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Transcript

Why God Wants Your Heart Not Your Checklist · Heart Religion

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome back to Heart Religion, a conversation with the leadership of Redeemer Bible Church to help all people know, love, follow Jesus more by faith from a heart that actually desires to please God.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_00: I'm back here for episode two with my brother Pastor Eric Rios here at RBC.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_00: We serve together.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_00: And our first episode, we just went after the heart.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_00: Why we're calling this heart religion?
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we kind of explored that a little bit.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_00: Fill us in.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: Where did we go last time?
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, last time was great.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_01: Heart religion is the name of the podcast.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: And we're saying that the heart matters.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: Jesus gets after the heart.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_01: Old Testament, New Testament, we get after the heart.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_01: And so we we started with a working definition, and I want to just remind us of that.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: You know, if we're again, Bible's open, we're talking about the immaterial part of man, internal affections, desires, control center.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_01: Uh just think about where like where everything comes from.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_01: And so uh if if we can think of ourselves personally, what are we?
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_01: We are a heart wrapped in flesh.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_01: So there's a lot of things that make up Justin and make up Eric.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_01: But at the end of our days, eternally speaking, the things that make us unique is that there is a heart that makes up Eric Rios.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_01: And then God has put some flesh around that heart, and that's who you got in front of you today, and that's the same thing for you.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_00: All that desire, affection, everything, why we do what we do.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_00: It's what God's after, right?
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_00: All over the Bible.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I guess one of the one of the desires of this episode would be to actually maybe go like jump right into are we making this up?
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: Like, is this all over the Bible, or is this just something that here at Redeemer we make a big deal out of because of a few proof texts?
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_00: So maybe I'll just open that can of worms.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_00: We got to prove our work.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we got to prove it.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_00: Is God really after the heart, beginning to end of the Bible?
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_00: So I'll let you start, bro.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's great.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, before we started this morning, uh, we were sitting in another room and we were praying together.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_01: And as we were thinking and praying, um, I was just reminded of Psalm 37, which was so good for my heart this morning, which says, Trust in the Lord and do good.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_01: Dwell in the land to befriend faithfulness.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_01: I love this verse 4.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_01: Delight yourself in the Lord, and he will give you the desires of your heart.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's good.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_01: And so a statement like this, people might think like, oh no, the heart, it's desperately sick and wicked.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_01: Who can know it?
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_01: Well, yes, that's true.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_01: But for the believer whose heart has been transformed, we actually have new desire.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: That's it.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: We have new affection.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_01: And then we can actually pray this prayer, the same thing that David said, that we can delight ourselves in the Lord.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_01: That's step one, right?
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: That's conditional.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_01: We have to delight ourselves in the Lord, and then we can beg God and we can plead with them and pray to the end that He would give us the desires of our heart.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: And even there, right?
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: Delight is affection language.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I just think it's one of the devil's best plays is that we can relate to God with rules, duty, church going, sure, and call it relationship, but there's no delight.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, can you imagine any earthly relationship that operated that way?
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_00: If in your marriage you're just like, well, of course I love you because I pay the bills, I show up for you, right?
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: With no delight.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_00: No, you'd be like, that ain't gonna work.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, if we all came with our check boxes and it's like, okay, this says that I have to talk to you for 30 minutes.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I didn't.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we have to sit down and eat dinner together.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_00: Almost like the I open my Bible app every day, so I've got a good streak of walking with God, but no affections.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, you just you see it, right?
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: I was thinking about Deuteronomy.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: And how we can look at the Torah, the first five books of the Bible, and sometimes the whole Old Testament even could get lumped into this as just this, like, well, you know, kind of rules driven, like, you know, kind of the the some people even would go so far to say, like, Israel was under the law and we're under grace, which is not true, but that's how we can perceive the Old Testament.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: And like Deuteronomy, right?
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_00: The second giving of the law, right?
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: I just gotta highlight a few statements like the Deuteronomy 6, 5.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_00: You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what's the heart of the law?
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_00: Love God, you know?
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_00: And then if you flip over a few pages to Deuteronomy 10, um, and I think it's 10, 12, and now, Israel, what does the Lord your God require of you but to fear the Lord your God, to walk in all his ways, to love him, and to serve the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_00: And then the next chapter, 11, verse 13.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_00: And if and if you will indeed obey my commandments that I commanded you today, but what's the command?
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: To love the Lord your God and serve him with all your heart, with all your soul.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: So he's like, it's like a command to love.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: So we we jump to duty.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_00: And he's like, no, no, this is what God's always been after.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_00: And then it's crazy if you go to the end of Deuteronomy.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, let's see here.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna jump over to uh see if I have the right in my notes here, uh, make sure I don't forget get the wrong passage.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_00: But in uh Deuteronomy uh 30, there's this another statement, right, to obey the Lord in verse 16.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_00: It's the covenant promises and covenant curses.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: Obey the Lord, the commandments of the Lord your God that I commanded you today, by loving the Lord your God and walking in his ways, right?
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_00: And by keeping his commandments and his statutes and his rules, then you shall live and multiply, and the Lord your God will bless you in the land that you're entering.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you're just like, what's God after?
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_01: Can I just go to verse 17?
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_01: Because look at the warning, right?
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we can just keep going in Deuteronomy.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_01: But if your heart turns away, yeah, and you will not hear, but are drawn away to worship other gods and serve them.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_01: Which again is affection and desire.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_01: Affection.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's all over the place.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_01: Love, fear, desire, affection.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, God is definitely after the heart.
• 6:24
  SPEAKER_00: Right, which is the heart of the law, even the old covenant, right?
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: That you would love God with all your heart, which is what Jesus picks up on.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously, I think it's repeated in every gospel, but you know, like in Matthew 22, when he's, what's the greatest command?
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's just like for Jesus, it's instantaneous.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, duh.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: Let me tell you.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, love the Lord your God with all your heart.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you can do all the all the stuff of religion, but a heart that's far from God.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: And God sees right through it, right?
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_00: And then so much of the prophets, right, which are these warning books, right?
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_00: Because Israel's really fallen away from Yahweh and they've gone their own way, right?
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_00: There's all of these warnings where it's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, you're honoring me with your lips, Isaiah.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_00: But a heart that's far from me.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: Or the stop sacrificing.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_00: That was religion.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_00: Stop it and rend your hearts, not your garments.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, what's God after?
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_00: He's after the heart.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_00: So I just think that's a, yeah, I mean, we could keep going, right?
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_00: There's just, it's literally cover to cover of the Bible.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I was thinking of 2 Corinthians 5, 14.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: And it's simply just the love of Christ compels or controls us.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_00: Even there, like, what are we under?
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_00: Man, we've been given God's lavish grace.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_00: We're called to walk worthy of the gospel, but why?
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_00: Affection.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_00: The heart, the love of Christ.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: It should compel us and control us.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I love it because these are the kinds of things that we can hide with other people.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I was looking at like 1 Samuel 16, and Samuel's word there was that man looks at the outward appearance, but God knows the heart.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_01: And then we can go to Hebrews, right?
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_01: And we can say that, yeah, we're all pretty much naked and bare before the Lord.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_01: The Lord knows the thoughts and intentions of our heart.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_00: Which is terrifying.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_01: It is.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_01: It's absolutely terrifying.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I think what it comes down to is if we're not actually doing heart religion and we're doing this superficial thing with one another, um, I can present myself to be a pretty upright guy in your sight around here, but I can't fool the Lord.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_01: And so the Lord hates hypocrisy.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that that's what this is fundamentally getting at.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_01: Is that our actions and our attitudes and our desires, they all got to line up.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_01: That's what a heart that's pure before the Lord, walking in integrity, actually looks like.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_00: And that's that's what the gospel is designed by God to do.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's designed to transform the heart.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_00: So even like regeneration, the promise is you're going to be given a new heart.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: That's again, not the not the not the thing pumping blood.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's that immaterial part of man.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: Our affections go from loving this world and the God of this world to actually loving God and his ways.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_00: Which is why then you see this connection between love and keeping commandments.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_00: Because your heart has been made new.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_00: And now you you desire to please him from a heart that loves him, but it's not automatic.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_00: Which I think leads us to this next question that we got to get into like, how do we cultivate the heart?
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: How do we keep the heart?
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: Because I imagine, right, we could be listening to this kind of podcast, reading this kind of book, seeing it all over the Bible, and maybe just going, like, well, that's cool, but that's not my heart.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, sure.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_00: Even as a Christian, I still love my sin sometimes.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like I still love my own desires.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_00: So like, let's just get into this.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_00: How do we cultivate our hearts?
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, that's a great question.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_01: I would say for the Christian that's listening to this right now and is really struggling with what you just said, they're like, oh, but but all this desire is still in me.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_01: And oh, I just I struggle with it.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_01: Uh my encouragement is praise God that you're struggling.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_01: Because outside of Jesus, outside of the gospel at work, you're still the old man and there's actually no fight.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_01: Because you're just going to give in to whatever lustful desire, float your boat for that day, and you're going to be stuck in your sin.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_01: And so today, if there is a struggle, if there's a wrestle and a fight to honor God, but the flesh is real and you it wants its own way, that's actually a testament to the gospel actually taking root in your heart.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: And so your question of like, okay, so how do we do this?
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_01: How do we cultivate our hearts?
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_01: How do we learn to love God from our hearts?
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: It is this supernatural thing.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_01: Part of it is something that we can't do.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_01: We can't perform this thing.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: We actually have to, by faith, submit ourselves to the Lord and actually welcome this heart transformation.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_01: And so it is from the Holy Spirit, it is through the Word.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_01: It is through God's people.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_01: And so as we put ourselves in these paths, like let's say a Sunday morning as a believer, well, the spirit lives within me.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_01: And this book is being opened.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_01: And we take heart religion very seriously, I would say from the pulpit as well, not just on a podcast and not just in a counseling room.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_01: But we actually have a goal and desire to get to the heart in every sermon, in every teaching instruction.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_01: We do lead school around here.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_01: All of that is designed to get to the heart.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_01: And so as people are hearing instruction from God's word, we expect two things to happen.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_01: We expect this real supernatural work begin to take root in their soul that's given by the Lord.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: And then we are responsible to get after it.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_01: Our affections have to change, our desires have to change, and we have to actually cooperate with what God is doing in our heart.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: Can I ask you a question?
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_00: Do you think it's possible to uh be doing all of these kind of external Christian things?
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um, whether it's going to church or Bible reading or small groups or whatever we kind of fill in those blanks with.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: And yet not have a heart that's been born again yet.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_00: And so is it possible to that?
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: That's the fundamental problem for some people that they can't love God?
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_01: I like to use the example of like a car parked in the garage, right?
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_01: Uh being parked in the garage doesn't make a car a car.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_01: I can go sit on the floor in my garage all month.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_01: It's not gonna make me a car.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so somebody can sit on a Sunday morning in one of the chairs that we have in the auditorium.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_01: They can come to lead school, they can go to home group.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's not gonna make them a Christian.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think that gets to just getting past that superficial, yeah, um, just being present and actually cooperating and understanding what the gospel is.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_00: Because there seems to be a measure of like cultural Christianity for some people.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, right.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe you were raised in the church, you know, Protestant, Catholic, something that was kind of around Christianity, right?
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_00: So you feel like I've always been in it.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_00: So there's cultural Christianity.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I think there's performative Christianity, you know, just performance-based.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a good person.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: I'm better than average.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_00: I'm moral.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a good father, a good husband, a good community member.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_00: I go to church.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: I believe in God.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_00: Like there's performative Christianity.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_00: I would say there's just straight moralism and pharisaical Christianity, more of a self-righteousness.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's still in the flesh, but I'm doing all the right things that even somebody might look on the outside and go, wow, you're a good Christian, right?
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_00: But it's all just moralism and performance-based.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_01: I think everything that you just said right there is true.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_01: And the word that you didn't say is Jesus.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_01: How are you changed by Jesus?
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_01: Do you love Jesus?
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_01: Do you love him?
• 14:19
  unknown: Yeah.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_01: Do you want to serve him?
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_01: Do you worship him?
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_01: At the end of the day, what we worship is gonna be presented.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think even there, even maybe stepping back and the maybe say, like, if you've never come to Christ on Christ's terms, then your heart hasn't been changed.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: So you're trying to get into the kingdom of heaven through your cultural Christianity, through your moralism, through your performance.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_00: And then you're just like, doggone it, my affections won't change.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I have no love for God.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and I would say that's even the promise of the new covenant was when you repent and believe, you're given a new heart.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: Your heart's no longer a heart of stone.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's a heart of flesh.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_00: It actually loves what God loves and hates what God hates.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: Now it's not automatic, meaning, oh, I'm perfect now, right?
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's a process.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: But my affections have begun to change.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I'd say that's where you know you reference the war that we have, the fight.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: I'd say that's Romans 7.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_00: There is this genuine, like, I love God.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_00: I want to please God.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_00: Doggone it.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes I don't.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_00: That's the war where in the flesh there really is no war.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_00: You may feel bad because you got caught in sin or you know you shouldn't do something, but there's no love for the glory of God.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: There's no affection for Jesus.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_00: And so I would say, even as we think about the heart, we got to start with just conversion.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I think American Christianity has watered down conversion.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we've really just kind of made it so weak sauce.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: Where Jesus was actually like, whoa, time out.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: Count the cost.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, whoa, hold on.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_00: Don't follow me unless you're serious.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_00: And I think we maybe need to go back there and just even say for some of us, it would be like, you know what?
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_00: I've been around Christianity for decades, maybe, but I've never actually come to the place of seeing myself as one who is in desperate need of God's mercy, or I'll be under his wrath.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_00: And so we maybe I've got to go there to cry out and go, God, I need a divine heart transplant.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_01: Amen.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_01: And it's again, we're not making this up because I think if the camera's off right now, me and you can go and talk about specific examples of actual people that have tapped us on the shoulder on Sunday and said, um, what's happening here, I've never heard.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_01: What's happening here in my heart, I've never experienced.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_01: Amen.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_01: I've been in the church, I've been around the church.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_01: I thought I got saved when I was nine years old.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_01: But at 30-something years old, something new is happening to me.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_00: Praise God.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, praise God.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I think sometimes we get we kind of freak out.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I thought I've been a Christian my whole life.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, I don't think God cares about that in that sense.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_00: God's after your heart.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_00: And if your journey towards faith is this growing up in the church and moralism and duty and performative religion and cultural Christianity, that's maybe all part of God drawing you.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: Right, sure.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: But there may come a moment where you go, man, I I've actually never come to a place of I'm a desperate, needy sinner before a holy God, deserving of his righteous judgment.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I need to repent and turn to Christ by faith, crying out for the new birth, right?
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_00: For regeneration.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: And instead of being so overly concerned about making sure that there's a time stamp on your salvation, because people want to make it about like, no, I need to know like that moment, that day, when I prayed that prayer, I'm like, yeah, I'm not gonna, I'm not that detective.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not gonna be able to figure that out.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: But can we just say that you're on this radical new growth spurt?
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, amen.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_01: So whether you're a brand new, you've been given a new heart today, or you've been a Christian for 10 years, something has changed.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_01: And I think a lot of times what we're saying is you're learning how to get after your heart.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_00: Isn't that, I think, the heart of Christ in John 3?
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_00: Like Nicodemus is the most religious figure in Israel.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_00: Externally based.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_00: All the rules are kept.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: And then Jesus talks about this thing called regeneration, the new birth, a new heart.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: And Nicodemus doesn't get it.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: And Christ is like, yeah, uh, a tree blows or the wind blows, you see the effects in the trees.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: That that would be your desires, your affections, right?
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: Right, are changed.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: And Nicodemus wasn't there yet.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_00: Praise God, he's there by the time Christ dies because he's Christ is buried in his tomb, right?
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_00: But in this conversation, he's still confused because he had the externals of religion in the name of the God of the Bible.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, I think we gotta just sit there for a while sometimes and say, has have my affections ever been changed?
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_00: You know, when I see somebody else loving Jesus, do I look at that and go, that's weird.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_00: What how do they do that?
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_00: Because sometimes we're just we realize we don't love Jesus like that.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_00: We gotta go back to maybe like, what does it mean to be born again?
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_00: So if we are born again, right, if we've been given a new heart, what are some of the rhythms of grace that God's given to us to cultivate the heart?
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, great question.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: God's given us his word.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that as those desires change, we begin to not just read our Bibles, but then I would say read them differently.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_01: Read them with not so much uh a desire to get the content, which absolutely I'm not don't hear me say that the content doesn't matter, but the content is there for us to know God.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: The content in the word is also for us to know our own hearts.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_01: And so we we get after a deep, intimate time with the Lord, and it is to know him, and then it is for him to reveal to us our either an encouragement that we are walking with him, but then there's always those moments where it's like, oh, I needed to hear that from the Lord today.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_01: That's that's an area of my desires that he wants to change.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: And so by begging God in prayer and in God's word in our in our daily reading and walk with him, he begins to show us our hearts.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and and sometimes God is taking a machete like like in the jungle in a rain for us and just hacking away just all this stuff.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_01: And then other times and seasons, it's like God has taken this scalpel and he's just like just making these tiny incisions to continually uh change our our hearts and help us to draw near to him.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_00: And it's all rooted in the love of God for us, which then produces a love of God from us.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: That's a good way to say it.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and I just think there's so many illustrations in the natural world that kind of help prove supernatural things.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I I think back to when I was just uh dating and engaged to my wife.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, right.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm a little sappy, you know.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_00: So we'd write letters because we had a long distance relationship.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I would just, you know, I think about like, what if she wrote me and I and then she says, Did you get the letter?
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, Yeah, I didn't have time to read it yet.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_00: Whoa.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_00: That never happened.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I'll be honest, it never happened.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like I would get those letters, I would read them over and over and over.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like I was, I love this woman, right?
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm my affections are off the charts for this woman.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so when she writes to me, I'm like, I'm going after it.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I might go after it every day for a week, you know, and just keep reading it, reading between the lines.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what is she really telling me?
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_00: That's what affection does.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I think when we make the word of God just this performative, okay, I've got to read through my Bible in a year, we're missing the point of do we love him?
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_00: And so we go to his word.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: Why?
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: Because he he loved us first and we love him back.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_00: And this is how we know him.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_00: Not just to just to be duty driven.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_00: Like, okay, what's my command to obey for the day?
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_00: I want to love God.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: I want to relate to God.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_00: I want all of my life to relate to God because God is fundamentally good and we know him through his word.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_00: And that's worship.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_01: Amen.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_01: That's worship.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_01: It is a heart that longs to please God and then a life that longs to please him.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: Because we can't have, we can't say that our heart is changed without the actions actually changing.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_01: But we don't address the action first.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_01: We actually go to the heart first and expect that a heart changed to love God always is going to change the action that it produces.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: Which would be like classic Paul.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_00: Every letter has these like rich gospel riffs.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: He just goes to town on the gospel for over half or more of a letter.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_00: And then he's going to turn.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, now, now let's let's think about how you can walk worthy.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I'm going to urge you to do so based on what?
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_00: Just this glorious gospel that I've just exploded on, right?
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, yeah, it is.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_00: Affections always produce action.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: That's happened in our human relationships, right?
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_00: It's how I my it's how I should relate to my wife or my children or my brothers and sisters.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_00: Affection produces action.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_00: And then it's exactly how God wants us to relate to him.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_00: Do we actually love him?
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_00: Which is going to come through just knowing him.
• 23:32
  unknown: Right.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_00: The more you know him, the more you love him.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_00: And so yeah, I think the word of God has got to be just paramount.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think another rhythm would be would be just being um being active with God's people.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_00: Not just to like hang out with the bros.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_00: But actually like engaging with God's people that in a way that we're delighting, rehearsing the gospel together.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, we're we're we're rejoicing in the gospel together, we're praying the gospel together.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, we're really actually wanting to delight in Jesus with one another, encourage each other to keep walking with Jesus.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, like it's a rhythm of grace that God's given to us to keep our hearts tender to Him.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you're speaking Hebrews 10 language right now.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_01: And I mean the writer of Hebrews, it's just a masterful job of just rooting it in the gospel and then showing how that affection produces something.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_01: And let me just kind of um park here for a second.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_01: Since we have confidence to enter the holy places by the blood of Jesus, by the new and living way that he opened for us through the curtain that is through his flesh, and since we have a great priest over the house of God, let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, with our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_01: Let us hold fast to the confession of our hope without wavering.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_01: For we for he who promised is faithful.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, that is just so gospel rich.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_01: That just shows how a heart is transformed and then a motivation is changed.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_01: And then that's the context for what we get next in this passage.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_01: Let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works, not neglecting to meet together, as it is the habit of some, but encouraging one another and all the more as you see the day drawing near.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_01: So we can hang out in the flesh.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_01: You can force me to sit with somebody.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_01: I can I can desire to sit with somebody because we have similar interests that maybe aren't the word, but there's something that's different.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_01: When two Christians are having a seat, having conversations about the word in a similar way to what we're doing now, this is what we say.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's actually stirring our affections for the Lord.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_01: It's stirring our affections for one another, it's changing our desires.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_01: And that we actually need this.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_01: That God's Word says, don't give that up.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_00: This is good for you.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think of like a fans.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they go to they pay big money to go to games with a whole bunch of people that have similar affections.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_00: And there's this synergy and energy that you're you're excited about.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_00: And you can structure an entire day, week, month around this event you're excited to go to, right?
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_00: Because your affections, but then it increases your affections, right?
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: There's something that's how God wired us.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_00: And you see that warning, right, in Hebrews 10 of not falling away, like staying faithful to the end.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_00: Which is maybe a podcast episode one day.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_00: That's a great, a great uh the warning in Hebrews and encouragement, right?
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: But really, what's the turn?
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_00: The family of God, the people of God that you would provoke and exhort and stir up, that we might keep knowing knowing, loving Jesus by faith.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's a rhythm that, again, we we we can say things like I'm too busy, or I'm an introvert, or it's not a good season of life.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_00: But really, what could be happening is our affections for Jesus are just dwindling.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's so true.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_01: I I love that you gave the example, that sports analogy.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, a couple years ago, we went to a uh Niners football game and we don't skip church a lot, but we, you know, we went out there on a Sunday.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_01: Did they play the Bears?
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_00: Because if it was the Bears game, that's probably okay.
• 27:15
  unknown: They did not play the Bears.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, but it was a great game.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_01: But, anyways, the point being, um, we were there early enough to see the tailgate.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_01: And the way things were set up out there in the parking lot, it was it was pretty cool.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_01: I'd never really seen anything quite like that.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_01: And it kind of drew me in, it got me excited a little bit, but then it left me a little sad because then I started thinking like, man, this is their church service.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_01: It's Sunday morning.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_01: Functional worship, they are here to worship.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, they are worshiping, they are sharing meals together, yeah, they are fellowshipping, they are singing chants, they are doing their thing, right?
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's just this, they're they're settling for lesser.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_01: And so I'm not saying that none of them are Christians.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_00: For sure, for sure.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_00: But can't we do that in the house of God?
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: And we call it fellowship, we call it all these Christianese terms, but we're actually not increasing affection for Jesus.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_00: Which gets back to heart religion.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, going back to if we're just committed to the heart, now our friendship and fellowship is actually like we want to help each other increase in affection for Christ.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_00: So then our conversations change, our questions change, like how we perceive each other changes.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: We start confessing sin to one another.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_00: Who does that?
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's not gonna happen in a Niners game, right?
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_00: That's what the gospel does.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_00: And as we confess sin, now we walk each other down gospel paths, we're restored to each other and the Lord, first John five, or first John one, five and seven, right?
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and now we're like, oh, my affection for Jesus is increasing through the family of God actually doing what it's designed to do.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_00: And it goes back to like that difference of so often in modern Christianity, it's performance-based, it's moralistic based, it's culturally based.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_00: So you can go to church every Sunday for your entire life, but and not cultivate affection for Jesus.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_00: Because you're just checking your church punch card.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_01: I think that it's it would be really helpful to leave our listeners with some questions of okay, that's that's cool, guys.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you you laid out, hopefully we've laid out and done uh done done our work to prove it through the text.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_01: But then what do we actually do when we're sitting with one another?
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_01: And I just think that some of the most simple questions are some of the most helpful.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, right.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how's your heart?
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know, and and one, we got to figure out first what that even means.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_01: But hopefully, episodes like this get us kind of moving in that direction.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_01: But right, that question is not like, how's your family?
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's not how's your job?
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's how's your heart?
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_01: And then we got to wrestle out how is my heart?
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_01: What is that question drawing to?
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_01: What are these desires and affections?
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_01: How am I encouraged in my walk with Jesus?
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_01: What am I struggling with?
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_01: Now I'm getting into the stuff of my heart that my brother is wanting to check in on me with.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's really good.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think once we understand the heart, we can ask those questions.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_00: And that's where this hopefully even this podcast helps us work out our hearts.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I think just, and then we get into other questions about like how are you been, you know, struggling to trust God.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_00: You know, where have you been tempted to go your own way?
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_00: How have you walked with God this week when you've been tempted?
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_00: And it gets, I mean, those are the kind of questions that should be happening in the church lobby, in home groups, right?
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_00: And and and we're working out our hearts together, right?
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_00: But I think for some of us, those would be shocking questions.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: It would almost be like, ain't none of your business.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I didn't get in your kitchen, stay out of mine, right?
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_00: Where that should just be normalized.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_00: Because what we're actually after is all of us working out our hearts before God.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_00: Because that's what glorifies God.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_00: That's what how we please God.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_00: And it's actually what's good for us.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_00: Which is the beautiful mystery of walking with God, right?
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_00: He's glorified, but it's actually for our good, right?
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_00: Because he's good.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, and that's actually would be one episode we should do, huh?
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_00: With questions.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_00: Let's go after questions to help us actually get to each other's hearts in love, not judgment, because there's no condemnation.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_00: Praise be to God.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_00: But we can have real talk at the level of our hearts to spur each other on to love and good works.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_00: Let's do it by faith.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, once again, thanks for listening to Heart Religion.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, we're eager to just encourage all people to know, love, follow Jesus better from a heart that actually wants to please God.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, if you have questions that you would like for your pastors to work out in this podcast, please drop them in uh an email, uh a comment, DM us, and uh we'll get those on the docket for a future episode.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_00: As our goal in Heart Religion is to help all people know, love, and follow Jesus better by faith.