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74: Back in Platinum- Baha Blast · Dungeonpedia

0:00
SPEAKER_06: You the adventurer.
0:02
SPEAKER_06: Yes, you.
0:03
SPEAKER_06: Do you desire knowledge of immense worlds and arcane power?
0:07
SPEAKER_06: A codex of untold stories and lore?
0:10
SPEAKER_06: Or perhaps simply easy listening for your daily commute.
0:13
SPEAKER_06: Then feast your eyes.
0:15
SPEAKER_06: Or more accurately, yes, upon Dungeon Pedia.
0:19
SPEAKER_06: Shit's about to get nerdy in here.
0:41
SPEAKER_02: Hello everyone, and welcome to Dungeon Pedia, an exploration into the lore of Dungeons and Dragons.
0:45
SPEAKER_02: We're your host, Lou and Markell.
0:47
SPEAKER_02: Taylor Stanfield.
0:48
SPEAKER_02: And I'm Travis Peasley.
0:49
SPEAKER_01: And also I won.
0:51
SPEAKER_01: The most lawful person at this table.
0:54
SPEAKER_01: At this table.
0:55
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, you realize that's not exactly something we to brag about, right?
0:59
SPEAKER_04: At least in a conjecture of our previous conversation.
1:02
SPEAKER_01: I won.
1:03
SPEAKER_01: It's not, but I won something.
1:05
SPEAKER_01: No, I won.
1:07
SPEAKER_01: I won.
1:08
SPEAKER_01: Are you gonna start demanding a recount too?
1:11
SPEAKER_04: Oh my lord.
1:12
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
1:13
SPEAKER_04: Segueing past that.
1:15
SPEAKER_02: Um no, so I'm saying I won because I had the least.
1:21
SPEAKER_02: Which it was the goal.
1:23
SPEAKER_02: Which is the which is my goal is to be as chaotic as possible.
1:26
SPEAKER_02: Ah, right.
1:27
SPEAKER_02: And so I won.
1:28
SPEAKER_04: You won by not being implicated.
1:30
SPEAKER_04: No, actually, I so I was uh I had to go have some lab work done at the doctor's office uh the other day.
1:38
SPEAKER_04: And I opened up before I left Twitter to kind of scroll through and I saw that Travis was in the lead by a large margin.
1:46
SPEAKER_04: And um because we posted that that um poll poll uh about which of us is the most lawful.
1:56
SPEAKER_04: Um which of the three of us and Travis is winning by a large margin, so I call him on my way home, and uh I'm like, and Travis is already getting pretty sleepy because he already he's already getting ready to go to bed.
2:09
SPEAKER_04: And I I'm like, hey, guess what?
2:12
SPEAKER_04: That according to that Twitter poll, you're the most lawful, and he's like, yay, I'm winning.
2:17
SPEAKER_04: And like, no, it's not winning.
2:19
SPEAKER_04: You're losing.
2:20
SPEAKER_04: You're the loser.
2:21
SPEAKER_04: You're the hall monitor.
2:23
SPEAKER_01: So I still count it as winning.
2:25
SPEAKER_02: I mean, actually, I think I I still think I won.
2:29
SPEAKER_04: Um, I am apparently pretty neutral.
2:33
SPEAKER_04: Uh of the 15 votes, Travis brought in 60%.
2:36
SPEAKER_04: I brought in 33%, and Luwan with what has to be only one vote for Lewin, which I want to talk to whoever voted for Lewin.
2:43
SPEAKER_01: Um, I won! Um, I will say, of all of the replies we got, Angus, I think yours is one of the best just because you did nothing but laugh.
2:56
SPEAKER_04: Which was good.
2:58
SPEAKER_04: Very good.
2:59
SPEAKER_01: That's a very proper response to this.
3:02
SPEAKER_01: To that, yeah.
3:03
SPEAKER_04: Um, Anthony uh at Tito to D at Totita Tito Totita said that he would normally vote for Travis, but in light of the Ukulots episode, he feels like he's a neutral evil puppeteer, which is accurate.
3:19
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
3:20
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
3:22
SPEAKER_02: Piggybacking off of that, uh, Traveler Farlander said, I don't feel like most lawful host here is really saying very much, which I think is also true.
3:31
SPEAKER_02: That is a fair point.
3:32
SPEAKER_02: Like I Travis might be the most lawful, but the bar is really low.
3:37
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, exactly.
3:38
SPEAKER_02: Because, like, yeah, yeah, look it up.
3:41
SPEAKER_04: Uh Rebecca Reinal said, and this is probably the most apt thing.
3:47
SPEAKER_04: She felt so sad.
3:49
SPEAKER_04: Uh, I vote Taylor because she said she was going to cover demons and devils and has lawfully stuck to that topic ever since.
3:55
SPEAKER_04: You have no idea how accurate that is, because the reason I was thinking about it after you posted that.
4:03
SPEAKER_04: The reason I have stuck to that topic ever since is because I was like, no, it's gonna be too chaotic to find everything if I spread it out.
4:11
SPEAKER_04: And I was like, oh.
4:12
SPEAKER_04: The opposite of chaos is law.
4:15
SPEAKER_04: No no.
4:16
SPEAKER_02: So Taylor felt so seen and validated by that comment.
4:19
SPEAKER_02: Actually, no, I felt really called out.
4:21
SPEAKER_01: Rebecca, you nailed that one on the head.
4:23
SPEAKER_01: True.
4:23
SPEAKER_01: Straight up nailed it.
4:25
SPEAKER_02: But yeah, we I so thank you.
4:29
SPEAKER_02: Thank you for the participation.
4:30
SPEAKER_02: Thank you for your votes.
4:32
SPEAKER_01: Thank you for voting.
4:33
SPEAKER_02: Your lack of votes for me.
4:34
SPEAKER_01: The participation and the ridiculousness that I've I've won.
4:38
SPEAKER_02: Hello.
4:38
SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
4:39
SPEAKER_02: We're all very proud of you.
4:40
SPEAKER_02: You are the most chaotic.
4:41
SPEAKER_02: You are the most chaotic Dungeon Pedia host.
4:44
SPEAKER_02: Or rather, maybe not even.
4:46
SPEAKER_02: Maybe I'm just the least lawful.
4:49
SPEAKER_04: I mean, I think what Traveler Farlander was saying about most lawful here is kind of not really saying much.
4:57
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
4:58
SPEAKER_04: We are all pretty chaotic.
4:59
SPEAKER_02: I feel like the bar for chaos, though, for us would actually be pretty high.
5:02
SPEAKER_02: Should we make another poll for most chaotic dungeon?
5:05
SPEAKER_02: No, I'm kidding.
5:05
SPEAKER_04: No, I mean it feels like that that's it it it's pretty much laid out there plain as day right now.
5:12
SPEAKER_04: Travis is the most lawful, Lewin's the most chaotic, and I'm pretty neutral.
5:16
SPEAKER_04: I mean, I guess.
5:17
SPEAKER_01: I don't necessarily feel like those are exactly the same things, but I mean that poll shows the extreme opposites of both.
5:27
SPEAKER_01: Fair.
5:28
SPEAKER_01: So I I think that poll pretty much covers it.
5:31
SPEAKER_04: We we could we we I mean we could put out a of a poll for each of us to guess what or to for people to say what they think our each alignment is.
5:42
SPEAKER_02: Oh, we could.
5:43
SPEAKER_02: Oh, there's so many possibilities.
5:44
SPEAKER_02: No, no, we started a rabbit hole.
5:47
SPEAKER_02: A rabbit hole about polls.
5:49
SPEAKER_02: So on the topic of alignment.
5:52
SPEAKER_02: On the topic of alignment, yes.
5:54
SPEAKER_02: Um we are continuing our discussion about the most lawful Draco Paladin Platinum Hall monitor himself, Bahamut.
6:05
SPEAKER_02: Because I have so much hubris.
6:08
SPEAKER_02: I in in line with my apparently chaotic nature.
6:12
SPEAKER_02: Uh I have so much Hebris and thinking that I could have fit all this into.
6:16
SPEAKER_02: I know I mentioned this in the last Bahamut episode, but I have so much Hebris and thinking that I could have fit this all into one episode because I literally have ten and a half pages of notes.
6:27
SPEAKER_04: And how long was that bibliography?
6:30
SPEAKER_04: Oh yeah, Lou and also put together a bibliography, which you can see if you subscribe to our Patreon.
6:35
SPEAKER_02: Uh it's like almost a full page.
6:37
SPEAKER_01: Jesus.
6:38
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
6:39
SPEAKER_02: Listen.
6:41
SPEAKER_02: Listen.
6:42
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
6:43
SPEAKER_02: Listen.
6:44
SPEAKER_02: I'm listening.
6:45
SPEAKER_02: I have nothing to say for myself, so.
6:48
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
6:48
SPEAKER_02: So we left off um finishing talking about Bahamut uh through third edition and 3.5.
6:56
SPEAKER_02: Um, and we finished off with a note about his his consorts that he apparently has.
7:03
SPEAKER_02: Um Bahamut fucks.
7:05
SPEAKER_02: Bahama fucks, apparently.
7:07
SPEAKER_02: He doesn't have kids when he fucks, because so he really fucks.
7:12
SPEAKER_02: He just fucks for fun.
7:13
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, exactly.
7:14
SPEAKER_02: Like Tiamat, at least, she has the excuse of like procreation.
7:18
SPEAKER_02: Like she makes spawns and stuff.
7:20
SPEAKER_01: I mean, you say that like you need an excuse.
7:22
SPEAKER_04: I mean, no, but it it feels more chaotic to fuck just to fuck than it does to fuck to make babies.
7:29
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
7:30
SPEAKER_01: I guess it depends on what you're making the babies for.
7:32
SPEAKER_02: You know what?
7:33
SPEAKER_02: That's the main point.
7:34
SPEAKER_02: She she is she is making the babies to be evil, to be evil, you know.
7:40
SPEAKER_02: Spawn spawn to take over the world.
7:42
SPEAKER_02: So fair point.
7:44
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
7:45
SPEAKER_02: I mean, I'm sure she fucks for fun too.
7:47
SPEAKER_02: And like I said, that might not even be what they meant by that.
7:51
SPEAKER_04: I'm going to go with yes.
7:53
SPEAKER_02: I'm going I'm going to go like by the word consorts, but I'm going to go with yes.
7:57
SPEAKER_02: So we are going to start off on what is typically a very disappointing note, which is fourth edition.
8:08
SPEAKER_04: Oh boy, just starting off on a real high point here.
8:11
SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's actually not it's not as it's not as bad as it usually is.
8:17
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
8:18
SPEAKER_02: Um, so before we start talking about Bahamut, specifically um himself in fourth edition, I would like to remind everyone that fourth edition origins for Tiamat and Bahamut uh tend to favor the idea that either their like their actual physical form or divine spark or whatever uh came from Io's corpse after he was slain by Erikus in the Dawn War.
8:44
SPEAKER_02: That's the popular convention that they ascribe to.
8:48
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
8:49
SPEAKER_02: Um, so this also plays into the story of their first conflict from Draconomicon Chromatic Dragons, which was published in 2008, um, which is very interesting to be getting information for Bahamut from the Chromatic Dragon book, but you know, whatever.
9:03
SPEAKER_04: I mean, every every book has sources on its enemy as well.
9:08
SPEAKER_04: Mm-hmm.
9:09
SPEAKER_02: So upon being slain by Eric Huss, uh, Isles Divine Spark entered his two oldest children.
9:15
SPEAKER_02: So in this Bahamut and Timot.
9:18
SPEAKER_02: Had well, they had already been um like extant at this point.
9:23
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
9:24
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
9:25
SPEAKER_03: Like that the yeah.
9:28
SPEAKER_03: Those are both the same thing.
9:30
SPEAKER_03: Hey, I mean, in this case, I guess.
9:33
SPEAKER_02: Anyway, anyway, let's not let's not think about that too much.
9:37
SPEAKER_02: But um, so like they had already been these existing, you know, kind of kind of people though.
9:45
SPEAKER_02: So um I was divine spark under Tiamat and Bahamut, and together they defeated Eric Hus, which I think is you know pretty metal.
9:54
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
9:55
SPEAKER_02: That they like defeated this guy that just killed their dad.
9:58
SPEAKER_04: Like it's pretty cool.
10:00
SPEAKER_04: Like, if we didn't already know how how like bad it turns out, I'd be like, oh, really that's so cool.
10:05
SPEAKER_04: Sibl like super deities.
10:09
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's like a nice, nice sibling moment.
10:11
SPEAKER_02: But their nice sibling moments would come to a close.
10:14
SPEAKER_02: Uh it said that this not only split Ayo's divine power between the two, but also his character, which is, I mean, a popular interpretation, but right.
10:25
SPEAKER_02: Um so Bahamut inherited his goodness and nobility, and Tiamat his avarice and arrogance.
10:33
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
10:34
SPEAKER_02: Because, you know, the nine the ninefold dragon is multifaceted.
10:39
SPEAKER_01: I mean, of course.
10:40
SPEAKER_02: Of course.
10:41
SPEAKER_01: Arrogant little bitch.
10:43
SPEAKER_02: But also good noble bitch.
10:45
SPEAKER_02: He he has layers.
10:47
SPEAKER_01: That too.
10:48
SPEAKER_02: Dragons are like onions.
10:49
SPEAKER_02: Oh god.
10:50
SPEAKER_02: They have layers.
10:51
SPEAKER_01: They all have layers.
10:53
SPEAKER_02: Anyway.
10:54
SPEAKER_02: So, uh, this next one is a quote from um chromatic dragons.
11:00
SPEAKER_02: Quote: The two dragon deities looked at each other across the corpse of the defeated king of terror.
11:05
SPEAKER_02: Neither could suffer the other to exist.
11:08
SPEAKER_02: End quote.
11:09
SPEAKER_02: Wow.
11:10
SPEAKER_04: Right?
11:11
SPEAKER_04: Wow, that's your fucking sibling.
11:13
SPEAKER_04: Like, come on.
11:14
SPEAKER_04: I don't always get along with my siblings, but I don't want to destroy them in single combat.
11:20
SPEAKER_04: I mean most of the time.
11:23
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's not true whatsoever.
11:24
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
11:25
SPEAKER_02: Taylor.
11:26
SPEAKER_04: Hey, if either of you are listening to this, I love you.
11:30
SPEAKER_01: Okay, first.
11:31
SPEAKER_01: That was my most brother.
11:33
SPEAKER_01: First of all, they are dragons.
11:35
SPEAKER_01: So like the wanting to destroy the other makes a little bit more sense.
11:40
SPEAKER_01: Makes a little bit more sense.
11:42
SPEAKER_01: That's all I got.
11:43
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
11:44
SPEAKER_01: I just had to start it off like I had more information, but I understand.
11:49
SPEAKER_01: You you clickbaited us.
11:51
SPEAKER_02: I did.
11:51
SPEAKER_02: That's not what clickbait is, but you know.
11:53
SPEAKER_01: Close enough.
11:54
SPEAKER_02: Um, but like, I don't know.
11:55
SPEAKER_02: And something about the way that like that was written, just like it's pretty, pretty good.
12:01
SPEAKER_01: Like the the the verbiage is the the verbiage was also uh pretty good.
12:06
SPEAKER_04: Pretty yeah, pretty gracious.
12:08
SPEAKER_04: Like it it it felt it felt like really poetic and beautiful, but also I'm pretty sure I felt similar things like you know, staring at my sibling when he's holding the remote.
12:18
SPEAKER_02: So right.
12:20
SPEAKER_02: It doesn't even have to be that dramatic.
12:22
SPEAKER_02: Um so Tiamat and Bahamut battled for days until eventually Tiamat fled and they turned their attention back to the you know the whole war that was happening.
12:32
SPEAKER_02: Oh yeah.
12:33
SPEAKER_02: That kind of there was a war, I forgot.
12:35
SPEAKER_02: There was a there was a war going on.
12:36
SPEAKER_01: But there's no war.
12:38
SPEAKER_02: And you know, the defeat of Eric Huss was not like that.
12:40
SPEAKER_02: There's no war in the Forgotten Realms.
12:44
SPEAKER_02: I don't think this is Forgotten Realms actually.
12:47
SPEAKER_04: I probably not, but that's the that's the main one that came to mind.
12:51
SPEAKER_04: Because that is typically uh like default D ⁇ D.
12:55
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I feel like that is a very um like of all of the all the modules.
13:00
SPEAKER_02: Um so as a deity in the players' handbook, which was published in 2008, uh Bahamut is lawful good and revered by most paladins, as well as worshipped by metallic dragons as the first of their kind.
13:12
SPEAKER_02: Uh his tenets are as follows Uphold the highest ideals of honor and justice, be constantly vigilant against evil and oppose it on all fronts, protect the weak, liberate the oppressed, and defend just order.
13:26
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
13:27
SPEAKER_01: So pretty lawful.
13:29
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, pretty typical for your lawful aligned gods.
13:33
SPEAKER_01: Anything really.
13:34
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
13:35
SPEAKER_03: Very um law-oriented.
13:39
SPEAKER_02: Well, okay, yes.
13:41
SPEAKER_02: But also uh I'm trying to I'm trying to think.
13:44
SPEAKER_01: Well, I guess like lawful evil might not be fit into those.
13:51
SPEAKER_04: Are there really lawful evil paladins?
13:53
SPEAKER_01: Like, I I know like oath breakers exist, but yes, there are, but I think it is mostly breakers.
14:00
SPEAKER_01: That's most paladins, in my opinion.
14:02
SPEAKER_01: Oathbreakers are lawful evil.
14:04
SPEAKER_02: No, I'm saying most paladins are evil, in my opinion.
14:07
SPEAKER_02: Because I'm paladins.
14:09
SPEAKER_02: I'm I'm bragging on paladins again.
14:12
SPEAKER_02: No, it it it it to me though, it's not just like lawful.
14:16
SPEAKER_02: It is kind of evocative to me, like these tenants are sort of evocative to me of the some would say lofty, pretentious kind of like the the the enlightened justice, if you will, that we talked about like last last episode.
14:34
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, no, I I know what you're talking about.
14:36
SPEAKER_02: Well, last last Bahamut episode.
14:37
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, right, yeah.
14:38
SPEAKER_02: Like it isn't it isn't just about like like law.
14:42
SPEAKER_02: It does it it's it's good as well as lawful, I guess.
14:47
SPEAKER_02: Which makes sense because Bahamut is lawful good.
14:50
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
14:50
SPEAKER_02: He is not his alignment did not get fucked around with in fourth edition.
14:54
SPEAKER_02: Wow.
14:55
SPEAKER_02: He maintains, like I said, a platinum-clad, lawful good run the entirety of his existence.
15:04
SPEAKER_02: I'm very proud.
15:05
SPEAKER_04: Right?
15:06
SPEAKER_04: Fourth edition, like fucked up the whole uh alignment system, so that is pretty damn impressive.
15:12
SPEAKER_04: For like for most.
15:13
SPEAKER_04: I'm not saying that the alignment system wasn't pretty fucked to begin with, but I mean, I think in general, ascribing a whole personality to one square is bad.
15:23
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but I mean it grew to be consistent up until fourth edition, and then whenever they went through and just kind of gutted it.
15:32
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:32
SPEAKER_02: And that was that was such a move to just like well, I feel like saying it that way makes it sound like I'm putting it in a positive context.
15:40
SPEAKER_02: But like to especially to uh coalesce what was it like lawful and neutral good together?
15:47
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
15:47
SPEAKER_04: Or wait, was it it was basically like chaotic good was the odd one out, and lawful evil was the odd one out in terms of like good was just lawful and neutral good.
15:59
SPEAKER_01: And then um I'm I think I mean I know a lot of them fell into unaligned in the fourth edition.
16:07
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
16:08
SPEAKER_02: It was but it was something to that effect, and I do remember there there being like that increased association between evil and chaos and like goodness and law always bugs me.
16:21
SPEAKER_02: But I will say, to the bar is kind of on the floor to not mess with alignments when it's like good for you.
16:30
SPEAKER_02: You kept Draco Paladin's alignment this time.
16:34
SPEAKER_04: Okay, yeah, I'm sorry.
16:36
SPEAKER_04: It it was good is um kind of uh the coalescence between law uh chaotic good and neutral good.
16:45
SPEAKER_04: Lawful good is odd one out, evil is the coalescence between lawfully evil and neutral evil, and then chaotic evil is the odd one out, and then there's unaligned.
16:55
SPEAKER_01: Which like it I get that they were probably trying to make it a bit more simple, but with how many like creatures and gods and everything there were already, changing something that big that big is more damaging, I think.
17:12
SPEAKER_04: At least in terms of mechanics.
17:13
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, in terms of mechanics, especially if it's like longtime players.
17:17
SPEAKER_01: Now, people that first started in fourth edition playing, they would have no idea, so it makes sense to them.
17:22
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
17:22
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
17:23
SPEAKER_01: But anyone that has a mindset of something other than it just is completely fucked.
17:29
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
17:29
SPEAKER_02: So uh Bahamut is a popular god in society at large, with many prying to him for protection and kings being crowned in his name.
17:37
SPEAKER_02: Oh.
17:38
SPEAKER_02: Uh his symbol has also been changed to that of a blue shield with a platinum colored dragon head in profile.
17:45
SPEAKER_02: Which like makes sense.
17:47
SPEAKER_01: So but I don't like it as much as remind me again what was the symbol prior.
17:53
SPEAKER_02: Um, it was Polaris um in front of like a Milky Way.
17:57
SPEAKER_02: That's right.
17:58
SPEAKER_02: Uh, it's like that's right, it's such a good look.
18:01
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I like it.
18:02
SPEAKER_02: The the new one, like, it makes sense.
18:05
SPEAKER_02: But that doesn't mean you have to like it.
18:06
SPEAKER_02: But and it's like he's the platinum dragon.
18:09
SPEAKER_02: So his sigil is a platinum dragon.
18:12
SPEAKER_02: Groundbreaking.
18:14
SPEAKER_02: Like, sorry.
18:16
SPEAKER_02: No.
18:16
SPEAKER_02: With uh with a blue shield.
18:18
SPEAKER_02: Oh, okay, excuse me.
18:19
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
18:20
SPEAKER_02: And I like that it was it was Polaris because he was also referred to as the king of the north wind and stuff, so it's like very it's very poetic.
18:29
SPEAKER_03: I I mean I I liked it better, but whatever.
18:32
SPEAKER_02: Gotta make it simple, I suppose.
18:34
SPEAKER_02: Um, so as described in the Dungeon Master's Guide for Fourth Edition, which was published in 2008, uh, Bohamet lives in and as of this point seems to be kind of the head honcho of Celestia, which is in the Astral Sea, as are like the other, you know.
18:51
SPEAKER_04: All of those fun spots.
18:53
SPEAKER_02: All of the all of those kind of like outer planesy type spots.
18:57
SPEAKER_02: So Draconomica and Metallic Dragons, which was published in 2009, uh expands a lot on various aspects of Bahamuth's character, as well as introduces his uh like formally introduces his associates, slash slash exarchs, slash consorts, apparently.
19:18
SPEAKER_02: That's that's just a reminder.
19:20
SPEAKER_02: Canaries.
19:21
SPEAKER_02: Bahama Fucks slash canaries, whatever.
19:23
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
19:24
SPEAKER_02: Um, so this book bestows Bahamut the title of the grandfather of dragons and leans very heavily on the figure of the old man with the canaries that I mentioned last episode, which was kind of his a very like favored guise of his that he would transform into to wander the prime.
19:45
SPEAKER_01: Right.
19:45
SPEAKER_01: That was his like manifestation.
19:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
19:48
SPEAKER_01: I I was about to question the grandfather part until you mentioned that, and I was like, oh, okay.
19:54
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
19:54
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
19:55
SPEAKER_02: Oh, well, there's there's there's more to that.
19:58
SPEAKER_02: So uh it said in this form, uh Bahama seems to wander the world aimlessly, but is actually somewhat philosophically assessing the quote worthiness of various things.
20:13
SPEAKER_04: The worthiness?
20:14
SPEAKER_02: Which I gotta say does not feel good.
20:17
SPEAKER_02: I get well, I I get what they're going for, which I'll explain in a minute.
20:21
SPEAKER_02: But that was another one of those moments like like Enlightened Justice where I read that and I literally rolled my eyes.
20:28
SPEAKER_02: I was alone in my apartment doing research and I rolled my eyes for no one in particular.
20:33
SPEAKER_02: Because I was like, really?
20:34
SPEAKER_01: I I don't know.
20:36
SPEAKER_01: That sounds to me like he's examining worthiness of like the world followers.
20:42
SPEAKER_01: Uh okay.
20:43
SPEAKER_01: Like people to become associates.
20:48
SPEAKER_04: Um, I mean, in the Or consorts, uh priests or whatever they're called.
20:53
SPEAKER_04: In the Dragonborn uh episode, the um Dragonborn were chosen one of the origins Dragonborn were chosen by Bahamut.
21:02
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
21:02
SPEAKER_02: So okay, that's which this is not this is not the case for them anymore in fourth edition, but that was uh Dragonborn's Holstees in like third edition.
21:11
SPEAKER_02: So it could be left over from that.
21:14
SPEAKER_02: So um as a god who's yeah, yeah, I mean I was just taking a guess to see if I got it, but and I just needed to stop and comment on how I felt like it was pretentious because you know, this is the god of the paladins episode.
21:29
SPEAKER_02: So um, so as a god who prefers to support or inspire others to reject evil and spread goodness, uh, he doesn't want to simply command every situation with his immense powers.
21:42
SPEAKER_03: Just a friendly reminder, he has immense power.
21:46
SPEAKER_03: I mean, he does.
21:46
SPEAKER_02: He got the thing.
21:47
SPEAKER_02: At this point, at this point, he really has been elevated very, very high, you know, on the level of of you know, some other very popular deities.
21:58
SPEAKER_02: He's not really, he's not a minor deity.
22:00
SPEAKER_02: Anymore.
22:01
SPEAKER_02: So that glow up.
22:03
SPEAKER_02: That glow up though.
22:05
SPEAKER_02: So um instead of you know taking that very direct approach, um, he likes to examine the worthiness, particularly of those who follow or fight alongside him.
22:14
SPEAKER_02: So yes, part of it is Okay, so warriors and followers, yeah.
22:20
SPEAKER_02: Consorts and what have you.
22:22
SPEAKER_02: Consorts, apparently.
22:24
SPEAKER_02: So uh, you know, and that's not just like searching out new ones, it's also testing his current ones.
22:31
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
22:31
SPEAKER_02: Uh another Which he sometimes likes to do.
22:36
SPEAKER_02: Uh he sometimes likes to test the mighty of his followers in combat.
22:41
SPEAKER_02: Oh my god.
22:42
SPEAKER_01: Beautiful.
22:43
SPEAKER_02: Though he will never attack a bloodied foe, and whenever he kind of goes on tour, tour.
22:50
SPEAKER_02: That was the first word that came to mind.
22:52
SPEAKER_02: To do this, he like has a healer like there.
22:55
SPEAKER_02: So he's not gonna go and kill one of his followers.
22:58
SPEAKER_03: Probably a good good idea.
23:00
SPEAKER_01: I mean, you guys, since you know you have played DD with me for years now, know that I am personally a fan of like one-on-one combat scenarios.
23:09
SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah.
23:10
SPEAKER_01: And of testing how strong like a given scenario or play is.
23:16
SPEAKER_02: So here's Bahamut for your one-on-one combat scenario.
23:19
SPEAKER_02: Oh my god.
23:21
SPEAKER_02: Okay, but also for the perspective of that follower, could you imagine how hysterical it would be that like you know, you you worship this this god, you devote your entire life to him, and then he just shows up to your temple one day and is like, hey, fight me.
23:36
SPEAKER_02: Fight me.
23:38
SPEAKER_01: I mean, on one hand, I would be like, I don't know.
23:43
SPEAKER_01: But on the other hand, it's like if you are that devout of a follower, you're probably gonna be like, Sure, yes, yes, whatever you want, sir.
23:50
SPEAKER_04: I do is you tell me a man.
23:54
SPEAKER_04: I guess.
23:55
SPEAKER_03: But like your god What if I kick so they kick my God's ass?
23:58
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, like you're about to die.
24:00
SPEAKER_01: We salute you.
24:02
SPEAKER_02: But like liter, especially also given that like a lot of his followers are dragons.
24:07
SPEAKER_02: Like, imagine how like explosive that fight.
24:10
SPEAKER_02: Oh my god.
24:12
SPEAKER_02: Literally, like, yeah, literally.
24:14
SPEAKER_01: That would be so epic though.
24:16
SPEAKER_02: You're like, how much of a mindfuck would that be?
24:18
SPEAKER_02: Your god just shows up at your doorstep and is like, hey, I'm here to fight.
24:24
SPEAKER_04: Just no, there's there's nothing I can add to that to make it any better.
24:29
SPEAKER_04: I mean, is it's pretty choice.
24:32
SPEAKER_01: It is pretty choice.
24:33
SPEAKER_02: So um, in this book, uh chromatic what not wow the other thing.
24:38
SPEAKER_02: Chromatic, not dragons.
24:39
SPEAKER_04: Chromatic not dragons.
24:41
SPEAKER_04: Not chromatic dragons.
24:42
SPEAKER_02: Uh metallic that that is the title of the book, actually.
24:44
SPEAKER_02: Not metallic or not chromatic dragons published in 2009.
24:50
SPEAKER_02: No, it's from Metallic Dragons.
24:52
SPEAKER_02: It said that seven ancient metallic dragons advise Bahamut and act as a jury for evildoers brought before him.
24:59
SPEAKER_02: But it it seems to me, based on like that these existed in different paragraphs, um, and and for a few other reasons, that these uh advisors are not his canaries, if you will.
25:14
SPEAKER_02: Um the golden worms are described as all gold rather than simply metallic, right?
25:21
SPEAKER_02: And are described as Bahamas' greatest servants and guards, not in the capacity that these seven metallic dragons are being described in.
25:30
SPEAKER_02: So I think they represent two different groups of dragons, and Bahama just likes the number seven.
25:36
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that makes sense.
25:37
SPEAKER_01: I mean, yeah.
25:38
SPEAKER_01: That it's a pretty good number, so I can see I can I can see how that kind of makes sense given the wording of it.
25:46
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
25:46
SPEAKER_02: Um, so unlike Sardior, who transforms a dragon into an archetype, uh, these great worms are individuals who have been brought into Bahamut's inner circle to replace a former member who died.
25:59
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
26:00
SPEAKER_02: So they're not, you know, they don't get they don't get promoted and then, you know, turned into essentially this other person.
26:08
SPEAKER_02: That I mean Which I mean was was kind of cool, but also like kind of kind of weird.
26:14
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
26:15
SPEAKER_02: Kind of kind of unsettling.
26:16
SPEAKER_04: Kind of reminds me of the uh the Modrins of the Primarch.
26:20
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, exactly.
26:21
SPEAKER_02: Or not the Primarch, the Prime Prime Primus.
26:23
SPEAKER_02: Primus.
26:24
SPEAKER_01: Dude, the Modrins were so fucking just fucky.
26:27
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
26:28
SPEAKER_02: So, um, we have we have now officially landed at the point I've been mentioning them for, you know, an episode and a half now.
26:37
SPEAKER_02: So we finally reached the point where we're actually going to introduce and talk a little bit about each of Bahamut's Exarch's Canaries, sometimes consorts.
26:48
SPEAKER_04: Ah.
26:52
SPEAKER_01: You know, we should have known because she said halfway through.
26:55
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
26:56
SPEAKER_02: Like I was I was.
26:57
SPEAKER_02: You were like, you were leading us on too.
26:59
SPEAKER_02: I I regretted framing it that way because I thought it was making it too obvious, but apparently not.
27:04
SPEAKER_02: And slow.
27:05
SPEAKER_01: Same.
27:05
SPEAKER_02: Same.
27:06
SPEAKER_02: Alright.
27:06
SPEAKER_02: To the break.
27:09
SPEAKER_02: Hey everybody.
27:10
SPEAKER_02: Thank you for checking out Bahamut Part 2.
27:13
SPEAKER_02: Woo woo.
27:14
SPEAKER_02: More platinum.
27:15
SPEAKER_02: More lawful.
27:16
SPEAKER_02: Just as much hole monitor?
27:18
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
27:18
SPEAKER_02: Too fast, too lawful.
27:20
SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
27:21
SPEAKER_02: Two dragons.
27:23
SPEAKER_02: Two dragon.
27:24
SPEAKER_02: No.
27:24
SPEAKER_02: No such thing as two dragons.
27:25
SPEAKER_02: No such thing as two dragons.
27:26
SPEAKER_02: No such thing.
27:27
SPEAKER_02: Two dragons.
27:31
SPEAKER_02: Anyway.
27:32
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27:39
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27:44
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27:45
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27:47
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27:49
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27:50
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27:51
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28:03
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28:04
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28:05
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28:07
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28:07
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28:12
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28:15
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28:17
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28:25
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28:28
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28:29
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28:30
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28:32
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28:33
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28:34
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28:37
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28:42
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28:43
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28:44
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28:46
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28:47
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28:48
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28:54
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28:55
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28:59
SPEAKER_04: As mentioned in the episode, Lewin has a bibliography that actually correlates to this episode, which you can find on our$5 tier.
29:08
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29:09
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29:09
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29:12
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29:14
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29:34
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29:36
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29:43
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29:45
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30:11
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30:16
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30:28
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30:32
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30:34
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30:40
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30:51
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30:58
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30:59
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31:01
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31:02
unknown: Woo!
31:03
SPEAKER_01: Um, a big thank you to Alexander Nakarada for our theme song Blacksmith.
31:08
SPEAKER_01: Also better than Christmas music.
31:10
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
31:11
SPEAKER_04: But Blacksmith's better than a lot of things.
31:13
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31:14
SPEAKER_04: And with that, let's get back to the podcast.
31:17
SPEAKER_02: Back to Bahamut.
31:18
SPEAKER_02: Back to the Canaries.
31:20
SPEAKER_02: Back.
31:20
SPEAKER_02: Back to the Canaries.
31:21
SPEAKER_04: Back in platinum.
31:27
SPEAKER_01: So consorts, assistants, people's whatever whatever we're calling them now, whatever they are.
31:36
SPEAKER_01: Whatever we want to call them.
31:37
SPEAKER_01: Let's go.
31:37
SPEAKER_02: Um so these are the these are going to be listed in no particular order because it doesn't seem like there is a specific hierarchy among them.
31:47
SPEAKER_02: Which there wasn't strictly for um like Sardior's exarch, but there was definitely a there were you know some that were slightly less powerful than others.
31:57
SPEAKER_01: So I mean it kind of makes sense because I kind of see Bahamut's whole thing as sort of like King R3 round table, nobody no one outranks each other.
32:06
SPEAKER_01: That's a big table.
32:08
SPEAKER_02: It would be because they're all cold dragons.
32:13
SPEAKER_02: Um so and also, wouldn't you know it?
32:16
SPEAKER_02: There's no like stat block or any kind of special thing for these characters.
32:22
SPEAKER_02: Of course.
32:24
SPEAKER_02: Which I mean, I guess I kind of prefer the fact that they actually talk about them in dedicated like lore sections as opposed to just giving them a stat block and calling it a day.
32:34
SPEAKER_02: Fair.
32:34
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's fair.
32:36
SPEAKER_02: But I would have preferred both.
32:38
SPEAKER_02: Anyway.
32:39
SPEAKER_01: I mean, there definitely should have been stat blocks, though, because there's a chance that you have to use all of these in a fight.
32:45
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
32:45
SPEAKER_02: I at least I don't think I don't think there were.
32:48
SPEAKER_02: I don't believe there were, but if I had come across them, they didn't have any information that I felt was relevant to include here.
32:55
SPEAKER_02: So I guess if you need one of them, just make a really souped-up gold dragon that can turn into a bird.
33:01
SPEAKER_02: So um so first we have Borcad the Claw.
33:06
SPEAKER_01: Beautiful.
33:07
SPEAKER_02: Who is Bahamut's hand of justice who both chronicles and enforces the law.
33:12
SPEAKER_02: So even though he like his name is Borcad the Claw, but he's actually like a point dexter.
33:18
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
33:19
SPEAKER_01: Like a like a pencil pusher.
33:21
SPEAKER_01: But he is the claw because he does all the writing.
33:24
SPEAKER_02: Oh shit.
33:26
SPEAKER_02: Oh, you're right.
33:27
SPEAKER_02: I guess I looked at claw and immediately thought, like, you know, like a very combat oriented character.
33:34
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
33:34
SPEAKER_02: I mean he enforces the law too.
33:35
SPEAKER_02: So he can throw down.
33:37
SPEAKER_04: You can throw down.
33:38
SPEAKER_02: So it's both.
33:39
SPEAKER_02: Um we have Kuria the Eye, uh, who is an aloof suspicious dragon who carries out her tasks in secrecy.
33:48
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I know.
33:49
SPEAKER_02: I know.
33:49
SPEAKER_01: An aloof suspicious dragon.
33:52
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
33:53
SPEAKER_02: Hey, I mean, you know, you're s if you're gonna have a spy master.
33:57
SPEAKER_02: Uh why not make it a dragon?
33:59
SPEAKER_02: Who's aloof and suspicious?
34:02
SPEAKER_01: I feel like the aloof part might be good.
34:04
SPEAKER_01: The suspicious part I don't know about.
34:07
SPEAKER_01: I mean if they're supposed to be like secret and everything.
34:11
SPEAKER_04: I think suspicious means like they're suspicious of everyone around them.
34:15
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
34:15
SPEAKER_01: As opposed to um they act suspicious.
34:18
SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
34:19
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
34:19
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
34:19
SPEAKER_01: That makes more sense.
34:20
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
34:20
SPEAKER_04: No.
34:21
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
34:21
SPEAKER_01: Got it.
34:22
SPEAKER_02: Is that I mean, that was my take.
34:24
SPEAKER_02: Well, no, I'm saying like the specifically the like dictionary definition of the word suspicious.
34:30
SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
34:30
SPEAKER_02: Um, it it can be used either way.
34:33
SPEAKER_02: It can, okay, I thought so.
34:35
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like you're acting very suspicious, or I'm just a suspicious person.
34:39
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, of that, whatever.
34:41
SPEAKER_02: So next we have Songrad the Wing, who is a swift dragon with powerful wings who serves as Bahamut's messenger and is the most commonly seen of Bahamut's inner circle because she's always kind of going places and doing things and um zipping in and out.
34:58
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it was also noted that she has a tendency to like, you know, after a mission, she'll just kind of go out and like explore, which I think is cute.
35:08
SPEAKER_04: That's pretty cute.
35:09
SPEAKER_02: So she's the one that most people would see if they saw a single one of them.
35:14
SPEAKER_01: I I like it.
35:15
SPEAKER_01: I also like the name Songred.
35:18
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
35:18
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
35:18
SPEAKER_02: Um, next we have Gru Grimar the voice, who is Bahamut's master negotiator and is sent in to settle disputes nonviolently.
35:31
SPEAKER_02: So we probably get set out a lot because Bahamet doesn't really like doesn't really like violence.
35:36
SPEAKER_01: Prefers to stay away from the violence.
35:38
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
35:38
SPEAKER_01: And I guess if uh Grimar can't do it, then nobody can.
35:43
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
35:44
SPEAKER_02: Oh well if he can't if he can't do it non-violently, then Bahamut has people.
35:48
SPEAKER_02: Mohammed has people for violently.
35:50
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
35:51
SPEAKER_02: Uh yeah, he does.
35:53
SPEAKER_02: So next up, we have uh Marashak the Tale, uh, who is massive and merciless in combat, but has a genial personality and serves as the closest thing Bahamut has to a bodyguard.
36:08
unknown: Hmm.
36:09
SPEAKER_02: So he's just Bahamut's big, nice bodyguard.
36:12
SPEAKER_02: I kind of love it though.
36:14
SPEAKER_02: I do too.
36:14
SPEAKER_02: And also like, Bahamut doesn't need one.
36:17
SPEAKER_02: Bahamut does not need one.
36:18
SPEAKER_01: Bahamut literally doesn't need one, though.
36:20
SPEAKER_01: I just picture him like a bouncer sorted by just being like, no, please just walk around that way if you want to.
36:25
SPEAKER_01: Please don't oh god, okay.
36:28
SPEAKER_01: Not this again.
36:30
SPEAKER_01: Like I really don't want to have to hurt you, but have a nice day.
36:34
SPEAKER_02: I think that that that's so like it the idea is so funny though to me.
36:38
SPEAKER_02: To have a gentle giant bodyguard.
36:40
SPEAKER_02: Well, to specifically for like Bahamut to have a bodyguard.
36:44
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
36:45
SPEAKER_02: Because it's like what like for humans, like we're all on a relatively similar, like physical level.
36:52
SPEAKER_04: Like, yes, obviously, some of us are like a lot more advanced in that.
36:57
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
36:57
SPEAKER_04: We we all know somebody who's like buff as hell and could like beat us, beat the hell out of us, and we all know someone who's like weak as hell and could get beaten up by a fly.
37:08
SPEAKER_04: Loon and I are both playing at ourselves.
37:10
SPEAKER_02: So, like, but but humans are on such a similar physical level.
37:14
SPEAKER_02: I think the spectrum is not as wide as it is for dragons, dungeons, and dragons creatures.
37:20
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
37:21
SPEAKER_02: So it like it makes sense for us that we would have bodyguards for important people because it's like, you know, the chance that someone of a similar physical capability could, you know, go up and beat the crap out of that celebrity or whatever is not as very high.
37:38
SPEAKER_02: But like it's Bahamut.
37:39
SPEAKER_02: It's Bahamut.
37:41
SPEAKER_01: No one's gonna kill Bahamut.
37:43
SPEAKER_01: Let me remind you of this little tidbit though.
37:45
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
37:46
SPEAKER_01: Gods have died.
37:48
SPEAKER_02: I mean, this is true.
37:49
SPEAKER_02: You're not wrong.
37:50
SPEAKER_01: People have killed gods before.
37:52
SPEAKER_02: I mean, yeah, people kill gods in Dungeons and Dragons all the time.
37:56
SPEAKER_02: But I just feel like if someone was going to be able to outmatch Bahamut.
38:01
SPEAKER_02: He would just let them?
38:02
SPEAKER_02: Well, and I feel like if if someone was going to be able to outmatch Bahamut, his bodyguard wouldn't be able to stop them.
38:08
SPEAKER_01: Uh but see, then it would be better odds for the two against one.
38:11
SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah, I guess you're right.
38:13
SPEAKER_02: Maybe they're just maybe they're just friends.
38:15
SPEAKER_02: Maybe they're just friends, and Bahamut keeps them around for that because he can't really do anything else.
38:20
SPEAKER_02: They're just best friends.
38:21
SPEAKER_02: He's like, yeah, come on, let's go.
38:22
SPEAKER_02: Best best consorts.
38:23
SPEAKER_02: That's his favorite.
38:26
SPEAKER_04: I don't know if you're allowed to have favorites.
38:28
SPEAKER_04: Actually, you know he's Bahamut, he can do what he wants.
38:30
SPEAKER_02: Right?
38:31
SPEAKER_02: No, Bahamut actually doesn't have doesn't have favorites.
38:34
SPEAKER_02: He's too like high-minded, you know.
38:37
SPEAKER_02: I love all my consorts equally.
38:39
SPEAKER_02: And I love all my children equally.
38:41
SPEAKER_02: Um, kind of like how Ayo did, except he clearly didn't love Tiamat as much as you know.
38:47
SPEAKER_02: I don't care for Tiamat later that day.
38:50
SPEAKER_01: You know what?
38:51
SPEAKER_01: I changed my mind.
38:53
SPEAKER_02: So um next we have uh Tronaxia the presents, who is a magnificent dragon who bomb it sends to intimidate stubborn foes into submission with her majesty.
39:06
SPEAKER_01: She's not even a negotiator.
39:08
SPEAKER_01: She's just there to just be pretty and subdue them.
39:13
SPEAKER_02: You know, I would I would imagine that he that like or not um not that uh Grumar and Tana and Tronaxia get sent on uh like details together a lot.
39:23
SPEAKER_02: So Grumar's like actually negotiating with the people and Trenaxia is just kind of standing behind him looking tough, just like whatever.
39:35
SPEAKER_04: If you don't agree with him, you're gonna have to deal with me.
39:37
SPEAKER_02: She just has like a she just her presence just forces like rolls against intimidation, just whatever.
39:44
SPEAKER_02: And like the people are just like sweating bullets.
39:48
SPEAKER_02: Right.
39:49
SPEAKER_02: I mean, I would be too.
39:50
SPEAKER_02: She's a big old gold dragon.
39:52
SPEAKER_02: That's fair.
39:52
SPEAKER_02: That's fair.
39:53
SPEAKER_01: I love it.
39:54
SPEAKER_02: Um, and finally we have Ergala the Fang, who uh when Bahamut musters an army, she serves as the commander with her mastery of tactics.
40:04
SPEAKER_02: So that's there's your when things have to be handled violently.
40:08
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, person.
40:11
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
40:12
SPEAKER_01: Well, I guess her and uh uh Marashak.
40:16
SPEAKER_01: I mean, he's like Bahamut's personal bodyguard.
40:18
SPEAKER_01: Oh, well, yeah, that's true.
40:19
SPEAKER_01: I'd if you have a bodyguard, there's really no sense in sending them away because of a big battle.
40:25
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that kind of defeats the purpose of having the bodyguard, so never mind.
40:29
SPEAKER_02: So Bahamut has fewer exarchs, which I've been referring to um the uh canaries as his ex as exarchs, because they're sometimes called that in other editions, but which I should have said this earlier.
40:44
SPEAKER_02: But that's actually technically not correct in this iteration, because in this iteration, exarts exarchs are divine intermediaries, which they these are not, they're more like his actual, you know.
41:00
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
41:00
SPEAKER_02: Um, so Bahama has fewer uh, but I just think the word exarchs is cool.
41:05
SPEAKER_02: So um so in fourth edition, Bahamut has fewer exarchs than most deities, and the most prominent is Cayutha.
41:12
SPEAKER_02: Uh, I don't know if you guys because this was supposed to all be in uh the same episode, and it didn't end up being in the same episode because of my hubris, but Kayutha is the name of the bull from um Islamic mythology.
41:28
SPEAKER_02: Oh the one that is standing on Bahamut.
41:32
SPEAKER_02: Right.
41:34
SPEAKER_02: I think that was how that went.
41:35
SPEAKER_02: So Kiutha is one of the names, the most commonly used name of that bull.
41:41
SPEAKER_02: So they and I believe uh before this he did not appear in any other edition.
41:48
SPEAKER_02: So somebody did at least a modicum of research and was like, hey, you know what would be cool is if we is if we put this reference to mythology in there.
41:57
SPEAKER_02: And they were right.
41:58
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so someone did the research.
42:01
SPEAKER_02: Um so Keutha is the last and greatest paladin of the dragonborn nation of Arkosia.
42:10
SPEAKER_02: It's all coming together.
42:12
SPEAKER_02: So, in recognition of his commitment to uh protecting his fellow Arkosians after the fall of their empire, Bahamut granted Keyutha a piece of his divine spark, and now he serves as an intermar an intermediary between uh Bahamut and all dragonborn kind.
42:31
SPEAKER_02: Damn.
42:32
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
42:32
SPEAKER_02: Damn talk about a promotion.
42:34
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so he's uh he's an important dude.
42:36
SPEAKER_01: You got a piece of the divine spark, right?
42:39
SPEAKER_01: Impressive.
42:40
SPEAKER_02: So um the note earlier that I mentioned about Bahamut being the grandfather and not father of Metallic Dragons ties to the concept of discorporation, which I don't think is something we've really talked about much, and it actually um relates to what we were just talking about about gods dying.
42:59
SPEAKER_02: Uh discorporation is a concept in fourth edition where when a deity becomes bloodied, uh, which means their HP's halved, right?
43:08
SPEAKER_02: Um, their mind leaves their physical body and they are unable to take a physical form for a time.
43:15
SPEAKER_02: So if I'm understanding it correctly, uh discorporation protects them from being killed in a similar avatar state.
43:22
SPEAKER_02: I'm sorry.
43:23
SPEAKER_02: I couldn't help it.
43:25
SPEAKER_02: We had to get we had to get it in here somewhere.
43:27
SPEAKER_02: The reference is that.
43:29
SPEAKER_02: Legally, we are required to.
43:31
SPEAKER_02: It's true.
43:32
SPEAKER_02: So if I'm understanding it correctly, it protects them from dying in a similar way to like a vampire turning into a gaseous form and going back to their coffin.
43:43
SPEAKER_02: Right.
43:43
SPEAKER_02: Or a Lich retreating into their phylactery.
43:47
SPEAKER_02: So, you know, it's kind of maybe inconvenient in that moment, because then you can't do anything.
43:53
SPEAKER_02: Well, and you can't settle that combat situation you were in, but at least you don't die.
43:58
SPEAKER_02: You know.
43:59
SPEAKER_02: Um So discorporation leaves the deity's power weakened for a time that can take anywhere from weeks to years.
44:09
SPEAKER_02: Because I mean ideally as a deity, you're not supposed to get bloody.
44:13
SPEAKER_02: Right.
44:14
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean You're you're maybe you're maybe not supposed to be getting in fights.
44:20
SPEAKER_02: You know?
44:20
SPEAKER_02: Whatever.
44:22
SPEAKER_02: Um you have people for that.
44:24
SPEAKER_02: Um so in order to kill a deity, specific measures must be taken to either prevent them from discorporating or to find measures to be able to kill them after they have done so.
44:36
SPEAKER_02: So I believe I mean that that's a concept that I have really only seen the name Discorporation used for in fourth edition.
44:42
SPEAKER_02: So I'm assuming it doesn't really translate into any other edition.
44:46
SPEAKER_02: Well, yeah, like it doesn't have much of a place in other editions, but the idea is that it's harder to kill gods than normal people.
44:55
SPEAKER_02: So because of Discorporation.
44:57
SPEAKER_02: So this ties back to Bahamut's reputation as the grandfather of dragons because it is rumored that Bahamut had a son who rebelled against his father for an unknown reason.
45:09
SPEAKER_02: Oh.
45:09
SPEAKER_02: Um, the idea is that the son could challenge his father in battle and actually kill him, uh, claiming his birthright and replacing his father as a god.
45:19
SPEAKER_02: Um, despite the best effort of those who would see Bahamut brought down, including but not limited to Tiamat, uh, no one has been able to discern the name or location of this child.
45:30
SPEAKER_02: If he even exists.
45:32
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
45:33
SPEAKER_02: And and like, and that's that's it.
45:35
SPEAKER_02: There's no nothing else about this potential son.
45:39
SPEAKER_02: I mean, I guess Bahamut fucks, I guess, more and makes babies.
45:47
SPEAKER_02: I I guess.
45:48
SPEAKER_01: Hmm.
45:49
SPEAKER_01: So I mean that could have just been a little tidbit thrown in for like DMs to take a path that way if they're.
45:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I was just thinking the same thing.
46:00
SPEAKER_01: Like, that's kind of like the big bad at the end of it all if they have like a like a paladin-centric.
46:06
SPEAKER_02: Oh, or it's like um, like um like a uh a um like an antichrist situation where it's like this kid's supposed to go and do this really evil thing, but then like they're a nice kid.
46:19
SPEAKER_02: You know?
46:19
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
46:20
SPEAKER_01: Hmm.
46:21
SPEAKER_01: Interesting that they decide to throw that in there though.
46:24
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
46:24
SPEAKER_02: Like it's like, hey, no context.
46:26
SPEAKER_02: Bahama has a kid, baby?
46:28
SPEAKER_02: Question mark.
46:29
SPEAKER_01: Possibly.
46:30
SPEAKER_01: Who knows?
46:31
SPEAKER_02: Do with that what you will.
46:32
SPEAKER_02: Oh man, could you imagine if he had like a baby with one of his um his like exarchs or something?
46:37
SPEAKER_02: That's well by exarchs I mean the the seven.
46:41
SPEAKER_02: Right.
46:42
SPEAKER_02: That would be a powerful fucking baby.
46:45
SPEAKER_02: Oh.
46:46
SPEAKER_02: Oh, anyway.
46:48
SPEAKER_02: Um, this is the white gold dragon.
46:50
SPEAKER_02: Oh god.
46:51
SPEAKER_02: Because this is a platinum and then gold.
46:53
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
46:54
SPEAKER_02: So uh next, uh, we are going back to oh actually, one more thing in fourth edition.
47:01
SPEAKER_02: Um, I did not include anything from this because it was not especially pertinent to the kind of overarching picture of Bahamut.
47:11
SPEAKER_02: Right.
47:12
SPEAKER_02: But um some good, I would say, bonus reading if you want that extra credit.
47:18
SPEAKER_02: If you're if you maybe want to beef up your uh beef up your your GPA.
47:23
SPEAKER_02: Um in Dragon Magazine issue number 378 in the articles Channel Divinity Bahamut and Deities and Demigods Bahamut, both written by Robert J.
47:33
SPEAKER_02: Schwab, who I have mentioned before.
47:36
SPEAKER_02: Right.
47:36
SPEAKER_02: Um, they both take a pretty good look, not so much as at Bahamut himself, but kind of at the um consequences of like his worship in the world, basically.
47:51
SPEAKER_02: One of them was an article about this uh fanatical sect of Bahamut that basically they they were given as an example of like you could include this if you want to have maybe like this really you know lawful good deity and all this, but then he has some worshippers who take it too far.
48:10
SPEAKER_02: Kind of thing, which was is very interesting, very good read.
48:14
SPEAKER_02: Just not I I had 10 and a half pages of notes.
48:17
SPEAKER_02: No, yeah, you know fair.
48:19
SPEAKER_02: So I would check those articles out if you maybe want a little bit of um kind of kind of really world buildy stuff to do.
48:26
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, especially if you're like a DM and like the idea of including Bahamut has started to appeal to you.
48:31
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
48:34
SPEAKER_01: We both looked at Travis.
48:36
SPEAKER_01: Wait, sorry, what?
48:37
SPEAKER_04: I said, especially if you're a DM and the idea of including Bahamut in the in your campaign has started to appeal to you.
48:44
SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
48:45
SPEAKER_01: That would actually be a very useful um tool.
48:49
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
48:50
SPEAKER_01: Tool.
48:50
SPEAKER_01: I was trying to think.
48:51
SPEAKER_01: Article.
48:52
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
48:52
SPEAKER_01: There um very useful articles to read for that specific reason.
48:55
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and there there are some there are some DMs who you know would would feel the same way about including Bahamut.
49:02
SPEAKER_02: Um, so in fifth edition, we're in fifth edition.
49:07
SPEAKER_02: Yay! We're back home.
49:10
SPEAKER_02: So Bahamut impires in core fifth edition as part of the core pantheon, despite having his roots as a racial god.
49:18
SPEAKER_02: So he's like, he's really made it, you know.
49:20
SPEAKER_02: I'm so proud of him.
49:21
SPEAKER_02: I really promoted.
49:23
SPEAKER_02: I really am.
49:24
SPEAKER_02: Like first he was like, maybe he's a god, and then it was like, okay, he's a lesser deity, and then he's a greater deity, and now he's just like one of the core.
49:34
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
49:35
SPEAKER_02: I'm so proud of him.
49:38
SPEAKER_04: He he did such a good job.
49:39
SPEAKER_02: Yep.
49:42
SPEAKER_02: You're doing amazing, sweetie.
49:44
SPEAKER_02: Anyway, it's just Io.
49:46
SPEAKER_02: So taken from the Dungeon Masters Guide, which was published in 2014.
49:51
SPEAKER_02: God, that was not not that long ago, and yet so long ago.
49:55
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
49:56
SPEAKER_02: That was the year that was the year Taylor and I graduated high school.
49:59
SPEAKER_02: Um and it it was weirdly so long ago, but also not.
50:04
SPEAKER_02: So uh Bahamut is a lawful good deity, still going strong.
50:11
SPEAKER_02: Um, and he has suggested domains in life and war and a symbol of a silver color, well, I mean silver-colored, you know, dragon in profile facing the left.
50:24
SPEAKER_02: Same fucking boring one from fourth edition, whatever.
50:27
SPEAKER_02: Minus the blue shield this time.
50:29
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
50:30
SPEAKER_02: Um, it might have been on a blue shield.
50:32
SPEAKER_02: I might have just forgotten to write that in.
50:33
SPEAKER_04: It's okay.
50:35
SPEAKER_02: But you know, because it might not show up too well on the you know, the white, so gotta have that color color variance.
50:41
SPEAKER_02: So there's quite a bit more to um Bahamut.
50:45
SPEAKER_02: Okay, the reason that I made that really ham-fisted DM comment a minute ago is because we are going to, I believe, for the first time, take a look at the Explorer's Guide to Wild Mount.
50:55
SPEAKER_02: Oh.
50:56
SPEAKER_02: Which was published in 2020, which I hadn't thought about that being Canon DD stuff.
51:03
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
51:04
SPEAKER_02: Until I was looking at this and I was like, oh shit.
51:06
SPEAKER_02: That is legit canon.
51:08
SPEAKER_04: Anyone listening not in the know, um, the Explorers, it's called the Explorer's Guide to Wild Mount, right?
51:14
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
51:14
SPEAKER_04: Um, is a um edition, a module for fifth edition DD that was implemented in this year, this past year?
51:25
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
51:26
SPEAKER_04: Um it is written by Matthew Mercer and follows his critical role campaign settings.
51:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I can talk about critical role.
51:35
SPEAKER_01: The first campaign setting that has been added canonically to DD since Eberon.
51:43
SPEAKER_01: Eberon.
51:44
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
51:45
SPEAKER_04: Which we loved Eberon.
51:47
SPEAKER_04: We still love Eberron.
51:48
SPEAKER_04: We're so glad that Anthony uh turned us on to it.
51:52
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
51:52
SPEAKER_04: We love Critical Role.
51:53
SPEAKER_04: And uh we love Critical Role, so it's all just really exciting.
51:57
SPEAKER_01: And we are just starting to get a taste of like the Wild Mount campaign setting as canon.
52:03
SPEAKER_02: So also, it's so weird to say that was published in 2020.
52:07
SPEAKER_04: Like we do a DD lore and history podcast, and we're talking about this year.
52:14
SPEAKER_01: Oh god.
52:15
SPEAKER_01: Congratulations, Matt.
52:16
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, honestly.
52:17
SPEAKER_02: So, um, Bahamut is one of the only gods whose worship is permitted in the prominent Dwendalian Empire, which I've only seen like 20.
52:28
SPEAKER_02: No, I've seen more than that.
52:29
SPEAKER_02: I've only seen like probably the first 30 to 40 episodes of campaign two, but that's kind of like one of the like prominent nature empires.
52:39
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, like a lot of shit happens there.
52:41
SPEAKER_02: Um so as in many other iterations, he is especially important to paladins and is revered by most metallic dragons.
52:50
SPEAKER_02: Uh Bahamut is an example of justice and nobility with tenets as follows Stand is a paragon of honor and justice.
52:58
SPEAKER_02: Smite evil wherever it is found, yet show compassion to those who have strayed from the path of righteousness, defend the weak, bring freedom to the persecuted, and protect the ideals of justice and order.
53:10
SPEAKER_02: Which to me seems like six or seven tenants, but whatever.
53:14
SPEAKER_04: You merge them together, you you get the number.
53:18
SPEAKER_04: I guess.
53:18
SPEAKER_02: Also, the phrasing strayed from the path of righteousness just makes me think of that bit from The Emperor's New Groove.
53:24
SPEAKER_02: Oh my god.
53:25
SPEAKER_02: Or the devil on Cronk's shoulders like he's trying to lead you down the path of righteousness.
53:29
SPEAKER_02: Oh my god.
53:29
SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna lead you down the path that rocks.
53:32
SPEAKER_02: That's like Bahama versus That's like my inner Bahama versus Tiamat.
53:38
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god.
53:40
SPEAKER_02: Oh my god, yes.
53:41
SPEAKER_02: And that's why on that's why I got one vote for being our most lawful co-host.
53:46
SPEAKER_02: So uh his image is shown in many halls of governments and judiciaries, uh, invoking his will in matters of justice.
53:55
SPEAKER_02: When not traversing the outer plains, he lives in his opulent castle on Mount Celestia.
54:00
SPEAKER_02: He also has a holy day known as Embertide, celebrated on the fifth day of Dusgar, which I don't know what that is.
54:08
SPEAKER_02: I don't know when that is.
54:09
SPEAKER_02: I'm sorry, Matt.
54:11
SPEAKER_02: Uh, to honor the lives of those that have fallen in defense of others.
54:15
SPEAKER_02: So it's kind of a like a like a somber holiday, if you will.
54:20
SPEAKER_02: It's a little more, a little more serious.
54:23
SPEAKER_02: But yeah, that's Bahamut.
54:25
SPEAKER_02: Actually.
54:26
SPEAKER_01: That seems kind of like a veterans day sort of thing.
54:29
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
54:30
SPEAKER_04: I was thinking about it um as we were talking about critical role, and I actually have some information to share about Bahamut in Eberron if you're interested.
54:40
SPEAKER_02: Oh yeah, I would love that, because I did not Bahamut is actually in Eberon.
54:45
SPEAKER_02: He doesn't play a very large role, but he is uh He doesn't play a critical role, if you will.
54:52
SPEAKER_02: Anyway, moving on.
54:53
SPEAKER_02: I didn't really like that one.
54:55
SPEAKER_04: He's um I liked it.
54:58
SPEAKER_04: He's one of the uh gods in the draconic religion, as you might you all might remember from the Eberon episodes if you listen to that.
55:06
SPEAKER_04: Eberon is a setting that is uh predominantly built around dragons.
55:11
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
55:11
SPEAKER_01: Um very dragon-heavy.
55:14
SPEAKER_04: But the primary dragons in that one are um Ebron, Kyber, and um the other one.
55:21
SPEAKER_04: Oh my god, what's the one that died?
55:23
SPEAKER_01: The other one that no one remembers.
55:25
SPEAKER_01: The other one.
55:25
SPEAKER_02: No one remembers them because they're dead.
55:27
SPEAKER_02: Cyberus.
55:28
SPEAKER_04: Cyberus, yeah.
55:30
SPEAKER_04: Cyberus.
55:31
SPEAKER_04: Um that he is one of the chief um dragon gods of that religion.
55:39
SPEAKER_04: And he is actually a constellation in the night sky.
55:43
SPEAKER_04: Oh, that's nice.
55:44
SPEAKER_02: I just wanted to share that with y'all.
55:45
SPEAKER_02: Oh, I like that.
55:46
SPEAKER_02: And that I feel like that oh, that reminds me of of um wow, his um how his old symbol was was Polaris in the in the night sky.
55:59
SPEAKER_02: That's like that's nice.
56:01
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
56:01
SPEAKER_04: Oh.
56:02
SPEAKER_04: It it is it is really kind of like full circle, I guess, in terms of like yeah.
56:08
SPEAKER_04: Obviously, the focus is taken off of Bahamut and Tiamat, because Tiamat's also in Eberon as a similar like child of chaos sort of thing.
56:16
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
56:17
SPEAKER_04: It it the focus is taken off them, but the um the key facts are still there.
56:21
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
56:22
SPEAKER_02: I think that's um well see now I feel like because I had I didn't know he was in Everton.
56:27
SPEAKER_02: It's a very minor.
56:28
SPEAKER_02: And I also I might I kind of might not have looked there because I think in my mind I was kind of like no dragon.
56:35
SPEAKER_02: They have their whole their whole own dragon situation, whatever.
56:41
SPEAKER_02: So anyway, that's Muhammad.
56:43
SPEAKER_02: Ooh.
56:44
SPEAKER_02: The Platinum Hall monitor himself.
56:47
SPEAKER_01: And that ends Lewin's suffering about talking about the lawful good dragon.
56:53
SPEAKER_02: You know, it's that it was tempered by the fact that he's kind of cool.
56:59
SPEAKER_02: He's kind of cool, and you know, that that I, you know, got to talk about dragons.
57:05
SPEAKER_02: Dragons.
57:06
SPEAKER_04: And also that you won for least lawful.
57:09
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
57:10
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
57:10
SPEAKER_04: So you are the least like Bahamut out of any of us.
57:14
SPEAKER_01: So congratulations.
57:16
SPEAKER_03: Yay! I like I don't know what I won, but I mean, least lawful.
57:22
SPEAKER_01: Well, then the knowledge of knowing that you are also considered chaotic by our listeners.
57:27
SPEAKER_02: Oh, okay.
57:28
SPEAKER_02: I mean, I would also like a physical prize too, but you know, whatever.
57:33
SPEAKER_01: We don't have one of those.
57:34
SPEAKER_02: But yeah, I feel I I feel good having having finished talking about the the three major, well, two of them are major.
57:43
SPEAKER_02: Um, porsardior, uh, dragon uh gods in Dungeons and Dragons, the representatives of chromatic and metallic dragons, and also I guess uh gem dragons are there sometimes.
57:57
SPEAKER_02: It's true.
57:58
SPEAKER_02: Porsardior.
57:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, sordior kind of got shafted on that one.
58:02
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, maybe now I can do something that's not dragons.
58:06
SPEAKER_02: Probably.
58:06
SPEAKER_01: No, why would I do that?
58:08
SPEAKER_01: We have email suggestions.
58:10
SPEAKER_04: We do, we have quite a few of them.
58:11
SPEAKER_04: Yes, and if you would like to suggest anything additional, you can send us an email at dungeonpedia.podcast at gmail.com.
58:19
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you can also tell your friends who like dragons.
58:23
SPEAKER_02: That's always nice.
58:24
SPEAKER_02: Tell your family who likes dragons.
58:26
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
58:26
SPEAKER_04: Because someone's gotta have one.
58:29
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
58:29
SPEAKER_02: And if you I mean, you should.
58:32
SPEAKER_02: If you don't, I'm sorry.
58:33
SPEAKER_02: Uh you can also follow us on our social media platforms.
58:37
SPEAKER_01: Especially if you want to take part in any more random polls that we just want to do.
58:41
SPEAKER_01: Random shit.
58:42
SPEAKER_03: Random shenanigans that don't matter, but we still enjoy the outcomes of.
58:46
SPEAKER_03: Hey, that's that's what matters.
58:48
SPEAKER_04: This is true.
58:49
SPEAKER_04: But thank you guys once again for listening.
58:52
SPEAKER_04: And we'll catch you next week with a non-dragon topic right here on Dungeon Pedia.
58:58
SPEAKER_04: I mean, maybe it could be a dragon topic.
59:01
SPEAKER_04: Next week's in my episode.
59:02
SPEAKER_04: We all know what it's gonna be.
59:03
SPEAKER_04: A Bud War?
59:04
SPEAKER_04: Probably.
59:05
SPEAKER_02: I mean, it doesn't have to be.
59:06
SPEAKER_02: There's like there's like minor gem dragons.
59:10
SPEAKER_02: I have to finish it.
59:11
SPEAKER_02: I have to finish it.