Latest / Why I Believe / Liz Berry: Just Call Out to Jesus

Transcript

Liz Berry: Just Call Out to Jesus · Why I Believe

• 0:01
  Hello and welcome back to Why I Believe.
• 0:03
  I'm your host Michelle Von Ruden and today I have Liz Berry with me.
• 0:07
  How are you today, Liz?
• 0:08
  Hey, Michelle, doing good.
• 0:11
  Thanks for having me on.
• 0:13
  Yeah, thanks for being here.
• 0:14
  Can you just tell us a little bit about yourself before we dive in?
• 0:18
  Sure, uh my name is Liz Berry and I'm from Eau Claire.
• 0:25
  Originally, I kind of moved around when I was a kid, but I went to high school in Eau Claire, so I consider it my hometown.
• 0:31
  I have a private practice, I'm a therapist and I specialize with women who have neurodivergence or ADHD.
• 0:38
  I...
• 0:38
  um
• 0:41
  Kind of a Jane of all trades, have a Mary Kay Beauty Consultant business also, and I just recently started taking in sewing and alterations, which has been really fun.
• 0:52
  My office is located in Banbury Place, and I've been in practice as a counselor for about five years, and I'm doing my private practice.
• 1:00
  This is in my second year now.
• 1:03
  Awesome.
• 1:04
  Well, thanks for being here, Liz.
• 1:07
  Thanks for having me.
• 1:08
  Yeah, so, you know, as we were talking earlier and going through your story, one of the things that stuck out to me is that a lot of people say they inherit their faith and then
• 1:18
  at some point they have to choose it.
• 1:19
  And usually it's not until later in life, know, teens or adulthood.
• 1:23
  But you were, you were, what do you say, six or seven when you decided to let Jesus in?
• 1:30
  Yeah, I've always been like a child with a very heavy conscience.
• 1:36
  So the joke that my mom always says is she never had to like discipline me because I had such a heavy conscience, I would do it myself.
• 1:45
  So she would say, I would come to her with my, my confession, essentially, it'd be like, this is what I did.
• 1:52
  Should I go to the naughty spot now?
• 1:57
  And I just, I always felt like
• 2:01
  like there was a father figure kind of watching over me and I think my father wasn't necessarily present at that time when I was that young and um I felt safe when I um felt
• 2:15
  this presence with me and so um we went to church and we went to Bible Bible or Sunday school and um I remember specifically when I was around that age
• 2:27
  listening to someone talk about Jesus and how he died on the cross and he's got the son and that he could be my forever friend essentially always with me.
• 2:37
  I remember feeling a significant amount of loneliness at that age.
• 2:40
  think my family had just gone through a lot of stuff and we had recently moved from Minnesota to California and I think that's why it appealed to me to have this forever
• 2:51
  friend.
• 2:51
  And so I started talking to Jesus as if he were just right there.
• 2:55
  um
• 2:56
  sitting next to me and I think I had a lot of really great teachers and my mom too who instilled a lot of faith in the unseen at that point and encouraged me to keep um going
• 3:11
  back to that image of him just being at my side and helping me through hard times.
• 3:18
  I remember learning to pray at that age too.
• 3:20
  My dog ran away and
• 3:22
  like my brother had left the fence open or something and he just got out.
• 3:26
  And I remember praying, he was gone overnight.
• 3:30
  I remember praying overnight, you know, please bring Dusty back and keep him safe wherever he is, that kind of thing.
• 3:36
  And then he came back and I just, think that was like my first memory of like an answered prayer.
• 3:40
  Yeah.
• 3:44
  Yeah.
• 3:47
  especially out in California, you know, you always see in those bigger cities, you always see these lost puppy or lost this or that, and you just, never know if they're going to
• 3:54
  come home.
• 3:56
  in the desert too.
• 3:58
  They could get sick really fast.
• 4:01
  Yeah, he made it back home the next day.
• 4:04
  I think someone found him and dropped him off.
• 4:06
  So that was an early blessing.
• 4:10
  Yeah.
• 4:11
  So has your faith life stayed that, I wouldn't say true is right word, like that consistent throughout your life?
• 4:21
  I would say so.
• 4:22
  um If anything, I increased my faith in the unseen in Jesus's presence in my life um because of the hardships that I went through.
• 4:32
  And I know that's the opposite of a lot of people.
• 4:35
  Some people deal with, know, well, if God doesn't care about me, then I don't care about him kind of a thing.
• 4:41
  But I spent a lot of time in my youth um asking a lot of questions and
• 4:51
  I think in the group of people that were influencing me at the time, there was always room for that.
• 4:57
  And I remember specifically one of my youth pastors telling me it's okay to doubt and that you should talk about your doubts and that you can look up answers in the Bible and pray
• 5:08
  about it and see if inside, if you feel a change.
• 5:11
  But that, I think teaching me that the father figure God was.
• 5:18
  safe place to bounce ideas off of and to talk openly about my own doubts.
• 5:23
  I think that kept my faith strong through the hard times.
• 5:28
  And I went through some hard periods, really hard periods.
• 5:32
  I'm 46 but I feel like I've seen enough hard times that like way beyond my age.
• 5:38
  And um just having like stuck to at
• 5:46
  when I'm at the loneliest points and I'm feeling the most lost, ah know, rehearsing the Lord as my shepherd in Psalms, you know, and that's just, it always gives me like this
• 6:00
  fresh intake of His presence, I guess you could say.
• 6:06
  Yeah, that's great.
• 6:08
  I really love how your pastor was like, yeah, it's okay to ask questions and it's okay to wonder and it's okay to not just take it for what somebody tells you.
• 6:18
  And I think that is super helpful when people are trying to discover their faith and expand their faith because you don't feel judged.
• 6:30
  You feel like, it's okay, like this is normal and people are gonna ask questions and we're not gonna take everything at face value without maybe needing an explanation.
• 6:38
  And I think for me that helped me, but it sounds like it probably helped you as well.
• 6:44
  Absolutely.
• 6:45
  um I mean, I remember early on too learning about, you know, we always talked about Jesus in the sense of Jesus's teachings and he was a teacher, you know, and think of a teacher
• 7:00
  who doesn't allow their student to ask questions.
• 7:03
  That doesn't make any sense.
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  So having that idea of like the scientific probe behind things and, and
• 7:11
  you know, faith-based scientific research.
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  Essentially, you know, he would, in the flesh and blood, he would want me to ask questions.
• 7:21
  He would want me to build my faith that way.
• 7:24
  And I think that just rests really easy for me.
• 7:27
  I can't imagine, I can't imagine trying to build a faith where I couldn't ask questions.
• 7:35
  Yeah, that's good.
• 7:36
  And I think it helps when you hit those hard times, right?
• 7:39
  When you and I were talking, you said that, you know, you'd been through a lot of trials.
• 7:43
  And at one point somebody asked you if you were mad at God.
• 7:47
  yeah, thanks for reminding me.
• 7:48
  couldn't remember that m in the moment here.
• 7:52
  So someone asked me, know, um I went through, I don't even remember what at what point this was, but one of the major trials I went through was being in an abusive relationship.
• 8:05
  and I was married to a man for eight years who I thought was supposed to be the one.
• 8:12
  I grew up with the Christian faith wanting to be married in the church and under the rope of three strands with me, God, him, me and God at the center and me him.
• 8:31
  know, he was a he was a pastor's son, his family was really involved in their church and everything seemed okay when we got married.
• 8:40
  But then we just went through trial after trial.
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  It turned out he had a lot of problems and that were unresolved and there was just so much abuse and things that happened over the years, but it was also intertwined with spiritual
• 8:52
  abuse because of the family being a high, you know, highly like recognized in the church, like the
• 9:01
  pastors were my parents-in-law.
• 9:03
  And so everything we did and said seems like the church congregation was affected somehow in the light of like we tried to get, tried to get capacity counseling and things like
• 9:15
  that.
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  And they would say things like, you know, essentially you better fix this because it reflects on the entire congregation.
• 9:22
  Nothing was private.
• 9:23
  And I just went through a lot of spiritual abuse that way too.
• 9:27
  And when I pulled away from that,
• 9:30
  And I would tell my story to people.
• 9:31
  They'd be like, my gosh, you know, like, aren't, aren't you mad at the, at the faith?
• 9:36
  Like, have you lost your faith?
• 9:38
  Are you mad at God after going through all of that?
• 9:41
  Like, how do you, how do you see God now?
• 9:44
  And it was like, no, I'm, if anything, I am running to him.
• 9:49
  I'm leaning into him more because I feel like I have nothing else.
• 9:54
  And he's always been there for me when I've been at my loneliest.
• 9:58
  And
• 10:01
  all means, you know, rage at God.
• 10:03
  There's nothing you can do or say to hurt him or to push him away.
• 10:06
  And that's the gift of Jesus is, you know, I'll never leave you or forsake you.
• 10:12
  That's what he says and that's what he does.
• 10:17
  And yeah, so no, I'm not mad.
• 10:21
  Yeah, well, I think that's a typical question, right?
• 10:23
  So when people go through trials, especially one that involves, you know, the church and the faith, that question seems pretty valid, right?
• 10:32
  Like, so are you mad?
• 10:33
  Are you upset?
• 10:34
  And I think one of the.
• 10:37
  Right, and I think that's key, right, because it's the people, it's not Jesus doing it, right?
• 10:42
  Because we all have free will.
• 10:45
  It's not God and his judgment or his plan for us to suffer.
• 10:49
  He wants us to be joyful and happy and free.
• 10:53
  And um there's such a thing as, know, righteous justice and things like that.
• 10:59
  But I think over time, I realized to put blame where blame was due, that it was the people who were doing the harm and not because of the church or because of the religion.
• 11:09
  was, you know, they were wayward from the beginning, whether they appeared good or not.
• 11:17
  after it was all said and done, I had to do a lot of therapy and work through forgiving the people that harmed me and for also taking responsibility for my part.
• 11:28
  Not that I would say that to someone who's in an abusive situation, okay, but my part was um things like um just taking responsibility for my mental health.
• 11:41
  um You know, things like
• 11:46
  that I could do, take care of myself, have some autonomy, don't allow others to manipulate me, those kinds of things.
• 11:53
  And it was like, God had to help me see that, that I, he had to help me find my worth again, and to know that I was worth much more than what was happening to me, and that I
• 12:04
  could move forward in that worth, and that's, you know, talk about having to use your faith when you're...
• 12:11
  down in like the lowest point of your life and you have people abusing you constantly.
• 12:16
  I mean think of, think of Paul and you know in the prisons and you know that the reason that his stories are so poignant is because that was the lowest point of his life and the
• 12:30
  loneliest point.
• 12:31
  But what did he do?
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  He praised God.
• 12:34
  You know, he knew that if God wanted to he could break the chains and that's
• 12:40
  sort of faith that I tapped into was like, okay, God, show me what I need to do.
• 12:45
  What are my next steps here to break these chains?
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  And those are the things that we can step into and take responsibility for.
• 12:55
  I believe.
• 12:56
  Yeah, no.
• 12:57
  And I just want to point out, you know, as a child of God, you don't have to earn your worth.
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  You just have to own it.
• 13:03
  Right.
• 13:03
  And I think that's sometimes when we go through these trials and tribulations, we forget that because we get into those scenarios, as you pointed out, Liz, like.
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  And I think it can be so hard.
• 13:17
  Yeah, you can only hear something so much before you're like, OK, yeah, maybe you're right.
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  But.
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  You don't even realize it.
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  You just kind of absorb it and adopt it as your own.
• 13:27
  But thank God God was there telling me, no, that's not right.
• 13:32
  You're supposed to be happy.
• 13:33
  This isn't this isn't supposed to be so hard.
• 13:37
  And was it before this or after this that you felt the Holy Spirit come on to you?
• 13:43
  Um, it was before that.
• 13:46
  I, um, I was in college, so like my early twenties, and I was at a worship meeting with, like a campus group, and I, um, had never really learned, because I grew up in an
• 14:03
  evangelical free church, I had never really learned too much about speaking in tongues.
• 14:07
  or having like the Holy Spirit be a part.
• 14:10
  It was part of the Trinity, but it wasn't something that I could interact with.
• 14:14
  And so um when I was in college, I was in this praise group and the pastor was teaching on it.
• 14:24
  And I was just mystified, like, what do you mean?
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  How can you feel um the Holy Spirit like working through you?
• 14:35
  it had been just kind of an afterthought, like God the Father, Jesus the Son, and then there's the Holy Spirit too.
• 14:44
  And I was like, no, actually the Holy Spirit is just as powerful and just as much of an advocate for you and just as much of a presence.
• 14:52
  And I started to tap into that and...
• 14:57
  I started praying in tongues and the first couple of words came out kind of clumsy and I was just like, whoa, it just a completely transcendent, different experience than I had
• 15:06
  ever had.
• 15:07
  But it like it gave me a verbal way to pray for things that I didn't know I need to pray for.
• 15:18
  I guess that's how I could explain it.
• 15:21
  And so if I was...
• 15:23
  If I felt like I was praying and I was getting nowhere or that I was hitting some kind of a wall, then I would try switching it up and then I would feel this relief, this nepartic
• 15:32
  relief.
• 15:36
  But then using the idea of, you know, when Jesus is being baptized and the Holy Spirit comes down on him and...
• 15:49
  keeping that frame of reference in my mind, think of, because we are one with the Trinity, God is in us and we are God, and we're so intertwined that when I think of Jesus'
• 16:08
  ministries and stuff, he needed the Holy Spirit too.
• 16:11
  So why wouldn't I?
• 16:14
  Right.
• 16:20
  Yeah.
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  Right.
• 16:23
  No.
• 16:23
  that makes perfect sense, right?
• 16:28
  Yeah.
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  And I'm sure that helped you get through all of your trials, especially as going through your divorce and things like that.
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  Now, was it that divorce that helped you decide to go into counseling or when did that start?
• 16:39
  And then also, didn't you, aren't you a chaplain as well?
• 16:43
  Yeah.
• 16:46
  Yeah.
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  There's another iron in the fire.
• 16:48
  Yeah.
• 16:48
  Tell us about, you know, you're calling to the chaplain and also, you know, coming out as a counselor as well.
• 16:54
  Yeah.
• 16:55
  Yeah.
• 16:56
  So what kind of shaped that path?
• 16:57
  think I had always been told, I think maybe that level of that conscientiousness that I've always had, I was always ready to listen to someone and I was always that kid on the
• 17:07
  playground who was like,
• 17:09
  picking out the kid who was all by himself or like at the cafeteria table, no one to eat with.
• 17:14
  And so then I would be the one to go and talk to them.
• 17:16
  And I still do that today when I see people eating alone.
• 17:19
  I'm like watching them like, are they okay?
• 17:22
  Usually they're fine, you know, but I like to, you know, if it's like an old person, maybe they lost their spouse or maybe, you know, who knows what anybody's going through.
• 17:32
  But again, that's where the Holy Spirit comes in.
• 17:34
  You feel this prompting to like approach somebody.
• 17:36
  uh
• 17:38
  But back to the counseling thing, I had always been told by my family and friends and stuff, like, you make a really good therapist.
• 17:46
  Because I was just a good listener.
• 17:48
  And I was wise for my age because I was going through a lot and had learned a lot of lessons.
• 17:57
  I just, I really enjoyed counseling people and just being there for them and always offering a listening ear and just the companionship of being with somebody when you're
• 18:07
  going through something hard, even if I didn't say or do anything particular.
• 18:11
  And I think that's where the gift of the chaplaincy stuff started oh to fall into place after I became a counselor.
• 18:18
  Then I worked at getting my first degree was in Christian counseling.
• 18:25
  through a seminary in Bible College and um I was taking a nap one day and I just, I think I just started, maybe just started classes and I didn't really know where I was going with
• 18:40
  it.
• 18:41
  It was just a master of arts in Christian counseling.
• 18:43
  And I woke up startled from the nap because I felt the Holy Spirit or God's voice.
• 18:49
  I heard it loud and clear say, Chaplain, help the sick and the dying.
• 18:54
  Mmm.
• 18:55
  like the word chaplain.
• 18:57
  It was like, whoa.
• 18:59
  And it startled me awake from my nap.
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  And I turned over to my partner.
• 19:03
  I was like, did you hear that?
• 19:07
  He was like, no.
• 19:08
  So I told him all about it.
• 19:09
  And he's like, yeah, that fits.
• 19:12
  That makes a lot of sense for you.
• 19:14
  And I knew I do know a chaplain who's close with my family.
• 19:20
  And I'm
• 19:21
  I've always enjoyed his company and talking to him about the tougher things that are hard to talk about, like death and um end of life stuff.
• 19:29
  um through some experiences, like with my grandmother passing away and then my dad had like a quintuple bypass and that chaplain was there with us as a family friend and
• 19:40
  chaplain.
• 19:40
  And um I started talking to him about going into the ministry in that sense.
• 19:45
  And he encouraged me to.
• 19:48
  to get certification and things like that so that I could start preparing for that as a field to go into.
• 20:00
  I happened to graduate with my master's in counseling at that point right as COVID was starting.
• 20:06
  Hmm.
• 20:07
  And so I was working at like a family, just a family clinic for counseling at that point.
• 20:12
  And I ended up just being a, like a pastoral counselor, but I did get my chaplaincy certification.
• 20:17
  And then when all the codes and stuff were lifted after COVID, I went into hospice and talk about, my gosh, the stories and the experiences that I had and the.
• 20:28
  presence of God that I felt in those rooms was life-changing.
• 20:33
  Just life-altering, I'll say.
• 20:35
  Not even changing, but like literally altered the course of my life.
• 20:39
  Working in that field for a little over a year.
• 20:43
  And of course I burnt out because a lot of people do.
• 20:46
  It was a lot of driving around and I covered a really vast region of patients, but I mean each and every experience at the point of the point of death was
• 20:59
  unique and had its own story and I just, it changed my faith too.
• 21:05
  It just made it that much more real because I literally could feel the presence of God in those rooms.
• 21:09
  I could feel like, Jesus is literally standing there.
• 21:13
  Like it was almost like I could see there was an angel in the room or there was Jesus there.
• 21:18
  And then
• 21:21
  And I think any nurse or hospice person will tell you the same, that they've had life altering faith experiences in those rooms.
• 21:29
  But yeah, after I um burned out on hospice, then I decided, well, I'll go back and get licensed as a licensed professional counselor.
• 21:37
  And that's how I started my private practice.
• 21:39
  I would take it to a superior and finished the rest of their master's program.
• 21:44
  And then I got licensed.
• 21:47
  I decided to open a private practice and I don't really like the idea of being in a clinic or working for somebody else.
• 21:54
  I'm just very independent that way.
• 21:55
  I'm an entrepreneur.
• 21:57
  I'm a member of Polka Dot Powerhouse.
• 22:01
  Yeah, no, that's awesome.
• 22:04
  So how are you walking in your faith these days?
• 22:06
  Are you doing anything with your uh pastoral license?
• 22:10
  Tell me what you're doing now.
• 22:14
  right now I am, my family's going through a lot and I'm so, so grateful to God for the experience I had in hospice because some things are going to start changing.
• 22:28
  there is going to be a need for me to be a very strong child to my parents and, um,
• 22:39
  Just that, we're, and my family is just at that stage where now the roles are being reversed.
• 22:45
  The parents are aging, the kids are starting to take on more responsibility for those kinds of things.
• 22:50
  And I'm so grateful to know what to expect in a way for end of life for both of them, really.
• 23:01
  They're not both dying or anything, but just knowing what to expect.
• 23:05
  I know it's not going to make that any easier, but
• 23:10
  I don't know, I think compared to my other siblings, maybe I just have the inside scoop.
• 23:17
  You know, and I think that in a way it's helping me to minister to my family and charity begins at home, right?
• 23:25
  They say ministry begins at home and it's really done a lot to heal my relationship with.
• 23:33
  my parents and my siblings.
• 23:35
  Our relationships are changing and growing in a way that I never expected through this process.
• 23:40
  um I am extremely exhausted.
• 23:47
  I can't imagine my parents how exhausted they must be.
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  And they're like, you near 80.
• 23:55
  So everything that they're dealing with is, I can't imagine.
• 24:01
  um
• 24:02
  but I can sympathize and I can empathize and I can apply what I know of my faith and pray for them regularly.
• 24:11
  And I'd say this is like a very unique time in our lives where not only are the like the physical familial roles being reversed, but also like I'm reminding them of the faith that
• 24:25
  they instilled in me.
• 24:26
  Now I'm going to cry.
• 24:26
  I'm going to...
• 24:30
  and reminding them of the faith they instilled in me from the very beginning because they're now going through the hardest trials they've ever faced.
• 24:39
  Yeah.
• 24:42
  Thank
• 24:44
  I mean just the basics like how can I pray for you?
• 24:49
  How can I support you guys this week?
• 24:57
  just like the things, the stories that they share with me and they just seem, you know, in that day they're just completely wiped out and tired and hopeless feeling and I can turn
• 25:08
  to them and say, well, you know, the Lord is my shepherd, I shall not want.
• 25:17
  And uh they'll say it with me, you know, they'll start chiming in too and we'll go through.
• 25:28
  and it's just beautiful and it's so hard, but I...
• 25:35
  My mom took care of my grandma when she was aging and she had late onset Alzheimer's diagnosis at like age 90 and she lived to be 98.
• 25:47
  So we took care of her.
• 25:50
  I was still living at home at the time and so in my family there's a lot of those kinds of traditions because we're Finnish and like my grandparents came over so.
• 26:02
  Mm-hmm.
• 26:04
  It's just a very like Scandinavian cultural thing where, you know, the one generation takes care of the next and we're close in it that way.
• 26:13
  And so taking care of my grandma when she was dying, um just my mom would always say, because I was a teenager at the time, she would, can you go curl your grandma's hair or
• 26:26
  can you go clean up in the bathroom after she was in there?
• 26:30
  Or can you help her get dressed this morning?
• 26:32
  show her where her toothbrush is, those kinds of things.
• 26:35
  And you know, I'm a teenager and I'm like, I don't wanna, you know, just let me sleep or I did it last time, make someone else do it.
• 26:44
  And she would always say to me, you will never regret it.
• 26:48
  If you go do this, you will never regret the time you're spending doing this.
• 26:51
  And it's so true.
• 26:52
  And I took it in stride and I started doing things above and beyond.
• 26:57
  I would give her shoulder rubs.
• 26:59
  I would ask her if she wanted me to,
• 27:02
  to wash her feet and give her a pedicure and take her for walks outside.
• 27:07
  And it just became, um, just became kind of my mission to like make her end of life as happy and loving as possible.
• 27:16
  Now I'm going to cry again.
• 27:19
  And when, when she did pass away.
• 27:24
  She actually didn't, she didn't, wasn't a Christian.
• 27:26
  She, until she passed away, she had always been.
• 27:31
  um
• 27:34
  always been an atheist and a communist because she grew up in the old country.
• 27:40
  And um it wasn't until she was like 96 or 97 that she was going to church with us one day and the pastor was talking to her and she accepted Jesus into her heart and it just was so
• 27:53
  amazing.
• 27:54
  She's like, I feel him, I feel him in there.
• 28:00
  That's beautiful.
• 28:03
  Liz, I feel like we could talk for hours and hours.
• 28:08
  If there is one lesson you want people to take away from your story, any part of it, what would that be?
• 28:23
  Just call out to Jesus, because He'll answer the call.
• 28:29
  He's waiting.
• 28:31
  Yeah.
• 28:32
  It's always waiting.
• 28:33
  And we get so busy.
• 28:37
  Yeah, he's there, that's for sure.
• 28:38
  All right, tell me, what is your favorite Bible verse or what are you walking through these days?
• 28:51
  Psalm 23.
• 28:52
  em I've always had that one I just come back to over and over and over.
• 28:58
  I think it's just my life chapter because I had it, I had a piece of really beautiful piece of art and um there's Jesus walking in the meadow with his lambs, you know, like a
• 29:12
  shepherd.
• 29:14
  And it's really beautiful with gold trim and it has the, you know, really pretty script written out.
• 29:21
  um that image of Jesus reaching out to like the lost lamb and you know searching after us seeking us out um has always meant a lot to me.
• 29:37
  So I'm leaning into that really heavily right now.
• 29:42
  Yeah.
• 29:45
  Well, thank you so much for being here today, Liz.
• 29:47
  I truly appreciate your time and your stories and just remind you to please take care of yourself as you're taking care of everyone around you.
• 29:54
  yeah, absolutely.
• 29:57
  Will do.
• 29:58
  Thanks, Michelle.
• 29:59
  Thank you.