Latest / Trumponomics / Why Older Workers Are the Key to the U.S. Economy

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Why Older Workers Are the Key to the U.S. Economy · Trumponomics

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Will robots conquer the world and take away hundreds of
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: millions of jobs from humans. It's not looking likely anytime soon.
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: That's because right now there are more job openings than
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: there are unemployed workers. So how do we keep the
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: economy running smoothly with all these unfilled jobs. Maybe the
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: answer isn't robots, but keeping older workers employed and hiring
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  Speaker 1: those who want a job. Welcome to Benchmark. I'm Scott Lanman,
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  Speaker 1: economics editor with Bloomberg News in Washington. Returning to the
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: show as guest co host is Chris Condon. He's a
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: Bloomberg reporter here in d C who covers the Federal
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: Reserve in the US economy. Chris, Welcome back to Benchmark.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: Glad to be back, Scott. So Chris, We're coming off
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  Speaker 1: a pretty strong U s employment report last week. The
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  Speaker 1: US added another two hundred twenty three thousand jobs in
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  Speaker 1: May and the unemployment rate ticked down to three point
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  Speaker 1: eight percent. But one thing that struck me is that
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  Speaker 1: the participation rate among people age sixty five and over
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  Speaker 1: is that ninetent, and that means that about one out
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  Speaker 1: of every five Americans that age either has a job
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  Speaker 1: or is actively looking for one, and that's almost double
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  Speaker 1: the level from twenty years ago. Chris, why has this
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  Speaker 1: been important to the Feed? Well, Scott, I think it's
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: safe to say that this helps to complicate the job
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: that the FED has to do. As you know there
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: they've got two jobs assigned to them by Congress, and
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  Speaker 1: that's to maximize employment in the United States but also
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  Speaker 1: try to keep inflation balanced as close as possible to
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  Speaker 1: two percent. And sometimes those things come into conflicts. So
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  Speaker 1: they're very especially at times when unemployment, as it has
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: been recently, has been dropping, they have to anticipate when
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: is that tighter labor market going to result in higher inflation. Now,
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  Speaker 1: when older workers start behaving differently, that starts to change
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  Speaker 1: that calculus. If if older workers represent a greater pool
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  Speaker 1: of available workers who perhaps will stay in the labor
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  Speaker 1: market or can be incentivized to come back in to
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  Speaker 1: the labor market, either full time or part time, that
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  Speaker 1: starts to complicate that that calculation that FED policy makers
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  Speaker 1: have to do about, Uh, what at what level will
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  Speaker 1: unemployment really begin to trigger inflation? I think when it
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  Speaker 1: comes to particularly the on the lower income side, more
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  Speaker 1: older people making themselves available for work, that starts to
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  Speaker 1: to delay that point in which low unemployment will trigger inflation,
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  Speaker 1: so more older workers staying in are coming back in
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  Speaker 1: you know, basically means a larger labor pool that overall
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  Speaker 1: whole down wages and inflation, and you know, keeps interest
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  Speaker 1: rates lower for longer, all else being equal. Right, On
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  Speaker 1: the other hand, if there are in the middle and
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  Speaker 1: upper income brackets, if older workers stay in the labor
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  Speaker 1: market longer, there they are disrupting the process by which
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  Speaker 1: they may retire and are replaced by new folks just
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  Speaker 1: out of school. Say that has a disinflationary impact, and
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  Speaker 1: they're disrupting that. So in a way, it can work
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  Speaker 1: in both directions, and as I said, makes it more
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  Speaker 1: complicated for the FED. It is complicated, like you said,
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  Speaker 1: And uh, I wanted to say that our interest in
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  Speaker 1: this issue was piqued by a Bloomberg opinion column by
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  Speaker 1: economist Tyler Cowen. You can check it out at Bloomberg
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  Speaker 1: dot com. Now to get some context, we spoke recently
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  Speaker 1: with two guests about this issue. Later, we'll hear from
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  Speaker 1: an ex ecutive with a utility company that one recognition
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  Speaker 1: for its policies aimed at retaining older workers, but First,
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  Speaker 1: here's our interview with Gene sets Fan, senior vice president
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  Speaker 1: of programs at a RP, the nonprofit group that represents
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  Speaker 1: thirty eight million Americans aged fifty and older. Gene, thanks
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  Speaker 1: for joining us on Benchmark. Thanks for having me. So
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  Speaker 1: I'm going to read a little bit of what Tyler
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  Speaker 1: Cowen wrote in his recent column, and I quote here.
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  Speaker 1: I would suggest that the ability to spot, mobilize, and
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  Speaker 1: deploy older workers is the next biggest source of competitive
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  Speaker 1: advantage in the US. The sober reality is that many
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  Speaker 1: companies should retool their methods to fit better with the
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  Speaker 1: experience and sound judgment found so often in older workers.
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  Speaker 1: That also will involve a retooling of the glamour notion
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  Speaker 1: to valorize the young less and the idea of maturity. More.
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  Speaker 1: HR departments may have to work harder to help older
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  Speaker 1: workers keep up with new technologies. Gene, can we talk
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  Speaker 1: a little bit about what he said about the glamor
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  Speaker 1: notion to valorize the young. How is it possible in
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  Speaker 1: our modern society to overcome some of these ingrained cultural notions. Well,
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  Speaker 1: first of all, I want to sort of reach out
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  Speaker 1: and hug Tyler for what he wrote. I think he
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  Speaker 1: is fought on in terms of tapping into this whole
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  Speaker 1: notion of the experience class or what we call older workers.
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  Speaker 1: I think the first thing we need to really do
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  Speaker 1: with employers, in particular HR staff and employers is to
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  Speaker 1: kind of underscore the fact that there is a business
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  Speaker 1: case to be made for experienced workers. If you look
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  Speaker 1: at some of the studies that we've done in the past,
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  Speaker 1: we actually did a business case together with a on Hewitt.
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  Speaker 1: We actually found sort of hard facts that show that
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  Speaker 1: for older workers, they are more motivated than their younger counterparts,
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  Speaker 1: they're more engaged. Um, both of those things really tanslates
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  Speaker 1: into higher productivity. And you couple that quite frankly with
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  Speaker 1: studies that have been done particularly by sort of German
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  Speaker 1: researchers around the multi generational workforce. When you actually have
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  Speaker 1: multiple generations in the workplace, it does if all age
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  Speaker 1: groups actually increase in their overall productivity. So I think
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  Speaker 1: there is first and foremost the need to actually look
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  Speaker 1: at the hard facts in terms of what this will
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  Speaker 1: bring for employers that there's a lot of positive aspects
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  Speaker 1: of having older workers in the workplace. And when we
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  Speaker 1: talk about older workers, what kind of age are we
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  Speaker 1: actually talking about here? Is it fifty sixty? Well, there's
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  Speaker 1: a lot of breakdowns right from different definitions brought by
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  Speaker 1: Department of Labor standards. They usually look at older workers
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  Speaker 1: as fifty five and above. The typical sort of retirement
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  Speaker 1: age is usually sixty five and above. All in all,
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  Speaker 1: I think what we're saying is we're actually seeing overall
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  Speaker 1: trends in terms of the older cohort of workers increasing
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  Speaker 1: in terms of growth. And if you look at again
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  Speaker 1: sort of the labor statistics with population growth of the
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  Speaker 1: older segments growing more but than the younger we're gonna
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  Speaker 1: see by four again this is based on from the
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  Speaker 1: Labors numbers, by the fifty five plus segment will be
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  Speaker 1: roughly about of the workplace and that's probably the largest
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  Speaker 1: age coport of all across the board. She and why
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  Speaker 1: would you say the participation rate of Americans over sixty
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  Speaker 1: five has been increasing and in fact it's been increasing
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  Speaker 1: since the nineteen eighties. What's the short answer for why
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  Speaker 1: that's happening. I think, first and foremost, we have sort
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  Speaker 1: of the longevity bonus. I think all of us are
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  Speaker 1: living longer and health You're lives so that's one aspect
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  Speaker 1: of it um and because of that, I think there's
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  Speaker 1: two things that's play here. Because you're living longer, you
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  Speaker 1: have more productive years. At the same time, you have
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  Speaker 1: more years to actually fund from the retirement standpoint. So
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  Speaker 1: I think both of those factors is certainly what we
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  Speaker 1: see in our surveys as the reasons why people want
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  Speaker 1: to work longer. But is it more because people want
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  Speaker 1: to work or because they have to work in order
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  Speaker 1: to make ends meet as their retirements or not their retirements,
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  Speaker 1: but their um their lives are lasting longer. As you
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  Speaker 1: mentioned again, our surveys have been relatively consistent on this
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  Speaker 1: front and financial needs from a worker's perspective. In terms
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  Speaker 1: of wanting to work longer, it is financial reasons that
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  Speaker 1: are the main drivers. But I also find what some
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  Speaker 1: interesting sort of stats out there when we actually look
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  Speaker 1: at retirees to actually work, both in terms of our
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  Speaker 1: surveys as well as the Retirement Confidence Survey does again
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  Speaker 1: launched two ball studies. When you actually look at what
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  Speaker 1: retirees are saying and why they actually go back to
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  Speaker 1: work or working part times, it really is that productivity
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  Speaker 1: aspect of trying to stay more engaged that is the driver,
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  Speaker 1: which I find interesting. Right, Um, if truly retirees are
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  Speaker 1: having a hard time funding their retirement, I would suspect
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  Speaker 1: that we would see that financial would still be the
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  Speaker 1: main driver. But that's not necessarily the case right now, Geane,
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  Speaker 1: How can employers be persuaded to embrace this to retain
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  Speaker 1: and higher older workers that should they be incentivized in
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  Speaker 1: some way or is there education involved? Well? I like
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  Speaker 1: to think about it this way. UM. We've actually run
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  Speaker 1: programs for many years trying to highlight employers who have
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  Speaker 1: done this well, and we've seen that in certain industries
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  Speaker 1: there are some employers that do this well because they
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  Speaker 1: have a chronic skill shortage. So if you like get
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  Speaker 1: for example, healthcare, some from academia as well as financial
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  Speaker 1: institutions where there's a chronic skill shortage, they actually do
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  Speaker 1: a very good job in having sort of this age
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  Speaker 1: diverse workforce UM and really focusing on retention UM workplace
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  Speaker 1: policies and practices for experience workers. So I think really
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  Speaker 1: having employers kind of underscore the true business value in
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  Speaker 1: in having a age diverse workforce is one aspect of this.
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  Speaker 1: What it is interesting to mean the whole notion of
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  Speaker 1: education that I think we should really underscore is on
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  Speaker 1: the talent acquisition side. What we don't see a lot
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  Speaker 1: of is intentional hiring of experienced workers across the board,
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  Speaker 1: and a little bit of a of this, I think
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  Speaker 1: to your point around education, I think we could go
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  Speaker 1: a long way again reinforcing, particularly among recruiters the benefits
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  Speaker 1: of UM again multi generational workforce, and also figuring out
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  Speaker 1: where best to tap the talent because I'm, like, you know,
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  Speaker 1: already made scalable pools of new applicants in college grads.
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  Speaker 1: For graduate school grads, I think it's probably a little
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  Speaker 1: bit harder to kind of find UM experience workers on
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  Speaker 1: math gene. I wanted to talk about a phrase I
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  Speaker 1: heard you just say. I heard you say intentional recruitment
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  Speaker 1: of older workers. And you know, often when we hear
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  Speaker 1: about this topic, it's more in the context of age
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  Speaker 1: discrimination and how to deal with that issue. And I'm wondering,
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  Speaker 1: is age discrimination in the US today, has it gotten
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  Speaker 1: worse in recent years or is it better, you know,
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  Speaker 1: say than ten years ago or twenty years ago. It's
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: hard to tell, I'll say that, but we just celebrated
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  Speaker 1: the fiftie anniversary of the Aged Combination Employment Act, And
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  Speaker 1: unfortunately it's very much out there in terms of the trends. Again,
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  Speaker 1: it's a little bit hard to tell for a couple
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  Speaker 1: of reasons. We definitely see basically the same number of reports,
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  Speaker 1: I would say, but in recent years it's harder for
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  Speaker 1: particularly employees to file an age discrimination case because of
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  Speaker 1: the Supreme Support ruling against the growth case. So age
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  Speaker 1: discrimination compared to other discriminations is almost a second class discrimination.
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  Speaker 1: There's a higher claim. In other words, if you want
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  Speaker 1: to file an age discrimination case, it has to be
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  Speaker 1: the sole force behind the disperate impact. So but for
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  Speaker 1: anything else, that was the main reason why you were
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  Speaker 1: treated differently, onelike other factors where it's more of a
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  Speaker 1: motivating factor or contributing factor. So it's again hard to
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  Speaker 1: say whether it's worse or not, but it's certainly it
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: is harder for employees to fight against this notion. Now,
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  Speaker 1: older workers can run into some other barriers, Gene, how
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  Speaker 1: often would you say that when they're looking for a job,
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  Speaker 1: they're not necessarily disqualified because they're too old, but because
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  Speaker 1: the perhaps the employer thinks they're salary or requirements are
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  Speaker 1: too high, or because the position is more of a
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  Speaker 1: junior posting those types of barriers. How how important is
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  Speaker 1: that our surveys don't exactly ask exactly the question that
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  Speaker 1: you ask, but we do have fielded this question focused
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  Speaker 1: on negative impacts based on age, and our studies again
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  Speaker 1: over the source of many years, it's been pretty consistent
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  Speaker 1: and seeing that either one in six or one in
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  Speaker 1: five folks will tell us that they weren't hired as
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  Speaker 1: a result of their age. And we also have seen
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: recently with another case UH with Cliber case out of
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: the Eleventh Circuit Courts of Appeals where there's a favorable
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  Speaker 1: ruling where for a while it was unclear whether job
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: applicants were covered under the A D A Age Discrimination
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  Speaker 1: Employment Acts or whether it was a full time employee
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: if you're how to be a part of that company already,
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: but currently it's There was an appeals case where the
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: gentleman Mr. Fliber was looking for a job that definitely
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: qualified for positions that was soliciting for applicants that had
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: no more than seven years experience, and so he um
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: sued against the company. At first it was he was
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: overalled and um but in the quarter of deals in
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: the seventh one circuits. I apologized they found in his favor,
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: saying that job applicants are also covered under a d A,
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: so that is favorable ruling on behalf of job applicants
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: a Geen, you guys have a vast store of information
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  Speaker 1: on this topic and it's been really fascinating speaking with
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: you about this. Gene sets Fans of a r P,
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: thank you so much for being with us on Benchmark.
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: Thank you for having me. That was our interview with
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: Gene sets Fan, senior vice president at A RP. Now
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: for a corporate perspective, here's our talk with Keith Hutchison.
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: He's the senior vice president of HR and chief Diversity
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: officer for National Grid u s A. That's the American
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: division of the UK based electric utility. He joins us
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: from their offices in Massachusetts. Keith, thanks for coming on
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  Speaker 1: Benchmark with us. Thanks for having me so. National Grid
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  Speaker 1: recently won an award from Columbia University's Public Health School
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  Speaker 1: for employers that excel at hiring and retaining workers over
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  Speaker 1: age fifty. What would you highlight that sets National Grid
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  Speaker 1: apart in this regard? So, one of the things that
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: sets National Grid apart is a couple of things actually.
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  Speaker 1: Um Firstly, we are a long term asset business, so
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: the work that we do, the services that we provide
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: for our customers are based on installing assets which are
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: intended to last four decades. Many of the gas pipes
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: and electric lines that provide energy needs to our customers
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: today have either been installed or built many many years
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: ago by employees who have attained long service with our company,
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: and so it's really important for us to be able
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: to retain the experience around managing and maintaining those assets
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: for our customers. And as a result, our offering that
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: we have term employees is based on the fact that
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: you join National Grid and there is a long term
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: career path for you with our company, and we celebrate
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: that by having career milestone awards for employees that exceed
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: forty years of service with our company. And that's crucial
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: for us because they have the knowledge of the equipment,
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: the assets that we have in the ground overheadlines that
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: need to be maintained every single day to provide a
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: safe and reliable service to our customers. So this is
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: we are in a different industry from others and that
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: we rely on the long term skills of our of
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: our workforce, and we value incredibly Keith, would you say
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: that it's becoming increasingly important to National Grid these these
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: workers that are say over fifty. It is. On one hand,
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: you could look at it and say that, you know,
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: retirement for a lot of our workers are is inevitable
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: and that we just have to accept that fact and
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: plan for it. We take a different view at National Grid.
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: We say, actually, there is a that is a really
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: important role to for for experienced workers to play in
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: our company. For example, there is a war for talent
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: in the market. You know, you've seen the recent unemployment
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: numbers issued recently, unemployment is going down, which means that
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: the availability of talent and resources in the market is
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: becoming incredibly competitive. And so for us, we are looking
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: at the next generation of workers that need to be
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: trained in how to do the work at National Grids
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: and that requires us to look at STEM related career
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: paths for new hires. But we need the workers, the
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: experienced workers, to be part of the training and the
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: knowledge transfer to those new folks coming into National Grid
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: because it's many of the career paths that we have
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: in our company require training and development for five or
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: six years to be fully competent. That's a long time
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: to join the company before you become fully competent to
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: do a role. The role that an experienced worker plays
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: in our company, not just doing the work, but mentoring
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: and training the next generation is incredibly important. So in
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: our view, given the fact that we will be recruiting
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: more people in advance of many of the retirements that
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: are planned over the next ten years, means that the
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: role that they will play for our company is more
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: critical now than ever. So are you recruiting people that
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: are older or is it really you bring in people
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: when they're younger and just work on making sure they
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: stick around for a long time. So it's a combination
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: of the two. I think typically we have always looked
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: at recruiting folks at a younger age and then training them. Actually,
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: in recent years we've taken a different approach and and
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: that's generated a number of the initiatives that we have
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: in Flight now, which is looking at how might we
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: attract folks who are more experienced, who might be at
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: the midpoint in their career in other companies around other
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: industries that can be retrained so that it's actually not
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: just being fully reliant on people selecting engineering as a
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: discipline or as a career path and join the national
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: goods so that we can train them. It's actually saying
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: there's tremendous value in us attracting folks who might be
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: who might have had a successful career elsewhere that we
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: want to bring over to National Grid. So it's a
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: combination of the two. And actually one of the challenges
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: that we have that we're grappling with at the moment
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: is how do you make it attractive for somebody to
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: leave an organization if they've been there for twenty years
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: or so, to join National Grid. At that point, it's
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: a different proposition than going out to the graduate market
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: and saying start your career with National Grid because we
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: offer you X, Y, and z. It's a completely different
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: attraction challenge that we will have for attracting experienced workers.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: But it's one that we see the value in and
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: one that we're prepared to invest in. Do you have
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: any estimates or hard numbers, Keith, on what proportion of
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: your workforce is over fifty and perhaps is that do
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: you know whether that is increasing? It is increasing, So
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: at the moment. In our US business, forty one cent
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: of our employees are over the age of fifty and
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: number is increasing um it is increasing every year um so.
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: And we have both management employees and represented employees as well,
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: and the numbers are broadly the same. For management employees
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: it's around fort and for our union workforce it's it's
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: about so broadly the same, averaging forty one. Now, Keith,
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: you've worked in different parts of the business. Is there
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: anything that you've personally learned in your career or any
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: particular experiences you've had, you know, with mentors or older
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: workers in your career. Absolutely, I mean I every I've
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: been very fortunate enough to have moved around the business.
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: I've worked supporting both our transmission gas distribution side of
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: the business US and UK. And the one thing that
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: I have always valued tremendously about National GRIDZE is the
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: incredible importance that history has in both our values but
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: in also how we develop people's career paths. So we
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: have a tremend this history. We are We're not a
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: company that is UH that has only been around for
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: a few years, and a lot of our workers value
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: that and a lot of our learning about where we're
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: going in the future is rooted in where we've come
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: from and the best place to get that. And then
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: my personal experience through getting mentors is how has the company,
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: what what is the company experienced up to this point,
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: and what does that tell us about where we need
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: to go next. That can be either in the HR
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: profession or it can be within the operations profession. And
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: I see it being incredibly important on both sides of that. Now, Keith,
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: as you know, unemployment in the US has dropped below
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: four We hear a lot of reports of employers struggling
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: to fill open positions, particularly skilled positions. How is National
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: Grid responding to that, perhaps partly with wage increases if
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: that's the case. And on this subject that we're talking about,
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: do you do anything in particular to incentivize older workers
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: to stay on us to the point where they might
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: have retired. Sure. Well, let me first say, I mean,
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: it's a great time to be a candidate in the market.
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: You know, with unemployment so low, there has never been
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: a better time to be a candidate because you're you're
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: now going to be having companies and industries touting for
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: your skills. So so, and we're acutely aware of that.
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: We know that what we offer in terms of compensation
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: and benefits in some areas needs to be competitive, but
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: we also have an obligation to our ratepayers. You know,
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: we are a regulated utility, and we have an obligation
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: to be able to show that what we pay the
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: benefits that we offer can be justified as being value
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: added to our to our customers. Every bit of income
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: that we get is given to us by customers who
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: pay their bills, so we cannot be frivolous. So we
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: have to do a lot of work to analyze what
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: are our competitors doing, what are the movements in the market,
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: and how do we respond accordingly, What have we done
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: specifically around benefits. Well, we are we've recently launched, in fact,
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: yesterday we launched a caregiver program. We're looking at a
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: suite of benefits in the company now that are looking
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: at targeting people at different points in their career with
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: the company. The caregiver benefits cover people who have just
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: started out a family who need support around childcare, but
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: it also extends to people who may be caring for
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: an elderly or sick relative. Because we know that given
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: the fact that society is aging, not just our workforce.
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: The chances are that most of our employees will at
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: some point be required to care for an elderly or
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: sick relative in their life, and we we recognize that,
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: and we want to be able to provide support to
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: people so that they can continue to flourish in their
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: career but get the support that they need outside of
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: work as well. And we recognize that, and we're looking
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: at a number of other solutions around benefits that will
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: help people to make choices about their career rather than
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: give up work early when they're simply not ready to
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: do that. One of the things that we recognize in
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: our workforces, many of our field workers feel compelled that
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: they have to return, that that's the only option available
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: to them. We don't agree with that, and we're challenging
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: that conventional thinking. We think, let's have a conversation early
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: on with our employees that says you are reaching nearing
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: retirement age, but let's have a conversation about what you
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: want to do, because it is tremendous value you can
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: continue to add to our business, whether it be retraining,
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: whether it be going into a back office position within
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: the company, so that actually we can help them facilitate
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: a phased retirement rather than what many employees have traditionally experienced,
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: which is they reached the retirement age and they have
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: no choice but to retire. And we think that challenging
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: those conventional wisdoms of the of the past is really
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: where the value can be in getting the most out
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: of our workforce long after they reach retirement eligibility. Last question, Keith,
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: I wanted to take a little bit more of a
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: global perspective. Obviously, our listeners can tell from your accent
• 25:57
  Speaker 1: that you're not from Massachusetts. You're from Scotland, right, I am, yes,
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: And I wanted to commend you because I heard you
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: say X, Y and Z before and your countrymen might
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: might not appreciate that, but but you've adapted pretty well
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: to America by not saying X, Y and Z, so
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: I wanted to give you credit for that. But you know,
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: National Grid is a longstanding UK company. I believe you've
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: worked in both places. Can can you explain any differences
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: between the US and UK on on the issue of
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: employing older workers? Are they in pretty similar situations? Firstly,
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: thank you for recognizing my my transition to the US.
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: I work very hard and get a lot of pressure
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: from my colleagues to adapt to the lingo. So I'm
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: glad to get the recognition. I don't believe there is
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: much of a difference, and I think it's more of
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: an industry challenge, and I think that's not unique to
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: the United States. I think it's the same challenge in
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: the UK. The amount of investment that we placed in
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: the skilled work force, the high skilled and capable workforce
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: that we have in the U S and the UK
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: requires years of investment. And our assets are the same.
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: You know, they made different design but ultimately they are
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: assets that have been designed to withstand and exist for
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: many decades to come. And many of the assets that
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: we management that we maintain today have been around for
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: for decades as well. And that's the same in the UK.
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: Um our workforces are are broadly similar in terms of
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: their career trajectory and age profile. I would say that
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: we have a larger workforce here in the US and
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: so we are probably facing a more acute challenge around
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: that than the UK, but the but the path is
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: is very similar. I would say that one of the
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: things that we are spearheading for the company in the
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: US is looking more at experienced workers. We've got an
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: initiative at the moment which is looking at how we
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: can attract and retain experience workers more in National Grid,
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: and we're going to start that work off in the
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: US because our workforce numbers are greater in the US
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: and unemployment is coming down rapidly as well. Any learnings
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: that we have or that we're able to take from
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: that work we will absolutely apply to the UK and
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: help the business in the UK do that. But the
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: great thing is we can test and trial an experiment
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: with some of these ideas and initiatives in the US
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: because there's such a great opportunity to do that, and
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: the UK will will undoubtedly take any best practice that
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: we can offer. All right, Keith Hutchison of National Grid,
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: thanks so much for your time. Thank you as my pleasure.
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: Benchmark will be back next week. Until then, you can
• 28:37
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• 28:45
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• 28:47
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• 28:50
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• 29:02
  Speaker 1: P is at J S E t Z, and our
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: guest Keith Hutchison from National Grid is at h U
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: T C h I S O n k R. Benchmark
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: is produced by tofor Foreheast. The head of Bloomberg Podcasts
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: is Francesca lev Thanks for listening, See you next time.