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Breaking Masks: The Cost of High-Functioning Anxiety · Is Your Way In Your Way?

• 0:25
  Cassandra: welcome you to Is your Way In your Way podcast.
• 0:29
  Cassandra: Actually, for my new listeners out there and I know I have some and always do but that's the name of my book Is your Way In your Way and it's a self-discovery guide for women on how to restore yourself, learn from your experiences and be your true self again.
• 0:48
  Cassandra: This podcast is for individuals who I call stuck.
• 0:52
  Cassandra: You're kind of in your way because a lot of limiting beliefs we have self-imposed barriers, imposter syndrome, self-sabotage, just a multitude of things and you've been wanting to write this book, you've been wanting to start a podcast, you want to start a business, you want to get a new job.
• 1:11
  Cassandra: It's just so many things Get out of a toxic relationship, just so much stuff that's rolling in your head, ruminating that it is that you want to do, but yet you're stuck.
• 1:22
  Cassandra: You're in your way.
• 1:23
  Cassandra: So we talk about topics related to what I call self-improvement, personal development and also my prayer is also that when you listen, when somebody listens to this podcast whatever has had you stuck, you will get unstuck by something that you've heard.
• 1:45
  Cassandra: And today I'm just super excited about my guest today and I say that because I get it, because I was where she was, and the name of the podcast is the Power of the Pause Breaking free from high functioning anxiety.
• 2:05
  Cassandra: Let me bring her back to the orange room.
• 2:09
  Cassandra: I'd like to introduce to you Dr Ebony Stone.
• 2:13
  Cassandra: Hi, dr Ebony, how are you today?
• 2:16
  Cassandra: Hello, how are you?
• 2:17
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I'm so excited to be here today.
• 2:19
  Cassandra: Oh girl, me too.
• 2:20
  Cassandra: I'm just super happy.
• 2:21
  Cassandra: Thank you for having me.
• 2:22
  Cassandra: Absolutely, it's the pleasure, it's all mine.
• 2:26
  Cassandra: Now, one of the things that I do before we start delving into the questions, I kind of tell my listeners give them a little background, ok, so they can kind of understand why you're qualified to talk about the power of the pause.
• 2:43
  Cassandra: So one of the things I want to ask my listeners, though have you ever felt like you were crushing it on the outside?
• 2:51
  Cassandra: I mean, you were doing phenomenal on the outside, but yet you were crumbling on the inside, like people saw you and thought you had it all together, but on the inside it was like, oh, it was just.
• 3:05
  Cassandra: You guys know what I mean by that, right?
• 3:08
  Cassandra: So like your success was just beautifully, beautifully, beautifully decorated mask.
• 3:17
  Cassandra: You wear a mask for exhaustion, anxiety and self-doubt.
• 3:21
  Cassandra: Now, if any of you are kind of shaking your head and say, yeah, yeah, I look good on the outside, but, boy, on the inside I am just falling apart, Well, if you're nodding right now, you're not alone.
• 3:33
  Cassandra: My guest today, dr Ebony Stone, knows this struggle all too well.
• 3:38
  Cassandra: She's a powerhouse leader, an entrepreneur and a mental health advocate.
• 3:44
  Cassandra: Dr Stone went from navigating the highest level of corporate America to realizing that high functioning Now listen, high functioning anxiety was running her life.
• 3:58
  Cassandra: In her book, the Power of the Pause, she opens up about how hitting the brakes intentionally can actually accelerate your success.
• 4:09
  Cassandra: Intentionally can actually accelerate your success.
• 4:15
  Cassandra: So what happens when we stop pushing and start pausing?
• 4:18
  Cassandra: So, hey guys, so let's dive in.
• 4:19
  Cassandra: Dr Ebony, now you had your educate, now you're a doctor.
• 4:23
  Cassandra: So we know that before your educational journey, like, you got a PhD in business administration, mba from Wayne State, a bachelor's in management information system from Oakland University.
• 4:39
  Cassandra: So before your educational journey, what was life like for you?
• 4:46
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You know that's a funny question.
• 4:48
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I don't.
• 4:49
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I didn't know life without education.
• 4:52
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Right From the time I was probably two years old, before I can remember.
• 4:58
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I was in school and I stayed in school.
• 5:00
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I went straight through a master's degree, stopped for a few years to get married, had a couple of kids and then went back and did a doctorate.
• 5:10
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So and then I worked in learning and development.
• 5:13
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So education was always a part of my life.
• 5:16
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I don't know that I really know life without education.
• 5:22
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I'm blessed, right, I recognize that I had a childhood that was unlike many.
• 5:29
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You know I have my mom and dad in the home together.
• 5:32
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I grew up with my siblings.
• 5:35
  Dr. Ebony Stone: My mom has a massive family.
• 5:37
  Dr. Ebony Stone: She had 15 sisters and brothers.
• 5:39
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I have a ton of cousins.
• 5:41
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I had a grandmother, my dad's mom, who lived literally a mile and a half away.
• 5:46
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I had grandmas, you know.
• 5:50
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Daily after school I got home, cooked meals.
• 5:54
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So I had a great life, right by any standard.
• 5:59
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I went to some of the best schools in the city.
• 6:03
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I'm from Detroit.
• 6:03
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I went to, you know, some of the best schools in the city.
• 6:07
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So I had a great life.
• 6:09
  Dr. Ebony Stone: But with that life also came a lot of pressure.
• 6:14
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Right.
• 6:14
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You're given these privileges of going to these schools, having these things, there's an expectation of performance and even if that expectation is not verbal, even if it's not coming from parents, the world is telling you you need to perform, like you have no reason not to be at the top of every single list.
• 6:38
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And even if the world didn't tell me that, that's how I internalized OK, like I had been given all of these things.
• 6:47
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So I needed to perform, you know, to show to be my ancestors, wildest dreams, right, and I had a great life, but I had to constantly stay.
• 7:04
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I think I attached my identity to the smart girl.
• 7:07
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I attached my identity to the smart girl.
• 7:09
  Cassandra: Oh, when you ask about education, always a part of my life, okay, Well, let me ask you then, what were your dreams and aspirations, except, like, going to school?
• 7:22
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Yeah, Honest to God, my dream was to get married and have a family and have a legacy.
• 7:32
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Came to work, I didn't really care Like, I went to school and I got a job.
• 7:39
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I mean, I got a degree in information systems because I was good at math, right, I was good at working with the computers.
• 7:45
  Dr. Ebony Stone: But my dream in life really was to continue the legacy that my parents had started.
• 7:50
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Family was extremely important to me.
• 7:52
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I wanted to help other people and at one point I believed I shouldn't say I believed.
• 8:00
  Dr. Ebony Stone: At one point I was like hey, I know, I want to be the executive right On the highest levels, that's what I said to myself, but it wasn't.
• 8:09
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I wasn't super clear with myself, it wasn't like, oh, in this industry, doing this thing, it was just kind of like that's the next step, that's the expectation to be at the top of the list.
• 8:19
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And so that's what happened, and I did both simultaneously.
• 8:24
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I got married to an amazing man.
• 8:25
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I have three beautiful children.
• 8:28
  Dr. Ebony Stone: We are still married, our children are still together, and so that dream, I'm living that dream, and I also rose to the highest ranks of corporate, so I was able to do those things as well, and now I get to spend my time helping others.
• 8:44
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So I think about my dreams.
• 8:47
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I can say that my dreams have come true, but it was not without challenge yes, wow.
• 8:54
  Cassandra: So that's interesting.
• 8:55
  Cassandra: When you said your the expectations that you, it sounded like you had of yourself, basically because look at your family, it was family-oriented, your parents are still together, you were always in Education seemed like it was key, it was important, and also you sounded like you were hard on yourself.
• 9:20
  Cassandra: And I say that because you're like OK, I want to be this, I want to do this, I want to get to the highest ranks.
• 9:26
  Cassandra: And you did OK, and so I like to know what did it look like when you were, gracefully, perhaps, navigating the corporate world?
• 9:39
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Yeah, it looked great on the outside and it was interesting on the inside.
• 9:44
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So I have done a number of things.
• 9:50
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I've done some consulting, I've worked in some small firms, I've worked worked in some large firms and it looked like Ebony, showing up every day, poised and ready to take on whatever the challenge of the day was, whatever the challenge of the day was.
• 10:08
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It was about leadership.
• 10:09
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It was about making sure that I was an example for all, but as a Black woman, I carried that.
• 10:18
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You got to be an example for all Black people Right, and so I was showing up with a smile on my face, even when I wasn't happy.
• 10:26
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I was calculated.
• 10:30
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Every move that I made was calculated.
• 10:34
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I was personable, but I didn't let too many people into my personal space.
• 10:41
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Relatable but, I, wasn't the one to, let's say, hang out after work or get to kind of the work clicks.
• 10:52
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Um, I many people would tell you that I spoke my piece, but, um, that was the ebony that they knew.
• 11:00
  Dr. Ebony Stone: They didn't know on the inside that there was a whole lot more going on.
• 11:05
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So that's what it looked on the outside.
• 11:07
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It looked like on the outside.
• 11:08
  Dr. Ebony Stone: The higher up I got, the older my kids got.
• 11:12
  Dr. Ebony Stone: On the inside it was a mess.
• 11:15
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Like I will tell you, we were running.
• 11:19
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Schedules were crazy.
• 11:20
  Dr. Ebony Stone: The house looked a mess.
• 11:23
  Dr. Ebony Stone: There was always clothes that needed to be folded, dishes that needed to be washed.
• 11:26
  Dr. Ebony Stone: There was another event that I had to go to to be folded, dishes that needed to be washed.
• 11:27
  Dr. Ebony Stone: There was another event that I had to go to.
• 11:30
  Dr. Ebony Stone: All of these things had to be done.
• 11:32
  Dr. Ebony Stone: My husband is an entrepreneur and so behind the scenes there was kind of this whirlwind tornado going on, and then we step outside and present to the world and then we come back into this whirlwind.
• 12:15
  Cassandra: Kind of what it looked like for, I would say, 15 years or so.
• 12:17
  Cassandra: You know, as the're currently doing now and we're going to talk about that, how did you define success when you were in that corporate environment?
• 12:22
  Cassandra: What was success?
• 12:23
  Dr. Ebony Stone: to you, success was measured by, to be quite honest, money promotions, and I went from tying my identity to education and being a smart girl to tying my identity to leading large groups of people, to leading large groups of people.
• 12:49
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And so, as long as I was leading a large group of people and making sure that I had a vision in front of them and guiding them toward that vision, I felt like I was being successful and to a certain extent I was.
• 13:02
  Dr. Ebony Stone: But that's not the full definition of success, as I see it today, right because and others saw you as being successful.
• 13:11
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Absolutely, Absolutely.
• 13:12
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I can't tell you how many people walked into an office and said I want to do what you do, Tell me how you do it.
• 13:19
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And I was thinking you have no idea what's going on Right, exactly.
• 13:25
  Cassandra: So, um, what was?
• 13:28
  Cassandra: Okay, you had all of that you got.
• 13:30
  Cassandra: It's interesting, because that's how we were brought up we have.
• 13:34
  Cassandra: You got married, you had the kids, had the white picket fence.
• 13:37
  Cassandra: You know you had the good job.
• 13:40
  Cassandra: You were doing this, you were doing that, and so what was your breaking point behind the pause framework that you're?
• 13:50
  Dr. Ebony Stone: doing yeah, yeah, great question.
• 13:52
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So after 2020,.
• 13:55
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So I would say, coming out of COVID was a breaking point because going into COVID I kicked into what I call overdrive.
• 14:07
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It was a space where I buried the feelings that Ebony had and I made sure that everybody else was okay.
• 14:15
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I was making sure my husband was okay.
• 14:18
  Dr. Ebony Stone: He's an entrepreneur, he's a contractor, he couldn't go into other people's homes right, and I knew sitting still was going to drive him bonkers.
• 14:25
  Dr. Ebony Stone: The kids were at home doing school.
• 14:27
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I wanted to make sure they were okay, unlike most people who just put their kids at the dining room table, which is you know what.
• 14:35
  Dr. Ebony Stone: In hindsight, maybe I should have done.
• 14:40
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Nope, I emptied my dining room.
• 14:41
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I turned it into a school room.
• 14:42
  Dr. Ebony Stone: They had desks and beanbags and whiteboards and all of the things and I was taking care of mom, who couldn't be out and about, and I was making sure that my team was okay.
• 14:49
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And I was taking care of mom, who couldn't be out and about, and I was making sure that my team was okay.
• 14:52
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I was checking on the people, my direct reports, every day.
• 14:55
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I had a meeting every single morning, cameras on just so I could look at my staff and in hindsight I was creating more chaos, but for me it felt like I was controlling everything and so, coming out of that and easing back into the workplace, I was trying to make sure everybody was OK as they were coming back into the office and all of those things.
• 15:16
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And once all of that stopped, I found myself in a space where now all of these emotions could come to the surface.
• 15:26
  Cassandra: Now you had gone back to work.
• 15:27
  Cassandra: Yep COVID was over.
• 15:30
  Dr. Ebony Stone: COVID was over.
• 15:31
  Cassandra: OK, all right.
• 15:33
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Things were supposedly back to normal.
• 15:35
  Dr. Ebony Stone: We can only bury feelings for so long.
• 15:38
  Dr. Ebony Stone: They will come to the surface if you do not process them Somehow someway.
• 15:43
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Yep, they are coming out.
• 15:45
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And so I was dealing with medical issues, I was gaining weight, all of these things, and so I had gone to the doctor and the doctor said you know, I really I couldn't sleep.
• 15:57
  Dr. Ebony Stone: She's trying to give me medication to sleep and he said I really want you to consider this behavioral health recommendation.
• 16:07
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I really would like for you to go see a therapist.
• 16:09
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I said, yeah, yeah, I'm going to go.
• 16:11
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And then when I went back, you know, a couple of times he told me.
• 16:15
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And so finally I said, you know, I've got to go and I have an amazing therapist.
• 16:21
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And I remember talking to her and her saying hey, I want to do a couple of assessments.
• 16:30
  Dr. Ebony Stone: After one, maybe two conversations, I want to do a couple of assessments.
• 16:34
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I really want to do an anxiety assessment.
• 16:38
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I really want to do an anxiety assessment and I'd like to do a depression assessment.
• 16:41
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And I was thinking, all right, I'm sure I'm anxious, I'm wound up or whatever.
• 16:46
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So it took us a few sessions to get through the assessments.
• 16:50
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And the funny thing was I was sitting in my car doing my therapy sessions because there was nowhere else I could go.
• 16:58
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Nowhere else was quiet, there was nowhere else.
• 17:02
  Cassandra: And your sessions were virtual.
• 17:04
  Dr. Ebony Stone: They were virtual.
• 17:05
  Cassandra: Okay.
• 17:05
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I was sitting in the car behind my house and I remember so clearly her saying Mrs Stone, you've been operating in a deficit so long you don't even realize that's what's happening, and something about her saying that just I think that was the moment that it all came crashing down on me and the tears just started running.
• 17:30
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And she continued, you know, said I just want you to take a moment and process.
• 17:35
  Dr. Ebony Stone: This is going to come with my recommendation that you take some time off of work.
• 17:40
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Ouch and correct, so you.
• 17:47
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So now you're dealing with this.
• 17:49
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Who doesn't want time off of work?
• 17:52
  Dr. Ebony Stone: but right really because I need time off work, right?
• 17:57
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So Now you're dealing with this and have all these thoughts swirling.
• 18:01
  Dr. Ebony Stone: They're just swirling.
• 18:03
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Are people going to think I'm doing this just to get time off work?
• 18:06
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Should I actually tell this story?
• 18:10
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Is it okay to tell this story?
• 18:12
  Dr. Ebony Stone: What are people going to think of me?
• 18:13
  Dr. Ebony Stone: How do I go back and be a leader after this?
• 18:16
  Dr. Ebony Stone: This is going to show weakness me.
• 18:17
  Dr. Ebony Stone: How do I go back and be a leader after this?
• 18:17
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Like does this?
• 18:18
  Dr. Ebony Stone: This is going to show weakness, like.
• 18:19
  Dr. Ebony Stone: All of these things are swirling.
• 18:21
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And I spent probably the better part of three or four more days dealing with whether or not I should take the time that she was suggesting.
• 18:38
  Cassandra: Okay, now doing those three and four days were you still working.
• 18:43
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Yep, okay, mm-hmm, I was still working and because I just I care so deeply for people, I was looking at my staff, I was looking at my peers, I was looking at people around me like I can't leave, like I have to be here for them.
• 18:59
  Dr. Ebony Stone: But a seed had already been planted by my therapist who was saying no, you won't be here for them if you don't take care of yourself, exactly Because you're going to end up not here in the worst way.
• 19:15
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And my doctor has said the same thing.
• 19:39
  Dr. Ebony Stone: He said listen, you're on the path to a heart attack, a stroke, so you have got to stop.
• 19:43
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And so those things combined are what caused me to just finally say, okay, I'm going to take the time that I need, I'm going to listen to these professionals.
• 19:54
  Dr. Ebony Stone: They were put in my life for a reason and I'm going to listen to them.
• 19:57
  Dr. Ebony Stone: They were put in my life for a reason and I'm going to listen to them.
• 20:00
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And so that's when I took the time off work.
• 20:03
  Cassandra: Okay, now let me ask you, because I have a lot of listeners who are looking real good on the outside, but on the inside they know they should be making the change.
• 20:13
  Cassandra: And you know all the stereotypical.
• 20:18
  Cassandra: Let's talk about mental health, mental illness and all of that, and we don't do it for fear of what people may think of us.
• 20:26
  Cassandra: You know we don't want to tell the truth, so to speak.
• 20:30
  Cassandra: We like I'm sick or I got this or whatever.
• 20:33
  Cassandra: How, what did you tell your boss when it was time for you to take a rest?
• 20:41
  Dr. Ebony Stone: to pause?
• 20:42
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Yep, nothing that my health care team suggested that I take time off work and they won't be sending paperwork for me to leave.
• 20:52
  Cassandra: Okay, and any questions asked.
• 20:54
  Cassandra: What do you think they thought of that when you said that to them?
• 21:02
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I know they were worried.
• 21:03
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I know we talked before this.
• 21:07
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I worked with some of the most amazing people, and so I know they were worried about me and in hindsight I would have maybe told them a little more, because I know they were worried about me, but I was in this space, it was.
• 21:28
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I was not in a good place and so I was not thinking clearly.
• 21:31
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I can remember.
• 21:33
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So my mother has had two bone marrow transplants, and I remember.
• 21:38
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And so after a bone marrow transplant you have to have 24-hour care.
• 21:43
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And so the last one she had, I remember taking a leave of absence to help her.
• 21:49
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I was very upfront about what things were going on and that type of thing.
• 21:53
  Dr. Ebony Stone: But I was worried and I was not showing up well at work and I remember my boss at the time, super caring I think it may have been a Wednesday and I was scheduled to go out on leave after Friday and I remember her calling me into her office and saying, hey, I think you probably should just go out on leave now.
• 22:13
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And I was like, oh, but I have these things that I have to finish.
• 22:16
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Oh, we'll take care of it.
• 22:18
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You need to go see about mom.
• 22:22
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And I recognized that I was not showing up well and because I had worked so hard to get where I was, I am thankful that she was protecting me in that space and saying, well, now, before you fall apart, right, I had gotten to that place again, but that wasn't.
• 22:40
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I wasn't worried about anybody on the outside, I was falling apart on the inside for me and I wasn't sure how that would be taken right, and so I was also very well versed in human resources.
• 22:59
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I have, you know, my MBA has a focus on organizational behavior, human resources, and so I knew, once I did certain things, what would trigger.
• 23:09
  Dr. Ebony Stone: That's right, yeah, and how to handle it.
• 23:13
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So emotionally I don't know that I handled it well, but professionally I handled it by the book.
• 23:25
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Everything, yeah, yeah.
• 23:29
  Cassandra: Yeah, and I and I ask that because you know, yeah, jobs are important careers and all of that but what I do know, people sacrifice their health for the job and and you don't know what people are thinking, you don't know, oh, they can't do that job, or will you have that job when you come back?
• 23:55
  Cassandra: Until it gets to a point like you know what, if I don't stop this, I'm not going to be here anyway.
• 24:05
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Correct, yeah, and I'd like to say this I think the majority of people you're right they don't know if they're going to have the job when they come back to it.
• 24:15
  Dr. Ebony Stone: They don't know what's going to happen.
• 24:18
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I will tell you that it was never a doubt in my mind that my job would be there when I got back.
• 24:23
  Dr. Ebony Stone: That was never a doubt in my mind that my job would be there.
• 24:28
  Dr. Ebony Stone: What was in my mind is that I think you talked about in your opening the mask that we put on.
• 24:37
  Dr. Ebony Stone: What was in my mind is that that mask would be gone and how would I exist without that mask, right, the mask that had been there since I graduated college, quite frankly.
• 24:49
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So how would I do that?
• 24:53
  Cassandra: So I think the mask of being like educated you all of this and all of that, and yeah, ok, and so how, yeah, all of this, you're that girl, that's right.
• 25:08
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And that girl has problems, right, right.
• 25:10
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And I hesitated to share my story.
• 25:15
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I'm so thankful for a therapist who pushed me to share my story.
• 25:21
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I'm so thankful for a therapist who pushed me to share my story, and I did, because so many people relate to it.
• 25:25
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And my husband said to me babe, I don't want that to be your story.
• 25:32
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I don't want your story to be about a six month period in your life.
• 25:40
  Cassandra: And I said.
• 25:41
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You know, if people decide that the sum of Ebony is six months in which I was caring for myself and they see that as a bad thing, then those aren't the people that I need in my life anyway.
• 25:56
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I don't want the people that I want to be a part of.
• 26:02
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Those aren't the people that I want to help, you know.
• 26:06
  Dr. Ebony Stone: But I do recognize that there are those people that are going to think differently of me for sharing my story.
• 26:14
  Dr. Ebony Stone: That's right.
• 26:15
  Dr. Ebony Stone: That's right.
• 26:17
  Cassandra: So you were out.
• 26:18
  Cassandra: For how long?
• 26:21
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Initially I was out for three months and then it was extended for another three months and during that time I realized that the healing process had began.
• 26:34
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I realized how free I was.
• 26:39
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I realized I was sleeping again.
• 26:43
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I realized how free I was.
• 26:45
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I realized I was sleeping again.
• 26:46
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I lost probably 15 pounds the difference in my blood pressure from the first time my doctor made the recommendation for me to go to therapy to probably four or five months into the leave.
• 26:59
  Dr. Ebony Stone: The difference was astronomical.
• 27:02
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Like blood pressure came way down, I realized that I needed to care for me and so during that time I made the decision to make some shifts.
• 27:14
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So I was away for six months and for health reasons, I decided not to return.
• 27:24
  Cassandra: Not to return, okay.
• 27:26
  Cassandra: Okay, let's talk about how is that, that journey to the power of the park Cause see, being off or away for six months.
• 27:45
  Cassandra: It had to be a journey, oh, for sure, yeah, and I'm asking that because we have listeners that are like you were burnt out.
• 27:57
  Cassandra: I just if, I if, if it's kind of like they used to say, when things are so rough, you come home and kick the dog.
• 28:05
  Cassandra: You know, you know you're hollering at the kids, hollering at the husband you know it's, you're not in a good place, but people say I got to work, what?
• 28:17
  Cassandra: What can I do?
• 28:18
  Cassandra: What can I do?
• 28:19
  Cassandra: So?
• 28:20
  Cassandra: Talk to them about the journey, what was the journey like, and the power of of the pause.
• 28:27
  Cassandra: And we're going to talk about that pause in a minute.
• 28:29
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Yes, so let me first say this I don't think I want a disclaimer out there that I don't think anybody I'm not telling anybody that they should leave their job, right, right, I was in a unique situation and having a husband that could support this continued health journey that I was on and we you know some other things that made it possible.
• 28:56
  Dr. Ebony Stone: But I do highly recommend therapy and I do highly recommend taking advantage of the benefits that you have if you have them available to you and you need them.
• 29:11
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Now.
• 29:11
  Dr. Ebony Stone: People will probably think it will be great from day one, like you stop working and then you know you're just living life footloose and fancy free, and that is not what it is like.
• 29:25
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I spent.
• 29:28
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I remember doing things like I'm a writer, I just love to write and I journal.
• 29:36
  Dr. Ebony Stone: My mother has always journaled.
• 29:38
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I remember spending weeks and I kept it in my phone.
• 29:42
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It's in the book.
• 29:42
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Some of the excerpts are in the book.
• 29:44
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I kept logs of what I was doing because I still felt like I had to prove what was going on in my life.
• 29:55
  Dr. Ebony Stone: There were days that I could not get out of the bed.
• 29:58
  Dr. Ebony Stone: The guilt was so overwhelmingly heavy.
• 30:02
  Dr. Ebony Stone: There were days that I spent crying, trying to figure out even what I was feeling, and so, when I think about it, it is not easy.
• 30:15
  Dr. Ebony Stone: The pause is not a vacation that so many people think it is.
• 30:25
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It definitely is not.
• 30:26
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I was not laying on the beach drinking my fives.
• 30:31
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I was having to confront some really, really strong truths.
• 30:37
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Right, I had a therapist who was walking me through this and we were analyzing what was happening.
• 30:43
  Dr. Ebony Stone: We were analyzing different situations.
• 30:45
  Dr. Ebony Stone: She would stop me and say hold on, don't gloss over that, let's talk about your feelings in that moment.
• 30:52
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And all of these feelings were, they were coming up and I had to deal with them.
• 30:58
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And then we got to a point where, after I had processed so much, it was how do you build a plan to go forward?
• 31:07
  Dr. Ebony Stone: What does that look like?
• 31:08
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And that is not easy because you have to decide what that looks like.
• 31:12
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And so, whether you're in a space where you're like, hey, I need a really hard reset, so you know you're on a mental health leave or you're just like I need a weekend, a three-day weekend, right, same principles can be applied, but it's not always, it's not easy.
• 31:39
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So that's what that journey looked like.
• 31:41
  Dr. Ebony Stone: For me.
• 31:42
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It was probably, and that is why, after 12 weeks, it was like you're doing the work, but we got more work to do.
• 31:52
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You were talking about a 25 year or so, almost 30 year career in programming.
• 32:04
  Dr. Ebony Stone: That had to be processed.
• 32:06
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You can't do that in one therapy Exactly.
• 32:12
  Cassandra: And that's why I asked you, because you know it was interesting during COVID how mental health became a topic of discussion and I was so relieved because mental health was here before COVID just gave people I don't want to use the word reason, but that just gave individuals like an out, like yeah, that's what I had, you know, and that, to me, was a relief for individuals because they were suffering with anxiety, depression, and they had been, but they're trying to keep it all in and and that's why people blow up and you know all of those things.
• 33:00
  Cassandra: So, but that process is not easy.
• 33:03
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Don't think if you leave that situation, life's going to be great, yeah, big deal, yeah, I literally wrote um like I felt like like I was crying and I was breaking down and like when she told me I needed to be off work and I felt somewhat I was like am I failing?
• 33:32
  Dr. Ebony Stone: But I felt relieved at the same time and I felt like, ok, great, I've gotten through this journey, but the journey was just beginning.
• 33:44
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I had no idea.
• 33:46
  Cassandra: Yes, yes, right.
• 33:48
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Beginning.
• 33:49
  Cassandra: That's right.
• 33:50
  Cassandra: That's right.
• 33:50
  Cassandra: So let's talk about how do you take up space without losing yourself.
• 34:03
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Oh, that's a great question how do you take up space without losing yourself?
• 34:08
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I think it's something we talked about a little earlier.
• 34:10
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It's about being transparent, being authentic and being fully you, because there are going to be people who don't want to hear it, who don't believe it, who don't buy it, and that's fine, but there is going to be that group of people who dial in.
• 34:29
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I remember when I decided that I was going to put these writings because this is not a book that I ever wanted to write Like I was going to write a book.
• 34:41
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I knew I'd write a book someday.
• 34:42
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It would be like the 10 leadership lessons of blah blah blah.
• 34:46
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Right, this was not the book that I was going to write, but because I like to write and journaling was a part of my journey, um, that's what I started doing and it just it became a book.
• 34:59
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And when I decided to publish it and we were going through the editing process, someone said to me you write as if you are talking to one person.
• 35:12
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Not as if you're talking to the world.
• 35:13
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Write to that one person.
• 35:15
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Talk to that one person.
• 35:16
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Talk to that one person.
• 35:18
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You would be surprised, if you talk to that one person, how many people will actually hear you.
• 35:33
  Cassandra: And I think that is because when you talk to one person you are as sincere, honest, transparent and authentic as you are.
• 35:36
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It's personal, and then everybody feels that.
• 35:38
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So when you say, how do you take up space and not lose yourself, you do just that.
• 35:44
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You be you.
• 35:45
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You be as authentic as you possibly can um, so what are you currently?
• 35:54
  Cassandra: okay?
• 35:54
  Cassandra: Okay, you wrote the book.
• 35:56
  Cassandra: I can't wait to read the book.
• 35:58
  Cassandra: I love the title of the book and what I also want to say you can have high functioning anxiety, not just work.
• 36:10
  Cassandra: You know, I don't want people to think, oh, this is all about corporate having a job, it could be your family.
• 36:17
  Cassandra: Yes, I mean, you know, even though we're talking about in the corporate environment and I was a high functioning, you know and what that means is like, if you think about a high functioning alcoholic, they can go to work, they can do all of this, they can do all of that, they can do all of that, but on the inside, my gosh, and oftentimes it's sneaky, right.
• 36:42
  Dr. Ebony Stone: People who suffer from high functioning anxiety are often high achievers.
• 36:47
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Yeah, they're winning awards, they're winning accolades because it's a what I call right and this is not clinical.
• 36:55
  Dr. Ebony Stone: But yeah, you want to control everything, like that's a part of it.
• 37:01
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You have to control it.
• 37:02
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So you're grabbing things and you're trying to control them and people are like, oh, that's amazing, and she just did this.
• 37:08
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And you're like, yeah, I just stayed up for 16 hours like a crazy person trying to get that done, when really it is my anxiety taking over.
• 37:18
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It's not.
• 37:19
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It's not a healthy human being doing right, because what do they say?
• 37:25
  Cassandra: depression is about the past, anxiety is about the future.
• 37:29
  Cassandra: Yeah, yeah, um, and you, you hit it.
• 37:33
  Cassandra: It's.
• 37:34
  Cassandra: It's those high achievers, it's those imposter syndrome folks, you know, that really set the bar higher for themselves and can't maintain it and you just like, yeah, I get it.
• 37:49
  Cassandra: And you know why I get it.
• 37:51
  Cassandra: Because I'm like that.
• 37:52
  Cassandra: You know why I get it.
• 37:53
  Cassandra: Because I've experienced that I'm like that.
• 37:59
  Cassandra: You know why I get it.
• 37:59
  Cassandra: Because I've experienced that I get it.
• 38:00
  Cassandra: Because my corporate job I was there for 30 plus years and I was a wreck.
• 38:03
  Cassandra: You look good on the outside, but on the inside I was just a wreck.
• 38:08
  Cassandra: And no, I didn't want to tell anybody, I needed time off.
• 38:11
  Cassandra: You know, because I was in an environment that, oh really Okay, well, just so.
• 38:17
  Cassandra: You'll know, because I was in an environment that, oh really OK, well, just so you know, you may not have this job when you get back.
• 38:24
  Cassandra: So everybody has different situations, different different circumstances and we are not machines, we're human beings.
• 38:31
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Yeah, and I wish and because this, this year and next year I'll be doing some studying about it, so I don't have research behind it just yet but what I really wish because of my experience I wish that organizations would force sabbaticals every so many years and you know, I don't know what it looks like, but people need to stop, People need to process, People need to rest and heal and regenerate and all of those things.
• 39:07
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And I wish that sabbaticals were forced and that everybody I don't know what that looks like to the bottom line of an organization.
• 39:16
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So you know, I know why there would be a fight against it, but there's just got to be a way to help the health of your staff, and not just physical health, but mental health as well.
• 39:34
  Dr. Ebony Stone: They don't have to be six month sabbaticals, but perhaps folks are.
• 39:40
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You know, every so often there's a 30 day sabbatical that you just gotta push away and I'm shutting it down, Like you don't have access anymore, so you can go recharge and regenerate and deal with anything that you've needed to deal with, Right?
• 39:58
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You know, in the future I'll be studying and looking at those things because there are some places that do require sabbaticals.
• 40:04
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So looks at those.
• 40:07
  Dr. Ebony Stone: But from my experience, I just wish that that was something that was quite frankly forced upon me Right Instead of using your vacation right like oh yeah that's not vacation?
• 40:21
  Cassandra: yeah right, exactly, exactly.
• 40:23
  Cassandra: So, dr Stone, what are you currently doing?
• 40:30
  Cassandra: When you said you wanted to help people, you have what we call the pause framework.
• 40:38
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Yes, talk about that, and so I use that.
• 40:42
  Dr. Ebony Stone: That framework is kind of the steps that I went through during this pause.
• 40:47
  Cassandra: Also.
• 40:49
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I've found that it can help others to just push away for a moment and sometimes, like I said, they're really quick pauses.
• 40:56
  Dr. Ebony Stone: How do you use a pause in the moment?
• 41:00
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Sometimes a pause is just saying in a meeting.
• 41:04
  Dr. Ebony Stone: While I appreciate that I am not ready to give my opinion, I want to process all of the information.
• 41:10
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So if we don't need it today, can I let you know by Friday and take that time that you need so that you're not forcing that pressure on yourself, and then you can walk away, analyze everything, make sure you understand it and then decide how to move forward.
• 41:26
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Sometimes it is a longer pause, right?
• 41:30
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Maybe you're saying, hey, I'm going to unfortunately use my vacation time because I got to back away, and during that time you're going through the same steps.
• 41:41
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Or maybe it's a leave and you are going through those steps of first stopping.
• 41:46
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And I believe listen I believe in prayer, and so when I pause, the very first thing I'm doing is praying.
• 41:54
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I just need to.
• 41:56
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You should pray all the time, but it's I am just.
• 41:59
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I'm praying about the situation.
• 42:01
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And then I'm trying to analyze what's happening.
• 42:04
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I'm trying to understand my part in it, because a lot of times we play a part in these things, this pressure that we're putting on us Not always, but sometimes we play a part in that.
• 42:15
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I want to understand my part in it.
• 42:18
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I will give you an example.
• 42:22
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I had someone provide a service for me and at the end of that service it was actually absolutely beautiful, the product was amazing, but I needed some changes to it a couple of years later and I asked and wasn't getting responses.
• 42:42
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I wasn't like the whole thing, it was just bad.
• 42:46
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And so I was going to have to pay again for that same service, just to get a tweak in it, which was very frustrating for me.
• 42:54
  Dr. Ebony Stone: A tweak in it, which was very frustrating for me, and I did.
• 42:59
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I ended up paying again and everything worked out.
• 43:01
  Dr. Ebony Stone: But then I had to ask myself what part did you play in that?
• 43:05
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Well, I had seen this person's product before and so I just wanted it because it was beautiful.
• 43:12
  Dr. Ebony Stone: But the person who got it said hey, I'll give you the number, but I can tell you service ain't great, ok, during the first rodeo, so to speak, the service was not great.
• 43:30
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So when I went back, I don't know why I expected anything different.
• 43:33
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Right?
• 43:33
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So I have to.
• 43:38
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You know it was an expensive lesson, but I have to also understand for myself what part I played.
• 43:40
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It doesn't make them right, but I have to understand what part I played in putting myself in that situation.
• 43:44
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Just a simple example.
• 43:46
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And so how do I help people with that?
• 43:49
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I do coaching.
• 43:49
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I've done coaching for years, corporately and personally.
• 43:56
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I focus specifically on Black women in the corporate world and helping them climb the ladder.
• 44:03
  Dr. Ebony Stone: We use the PAWS framework to do that.
• 44:05
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I have group coaching that kicks off quarterly, so we'll be kicking off another cohort beginning of April.
• 44:13
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I do some speaking and then I also do some workshops and consulting to help.
• 44:19
  Dr. Ebony Stone: In the same framework, how do you insert these intentional pauses to help you continue to move forward?
• 44:29
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Also, how do you define?
• 44:31
  Dr. Ebony Stone: You asked me a question which is an amazing question.
• 44:33
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Also, help people define.
• 44:35
  Dr. Ebony Stone: What does success look like to you?
• 44:36
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Because success is different for everybody, and so once you define what success looks like for you, there's a freedom in it.
• 44:53
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It's an amazing freedom in it, instead of chasing the dream that the world has for you is what we talked about before the show started.
• 44:57
  Dr. Ebony Stone: It's about making sure you're completing the task that God has Exactly, and there's a freedom in that that is just different than as defined by the world.
• 45:10
  Cassandra: That's good.
• 45:11
  Cassandra: That's good.
• 45:12
  Cassandra: How can people get in touch with you?
• 45:18
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Oh yeah, Great People can.
• 45:20
  Dr. Ebony Stone: My website is just Dr Ebony Stone dot com.
• 45:24
  Cassandra: And.
• 45:24
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I'm on all the socials Facebook, instagram, playing with TikTok now that's interesting and then mostly on LinkedIn and all of the handles are Dr Ebony Stone.
• 45:37
  Dr. Ebony Stone: So I'm in all of those places.
• 45:40
  Dr. Ebony Stone: And then the book.
• 45:41
  Dr. Ebony Stone: The book is on my website, but it's also available as an audio book and anywhere that you can have books online.
• 45:49
  Cassandra: Okay, is the audio books voice yours?
• 45:53
  Cassandra: It is?
• 45:54
  Cassandra: Oh good, I love those.
• 45:55
  Cassandra: I love those.
• 45:56
  Cassandra: That was a great learning experience.
• 45:59
  Cassandra: Yeah, it sure was Mine too, but nobody could tell my story like me, no.
• 46:06
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Not, at all Not at all.
• 46:08
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I remember.
• 46:09
  Dr. Ebony Stone: That was interesting, though.
• 46:10
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I remember just reading and reading and the girl stops me, the engineer, and she said, hey, you got to take a break, right, well, okay, well, what time do we start tomorrow?
• 46:20
  Dr. Ebony Stone: She said, no, no, no, not tomorrow.
• 46:23
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Your voice needs a break.
• 46:25
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Yeah, it's nothing I've ever done before.
• 46:28
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I didn't know.
• 46:29
  Dr. Ebony Stone: I said oh okay, well, tell me when to come Exactly.
• 46:32
  Cassandra: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 46:34
  Cassandra: Yeah.
• 46:34
  Cassandra: Well, dr Ebony Stone, it was a delight to have you as a guest on.
• 46:41
  Cassandra: Is your Way In your Way and just listening to your story, you were in your way just by your expectations, how you grew up and what you thought you should be doing.
• 46:59
  Cassandra: But the body says something's up Right.
• 47:05
  Cassandra: So I just you know, I just thank you.
• 47:07
  Cassandra: I got a lot of nuggets out of that.
• 47:11
  Cassandra: I could relate to your story and I know I have many listeners on that can relate to it as well, and I ask my listeners to please share this podcast with somebody where you know this would be of their best interest, and also, as I always say, listeners.
• 47:33
  Cassandra: Bye for now, god bless and dr ebony stone, again, it was the my pleasure to meet you and to speak with you godspeed, godspeed, thank you.
• 47:47
  Dr. Ebony Stone: Thank you for having me sure.