Latest / Conversations: Special Guests with Preston Scott / Can You Hold A Criminal At Gunpoint And Wait For Police? It Depends ...

Transcript

Can You Hold A Criminal At Gunpoint And Wait For Police? It Depends ... · Conversations: Special Guests with Preston Scott

0:11
And here we are. It's the third and final hour at least it's for
0:16
Today Show five thousand and eleven of the Morning Show with Preston Scott. That
0:23
is Grant Allen running the radio broadcast, and I am joined by. He's
0:28
the co founder of the Talent Training Group, co host of Talent Outdoors.
0:32
And I'm proud to say a friend, a friend who was kind enough to
0:37
come when we celebrated our five thousand show. And I gotta tell you,
0:41
sir, that meant a lot seeing you and JD here. I'll tell you
0:45
what it was worth the trip. It was worth the trip. You just
0:48
had to do it, didn't you. I'll tell you what. It's become
0:51
a habit listening to Paul Fire on our show. Say, I'll tell you
0:55
what has just become the thing around the shop. Now, I'll tell you
1:00
what it's just as a hook. Yeah, I know. Some people do
1:03
things. You pick up on it. I I've I just picked up on
1:07
things from people over the years. And somebody said that what somebody brought up
1:11
by the day that the Southern accent is slowly disappearing. I guess it's because
1:15
we watch TV and VIDI anyway, it's just so we adopt the things other
1:22
people do and say. So anyways, coming in this morning and uh on
1:26
the interstate, watching a beautiful, beautiful sunrise. I took, you know,
1:30
drive and reached out and no small task you make in your way here
1:33
in the morning, and I appreciate it. That's that's an hour drive.
1:36
But you know, I gotta I have to come over here on Wednesdays anyway.
1:38
I just have to get up really early and convince my wife to take
1:42
the kids to school. It's just I have pressed in today. You have
1:45
to take the kids, so she has to get up a whole fifteen minutes
1:48
early. But I but you know, I'm sitting there contemplating the cosmos and
1:51
thinking about how blessed I am and how even the stresses in my life or
1:55
I think I think life is a test. You know. It's if if
1:59
God put us on this earth and said here everything's going to be perfect,
2:01
then why I put us here? You know, we just stay just stay
2:05
in heaven, you know why I come here. And so you know,
2:08
I think about all the terrible, you know, just aggravating stuff and mess
2:13
and you know what, I'm I'm pretty dog and unfortunate to be able to
2:15
deal with this stuff. I'm just I'm glad to where I'm at. So
2:19
and then I look up and I look for messages in the strangest places,
2:22
and then I try to interpret them. And I'm driving down I ten around
2:24
the rest way station over in grand Ridge, and there's a d O T
2:29
sign with a very pointed message, and it said on the interstate, stay
2:35
off the train tracks new and fast, more and faster trains. And I
2:40
said, what, there are no train tracks around here. Somebody were all
2:46
to sign and made a mistake. And I'm at a mile up the road.
2:49
There's another one said the same thing. I said, somebody really messed
2:53
up. Another milito the road. There's three of them. They all say
2:57
the same thing. I don't know who it's going on, so I'm looking
3:00
for the if anybody hasn't. Anyway, I posted on my Facebook page,
3:04
feel free to go out there and tell me the underlying meaning of Florida Department
3:08
event. It says FTOT Well, no, it's one of those big orange
3:13
signs. But sometimes so it'll tell you who's sending the message, whether it's
3:15
the sheriff in the county or well no. I remember when I was Sheriff's
3:20
office in traffic in years ago. I programmed those signs and we can get
3:23
signs and we put them around the county. And I tried to convince Sheriff
3:27
Campbell to put Sheriff Campbell says, click at her ticket, and he said,
3:30
no, those sons are those signs are funded by the government. There
3:35
are grant signs. Don't put my name on them. That wouldn't be appropriate.
3:39
I've seen sheriff since then put their name on them, and he and
3:45
we can't. We coined the phrase your sheriff says, do so. And
3:49
so when you see someone in Leon County that says your sheriff says, that's
3:52
where it came from. Okay, because because Sheriff Flair Campbell was acting appropriately
3:58
and not remiss a operating government resources for his greater glorification. So for circling
4:03
back now, anyone listening and you have the inside track on what those signs
4:10
are all about, well, I mean I know where they come from.
4:13
Those are those are probably there's probably some sort of construction or something going on,
4:16
or maybe it has something to do with storm. But at what point
4:19
did trains get appreciably faster. Well, I don't know. I'm sitting there
4:24
trying to think, well, well, there's no train tracks around here,
4:27
there's one that runs parallel to ten and ninety. I mean, is any
4:30
part of that bullet train running in South Florida? Did they move them up
4:32
from there? And no, I don't think so. They quit running am
4:35
track through there a long time ago. And there's if I thought they killed
4:41
the bullet train project. I don't know. There's something in South Florida,
4:44
some some new train opening or something down there. I don't know if that's
4:47
one of those wireless signals went haywire from some thing or vote programming, artificial
4:55
intelligence, that's what it is. It's telling us what's coming. There's there's
5:00
a new training town. We just don't they're gonna sneak it in here overnight,
5:04
put down some new tracks. I don't know. I mean, you
5:08
know, you just go what I don't Anyway, I guess you guys have
5:14
an email address for your show. We do, and I don't know what
5:19
it is. I'll have to we need to, we need to. We
5:23
need to plug that so people can send you email address as a producer.
5:27
And yeah, you could do that. That's a personal email, or you
5:30
could just send it to me if you know the answer to the question.
5:33
It's pressing at iHeartRadio dot com. We come back some stories in the news
5:38
and see what we can learn next. Alright, twelve minutes after the hour
5:42
personal Defense segment, Charlie Strickland of the Talent Training Group in with us.
5:45
He comes in the third Wednesday of the month and we talk about some things
5:50
in the news. We talk about some things that aren't in the news,
5:54
some stories in the news, Charlie that I want to run by you one
5:58
in each segment for the time we've got left, and then we'll just kind
6:01
of go from there on anything that it leads to. This story broke overnight.
6:08
Guy who's a manager of a CVS in Arizona's names Michael Jacobs, comes
6:12
home at ten fifty every night, which tells me he's the guy that closes
6:15
up that particular CVS at ten o'clock each evening. Customer earlier was arrested for
6:25
shoplifting. CBS got the merchandise back and they said we're not going to press
6:30
charges, We're gonna let him go, and so the guy came back ordered
6:36
everybody out of the store, shot and killed this young man forty eight years
6:42
old. Obviously, you can't predict excuse me, sorry, folks, the
6:50
conduct of somebody that's going to commit a crime like that. But it speaks
6:56
to me something that we touch on all the time. But I think it
6:59
veries reminding businesses that deal with people and best ways to prevent stuff like that
7:06
from happening. Yeah, I just got the yesterday taught a state and the
7:13
day before yesterday taught a class to nine different states, a nonprofit that deals
7:17
with you know, parent networks, things like that. And I was the
7:20
personal safety segment of this. I was talking about active shooters. And I
7:25
show a slide that shows a picture of a cross section of all of the
7:29
people prior to you know, or most of the major ones that made the
7:32
news prior to about twenty nineteen when I made the slide, and people,
7:35
it's not what people think. It's this broad spectrum of backgrounds and religions and
7:41
different sexes and identities now and all this stuff. And you know, and
7:45
I bring up the point that how do you predict If you can't predict who
7:50
the next person is it does something like this, then if you can't,
7:56
if you can't determine a pattern based on what you see and your observations and
8:00
history, then if you can't develop a pattern, and how can you predict
8:03
who it's going to be? And listen, there are shoplifters caught in Tallahassee
8:09
every single day. This could happen at any store, any location, any
8:15
single day. I mean, so the fact is is that it can happen
8:18
here. It can and probably has. I mean I used to work robberies
8:22
here. I mean it was in a robbery task force. I mean,
8:26
you know, we worked serial robbery cases. That makes it sound really bad,
8:30
but yeah, it's a series of robberies that people are committing. There's
8:33
a lot of violence. I mean, I'm looking at I was just looking
8:35
up on the screen here in your studio when they were showing a violent cardjacking
8:39
in Chicago. We expect that in Chicago. Guess what, it happens right
8:41
here. It happens in small towns, that happens in and uh, you
8:46
know Tallahassee regularly. So but this shop caught a break. Yeah, it
8:50
gave him a break. It doesn't matter because mental illness is a thing,
8:52
and this person was either mentally ill or suffered some some serious anger issues.
8:58
And the fact is is, you know, and the thing is, it's
9:01
if CDs had to press charges and he had to been arrested, it may
9:05
not have gone that way. Maybe he would have gone to jail, Maybe
9:07
he would have got a notice to appear. I don't know. The fact
9:09
is is getting giving people breaks and washing your hands of the minor theft just
9:16
just compounds the issue. Chances are if somebody had to enforced the law and
9:20
press charges at some point in that person's past, they may have been in
9:24
jail that day. I mean, when we do traffic crash reconstruction, a
9:26
lot of times they go back and look and say, we do interviews and
9:30
look at what they did an hour or two hours before, because it determines
9:33
where they would have been at that point in time. Same thing with this
9:35
type of crime. Charlie said that, you know, hearing Paul Tyre on
9:41
Talent out Doors say I'll tell you what, it's got him saying I'll tell
9:43
you what me listening to Charlie doing Talent out Doors has me saying, and
9:48
we're back, Well, I'm disappointed because we got an answer on the trainees.
9:54
I was looking for some deeper meaning. I was thinking it was a
9:58
message to me about something thing, and I was only one that saw it.
10:01
But apparently Bruce almighty, Yeah, I mean, you know, so
10:07
what would I do? Know? So apparently the bright Line Express from between
10:13
Orlando and Miami is opening this week, and it is a high speed train,
10:18
and apparently it's so high speed that if they missed her stop, they
10:22
can't slow down to the get to the Panhandle, and so we have to
10:26
be careful up here too. I thought it was better. I was.
10:28
I knew it was a glitch, but I was kind of hoping for more.
10:31
But so, yeah, that thing's supposed to be screaming along down there
10:35
eighty miles an hour or more. I'm not in a hurry to get to
10:39
Orlando or to Miami, but I would be in a hurry to get out
10:41
of Miami, so anywhere else other than Miami. So there, I'll leave
10:46
it right there. I'm just gonna leave it right there because I'm not a
10:48
big fan of either. But we were talking about the case that we heard
10:54
reported overnight Arizona CVS manager was shot and killed by a guy who was arrested
11:01
for shoplifting. They didn't press charges. CVS didn't. I guess it's a
11:05
policy. And he came back and shot and killed the manager. But he
11:09
ordered staff and customers out of the store. I feel like between customers that's
11:16
one level, staff, a second level, and the man himself, there
11:20
are three different opportunities there for somebody to perhaps stop this. When you start
11:24
ordering people. When a bad guy starts ordering people out of a location,
11:30
there's they are targeting someone. They are setting something up. Because if you
11:33
were doing a takeover robbery, you wouldn't order them out, You'd tell him
11:37
to get on the ground. So they couldn't go call law enforcement, They
11:39
couldn't call nine one one. This is a target of killing at that point.
11:43
He went there with the intent to kill this person order and he's admitted
11:46
that, right, and so this first degree premeditated. I mean, you
11:50
see what he's been charged with you, right. But the thing is is
11:52
when you see something like that shaping up, know that this is going south
11:56
in a hurry. Know that if you were ever going to use force against
11:58
someone, this is the time to do it. If you were a client
12:00
or a customer inside there, or a staff member with a gun, and
12:03
I'm sure CBS does not allow guns for employee. I want to talk about
12:07
that too, Go ahead. But the point being is if you're ever going
12:11
to use force, this is the time that you would do it because this
12:13
is not going to go well for someone. So it's just a personal decision
12:16
you have to make. Am I prepared? You know? Can I do
12:20
something? I am I in a position to do something? You know,
12:22
you or I would? You know in a case like that, I always
12:26
have a gun, no matter what, no matter what, no matter where.
12:31
I actually went back and got my standards back, and I am now
12:33
a reserve deputy in Jackson County. Now I can carry a gun any of
12:37
dad gun where I want to accept the places as I would never go,
12:39
like to jail. So I mean, it's just my passion to be able
12:43
to protect people. Go ahead, Well, I was just gonna say,
12:48
let's talk about you know, likely CVS, like a lot of major companies
12:52
have a policy of not carrying. So but that doesn't mean you can't carry.
12:56
It just means that if you do, when there's something that goes wrong,
12:58
you get fired. You get fired. And so here's what I do.
13:01
I work for a corporation right now. Because here's the thing is,
13:05
if something happens, Okay, so I'm sure CBS they've got insurance something's gonna
13:09
happen, family is going to get something. I'd compound that, I'd put
13:11
in a written request. So, with the latest changes in far to law
13:15
allowing concealed carry without a permit, put in a request that you place a
13:18
business say can I carry a firearm? Am I am trained and prepared to
13:24
protect my own life in a situation like this, and especially if you're in
13:28
retail now and I and I would like to carry a firearm concealed while at
13:33
work, or at least have one on the property I could obtain and they're
13:35
going to tell you no. But then your law, at least your family
13:39
can sue the pants off of them for not providing adequate protection after after you
13:43
requested the ability to do that for yourself. And I think it adds a
13:46
level of of culpability on part of the or employer, because you know,
13:52
and I get back to this, I heard Marion Hammer say this the number
13:54
of times if if someone says you can't carry a gun here, well,
13:58
then they're assuming a certain amount of the responsibility for protecting, which is you
14:01
know, I mean, I run an arm security company. This is what
14:05
we do as we go and protect people. So yeah, I think I
14:11
would roll the dice. Don't come to the talent range and expect to do
14:16
that, because every one of our employees has a gun, yeah, and
14:18
they know how to use them. Yeah, and we're going to fight over
14:22
who gets to shoot shoot. So I mean, you know, it's it's
14:24
one of those things that'll come back and bite me at court one day.
14:31
It's just a joke, people, just a joke. We're just having fun.
14:35
It's an entertainment portion of the radio program. Okay, this it would
14:43
be entertaining for somebody. We have a bunch of veterans and stuff, so
14:48
none of them are going to be you know, I just I just think
14:52
that folks. We bring up stories from the news because I think there are
14:54
opportunities for all of us to learn from them, to think through them.
15:00
We come back. We got another story just like it, and it's for
15:03
any one of you that drives a nice car, truck, live in a
15:07
nice neighborhood, nice area, buy stuff at the store. Someone's in the
15:11
parking lot and they're paying attention. Get back to that next in the Morning
15:15
Show with Preston Scott. Continuing our personal defense segments here on the Morning Show
15:22
with Preston Scott Show five thousand and eleven, and I'm with Charlie Strickland,
15:30
co host of Talent Outdoors, co founder of the Talent Training Group, talking
15:33
about stories in the news. You and I have talked, JD and I
15:37
have talked. I've talked on the program Charlie at nauseum about the brazenness that
15:46
bad people are engaging in and now following people pretending to be law enforcement,
15:52
following them into their homes, following them into and in this case, carjackers
15:56
pulled masks on. They see a guy driving an Aston Martin and they follow
16:00
him all the way back to his home. He pulls into the garage,
16:03
not even aware that they've followed him. In the driveway, he is a
16:07
collection of a few cars. They get away with the Aston Martin, and
16:12
another vehicle punched him out. Question becomes not just one of awareness, but
16:18
if somebody is not necessarily I didn't see anyone brandish a weapon in this,
16:26
but they attacked him. You can shoot him, can't you. Well,
16:30
So, speaking of in Florida, all right, because every state's different.
16:34
In Washington's different. So if you are in your home or in your vehicle,
16:40
you're occupied vehicle. Yes, if someone attempts to illegally and forcibly enter
16:45
your residence, dwelling or occupied conveyance with or without a firearm with doesn't matter,
16:49
doesn't matter, doesn't matter. The fact is there's a presumption of violent
16:53
and ten on their on their behalf, and it's castle doctrine, not stand
16:57
your ground, it's castle do when you are in one of those places.
17:02
And so if you were you pull into your driveway, doesn't have to be
17:04
in your garage, just is doubly protective in your garage because now you're in
17:08
your home, the cartilage of your home, which is the immediate surrounding and
17:12
part of the home, and you're in your vehicle. So yeah, if
17:18
someone attempts to oh and also castle doctrine covers if they're trying to carjack,
17:22
you commit a forcible felony. So all of those things protect you, and
17:25
you have no civil or criminal culpability. You can't be sued successfully and you
17:30
and you cannot be criminally prosecuted if you use deadly force when they're trying to
17:37
do that. Now, if they're steal in the car out of your driveway
17:40
and you walk outside and shoot them, no, that's not that's not legally
17:44
permissible. You leave your car in your driveway, you're walking away from your
17:48
vehicle, they come in, try to break in, or they attack you,
17:52
then obviously it's for you can defend yourself if they try to break in
17:56
your car, and even when you're standing there, you know you're over here,
18:00
they're not kind of saying I want the keys to your car. If
18:03
that's a that's an armed robbery or a robbery you know of a person that's
18:07
a violent felon the end, you can you can use deadly for us to
18:10
protect yourself in that case. I want to get to and again we talk
18:15
about a time and again how this could have all been avoided. Well,
18:19
the thing is is we talk and we have talked about again again against situational
18:23
awareness, awareness of your surroundings and not being in condition white or you see
18:27
you are so zoned out that you're not focusing on what's going on around you
18:32
and sell phones and so that type of stuff or the biggest culprit when it
18:36
comes to that. So you need to be when you're driving, you need
18:37
to watch, particularly as you get close to home. You know, if
18:41
you've got someone who's been behind you for a while and they make that last
18:45
turn into your neighborhood, you don't recognize the vehicle. Sometimes it's a good
18:51
idea just to drive past your house and make a U turn somewhere circle of
18:53
the block and see what happens. I mean, because uh, you know,
18:59
just depends on what you're driving, what the situation is. And listen,
19:03
people get carjack for junks sometimes, I mean they just want they want
19:06
a car to go commit a crime when yep, or they want a car
19:08
they don't want to get caught in their relatives car that they're in doing some
19:12
other crime or something. I mean a lot of the a lot of times
19:15
the car shopping up in your neck of the woods up in the Clarin Lakes
19:19
area up there, when they go through at night and they're going in cars
19:22
and they're I didn't near it down too much, but there's you live in
19:26
the Northeast, I know, somewhere in the county, so somewhere up there
19:30
there's there's people that car shop at night. They get they go steal cars
19:37
and they go do that in stolen cars. So from Clarin Claren Lakes,
19:40
goldenig I can't get in Golden Eggle because they have a gate. But you
19:42
know those uh summer Brook, you may have stolen cars driving around up They're
19:48
looking for unlocked cars. If you're not, there's Southwood in our exact region,
19:52
Panama City's Guide its own areas, Panama City Beach. There are areas
19:56
that are always targeted by bad guys. I just want to point out situational
20:02
awareness, the number of people that just don't think it will ever happen to
20:04
them. Yeah, I mean listen, you've got to pay attention. And
20:07
if you don't pay attention, and then bad things can happen. So watch
20:11
watch, I mean watch out for yourself. Let me pulling your driveway,
20:15
look around, see if a car stopped it into the driveway out on the
20:18
street or something. I mean, this just takes some little extra effort.
20:21
And I'm just telling all of you that drive a nicer vehicle, a nicer
20:23
truck, whatever this is happening, you just need to be paying attention.
20:30
Forty minutes past the hour, forty two minutes past the hour, final segment,
20:34
Personal Defense. Charlie Strickland of the Talent Training Group, My guest and
20:40
I've been teasing this story. I thought it was I just thought it was
20:42
interesting. Farmer holds burglars at gunpoint after he finds them creeping around property,
20:51
and he held them there waiting for police, and the police eventually showed up
20:55
and arrested the guys. Good on him. But let's talk about that,
21:00
because you and I have already chatted about this a little bit in the break.
21:03
It's an interesting topic. What can you do holding someone who is a
21:11
bad guy. We're not talking about any other scenario here other than someone that
21:15
is a is a bad guy. What can you do to hold him at
21:19
gunpoint while you wait for police? Okay, well, now farmers have the
21:23
ability. There's a statue in there, and I can't remember the exact verbiage,
21:27
but if someone's stealing agricultural products or whatever, that they can use reasonable
21:32
force today. And this is Washington State, and I have no idea what
21:36
their laws are. Probably extremely liberal. Probably they'll probably put that farmer in
21:41
jail up there. But I'm talking about down here in God's Country, in
21:45
the Bible Belt, in the Wiregrass and North Florida and South Georgia, South
21:49
Alabama. You go to South Alabama, South Georgia, they don't care.
21:55
You know, well, I shot him in the leg and he's still there
21:57
and you probably pull out off in some of those areas. But no.
22:02
But seriously, though, that's my way of getting out of that. So
22:08
if if I had a judge tell me one time, well, if you
22:11
in one of our classes, is what we were actually training some judges,
22:15
and he said, you know, if you point a gun at someone us
22:17
an aggravated as aut with a deadly weapon. However, it may be justified
22:19
by law. You know, there's laws that allow you to do that.
22:22
But technically that's what it is. If someone is committing a crime, you
22:27
know, you can detain someone's committing a crime against you. It's lawful for
22:30
you detain someone. Now how you do that is a different story, right.
22:37
I would not commit violence against someone to detain them. I don't even
22:42
want to touch them unless they're committing a felony where they're breaking in my home,
22:45
something where deadly force was justified. Katie Barter that I can't do anything
22:49
I want to at that point in time to detain them. I can.
22:53
They can be laying there not breathing when law enforcement gets there, because deadly
22:56
force was justified. So but you know there's that just because you can doesn't
23:03
mean you should use deadly force. But in a case like this, deadly
23:06
force can't be used on someone who's just creeping around your place or you know,
23:11
loi earning and prowling or even stealing property that's not inside the curtilage of
23:15
your home or inside your occupied vehicles. So if you caught somebody in your
23:19
yard or around your barn or something, sure you have a gun for your
23:25
personal protection on your property, and you can carry openly on your property concealed
23:30
anywhere. And you point a gun at them and you tell them to stay
23:34
there until law enforcement arrives, and you didn't shoot them. You just you
23:38
have the gun for your protection in case they decide it. Just said warning
23:42
to them that if they try to attack you, if they're stupid enough to
23:45
fall for the fact that I'm pointing a gun at you, and you ought
23:48
not to move, because if I were a bad guy and I knew and
23:53
you point a gun at me and said stay there, and I knew you
23:56
couldn't legally shoot me. I'd get up and run. I wanted to talk
23:59
about at that. We don't have a lot of time left. Scenario one,
24:03
the guy submits he simply doesn't know. You can't shoot him, yep.
24:07
Scenario two, he then approaches you, you can't shoot him. Well,
24:11
if he runs away, you can't shoot him because you can't approaches you
24:15
he comes at If he starts to approach you and gets close enough to where
24:19
he could reasonably grab the farm take it away from you, and he isn't,
24:23
and through threat and action, he is verbally or physically threatening to take
24:29
the gun away from you, and he's in such close proximity that he could
24:33
reasonably do that, and you were in reasonable fear of death a great body
24:34
harm based on his actions. And that's the textbook definition of you're standing your
24:41
ground at that point, and the statutes cover that as well. I think
24:45
it'd be helpful to know exactly what Charlie just said so that you can then
24:48
inform that person. Look, I don't want to have to shoot you,
24:52
but if you take another step, you're giving me reason you get closer to
24:55
me, I'm gonna take that as an attempt to take my farm from me
24:57
and use it against me. So one more step and I'm gonna shoot you
25:00
dead. That's a good firm language that he should probably understand because you're also
25:06
aware of the law. Be aware of the law, be able to articulate
25:10
the law, and then also learn that when law enforcement comes you shut up
25:14
and get an attack. There you go. You have the right to remain
25:18
silent. You should also have the intelligence to do the same thing. And
25:21
if you listen to Talent Outdoors there's an attorney that anyway. Thanks for coming
25:26
in and the problem. Good to see you, a good see Charlie Strickland,
25:30
Talent Outdoors Talent Training Group. My guests on The Morning Show with Preston Scott