Latest / Most Things Kenobi - A Star Wars Podcast / Episode 114: Discussing Count Dooku/Darth Tyranus

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Episode 114: Discussing Count Dooku/Darth Tyranus · Most Things Kenobi - A Star Wars Podcast

0:00
Hello there. It's time for most things
0:02
Kenobi. Shouldn't it be all things
0:05
Kenobi? Hi everyone.
0:19
Welcome to another episode of Most Things Kenobi, a podcast
0:22
about Obi Wan, Kenobi and all things Star Wars.
0:25
I'm your host, Leanne. And I'm your host, Lauren, and
0:30
we're going to do our best to do an entire episode on Count
0:33
Dooku. But there's so much shit that it
0:37
may have to spill into a second at some future point, because
0:41
this man has a lot of back story.
0:44
He does. It's crazy.
0:46
It just goes on and on. And I think part of it is
0:49
because he's been in a bunch of novels in addition to Clone
0:52
Wars. So it's just it.
0:54
It's a lot. It was a lot more than I
0:57
thought. Well, he's he's he's been around
1:00
a while. He's had some tales of the Jedi
1:05
stuff added to his ever increasing story, which gave him
1:11
even more depth. And I'll preface this all by
1:14
saying we haven't read the books.
1:17
I haven't. I don't believe you.
1:18
I haven't either. No, there's just not enough time
1:22
in a life to read all of the Star Wars printed media.
1:27
This is true. What time I was like, I'm just
1:29
going to write down all of the novels and cross them off.
1:32
It took me hours. There are so many.
1:35
It's insane. And there's no way I'm going to
1:39
read them all in a lifetime. So yeah, that's why we claim
1:42
we're not experts. We're just here to discuss what
1:44
we want. Yeah.
1:46
So that's what we're going to do today with Dooku.
1:49
Because, listen, he's kind of a badass and I and I feel bad.
1:53
I just generally when I think of him, I feel.
1:58
Well, I learned some things that will make you feel more bad.
2:02
Great. I love Star Wars.
2:07
You know, when my mother said, wow, this is all awful.
2:10
It's like, yeah, yes, correct it.
2:14
Just keeps going. There's no end to the awfulness.
2:18
Well, I just, you know, I don't. I can't even say that.
2:22
I was going to say I don't feel bad for mall when we're talking
2:25
about Siths, but I kind of do. By the end, it's just such a
2:31
he's just such a mess, a glorious mess.
2:35
But with Dooku, he's got the same things of, like, misguided
2:40
intent. And it's a shame.
2:45
Yeah, you were saying that there were things about.
2:48
Duke, who's background that reminded you of Anakin and me
2:52
too, because his childhood, the way he came to the Jedi, it's
2:57
like this man just kept repeating patterns throughout
3:01
his life and it that's something.
3:04
So heartbreaking. Well, let's talk about his
3:07
beginning and I'll default to you since you you brought it up.
3:12
So, well, I mean, I would like to read.
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The book, I guess it's so most of this I think comes from
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Dooku. Jedi Lost that that novel that
3:21
was written on Dooku. I mean, it's definitely on the
3:23
list we should put it. We're compiling for those who
3:26
are interested. We're compiling an Amazon wish
3:29
list for most things, Kenobi, which consists of mainly printed
3:35
media from Star Wars. Because we're behind.
3:37
We just made this. We just made this statement and
3:41
this. Seems like a book.
3:42
The The Dooku book seems like it would be an excellent tale.
3:49
Yeah, it's if this is all from that and there's some crazy
3:53
shit. And it all ties into what we
3:55
already know and love about Quigon and the Clone Wars.
4:00
So I mean, we're all Quigon lovers, so this is another tie
4:06
in. To it is understanding a Jedi we
4:09
saw so little of, but love so much.
4:13
Yeah, Duku had a huge impact on the way Qui Gon was.
4:17
There were certain elements that I think there were already there
4:20
that Duku just fostered. But so he was a son of a count,
4:29
you know, we all know he's from Soreno, which is, you know, he
4:33
goes back there and becomes count later.
4:35
But his father thought he was a freak.
4:41
Why? That's sad.
4:43
Yeah, so he showed his forced sensibility, showed early and
4:49
his father did not like that he he thought it was frightening
4:53
and a freak show. And he contacted the Jedi Order
4:58
and said come take my son like I don't want him.
5:01
And instead of waiting for the Jedi to come.
5:04
He took this baby Doo goo and left him outside the castle on
5:09
the edge of the forest, naked. No food, no shelter, no
5:13
identification. OK, pause.
5:17
I'm seeing similarities to Ventris.
5:21
Wasn't she basically just abandoned right off the bat?
5:24
She's given a way to. Yeah.
5:27
Yes, Anakin, for that matter, yes.
5:31
I was just going to say you could say all the Jedi were
5:34
abandoned because they were needed as small children.
5:37
So we can, we can just clear that up right now that that's a
5:41
general understanding. But to be called a freak because
5:45
you have a talent or something different about you, Yeah, I
5:49
mean, that's rough. Yeah, so he was taken in by the
5:54
Jedi, They found him, they arrived and found him and
5:57
realized this is the force sensitive baby that's just been
6:00
left. So they took him back to the
6:02
Jedi Temple and he was integrated into the Jedi and
6:05
like raised under the tutelage of Master Sunube, which is kind
6:10
of awesome. I love Master Sunube.
6:13
He's so adorable. Yes, he.
6:17
Is. But he was in this group of
6:18
younglings that included Saifo, Diaz and so.
6:23
Like Anakin, he didn't get along with everybody because he had
6:27
this kind of other sensibility about him that people thought he
6:30
was like lording over them. And like, Anakin wasn't that.
6:35
Well, I guess he was kind of, he was arrogant in a sense, which
6:39
isolated him, but also he was just like looked down on because
6:42
he was older, you know, when he was brought to the Jedi.
6:46
So Dooku is. Raised in the temple and becomes
6:50
very close friends with Sypho Diaz, and there's all sorts of
6:53
crazy shit that goes down. But eventually he becomes Yoda's
6:58
Padawan and Yoda Sypho Diaz, Sypho Diaz's master who I can't
7:04
remember the name of now, and Dooku all go back to Soreno for
7:09
a festival. And while he's there, Yeah,
7:12
while he's there, Dooku meets a little girl.
7:16
And they become friendly, and they kind of run around the
7:19
palace together and get to know each other.
7:21
And then her father shows up, and it turns out it's Dooku's
7:26
sister and Dooku's father. And Dooku learns there because
7:31
the man says you're a freak. Like I told Yoda, I never want
7:34
to see you again. So now Dooku knows his past and
7:39
he knows he's been given up, and Yoda has to explain it all to
7:42
him. And that's like.
7:45
Chop number one in the tree. It'll to make it fall
7:48
eventually, which is just so desperately heartbreaking.
7:51
Well, I mean, how old was he when this happened when he met
7:56
up with his dad to sister? He was probably a young teenager
7:59
because I think he became a pad of 1 when he was like 12,
8:04
something like that, like somewhere in there, I don't
8:06
know. So, pretty, pretty ripe age for
8:11
emotions and not quite learning how to deal with.
8:15
I mean, this is the this is the beginning of every bad tale that
8:19
we know of. You know, abandonment issues,
8:22
anger, people, lying or keeping the truth from them.
8:27
These are themes in Star Wars that repeat themselves.
8:32
Yeah, it's that's tragic. It's very sad, but like later,
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it turns out he has an older brother and a younger sister.
8:41
When he leaves the Jedi Order and goes back to become Count
8:45
Dooku, he does so by killing his older brother and overthrowing
8:50
him. Makes sense?
8:52
And his sister gets kidnapped by the Republic at some point and
8:56
he doesn't want her to spoo the beans on what he's doing is like
9:00
a sis basically. So he has Venturous rescue her
9:04
from her kidnappers to kill her. Oh.
9:08
So he's. Killed his whole family off at
9:11
this point. It's it's insane.
9:12
Which is sad because he and his sister had been been friendly
9:16
after meeting her. They contacted each other in
9:18
secret for the rest of their lives, basically until he killed
9:22
her. It's just insane to me.
9:24
This is just, it's so twisted. They didn't have anything to do
9:28
with it. That's why that seems even more
9:32
tragic. Yeah, it wasn't her decision to
9:35
abandon him or call him a freak. You know why?
9:39
Yeah, this is overboard. But it's it's, it's, it's, it's,
9:44
it's. Very Sidney.
9:50
Oh man. Well, I like I was kind of
9:53
looking up Duke who's name because he changes to Darth tear
9:58
in his once he becomes Sidious, his apprentice, right.
10:02
And it's spelled differently, but it's very similar to the
10:04
Latin word for tyrant, yes. Which is pretty obvious.
10:09
But then he's Count of Serenno, which is Spanish for serene and
10:13
tranquillity. I've always liked Serenno.
10:18
Honestly. I like his castle, His little,
10:20
his little crib. Yeah.
10:23
On a hill overlooking Serenno seems cool as a planet.
10:30
You know the the landscape and the architecture and things.
10:33
So I always liked seeing it when we got glimpses of it and but I
10:40
I really think I mentioned it you know off when we were
10:44
getting ready and set up to record this episode that Dooku's
10:48
fall is very similar to Anakin's in the sense that and I have a
10:55
question, a followup question to this.
10:57
But he murdered as we know from Tales of the Jedi.
11:01
He murders Yatl in like a one-on-one confrontation spurred
11:06
on by Sidious who's like looming in the background as usual.
11:12
And we all know this now cuz it tells the Jedi.
11:14
But is it a thing where you have to have a one-on-one beheading
11:19
of some kind because Yaddle didn't go peacefully.
11:24
That was terrible. The whole thing was awful.
11:28
You know we didn't see it per se.
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We don't see any of these execution style, you know,
11:34
endings in Star Wars, but didn't How many Sith had to make this
11:41
choice in order to, like, turn over?
11:43
You know they have a steady timeline of failing and pattern
11:48
behavior patterns and repeated things that get them there, but
11:52
it's like they have to make this one final choice to kill this
11:56
person, this unarmed you know, disarmed individual.
12:01
And then Sidious is like, OK, you've made it.
12:03
You've now completed your your yeah I.
12:07
Think it's because murder is the ultimate Sid, right?
12:13
Like it is. It's like and they this is
12:16
talked about in many fandoms like even Harry Potter, right?
12:18
It like rips your soul in half to commit murder.
12:24
Unless you're. Freak Who likes it?
12:27
I don't know. But they don't care.
12:30
I'm not. I'm not a doctor, so I can't say
12:34
I can't speak medically about any of that.
12:36
But like mythologically, in mythology, killing corrupts the
12:43
soul. So if you're willing to kill,
12:46
like it's your test as a Sith. So Sidious is waiting, if you're
12:50
willing. To do that then he's like, yes,
12:53
now I've got you, you know, like that's why he kept telling Luke,
12:57
that's. Right, To use your anger, like
12:58
kill your father with anger, cuz that would make Luke vulnerable
13:03
to his control. Then like he would be
13:05
manipulative, easy to manipulate is what I'm trying to say.
13:10
That's essentially what I was getting at, because we saw it
13:12
with Anakin, we saw it with Dooku in Tales of the Jedi, and
13:16
we see it presented to Luke and Luke just we we know he's better
13:22
than that, he's better than everyone.
13:23
But it's it's also all of this with with Dooku.
13:30
To reference Anakin again involves Mace Windu and a
13:35
council decision. And it's so funny because I have
13:42
the quote here where Duku asked Mace Window, Do you think the
13:46
Jedi would truly keep peace if they continue to take everything
13:49
the Senate says as law? And then after that Window is
13:54
appointed to the Council over Duku, So very similar with
13:57
Anakin and stuff and the questioning of the Council and
14:00
the questioning of the Senate. And am I wrong to think that
14:04
Duku, what he's asking here, is so bad?
14:09
I don't think you're right. I think actually that's the
14:12
tragedy of Duku, right, is that his intentions are actually all
14:18
good at the beginning. And like there's there was
14:22
something I read that said he kind of instilled in Quigon to
14:26
serve the people, not the Senate.
14:30
And we saw that entails of the Jedi, his slow disillusionment
14:33
when he was sent to rescue that senator's son and it turned out
14:37
the Senator was abusing. His populace and then the whole
14:43
thing was very difficult because that's where the lines get
14:46
blurred. And that was not the first time.
14:51
According to I think this was also in Do who Jedi lost.
14:55
Sypho Diaz had a vision once they were older.
14:58
They were probably, I don't know, in their 20s, but they
15:00
were still apprentices but almost Jedi Knights and Sypho
15:05
Diaz had a vision of one of the planets being.
15:09
Damaged, like very severely damaged by a solar flare or
15:13
something like that. And Yoda said you can't tell
15:16
anybody this because you don't know if what you saw is going to
15:19
happen and you could terrify all population for no reason.
15:23
So Duku Sypho Diaz and Sypho Diaz's master who believed Sypho
15:28
Diaz went to the senator and told them what was going to
15:32
happen, and that guy was more concerned about protecting their
15:36
resources than their people. And they all like the all the
15:41
people died. And so that was one of the
15:44
another thing that was, you know, another notch in Dooku of
15:48
his disillusionment with both the Republic and the Jedi.
15:54
He didn't stand a chance. Like he wanted to do the
15:59
idealistic thing, like he was altruistic, but the more he
16:04
tried, the more he came up against the wall.
16:07
So when? City is offered him more
16:12
freedom. He thought it was for the right
16:15
thing, but of course it wasn't. No, I I have a hard time with if
16:22
you play by the rules, you get ahead.
16:24
If you question anything, you don't.
16:28
And that is the worst message to send absolutely anyone in any
16:33
walk of life. If you just fall in and stay
16:38
silent, then you'll go farther. Don't question the Jedi Council,
16:45
Don't question the Senate. Just do your job.
16:47
Don't question right. And I fucking hate that from a
16:52
personal professional. Everything level.
16:55
And what it does is beat people down into submission for all the
17:00
wrong way, all the wrong reasons.
17:03
And then when they're presented, something wrapped prettily in,
17:06
you know, the right thing with the right bow by the wrong
17:10
person, they're going to grasp at that because they're not
17:13
getting anything from the other way.
17:16
No one believes them, nobody trusts them, Just shut your
17:18
mouth, etcetera. So do I blame them for seeing
17:24
what Sidious presents or Palpatine whatever form and
17:28
saying, you know what, why not? I'll try it.
17:31
Because over here, it's not working.
17:33
This isn't. Yeah, I'm not respected over
17:35
here. I can see why they would take
17:39
that choice now. Murdering and all of this.
17:42
Bit far, way too far. But I can see if it's presented
17:47
as like you have freedom over here, you can express whatever
17:50
you want over here. Yeah, of course a person's going
17:53
to go over there. And it's tragic with all of
17:57
these different characters that they were kind of like, what's
18:03
the word like? Groomed into that direction to
18:09
make sure that they made that decision and City has got what
18:12
he wanted in the end. It's terrible.
18:15
Yeah, it's Dooku. You could kind of look at him in
18:19
two different ways. He either has this destiny,
18:21
right, of having been this person who thinks he's doing
18:25
great things and ultimately is a pawn, or you can see him as you
18:31
know it's not Destiny's choices and all these choices that he's
18:35
made. He thought he was moving towards
18:38
one goal and ultimately he ended up somewhere else altogether.
18:41
It's really kind of scary, yeah. Because because it shows how you
18:48
could think you're doing the right thing and you end up so
18:50
far corrupted. And that's the thing too, is
18:53
once he turned to go with Sidious.
18:55
He did get corrupted. He was seduced by the power and
18:59
all the things that came with what City has offered.
19:01
And ultimately he did start doing things for the wrong
19:04
reasons. But he started for the right
19:07
reasons. Yeah.
19:08
It's this is what I find the most fascinating about Duku is
19:13
it's that question. Was it destiny or was it
19:16
choices? That's the question for
19:18
everything, right? In real life and in a Galaxy
19:20
far, far away. But it's it, doesn't it?
19:25
It's not lost on me that one of the episodes in Tales of the
19:29
Jedi that involves Dooku is called choices.
19:34
So it's like, man, it's it's the same thing with Anakin.
19:39
Every fucking choice he made, he still made them.
19:42
Right. Whether he was groomed and and
19:46
put on this path that you know, you know, Sidious had him all
19:50
along, etcetera, etcetera, still made every single choice, but it
19:55
was still his destiny to do so. I don't know.
19:57
It's so complicated. It is.
19:59
It is. Once you start to do any kind of
20:02
questioning about destiny versus choices, you quickly get into
20:06
like a quagmire. Because the Wills made Anakin.
20:10
I created him. The wills.
20:14
Like he exists because he had a destiny, but he still made
20:18
choices, supposedly right, free will choices that led him to.
20:23
So it's like, what is it? Is it choice?
20:25
Service. Destiny?
20:26
I don't know. Well, at least at least the
20:30
episode is called Choices, so we'll lean on it for at least
20:33
that 30 minute or 15 minute, whatever minute episode it was.
20:39
Yeah, Duku is difficult, but he's a fantastic fighter.
20:43
Did it? Did you happen to read anything
20:44
about how he came to his style of his one handed like
20:48
swordsmanship? He defeated.
20:53
The thing that I saw was that when he was doing his trials,
20:57
not not his trials because I guess it was from moving from a
21:00
youngling into Padawan. So whatever that transition is
21:05
called. He fought Sypho Diaz blindfolded
21:08
with one hand behind his back and won and wanted to be taken
21:15
Padawan by this woman who he had had some like weird conflict
21:19
with. And then they became like a very
21:22
like teacher apprentice. Like he started to learn a lot
21:25
from her, even though he didn't trust her at first.
21:27
Whatever is complicated, she chose Sypho Diaz as her Padawan.
21:33
Until he was again, like really wounded by that, until he
21:35
realized Yoda wanted him as Padawan.
21:38
So I don't know he, I don't know where it kind of developed.
21:43
Master Sunube was in charge of training a lot of Jedi in their
21:46
lightsaber technique when they were very young, But they've
21:52
kind of always said he was good at it.
21:54
And they've even gone as far to say as he's one of the best
21:58
ever. Yeah, yeah.
22:00
I mean, we see that in Clone Wars.
22:03
He's pretty good. And it seems very effortless for
22:07
him. Yes, yes.
22:08
Yeah, that's the thing. He comes.
22:09
It's very count of him. If I picture a count fighting,
22:14
it's with one arm. Yeah, very, you know.
22:18
And he has the curved hilts He does, yes.
22:21
Which that's OK. So this is another thing he saw
22:26
like a curved Sith. Blade When he was a kid, he and
22:30
Siphon Diaz again snuck into a part of the temple in the the
22:35
Jedi Archives where they house Sith artifacts.
22:39
Yeah. And so they snuck in there and
22:42
found all this stuff, and Dooku was, like, really drawn to some
22:45
of it. And then they were discovered
22:48
and got in trouble and all that. But it's like there's these
22:51
little Easter eggs all throughout his life of like,
22:55
perfectly. When you add them all up lead to
23:00
what we end up with. So yeah, I don't know the the, I
23:05
mean, he's definitely kicked over one's ass and well, we
23:10
don't talk about that there. There are there have to be
23:13
reasons for that that that whole thing is.
23:16
So have you seen the Hayden and the Body Double stunt double,
23:21
whatever that of the scene that was supposed to be what his and
23:25
Duke, whose fight was? Yeah.
23:27
Have you ever seen that? Because it's fucking amazing.
23:30
It lost opportunity. He.
23:34
Even burns Dooku's eye with his eye saver.
23:37
God damn it, we could have had it all.
23:40
We could have had it all, but we didn't.
23:44
We got A tag of the clones, but that whole thing, I look Hayden
23:51
looks fucking amazing when he's got the two and he's got Dooku's
23:55
head in between them. It's a little after you watch
23:59
The Clone Wars. It's a little underwhelming
24:01
based on how many fights. Him and Duke, who have, and the
24:05
great amount of Force lightning and anger and, you know, chiding
24:11
from Sidious, who just had, well, Palpatine, who just
24:13
happens to be there for some of them, you know, just overseeing
24:16
his progress, if you will. Oh, I hate him.
24:19
But we got to do a. We got to do an episode on Palps
24:22
and now that I've seen a. Naked series.
24:27
Naked suit. It was a naked suit.
24:29
It wasn't real, but. Here the last episode for
24:33
reference for reference. Yes, Empire strips back, but you
24:37
know we got to do an episode on Palpatine because we could sit
24:40
here for fucking weeks and talk about his.
24:45
Just his coincidental appearances in some of these key
24:50
fights, right? And I I referenced him with
24:53
Dooku. God, how did Dooku not see it?
24:57
How did? How did none of them see it?
25:01
I know, I know. It's.
25:04
And especially since he kind of just keeps following the same
25:07
pattern. You know, he's got Dooku.
25:09
Well, he had mall. Yeah, right.
25:11
Who got cut in half by our beloved?
25:14
Yes, we are beloved. Yes.
25:16
Fell down a reactor shaft and then Duke who comes along and
25:21
gets replaced by Anakin and Anakin he tries to replace with
25:25
Luke is and then Ray. It's just all the same over.
25:29
It's just over and over. Listen, I don't.
25:32
I don't know why it wasn't more obvious.
25:37
I don't know. I.
25:37
Must have been very good at hiding himself in the darkness,
25:42
you know. Using the dark side to hide
25:46
behind. Yeah, and and and to cover the
25:49
eyes of those like Yoda, who felt the worst after realizing
25:54
like, wow, this whole time right under my nose.
25:58
Gee whiz, you know. There was some crazy other shit
26:04
too. With Dooku had another, so he
26:06
had rail. Avaros was his first apprentice,
26:10
then he had qui gone. Yes.
26:12
Then he had another apprentice, who I didn't find the name of,
26:15
but she turned to the dark side and quote, had to be killed
26:18
because she brought shame to the Jedi.
26:23
Did she get sent to the Citadel? Remember the.
26:26
Good question. The Citadel for Jedi who didn't
26:29
fall in line. Yeah, right.
26:32
Well, I was in Duke, who sent there, probably because they
26:34
couldn't catch, couldn't catch him, No, Yeah, he's wily.
26:41
But then once he becomes Darth Tear Ness, he also he trains
26:45
Grievous, then he trains Ventris, and then who else was
26:49
it? Well, Savazo Press Savaz, yeah.
26:53
And then Quinlan Vos. Yeah, yeah.
26:56
Oh, what a lineup. Training, training our dear
27:08
spirit animal Grievous is like 4 Jedi, one cuz they have four
27:11
arms so right and a collection of sabers.
27:19
Yeah. What is all that?
27:20
I wonder how he taught him because he didn't have the
27:22
force. I guess you can.
27:25
I mean, I don't know, Grievous. I mean, they just.
27:29
Programmed him or something? I don't know.
27:31
He seems like if you're made of metal, you could probably get
27:34
along better than like because you're not really worried about
27:37
whopping something off. You know what I mean?
27:39
Like, no he could. Just have it replaced.
27:41
That's it. In his lair, Grievous's lair.
27:45
So Dooku and Qui gone are a whole another thing.
27:49
And it leads us to the little conversation that Obi Wan has
27:53
with Dooku in the prequels, right?
27:56
Or. Or is it During the Clone Wars,
27:58
when he's captured, there's, there's.
28:00
Attack of the Clones, Okay. That's what I was thinking,
28:02
because then it's flipped in the Clone Wars.
28:05
Yeah, Obiwan is captured in. Yeah, Obiwan is captured in and
28:09
tag of the clone. Yes.
28:10
Duke. Who is captured in.
28:12
Duke who captured. Yes, duh.
28:13
That's the the episode. Hello.
28:16
One of my favorites, by the way. Our favorite.
28:19
Yeah, yeah. But it leads to that
28:21
conversation of, like, the taunting, right?
28:24
Our patriot John made a good point too, that in the
28:27
novelization of Revenge of the Sith.
28:30
Dooku is still trying to get Palpatine to take Obiwan instead
28:35
of Anakin. Like he doesn't know.
28:37
He doesn't know that Palpatine has plans for Anakin, but he
28:40
keeps saying like Obiwan would be a good candidate.
28:44
He has. There are enters the poor.
28:46
Yeah, dark Obiwan. Yeah, I don't think Duku could
28:52
have been convincing enough. There would have to be something
28:55
else that would make it happen, but that's right.
28:57
That's right. I don't think it would have
28:58
happened. I I was Duku.
29:02
Poor Duku. That's not it.
29:06
Duku. That wasn't the plan.
29:10
But if you could turn Obi Wan, yeah, he'd be a good one to have
29:15
turn. But that's the thing about Obi
29:17
Wan. He's not.
29:19
He's not going to turn. He can't.
29:21
He won't. He's never been disillusioned
29:24
despite all the shit that's happened.
29:26
So yeah, granted none of that had been written yet and it by
29:30
the time Revenge of the Sith came out, but still, like, it's
29:36
a fun thing to think about, but just not realistic at all.
29:40
So Qui Gun is kind of obsessed with the prophecies because of
29:45
Dooku also. That would make sense.
29:47
Yeah, Yeah. I mean, OKI have to bring up the
29:51
wills again. Did they see anything going on
29:54
with, with Qui Gun? Because he's the first one to
29:58
essentially learn to speak in the after, right?
30:01
As a first one, so did the Wills.
30:04
Like, was that part of it? That's a really good question.
30:08
I don't know because there's a moment in in this.
30:12
Apparently Duku lost. I guess because this is not for
30:15
Ambassador Apprentice. Where Dooku is showing Kwagon
30:18
around the temple after he's become a Padawan and he sees, I
30:24
think it is a holocron, but it could have been something in the
30:28
Jedi Archives gets Kwagon's attention like he's drawn to it,
30:33
and Dooku acts all weird, like that's the Jedi prophecies.
30:37
Like I don't want to talk about it.
30:41
Yeah, so like Dooku had already started studying it, but Quigon
30:45
was drawn to it. And then because of both of
30:48
their curiosity, it like made Quigon get and Dooku for that
30:51
matter, a little obsessive about them.
30:54
Which is very odd because knowing Quigon in other ways,
30:59
like being ruled by a prophecy, doesn't fit his personality in
31:05
my opinion that well. If he was drawn to the holocron,
31:08
then I would have to say it was part of the wills willing it,
31:12
right? Right.
31:13
It seems like it the same way that maybe Duku was drawn to
31:17
that Sith artifact, right? In a very similar parallel way,
31:23
but for opposite reasons. Yeah, it's interesting.
31:28
It's the most difficult topic in Star Wars, I think.
31:32
The wills well, in like we're We're theorizing about it.
31:36
Who knows? Maybe George Lucas had.
31:38
Plans and answers for that. Or maybe not.
31:40
Maybe you just wanted it to be kind of ethereal, where there's
31:43
no real answer at all. Yeah, I'm OK with both.
31:48
Yeah, me too. I'm OK with there not being an
31:51
answer because it's fun to talk about.
31:53
Exactly. And the more people you ask, the
31:55
more answers you're going to get, the more points of views.
31:57
And you know, it's all about a certain point of view,
31:59
basically. So you know, no right or wrong
32:05
answer. So this is just like, this is
32:08
scratching the surface with Duku.
32:10
Yeah, surface level Duku shit. And the man is far too talented
32:18
and far too smart. He's intelligent.
32:20
He's not easily one upped by either intelligence or by
32:27
skilled fighting. And we'd be remiss if we didn't
32:32
mention, like, Christopher Lee's influence with He's just like
32:36
the the top when it comes to intimidating bad guys.
32:41
That used to be good, because he also played Soremon in the Lord
32:47
of the Rings trilogy movies. And for anyone who understands
32:52
Lord of the Rings and Middle Earth, Soremon used to be a good
32:55
wizard and was deceived and turned.
32:58
So it's no surprise that Christopher Lee was also do who
33:03
in the fact that he comes across as this respectable, you know,
33:07
straight spine chin up. I'm elite in a way.
33:11
He's intelligent, he's good at what he does.
33:13
And yet he could have been so much more had he just not
33:18
strayed or had not been led astray by whatever force willed
33:24
him that way. And I'll say that on purpose
33:27
with the word will in it. I love Christopher Lee.
33:33
I do too. He's a badass.
33:35
His voice is wonderful. I was just going to say that I
33:40
loved the moment where he's talking to Obi Wan and he says
33:44
that he misses Qui Gon. Yeah.
33:47
The tone in his voice is so beautiful, and in that moment I
33:52
really believe him. I don't think he's manipulating
33:56
when he says that. I think he.
33:58
I think this is an attack of the clones.
34:00
Like I really think that he he's sad to have lost qui gone and
34:05
they can even play that. And Tales of the Jedi too.
34:08
Yeah, well, and and Corey Burton, who voices him in in
34:12
Clone Wars, Tales of the Jedi He Came Back, does a fantastic job
34:17
as far as like, recreating that. Very distinct sound of his
34:22
voice, you know, it's just very it's a very distinct voice.
34:26
There are moments when I hear Christopher Lee and I'm like,
34:29
that sounds weird because I'm so used to Corey Burton.
34:34
It's kind of crazy. It's it's really, I mean talent
34:37
all around, these voice actors and actresses are just on a
34:40
different level, all of them. But it's I'm going to go back to
34:46
how I started this episode. I just feel bad for Dooku.
34:49
In the end, he got played just like the rest of them.
34:53
Yeah, he was just one of Palpatine's pawns and like you
34:57
said, such a waste of talent and possibility, you know?
35:02
Yeah, yeah, and geez, if that didn't just come full circle.
35:07
And Tales of the Jedi, those were my favorite episodes.
35:09
Yeah, out of that whole first batch of Tales of the Jedi
35:13
episodes. I love a good back story, but
35:17
there's too much here for one episode.
35:21
You know, maybe we can dive deeper some other time.
35:23
But yeah, there's a lot. And it all, like with Siphon
35:27
Diaz and how it ties into Clone Wars and everything.
35:30
It's just, it's a lot. The whole Camino thing is is its
35:34
own. The whole Camino thing alone is
35:38
a whole episode. So maybe we should do an episode
35:40
on Camino? We should, I think we put it on
35:43
our list as a quote. Camino Shit show yes.
35:46
App renamed Yes. Next week I'm.
35:57
I'm stoked. I'm very stoked.
36:00
Include me in this. I'm stoked too, yeah.
36:04
It's going to be great. We are going to talk about what
36:06
would turn Obiwan to the dark side in the Mortis Ark episodes.
36:11
Yeah, kind of touched on it here.
36:13
So now we're we're feeling like talking about it.
36:16
I mean, Mortis is a never ending a thing that we have to revisit
36:20
and with dark Obi Wan looming, OK, this is going to be good.
36:24
Yep, yeah, I think. It's the only time we could
36:27
legitimately see him look like a Sith and it would just be
36:31
temporary. Yes, it's all temporary.
36:35
He's too good to that life, but it's fun to dabble.
36:39
Yeah, so join us next week so we can do some dark Obi One talk.
36:45
Thank you so much for joining us here on the Most Things Kenobi
36:48
Podcast. We appreciate every single one
36:50
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36:56
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36:59
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37:02
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37:11
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37:14
Things kenobi.com. So until next time, Myspace
37:18
Twin, may the Force be with you always.