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Wisdom From A Forbes 30 Under 30 Founder · Unstoppable You

• Haley Marie Keith (00:00): So with every no, there's a reason. My first instinct is I really want to dig in. I want to make why did you say no? What are the reasons? How can I improve? With every no, I always chase the real why behind it, kind of looking at that with a self-aware lens and saying, "Is this something I can change? Is it really worth changing and doing that? " But also I think with every no, you turn around and you say, "Well, where am I going to find my yes?" It's, "All right, well, that one didn't work, so I guess I'm going to keep going. Where's the next door that's going to open to get my yes?" Bree Katulak (00:29): Hey, I'm Bree and this is Unstoppable You, the podcast for women ready to stop choosing between their dreams, family and personal growth. No, we're not the right fit. Why don't you come back when you have some more traction? (00:49): That's interesting, but it's still too early. That's what building something from nothing actually sounds like in the beginning because getting the opportunity is not at all the hard part. Getting other people to believe in it before it exists is. Today I'm talking with Haley Marie Keith, co-founder of MITO Materials and a Forbes 30 Under 30 honoree who built something in a highly technical male dominated space while raising two young kids. I had the opportunity to serve as an advisory board member for Haley and what honestly stood out to me immediately wasn't just what she was building. It's what she was willing to push through to build it because behind every company that makes it are moments like that. Rejection, doubt, people choosing not to believe yet. And what makes this conversation so powerful is because Haley is doing that in real time. She hasn't just built a company. (01:54): She's built belief with investors, with customers, with a team, and honestly with herself. So today we're talking about what it actually takes to build something from nothing, how you keep going when people say no, how you create belief before there's proof and what you learn in the process regardless of the outcome. (02:24): So before we get started and really dive deep, I need to know what does having it all mean to you? Haley Marie Keith (02:31): Yeah, so I have a history degree actually first and I've always been that way where I want to look at the whole picture and see the whole life of someone. And so when I think of having it all, I imagine myself at 80 and I think, who's with me? What are we doing and what are we talking about? And so to me, having it all is being with my husband of 60 years at 80 and having my kids and their kids all around us talking about all of our memories and the vacations we got to take to Europe and the hard work that we're doing and really creating an impact. I imagine after all hanging out, we go to a coffee shop and as we're walking in, we're talking with people about what's going on in the community. And so to me, having it all is just living a life with intentionality that builds impact within your family and then also in the broader world. Bree Katulak (03:17): And I think the way you frame that is so unique and I love that about looking back on your life because everyone always talks about the future and what they're doing now. But I love the retrospective view that you put on it too. So that's fantastic. From the outside, your life looks absolutely amazing and you can already reflect back and have a lot of those conversations today. You were Forbes 30 under 30, you've started your own company and now you have even more to tell about that journey with your company. So at what point did you realize there was more to it and this is something that you had to lead? Haley Marie Keith (03:57): Yeah. So I think I've always known I was different, just set up in a different way than everyone else. Skipped kindergarten and was the youngest in my class for forever and then got to high school and was like, "Oh, I could take a couple classes and graduate early." And so I graduated at 16. So I've always been this different bird in the sea of people. And so when I started to think about my career professionally, I never intended to start a company. I always intended to go into business, probably manufacturing because I love banking things and seeing how things are made and I wanted to be high up in management and run the corporate ladder. But as I graduated, I just sat there thinking, how am I going to climb the corporate ladder and also have a family? This is super important to me. So I think always setting my sights on those kind of different opportunities, I fell into entrepreneurship in my MBA. (04:46): So I decided to stick around in Arkansas, met Kevin shortly after who was going to Oklahoma State, went there and decided I was going to get my MBA. And then the very first class this technology came around and it was like making things and composites and fancy materials. And I was like, "Oh, interesting. I bet I could write a business plan with this. " And I did DECA in high school. So I get into my MBA, I'm like, "I'm going to write a business plan. I'm going to do this thing." And it turned into a company. We spun it out of the university. Kevin and I did that. We did get on Forbes 30 under 30. And shortly after graduating and really turning it into a company, there was this period of time where we didn't know if it was going to make it. We had gotten this grant funding, it's the valley of death for scientific startups. (05:27): You get the initial grant, you think, "Oh God, I can do something with it. " You try to build it, but then you go after venture funding and there's this chasm between communicating what the technology can do at that early stage and what it could do in the market. I remember staying out until 3:00 AM with an entrepreneur in Stillwater trying to rewrite my books to get the phase two for the SBIR and realizing this is something I'm clearly committed to and I think I really want to take it forward and that means I'm going to have to change this idea of what this is going to look like. And so shortly after that, we did get the phase two. It was like $729,000 and we found out on my 22nd or 23rd birthday, which is also on seven / 29. I called it the Phoenix moment, the rebirth of MITA on that day because we worked really hard. (06:16): We just didn't know if it was going to make it. So we actually moved to Indiana to live with my mom with my six-month-old daughter and we were living in her basement, applying for the grants, fighting off a lawsuit and trying to just push through to get to see if this company would live. And we got the phase two and then we got accepted into Techstars at the Heritage Group here in Indy. And that's what brought us to Indy. And I think that was really the moment where my idea of leadership and how the company was going to be and what it meant to lead the company really changed. Now it was like, no, we got to hire, we've got to really build, how do we get into the commercial space? And the techstars and the grants and all of that kind of coming together in a short span of time transformed the way I had to think about things. Bree Katulak (06:56): That's amazing. I mean, everything that you just walked through, that is a lot. I'm sure that there was a lot that you had to say no to. What did you have to say no to and what was your sacrifice and what was that thought process like? Haley Marie Keith (07:09): I've been thinking about this a lot. When you try to have both things, a family and a company, you don't really get to fully engage in both. Kevin and I were like 25, 26, and we were just parents. We had jobs and we could just focus on Len Langley. We probably would've had another kid sooner. We probably would've had a support group of friends and we're all going through the same kind of life experiences. We didn't get that in the same way as an entrepreneur at 2526, what would I have been doing if I didn't have a kid? I would've been going to every networking event and not worrying about bedtime would've probably afforded the company a lot of different opportunities. We probably wouldn't have stayed in Indiana. We would've been in Houston or Boston, which are the better places to start material companies. But I was very clear on, no, I want to be close to our family also because in this day and age you can't afford daycare without grandparents somewhere near. (07:55): So those things we missed out on in the fact of just really going full into each experience. But I also look back thinking there's no way we could have done it and not had the kids because the kids afforded such a level of balance and regrounding in those really hard moments. We'd come home, Langley was like two and a half and she's napping twice a day and we're doing meetings and then having bike rides for two hours to go on the mown on. She's like, "Oh, the butterflies, mom." And you're like, "Yeah, the butterflies. Who cares about the million dollars of venture funding we're not getting right now because we're about to close again." It's those things. So there were definitely some costs, but I think there were a lot of great gains too. Bree Katulak (08:37): I love the mention of the butterflies because it puts everything in perspective. And yes, things seem very heavy and they are heavy in those moments, but just to pull you back and to realize what it's all for and that you are going to have these memories when you're 80 to talk about the butterflies too. I guess what has this journey required you to become and evolve into over the course of time? Haley Marie Keith (09:03): Going back to your first episode, I remember I identified very heavily with being the person that just chasing the achievement. I was very much like, "I'm going to graduate early. I'm going to go to college, Forbes 30 to 30. I'm going to put this on my list." And I think what these experiences have really evolved or changed for me is I'm a lot more gray. The guy used to be very black and white, like this was right and this is wrong and this is an achievement and this is what means to fail. And I think building a team, raising a family, having both of those things, it pushes your empathy in a way that I probably ignored for a lot of the time. So you live in this gray space with this fluidity of schedules and opportunities and other people's thoughts and feelings and you have to balance all of that and embrace the gray. (09:46): And I think that's what has changed for me. Bree Katulak (09:49): I like that a lot. How do you feel like parenting and managing people in a company? How do you feel like they compare or different? Haley Marie Keith (09:57): Actually wrote down what does success mean? Well, success in parenting to me is my kids are well-rounded. They're thoughtful, they're self-aware, they're problem solvers. And the true success of parenting is being like, you're 18 and you can go out on your own. You can go live a life. That's what you are meant to do, but also please come back. So please want to come back. And I think the same with building a team. We hired a lot of people just out of college. Lindsay got her PhD in our material and she came straight from OSU to us and watching her go off and get a different job and just kill it in this way has been so rewarding to be like, oh, we really grew together and you taught me so many things and I taught you so many things and now we get to experience that in different settings because of the experience we've had. (10:40): So I think in that way it's very similar, but obviously in other ways. Bree Katulak (10:44): Let's go back to your comment on the achievement and really resonating with that. Where do you think your drive to check the boxes on achievement came from? Do you feel like it came from society or it's intrinsically in you? Haley Marie Keith (10:57): I think a lot of it's very intrinsic. I mean, I'm the oldest, so I was just naturally that way, but I do also think that as I grew up watching my mom, she was a VP of customer service in the RV industry for multiple companies growing up. So whenever I was off school, I would go into her office and see her just kill it, negotiate and work with teams and solve problems and also be very aware. She's probably one of the only women in those offices. Most of the people were men. So it was really cool to see her build her career that way in an industry full of men. I wanted to go into the RV industry for a while. I knew it was male dominated and I was like, I'm going to be the difference. I know how to be different. So that is just so intrinsically a part of me that it didn't scare me and that felt like a calling that I should answer in terms of the industries I chose. Bree Katulak (11:43): I love that comment that you just made of, I know how to be different because that ties back to how you started your conversation about I always knew I was different and how you've literally thrived off of being different. I think that's a really important message. How does your story with seeing your mom killing it in the RV industry translate to your daughters and how they're seeing your career evolve over time and what you've pushed through? Haley Marie Keith (12:08): That's a great question. My oldest daughter, who's seven now, she was called Baby MITO. She grew up with the whole thing. And my second daughter doesn't really know it as much, but she definitely spent her first two years in her offices. We couldn't afford daycare, so she was with us the whole time. So I think they're definitely learning this stage of intense pushing forward and Langley set up her room to have a desk so that she could face the door and she was like, "I want to be a boss." And so it's very forward for her. Women lead. This is what I'm going to do. I want to be the boss. I think Camden will have that too. And my mom has actually transformed her career, so she's now in ERP and software consulting. So she went from running manufacturing to now also killing it in this career. (12:48): They get to see her as a grandma or Nay Nay is what we call her work and have conference calls. So I think it's really cool that our work life has evolved in such a way that our kids can watch us work. They can see what it looks like to work and then they can imagine themselves with this reality of like, oh, I can get on a stage and give a speech because I saw my mom do it or, oh, these conference calls, that's easy enough to do. And I think that brings an experience that I got to have with my mom at her offices, but it gets to bring it in a way that's home, which I think is really cool. Bree Katulak (13:18): I think that's absolutely amazing. Yeah. So with building all of this, with building MITO, with ultimately getting to the point that you have with an exit, what do you think that it's either cost you or provided to you along that journey? And it can be personally or emotionally that people wouldn't expect. Haley Marie Keith (13:39): I'm definitely more of a positive person. So I like to think of all the things that afforded me. It afforded me so many opportunities, ability to travel, ability to be able to see my kids grow up in these younger times because had I been working climbing in corporate ladder, I probably wouldn't have seen them from nine to five. So it did afford me a lot of things. Cost-wise, there's a lot of emotional stress that you don't even know you can handle, people, relationships. I feel like I lost out on a lot of friendships and people that were close to me, people I thought I could trust and turns out I couldn't and almost loses your faith and humanity a little bit to just be in that position and be betrayed in different ways. That's hard and also correlates into how you enter different parts of your life and also just how to show up in friendships too. (14:27): The emotional toll, the burnout is all very real and it ebbs and flows and I think that's also difficult. Sure. In some days, in some seasons of my life, I'm like, "Yeah, I can definitely do all of it. " And then in other seasons, I'm like, "I just need to recluse into my house and not talk to anyone for a while." And finding things that can- Bree Katulak (14:43): I think that's real. Haley Marie Keith (14:44): Right. And finding people that can- It's very real. Deal with that level and be a consistent presence is one of the biggest costs. Bree Katulak (14:51): If it's okay, let's talk more about those highs and the lows because I absolutely experience the same thing. I mean, I'll have days or weeks where I'm like, "I can take on the world and I'm seriously Mighty Mouse." And then I have other moments where I'm like, "What did I sign myself up for? I need to go just lock myself in a room." But I feel like at least in our household, Adam, my husband has been that constant steady state that kind of reigns me back in. He'll pull me down, but he'll also pull me back up to that even playing field. How does that work between you and Kevin, or do you feel like you have another person in your life that is able to help you keep that steady state? Haley Marie Keith (15:32): It's absolutely Kevin. It's one of the main reasons I married him. He's so consistent and so constant and that's been so helpful for me who does the highs and lows. I like a litle bit of chaos. I live in that. I thrive in that, but sometimes I need to come back to that middle. And so for us, it's always we're a partnership, that's how our marriage is structured. And so as partners we need to be able to show up for each other, how can we build each other back up? So we have those conversations a lot. And God, I don't know what I would've done without Kevin in the last two years. I think the last two years have been probably the hardest for me personally and professionally because MITO had taken this really intense turn where we weren't sure on funding and I didn't know how I was going to get it. (16:13): I achieved a new low of level of self-confidence when I gave into this idea that if I was a man that I would've been able to find the funding for the company and transform it in a way that I couldn't because I was a female CEO in a really hard tech industry that couldn't cross this chasm between seed funding and series A and telling that story the right way and getting in front of people and making it understood. There was so much actual validation of the product, but for some reason there were all of these nos and there were all of these challenges and all of these things I had to keep letting go of the team, the space. And so in the midst of all of that, Kevin really had to take a stronger and more constant approach and just say, look, I think at this moment for our family, one of us needs to leave. (16:56): For me, I couldn't. I was like, "This is my ship. I've got to go down with the ship or I've got to fix the ship. I've got to do the ship." So he transformed careers and was able to provide that level of consistency while I was going through these very high ups and downs with the company and he was there in support for the company, but building that family foundation too was really impactful. So to have a partner like that is everything because we wouldn't have made it through that season, I don't think. Bree Katulak (17:21): Absolutely. Because I know some people I've heard, at least in some spaces, some people are like, "Well, how can you do that and have a happy marriage?" But I don't look at it as the marriage is the hard part. I look at it as it's necessary to keep it all together, right? Haley Marie Keith (17:40): 100%. Yeah. I couldn't have it all and not have a marriage. The marriage is all about choosing the person and choosing to do it together. At the end of the day, what is the life that we want to have and how do we accomplish that together? Bree Katulak (17:53): It all comes back to your comment from the very beginning. It's intentionality and it's in every aspect of your life. So I mean, I couldn't agree more. So let's shift a little bit and let's talk about being unstoppable because in my mind, ever since I was introduced to you, I've fangirled over you, I guess. So what does it mean to you to be unstoppable? Haley Marie Keith (18:16): To be unstoppable for me really does go back to that intentionality. It means living with intention, knowing what I'm capable of, being aware of what I can handle and what I can't, and also being intentional about where I want to go. To be unstoppable in life is just making sure that I am thinking about my family, how I can show up in these moments with my daughters and shut the world away. And then at the same time, how am I balancing or at least organizing my day so that I can be very intentional when I show up for work, I'm here for it and I'm going to be all in. Being unstoppable is all about being extremely intentional with your time, your goals, your attitude and bringing your full self into everything. No room for masks. I don't want to be anyone else. I just want to be me. (19:02): I Bree Katulak (19:02): Love what you just said so much because I have been embracing vulnerability so much over the past two to three years, it has really opened up my world. I mean, not wearing the mask like you just said is so critical because honestly, when people come to work, when people come to friendships, whatever it is, you name it, they just want the truth. They just want the real thing. And I feel like that vulnerability is so critical. So let's go back to something that you said. You said knowing what you're capable of and what you're not. Have you always had a clear vision on what that is or do you think that's evolved over time? Haley Marie Keith (19:40): No, it totally evolved. This last week, we sent me the episode notes and I was like, I cried. I was like, wow, this is weird and insane to look at my story in this way, but also just getting through the last two years, getting MITO to a sal point and saying that I'm an exited founder. I didn't think I was capable of that for the last two years. I didn't know that really could have happened. So I think what you're capable of evolves and it evolves in what your highest capabilities are. And also with each season when you're intentional and aware about it, you can take down that capability bar and say, right now I'm capable of this because I'm prioritizing this. Right now, I'm in this very interesting state of I've achieved the entrepreneur's dream. I started a company, I built it, I had a team, I raised money, I did all the things and I exited it. (20:30): It wasn't a great exit, but for me it was a perseverance exit that means that I was capable of getting it done. Now I have to sit back and be like, okay, did that. Now how do I want to show up and what are my capabilities now? Can I be more capable or can I extend this capability of like, I can accomplish this thing I didn't think was possible into my professional career and my family life. My kids are seven and two and a half. These are the critical years. I need to be capable of providing core memories. So how can I build my life to be capable of providing these core memories? So yeah, in a couple of weeks we're going to Denmark. That was one of my big things. I wanted to go to Europe with my kids and start them traveling early and explore the world. (21:11): And so yeah, we are leaving to go to Denmark over the 4th of July for 10 days. Bree Katulak (21:15): It'll be an adventure, but you're going to create those core memories exactly like you said. So I want to go back to something that you referenced before. So I'm going to put a personal spin on it, but showing up confidently, I think that's something that I attribute to being unstoppable, but sometime is so hard from a mental aspect. Haley Marie Keith (21:34): Yes. In those moments, I have a very simple thing that I do and it's been curated over the last 10 years for our journey. Kevin and I started an entrepreneur playlist with our friends who owned a coffee shop in Stillwater and they had started this idea and we're like, yes, because there are certain songs that just pump you up, but other songs that are like, oh, it's a heavy moment and sometimes you got to scream about it. So I would always put on the entrepreneur playlist and I'd sift through the different songs to meet the moment and there's just these really good pump-up songs that are like, get you energized. They let you know you can do it. And one of my favorites, especially for MITO, because it has a special lyric, was Whatever It Takes by Imagine Dragons. So anytime I had to show up for MITO, I'm playing this song, I'm going in, I'm going to do whatever it takes because I love the high that comes with getting through it. (22:20): The line is, I don't want to be a parenthetical or a hypothetical working on something that I'm proud of out of the box and epoxy to the world and the vision we lost. And MITO was a powder that went into epoxy. So it all worked. Bree Katulak (22:32): It's very key. That is fantastic. I love that so much. Have you ever walked into a room and felt underestimated? I mean, we had conversations about you saying, "If I was a man, would I have gotten it? " Haley Marie Keith (22:44): Yes, all the time, especially in pitching when you walk into a VC or you walk into a room full of angels, you're there to express intense confidence in your idea and in the business and the strategy that you have, but then you get the questions or you get the looks or you get the like, "Oh, you're cute." So there have been a lot of times where I've been very underestimated as a female, as a young entrepreneur, first time founder. And in every one of those moments I've met it with vulnerability, like, "You're right. All those things are true. Yeah. And it's about who I have around me and what I'm capable of and how I've done it. And here's my track record of what we've built already," but it never stopped. There was always a moment in every room where you're like, okay, I've got to be aware of what's being projected at me and I've got to put up this shield or with my words somehow project a different level of confidence, surety and sometimes call it out. (23:34): I think I got to the point where towards the end I was basically like, "Yeah, I've built all of this with this much money, which is one third of the guy on my board who raised three times more money to do this. " Female entrepreneurs get less than 3% of venture funding. And then they'd be like, "Oh, really? Yes. And we're building businesses that can matter and are venture backable and you have to be aware of that statistic and say, why is that? And could you do it differently?" Because they also suggest that when you're a female ran company, you use your money differently and usually more scrappy. You can achieve more with less. Why? Well, because we're always given less so we have to figure out ways to do that. And so you meet these different milestones in different ways. So yeah, there's always that, well, what if we could have had three times as much money? (24:18): Where would we have gone? How could we have done it? And I think that'll always be a question, but I'm proud of why I built what I had. Bree Katulak (24:25): Yeah. So I have to ask this silly question. Is Taylor Swift's the man on your entrepreneur playlist? Haley Marie Keith (24:31): Of course. Yeah. Bree Katulak (24:32): I know. I was going to say, I feel like that's a clear and obvious one that has to be on there, but I had to ask. Of course. Haley Marie Keith (24:39): Yes, yes. Absolutely on there. That's such a great power song. Bree Katulak (24:42): It really is. I have definitely danced and sang very loudly to that song multiple times. Absolutely. Yes, yes. Was there ever a moment that you had to believe in yourself more than anyone else? Haley Marie Keith (24:56): Yeah, this past couple months has been really intense. Everyone's gone. There's nobody here. It's me finishing out this race and it's a marathon. And I think the hardest part for me was I didn't expect to finish it alone. I really thought that when we exited, we'd have the whole team around and it would be a big thing. And there was definitely times where I don't have to do this. I could literally quit. I could just be like, I'm done and walk away and the deal would fall through. And I couldn't do that to the investors that believed in me because there was the few that did that put that effort and that risk in. And so I think that pushed me in a way to force myself to believe that I really could take it through. There were definitely times where it was hard to even put that belief in myself and think, can I really do this? (25:38): And also if I get through it, what do I do next? Who am I after this? I don't feel like there's much Haley left, but I have to keep pushing through and finish it. Bree Katulak (25:46): Let's talk about the comment you just made. Not much of Haley left. Are you taking time to reflect and say, let's find Haley again? Haley Marie Keith (25:53): Kind of. My husband would say no because I'm already jumping into new things. I'm already considering what I'm building out professionally and how I can work alongside people that I want to learn from and grow from. But yeah, in the quiet moments, there are definitely those minutes. I've taken the first hour and a half of every Monday to be my time. And it's either my time to just make my calendar or read a book or do something. And that's time I didn't put aside before I'm trying to build back my self-care because I lost a lot of that in the last two years. Kevin and I are married and I had a manicure for eight full years. He never saw my natural nails. And I think for the last year and a half it's been all just plain nails all natural and that's not my favorite. (26:34): So I'm trying to build that back and get that part of Hailey back, be closer to my family, different things like that. So it's a process. It's definitely this rebalancing effort that I'm trying to work through. But yeah, with a different level of confidence though, because I did get through it. Bree Katulak (26:49): Yes, you did. And you should feel extremely confident. That is a major milestone for sure. Going back to the statistic that you quoted about how much funding women get from venture capitalists as compared to men. So I'm sure you've heard a lot of nos. What has stuck with you when you hear those nos? And I guess how do you typically respond and move forward? Haley Marie Keith (27:12): So with every no, there's a reason and it's very rare that you could walk away and be like, "Oh, it's because I'm a woman." There are some that have had some nos where it's like, oh, that's clearly a factor. But I think with every no, my first instinct is I really want to dig in. I want to be like, "Why did you say no? What are the reasons? How can I improve?" And then I take that feedback and I say, I just wholeheartedly disagree. You want me to go this business this way, I don't want to grow the business that way. We fundamentally don't agree. So that's a great reason to say no. There are other nos that are a bit more nuanced and like, well, if I had more resources, I absolutely would do that, but I don't have those resources, therefore I'm incapable so I would like you to help me be capable. (27:49): And if you're not willing to do that, then that's also unreasonable now. With every no, I always chase the real why behind it. And I also, when there's that darker truth, I accept that and say, okay, can I change it? No. So just kind of balancing out the no with the real reason why, looking at that with a self-aware lens and saying, is this something I can change? Is it really worth changing and doing that? But also I think with every no, you turn around and you say, "Well, where am I going to find my yes?" It's not like a, "Oh, okay, well they said no and walk away." It's, "All right, well that one didn't work. So I guess I'm going to keep going. Where's the next door that's going to open to get my yes?" Because there will be somebody that sits there and sees my story and says, "Yeah, I see what you're building. (28:33): I see what you did. I see why you're doing it that way and I like it and I'm going to go for it. " And those are the ones that give you the confidence. Those are the ones you want on your team. Bree Katulak (28:42): Right. I think that perfectly aligns with why you are absolutely unstoppable because a no isn't just I turn around and give up. It's, okay, where's the next door because we're going to find our yes. So what would you say to other women, other motivated men entering into entrepreneurship who have the idea but is staring at their first no? Haley Marie Keith (29:06): A no is just an opportunity for you to grow. Why isn't a no? Is it a changeable no? Can I think about it differently? I always got the advice when I would get nos or in those hard times for entrepreneurship, find a mentor. Those are so hard. I mean, it's so hard to know who to trust because when you trust the wrong people, it really doesn't work out. And so when you get that first no or second no and you're sitting there wondering how and what it can do, put yourself around people that have done similar things. It doesn't have to be the same industry, it doesn't have to be the same kind of business. It's better if it is. But what I would say to the person who gets their no and they have an idea, it would be to go and find somebody who's building something and be brave and talk to them about that and say, "Okay, how?" Because I think you'll learn more from that. (29:51): You'll be able to understand a little bit maybe more why that person said no. And when you build out that community of people that are doing it and building it, I think you'll be able to find more yeses That's where the doors are. Bree Katulak (30:01): Yeah, absolutely. Would you start a company again? Would you do it all over? Haley Marie Keith (30:06): Oh yeah, probably will, honestly. But I'm going to wait because right now I'm focused on capability of core memories of my kids. So I got to get them in maybe to high school, maybe graduated. That's kind of my time boxing. Bree Katulak (30:19): Yeah, I love your intentionality and I absolutely cannot wait to see what you're doing next because I'll be your number one hype girl for sure. Haley Marie Keith (30:29): Well, I'm excited. Hopefully to do a podcast and build out some more of the story because I learned a lot. So that's one of the things I have, cooking podcast, book, something like that. But this has been great and I hope to continue and be maybe on again and talk through more things. I love what you're building and I will always be a massive fan of yours as well. So this has been great. Bree Katulak (30:48): Thank you so much. You're so sweet. All right. So here's my challenge for you over the next two weeks. I want you to think about something that you've put out into the world, idea, a conversation, an opportunity, something you wanted that didn't get the response that you had originally hoped for. Maybe it was a no, maybe it was silence. Maybe it was a not right now, but what did you do next? Did you follow up? Did you adjust and try again? Or did you quietly take a step back? Because that moment right there, that's where most people stop. Not because they don't care and definitely not because they're not capable, but because rejection feels final even when it's not. And what Haley's story shows us is this. The difference isn't the idea. It's the willingness and the drive to keep going after the no. So over the next two weeks, I want you to do something incredibly simple but uncomfortable. (31:58): Go back to that one place where you stopped. One conversation, one opportunity, one ask and take one more step.That's it. Follow up. Reach back out. Say the thing you didn't say in the moment because belief is not just built in one moment. It's built in what you do after things don't go your way. This is your life. Define it, live it, be unstoppable. Thank you for listening to Unstoppable You. If this episode was helpful, I'd love to know. Connect with me on LinkedIn at Bree Katulak. That's K-A-T-U-L-A-K on LinkedIn and shoot me a message. This show is for you. Be Unstoppable. I'll see you next time.