:32
the lesson or whatever. This is going to culminate it,
31:34
you know, and it may not be this season, it may be next season or
31:37
something. You know they only have three
31:39
episodes left or whatever, right?
31:41
Yeah, I think it's eight episodes total, right.
31:44
So yeah, yeah, my God, all of this in one episode.
31:48
We could do an arc on just this one episode.
31:52
I know we really could because there's so much, there's so much
31:55
more. And like the fact that she she
32:00
chooses life, then kind of You see this shift in her trust.
32:07
And the force, you know, the space whales and yes, the space
32:11
whales. She says, you know, we'll end up
32:13
where we end up. Kind of just, you know, we'll go
32:17
where we go. We'll see where this takes us.
32:18
Which is more because this whole time I felt like I love Rosario
32:22
Dawson, but Asoka is Snips. Yeah, she's snippy.
32:27
She is. She is.
32:30
I've said all along, this show is missing.
32:33
The twinkle in the eye. You know that is Star Wars.
32:35
It came, it came. Yeah, you see it now.
32:38
It's like she had forgotten it, but it can.
32:42
I think part of why I'm I'm struggling with that is that
32:46
change, that character growth or whatever lack of growth or
32:49
recession happened off camera again.
32:54
So it's like the the Asoka from Rebels in the Asoka we're seeing
32:57
now and now she's having to change again.
32:59
It's like, well, we didn't see why she needs to change.
33:02
We didn't see her lose herself, which is why she's now having to
33:06
have this lesson from Anakin or whatever.
33:08
I don't know. I feel like my brain is
33:11
scrambling to keep up and I know I'm not stupid, so right.
33:15
No, I'm I'm, I'm with you. There is, there are gaps.
33:19
And it's not because I was screaming during some of it.
33:23
I know it. I think, I think we'll have to
33:27
revisit it. Honestly, as soon as you said
33:30
space whales, I would just like to mention the phenomenal music.
33:35
The music is gorgeous. Kevin Kiner again.
33:40
Again, props. He brought it and the ending
33:48
with the whales and like the the the look in everyone's eyes and
33:53
the ships and like the pure, like awe.
33:57
The music built that up, you know, it turned them from being
34:01
like space whales into this majestic force being that like a
34:06
soca can speak to in some way. And like, they don't know
34:10
anything about how she did it or how, you know, Jedi can do it or
34:13
Force fielders can do it. And it's like, off they go on
34:16
their journey with these special creatures.
34:19
It was so beautiful. I, like, had tears.
34:22
And it was probably a combination of just being
34:25
completely overwhelmed. And then the music was so
34:27
pivotal at the end. It was just like, you know?
34:32
Yeah, I'm never going to snicker at the space whales ever again
34:37
because they're they're majestic.
34:39
They are. The big one was beautiful and he
34:41
had, he had kind eyes and a lot of teeth and he was gentle.
34:47
He was those little flat plant eating teeth.
34:52
I mean, they weren't little. They were huge.
34:53
But they were massive. But you know, they're they're
34:56
they're skinny. They're narrow.
34:58
Yes, yes. And they there's clearly an
35:02
understanding that they mean no harm and he'll just hold them in
35:06
his mouth until they arrive at the new destination.
35:09
I love that. I just love that so much.
35:12
The trust of two separate beings, you know?
35:15
I just. I love that.
35:16
I love it. I love it.
35:16
I love it. I love loath wolves.
35:19
I love the space whales. I love.
35:22
Should we start calling them pergos?
35:25
I guess they are pergal, yes. I mean, Pergil, Pergal, space.
35:31
That's what I was wondering. Virgil or Virgil?
35:34
It's Virgil. The Pergil.
35:36
His name is Virgil. That's it.
35:38
We're calling the big one Virgil.
35:43
It just made-up a nickname. I don't even know the gender of
35:45
the poor whale. But Virgil's?
35:47
The better, I guess. So I wanted to ask you because
35:50
you are our resident Lord of the Rings expert.
35:54
Oh boy. Yes.
35:55
What are the parallels here with Gandalf the White and Asoka the
36:00
White? Because it's more than just the
36:03
outfit if we're talking Lord of the Rings only if there's any
36:08
parallel. The thing about Gandalf is it's
36:14
funny because there's a lot of fire involved in his path.
36:17
He sacrificed himself against a fiery evil being.
36:21
You can take that as you want, Anakin Mustafar.
36:24
You know, anger, fire, you know the whole thing, the
36:27
connections. He sacrificed himself to defeat
36:31
the Bell Rog, which is a fire breathing, fire wielding furnace
36:38
creature from the the dark depths.
36:40
I don't know how else his mouth is like a furnace.
36:43
Anyway, he went down and he fell.
36:46
Same as a soca down deep, deep, deep.
36:48
And then, since he's kind of in this, like he was sent from the
36:54
mystical beings in the Lord of the Rings, round like the high,
36:57
the high entities, the ethereal beings, his job was not done.
37:03
So they sent him back, and he was Gandalf the Gray, and then
37:08
he became Gandalf the White. Now when he came back, he came
37:12
back with a new name, a sense of who he used to be, but had a
37:18
more clearer path going forward and what he needed to do.
37:22
And he was very focused. And he had like he could speak
37:25
to animals. He could, I know he could kind
37:30
of, let's say he had much more power in his staff than he used
37:36
to. He could wield more power.
37:39
I mean, he always had the power, but he came back with a purpose.
37:42
And so everything he was outfitted with, basically lent
37:45
to that purpose, was going to help him help everyone else.
37:48
So his he was essentially sent back to do a job by the higher
37:56
beings came back with a white rope.
38:00
Basically everything you just described described as soca as
38:03
well. And I tried not to be.
38:05
I tried not to do that. I tried to tell his story
38:08
without relating it to this. But as I'm telling it, it's kind
38:12
of obvious, right? I mean, we we know that Felonia
38:15
is a huge Lord of the Rings geek.
38:17
And obviously. Has Gandalf top of mind pretty
38:21
much all the time. Everyone loves Gandalf.
38:24
He's wonderful and he's real cheeky when he first comes back,
38:28
the way he, like, reintroduces himself to the characters, like
38:31
when they find they're like Gandalf, Oh my God, you're back.
38:33
You lived and he's like Gandalf. That name seems familiar.
38:37
I am Miss Randeer and blah blah blah and get off the white and
38:40
all this stuff. And so he takes on whatever they
38:42
say, but he's like kind of. He's not all there, but he is.
38:48
Is he messing with them or is that oh it's a little it's a
38:51
little of both. But I think a part of him was
38:55
wiped out because he was reborn. He retells the story of what
38:58
happened. He was.
38:59
He essentially died, was brought back with a with a sole purpose.
39:04
That's. Very obviously connected.
39:08
There there is. No.
39:09
I probably didn't give him justice in my abridged version,
39:13
but guess what? You're going to have to read the
39:14
story. So can we talk about Hara and
39:23
her son? Because yes, I love little
39:27
Jason. He's a pensive little boy.
39:29
He is Canaan's son. So freaking cute and I love the
39:34
green hair. Honestly, I know I would like to
39:37
have green hair. It looks good on him.
39:39
And yeah, and him and Chopper are like buddies.
39:43
Which I think is so nice because Chopper's been with Hara since
39:46
day one, you know? Yeah, they're basically
39:48
brothers. Yeah, I think that's sweet.
39:51
I I loved that he could sense and hear in a way, that
39:59
something was taking place in the water.
40:00
Now here's my fucking question. Did Hara hear it or not?
40:07
Yeah, quick question. I don't know.
40:09
She seemed like she did, which would make no sense unless there
40:13
was actually something going on in the water and it wasn't just
40:18
in the force. I don't think she heard it.
40:21
I think she was made aware that she needs to trust her son and
40:26
his abilities because she trusted Canaan and his abilities
40:30
and it dawned on her that OK, he wouldn't be making this shit up,
40:36
right? So let's take action.
40:38
She's an action kind of person. Like, she was kind of impatient
40:41
and like what? You know, What do you want?
40:42
Guess what? Mommy's working.
40:44
You know one of those things like.
40:46
Mommy's being a badass. What do you want?
40:48
And make it quick, you know, so mommy's defying a sentence.
40:53
Yes, yes, but I think it when she took a minute to pause and
40:59
stood next to her little boy who's just a smaller version of.
41:06
You know, Canaan has dawned on her.
41:09
Trust him. You know, not not everything is
41:12
like visible to the the naked eye, if you will.
41:17
So I don't think she heard it. A lot of people, I saw a lot of
41:19
people say like, oh, this means that anyone with the everyone
41:23
has the force and everyone can hear.
41:24
And I'm like I think it's much, much more motherly in the fact
41:29
of like trust your son, you know don't brush him off.
41:33
I swear to God if they if this is just one more example of
41:38
anyone has the force and this is the the company line now, I'm
41:42
going to get real tired of it because they're that would be
41:45
very heavy-handed if that was the case.
41:47
Yeah, I I really, I don't think she could hear it.
41:53
But she was so she was so taken by how her son seemed like
41:58
totally engrossed in it. Yeah, I'm very sure of himself.
42:02
Yeah, that even though she tried to hear it, she knows like this
42:08
is a Canaan thing and she trusted Canaan how many times,
42:11
right? He didn't even have sight and he
42:14
could perceive things. So I think it's a really nice
42:18
symbol of a mother slowing down. Just take a minute, pause.
42:23
Breathe. Trust your kid.
42:26
Keep it pushing. So it's what we've talked about
42:29
in. I'm actually really pleased that
42:32
Star Wars has done this a few times.
42:34
We talked about it with and or how like.
42:36
Yeah, Cassian loves his mother and loved his father and wasn't
42:41
a perfect family, but they still they loved each other.
42:44
And this is another. It's like it's it's just so
42:47
refreshing that it's not contention in the family, you
42:51
know, It's like the family loves each other and they're doing
42:53
stuff together and they're working towards a goal, sort of.
42:57
But also just like you said, it's just a mother trusting her
42:59
son. That was refreshing, honestly,
43:03
that it didn't turn into some other layer of intrigue.
43:06
It's like we don't need it. We don't need it.
43:08
No, it's good how it is. We'll just brace ourselves and
43:13
see where this goes. It better fucking go to Thron
43:18
soon. We're almost done with this
43:20
season. If we don't get thrown, I, I,
43:25
I'm dying for some thron. I swear if he'd if he doesn't
43:29
show up to like the last episode at some sort of teaser
43:32
cliffhanger for next season, I'm gonna be so pissed.
43:35
Now he's got to be next episode cuz they got a we didn't get any
43:41
bail in no, Yeah. None of that crew.
43:46
So I imagine, do you think the whole next episode will only be
43:49
them? Better not be.
43:52
I will say I had more than one person message me.
43:56
Haters gonna hate, I guess, but whatever.
43:58
I'm gonna say it anyway. More than one person messaged me
44:01
to say they were really. They enjoyed the episode a lot
44:04
more. Cuz Sabine wasn't in.
44:06
It oh, I I heard it too. Look at the focus was on Asoka
44:10
and what we know about Asoka and I believe that's the title of
44:13
the show. So I very thrilled that we got.
44:19
Listen, I know people out there who have not seen Clone Wars or
44:23
a lot of Clone Wars or Rebels and completely loved Episode 5,
44:32
just as they've loved every other episode where they don't
44:34
know all these characters. And one of my friends, a
44:38
coworker watching the show, said he was blown away by everything
44:43
in the episode that he didn't quite grasp and didn't quite
44:46
know. You know the detail details.
44:49
But he fucking loved it. It's his new like Tuesday Tanno,
44:53
Tuesday routine which I thought was really cool.
44:55
So if you're listening out there I know you know who you are if
44:58
you're listening. It was it's been a pleasure
45:00
trying to explain all this so it's so it's so funny.
45:08
I love talking about it. My mom really liked the episode,
45:12
but. She finally, I think she finally
45:14
felt bad for Anakin. I said full the way to catch up.
45:19
She's like, well, he's not nice, but I I guess, I guess everyone
45:22
has a story. Yes they do.
45:24
This one is the longest one. This is the most hurtful one,
45:30
yeah. I think that's why I found this
45:32
so interesting and engaging, because you're not sure which
45:37
Anakin you're going to get. They are two sides of one coin.
45:42
Yeah, we've talked about in the past.
45:44
He is a conundrum. He's duality completely because
45:48
he's a hero who's selfish, you know, and he's brave and.
45:54
So fearful, yes. It's why I feel so interesting.
45:59
Yeah. That's why I've always thought
46:01
that the character of Anakin is so compelling because he
46:05
represents all the great that we can be and all of the bad that
46:10
we can be. That's inherently within
46:12
everyone. Everyone has that darkness, that
46:16
that the part of us that we don't want to acknowledge, but
46:20
it comes out every now. And that not to the degree that
46:22
he's we're killing younglings, but like, you know what I mean?
46:26
Like he represents what's in everyone and what will happen.
46:32
If you honor one over the other, be it the good, the good side,
46:36
or the dark, I mean, that's in every story of good and evil.
46:41
It's it's the battle of these two parts, of every hole.
46:47
It's you can't have the light without the darkness.
46:51
You can't have good without knowing bad.
46:54
You can't have redemption without knowing the fall.
46:57
It's it's what makes this so good.
47:03
And in a Clone Wars outfit, I can't.
47:07
I can't complain. This week we're eating good.
47:09
US Clone Wars fans, we're eating good.
47:13
We are. Ovaries exploded all over the
47:16
world on Tuesday. Let's talk about food.
47:23
And you went straight to ovaries.
47:25
I knew I liked you. Praise B Episode 5, bitches.
47:37
Cue the music. Cue the music.
47:44
So next week we're gonna take a turn back to Luke Skywalker, cuz
47:49
we love him and we haven't talked about him in a hot
47:51
minute. Yeah, I was thinking about them
47:54
the other day and I was like, you know what?
47:55
I miss Luke. I miss Luke too.
47:58
So we're going to talk about Luke.
47:59
In fact, what we're going to talk about is something that has
48:02
interested us. We're going to explore it.
48:04
It's why does Luke Skywalker not have any scarring or markings on
48:11
him from the Force lightning that Sidious threw at him and
48:16
Return of the Jedi so. We're going to talk about it
48:19
from a mythical standpoint, You know, the symbolism of
48:21
lightning. We're going to talk about from
48:23
meteorological standpoint because that's me.
48:26
And we're going to talk about it from a Star Wars standpoint.
48:29
Do you literally have a lightning bolt on your shirt?
48:31
I actually do, but it's it has nothing to do with weather,
48:35
which is even funnier. But it all comes together for
48:40
next week's episode, so please join us back here for some fun
48:44
and some lightning. It'll it'll add a spark to your
48:47
day. Oh God.
48:53
Last week we discussed Asoka episode three and four and we
48:57
asked our audience what were their thoughts on the episode
49:01
and you guys delivered once again on Spotify.
49:03
We had is let's said a loved episode four had goosebumps.
49:06
When I heard hello snips I was literally screaming at the top
49:12
of my lungs when I saw Anakin. Hey, same, Sean said.
49:21
Luke was way too old to start training, but to your point, he
49:24
must have inherited Papa Vader's midichlorians and had potential
49:29
not seeing Sabine's Jedi journey.
49:32
I see, yeah. Cuz I, I said.
49:34
Isn't she a little old in comparison to like, yeah, Grogu
49:38
or even Luke in A New Hope and everything.
49:41
So maybe there's exceptions. I don't know.
49:43
Yeah, yeah. I mean, Luke was 18 in A New
49:46
Hope. But.
49:47
But he was destined. There's a difference between
49:49
destiny and casual force. Wielder OK True, true, true.
49:56
Just my opinion. And then Alexandra said.
49:59
Episode 4 I Died. I feel that in my soul, yeah.
50:07
It took everything to not scream when Hayden appeared.
50:10
Yeah, pretty much. I think I went and made some
50:13
weird hideous noise when it when I realized what was going to
50:17
happen. Yes, and I would like.
50:18
I would like to check in with everyone that died in episode 4.
50:21
Are you still alive or are you completely dead?
50:25
We might need to do a support group episode.
50:28
Or not episode but a support group on Zoom.
50:30
Yeah, yeah. For everyone.
50:32
There are a lot of Force Ghosts that ended up after episode 5,
50:36
so thank you for everyone who replied as usual.
50:42
And thank you so much for joining us here on the Most
50:44
Things Kenobi Podcast. We appreciate every single one
50:48
of our patrons and are grateful for your support.
50:51
If you would like to support the podcast and become a patron as
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well, head over to The Most Things Kenobi Patreon.
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As always, you can follow us on Tumblr, Twitter.
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Instagram and YouTube and don't forget to subscribe on your
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favorite podcast player. If you enjoy the podcast, feel
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free to rate us on Spotify and Apple.
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And if you need just one place to find all these, head over to
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most things kenobi.com. So until next time, Myspace
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Twin, may the Force be with you. Always.