Latest / Founder Unfiltered - What Founders Think But Never Say / Your Nervous System Is Running Your Business (Whether You Admit It or Not) with Jenni Gritters

Transcript

Your Nervous System Is Running Your Business (Whether You Admit It or Not) with Jenni Gritters · Founder Unfiltered - What Founders Think But Never Say

• 0:00
  Welcome to another episode of 6 Figure Secrets for Fractional
• 0:04
  Experts. My name is Bradley Jacobs.
• 0:06
  I'm your host, the founder and CEO of my Lands.
• 0:09
  Today I'm joined by Jenny Gritters.
• 0:12
  Jenny is the author of The Sustainable Solopreneur and a
• 0:16
  business coach and strategist for solopreneur seeking
• 0:19
  simplicity, stability and power. Jenny, welcome to the show.
• 0:23
  Thanks for having me, Bradley. I'm excited about this.
• 0:25
  I want to start with your book. A lot of people want to write a
• 0:28
  book. Not everyone actually goes and
• 0:30
  does it. Obviously you have to have a
• 0:32
  real drive. It's like, OK, why am I writing
• 0:34
  this book? Like why is it needed in the
• 0:36
  world? What were you seeing out there?
• 0:38
  Were like OK I really need to get this message out there and
• 0:41
  share this with the world. Yeah.
• 0:42
  I mean, I've wanted to write a book for a long time and
• 0:44
  probably like most of you listening, I had not written it
• 0:47
  right. I would like put it on my vision
• 0:49
  board and never actually do it. But what started to happen, I
• 0:53
  think a couple things. First, I had extra capacity open
• 0:57
  up in my life. I closed a writing agency that I
• 1:00
  had run a content agency for a long time.
• 1:02
  And I always joke that I got the words back right, like I used to
• 1:05
  give those words to my clients. So part of it is personal that I
• 1:09
  actually had space. And then the other part of it is
• 1:12
  that I think the level of discomfort and unsustainability
• 1:17
  that I started seeing in the people who were coming to ask
• 1:19
  for coaching started to get almost like worse and worse and
• 1:22
  worse. So a lot of these, you know, the
• 1:25
  economy is tough. The way we're taught to work is
• 1:27
  broken. And so I wanted to create
• 1:30
  something in my own business ecosystem that was more
• 1:32
  accessible. I would say more people could
• 1:34
  get some of the frameworks I teach and the ways of thinking
• 1:38
  that I put into the world in their hands.
• 1:41
  So, I mean, it's important to say I really had to have
• 1:44
  accountability to get this done. I mean, I had a book coach I was
• 1:48
  working with and had to really put time on my calendar.
• 1:51
  Like it was no small feat, but it's important.
• 1:54
  I wanted a little capsule. I think of like this moment,
• 1:58
  this body of work, which I've been teaching for, you know,
• 2:01
  almost eight years at this point.
• 2:02
  So it was also fully baked. So it was ready.
• 2:06
  It was ready to be in book form, which we can have great ideas,
• 2:09
  but making it into a book is a is a pretty big big hurdle, time
• 2:12
  wise and otherwise. I'm so glad the word sustainable
• 2:15
  is in there because to me that's always the biggest challenge for
• 2:18
  anyone going out on their own is like, how do I make this work
• 2:21
  long term? So what would be the top one or
• 2:25
  two or three things that you'd say from the book or otherwise
• 2:29
  that do make a sustainable business for, let's just say, a
• 2:33
  business owner? Right At the end of the day,
• 2:35
  every solopreneur is a business. Owner, absolutely.
• 2:37
  I mean, so I work like you do with fractionals.
• 2:39
  Independent consultants, I think freelancers end up in that
• 2:42
  bucket too. Boutique agency owners, like
• 2:44
  anybody who's sort of like running a business with a very
• 2:47
  small team or just themselves, what happens is that we wear
• 2:51
  every hat. And you know, sustainability is
• 2:54
  defined as the ability to last. And I would say for those first
• 2:58
  two or three years of business, you are really in survival mode.
• 3:01
  You're just like trying to find the clients.
• 3:03
  You're overjoyed when someone says yes to you, right?
• 3:06
  Like it's really those first few years are really about vetting
• 3:09
  the idea, like, is this business going to stand?
• 3:11
  But people always come to me at your 3:00-ish.
• 3:14
  I would say it's like this classic wobble moment where
• 3:17
  they're like, wait, I can't keep doing this.
• 3:19
  And by this I mean being reactive.
• 3:21
  I mean not having a plan, like not having an actual revenue
• 3:24
  strategy. Referrals stop working quite as
• 3:27
  well at year 3. So it might be your network is
• 3:30
  tapped. So when I talk about
• 3:33
  sustainability, there are these key principles. 1 is intention.
• 3:37
  And when you think about the root word of intention, it's in
• 3:40
  tension. It's like pulling back the bow
• 3:42
  to shoot the arrow. Most of us are just kind of like
• 3:46
  flailing for those first few years.
• 3:48
  And so intention is really important, being on purpose,
• 3:51
  right? Like, what is your business here
• 3:53
  to do? What do you offer?
• 3:55
  Who do you serve? What is your price point?
• 3:57
  What are your financial goals? Like?
• 3:58
  It sounds dumb, but I think so many of us don't actually lock
• 4:01
  into those details. They say you like can't get to a
• 4:04
  destination if you have no destination.
• 4:06
  Our brains need something to move towards.
• 4:08
  So that feels essential. It's like the infrastructure
• 4:11
  part. And then frankly, the other
• 4:12
  part, which might almost seem counterintuitive, is
• 4:14
  flexibility. So as the market shifts, can you
• 4:17
  shift? Can you be creative?
• 4:19
  Can you stay aware of your own life capacity as it shifts to
• 4:23
  the combination of those two? It's like strong backbone.
• 4:26
  Flexible joints is usually, to me at least, what allows a
• 4:29
  business to evolve long term, right?
• 4:32
  And to be sustainable, to stick around, to allow you to keep
• 4:35
  doing it long term. Yeah, I think that's the key for
• 4:38
  me. And so many of these people that
• 4:40
  are total experts in what they do, right, They're amazing.
• 4:44
  And yeah, they never properly run a business.
• 4:47
  And so they're like, oh, I'm just going to go, you know, be a
• 4:49
  fractional CMO or whatever. And then they realize, oh,
• 4:53
  shoot, like I have to run a whole business here.
• 4:57
  This is not just a little side project.
• 4:59
  This is a whole thing. You wear all the hats, right?
• 5:02
  And I think that's actually what often makes this unsustainable
• 5:04
  is if you're trying to wear all the hats at the same time.
• 5:07
  So it's like, I can't be the marketer and the strategist and
• 5:11
  the doer and the CFO all at the same time.
• 5:13
  Like that doesn't actually make sense, right?
• 5:15
  So the intention part is really about deciding what hat you're
• 5:19
  wearing, when, why, what's the structure there?
• 5:22
  And also, frankly, once you get to a certain level, do other
• 5:25
  people need to support you? Like for a lot of us, the answer
• 5:29
  is yes in certain ways, right? Even if you're a solopreneur,
• 5:31
  right? To me, what I've heard over and
• 5:35
  over and over again and the direction I've taken my business
• 5:37
  is supporting with business development, with OK, your
• 5:40
  network at some point runs dry. It's not enough.
• 5:44
  There's no levers to pull. There has to be sustainable,
• 5:48
  consistent business development efforts and look at many
• 5:51
  different ways, but it's got to be there.
• 5:54
  If I'm working, let's just say 40 hours a week as solopreneur,
• 5:58
  what percent of my time would you recommend?
• 6:01
  Am I spending on new client acquisition or marketing
• 6:05
  activities at this stuff? Yeah.
• 6:06
  I mean, first of all, I don't want you working 40 hours a week
• 6:09
  on client deliverables. This is my #1 so 25 to 30 hours
• 6:13
  Max contracted hours with a client because of this, right?
• 6:17
  Because I think at least 25% of your time, if not more, it
• 6:20
  depends on the season of business you're in, needs to be
• 6:23
  spent tending to the business. And that's how I got into this
• 6:28
  is I was running a freelance writing business and realized I
• 6:32
  and everyone around me had no idea that this was part of it.
• 6:35
  We were just doing our calculations based on 40 hours a
• 6:38
  week. We're just like taking
• 6:39
  everything from the full time job and showing up as if that's
• 6:42
  the rule book. It's not the rule book, you
• 6:44
  know? So 20 to 25 hours of client work
• 6:47
  is juicy. And then I want you spending
• 6:49
  like 10 to 12 hours on business development, which means
• 6:53
  financial tending, networking, marketing, content creation and
• 6:57
  all that stuff. And then we get to add to the
• 6:59
  top of that the belief stuff, which we could talk about, But
• 7:02
  like working with yourself on your beliefs about what's
• 7:05
  possible is a huge part of this equation.
• 7:08
  When I coach that like it's foundational and yet we don't
• 7:11
  really leave time or space for it.
• 7:12
  So that could be in coaching and therapy wherever it is.
• 7:14
  But that to me falls actually in the business development bucket
• 7:18
  as well. So I guess I'm saying 25 to 30%,
• 7:21
  but it depends. Again, you might be in a season
• 7:23
  where you need a lot more clients, so you would do more
• 7:26
  than that in that season or maybe a little less if you're in
• 7:28
  a maintenance mode season. Yeah.
• 7:31
  And when you say a little less, let's say I'm in maintenance
• 7:33
  mode, I have my roster is full with my 20-5 hours a week.
• 7:37
  Let's say I have client work then and I because I really want
• 7:41
  to hammer this home, right, Because this is the biggest
• 7:43
  thing that I see, the biggest mistake I see made all the time.
• 7:46
  So like my plate is full. Yeah, And you're not doing any
• 7:50
  marketing, right? I mean, I see this all the time,
• 7:52
  right? I call this the Panic Hustle,
• 7:54
  Bradley. So it's like you're like, I'm
• 7:56
  good, my roster is full, and all of a sudden a couple clients
• 7:58
  fall off and you're panicked and you almost have to start from
• 8:01
  scratch. So think of it as like a Little
• 8:04
  River that's running through your business that is moving at
• 8:07
  all times. That's your marketing, right.
• 8:09
  So when we see marketing, a lot of my people, I don't know if
• 8:13
  yours do have a big resistance to marketing, they don't want to
• 8:15
  do it. Relationship building is the
• 8:17
  term I prefer. You need to be talking to people
• 8:19
  about what you do. And that can happen in a lot of
• 8:23
  different ways. But like it's, it's essential.
• 8:25
  I mean, I've been a six figure freelancer solar printer since
• 8:29
  my first year. It was always because of this,
• 8:32
  it was because of the coffee chats.
• 8:34
  It was because when something dried up, I had six people to
• 8:37
  e-mail to say, hey, I have availability now, right?
• 8:40
  So call it putting people on the bench, whatever you want, you
• 8:43
  got to do it. You and I both know otherwise
• 8:46
  you, you get there and it's scary.
• 8:48
  Feels like the floor is falling out from beneath you.
• 8:50
  Yeah. And as you said, and you got to
• 8:52
  start from scratch and this is not something you just like turn
• 8:55
  on the water hose and water starts coming out immediately,
• 8:57
  right? I ran.
• 8:58
  A workshop the other day that had 200 people signed up, 100
• 9:01
  people attended live, 40 people just joined one of my programs.
• 9:05
  And someone said to me, like, how is that possible?
• 9:07
  And I'm like, that's seven years of marketing, right?
• 9:11
  That's not like I didn't just decide to do that.
• 9:14
  That is relationships built with people and trust built with
• 9:17
  people over a long period of time.
• 9:19
  So it's that's why you're exactly right.
• 9:21
  It's not like you can just press go, right?
• 9:23
  It's an ongoing practice. Yeah.
• 9:26
  Reminded me of the question I'll get of like, how did you build,
• 9:28
  build up your LinkedIn following?
• 9:30
  And it's like, well, I posted every day for six years.
• 9:34
  Well, and you know, there's that quote.
• 9:35
  Everybody wants the result. No one wants to take the actions
• 9:38
  it took to get there. Like, it's actually, when I talk
• 9:41
  about sustainability, I think it's incredibly unsexy.
• 9:43
  It's why this isn't, doesn't get talked about a lot because it
• 9:46
  really is. Just why is your sub stock so
• 9:49
  big? Because I posted an essay every
• 9:51
  Monday for three years. I mean, it's just I showed up.
• 9:56
  And when we talk, I mean steady, repeated actions, that's the
• 10:00
  game we're playing here. It's actually safer.
• 10:01
  It's much safer. So for a lot of my people, it's
• 10:04
  understanding ritual. Like every week, what are my
• 10:06
  rituals or routines or whatever actions I'm taking to tend to
• 10:10
  the system knowing I'm not going to get immediate results.
• 10:14
  And I know that's tricky. Transactional relationship
• 10:17
  building doesn't pay dividends. Deep relationship building does,
• 10:20
  right? So to that end, if I'm spending
• 10:24
  8 to 12 hours a week on business development, if you were to say
• 10:29
  there's no one-size-fits-all, but if you were going to say the
• 10:32
  most important activities for in that 8 to 12 hours for a
• 10:36
  solopreneur, what would you say? OK.
• 10:39
  So it depends on your business. Like you just said, some people
• 10:41
  are going to be content creation gurus.
• 10:45
  Some people are gonna hate that. I do want you to have at least
• 10:49
  one in person conversation. You know, virtual is fine, but I
• 10:52
  want you to be talking to a human.
• 10:54
  So that could be a coffee chat. That could be a potential
• 10:56
  client. Sometimes it's just I will go on
• 10:59
  LinkedIn and look at like what people I know are doing and send
• 11:01
  them a little note and say like, that looks dope, right?
• 11:03
  But I want you actually like speaking to someone.
• 11:06
  So that is #1 like legit connection could be a networking
• 11:10
  event in your town #2 I want you to be following up with leads
• 11:15
  that you may have talked to a few months ago.
• 11:17
  So that's something that I think is really important.
• 11:20
  Like when people need new clients, the most likely to
• 11:24
  become a client is a warm lead person that you have spoken to
• 11:27
  in the past. So there's a follow up element
• 11:30
  to it. And then in some way, I do like
• 11:32
  you to be sharing. So even if you hate social
• 11:34
  media, an e-mail newsletter is great.
• 11:36
  Like some kind of content, especially if you're in a role
• 11:39
  like you or I that needs to be teaching content, right?
• 11:42
  We're talking about with a brand.
• 11:44
  There are these three core concepts I use, authority,
• 11:47
  authenticity, and aspiration. So I want you to have content
• 11:51
  every week that is hitting those 3 buckets.
• 11:53
  Authority, meaning can you be trusted to give them the results
• 11:56
  that they want? Authenticity, meaning are you
• 11:58
  honest, right? Like is this real?
• 12:00
  And then aspiration is, are you building something for you or
• 12:03
  your clients that your potential clients want?
• 12:07
  And that one's very important because that one's really
• 12:09
  emotional. So something each week that's
• 12:12
  like hitting on that. And then I would say I want you
• 12:14
  to do something reflective every week.
• 12:16
  So whether that's, you know, I'm in the midst of like a belief re
• 12:20
  patterning thing for myself about money, You'll notice you
• 12:24
  start to feel tension about something in your business.
• 12:26
  Maybe it's a sign you need an upgrade.
• 12:28
  So coaching, therapy, journaling, whatever that looks
• 12:32
  like, that's like a nervous system tending thing that will
• 12:35
  pay dividends long term for expansion.
• 12:38
  So some type of content, some type of in person thing, follow
• 12:42
  up on leads and tend to your own psyche.
• 12:48
  That would be my like ideal instruction manual for you.
• 12:51
  And then I mean, I do like people to be sort of like
• 12:54
  absorbing content in some way, but usually it's like go take a
• 12:56
  walk and listen to a podcast, right?
• 12:58
  And be picky about what information you're taking in,
• 13:01
  because they're a bit out there. Cool, so you've mentioned a few
• 13:05
  times these this belief system and then you just shared an
• 13:08
  example from yours. And I want to bridge this for
• 13:12
  people that are really well versed in what does it mean to
• 13:15
  soothe my nervous system? And how do the internal belief
• 13:17
  structures like and the people that are like, that's your full
• 13:20
  of shit, right? Like the people that like are so
• 13:22
  not bought into this totally. Can I give you a perfect example
• 13:25
  of this from this week? OK, stories are the best for
• 13:28
  this. So I feel like I had someone say
• 13:30
  to me the other day, like how do you sell mindset work?
• 13:34
  I was like, you know, the people who come to me are like ready
• 13:36
  because they're like they've hit a wall.
• 13:38
  So here's the wall I hit this week.
• 13:40
  I'm offering a program has 45 people signed up right now.
• 13:43
  It's called Create. It's an 8 week business building
• 13:46
  rebuilding program. And I noticed this week that I
• 13:49
  have weird energy about it. Like I showed up and was like, I
• 13:52
  need to market this. I don't want to market this.
• 13:55
  Why don't I want to market this? And so I sat with like, because
• 14:00
  there's something that's happening for me personally, or
• 14:02
  is there like actually a structural issue that means I
• 14:04
  don't want to invite more people in.
• 14:06
  And what it turned out was happening is that I was feeling
• 14:09
  this like chest clenchy, which I would call a nervous system
• 14:12
  response. My body does not feel safe in
• 14:14
  some way. I feel tense, I feel anxious.
• 14:17
  It was because the structures in place for that program are great
• 14:21
  for 30 people and not great for 50 people.
• 14:24
  And so if 50 people sign up, I have to do more work.
• 14:27
  So I don't want them to sign up. So I'm showing up in my
• 14:31
  marketing in 1/2 assed way and guess what's happening?
• 14:34
  No one's registering. So what do we do about that?
• 14:37
  It's like part practical and part nervous system.
• 14:40
  So I had to sit with what kind of support structures would be
• 14:43
  necessary to hold 50 to 70 people in this container.
• 14:47
  So earlier this week, I brought on another supporting coach.
• 14:51
  I changed my schedule. I let my assistant know she's
• 14:54
  going to need to be more heavily involved, right?
• 14:56
  I set it up so it won't cost me more well-being.
• 15:00
  And in doing that, I don't feel anxious about it anymore.
• 15:03
  I'm promoting it from a more stable place.
• 15:06
  My nervous system has calmed down because it feels safe,
• 15:08
  because it feels held by the structure, right?
• 15:10
  So I know it sounds woo woo, but it's your body will have some
• 15:14
  kind of response and it will tell you like this expansion
• 15:17
  isn't safe. I see this happen all the time
• 15:18
  with money too. I don't know if you've had this
• 15:20
  experience, but it's like people will have a high earning month
• 15:23
  and it's almost like they get rid of that money as fast as
• 15:25
  they possibly can subconsciously.
• 15:27
  And it's because they feel uncomfortable with, they don't
• 15:30
  have structures in place to understand what to do with that
• 15:34
  money. They may have belief systems
• 15:36
  about what money means, like being more wealthy means
• 15:39
  whatever. It makes me unrelatable, it
• 15:40
  makes me unlovable. It means whatever.
• 15:42
  And so they get rid of it or they cause some kind of like
• 15:45
  catastrophic personal event that like requires that money to be
• 15:49
  spent. That's what I mean by belief
• 15:51
  systems. So it's a little bit of like,
• 15:53
  it's like how to stop self sabotaging yourself because we
• 15:56
  have upper limits. I watch it happen with people.
• 15:58
  Like the most I can make and be well, is 20 KA month OK?
• 16:03
  Is that true? Maybe.
• 16:06
  What are you going to have to change for that to be safe?
• 16:09
  So does that answer that question?
• 16:10
  It's like a it's both psychological and practical.
• 16:14
  In my world, strategy and psychology are linked so.
• 16:19
  For those listening, maybe the indication might be I might have
• 16:24
  evidence in my business, let's say that I have, you know, a
• 16:27
  good month and then a bad month or growth has got in some way or
• 16:31
  that there could be an indicator like that that might and
• 16:34
  probably is repeating in some way, shape or form, right.
• 16:36
  It probably keeps happening. Yeah.
• 16:38
  They're. Like flares?
• 16:40
  Right. And or there's this physical in
• 16:43
  my body response where as you said, my chest tightens up or
• 16:46
  like my throat gets like closed up or people.
• 16:49
  Will just avoid the thing. That's a really common one.
• 16:51
  They'll just avoid it. They're like, I'm just not doing
• 16:53
  that task at all. And so my question, so is, I
• 16:56
  mean, why, right. If you're avoiding, it's because
• 16:59
  there's some kind of discomfort in it.
• 17:00
  Yeah. Hopefully people listening now
• 17:02
  can like understand what we're talking about, and then the
• 17:05
  question would be, all right. So you found the secondary layer
• 17:10
  of what was really going on. It's not that you didn't want to
• 17:12
  run the program. It's not that the program's not
• 17:14
  good. It's not all these things.
• 17:15
  It's the current structure that you had wasn't sustainable for
• 17:18
  the numbers you were getting. So you have to expand the
• 17:20
  structure. But you only could come to the
• 17:23
  solution once you figured out what was really going on.
• 17:25
  But the story really was that you had going on like the.
• 17:28
  Root cause, right? Yeah, right.
• 17:30
  So how do you invite people? And like, maybe the answer is go
• 17:34
  work with a coach or therapist, but like, how do you really
• 17:36
  invite people to get to the truth?
• 17:38
  I mean, I think part of the answer is yes, consult a coach
• 17:42
  sometimes. So I actually sent a message to
• 17:44
  my coach about this and I said, I think maybe the price point is
• 17:47
  wrong or like, why aren't people signing up?
• 17:50
  And she was like, can we slow it down?
• 17:53
  What she's like, I'm looking at the price point, the price
• 17:55
  points, not wrong. Like I think this is about you
• 17:58
  hitting a cap of what you're comfortable with.
• 18:01
  So I do think it's really helpful to have people call us
• 18:03
  out on our shit. You know, it's like you need
• 18:05
  somebody to reflect that back to you.
• 18:07
  That can be a peer, that can be a coach, that can be a mentor.
• 18:11
  There's a lot of ways to get that.
• 18:12
  I think the other thing is that you can do this with yourself to
• 18:16
  some degree as well, which is to ask the question to ask why a
• 18:22
  bunch of times, right? So usually the first why is
• 18:25
  something obvious, right? Like this program isn't, people
• 18:27
  aren't buying it 'cause it, it's too expensive, whatever and my
• 18:31
  audience doesn't like to pay. I mean, that's like a weird,
• 18:33
  that's not necessarily true, right?
• 18:35
  But it's one answer. But what else could be the
• 18:38
  reason? But what else could be the
• 18:39
  reason? But what else could be the
• 18:40
  reason? When you get down to the fifth
• 18:42
  one, you usually get to the layer.
• 18:43
  So I call it the five whys with my clients.
• 18:46
  But it's really, like I said, slowing yourself down enough to
• 18:49
  ask what is going on. And if you can slow yourself
• 18:53
  down enough to notice your body, you will notice if it's within
• 18:56
  you or if it's external. If it's an external thing like
• 18:58
  pricing, you won't feel nauseous or like you're clenching your
• 19:03
  teeth or if if that's going on, that's a cue that it's your
• 19:06
  belief system that's getting in the way.
• 19:09
  When I say nervous system, I basically mean what feels safe
• 19:11
  to you because we can change what feels safe to us.
• 19:13
  That's the biggest flex I think in our businesses, frankly, is
• 19:17
  to learn how to do that. It's like a little mystical
• 19:19
  power, but so body will tell you journaling, asking why five
• 19:24
  times. We'll also tell you from the.
• 19:26
  Journaling standpoint, I've found what I'm scared of, like
• 19:30
  the business isn't growing past, you know, 50 students, whatever,
• 19:34
  because I'm scared of dot, dot dot.
• 19:36
  And then just like rewrite everything that comes to mind.
• 19:39
  I'm scared. I want a free time.
• 19:40
  I'm scared the program will suck.
• 19:41
  I'm scared no one will like whatever, everyone will hate it.
• 19:43
  Like I don't, I don't know. You just write down everything
• 19:46
  and then you really feel like what's true here.
• 19:48
  And I think that's a core question.
• 19:50
  What's true here, right? I always tell my clients there's
• 19:53
  facts and there's feelings like I'm not making enough money.
• 19:57
  Could be a fact, but it's most likely actually a feeling for
• 19:59
  most people if we look at the numbers.
• 20:03
  And so why is that feeling, you know, is that true?
• 20:06
  Is that helpful? Is that going to get me?
• 20:09
  To action in a way that gets me more clients.
• 20:11
  No, it's just going to cause me to collapse, right?
• 20:13
  So I think we can do this jujitsu on ourselves a little
• 20:16
  bit, but this is my favorite part of work with people because
• 20:19
  if we developed that as a foundational tool kit, all the
• 20:22
  strategic decisions get a lot easier, right?
• 20:24
  Yeah, I love that it's everyone wants to go work on the strategy
• 20:28
  and actually get to the root of like where you feel safe and
• 20:32
  what your beliefs are and all that kind of stuff.
• 20:34
  Like anyone can come up with a strategy, right?
• 20:37
  This strategy is not rocket science.
• 20:39
  It's. The easy part, it's like the
• 20:40
  icing on the cake, right? Like I have a client who she
• 20:44
  knows what she needs to do, but she's not doing it.
• 20:46
  Why is she not doing it? Because she's so programmed for
• 20:49
  overwork and she gets certain things from overworking.
• 20:53
  But it means she's so trapped in the old model that literally we
• 20:56
  had to learn how to help her feel safe in her body so she
• 20:59
  could release old clients and then choose the new ones.
• 21:01
  And that happened in like 2 weeks during the six month
• 21:04
  period. Took about four months to feel
• 21:06
  safe, right? It's like, that's what I mean,
• 21:09
  like this part, but this is also the part that sticks.
• 21:11
  You keep it forever, you know? So to the point of
• 21:15
  sustainability, like I think we just can't talk about business
• 21:17
  sustainability without this part.
• 21:19
  There's lots of ways in which sustainability matters, but if
• 21:22
  you're fighting with yourself every day, it's exhausting.
• 21:24
  And it also means you're probably in a roller coaster.
• 21:26
  Like you said, it's working one month, it's not working the next
• 21:29
  month. Also exhausting I'm.
• 21:31
  Curious if you have any recommendations on rituals
• 21:34
  around, let's say, goals I want to achieve?
• 21:37
  Let's just say I want to be doing 40K months for my
• 21:39
  solopreneur business. And let's say I'm doing like 12K
• 21:42
  or 15K right now. And the 40K probably feels like
• 21:45
  big and terrifying and like, how the hell do I do that?
• 21:48
  Are you someone who, you know, writes the goal down?
• 21:51
  Like I am doing 40 KA month every morning in your journal.
• 21:54
  Do you like yeah, you like vision yourself as having, you
• 21:59
  know, 4 clients at 10 KA month? Like how do you what do you
• 22:02
  recommend a couple? Of things.
• 22:04
  So first I think there's a more again psychological and a more
• 22:08
  strategic. So I'm a big, I like to draw
• 22:10
  business models. So I will first often my brain
• 22:14
  goes to the structural, which is OK.
• 22:17
  What would need to happen for me to have a 40K month?
• 22:20
  How many clients are in this category?
• 22:21
  How many clients are in this program?
• 22:23
  What's the price for those programs?
• 22:26
  Right? So that helps me because I'm
• 22:28
  grounding myself in that future reality.
• 22:30
  Like I'm literally doing the math problem.
• 22:32
  And then I also do the exercise of like, what does the 40 KA
• 22:36
  month version of me do every day and every week?
• 22:38
  So I'm actually in the midst of this.
• 22:40
  I'm launching a new business this year.
• 22:42
  And so it is a business that's more like a 50 to 80 KA month
• 22:45
  business versus I've been running one that's more like 20
• 22:47
  to 30. And so I'm asking a lot of
• 22:50
  questions about like the version of me who runs the 50 KA month
• 22:53
  business. What does she do?
• 22:55
  Well, her calendar clearly has more open space because she's
• 22:58
  more strategizing and delegating than doing.
• 23:02
  That version of me goes and gets massages and acupuncture more
• 23:05
  often because she needs to feel calm so she can make good
• 23:08
  decisions, right? That version of me has a bigger
• 23:10
  team. And so there's like those two
• 23:13
  pieces, right? It's like The Who am I becoming
• 23:15
  down to? Like what are you wearing?
• 23:16
  And then there's the version of what's the tactical like
• 23:20
  projection of how you would get there.
• 23:23
  I talk about the bridge a lot too, which is like you're here
• 23:26
  at 14K months, you want to go here 40K months.
• 23:29
  OK, now we have the picture of the 40K months.
• 23:32
  Literally, we can't just go there right away.
• 23:35
  You will, again, nervous system will collapse.
• 23:37
  You won't be able to handle it. So what are the incremental
• 23:39
  milestones then between here and there?
• 23:41
  I call that titration. So you're like letting go of the
• 23:44
  old thing and growing a little bit of the new thing, but you're
• 23:47
  still holding both. And I mean, I just feel like I
• 23:49
  should say it's really messy and chaotic when you're doing like,
• 23:52
  you've probably done this, right, Like growing a new thing
• 23:54
  while holding the old thing is hard and it works long term, but
• 23:58
  it's not, again, it's not sexy. I'm not a big goal setter, to be
• 24:01
  honest, but I'm a big, like, what vision are you walking
• 24:04
  towards type of person? Yeah.
• 24:07
  And so if a client comes to you and they say I want to grow my
• 24:10
  business and you're like, OK, well, what does that really
• 24:11
  mean? You give them a destination or
• 24:13
  they come up with a destination, let's say that's the that 40K
• 24:17
  per month. And then you ask, how does that
• 24:19
  feel in your body? And they're like, I'm freaking
• 24:23
  out, right? Like my chest is on fire and
• 24:26
  like I get nervous and whatever. So it's clearly the vision of
• 24:29
  that is unsafe. Right.
• 24:32
  It's too far out from where you are, right?
• 24:34
  It's like if I told you like, now go climb Mount Everest,
• 24:37
  you'd be like, what the fuck? Like what shoes do I wear?
• 24:40
  How how do I train? Right?
• 24:42
  Like it's just that type of a business is very different.
• 24:45
  I find that like up until about 15 KA month, you can do it
• 24:49
  mostly yourself. It's mostly you being the doer,
• 24:51
  maybe a little strategy. A 40 KA month business is not
• 24:55
  that. And so it makes sense that that
• 24:57
  clients nervous system would be like, because they haven't
• 25:00
  trained for that. So my mind, I would probably say
• 25:03
  like, OK, what are the incremental skills that are
• 25:05
  happening between those two places?
• 25:06
  And how are we literally like lifting weights, going to the
• 25:10
  gym to prepare for that ultimate reality?
• 25:13
  And so that looks like different things for different people.
• 25:15
  Like I'm thinking like, OK, the next scale would probably be
• 25:18
  around 20 K. That's a big marker for a lot of
• 25:21
  people. And probably you're going to
• 25:23
  bring on like one assistant and learn how to delegate.
• 25:25
  And we're going to start there. If I gave you 40K instead of 14,
• 25:28
  you also wouldn't even know what to do with it, right?
• 25:30
  So like, are your systems sound like that's a wise body that
• 25:34
  screams about that? I think so, yeah.
• 25:37
  How do you think about knowing when to keep pushing?
• 25:42
  Like, OK, let me give this strategy.
• 25:43
  Let me give this niche, whatever it is, more time.
• 25:47
  And when it's time to say, you know what, like this ain't
• 25:49
  working and it's time to pivot in some way, shape or form.
• 25:53
  Yeah, I call it scary good and scary bad.
• 25:55
  Usually, you know, scary bad is it's not working and you're like
• 25:58
  clawing at a door. Scary good as it's a comfort
• 26:01
  zone edge and you need to stay with it.
• 26:04
  So scary bad as it's misaligned. I hate it, I dread it, I don't
• 26:08
  want to do it. Scary good is I'm learning and
• 26:11
  this is new and so I don't really know what to do.
• 26:15
  But it's not because I don't want to, it's just because it's
• 26:17
  new. So I think there's a little bit
• 26:20
  of like self-awareness discernment muscle that you grow
• 26:23
  there around what the difference is between those two things.
• 26:26
  I'm also a big fan of like actual set experiments.
• 26:29
  So when you start something new, I'm doing this right now, I'm
• 26:33
  growing a new Instagram account. I'm giving it three months.
• 26:36
  And within those three months, I'm not allowed to judge whether
• 26:38
  or not it's working because otherwise I find people back out
• 26:43
  too soon or they get like lost in analysis paralysis.
• 26:46
  And it's like, no, you, we don't even have enough data, right?
• 26:49
  So three months of showing up, I mean, that'll change depending
• 26:53
  on what the business task is, but that feels like a permission
• 26:55
  slip to most people. And at three months, maybe you
• 26:58
  do decide it's not working. You'll know, though.
• 27:01
  You'll know if it's not worth, like, we contain the information
• 27:04
  we need. I believe that like, 99% of the
• 27:06
  time, right? I call it clawing at the closed
• 27:08
  door when there's, like, a window open next to it.
• 27:10
  You know, when you're doing that, it feels bad.
• 27:12
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 27:13
  I'm glad you said that. I did not look at the analytics
• 27:17
  for this podcast for months like so many.
• 27:22
  Nobody was listening to it for many minutes honestly.
• 27:24
  Like if you look at our chart. You would have cut it off too
• 27:27
  soon probably if you looked at it right.
• 27:29
  So same thing when people ask me about sub stack, they're like,
• 27:32
  how many? You know how many subscribers?
• 27:34
  I don't even know how many subscribers I have.
• 27:35
  I just show up there and I write and occasionally I check it.
• 27:38
  But I think like the point has to be the creation of the thing
• 27:41
  for those of us who are creators, not analytics, at
• 27:44
  least for a while. It just takes a while to grow
• 27:47
  this stuff. So the experiment mindset gives
• 27:49
  you like I will literally put on my calendar, now I get to worry
• 27:52
  about this thing. I'm not gonna do it until March,
• 27:56
  and then I'll worry and then I'll assess and then only
• 27:58
  analyze well. I would bet actually putting it
• 28:01
  in your calendar in and of itself is the permission that
• 28:04
  allows you to not think about it, not worry about it.
• 28:06
  Like that small action in which someone might easily dismiss.
• 28:09
  Like I don't need to do that. No, that's the exact thing that
• 28:12
  gives you the permission to not look.
• 28:14
  And it's been taken care of, like, right?
• 28:15
  Like it has a holding space. I don't have to hold it in my
• 28:17
  brain. You know, I think when people
• 28:19
  ask me about why I take a lot of risks, I guess, right?
• 28:22
  Like, but it doesn't feel risky to me because I do it all with
• 28:25
  an experiment framework of like, I'm just trying stuff, We'll see
• 28:28
  what works. I'm like, when you have less of
• 28:30
  a grip on it, it's easier to let it go if it's not working and
• 28:34
  it's more fun if it does work. It's like a pleasant surprise.
• 28:37
  So I know that's easier said than done, but holding it
• 28:41
  loosely is really speaking to the flexibility of
• 28:44
  sustainability. I mean, it's a, it's a big one
• 28:46
  to me of like that play and creativity is good for business.
• 28:50
  Yeah. This is, I had a business
• 28:51
  coaching session yesterday and I was feeling maybe Tuesday and I
• 28:55
  was feeling pretty unmotivated going into it.
• 28:57
  And I just told him so. And he was like, why?
• 29:00
  And I was like, well, you know, we're not growing as fast as I
• 29:02
  want. And we had this customer was
• 29:03
  unhappy with one thing and there were just a few little things
• 29:06
  that came up. And he's like Bradley, like, why
• 29:08
  do you do this business, right? I was like, OK, I talked about
• 29:11
  the mission and my why and all this kind of stuff.
• 29:13
  And he's like, well, what do you like, let's say outcomes didn't
• 29:16
  matter. What do you enjoy?
• 29:18
  What business activities do you enjoy?
• 29:21
  And I started thinking about it. I was like, well, I love
• 29:23
  building. I love talking to customers.
• 29:25
  I love writing about my experience and sharing it.
• 29:28
  Like I pretty much love all the all the things I do, frankly,
• 29:31
  like I don't and the few things I don't love doing.
• 29:33
  I have an assistant, right? I have AVAI have a team of staff
• 29:36
  I have and I would happily do the exact same activities, but
• 29:40
  from a frame of I enjoy doing them versus I need to do them to
• 29:44
  drive a certain business outcome.
• 29:47
  It's the same activities with a different lens.
• 29:50
  And I was like, Oh my God, this is just like, this is it right
• 29:54
  I. Mean it's but it's still like
• 29:56
  what success question, right? I mean, I dance with this a lot.
• 29:59
  I work with high achieving people.
• 30:01
  Probably you and I are both high achieving as well.
• 30:03
  And so we usually come from this background where like metrics
• 30:06
  were really important success markers.
• 30:09
  And I don't know about you, but for me, I would go get a job if
• 30:13
  I wanted something easy. Like I actually like the
• 30:15
  building. I like like there's these parts
• 30:17
  of this that I enjoy. I'm prioritizing for my joy.
• 30:19
  I'm prioritizing for creativity. The irony is that when I enjoy
• 30:24
  things, I sell them more magnetically and they work
• 30:27
  better, right? So there is this kind of like
• 30:29
  strategic element to that. But I think the, it's funny, I
• 30:34
  used to have on my spreadsheet like my end of month business,
• 30:37
  but I just had my revenue numbers.
• 30:38
  Then I had to Add all these columns after a therapy session.
• 30:41
  That was like, what are the other success markers?
• 30:43
  Not just the revenue numbers, right?
• 30:45
  I've had amazing months where my revenue was the lowest.
• 30:48
  It's like it does not necessarily correlate, I guess.
• 30:52
  So I think that question of what are you optimizing for is, is
• 30:56
  what I take from that story. And it's one I'm always asking
• 30:59
  myself, like, what's the point? Like, why are we doing this?
• 31:03
  Not, not for the metrics. I'll be miserable if that's the
• 31:05
  answer, right? And you're doing it because you
• 31:07
  genuinely, I imagine most people, especially solopreneurs,
• 31:10
  right, they go out there, maybe every business owner for the
• 31:13
  most part, you're like, I want to build this thing.
• 31:16
  I want to solve this problem. I care about this customer.
• 31:19
  Maybe it's a problem I faced myself.
• 31:20
  Maybe I just love being a marketer.
• 31:22
  So I'm going to go out and do a fractional CMO, whatever it is.
• 31:25
  And if I can really root into that every single week of I get
• 31:32
  to do this because I love it. And when that happens, as you
• 31:37
  said, I'm more magnetic. I attract clients, I do my best
• 31:40
  work, I'm show it motivated, like good things happen and not
• 31:43
  focus on, OK, how did I do revenue wise?
• 31:46
  How did like what happened here, what happened here and be like
• 31:48
  totally obsessive over. I know that's math, you know?
• 31:52
  And like, math is good, but math is an inhuman metric.
• 31:57
  Like, I mean, what's something sustainable is something you
• 31:59
  enjoy, frankly, you know, so it is.
• 32:03
  I call it chosen storms. You know, I think about
• 32:05
  entrepreneurship is not easy, but that phrase helps me because
• 32:10
  it's like, would I choose this again?
• 32:13
  It's like you're having a hard week.
• 32:14
  Would you still choose this over going to get a 60 hour, 70 hour
• 32:18
  a week tech job? Yes, right.
• 32:21
  Yeah. Because it's a storm.
• 32:23
  We're choosing. That's why we all do this.
• 32:25
  I think, 'cause we want to be a choice and choose, you know?
• 32:28
  So that helps me at least to kind of reground, 'cause it's,
• 32:31
  it's not easy every week. Certainly not.
• 32:33
  And there's so many people looking at us and watching us
• 32:35
  build businesses like this that are creator centric.
• 32:38
  That's not easy when you're having a rough week, yeah.
• 32:41
  It's not every single time someone gives me even the
• 32:43
  tiniest compliment on content or the podcast or the product, I'm
• 32:47
  like, thank you for saying that truly.
• 32:50
  Because sometimes it just feels like all I'm doing is getting
• 32:52
  constructive feedback, gap feedback, how it could be better
• 32:55
  or no feedback, which is just like into an echo chamber.
• 32:58
  I'm like shit, give compliments to your founders like we, we
• 33:02
  need it. We need it.
• 33:04
  I know, I know it's like especially when you're evolving
• 33:07
  or you're changing your mind in your work, I think being in
• 33:10
  public while you're doing that is it's something that's always
• 33:13
  been really tricky for me and I have to kind of just give myself
• 33:15
  permission to be like I'm, I'm just going to back off for a
• 33:18
  second and it's always a wise choice, but it's tough to do.
• 33:21
  I mean, again, from like a metrics perspective, right?
• 33:23
  Like I'll watch my revenue drop, but then it always goes back up
• 33:26
  again after I've taken time to integrate.
• 33:29
  So you know, it's it's a growth edge.
• 33:31
  So if we get to. Wrap up in a few minutes.
• 33:32
  But would love an opportunity for you to plug your services,
• 33:35
  your book. Like, where can people find you?
• 33:37
  How can they work with you if they're inspired by this
• 33:40
  conversation? Yeah.
• 33:41
  Thanks for asking. So my book, The Sustainable
• 33:43
  Solopreneur is available pretty much everywhere, bookshop.com or
• 33:47
  bookshop.org, Amazon, or if you want to buy it on my website, I
• 33:51
  will send you a direct copy with a little note.
• 33:53
  So I'll share those links with Bradley and then I do coach
• 33:57
  one-on-one, although a little bit on a limited level.
• 33:59
  So that's a six month program. It's called the spiral.
• 34:03
  I really do well three programming work with people so
• 34:05
  that all this belief stuff we're talking about, it's like, let's
• 34:08
  get you a new set of core beliefs and a nervous system
• 34:10
  that feels safe. So it's really for people who
• 34:12
  are wanting to scale but are hitting, I say scale.
• 34:16
  I don't like the word scale expand and you know, because
• 34:18
  expanding could be and I just want more time or yes, I want
• 34:21
  more revenue or yes, I want more clients.
• 34:23
  But if you're in that place and you want to do that like deep,
• 34:26
  juicy work, that really sticks. That's my favorite.
• 34:29
  So I'll have a few spots opening for that in spring.
• 34:31
  And then like I said, I'm building a whole new business
• 34:33
  ecosystem. It is called the World Builders.
• 34:36
  So it is an ecosystem for creatives and entrepreneurs who
• 34:39
  build new ways of doing and being with their work.
• 34:42
  So I'm really interested in people who are developing new
• 34:44
  systems and new ways of operating businesses that we
• 34:47
  don't see very often. So there's a podcast for that.
• 34:50
  It's called the World Builders Podcast.
• 34:52
  And those programs will start to trickle out throughout the next
• 34:56
  year. So if you're following the
• 34:58
  podcast or find me on social with my name on Instagram or
• 35:01
  whatever, you'll get all that detailed information.
• 35:04
  So it's fun. I'm in a little building cave
• 35:06
  right now, so there's not as many public programs, but it's
• 35:08
  kind of nice, you know? Building's the best part, so I'm
• 35:11
  enjoying it, yeah. Amazing.
• 35:13
  Well, thank you so much, Jenny, for sharing your wisdom with us
• 35:17
  and your time. Sounds like some amazing
• 35:19
  programs coming out soon. So we'll share the links, the
• 35:22
  book links, the program links, your social links so people can
• 35:25
  find you. And with that, yeah, just thanks
• 35:28
  so much for your time. I really appreciate it.
• 35:29
  Yeah. Appreciate you, Bradley.
• 35:30
  We'll talk soon.