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WoTS Tangents compilation: TEOTW, TGH, & TDR · WoT Spoilers

• 0:09
  Speaker 1: This is the Wheel of Times Spoilers podcast. Your hosts
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: are Seth Jacobson and Patrick Hyler.
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that is funny that you mentioned that earlier.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: Was talking to Seth right before we turned the microphones
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: on that I've started listening to this podcast called My
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: Favorite Murder recently, which is a really popular true crime one.
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: These two young ladies just talk about their favorite serial
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: killer stories or whatever, and they have that same microphone effect.
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: I was telling Seth that someone someone wrote into their
• 0:46
  Speaker 2: podcast and was like, what's that gong noise? I think
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: we managed to have managed to edit it out.
• 0:52
  Speaker 3: Most of them. Yeah, but occasionally there's a little like,
• 0:56
  Speaker 3: I don't even know what to call it. It's like
• 0:57
  Speaker 3: a lever for turning the the screw on the microphone stand. Yeah,
• 1:03
  Speaker 3: and Timber likes to bump it and it sort of
• 1:05
  Speaker 3: flaggles back and forth that makes a waaa wa wah
• 1:08
  Speaker 3: sound into the microphone.
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: It's this like spring loaded boom arm thing that just
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: like clamps to a table all the microphone so we
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: don't have to hold them.
• 1:18
  Speaker 3: They're like those old lamp stands.
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly like that.
• 1:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think those would usually have like a heavy
• 1:29
  Speaker 3: base instead of a clamp. How's your Thanksgiving?
• 1:34
  Speaker 2: It was really nice, just me and jewels. Uh, made
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: a duck and mashed potatoes and greens and a bunch
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: of stuff. Drank a bunch of whiskey, which is part
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: of the reason that this is the first drink I've
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: had since Thanksgiving, because it's just like so dried out
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: at the end of those two days.
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I went and visited my family and we opened
• 2:05
  Speaker 3: a nice bottle of whiskey and a good amount of it. Yeah,
• 2:12
  Speaker 3: it was nice. That was actually the first like really
• 2:16
  Speaker 3: family get together I've had in along since I've had
• 2:18
  Speaker 3: a big family. Timmer's over here being full of antics.
• 2:24
  Speaker 3: He's just like scratching at the ground and then looking
• 2:27
  Speaker 3: at me, and then scratching at the ground and then
• 2:29
  Speaker 3: looking at me. We've been on two walks, you've been fed.
• 2:34
  Speaker 3: I played with you. We're going to kick you out
• 2:38
  Speaker 3: if you don't relax.
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: I hope the microphone picked that up. Yeah, I was
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: just saying.
• 2:45
  Speaker 3: I threw Timber in a car and drove down to
• 2:47
  Speaker 3: southern Oregon.
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: And it's cool. You had like a real family Thanksgiving.
• 2:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's really been the first time we've ever been
• 2:54
  Speaker 3: on the same coast.
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: I haven't done that in years. It's been a while
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: time for me. Yeah.
• 3:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I keep going to my girlfriends thanksgivings rather than
• 3:06
  Speaker 3: my own. So it was nice to see my family
• 3:10
  Speaker 3: and they gave me a few things, you know, I
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: got a few a little bit of bling by going
• 3:15
  Speaker 3: to visit them. Nice my mom's old laptop, so I'm
• 3:20
  Speaker 3: back in business with that, which is really exciting for me. Yeah,
• 3:24
  Speaker 3: two thousand and one instead of a two or sorry,
• 3:26
  Speaker 3: twenty eleven is supposed to two thousand and eight, so
• 3:28
  Speaker 3: it's a little bit newer, a little bit newer.
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, pretty stoked about it.
• 3:32
  Speaker 3: And then my dad gave me a nice leather jacket
• 3:36
  Speaker 3: that he hasn't worn since the seventies.
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, sweet barmber jacket, right, that looks like I
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: got worn like once probably in nineteen seventy and then
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: just sat it looks new. I did have a good
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: time with Choules. Yeah, drank a bunch of whiskey. Like
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: I said, we watched The New Stranger Things, Oh good,
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: which we kept like meaning to marry and then stalling out.
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: What'd you think?
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: It was really good? Yeah? I had I had a
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: good time with it. It's a really cool concept. I
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: love the setting, the like instant nostalgia that like the opening,
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: just the opening, like thirty seconds, the stranger things. Sure,
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: I feel like they must have done that on purpose, like,
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: let's set it when our target audience was growing up.
• 4:28
  Speaker 3: Well, I mean, you know, there's a reason that seventies
• 4:30
  Speaker 3: show came out about ten years ago, and we're basically
• 4:33
  Speaker 3: getting that eighties show.
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, except except it's science fiction, right, which would make
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: sense for the eighties. Yeah, you know the seventies what
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: was on TV? Stupid sitcoms? What was on in the eighties?
• 4:50
  Speaker 3: We had good sci fi and good horror and all,
• 4:52
  Speaker 3: you know, all the Steven Spielberg stuff and.
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, the clothes and the kids have the Dungeons
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: and Dragons like monster manual that's been photo copied. And
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: I love that the kids got a lot of their
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: good ideas from Dungeons and Dragons lore, like how they
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: figure out did you have you watched through the whole? Yeah? Yeah, hi,
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: kel see the holidays bullshit perfect.
• 5:21
  Speaker 3: I think we just we were just bullshitting about the holidays.
• 5:24
  Speaker 3: And you know it's been I don't know seven months
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: about since we started this podcast and we've done The
• 5:32
  Speaker 3: Eye of the World, and I don't know, I just
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: wanted to have an episode where we got to sit
• 5:37
  Speaker 3: around and reflect back on all the things that we
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: did and think about the first book and answer any
• 5:42
  Speaker 3: questions people might have.
• 5:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I can't believe it's been seven months.
• 5:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think so.
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: When has it been seven months?
• 5:51
  Speaker 3: I looked back at the.
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: You know, because in the beginning, we weren't doing two
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: episodes a week. Oh, that's right, But so now we're Yeah,
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: seven months. It's crazy.
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: But the good news is the artwork is done and
• 6:07
  Speaker 3: I'm finally getting buttons and stickers made for everybody.
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm excited about that to finally send people stuff. Yeah.
• 6:15
  Speaker 3: I feel like, not that we've been negligent, but that
• 6:18
  Speaker 3: I really wanted to get this done earlier.
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's okay. I listened to so many other podcasts,
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: and I mean, and I feel like we're doing a
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: better job at than most fair enough, and like so
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: many of the cool, nicely produced Radiotopia and the NPR
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: podcast that I listened to and stuff like that, Like
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: they send out buttons and stickers and they have like
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: tens of thousands of dollars.
• 6:45
  Speaker 3: But they also to send out tens of thousands of sticks.
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: True. True, you probably just need an intern to work
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: for a whole month to just do.
• 6:52
  Speaker 3: That, right, right, I'm hoping to just send out a few.
• 6:56
  Speaker 4: We all have time. Fans are used to waiting.
• 6:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah, just a little bit. Not as much as a
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: game with Thrones fans, though, Oh.
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: God, I'm done.
• 7:04
  Speaker 4: I'm just over it.
• 7:05
  Speaker 3: Man, I was over it a decade ago, all right, Yeah,
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: I know.
• 7:10
  Speaker 4: Well he just released a blot another post about like
• 7:14
  Speaker 4: if I have time, I'm going to finish these things,
• 7:16
  Speaker 4: and I'm like, you know what, that's fine. You don't
• 7:20
  Speaker 4: have to finish it.
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: No, we're good.
• 7:23
  Speaker 4: I'm fine. I'm over it. It's gone, the show is
• 7:27
  Speaker 4: gonna end it and whatever.
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 7:30
  Speaker 3: No, I think that's where we all are as readers.
• 7:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 7:34
  Speaker 3: Well, hopefully it didn't make people wait too long on
• 7:37
  Speaker 3: that stuff. Mostly, I'm also excited to like give them
• 7:40
  Speaker 3: out to people and try and like promote the podcast
• 7:42
  Speaker 3: with the merch.
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I'm just happy that we can give something back.
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, T shirts. I should think about making up T shirts.
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: We should sell some T shirts.
• 7:55
  Speaker 3: Yeah. So I looked into like te spring or whatever
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: it was. I wasn't really sure.
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: Should we go to jordan Con and hawk them in
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: the parking lot out of the back of a white man? Maybe?
• 8:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah? Who those creepy guys in the parking lot? I
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: don't know, but they do something spoiler related.
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: That's weird.
• 8:18
  Speaker 4: I got some Wheel of Time spoilers T shirts for you,
• 8:23
  Speaker 4: just like only five dollars a kiss.
• 8:26
  Speaker 3: Come on, kid, you know you want it.
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: I'll give you the.
• 8:32
  Speaker 5: Sticker for.
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: I have to rent a windowless van just for that.
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: They're only like twenty five bucks a day or something.
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: That's true. Yeah, I'm sure. I'm sure you could just
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: pick them up off the Atlanta no problem.
• 8:49
  Speaker 4: But make sure like the paint is peeling.
• 8:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that definitely helps. The other thing that helps is
• 8:56
  Speaker 3: having like stains all over it and a bumper that's
• 9:01
  Speaker 3: kind of falling off. But you know, tie on a
• 9:04
  Speaker 3: little bit. So I did actually reserve rooms in Atlanta?
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: Oh really? Yeah? When is jordan Con again.
• 9:14
  Speaker 3: For twenty right?
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: How do I keep forgetting that? Hey, Kelsey, are you
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: trying to go to jordan Con?
• 9:24
  Speaker 4: Sadly, no, I want to. I'm hoping to defend my
• 9:31
  Speaker 4: dissertation that month. If all things go well, well, I.
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: Guess if you have to have an adult life.
• 9:39
  Speaker 4: It's been so long coming, but I'm well, I guess
• 9:42
  Speaker 4: the consolation prize is that if that doesn't happen, then
• 9:46
  Speaker 4: I could potentially swing it, depending on how stressful things are.
• 9:52
  Speaker 4: Lots of things up in the air. So probably no,
• 9:56
  Speaker 4: but maybe twenty nineteen.
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: Cool. Cool, and that's been like half a year. I
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: can definitely plan that.
• 10:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but I figured we should get in on the
• 10:06
  Speaker 3: the booked rooms because they were a much cheaper rate
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: than anything that I could find.
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, did you just like find something near? Is it
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: at like a convention center?
• 10:16
  Speaker 3: There's like a reserved chunk of rooms for people who
• 10:19
  Speaker 3: are at.
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: The corn gotcha? I have never been to Atlanta, I.
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: Mean either this will be a first for both of us.
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: I've only been to like rural Georgia, where there's nothing
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: good to look at except for except for nature. I
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: was there for yeah, backpacking, that's it.
• 10:37
  Speaker 3: Beautiful place. Shame about the people.
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: But yeah, I only stopped in like two little towns
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: that was like the highlight was like a Walmart and
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: a gas station that sold liquor. Nice or Yeah, that
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: was like all that was. I mean where I was,
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: you know, right, it's just like a motel, a walmart
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: on a gas station.
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: It was basically the town I lived in in Virginia
• 11:00
  Speaker 3: was out Waynesboro, Virginia, about halfway between there.
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: I stayed in Waynesboro for a couple of days.
• 11:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I remember that being really funny. I think it
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: was when I lived there too, right, I.
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: Think, yeah, I think we might have established that one that.
• 11:14
  Speaker 3: It was like over like before we ever know each other.
• 11:16
  Speaker 3: We were in the same town.
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: Like there was like a church that like opened up
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: their basement to Appalachian trail hikers. Sure, soon you're coming
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: through town, they just let you you can sleep in
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: the basement.
• 11:29
  Speaker 3: Awesome.
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: I do remember that they were a little finicky about
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: you know, a lot of backpackers wander into their hostile
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: drunk in the middle of the night, and they weren't
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: too fond of that. But there's not really a lot
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: you can do about drunk backpackers. Yeah, it's just what
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: you do. What else There's nothing else to do in Waynesboro.
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: That's very, very true.
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: I'm trying to remember anything else about the town. I
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: don't really I mean, I think there was a Chinese
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: buffet yep, yep, which we definitely hit up. I don't
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: remember anything else. I think we yeah, probably bought beer
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: at a gas station and sat in like a park
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: and drank it. That's usually it's pretty pretty standard. Fair.
• 12:15
  Speaker 3: I have memories, yeah, not many of them are fond
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: of Portland's nice. Portlands are really nice, but I live
• 12:21
  Speaker 3: here now. The weather today is gorgeous.
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: What do you what do you mean like dark and rainy?
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: Was it?
• 12:29
  Speaker 3: It was sunny and cold today?
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 12:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it didn't rain at all.
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: Oh well, I don't know. It was drizzling a little.
• 12:35
  Speaker 3: When Okay, I missed that. That's what happens when you
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: spent all day in office, you missed the weather.
• 12:40
  Speaker 4: Hey, okay, sorry, I've got a two dogs who are
• 12:44
  Speaker 4: about to fight over a toy. You guys, Hey, hey, nice.
• 12:51
  Speaker 3: Yelling at your dog's podcast today? Apparently, Yeah, they're really cute.
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: What kind of dog do you have?
• 13:01
  Speaker 4: I have a brindle mix. And then my friend and
• 13:06
  Speaker 4: I are puppy sitting a mutt that we found on
• 13:10
  Speaker 4: the street named Chi lupa Batman.
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: Chila Batman.
• 13:19
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, she's not my Batman.
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: It's not my dog.
• 13:28
  Speaker 4: My dog is Ruben, who was named at the shelter.
• 13:30
  Speaker 4: But Ruben really likes to chew toys and chew like
• 13:35
  Speaker 4: it's really upset when Ruben choose her toys and they
• 13:40
  Speaker 4: like started ground.
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: I took Timber down to my parents and they have
• 13:44
  Speaker 3: a dog. They're fostering for Aid to the Death, and
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: so there's some organization I can't remember the exact name
• 13:53
  Speaker 3: of it.
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, don't they operate out of Boring.
• 13:57
  Speaker 3: Yes, And so they're fostering a puppy and so Timber
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: got to go hang out with a puppy and for
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: the most part he was They got to run around
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: and chase, but he did get a little bit of
• 14:07
  Speaker 3: the neck biting and that kind of pissed Himber off
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: because the puppy kept like digging his sharp teeth right
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: into his jowls, and he was like that, No, that's annoyance.
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: It's not that hanging off his jowls totally.
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: Timber doesn't really have any jowels, so he was not
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: happy about that at all. But the rest of the
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: time they were just playing and running and it was great.
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: Oh, that's nice. I used to work for a couple
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: when I was a kid that did that. There's a
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: there's one in Morristown, New Jersey that's a like a
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: Seeing Eye Training center or whatever. I think they just
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: call it the Seeing Eye there. I think the program
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: marks the same all across the country where they like
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: they don't want to train the dogs until there, I forget,
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: like over a year old or something like that. Right,
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: so they foster, they do, like do the breeding program,
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: and then they foster the mounts of families to raise
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: until they're however old. Yeah, and then they I remember
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: that at least in that program, they get first DIBs
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: if the dog fails the Seeing Eye training. And they
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: had they had one that had failed because it was
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: afraid of like loud noises, particularly thunder and lightning. It
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: would like run and hide. Sure it was otherwise a
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: perfectly trained, well mannered dog. Oh.
• 15:25
  Speaker 3: I bet my parents are hoping that they have a
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: foster failure.
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, probably only I
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: have no idea what percentage, but I'm sure most don't
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: don't pass. Realty, rigorous, tough. It's got a focus all
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: that time.
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: They breed for it, though, don't they.
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah? But I can't imagine that. It's like easy sure no, sure,
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: like that dog that that couple had failed because it's
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: free of thunder.
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: Right right, there could be a lot of things. Yeah, yeah,
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: Well I have to do something I've been neglecting for
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: a while.
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: Huh.
• 16:06
  Speaker 3: I have to thank some patrons.
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I think we got how many did we
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: get over the last two weeks? Because we have.
• 16:12
  Speaker 3: More than ten, less than thirty. You know, last week
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: was Thanksgiving, so I didn't get a chance to do
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: it then, and I think I skipped it the week before.
• 16:20
  Speaker 3: So it's been probably four episodes or so since I've
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: had a chance to thank them, gotcha? So I am
• 16:27
  Speaker 3: falling behind on that because the help has not stopped
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: rolling in. It's not like people are slowing down or
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: it feels pretty steady. It does feel very steady. So's
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: it's just been fun to watch that growth.
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: That's continuing to grow. Like I don't we may actually
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: be able to do well. I don't know what I'm.
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: Saying that every month we seem to get another, you know,
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: group of patrons who are helping us out. And you know,
• 16:56
  Speaker 3: I see I know a trend line when I see one,
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: and This one makes me pretty damn happy. Yeah, yeah,
• 17:03
  Speaker 3: that's all I want to say. So I'm going to
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: start with Neil Williams. This is back in November sixteenth,
• 17:10
  Speaker 3: pledged the full twenty bucks.
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: Thank you very much.
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: Neil, I Dream of Stars pledged. Alistair Barnes pledged a
• 17:20
  Speaker 3: couple bucks.
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: Thank you, Alistair. We appreciate you.
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: Colton Geymon jumped up a level. Always nice to see
• 17:28
  Speaker 3: someone who still appreciates.
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: It's always appreciated. That happens a lot. The surprising amount.
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: Uh yeah, that's a good chunk of where I think
• 17:36
  Speaker 3: the jumps come from is people who come back to
• 17:39
  Speaker 3: us the end.
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 17:41
  Speaker 3: Speaking of which, John Hunt jumped up a little bit
• 17:44
  Speaker 3: to the highest level.
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: Thank you John, Thank you, Jo. I'm consistently surprised by
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: that people care about what we're doing.
• 17:52
  Speaker 3: Still happy about it though.
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: Jemma Murray appreciate you, Jemma.
• 17:58
  Speaker 3: Now here's a name that looks for me to me.
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: Donald Hyler, Thanks Dad, I've seen that last name somewhere before.
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: Thanks Patrick's head. Oh man, you were turning a beautiful.
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: Shade of red.
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: Uh to Carlson, that's got some umlots on there. So
• 18:23
  Speaker 3: I'm not so sure about the pronunciation.
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: Thank you to her? Is it Bjorn b j O r.
• 18:28
  Speaker 3: N Josh hefley half file a can you tell him?
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: Not any good at names, We're terrible at this, But
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: thank you Josh.
• 18:37
  Speaker 3: Thank you Adria Farmer, who actually emailed a few times.
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: Good good to speak with you.
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: Adria A r A d I A Rada, Thank you
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: miss Farmer. Miss I'm guessing.
• 18:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Christine, rice up your pledge and margarethe havegar.
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: You guys are all awesome and like we always say,
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: that makes this whole thing worth it and keeps us going.
• 19:04
  Speaker 3: And I also want to say, like we've had some
• 19:05
  Speaker 3: just great feedback on our emails, you know, just people
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: continually send positive messages and tell us how much they
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: love it, and that's just been really really great.
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Like every week now there's at least a handful
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: of emails people just saying thank you, which is awesome.
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: I'm glad you guys like what we're doing.
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: We'd probably be doing it anyway, just with less dedication and.
• 19:35
  Speaker 3: I'd be like Patrick Key coming over. He'd be like, no,
• 19:37
  Speaker 3: I want to hang out with my girlfriend this week.
• 19:41
  Speaker 3: So that's it for the patrons. I don't really have
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: a lot of corrections, haven't really been getting Yeah, yeah,
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: you know, we should send people back to the reddit
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: because we've been posting summaries on Reddit, and that's a
• 19:55
  Speaker 3: good way to sort of communicate with us about about
• 19:59
  Speaker 3: each trying to.
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: Keep everything organized.
• 20:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so you know, I do still post on WoT
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: spoilers dot reddit dot com. So come check us out
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: there and have a conversation there.
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, check out our so I read it, guys.
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we also spent a lot of time, of course
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: talking with our discord folks. Unfortunately that is just patron only.
• 20:22
  Speaker 3: There's a great conversation going on there pretty well. You know,
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: like today, my phone was just going off all day
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: because I was sitting at work and I kept reading it.
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: I haven't set the vibrate, I.
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: Didn't even have the app on my phone. I'm going
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: to do it right now.
• 20:35
  Speaker 3: And yeah, I just was following along with the conversation
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: all day, really enjoying myself. And I was supposed to
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: be working, so I didn't do a lot of replying,
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: but definitely enjoyed reading it. Kelsey, you were participating in that.
• 20:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that was a lot of fun. I was also
• 20:52
  Speaker 4: at work. But yeah, we were sharing a lot of
• 20:59
  Speaker 4: our works. So if you guys our patrons and want
• 21:05
  Speaker 4: to hop on the discord, like sometimes we share photos
• 21:07
  Speaker 4: of different artwork we find, or ask questions about characters
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: or make fun of you know, ninive tugging on our braids.
• 21:14
  Speaker 4: So full its stuff.
• 21:20
  Speaker 3: Well, and I just love seeing people, you know, have
• 21:23
  Speaker 3: a conversation there.
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's cool that it's like a place that people
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: hang out.
• 21:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it's really cool, and it's just adds to
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: the whole community feel.
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: That I feel like is going on. Yeah, there's dozens
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: of you.
• 21:52
  Speaker 4: Yeah, like today, you know, I asked the important question
• 21:57
  Speaker 4: of if I was the only one who liked the circus,
• 22:00
  Speaker 4: So you too can weigh in on.
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: Do you mean like the real world? No?
• 22:04
  Speaker 4: No, no, like the real time circus?
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: Sequist okay, but everyone hates it's like the circus. I
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: got you. I mean, I love anything having to do
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: with Tuuan. That's a good point.
• 22:21
  Speaker 4: Well, yeah, she was a part of the circus when
• 22:23
  Speaker 4: met met up with Luca.
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so there's those two distinct like circus scenes. There's
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: one like Niie Eve and Elane and Tom and they
• 22:31
  Speaker 3: go up and they I think.
• 22:33
  Speaker 4: That's the more controversial sequence because I like the plot
• 22:38
  Speaker 4: that happens, but a lot of people don't think a
• 22:40
  Speaker 4: lot of plot happens, and arguably Ninive is not on
• 22:44
  Speaker 4: our best behavior, so.
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: What time people like about it.
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: There's not a lot of action that happens, and they're
• 22:52
  Speaker 3: not really moving that fast, and it's one of those
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: scenes where if you probably get out of the book,
• 23:01
  Speaker 3: nothing would really change.
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: Fair Okay, yeah.
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: You know, it's just it's just one of those scenes
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: where people like it really feels like he's kind of
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: patting the books out a little bit with it at
• 23:13
  Speaker 3: that point, you know. But that being said, I love it.
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: I haven't re read that part a long time, but
• 23:22
  Speaker 2: I feel like I enjoyed it. I guess. I mean,
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: I guess I always think of Matt and Tuan though, Yeah,
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: which is is later.
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but I enjoy the whole. I enjoy laying up
• 23:32
  Speaker 3: on the high wire. I enjoy her sort of playing
• 23:35
  Speaker 3: around with the whole, you know, figuring it out with
• 23:38
  Speaker 3: using a platform of air and then like, but you
• 23:41
  Speaker 3: can't do that for the actual performance, so she just
• 23:43
  Speaker 3: like goes for it.
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 23:46
  Speaker 3: I like it too, Yeah, and like my Neive is like,
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: clearly an attractive person and she's dealing with this unwanted
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: attention and she wants you know, she's clearly in love
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: with Land, but she's got this other kind of attractive
• 23:59
  Speaker 3: dude with her. But she thinks it's ridiculous.
• 24:02
  Speaker 6: You know.
• 24:03
  Speaker 3: I mean, it's it's all about relationships. And you know,
• 24:06
  Speaker 3: as we've talked about before, there's a lot of vitriol
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: around the women, and this is all about the women.
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: I mean, I feel like I could think of some
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: scenes with her parts with Matt or Parrien or whatever
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: male characters that are just mostly useless scenes, I guess,
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: but that there's usually more violence.
• 24:29
  Speaker 4: There's that gus see I like. I also like the
• 24:33
  Speaker 4: character development aspect of like the characters worrying about their
• 24:39
  Speaker 4: relationships and other people like I. I like that aspect
• 24:42
  Speaker 4: of it. I don't always need like battle sequences, and
• 24:46
  Speaker 4: but I mean, you know, I get the arguments about
• 24:49
  Speaker 4: some of these, you know, chapters and plot lines in
• 24:54
  Speaker 4: the series that again are probably not super necessary. Most
• 24:58
  Speaker 4: of the listeners are probably super fans, so if you're
• 25:01
  Speaker 4: a super fan, you probably like it. For the most part, I.
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: Am interested to see what people would think give us,
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: like email us or talk about it on our sabreddit
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: you know it Stu a Pole.
• 25:13
  Speaker 4: How do you feel about the circus? I know that
• 25:17
  Speaker 4: the Wheel of Time specific subrett is pretty h harsh
• 25:21
  Speaker 4: on it. It definitely is Enigma votes yes to the circus.
• 25:27
  Speaker 3: I mean, I'm just of the opinion of, like, give
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: me more Wheel of Time. The more the better, you know,
• 25:31
  Speaker 3: And I think that there's some people who just want
• 25:33
  Speaker 3: to get on with it.
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: It can't all be it can't all be like battle
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: and torture and crazy forsake and stuff happening. Yeah, in
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: a huge epic series, there has to be like set
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: up and how characters get from one place to another
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: and right right. I just otherwise Robert Jordan could have
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: just written the Last Battle, which would have been cool
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: by itself. It's even more epic once you've already read
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: ten thousand pages to get there, right or whatever it.
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: Is, you know, And like sometimes the characters go through
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: kind of boring times to get through to their exciting action.
• 26:12
  Speaker 3: And I don't know, they're just they're growing up, right
• 26:15
  Speaker 3: like their kids. They're sixteen to twenty five year olds
• 26:20
  Speaker 3: trying to figure out.
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: Life in that regard, I think they are very well
• 26:26
  Speaker 4: behaved considering the circumstances.
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, yes, do you know what I was
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: doing when I was eighteen to twenty.
• 26:32
  Speaker 4: Two dicking around?
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, how'd you know? Like you guess?
• 26:42
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean like, yeah, they go through a lot
• 26:46
  Speaker 4: and it starts in The Eye World.
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: Drunk for most of those four years I worked and
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: went to the bar. Yeah, that's a lot of what
• 26:57
  Speaker 2: I did.
• 26:59
  Speaker 4: Sounds about right, Yeah, And it starts in the Eye
• 27:03
  Speaker 4: of the World.
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: No, but the Eye of the World was I mean,
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: it's such a wonderful book, filled with so much foreshadowing.
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: It's where everything starts, you know, it's the introduction of
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: the characters. But it's also in a lot of ways
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: because it's got so much great foreshadowing in it, it
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: makes the ending that much more epic.
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: Totally.
• 27:27
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: And I think we were being asked like, how much
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: do you think Robert Jordan had planned out ahead of time?
• 27:39
  Speaker 3: And how much do you think he What.
• 27:40
  Speaker 4: Was interesting about the Brandon Sanderson signing as someone asked
• 27:45
  Speaker 4: him how difficult foreshadowing is, and he said that it's
• 27:50
  Speaker 4: actually not as difficult as you would think because you
• 27:54
  Speaker 4: can be as vague as you want and kind of
• 27:58
  Speaker 4: fill it in as you need to, Like, it gives
• 28:02
  Speaker 4: you liberty as an.
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: Author, and so I think, so you can leave some home, right.
• 28:06
  Speaker 4: So, Like, on the one hand, men's visions almost all
• 28:11
  Speaker 4: of them become fulfilled, and a lot of them she
• 28:14
  Speaker 4: just mentions like right when we meet her, So on
• 28:18
  Speaker 4: the one hand, like that was planned out way in advance.
• 28:22
  Speaker 4: On the other hand, some of her visions are super vague,
• 28:25
  Speaker 4: and so that gives the author like liberties to you know,
• 28:30
  Speaker 4: manipulate the story as it's needed.
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: I always thought the one who follows after was a
• 28:35
  Speaker 3: failed prophecy that he like put that in there and
• 28:40
  Speaker 3: then like just didn't have anything to do with it.
• 28:42
  Speaker 4: Was that talking about the Sword of Calendar?
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because there's.
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: That one ashaman who like it's the one who draws
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: it out will follow after or something like that and
• 28:53
  Speaker 3: sticks it back in the stone and it's like Nourishma
• 28:56
  Speaker 3: or some random I.
• 28:57
  Speaker 4: Think it's or yeah, he makes Narishima go grab it,
• 29:01
  Speaker 4: like he teaches him.
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: All the because Rand left a bunch of traps or something.
• 29:06
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's kind of like a shit dob for Narishma
• 29:10
  Speaker 4: because he's like, you almost killed me. Yeah, that was
• 29:14
  Speaker 4: way more complicated than you made it so, and Rand's
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: like whatever.
• 29:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah darth Rand back in that, Yeah he was.
• 29:22
  Speaker 4: He was kind of.
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: Hey, darth Rand. I just learned that people call that
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: phase darth Rand. Recently. I think there was something on
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: the subreddit on real time Subreddit, like I don't know,
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: a day or two ago that I ran into where
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: people were breaking down the phases of Rand. Do you
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: see that I did post? Do you see that.
• 29:39
  Speaker 4: Kelsey Darth Rand and Jesus Rand. I don't know if
• 29:43
  Speaker 4: I saw that that post specifically, but yeah, I've seen
• 29:46
  Speaker 4: I've seen them on the subredder.
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: I think they broke it down like farm Boy, Dragon Reborn,
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: Darth Rand, Jesus Yeah, Orb Zen Rand. I prefer Zen Rand.
• 30:00
  Speaker 7: Yeah.
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: I don't like the Jesus Rand. That's probably personal. I
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: think our parts.
• 30:07
  Speaker 4: I think I think there are like that, there are
• 30:10
  Speaker 4: strong Jesus illusions.
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: Oh sure, like the.
• 30:15
  Speaker 4: Leaving for three days, the wounds in his side.
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but I mean you okay, well the three days thing,
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: I'm the wound in the side thing is a pretty
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: prevalent thing, and because it does an Odin get stabbed
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: in the side when he's up on up on the
• 30:33
  Speaker 2: Tree of Life.
• 30:35
  Speaker 3: And there's Prometheus who gets his liver eaten by the vultures.
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but the Three Day thing, that's really uh m,
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: Zoroaster slash Jesus thing.
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: Well, and being reborn and actually being you know, God
• 30:50
  Speaker 3: put into the Creator in a human body. There's a
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: ton of Christian allegory through the entire series, and there's
• 30:59
  Speaker 3: no doubt that is a Jesus figure.
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: I've been every time I go to Powells to walk
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: around for whatever reason, I see Neil Gaiman's new Ish
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: book Norse Mythology. So it's called something like that. I've
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: been meaning to read it. I'm pretty sure it's just
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: him talking about how different mythology plays into all these
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: different fictions, how he does it. I don't know if
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: you guys out there have read American Gods, but that's
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: a great book.
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: I actually just went through it recently.
• 31:36
  Speaker 2: Took it's a fun one. Yeah, I really like it.
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: It's a it whacked. He likes to wax romantic about America. Yeah,
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: and that doesn't really appeal to me. Uh yeah, I
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: guess I see where you're coming from, but I like,
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: I feel like I can come from either side there.
• 31:58
  Speaker 3: It's it's I like his stories, but the fact that
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: they're placed in modern day society sometimes I like, I
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: like fantas fantastic societies, you know, I like, I like
• 32:10
  Speaker 3: being somewhere else. I don't necessarily like being in the
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: place I'm in.
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: So Neil Gamon, if you're out there and listening, you
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: should come on our podcast.
• 32:19
  Speaker 8: Sometimes he's seriously, he's definitely listening totally.
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah right. If I mean, I'm gonna choose
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: to believe that it can't under a pseudonym.
• 32:49
  Speaker 3: If at some point we got Sanderson to listen in,
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: I think, I think like we have a shot at
• 32:53
  Speaker 3: some day of him like being like, oh I wonder
• 32:55
  Speaker 3: what this is, and like putting on the first episode
• 32:57
  Speaker 3: and be like.
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: Okay, didn't you say that when you signed your book,
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: you like mentioned that you do the name of your podcast,
• 33:04
  Speaker 2: And he was like.
• 33:04
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, I had him sign it over to
• 33:06
  Speaker 3: the podcast.
• 33:07
  Speaker 5: Well.
• 33:07
  Speaker 3: I also I brought up the legendarium and he knows
• 33:09
  Speaker 3: the legendarium, gotcha, So he did not know us.
• 33:15
  Speaker 4: That's okay.
• 33:17
  Speaker 2: He's busy. He was and now he's also on every episode.
• 33:23
  Speaker 3: Clearly, between the time when we saw him and when
• 33:25
  Speaker 3: you saw him in Houston, he was he binged all
• 33:30
  Speaker 3: of our episodes because it's.
• 33:32
  Speaker 4: Not like he has anything else to do. It's not
• 33:36
  Speaker 4: like raising a million children and writing.
• 33:39
  Speaker 2: When you're flying around the country walking through airports.
• 33:42
  Speaker 3: You know, I listened to podcasts when I'm on an
• 33:47
  Speaker 3: air and flying.
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I make a point of downloading a bunch of two.
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: Do you think he'll be at Jordan Cohn? Yes, definitely right.
• 33:56
  Speaker 3: I have read that they said he's coming.
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: Dude, if we have T shirts by then we should
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: at least give him a button and a sticker.
• 34:03
  Speaker 3: Sure, Oh yeah, totally.
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: Typically we reserve these for people who donate, but I
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: guess we'll make an exception since you're such a big fan.
• 34:13
  Speaker 4: Get in our van. Get in the van, mister Sanderson.
• 34:22
  Speaker 4: I really hope if he listens, he does not listen
• 34:25
  Speaker 4: to this episode.
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: I kind of hope they'll probably think it's funny, it's
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: a good sense of humor. We'll edit some of that out.
• 34:39
  Speaker 3: That's perfect. We don't need it for That's why we
• 34:41
  Speaker 3: want to rent the van, not for children. It's we're
• 34:43
  Speaker 3: just gonna kidnap Brandon. Tell me what happens in stormlight?
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: Ar card?
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: Now, what's up with the pipe lighting?
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: Explain the boys. Wait, you can't break me.
• 35:06
  Speaker 4: You can't handle the truth anyway.
• 35:09
  Speaker 3: Okay, Yeah, I need to get my breath back here
• 35:11
  Speaker 3: for a second.
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: I'm sure he's a cool guy. It just reminded me.
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: I read a funny like fake like the Onion type
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: news article recently about Georgia R. Martin's neighbor while while
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: George Martin was sleeping, started building a wall around his house.
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: And after this long back and forth where every time
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: George Martin left the house, his neighbor would run out
• 35:37
  Speaker 2: onto the front lawn and yell like, why aren't you writing?
• 35:41
  Speaker 4: Is that real?
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: No?
• 35:44
  Speaker 4: Oh, you said it was the Onion.
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: It was like an Onion esque. I don't think it was.
• 35:51
  Speaker 3: So I sat down today and actually added up all
• 35:54
  Speaker 3: the months between his various books, and it was like
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: between the first and second, was like.
• 36:01
  Speaker 4: That's Tula getting mad that I'm not petting her.
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, a dog named Chilupa.
• 36:07
  Speaker 4: I have Tula on my left and Ruben on my right.
• 36:11
  Speaker 3: So you'll never go hungry exactly.
• 36:15
  Speaker 4: So Actually, Chula is a Hurricane Harvey hero. She my
• 36:19
  Speaker 4: friend's apartment was completely flooded and she posted like a
• 36:24
  Speaker 4: picture of Chula on their couch. It just like water
• 36:28
  Speaker 4: all around them, and so my friend like carried her
• 36:32
  Speaker 4: into the water and then they made it to safety
• 36:36
  Speaker 4: and Chula caught a pigeon. She caught them dinner. She
• 36:42
  Speaker 4: was like, never fear.
• 36:44
  Speaker 3: Family, that's awesome. Did he like present it to them?
• 36:49
  Speaker 4: Oh? Yeah, she was so proud. She was like, look
• 36:52
  Speaker 4: what I got.
• 36:53
  Speaker 2: I mean, a pigeon's pretty hard to catch. That's that's
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: pretty impressive.
• 36:57
  Speaker 3: I don't know, have you said there's been some fat
• 36:59
  Speaker 3: page out there?
• 37:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess if Aria can.
• 37:06
  Speaker 3: Do it with a stick. But yeah, I gotta say, like,
• 37:09
  Speaker 3: the one thing that I have been so surprised about
• 37:11
  Speaker 3: is just how awesome the community has been. I have
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: to throw out John Morel's name. John has done an
• 37:21
  Speaker 3: absolutely amazing job helping me with the editing. He's taking
• 37:25
  Speaker 3: a first pass of these things. He's doing it on
• 37:29
  Speaker 3: every episode for the past I don't know, nine or
• 37:31
  Speaker 3: ten episodes now, it's been really actually since we had
• 37:35
  Speaker 3: Kelsey on the first time.
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: That is really awesome.
• 37:39
  Speaker 3: It's been just just an amazing and a huge help.
• 37:42
  Speaker 3: So I can't thank you enough. I really can't. And
• 37:46
  Speaker 3: that's just the kind of help that the community has
• 37:49
  Speaker 3: been offering us.
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: All the time, like consistently too.
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And I feel bad sometimes where I can't I
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: have to say to people like, we don't really have
• 37:58
  Speaker 3: anything for you, have anything for you, but thank you
• 38:01
  Speaker 3: for your offer of help. And you know, tons of
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: people would love to be guests. I've definitely had those offers,
• 38:09
  Speaker 3: and I should say, you know, the people that we've
• 38:11
  Speaker 3: had on as guests have been the folks who have
• 38:14
  Speaker 3: shown up in the discord channel and have just been
• 38:17
  Speaker 3: talking to us and providing great feedback.
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: And consistently consistently. Yeah, I haven't seen John around in
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: a minute. No, no around. I mean I haven't seen
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: John on the internet in a minute.
• 38:28
  Speaker 3: But yeah, I think we wanted to try and have
• 38:30
  Speaker 3: him back at some point. I should send him an email,
• 38:34
  Speaker 3: but yeah, I mean we we had and then of
• 38:37
  Speaker 3: course just having Kelsey on and I'm really excited to
• 38:40
  Speaker 3: have you back because you just made me laugh so
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: hard that I forgot what I was saying.
• 38:47
  Speaker 4: Glad to be here.
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: We've got a lot of compliments on the other episode
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: you were on too, So thanks listeners.
• 38:53
  Speaker 4: Thanks guys. Talking about Wheel of Time is my favorite thing.
• 38:57
  Speaker 4: So glad to contribute.
• 38:59
  Speaker 3: And this is just it's been a loose episode.
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: I don't know, we have no structure set aside to
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: do that do We're supposed to be reflecting on the
• 39:09
  Speaker 2: eye of the world, but I think we're just reflecting
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: on becoming podcasters and that adventure really, which is a
• 39:15
  Speaker 2: lot of what this has been for us. You remember
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: the first time we sat down, Yeah, was that my place? No,
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: it was it was upstairs. It was upstairs. Yeah, well,
• 39:28
  Speaker 2: okay one of the first times was that my place?
• 39:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a couple of times because we would like
• 39:32
  Speaker 3: went we alternated your place in my place a few
• 39:34
  Speaker 3: times early, yeah, and then, but it just made sense
• 39:38
  Speaker 3: to have a setup.
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: We could still do that theoretically. Yeah.
• 39:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I've just got a lot more equipment going on
• 39:44
  Speaker 3: now though. Oh yeah, that's true. And we have the
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: recording studio quotes you mean the crates on the walls. Yeah, yeah,
• 39:52
  Speaker 3: it totally counts. And I feel like hopefully the quality
• 39:56
  Speaker 3: of the audio is improved a little bit, and certainly
• 39:58
  Speaker 3: the qual of the hosts has improved a little bit.
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I feel like we're doing a good job.
• 40:15
  Speaker 3: But Kelsey, you've been around since you know. I was
• 40:18
  Speaker 3: actually checking back to when you first started commenting on
• 40:21
  Speaker 3: these things. You must have been one of our first listeners.
• 40:23
  Speaker 4: I think I was because the release of the podcast
• 40:29
  Speaker 4: coincided right about the first time I finished the series,
• 40:35
  Speaker 4: so I was like, I was trying to consume everything,
• 40:39
  Speaker 4: and so I was like reading all the posts and
• 40:41
  Speaker 4: theories that I had been avoiding because of spoilers, and
• 40:45
  Speaker 4: so then cool, the podcast just kind of came up,
• 40:48
  Speaker 4: like probably that same week, and I was like, yes,
• 40:52
  Speaker 4: this is perfect. I don't ever have to leave.
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: I didn't realize your first read through was that recently.
• 41:00
  Speaker 9: Yeah, it was.
• 41:01
  Speaker 4: I discovered it only about a year ago, so I'm
• 41:05
  Speaker 4: a newbie.
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: How'd you discover the Wheel of Time?
• 41:08
  Speaker 4: My friend actually recommended it to me, suck Laura. She
• 41:12
  Speaker 4: she just had a baby, so she's not like a
• 41:14
  Speaker 4: regular listener, but she had mentioned it to me, and
• 41:19
  Speaker 4: I started listening to it on audible, but the prologue
• 41:23
  Speaker 4: was kind of weird and I had a hard time focusing.
• 41:25
  Speaker 4: And then I was in a bookstore a couple of
• 41:27
  Speaker 4: weeks later and I saw it and I was like,
• 41:28
  Speaker 4: you know, I'm gonna try this, try this in paperback.
• 41:32
  Speaker 4: And I think it was either Christmas holiday last year
• 41:35
  Speaker 4: Thanksgiving holiday last year, so I had a good chunk
• 41:39
  Speaker 4: of time to start reading. And pretty much as soon
• 41:44
  Speaker 4: as the trollics attacked the two rivers, I was like, oh, yeah,
• 41:47
  Speaker 4: I'm hooked.
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: In the in the first book, yeah, book one.
• 41:54
  Speaker 3: So what has it been like? Is this your first
• 41:57
  Speaker 3: read through reread?
• 41:58
  Speaker 4: Then? Yeah, my first reread?
• 42:01
  Speaker 3: What has been like.
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: Sort of like catching a little details on your first
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: read through, that's been pretty cool.
• 42:08
  Speaker 4: So it's hard to distinguish whether I'm catching stuff for
• 42:12
  Speaker 4: the first time on a reread or like reading an
• 42:15
  Speaker 4: article or listening to the podcast. It all kind of
• 42:17
  Speaker 4: blends together. But just seeing things so clearly, like Egwayne's death,
• 42:27
  Speaker 4: I think, I mean that's that's been foreshadowed forever, and
• 42:32
  Speaker 4: even little things like I think book two or three,
• 42:35
  Speaker 4: when the girls are in the tower and Men is
• 42:38
  Speaker 4: with them, and Agwayne mentions that like she asks men, oh,
• 42:44
  Speaker 4: you know, do a viewing of me? And Men like
• 42:47
  Speaker 4: always gives her weird looks and it could mean anything, right, like, oh,
• 42:52
  Speaker 4: she sees a vision, that makes sense, she sees the
• 42:55
  Speaker 4: amor that she becomes the ambulin, or she sees her death,
• 42:58
  Speaker 4: like it could mean anything. But I kind of felt
• 43:00
  Speaker 4: like it was maybe she saw her death and she
• 43:03
  Speaker 4: just didn't want to see it. Just a little stuff
• 43:05
  Speaker 4: like that.
• 43:07
  Speaker 3: A queen's death is not something I've seen a lot
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: of foreshadowing for.
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: I was going to ask, what's the foreshadowing for that she.
• 43:17
  Speaker 4: Sees two forks in the road. I think it's a
• 43:21
  Speaker 4: dream and one is with Gawain and it leads to
• 43:27
  Speaker 4: their death or and then one is that or maybe
• 43:30
  Speaker 4: it's specifically Gawain's death.
• 43:32
  Speaker 3: But yeah, is are there two paths and one leads
• 43:35
  Speaker 3: to marriage and one leads to like.
• 43:37
  Speaker 4: Yeah, one leads to marriage and one leads to death.
• 43:39
  Speaker 4: But she can't tell which is which and which things
• 43:42
  Speaker 4: line up with which, right, And then there's also like
• 43:45
  Speaker 4: the parallels between her and Queen Eleissandra.
• 43:49
  Speaker 3: I think, oh, good, catch.
• 43:53
  Speaker 4: Who it's it's I guess this is relevant to iya
• 43:56
  Speaker 4: the world, which is great. When Marine tells that story.
• 44:01
  Speaker 2: I never even noticed that the parallel between those two before.
• 44:05
  Speaker 4: It's like a Gwayne's death story. Like the trollics are
• 44:08
  Speaker 4: coming down on the on Manethin and there's no hope
• 44:12
  Speaker 4: and she's like bonded to a warder, and the warder
• 44:15
  Speaker 4: her husband dies and then oh my.
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: God, it's like the same thing. Yeah.
• 44:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Like it's like I think she's married to the
• 44:22
  Speaker 4: king and they're they're bonded and they're married, and then
• 44:26
  Speaker 4: she like goes down. She like dies by channeling.
• 44:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, once her husband dies, she draws in enough power
• 44:34
  Speaker 3: to take out the entire trollic army.
• 44:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 44:36
  Speaker 4: So some people I like to.
• 44:38
  Speaker 2: Call it was that pulls an LTT. I like to
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: call it.
• 44:42
  Speaker 4: Oh yeah. So I've seen theories that she's Alessandra reborn,
• 44:47
  Speaker 4: which would be cool.
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: Oh I like that. I'm gonna yeah, I'm gonna choose
• 44:52
  Speaker 2: to believe that one. Sure.
• 44:54
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean it's one of those things that you
• 44:57
  Speaker 4: kind of just want to believe it or not.
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: You'd have to be crazy powerful too. Seth and I
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: have talked about whatever Alessandra did, We've talked about that before.
• 45:10
  Speaker 2: It might have been in one of the super early episodes.
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: But that looks a hell of a lot like what
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: Rand does in The Stone, but even bigger. When rand
• 45:22
  Speaker 2: makes like an almost sentient thing out of the power
• 45:26
  Speaker 2: that hunts down the trolls that hurricane.
• 45:28
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I imagine she's using a little more raw power,
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: just like raw power to wipe them out.
• 45:36
  Speaker 5: Like there.
• 45:36
  Speaker 3: I imagine they're all on a field and she just
• 45:38
  Speaker 3: sends out this like gigantic almost nuclear blast of power
• 45:44
  Speaker 3: that just vaporizes the troles.
• 45:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, yeah, because the whole I don't think she
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: kills any humans though.
• 45:52
  Speaker 3: She levels the city.
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that's true.
• 45:55
  Speaker 3: It becomes it's just a flat point. If there were
• 45:59
  Speaker 3: any humans in that city, they died, but they were
• 46:02
  Speaker 3: all in Amon's Field, which is where he died. But
• 46:08
  Speaker 3: that was far enough away from the city of Menethrene
• 46:10
  Speaker 3: that it was preserved.
• 46:11
  Speaker 4: I thought, was well, I guess Manethrone was overtaken.
• 46:16
  Speaker 3: Menethrone is in the mountains of mist Okay.
• 46:20
  Speaker 2: The Yeah, the capital is in the mountains.
• 46:23
  Speaker 3: Right, and the only thing that's left of it is
• 46:26
  Speaker 3: a flat plane of glass because she just just wiped
• 46:28
  Speaker 3: it out. And Emmons Field is the location where Aimon
• 46:34
  Speaker 3: because it's amens Field.
• 46:35
  Speaker 2: Where he died.
• 46:37
  Speaker 3: Right, he was the king, right, he was her husband.
• 46:41
  Speaker 2: Like the last stand forward, the hard Guard and all that.
• 46:46
  Speaker 4: Right allah on Alissandra.
• 46:52
  Speaker 3: You know, I wonder are there any is there anyone
• 46:54
  Speaker 3: out there who was dedicated enough time to speak the
• 46:57
  Speaker 3: old tongue, because I.
• 46:59
  Speaker 4: Know there's got to be that least someone at Jordan
• 47:01
  Speaker 4: con for sure.
• 47:02
  Speaker 2: I'm sure if you're out there, I mean there's we could.
• 47:09
  Speaker 2: We could painstakingly google each word. And because there's there's
• 47:13
  Speaker 2: a list, there's aren't there pronunciation keys sure for all
• 47:18
  Speaker 2: the Yeah, there is.
• 47:21
  Speaker 3: It's a bit of a limited vocabulary.
• 47:23
  Speaker 2: Flipping through the I just realize I've been pronouncing murdrawl
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: wrong this whole time.
• 47:32
  Speaker 4: It's not me, Yes, you have been How have you
• 47:34
  Speaker 4: been pronouncing it?
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: Drawl?
• 47:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's drawl.
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: I'm looking at the pronunciation keys on the back of
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: the Great Hunt right now.
• 47:45
  Speaker 3: There are definitely people that wish we would have done
• 47:47
  Speaker 3: that a little bit earlier than the end of the book.
• 47:53
  Speaker 2: Probably. I don't think anyone complained about that one.
• 47:56
  Speaker 3: Oh, we definitely have had some complaints.
• 47:58
  Speaker 2: About saying not about me saying mere draw, but just
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: you know, pronounc annunciation for sure, for sure.
• 48:04
  Speaker 3: I mean we do our best. But man, and then
• 48:08
  Speaker 3: I think I had someone uh with shepherd or think
• 48:13
  Speaker 3: and like the number of times I said the wrong
• 48:15
  Speaker 3: name and the wrong place.
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: Oh sure, but yeah, there's there's comprehensive pronunciation guides that
• 48:23
  Speaker 2: we don't use.
• 48:27
  Speaker 3: You know, I'm okay with that.
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a little much.
• 48:32
  Speaker 3: So I really enjoyed the first couple of episodes we did.
• 48:35
  Speaker 3: I felt they were kind of unique.
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we haven't really done anything like that since, and.
• 48:41
  Speaker 3: I know we want to. I mean we've been talking
• 48:43
  Speaker 3: about the notes. You had some computer issues, so you
• 48:45
  Speaker 3: were you had tons of notes.
• 48:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah for sorry for for the next couple of lower
• 48:54
  Speaker 2: episodes we're going to come out with. I do have
• 48:56
  Speaker 2: I have the stuff that I emailed you, but I
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: lost whatever else I was working on, which won't it
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: won't be that hard to put back.
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: Together, right, But it's been hard to do without a computer.
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I can't can't do it. I haven't been working
• 49:09
  Speaker 2: on it, right, So I do.
• 49:11
  Speaker 3: I do want to get those recorded and out because
• 49:13
  Speaker 3: I think the lower episodes I really want to get
• 49:15
  Speaker 3: started on the Great Hunt. I'm already like I started
• 49:18
  Speaker 3: reading the Bores chapter and I was like, ooh, lots
• 49:20
  Speaker 3: talk about in this one.
• 49:21
  Speaker 10: Awes.
• 49:22
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, there's so many. I was wondering about all
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: the different like the notes that Bores makes about like
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: he sees all these different people.
• 49:34
  Speaker 3: We have to identify as many of them as we can.
• 49:37
  Speaker 2: I feel like we might be able to get a
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: lot of them.
• 49:39
  Speaker 3: I think so some of them anyway, or at least
• 49:41
  Speaker 3: make decent casses.
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, some may have never been totally revealed. True.
• 49:48
  Speaker 4: I think the Tinkers were never revealed.
• 49:53
  Speaker 3: Tinker Dark friends, as far as I'm aware.
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there was.
• 49:57
  Speaker 5: There was at least one Tinker.
• 49:59
  Speaker 4: There's like one or too, and there.
• 50:01
  Speaker 2: Was there were a few that were probably never like
• 50:05
  Speaker 2: some regular peasant folks. And oh one was and Duran
• 50:16
  Speaker 2: queen's guard. But I feel like we could probably guess
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: that one.
• 50:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah, doesn't he show up.
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: He's kind of has a major plotline. No, wait, but
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: he's not.
• 50:26
  Speaker 4: He doesn't show up as it as a queen's guard.
• 50:29
  Speaker 4: She puts him on the.
• 50:31
  Speaker 3: Queens when he shows up, Yeah, I think he's a mercenary.
• 50:37
  Speaker 3: The whole point of that scene is just to show
• 50:39
  Speaker 3: dark friends in all aspects of society. Yeah, And you know,
• 50:45
  Speaker 3: I don't think he's necessarily showing us individuals that we
• 50:49
  Speaker 3: see a later time, except maybe I said.
• 50:52
  Speaker 2: I.
• 50:54
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think that's like our first confirmation that there
• 50:58
  Speaker 4: are black Raja.
• 51:00
  Speaker 2: At least that's a good point confirmation, because there's nothing
• 51:04
  Speaker 2: in the first book about black sisters. They're dark friends.
• 51:09
  Speaker 2: Are they mentioned? Is it mentioned that there's.
• 51:12
  Speaker 3: I mean, there's a couple of times where there's there's
• 51:15
  Speaker 3: one where they're talking about going to Tarballin and I
• 51:19
  Speaker 3: think Lance says something about maybe not even Tarvallan being safe.
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, but that's not really a that's not a confirmation, no, right, but.
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: It's sort of the suggestion that there may be dark
• 51:34
  Speaker 3: friends in the tower.
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, nodding.
• 51:38
  Speaker 3: And I mean, of course Lye knows because New Spring,
• 51:40
  Speaker 3: like he and Marine confronted the black hatjaw.
• 51:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 51:47
  Speaker 4: But also, Lan's just the type of person to not
• 51:52
  Speaker 4: trust anybody unless you prove yourself.
• 51:55
  Speaker 3: There's no safety anywhere for land exactly. Well, that's I mean,
• 52:01
  Speaker 3: when your homeland's destroyed, it's got to be hard to feel.
• 52:03
  Speaker 4: Safe and you're raised by soldiers, Yeah.
• 52:09
  Speaker 3: Five warriors. Really, here's your knife to play with. Have fun,
• 52:13
  Speaker 3: little baby, don't cut yourself too.
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: Badly, because that's something in the play.
• 52:21
  Speaker 3: That must have been the hell of a way to
• 52:23
  Speaker 3: grow up. I mean a lot like the Aeel, Right,
• 52:27
  Speaker 3: they grow up with a spear in their hand from
• 52:28
  Speaker 3: a very young age.
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we're a little Fremen child running around finishing off
• 52:36
  Speaker 2: the injured after a battle. That's a whole that's the
• 52:38
  Speaker 2: whole thing. Oh, in the freemen society in Dune, Yeah, like.
• 52:42
  Speaker 3: Learn to kill early. I'm always amazed that more I yell,
• 52:47
  Speaker 3: I guess, I guess the whole tradition of guy Shine
• 52:50
  Speaker 3: means a lot of their battles don't end in a
• 52:52
  Speaker 3: lot of bloodshed, or.
• 52:54
  Speaker 2: That they don't have to.
• 52:56
  Speaker 4: You mean, because they have chin wars well, that they
• 53:01
  Speaker 4: prefer to take someone prisoner rather than kill them. Oh,
• 53:04
  Speaker 4: that's right, that's right.
• 53:06
  Speaker 3: And taking someone prisoner. So I imagine a lot of
• 53:08
  Speaker 3: the skirmishes between that yell aren't necessarily the most. They're
• 53:11
  Speaker 3: probably very there's not a lot of blood in those battles.
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: Have you ever read about counting coup amongst Native Americans? No,
• 53:20
  Speaker 2: it was like, I don't know a terrible lot about this,
• 53:23
  Speaker 2: and there's a ton of different tribes at a lot
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: of different cultures, but I do know that amongst some
• 53:29
  Speaker 2: and their warfare was said to be centered around this
• 53:34
  Speaker 2: thing called counting coup, where you would run up to
• 53:38
  Speaker 2: or run up on an enemy and like slap him
• 53:41
  Speaker 2: with a special stick and like back away. And this
• 53:45
  Speaker 2: was like a whole honor thing where you like hit
• 53:48
  Speaker 2: him and he didn't touch you, or you captured him
• 53:52
  Speaker 2: and didn't without being injured. It wasn't said to be
• 53:56
  Speaker 2: not as much about just slaughtering people as much as
• 53:59
  Speaker 2: it was about like an honor thing, and that may
• 54:03
  Speaker 2: have been I really I would like to have read
• 54:05
  Speaker 2: more about this before. I don't want to offend anyone,
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: Like I said, there are tons of cultures, but it
• 54:10
  Speaker 2: was definitely a thing, a thing called acoustic where you'd
• 54:15
  Speaker 2: just like and the shorter you're the stick that you
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: touch the enemy with that's trying to kill you without
• 54:20
  Speaker 2: being killed, is the more honor you.
• 54:23
  Speaker 3: It kind of sounds like capture the flag.
• 54:25
  Speaker 2: It's a shitload like that. There's a whole I mean,
• 54:29
  Speaker 2: there's a lot of ritualized warfare in different places at
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: different times.
• 54:34
  Speaker 3: Which makes sense because actual warfare is costly and deadly.
• 54:38
  Speaker 2: The various Aztec societies had whole this whole thing called
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: the flower wars where it was just about taking prisoners,
• 54:46
  Speaker 2: just sacrifice to gods. It wasn't about like taking land
• 54:51
  Speaker 2: or dominating as much as it was about like human
• 54:54
  Speaker 2: sacrifice making the gods happy.
• 54:58
  Speaker 3: Religion making people do stupid things.
• 55:00
  Speaker 2: So there were people as if we needed any ideas.
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: Thanks a lot God, Yeah, jeez, maybe you should edit
• 55:11
  Speaker 2: out the thanks a lot God. I have plenty of
• 55:16
  Speaker 2: religious listeners. You people out there, do whatever you want.
• 55:19
  Speaker 2: I don't, I don't care. I don't begrudge anyone.
• 55:23
  Speaker 3: No, no, just don't make me do it.
• 55:27
  Speaker 2: Right, that's the key. Yeah, hit all that out that
• 55:32
  Speaker 2: can long go.
• 55:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't really know. It's been it's been a
• 55:37
  Speaker 3: fun journey, it's been. I've just been amazed how many
• 55:41
  Speaker 3: things I've learned, new things I've learned.
• 55:45
  Speaker 2: Me too, And theories we've come up with on the
• 55:47
  Speaker 2: fly that hour, like my beliefs about different things.
• 55:52
  Speaker 3: Well, and things I've learned from you and things I've
• 55:53
  Speaker 3: learned from the listeners.
• 55:55
  Speaker 4: And my favorite theory that you guys came up.
• 55:59
  Speaker 10: With was is about men's vision of the darkness versus
• 56:06
  Speaker 10: the specs of light, and then the specs of light
• 56:08
  Speaker 10: is friendship.
• 56:12
  Speaker 4: I mean that's oversimplified, but like rand being with this
• 56:16
  Speaker 4: people and like, but it's true for all of them, right,
• 56:19
  Speaker 4: Like a parent doesn't do well alone. No, we've seen
• 56:24
  Speaker 4: how that goes.
• 56:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the closer they are together, the more powerful they are.
• 56:29
  Speaker 4: Right, it's like their emotional wellbeing. I mean, yeah, they're
• 56:32
  Speaker 4: all like super powerful and that helps each other, but
• 56:37
  Speaker 4: they need the support of one.
• 56:40
  Speaker 3: Another with your powers combined. I and the Dragon.
• 56:45
  Speaker 2: Reborn, Captain Planet, yeah, earth wings, So whose heart that's uh, Matt, Matt, Well,
• 56:59
  Speaker 2: there is that whole prophecy, like I hope that the
• 57:02
  Speaker 2: heart of Stone remembers love and the Yeah, that's very
• 57:06
  Speaker 2: much like I think they go through the five different
• 57:08
  Speaker 2: powers and uh, you know, I got to say Captain
• 57:12
  Speaker 2: Planet has a lot to do with the wheel of time,
• 57:17
  Speaker 2: you know what.
• 57:17
  Speaker 4: And then there's like basically an Ishmael and his weird
• 57:22
  Speaker 4: like girl villain sidekick, uh huh land Fear.
• 57:26
  Speaker 3: Hello, absolutely, and I mean the five powers, like I
• 57:31
  Speaker 3: mean spirit instead of heart, but come on.
• 57:34
  Speaker 2: No, yeah, I mean they both use thought. One of
• 57:37
  Speaker 2: my favorites was Niive Shot first.
• 57:41
  Speaker 4: I subscribe to that one.
• 57:43
  Speaker 2: Oh no, we came up with that when we were
• 57:47
  Speaker 2: talking about when paren and a queen are captured by
• 57:50
  Speaker 2: the White Cloaks and they're like beaten up and tied
• 57:53
  Speaker 2: up in a tent or something or thrown on the ground,
• 57:56
  Speaker 2: and ninive Land and Marine go to go to save them,
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: and Niieve goes and cuts the horse lines so that
• 58:10
  Speaker 2: when Moraine makes a distraction, all the horses will run
• 58:14
  Speaker 2: away and distract the white Cloaks. And there's a moment
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: when she needs it to happen. She needs it, yeah,
• 58:29
  Speaker 2: like give me something or hurry up or something like that.
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: And then like the lightning explodes out of the sky.
• 58:35
  Speaker 3: And there's one strike, and then we think there's a delay,
• 58:38
  Speaker 3: and then there's a bunch of other strikes and we
• 58:39
  Speaker 3: think that first one was Naive and the rest of
• 58:42
  Speaker 3: them were Moraine.
• 58:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm not convinced you're going, but it's so much fun.
• 58:50
  Speaker 3: So give because we both convinced ourselves.
• 58:52
  Speaker 5: So tell it.
• 58:53
  Speaker 3: Tell us why you're not convinced. I want to know.
• 58:55
  Speaker 4: So so the language you're you're absolutely right like, and
• 58:59
  Speaker 4: it reinforces this whole idea of need. Yeah, but the
• 59:05
  Speaker 4: counter the reason I'm not convinced, I mean, I'm basically
• 59:08
  Speaker 4: on the fence about it. But the reason I'm not
• 59:10
  Speaker 4: convinced is because lightning, so it's such a like a
• 59:15
  Speaker 4: hard thing to channel. And it's not that she's not
• 59:19
  Speaker 4: powerful enough, obviously, but this whole like she's had this
• 59:24
  Speaker 4: block for so long, she doesn't she can't really channel properly.
• 59:31
  Speaker 4: I think that up until this point, the only thing
• 59:34
  Speaker 4: she's really done is heel. But she has to do
• 59:40
  Speaker 4: it like as part of her practice. So that's that's
• 59:43
  Speaker 4: really why I was kind of like, I don't know,
• 59:46
  Speaker 4: I don't know about that one.
• 59:48
  Speaker 3: No, I buy any that. My counter argument is that
• 59:51
  Speaker 3: she's not blocked yet.
• 59:53
  Speaker 4: No. I think that the block develops as a mechanism
• 59:58
  Speaker 4: to keep them from dying, because I think it's said
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 4: at one point that wilders so like one in four
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 4: will survive, so the rest die, and then of those
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 4: that survive, I think most of them have some sort
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 4: of block. So my theory was that it's a block
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 4: that keeps them from dying, like allows them to be
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 4: that one and four through whatever mechanism.
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 3: See, I was thinking the block develops more as they
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 3: learn to channel regularly, because they all have a situation
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 3: in which they can channel. There's some stress or some
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 3: something that causes them to channel. Yeah, and then as
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 3: they and that protects them from being aware that they're channeling,
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 3: and so the block doesn't necessarily develop until they are
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 3: aware they can channel, and before that, like need still
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 3: comes into play. But no, I mean I see what
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 3: you mean where, because I'm basing that off of Rand's journey,
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 3: where need comes into play a lot in terms of
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 3: why he channels.
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 10: Yeah.
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but he hasn't gone through. He hasn't survived being
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 3: a wilder yet, right.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 4: It just seems too easy, Like it seemed too easy
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 4: for her to be like please, and then she gets
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 4: the super thing of lightning, and then for like five
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 4: books she can barely like light a candle except when
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 4: she's met obviously and accidentally set swans to him on fire.
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 4: But I mean, yeah, I mean there's there's definitely evidence,
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 4: but it's, uh, it's a decent theory, Like there's enough
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 4: evidence in the book to.
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 2: To support it. Yeah.
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, No, I get where you're coming from in terms
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 3: of like she has the block and therefore and she's
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 3: clearly not angry, and there is indications that she only
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 3: heals when she gets really pissed off.
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 4: That her right because working it makes her upset, right.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So you know, I totally buy where you're coming
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 3: from that she doesn't have the anger in her and
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 3: she has the block in place, and it doesn't make
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 3: sense for her to and parents nearby and he's a taveran.
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 3: So yeah, incidents just worked out. And you know, I
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 3: think that's a that's a good point.
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I'm trying to think of other times that we
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 2: see her channel and if she's angry for like from
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 2: the beginning, and I think she may like when she
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 2: rubs selve on Parrien who's been badly beaten. Pretty sure
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 2: she's angry. Yeah, oh yeah, scene whenever she's other examples,
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 2: seeing anyone hurt makes her angry so she can always
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 2: heal them.
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and she was she was angry at having to
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 4: watch a GWayne die when she was a kid, and
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 4: that's how she was able to heal Wayne.
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, she was angry that she thought she would have.
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 3: To watch her Yeah. Yeah, did uh do you think
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 3: that's the first time ninive Gerald? Was it a Gwain
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 3: or do you think it was?
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 4: I don't know.
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 2: I don't think we know.
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 4: We know she talks about her being sick and then
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 4: she she talks about healing and Gwain, but I don't
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 4: know if we.
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 2: Have is it that tells that story?
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 4: She tells it to Moraine also in the Eye of
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 4: the In the Eye of the World, so this is great,
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 4: Moraine says, when you heal someone, there's an affinity that
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 4: you developed, which kind of plot wise fell to the wayside.
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 4: But she says, was it it's.
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 2: Like around footprints in air? I think it's around Yes, she.
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 4: Says, was a parent or a GWayne you healed because
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 4: you knew where we were exactly?
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 10: Like what?
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 2: Oh? Yeah, yeah, she was like, which one was? Yeah, yeah,
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 2: that's right.
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 3: I've heard that it kind of falls by the wayside.
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 3: There are few other incidents that people have been able
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 3: to find where it appears a character can find another
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 3: character because they've healed them, but it's never brought up again.
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 3: But there it does look like there are a few
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 3: times where.
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: It's not a huge thing in the series.
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 3: No, it's not.
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 2: No, it definitely definitely comes up a few times.
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess that's that's one of the big Eye
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 3: of the World things I'd like to talk about. Is
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 3: there stuff in the Eye of the World that does
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 3: not really carry to the rest of the series, you know,
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 3: and we've definitely brushed over that to some degree, but
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 3: it's there. Yeah, and this is one of them, you know,
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 3: I don't think do you think the black threads are
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 3: one of them?
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 4: So is that in reference to Rands like cutting off Ishmaels. Yeah,
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 4: I never really got that that. I mean, that whole
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 4: sequence is so abstract.
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 3: I know what happens again with Osmodia.
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't know. I've never understood that. I always
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 4: chalked it up to it's from Rand's perspective and he
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 4: has no idea what's going on, and this is just
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 4: his visual representation of what's happening.
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I think it's partially because he encounters the character
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 3: in Teleyranriod. Yeah, and so but you know, he sees
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 3: other characters in the World of Dreams and the other Forsaken,
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 3: and they don't have that black thread. True, It's it's
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 3: a very odd combination of the two, sort of like
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 3: if he never ever saw another Forsaken, or you know,
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 3: if he always saw the black thread when he saw
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 3: a Forsaken in the World of Dreams, I'd be like, Okay,
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 3: that makes sense or if he never saw it. Okay,
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 3: that makes sense. But it's this sometimes thing that it's
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 3: there when he needs to cut them off, but otherwise
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 3: it's not there like that. That does confuse.
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm trying to think of something that's not like
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 4: the cop out of it's just a literary device.
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 3: And I get that it's it's his connection to the
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 3: dark One, and it's and it's there to filter. You know,
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 3: we only see it on the mail forsaken, So I
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 3: assume it's not a true power connection but a filter
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 3: for Sidine so that they don't get the taint.
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 4: Yeah, all right, that's right, because does it as Modian say,
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 4: you cut off my connection to the dark One that
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 4: was keeping me sane exactly, And I mean he gets
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 4: he gets blocked, like Rand blocks him so he can't
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 4: channel even if he wanted.
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 3: To, but just a trickle, right, Yeah, that's actually land fear.
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 4: Oh that's right. She comes up with this complicated weave, right.
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 3: And that's and that Rand therefore isn't sure how much
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 3: as Modim can channel at any given time. Right, So
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 3: he was always worried that Osmodian is like faking that
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 3: he's weaker than he actually is.
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 4: That's right, because what wasn't it going to dissipate over time?
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 3: Suppose he supposedly, but he didn't live long enough for
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 3: that to be an issue.
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 2: Sadly doesn't as MOODI and just disappear. Do we know?
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 4: No, it's the huge wheal of time controversy Grendel.
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 3: No, guys, there's no I know Grendall killed him, but
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 3: it was for a long time.
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 2: I don't even remember well.
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 4: I think the controversy was when a lot of people
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 4: discussed it and then someone asks Robert Joran in an
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 4: interview and he was like, you, guys, it's in the text.
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 4: It's obvious.
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 3: It was the obvious comment that pissed everything, like really
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 3: got everyone in a frenzy. It was like he was like, no,
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 3: even at the point at which he died, it was
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 3: obvious which character killed him, and people like, no, it's
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 3: not like, look at look at this argument we've written out.
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 3: We have no clue, we've idea, you know, and uh,
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 3: in hindsight, it was pretty obvious.
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 4: I mean, that's definitely a reread level type.
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 2: Of what can you remind me of the scene where
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 2: that happens.
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 3: He walks into a cupboard and he goes you.
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 4: Know, it's an epilogue. It's an epilogue.
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 3: It's the blog yeah, of a book five five Oh yeah,
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 3: Early Fires of Heaven. That's because it's after land Fear
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 3: and Moraine go through the Twisted door Terranngreal. So land here, Yeah,
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 3: I know. So land Fear is not a candidate because
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 3: she's already gone through the doorway. But she was like
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 3: the best candidate, and Grendall just didn't make sense because
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 3: she'd like hardly even been mentioned. She was the only
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 3: one left.
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, she wasn't very developed at that point.
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 3: No, but now, knowing what I know about Grendall, of
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 3: course it makes sense that she would be the one
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 3: who would.
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 2: Take him out.
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 4: Yeah, she was. She was a pretty awesome forsaken.
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 3: She was like her and Demandred. I think we're the
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 3: most effective forsaken land Fear in the beginning. But she wasn't.
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 3: She was had her own goals.
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, land Fear is out for herself. Yeah, well that's
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 2: the whole theory about land Feir. Is she really really
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 2: that evil? Really? Is she any more evil than like
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 2: any anyone else? Like, if you could, if all you
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 2: had to do was get your your ex boyfriend to
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 2: take one Choden Kyle, and you take the other and
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 2: then you own the world together. I mean that's pretty
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 2: uh probably call my ex girlfriend. Yeah, like, hey, there's
• 1:10:08
  Speaker 2: this really good deal. Would you like to rule the world? Check? Yes,
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 2: they're like.
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah, no, yeah, totally.
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 4: A lot of like Landfor and Asmodian, a lot of
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 4: their evil stuff was off screen in the Age of
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 4: Legends and just kind of like you're just supposed to,
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 4: you know, follow, Oh they did bad things, like that's
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 4: the story.
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 3: Landford does a fair amount of bad stuff during the series.
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm blanking right, No, I know you.
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 3: Well, like you know, some of some of the characters
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 3: don't just don't have enough screen time to do it.
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 3: But we assume they got to whatever position of power
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 3: they were in and through doing some pretty awful things.
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 7: You know.
• 1:11:03
  Speaker 3: It's like it's like when Helena takes out a couple
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 3: of maids because they were spying on a green and
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 3: she wanted more control, and it's like, yeah, I'll just
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 3: take out two people. Or when land Fear cuts off
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 3: a guy's head she's talking too because she gets a
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 3: summons from the Dark One and he's in her way.
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 3: You know, it's just it's just casual murder, just no
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 3: actual empathy for other human beings. They're in your way,
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 3: kill them, move on, right.
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 4: Yeah, all the Forsaken are definitely evil. I'm just trying
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 4: to like categorize them in my.
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 3: Head in a lot of ways. I don't know if
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 3: land Fear you know, I guess we had this discussion.
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 3: I thought Landfeir was taught in the backlash of opening
• 1:11:47
  Speaker 3: up the boar and was immediately turned, But I guess
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 3: she actually turned later.
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's right. I think it wasn't.
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 4: She her whole the whole purpose of her research was
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 4: to gain power and push boundaries.
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but it was also to unite men and women.
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 4: Was that hurt?
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 2: It was to find this this extra source of power
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 2: where I thought it was a more like kind of
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 2: enlightened thing where they're like looking found this extra source
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 2: of power and they were looking for a way to
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 2: tap in it into it so that everyone could channel Yeah.
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 2: Just not just I said. I I thought it was
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 2: not just the people who were born with the talent.
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 3: I thought it was just that they wanted the male
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 3: and the females to work together without that having two
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 3: separate powers was frustrating, and they wanted to both be
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 3: able to use the same power.
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 2: Could have been all that oh by that, but.
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I mean they were, there were scientists.
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 3: There were scientists investigating a new energy source and a
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 3: new power source, which.
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 4: Is not inherently bad.
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 3: No, No, I think in a lot of it's like,
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 3: I mean, we talked about the Manhattan Project, and I
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 3: don't think anyone really vilifies the scientists.
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 2: No, nobody vilifies the Manhattan Project just using the outcome.
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 3: Despite the fact that I think some of those scientists
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 3: have gone on record to say they have a lot
• 1:13:17
  Speaker 3: of guilt for their participation in the in that science.
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, oh yeah. One of Dan Carlin's newer hardcore histories
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 2: is but he basically just talks about the A bomb
• 1:13:33
  Speaker 2: and like how that changed the world, and there's some good,
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 2: some good parts where pus it. Maybe Oppenheimer went to
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 2: the president at the time and was like, I have
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 2: blood on my hands. The President, supposedly behind closed door,
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 2: has said something like, never bring that man back into
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 2: my office, like he thinks he has blood on my hands.
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 2: I dropped the bomb, he just made it.
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 3: It's a tough place to be in. And then you
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 3: talk about the pilot, who I'm sure, oh yeah, you know,
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 3: had feelings a person who actually dropped the bomb, literally
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 3: literally dropped the bomb. You know that there are levels
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 3: of guilt and levels of responsibility all the way up
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 3: and down the chain. And I think that's true. You know,
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 3: bringing this back to land Fear, you know she didn't
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 3: do that alone her, you know, I know her scientific
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 3: partner died in the backlash.
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 2: I forget the dude's nick. Oh.
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 3: I like so going back to the black threads, Enigma
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 3: brought up the idea that he may only see it
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 3: when he's touching untainted true power. But I guess that
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 3: wouldn't really work with usmodion, assuming that.
• 1:14:46
  Speaker 4: The threads are the same.
• 1:14:52
  Speaker 2: I thought the black thread was the True Power.
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 3: No, I don't think it's the True power because we
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 3: don't see the females have any of the threads. I
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 3: think it's their connection to the one power, and it's
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 3: filtering out the taint.
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 4: I see very so rand an Ishmael channel the true Power.
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 4: Does simarog Ever.
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 3: No, Grendall does.
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 4: Grendall does, Okay, And I think that's it.
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 3: I'm trying to remember of another circumstance. I feel like,
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 3: I mean some of the other for sake, and I
• 1:15:28
  Speaker 3: feel like, you know, they think about using it, and
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 3: they said, like I've used it a few times, but
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 3: especially in the Third Age. I think in the Age
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 3: of Legends they all used it occasionally, but in the
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 3: Third Age, the dark One is really restricted. Who has
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 3: access to the true power to really his favorites, and
• 1:15:48
  Speaker 3: he's and only even even Grendall, who was one of
• 1:15:51
  Speaker 3: his favorites, only got a trickle. Yeah, but didn't like
• 1:15:54
  Speaker 3: when wasn't Oh who gave the fool boxes to the idea?
• 1:15:58
  Speaker 3: Wasn't that Samuel?
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 4: I think that was sim.
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, to the grindle.
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think that he used some true power.
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 2: When he that's right to like demonstrate how it worked
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 2: or something or something. I'm not really sure.
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 3: Oh you know what, never mind, the Watcher Ismael was
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 3: or Morden was there.
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 4: Yeah, he was watching.
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 2: Watching, and he was using the true power.
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 3: So that was just his Ishmael Morgan again, Yeah, sorry, House,
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 3: I was getting that scene a little mixed up in
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 3: my Malah Marden.
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 2: It's just constantly using the true power.
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 3: That's all he uses.
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 4: That's why he's so crazy. I mean, he's using it
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 4: in the prologue.
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 3: Absolutely. I don't think we ever see him channel the
• 1:16:46
  Speaker 3: one power.
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 2: That's interesting, which I might never actually thought of.
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 3: It might be what makes him Nabliss. Naybliss might be
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 3: the person who channels the true power exclusively.
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 4: So when he go in book seven, when he comes
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 4: to help Rand.
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 3: Crossing the bailfire, that's true power. That's true power. So
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 3: that the one power crosses the true power. And yeah,
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 3: that's why they undo each other because it's.
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 2: Actually I wonder about two different powers than the True
• 1:17:25
  Speaker 2: Power and the body switch and all of that so much.
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 3: I have so much to say about that in six
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 3: more books.
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 4: Oh I have Oh sorry, I have a weird I
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 4: have a question slash theory, go for it.
• 1:17:40
  Speaker 2: So do you guys?
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 4: Remember when Ninive is in the World of Dreams and
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 4: Egwayne is like, oh, there's this isida I named Sharina,
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 4: you would really like her, and Ninive kind of freaks out.
• 1:17:56
  Speaker 4: And it's because Sharina was the Isidai in Malchis in
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 4: her accepted tests.
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 2: That's right.
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 4: I was like convinced that that was going to play
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 4: a role. I'm like that's crazy, Like, who is this
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 4: Sharena person? Like what does this mean? Because clearly, like
• 1:18:16
  Speaker 4: the accepted test is it's connected to the pattern in
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 4: some way that shows you a glimpse of your future,
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 4: and then it never like really played out, and so
• 1:18:27
  Speaker 4: I'm kind of like, I'm still convinced it means something,
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 4: but i don't know what. Like it's like this half
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 4: formed theory of pattern and the world of dreams.
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 3: And I would go simpler than that. I would say
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 3: it's just in there to show that to make you
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 3: confused as to whether or not the test is real.
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 2: Or Okay, I see the test.
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 3: You know, there's always that uncertainty, like when they come out,
• 1:18:58
  Speaker 3: what's the first thing they say, like, what is it real?
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 4: That's true?
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 3: And yeah, the isaid I are saying, we don't know.
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 3: Basically, some women go in and they may find a
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 3: life they prefer and they may stay and live out
• 1:19:11
  Speaker 3: that life. Yeah, and it may be totally real to them.
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 3: And so I think this whole.
• 1:19:16
  Speaker 2: Or they are mirror worlds.
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 3: Maybe, or maybe they only exist for as long as
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 3: the they're channeling, and then when they stop channeling, that
• 1:19:24
  Speaker 3: person stops existing.
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 2: And is dead. Interesting a lot of possibilities there.
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 3: But I do think that with the seeing a real person,
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 3: that just makes you sort of It's one of Jordan's
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 3: Jordan Lake Living leaving deliberate mysteries in his books. Sure,
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 3: and I think that's one of the Yeah, And I
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 3: think that showing you a real person is his way
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 3: of saying, was it real?
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 2: You don't know?
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 9: Yeah?
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 2: I do wonder sometimes if even he knew. Does it matter? No,
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 2: I don't like you can just write that. Yeah.
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 3: Have you ever read The Lady and the Tiger.
• 1:20:04
  Speaker 2: I don't. I don't think so.
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 3: It was a short story I had to read in
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 3: like sixth grade, you know, one of those doesn't really
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 3: mean anything. Well, it was a short story, right, that
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 3: I read for literature class. And the whole point is
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 3: this guy, I think he's he's sleeping with the king's
• 1:20:20
  Speaker 3: wife and the king throws him in an arena and
• 1:20:25
  Speaker 3: one of two doors is going to open, and either
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 3: he's gonna see the lady on the other side that
• 1:20:29
  Speaker 3: he gets to marry and live with for the rest
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 3: of his life, but it's not his true love who's
• 1:20:35
  Speaker 3: the queen's wife, or there's a tiger who's going to
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 3: eat him, and he looks up and the queen and
• 1:20:41
  Speaker 3: basically the queen says, go left, and he opens the
• 1:20:45
  Speaker 3: door and the story ends, and that's it, Like you
• 1:20:51
  Speaker 3: don't know which what you know? And so the whole
• 1:20:53
  Speaker 3: point of the short story is was that the you know,
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 3: does this love of his life would she rather him
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 3: be eaten or live out his life with another woman?
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 2: Gotcha?
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 3: And it's a deliberate it's left deliberately to make you think,
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 3: and there is no right answer. The author didn't come
• 1:21:17
  Speaker 3: up with an answer. And I think Jordan likes to
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 3: leave some of those I call him Lady or tiger
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 3: choices hidden around his stories, like is is the test
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 3: real or not? He doesn't know. We don't know, the
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 3: ey said, I don't know. There is no straight up answer.
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 4: Yeah, which is freaking careless of them. They're like, we're
• 1:21:40
  Speaker 4: just gonna keep doing this thing.
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 3: Their whole attitude towards Tara and Kreol is caroleins totally like,
• 1:21:49
  Speaker 3: we don't know how these work, we don't know what
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 3: they're supposed to do, but we can get this one
• 1:21:52
  Speaker 3: effect out of them, So sure, why not.
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 2: Let's by do you want to prove yourself go in there.
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah, jump on in. Some people don't make it back
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 3: out again?
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 5: What no, fuck you?
• 1:22:04
  Speaker 4: It's so messed up and there's.
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 2: Like it right, that would be my reaction. I quit?
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 2: How about that? Going home?
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 4: I'm going to join the kid is what's going to happen?
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 2: Totally, dude, Your initiation frat rituals are way too intense.
• 1:22:23
  Speaker 3: I guess it's more of a sorority though.
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 4: Well, and that's their whole point, right. You have to
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 4: want it more. You have to want to be, I said,
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 4: I more than any temptation that Tara angry All throws
• 1:22:35
  Speaker 4: at you, or fear or whatever. Yeah, which I freaking
• 1:22:39
  Speaker 4: I love n Nieves testing so much because she leaves,
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 4: not because she loves the White Tower, but because she's like,
• 1:22:47
  Speaker 4: this is the only way I can protect my people,
• 1:22:50
  Speaker 4: and I have this tool and I'm going to use it.
• 1:22:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:22:55
  Speaker 3: I also like that she fails and then just goes
• 1:22:56
  Speaker 3: ahead and opens it back up.
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 4: Oh yeah, it's insane.
• 1:22:59
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, forgot about that.
• 1:23:01
  Speaker 3: Don't mess with Nineve.
• 1:23:02
  Speaker 2: She breaks all the rules, yeah, pretty much all of them.
• 1:23:08
  Speaker 2: Kind of reminded me of the classic pulp fiction question,
• 1:23:11
  Speaker 2: what's in the box.
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 4: That's from U seven seven.
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 2: The briefcase and pulp fic.
• 1:23:19
  Speaker 3: No, okay, that's very different. What's in the boxes?
• 1:23:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, okay, okay, what's in the briefcase is that? Yeah?
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's no, there is. Tarantino never came up with
• 1:23:32
  Speaker 3: something to put in the briefcase.
• 1:23:33
  Speaker 2: That's what I say when people, when people start talking
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 2: about that at a bar or something, I'm like, guys,
• 1:23:39
  Speaker 2: the name of the film is pulp fiction. Yeah, just
• 1:23:44
  Speaker 2: think about that for a second. The whole that's the
• 1:23:47
  Speaker 2: whole point. The whole point is to make you.
• 1:23:49
  Speaker 4: Think I do anywhere realize that until now.
• 1:23:52
  Speaker 2: Also, Samuel L. Jackson sabs inside the inside the briefcase
• 1:23:58
  Speaker 2: is a light bulb. Yeah, that's actually in there, right.
• 1:24:06
  Speaker 3: That's what produced the light that was on their faces.
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 3: That's a good one. Yeah, we've been sort of rambling
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 3: out here. This is what happens when we have no
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 3: structure whatsoever. Like did we we didn't like do any
• 1:24:21
  Speaker 3: you know, normally we've prepped for an episode.
• 1:24:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we didn't know prep. We did know prep, which
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 2: is actually pretty cool.
• 1:24:28
  Speaker 3: It's been fun.
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 4: We've we've actually probably stayed about as on topic as normal.
• 1:24:37
  Speaker 2: That's a good play.
• 1:24:39
  Speaker 3: On topic, we stay.
• 1:24:41
  Speaker 4: It's a lion or a woman's situation. I'm leaving it.
• 1:24:44
  Speaker 2: Up to lady or the type.
• 1:24:49
  Speaker 9: I don't know.
• 1:24:50
  Speaker 4: Man, it's lame.
• 1:24:51
  Speaker 2: Does it matter if we stay on topic? I do
• 1:24:55
  Speaker 2: we know? I don't think so. I don't think so.
• 1:24:58
  Speaker 4: Oh true? Yeah, there's more him for theories, more rambling. Okay,
• 1:25:05
  Speaker 4: philosophical question. Yeah, I have the world only who is
• 1:25:11
  Speaker 4: best character?
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 2: The best character?
• 1:25:15
  Speaker 3: Best character?
• 1:25:16
  Speaker 2: Can you can? You can you pick like a category
• 1:25:19
  Speaker 2: as far as what does best mean best?
• 1:25:21
  Speaker 4: It's subjective? So okay, like who wins? I have the world?
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 4: Like if it was a beauty pageant, I mean, besides Bella.
• 1:25:29
  Speaker 4: I mean yeah, like Enigma says Bella. That's pretty strong.
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 4: That's a strong vote.
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I think I think we can all
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 3: just like let's go for second.
• 1:25:38
  Speaker 4: Place here, Okay, Like, are we all voting for Bella?
• 1:25:43
  Speaker 4: I know, we gotta we gotta vote for Land.
• 1:25:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Jonathan says Land.
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 3: Land's awesome kind, but Land really comes out more when
• 1:25:53
  Speaker 3: he gets a chance to be sort of buddy buddy
• 1:25:56
  Speaker 3: with Rand didn't give him of his you know, death
• 1:26:01
  Speaker 3: is lighted in a feather.
• 1:26:03
  Speaker 2: Christine says, ninety. Yeah, I want to.
• 1:26:06
  Speaker 3: Say, okay, all right, give me, give me Ishmael.
• 1:26:15
  Speaker 2: Is just an awesome metal character, and the whole plotline
• 1:26:20
  Speaker 2: of the Eye of the World is basically in his hands.
• 1:26:23
  Speaker 2: He's manipulating these events constantly, and he's.
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 3: In the boy's heads. And yeah, that's that's a strong argument.
• 1:26:31
  Speaker 2: He's an awesome characters through the whole series.
• 1:26:33
  Speaker 3: What makes the what makes the heroes interesting is a
• 1:26:36
  Speaker 3: good villain.
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because if you know, if not for him, they'd
• 1:26:40
  Speaker 2: still be hurting sheep, Matt would be milking cows.
• 1:26:44
  Speaker 3: Well, that's why I said Moraine, because I think if
• 1:26:46
  Speaker 3: not for Moraine, they'd still be.
• 1:26:48
  Speaker 2: I mean that too, Yeah, they'd be dead.
• 1:26:51
  Speaker 3: And she really gets to show. She gets to stride
• 1:26:54
  Speaker 3: in and be awesome and just you know, kick some
• 1:26:58
  Speaker 3: trollic ass and sek some fairies.
• 1:27:01
  Speaker 2: And make a giant ball of fire. Right.
• 1:27:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, like this is when she is pretty amazing.
• 1:27:09
  Speaker 2: Magma says, without Bella, Morine wouldn't know that random was
• 1:27:12
  Speaker 2: the dragon room born.
• 1:27:14
  Speaker 5: She is true.
• 1:27:17
  Speaker 3: Bella is the first sign of the dragon being reborn.
• 1:27:23
  Speaker 3: That's got to be a prophecy somewhere. The shaggy horse
• 1:27:25
  Speaker 3: that doesn't tire.
• 1:27:27
  Speaker 4: Oh. One of my favorite pieces of Will of Time
• 1:27:30
  Speaker 4: humor is Swan riding Bella, because it's like Bella is
• 1:27:34
  Speaker 4: the most like Bella. Bella's never going to buck a writer,
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 4: like she is the most steady character in the whole series.
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 4: And Swan's like, I don't trust.
• 1:27:42
  Speaker 2: This horse, right, she doesn't trust any horse.
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 4: No.
• 1:27:48
  Speaker 5: I know.
• 1:27:48
  Speaker 4: It's funny because she's like riding the most docile horse
• 1:27:51
  Speaker 4: in the world, and she's like, they gave me a
• 1:27:53
  Speaker 4: difficult horse on purpose, just to make fun of me.
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 2: Even that horse. I like that about her because I
• 1:27:59
  Speaker 2: also mistrust horses. There enormous skittish animals that kind of
• 1:28:05
  Speaker 2: scary easy, and they can just they can get a
• 1:28:08
  Speaker 2: little nervous and kill you, can you imagine makes me uncomfortable,
• 1:28:14
  Speaker 2: Like man could kill.
• 1:28:15
  Speaker 4: A mans like on purpose.
• 1:28:20
  Speaker 3: He's like hydraulics. Yeah, but I think of them as
• 1:28:23
  Speaker 3: big dogs, like I know, a dog. If a dog
• 1:28:25
  Speaker 3: really wanted to, he could probably you know, kill me
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 3: right like, but they don't.
• 1:28:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean, yeah, I just I'm sure a
• 1:28:35
  Speaker 2: lot of that comes from me not really knowing anything
• 1:28:37
  Speaker 2: about horses.
• 1:28:39
  Speaker 3: How much how much exposure have you had to horses,
• 1:28:42
  Speaker 3: Like I'm gonna say zero, real, have you ever touched
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 3: a horse?
• 1:28:50
  Speaker 2: I like, yes, have you? Yes? But I was like
• 1:28:56
  Speaker 2: really young, and I like, I can think of like
• 1:28:59
  Speaker 2: a couple of like hony rides at a county fair
• 1:29:02
  Speaker 2: or something like that. And then when my parents took
• 1:29:07
  Speaker 2: me a couple of times when I was a really
• 1:29:09
  Speaker 2: little kid, and it was my understanding that I was
• 1:29:13
  Speaker 2: given like the old horse and you just had to
• 1:29:14
  Speaker 2: sit on it and they'd just like walk the trail
• 1:29:18
  Speaker 2: like they don't. I did that a couple of times,
• 1:29:20
  Speaker 2: but it's such a distant memory. I don't really so
• 1:29:23
  Speaker 2: now I wouldn't know what to do with a horse,
• 1:29:27
  Speaker 2: Like I wouldn't know how to saddle it, or.
• 1:29:28
  Speaker 4: I wouldn't know how to do Yeah, I mean I
• 1:29:31
  Speaker 4: don't have a lot of equestrian experience. But it's not
• 1:29:36
  Speaker 4: I know, I mean, it's not like an intuitive thing
• 1:29:38
  Speaker 4: like you definitely.
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 3: Well see like when I lived in Waynesboro, I lived
• 1:29:41
  Speaker 3: near some horses, a bunch of different various you know,
• 1:29:45
  Speaker 3: you walk, I'd walk the dog and the horses would
• 1:29:48
  Speaker 3: come running up to the fence and you know, they'd
• 1:29:52
  Speaker 3: stick their nose over and you'd pet their nose and
• 1:29:54
  Speaker 3: smack them on the side of in the hawks, you know,
• 1:29:57
  Speaker 3: on the shoulder, and give them a good pat and
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 3: they'd on your hair and lick the dog. And I
• 1:30:03
  Speaker 3: used to run back and forth and the horse would
• 1:30:05
  Speaker 3: run with me, and uh play, you know. And I
• 1:30:10
  Speaker 3: feel like I made friends with a bunch of the
• 1:30:11
  Speaker 3: horses down there without like trying to ride them or anything.
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 3: You know, you just scratch them where they tell you
• 1:30:18
  Speaker 3: to scratch, and you know, play with them like you
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 3: and any other animal. And I seem to be totally
• 1:30:25
  Speaker 3: happy to do that.
• 1:30:26
  Speaker 2: They make me nervous.
• 1:30:27
  Speaker 3: They are like half a ton, you know, they're they're
• 1:30:31
  Speaker 3: they're heavy animals. Half a ton is not that's an exaggeration.
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 3: They're big. They're big, and they have hoofs. But dogs
• 1:30:39
  Speaker 3: have teeth, birds have beaks. I love animals. I'll take
• 1:30:43
  Speaker 3: just about any animal. I love the ravens. I love
• 1:30:46
  Speaker 3: to like I want because in Portland we've got ravens
• 1:30:50
  Speaker 3: all over the place.
• 1:30:51
  Speaker 2: I would get a pet.
• 1:30:52
  Speaker 3: Raven and so smart, really really smart. And well I
• 1:30:58
  Speaker 3: do have a pet. Well I don't have a pet.
• 1:31:00
  Speaker 3: I grew up with a blue and gold macaw.
• 1:31:04
  Speaker 2: Oh, I saw the picture you posted on Instagram. Yeah.
• 1:31:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, So I went home for Thanksgiving and and
• 1:31:10
  Speaker 3: this bird thinks I'm its mate, and they mate for life.
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 3: So every time I come near, it gets very very
• 1:31:18
  Speaker 3: affectionate and spreens me and fluffs up and just you know, really.
• 1:31:26
  Speaker 2: Crazy that they can remember you for that long.
• 1:31:28
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, no problem, considering.
• 1:31:31
  Speaker 2: You only see it like every few years or something.
• 1:31:33
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 1:31:33
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but I mean I raised him from I raised
• 1:31:35
  Speaker 3: her from a patchling and fetter, and she'll probably outlive me.
• 1:31:42
  Speaker 2: Wow, they lived that long.
• 1:31:44
  Speaker 3: They live eighty years.
• 1:31:45
  Speaker 2: Holy shit.
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 10: Yeah.
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 3: And I got it when I was ten, so you know,
• 1:31:48
  Speaker 3: I mean unless I lived in ninety.
• 1:31:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like that's there's a good chance that allow living.
• 1:31:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah, certainly outlive my parents and become mine at some point.
• 1:31:56
  Speaker 3: So but you know, so, yeah, I have a pet parrot.
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 2: How do you does it just stay in a cage?
• 1:32:03
  Speaker 2: It's but it's not like a parrot though that It's
• 1:32:05
  Speaker 2: like it's pretty big. It's like two feet tall, not
• 1:32:08
  Speaker 2: including tail.
• 1:32:09
  Speaker 3: Right, two feet maybe including tail including tail, Yeah, maybe,
• 1:32:14
  Speaker 3: you know. It's it's it's on my shoulder and it's
• 1:32:16
  Speaker 3: not much taller than my head I like this picture. Yeah, yeah,
• 1:32:19
  Speaker 3: bring a pictures.
• 1:32:20
  Speaker 2: It's a big, big creature.
• 1:32:24
  Speaker 3: Blue and golden calls aren't small. I mean she's she's
• 1:32:26
  Speaker 3: a good ten pounds. That might be you know, I
• 1:32:32
  Speaker 3: don't know. I don't know, actually sure.
• 1:32:34
  Speaker 2: Oh man.
• 1:32:35
  Speaker 3: At some point she got a little over amorous. I
• 1:32:37
  Speaker 3: was petting her, like scratching her butt, and she got
• 1:32:39
  Speaker 3: a little uh anyway, So I've never seen a parrot
• 1:32:46
  Speaker 3: orgasm before, but apparently it's a real thing. Her kloyeka
• 1:32:52
  Speaker 3: was expanding and contracting at a very fast rate.
• 1:32:57
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to ask what is it's their.
• 1:33:01
  Speaker 4: I was just gonna throw some biology on Patrick, but
• 1:33:04
  Speaker 4: I don't know if he is.
• 1:33:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think he needs a little bit of biology here.
• 1:33:09
  Speaker 4: So birds meet in a weird way. They've got a cloaco,
• 1:33:13
  Speaker 4: which is basically like a hole, and they pass they
• 1:33:18
  Speaker 4: passed the goods through it. That's not a great explanation,
• 1:33:24
  Speaker 4: but it gets the point across.
• 1:33:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they use that hole for everything, gotcha. Yeah, I
• 1:33:32
  Speaker 2: did know that because.
• 1:33:33
  Speaker 3: They have the you know, like chickens lay eggs through
• 1:33:35
  Speaker 3: the hole, and they poop through the hole, and they
• 1:33:37
  Speaker 3: have sex through the hole, and it's all the same
• 1:33:41
  Speaker 3: hole and they pee.
• 1:33:42
  Speaker 2: Through the hole. Well it's utilitarian.
• 1:33:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, at least at least it's not anemone that only
• 1:33:49
  Speaker 3: have one hole in and out they eat and poop
• 1:33:51
  Speaker 3: through the same hole.
• 1:33:52
  Speaker 2: Huh.
• 1:33:54
  Speaker 4: Yep, Brandon, are you still listening, mister Sanderson?
• 1:34:07
  Speaker 2: Are you enjoying the talk of bird sexuality?
• 1:34:26
  Speaker 10: No?
• 1:34:26
  Speaker 3: So, I mean I grew up at some point in
• 1:34:28
  Speaker 3: my house growing up, there were sixteen different birds in
• 1:34:32
  Speaker 3: that house.
• 1:34:33
  Speaker 2: Oh my god, at different times, no, all.
• 1:34:36
  Speaker 3: At the same time. At one point we got the
• 1:34:37
  Speaker 3: sixteen birds. My mother was a little bit of a
• 1:34:40
  Speaker 3: crazy bird lady.
• 1:34:41
  Speaker 2: I didn't know that a bird person, was it. I mean,
• 1:34:43
  Speaker 2: I guess I did know it was a thing.
• 1:34:44
  Speaker 3: But yeah, I know, my mom was totally a bird person.
• 1:34:46
  Speaker 3: And we like because we had you know, we had
• 1:34:49
  Speaker 3: like two love birds, three parakeets, three cocka tells, two
• 1:35:00
  Speaker 3: blue and gold macaws.
• 1:35:02
  Speaker 2: All in like separate. What kind of a cage does
• 1:35:06
  Speaker 2: the or what kind of a enclosure does the you're
• 1:35:11
  Speaker 2: a bird live in?
• 1:35:13
  Speaker 3: She's got a cage, but she'll and then a perch,
• 1:35:15
  Speaker 3: and mostly she rides around on her shoulder, my shoulder.
• 1:35:21
  Speaker 3: But you know, she she's got a perch and it
• 1:35:23
  Speaker 3: it's on rollers. It's really just as simple like a
• 1:35:25
  Speaker 3: tea that she likes to sit on, and that just
• 1:35:29
  Speaker 3: is in whatever social area.
• 1:35:32
  Speaker 4: You know.
• 1:35:32
  Speaker 3: It's got a little catch at the bottom to catch
• 1:35:34
  Speaker 3: the poop and whatever food she drops, and a bowl
• 1:35:37
  Speaker 3: for her to eat and drink out of, and she
• 1:35:39
  Speaker 3: just is in whatever space we're in, just sitting on
• 1:35:43
  Speaker 3: her perch, hanging out. She likes to be on my shoulder.
• 1:35:47
  Speaker 3: And then at night, she's got a cage. She sometimes
• 1:35:49
  Speaker 3: she hops off and like climbs and explores and checks
• 1:35:52
  Speaker 3: everything out. You know, she's not restricted to the perch,
• 1:35:58
  Speaker 3: but most of the time that's where she hangs out.
• 1:36:01
  Speaker 2: I figure birds would poop everywhere, though.
• 1:36:05
  Speaker 3: She's actually trained to poop on her perch.
• 1:36:09
  Speaker 2: Oh, well that's handy.
• 1:36:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah, they're ridiculously smart. They're not at hard ducks. Yeah,
• 1:36:15
  Speaker 3: they're not at all hard to train.
• 1:36:16
  Speaker 2: Awesome. Then I would love to have a bird bird.
• 1:36:21
  Speaker 3: They are awful. So let me let me let me
• 1:36:23
  Speaker 3: get this straight. I grew up with them. I would
• 1:36:25
  Speaker 3: never ever choose to purchase and have a bird as
• 1:36:30
  Speaker 3: a pet. They are yeah, like you said, Kelsey, a
• 1:36:33
  Speaker 3: massive amount of work. They have to be. They make
• 1:36:36
  Speaker 3: a huge mess. They do shit everywhere. You know, you
• 1:36:39
  Speaker 3: can train them to ship on their perch and Harper does,
• 1:36:42
  Speaker 3: but she poops every like ten minutes or so.
• 1:36:48
  Speaker 2: Just that's pretty serious.
• 1:36:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, so like you do have to like
• 1:36:53
  Speaker 3: take her back to the perch frequently, and they are
• 1:36:57
  Speaker 3: it's like having a two year old for the rest
• 1:36:59
  Speaker 3: of your life. Like you don't want a two year
• 1:37:02
  Speaker 3: old for the rest of your life.
• 1:37:03
  Speaker 2: Oh no, I don't.
• 1:37:04
  Speaker 4: I don't have but I have friends who have birds,
• 1:37:08
  Speaker 4: and like, not only are they just a lot of work,
• 1:37:12
  Speaker 4: but they like you have to give them fulfilled lives.
• 1:37:17
  Speaker 4: And that's also not easy. Like they have to be stimulated, well,
• 1:37:22
  Speaker 4: especially the smart ones, and they hate to be alone.
• 1:37:28
  Speaker 4: So yeah, that can be difficult.
• 1:37:34
  Speaker 3: They're difficult on like ten different levels.
• 1:37:36
  Speaker 2: See here I was. I've like I always kind of
• 1:37:39
  Speaker 2: thought it would be nice to have like a couple
• 1:37:40
  Speaker 2: of songbirds and just like have that nice sound and.
• 1:37:44
  Speaker 3: The songbirds aren't quite as bad. But you need a
• 1:37:47
  Speaker 3: nice big cage and they're not that smart, so you
• 1:37:49
  Speaker 3: can get away with a little less gotcha attention.
• 1:37:53
  Speaker 2: But I have no idea. I've never had a bird.
• 1:37:57
  Speaker 2: You really don't want one.
• 1:37:58
  Speaker 3: They're not domesticated animals. They are in no way designed
• 1:38:01
  Speaker 3: to live with people. They're designed to be flying free,
• 1:38:04
  Speaker 3: and it pisses them off to be stuck in a cage.
• 1:38:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I've only ever had dogs, So yeah, they're domesticated
• 1:38:11
  Speaker 2: and like probably the most well domesticated of all the animals.
• 1:38:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, certainly better than cats.
• 1:38:18
  Speaker 4: Isn't there an argument that they're not they're not actually domesticated.
• 1:38:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there's there's some arguments that because I think I
• 1:38:29
  Speaker 2: think it's because they're not. They don't technically rely on
• 1:38:34
  Speaker 2: human beings for survival. I think at the point where
• 1:38:39
  Speaker 2: domestic animal is truly considered domesticated is that they need
• 1:38:44
  Speaker 2: human beings, so like.
• 1:38:49
  Speaker 3: Relatively recently part of our lives. When you look like
• 1:38:53
  Speaker 3: dogs have been domesticated the longest, and then I think
• 1:38:57
  Speaker 3: it was like goats, and then sheep, and then cows
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 3: and horses were in there somewhere, but there aren't that,
• 1:39:07
  Speaker 3: and then pigs. Pigs were pretty early, but all of
• 1:39:12
  Speaker 3: those were like centuries millennia before cats became part of
• 1:39:16
  Speaker 3: our lives. Cats are ridiculously recent.
• 1:39:20
  Speaker 2: You don't know when cats started, but not understanding that
• 1:39:25
  Speaker 2: they just kind of started hanging around.
• 1:39:27
  Speaker 4: I mean, there are populations of outdoor cats like they
• 1:39:31
  Speaker 4: will never they'll live their whole lives outdoors. Yeah, And
• 1:39:36
  Speaker 4: I mean there's definitely dogs that do too, but I
• 1:39:38
  Speaker 4: think it's harder for them.
• 1:39:42
  Speaker 2: That's kind of my understanding that they don't. If humans
• 1:39:45
  Speaker 2: disappeared tomorrow, cats would be fine.
• 1:39:47
  Speaker 3: And wild dogs tend to revert to more of a
• 1:39:51
  Speaker 3: wild phenotype. They tend to look a little bit different
• 1:39:55
  Speaker 3: than domesticated dogs, and.
• 1:39:58
  Speaker 4: They'll usually be in the pack of some sort.
• 1:40:02
  Speaker 2: Yes to some groups out there, I think is the dingo?
• 1:40:12
  Speaker 2: Do they hate your baby? And there's one called the
• 1:40:16
  Speaker 2: such and such singing dog some far east, like New
• 1:40:20
  Speaker 2: Zealand singing dog or some such thing. But they're they're
• 1:40:24
  Speaker 2: basically animals that were once domesticated and then returned.
• 1:40:28
  Speaker 4: Oh is that true for dingos?
• 1:40:33
  Speaker 2: Talking out my ass right now? I was just curious
• 1:40:36
  Speaker 2: that might have been one of the examples. I can't remember.
• 1:40:38
  Speaker 4: Can you post a picture of Timber asking for a friend.
• 1:40:44
  Speaker 2: In the discord?
• 1:40:45
  Speaker 4: Sure? Yeah, I don't know. If other people love dog pictures,
• 1:40:49
  Speaker 4: I love like.
• 1:40:50
  Speaker 3: A ton on your Yeah, if you if you look
• 1:40:52
  Speaker 3: at my personal instagram with it, which is just seth jj. Yeah,
• 1:41:00
  Speaker 3: that's probably going to be your best because there's lots
• 1:41:03
  Speaker 3: and lots and lots.
• 1:41:04
  Speaker 2: That's all it is, is Seth post more pictures of
• 1:41:07
  Speaker 2: Timber than himself for anything else.
• 1:41:10
  Speaker 3: That's I mean, that's that's what my instagram is for.
• 1:41:13
  Speaker 3: Is it's four pictures of Timber, but an occasional other
• 1:41:17
  Speaker 3: like thing gets spliced in there just because like I
• 1:41:19
  Speaker 3: want to put it out there.
• 1:41:20
  Speaker 2: But I'm looking at it right now.
• 1:41:22
  Speaker 3: Yeah, if you look at my Instagram, it's ninety percent
• 1:41:25
  Speaker 3: pictures something that's.
• 1:41:26
  Speaker 2: Your mom's dogs are huge.
• 1:41:30
  Speaker 3: What was that patter?
• 1:41:31
  Speaker 2: Your mom's dogs are huge. They look like powerful animals.
• 1:41:34
  Speaker 3: So they're bull mastiffs. They're gigantic.
• 1:41:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And now we take a pause while we
• 1:41:39
  Speaker 2: all look at pictures of dogs that scrolling through the sethsense.
• 1:41:43
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry, I'm looking at Timber me too.
• 1:41:47
  Speaker 3: Ruben's acutie.
• 1:41:49
  Speaker 4: That's probably the best photo of him. He's very lazy.
• 1:41:56
  Speaker 4: He We call him the Princess because, oh god, the
• 1:42:01
  Speaker 4: things scared of rain, wet grass, puppies, elevators, escalators, load
• 1:42:10
  Speaker 4: noises exactly.
• 1:42:13
  Speaker 2: I can kind of understand.
• 1:42:16
  Speaker 4: Sometimes the groomer the vets.
• 1:42:23
  Speaker 3: Anyway, we went definitely well on Tangent into dog land
• 1:42:25
  Speaker 3: there until you get a couple of dog owners together
• 1:42:30
  Speaker 3: and they start, oh.
• 1:42:31
  Speaker 4: God, I know, like so many dogs and I have
• 1:42:34
  Speaker 4: no idea who their parents are. I'm just like, it's
• 1:42:38
  Speaker 4: Lucy exactly.
• 1:42:40
  Speaker 5: Oh.
• 1:42:41
  Speaker 3: At the dog park, we were just like, oh, I'm
• 1:42:43
  Speaker 3: Timber's dad. That's my name. Like I don't have a name,
• 1:42:46
  Speaker 3: I'm just Timber's dad.
• 1:42:48
  Speaker 5: Yep.
• 1:42:52
  Speaker 4: That's why I kind of I kind of hate it that,
• 1:42:54
  Speaker 4: like dogs don't like ice tod eye.
• 1:42:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm like, what the hell's up with that?
• 1:43:02
  Speaker 3: The whole like cats, Like I said, I like it again,
• 1:43:05
  Speaker 3: that's another eye of the world is them, Like, I
• 1:43:06
  Speaker 3: know it's in a few other places, but yeah, yeah.
• 1:43:11
  Speaker 2: It's not important part of the books.
• 1:43:13
  Speaker 4: Really, No, no, it doesn't. I mean, well, there is
• 1:43:16
  Speaker 4: a black sister, black auges sister who plays with.
• 1:43:21
  Speaker 3: It rescues cats.
• 1:43:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, oh yeah, I.
• 1:43:25
  Speaker 4: Mean it's kind of a cool way to like distinguish
• 1:43:28
  Speaker 4: her because I think it comes up later like oh
• 1:43:30
  Speaker 4: there was an iside the one who like has feeding
• 1:43:34
  Speaker 4: off the cats in the city, right or something like that.
• 1:43:37
  Speaker 3: That's that's how they track her down, and it doesn't
• 1:43:40
  Speaker 3: it makes her memorable, makes it like not just another
• 1:43:43
  Speaker 3: black sister.
• 1:43:44
  Speaker 2: Of course, the crazy cat Lady is black, aucha. Yeah,
• 1:43:49
  Speaker 2: it's a good point.
• 1:43:50
  Speaker 3: Wolves don't care about I said, I, so why would dogs?
• 1:43:56
  Speaker 4: Yeah that's true, that's right.
• 1:43:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah, the Black Tower has a bunch of dogs and
• 1:44:00
  Speaker 3: they chase around the female channelers.
• 1:44:02
  Speaker 4: So it's just one of those Jordan male versus female, right.
• 1:44:08
  Speaker 3: He's trying to create this whole like dynamic opposing dynamics,
• 1:44:13
  Speaker 3: and the dog cat dog people versus cat people is
• 1:44:16
  Speaker 3: definitely an easy one to to put out there.
• 1:44:20
  Speaker 4: I mean, I love cats too, I just can't on
• 1:44:22
  Speaker 4: them because my fancy is allergic.
• 1:44:25
  Speaker 2: I am also allergic to cats.
• 1:44:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I've lived with them, but it's a miserable experience.
• 1:44:32
  Speaker 3: Oh really, Yeah, it's I'm either on all sorts of
• 1:44:39
  Speaker 3: medication which makes me woozy, or my eyes are itchy,
• 1:44:45
  Speaker 3: or to be honest, my butthole gets itchy.
• 1:44:49
  Speaker 2: That's weird.
• 1:44:50
  Speaker 3: It's really weird. But fucking cats, man.
• 1:44:55
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry, I just love it becomes uncomfortable in your
• 1:45:01
  Speaker 4: podcast word.
• 1:45:05
  Speaker 2: It gets so that whatever point technically allergic to dairy.
• 1:45:13
  Speaker 2: But right, sometimes I just do it anyway because like
• 1:45:19
  Speaker 2: I'll be walking's great.
• 1:45:21
  Speaker 3: Like cattle come up to me and I'll just I'll
• 1:45:22
  Speaker 3: pet the cat, you know, and I'm not it's not
• 1:45:26
  Speaker 3: going to be a good time. I'm gonna touch my
• 1:45:29
  Speaker 3: eyes and I'm gonna like cry for three hours.
• 1:45:33
  Speaker 2: I feel you. The other day I walked into a
• 1:45:35
  Speaker 2: little big Burger and it's like, I'll have two hamburgers
• 1:45:38
  Speaker 2: and they were like, do you want to cheese on that?
• 1:45:39
  Speaker 2: And I only hesitated for like a second. It's like, yeah,
• 1:45:42
  Speaker 2: I'll take the shove. I don't have to work tomorrow.
• 1:45:47
  Speaker 4: Oh, I'm pretty sure there's a cat outside like doing
• 1:45:52
  Speaker 4: a meeting call.
• 1:45:56
  Speaker 2: Oh the loud Uh. I used to live in Brooklyn
• 1:46:01
  Speaker 2: and there was this lady. So kind of the way
• 1:46:07
  Speaker 2: that worked in my neighborhood is there's like these rows
• 1:46:10
  Speaker 2: of apartment buildings, but behind the apartments there's there'll be
• 1:46:14
  Speaker 2: these open courtyards that are just kind of like a
• 1:46:16
  Speaker 2: shared open space. And there was this crazy cat lady
• 1:46:19
  Speaker 2: that lived in like the building directly behind my building,
• 1:46:23
  Speaker 2: and she would just literally she would just open the
• 1:46:26
  Speaker 2: window and throw cat food out of her window into
• 1:46:32
  Speaker 2: the courtyard, and so there were just all these straight cats,
• 1:46:34
  Speaker 2: which also, I mean, if you live in Brooklyn, it's
• 1:46:38
  Speaker 2: kind of cool that she's attracting all the straight cats
• 1:46:40
  Speaker 2: because that means the rats are like on a different blocks,
• 1:46:45
  Speaker 2: because that's also a problem. Or just you know, you'll
• 1:46:48
  Speaker 2: be walking down the street and rats will scurry out
• 1:46:50
  Speaker 2: from behind a garbage can all the time.
• 1:46:53
  Speaker 3: I remember that in Philadelphia, the subway system especially had
• 1:46:58
  Speaker 3: just a ton of rats in it, just because they
• 1:47:01
  Speaker 3: just hang out on the tracks and eat everything that
• 1:47:03
  Speaker 3: falls down onto them.
• 1:47:05
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, the subways are nasty, although I do miss them.
• 1:47:11
  Speaker 2: It's nice to be able to just walk into a
• 1:47:13
  Speaker 2: tunnel and go wherever you want in the city at.
• 1:47:15
  Speaker 3: Oh, it's fantastic.
• 1:47:16
  Speaker 2: Two bucks. I'm sure it's like too much now, but
• 1:47:20
  Speaker 2: I wish Portland had a better subway system. I yeah,
• 1:47:25
  Speaker 2: I've always kind of wished that they would start building one.
• 1:47:28
  Speaker 2: But I sort of wonder about the water table. I mean,
• 1:47:31
  Speaker 2: my basement floods and it's only like four feet below ground.
• 1:47:35
  Speaker 3: If they can do it in New York, which is
• 1:47:37
  Speaker 3: a freaking island.
• 1:47:38
  Speaker 2: That's true, they do. Yeah, now that you say that,
• 1:47:41
  Speaker 2: I mean they have to if the electricity gets shut off.
• 1:47:46
  Speaker 2: If there's like a bad hurricane in New York, the
• 1:47:47
  Speaker 2: subways just start flooding. Right, there's pumps that run twenty
• 1:47:50
  Speaker 2: four to seven, right and just blow the water back
• 1:47:53
  Speaker 2: out into the ocean. Right, it seeps back in.
• 1:47:57
  Speaker 3: But we've got mountains here, We've got rock. Should be
• 1:48:00
  Speaker 3: able to carve into that and make a decent subway system.
• 1:48:03
  Speaker 3: But anyway, the whole infrastructure issue in Portland, I mean,
• 1:48:06
  Speaker 3: we're a city that's growing too fast for the infrastructure
• 1:48:11
  Speaker 3: that we have in place, and we're not building new infrastructure.
• 1:48:13
  Speaker 2: No, it's like really clearly not made for the amount
• 1:48:18
  Speaker 2: of people that live in it.
• 1:48:19
  Speaker 3: No, So don't move to Portland. It's miserable.
• 1:48:23
  Speaker 2: Go away. We hate it.
• 1:48:26
  Speaker 3: It's terrible here, absolutely terrible. Are you ever planning to
• 1:48:31
  Speaker 3: move away?
• 1:48:33
  Speaker 2: Me? Every day, that's all I think about it.
• 1:48:37
  Speaker 4: Well, my so, my fance lives in Dallas, so we've
• 1:48:43
  Speaker 4: been doing the long distance thing, and that's where I
• 1:48:47
  Speaker 4: grew up. So I'm going to head back there. Which
• 1:48:50
  Speaker 4: it's a little bit ironic because my plan was to
• 1:48:53
  Speaker 4: live abroad and now I'm the kid who's gonna.
• 1:48:59
  Speaker 3: Go back home.
• 1:49:00
  Speaker 2: That's okay, and you're in Houston, Houston.
• 1:49:03
  Speaker 4: I in Houston.
• 1:49:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, how how far is that? How far are those
• 1:49:07
  Speaker 2: away from each other?
• 1:49:10
  Speaker 3: Texas distances so a long way.
• 1:49:12
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's two hundred and fifty miles and it's about
• 1:49:17
  Speaker 4: four hours with a little bit of traffic, am I
• 1:49:22
  Speaker 4: a little bit? I mean like it's hard to get
• 1:49:24
  Speaker 4: out of Houston is the problem?
• 1:49:26
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 1:49:27
  Speaker 4: So once you're out, it's like going. It's just eighty
• 1:49:30
  Speaker 4: miles an hour the whole way.
• 1:49:32
  Speaker 2: But because there's nothing in between, No, I mean there's BUCkies, but.
• 1:49:37
  Speaker 4: Y y'all don't have BUCkies.
• 1:49:40
  Speaker 3: I don't know what BUCkies is.
• 1:49:41
  Speaker 4: Any Texas Texas listeners.
• 1:49:44
  Speaker 2: No, it's like BUCkies. Do they have like a famous
• 1:49:48
  Speaker 2: donut or something?
• 1:49:49
  Speaker 7: Uh?
• 1:49:50
  Speaker 4: They have beaver nuts.
• 1:49:52
  Speaker 2: That's it. That's it. Yeah, they're like pork rinds that
• 1:49:55
  Speaker 2: are have maple glaze or something like that.
• 1:49:58
  Speaker 4: I'm sure they have those.
• 1:50:00
  Speaker 2: Heard about them like they're famous, like a.
• 1:50:03
  Speaker 4: Little crispy caramel thing. I don't know. I'm not super
• 1:50:07
  Speaker 4: into them. But no, there's just there. It's a super
• 1:50:12
  Speaker 4: gas station, like giant tons of bathrooms, every snack, hot food,
• 1:50:19
  Speaker 4: poop bags for your dog, like so it's always crazy
• 1:50:24
  Speaker 4: and then they sell like all kinds of stuff. They
• 1:50:26
  Speaker 4: sell like pajamas, and you know, there's like I've seen
• 1:50:30
  Speaker 4: stuff like that in like weird towns in the South
• 1:50:33
  Speaker 4: where their big store is like it's a gas station.
• 1:50:37
  Speaker 2: But then they'll have like a walk in beer cooler
• 1:50:41
  Speaker 2: that's like a huge room. There'll be like groups of
• 1:50:44
  Speaker 2: people and like picking different beers, and there's like a
• 1:50:47
  Speaker 2: whole deli, and like, I don't know, in New Jersey
• 1:50:51
  Speaker 2: they have quick Check, which is not as big. It's
• 1:50:53
  Speaker 2: not it's more like a seven to eleven, but they
• 1:50:55
  Speaker 2: also have like a deli in Yeah, it's just kind
• 1:50:58
  Speaker 2: of like an AMPM on the West coast expanded, just bigger.
• 1:51:06
  Speaker 3: Virginia had. Oh it was a big red overhang. Their
• 1:51:12
  Speaker 3: trucks always say, follow us to a tasty sandwich. I
• 1:51:14
  Speaker 3: can't remember the name.
• 1:51:15
  Speaker 2: Of the place. Sheets. Sheets, Yeah, I used to go
• 1:51:20
  Speaker 2: to a lot of Sheets. They have those further North
• 1:51:21
  Speaker 2: Lake up in Ohio too. Yeah, at least that far.
• 1:51:26
  Speaker 3: Regional differences in stores is fascinating.
• 1:51:30
  Speaker 2: I love those little things about going different places in
• 1:51:33
  Speaker 2: the country.
• 1:51:34
  Speaker 4: So this is my drive to Dallas, which you'll give
• 1:51:36
  Speaker 4: you like the very Texas experience.
• 1:51:39
  Speaker 7: So Houston where like NASA the first heart surgery, like
• 1:51:47
  Speaker 7: major metropolitan area, and then you go get out of traffic,
• 1:51:52
  Speaker 7: and then like BUCkies starts advertising about one hundred miles away,
• 1:51:57
  Speaker 7: so they have like.
• 1:51:57
  Speaker 4: The BUCkies Go Fort and then you just hit like
• 1:52:02
  Speaker 4: small towns, and then about an hour outside Dallas you
• 1:52:07
  Speaker 4: start getting like the h do you know where you're
• 1:52:11
  Speaker 4: going when you die? Billboards? And there's like one that's
• 1:52:14
  Speaker 4: literally fire and it's like, don't go to Hell, call
• 1:52:17
  Speaker 4: this number. And then there's.
• 1:52:19
  Speaker 2: Another one, well, the Christian conversion billboards.
• 1:52:23
  Speaker 4: Yes, I don't mean.
• 1:52:24
  Speaker 2: You don't have those so much in the North.
• 1:52:27
  Speaker 4: Hesitate call it like Christian because it's like pretty crazy.
• 1:52:33
  Speaker 2: It's not like well just the really like fiery evangelist.
• 1:52:39
  Speaker 3: I'm telling you across the mountains. Get out into eastern Oregon.
• 1:52:43
  Speaker 2: Oh out like bend Way. I never get out there.
• 1:52:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Oh it's out there. The billboards. It doesn't. It's
• 1:52:51
  Speaker 3: not that well, you don't have a car, so you don't.
• 1:52:54
  Speaker 2: My range is kind of like go up to Seattle sometimes,
• 1:52:58
  Speaker 2: but it's like Portland, Seattle, Vancouver. I don't and if
• 1:53:02
  Speaker 2: I get out of the city. It's like directly to
• 1:53:04
  Speaker 2: the wilderness. I don't go to like like I don't
• 1:53:07
  Speaker 2: go to bed. I've no reason to go to town. Really.
• 1:53:13
  Speaker 3: I think I've done some some touristy stuff down there,
• 1:53:15
  Speaker 3: and I've done a few bicycle tours where I've driven
• 1:53:18
  Speaker 3: out there and then and then hopped on the bike
• 1:53:20
  Speaker 3: and that was fun. I did the whole John Day
• 1:53:22
  Speaker 3: Loop that was a week of biking and camping, and
• 1:53:29
  Speaker 3: the day two I think we hit like a hundred degrees,
• 1:53:33
  Speaker 3: which was just killer on the bike. It was so
• 1:53:36
  Speaker 3: and there was no shade on that entire ride. The
• 1:53:39
  Speaker 3: Northwest is nice because there's there's wilderness all around us. Yeah,
• 1:53:45
  Speaker 3: so we've diverged.
• 1:53:46
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 1:53:49
  Speaker 4: For John, he's gonna have to like he's gonna be like,
• 1:53:52
  Speaker 4: what the hell do I even cut?
• 1:53:53
  Speaker 3: Like this show was all after show, just made a
• 1:53:58
  Speaker 3: whole show.
• 1:53:58
  Speaker 2: Just this is this season's after This season's after show
• 1:54:03
  Speaker 2: is exactly what. We just just cut this into ten
• 1:54:05
  Speaker 2: minute blocks. But at the end of each episode we'll
• 1:54:09
  Speaker 2: make that what happens next, And well, we just finished
• 1:54:11
  Speaker 2: season one and season one needs an after show, and
• 1:54:14
  Speaker 2: that's what this is, Okay, right, like that. Yeah, right, Yeah,
• 1:54:19
  Speaker 2: we were talking h Gray and Gristol a couple of
• 1:54:23
  Speaker 2: weeks ago, the last time we recorded. I think do
• 1:54:26
  Speaker 2: we call it season one or book one?
• 1:54:29
  Speaker 4: Wait? Are you asking me a question?
• 1:54:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, totally. When we start with book two, is are
• 1:54:35
  Speaker 3: we going to call this book two? Are we going
• 1:54:37
  Speaker 3: to call it season two? Are we just going to
• 1:54:39
  Speaker 3: keep going like episode fifty Do we go two?
• 1:54:42
  Speaker 2: Or do we just continue counting in episodes?
• 1:54:44
  Speaker 3: Do we do season two? Episode one?
• 1:54:46
  Speaker 4: That might be helpful in terms of like.
• 1:54:51
  Speaker 2: Organizing book one, Book two.
• 1:54:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah, or I like season two. I like seasons as well.
• 1:54:59
  Speaker 4: I think I think it'll be a great resource, Like
• 1:55:02
  Speaker 4: if you want to go back and listen to, like
• 1:55:05
  Speaker 4: a certain chapter from a specific book, you can click
• 1:55:10
  Speaker 4: on like, oh.
• 1:55:12
  Speaker 2: We should go with whatever books or book because it's
• 1:55:16
  Speaker 2: organized by Yeah, but.
• 1:55:19
  Speaker 3: I also want to keep counting up right, I don't
• 1:55:21
  Speaker 3: want to like I want to say episode fifty two,
• 1:55:27
  Speaker 3: I don't want to say season two, episode one. So
• 1:55:30
  Speaker 3: because most podcasts don't well start their count most podcasts
• 1:55:35
  Speaker 3: just keep the count going.
• 1:55:36
  Speaker 2: They're named after the chapter two for the most part,
• 1:55:40
  Speaker 2: unless we do two chapters.
• 1:55:41
  Speaker 3: What I could do is say you know, Real Time
• 1:55:45
  Speaker 3: episode fifty two, the Great Hunt Chapter one. Should we
• 1:55:50
  Speaker 3: just do like the Great Hunt? You know, whatever the
• 1:55:52
  Speaker 3: you know, whatever the title of the chapter is, or
• 1:55:55
  Speaker 3: even just doesn't even have to be the Great Hunt.
• 1:55:57
  Speaker 3: It could be you know, TGH. Just do the abbreviations.
• 1:56:04
  Speaker 4: I think as long as there's some way to easily
• 1:56:05
  Speaker 4: figure out what book you're on, and then.
• 1:56:09
  Speaker 2: I think the three letter thing is pretty standard amongst
• 1:56:12
  Speaker 2: fans too, Like everybody knows what eot W is, right right, right?
• 1:56:17
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I should go. I'm pretty deep into the Way
• 1:56:19
  Speaker 4: of Kings.
• 1:56:20
  Speaker 2: So, oh, are you reading through before you start?
• 1:56:26
  Speaker 4: Yeah? So, I've never read it before. It's the first
• 1:56:29
  Speaker 4: time I've been doing audiobooks at work.
• 1:56:32
  Speaker 2: And then really excited for you.
• 1:56:35
  Speaker 4: It's been really awesome.
• 1:56:37
  Speaker 2: It was really good. I'm about to read through too,
• 1:56:39
  Speaker 2: because I don't want to read the new book with
• 1:56:41
  Speaker 2: It's been a couple of years since I read those, So.
• 1:56:45
  Speaker 3: I just finished the new one.
• 1:56:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Oh yeah, how is it? That's that's plenty.
• 1:56:57
  Speaker 3: It's not everything I wanted to be, but in some
• 1:57:00
  Speaker 3: ways it was so much more, if that makes sense. Yeah, Like,
• 1:57:05
  Speaker 3: you know, whenever you have expectations, there's certain things that
• 1:57:09
  Speaker 3: I wanted to be in it that weren't because there's
• 1:57:13
  Speaker 3: seven more books. He didn't answer all my questions. But
• 1:57:19
  Speaker 3: how long is it's so good? How long is the book?
• 1:57:22
  Speaker 3: Twelve hundred pages?
• 1:57:23
  Speaker 2: Holy shit?
• 1:57:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's massive.
• 1:57:26
  Speaker 2: Have I ever read a twelve hundred page book? I
• 1:57:29
  Speaker 2: don't think I have the Bible shorter than that.
• 1:57:35
  Speaker 4: I mean, like, I have the paperback version and it
• 1:57:38
  Speaker 4: hurts my hand holding it open.
• 1:57:40
  Speaker 3: Oh, I didn't know they came out with the paperback
• 1:57:42
  Speaker 3: is the same time as the hardback.
• 1:57:44
  Speaker 4: No, well, I have the paperback of Way of Kings.
• 1:57:47
  Speaker 2: Oh, but basically, like I think I had that in
• 1:57:50
  Speaker 2: paperback too.
• 1:57:51
  Speaker 4: It's been on my shelf to start for a while.
• 1:57:54
  Speaker 4: But I've been, you know, rereading through real of Time.
• 1:57:57
  Speaker 4: And I went to the bank the Sandersons, and I
• 1:58:01
  Speaker 4: was like, I gotta read these books. I'm too excited,
• 1:58:04
  Speaker 4: Like I'm just saying to jump in.
• 1:58:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:58:07
  Speaker 4: So yeah, I don't know if the live listeners are
• 1:58:13
  Speaker 4: storm Light readers. I don't want to be spoilery, but
• 1:58:16
  Speaker 4: I'm like just getting I think I'm getting to the
• 1:58:20
  Speaker 4: point in Way of Kings. I'm a little over halfway
• 1:58:23
  Speaker 4: where like I understand more about the world and the magic,
• 1:58:29
  Speaker 4: and I'm definitely invested in the characters.
• 1:58:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I feel like we can spoil whatever on this podcast.
• 1:58:37
  Speaker 2: It's like the whole point anyway.
• 1:58:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I don't really need to go into
• 1:58:40
  Speaker 3: the other than to say it's it's good. You know,
• 1:58:43
  Speaker 3: the Way of Kings when it came out, there wasn't
• 1:58:46
  Speaker 3: Words of Radiance yet, And so I got I got
• 1:58:49
  Speaker 3: to the end of Way of Kings and just started
• 1:58:53
  Speaker 3: like it was one of those books where I got
• 1:58:54
  Speaker 3: to the last page and just flipped right to the
• 1:58:57
  Speaker 3: first page and started reading again, like I didn't even
• 1:59:00
  Speaker 3: get up to pause, Like I was just that I
• 1:59:03
  Speaker 3: wanted The experience of reading Way of the Kings was
• 1:59:07
  Speaker 3: unlike anything I'd ever really experienced before, and I wanted
• 1:59:10
  Speaker 3: to go do it again.
• 1:59:13
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 1:59:13
  Speaker 3: It's like when the little kid comes down the slide,
• 1:59:14
  Speaker 3: It's like, I.
• 1:59:15
  Speaker 2: Want to do it again.
• 1:59:16
  Speaker 3: I want to do it again.
• 1:59:17
  Speaker 2: That was me with Way of Kings.
• 1:59:19
  Speaker 4: That's awesome. That's exactly what I did with Wheel of Time.
• 1:59:22
  Speaker 4: Like I finished and I was like, what the fuck?
• 1:59:26
  Speaker 2: Like, no, all right?
• 1:59:29
  Speaker 4: Book one?
• 1:59:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, and I'm almost jealous because I you
• 1:59:36
  Speaker 3: know the Wheel of Time. I didn't get to have
• 1:59:39
  Speaker 3: that experience because it wasn't done.
• 1:59:43
  Speaker 4: I'm so glad, Like I didn't have to wait on
• 1:59:45
  Speaker 4: any of the books, and that's why I like, I
• 1:59:48
  Speaker 4: think I love some of the Middle books so much,
• 1:59:50
  Speaker 4: is because I wasn't waiting on anything, so it didn't like,
• 1:59:55
  Speaker 4: it didn't bother me.
• 1:59:57
  Speaker 3: Oh man, I remember the uncertain years of uncertainty after
• 2:00:02
  Speaker 3: Jordan died.
• 2:00:04
  Speaker 4: Oh god, I can't even imagine that it was.
• 2:00:08
  Speaker 2: It was.
• 2:00:09
  Speaker 3: It was rough because like I didn't know if the
• 2:00:12
  Speaker 3: series was honestly gonna be good. Yeah, you know, it's
• 2:00:17
  Speaker 3: it's how nervous.
• 2:00:18
  Speaker 4: How nervous were you when you opened up Sanderson's.
• 2:00:22
  Speaker 3: Oh, super nervous, super nervous.
• 2:00:25
  Speaker 2: I had already surrendered to the possibility that it was
• 2:00:29
  Speaker 2: going to be awful.
• 2:00:29
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, you just kind of have to.
• 2:00:31
  Speaker 2: Like I was just going to hate it, but I
• 2:00:33
  Speaker 2: was like, I have to know the ending.
• 2:00:35
  Speaker 3: So the only thing that I had going for me
• 2:00:37
  Speaker 3: is once I heard that Brandon Sanderson was finishing it,
• 2:00:40
  Speaker 3: I read everything else he'd put out at that point,
• 2:00:43
  Speaker 3: and I really liked it. Yeah, so I had hope.
• 2:00:48
  Speaker 3: And do I think he did everything perfectly. No, Do
• 2:00:53
  Speaker 3: I think he did as good of a job as
• 2:00:55
  Speaker 3: anyone could have possibly done.
• 2:00:57
  Speaker 2: Yes, Yeah.
• 2:00:59
  Speaker 4: I think it helps that he he was such a
• 2:01:01
  Speaker 4: big fan too, so he's like, I would want to
• 2:01:05
  Speaker 4: read it, I didn't want to write it, like right,
• 2:01:08
  Speaker 4: And you know, I think he knows, like he's open
• 2:01:13
  Speaker 4: about the stuff that he didn't get right, which I
• 2:01:15
  Speaker 4: think helps fans like you're just like okay, like and
• 2:01:21
  Speaker 4: it's also kind of special, like the characters are so
• 2:01:23
  Speaker 4: special that it's like, well in another author's hands, like, yeah,
• 2:01:26
  Speaker 4: they're not exactly right.
• 2:01:31
  Speaker 3: I did read though that there was very little of
• 2:01:33
  Speaker 3: Paren written by Jordan, Yeah, and that most of Parent
• 2:01:39
  Speaker 3: in the last three books is Sanderson's And I think.
• 2:01:44
  Speaker 4: I personally like the way he wrote Parent, love it. Yeah,
• 2:01:48
  Speaker 4: And I think it's because Paren is his personal favorite
• 2:01:52
  Speaker 4: Wheel of Time character, and so I think that that's
• 2:01:54
  Speaker 4: part of like he got Paren. And so people who
• 2:01:58
  Speaker 4: get a little more annoyed at the representation of Matt
• 2:02:02
  Speaker 4: and Ninive are people who are like they got them,
• 2:02:06
  Speaker 4: Like they connected with Matt, they connected with Ninive, And
• 2:02:09
  Speaker 4: then when they say, you know, a comment that's different,
• 2:02:13
  Speaker 4: it like is really striking to them when another reader,
• 2:02:17
  Speaker 4: you know, maybe going to your favorite, Like, it doesn't
• 2:02:20
  Speaker 4: really bother you that Matt isn't exactly one hundred percent.
• 2:02:24
  Speaker 4: But I really like when I found out Paren was
• 2:02:27
  Speaker 4: his favorite, I was like, oh, yeah, that makes.
• 2:02:29
  Speaker 3: Total sense, and Paren being one of my favorites, you know,
• 2:02:33
  Speaker 3: I do buy. I really like what he did with
• 2:02:35
  Speaker 3: him and the way he took his world's dreams powers
• 2:02:40
  Speaker 3: and sort of turned it up to eleven in a
• 2:02:44
  Speaker 3: very Brandon Sanderson way.
• 2:02:46
  Speaker 4: Oh totally, like magic systems is his thing, and he
• 2:02:51
  Speaker 4: he cranked it up, which is perfect because it's like
• 2:02:55
  Speaker 4: the Last Battle, like rules don't matter anymore.
• 2:02:58
  Speaker 2: Really, Yeah, a group of the most powerful badasses that
• 2:03:05
  Speaker 2: pretty much the whole I mean, in the Last Battle,
• 2:03:08
  Speaker 2: you're just following those people. Yeah. The Gathering Storm came
• 2:03:11
  Speaker 2: out in two thousand and nine, by the way, Yeah,
• 2:03:16
  Speaker 2: I think I might have waited. I think I didn't
• 2:03:19
  Speaker 2: read Towers of Midnight right away, okay, two thousand and five. Five.
• 2:03:24
  Speaker 3: It was a four year gap between the two.
• 2:03:26
  Speaker 4: Yeah, oh yeah, so you died in two thousand and seven.
• 2:03:30
  Speaker 2: I feel like I read. I did my read in
• 2:03:34
  Speaker 2: two thousand and six. The first one I kind of
• 2:03:37
  Speaker 2: remember easily because it was my first real apartment out
• 2:03:40
  Speaker 2: on my own. Yeah.
• 2:03:42
  Speaker 3: My first read was ninety five.
• 2:03:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's yeah, jeez. The first six books were out.
• 2:03:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think when by the time I'd finished
• 2:03:53
  Speaker 3: the first six, the seventh one was either out or
• 2:03:57
  Speaker 3: was about to come out for someone came out. So
• 2:03:59
  Speaker 3: I pretty much read the first seven in a row.
• 2:04:03
  Speaker 2: Oh you know, I'm totally lying. I did read these
• 2:04:05
  Speaker 2: when I was a really little kid. I think I
• 2:04:06
  Speaker 2: read like the first four or something like that. Oh yeah,
• 2:04:13
  Speaker 2: a little definitely. I remembered a lot about the first book,
• 2:04:17
  Speaker 2: but I didn't really follow through. I think I didn't
• 2:04:19
  Speaker 2: have them all. At that point. My fantasy and science
• 2:04:22
  Speaker 2: fiction reading was largely based on like whatever my grandfather
• 2:04:26
  Speaker 2: just had, like that guy just read novels, Like right, yeah.
• 2:04:32
  Speaker 3: I just have recommended this series to my nine year
• 2:04:35
  Speaker 3: old nephew nice, yeah, because I was like, I'm not
• 2:04:39
  Speaker 3: sure it might be a little complicated for him, and
• 2:04:42
  Speaker 3: his mom was like, yeah, he's reading like series. He's
• 2:04:44
  Speaker 3: like blowing through Harry Potter, Like yeah, then go for it.
• 2:04:47
  Speaker 3: Like if you can handle Harry Potter.
• 2:04:49
  Speaker 2: I think, so this is it's I feel like it's
• 2:04:53
  Speaker 2: a step up, but not that big of a step. No, Well,
• 2:04:56
  Speaker 2: it's it's high fantasy, and the way that Harry Potter
• 2:04:59
  Speaker 2: I feel like some high fantasy. It's different.
• 2:05:02
  Speaker 3: It is different, it is, but.
• 2:05:04
  Speaker 2: It's somehow less complicated.
• 2:05:07
  Speaker 3: And if Harry Potter isn't quite satisfying him and he's
• 2:05:10
  Speaker 3: blowing through it really quickly, I feel like Wheel of
• 2:05:13
  Speaker 3: Time is a decent place to go next.
• 2:05:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I think I was around that age the first
• 2:05:18
  Speaker 2: time I read.
• 2:05:20
  Speaker 3: Because, like the concept for a couple of things, the
• 2:05:22
  Speaker 3: Wheel of Time is not overtly violent, the language is
• 2:05:27
  Speaker 3: not extremely difficult, and the storytelling, at least on the
• 2:05:34
  Speaker 3: top level, is pretty straightforward. At least in the first
• 2:05:37
  Speaker 3: three books. You know, people do stuff, they go away,
• 2:05:42
  Speaker 3: they come back together, there's a big battle, they win, Hurrah.
• 2:05:46
  Speaker 3: Heroes Like the first three books are relatively easy to understand.
• 2:05:52
  Speaker 3: It's not really till the fourth book that things start
• 2:05:54
  Speaker 3: to spiral out of control, branch out.
• 2:05:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah, in a beautiful way.
• 2:06:00
  Speaker 3: Oh absolutely, But I think the first three books can
• 2:06:03
  Speaker 3: definitely be recommended to pretty young kids, and then if
• 2:06:07
  Speaker 3: they find those satisfying, I think they will come back
• 2:06:09
  Speaker 3: to it when they feel like they can handle the
• 2:06:11
  Speaker 3: whole thing. You know, I'm not one too. I'm always
• 2:06:15
  Speaker 3: willing to let a kid try a book. I will
• 2:06:18
  Speaker 3: never prevent a kid from reading a book because if
• 2:06:21
  Speaker 3: it's too much or too adult, they'll lose interest.
• 2:06:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 2:06:27
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean I agree certainly if he's gone through
• 2:06:30
  Speaker 4: all of Harry Potter, Like that's a lot of books
• 2:06:33
  Speaker 4: to read, right, And it's kind of like, Okay, if
• 2:06:37
  Speaker 4: you go through the first three books and if you
• 2:06:38
  Speaker 4: still like it, then go for it.
• 2:06:42
  Speaker 3: But I think maybe you know, like twelve thirteen is
• 2:06:44
  Speaker 3: probably the more appropriate age. You're not appropriate, it's the
• 2:06:48
  Speaker 3: wrong word, You're more likely to get it and want
• 2:06:51
  Speaker 3: to keep going with it.
• 2:06:53
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And I think that you're at that age you
• 2:06:57
  Speaker 4: can relate to the characters more because I mean, like
• 2:07:00
  Speaker 4: if you're thirteen, Matt and random paranor only a few
• 2:07:03
  Speaker 4: years older.
• 2:07:04
  Speaker 2: So yeah, and the farm boy phase is I feel like,
• 2:07:09
  Speaker 2: like Seth was saying, it's a lot easier to understand,
• 2:07:11
  Speaker 2: like Rand likes a queen. A queen likes Rand, but
• 2:07:14
  Speaker 2: things are difficult. Yeah, And it's like a pretty easy.
• 2:07:20
  Speaker 3: A little bit of star Cross Lovers. You don't field
• 2:07:22
  Speaker 3: the whole polyamorous three culture relationship.
• 2:07:25
  Speaker 4: But it's a lot more cutesy, right, Yeah, and yeah,
• 2:07:29
  Speaker 4: I mean some of the later stuff is not like
• 2:07:34
  Speaker 4: the sex stuff isn't super overt.
• 2:07:37
  Speaker 2: No, that is so.
• 2:07:40
  Speaker 3: At least the Eye of the World is almost entirely
• 2:07:42
  Speaker 3: told from a single perspective.
• 2:07:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 2:07:46
  Speaker 3: I think that's why The dragon Ryborn is such a
• 2:07:48
  Speaker 3: jarring novel for people, because you've you've spent most of
• 2:07:51
  Speaker 3: your time in Rand's head, and then in The dragon
• 2:07:54
  Speaker 3: Ryborn you almost don't see any of him whatsoever. You
• 2:07:58
  Speaker 3: get a couple of glimpses, but he's.
• 2:08:00
  Speaker 2: Uh yeah, that's where it really changes, you know. I
• 2:08:03
  Speaker 2: gives other povs full access. I was allowed to take
• 2:08:06
  Speaker 2: out anything I wanted from the library. Like my family
• 2:08:10
  Speaker 2: didn't look at what sort of books. I'm made it
• 2:08:14
  Speaker 2: out fine, that's I don't think that that stuff should.
• 2:08:17
  Speaker 4: Be Oh yeah, I mean I was always reading all
• 2:08:22
  Speaker 4: kinds of stuff and all.
• 2:08:24
  Speaker 2: Sorts of weird fantasy and science fiction.
• 2:08:26
  Speaker 4: And if you're the type of child that's like a
• 2:08:30
  Speaker 4: voracious reader, then I think that that's it's like good
• 2:08:34
  Speaker 4: for them to learn different thuring things by books.
• 2:08:40
  Speaker 2: Absolutely, there's nothing worse.
• 2:08:45
  Speaker 3: For a voracious reader than trying to like say you
• 2:08:47
  Speaker 3: can't read this, because that's immediately what they're going to
• 2:08:49
  Speaker 3: go and want to read. Yeah, yeah, totally, and like
• 2:08:53
  Speaker 3: just let kids direct. You know, we are very good
• 2:08:57
  Speaker 3: at directing our own learning. If we want to learn it,
• 2:09:00
  Speaker 3: we will And so that's why I think exploration into books.
• 2:09:04
  Speaker 3: If you get a kid who wants to read, throw
• 2:09:07
  Speaker 3: books at him and totally don't worry about the content.
• 2:09:12
  Speaker 2: Having this memory of the grandpa that I was talking about,
• 2:09:14
  Speaker 2: he would go to flea markets and just buy like
• 2:09:17
  Speaker 2: bulk novels and just read through like westerns and a
• 2:09:22
  Speaker 2: bunch of sci fi. And that's how I originally found
• 2:09:25
  Speaker 2: that The Eye of the World. And I remember him
• 2:09:28
  Speaker 2: reading Steven some Stephen King novel, I think it was it,
• 2:09:31
  Speaker 2: and I was like, looked at the cover and I
• 2:09:33
  Speaker 2: was like, what's that and he was like, you shouldn't
• 2:09:34
  Speaker 2: read this, and I was like why not? And he
• 2:09:42
  Speaker 2: was like, well, this is like it's going to give
• 2:09:43
  Speaker 2: you nightmares. And I was like, no, it won't, No,
• 2:09:45
  Speaker 2: it won't, and he gave it to me. Actually, when
• 2:09:49
  Speaker 2: I begged for it enough, I was fine, Yeah.
• 2:09:52
  Speaker 4: I watched the movie when I was like twelve. I
• 2:09:56
  Speaker 4: was at my friend's house and she was like, let's
• 2:09:58
  Speaker 4: watch this movie.
• 2:09:59
  Speaker 11: Oh my god, it's funtage my life for so many years.
• 2:10:06
  Speaker 11: I was just like lying awake, staring at the ceiling, like,
• 2:10:10
  Speaker 11: oh my god, I'm gonna die.
• 2:10:15
  Speaker 3: I watched it for the first time with when I
• 2:10:18
  Speaker 3: heard the new one was coming out. I had actually
• 2:10:20
  Speaker 3: never seen the old version of it, and I found
• 2:10:23
  Speaker 3: it really bad and pretty cool.
• 2:10:25
  Speaker 4: I can't I can't imagine it as an adult, Like,
• 2:10:27
  Speaker 4: as an adult, i'd probably hate it, but like, and
• 2:10:30
  Speaker 4: we didn't watch the ending, and I've heard the ending
• 2:10:32
  Speaker 4: is stupid. We got so scared that I was like.
• 2:10:35
  Speaker 3: Oh, well, the modern one doesn't makes a good decision
• 2:10:39
  Speaker 3: where it sticks with them as kids. Yeah, old one
• 2:10:43
  Speaker 3: did a lot of swapping, just like the book did.
• 2:10:45
  Speaker 3: It was true to the book in a way, but
• 2:10:47
  Speaker 3: it was also because it was swapping between like adults
• 2:10:52
  Speaker 3: and kids, and the relationships between the adults was actually
• 2:10:56
  Speaker 3: kind of creepy. And then they tried to mirror it
• 2:10:58
  Speaker 3: and the kids and the adults were like really bad
• 2:11:01
  Speaker 3: eighties actor And like I didn't enjoy it at all.
• 2:11:07
  Speaker 3: I just like, I really enjoyed.
• 2:11:09
  Speaker 2: Was it?
• 2:11:10
  Speaker 3: Tim Curry?
• 2:11:10
  Speaker 2: Is it? He was great series?
• 2:11:15
  Speaker 3: I thought it was just a movie. It was it
• 2:11:20
  Speaker 3: was a really long movie, was it?
• 2:11:22
  Speaker 2: Oh God, I'm thinking of it as a mini series.
• 2:11:25
  Speaker 3: I just watched the Dune mini series for the first time.
• 2:11:29
  Speaker 2: Have you said that was a sci fi channel made? Yeah,
• 2:11:32
  Speaker 2: that's the better, the better film. I had that on
• 2:11:36
  Speaker 2: DVD when I was like, yeah.
• 2:11:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, you should read the first three.
• 2:11:46
  Speaker 2: I think seth that I usually say yeah, read, yeah,
• 2:11:49
  Speaker 2: read the first three. It gets crazy after that.
• 2:11:53
  Speaker 3: Beyond that it gets it gets a little outlandish and
• 2:11:56
  Speaker 3: there's major like like thousand year time jumps and stuff
• 2:12:00
  Speaker 3: like that.
• 2:12:00
  Speaker 2: So I like, well the whole lineage like God Emperor.
• 2:12:05
  Speaker 2: I like, I can't remember. It might have been like
• 2:12:08
  Speaker 2: six or seven that I read, and then I kind
• 2:12:11
  Speaker 2: of sampled the stuff. His son wrote like, you should
• 2:12:15
  Speaker 2: talk to John the Bartender. He's a really.
• 2:12:21
  Speaker 4: I set your friend you got in the series.
• 2:12:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I call him John int the Bartender. He's just
• 2:12:26
  Speaker 3: the bartender at the bar I go to Downstree and.
• 2:12:29
  Speaker 2: I should do it. We should give a shout out
• 2:12:31
  Speaker 2: to Grain and Gristle and Portland, Oregon, totally Grain and gristle.
• 2:12:34
  Speaker 2: That's that's my bar of choice. Really good spot if
• 2:12:37
  Speaker 2: you want to eat meat and drink beer. Fantastic.
• 2:12:41
  Speaker 3: It's the place where if I order a burger medium rare,
• 2:12:43
  Speaker 3: it actually comes out medium rare, and you know how
• 2:12:46
  Speaker 3: rare that is very rare? About medium rare? Okay, but no,
• 2:12:55
  Speaker 3: they and they have like a great stew and they
• 2:12:58
  Speaker 3: have a mistake. But you know, honestly, I just go
• 2:13:00
  Speaker 3: there mostly to drink because.
• 2:13:02
  Speaker 2: They have their they carry that kind of smaller brewery.
• 2:13:06
  Speaker 3: Upright brewing, so they're a tasting room properly brewing. So
• 2:13:10
  Speaker 3: they generally have four or five or six of.
• 2:13:12
  Speaker 2: Their beers on tap. No bunch of you Portlanders listen
• 2:13:16
  Speaker 2: to us, So go there. Yeah, definitely, And Seth and
• 2:13:19
  Speaker 2: Patrick maybe discussion.
• 2:13:22
  Speaker 3: If you run into John, tell them I sent you.
• 2:13:24
  Speaker 4: Well. If I'm ever in Portland, will which I would
• 2:13:29
  Speaker 4: love to get to Portland.
• 2:13:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Portland's great little city. I don't live here.
• 2:13:36
  Speaker 2: Money, terrible city rants all the time. I feel like
• 2:13:41
  Speaker 2: I should explain that Portlanders have this thing where we
• 2:13:43
  Speaker 2: tell people not to move here because we hate it
• 2:13:45
  Speaker 2: and it's not true.
• 2:13:47
  Speaker 4: Get out of.
• 2:13:49
  Speaker 3: Don't give away our secrets. Just because it's the best
• 2:13:52
  Speaker 3: place in the country and we don't want more people
• 2:13:54
  Speaker 3: to come.
• 2:13:54
  Speaker 2: At least Kelsey to understand we can. You can edit
• 2:13:58
  Speaker 2: that out, all right, fair enough, just just so she
• 2:14:01
  Speaker 2: knew what we were talking about. I used to live
• 2:14:04
  Speaker 2: in Houston, got humidity and mosquitoes and.
• 2:14:13
  Speaker 4: We actually have dang a fever here.
• 2:14:16
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we got everything here.
• 2:14:19
  Speaker 2: You're selling it.
• 2:14:23
  Speaker 4: If you got cancer. We got a great hospital. It's
• 2:14:27
  Speaker 4: like a.
• 2:14:27
  Speaker 2: Hundred thousand, one hundred thousand people.
• 2:14:32
  Speaker 4: And in the medicine, no, there's like mine.
• 2:14:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 2:14:36
  Speaker 3: I was just saying.
• 2:14:39
  Speaker 4: That's work in the medical center.
• 2:14:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah, the medical center is.
• 2:14:45
  Speaker 2: A small city basically.
• 2:14:48
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 2:14:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think we're sort of petering out here.
• 2:14:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 2:14:52
  Speaker 4: I got to go read some Way of Kings.
• 2:14:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So let's let's call it a night. And guys,
• 2:14:59
  Speaker 2: it's been fantastic. That's going to be a heck of
• 2:15:02
  Speaker 2: an interesting episode.
• 2:15:03
  Speaker 5: To put out.
• 2:15:04
  Speaker 4: I want to see how John Edison is, like, sorry, John,
• 2:15:11
  Speaker 4: I feel mad.
• 2:15:12
  Speaker 2: And in summary, there's no way to summarize.
• 2:15:15
  Speaker 3: There's no way somewhere that definitely love the world.
• 2:15:19
  Speaker 4: Its asshole in there.
• 2:16:36
  Speaker 1: This is the Wheel of Times Spoilers podcast. Your hosts
• 2:16:40
  Speaker 1: are Seth Jacobson and Patrick Hyler.
• 2:16:46
  Speaker 3: Okay, so there was this Deadline article where they let
• 2:16:49
  Speaker 3: it slip that Amazon had the rights to it. However,
• 2:16:56
  Speaker 3: it was sort of a weird article and a weird reference,
• 2:16:59
  Speaker 3: and no one's confirmed or denied it. So right now
• 2:17:03
  Speaker 3: the leading candidate is Amazon to have it, but that's
• 2:17:07
  Speaker 3: based on kind of a sketchy article that has neither
• 2:17:11
  Speaker 3: been confirmed nor denied.
• 2:17:13
  Speaker 2: Gotcha. Yeah, well, I just i'd like to see that
• 2:17:17
  Speaker 2: happen because, you know, either Netflix or Amazon, they have
• 2:17:20
  Speaker 2: the kind of money and the production quality that I
• 2:17:26
  Speaker 2: would like to see go into the show.
• 2:17:27
  Speaker 3: And the freedom to explore the kind of show it
• 2:17:30
  Speaker 3: needs to be, whereas any sort of network television is
• 2:17:33
  Speaker 3: going to have. You know, you're going to end up
• 2:17:35
  Speaker 3: with something like The Shannara Chronicles, which is very MTV.
• 2:17:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I heard it. I watched it. Oh, it was terrible, terrible. Honestly,
• 2:17:45
  Speaker 2: I just thought the books were okay, So I didn't.
• 2:17:47
  Speaker 3: Really Yeah, well, I really enjoyed the books as a kid,
• 2:17:49
  Speaker 3: and I think there's a lot into them, and I
• 2:17:51
  Speaker 3: think you could make a fairly dark and interesting series
• 2:17:54
  Speaker 3: that is not what MTV did.
• 2:17:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, was it actually MTV. Yes, oh, I thought you
• 2:18:01
  Speaker 2: were just that was commentary.
• 2:18:02
  Speaker 3: Ooh no, yeah, it doesn't sound good. No, it was
• 2:18:04
  Speaker 3: actually in TV bought the rights and made it, and
• 2:18:06
  Speaker 3: it was everything you think a show made by MTV
• 2:18:10
  Speaker 3: would be.
• 2:18:13
  Speaker 2: I'm imagining that they like take the character aside in
• 2:18:16
  Speaker 2: like a side room, and then they're They're like, I
• 2:18:18
  Speaker 2: don't like this other character. Yeah, it was. It was
• 2:18:22
  Speaker 2: like a combination of the real world. I'm just I'm
• 2:18:25
  Speaker 2: just being funny now. It was less real world. It
• 2:18:29
  Speaker 2: was more like what's the Sparkly Vampire one? Twilight? Ooh.
• 2:18:33
  Speaker 3: It was like they took Twilight and tried to make
• 2:18:35
  Speaker 3: it in a fantasy world.
• 2:18:39
  Speaker 2: Was sort of Shanara meant to be like a ya lit.
• 2:18:43
  Speaker 3: No, no, not at all. First book is almost a
• 2:18:47
  Speaker 3: direct copy of Tolkien. I mean in the same way
• 2:18:48
  Speaker 3: that I Have the World is a lot like Tolkien. Yeah,
• 2:18:53
  Speaker 3: but it's I'd say it's even closer to Tolkien. It's
• 2:18:56
  Speaker 3: like between I Have the World and Tolkien and then Elfstones.
• 2:18:59
  Speaker 3: He really started to go his own way and do
• 2:19:01
  Speaker 3: his own thing, and it got interesting for a while,
• 2:19:04
  Speaker 3: and they sort of tried to take that interesting part
• 2:19:07
  Speaker 3: of it and do something with it, and it was
• 2:19:09
  Speaker 3: just discoherent.
• 2:19:11
  Speaker 2: Mumbled, Oh that's the lame, and all.
• 2:19:15
  Speaker 3: The characters were boring teenage angsty.
• 2:19:20
  Speaker 2: I'm like, I'm looking up the synopsis of sort of
• 2:19:23
  Speaker 2: China right now because I read this a long time ago.
• 2:19:29
  Speaker 2: To major plots in fictional world called the floor Lands.
• 2:19:33
  Speaker 2: Shay Almsford, he's basically a hobbit. Him and his brother
• 2:19:37
  Speaker 2: are basically Sam and I don't remember any of this.
• 2:19:43
  Speaker 2: I feel like this might have been the one. Yeah,
• 2:19:47
  Speaker 2: I think this is the one where I read a
• 2:19:48
  Speaker 2: lot of the first book and I didn't like it,
• 2:19:50
  Speaker 2: and I just didn't that's fair.
• 2:19:53
  Speaker 3: But you should try book two, yeah, because book one is,
• 2:19:58
  Speaker 3: like I said, a pretty much boring copy of Yeah,
• 2:20:03
  Speaker 3: Lord of the Rings, and book two is like a
• 2:20:07
  Speaker 3: generation later and they have these things called the Elvestones
• 2:20:09
  Speaker 3: that they just happen to get in the first one,
• 2:20:11
  Speaker 3: and there's some really interesting stuff that.
• 2:20:14
  Speaker 2: Goes on with some magic quality a.
• 2:20:17
  Speaker 3: Magic cloak, and there's demons and they're like corrupting.
• 2:20:23
  Speaker 2: I can't remember, but I just skiined the synopsis and
• 2:20:25
  Speaker 2: remembered very little of itself.
• 2:20:28
  Speaker 3: But yeah, go to Elstones of read book two and
• 2:20:31
  Speaker 3: then book three is The Wish Song of Shanara, and
• 2:20:34
  Speaker 3: that sort of makes a first complete trilogy. And then
• 2:20:38
  Speaker 3: there's a second It's like four or five books, which
• 2:20:42
  Speaker 3: are I believe that the Scions of Shannara. Yeah, so
• 2:20:46
  Speaker 3: it's like for those who have inherited the power from
• 2:20:49
  Speaker 3: the original trilogy, and those are fantastic. And then he
• 2:20:53
  Speaker 3: goes off into what a lot of authors do, which
• 2:20:56
  Speaker 3: is he starts to write a bunch of books that
• 2:20:59
  Speaker 3: merge together and repeat the same characters and repeat the
• 2:21:02
  Speaker 3: same blot points over and over again, and it starts
• 2:21:04
  Speaker 3: to get pretty boring.
• 2:21:06
  Speaker 2: Sounds similarly named. As I read this series a long
• 2:21:09
  Speaker 2: time ago is called like Kushil's Avatar. I think was
• 2:21:13
  Speaker 2: the first book. But that was all right. I think
• 2:21:18
  Speaker 2: I read all the way through some interesting stuff. There
• 2:21:23
  Speaker 2: was another thing that I found while wandering through the library.
• 2:21:25
  Speaker 2: It's like, that's an interesting looking cover.
• 2:21:28
  Speaker 3: I did read that book, the first one. I don't
• 2:21:30
  Speaker 3: think I read any of the others.
• 2:21:34
  Speaker 2: It goes on. I remember liking it. Of course I
• 2:21:37
  Speaker 2: could barely describe the plot to you now.
• 2:21:39
  Speaker 3: But totally I'm reading this summery and I'm like, oh yeah,
• 2:21:42
  Speaker 3: I definitely read the book here, and I think I
• 2:21:44
  Speaker 3: enjoyed it, But you're right, I don't remember all of
• 2:21:48
  Speaker 3: what happened.
• 2:21:49
  Speaker 2: Is honestly the only fantasy series that I can think
• 2:21:52
  Speaker 2: of that kind of revolves around the sexuality of the
• 2:21:57
  Speaker 2: main characters. Yeah, well, there's lot to it, at least.
• 2:22:01
  Speaker 2: I think you actually recommended these to me. I think
• 2:22:03
  Speaker 2: that's why I've read them. Oh so, or I read
• 2:22:06
  Speaker 2: the first one anyway, it like got on my list
• 2:22:08
  Speaker 2: at some point. Yeah.
• 2:22:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm just in a point where, like I have
• 2:22:12
  Speaker 3: a hard time reading anything that's not Wheel of Time
• 2:22:14
  Speaker 3: these days.
• 2:22:16
  Speaker 2: That's fair.
• 2:22:17
  Speaker 3: Everything I compared to it is just inferior, with the
• 2:22:20
  Speaker 3: notable exception of the stuff that I think Brandon Sanderson
• 2:22:23
  Speaker 3: is doing.
• 2:22:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Weel Time is comforting and familiar and I'm fond
• 2:22:29
  Speaker 2: of it. Oh yeah, awesome and epic.
• 2:22:32
  Speaker 3: But I devoured Oathbringer as soon as that came out. Yeah,
• 2:22:35
  Speaker 3: which you still haven't read, No, I haven't. We got
• 2:22:38
  Speaker 3: to sit you down and make you read for like
• 2:22:40
  Speaker 3: two or three weeks straight.
• 2:22:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I know I have to. I was just I've
• 2:22:45
  Speaker 2: been super busy, But I'll get around to it eventually. Yeah. Well,
• 2:22:48
  Speaker 2: you've picked up a lot of shifts, yeah, which is
• 2:22:51
  Speaker 2: how your schedule works, where you have like these waves
• 2:22:53
  Speaker 2: of like working almost every day for like two weeks straight.
• 2:22:56
  Speaker 3: And then working one day a week, so it's boom
• 2:23:01
  Speaker 3: and bust.
• 2:23:02
  Speaker 2: Oh. By the way, Kelsey T. Baldwin, I'm glad you
• 2:23:06
  Speaker 2: agreed with me on that. I thought it was a
• 2:23:09
  Speaker 2: really interesting, well written way of making sexuality like a
• 2:23:15
  Speaker 2: huge part of a series like this, because I feel
• 2:23:17
  Speaker 2: like it would be really tempting to just make the
• 2:23:20
  Speaker 2: series basically just erotic wit right, But it's not. It's not.
• 2:23:25
  Speaker 2: But I feel like that's where, you know, a lot
• 2:23:27
  Speaker 2: of bad fantasy kind of goes.
• 2:23:29
  Speaker 3: It's just like a lot of fan fiction goes there.
• 2:23:32
  Speaker 2: Super hot alien chicks, bro, And that's like all you
• 2:23:35
  Speaker 2: get out of that, you know.
• 2:23:39
  Speaker 3: And I'm gonna yell at you to read Broken Earth
• 2:23:41
  Speaker 3: again just because Broken Earth is fantastic.
• 2:23:45
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, well, Seth has talked a lot about that.
• 2:23:48
  Speaker 2: That's another one I've been meaning to get around to.
• 2:23:50
  Speaker 2: But between Wheel of Time stuff, miss Born.
• 2:23:54
  Speaker 3: And work, how are you doing on Misborne these days?
• 2:23:57
  Speaker 2: I'm like halfway through all of Ascension. Okay, next time
• 2:23:59
  Speaker 2: I sit down for a day because last time I
• 2:24:02
  Speaker 2: sat down for a day, I just completed Misborn, the
• 2:24:05
  Speaker 2: first one.
• 2:24:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's wait, that's what it's called, right, Yeah, it's
• 2:24:08
  Speaker 3: the Final Empire, I think is the subtitle?
• 2:24:11
  Speaker 2: Oh, the Final Empire. Oh that's funny. My copy just
• 2:24:13
  Speaker 2: has Misborn on it. Yeah, I think they Wait, that's
• 2:24:16
  Speaker 2: your copy, isn't it.
• 2:24:17
  Speaker 3: I think No, I learned about my copy. That's my
• 2:24:20
  Speaker 3: copy of Well of Ascension, your copy of Misborn.
• 2:24:22
  Speaker 2: Oh okay, so it's Misborn.
• 2:24:24
  Speaker 3: The Final Empire is what they subtitled it once they
• 2:24:26
  Speaker 3: started coming out with more books. Also, yeah, Missborn. Yeah,
• 2:24:31
  Speaker 3: so I think in the later copies is subtitled the
• 2:24:34
  Speaker 3: Final Empire. But yeah, I'm super excited to get started
• 2:24:38
  Speaker 3: on the Misborn podcast. I've been like chomping at the bit.
• 2:24:41
  Speaker 2: I really am too. In Well, we promised to release
• 2:24:44
  Speaker 2: something twenty two days from now. Because we're recording this
• 2:24:48
  Speaker 2: on the.
• 2:24:49
  Speaker 3: Eighth, i'd like to get it recorded and released before
• 2:24:52
  Speaker 3: we go to Jordan Con.
• 2:24:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That way we can get a little interaction with
• 2:24:55
  Speaker 2: people and stuff.
• 2:24:56
  Speaker 3: Point people to it and say here's episode zero. Yeah,
• 2:25:00
  Speaker 3: get in on the ground floor.
• 2:25:01
  Speaker 2: We're going to talk about what we're going to talk about,
• 2:25:03
  Speaker 2: and that should be pretty easy.
• 2:25:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we don't have to do too much prep for that,
• 2:25:07
  Speaker 3: but we keep Like I said, with your schedule being busy,
• 2:25:09
  Speaker 3: it's been hard to coordinate a good time to Yeah.
• 2:25:14
  Speaker 3: I finished the whole series, including a secret history. I'm
• 2:25:18
  Speaker 3: jealous I've had time to read. And then I went
• 2:25:22
  Speaker 3: back and I reread The Dragon Reborn too, Yeah, from
• 2:25:26
  Speaker 3: start to finish, so that that was really helpful. I'm
• 2:25:30
  Speaker 3: going to try and do that. I think between each
• 2:25:32
  Speaker 3: book is like reread the whole next book, because there's
• 2:25:35
  Speaker 3: so many things that are relevant at the end of
• 2:25:38
  Speaker 3: the book to the beginning, and so it's nice to
• 2:25:41
  Speaker 3: have read the whole thing when we start.
• 2:25:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I've been trying to read it like as I
• 2:25:45
  Speaker 2: read it, if there's anything that I don't understand, I
• 2:25:46
  Speaker 2: don't bother like trying and leave it a mystery, I
• 2:25:49
  Speaker 2: just look it up immediately. And I mean never had
• 2:25:51
  Speaker 2: the series already mess born to try to read it
• 2:25:55
  Speaker 2: with as many spoilers included as possible, so that when
• 2:25:57
  Speaker 2: we start going back through it, when we come back
• 2:26:00
  Speaker 2: to page one and start recording, I'll be pretty well versed.
• 2:26:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I was absolutely doing that too the whole time,
• 2:26:06
  Speaker 3: which was like, wait, I don't know is this misspirit
• 2:26:09
  Speaker 3: Kelseer is it?
• 2:26:11
  Speaker 2: Is it? Oh? Yeah? And you know it's purposely confusing. Yeah,
• 2:26:15
  Speaker 2: like RJ does that a bunch.
• 2:26:17
  Speaker 3: But it's already you know, people have been able to
• 2:26:18
  Speaker 3: figure out who's who, and so you can just look
• 2:26:20
  Speaker 3: it up as we're going through and then you're like, oh, okay, yeah,
• 2:26:23
  Speaker 3: I know what's going on. It's been fun to sort
• 2:26:26
  Speaker 3: of reread the Misborn trilogy with the same eye for
• 2:26:32
  Speaker 3: detail that we've been using in the Wheel of Time
• 2:26:35
  Speaker 3: and sort of in my head treat it to the
• 2:26:37
  Speaker 3: same analysis totally.
• 2:26:41
  Speaker 2: I just passed the part where Vin still thinks or
• 2:26:44
  Speaker 2: a sore or or a sore Yeah is or a
• 2:26:49
  Speaker 2: sore but he's not nod. Yeah, And I'm really glad
• 2:26:53
  Speaker 2: because I'm going to call him ten soon because it's
• 2:26:55
  Speaker 2: way easier to say.
• 2:26:59
  Speaker 3: But yeah, no, that's really cool. One in ten Soon is.
• 2:27:01
  Speaker 3: I love ten Soon.
• 2:27:02
  Speaker 2: He is.
• 2:27:05
  Speaker 3: He might be my favorite character.
• 2:27:07
  Speaker 2: I like the Mistraiths a lot, but we don't call
• 2:27:11
  Speaker 2: them that. We call Condra Condra, who are like grown
• 2:27:15
  Speaker 2: up Mistraates essentially, or spiked Miss spiked me.
• 2:27:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah, they've been they've been imbued with they've been investiture
• 2:27:24
  Speaker 3: basically basically hem allergic spike.
• 2:27:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, how do they do the spike because with humans,
• 2:27:29
  Speaker 2: they'd nail it through a person into a person. Right, Well,
• 2:27:33
  Speaker 2: that's with the inquisitors, right, So the inquisitors. The spike
• 2:27:38
  Speaker 2: goes through a mist born or misting directly into the inquisitor,
• 2:27:43
  Speaker 2: and then you get there basically whatever power you pull
• 2:27:46
  Speaker 2: out of them in the placement, in the type of
• 2:27:48
  Speaker 2: metal matters, right with the what about with the giant? Yeah,
• 2:27:54
  Speaker 2: the coloss they get four spikes, but those spikes aren't
• 2:27:59
  Speaker 2: made from a missing or misborn. They're actually made from
• 2:28:02
  Speaker 2: regular human beings. And what they do is they pull
• 2:28:04
  Speaker 2: out the part of preservation that is their soul, and
• 2:28:07
  Speaker 2: then they combine that into four spikes into one person,
• 2:28:12
  Speaker 2: and that becomes the Coloss. The Condra, it's two, it's
• 2:28:16
  Speaker 2: just two spikes, and they're they're made as a pair. Present.
• 2:28:20
  Speaker 2: They would call one presence and the other one. There's
• 2:28:24
  Speaker 2: four blessings and each Condra gets one of the four,
• 2:28:29
  Speaker 2: so's potency, presence, presence, and I don't remember what the
• 2:28:33
  Speaker 2: other two are. Ten Souon has both those.
• 2:28:36
  Speaker 3: Ten soon he steals the potency one from or sore
• 2:28:41
  Speaker 3: So or ser just had the potency. Tenson just had presence,
• 2:28:44
  Speaker 3: and ten soon killed them and took his, and so
• 2:28:46
  Speaker 3: he had two, which made him really powerful.
• 2:28:49
  Speaker 2: Is that why Tensun can keep up with then as
• 2:28:52
  Speaker 2: he runs through the streets. Yep. Nice.
• 2:28:55
  Speaker 3: Yeah, he's essentially a double spike.
• 2:28:59
  Speaker 2: Super contra, a co lost contra. So I'm just getting deep, deep,
• 2:29:05
  Speaker 2: deep into the magical systems and the eighteen different metals.
• 2:29:11
  Speaker 3: Yes, they're eighteen.
• 2:29:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I was looking into that because it's.
• 2:29:16
  Speaker 3: The sixteen normal ones plus the two god metals, the
• 2:29:19
  Speaker 3: various pieces of the body, how they both have like
• 2:29:23
  Speaker 3: one has black smoke, the other ones the mist one's
• 2:29:25
  Speaker 3: ATM the other ones, I forget what it's called larassium, Yeah,
• 2:29:30
  Speaker 3: larassium or something like that.
• 2:29:32
  Speaker 2: But I'm not even at that point in those series yet.
• 2:29:35
  Speaker 2: We'll get there. And some of them you don't find
• 2:29:38
  Speaker 2: out about until the second set, right.
• 2:29:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you don't find out about the last two normal
• 2:29:45
  Speaker 3: metals until the second set of blacks.
• 2:29:48
  Speaker 2: Those are the time bubbles. Yeah. I read about them,
• 2:29:52
  Speaker 2: and I was like, I don't remember this in Missborn.
• 2:29:54
  Speaker 3: No, it's not at all. And you haven't read Secret
• 2:29:57
  Speaker 3: History yet, either where there's a lot of stuff revealed,
• 2:30:00
  Speaker 3: or Alley of Law or else. You haven't read Alloy
• 2:30:02
  Speaker 3: of Law either.
• 2:30:02
  Speaker 2: NOA, I'll just keep going. Yeah you should, because Alloy
• 2:30:10
  Speaker 2: of Law is going to come up. It will.
• 2:30:11
  Speaker 3: But for the most part, I'm not too worried about
• 2:30:14
  Speaker 3: there's It is definitely a second trilogy, and while some
• 2:30:17
  Speaker 3: stuff is callbacks, I don't think there's too much that
• 2:30:20
  Speaker 3: flashes forward.
• 2:30:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah. There. I mean, I'm tempted to say that they're
• 2:30:24
  Speaker 2: not connected, but like from what I've read, you know,
• 2:30:27
  Speaker 2: there's some connections, but there aren't really not between the
• 2:30:32
  Speaker 2: characters in the books. Okay, no, that's also not true.
• 2:30:35
  Speaker 2: But I think you know what I mean, I do,
• 2:30:36
  Speaker 2: I do. It's not one cohesive story.
• 2:30:38
  Speaker 3: No, it's there's a large I mean centuries time break.
• 2:30:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I'm aware, Sir Sepin of what's in Secret History,
• 2:30:48
  Speaker 2: but I haven't. I haven't read it myself.
• 2:30:50
  Speaker 3: I've been telling him about it as i've been going
• 2:30:53
  Speaker 3: through it. Yeah, so he's sort of like, all right,
• 2:30:54
  Speaker 3: I get it, shut up. But we're trying to spoil
• 2:30:57
  Speaker 3: things as much as possible. So just so we're we
• 2:31:00
  Speaker 3: have as many spoilers on our front of our minds
• 2:31:02
  Speaker 3: as possible.
• 2:31:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So I'm going to read the whole thing and
• 2:31:05
  Speaker 2: then when, like I said, when we start at page one,
• 2:31:08
  Speaker 2: that's when we'll start recording.
• 2:31:10
  Speaker 3: You know, I'm sure I'll start bringing up the three realms,
• 2:31:15
  Speaker 3: the cognitive realm, the spiritual realm, the physical realm, and
• 2:31:18
  Speaker 3: how those interact. I'll be probably talked about how the
• 2:31:21
  Speaker 3: spiritual realm that Kelseier goes into is very different from
• 2:31:25
  Speaker 3: the spiritual realm in storm Light because in storm Light
• 2:31:30
  Speaker 3: it's all black beads. There these little round glass beads
• 2:31:36
  Speaker 3: that represent the souls of items. In Misborn it's all misty.
• 2:31:41
  Speaker 3: It's like the end, It's just two very different environments,
• 2:31:44
  Speaker 3: even though it's both the cognitive realm, and it's because
• 2:31:47
  Speaker 3: of how the people in the different areas think about
• 2:31:49
  Speaker 3: oh the magic systems.
• 2:31:52
  Speaker 2: Interesting. Yeah, hey, maybe by the time we're done with
• 2:31:57
  Speaker 2: miss Born, storm Light will be done. No, No, we're
• 2:32:03
  Speaker 2: probably hopefully by the time we're done with miss Borne,
• 2:32:07
  Speaker 2: the next book will be out.
• 2:32:09
  Speaker 3: That would be nice, That would be nice. Maybe he finishes.
• 2:32:14
  Speaker 2: The first five, does he have like a projected amount
• 2:32:17
  Speaker 2: of books that are supposed to pay.
• 2:32:18
  Speaker 3: Ten Yeah, and he's got a pretty strict outline and
• 2:32:21
  Speaker 3: he's very good about sticking to his book lengths. So
• 2:32:25
  Speaker 3: and it's supposed to be two.
• 2:32:26
  Speaker 2: Groups of five. Cool.
• 2:32:28
  Speaker 3: So there's like a group of five and then like
• 2:32:30
  Speaker 3: I think like a ten to twenty year break, not
• 2:32:32
  Speaker 3: not specified, but basically long enough for some other kids
• 2:32:36
  Speaker 3: to grow up and things like that and time to pass,
• 2:32:39
  Speaker 3: and then there's going to be another five.
• 2:32:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 2:32:41
  Speaker 3: His plan is one every two years, but I think
• 2:32:43
  Speaker 3: it's gonna end up being closer to one every three years.
• 2:32:46
  Speaker 3: So I'm guessing we probably won't see the end of
• 2:32:49
  Speaker 3: the first five book for like another five six years.
• 2:32:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So that's too bad.
• 2:32:54
  Speaker 3: And I think we're gonna get Misborn done in probably
• 2:32:56
  Speaker 3: like two years. Even if we don't go that's to
• 2:32:58
  Speaker 3: pass on it, although I guess we could do the
• 2:32:59
  Speaker 3: second trilogy.
• 2:33:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So that's what I'm thinking of when we finish
• 2:33:05
  Speaker 2: Miss Born one day in the distant future. That begs
• 2:33:12
  Speaker 2: the question or do we want to do more Cosmir stuff?
• 2:33:14
  Speaker 2: And the answer is, yes, we want to do more
• 2:33:15
  Speaker 2: Cosmo stuff. Probably, yeah, we want to, But We only
• 2:33:20
  Speaker 2: want to do series that are complete, yeah, because then
• 2:33:25
  Speaker 2: how can we spoil them if we're not very incompletely.
• 2:33:28
  Speaker 2: We don't want to be guessing it stuff.
• 2:33:29
  Speaker 3: No, yeah, there's there's a bunch of Cosmeo stuff, but
• 2:33:33
  Speaker 3: again it's not it's not complete, you know.
• 2:33:34
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, you know we could do singles and stuff too.
• 2:33:37
  Speaker 2: We don't have to do long series either, but once
• 2:33:40
  Speaker 2: we're doing Wheel of Time and Misborn, we probably won't
• 2:33:43
  Speaker 2: want to be doing anything else until one of them's done,
• 2:33:47
  Speaker 2: unless something kicks off and we start making a lot
• 2:33:51
  Speaker 2: more money and we can just do this in our
• 2:33:54
  Speaker 2: full for full time. Yeah, because if I could work
• 2:33:56
  Speaker 2: on this for eight hours a day and have that
• 2:33:58
  Speaker 2: be affordable, then we could probably do three series.
• 2:34:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, plus bringing in some other people.
• 2:34:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, for editing and things like that. Oh Name of
• 2:34:09
  Speaker 2: the Wind. Yeah, I would love to do that, but
• 2:34:11
  Speaker 2: when the hell's that? Can I ever get done? I
• 2:34:14
  Speaker 2: love that series? Yeah?
• 2:34:16
  Speaker 3: I know we'll never do Game of Thrones either, because
• 2:34:19
  Speaker 3: he'll never finish it.
• 2:34:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I particularly have a lot of love for the
• 2:34:25
  Speaker 2: slow regard of Silent Things, which is like a sideline too.
• 2:34:30
  Speaker 2: Did you read that seth?
• 2:34:31
  Speaker 4: Oh?
• 2:34:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I loved it.
• 2:34:32
  Speaker 2: It was really good. I have never and can't think
• 2:34:36
  Speaker 2: of any other novel that only has one character. I
• 2:34:42
  Speaker 2: can't think of any except that one. Nothing, that's just
• 2:34:47
  Speaker 2: I was blown away by that. And you know, Ari's
• 2:34:51
  Speaker 2: weird and has a bizarre way of looking at things,
• 2:34:54
  Speaker 2: and it's just really fun.
• 2:34:56
  Speaker 3: I'll have to do a reread on that. I've been
• 2:34:58
  Speaker 3: waiting for his next book to come out before I
• 2:34:59
  Speaker 3: go back and reread this stuff. But it's been such
• 2:35:02
  Speaker 3: a long time that i've I've forgotten.
• 2:35:04
  Speaker 2: I have a copy. I lent it to Julia along
• 2:35:07
  Speaker 2: with Eye of the World. She took my copy of
• 2:35:09
  Speaker 2: Eye of the World and then listened to the audiobook. Okay,
• 2:35:12
  Speaker 2: well whatever, I'm just glad you're into it. Is she uh,
• 2:35:17
  Speaker 2: is it the one that's all marked up? Yeah? She
• 2:35:20
  Speaker 2: said it was partly marked up because I had had
• 2:35:23
  Speaker 2: two copies and I think I picked up the wrong
• 2:35:25
  Speaker 2: one for like a week, and I was just like, whatever,
• 2:35:28
  Speaker 2: it's fine, that's right. I also buy my paperbacks used guys,
• 2:35:33
  Speaker 2: so I you know, there are two or three dollars
• 2:35:36
  Speaker 2: for a used paperback, and I just don't worry too
• 2:35:39
  Speaker 2: much about it.
• 2:35:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah, the Eye of the world goes away.
• 2:35:42
  Speaker 2: I just by the world. People take it, it vanishes.
• 2:35:46
  Speaker 2: I don't care. It's fine.
• 2:35:49
  Speaker 3: Whenever I see us bookstore, I'll always check for a
• 2:35:52
  Speaker 3: Wheel of Time book always and I buy them. The
• 2:36:08
  Speaker 3: other thing that's coming up that I'm really getting excited
• 2:36:10
  Speaker 3: for is this D and D session with some of
• 2:36:12
  Speaker 3: the Chosen.
• 2:36:13
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that is pretty exciting. And that's a project
• 2:36:16
  Speaker 2: that I'm not really involved in it at all, but
• 2:36:18
  Speaker 2: it's been really fun to hear about it.
• 2:36:21
  Speaker 3: It's going to be run The lower Master is going
• 2:36:23
  Speaker 3: to be Morgantini, who came and visited us. Yeah, we
• 2:36:27
  Speaker 3: got and we hung out with them that one night,
• 2:36:29
  Speaker 3: so that was pretty fun.
• 2:36:30
  Speaker 2: Some beers and tacos.
• 2:36:31
  Speaker 3: Aradia, who you all know and love, is going to
• 2:36:34
  Speaker 3: be on there. I think she's playing Dwarf, and Christine's
• 2:36:42
  Speaker 3: going to be playing in high Elf, and then Fate
• 2:36:46
  Speaker 3: is going hasn't finished his character sheet yet, and I'm doing.
• 2:36:50
  Speaker 2: A forest warrior human human.
• 2:36:55
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's sort of an ideal type, you know, a
• 2:36:58
  Speaker 3: laan Aeel combo cool character. And this is all done
• 2:37:04
  Speaker 3: in Lord of the Rings, so it's in the time
• 2:37:07
  Speaker 3: between the Hobbit and Fellowship so it's between those like
• 2:37:12
  Speaker 3: it's in that like a nine year period of time. Cool,
• 2:37:16
  Speaker 3: and we've given him some backstory and you know, I'm
• 2:37:18
  Speaker 3: excited to see what he's gonna do. We did a
• 2:37:20
  Speaker 3: practice session just with like pre made characters a while
• 2:37:25
  Speaker 3: back and that was a lot of fun, and I
• 2:37:27
  Speaker 3: did a really rough cut. We got about two quality
• 2:37:30
  Speaker 3: hours of us just hanging out and playing games, and
• 2:37:33
  Speaker 3: it sounded like a blast youse.
• 2:37:35
  Speaker 2: Like D and D and tabletop podcasts type things have
• 2:37:39
  Speaker 2: are pretty darn popular. There are some like really really
• 2:37:42
  Speaker 2: big ones out there. There's a ton of people, a
• 2:37:46
  Speaker 2: lot of us nerrits have grown up and we're still
• 2:37:49
  Speaker 2: into it.
• 2:37:50
  Speaker 3: So yeah, and I started listening to glass Cannon just
• 2:37:53
  Speaker 3: to get an idea of what a D and D
• 2:37:56
  Speaker 3: podcast sounds like. Yeah, and also just to help me
• 2:37:59
  Speaker 3: pick up the like the skills and the various.
• 2:38:03
  Speaker 2: Guys on glass Canon are really good.
• 2:38:04
  Speaker 3: They're fun, and I'm just enjoying it as a podcast.
• 2:38:07
  Speaker 3: Like I've seen now why they're a popular genre.
• 2:38:10
  Speaker 2: It's fun.
• 2:38:11
  Speaker 3: You get to play D and D without doing any
• 2:38:13
  Speaker 3: of the work, you know, and you're listen, you know,
• 2:38:16
  Speaker 3: to people who know what they're doing. And tap the
• 2:38:19
  Speaker 3: language down and are good friends and all that kind
• 2:38:21
  Speaker 3: of stuff.
• 2:38:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think they threw like some cool music in there.
• 2:38:24
  Speaker 2: I listened to an episode or two when one of
• 2:38:28
  Speaker 2: the shows in Morgantini came down from Washington and visited
• 2:38:31
  Speaker 2: us in Portland. Who's going to a Glass Canon meetups?
• 2:38:34
  Speaker 2: That's how I heard about it, So I went and
• 2:38:36
  Speaker 2: listened to it. They're good, yeah, and very popular.
• 2:38:42
  Speaker 3: I'm super excited because having met two of the five
• 2:38:47
  Speaker 3: people who are doing it, and so those three of
• 2:38:49
  Speaker 3: us have met and it's yeah, we've hung out in
• 2:38:52
  Speaker 3: this discord channel forever, so there's a good chemistry there.
• 2:38:55
  Speaker 2: Where is Christina? Isn't she in the Midwest somewhere? Why
• 2:38:58
  Speaker 2: am I thinking Midwest? I agree with you too far
• 2:39:01
  Speaker 2: to just meet up.
• 2:39:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, no, there's definitely no no way she can get down.
• 2:39:05
  Speaker 3: I have no idea where Fate is. And both Fate
• 2:39:09
  Speaker 3: and Morgantini are experienced D and D players, So Morgantini
• 2:39:15
  Speaker 3: knows what he's doing setting this up, and he's done
• 2:39:17
  Speaker 3: a lot of work getting it going.
• 2:39:19
  Speaker 2: That's awesome.
• 2:39:19
  Speaker 3: And Fate, you know, he'll be a good, good support character.
• 2:39:22
  Speaker 3: And then sort of me Christini and a Radio are
• 2:39:25
  Speaker 3: just winging it and learning as much as we can
• 2:39:27
  Speaker 3: because this is new for us.
• 2:39:28
  Speaker 2: It'll be fine. And like a lot of this stuff
• 2:39:32
  Speaker 2: we've said about lots spoilers that like, I think that
• 2:39:36
  Speaker 2: it sounds good a lot of the time, you know,
• 2:39:39
  Speaker 2: recording equipment and space and everything, but also just like
• 2:39:42
  Speaker 2: that we're already comfortable with each other. We know each
• 2:39:45
  Speaker 2: other m hm. You can joke and stuff where it
• 2:39:48
  Speaker 2: would be really difficult to do that with strangers. So
• 2:39:50
  Speaker 2: it's like, it's really good that this is like a
• 2:39:52
  Speaker 2: group of people that hang out all the time anyway. Right.
• 2:39:55
  Speaker 3: We don't really have concrete plans to release it as
• 2:39:58
  Speaker 3: a podcast at this point, but it's definitely a possibility
• 2:40:02
  Speaker 3: and we're planning. We're sort of planning for it without.
• 2:40:05
  Speaker 2: Committing to it, gotcha, gotcha.
• 2:40:08
  Speaker 3: You know, it's going to depend on schedules and how
• 2:40:13
  Speaker 3: much content we can produce and the quality of the content.
• 2:40:15
  Speaker 2: And it's hard to get five or six people that
• 2:40:18
  Speaker 2: live in different time zones together at any one time,
• 2:40:21
  Speaker 2: even in a text chat, you.
• 2:40:23
  Speaker 3: Know, right, And there's always you know, recording stuff and
• 2:40:27
  Speaker 3: just time and time investment and deciding if it's worth it.
• 2:40:30
  Speaker 3: But I really would love to be producing a D
• 2:40:36
  Speaker 3: and D podcast beside the Watt spoilers podcast, beside the
• 2:40:40
  Speaker 3: Missport spoilers.
• 2:40:41
  Speaker 2: And it's right up our alley. Obviously a lot of
• 2:40:44
  Speaker 2: people who already listened were already listened to WAT Spoilers
• 2:40:48
  Speaker 2: and will probably listen to Missport or probably into Tabletop two. These,
• 2:40:52
  Speaker 2: all of these things all kind.
• 2:40:53
  Speaker 3: Of good, right, right, There's some overlapping interest going on there, Yeah,
• 2:40:57
  Speaker 3: And honestly, I'm just excited to play D and D
• 2:40:59
  Speaker 3: for the first in my life with a group of people.
• 2:41:01
  Speaker 3: I played a few times in my teenage years with
• 2:41:04
  Speaker 3: a bunch of assholes, you know, and we never had
• 2:41:10
  Speaker 3: the patience to really get into it beyond like character
• 2:41:12
  Speaker 3: creation and stuff.
• 2:41:13
  Speaker 2: You need a good group of people, yeah, who can
• 2:41:17
  Speaker 2: work well with each other. I had a good group
• 2:41:21
  Speaker 2: in high school that I got together with, you know.
• 2:41:24
  Speaker 2: I feel like part of the reason that worked probably
• 2:41:26
  Speaker 2: is because we really didn't have a lot better to do,
• 2:41:29
  Speaker 2: as like, you know, especially before we were driving. But
• 2:41:32
  Speaker 2: even after we were driving, I played some campaigns that
• 2:41:35
  Speaker 2: were really fun. My issue I always lived in places
• 2:41:38
  Speaker 2: where to get anywhere you had to drive and so
• 2:41:41
  Speaker 2: before I could drive, it was very difficult to get
• 2:41:43
  Speaker 2: anywhere on a regular basis and commit to something like
• 2:41:45
  Speaker 2: a D and D group project because I could like
• 2:41:48
  Speaker 2: show up once, but then I'd have trouble showing up
• 2:41:51
  Speaker 2: again on a regular basis. Kelsey t bald One just said,
• 2:41:55
  Speaker 2: you guys created a pretty sweet community out of us
• 2:41:57
  Speaker 2: WAT fans, and thank you.
• 2:41:59
  Speaker 3: I will say over and over again that we just
• 2:42:02
  Speaker 3: tapped into an existing amazing community and you know, maybe
• 2:42:06
  Speaker 3: brought some people together, but yeah, you know, the community
• 2:42:09
  Speaker 3: was out there and we just were able to tap
• 2:42:12
  Speaker 3: into it. I was thinking about this today. I really
• 2:42:15
  Speaker 3: contribute a lot of the positivity on a network to
• 2:42:17
  Speaker 3: the prevalence of women.
• 2:42:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah we have. That still surprises me because when you
• 2:42:23
  Speaker 2: do a I don't know, fantasy sci fi stuff that
• 2:42:26
  Speaker 2: I guess at least the stereotype is that it's like
• 2:42:29
  Speaker 2: it's all men or like ninety percent, you know, but
• 2:42:32
  Speaker 2: it's a lot of the time our discord servers like
• 2:42:35
  Speaker 2: half and half it looks like, which is cool.
• 2:42:38
  Speaker 3: It's definitely a wheel of time thing.
• 2:42:40
  Speaker 2: It's not just the community, it's it's because of the
• 2:42:44
  Speaker 2: the way wheel of time.
• 2:42:45
  Speaker 3: I believe has always shown a bit of a balance
• 2:42:47
  Speaker 3: of the genders, and it's always attracted a more heavily
• 2:42:50
  Speaker 3: female audience than a lot of.
• 2:42:51
  Speaker 2: The other Yeah, I think the way we present it.
• 2:42:54
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a lot of violence porn out there in
• 2:42:57
  Speaker 3: fantasy novels that frankly is not very attractive.
• 2:43:00
  Speaker 2: To a lot of people. Yeah.
• 2:43:02
  Speaker 3: I think I find Game of Thrones to be a
• 2:43:04
  Speaker 3: lot of like revenge and corny. No it is, Yeah,
• 2:43:07
  Speaker 3: it's kind of violence porn.
• 2:43:10
  Speaker 2: I mean there's there's a lot of that. When I
• 2:43:12
  Speaker 2: first read it, I thought that was kind of cool
• 2:43:15
  Speaker 2: that I was like, oh, this is the first thing
• 2:43:17
  Speaker 2: I ever read that's just like straight up incest, murder, torture.
• 2:43:21
  Speaker 2: It's just all it's just right there in front of you.
• 2:43:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's not implied, it's just like that's what's
• 2:43:26
  Speaker 3: on the page.
• 2:43:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And that was fantastic and fairly groundbreaking at
• 2:43:30
  Speaker 2: the time, but then it just got copied into the ground. Sure.
• 2:43:35
  Speaker 2: I've read a lot of other novels like that now.
• 2:43:39
  Speaker 2: I'm thinking of like one that was called, like I
• 2:43:41
  Speaker 2: want to say it was like called Prince of Thorns.
• 2:43:44
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, is that it? That was like brutal.
• 2:43:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a lot of brutal stuff out there, and
• 2:43:50
  Speaker 3: that's just not what I enjoy reading. I don't feel
• 2:43:53
  Speaker 3: like there's any subtlety to it.
• 2:43:55
  Speaker 2: No, there isn't. But you know, it has its appeal,
• 2:43:58
  Speaker 2: like what I mean to me anyway, it has its
• 2:44:01
  Speaker 2: appeal like just wild, endless action. Basically, it's is cool
• 2:44:07
  Speaker 2: in its own right, but it's not not as sustainable
• 2:44:10
  Speaker 2: as something like Wheel of Time as far as like
• 2:44:15
  Speaker 2: maintaining interest. Yeah, and once you read your you know,
• 2:44:20
  Speaker 2: crazy battle scene, violence porn or whatever, like, are you
• 2:44:23
  Speaker 2: really going to read that again? Like you read it
• 2:44:26
  Speaker 2: and you got to it to its conclusion, and it's
• 2:44:28
  Speaker 2: like no longer really.
• 2:44:29
  Speaker 3: Interesting, which is totally different than domais Wells because Domi
• 2:44:33
  Speaker 3: as Wells. Although it is violent and we all think
• 2:44:36
  Speaker 3: of the you know, Ahaman kill as just like this
• 2:44:38
  Speaker 3: seminal moment there, it's actually a lot of it is
• 2:44:43
  Speaker 3: in Rand's head and a lot of it is you know,
• 2:44:47
  Speaker 3: seen from a distance, and a lot of this there's
• 2:44:50
  Speaker 3: more going on there than just the meat grinder.
• 2:44:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, a lot more. And you know, I think that's
• 2:44:56
  Speaker 2: also a scene that we all talk about in the
• 2:44:59
  Speaker 2: Wheel of Time a lot the ballot do my Wells
• 2:45:03
  Speaker 2: because that it has that violence porn element. Sure, kind
• 2:45:08
  Speaker 2: of overusing this phrase, but it has that element to it,
• 2:45:10
  Speaker 2: and Wheel of Time really doesn't have a lot of that.
• 2:45:13
  Speaker 2: It is a rare scene, yeah, where that happens, Like
• 2:45:17
  Speaker 2: Draper Chardan is rarely describing piles of bodies. But I
• 2:45:22
  Speaker 2: feel like that makes it stand out all that much
• 2:45:24
  Speaker 2: more that you know, you're six basically halfway through the series,
• 2:45:27
  Speaker 2: six books in before you get this, you know, incredible
• 2:45:30
  Speaker 2: violent conclusion, and then the next time you really have
• 2:45:32
  Speaker 2: violence like that is the final battle. Yeah, at least
• 2:45:36
  Speaker 2: in so much especially human versus human. Like we see
• 2:45:40
  Speaker 2: a lot of dead trollocks.
• 2:45:42
  Speaker 3: Right, but they're basically automatons that we can you know,
• 2:45:45
  Speaker 3: I'm sorry, Narg, but for the most part, we do
• 2:45:49
  Speaker 3: just don't care about trulucks.
• 2:45:51
  Speaker 2: What are they talking about in Dark Friends Social before
• 2:45:54
  Speaker 2: a new show called Cooking with nar House questions, Right,
• 2:45:58
  Speaker 2: it's a ross of what the roast shut up, don't
• 2:46:02
  Speaker 2: ask questions.
• 2:46:05
  Speaker 3: I also like cast Iron Cooking with mister Sluhan.
• 2:46:12
  Speaker 2: Using the.
• 2:46:14
  Speaker 3: Violence as a punctuation point or as a crescendo means
• 2:46:18
  Speaker 3: that do my as wells is an incredibly memorable point
• 2:46:22
  Speaker 3: in the series, whereas something like Game of Thrones, I
• 2:46:24
  Speaker 3: mean maybe the Red Wedding, Like I can't really point
• 2:46:27
  Speaker 3: to like one instance of violence that I'm like that
• 2:46:31
  Speaker 3: was shocking more than anything else that was.
• 2:46:34
  Speaker 2: There's tons and tons of violence like that. But I mean,
• 2:46:36
  Speaker 2: the Red Wedding is remarkable, you know because several main
• 2:46:39
  Speaker 2: characters die, right, Yeah, And.
• 2:46:41
  Speaker 3: I guess that, you know, you could compare the Last
• 2:46:43
  Speaker 3: Battle to that, but that's the end of the series.
• 2:46:45
  Speaker 2: So even still, the Last Battle, like there's a bunch
• 2:46:50
  Speaker 2: of Matt's perspective where he's like controlling events, Like there's
• 2:46:55
  Speaker 2: like viewing the battle from above through the horizontal gateways.
• 2:47:00
  Speaker 3: It's much more game like than battle like in some places.
• 2:47:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, well there's plenty of battle scenes, but
• 2:47:08
  Speaker 2: I mean the Last Battle is like what hundreds of
• 2:47:10
  Speaker 2: pages long, right right.
• 2:47:11
  Speaker 3: Right, And I like what the Last Battle does where
• 2:47:15
  Speaker 3: it sort of takes you in and out of the
• 2:47:17
  Speaker 3: violence and how there's like there's calm spots in a
• 2:47:20
  Speaker 3: battle in war and you know, spots where people are
• 2:47:23
  Speaker 3: planning and spots where like you almost can't even tell.
• 2:47:26
  Speaker 2: A war is going on.
• 2:47:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but then there's this extreme violence going on elsewhere,
• 2:47:30
  Speaker 3: and it's sort of it's a more complete view of
• 2:47:33
  Speaker 3: the world during a war, whereas Game of Thrones is
• 2:47:36
  Speaker 3: always just feels like and here's.
• 2:47:38
  Speaker 2: The battle centered around. Yeah.
• 2:47:41
  Speaker 3: I also wanted to say, he just like how awesome
• 2:47:45
  Speaker 3: the episodes were that the girls did.
• 2:47:49
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, those did really well. We noticed that they
• 2:47:52
  Speaker 2: got more downloads than usual. I think it's fantastic that
• 2:47:57
  Speaker 2: they did that, and I definitely want them to do more. Yeah,
• 2:48:03
  Speaker 2: I think they're into it. But yeah, that was really fun.
• 2:48:08
  Speaker 2: I'm glad we can do that with our podcasts me too.
• 2:48:12
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there's nothing more fun than like building something that's
• 2:48:16
  Speaker 3: moving and handing the keys over to somebody else and
• 2:48:18
  Speaker 3: watch it go.
• 2:48:22
  Speaker 2: They did a really good job. I did a surprisingly
• 2:48:24
  Speaker 2: stutter free for two people. Well, I mean, neither of
• 2:48:27
  Speaker 2: them were doing it for the first time, I guess
• 2:48:28
  Speaker 2: because they had both done episodes with us before they
• 2:48:30
  Speaker 2: did one together.
• 2:48:31
  Speaker 3: Sure, but this is the first time where they were
• 2:48:34
  Speaker 3: driving the conversation and steering it, and you know, before
• 2:48:37
  Speaker 3: it was you and I talking and they were also
• 2:48:41
  Speaker 3: adding their feedback.
• 2:48:42
  Speaker 2: Where is this more?
• 2:48:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, whereas just here, they had their own subjects. Anyway,
• 2:48:48
  Speaker 3: the they did a fantastic job is all I'm saying
• 2:48:51
  Speaker 3: is like that was really cool to see and fun
• 2:48:54
  Speaker 3: to edit and fun to listen to.
• 2:48:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it was. I think it was fun to just
• 2:48:58
  Speaker 2: hang out here and be one of the listeners.
• 2:49:03
  Speaker 3: Also, I want to shout out to John because his
• 2:49:06
  Speaker 3: editing work, as always, is fantastic.
• 2:49:08
  Speaker 2: John Horrell, you're the man. Thank you so much. But yeah,
• 2:49:12
  Speaker 2: that guy helps us a ton. We wouldn't have the
• 2:49:15
  Speaker 2: time to do what we do if he didn't put
• 2:49:18
  Speaker 2: in a ton of work for us.
• 2:49:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't think the quality would be as good either.
• 2:49:23
  Speaker 3: You know, he's he knows what he's doing around the audio.
• 2:49:26
  Speaker 3: You know, he's able to edit without like making it
• 2:49:28
  Speaker 3: sound bad.
• 2:49:29
  Speaker 2: He is a professional. Yeah, he's a professional. This is
• 2:49:33
  Speaker 2: really Other podcasters pay like one hundred bucks an episode
• 2:49:36
  Speaker 2: to do stuff like have this stuff like this done? Yeah,
• 2:49:40
  Speaker 2: and John just that's just like no, I like it.
• 2:49:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, thanks for let me do it. And we keep
• 2:49:44
  Speaker 3: like like what really sure?
• 2:49:47
  Speaker 2: Are you sure? Okay?
• 2:49:50
  Speaker 3: Oh, So I asked for questions, just things to talk about,
• 2:49:53
  Speaker 3: and I got some good ones. I want to know
• 2:49:55
  Speaker 3: if you wanted to maybe go through those. Yeah, just basically,
• 2:49:59
  Speaker 3: folks on discord, we asked if you had anything you
• 2:50:01
  Speaker 3: wanted us to talk about, and it's got a fairly
• 2:50:04
  Speaker 3: long list of things, some of which are.
• 2:50:06
  Speaker 2: Kind of silly.
• 2:50:06
  Speaker 3: So that's perfect. So Block on the New Kid asks
• 2:50:11
  Speaker 3: what are you most looking forward to in The Dragon
• 2:50:13
  Speaker 3: Reborn and is there anything you guys are dreading.
• 2:50:17
  Speaker 2: Dreading as far as talking about. Yeah, no, I wouldn't
• 2:50:21
  Speaker 2: say there's anything I'm dreading. I'm interested in how this
• 2:50:26
  Speaker 2: isn't Dragon Reborn specific, but I'm interested in how some
• 2:50:29
  Speaker 2: scenes will go in the future, like Elaine's seven page
• 2:50:33
  Speaker 2: bath scene. What do we do for that? You know,
• 2:50:38
  Speaker 2: I think there's gonna be funny to talk about.
• 2:50:41
  Speaker 3: I'm really excited about getting into tell Iran Riodd and
• 2:50:45
  Speaker 3: like I just so, I've just reread The Dragon Reborn
• 2:50:48
  Speaker 3: and it is heavy on the Teleron Riod stuff. I mean,
• 2:50:52
  Speaker 3: Parent's in there, Rand's in there, a GWayne is in there,
• 2:50:56
  Speaker 3: they get the stone ring, Tearangreol from Very and so stuff. Yeah,
• 2:51:02
  Speaker 3: I'm really excited to get into how Teleron Riad works
• 2:51:07
  Speaker 3: and it becomes a sort of parallel communication network for them,
• 2:51:11
  Speaker 3: which is just fantastic.
• 2:51:13
  Speaker 2: How does Dragon Reborn end? What is the last? Because
• 2:51:17
  Speaker 2: for me, I know, I've heard a lot of other
• 2:51:19
  Speaker 2: fans say this themselves, that like the story of the
• 2:51:24
  Speaker 2: Wheel of Time runs together in my head and I
• 2:51:26
  Speaker 2: often forget where one book ends and the other begins.
• 2:51:28
  Speaker 2: M m, well, that's why I just reread The Dragon Reborn,
• 2:51:31
  Speaker 2: so that gave me a good idea of what it
• 2:51:33
  Speaker 2: spans from beginning to end, you know.
• 2:51:37
  Speaker 3: But I'm actually really excited about how it expands the
• 2:51:41
  Speaker 3: point of views. It's the first time where we are
• 2:51:44
  Speaker 3: not primarily in Rand's head and lots of.
• 2:51:47
  Speaker 2: Land fair stuff too. Yeah, so much.
• 2:51:51
  Speaker 3: I'm really excited to get into this one because you know,
• 2:51:54
  Speaker 3: if I said that, like the Great Hunt is where
• 2:51:56
  Speaker 3: the story gets its feet, the Dragon Reborn is where
• 2:52:00
  Speaker 3: it starts to run. And then I feel like it
• 2:52:02
  Speaker 3: really hits its stride with the Shadow Rising, that to me,
• 2:52:06
  Speaker 3: I think is the best book in the series. Yeah,
• 2:52:10
  Speaker 3: and then spend some time doing some setup and then
• 2:52:12
  Speaker 3: you've got this great Lord of Chaos and do my
• 2:52:15
  Speaker 3: as wells for book six, which is fantastic. Book five
• 2:52:18
  Speaker 3: can be a little slow for me at times, and
• 2:52:21
  Speaker 3: then I feel like Book seven is a huge turning
• 2:52:24
  Speaker 3: point with the crossing of the streams. To me, that's
• 2:52:27
  Speaker 3: like a seminal pivot point in the series.
• 2:52:30
  Speaker 2: I'm nodding.
• 2:52:31
  Speaker 3: The relationship between random and dark changes and becomes a
• 2:52:35
  Speaker 3: little more symbiotic. And then I just feel like it's
• 2:52:38
  Speaker 3: a slow build up until sort of a comp you know,
• 2:52:41
  Speaker 3: get all the characters into place and have them do
• 2:52:44
  Speaker 3: what they need to do for the last battle.
• 2:52:48
  Speaker 2: I'm chuckling at the next question, when are you all
• 2:52:51
  Speaker 2: going to consult the gloss rays for pronunciation guides? Yeah?
• 2:52:54
  Speaker 3: I put that in there because I wanted to say never.
• 2:52:56
  Speaker 3: I am never going to consult the pronunciation guys. I
• 2:52:59
  Speaker 3: listened to the audiobook. I do what I I'll listen
• 2:53:01
  Speaker 3: to you guys correct me, but uh, I'm gonna say how.
• 2:53:04
  Speaker 2: I say it. Deal with it.
• 2:53:05
  Speaker 5: Ha.
• 2:53:07
  Speaker 2: I'm working on a Gwaynegwayne, a GWayne Egwayne and not agweenee.
• 2:53:15
  Speaker 3: I was listening to the audiobook for The Dragon Reborn. Man,
• 2:53:20
  Speaker 3: there's so many new terms in The Dragon Reborn that
• 2:53:23
  Speaker 3: they did not have the pronunciation down for in the audiobook.
• 2:53:27
  Speaker 2: So they're wrong sometimes in the wrong.
• 2:53:29
  Speaker 3: A ton in the audio books like Teleron Riod was
• 2:53:33
  Speaker 3: totally different. I couldn't even tell you how they pronounced
• 2:53:36
  Speaker 3: them because I'd hear them and be like, what word
• 2:53:38
  Speaker 3: is that? And I'd be like, Oh, that's the new
• 2:53:41
  Speaker 3: that's a new word for them.
• 2:53:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, and they're not. They haven't nailed down how
• 2:53:46
  Speaker 2: they're going to pronounce it.
• 2:53:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there's definitely different ways to pronounce these words if
• 2:53:50
  Speaker 3: you're going by the audio books, because they change.
• 2:53:53
  Speaker 2: We're pretty good. I'll let you be the judge of them.
• 2:53:57
  Speaker 2: Let everyone else be the judge of that. I think
• 2:53:59
  Speaker 2: we're pretty good too.
• 2:54:00
  Speaker 3: Some people are definitely bothered by our pronunciations because they
• 2:54:03
  Speaker 3: don't agree with what they think, but you know that's
• 2:54:05
  Speaker 3: we We've picked something and we're sticking with it for
• 2:54:08
  Speaker 3: the most part. Yeah, we're trying not to vary it
• 2:54:11
  Speaker 3: up too much. He may not agree with us, but
• 2:54:14
  Speaker 3: you know, go back to what Brandon Sanderson said, is like,
• 2:54:18
  Speaker 3: he doesn't really care how you pronounce the names. It's
• 2:54:21
  Speaker 3: a book medium.
• 2:54:23
  Speaker 2: It's never really meant to it was. It wasn't intended
• 2:54:27
  Speaker 2: for this kind of format.
• 2:54:29
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, and I'm really excited for post healing Matt
• 2:54:33
  Speaker 3: and the Night the Lucky Night is great.
• 2:54:38
  Speaker 2: But post healing Matt in general, just like through the
• 2:54:40
  Speaker 2: rest of the series will be really fun.
• 2:54:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And I feel like I picked up on a
• 2:54:45
  Speaker 3: few things that I on this read through that I
• 2:54:47
  Speaker 3: hadn't picked up before.
• 2:54:50
  Speaker 2: Beats up, go In and Gallid uh huh, that'll be fun.
• 2:54:55
  Speaker 3: And I have been super obsessed with a Glad, a
• 2:54:59
  Speaker 3: Gwayn and Gollad together because so far it seems like
• 2:55:03
  Speaker 3: they're still destined to be together, Like all through the
• 2:55:05
  Speaker 3: Dragon Reborn they seem to be destined to be together. Hm,
• 2:55:09
  Speaker 3: I cannot There's one point where Elaine sits down and says, oh,
• 2:55:15
  Speaker 3: didn't you realize Gowin is totally into you?
• 2:55:18
  Speaker 2: Oh? Really?
• 2:55:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And that's the first time that Agwayne considers him.
• 2:55:24
  Speaker 3: I think that's really when her mind changes. She like
• 2:55:28
  Speaker 3: considers him as a potential for the first time. But yeah,
• 2:55:32
  Speaker 3: it's a definite changeover.
• 2:55:34
  Speaker 2: At that point.
• 2:55:36
  Speaker 3: So there's already just having having listened to it again,
• 2:55:38
  Speaker 3: I've got like a thousand things my mind's going on,
• 2:55:40
  Speaker 3: like between the Misborn stuff and the Dragon Reborn, because
• 2:55:45
  Speaker 3: I feel like we, you know, we've been on the
• 2:55:46
  Speaker 3: Great Hunt for a while and we've sort of been
• 2:55:48
  Speaker 3: getting to the end of that. But now with this
• 2:55:50
  Speaker 3: like new this new book and the new series and
• 2:55:53
  Speaker 3: the D and D stuff, I am absolutely.
• 2:55:56
  Speaker 2: On like an adrenaline rush.
• 2:55:58
  Speaker 3: Of content and I am stoked to get going on
• 2:56:02
  Speaker 3: all this stuff.
• 2:56:03
  Speaker 2: Awesome me too, looking at the next.
• 2:56:05
  Speaker 3: Week, not to mention, we've got the Dragon Jordan Con
• 2:56:08
  Speaker 3: coming up in eleven days.
• 2:56:11
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, geez, I can't believe we're going to be
• 2:56:15
  Speaker 2: on a plane in a week and a half.
• 2:56:17
  Speaker 3: Hoping we're going to start recording The Dragon Reborn. But
• 2:56:21
  Speaker 3: by the time this comes out, the next episode hopefully
• 2:56:24
  Speaker 3: will be us live from Jordan Con. So that's that
• 2:56:27
  Speaker 3: should be the next episode, you guys here, So I'm
• 2:56:30
  Speaker 3: excited about it.
• 2:56:31
  Speaker 2: We don't exactly know what we're going to be doing.
• 2:56:33
  Speaker 2: It's a little bit.
• 2:56:34
  Speaker 3: Of get there and see, yeah, simply because we really
• 2:56:38
  Speaker 3: don't know what the environment's going to be like, we
• 2:56:40
  Speaker 3: don't know who we're going to get a chance to
• 2:56:41
  Speaker 3: talk to. We definitely want to have a meet up
• 2:56:45
  Speaker 3: at a bar somewhere, uh totally probably the night of
• 2:56:49
  Speaker 3: the twentieth, but that's going to be probably announced on
• 2:56:54
  Speaker 3: discord As to where we're going to meet up just
• 2:56:57
  Speaker 3: like that day.
• 2:56:58
  Speaker 2: It's just going to be so weird to be in
• 2:57:01
  Speaker 2: a room full of people who are into the wheel
• 2:57:03
  Speaker 2: of time. That doesn't that doesn't happen.
• 2:57:06
  Speaker 3: No, you know, well, I guess except when we got
• 2:57:10
  Speaker 3: like Kelsey a radiover and then there's like three of us,
• 2:57:13
  Speaker 3: Well then there was Three's not as close as I
• 2:57:16
  Speaker 3: can get to a room full. We couldn't get down
• 2:57:19
  Speaker 3: there if you guys hadn't funded it. Which, by the way,
• 2:57:22
  Speaker 3: thank you so much to all the patrons who are
• 2:57:25
  Speaker 3: sending us to Jordan Conn.
• 2:57:26
  Speaker 2: Thank you patrons for buying those plane tickets. It's important
• 2:57:30
  Speaker 2: to point.
• 2:57:31
  Speaker 3: Out definitely that's where we've taken the last two months
• 2:57:33
  Speaker 3: of donations, and it's just been fantastic that we're going
• 2:57:37
  Speaker 3: to be able to do this because I don't think
• 2:57:39
  Speaker 3: we could have otherwise.
• 2:57:41
  Speaker 2: No, I don't think we would have made it. It's
• 2:57:44
  Speaker 2: a big expense, you know. A couple thousand bucks is
• 2:57:48
  Speaker 2: uh breaks the bank for.
• 2:57:49
  Speaker 3: Us, and we're excited about next month. That'll pay for
• 2:57:54
  Speaker 3: the hotel rooms. Yeah, and then we'll have a little.
• 2:57:57
  Speaker 2: Bit left over too. True.
• 2:58:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we did get we well, we got an offer
• 2:58:02
  Speaker 3: for someone who wanted to do a bit of an ad.
• 2:58:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a tattoo shop. I don't know the details,
• 2:58:08
  Speaker 2: but he's the guy who did Jeff's Jeff Petree Petrees
• 2:58:11
  Speaker 2: who's on here all the time. You guys have seen it,
• 2:58:14
  Speaker 2: ve finished it.
• 2:58:16
  Speaker 3: He finished it, and there's a video on Instagram that
• 2:58:19
  Speaker 3: is fantastic.
• 2:58:21
  Speaker 2: And I want to.
• 2:58:22
  Speaker 3: Get him on here and have him do a little
• 2:58:24
  Speaker 3: interview about the process and then and talk to him
• 2:58:27
  Speaker 3: about it and talk about how awesome that tattoo is
• 2:58:31
  Speaker 3: and how because the the tattoo artists you said were
• 2:58:33
  Speaker 3: fans of the series itself, so there's no better place
• 2:58:38
  Speaker 3: to get a Wheel of Time tattoo than.
• 2:58:40
  Speaker 2: Been talking to him for a while. And they're in Georgia,
• 2:58:43
  Speaker 2: so they're near the con. Yeah, I think they're based
• 2:58:45
  Speaker 2: at a Savannah the shop.
• 2:58:47
  Speaker 3: What's the name of the shop.
• 2:58:49
  Speaker 2: I believe it's Red Ocean Tattoo. Let me look that up.
• 2:58:51
  Speaker 2: Really quiet, he's good.
• 2:58:53
  Speaker 3: I wonder if he's close enough to visit from the
• 2:58:56
  Speaker 3: con because he's in the he's in the same state.
• 2:58:59
  Speaker 2: I should ask him, I felt there.
• 2:59:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that would actually be because he could probably come in,
• 2:59:03
  Speaker 3: just drive in.
• 2:59:04
  Speaker 2: I don't know Georgia very well. I'm looking at it.
• 2:59:07
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, Savannah's on the coast. Atlanta's like North Georgia.
• 2:59:12
  Speaker 2: I don't know the state at all. The red dots Savannah,
• 2:59:15
  Speaker 2: you can see Atlanta and like.
• 2:59:17
  Speaker 3: The Oh yeah that is wow. George is bigger than
• 2:59:21
  Speaker 3: I thought it was.
• 2:59:22
  Speaker 2: It's a pretty big state. I didn't realize it fixed
• 2:59:24
  Speaker 2: ended up that far, DT says. Google says, it's three
• 2:59:28
  Speaker 2: hours and forty eight minutes driving from the hotel. You know,
• 2:59:31
  Speaker 2: if he's as if he's a Wheel of Time fan,
• 2:59:33
  Speaker 2: he might be making maybe either way.
• 2:59:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that's that's not unreasonable. I can make
• 2:59:38
  Speaker 3: that drive in a in a morning to go to
• 2:59:40
  Speaker 3: the the.
• 2:59:41
  Speaker 2: Car all a message about it to see if they'll
• 2:59:43
  Speaker 2: be there, because that would be cool to talk to.
• 2:59:45
  Speaker 3: Him, that would be yeah him.
• 2:59:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it'll be cool to We can just get small
• 2:59:51
  Speaker 2: things like that and just piece together a bunch of
• 2:59:54
  Speaker 2: short interviews. Yeah.
• 2:59:56
  Speaker 3: Encourage people who were at the con who wanted a
• 2:59:58
  Speaker 3: Wheel of Time tattoo to make the drive.
• 3:00:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, to interview me while getting tatto while getting a
• 3:00:06
  Speaker 2: Wheel of Time tattoo.
• 3:00:09
  Speaker 3: That would be really funny. Put the microphone on you
• 3:00:12
  Speaker 3: for all the little like exclamations of pain.
• 3:00:16
  Speaker 2: You gotta do the whole interview early, because I'll tell you,
• 3:00:18
  Speaker 2: after about an hour and a half of getting tattooed,
• 3:00:21
  Speaker 2: I pretty much shut down, no longer interested in conversation.
• 3:00:25
  Speaker 2: I just quietly breathe. Yeah, I imagine you'd be in
• 3:00:30
  Speaker 2: a lot of pain. I've sat for probably four hours.
• 3:00:37
  Speaker 2: I don't think I've ever sat longer than that. Maybe
• 3:00:39
  Speaker 2: a little, but not much.
• 3:00:42
  Speaker 3: I'm putting a link into the Instagram video of the tattoo.
• 3:00:46
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that's really cool. There's no sound in this,
• 3:00:48
  Speaker 2: is there? Oh yeah there is? Yep, there's sound in this, Okay.
• 3:00:54
  Speaker 3: But you can see. It's some of the fantastic fan
• 3:00:56
  Speaker 3: art I've seen put together in a really unique and
• 3:00:59
  Speaker 3: interesting way, and it wraps all the way around.
• 3:01:02
  Speaker 2: I like that he has ishmail on the back.
• 3:01:04
  Speaker 3: The Ishmail is fantastic. I think the Moraine also is
• 3:01:08
  Speaker 3: really really good loyal mm hmm. And then it's got
• 3:01:12
  Speaker 3: the sort of the three boys on top of each other.
• 3:01:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like so much color. You know. I'm trying
• 3:01:17
  Speaker 2: to think of how to explain the style, like very
• 3:01:20
  Speaker 2: little outline, and it's a full. It's really a full sleeve.
• 3:01:25
  Speaker 3: From wrist to shoulder, every inch all the way around.
• 3:01:28
  Speaker 2: Like my sleeve is like a collection of things, and
• 3:01:31
  Speaker 2: it is themed, but it's well, it's all outlines. My
• 3:01:34
  Speaker 2: sleeve is all outlines, and.
• 3:01:36
  Speaker 3: Yours was done in a bunch of different pieces. His
• 3:01:38
  Speaker 3: was conceived as a single sleeve from start to finish.
• 3:01:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, super cool. But you can see why we're totally
• 3:01:44
  Speaker 2: willing to accept them as sponsors. Yeah, yeah, because that
• 3:01:48
  Speaker 2: work is incredible, as everyone in Discord is saying as
• 3:01:51
  Speaker 2: they watch the video, and like, if we're going to
• 3:01:53
  Speaker 2: advertise anything, I would love to advertise for tattoo shops
• 3:01:56
  Speaker 2: like sure, and like smaller stuff like that, that's cool
• 3:02:00
  Speaker 2: to do. I wouldn't be particularly excited about doing like,
• 3:02:05
  Speaker 2: you know, I don't know Postmates or whatever, you know,
• 3:02:09
  Speaker 2: depending on how much they're willing to pay me, I
• 3:02:11
  Speaker 2: will totally blow Postmates.
• 3:02:16
  Speaker 3: For the most part.
• 3:02:16
  Speaker 2: I'd prefer to do something like this exactly exactly. And
• 3:02:20
  Speaker 2: I'm right there with you, so maybe we should cut
• 3:02:26
  Speaker 2: that out.
• 3:02:27
  Speaker 3: But when when you hear us doing Postmates in a year,
• 3:02:30
  Speaker 3: remember this, it's not selling out, it's making money up.
• 3:02:34
  Speaker 2: Isn't that what work is exactly selling your time out.
• 3:02:38
  Speaker 3: I'm pretty soaked that we broke twenty thousand downloads this
• 3:02:41
  Speaker 3: past month.
• 3:02:41
  Speaker 2: That's true, guys. We broke twenty thousand downloads this month.
• 3:02:44
  Speaker 2: And by that I mean we got twenty thousand downloads
• 3:02:47
  Speaker 2: in thirty days, not twenty thousand downloads total, right, which
• 3:02:52
  Speaker 2: is a big mile marker for us.
• 3:02:55
  Speaker 3: That was something that early on when we were looking
• 3:02:58
  Speaker 3: at like what kind of size do we need to
• 3:03:01
  Speaker 3: be to really reach out to advertisers and start talking
• 3:03:04
  Speaker 3: to them. You know, it's been a year, so those
• 3:03:06
  Speaker 3: numbers have grown, But I always thought that twenty thousand
• 3:03:10
  Speaker 3: downloads in a month was going to be a significant.
• 3:03:12
  Speaker 2: Number for US. But a lot of our listeners are international,
• 3:03:15
  Speaker 2: which does not help us with the advertising stuff. No, Unfortunately,
• 3:03:19
  Speaker 2: advertisers mostly just want to talk to the folks in
• 3:03:21
  Speaker 2: the US. See patrons. There's like one hundred and thirty
• 3:03:26
  Speaker 2: around one hundred and thirty patrons if I think it's
• 3:03:29
  Speaker 2: was one hundred and thirty six the last time I looked. Thanks,
• 3:03:32
  Speaker 2: by the way, everyone in this room, because you're all donors, right, Yeah,
• 3:03:37
  Speaker 2: I know, you guys are fantastic. Let's go back to
• 3:03:51
  Speaker 2: the questions we had a few more after reading this,
• 3:03:56
  Speaker 2: did you expect to like any of the shan Chan?
• 3:03:59
  Speaker 2: And with the reread, does it affect how you feel
• 3:04:01
  Speaker 2: about them? Overall?
• 3:04:03
  Speaker 3: I do like the sean Chan. I like them a lot,
• 3:04:06
  Speaker 3: and I.
• 3:04:08
  Speaker 2: Like them because they're interesting though, because they're nice.
• 3:04:11
  Speaker 3: It's unlike they're good people. I like the Foresake and
• 3:04:14
  Speaker 3: a lot too, but that's not because they're good people.
• 3:04:18
  Speaker 2: Right, Like I love land Fear as a character, but
• 3:04:21
  Speaker 2: she's an awful person, right, And that's what I think
• 3:04:25
  Speaker 2: Stone Dog was getting at and saying basically, like, could
• 3:04:29
  Speaker 2: you like the shan Chan and like as characters? Of
• 3:04:31
  Speaker 2: course they're complex. Complex is the best way to put it. Like,
• 3:04:36
  Speaker 2: there's good and bad and they're it's a you know,
• 3:04:38
  Speaker 2: it's a culture of people. You can't say it's not
• 3:04:40
  Speaker 2: black or white.
• 3:04:41
  Speaker 3: And there's no doubt that in America we live with
• 3:04:45
  Speaker 3: a constant reminder of slavery and what that does to
• 3:04:49
  Speaker 3: a society. Yeah, we can address the individuals as decent
• 3:04:54
  Speaker 3: people in the society, even when the society is built
• 3:04:57
  Speaker 3: around a flawed or deeply placed inequality.
• 3:05:03
  Speaker 2: Right. We've had this conversation a little bit before, hesitant
• 3:05:07
  Speaker 2: to get into it too much, but there's like, you know, interesting,
• 3:05:11
  Speaker 2: I guess arguments are conversations that I see happening quite
• 3:05:14
  Speaker 2: a bit when people are discussing history, like specifically American history,
• 3:05:18
  Speaker 2: but also you know, Roman history, Greek history, whatever. Lots
• 3:05:22
  Speaker 2: of people have owned slaves over the time, and slave
• 3:05:24
  Speaker 2: trade has been many different types. There's many different variants
• 3:05:27
  Speaker 2: over history. But like it's difficult to when you look
• 3:05:32
  Speaker 2: back at something like this, and obviously the Seann chan
• 3:05:35
  Speaker 2: happened in a fictional fictional people in a fictional universe,
• 3:05:39
  Speaker 2: But like, can you them out of the context of
• 3:05:43
  Speaker 2: their time? Like, was George Washington a terrible human being?
• 3:05:48
  Speaker 2: Should we disregard other things that he did and said?
• 3:05:51
  Speaker 2: Because he owned many slaves? Should we should we do that?
• 3:05:55
  Speaker 2: Can we do? I don't know? You know, the answer
• 3:05:57
  Speaker 2: is I don't fucking.
• 3:05:58
  Speaker 3: Know, Like we can't. I think we have to put
• 3:06:01
  Speaker 3: them in their time and place, and we can say
• 3:06:03
  Speaker 3: that it was wrong for the society to be doing
• 3:06:06
  Speaker 3: that doesn't make the people who evolved in that society
• 3:06:11
  Speaker 3: automatically bad people. They didn't necessarily fight against the bad thing.
• 3:06:16
  Speaker 3: We cannot evaluate people outside of their time, you have
• 3:06:18
  Speaker 3: to understand somebody's context. I feel the same thing is
• 3:06:22
  Speaker 3: true for the Shawn Chin is you have to evaluate
• 3:06:24
  Speaker 3: them in the context of their society, and like something
• 3:06:28
  Speaker 3: someone like Llewellyn when she realizes the truth really changes
• 3:06:32
  Speaker 3: her behavior.
• 3:06:34
  Speaker 2: But what happens is when a shan Chan or a
• 3:06:37
  Speaker 2: shan Chan royalty, you know, bucks the system, they get
• 3:06:40
  Speaker 2: hung in a silk bag out of a window until
• 3:06:42
  Speaker 2: they starve to death. Like, you can't really take them
• 3:06:46
  Speaker 2: out of the context of their culture because I also
• 3:06:48
  Speaker 2: ask how much of a choice do they have and
• 3:06:51
  Speaker 2: so far as how much they participate in enslaving people.
• 3:06:54
  Speaker 3: And that comes back to the whole question of like
• 3:06:56
  Speaker 3: how do culture shift, how do you change cultural norms?
• 3:07:00
  Speaker 3: And what's a currently accepted practice in a culture? And
• 3:07:04
  Speaker 3: that's something that I think is a bigger.
• 3:07:06
  Speaker 2: Topic than the Wheel Time Spoilers podcast. Not qualified to
• 3:07:08
  Speaker 2: answer these questions. Please, don't anyone on the internet think
• 3:07:14
  Speaker 2: that we know what we're talking about, because we don't.
• 3:07:16
  Speaker 3: There was a great discussion about the testing, so I
• 3:07:20
  Speaker 3: think this was brought up when during a radio's comments
• 3:07:24
  Speaker 3: on how are young girls tested for soldam and how
• 3:07:30
  Speaker 3: are they tested for domine.
• 3:07:33
  Speaker 2: Right, we talked about this in the little bit we did,
• 3:07:36
  Speaker 2: but there was interesting new ideas that came forth. So
• 3:07:40
  Speaker 2: there's really two ways you could.
• 3:07:41
  Speaker 3: Test young girls for domine. You could either lock the
• 3:07:46
  Speaker 3: collar around their neck uh huh and see if it works,
• 3:07:49
  Speaker 3: or just walk them past a channeler and see if
• 3:07:53
  Speaker 3: the channeler senses their ability to channel.
• 3:07:58
  Speaker 2: When you do that, it's important to point out the
• 3:08:02
  Speaker 2: demani senses a girl with a spark, not with any
• 3:08:07
  Speaker 2: ability to channel. So a collar demani can sense a
• 3:08:11
  Speaker 2: girl's a spark and they know that that's what they're
• 3:08:14
  Speaker 2: looking for. Right.
• 3:08:15
  Speaker 3: I had always thought that there's no way they use
• 3:08:18
  Speaker 3: the collar because the caller wo would trap the soul
• 3:08:21
  Speaker 3: dam as well because they have the ability to channel.
• 3:08:25
  Speaker 3: But Discord was pointing out that before these girls have
• 3:08:29
  Speaker 3: the ability to learn, but they can't actually channel, and
• 3:08:32
  Speaker 3: so you can't force them into a link because they
• 3:08:37
  Speaker 3: don't have the ability to channel yet. So you could
• 3:08:40
  Speaker 3: actually probably use the collar to test for girls with
• 3:08:45
  Speaker 3: the spark versus those with the ability. I think the
• 3:08:48
  Speaker 3: caller would work on girls who had the spark.
• 3:08:50
  Speaker 2: But that's not how they do it though.
• 3:08:52
  Speaker 3: But I don't think that's how they do it simply
• 3:08:54
  Speaker 3: because I don't think people submit to the caller.
• 3:08:57
  Speaker 2: They basically all the young girls in a shan Chan
• 3:09:01
  Speaker 2: village go to I assume would be several linked pairs
• 3:09:05
  Speaker 2: of soldam and demani. They're all there, so anyone with
• 3:09:09
  Speaker 2: a spark can be sensed. All the young girls have
• 3:09:11
  Speaker 2: the opportunity to put up on the bracelet, and if
• 3:09:15
  Speaker 2: they can sense the demani's feelings, then they're trained as soldam.
• 3:09:22
  Speaker 3: I think the debate is between do they test with
• 3:09:24
  Speaker 3: the collar or do they just test but with people
• 3:09:26
  Speaker 3: walking by, And there was some interesting points on both
• 3:09:28
  Speaker 3: sides of that that I wanted to bring up.
• 3:09:29
  Speaker 2: I felt sure about that, but now I can't think
• 3:09:32
  Speaker 2: of where we see that exactly.
• 3:09:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't think there's a specific example.
• 3:09:36
  Speaker 2: Oh okay.
• 3:09:37
  Speaker 3: And so the reason the caller works on the soldam
• 3:09:40
  Speaker 3: is after they've been linked long enough to the domine,
• 3:09:44
  Speaker 3: it unlocks their ability to channel. I think they're just
• 3:09:46
  Speaker 3: basically warders with a block in place, but they have
• 3:09:49
  Speaker 3: the ability to channel, and they just don't know how
• 3:09:52
  Speaker 3: to do anything. And so then when you put the
• 3:09:54
  Speaker 3: collar on them, all of a sudden, it works because
• 3:09:57
  Speaker 3: they have that ability channel sort of trained into them unconsciously,
• 3:10:02
  Speaker 3: unlike totally untrained girls. Right, they've touched the source by proxy.
• 3:10:07
  Speaker 3: I mean they've they've been the controlling element in a
• 3:10:10
  Speaker 3: channeling link.
• 3:10:11
  Speaker 2: For many years.
• 3:10:12
  Speaker 3: It always makes me wonder if Soldam live longer.
• 3:10:15
  Speaker 2: Hmmm, I don't know. I don't think so.
• 3:10:19
  Speaker 3: I think Domine lived for a long time, but I
• 3:10:22
  Speaker 3: don't think the Soldam get the benefit of channeling.
• 3:10:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we know Demani.
• 3:10:27
  Speaker 3: Do do we see any old quotes Soldam?
• 3:10:31
  Speaker 2: None that I can think of, But I mean, we
• 3:10:33
  Speaker 2: don't meet a ton. I mean a little bit, but
• 3:10:37
  Speaker 2: we don't meet a ton in great detail. But we
• 3:10:41
  Speaker 2: do with a couple of the Domani. Who's the she's
• 3:10:46
  Speaker 2: like the oldest channeler in the world. She's like six
• 3:10:48
  Speaker 2: hundred or something.
• 3:10:49
  Speaker 3: Something ridiculous, and she's she's the only one who's like
• 3:10:52
  Speaker 3: more powerful than I Neve Olivia.
• 3:10:54
  Speaker 2: Olivia, that's right, And I found it by going to
• 3:10:57
  Speaker 2: Landfier's page and looking at her strength and the power,
• 3:11:00
  Speaker 2: because Olivia is often used as like one of the
• 3:11:02
  Speaker 2: markers of like the high end of female power. That
• 3:11:07
  Speaker 2: swat wiki page says land Fear is stronger than most
• 3:11:12
  Speaker 2: females except for Olivia. Summerhawk CON's ma asks when do
• 3:11:17
  Speaker 2: we think the Forsaken have been released? Do we think
• 3:11:20
  Speaker 2: it was during the flicker flicker Flicker months? Well, I
• 3:11:24
  Speaker 2: think it was when the seals break. That would be
• 3:11:26
  Speaker 2: the most logical.
• 3:11:27
  Speaker 3: Is that we've got a few of them out here
• 3:11:30
  Speaker 3: in the beginning, after the first seal broke in the
• 3:11:33
  Speaker 3: Eye of.
• 3:11:33
  Speaker 2: The World, Land fear Ishmael, the lal right.
• 3:11:38
  Speaker 3: And then here I think at the end of the
• 3:11:41
  Speaker 3: Great Hunt, those seals break and releases the rest of
• 3:11:44
  Speaker 3: the Forsaken.
• 3:11:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that would be the most most logical.
• 3:11:48
  Speaker 3: They're either out already or they're released.
• 3:11:50
  Speaker 2: I think they're.
• 3:11:50
  Speaker 3: Released as the seals break, So I'm not entirely sure
• 3:11:54
  Speaker 3: which ones get released when.
• 3:11:56
  Speaker 2: It's there's no way to really know when exactly they're released.
• 3:11:59
  Speaker 2: Like we can say, like, for instance, when we were
• 3:12:03
  Speaker 2: doing the patron only episode on Grandell, like I can
• 3:12:09
  Speaker 2: see where her plot picks up, and like when we
• 3:12:11
  Speaker 2: see her perspectives at first and when people are talking
• 3:12:14
  Speaker 2: about her being around, But that's as far as we know, Like,
• 3:12:18
  Speaker 2: we don't know the day that she was released.
• 3:12:21
  Speaker 3: Full season, between the end of The Great Hunt and
• 3:12:25
  Speaker 3: the Dragon Reborn, So there's a full three months in
• 3:12:28
  Speaker 3: there where the Forsaken. It's basically all winter where the
• 3:12:30
  Speaker 3: Forsaken could be you know, setting themselves up. And at
• 3:12:35
  Speaker 3: the beginning of The Dragon Reborn we see more gae
• 3:12:37
  Speaker 3: has changed her perspective a little bit on the ice
• 3:12:41
  Speaker 3: ad Eye because Gabriel is you know, basically mind controlling her. Yeah,
• 3:12:47
  Speaker 3: at the beginning of The Dragon Reborn, I definitely see
• 3:12:49
  Speaker 3: evidence of the Forsaken being out in the world for
• 3:12:52
  Speaker 3: some time, but it's hard to really know if that
• 3:12:55
  Speaker 3: was during the months of Flick or Flicker, or if
• 3:12:59
  Speaker 3: it's during the month after the end of the Great Hunt.
• 3:13:03
  Speaker 3: I think it's after the two seals are broken and
• 3:13:05
  Speaker 3: the rest of the four a can get out.
• 3:13:08
  Speaker 2: During like around the time when the Horn is first blown.
• 3:13:12
  Speaker 3: Between the beginning of the Great Hunt or the end
• 3:13:14
  Speaker 3: of The Eye of the World and the beginning of
• 3:13:17
  Speaker 3: The Dragon Reborn. So the Great Hunt plus the two
• 3:13:21
  Speaker 3: time periods on either side is a full year, Yeah,
• 3:13:25
  Speaker 3: which is the longest time period over any one individual
• 3:13:30
  Speaker 3: book in the series, because it's only you know, a
• 3:13:33
  Speaker 3: two year series. So yeah, they start after a Lane
• 3:13:37
  Speaker 3: has gone to the Tower, which means after the Great Hunt.
• 3:13:39
  Speaker 3: So yeah, I'm I'm firmly convinced that we saw those
• 3:13:43
  Speaker 3: two seals break in the Great Hunt and that released
• 3:13:45
  Speaker 3: the rest of the Forsaken.
• 3:13:46
  Speaker 2: I would think so if they're not out yet, But
• 3:13:49
  Speaker 2: like I said, there's no real way to say.
• 3:13:52
  Speaker 3: But that's that's my head cannon, is that the four
• 3:13:55
  Speaker 3: for Saken, we're out from the breaking of the first seal,
• 3:13:58
  Speaker 3: and then you know, four more from the next one,
• 3:14:00
  Speaker 3: and four more for the next one. And I guess
• 3:14:02
  Speaker 3: maybe there's one who didn't get out quite yet. Maybe
• 3:14:04
  Speaker 3: Demandred was stuck in for the a while until the
• 3:14:06
  Speaker 3: last one broke. Maybe that's why we don't hear it
• 3:14:08
  Speaker 3: from him for such a long time.
• 3:14:09
  Speaker 2: And Bishamael's first because this is part of his thousand
• 3:14:12
  Speaker 2: year cycle. Yeah, he's well, he was never fully constrained, right,
• 3:14:18
  Speaker 2: only partly.
• 3:14:20
  Speaker 3: I wonder if that's the reason why he's always in
• 3:14:23
  Speaker 3: a dream yard, is that he can't physically get into
• 3:14:25
  Speaker 3: the real world until the seals break, because that he's
• 3:14:29
  Speaker 3: partially constrained until the end.
• 3:14:30
  Speaker 2: Of the eye of the world.
• 3:14:31
  Speaker 3: Interesting theory that because you know, we see him in dreams,
• 3:14:35
  Speaker 3: but we never see him actually enter the physical world,
• 3:14:37
  Speaker 3: and maybe that's how he's One of the ways he's
• 3:14:39
  Speaker 3: partially constrained is that he's he can only influence the
• 3:14:43
  Speaker 3: Black Aja or something like that.
• 3:14:45
  Speaker 2: We do rarely see him in the real world.
• 3:14:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, almost never, as until he's more done. But I
• 3:14:51
  Speaker 3: do think in the eye of the world when they fight,
• 3:14:53
  Speaker 3: it's just in the world of dreams, Rand goes up
• 3:14:55
  Speaker 3: those steps and enters the world to dreams. Balzamon doesn't
• 3:14:58
  Speaker 3: come out.
• 3:14:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, it's arguable whether or not we've seen him,
• 3:15:03
  Speaker 2: not in telleran Riad yet even and in the Battle
• 3:15:08
  Speaker 2: and the Sky. That's why what I'm saying is like,
• 3:15:10
  Speaker 2: even that's debatable.
• 3:15:11
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, because you could say the horn was uniting
• 3:15:13
  Speaker 3: Teller Ronald in the Sky. Yeah, no, it was in
• 3:15:16
  Speaker 3: Teller ron real clearly.
• 3:15:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 3:15:19
  Speaker 3: Valeron wants to hear us talk about power levels, but frankly,
• 3:15:22
  Speaker 3: we just haven't done the research on it. I don't
• 3:15:25
  Speaker 3: I'd have to do some research before I talked about it.
• 3:15:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, fell around, We don't know that much about that.
• 3:15:31
  Speaker 2: I largely the only way I can really know which
• 3:15:35
  Speaker 2: characters are more powerful than the rest is by because
• 3:15:37
  Speaker 2: they're often like in the wiki pages and knowing from
• 3:15:42
  Speaker 2: having read the series a bunch of times, I know
• 3:15:45
  Speaker 2: character A is less powerful than character B, who is
• 3:15:48
  Speaker 2: less powerful than character C, who is more powerful than
• 3:15:52
  Speaker 2: so based on that, I have like a rough idea,
• 3:15:56
  Speaker 2: but it's very hard to say, Like, we talk about
• 3:16:00
  Speaker 2: how powerful land Fear may or may not be all
• 3:16:02
  Speaker 2: the time, and I don't think we'll ever really come
• 3:16:05
  Speaker 2: to a conclusion.
• 3:16:06
  Speaker 3: Well, I think that was CON's ma. I've got my
• 3:16:10
  Speaker 3: who said what is above and below? And so I'm
• 3:16:12
  Speaker 3: like reading the wrong user name Boots who said what
• 3:16:15
  Speaker 3: on these things?
• 3:16:16
  Speaker 2: Sorry about that.
• 3:16:18
  Speaker 3: Bambi was the one who asked about the release of
• 3:16:21
  Speaker 3: the forsaken New Kid on the Block was the what
• 3:16:27
  Speaker 3: you're most looking forward to. Jeff Dugan was the one
• 3:16:30
  Speaker 3: who asked about the pronunciation guide.
• 3:16:32
  Speaker 2: Oh and that is just reversed reversed.
• 3:16:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so that's problems. I was doing it one way
• 3:16:36
  Speaker 3: and then I reversed it, which threw me off. Power
• 3:16:39
  Speaker 3: On actually asked I'd love for there to be a
• 3:16:41
  Speaker 3: discussion on how Gwayne's time with the shan Chan helped
• 3:16:45
  Speaker 3: strengthen her and prepare her role as a wise One's
• 3:16:49
  Speaker 3: apprentice and later when they're trying to break her in
• 3:16:51
  Speaker 3: the White Tower.
• 3:16:52
  Speaker 2: Hmm. We've talked about this a good bit in previous episodes,
• 3:16:59
  Speaker 2: well a little bit at least where Quayne's time with
• 3:17:03
  Speaker 2: the Sean Chan. This is a big moment for her
• 3:17:07
  Speaker 2: because of the stretching where a new channeler that's forced
• 3:17:12
  Speaker 2: to try harder learns faster and they grow faster toward
• 3:17:17
  Speaker 2: their potential in the power.
• 3:17:19
  Speaker 3: I also think it has a lot to do with
• 3:17:21
  Speaker 3: her mental discipline and her determination to not be taken
• 3:17:24
  Speaker 3: prisoner again. Is a lot of why she gains power
• 3:17:27
  Speaker 3: as quickly as she does is she really does not
• 3:17:29
  Speaker 3: want to be put back in the situation where she
• 3:17:32
  Speaker 3: doesn't have the power to protect herself, and so that's
• 3:17:36
  Speaker 3: driving her to learn as fast as she possibly can.
• 3:17:39
  Speaker 2: That's very true, I think.
• 3:17:41
  Speaker 3: Yet that's why she's always driven to learn more and
• 3:17:43
  Speaker 3: more and more and more, is because she does not
• 3:17:46
  Speaker 3: want to be vulnerable. Basically, she wants to be the
• 3:17:49
  Speaker 3: person in the White Tower with Sora's song real blasting
• 3:17:54
  Speaker 3: rockin out of the sky, not the girl cowering in
• 3:17:58
  Speaker 3: the corner with the color on her neck.
• 3:18:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, this changes changes her attitude in many ways. I
• 3:18:03
  Speaker 2: feel like I would also like to point out that.
• 3:18:06
  Speaker 2: And I think of this as since some of my
• 3:18:08
  Speaker 2: life experiences sometimes where you know, you go through a
• 3:18:12
  Speaker 2: hard thing and then later on your perspective has changed forever.
• 3:18:17
  Speaker 2: So things that aren't as hard as that never seem
• 3:18:20
  Speaker 2: like as big of a deal ever. Again, right, you
• 3:18:23
  Speaker 2: can always kind of be like you remember that time
• 3:18:25
  Speaker 2: where I was enslaved and tortured, when I had to
• 3:18:28
  Speaker 2: live with a collar around my neck. That of course
• 3:18:30
  Speaker 2: that never happened to me. But Agwayne has that perspective,
• 3:18:33
  Speaker 2: like she has that real world experience. So after that,
• 3:18:36
  Speaker 2: like being beaten with a ruler is like whatever, yeah,
• 3:18:42
  Speaker 2: you know, or whatever it is, shereaves a paddle or
• 3:18:44
  Speaker 2: whatever it is. She just lived through the sensation of
• 3:18:47
  Speaker 2: being boiled alive.
• 3:18:48
  Speaker 3: Right and survived it and didn't break. Yeah, and it
• 3:18:52
  Speaker 3: just becomes practice. I mean it's you know, she is
• 3:18:54
  Speaker 3: in so much pain for such long chunks of time,
• 3:18:59
  Speaker 3: she becomes capable of ignoring it and locking it away.
• 3:19:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think the Sean Chan experience was her
• 3:19:08
  Speaker 2: first step down that road. I was saying this a
• 3:19:11
  Speaker 2: bit when we were talking about her experiences, but just
• 3:19:14
  Speaker 2: that I see these moments, these big moments as like
• 3:19:18
  Speaker 2: heat that tempers the metal that a guen will become.
• 3:19:21
  Speaker 2: She's getting stronger and stronger each time one of these
• 3:19:25
  Speaker 2: crazy events happens. Also more brittle, Oh that's fair. Yeah,
• 3:19:31
  Speaker 2: but she's getting harder tougher all the time. And the
• 3:19:35
  Speaker 2: Sean Chan there's stretching, which I mentioned, But they teach
• 3:19:39
  Speaker 2: her battle leaves that nobody else really seems to have.
• 3:19:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah, or isn't at least willing to teach her none
• 3:19:45
  Speaker 3: of the ice that I are going to show her
• 3:19:47
  Speaker 3: how to like blow up the earth. Right, she probably
• 3:19:51
  Speaker 3: embodies the most knowledge in any one person from all
• 3:19:55
  Speaker 3: the various different cultures because she is he.
• 3:19:57
  Speaker 2: Has knowledge and the power other than the Forsake.
• 3:20:00
  Speaker 3: I think, even more than the Forsaken, because she learns
• 3:20:03
  Speaker 3: a lot of the Forsaken tricks through Magedeon. Yeah, and
• 3:20:08
  Speaker 3: there are things that the shawn Chan and the wise
• 3:20:12
  Speaker 3: Ones have thought of that you know, the whole bonding
• 3:20:15
  Speaker 3: ceremony for sisters.
• 3:20:18
  Speaker 2: Right, there are things that she knows that the Forsaken don't. Right.
• 3:20:21
  Speaker 2: Plus when you consider Quendi our creation, yeah, the sea
• 3:20:26
  Speaker 2: folk weather stuff, but also the dream world stuff. Right,
• 3:20:30
  Speaker 2: she becomes a really powerful dreamer.
• 3:20:32
  Speaker 3: She's also an incredibly powerful.
• 3:20:33
  Speaker 2: Dreamer and pression as well, which is something we don't
• 3:20:36
  Speaker 2: really see parent taking advantage of very much. But a
• 3:20:39
  Speaker 2: queen is able to tell things about her future when
• 3:20:44
  Speaker 2: she dreams.
• 3:20:45
  Speaker 3: When she's at least able to predict the assault on
• 3:20:47
  Speaker 3: the White Tower by the Shawn Chan. Yeah, which, by
• 3:20:50
  Speaker 3: the way, there's a great scene in Dragon Reborn where
• 3:20:53
  Speaker 3: she like goes through all her dreams and every single
• 3:20:56
  Speaker 3: one of them is a foretelling of the future. And
• 3:20:59
  Speaker 3: some of them are foretellings in the Towers of Midnight
• 3:21:04
  Speaker 3: and the Memory of Light. So a lot of those
• 3:21:06
  Speaker 3: things that she foretells don't happen until later. I'm excited
• 3:21:09
  Speaker 3: to get to that little scene.
• 3:21:11
  Speaker 2: That's awesome. That's so funny that the cast iron pan
• 3:21:13
  Speaker 2: has becod of like a meme in the server. I
• 3:21:17
  Speaker 2: got really excited about the cast iron stuff. I know
• 3:21:21
  Speaker 2: you do.
• 3:21:21
  Speaker 3: I love cast iron, man, It's a great cooking surface.
• 3:21:26
  Speaker 3: Kelsey has another question. Kelsey Baldwin had a question regarding
• 3:21:30
  Speaker 3: your talents episode. Do you consider Elaine's proficiency in creating
• 3:21:33
  Speaker 3: duplicating on gre All as Yes, I do consider it
• 3:21:37
  Speaker 3: a talent I absolutely consider her proficiency.
• 3:21:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, not everyone can do that.
• 3:21:42
  Speaker 3: And then I also think it's interesting that Rand gave
• 3:21:44
  Speaker 3: them this seed tarrangreoll, which means, isn't it so it
• 3:21:49
  Speaker 3: takes a tarrangreoll to create onre All.
• 3:21:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 3:21:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah, because Rand tells her how to make them right
• 3:21:54
  Speaker 3: before he takes off for the blight. It's like the
• 3:21:56
  Speaker 3: last piece of information how to make angriell, and he
• 3:21:59
  Speaker 3: gives her the seed, and it's like, you have to
• 3:22:01
  Speaker 3: put your power into the seed for a long period
• 3:22:05
  Speaker 3: of time to create the ungrill, so it like leaves
• 3:22:08
  Speaker 3: you weak for a period of time, which is why
• 3:22:11
  Speaker 3: they're hard to create. And I've always thought a saw
• 3:22:15
  Speaker 3: onre All was created in the same way, but instead
• 3:22:18
  Speaker 3: of an individual doing it, it would be a circle.
• 3:22:21
  Speaker 3: And that's why they were even rarer, is it would
• 3:22:23
  Speaker 3: be so hard to get a circle to agree to
• 3:22:25
  Speaker 3: put all their power into a seed for an extended
• 3:22:29
  Speaker 3: period of time and then only one of you gets
• 3:22:31
  Speaker 3: to use it.
• 3:22:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 3:22:33
  Speaker 3: My head canon is the songre All are created by
• 3:22:35
  Speaker 3: circle and Onreall are created by an individual, but they're
• 3:22:38
  Speaker 3: created in the same way. I like that, and tear
• 3:22:41
  Speaker 3: on Greoll can be created at a whim, but you
• 3:22:44
  Speaker 3: need the talent and there's a very specific tearangreal that
• 3:22:47
  Speaker 3: creates on Grell.
• 3:22:47
  Speaker 2: And saw Onrell.
• 3:22:49
  Speaker 3: This will be episode ninety nine, and then episode one
• 3:22:52
  Speaker 3: hundred is going to be live from jordan Con.
• 3:22:56
  Speaker 2: Crazy, guys. I can't believe we're actually to be there.
• 3:23:01
  Speaker 3: I can't believe that we're gonna it's gonna be crazy.
• 3:23:03
  Speaker 3: It's going to be episode one hundred on our one
• 3:23:05
  Speaker 3: year anniversary at jordan Con Live.
• 3:23:09
  Speaker 2: I'm sure we'll be wanting to spend some time in
• 3:23:13
  Speaker 2: discord too, because we can just talk to you guys
• 3:23:16
  Speaker 2: about what we did that day totally, and that can
• 3:23:18
  Speaker 2: be we can make that part of episodes too. You know,
• 3:23:21
  Speaker 2: we've never done anything like the Jordan Cotton episode before.
• 3:23:25
  Speaker 3: And one a week is or won a book is
• 3:23:28
  Speaker 3: fine for the edge of episode. Yeah, I figure that's
• 3:23:31
  Speaker 3: every fifty episodes or so one random.
• 3:23:33
  Speaker 2: We'll only subject you to this once every year or
• 3:23:36
  Speaker 2: so twice a year maybe.
• 3:23:39
  Speaker 3: And it's nice for us to just get a chance
• 3:23:41
  Speaker 3: to sit back and talk about where we are and
• 3:23:44
  Speaker 3: the state of the podcast and the state of the books,
• 3:23:46
  Speaker 3: and yeah, what our plans are and we.
• 3:23:49
  Speaker 2: Got to talk about the miss Born stuff and.
• 3:23:51
  Speaker 3: Just thank everyone for helping us. It's been it's been
• 3:23:54
  Speaker 3: a cool experience, and I just I guess I want
• 3:23:56
  Speaker 3: to thank everybody out there who listens. You know, we
• 3:23:58
  Speaker 3: thanked our patrons a lot because they do support us financially,
• 3:24:00
  Speaker 3: but everyone out there who listens, who downloads, you've just
• 3:24:03
  Speaker 3: done fantastic things for us.
• 3:24:05
  Speaker 2: I mean, yes, every DOWU is counted. We love it.
• 3:24:09
  Speaker 2: Thank you, Thank you for listening in general. But hey,
• 3:24:11
  Speaker 2: if you don't have cash and or you don't have
• 3:24:14
  Speaker 2: the spare cash to buy us a cup of coffee,
• 3:24:17
  Speaker 2: you can do stuff like subscribe to our YouTube channel
• 3:24:21
  Speaker 2: and like our stuff there, which are just recordings of episodes.
• 3:24:25
  Speaker 2: That's the only reason we put those there, just we
• 3:24:27
  Speaker 2: had some requests people wanted to listen on YouTube. Yep,
• 3:24:31
  Speaker 2: you can write us a nice review and iTunes.
• 3:24:34
  Speaker 3: That's always fantastic. I know what I've been hearing from
• 3:24:37
  Speaker 3: a lot of people's They find us through just doing
• 3:24:39
  Speaker 3: a search on iTunes for real time, and so a
• 3:24:42
  Speaker 3: good rating on there makes a huge difference for people
• 3:24:45
  Speaker 3: finding us.
• 3:24:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 3:24:46
  Speaker 3: Huge.
• 3:24:48
  Speaker 2: You can also write us a very kind email, which
• 3:24:50
  Speaker 2: a lot of you do, and that's really really nice.
• 3:24:52
  Speaker 5: Oh.
• 3:24:52
  Speaker 3: I always appreciate that. But I figured I would actually
• 3:24:56
  Speaker 3: read a couple of the reviews that we've gotten over time,
• 3:25:02
  Speaker 3: because I don't want to encourage people to review.
• 3:25:03
  Speaker 2: So I'm going to put a couple out there.
• 3:25:05
  Speaker 3: Okay, someone named mrdrawl. It's fun. Great guys. They've come
• 3:25:10
  Speaker 3: really far since the beginning of their podcast. I mainly
• 3:25:13
  Speaker 3: listened while I'm swimming in the mornings, and I'm always
• 3:25:15
  Speaker 3: learning new things. I thought I knew everything after reading
• 3:25:18
  Speaker 3: the series seven plus times. These guys bring up really
• 3:25:20
  Speaker 3: good points and theories that I've never thought of myself.
• 3:25:23
  Speaker 3: Hashtag n neve shot first.
• 3:25:26
  Speaker 2: Just one of our early theories. How does he listen
• 3:25:29
  Speaker 2: while swimming? I assume waterproof earbuds, and I've seen little
• 3:25:35
  Speaker 2: waterproof MP three players. Cool. I did not know that.
• 3:25:39
  Speaker 2: I didn't know that was a thing.
• 3:25:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and then you get like earbuds that go in
• 3:25:43
  Speaker 3: and I haven't looked at the technology in a while
• 3:25:45
  Speaker 3: because I can't swim anymore because I tore my rotator cuff.
• 3:25:48
  Speaker 2: But I was a huge swimmer for a long time.
• 3:25:50
  Speaker 3: And in the days before MP three players, and I
• 3:25:54
  Speaker 3: desperately wanted to find a way to hook up a
• 3:25:56
  Speaker 3: CD player to like my swim cap or something so
• 3:25:59
  Speaker 3: I could, like, there's no way to do it. Yeah,
• 3:26:03
  Speaker 3: with new MP three players, i've seen them. They're like
• 3:26:05
  Speaker 3: I've seen little tiny ones that you like basically strap
• 3:26:07
  Speaker 3: onto your goggles in like the back of your head
• 3:26:10
  Speaker 3: and then like they have just a little wire that
• 3:26:11
  Speaker 3: comes down into your ear and they're they're really neat.
• 3:26:14
  Speaker 3: Now with like Bluetooth headphones, I bet you could like
• 3:26:17
  Speaker 3: do Bluetooth headphones in your ears and like have the
• 3:26:19
  Speaker 3: phone sitting on like the edge of the pool or something.
• 3:26:21
  Speaker 2: Probably if the headphones were waterproof, Yeah, you can, definitely.
• 3:26:25
  Speaker 2: I used to do laundry in my old apartment. I
• 3:26:27
  Speaker 2: would walk down the stairs, go into the basement and
• 3:26:29
  Speaker 2: just leave my phone plugged in upstairs. It didn't matter
• 3:26:31
  Speaker 2: because I was in the same building. I was directly
• 3:26:33
  Speaker 2: below where my phone was, so it worked fine.
• 3:26:37
  Speaker 3: JF one forty says the best sheep hurders You'll find.
• 3:26:40
  Speaker 3: Was starting my fourth listen of the Wheel of Time
• 3:26:42
  Speaker 3: and decided to see if there was a podcast that
• 3:26:44
  Speaker 3: tore the series apart to listen to. While I did
• 3:26:47
  Speaker 3: Seth and Patrick do a great job making it fresh again.
• 3:26:50
  Speaker 3: Timber also has great thoughts, get your Wheel of Time
• 3:26:53
  Speaker 3: fixed with a dash of beer recommendations?
• 3:26:55
  Speaker 2: What more could you ask for? We haven't done a
• 3:27:00
  Speaker 2: beer recommendation in a while. We should do that.
• 3:27:02
  Speaker 3: We haven't drinking that much durning the recording sessions.
• 3:27:05
  Speaker 2: That's true. Neil G. Williams writes compelling listening for any
• 3:27:10
  Speaker 2: Wheel of Time. If you are a fan of Wheel
• 3:27:13
  Speaker 2: of Time, you will adore this podcast. Seth and Patrick
• 3:27:16
  Speaker 2: dive headfirst into the intrigue and behind the scenes plots
• 3:27:19
  Speaker 2: and myriad storylines that make Wheel of Time the finest
• 3:27:22
  Speaker 2: example of epic fantasy ever written. You should also subscribe
• 3:27:26
  Speaker 2: because the more followers the podcast acquires, the more its
• 3:27:29
  Speaker 2: hosts are guilt tripped into putting more and more effort
• 3:27:32
  Speaker 2: into making this already great podcast even better. A perfect
• 3:27:35
  Speaker 2: positive feedback loop. I remember that one that was good.
• 3:27:40
  Speaker 3: Bloody Moomoo writes WoT wo word he gets the award
• 3:27:48
  Speaker 3: for shortest review.
• 3:27:50
  Speaker 2: Great was f h k I NBG writes great podcasts
• 3:27:57
  Speaker 2: and top level aschamon really know their stuff, Thanks my teeth.
• 3:28:01
  Speaker 2: Or writes great stuff.
• 3:28:03
  Speaker 3: Deep Dive read the glossary from before, pronunciations only complaint.
• 3:28:08
  Speaker 2: And then this is this a bunch of other ones.
• 3:28:10
  Speaker 2: But I think that's good, good and good enough for now.
• 3:28:12
  Speaker 2: I just wanted to read a few of those out
• 3:28:14
  Speaker 2: and say thank you for those of you people who
• 3:28:15
  Speaker 2: have read it. And those are US only. I know
• 3:28:17
  Speaker 2: there's a bunch of international reviews. I'll have to get
• 3:28:19
  Speaker 2: to those.
• 3:28:20
  Speaker 3: They're a little harder for me to see because I
• 3:28:22
  Speaker 3: have to like log.
• 3:28:22
  Speaker 2: Into the international store, which is complicated, so I don't
• 3:28:27
  Speaker 2: always check up on those. But I know you guys
• 3:28:29
  Speaker 2: are are not just writing reviews in the US, so
• 3:28:32
  Speaker 2: I appreciate the international ones as well.
• 3:28:35
  Speaker 1: Appreciate it.
• 3:28:36
  Speaker 2: Thanks for listening so far, Thank you, and good night.
• 3:29:11
  Speaker 2: ID to derail this, but I feel like I'm going crazy.
• 3:29:13
  Speaker 2: Do you smell like pasta with Lemons bank?
• 3:29:17
  Speaker 5: Going nuts? Yeah?
• 3:29:21
  Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, there's one of the neighbors of the neighbors
• 3:29:24
  Speaker 3: and the smell is getting down to.
• 3:29:26
  Speaker 2: Us and they're just like, am I might clothes that disgusting?
• 3:29:28
  Speaker 2: When it's just smalling.
• 3:29:52
  Speaker 1: This is the Wheel of Time Spoilers podcast. Your hosts
• 3:29:56
  Speaker 1: are Seth Jacobson and Patrick Hyler.
• 3:30:00
  Speaker 3: Again, we've been thinking people. Last couple of episodes, I've
• 3:30:02
  Speaker 3: got a couple of more thank yous that I want
• 3:30:04
  Speaker 3: to put out there. Jason Curry, I wanted to say
• 3:30:07
  Speaker 3: thank you too. He likes to give us a little
• 3:30:10
  Speaker 3: bit of money outside of Patreon. He sends us bonuses
• 3:30:13
  Speaker 3: whenever we finish a book, and because it's outside of Patreon,
• 3:30:17
  Speaker 3: I forgot about that. But he's also given.
• 3:30:19
  Speaker 2: Us yes, and he's been around forever, right, he was
• 3:30:23
  Speaker 2: like one of the original donors, I think.
• 3:30:25
  Speaker 3: And he just joined Discord as Conan Blackthorn.
• 3:30:29
  Speaker 2: Oh awesome, Hey, Hey, welcome, welcome.
• 3:30:34
  Speaker 5: I saw him in the feet, but I didn't know
• 3:30:36
  Speaker 5: who that was.
• 3:30:37
  Speaker 2: I were we exchanging emails or talking on Facebook recently?
• 3:30:42
  Speaker 2: I can never remember which platform I'm talking to people on.
• 3:30:45
  Speaker 2: It's all blends together. I feel like I was talking
• 3:30:47
  Speaker 2: to him recently. And if you're there, what's up? Yes,
• 3:30:52
  Speaker 2: you are there, he is here, Hello, mister Curry. Perhaps
• 3:30:55
  Speaker 2: he's just listening.
• 3:30:57
  Speaker 3: And then I had one more thank you I needed
• 3:30:58
  Speaker 3: to say, which was to Patrick. Because we've gone through
• 3:31:02
  Speaker 3: three of these books. It's been fucking amazing. Thank you
• 3:31:06
  Speaker 3: for hanging with me and keeping this up this whole time.
• 3:31:09
  Speaker 2: Oh, you're welcome, my friend. I wasn't expecting that. Let's
• 3:31:13
  Speaker 2: let's let's think clink loud enough that the mics will
• 3:31:16
  Speaker 2: pick it up. Okay, this has been a hell of
• 3:31:21
  Speaker 2: a ride, and it's just getting more exciting with the
• 3:31:25
  Speaker 2: release of the TV show.
• 3:31:27
  Speaker 3: And I don't think either of us thought we'd be here.
• 3:31:30
  Speaker 2: I am nodding seriously. I think about that all the
• 3:31:33
  Speaker 2: freaking time, Like it was like a year ago when
• 3:31:37
  Speaker 2: we were like, whoa cool, this thing might actually like
• 3:31:39
  Speaker 2: pay for itself. We're not just going to be in
• 3:31:42
  Speaker 2: the hole like making this thing. And now we're in
• 3:31:46
  Speaker 2: a position where we're like, you know, going to email
• 3:31:50
  Speaker 2: start a conversation with Lipsyn tomorrow about what our options
• 3:31:53
  Speaker 2: are as far as advertising, right, we never would have
• 3:31:57
  Speaker 2: thought no. And and another huge development that we can
• 3:32:04
  Speaker 2: bullshit about for a bit, but just insofar as the
• 3:32:07
  Speaker 2: development of the podcast, we were always talking like, if
• 3:32:11
  Speaker 2: a show happens, that's going to be a big freaking
• 3:32:14
  Speaker 2: deal for us, and it's happening. We just found out
• 3:32:17
  Speaker 2: what two days ago or today, yes, two am yesterday,
• 3:32:23
  Speaker 2: Yes that is.
• 3:32:25
  Speaker 3: I didn't actually see it until I woke up in
• 3:32:27
  Speaker 3: the morning, but that's when the news came out was
• 3:32:30
  Speaker 3: basically that's awesome.
• 3:32:32
  Speaker 9: Yeah, so exciting, Oh my god.
• 3:32:35
  Speaker 3: And so, by the way, you may be hearing two
• 3:32:38
  Speaker 3: other voices, and I should introduce them before we get
• 3:32:41
  Speaker 3: too much further. You've probably heard them before. They've both
• 3:32:45
  Speaker 3: been guests. A radio farmer who's been on many times to.
• 3:32:49
  Speaker 9: Hello radio, Hey everyone.
• 3:32:53
  Speaker 3: And you know, she's a constant presence in the discord,
• 3:32:57
  Speaker 3: correcting us all the time. We call it the fastest
• 3:33:01
  Speaker 3: typist in the West. She can really come out with
• 3:33:04
  Speaker 3: answers before anyone else even has a chance to like
• 3:33:06
  Speaker 3: figure out what they are.
• 3:33:07
  Speaker 2: She's kind of like more efficient than wat Wiggie. It's ridiculous.
• 3:33:11
  Speaker 2: We just ask a radio. We don't actually have to
• 3:33:13
  Speaker 2: go to the wiki we have at a radio. And
• 3:33:15
  Speaker 2: then we have Travis, who's a slightly more recent edition,
• 3:33:18
  Speaker 2: but again one of the loudest voices in the discord,
• 3:33:22
  Speaker 2: and he likes to die on some hills, so we
• 3:33:24
  Speaker 2: figure it's always nice you can stand on hill I
• 3:33:28
  Speaker 2: do not die on them.
• 3:33:29
  Speaker 3: I would differ, uh.
• 3:33:33
  Speaker 5: Yet, to take any hill from underneath me.
• 3:33:36
  Speaker 3: That is not true. I like to find at least
• 3:33:39
  Speaker 3: one of your hills at least which one.
• 3:33:42
  Speaker 2: Maybe maybe Team walk By that's the team that's that
• 3:33:45
  Speaker 2: was the exact one I was thinking of. Okay, all right,
• 3:33:48
  Speaker 2: I'll give you that one, right. I love it though,
• 3:33:50
  Speaker 2: And for people who don't hang out on Discord and
• 3:33:53
  Speaker 2: don't really know what we're talking about about dying on
• 3:33:55
  Speaker 2: hills and things like that, or always having debates on
• 3:33:59
  Speaker 2: like very headcanon of how something works, how like the
• 3:34:03
  Speaker 2: mechanics of something works, or how are you.
• 3:34:06
  Speaker 5: Know, example, Team walk By or I don't know what
• 3:34:09
  Speaker 5: was the what was the counter to that team?
• 3:34:12
  Speaker 2: Everyone's colleyed something like that where we're talking about how
• 3:34:17
  Speaker 2: the sean chan test channelers and we couldn't come to
• 3:34:20
  Speaker 2: a conclusion. Well, I guess the whole point of that
• 3:34:23
  Speaker 2: was Travis is always in there in the debate, whether
• 3:34:27
  Speaker 2: it's on our side or not, but frequently it's not
• 3:34:30
  Speaker 2: on our side. But that's that's really fun and one
• 3:34:33
  Speaker 2: of the things that makes hanging out and Discord really fun.
• 3:34:36
  Speaker 9: It's so much more than just a podcast. You guys
• 3:34:39
  Speaker 9: made a real community. It's so cool.
• 3:34:42
  Speaker 2: I would disagree with you. You guys made the real community.
• 3:34:46
  Speaker 2: Patrick and I. Yeah, we made the server and then
• 3:34:50
  Speaker 2: people showed up and tried into a thing. It would
• 3:34:52
  Speaker 2: be pretty lame if all if only our ideas were
• 3:34:56
  Speaker 2: ever implemented there were, there would not be that much
• 3:34:58
  Speaker 2: going on.
• 3:34:59
  Speaker 9: Yeah, it's it was amazing how much my field camp
• 3:35:02
  Speaker 9: was like the Server but in real life, like we
• 3:35:05
  Speaker 9: just all happened to show up because we had to
• 3:35:07
  Speaker 9: take this class, and we were like fucking family after
• 3:35:11
  Speaker 9: like two days, and then we got to hang out
• 3:35:13
  Speaker 9: for a whole week, and it was just I made
• 3:35:16
  Speaker 9: so many genuine friends and it reminded me so much
• 3:35:18
  Speaker 9: of the experience in the Server, only with camping, and
• 3:35:24
  Speaker 9: it's I don't know, it's it's surreal finding communities that
• 3:35:29
  Speaker 9: are just so much fun. And then you go to
• 3:35:31
  Speaker 9: a class where you're supposed to work together in groups
• 3:35:33
  Speaker 9: and everyone's just like adul then not interested. It's amazing.
• 3:35:39
  Speaker 9: This community is so great, so amazing.
• 3:35:43
  Speaker 3: I will say, if there's one thing I've done differently
• 3:35:46
  Speaker 3: than other Internet communities is I don't tolerate in tolerance.
• 3:35:52
  Speaker 2: Well, yeah, you know, and I think we've been very
• 3:35:55
  Speaker 2: lucky that probably in the watch spoilers discord, like all
• 3:36:00
  Speaker 2: the people who are going to show up are pre
• 3:36:01
  Speaker 2: vetted and that there are people who over read the
• 3:36:03
  Speaker 2: wheel of time, you know, and so that's that's helpful.
• 3:36:07
  Speaker 2: I've seen too many Wheel of Time communities to believe
• 3:36:10
  Speaker 2: that that's the soul reason.
• 3:36:12
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that we are so friendly. There's something else going
• 3:36:16
  Speaker 3: on here. It's not just I do think the wheel
• 3:36:20
  Speaker 3: of Time helps.
• 3:36:21
  Speaker 5: I don't know how many of you guys are involved
• 3:36:23
  Speaker 5: in like the big Facebook group, because there's multiple Facebook groups,
• 3:36:27
  Speaker 5: but there's one that had something like twelve thirteen thousand people,
• 3:36:31
  Speaker 5: and that one years ago, like three years ago, maybe
• 3:36:36
  Speaker 5: even four years ago now, when I first joined it,
• 3:36:38
  Speaker 5: and it was like three thousand people, it was a
• 3:36:42
  Speaker 5: pretty cool community. Everybody kind of knew each other. There
• 3:36:46
  Speaker 5: were like there were clicks, but they were all clicks
• 3:36:49
  Speaker 5: that were kind of like they all got along with
• 3:36:51
  Speaker 5: each other. And like, as that group has gotten bigger
• 3:36:54
  Speaker 5: and come to encompass like twelve thousand people, and they've
• 3:36:57
  Speaker 5: added to their administrative team and stuff like that, it's
• 3:37:00
  Speaker 5: just gotten so out of hand and it's not a
• 3:37:03
  Speaker 5: fun place to be anymore. Like I'm only still in
• 3:37:05
  Speaker 5: that group because every now and again an interesting post
• 3:37:08
  Speaker 5: comes along, and I've been in it for so long
• 3:37:09
  Speaker 5: that I refuse to be chased out, but I don't
• 3:37:12
  Speaker 5: participate in it very much anymore.
• 3:37:13
  Speaker 2: Travis, is it is it no bands, no censorship?
• 3:37:17
  Speaker 5: No, that's the one that I admined at for like
• 3:37:20
  Speaker 5: a brief moment.
• 3:37:21
  Speaker 4: Oh.
• 3:37:21
  Speaker 2: Really, that one can be particularly nasty, that.
• 3:37:24
  Speaker 5: One can be particularly crude. People like to just troll
• 3:37:27
  Speaker 5: that group. And unfortunately the lady who made that one,
• 3:37:32
  Speaker 5: she's really cool, but like her whole thing was like,
• 3:37:35
  Speaker 5: we're gonna make this group and people can talk about
• 3:37:37
  Speaker 5: whatever they want in it, because it was like the
• 3:37:40
  Speaker 5: complete antithesis of the big group, which is the one
• 3:37:43
  Speaker 5: that Ebonie is the admin of and Ebony, And I
• 3:37:47
  Speaker 5: don't blame Ebonie at all.
• 3:37:49
  Speaker 3: Ebany's great. I got to hang out with her at
• 3:37:51
  Speaker 3: Jordan Kahn, the.
• 3:37:52
  Speaker 5: One that Ebonie is an admin of. Ebanie is a
• 3:37:54
  Speaker 5: great admin. It's some of the other admins that I
• 3:37:56
  Speaker 5: don't care for too much, but they've relegated so much.
• 3:38:00
  Speaker 5: Like in our Discord, we have like channels. It's I
• 3:38:03
  Speaker 5: think that discord is just a better platform for discussing
• 3:38:05
  Speaker 5: it personally because there's different channels where we can talk
• 3:38:08
  Speaker 5: about certain things like the show and the uh WAT
• 3:38:12
  Speaker 5: Wednesday and our pets and selfies and whatever we want
• 3:38:16
  Speaker 5: to do, like there's an individual channel for that all
• 3:38:18
  Speaker 5: within the same platform, whereas that group you used to
• 3:38:22
  Speaker 5: be able to do all of that stuff within that
• 3:38:23
  Speaker 5: one group. And then the admins kind of came in
• 3:38:27
  Speaker 5: and were like, no, we're gonna split all of this
• 3:38:29
  Speaker 5: set because it just gets to be too busy and
• 3:38:33
  Speaker 5: posts get buried and then you and then they started
• 3:38:36
  Speaker 5: putting in like restrictions like don't talk about anything even
• 3:38:39
  Speaker 5: if you're relating it to the series that might kind
• 3:38:42
  Speaker 5: of a little bit start to become political or religious,
• 3:38:45
  Speaker 5: and it's just like, well, now we can't compare you know,
• 3:38:48
  Speaker 5: the White Cloaks to the KKK, because that gets bad
• 3:38:53
  Speaker 5: really quickly, right yeah, Or we can't compare. Like there
• 3:38:57
  Speaker 5: was a big thing where people were like comparing Alida
• 3:38:59
  Speaker 5: and Trump, and it's like, Okay, while you might have
• 3:39:02
  Speaker 5: some validity in that, we're getting political and now that
• 3:39:05
  Speaker 5: whole entire thread is going to get shut down and
• 3:39:07
  Speaker 5: if you even think about like disagreeing with an admin,
• 3:39:12
  Speaker 5: they just kick you out of the group altogether. And
• 3:39:13
  Speaker 5: it's just become a place that's like so heavy handed
• 3:39:16
  Speaker 5: and over controlled that I don't want anything to do
• 3:39:18
  Speaker 5: with it.
• 3:39:18
  Speaker 2: That's fair.
• 3:39:19
  Speaker 3: And then I think that's a balance that we are
• 3:39:21
  Speaker 3: certainly going to struggle to hit as we grow. And
• 3:39:26
  Speaker 3: you know, I mean, yeah, a radio, you're right there
• 3:39:28
  Speaker 3: with me. And that's why we've established the Hall of
• 3:39:31
  Speaker 3: the Tower. That's why I'm trying to bring as many
• 3:39:33
  Speaker 3: people as I can in that I trust into the
• 3:39:36
  Speaker 3: admin group. And yeah, I mean there's going to be
• 3:39:40
  Speaker 3: a huge effort in the future to maintain the civility
• 3:39:43
  Speaker 3: of the Discord group because I think right now it's
• 3:39:45
  Speaker 3: doing a fantastic job.
• 3:39:48
  Speaker 5: And yeah, this discord is amazing, right, Like it makes
• 3:39:51
  Speaker 5: an excellent community for the kind of discussion that is
• 3:39:56
  Speaker 5: just so stimulating and so rewarding and like worthwhile. And
• 3:40:02
  Speaker 5: for the most part, I think that the team that
• 3:40:04
  Speaker 5: we have at the moment is able to keep things
• 3:40:08
  Speaker 5: on track and not even with like just getting out
• 3:40:10
  Speaker 5: there and being super heavy handed and being like, no,
• 3:40:13
  Speaker 5: don't do that. It's just more of a like leading, right, Yeah,
• 3:40:16
  Speaker 5: that's cool, but let's talk about this instead now, just
• 3:40:18
  Speaker 5: kind of bringing up another topic and steering it a
• 3:40:21
  Speaker 5: lot more subtly.
• 3:40:23
  Speaker 2: Yes, I agree with that there has been very little.
• 3:40:27
  Speaker 2: I should I say that angst and or banning really
• 3:40:31
  Speaker 2: hasn't happened very much at all.
• 3:40:32
  Speaker 3: Agonare has only brought out the band hammer like three times.
• 3:40:36
  Speaker 2: Which is pretty impressive for any Internet community, to be honest.
• 3:40:40
  Speaker 5: I think what's really great is that all of the
• 3:40:42
  Speaker 5: people that are here, the huge core that we have,
• 3:40:46
  Speaker 5: like it's a very large core, and it's a very
• 3:40:49
  Speaker 5: tight core, and we all have the same love for
• 3:40:53
  Speaker 5: this series and the same love for this community, and
• 3:40:55
  Speaker 5: it keeps us all together. And when somebody does come
• 3:40:59
  Speaker 5: in that starts to create waves, I think as a
• 3:41:02
  Speaker 5: community we either redirect that individual and kind of like
• 3:41:08
  Speaker 5: integrate them and like teach them subtly how to integrate.
• 3:41:12
  Speaker 3: That's what I'm most impressed with is that I've seen
• 3:41:14
  Speaker 3: that happen over.
• 3:41:15
  Speaker 5: It just kind of push them out.
• 3:41:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 3:41:17
  Speaker 3: Well, and even the pushing out is not overt, it's
• 3:41:22
  Speaker 3: just they they get no responses to the stuff that
• 3:41:25
  Speaker 3: no one really wants to talk about.
• 3:41:27
  Speaker 5: Right, yeah, nobody, Just people just don't feed into it.
• 3:41:29
  Speaker 5: So they kind of either get the clue that Okay,
• 3:41:31
  Speaker 5: we don't talk about that here or we don't go
• 3:41:33
  Speaker 5: that direction here, and they either stop going in that
• 3:41:36
  Speaker 5: direction and go in other directions with us, or they
• 3:41:41
  Speaker 5: just kind of fall off the face of life.
• 3:41:44
  Speaker 3: And that's why I am so excited to meet these
• 3:41:47
  Speaker 3: everybody in person that I can meet, Like the twenty
• 3:41:50
  Speaker 3: five people or so that are going to show up
• 3:41:52
  Speaker 3: on this weekend. Guys, there's gonna be some hugging going on.
• 3:41:57
  Speaker 3: I'm just.
• 3:42:01
  Speaker 9: It's going to be so great.
• 3:42:04
  Speaker 5: So show of hands. Who wore pink today?
• 3:42:09
  Speaker 2: I didn't know it's supposed to wear pink.
• 3:42:10
  Speaker 5: It's a reference. Is mean girl's day to me? It's
• 3:42:13
  Speaker 5: October third and it's Wednesday.
• 3:42:16
  Speaker 2: I didn't know that today was me and.
• 3:42:18
  Speaker 9: Something I didn't but I've never watched me like I.
• 3:42:22
  Speaker 2: Do actually have a pink shirt that I wear sometimes,
• 3:42:25
  Speaker 2: pink button down.
• 3:42:27
  Speaker 9: And Jesus is going to be watching over us all.
• 3:42:33
  Speaker 3: I want to talk about a certain series that may
• 3:42:37
  Speaker 3: or may not be at the source of the podcast.
• 3:42:38
  Speaker 3: I want to talk about The Wheel of Time.
• 3:42:41
  Speaker 5: Oh hey, imagine that novel idea.
• 3:42:44
  Speaker 3: We have just finished the first trilogy and me and
• 3:42:47
  Speaker 3: Patrick have said an awful lot of things about this book.
• 3:42:53
  Speaker 3: There's one hundred and fifty four or five episodes out
• 3:42:56
  Speaker 3: there for you to listen to. It's a lot of hours.
• 3:42:59
  Speaker 3: We're stoked about it. I want to hear someone else's opinion,
• 3:43:03
  Speaker 3: like my opinion, Well you're the one talking, so yeah.
• 3:43:08
  Speaker 5: I mean, I think you guys know how I feel
• 3:43:10
  Speaker 5: about this, this community that we've built in this podcast
• 3:43:13
  Speaker 5: that you guys have created, and I just wish that
• 3:43:19
  Speaker 5: it would have happened sooner. I've craved this kind of
• 3:43:22
  Speaker 5: community and discussion and in depth like deconstruction of the
• 3:43:28
  Speaker 5: series for so long, and I've wanted, like I've tried
• 3:43:32
  Speaker 5: so hard to get all of my friends into the
• 3:43:33
  Speaker 5: series so I could have these kinds of conversations with them,
• 3:43:36
  Speaker 5: and then Seth and Patrick come along and it's like,
• 3:43:39
  Speaker 5: wish granted, and now my life is that much more complete.
• 3:43:43
  Speaker 5: So seriously, I'm not crying. I mean, if I am,
• 3:43:48
  Speaker 5: their happy tears.
• 3:43:49
  Speaker 3: But I think we felt the same way. Is that
• 3:43:55
  Speaker 3: we wanted this and that's why we created it. I
• 3:43:57
  Speaker 3: don't think there was never, I mean certainly no profit
• 3:44:01
  Speaker 3: motive behind it. The idea that we've been making money
• 3:44:04
  Speaker 3: is ridiculous.
• 3:44:05
  Speaker 2: We thought we were gonna have to pay to do it.
• 3:44:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, we were like trying to one of the.
• 3:44:10
  Speaker 5: Things that I think one of the things that made
• 3:44:12
  Speaker 5: this so appealing to me was when I started listening,
• 3:44:16
  Speaker 5: which was just after Jordan Con, the last Jordan Con,
• 3:44:19
  Speaker 5: because that's when Ebanie posted it and I saw it
• 3:44:23
  Speaker 5: and was like, I'll give that a shot. When I
• 3:44:25
  Speaker 5: first started listening and I heard your guys's like introduction
• 3:44:29
  Speaker 5: of each other and yourselves and your reasoning for wanting
• 3:44:32
  Speaker 5: to do this, Like just how organic and natural that sounded,
• 3:44:37
  Speaker 5: and how genuine that sounded. Like We're just two guys
• 3:44:41
  Speaker 5: that have been friends for a really long time and
• 3:44:43
  Speaker 5: accidentally found out that we both have this passion for
• 3:44:46
  Speaker 5: this series and like wanted to be able to dive
• 3:44:51
  Speaker 5: deeper into it with each other but also potentially with
• 3:44:54
  Speaker 5: other people and make that available to other people. Like
• 3:44:56
  Speaker 5: something about that just spoke to me so heavily, and
• 3:44:59
  Speaker 5: I was like, man, I want to be a part
• 3:45:00
  Speaker 5: of this community so hard.
• 3:45:02
  Speaker 2: That's cool, Travis. I actually didn't know that you were
• 3:45:05
  Speaker 2: like one of the because we got a big, like
• 3:45:09
  Speaker 2: a big rise in followers when Jason Denzel tweeted about
• 3:45:14
  Speaker 2: us first that was pretty early on and then yeah,
• 3:45:18
  Speaker 2: oh yeah, and then around the around the con because
• 3:45:24
  Speaker 2: like dragon Mount featured us like a couple of times
• 3:45:28
  Speaker 2: mentioned us in different places, and that was another big jump.
• 3:45:31
  Speaker 3: Well, we made friend Trevanny and Mashie and the two
• 3:45:35
  Speaker 3: of them are both writers on Dragon Mount. And we
• 3:45:39
  Speaker 3: interviewed Jason Denzel around that time. So if you want
• 3:45:43
  Speaker 3: to go back and listen to that episode, and I
• 3:45:45
  Speaker 3: honestly think like episode hundred kind of fucking rocked live
• 3:45:48
  Speaker 3: from the Con. Yeah, that's that was really fun with
• 3:45:52
  Speaker 3: your interview.
• 3:45:52
  Speaker 5: I think it was great that it happened that way.
• 3:45:54
  Speaker 5: That like episode one hundred was you guys at the con.
• 3:45:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeahked out perfectly, totally coincidental. Like I couldn't plan
• 3:46:01
  Speaker 3: that if I wanted to.
• 3:46:01
  Speaker 2: We had to like slow down release schedules slightly before
• 3:46:04
  Speaker 2: we got there or we would have run over it.
• 3:46:06
  Speaker 2: Didn't we like not release one episode, We typically one
• 3:46:09
  Speaker 2: or two. Yeah, I think I think I did, Like
• 3:46:11
  Speaker 2: I stretched it a little bit, but I didn't, like
• 3:46:14
  Speaker 2: really wanted to make that happen. Yeah, we really wanted
• 3:46:16
  Speaker 2: to make that happen. So it was but that was fine.
• 3:46:18
  Speaker 5: Tone Dog says, the podcast relet my love for this series,
• 3:46:22
  Speaker 5: And I mean I feel that in a way, like
• 3:46:24
  Speaker 5: not that I was ever losing love for this series,
• 3:46:26
  Speaker 5: but it just like I wouldn't say it relt my love,
• 3:46:29
  Speaker 5: but it deepened it.
• 3:46:31
  Speaker 9: Yeah, so much nodding.
• 3:46:34
  Speaker 3: I'm there with you. Like I I was kind of
• 3:46:36
  Speaker 3: at the point with Wheel Time where I was like,
• 3:46:38
  Speaker 3: I know this series. I know everything that happens in
• 3:46:40
  Speaker 3: this series, Like I get all the important parts. There's
• 3:46:43
  Speaker 3: a few little bits that Sanderson added at the end
• 3:46:46
  Speaker 3: that I may need to like look into deeply. Oh
• 3:46:48
  Speaker 3: my god, was I wrong? Like there, I've learned so
• 3:46:52
  Speaker 3: much by doing this podcast so much.
• 3:46:55
  Speaker 5: I'm I'm nodding so hard right now. Yeah, yeah, I
• 3:46:59
  Speaker 5: mean I got to the point I think that me
• 3:47:01
  Speaker 5: and Aradia might share this like we we just we
• 3:47:06
  Speaker 5: know all of the factoids, like you know, the semantics
• 3:47:11
  Speaker 5: of the way things work, like the the foundations of things.
• 3:47:17
  Speaker 5: But it's the deeper theories and the setterfuge and the
• 3:47:21
  Speaker 5: intrigue and the motivations and stuff that we're deconstructing and
• 3:47:25
  Speaker 5: looking deeper into that is what really makes for it.
• 3:47:29
  Speaker 5: Because I think Iradi and I are both incredibly knowledgeable
• 3:47:33
  Speaker 5: about like this character looks like this, and this character
• 3:47:36
  Speaker 5: committed this action right and this is how this kind
• 3:47:39
  Speaker 5: of thing works. But it's the digging into the other
• 3:47:44
  Speaker 5: things that has been an incredible experience.
• 3:47:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I feel like there was a couple of key
• 3:47:53
  Speaker 3: posts on Reddit, the red subreddit that sort of made
• 3:47:57
  Speaker 3: me re examine how some cacharacters were thinking. But Matt
• 3:48:02
  Speaker 3: and Fayel, Yeah, and I felt like I had to
• 3:48:05
  Speaker 3: rethink both of those characters and in what way is
• 3:48:10
  Speaker 3: Fayil was awful? Terrible, no good, very bad. I can't
• 3:48:16
  Speaker 3: stand to her. Why is she even exist this? She
• 3:48:19
  Speaker 3: makes the story worse? And then I read that summary
• 3:48:24
  Speaker 3: on read about looking at things from her perspective and
• 3:48:26
  Speaker 3: the fact that paren reacts to how she feels, not
• 3:48:30
  Speaker 3: how she portrays how she feels, and how that's such
• 3:48:33
  Speaker 3: a hard thing because like, you persent a certain face
• 3:48:36
  Speaker 3: to the world and you expect people to react to that,
• 3:48:39
  Speaker 3: even though you may be terrified on the inside. And
• 3:48:42
  Speaker 3: he's reacting to the emotions that are on her inside
• 3:48:45
  Speaker 3: that she's trying to hide from the world, and that
• 3:48:48
  Speaker 3: drives her fucking nuts, you know, Like he's reacting wrong.
• 3:48:52
  Speaker 3: She's telling him, you know, and like, if you look
• 3:48:54
  Speaker 3: at it from that perspective, she is a very sympathetic
• 3:48:59
  Speaker 3: character who was dealing with a like emotionally crazy boyfriend
• 3:49:04
  Speaker 3: who's somehow figuring out what she's feeling even though she
• 3:49:07
  Speaker 3: doesn't want it to be And you know who's like
• 3:49:13
  Speaker 3: want she wants him to be strong, that's part of
• 3:49:15
  Speaker 3: her culture, and he's acting weak around her and strong
• 3:49:17
  Speaker 3: around this Barrelaine bitch. Like you know, like there's a
• 3:49:21
  Speaker 3: certain level of sympathy I have for her. Now, She's
• 3:49:25
  Speaker 3: flawed on many levels, as are all the character character, yeah,
• 3:49:30
  Speaker 3: which is what makes them human to me.
• 3:49:32
  Speaker 2: But but that that transition made me really re examine
• 3:49:37
  Speaker 2: Fayeel And then at the same time just really someone
• 3:49:40
  Speaker 2: said basically, like Matt doesn't says one thing, feels another thing,
• 3:49:46
  Speaker 2: and does the third thing.
• 3:49:47
  Speaker 3: And you have to examine those separately to figure him out.
• 3:49:50
  Speaker 3: And so those the combination of those two things.
• 3:49:53
  Speaker 5: Matt is one of those characters that I have such
• 3:49:55
  Speaker 5: a love hate relationship with sure, because like, I love Matt,
• 3:49:58
  Speaker 5: I think that he has some of the coolest adventures
• 3:50:01
  Speaker 5: and he has some of the like he is like
• 3:50:05
  Speaker 5: the the trope of the person that everybody wants to
• 3:50:09
  Speaker 5: be in an adventure. He finds himself in these crazy situations.
• 3:50:12
  Speaker 5: He always looks out and things just kind of work
• 3:50:14
  Speaker 5: for him. He has these crazy things that just fall
• 3:50:16
  Speaker 5: in his lap, and like that's what everybody thinks of
• 3:50:20
  Speaker 5: when they think of like a great adventure and what
• 3:50:21
  Speaker 5: it would be like, and he is that character and
• 3:50:24
  Speaker 5: the entire time he just cries about it.
• 3:50:31
  Speaker 9: Oh god, that's a good summary.
• 3:50:36
  Speaker 2: Actually, yes he does, but that does you know that
• 3:50:39
  Speaker 2: also plays under what Seth was saying, where he he
• 3:50:41
  Speaker 2: thinks one thing, says different something else, and acts in
• 3:50:46
  Speaker 2: like as C. He has a thought as A or
• 3:50:53
  Speaker 2: speeches B. His action is C. And we got to
• 3:50:58
  Speaker 2: see a Q example of that right the end of
• 3:51:02
  Speaker 2: Dragon the Dragon Reborn, Right when he's like, what was it?
• 3:51:06
  Speaker 2: He's thinking, like he's having thoughts while he's speaking, and
• 3:51:11
  Speaker 2: the thoughts are like, oh man, I hope Tom's better,
• 3:51:14
  Speaker 2: so like I'd like to hook up with him again
• 3:51:16
  Speaker 2: so we can get the hell out of this crazy stuff.
• 3:51:18
  Speaker 2: And while he's saying out loud, literally you can count
• 3:51:21
  Speaker 2: on me, guys.
• 3:51:25
  Speaker 3: And we know he does like something totally different, which
• 3:51:27
  Speaker 3: is like, which is follow the group, Like he just
• 3:51:30
  Speaker 3: stays with yeah totally yeah.
• 3:51:32
  Speaker 5: And see that's the thing is when if you look
• 3:51:34
  Speaker 5: at Matt and just his actions, he is easily one
• 3:51:37
  Speaker 5: of the most honorable characters in the entire series. That's
• 3:51:42
  Speaker 5: why does what is needed of him and what's right
• 3:51:45
  Speaker 5: of him. There are just certain things about Matt that
• 3:51:47
  Speaker 5: drive me nuts. And because womanizing, for some reason, rubbed
• 3:51:51
  Speaker 5: the wrong way. That's the wrong way. It's always rubbed
• 3:51:56
  Speaker 5: me the wrong way. I don't care about your drinking
• 3:51:58
  Speaker 5: and your gambling, go out and have fun, but the
• 3:52:00
  Speaker 5: fact that you treat women like accessories has always bothered me.
• 3:52:05
  Speaker 2: There is that, But at the same time, he only
• 3:52:08
  Speaker 2: chased women who encourage it.
• 3:52:11
  Speaker 3: You know, he was out there flirt like he is.
• 3:52:15
  Speaker 3: Essentially he's a pretty boy, you know, and women are
• 3:52:18
  Speaker 3: into him and he's like, yeah, sure, okay.
• 3:52:22
  Speaker 2: He's rich. I'm sure that helps. Yeah by accident.
• 3:52:25
  Speaker 5: Yeah he was rich by accident, and he still complains
• 3:52:29
  Speaker 5: about it.
• 3:52:32
  Speaker 2: Is is Matt a womanizer? Is that?
• 3:52:34
  Speaker 4: You know?
• 3:52:35
  Speaker 3: He gives money away to like women and children in need.
• 3:52:37
  Speaker 3: He does, and he like is constantly helping people with
• 3:52:41
  Speaker 3: his money.
• 3:52:43
  Speaker 2: I don't I don't know what I think of that,
• 3:52:45
  Speaker 2: am I Are you ready to classify Matt as a womanizer?
• 3:52:50
  Speaker 5: And that is definitely a womanizer. He goes into these ends.
• 3:52:54
  Speaker 5: He always looks for ends where they're not quite trashy
• 3:52:57
  Speaker 5: and garbage and the girls aren't gonna have crabs. But
• 3:53:02
  Speaker 5: he doesn't go into the ones where the girls would
• 3:53:05
  Speaker 5: smack him across the face for his impotent grins. Yeah,
• 3:53:09
  Speaker 5: he goes into the ones that are in the middle,
• 3:53:10
  Speaker 5: where the girls are just a little loose. They're they're
• 3:53:16
  Speaker 5: they're good enough that you know, they have a good
• 3:53:18
  Speaker 5: reputation and they're right in the public. But there's always
• 3:53:21
  Speaker 5: one or two of them that if he tips them
• 3:53:23
  Speaker 5: a silver penny and smiles at them and buys them
• 3:53:27
  Speaker 5: a drink when they're on their break, he knows he
• 3:53:30
  Speaker 5: can get his kiss and his cuddle at the end
• 3:53:32
  Speaker 5: of the night.
• 3:53:33
  Speaker 2: But he's not like they're not. I gotta say, I'm
• 3:53:36
  Speaker 2: curious what a radio thinks.
• 3:53:38
  Speaker 9: Yeah, I think, I mean, I think he's really chauvinistic.
• 3:53:44
  Speaker 9: He assumes women can't take care of themselves and assumes responsibility.
• 3:53:49
  Speaker 9: He is he is a product of his upbringing, and
• 3:53:52
  Speaker 9: I that's what really bothers me.
• 3:53:54
  Speaker 5: And like, but how is he a product of his upbringing?
• 3:53:57
  Speaker 5: Answer me that, because like man, the women, sorry, the
• 3:54:00
  Speaker 5: women of the of the Two Rivers. The women of
• 3:54:03
  Speaker 5: the Two Rivers. Look at Ninive, look at Igwayne, look
• 3:54:06
  Speaker 5: at Mistress Luhan. She killed the trollic with a frying pan.
• 3:54:11
  Speaker 5: What do you mean? They can't take care of themselves?
• 3:54:27
  Speaker 9: So, I mean I feel like I don't know with Matt.
• 3:54:30
  Speaker 9: It's like, especially when you finally get Brigida's POV when
• 3:54:36
  Speaker 9: they're in Caitlin and she talks like, so, first you
• 3:54:39
  Speaker 9: see an Olver, right, because Matt points out all these
• 3:54:43
  Speaker 9: traits about Oliver that he gets from the different Red Arms,
• 3:54:45
  Speaker 9: and he's like, but I don't know where he's getting,
• 3:54:47
  Speaker 9: you know that, like just Lasivius Leer from I don't
• 3:54:50
  Speaker 9: know why. He's trying to like them and you can't
• 3:54:53
  Speaker 9: do that. So first you see it with Oliver, and
• 3:54:55
  Speaker 9: then you see Brigida's.
• 3:54:56
  Speaker 6: Povy's like, wow, he's not slapping that girl's ass, and
• 3:55:01
  Speaker 6: I'm like, what the fuck He's like just casually like
• 3:55:04
  Speaker 6: fondling women in public because they're the barmaid, Like seriously.
• 3:55:08
  Speaker 9: Right now, Like that's not cool.
• 3:55:10
  Speaker 2: I'm not at all.
• 3:55:11
  Speaker 9: So you know, I'm I have issues with Matt, but
• 3:55:16
  Speaker 9: I really do think the analysis that he is like
• 3:55:20
  Speaker 9: the archetype of the happy go lucky adventurer, and then
• 3:55:24
  Speaker 9: Matt has to like live with all the consequences of that.
• 3:55:27
  Speaker 9: So it's like he still gets to be the happy,
• 3:55:28
  Speaker 9: go lucky adventurer, but he gets punished because you know,
• 3:55:31
  Speaker 9: it actually sucks to be doing that. So he's a
• 3:55:35
  Speaker 9: necessary character.
• 3:55:37
  Speaker 5: But I think Matt. I think that Matt kind of
• 3:55:41
  Speaker 5: portrays everything that Robert Jordan wanted the series to portray
• 3:55:45
  Speaker 5: about adventuring and the way that these kinds of situations
• 3:55:49
  Speaker 5: would actually work out. Like if you've ever listened to
• 3:55:51
  Speaker 5: his interview at the end of the audiobooks where he
• 3:55:53
  Speaker 5: says that, like an interview isn't gonna work, or an
• 3:55:56
  Speaker 5: adventure isn't going to work the way that it does
• 3:55:58
  Speaker 5: in like The Lord of the Ring where this old
• 3:56:00
  Speaker 5: wise wizard walks into the village says, hey, you're the
• 3:56:03
  Speaker 5: chosen one. It's your turn to save the world, and
• 3:56:05
  Speaker 5: everybody's just like all right, cool, let's go. There's going
• 3:56:07
  Speaker 5: to be all kinds of other things going on, and
• 3:56:09
  Speaker 5: there's going to be a lot more complicated storylines than that,
• 3:56:13
  Speaker 5: And you've got Matt who kind of shows that, and
• 3:56:18
  Speaker 5: you get to see both sides, because the stories always
• 3:56:22
  Speaker 5: show the fun stuff, So we get to see Matt's
• 3:56:25
  Speaker 5: fun stuff, his drinking, his gambling, his fighting, his luck
• 3:56:29
  Speaker 5: with the women and the beautiful women that he gets
• 3:56:32
  Speaker 5: to experience, and the beautiful cities that he gets to see,
• 3:56:35
  Speaker 5: and all of the stuff that he gets to do
• 3:56:37
  Speaker 5: that we normally think about when we think of an
• 3:56:40
  Speaker 5: adventure or a novel or a story. But we also
• 3:56:43
  Speaker 5: get to see the parts that don't make it into
• 3:56:46
  Speaker 5: the story, where he ends up in these battles all
• 3:56:49
  Speaker 5: the time that he didn't ask for and that he
• 3:56:51
  Speaker 5: tries to avoid and almost loses his life several times,
• 3:56:54
  Speaker 5: and does lose his life on at least one occasion.
• 3:56:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean him and a few other of the
• 3:57:02
  Speaker 3: main characters. I mean, it's uh, being dead and back
• 3:57:07
  Speaker 3: alive again is not a unique property of Matt.
• 3:57:10
  Speaker 5: No, it's not. I mean, there are several lives. I
• 3:57:14
  Speaker 5: mean you could say that it happened with Avianda, and
• 3:57:17
  Speaker 5: you could say that, I mean it did rand ever die?
• 3:57:23
  Speaker 3: I mean his body certainly did.
• 3:57:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 3:57:27
  Speaker 9: Yeah, yeah, my neeves doorway closed on her accepted test.
• 3:57:33
  Speaker 9: But Matt's like the cat of the series. He definitely
• 3:57:35
  Speaker 9: has the most lines.
• 3:57:38
  Speaker 2: Probably one of my favorite one liners I ever thought
• 3:57:41
  Speaker 2: of on the Fly was when we were talking about
• 3:57:43
  Speaker 2: n Knees accepted tests and I was like, the way
• 3:57:45
  Speaker 2: the way back comes but once unless you're Ninive, right.
• 3:57:51
  Speaker 5: And then it comes when you've goddamne exactly however many
• 3:57:55
  Speaker 5: times you want to.
• 3:57:56
  Speaker 3: She's fucking nine, Eve, Can we talk about nine for
• 3:57:59
  Speaker 3: a little while.
• 3:58:00
  Speaker 9: Oh, yeah, we've talked about Nina you want, Leah, Yes,
• 3:58:04
  Speaker 9: we are recording.
• 3:58:05
  Speaker 5: I actually literally today at work just finished the part
• 3:58:11
  Speaker 5: where uh, because I listened to the audiobooks. I just
• 3:58:13
  Speaker 5: finished her testing for the Shawl and God her getting
• 3:58:19
  Speaker 5: her getting voted, her getting voted into isid Iism. And
• 3:58:25
  Speaker 5: it's always such a powerful scene because it's like we
• 3:58:29
  Speaker 5: all know that isid ie are one of two things.
• 3:58:35
  Speaker 5: They're either the model of what the Tower wants them
• 3:58:39
  Speaker 5: to be or they're the model of what the world
• 3:58:41
  Speaker 5: needs them to be. And you see that in characters
• 3:58:45
  Speaker 5: like Ninive and A GWayne and Morain and kadzwayin they
• 3:58:49
  Speaker 5: are the people that the world needs them to be.
• 3:58:52
  Speaker 5: And then you see like uh, Little Interest and Romanda
• 3:58:57
  Speaker 5: or even Varian would be like what the world needs
• 3:58:59
  Speaker 5: her to be. But you see them like like a
• 3:59:02
  Speaker 5: Nora and Lelaine and Romanda and some of these other
• 3:59:06
  Speaker 5: I said, I who put dignity and isid I serenity
• 3:59:12
  Speaker 5: and the image of the White Tower over the service
• 3:59:17
  Speaker 5: of the White Tower.
• 3:59:19
  Speaker 2: I dig that.
• 3:59:22
  Speaker 9: Yeah, yeah, I did not. I'm kind of with Agnor
• 3:59:25
  Speaker 9: in the discord, like I did not understand her as
• 3:59:28
  Speaker 9: a kid, I really did not get her. But as
• 3:59:32
  Speaker 9: an adult, she makes a lot more sense.
• 3:59:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, a lot. I really have to agree with that.
• 3:59:40
  Speaker 2: I feel like, as I especially this last time this
• 3:59:44
  Speaker 2: reread that I'm kind of doing for the podcast or
• 3:59:47
  Speaker 2: with the podcast as an adult looking back, like she's
• 3:59:50
  Speaker 2: so young and she got thrust in this position of
• 3:59:52
  Speaker 2: power where people don't really you know, there's a couple,
• 3:59:55
  Speaker 2: I'm sure a couple of key people in her community
• 3:59:57
  Speaker 2: that thought she could handle it, but really no one
• 3:59:58
  Speaker 2: else did. So I kind of developed this characteristic where
• 4:00:03
  Speaker 2: she is like brutally heavy handed, heavily handed all the
• 4:00:08
  Speaker 2: time with everyone just to prove, yeah, to flex her
• 4:00:12
  Speaker 2: power all the time.
• 4:00:13
  Speaker 5: There was a scene right before she got to her testing,
• 4:00:16
  Speaker 5: and I kind of want to touch on something Jesus
• 4:00:18
  Speaker 5: said in the discord, But with Ninive, there was a
• 4:00:23
  Speaker 5: scene before her testing where Igwaine summons her to the
• 4:00:27
  Speaker 5: World of Dreams and is like, show up in the
• 4:00:29
  Speaker 5: World of Dreams and meet with me before I make
• 4:00:31
  Speaker 5: you regret it. And when she finally shows up and
• 4:00:36
  Speaker 5: Agwayne and her are talking and she's like, Ninive, I
• 4:00:38
  Speaker 5: actually didn't call you here to chastise you or to
• 4:00:42
  Speaker 5: do anything bad. I want your advice, and she goes
• 4:00:45
  Speaker 5: off about you know, I want your advice because you're
• 4:00:48
  Speaker 5: one of the only people that I know that's been
• 4:00:50
  Speaker 5: in a situation. It's been in a situation like mine
• 4:00:53
  Speaker 5: where you were thrust into this position of power and
• 4:00:57
  Speaker 5: influence and leadership way too young, and nobody took you
• 4:01:00
  Speaker 5: seriously because of your age. And I'm in a position
• 4:01:05
  Speaker 5: where I'm on the cusp of being the omerline that
• 4:01:08
  Speaker 5: I want to be and that I need to be,
• 4:01:11
  Speaker 5: and one misstep can make me the puppet of the hall.
• 4:01:15
  Speaker 5: How do I deal with this? And Ninieve, not realizing
• 4:01:20
  Speaker 5: that she's kind of setting up her own subjugation here,
• 4:01:24
  Speaker 5: goes and is like, you have to be firm and
• 4:01:27
  Speaker 5: you can't let them see you just making noise. You
• 4:01:31
  Speaker 5: people aren't gonna like you. You're gonna have to be heavy handed,
• 4:01:33
  Speaker 5: and you're gonna have to assert your authority and establish
• 4:01:38
  Speaker 5: that dominance. But it has to be done.
• 4:01:42
  Speaker 2: And then.
• 4:01:45
  Speaker 5: She kind of backs nine even into this corner, like,
• 4:01:47
  Speaker 5: but you're my friend and you don't do that.
• 4:01:49
  Speaker 3: It's a brilliant piece of politics, hmm. She she basically
• 4:01:56
  Speaker 3: learns from the former ambulance seat how to manipulate me
• 4:02:01
  Speaker 3: to make but I just think, think how to manipulate people.
• 4:02:04
  Speaker 2: And she applies that to Ninive.
• 4:02:06
  Speaker 9: And Swan was also really young for her office, you know,
• 4:02:10
  Speaker 9: years old, but that's incredibly young for anomerland. Anomenant should
• 4:02:14
  Speaker 9: be like one hundred and forty.
• 4:02:15
  Speaker 3: A lot of isaid I don't even get to be
• 4:02:17
  Speaker 3: isid eye until they're forty much less exactly.
• 4:02:20
  Speaker 9: So she had to learn the same lessons of being
• 4:02:23
  Speaker 9: an absolute hard ass and teaches that to be go in.
• 4:02:27
  Speaker 9: So we go into really a great, a great synthesis
• 4:02:29
  Speaker 9: of the big politics and the small village politics, but
• 4:02:33
  Speaker 9: from the same position of agism induced problems.
• 4:02:37
  Speaker 3: I was thrown in with the silver Pike.
• 4:02:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I always saw a lot of similarity between Ninive
• 4:02:43
  Speaker 2: and Swan just in that they're in their personalities and
• 4:02:48
  Speaker 2: maybe maybe a little bit in their upbringing. It seems
• 4:02:50
  Speaker 2: like Swan possibly had a little bit of a rougher time.
• 4:02:53
  Speaker 2: But they're just both these really tough women from.
• 4:02:56
  Speaker 3: Well farmer and fisherman's daughter. I don't feel like that
• 4:02:59
  Speaker 3: there's a big different there.
• 4:03:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a lot of similarity.
• 4:03:03
  Speaker 5: And I mean.
• 4:03:06
  Speaker 3: As opposed to Moraine, who was the daughter of Yeah,
• 4:03:11
  Speaker 3: she was totally royalty.
• 4:03:12
  Speaker 2: She was the king, right, the king right. So agen
• 4:03:16
  Speaker 2: are saying they're both like these strong working class women
• 4:03:19
  Speaker 2: that actually had to Yeah, that's a good way to
• 4:03:21
  Speaker 2: put it. They actually had to work for a living.
• 4:03:23
  Speaker 9: Yeah, they had different social positions within the context of
• 4:03:26
  Speaker 9: working class, and they lived in vastly different like urban environments.
• 4:03:30
  Speaker 9: I mean, and you've lived in a village, Swan lived
• 4:03:33
  Speaker 9: in tyr like, yeah, one of the biggest dragon like
• 4:03:37
  Speaker 9: she was living in a very urban environment and like
• 4:03:39
  Speaker 9: had to deal with that. So like there's that that's
• 4:03:41
  Speaker 9: different in their upbringing. But yeah, both hard working, sweat
• 4:03:45
  Speaker 9: of the bras, working class type.
• 4:03:47
  Speaker 2: Of motherfuckers, right, Yeah, for lack of a better term, Yeah, I.
• 4:03:53
  Speaker 3: Think that's one of the reasons why Suwan was able
• 4:03:55
  Speaker 3: to understand Rand on a level that I'm not sure
• 4:03:57
  Speaker 3: Moraine ever did.
• 4:03:59
  Speaker 9: Right.
• 4:04:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, Moraine never really got the rural part
• 4:04:07
  Speaker 3: of Rand.
• 4:04:09
  Speaker 2: Moraine grew up very privileged. She's been wealthy her entire.
• 4:04:12
  Speaker 9: Life, and she's totally one of those I sidai, who
• 4:04:16
  Speaker 9: will you know make herself into what the world needs.
• 4:04:18
  Speaker 9: I mean, she was a blue. She was the bluest
• 4:04:20
  Speaker 9: of blues. Sure, yes, so like yeah, I think Swan
• 4:04:26
  Speaker 9: by virtue of having to be omrelin, which is really
• 4:04:28
  Speaker 9: a different type of ice did I maybe, you know,
• 4:04:32
  Speaker 9: between that and her upbringing, her appreciation of Rand's situation
• 4:04:36
  Speaker 9: was maybe more nuanced. But Moraine also got the ball rolling.
• 4:04:39
  Speaker 9: I mean, she had no idea what she was going
• 4:04:42
  Speaker 9: to find, and she went in there with enough force
• 4:04:44
  Speaker 9: of will to make anybody come along and make anything happen.
• 4:04:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 4:04:49
  Speaker 3: Speaking of Moraine, what do you think about the news
• 4:04:51
  Speaker 3: that she may be the focus of the early Wheel
• 4:04:57
  Speaker 3: of Time series, that she may be quote unquote the
• 4:04:59
  Speaker 3: main character in the beginning.
• 4:05:01
  Speaker 9: My potion is that it was It's an awesome idea
• 4:05:05
  Speaker 9: because you'll be able to do so much world building
• 4:05:08
  Speaker 9: in her flashbacks and in her internal like monologue type stuff,
• 4:05:13
  Speaker 9: and like her just her pav You'll be able to
• 4:05:17
  Speaker 9: do so much quicker world building than walking the boys
• 4:05:19
  Speaker 9: through it, because they're really fucking dense.
• 4:05:22
  Speaker 3: Writing the book, and from her perspective, like you can
• 4:05:25
  Speaker 3: know what's going on in a way that you really
• 4:05:27
  Speaker 3: can't know from the boys perspective.
• 4:05:29
  Speaker 9: Exactly. If you give, like, yeah, like a ten minute
• 4:05:32
  Speaker 9: montage that hits on the high points of New Spring basically,
• 4:05:36
  Speaker 9: and my other has the wind rushing her into the
• 4:05:39
  Speaker 9: two rivers, then that would be a much better place
• 4:05:41
  Speaker 9: to start.
• 4:05:44
  Speaker 2: Throughout. Yeah, go for it.
• 4:05:46
  Speaker 5: To counter that, it's just that, like I've seen a
• 4:05:50
  Speaker 5: lot of people on Facebook and Twitter get really upset
• 4:05:54
  Speaker 5: about about Morain being portrayed as like the main character,
• 4:05:58
  Speaker 5: and I'm kind of just sitting back and looking at it,
• 4:06:00
  Speaker 5: Like nobody said that Morain's going to be the main character.
• 4:06:03
  Speaker 5: I just said that it's going to follow Morain. And
• 4:06:06
  Speaker 5: you can say, from you know, any angle, that the
• 4:06:09
  Speaker 5: first book of the series did follow Morain. She was
• 4:06:12
  Speaker 5: there through almost every scene, and she wasn't the main character,
• 4:06:17
  Speaker 5: but she was definitely the driving force behind everything.
• 4:06:21
  Speaker 2: The decision man, right, Yeah, yeah, no one else knows
• 4:06:26
  Speaker 2: what they're doing.
• 4:06:27
  Speaker 5: I also like don't want to sit there and take
• 4:06:29
  Speaker 5: that too seriously, because if you look through pick any
• 4:06:32
  Speaker 5: series that you've watched on Netflix that you've binged, and
• 4:06:36
  Speaker 5: read this series summary like the little Kicker that they
• 4:06:39
  Speaker 5: give you to like make it sound super interesting, and
• 4:06:42
  Speaker 5: like read the episode synopsies that they give you for
• 4:06:46
  Speaker 5: each episode. Yeah, and they're terrible and they're not really
• 4:06:51
  Speaker 5: accurate to what actually happened, right, So by them saying that,
• 4:06:55
  Speaker 5: you know, if you read the way that it was
• 4:06:59
  Speaker 5: put out with the announcement for the green light, it
• 4:07:03
  Speaker 5: it's almost pandering to the feminist movement in the sense
• 4:07:10
  Speaker 5: that we're putting they've they've built it to a they've
• 4:07:16
  Speaker 5: built it to a a to look like women are
• 4:07:22
  Speaker 5: the dominant sex and that only women can use magic
• 4:07:26
  Speaker 5: and women kind of rule the world. And the series
• 4:07:28
  Speaker 5: is going to follow this powerful woman who is part
• 4:07:31
  Speaker 5: of this world ruling class, and that is kind of
• 4:07:35
  Speaker 5: there to I think draw in the vocal crowd of
• 4:07:40
  Speaker 5: this age and this era in the world right now
• 4:07:44
  Speaker 5: where everybody kind of wants to see women in power
• 4:07:46
  Speaker 5: and people of color and power and I the thing
• 4:07:50
  Speaker 5: about the Wheel of Time is that if you're really
• 4:07:51
  Speaker 5: going to be true to it, which I really feel
• 4:07:53
  Speaker 5: like Raif will be, and Raith has already talked about
• 4:07:56
  Speaker 5: it in this in this attitude or in this this light.
• 4:08:00
  Speaker 2: That yeah, it's about to break in time. And just
• 4:08:03
  Speaker 2: to bring up that, Raife has pretty much specifically said
• 4:08:06
  Speaker 2: he really wants to put a focus on like powerful
• 4:08:09
  Speaker 2: female characters and uh, kind of take the LGBT characters
• 4:08:14
  Speaker 2: that are in the series and make it less subtle,
• 4:08:17
  Speaker 2: like just going.
• 4:08:18
  Speaker 5: Yeah, its subtle and not just about you know, situational homosexuality, right.
• 4:08:25
  Speaker 5: But even more than that, what I was getting at
• 4:08:27
  Speaker 5: was that Raife has already acknowledged that the series isn't
• 4:08:30
  Speaker 5: about you know, women being in power or men being
• 4:08:33
  Speaker 5: in power, or one being over the other. The series
• 4:08:36
  Speaker 5: is entirely about the restoration of balance and the complete
• 4:08:41
  Speaker 5: chaos that comes with a lack of that balance. And
• 4:08:45
  Speaker 5: I feel like we're going to see that transition throughout
• 4:08:48
  Speaker 5: the series of you know what happens when women are
• 4:08:51
  Speaker 5: completely in control. We're going to get that in the
• 4:08:53
  Speaker 5: beginning when women are completely in control, with the White
• 4:08:56
  Speaker 5: Tower being the height of power in the world shifting
• 4:08:59
  Speaker 5: that you Rand and the Aushaman being the height of
• 4:09:04
  Speaker 5: power in the world for a minute, and how that
• 4:09:06
  Speaker 5: they're two different kinds of chaos. But when Rand and
• 4:09:09
  Speaker 5: e Gwaine come together and figure out how to work
• 4:09:13
  Speaker 5: with each other, and not just Randon Egwain, but when
• 4:09:16
  Speaker 5: men and women, You've got Parian and fail, You've got
• 4:09:20
  Speaker 5: Rand and cats, Wayne and Rand and everybody else and
• 4:09:23
  Speaker 5: Matt and Tuan and the boys as a whole, with
• 4:09:28
  Speaker 5: Isidi as a whole, and the world as a whole
• 4:09:30
  Speaker 5: with Isidaye as a whole, these masculine and feminine energies
• 4:09:34
  Speaker 5: and forces learning to work with each other rather than
• 4:09:38
  Speaker 5: against each other. You see that transition throughout the series.
• 4:09:42
  Speaker 5: You see it shift from one source of power to
• 4:09:44
  Speaker 5: another source of power to a more unified front. And
• 4:09:47
  Speaker 5: it's an incredible journey. And I think that Rape understands that,
• 4:09:51
  Speaker 5: and Raith is going to implement that.
• 4:09:53
  Speaker 2: So I also kind of really wanted to add that
• 4:09:56
  Speaker 2: I am sort of down with it, like I'm cool
• 4:09:59
  Speaker 2: with Rave, even more or less explicitly stating I can't
• 4:10:03
  Speaker 2: remember the exact tweet, but I'm pretty sure it was
• 4:10:05
  Speaker 2: a tweet I read a while ago, more or less
• 4:10:06
  Speaker 2: explicitly stating that he's like kind of going, like going
• 4:10:10
  Speaker 2: to capitalize on the way culture is moving right now,
• 4:10:13
  Speaker 2: like me too, and like feminist stuff and like using
• 4:10:18
  Speaker 2: the wheel of time because the wheel, the Wheel of
• 4:10:20
  Speaker 2: Time has feminist themes in it, and it has people
• 4:10:24
  Speaker 2: of color, and it has queer people, and it's like,
• 4:10:28
  Speaker 2: you know what other fantasy series does, Like it's just
• 4:10:31
  Speaker 2: a bunch of white, straight people, like you.
• 4:10:34
  Speaker 3: Know, Broken Earth and Kate Jemison, Go fucking.
• 4:10:37
  Speaker 9: Leave it now there book, it's a new trilogy. I mean,
• 4:10:42
  Speaker 9: this show is absolutely in the nineties.
• 4:10:45
  Speaker 5: No, I mean when you when you just started that
• 4:10:48
  Speaker 5: in the fantasy genre, because if you look at old
• 4:10:51
  Speaker 5: fantasy and original fantasy and classic fantasy, the Hobbits are white,
• 4:10:55
  Speaker 5: the elves are white, as are where people are white,
• 4:11:03
  Speaker 5: and the aliens are green, but they're also invaders that
• 4:11:05
  Speaker 5: need to be killed.
• 4:11:07
  Speaker 9: Or the aliens are white because they're actually Martians or something.
• 4:11:10
  Speaker 5: Right, the aliens are white, and they're the higher power.
• 4:11:15
  Speaker 5: They're the higher white that's going to enlighten us, all right,
• 4:11:19
  Speaker 5: I like that.
• 4:11:20
  Speaker 9: Yeah, it's but ARCHI tried really hard. So the show
• 4:11:24
  Speaker 9: just has to really go yeah, a little bit deeper
• 4:11:26
  Speaker 9: into what he already laid out.
• 4:11:29
  Speaker 3: No, and and just based on the time what he implied.
• 4:11:31
  Speaker 5: We have to say straight out exactly right, exactly exactly.
• 4:11:36
  Speaker 5: That's such a beautiful way of putting it, what he
• 4:11:38
  Speaker 5: implied we have to say straight out because he was
• 4:11:41
  Speaker 5: implying this at a time where you couldn't say it
• 4:11:44
  Speaker 5: straight out without it being hot button topic material. And
• 4:11:49
  Speaker 5: now it's so much more commonly spoken of and even
• 4:11:53
  Speaker 5: demanded by people, like the world wants to see this
• 4:11:57
  Speaker 5: right now, so the world wants to see it.
• 4:12:00
  Speaker 9: Yeah, I just want to go into what Fire Phoenix
• 4:12:02
  Speaker 9: said in the discord about how we had I mean,
• 4:12:05
  Speaker 9: we continue to have a long discussion about how rape
• 4:12:07
  Speaker 9: is portrayed in the series. That's just something that we
• 4:12:10
  Speaker 9: do in the discord for anyone who didn't know. Yes,
• 4:12:12
  Speaker 9: but because it's a real world to shoot that's actually
• 4:12:15
  Speaker 9: in the books, and it's portrayed in the books like
• 4:12:19
  Speaker 9: the worst thing that can happen. Basically we don't see
• 4:12:21
  Speaker 9: it on screen, but it's held up as like one
• 4:12:23
  Speaker 9: of the worst things that can happen.
• 4:12:24
  Speaker 5: And worse than death, like it's and the reason we
• 4:12:27
  Speaker 5: don't see it on screen is because it is one
• 4:12:29
  Speaker 5: of the worst things that can happen. Like RJ treats
• 4:12:31
  Speaker 5: it like the taboo that.
• 4:12:32
  Speaker 9: It is right, which is just you know, unusual for
• 4:12:36
  Speaker 9: the genre. Shall we say?
• 4:12:38
  Speaker 5: Yeah, that's a good point, especially because if you look
• 4:12:41
  Speaker 5: at the other end of it, where you have authors
• 4:12:45
  Speaker 5: like George R. Martin, who also built an incredible world
• 4:12:48
  Speaker 5: and wrote an incredible story. You have him where he
• 4:12:52
  Speaker 5: like almost in depth, describes the rape way too much depth.
• 4:12:58
  Speaker 3: Can I put it? On the other end of that,
• 4:13:00
  Speaker 3: Piers Anthony describes rape scenes in much of his fantasy
• 4:13:04
  Speaker 3: for humorous effects.
• 4:13:08
  Speaker 2: Well, there is a heavy, heavy amount of magic induced
• 4:13:14
  Speaker 2: sex in Piers Anthony with nymphs or various other creatures,
• 4:13:20
  Speaker 2: and so like I, you know, when you talk about
• 4:13:23
  Speaker 2: various levels of rape, you can I feel like there's almost.
• 4:13:27
  Speaker 3: A triangle of treating it as something serious that is taboo,
• 4:13:32
  Speaker 3: treating as something that is carnage and viscous and almost enjoyable,
• 4:13:39
  Speaker 3: and treating it as humorous and dismissive. And I think
• 4:13:43
  Speaker 3: two of those are bad.
• 4:13:45
  Speaker 2: There's some of that in the Wheel of Time too.
• 4:13:46
  Speaker 2: We've had this conversation a bunch of times about Matt
• 4:13:49
  Speaker 2: and Tiland.
• 4:13:50
  Speaker 3: It's a tough conversation. I don't necessarily really want to
• 4:13:54
  Speaker 3: have it.
• 4:13:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I know, I kind of want to cowardly shrink
• 4:14:00
  Speaker 2: away from having this discussion because I'm you know, so.
• 4:14:03
  Speaker 3: Thanks for bringing it up.
• 4:14:07
  Speaker 2: Well done.
• 4:14:09
  Speaker 5: I feel like it's one of those things that's worth
• 4:14:12
  Speaker 5: talking about. Like, yeah, rape is a touchy subject, and
• 4:14:14
  Speaker 5: sexual violence is a very touchy subject, but it's also
• 4:14:18
  Speaker 5: one of those things that if you want to make
• 4:14:20
  Speaker 5: a difference with it, and if you want to show
• 4:14:23
  Speaker 5: the true effect of it and the impact that that
• 4:14:28
  Speaker 5: has on not just individuals but society, and not just
• 4:14:31
  Speaker 5: society but individuals like you, have to talk about it,
• 4:14:34
  Speaker 5: and you have to be able to look that demon
• 4:14:36
  Speaker 5: in the eye before you can slay it.
• 4:14:37
  Speaker 2: You're totally right. I'm just afraid to say something stupid
• 4:14:41
  Speaker 2: and then everyone will hate me. That's my fear I feel.
• 4:14:45
  Speaker 2: I feel.
• 4:14:47
  Speaker 5: But in those moments when something like that does happen again,
• 4:14:50
  Speaker 5: it's looking that demon in the eye and being like fuck, whereas, yeah,
• 4:14:53
  Speaker 5: I fucked up, I enabled that demon. Let me learn
• 4:14:55
  Speaker 5: from that mistake and faith.
• 4:14:56
  Speaker 3: Sure, I have the opposite problem because I feel like
• 4:14:59
  Speaker 3: I and I'm stuck on both sides of the argument.
• 4:15:03
  Speaker 3: I see it as a horrific rape, but I also
• 4:15:06
  Speaker 3: kind of find it entertaining, and like, because it's written
• 4:15:09
  Speaker 3: to be entertaining, it is, Yeah, it is, and I do,
• 4:15:13
  Speaker 3: and I have found it entertaining for most of my
• 4:15:16
  Speaker 3: life until recently, where holy shit, I said that it's like, wow,
• 4:15:23
  Speaker 3: actually this is bad, you know, and like I've had
• 4:15:27
  Speaker 3: to re examine that in my head. But at the
• 4:15:30
  Speaker 3: same time, I mean, I can still read it as funny.
• 4:15:33
  Speaker 5: I don't think that there's a I mean, I've never
• 4:15:38
  Speaker 5: found rape to be particularly funny, but to say that
• 4:15:42
  Speaker 5: I haven't found it entertaining would be a lie. Not
• 4:15:45
  Speaker 5: entertaining in a like, yeah, let's go watch people get
• 4:15:48
  Speaker 5: raped kind of thing. But it's like we find violence entertaining,
• 4:15:51
  Speaker 5: we find destruction entertaining. Does that make them good?
• 4:15:54
  Speaker 3: No, it's just it's just America's funniest home videos succeeded
• 4:16:00
  Speaker 3: on guys getting smacked in the ball.
• 4:16:03
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and then you had you had ridiculousness that came
• 4:16:06
  Speaker 5: after that did just as well for the exact same reason.
• 4:16:09
  Speaker 2: And it's just.
• 4:16:11
  Speaker 5: One of those things, like it's gonna be entertaining because
• 4:16:14
  Speaker 5: of the fact that it's so compelling. We don't find
• 4:16:16
  Speaker 5: it entertaining, or at least we shouldn't find it entertaining
• 4:16:19
  Speaker 5: because it's like relatable or interesting or like encouraging or inspiring.
• 4:16:24
  Speaker 5: Like I hope that people don't find rape inspiring unless
• 4:16:26
  Speaker 5: you find it inspiring to make a difference, But it's
• 4:16:30
  Speaker 5: definitely one of those things that tugs at our heartstrings
• 4:16:33
  Speaker 5: and inspires emotion and gets us emotionally and intellectually involved
• 4:16:38
  Speaker 5: in something because of the depth and the impact that
• 4:16:41
  Speaker 5: it has on people and societies. Yeah, so I just
• 4:16:45
  Speaker 5: it's it's one of those things that, yeah, you obviously
• 4:16:49
  Speaker 5: don't want to talk about it lightly, but not talking
• 4:16:53
  Speaker 5: about it isn't the answer either.
• 4:16:56
  Speaker 3: And I want to sort of obe Thunder said something
• 4:16:58
  Speaker 3: that I think is important, that it's really an attempt
• 4:17:02
  Speaker 3: to take someone who is a womanizer and put him
• 4:17:08
  Speaker 3: in the reverse situation where he is subject to a manonizer,
• 4:17:14
  Speaker 3: you know, like and and the idea is that he
• 4:17:17
  Speaker 3: the humor in it, is that he is in the
• 4:17:19
  Speaker 3: opposite situation as usual, that he is experiencing the relationship
• 4:17:25
  Speaker 3: from the other side, and.
• 4:17:29
  Speaker 2: In order to and in a culture where it's kind
• 4:17:32
  Speaker 2: of cool exactly.
• 4:17:33
  Speaker 3: And the culture where women are dominant and men are subordinate,
• 4:17:36
  Speaker 3: and he's experiencing just you know, as basically a victim
• 4:17:41
  Speaker 3: of his own womanizing. And what I feel is super
• 4:17:44
  Speaker 3: important about that is that And I'm stalling because I
• 4:17:47
  Speaker 3: forgot what I was going to say.
• 4:17:50
  Speaker 5: Uh, ob I kind of have to disagree a little
• 4:17:53
  Speaker 5: bit though, because like the culture was exactly that all
• 4:17:56
  Speaker 5: women saw it as normal, Like, yeah, well, right now,
• 4:18:00
  Speaker 5: society almost sees it as normal to put women in
• 4:18:03
  Speaker 5: those kinds of situations and to be misogynistic, and like
• 4:18:07
  Speaker 5: rape culture and rape jokes are you know, a societal
• 4:18:11
  Speaker 5: norm That doesn't make it right, That doesn't make it okay.
• 4:18:14
  Speaker 5: And just because it was okay for the queen of
• 4:18:17
  Speaker 5: this country where women are obviously the powerhouse of a relationship,
• 4:18:21
  Speaker 5: doesn't make it okay to mistreat a man that has
• 4:18:24
  Speaker 5: expressly stated that he's uncomfortable with the situation or doesn't
• 4:18:28
  Speaker 5: like the situation or once out of the situation, Like
• 4:18:32
  Speaker 5: it's hard for me to say that it wasn't rape
• 4:18:35
  Speaker 5: when she literally locked him in a room and refused
• 4:18:40
  Speaker 5: to let him eat until she got her way with him.
• 4:18:45
  Speaker 2: It's brutal.
• 4:18:45
  Speaker 3: I'm just yeah, no, yeah, absolutely. My point was that
• 4:18:50
  Speaker 3: Robert Jordan, in order to sort of make this equivalence
• 4:18:53
  Speaker 3: maybe sort of when he flipped it in order to
• 4:18:56
  Speaker 3: be like, oh, why wouldn't Matt just have sex with
• 4:18:59
  Speaker 3: her and Lee? If he had to like make some
• 4:19:01
  Speaker 3: sort of he went to extremes with it, and so
• 4:19:06
  Speaker 3: instead of being just a reversal of roles, it really
• 4:19:09
  Speaker 3: if you strictly reverse the roles, it would be rape.
• 4:19:12
  Speaker 3: It's just that he had to take it to extremes
• 4:19:14
  Speaker 3: to make it what he felt realistic, having a male
• 4:19:19
  Speaker 3: in the situation as a female, Like he was really
• 4:19:22
  Speaker 3: just trying to flip the situation, and in order to
• 4:19:25
  Speaker 3: make it more compelling by our standards, he made it rapee.
• 4:19:30
  Speaker 2: I really liked that. Jesus for ANGI is bringing up
• 4:19:32
  Speaker 2: like Tayland tells him to smile, like it's really the
• 4:19:36
  Speaker 2: complete role reversal, like oh, such a pretty face, Like
• 4:19:40
  Speaker 2: why don't you smile for me? You know that whole thing.
• 4:19:43
  Speaker 3: I mean, I believe Harriet wrote that line.
• 4:19:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I honestly wouldn't surprise me. Yeah, and
• 4:19:51
  Speaker 2: it maybe is interesting and like Travis was saying important
• 4:19:56
  Speaker 2: to have these kind of conversations because to like to
• 4:19:59
  Speaker 2: read that scene over again and like with viewed through
• 4:20:05
  Speaker 2: the lens of culture now is like, sure, it's creepy,
• 4:20:08
  Speaker 2: but it also like it puts things into perspective and
• 4:20:11
  Speaker 2: in a way that like kind of what I was
• 4:20:13
  Speaker 2: getting up before is like being a masculine presenting, straight
• 4:20:16
  Speaker 2: white guy often like cringe away from these conversations because
• 4:20:19
  Speaker 2: I don't want to be that guy who like has
• 4:20:22
  Speaker 2: all these opinions about feminism and rape culture and that,
• 4:20:25
  Speaker 2: you know, but this also helps put it into perspective
• 4:20:28
  Speaker 2: so that like I can see this through like the
• 4:20:32
  Speaker 2: eyes of a character that I feel like is like myself,
• 4:20:35
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean, or that looks like me,
• 4:20:37
  Speaker 2: you know, you know.
• 4:20:39
  Speaker 3: I also want to say it's a straight white guy.
• 4:20:42
  Speaker 3: The number of conversations I've been approached with assuming I
• 4:20:45
  Speaker 3: have certain opinions.
• 4:20:46
  Speaker 2: Oh well sure, I.
• 4:20:51
  Speaker 3: Anyway, The number of times like, sorry, I'm trying to
• 4:20:59
  Speaker 3: avoid talking about politics right now.
• 4:21:01
  Speaker 5: They can always get edited out. Yeah, but no, I
• 4:21:06
  Speaker 5: understand important. I mean, it is an important subject, and
• 4:21:10
  Speaker 5: it's one of those subjects that we can go on
• 4:21:12
  Speaker 5: and on about for days, and sure, ultimately I think
• 4:21:15
  Speaker 5: that for the most part, everybody in this discord agrees
• 4:21:18
  Speaker 5: that rape is bad and that rape.
• 4:21:21
  Speaker 2: Whoa, I wouldn't go seth. I mean, and if you.
• 4:21:26
  Speaker 5: Don't, please kindly find your way out of this person
• 4:21:29
  Speaker 5: right right, right right, I'll show you the door with
• 4:21:33
  Speaker 5: the band hammer. Go ahead and now, and Agnor will
• 4:21:37
  Speaker 5: be more than happy to accommodate.
• 4:21:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I have.
• 4:21:43
  Speaker 9: I just want to say, I think it's really cool
• 4:21:46
  Speaker 9: that we all know the scene is coming and we
• 4:21:48
  Speaker 9: are having this conversation so many times, and we're going
• 4:21:51
  Speaker 9: to rehash all of this get when we get there.
• 4:21:56
  Speaker 9: Like I mean, on the one hand, I was like, man,
• 4:21:58
  Speaker 9: we're talking about this a whole bunch. But on the
• 4:22:00
  Speaker 9: other hand, it's like we really get to process this
• 4:22:02
  Speaker 9: as a community, like repeatedly through this experience, we all
• 4:22:06
  Speaker 9: share of having read that scene however many times, and I.
• 4:22:09
  Speaker 2: Just think it's really it's a big part of his story.
• 4:22:11
  Speaker 9: Yeah, I think it's a really cool thing we have
• 4:22:14
  Speaker 9: that we can do that.
• 4:22:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, he's there for a whole book, Like there's a
• 4:22:19
  Speaker 3: lot of material with Matt and time.
• 4:22:22
  Speaker 2: He's there for a little bit more than a sake.
• 4:22:24
  Speaker 3: Oh well, there's a whole gap where he's not in
• 4:22:26
  Speaker 3: a book.
• 4:22:28
  Speaker 2: I mean, which book is the Thailand stuff? Does anyone
• 4:22:33
  Speaker 2: before I know that I'm asking it difficulty? Yeah, No,
• 4:22:39
  Speaker 2: it's after A Lord of Chaos is a Crown of Swords.
• 4:22:42
  Speaker 2: I thought I think it might Then I thought I was.
• 4:22:45
  Speaker 2: Then I doubt myself might be.
• 4:22:48
  Speaker 5: I think it might be like maybe a little bit
• 4:22:50
  Speaker 5: towards the end of Crowd of Swords, through most of
• 4:22:55
  Speaker 5: Crown of Sorts. I meant to say, through the end
• 4:23:02
  Speaker 5: of Lord of Chaos and through most of kind of Swords.
• 4:23:05
  Speaker 5: That's what was supposed to come out of my mouth.
• 4:23:08
  Speaker 2: Oh, I see, I see.
• 4:23:10
  Speaker 5: It's like I because they use the Bowl of the
• 4:23:13
  Speaker 5: Winds at the end of book seven, right, which is
• 4:23:16
  Speaker 5: Crowd of Swords.
• 4:23:19
  Speaker 2: Yes, I can never keep track.
• 4:23:23
  Speaker 5: Right, I've read the series so many times, and I
• 4:23:25
  Speaker 5: know the sequence of events. But because I've read the
• 4:23:29
  Speaker 5: series so many times, I stop paying attention to what
• 4:23:30
  Speaker 5: happens and what book Book eight is where he cleanses
• 4:23:34
  Speaker 5: the source. Book nine is where he cleanses the source.
• 4:23:37
  Speaker 5: I'll never forget that.
• 4:23:38
  Speaker 2: To Adbit, You're right, you're right, right, right, right, right, right,
• 4:23:41
  Speaker 2: I always think when it's it's book eight, but it's
• 4:23:43
  Speaker 2: really book nine.
• 4:23:45
  Speaker 9: There are books.
• 4:23:49
  Speaker 2: That's how I just place events, like I remember what's
• 4:23:53
  Speaker 2: happening around that time, like what everybody else is doing,
• 4:23:56
  Speaker 2: and I don't really.
• 4:23:57
  Speaker 3: Know clesing is the cleansing book nine ten. The cleansing
• 4:24:02
  Speaker 3: is really thislog because you go back in top Jack.
• 4:24:06
  Speaker 9: No, cleansing is just like the last just like the
• 4:24:08
  Speaker 9: last two or three chapters.
• 4:24:11
  Speaker 5: Yeah yeah, and then like the first twenty chapters of
• 4:24:14
  Speaker 5: the next that right, it's such a like it's funny
• 4:24:19
  Speaker 5: to think that, like when book ten comes in and
• 4:24:23
  Speaker 5: you're like reliving the moments before the cleansing and the
• 4:24:28
  Speaker 5: moments during the cleansing, in the moments after the cleansing,
• 4:24:31
  Speaker 5: like to think, like the first third of book ten
• 4:24:35
  Speaker 5: really takes place over like several hours.
• 4:24:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 4:24:41
  Speaker 3: No, it's it's incredible, like especially when you when in
• 4:24:44
  Speaker 3: real time you were waiting years. Sorry, Timber started growling
• 4:25:01
  Speaker 3: at me because he has a bone, and I was
• 4:25:02
  Speaker 3: spoken at him, I don't love you, guys.
• 4:25:04
  Speaker 5: My dog is Oh I got a dog since the
• 4:25:07
  Speaker 5: last time I've been on the show.
• 4:25:08
  Speaker 2: Oh wow, congratulations.
• 4:25:10
  Speaker 5: I mean you've probably seen him in the discord. But
• 4:25:14
  Speaker 5: last time, I had a cat and she wouldn't stop talking.
• 4:25:17
  Speaker 5: And now I have a dog and he won't stop
• 4:25:19
  Speaker 5: clawing his way across the kitchen tile. So you guys
• 4:25:22
  Speaker 5: have probably heard him scampering back and forth.
• 4:25:24
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I think I did a couple of times.
• 4:25:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 4:25:27
  Speaker 3: Stone Dog says that book when it came out was
• 4:25:29
  Speaker 3: so frustrating, and I totally agree, because, like, the cleansing happened,
• 4:25:32
  Speaker 3: and he wanted to know what happened after the cleansing,
• 4:25:35
  Speaker 3: and that entire book was about what happened before the
• 4:25:38
  Speaker 3: cleansing and during the cleansing and during the cleansing, and
• 4:25:41
  Speaker 3: you were just like, oh my god, I just want
• 4:25:43
  Speaker 3: to find out what happens next.
• 4:25:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 4:25:46
  Speaker 5: It wasn't really even until like book what eleven, yeah, twelve,
• 4:25:52
  Speaker 5: that we really start to see the after effects of
• 4:25:54
  Speaker 5: the cleansing.
• 4:25:55
  Speaker 3: Yeah, no, it's incredible, Like how I mean, And that's
• 4:25:58
  Speaker 3: where I think the origin of this slog comes strong.
• 4:26:01
  Speaker 3: And like, in real time reading through these books, it
• 4:26:04
  Speaker 3: doesn't bother me at all, But when you had to
• 4:26:06
  Speaker 3: wait years between the books, yeah, it was a big
• 4:26:08
  Speaker 3: fucking problem to go back in time and not know
• 4:26:11
  Speaker 3: what happens, Like, are you kidding me, Robert Jordan, I'm
• 4:26:14
  Speaker 3: coming after you, Like.
• 4:26:18
  Speaker 5: Are we gonna pause anytime soon to take potty breaks and.
• 4:26:21
  Speaker 3: Stuff we've been slipping away to do so.
• 4:26:23
  Speaker 2: I actually just got back.
• 4:26:26
  Speaker 3: Oh but yeah, we can totally take a break if
• 4:26:28
  Speaker 3: you want, for drinks and potty breaks and all that
• 4:26:32
  Speaker 3: kind of stuff.
• 4:26:34
  Speaker 2: No, that's a good suggestion. Let's let's refill some beers and.
• 4:26:39
  Speaker 9: Oh, hey, everyone at everyone, Leah's saying that I should
• 4:26:43
  Speaker 9: tell you that there's still spots to hang out, hang
• 4:26:46
  Speaker 9: on Friday, spots to hang on Friday. So yeah, everyone
• 4:26:49
  Speaker 9: who's listening to that, just on Saturday.
• 4:26:52
  Speaker 3: And Saturday, everyone who's listening, If you can make your
• 4:26:54
  Speaker 3: way to Portland, Oregon on October twelfth, thirteenth, fourteenth, there's still.
• 4:27:00
  Speaker 2: Space for you to hang out.
• 4:27:01
  Speaker 3: Do it, Come chill. We've got at least twenty four
• 4:27:05
  Speaker 3: people showing up. You will not be the only one,
• 4:27:09
  Speaker 3: but it'll be a fun group. It's gonna be a blast.
• 4:27:13
  Speaker 5: Is this getting published? Like, are people gonna hear about
• 4:27:16
  Speaker 5: this in the podcast?
• 4:27:17
  Speaker 2: Probably? Cool.
• 4:27:20
  Speaker 9: Yeah, we've got a channel in the discord you can
• 4:27:22
  Speaker 9: message Leah. Everyone should wear the color of their audia.
• 4:27:26
  Speaker 5: Also, seriously, guys, if you listen to the podcast and
• 4:27:29
  Speaker 5: you're not in the discord, please join the discord. Look
• 4:27:32
  Speaker 5: us up, find us, like for real, because.
• 4:27:35
  Speaker 9: Yeah, we're cool.
• 4:27:36
  Speaker 5: We're cool people and we love new people. And even
• 4:27:39
  Speaker 5: if you're not gonna be a patron, which is fine,
• 4:27:42
  Speaker 5: you're by no means obligated to become a patron, but
• 4:27:45
  Speaker 5: join us in the discord. You can still participate in
• 4:27:47
  Speaker 5: the conversations and the discussions and the fun. Then oh yes, yes, yeah,
• 4:27:54
  Speaker 5: we never stopped recording. I forgot, like, by all means,
• 4:27:58
  Speaker 5: join us in the discord, like you guys are all welcome.
• 4:28:02
  Speaker 9: God, I haven't listened to an episode in so long,
• 4:28:05
  Speaker 9: but I don't feel like I'm missing out that much
• 4:28:07
  Speaker 9: because I get to participate in the discord and stuff.
• 4:28:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, people who are there for the live recordings don't. Really.
• 4:28:15
  Speaker 2: I wonder about that sometimes, how many people are listening
• 4:28:20
  Speaker 2: to the live recording and listening to the episode when
• 4:28:24
  Speaker 2: it's released, or the opposite, like how many people just
• 4:28:26
  Speaker 2: listen live? Because I kind of I could see it, Like,
• 4:28:29
  Speaker 2: I don't blame you.
• 4:28:31
  Speaker 5: Recently, I've only listened live, but because I've missed a
• 4:28:34
  Speaker 5: lot of the more recent live recordings. I still download
• 4:28:38
  Speaker 5: because I still want you guys to get your downloads.
• 4:28:41
  Speaker 5: I subscribe, so it just automatically downloads.
• 4:28:44
  Speaker 2: Please subscribe.
• 4:28:46
  Speaker 5: But I haven't actually gone back. I honestly haven't listened
• 4:28:53
  Speaker 5: to an episode since the last time. This is gonna
• 4:28:57
  Speaker 5: sound so vain. I'm so sorry. I haven't listen to
• 4:29:00
  Speaker 5: an episode since the last time I was on the show.
• 4:29:05
  Speaker 2: I bet you're gonna listen.
• 4:29:06
  Speaker 9: To we haven't listened. I haven't gotten to participate in
• 4:29:09
  Speaker 9: the live recordings a lot lately because I've had stuff
• 4:29:12
  Speaker 9: going on and I haven't really had a place in
• 4:29:13
  Speaker 9: my life to listen to podcasts. So I'm like just
• 4:29:15
  Speaker 9: building up a massive binge, which like I'm low key
• 4:29:18
  Speaker 9: excited about.
• 4:29:19
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm not sad about the fangs that I have
• 4:29:21
  Speaker 5: ahead of me because that's episode like one twenty six,
• 4:29:25
  Speaker 5: one twenty seven, and we're at like one fifties.
• 4:29:28
  Speaker 2: Three or something like that now. So I have.
• 4:29:31
  Speaker 5: Lots of binging to do, and I'm excited for it
• 4:29:34
  Speaker 5: because I plan on going back and listening by all means, right.
• 4:29:37
  Speaker 9: And I hate missing the live recordings.
• 4:29:40
  Speaker 3: So what I'm hearing is we're releasing the episodes too quickly.
• 4:29:44
  Speaker 3: I should just slow way down and release few make
• 4:29:48
  Speaker 3: this last longer.
• 4:29:51
  Speaker 9: I mean, we can always you know, no, just don't,
• 4:29:58
  Speaker 9: just please don't.
• 4:29:59
  Speaker 5: We can always not do that, no, seriously progressively less os.
• 4:30:07
  Speaker 9: Yeah, and now now you've made fate sad, so so
• 4:30:11
  Speaker 9: don't do that. Don't make fit sad. I cat missing
• 4:30:15
  Speaker 9: the live recordings, but you guys, you guys cannot do
• 4:30:17
  Speaker 9: live recordings on Tuesday and Thursday nights able to come,
• 4:30:22
  Speaker 9: so don't stop.
• 4:30:23
  Speaker 2: It for for now, it's going to be just like
• 4:30:26
  Speaker 2: when we can. We are both looking forward to getting
• 4:30:29
  Speaker 2: back to a regular schedule because I really liked being
• 4:30:33
  Speaker 2: what was it Thursday, Sunday, Monday or something Thursday, Saturday Monday. Yeah,
• 4:30:39
  Speaker 2: for the longest time where that was what we did.
• 4:30:42
  Speaker 9: But yeah, yeah, I just I can never make it
• 4:30:45
  Speaker 9: to Thursdays and it gives me so many sads.
• 4:30:48
  Speaker 2: Hey, you used to be able to make it because.
• 4:30:51
  Speaker 9: I was hurt. I couldn't. I couldn't go to aikido
• 4:30:53
  Speaker 9: class because my ankle was hurt, so I could go
• 4:30:55
  Speaker 9: to Thursday sessions. But now my ankle is better, I
• 4:30:58
  Speaker 9: can't be part of the Thursday you know the solutions.
• 4:31:02
  Speaker 9: After you come on nice today.
• 4:31:04
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna have to break your ankle.
• 4:31:06
  Speaker 9: No, you need to adhere to my schedule.
• 4:31:11
  Speaker 5: So everybody at Spoiler con injure a radio.
• 4:31:19
  Speaker 9: Oh man, you guys are great. No, I you guys
• 4:31:22
  Speaker 9: just need to fucking adhere to my.
• 4:31:26
  Speaker 3: Well, if you send us an email and let us
• 4:31:27
  Speaker 3: know what it is, we'll work on it.
• 4:31:29
  Speaker 5: You guys, keep doing what you're doing, because it works
• 4:31:32
  Speaker 5: great for me, except for that one day that I
• 4:31:35
  Speaker 5: saw you guys were recording, but I didn't see that
• 4:31:37
  Speaker 5: you were recording at noon, so I didn't tune in
• 4:31:39
  Speaker 5: at work, and I was really pissed off when I
• 4:31:41
  Speaker 5: discovered what happened after work. Sorry, don't worry us.
• 4:31:47
  Speaker 3: Getting up early in recording is not going to be
• 4:31:50
  Speaker 3: a hobbit, no habit.
• 4:31:54
  Speaker 5: You I feel that.
• 4:31:57
  Speaker 9: I hope you do morning person so not a morning
• 4:32:00
  Speaker 9: person I cannot do.
• 4:32:02
  Speaker 2: I am a morning person. Patrick is not.
• 4:32:05
  Speaker 4: No.
• 4:32:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think I could drag Patrick to the
• 4:32:09
  Speaker 2: microphone before noon. I mean, like even that was didn't
• 4:32:15
  Speaker 2: we start recording like at noon or something like that? Yeah? Yeah,
• 4:32:18
  Speaker 2: I mean I got it. But you know, it's also
• 4:32:23
  Speaker 2: particularly my schedule is so freaking weird now because I
• 4:32:26
  Speaker 2: used to only work brunch as a bartender, which is
• 4:32:32
  Speaker 2: this great niche thing that you can do in Portland.
• 4:32:34
  Speaker 2: You can be a bartender and make a bartender's living
• 4:32:37
  Speaker 2: and work from eight to three. It's fucking great. But
• 4:32:42
  Speaker 2: now I work at like a regular bar where I
• 4:32:44
  Speaker 2: kind of do both. So my sleep schedule is just
• 4:32:46
  Speaker 2: all over the place. I work brunch Saturday, Sunday close
• 4:32:50
  Speaker 2: Monday night, so then I'm up till two am. Why
• 4:32:55
  Speaker 2: then that's like when I'm done, so that I can't
• 4:32:59
  Speaker 2: finish war and just go to sleep. It's impossible. You know.
• 4:33:03
  Speaker 5: There was a good stent of time, like a week ago,
• 4:33:05
  Speaker 5: that I wanted you guys to live where I live
• 4:33:07
  Speaker 5: because my job was hiring and we just needed somebody
• 4:33:11
  Speaker 5: who was reasonably intelligent and sounds good on the phone,
• 4:33:14
  Speaker 5: which either of you guys fit that criterion, and it
• 4:33:19
  Speaker 5: would have been a perfect, like nine to five job
• 4:33:24
  Speaker 5: Monday through Friday, so you guys would have had evenings
• 4:33:27
  Speaker 5: and weekends to do whatever you wanted.
• 4:33:29
  Speaker 2: I've had phone jobs before. There's a reason I do
• 4:33:32
  Speaker 2: what I do. That's fair and it's not working in
• 4:33:37
  Speaker 2: an office. Well, seth, you worked in an office for
• 4:33:40
  Speaker 2: a long time. I understand wanting to do something different.
• 4:33:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm relatively new to the food business. I'm still
• 4:33:45
  Speaker 3: enjoying the perks such as free beer, free food, the
• 4:33:49
  Speaker 3: ability to you know, drink on the job.
• 4:33:55
  Speaker 2: Which is a poorly kept secret of being a cook
• 4:33:58
  Speaker 2: hashtag chef is drunk. I'm not talking about home cooking.
• 4:34:05
  Speaker 2: I'm talking about kitchen cooking. Right, professionals are drunk, right exactly? Yeah, no,
• 4:34:12
  Speaker 2: I don't. It's not like you know, not only I'm
• 4:34:16
  Speaker 2: exaggerating quite a bit.
• 4:34:17
  Speaker 5: I'm just I can see it. I can see it.
• 4:34:21
  Speaker 5: It's like one of the few jobs where I can
• 4:34:22
  Speaker 5: really see, like work beers being the most acceptable thing ever. Exactly,
• 4:34:31
  Speaker 5: how come we never see any drunk cooks in the
• 4:34:33
  Speaker 5: wheel of time, now that you mentioned it, Like, none
• 4:34:36
  Speaker 5: of the cooks are drunk.
• 4:34:37
  Speaker 3: Oh that's what you thinks.
• 4:34:40
  Speaker 2: Just have a really high tolerance.
• 4:34:43
  Speaker 3: You think Master Lvier makes all that or Tam makes
• 4:34:49
  Speaker 3: all that cider and doesn't drink any of it.
• 4:34:52
  Speaker 2: Sitting alone out in a farm in the middle of nowhere, Like,
• 4:34:54
  Speaker 2: what do.
• 4:34:55
  Speaker 3: You do raising your sun by yourself work in drink
• 4:34:58
  Speaker 3: River's back and drinking your apples.
• 4:35:00
  Speaker 2: Got like twelve books. That's it.
• 4:35:03
  Speaker 5: Shit does Master Alvier? Does he actually make liquor? I
• 4:35:08
  Speaker 5: thought I thought brandy. I thought, yeah, I thought that
• 4:35:12
  Speaker 5: Tam did that. I thought Tam was the liquor master.
• 4:35:14
  Speaker 5: I thought he made the brandy.
• 4:35:16
  Speaker 2: No, No, Tam just makes a cider.
• 4:35:20
  Speaker 9: Yeah, Master Olvir makes makes.
• 4:35:22
  Speaker 2: Brandy, doesn't doesn't In the first chapter, isn't Tam bringing
• 4:35:26
  Speaker 2: like it's a lot of cider and a little bit
• 4:35:28
  Speaker 2: of a little bit of brandy or something like that.
• 4:35:31
  Speaker 9: Yeah, but Master Alvir also makes brandy. Probably they all
• 4:35:35
  Speaker 9: make brandy. Insider like, I mean, if you think about like, okay,
• 4:35:38
  Speaker 9: so up in Oregon, I was just writing with this
• 4:35:39
  Speaker 9: for an assignment. Today, we have shit tons of pioneer
• 4:35:42
  Speaker 9: apple orchards and like homestead trees like all over the place.
• 4:35:46
  Speaker 9: So if you imagine like the Two Rivers as being
• 4:35:48
  Speaker 9: like Oregon territory, there's a lot of work. Like everyone
• 4:35:52
  Speaker 9: has orchards. Yeah, everybody has orchards.
• 4:35:55
  Speaker 2: I seriously last week ate breakfast on my ten block
• 4:35:59
  Speaker 2: walk to work. I ate figs and apples.
• 4:36:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah that's amazing.
• 4:36:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they just they just hang out over the street.
• 4:36:07
  Speaker 5: My boss brought fresh figs to work the other week
• 4:36:11
  Speaker 5: and they were so good.
• 4:36:14
  Speaker 9: Yeah, we got fresh plums from my husband's work. He
• 4:36:17
  Speaker 9: just like got a basket of plums handed to him
• 4:36:19
  Speaker 9: by his boss, Like, here, I have plums.
• 4:36:21
  Speaker 2: I went to go to get breakfast and on the
• 4:36:25
  Speaker 2: way I encountered a fig tree and I started eating
• 4:36:27
  Speaker 2: fresh figs.
• 4:36:29
  Speaker 3: And by the time I was done, I was like, oh,
• 4:36:31
  Speaker 3: oh I'm full. Yeah, right, all right, I'm gonna go home.
• 4:36:34
  Speaker 2: And make some coffee. And that was my breakfast.
• 4:36:37
  Speaker 3: I've totally done that where I was like, oh, I'm
• 4:36:38
  Speaker 3: just gonna go to the breakfast place and I literally
• 4:36:42
  Speaker 3: ate breakfast on the way and decided not to go
• 4:36:45
  Speaker 3: pay money.
• 4:36:45
  Speaker 2: For We were probably eating from the same tree, probably, Yeah,
• 4:36:49
  Speaker 2: I mean, well it's hard, there's so many trees around here. Yeah.
• 4:36:52
  Speaker 2: I actually had to pull over.
• 4:36:53
  Speaker 3: I was driving.
• 4:36:55
  Speaker 2: I don't know where I was.
• 4:36:56
  Speaker 3: I was not close to here, and I saw a
• 4:36:58
  Speaker 3: fig tree where the figs turned dark purple and like
• 4:37:02
  Speaker 3: they look they look like Christmas tree ornaments.
• 4:37:05
  Speaker 2: That's when they're perfect. Yeah, And so I pulled over
• 4:37:08
  Speaker 2: and I had to just pick a bunch of those.
• 4:37:10
  Speaker 5: There's something about sunwarm produce that is unlike anything else
• 4:37:14
  Speaker 5: in the.
• 4:37:15
  Speaker 2: World, absolutely directly off the tree. We may be hunter gatherers.
• 4:37:22
  Speaker 9: Urban hunter gatherers, hipster.
• 4:37:25
  Speaker 2: Hunter gatherers, hunter hip hipster hunters hips.
• 4:37:30
  Speaker 9: Hipster gatherers.
• 4:37:32
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and ebudar. They make lemonade. Remember Matt bites a
• 4:37:35
  Speaker 5: lemon and refuses to drink lemonade.
• 4:37:38
  Speaker 9: It's just like, why would anyone drink I will not
• 4:37:41
  Speaker 9: drink anything made of that. That is nonsense.
• 4:37:46
  Speaker 3: That that totally flew by me.
• 4:37:47
  Speaker 2: You know a line I think about all the time.
• 4:37:50
  Speaker 2: Strawberries don't taste like straw at all.
• 4:37:52
  Speaker 5: It's like, I think that's.
• 4:37:54
  Speaker 2: A naive when she's in the South somewhere.
• 4:37:56
  Speaker 9: Yeah, yeah, it's with it's with Elaine. Elaine claim so
• 4:38:00
  Speaker 9: have eaten them and ninives like these. I don't believe
• 4:38:03
  Speaker 9: that you've ever eaten them. And they don't taste like
• 4:38:04
  Speaker 9: straw and I don't know. That's fine.
• 4:38:07
  Speaker 5: And the iel grow tomatoes and corn.
• 4:38:12
  Speaker 9: Right, which I'm just like, they do not have enough
• 4:38:14
  Speaker 9: water for that. Like, I'm so perplexed by tomatoes and
• 4:38:17
  Speaker 9: corn of all fucking protein.
• 4:38:18
  Speaker 5: But they recycle all of their water, and they have
• 4:38:21
  Speaker 5: a lot of water in their holds. It's when they
• 4:38:25
  Speaker 5: go out rating when water is a problem and they
• 4:38:27
  Speaker 5: don't waste any water, like when they shower. They shower
• 4:38:30
  Speaker 5: with organic soap that ultimately just becomes fertilizer when they
• 4:38:33
  Speaker 5: dump their bathing water into their crops.
• 4:38:37
  Speaker 9: Yeah, I mean that's true. They are. They're definitely Fromen,
• 4:38:40
  Speaker 9: but with less sci fi and more just fie, just purify.
• 4:38:46
  Speaker 9: But yeah, it's true. See what else there's he talks about.
• 4:38:51
  Speaker 9: I mean, I know it is that a fruit, but octopus?
• 4:38:53
  Speaker 9: He talks about octopus in the same sort of like
• 4:38:55
  Speaker 9: wondering ways he talks about lemons.
• 4:38:58
  Speaker 2: Oh, I don't remember the octopus thing either.
• 4:39:00
  Speaker 9: Yeah, it's right before Thailand attacks him, because he compares
• 4:39:05
  Speaker 9: Thailand to an octopus.
• 4:39:06
  Speaker 2: Oh Jesus.
• 4:39:07
  Speaker 9: Oh, it's like part of him being like, holy shit,
• 4:39:12
  Speaker 9: she has so many arms. What the hell? This is
• 4:39:13
  Speaker 9: like those weird creatures they sell down on the docks.
• 4:39:16
  Speaker 9: And that's like the only mention.
• 4:39:17
  Speaker 2: Can I just say it?
• 4:39:18
  Speaker 3: Like, now that we've gotten past the first trilogy, which
• 4:39:20
  Speaker 3: I really feel like is the classic hero Journey, there
• 4:39:24
  Speaker 3: is so much information in the rest of these books.
• 4:39:29
  Speaker 3: I know, just just you saying lemons and octopus. I
• 4:39:32
  Speaker 3: didn't know either of those things. I'm already learning, like
• 4:39:35
  Speaker 3: when we get when we get to these books, I'm
• 4:39:37
  Speaker 3: going to learn so fucking much.
• 4:39:40
  Speaker 2: A lot of the time, it's like a vague description,
• 4:39:42
  Speaker 2: like strawberries don't taste like straw at all. It is
• 4:39:44
  Speaker 2: really obvious. But you know, I think when Matt eats
• 4:39:48
  Speaker 2: the lemon, he like describes this yellow fruit that.
• 4:39:51
  Speaker 5: Looks and you know, just exterior.
• 4:39:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so you have to kind of read into it,
• 4:39:57
  Speaker 2: whereas otherwise, you know, it could have been an apricot
• 4:39:59
  Speaker 2: or you know whatever, a number of things a pair.
• 4:40:03
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm really excited to break into ts R. It's
• 4:40:06
  Speaker 5: going to be such a journey.
• 4:40:09
  Speaker 9: Oh my god. So many intense things happen in the
• 4:40:12
  Speaker 9: Shadowy Born. It's obnoxious. It's like, I mean, there's the
• 4:40:17
  Speaker 9: whole two rivers, Tanker Fayel.
• 4:40:22
  Speaker 5: It's happening.
• 4:40:24
  Speaker 4: I mean, the vision stuff, Oh my god, the stuff,
• 4:40:29
  Speaker 4: Oh my god.
• 4:40:30
  Speaker 9: That's going to be like one episode of per TSR.
• 4:40:32
  Speaker 2: Might also be the longest book, Okay, well no not.
• 4:40:36
  Speaker 2: I think Lord of Chaos my paperback here is nine
• 4:40:41
  Speaker 2: hundred and eighty pages. Lord of Chaos is over a thousand. Yeah,
• 4:40:45
  Speaker 2: I mean am All is too, but it's one of
• 4:40:49
  Speaker 2: the longer ones for sure.
• 4:40:50
  Speaker 3: There's a lot in here longer than he is longest.
• 4:40:55
  Speaker 9: I feel like Shadow Rising is in many ways very
• 4:40:58
  Speaker 9: similar to I of the World, and that it's an
• 4:41:00
  Speaker 9: incredible standalone.
• 4:41:01
  Speaker 5: Yes, I mean you need.
• 4:41:02
  Speaker 9: The context of what comes before, but so much happens.
• 4:41:05
  Speaker 9: It's like, like, what am I thinking? I think I'm
• 4:41:08
  Speaker 9: thinking of a cross as a Twilight. Maybe it's really
• 4:41:11
  Speaker 9: just a bridge between two other books. Whereas I feel
• 4:41:15
  Speaker 9: like Shadow Rising is it's.
• 4:41:17
  Speaker 3: The beginning of a new genre.
• 4:41:19
  Speaker 9: Store It's yeah.
• 4:41:20
  Speaker 3: It's the genesis, It's the egg of a new genre.
• 4:41:24
  Speaker 3: Like everything up to the Dragon Reborn was a rehash
• 4:41:30
  Speaker 3: of the Lord of the Rings. It was a hero's journey, right,
• 4:41:33
  Speaker 3: We've all seen that. And then he took this thing
• 4:41:37
  Speaker 3: and said, yeah, I'm going to make a universe out
• 4:41:40
  Speaker 3: of this, and I'm gonna I'm going to show you
• 4:41:43
  Speaker 3: what happens after Happily ever after, I'm going to show
• 4:41:46
  Speaker 3: you what happens after the hero wins.
• 4:41:49
  Speaker 9: After the Ring falls into the volcano, exactly.
• 4:41:52
  Speaker 3: Exactly, And that to me is the brilliance of this
• 4:41:56
  Speaker 3: whole universe. He just keeps going. He's like, yeah, that
• 4:41:59
  Speaker 3: was that was my trilogy. You enjoyed it. This is
• 4:42:02
  Speaker 3: what happens afterwards, And I mean it's a little disingenuous
• 4:42:05
  Speaker 3: because you have the whole last Battle.
• 4:42:08
  Speaker 9: But no, it's it's definitely like The Shadow Rising is
• 4:42:11
  Speaker 9: the book that lets you know that that's what's going
• 4:42:14
  Speaker 9: to happen now.
• 4:42:15
  Speaker 3: Right, It's yeah, it's the it's the place where the
• 4:42:18
  Speaker 3: storylines diverge. It's really the last time the three boys
• 4:42:22
  Speaker 3: are together.
• 4:42:23
  Speaker 9: Mm hmmm.
• 4:42:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 4:42:24
  Speaker 9: A lot of the storylines get that stay separate for
• 4:42:27
  Speaker 9: the rest of the series, get established.
• 4:42:29
  Speaker 2: Right here in Shadow exactly.
• 4:42:31
  Speaker 3: It's where I feel like the rest of the series
• 4:42:33
  Speaker 3: is going.
• 4:42:33
  Speaker 2: It is.
• 4:42:34
  Speaker 3: It is the genesis of everything else that happens afterwards.
• 4:42:37
  Speaker 9: This is when all the different storylines take on their
• 4:42:40
  Speaker 9: own lives and sometimes make this the timeline so fucked
• 4:42:43
  Speaker 9: up that you need an entire book, an entire leap book.
• 4:42:46
  Speaker 2: It's funny that you.
• 4:42:48
  Speaker 5: That you call TSR the genesis because the Fires of
• 4:42:52
  Speaker 5: Heaven as in a lot of ways an exodus with
• 4:42:56
  Speaker 5: the ideal coming en mass over the dragon Wall.
• 4:43:00
  Speaker 2: And that's cool. That's that's interesting is believing the desert
• 4:43:05
  Speaker 2: and wandering mass exodus.
• 4:43:07
  Speaker 9: I'd never thought of that.
• 4:43:08
  Speaker 3: Not to mention the thirty twelve, the thirteen tribes of
• 4:43:12
  Speaker 3: the Ayell, don't forget the gen Iell.
• 4:43:14
  Speaker 9: Well, the gen are the tribe that is exactly the
• 4:43:17
  Speaker 9: try that has not around anymore, right, And I mean
• 4:43:22
  Speaker 9: technically a lot of them stay behind too. A lot
• 4:43:25
  Speaker 9: of Iell stay behind in Ridian.
• 4:43:27
  Speaker 5: Sure, a lot of Ill stay behind in Ridian. But
• 4:43:31
  Speaker 5: I feel like most of the spears go over the
• 4:43:35
  Speaker 5: dragon wall. Very few spears stay behind it. A lot
• 4:43:38
  Speaker 5: of roof mistresses and and and crafts people that stay
• 4:43:44
  Speaker 5: behind for the most And.
• 4:43:45
  Speaker 3: I feel like the whole culture of Woodeon has to
• 4:43:47
  Speaker 3: change because water is abundant in that city.
• 4:43:50
  Speaker 5: Yeah, well, the ideal culture will never be the same, like,
• 4:43:54
  Speaker 5: and it's prophesied that the Iell culture will never be
• 4:43:56
  Speaker 5: the same. The Chief of Chiefs will come and he
• 4:44:01
  Speaker 5: will break them, and he will reforge them and destroy
• 4:44:04
  Speaker 5: them and leave nothing but a remnant of a remnant.
• 4:44:06
  Speaker 2: And take them back.
• 4:44:09
  Speaker 9: Right. So, yeah, whoever's left in the waist, maybe they
• 4:44:12
  Speaker 9: end up not carrying the legacy of the IEO. Maybe
• 4:44:15
  Speaker 9: they're the only legacy of the IDEO. Like, who knows
• 4:44:18
  Speaker 9: what the fuck happens with the Ridion. See there's another
• 4:44:20
  Speaker 9: fucking standalone series that you could spin off from the
• 4:44:23
  Speaker 9: end of development of the suck happens in the RIDI yeah,
• 4:44:27
  Speaker 9: what happens there?
• 4:44:29
  Speaker 5: If I could bring you know, you come across those
• 4:44:30
  Speaker 5: posts on Facebook and stuff all the time where it's like,
• 4:44:32
  Speaker 5: if you could bring any person from any time back
• 4:44:36
  Speaker 5: from the grave, who would it be. It's always an
• 4:44:38
  Speaker 5: easy Robert Jordan for me, because like I mean, yeah,
• 4:44:44
  Speaker 5: it would be great to talk to you, like.
• 4:44:46
  Speaker 2: Bring him back and make sure he's bored.
• 4:44:50
  Speaker 5: The Pharaohs or like the people of the people of
• 4:44:55
  Speaker 5: like Pompeii, or like all of these other great historical
• 4:44:58
  Speaker 5: things are like a life one of the librarians from
• 4:45:02
  Speaker 5: the Library of Alexandria would be such a great thing
• 4:45:05
  Speaker 5: to bring back. But fuck all of that. I just
• 4:45:07
  Speaker 5: want to bring RJ back so he can judge Brendan
• 4:45:12
  Speaker 5: Sanderson's work, make the adjustments that need to be made,
• 4:45:15
  Speaker 5: and do all of the spinoffs that need to exist.
• 4:45:20
  Speaker 9: I would just tell you to rafo so annoying.
• 4:45:24
  Speaker 3: I just realized, you know, Robert Jordan wasn't that old
• 4:45:28
  Speaker 3: when he died. He was fifty nine.
• 4:45:30
  Speaker 9: No, it's kind of like Carl Sagan in that regard,
• 4:45:32
  Speaker 9: actually taken by some stupid fucking elness way too early.
• 4:45:35
  Speaker 2: Yep. Yeah, that that is really on.
• 4:45:38
  Speaker 3: Vaccinate your children, please.
• 4:45:40
  Speaker 9: I don't think that that would have happened.
• 4:45:41
  Speaker 2: I know, I'm just saying.
• 4:45:44
  Speaker 9: I mean, I'm totally down.
• 4:45:46
  Speaker 2: But he had some super rare disease amulidosis amelo amy
• 4:45:52
  Speaker 2: lloyd dosis or something blood disease. Yeah, he said skeptically.
• 4:45:59
  Speaker 2: I'm not sure exactly.
• 4:46:00
  Speaker 5: The survival ratings of that disease were so low.
• 4:46:05
  Speaker 2: What is this?
• 4:46:05
  Speaker 9: Literally the same thing that got causing causing A died
• 4:46:07
  Speaker 9: from some weird blood disease too, and he was in
• 4:46:10
  Speaker 9: his forties. I'm going to be really annoyed if they
• 4:46:12
  Speaker 9: both died of the same thing. I'm going to have
• 4:46:13
  Speaker 9: a bone to pick with that thing.
• 4:46:15
  Speaker 2: So. Amuloid diosis is a group of diseases in which
• 4:46:19
  Speaker 2: abnormal protein known as amyloid fibrils builds up in tissue.
• 4:46:25
  Speaker 2: I don't really understand what this means.
• 4:46:27
  Speaker 9: I vibrate.
• 4:46:28
  Speaker 3: I actually was looking it up. I couldn't really figure
• 4:46:30
  Speaker 3: out what the problem was. I think it may cause
• 4:46:33
  Speaker 3: a thickening of heart muscles, which eventually causes a heart attack.
• 4:46:37
  Speaker 3: So I'd love to hear feedback from anyone who actually
• 4:46:40
  Speaker 3: understands the disease and what happened.
• 4:46:43
  Speaker 2: Basically, this sounds very complicated. Is there a doctor in
• 4:46:47
  Speaker 2: the house.
• 4:46:48
  Speaker 9: Yeah, someone drops in bioscience on it.
• 4:46:50
  Speaker 2: Apparently there's many different forms that it takes and some
• 4:46:53
  Speaker 2: are genetics are and.
• 4:46:56
  Speaker 3: What they released in the press doesn't fully describe what
• 4:46:59
  Speaker 3: actually happened, and so we're left to speculate a little bit.
• 4:47:04
  Speaker 2: Well, yeah, and you know that's like personal family stuff.
• 4:47:07
  Speaker 2: Totally know. I understand not wanting to be like, here's
• 4:47:10
  Speaker 2: precisely what's happening, you know, to this guy's body.
• 4:47:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and yet we're a fan based based around speculating
• 4:47:18
  Speaker 3: on exactly what happened. And it's hard not to at
• 4:47:21
  Speaker 3: least think.
• 4:47:23
  Speaker 2: About that a little bit. It's sad, it's sad.
• 4:47:25
  Speaker 3: But whatever whatever it was, I mean, obviously it took us,
• 4:47:28
  Speaker 3: took him from us far too soon.
• 4:47:32
  Speaker 2: I'm with Travis on this. Just bring our j back
• 4:47:35
  Speaker 2: and right age, right the fourth age.
• 4:47:40
  Speaker 5: You know what, I would love to see him right
• 4:47:42
  Speaker 5: the fourth age, but even more, I would just love
• 4:47:44
  Speaker 5: to see him expound upon the third age and what
• 4:47:46
  Speaker 5: goes on like with with with Ruidian, I mean, I
• 4:47:51
  Speaker 5: guess it would technically be fourth age.
• 4:47:53
  Speaker 9: Yeah, it's fourth age after the LB is.
• 4:47:55
  Speaker 2: Over Ruidian, the Ways, the o Gear, the Ie. I
• 4:48:00
  Speaker 2: want to know everything about what happens to the Iel.
• 4:48:02
  Speaker 5: And I want to see the evolution of Emen's Field.
• 4:48:05
  Speaker 5: I want to see what happens to Emmen's Field as
• 4:48:07
  Speaker 5: the two Rivers as a province begins to come into
• 4:48:10
  Speaker 5: its own.
• 4:48:11
  Speaker 2: And yeah, the Emmons Field as a large city, right.
• 4:48:16
  Speaker 9: Yeah, how does its relationship to and or change.
• 4:48:31
  Speaker 3: But I'm totally stoked for the story of paren Cleansing
• 4:48:35
  Speaker 3: the Ways by Brandon Sanderson.
• 4:48:37
  Speaker 5: Oh my, that's why it disappeared off of the Internet,
• 4:48:42
  Speaker 5: because it's getting published and that that thing that's coming
• 4:48:44
  Speaker 5: out right so excited.
• 4:48:47
  Speaker 3: I didn't know it was ever available on the internet.
• 4:48:49
  Speaker 5: Yeah, like it was possible to read it, and then
• 4:48:53
  Speaker 5: I never got around to actually doing it. But like
• 4:48:54
  Speaker 5: there are people out there who had copies of it,
• 4:48:57
  Speaker 5: or like there were places you could go to like
• 4:48:58
  Speaker 5: read copies of it because it was a story that
• 4:49:00
  Speaker 5: people were like few people, but there were people that
• 4:49:04
  Speaker 5: talked about it and knew what happened. And it was
• 4:49:06
  Speaker 5: more than just like Brandon Sanderson talking about it or
• 4:49:09
  Speaker 5: Harriet mentioning it, or like the discussion about why it
• 4:49:13
  Speaker 5: never made it into actual publication, Like it was actually
• 4:49:15
  Speaker 5: like here's some Brandon Sanderson fanfic that people can actually access,
• 4:49:20
  Speaker 5: and there were interviews like before I think last time
• 4:49:24
  Speaker 5: I was on the show, I talked about it, and
• 4:49:26
  Speaker 5: like before that day I had been able to like
• 4:49:29
  Speaker 5: look it up and like find interviews where Brandon Sanderson
• 4:49:31
  Speaker 5: had talked about it and why it didn't get published.
• 4:49:34
  Speaker 5: And then that day when I brought it up to
• 4:49:36
  Speaker 5: you guys, I tried finding anything on it and it
• 4:49:39
  Speaker 5: was just all gone and I felt like total Mandela effect.
• 4:49:43
  Speaker 5: And then a couple months later, find out that that
• 4:49:45
  Speaker 5: story is going to be getting published and I can't
• 4:49:47
  Speaker 5: remember the name of this it's getting published in this
• 4:49:50
  Speaker 5: this thing. I can't remember what this thing is called,
• 4:49:53
  Speaker 5: but yeah, Unfettered then.
• 4:49:55
  Speaker 9: Right, It's like because there was there was River of
• 4:49:58
  Speaker 9: Souls and Unfettered one and then Unfettered two, I guess
• 4:50:01
  Speaker 9: didn't have it, And this is Unfitted three, if I believe.
• 4:50:04
  Speaker 2: Correct, collection of short stories, and for anyone who's curious,
• 4:50:08
  Speaker 2: I feel like you guys probably all know that they're
• 4:50:10
  Speaker 2: all worth reading, Like all the stories and Unfettered, it's
• 4:50:13
  Speaker 2: a really fun I always have had fun reading the
• 4:50:17
  Speaker 2: short story compilations.
• 4:50:19
  Speaker 9: I haven't read the rest of Unfettered, though I enjoy it.
• 4:50:21
  Speaker 2: I will confess that I will as well.
• 4:50:23
  Speaker 9: Oh well, I downloaded the whole ebook, but I haven't
• 4:50:28
  Speaker 9: read the whole thing.
• 4:50:29
  Speaker 2: It was one of those things where like, for instance,
• 4:50:31
  Speaker 2: I just picked up The Shatter Rising and looked at
• 4:50:33
  Speaker 2: page one and I read a page and a half
• 4:50:35
  Speaker 2: before I actually put it back down while I was
• 4:50:37
  Speaker 2: listening it just like it do you just keep going
• 4:50:40
  Speaker 2: and like, oh shit, I'm not supposed to be doing
• 4:50:42
  Speaker 2: this right now.
• 4:50:44
  Speaker 5: So does that mean you're not going to take a
• 4:50:45
  Speaker 5: ridiculously long break before you jump into it, because that's
• 4:50:48
  Speaker 5: what that sounded like to me.
• 4:50:49
  Speaker 2: Well, it's certainly not going to be ridiculously long somebody
• 4:50:53
  Speaker 2: who's asking. A couple of people have asked me about
• 4:50:55
  Speaker 2: that on social media's recently, and I I said, max,
• 4:51:01
  Speaker 2: two weeks probably, and we're going to be doing stuff
• 4:51:03
  Speaker 2: during that time, Like we're planning on doing Patron episodes tomorrow.
• 4:51:07
  Speaker 3: It's more just this week we're going to record this
• 4:51:11
  Speaker 3: episode and a couple of Patron episodes below River of Souls.
• 4:51:17
  Speaker 2: I'm hoping to throw together as one more Forsaken and
• 4:51:21
  Speaker 2: get it done and out before we jump into the
• 4:51:24
  Speaker 2: Shadow Rising. The momentum, as Travis said, has been really
• 4:51:30
  Speaker 2: freaking amazing. All of them has been going off the charts.
• 4:51:33
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and I hope that we can keep that rolling
• 4:51:36
  Speaker 5: with you know, our hashtags and tagging on Twitter during
• 4:51:41
  Speaker 5: the what Wednesdays and every other time that we post
• 4:51:45
  Speaker 5: anything real have time related on any social media.
• 4:51:47
  Speaker 2: That has I'm convinced has made a really big difference.
• 4:51:50
  Speaker 2: And I've considered trying to like maybe organized stuff sometimes.
• 4:51:55
  Speaker 2: But if you guys just ever want to go and proselytize,
• 4:51:58
  Speaker 2: please do. And most of you already.
• 4:52:02
  Speaker 9: I'm not even on Twitter, but like I mean, just
• 4:52:06
  Speaker 9: from just watching what's happened in the discord and watching
• 4:52:09
  Speaker 9: what happened what happened with the downloads, Like clearly the
• 4:52:13
  Speaker 9: Twitter situation is like working for you guys, Like holy crap,
• 4:52:18
  Speaker 9: I'm not even part of that. Like I can't even
• 4:52:19
  Speaker 9: take responsibility for that. That is not me.
• 4:52:24
  Speaker 2: So within two days we'll have right last November.
• 4:52:28
  Speaker 9: Holy shit, you guys, you're fucking doing such an important thing.
• 4:52:33
  Speaker 9: Look at how well it's going.
• 4:52:34
  Speaker 3: And I can and I can show you that. I've
• 4:52:35
  Speaker 3: shown you guys some of the graphs and like that.
• 4:52:37
  Speaker 3: But the numbers are are I mean, growth is consistent.
• 4:52:42
  Speaker 2: It's huge.
• 4:52:43
  Speaker 3: Hold on, I got like Timber and he's like going nuts.
• 4:52:47
  Speaker 2: It's just running back and forth on the stairs.
• 4:52:52
  Speaker 9: It's so cool to see how this is growing, especially
• 4:52:55
  Speaker 9: because like all I do is hang out in the discord,
• 4:52:57
  Speaker 9: Like I don't really do much social media anything. I like,
• 4:53:02
  Speaker 9: I tell everyone that I come across about it. Like
• 4:53:04
  Speaker 9: there's someone in my class who like, so we had
• 4:53:06
  Speaker 9: to do an introductory like forum post, you know, be like, hey,
• 4:53:08
  Speaker 9: this is what I'm into, like outside of school, like
• 4:53:10
  Speaker 9: blah blah blah. So it's an online class, and of
• 4:53:13
  Speaker 9: course I'm like, I one of my hobbies is rereading
• 4:53:16
  Speaker 9: the Wheel of Time, because it's one of my hobbies.
• 4:53:21
  Speaker 9: And somebody is like, hey, I'm also a fan of
• 4:53:23
  Speaker 9: Wheel of Time. I'm like, have you heard of the
• 4:53:25
  Speaker 9: Wheel of Time spoilers podcast? Like give me an inch,
• 4:53:30
  Speaker 9: and I am like, you know all over that, Oh
• 4:53:35
  Speaker 9: my god, Like I said that, it's a person my
• 4:53:37
  Speaker 9: my family's land who like recognized your guys a sticker
• 4:53:40
  Speaker 9: as being Wheel of Time characters. And I'm like, so
• 4:53:43
  Speaker 9: can I send you the link? Hah? Hey do the link?
• 4:53:46
  Speaker 9: Have you listened to the podcast? Hey? What's that? What's that? Like?
• 4:53:49
  Speaker 9: I'm obnoxious. I'm literally obnoxious, and I don't do any
• 4:53:52
  Speaker 9: social media stuff. It's only IRL stuff that I do.
• 4:53:56
  Speaker 2: Well, that's fine, but do a lot with the Discord, don't. Don't.
• 4:54:01
  Speaker 2: You're amazing.
• 4:54:02
  Speaker 5: Thank you for everything that you don't underrate yourself because
• 4:54:06
  Speaker 5: you do contribute so much to the discord.
• 4:54:09
  Speaker 9: It's so weird. I've never been this involved in anything
• 4:54:12
  Speaker 9: like ever, Like, I'm such a fucking recluse. I don't
• 4:54:15
  Speaker 9: deal with people like this is so outside of my
• 4:54:18
  Speaker 9: comfort zone in so many ways, and yet it is
• 4:54:21
  Speaker 9: my ultimate comfort zone because it's the Wheel of Time.
• 4:54:24
  Speaker 9: I had a woman like stab my leg for seven
• 4:54:27
  Speaker 9: hours straight to like mark how much dedication I have
• 4:54:30
  Speaker 9: to the Wheel of Time. So you know, I'm just
• 4:54:35
  Speaker 9: so glad you guys made this platform possible because I
• 4:54:37
  Speaker 9: was not going to invent a podcast like this, like
• 4:54:39
  Speaker 9: I might help make the discord go, But you guys
• 4:54:42
  Speaker 9: planted the seed.
• 4:54:43
  Speaker 5: Oh totally, seriously, totally you guys. You guys started this,
• 4:54:48
  Speaker 5: and it's.
• 4:54:49
  Speaker 2: Well, this thing is going to continue to grow, and
• 4:54:52
  Speaker 2: you guys are gonna end up being a big part
• 4:54:54
  Speaker 2: of it. It's like it's kind of too late. We
• 4:54:56
  Speaker 2: already are, so I hope you're in for the ride. Yeah, totally.
• 4:55:00
  Speaker 5: I don't plan on abandoning you guys whatsoever. So I'm
• 4:55:05
  Speaker 5: I'm happy about this, And honestly, I think one of
• 4:55:09
  Speaker 5: my biggest fears isn't so much that like I'm gonna
• 4:55:12
  Speaker 5: end up being a part of it, but rather that
• 4:55:13
  Speaker 5: like something is going to happen and you guys are
• 4:55:17
  Speaker 5: going to not be able to continue.
• 4:55:21
  Speaker 2: At that point really in the card.
• 4:55:24
  Speaker 5: I mean, I don't easy it being in the cards.
• 4:55:26
  Speaker 5: And I have so much faith in you guys, and
• 4:55:28
  Speaker 5: don't think that that's part of your guys' like plan
• 4:55:30
  Speaker 5: or character or like, even if something tragic were to happen,
• 4:55:34
  Speaker 5: I feel like you guys would find a way to
• 4:55:35
  Speaker 5: continue making this happen. But I mean that's not the
• 4:55:38
  Speaker 5: way fear works.
• 4:55:40
  Speaker 3: I mean if I'm still conscious, I'll be making this
• 4:55:43
  Speaker 3: if I'm if I'm if I'm dead, one of you
• 4:55:46
  Speaker 3: two will hang out with Patrick and John will.
• 4:55:48
  Speaker 9: Edit the episodes like this is going for.
• 4:55:52
  Speaker 2: It And if Patrick with Patrick and both of us die,
• 4:55:56
  Speaker 2: you and a radio will take over as well as
• 4:55:58
  Speaker 2: like Kelsey or should we should we make like a
• 4:56:01
  Speaker 2: master Google doc that's password protected with all the passwords
• 4:56:05
  Speaker 2: for everything, just something happened. It's like it's like the
• 4:56:09
  Speaker 2: will of the podcast, the will of the podcast just
• 4:56:12
  Speaker 2: in case anything happens. Here's how you change everything all the.
• 4:56:16
  Speaker 3: Technically we are a company, right like the media, ll
• 4:56:20
  Speaker 3: C is an entity that exists independent of me a practice.
• 4:56:24
  Speaker 2: Seth and I are CEO.
• 4:56:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah and I think, Okay, will you testify that if
• 4:56:36
  Speaker 3: you and I are both dead or Radia gets possession
• 4:56:38
  Speaker 3: of Fox and Raven Media dumb down.
• 4:56:40
  Speaker 5: Okay, Well, I'm just going to pretend that I'm not
• 4:56:47
  Speaker 5: being left out. I have, sir, and you joined the
• 4:56:55
  Speaker 5: podcast first. But I mean what I mean, But.
• 4:56:57
  Speaker 9: I'm here to you.
• 4:56:58
  Speaker 2: I'm here to yes you are.
• 4:57:00
  Speaker 9: Well, I'll put you in my okay, so very sad.
• 4:57:03
  Speaker 9: It's in my will that Travis comes after.
• 4:57:06
  Speaker 2: It's gonna have to be at least two people.
• 4:57:09
  Speaker 5: CEO, Yes, that's myself.
• 4:57:12
  Speaker 9: Twin No, No, I could not do this myself. You're
• 4:57:14
  Speaker 9: definitely my keeper.
• 4:57:17
  Speaker 5: Excuse me in the discord, I am the omerline right
• 4:57:23
  Speaker 5: name speaker.
• 4:57:25
  Speaker 9: Oh my god, you guys, you realize, like we're just
• 4:57:28
  Speaker 9: bullshitting without any attention whatsoever to what happened in this book.
• 4:57:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I know, that's fine. You know what this is
• 4:57:35
  Speaker 3: called tangents reborn.
• 4:57:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you have.
• 4:57:41
  Speaker 5: You have long tangents with traffis going on right now.
• 4:57:43
  Speaker 2: So I mean it was bound totally gets carried across
• 4:57:47
  Speaker 2: the continent and doesn't remember anything. Girls go to school,
• 4:57:51
  Speaker 2: Rand runs across the continent, gets to Tier, Girls leave school,
• 4:57:56
  Speaker 2: also go to Tier. What else happens?
• 4:57:59
  Speaker 5: Fireworks flow up a wall, girls get rescued, show big
• 4:58:07
  Speaker 5: civil war, and Kyrie and.
• 4:58:10
  Speaker 2: Fall in love.
• 4:58:11
  Speaker 9: The all preliminary forces show up.
• 4:58:15
  Speaker 5: Iguaine proves that channeling and Tillernriott is real.
• 4:58:18
  Speaker 2: Not necessarily can I totally tangent? So dare you? Paren
• 4:58:27
  Speaker 2: gets like rescues fayel and like? Is that the beginning
• 4:58:31
  Speaker 2: is that when the relationship becomes physical right there? Because
• 4:58:34
  Speaker 2: that's when I imagined wakes up alone in after this crazy
• 4:58:41
  Speaker 2: thing and they're like all all like messed up and bruised,
• 4:58:46
  Speaker 2: and but then they were like they start making out
• 4:58:49
  Speaker 2: right then, right, my falcon, my Blacksmith.
• 4:58:56
  Speaker 9: I mean he's he can't be on top because he's
• 4:58:59
  Speaker 9: torn up.
• 4:59:00
  Speaker 2: Fair, that's fair. I mean he's gonna.
• 4:59:02
  Speaker 9: Not resist when she attacks. That's how that goes down.
• 4:59:06
  Speaker 2: I think, yeah.
• 4:59:08
  Speaker 3: I mean I don't think it starts right then because
• 4:59:10
  Speaker 3: he's badly injured. So I think that he's like, yeah,
• 4:59:15
  Speaker 3: there's there may be some kissing going on, and.
• 4:59:17
  Speaker 9: Probably more kissing than he's ever experienced.
• 4:59:20
  Speaker 5: Definitely a release to the sexual attention.
• 4:59:24
  Speaker 3: But yes, yes, just because he's a wolf, doesn't I
• 4:59:34
  Speaker 3: mean she like, you know, when the dog gets the
• 4:59:36
  Speaker 3: leg going, Just.
• 4:59:40
  Speaker 2: Jesus, that's too real.
• 4:59:45
  Speaker 9: And then and rand Rand admits to himself that he's
• 4:59:48
  Speaker 9: a dragon Reborn's yes, well, finally gets the funk over himself.
• 4:59:55
  Speaker 5: Would you call it admitting it to himself or just
• 4:59:58
  Speaker 5: like surrender.
• 4:59:59
  Speaker 3: He's for to admit like he has.
• 5:00:02
  Speaker 9: I think he admits it. I think he admits it.
• 5:00:04
  Speaker 9: I think because his okay, So he goes through literally
• 5:00:07
  Speaker 9: like that thing that's really annoying. Like, Okay, I'm not preface,
• 5:00:10
  Speaker 9: I'm not a video game person, but you know how
• 5:00:13
  Speaker 9: you go through the fake boss battle and then there's
• 5:00:15
  Speaker 9: the real boss battle.
• 5:00:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not even my final form, right.
• 5:00:21
  Speaker 9: Like that's how this book really like as an end
• 5:00:24
  Speaker 9: of a trilogy, Like that's how this book really goes
• 5:00:27
  Speaker 9: is it's like he doesn't even reach for Colindor and
• 5:00:31
  Speaker 9: admit that he's the Dragon until after the preliminary fake
• 5:00:36
  Speaker 9: boss has been defeated.
• 5:00:38
  Speaker 2: Yes, you know, like.
• 5:00:39
  Speaker 9: Moraine comes in and fucking swoops the fake boss out
• 5:00:43
  Speaker 9: of the way, and RAN's like, oh good, I don't
• 5:00:45
  Speaker 9: have to.
• 5:00:45
  Speaker 5: Deal with Like we talked about this almost anti climactic,
• 5:00:50
  Speaker 5: the way that she dispatches the law.
• 5:00:52
  Speaker 2: It's very yeah, Tom, we talked about that in the
• 5:00:56
  Speaker 2: second to the last chapter of The Dragon Were Born.
• 5:01:00
  Speaker 2: And because Rand is afraid to take calendar during the
• 5:01:02
  Speaker 2: fight with Ballal, because he's like, what if I turn
• 5:01:04
  Speaker 2: around jump try to grab it and my hand slaps
• 5:01:08
  Speaker 2: an invisible wall, then I get stabbed in the back.
• 5:01:11
  Speaker 2: And so he's he's afraid to do it because he
• 5:01:13
  Speaker 2: doesn't he doesn't believe that he's the Dragon. Reborn. But
• 5:01:15
  Speaker 2: then Ishmael shows up takes out Moraine, and he's like, well,
• 5:01:19
  Speaker 2: it's either maybe die or definitely die.
• 5:01:22
  Speaker 3: So right right, if I face him head on, he's
• 5:01:25
  Speaker 3: going to kill me in a heartbeat. So I gotta
• 5:01:28
  Speaker 3: take the chance to l and the dragon I mean
• 5:01:29
  Speaker 3: the dragon reborn or I'm dead.
• 5:01:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it is his choice, right.
• 5:01:33
  Speaker 9: Yeah, And he doesn't feel put in that position with Belaw,
• 5:01:36
  Speaker 9: which does say something about his skills and how much
• 5:01:39
  Speaker 9: he's like advanced because he's facing a foresake and doesn't
• 5:01:41
  Speaker 9: feel the need to take the last extreme. That is
• 5:01:44
  Speaker 9: really significant for his personal growth ignorance.
• 5:01:48
  Speaker 5: I might also that sure because Billall is kind of
• 5:01:51
  Speaker 5: still toying with him, Like there's not a major like
• 5:01:55
  Speaker 5: duel or anything going on between him and Belall, Like
• 5:01:58
  Speaker 5: it's kind of just floating and being the behind all
• 5:02:03
  Speaker 5: of this.
• 5:02:04
  Speaker 9: It's kind of well, think about it, like to Rok,
• 5:02:06
  Speaker 9: like he was way more nervous about Tu Roky than
• 5:02:09
  Speaker 9: he was about Bla, and they're kind of similar opponents.
• 5:02:12
  Speaker 3: Mall All is clearly better.
• 5:02:15
  Speaker 9: Definitely, But and yeah, asz Agnar said, like he did
• 5:02:18
  Speaker 9: the evil monologue thing, so like there's that. But yeah,
• 5:02:22
  Speaker 9: It's like, this is the book where Rand stops doubting
• 5:02:26
  Speaker 9: that he's the Dragon and commits to being the Dragon.
• 5:02:29
  Speaker 9: And then the rest of this series he's doubting if
• 5:02:32
  Speaker 9: he's doing a good job, if he's mad, but he
• 5:02:35
  Speaker 9: doesn't doubt the fact that he is the Dragon. That
• 5:02:38
  Speaker 9: is something that ends at the end of the.
• 5:02:42
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I just kind of feel like before maybe it's
• 5:02:46
  Speaker 5: still fair to say that he admitted it to himself,
• 5:02:49
  Speaker 5: but I just feel like before he grabbed Calendar, he
• 5:02:53
  Speaker 5: already knew. He knew in his heart of hearts, and
• 5:02:55
  Speaker 5: he he just needed some tangible proof so he could
• 5:03:01
  Speaker 5: come to grips with it. And that's that's what Calendar did.
• 5:03:05
  Speaker 3: Well, He's fulfilled so many of the other prophecies, like
• 5:03:08
  Speaker 3: being born on Dragon Slope. There's a bunch of other
• 5:03:10
  Speaker 3: prophecies old blood being raised by the a different old
• 5:03:14
  Speaker 3: blood exactly, So like he's fulfilled those prophecies, but he
• 5:03:18
  Speaker 3: couldn't necessarily prove any of those to himself. But when
• 5:03:22
  Speaker 3: he got Calendor, that was final tangible proof that yes,
• 5:03:27
  Speaker 3: I fulfilled one of the prophecies, Yes I am the
• 5:03:30
  Speaker 3: Dragon reborn. Even though he's fulfilled a bunch more. He
• 5:03:33
  Speaker 3: didn't want to admit that because that meant Tamils and
• 5:03:35
  Speaker 3: his father.
• 5:03:37
  Speaker 5: Have any of you guys ever noticed that the cleansing
• 5:03:40
  Speaker 5: of the source is in the prophecies?
• 5:03:43
  Speaker 2: No? Yeah, I mean yeah, but which wounds of madness?
• 5:03:47
  Speaker 2: The wounds of madness? Yeah?
• 5:03:48
  Speaker 5: Yeah, where he heals the wounds of madness and something
• 5:03:53
  Speaker 5: about he breaks the chains of madness too.
• 5:03:57
  Speaker 9: I think, and by our hand something like by our
• 5:04:00
  Speaker 9: hand was this curse bra and by his hands shall
• 5:04:03
  Speaker 9: it be taken away? Something like that?
• 5:04:04
  Speaker 2: Right? Right?
• 5:04:05
  Speaker 3: No, totally.
• 5:04:06
  Speaker 5: My friend who actually introduced me to this series, like
• 5:04:09
  Speaker 5: when I told him that, like I saw the cleansing coming,
• 5:04:12
  Speaker 5: he was like how, And I'm like, because all of
• 5:04:14
  Speaker 5: the different scenes where you see Maurain spewing prophecy and
• 5:04:17
  Speaker 5: where rand is reading the prophecy to try to figure
• 5:04:20
  Speaker 5: out what it is he's supposed to be doing, Like,
• 5:04:22
  Speaker 5: there's a lot of little things and if you pick
• 5:04:24
  Speaker 5: them apart and really listen to what's going on, you
• 5:04:26
  Speaker 5: can kind of figure it out. So he kind of
• 5:04:29
  Speaker 5: blew his mind and I was like, well, see who's
• 5:04:33
  Speaker 5: the bigger fan.
• 5:04:35
  Speaker 9: That's super awesome.
• 5:04:38
  Speaker 5: Hey, Seth, do you see the suggestion and discord for
• 5:04:43
  Speaker 5: a Patreon episode on Prophecy. On Prophecy, I'm on my.
• 5:04:49
  Speaker 2: Other laptop right now, but I will try to remember
• 5:04:52
  Speaker 2: that and add it to the list.
• 5:04:54
  Speaker 9: It's a good idea, go ahead. Yeah, that's a a
• 5:05:00
  Speaker 9: really good idea. An episode that's just about the prophecies
• 5:05:02
  Speaker 9: for patrons.
• 5:05:05
  Speaker 3: That might have to be a couple of episodes, right,
• 5:05:07
  Speaker 3: we could do like Men's prophecies, and then like dreams,
• 5:05:10
  Speaker 3: and then.
• 5:05:11
  Speaker 9: Like right and then like the koreanthan cycle.
• 5:05:14
  Speaker 2: Exactly, Yeah, dreams written Prophecy, and then all the fourth
• 5:05:19
  Speaker 2: Age stuff, right, do the the visions from Ruidian, all
• 5:05:26
  Speaker 2: the visions from.
• 5:05:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, all's future visions.
• 5:05:31
  Speaker 2: And then ran stuff.
• 5:05:36
  Speaker 9: That real soon, I know.
• 5:05:38
  Speaker 2: I'm so excited to go to the waste. We got
• 5:05:41
  Speaker 2: to kill off Ball first, Yeah, we got new do ball,
• 5:05:47
  Speaker 2: and then pick a big one this time, and and
• 5:05:50
  Speaker 2: try to do like land Fear.
• 5:05:52
  Speaker 3: So when are we going to start our novel?
• 5:05:58
  Speaker 9: You're writing a novel.
• 5:05:59
  Speaker 2: Now, know? I just said that. Sometimes when we're drinking
• 5:06:03
  Speaker 2: together with loosely tied, you've got to talk. I have
• 5:06:06
  Speaker 2: an idea for an interesting magic system, or what I
• 5:06:11
  Speaker 2: think is an interesting magic system. Just to be clear
• 5:06:14
  Speaker 2: that I've been working on in my head for a
• 5:06:16
  Speaker 2: really long time, and I.
• 5:06:18
  Speaker 5: Could totally write it and read your own audio book.
• 5:06:21
  Speaker 2: Let me put it this way. That would be so cool.
• 5:06:24
  Speaker 3: I will be your editor if you write it, okay,
• 5:06:28
  Speaker 3: But I can't write it.
• 5:06:29
  Speaker 2: I just don't even know like who my characters are
• 5:06:32
  Speaker 2: or anything yet. I like understand the magic system, and
• 5:06:35
  Speaker 2: I kind of understand the world a little, but I
• 5:06:38
  Speaker 2: I don't know much more, like what is the plot?
• 5:06:42
  Speaker 5: Have to come with something plot building? But character building
• 5:06:46
  Speaker 5: is so much fun to me, Like I love creating
• 5:06:48
  Speaker 5: like backstories and like character traits and character flaws and like.
• 5:06:54
  Speaker 5: Character building is incredibly fun to me, but plot building
• 5:06:57
  Speaker 5: is so challenging.
• 5:06:58
  Speaker 2: That's actually one of the only things I've done as
• 5:07:00
  Speaker 2: I built the main character and her pet for lack
• 5:07:06
  Speaker 2: of a better if this is going to get much
• 5:07:07
  Speaker 2: more complicated, it's not just a pet. It's like a
• 5:07:10
  Speaker 2: familiar kind of a thing. Yes, like a familiar all right,
• 5:07:14
  Speaker 2: I'm just going to throw it out there. So the
• 5:07:15
  Speaker 2: magic system in this world is drugs. I know it
• 5:07:21
  Speaker 2: sounds crazy, but like like you can like visit the
• 5:07:25
  Speaker 2: spirit world and commune with your animal and like you
• 5:07:29
  Speaker 2: get on a new different level.
• 5:07:31
  Speaker 5: It's just well, I have to take these mushrooms first.
• 5:07:34
  Speaker 2: Right, you have to eat a lot of mushrooms, Like
• 5:07:35
  Speaker 2: if you keep on going to the spirit world, you've
• 5:07:38
  Speaker 2: got to eat a ton. And that's the drawback to
• 5:07:40
  Speaker 2: the magic system.
• 5:07:41
  Speaker 5: And then there's these crazy villains who are trying to
• 5:07:44
  Speaker 5: make it like even stronger, and they're like reflecing.
• 5:07:48
  Speaker 2: There's a magical crack, but like it'll suck up your
• 5:07:50
  Speaker 2: life still, you.
• 5:07:51
  Speaker 5: Know, inject it, but it kind of makes you crazy
• 5:07:54
  Speaker 5: when you're not on the high.
• 5:07:56
  Speaker 9: I would read that's so, but.
• 5:08:00
  Speaker 2: That's the concept that like, you know, coming up with
• 5:08:04
  Speaker 2: and reading books like The Wheel of Time is so
• 5:08:07
  Speaker 2: fucking intimidating, Like I can't ever imagine creating anything like that.
• 5:08:11
  Speaker 5: And see, that's my problem is I always want to
• 5:08:14
  Speaker 5: sit down and write a novel, like it's something I've
• 5:08:17
  Speaker 5: wanted to do for the longest time, and then every
• 5:08:19
  Speaker 5: time I sit down to do it, like there was
• 5:08:21
  Speaker 5: one where I literally filled probably like seven or eight
• 5:08:25
  Speaker 5: composition books with like a story that I was writing,
• 5:08:28
  Speaker 5: and then I sat down and I read through it
• 5:08:30
  Speaker 5: and I saw like all of these similarities to the
• 5:08:34
  Speaker 5: Wheel of Time, and was like, all these similarities but
• 5:08:38
  Speaker 5: inferiorities to the Wheel of Time, and I was just like, no,
• 5:08:40
  Speaker 5: I'll never be able to do this. It will never
• 5:08:42
  Speaker 5: be I'm never going to be good enough.
• 5:08:47
  Speaker 3: It'll never run. If you compare yourself to Ussain.
• 5:08:51
  Speaker 2: Bolt, yeah, no, that's great advice.
• 5:08:53
  Speaker 3: And I cannot compare yourself to the best in the genre.
• 5:08:56
  Speaker 3: You just can't. Like, if you do that, you're being
• 5:08:59
  Speaker 3: an idiot because Robbery Jordan was amazing.
• 5:09:04
  Speaker 9: Dude, you need to read Broken Earth, you.
• 5:09:06
  Speaker 2: Know what I'm I'm on book.
• 5:09:09
  Speaker 9: Dude, I don't even care what you're excuse.
• 5:09:13
  Speaker 5: I'm on book thirteen of the Wheel of Time and
• 5:09:15
  Speaker 5: I already owned the Broken Earth trilogy on on Audible.
• 5:09:18
  Speaker 5: That's my next that's my next conquest, dude.
• 5:09:22
  Speaker 9: It's the fucking best.
• 5:09:24
  Speaker 3: No, it's not your next conquest. It's what you're going
• 5:09:26
  Speaker 3: to listen to right now. You're going to hang up,
• 5:09:29
  Speaker 3: you know what, Just fucking hang.
• 5:09:31
  Speaker 5: Out recording, go read Broken Earth. Don't talk to us
• 5:09:34
  Speaker 5: until you're done. It's so I haven't.
• 5:09:36
  Speaker 2: Heard, guy.
• 5:09:37
  Speaker 9: Seriously, I've told so many of my geology friends about
• 5:09:40
  Speaker 9: it because I'm like, guys, guys, it's the geology.
• 5:09:43
  Speaker 3: Literally the third conversation about Broken Earth I'm having today.
• 5:09:46
  Speaker 3: Patrick doesn't know this, but I've had. I had a
• 5:09:49
  Speaker 3: conversation Aberath twice this morning with two different people I know.
• 5:09:53
  Speaker 5: So I'm going to read Broken Earth and then I'm
• 5:09:56
  Speaker 5: going to follow the same way A radio has and
• 5:09:58
  Speaker 5: we're going to do Broken Earth a radio.
• 5:10:01
  Speaker 9: Dude, Yes, but say first, I have to do Pearn
• 5:10:05
  Speaker 9: spoilers because I know Pearn way better than Broken Her Okay, well,
• 5:10:09
  Speaker 9: I haven't read maybe I should, dude, what seriously, She's
• 5:10:13
  Speaker 9: been writing that for so long and now her son
• 5:10:15
  Speaker 9: took over. So the author like has been writing these
• 5:10:17
  Speaker 9: books since the late seventies and now her son is
• 5:10:19
  Speaker 9: writing in the same world. And I have not read
• 5:10:22
  Speaker 9: all the books, but I want to do Pern spoilers.
• 5:10:26
  Speaker 9: And I'm pretty sure, like somebody want of the Supper
• 5:10:30
  Speaker 9: Times that they do it with me, But I would
• 5:10:32
  Speaker 9: be broken in the spoilers. I just need to read
• 5:10:34
  Speaker 9: it a few more times. I've only read it once.
• 5:10:35
  Speaker 2: I've read it so many times.
• 5:10:38
  Speaker 9: Well, I only read it because you told me too.
• 5:10:40
  Speaker 9: It's I've only gotten but I bought the whole trilogy
• 5:10:43
  Speaker 9: all at once, because I figured if you told me
• 5:10:45
  Speaker 9: to read it, then how could I possibly regret that?
• 5:10:47
  Speaker 3: So well, and you're a fucking geologist and it's about earthquakes,
• 5:10:52
  Speaker 3: and like, I mean, it couldn't be better for you,
• 5:10:56
  Speaker 3: Like there honestly couldn't be a.
• 5:10:57
  Speaker 9: Better and the spinell followed her. Yeah, Like I didn't
• 5:11:03
  Speaker 9: even know what spinel was before I studied geology, and
• 5:11:07
  Speaker 9: now I do, and that makes the book so much better.
• 5:11:10
  Speaker 2: I feel like I should take this opportunity to say
• 5:11:12
  Speaker 2: that we've been recording for approximately two hours and a
• 5:11:17
  Speaker 2: little less, and is there any way to wrap this up?
• 5:11:21
  Speaker 2: Is there a way that would be good to wrap
• 5:11:22
  Speaker 2: it up? Do we just go for another hour? I
• 5:11:25
  Speaker 2: mean that's my question. I'd like we can keep going.
• 5:11:28
  Speaker 2: I feel like just thought I should we should have
• 5:11:29
  Speaker 2: this discussion. Yeah, no, I absolutely agree with you. Guys.
• 5:11:32
  Speaker 3: Are you do you guys want to keep going? You
• 5:11:34
  Speaker 3: want to wrap it up?
• 5:11:35
  Speaker 2: How are you feeling?
• 5:11:36
  Speaker 5: I mean, I'm down to keep going. I feel like
• 5:11:38
  Speaker 5: maybe we could get a little bit more WAT related
• 5:11:40
  Speaker 5: stuff going, so there's actually something to publish.
• 5:11:45
  Speaker 9: I would love to like go for a forty five minute,
• 5:11:48
  Speaker 9: watt focused, wrap up, Yeah, tangent threat, totally read Patrick,
• 5:11:53
  Speaker 9: What are we talking? What are we talking?
• 5:11:55
  Speaker 5: What am I reading?
• 5:12:07
  Speaker 2: The Wheel of Time turns an agent coming past, leading
• 5:12:11
  Speaker 2: memories become legends and legend f and long long birth
• 5:12:19
  Speaker 2: comes against in one age become an age long past.
• 5:12:27
  Speaker 2: This is getting cold? He doesn't this sound a little
• 5:12:29
  Speaker 2: like a combination between a prayer meeting and an AA
• 5:12:32
  Speaker 2: meeting or something.
• 5:12:35
  Speaker 5: Just daily, keep coming back the daily prayer of the
• 5:12:40
  Speaker 5: Wheel of Time.
• 5:12:42
  Speaker 9: Give me dragon, for I have not read.
• 5:12:45
  Speaker 2: One book is too many and a thousand is never enough. Guys, Oh,
• 5:12:52
  Speaker 2: I like Kelsey Baldwin's idea, like what are what are
• 5:12:56
  Speaker 2: we looking forward to?
• 5:12:57
  Speaker 9: In The Shadow Reborn? And like what are we looking for?
• 5:13:00
  Speaker 9: Talk about?
• 5:13:01
  Speaker 2: She did?
• 5:13:02
  Speaker 5: I did?
• 5:13:03
  Speaker 9: He's t s R. You know, but what are we
• 5:13:22
  Speaker 9: what do we what are we looking forward to? Or
• 5:13:23
  Speaker 9: what do we want to dissect? Or what character arcs
• 5:13:26
  Speaker 9: do we want to watch?
• 5:13:28
  Speaker 5: You know what I'm not looking forward to. I know
• 5:13:30
  Speaker 5: it's not the next book, it's the book after the
• 5:13:32
  Speaker 5: next book. But I'm definitely not helpful. I'm definitely not
• 5:13:36
  Speaker 5: looking forward to the cessation of Moraine's involvement.
• 5:13:41
  Speaker 2: O the big blowout between random Moraine that gets really gross.
• 5:13:48
  Speaker 9: Not really in Shadow Reborn.
• 5:13:52
  Speaker 2: She's definitely not now.
• 5:13:58
  Speaker 9: Shadow RISINGR.
• 5:14:00
  Speaker 2: I can say, I'm really excited to get to the
• 5:14:03
  Speaker 2: Iel in general, and Rand's introduction to Ael culture. I'm
• 5:14:06
  Speaker 2: really excited about you, redheaded bastard. You love the Ael,
• 5:14:09
  Speaker 2: I do love.
• 5:14:10
  Speaker 5: But the Iel are so cool and they're probably like
• 5:14:12
  Speaker 5: ninety babes.
• 5:14:14
  Speaker 9: So would you like to play met kiss?
• 5:14:17
  Speaker 2: They're in such good shape. They all just run all
• 5:14:20
  Speaker 2: day there, you.
• 5:14:21
  Speaker 5: Know, you know, yeah, they're all fit.
• 5:14:23
  Speaker 2: There's some great legs going on.
• 5:14:25
  Speaker 9: Yeah, I will run down your great.
• 5:14:28
  Speaker 2: Legs going on.
• 5:14:29
  Speaker 5: And I mean, I don't don't get bothered by this seth.
• 5:14:32
  Speaker 5: But I've always had a bit of a thing for
• 5:14:33
  Speaker 5: the Gingers. So Patrick, I'm sorry.
• 5:14:36
  Speaker 2: Wait wait for Gingers. Yeah, I was.
• 5:14:39
  Speaker 3: Gonna say, why should I get offended? I'm a fucking
• 5:14:42
  Speaker 3: brown is dirt.
• 5:14:44
  Speaker 5: You're I'm just I'm.
• 5:14:46
  Speaker 2: Two rivers all the way guys, Okay, sure.
• 5:14:49
  Speaker 3: I mean like brown hair.
• 5:14:50
  Speaker 9: I'm sorry, I'm.
• 5:14:53
  Speaker 5: Definitely I would say that I'm I'm probably two rivers
• 5:14:57
  Speaker 5: or altarin in complexion, like I'm slightly olive. I have
• 5:15:00
  Speaker 5: dark hair, and like coppery brown eyes.
• 5:15:04
  Speaker 2: I'm also a short idell.
• 5:15:06
  Speaker 9: I mean I could be and Dooran Kelsey. I'm definitely.
• 5:15:09
  Speaker 9: I mean, I'm so not tall. I'm so short like
• 5:15:12
  Speaker 9: and Dooran might work. I could be the red haired
• 5:15:14
  Speaker 9: and Or girl for sure.
• 5:15:15
  Speaker 2: Okay, how tall are you?
• 5:15:17
  Speaker 9: Five two?
• 5:15:18
  Speaker 5: Oh? Okay, my mom's five two. I'm five to seven.
• 5:15:21
  Speaker 9: Yeah, I'm short. My border' is like five eleven, so
• 5:15:24
  Speaker 9: I get a crook in my neck.
• 5:15:26
  Speaker 2: Julia's five two. But she's blonde. Where the blonde people
• 5:15:30
  Speaker 2: in the Wheel of Time and Or.
• 5:15:32
  Speaker 9: Yeah, yeah, and Or and then what is it? The
• 5:15:36
  Speaker 9: and Leandrone has honey brown, so that's like borderline blonde,
• 5:15:41
  Speaker 9: like depending what kind of honey you're thinking.
• 5:15:43
  Speaker 5: I've always seen her as like a chestnut slash dirty
• 5:15:48
  Speaker 5: blonde colored hair.
• 5:15:50
  Speaker 9: But yes, mostly and Or and the Ieel like those
• 5:15:53
  Speaker 9: are the redheads.
• 5:15:54
  Speaker 5: But I think that her hair color isn't necessarily even
• 5:15:56
  Speaker 5: common for terrbond because I feel like most of the
• 5:15:58
  Speaker 5: terra bonners have ye know.
• 5:16:00
  Speaker 9: It's not she has an unusual hair. It's kind of
• 5:16:03
  Speaker 9: like how tyrants like occasionally have blue eyes. Like there's
• 5:16:06
  Speaker 9: like in.
• 5:16:06
  Speaker 5: The occasional pale hair, which is like throw back to
• 5:16:09
  Speaker 5: the Spanish stock is what that is because basically they
• 5:16:13
  Speaker 5: have the fair skin, the fair European skin and fair
• 5:16:15
  Speaker 5: European eyes from Spain mixed with the native coloring.
• 5:16:20
  Speaker 9: Oh jesus, see, I'm so bad with makeup. Like I try,
• 5:16:24
  Speaker 9: I really do, but it's just so much work and
• 5:16:25
  Speaker 9: then you have to take it off again. And I
• 5:16:27
  Speaker 9: just I do makeup and fits and starts. I'm just
• 5:16:32
  Speaker 9: I really want to put purple in my hair though,
• 5:16:34
  Speaker 9: like I really wanted, just like a big old, obnoxious
• 5:16:36
  Speaker 9: stripe of like neon purple through my hair.
• 5:16:38
  Speaker 2: Just doing it.
• 5:16:39
  Speaker 5: Just do it, man, There's nothing.
• 5:16:41
  Speaker 9: More time and shit, there's nothing.
• 5:16:43
  Speaker 5: More liberating than putting color in your hair. Like I
• 5:16:46
  Speaker 5: love when I have blue in my hair. I just
• 5:16:48
  Speaker 5: hate that it washes out.
• 5:16:50
  Speaker 3: So when I died my hair blue, so I was
• 5:16:52
  Speaker 3: a swimmer and I used to dye my hair every
• 5:16:54
  Speaker 3: year before I shaved it off. And blue hair is great,
• 5:16:58
  Speaker 3: It's fan fuckingastic.
• 5:16:59
  Speaker 2: Hello.
• 5:16:59
  Speaker 3: It does washes out to like a green color, which
• 5:17:01
  Speaker 3: is kind of gross.
• 5:17:02
  Speaker 5: It doesn't wash out to a green color if you
• 5:17:04
  Speaker 5: lift the blonde high enough. If you lift the blonde
• 5:17:07
  Speaker 5: high enough and you get it past that yellow and
• 5:17:10
  Speaker 5: get it closer to white before you start putting the
• 5:17:12
  Speaker 5: bleach in. It actually washes out to this beautiful like princess.
• 5:17:18
  Speaker 3: But then my scalp is like, you know, rotting because
• 5:17:22
  Speaker 3: I put so much bleach on my hair.
• 5:17:24
  Speaker 2: Oh wow, that's.
• 5:17:27
  Speaker 3: You may pay that sort of damage for your beauty,
• 5:17:29
  Speaker 3: but I'm not willing to.
• 5:17:31
  Speaker 5: Well, Fortunately for me, my boyfriend is a cosmetologist and
• 5:17:34
  Speaker 5: dyes my hair and doesn't ruin my scalp.
• 5:17:36
  Speaker 9: Yeah. See, this is another reason why I wish you
• 5:17:38
  Speaker 9: lived closer.
• 5:17:42
  Speaker 5: I mean, I have like a literal list of reasons
• 5:17:45
  Speaker 5: why I wish we lived closer.
• 5:17:47
  Speaker 9: Oh my god, right seriously, no, Okay, So when I
• 5:17:50
  Speaker 9: was like in middle school, I did my hair black
• 5:17:52
  Speaker 9: and people legit thought my hair was black and it's like, hello,
• 5:17:55
  Speaker 9: my eyebrows are still pale as shit, I still have
• 5:18:00
  Speaker 9: no eyebrows because they're so blonde. Like, why do you
• 5:18:03
  Speaker 9: think my hair is fucking black just because my head
• 5:18:05
  Speaker 9: hair is black? It was so silly.
• 5:18:08
  Speaker 2: Are you are you blonde or you're ginger? Right?
• 5:18:11
  Speaker 9: I can never decide what category I belong in. I'm
• 5:18:14
  Speaker 9: like a strawberry blonde.
• 5:18:16
  Speaker 2: Okay, well that's a category.
• 5:18:18
  Speaker 9: So it's like it's a dishwater blonde at the root,
• 5:18:21
  Speaker 9: but then once it gets some sun, it turns into
• 5:18:23
  Speaker 9: like a much more orange like strawberry in the sun.
• 5:18:27
  Speaker 9: But then if you go inside, it's more like dishwater.
• 5:18:29
  Speaker 9: Like it's a really weird transient. I know, right, but
• 5:18:35
  Speaker 9: I'm not curly. There's no curl at all. I'm straight.
• 5:18:39
  Speaker 9: My hair's so straight. My hair is so straight.
• 5:18:42
  Speaker 5: If you guys, if you guys could live anywhere in
• 5:18:44
  Speaker 5: the wheel of time, like in Randland, where would you guys.
• 5:18:47
  Speaker 2: Want to live? Are you a waste? Waste? Ye?
• 5:18:52
  Speaker 5: Not surprised.
• 5:18:54
  Speaker 9: I mean I feel like basically any of the Borderlands,
• 5:18:59
  Speaker 9: except that I'm like a super non athletic, like non
• 5:19:02
  Speaker 9: violent person, So I don't know why.
• 5:19:04
  Speaker 5: I mean, the Borderlanders need clerks.
• 5:19:06
  Speaker 9: Too, Like I don't know, like they have like some
• 5:19:09
  Speaker 9: of the best landscapes, and they don't have like the
• 5:19:11
  Speaker 9: bullshit politics, and they have like seasons.
• 5:19:14
  Speaker 2: And shit, yeah of mad men. Maybe maybe I'd be
• 5:19:18
  Speaker 2: like if they could be like an Aiel Blacksmith, so
• 5:19:22
  Speaker 2: I could just like not have to deal with getting
• 5:19:24
  Speaker 2: stabbed and stuff.
• 5:19:25
  Speaker 5: But still be like a badass.
• 5:19:27
  Speaker 2: Io. Yeah, yeah, exactly. You see.
• 5:19:30
  Speaker 9: But see for me, like I'd want to be in Isidie,
• 5:19:33
  Speaker 9: so I'd live in Tarbalin. Like it doesn't matter where
• 5:19:36
  Speaker 9: i'd be born. I would want to become Isidye and
• 5:19:38
  Speaker 9: live in Tarvalin.
• 5:19:39
  Speaker 2: Oh sorry, would you be like a marine? Silent?
• 5:19:41
  Speaker 3: I said, I like traveling around or would you just oh.
• 5:19:44
  Speaker 9: No, no, no, no no. I'd be like Sarah Fell or
• 5:19:47
  Speaker 9: someone and just live in the tower and like never
• 5:19:50
  Speaker 9: go outside. Dull. I'm the first chair for a.
• 5:19:56
  Speaker 5: Reason, but not like a field research brown. She wouldn't
• 5:19:59
  Speaker 5: be like.
• 5:20:00
  Speaker 9: No, see, oh my god. Yeah. So I went to
• 5:20:04
  Speaker 9: this seminar today because I'm supposed to go to seminars.
• 5:20:06
  Speaker 9: I get one credit for going to these seminars once
• 5:20:08
  Speaker 9: a week at school, and I went to this one
• 5:20:11
  Speaker 9: today where this woman gave a talk and she was
• 5:20:13
  Speaker 9: talking about how valuable it is how our college does
• 5:20:16
  Speaker 9: so much field work, and how our people understand that
• 5:20:19
  Speaker 9: you can't just get your education, like from being in
• 5:20:21
  Speaker 9: front of a computer. And I'm sitting there like, but
• 5:20:24
  Speaker 9: that's what I want to do. I hate field work.
• 5:20:28
  Speaker 9: I mean into this latest field camp, which I kind
• 5:20:31
  Speaker 9: of changed my mind about everything. But traditionally, like I
• 5:20:33
  Speaker 9: hate dealing with people, I hate traveling. I just want
• 5:20:37
  Speaker 9: to hang out on my computer and like do cool
• 5:20:39
  Speaker 9: shit from there.
• 5:20:40
  Speaker 2: So I would be Yeah.
• 5:20:43
  Speaker 9: I would do that in the tower. I would just
• 5:20:45
  Speaker 9: hang out in the tower and like send my warder
• 5:20:46
  Speaker 9: to the library to get me shit and bring me
• 5:20:49
  Speaker 9: food from the kitchen, and like that would be my
• 5:20:51
  Speaker 9: life and I'd be so happy.
• 5:20:53
  Speaker 5: I've always felt that I would be like a Kyrie
• 5:20:56
  Speaker 5: in and Born that lives in Tarvellin. But where's andorin styles?
• 5:21:06
  Speaker 5: Because I mean I want to be an I said,
• 5:21:07
  Speaker 5: I too, so and I would probably be a blue
• 5:21:11
  Speaker 5: with heavy yellow.
• 5:21:12
  Speaker 9: Tendencies very more rain. Yeah, and see, like Jesus see
• 5:21:18
  Speaker 9: that whole communication thing. That's what I keep finding myself
• 5:21:21
  Speaker 9: drawn towards in science, which really bothers me because I
• 5:21:24
  Speaker 9: hate people and I don't want to talk to them.
• 5:21:26
  Speaker 9: Apparently I really want to talk to them, like subconsciously and.
• 5:21:29
  Speaker 2: Like Google Docs, you're a talker. You are.
• 5:21:34
  Speaker 9: You guys have no idea how much I'm not a
• 5:21:37
  Speaker 9: talker and the rest of my life, but.
• 5:21:40
  Speaker 5: You're totally a talker when it comes to subjects that
• 5:21:44
  Speaker 5: you care about deeply, like the wheel of time and
• 5:21:47
  Speaker 5: like your other podcast would just roll with it, and
• 5:21:51
  Speaker 5: like pology.
• 5:21:53
  Speaker 9: You guys are bullying because they're all bullying the discord
• 5:22:00
  Speaker 9: chat you guys and voice Oh my god, I am blushing.
• 5:22:05
  Speaker 2: Also, you get to be with a like when when
• 5:22:09
  Speaker 2: we're doing the podcast, and I even I still think
• 5:22:12
  Speaker 2: about this sometimes when when I was uncomfortable being in
• 5:22:15
  Speaker 2: front of the microphone, Do you remember that vaguely in
• 5:22:18
  Speaker 2: the distant paths? Yeah, no, no, it's not that distant.
• 5:22:23
  Speaker 2: Let's be honest. It was like Jesus, what am I?
• 5:22:25
  Speaker 2: What am I gonna say that could possibly be interesting
• 5:22:28
  Speaker 2: to anyone? You know? I remember, I know, I realized
• 5:22:30
  Speaker 2: that I can actually just kind of have a casual
• 5:22:32
  Speaker 2: conversation with people I hang out with like two three
• 5:22:34
  Speaker 2: times a week. And that is a podcast. That is
• 5:22:38
  Speaker 2: That is what that is. It's way less complicated than
• 5:22:41
  Speaker 2: I thought.
• 5:22:42
  Speaker 3: But no, I agree that like comfort in front of
• 5:22:44
  Speaker 3: a microphone is something that that's hard to achieve, and
• 5:22:47
  Speaker 3: like even if you are comfortable sound, even if you're
• 5:22:49
  Speaker 3: not comfortable sounding like you are is important.
• 5:22:52
  Speaker 9: We see, I my mom was like a singer songwriter.
• 5:22:56
  Speaker 9: When I was a little kid, so like, I literally
• 5:22:58
  Speaker 9: don't remember the first time that I got on stage
• 5:23:00
  Speaker 9: because I was like three, and then my school was
• 5:23:03
  Speaker 9: like you have to do a play every year, So like,
• 5:23:05
  Speaker 9: I really don't have a lot of stage fright. And
• 5:23:08
  Speaker 9: I've like, I mean, I've made recordings, I've posted them
• 5:23:11
  Speaker 9: in the discord like the vain fucking tomfoolery that I am.
• 5:23:16
  Speaker 9: But I like, I've done productions. I've been in plays, musicals,
• 5:23:20
  Speaker 9: musical recordings. I've been in front of microphones before, but
• 5:23:24
  Speaker 9: just never just for myself off the cuff. It's always
• 5:23:28
  Speaker 9: been for something that I practiced to like perform, you know.
• 5:23:32
  Speaker 2: And as long as you're talking about let us different
• 5:23:33
  Speaker 2: know about and clearly you know something about the wheel
• 5:23:36
  Speaker 2: of time, I feel like it's fine.
• 5:23:41
  Speaker 9: Yeah, Now this this place has been a very a
• 5:23:43
  Speaker 9: very good experience for me to find my voice talking
• 5:23:46
  Speaker 9: about something that I didn't practice beforehand.
• 5:23:49
  Speaker 3: Actually too, I try and talk about it to people
• 5:23:52
  Speaker 3: outside of the Discord, and it's hard, it's hard to
• 5:23:55
  Speaker 3: find the right way to speak about it. As I
• 5:24:00
  Speaker 3: can get is like it's Game of Thrones without wait
• 5:24:03
  Speaker 3: as much violence, and I'll get like an okay, acknowledgment
• 5:24:07
  Speaker 3: from that.
• 5:24:08
  Speaker 2: That's why I don't really bring it up a lot
• 5:24:09
  Speaker 2: because I'm like, you know, even when I say like, oh,
• 5:24:12
  Speaker 2: I make this podcast, people are like, oh, what's the
• 5:24:14
  Speaker 2: podcast about. I'm like, oh, it's this book series. This
• 5:24:16
  Speaker 2: is what it's called, and they're like, oh, what's that?
• 5:24:19
  Speaker 2: And it's just like, can you describe the plot of
• 5:24:22
  Speaker 2: the Wheel of Time? Uh? Yeah.
• 5:24:25
  Speaker 5: My boss asked me that question the other day when
• 5:24:27
  Speaker 5: I told her why I needed to borrow this headset.
• 5:24:29
  Speaker 5: She was like, what's the basic plot? And I was like,
• 5:24:33
  Speaker 5: do you have an hour?
• 5:24:36
  Speaker 3: There's no summary?
• 5:24:38
  Speaker 2: Well, that is somewhere to summarize.
• 5:24:41
  Speaker 9: I've tried so many ways and they all are too
• 5:24:45
  Speaker 9: long and totally inadequate.
• 5:24:46
  Speaker 3: That's why I feel some sympathy for this announcement about
• 5:24:49
  Speaker 3: the fact the green Light of the TV series where
• 5:24:52
  Speaker 3: they're like, it's about following Moraine as an I said I,
• 5:24:55
  Speaker 3: and it's like, no, but okay, fair enough. You could
• 5:24:59
  Speaker 3: construe it that way, Like there's just so many ways
• 5:25:01
  Speaker 3: you can put that, and like fitting it into a
• 5:25:04
  Speaker 3: ten word sentence is never going to be enough.
• 5:25:07
  Speaker 9: Ever, Yeah, yeah, which is why I'm really not worried.
• 5:25:11
  Speaker 5: Yeah, exactly, which is exactly why I'm surprised that they
• 5:25:14
  Speaker 5: were able to put something that's even vaguely Wheel of
• 5:25:16
  Speaker 5: Time into such a very short amount of words.
• 5:25:19
  Speaker 2: Well, I don't know about you, guys, but I drank
• 5:25:21
  Speaker 2: a lot while I was reporting this. Uh, and I'm
• 5:25:25
  Speaker 2: a little drunk, and I'm ready to actually take a break. Wrong, seth.
• 5:25:29
  Speaker 5: That means we can get some interesting conversations going. Time
• 5:25:33
  Speaker 5: for you to leave.
• 5:25:34
  Speaker 3: Ask me anything. I am here to answer your questions.
• 5:25:39
  Speaker 2: Oh lord, do you want to go get a hamburger
• 5:25:41
  Speaker 2: after this? I'm already thinking about it.
• 5:25:43
  Speaker 5: Okay, where are we getting hamburgers from?
• 5:25:45
  Speaker 2: Because I'm down Probably Alberta Street pub. Yeah, oh man,
• 5:25:49
  Speaker 2: there is a bartender. There is a young lady or
• 5:25:54
  Speaker 2: probably around my age, who just recently finished The Wheel
• 5:25:58
  Speaker 2: of Time, became a patron and started listening to the show.
• 5:26:00
  Speaker 2: So we can go there. And somebody that listens to
• 5:26:03
  Speaker 2: the show is the person that pours his strinks? Is
• 5:26:06
  Speaker 2: she Is she a Discordian? No, because I think she
• 5:26:11
  Speaker 2: just finished a mall. Okay, I'll check her Instagram. Okay, yeah,
• 5:26:18
  Speaker 2: from light archive all that stuff. I want to read
• 5:26:20
  Speaker 2: all of that like I want to get into it.
• 5:26:21
  Speaker 2: My problem is that, like I start reading other books
• 5:26:24
  Speaker 2: and then I get to this point while I'm reading them,
• 5:26:27
  Speaker 2: and I'm like, but this isn't the Wheel of Time,
• 5:26:29
  Speaker 2: and I start missing my friends and just end up
• 5:26:31
  Speaker 2: going back to the.
• 5:26:31
  Speaker 5: Wheel of Time.
• 5:26:32
  Speaker 9: That's what the audiobooks are for.
• 5:26:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you just try a storm Light.
• 5:26:37
  Speaker 9: No, you should try Broken as well.
• 5:26:38
  Speaker 3: Yes, you should always read that first, Like I mean,
• 5:26:40
  Speaker 3: before anything else, read Storm read Broken Earth.
• 5:26:43
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna as soon as I finish
• 5:26:45
  Speaker 5: with the Wheel of Time, I'm gonna go ahead and
• 5:26:47
  Speaker 5: start Broken Earths.
• 5:26:48
  Speaker 9: I used like they're so good, They're so I really
• 5:26:52
  Speaker 9: want to reread it, but I'm yeah.
• 5:26:55
  Speaker 3: Also, I will say the narrator with the audio books
• 5:26:59
  Speaker 3: is excellent.
• 5:27:01
  Speaker 5: Yeah, that's one thing that I worry about the audio
• 5:27:03
  Speaker 5: books because like the narrator for the Game of Thrones
• 5:27:07
  Speaker 5: books like sucks. I mean, I wouldn't say that he sucks.
• 5:27:12
  Speaker 5: He just sounds like, oh, well maybe he does. I'm
• 5:27:17
  Speaker 5: just trying not to be mean.
• 5:27:19
  Speaker 9: The Harry Potter narrator, I haven't I hate the Harry Potter.
• 5:27:23
  Speaker 5: I haven't listened to.
• 5:27:24
  Speaker 2: Him so much. I haven't listened to it.
• 5:27:25
  Speaker 9: I can not with that guy.
• 5:27:27
  Speaker 3: I'm not a big fan of the British accent with
• 5:27:30
  Speaker 3: a lot of the narrated books, like The Hobbit, like
• 5:27:33
  Speaker 3: a lot of a lot of the old school fantasy
• 5:27:35
  Speaker 3: books are narrated with a British accent, and I'm not
• 5:27:38
  Speaker 3: a big fan.
• 5:27:39
  Speaker 2: I want to hear them in I.
• 5:27:41
  Speaker 5: Like the British accent, so I'm all about it. Like
• 5:27:43
  Speaker 5: I listened to Russell Brand's book Revolution narrated by Russell Brand,
• 5:27:49
  Speaker 5: and I found it incredibly interesting.
• 5:27:51
  Speaker 9: Oh yeah, Bill Bryson narrates his own books, and that's
• 5:27:54
  Speaker 9: pretty cool.
• 5:27:55
  Speaker 3: There is that, But I feel like there's this pretentious
• 5:27:57
  Speaker 3: British accent that's done by Americans that is not actually
• 5:28:00
  Speaker 3: a British.
• 5:28:01
  Speaker 5: Oh like when Michael Kramer tries to do Elaine Yes,
• 5:28:06
  Speaker 5: and it just sounds exactly exactly not very organic.
• 5:28:09
  Speaker 3: Well, but that's the point. Elayne's supposed to sound super
• 5:28:12
  Speaker 3: snooty and not very organic.
• 5:28:13
  Speaker 5: She is, so I think it's I love Elaine and
• 5:28:17
  Speaker 5: I love her plotline. Like I'm one of the few
• 5:28:20
  Speaker 5: guys who one of the few.
• 5:28:22
  Speaker 3: People white up on the fucking tightrope.
• 5:28:26
  Speaker 9: Likes like a bloody quick.
• 5:28:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah exactly, Oh, thank you.
• 5:28:33
  Speaker 5: I've always loved Elaine's story arc, especially and so many
• 5:28:37
  Speaker 5: people hate Elaine's story arc in Camlin when she's retaking
• 5:28:40
  Speaker 5: the throne, But that's one of my favorite parts of
• 5:28:43
  Speaker 5: the entire series.
• 5:28:44
  Speaker 2: I see the appeal of it.
• 5:28:45
  Speaker 9: It's different, Yeah, it's different.
• 5:28:47
  Speaker 5: I love the intrigue, and that's why I feel like,
• 5:28:51
  Speaker 5: if I were to be I said I, I would
• 5:28:54
  Speaker 5: be blue because I'm so interested in that intrigue and
• 5:28:58
  Speaker 5: I love being able to witness it.
• 5:29:01
  Speaker 3: My frustration comes from the fact that Elaine doesn't realize
• 5:29:04
  Speaker 3: that just because her baby is born healthy, she's not
• 5:29:07
  Speaker 3: immortal and not. Yeah, like that's that's really Like I
• 5:29:12
  Speaker 3: feel like people are just like stop thinking you're unkillable
• 5:29:16
  Speaker 3: or uninjurable. Like you can have a fate worse than
• 5:29:18
  Speaker 3: death and still have your baby be born healthy, Like
• 5:29:21
  Speaker 3: it can be taken from you. Like there's so many things.
• 5:29:24
  Speaker 2: You could not have a mind anymore.
• 5:29:26
  Speaker 3: Exactly, Like there's so many reasons why this is not
• 5:29:28
  Speaker 3: okay for you to be like rushing off into danger.
• 5:29:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 5:29:32
  Speaker 5: That her recklessness is always and that's one of the
• 5:29:35
  Speaker 5: things that makes her human, which totally talking about Earl totally.
• 5:29:39
  Speaker 5: Like all of the characters have flaws, and that's definitely
• 5:29:42
  Speaker 5: one of Elaine's flaws. But when it comes to like
• 5:29:44
  Speaker 5: political savviness and when it comes to like cleverness and
• 5:29:48
  Speaker 5: creativity and like thoughtfulness, like very few people rival Elaine
• 5:29:55
  Speaker 5: in the series, Like she is a political mastermind.
• 5:30:00
  Speaker 2: Part of that is having Dialand to help her out.
• 5:30:02
  Speaker 5: Yeah, Dialon helps her out a lot. Dilond does help
• 5:30:06
  Speaker 5: her out a lot, But I feel like Dilon doesn't
• 5:30:08
  Speaker 5: answer everything, and she does a lot of things that
• 5:30:10
  Speaker 5: Dilon would have never thought of. Dilond just kind of
• 5:30:12
  Speaker 5: like helped her find her way there by giving her
• 5:30:16
  Speaker 5: a nudge or asking a question and like trying to
• 5:30:19
  Speaker 5: help her think through it from different angles. But every
• 5:30:22
  Speaker 5: good queen has a good advisor, like even more Gaze
• 5:30:26
  Speaker 5: had had Elida.
• 5:30:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, although Elia is an idiot.
• 5:30:31
  Speaker 5: Elida wasn't an idiot all the time. Though Elida became
• 5:30:35
  Speaker 5: more of an idiot after she achieved the Shawl. Elida
• 5:30:38
  Speaker 5: was very clever and very capable. I mean the staff
• 5:30:42
  Speaker 5: the stole, Yeah, that's what I meant.
• 5:30:43
  Speaker 3: Was the Stollavane got to her.
• 5:30:47
  Speaker 5: Yes, that's what really messed Elida up because Alida was
• 5:30:50
  Speaker 5: very capable, and I honestly feel like had Elida not
• 5:30:53
  Speaker 5: gotten so power hungry and not been tainted by Mordif
• 5:30:58
  Speaker 5: and Faine, she could have actually been a decent omreline.
• 5:31:02
  Speaker 5: She wouldn't have been the armorline the world needed. She
• 5:31:04
  Speaker 5: would have been a better armor line in a different time,
• 5:31:06
  Speaker 5: but she could have been a good omor win.
• 5:31:09
  Speaker 2: I think you're probably right, especially with the interference of
• 5:31:11
  Speaker 2: Padd and Fine.
• 5:31:13
  Speaker 5: And so many people forget about the influence with Patten
• 5:31:15
  Speaker 5: Faine because it's there's not as many chapters with Podd
• 5:31:19
  Speaker 5: and Fine and Elida's presidence as there are with Podd
• 5:31:22
  Speaker 5: and Faine and other people's presence. Like we see more
• 5:31:24
  Speaker 5: of him with the White Cloaks. We see him a lot.
• 5:31:28
  Speaker 5: With the White Cloaks, we see him. I think we
• 5:31:30
  Speaker 5: can see him a little bit more with the Shaun
• 5:31:31
  Speaker 5: Chin with.
• 5:31:33
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's it's not a lot of scenes,
• 5:31:36
  Speaker 3: but it's a very clear scene, right.
• 5:31:39
  Speaker 5: But where there's only like a couple of very brief
• 5:31:42
  Speaker 5: scenes with Elida, I think there might even only be
• 5:31:45
  Speaker 5: like one scene where he actually interacts with Elida, because
• 5:31:48
  Speaker 5: basically he's in the tower for one reason, and that's
• 5:31:51
  Speaker 5: to get the backer right.
• 5:31:53
  Speaker 9: He actually interacts more with all of the area than
• 5:31:56
  Speaker 9: with Alina, which really shows how much art call is
• 5:31:59
  Speaker 9: neither of the dark or the light.
• 5:32:00
  Speaker 4: It is completely.
• 5:32:05
  Speaker 5: It's abandoned the light to fight the shadow the other way.
• 5:32:10
  Speaker 9: The other left.
• 5:32:13
  Speaker 2: Are you Are you trying to call it? Uh?
• 5:32:16
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think are you guys ready?
• 5:32:17
  Speaker 2: I mean I enjoyed this, but yeah, we actually made it.
• 5:32:25
  Speaker 5: Yeah, hould on before we head stop. I do want
• 5:32:28
  Speaker 5: to remind everybody to support us on Patreon and to
• 5:32:31
  Speaker 5: join the discord like we love you. If you guys,
• 5:32:34
  Speaker 5: love us back, show it in any possible way that
• 5:32:36
  Speaker 5: you can.
• 5:32:37
  Speaker 2: Thank you.
• 5:32:38
  Speaker 5: Travis tag Us on Twitter, support us on Patreon, let
• 5:32:43
  Speaker 5: us know if there's anything else that we can do
• 5:32:45
  Speaker 5: to reach out further to the community. We want to
• 5:32:47
  Speaker 5: get more people involved, We want more people to be involved,
• 5:32:50
  Speaker 5: and we want to grow with you.
• 5:32:51
  Speaker 2: Guys.
• 5:32:52
  Speaker 5: Join us, love us, let us love you, We love you.
• 5:32:56
  Speaker 9: Good night.
• 5:32:59
  Speaker 1: Thank you for listen listening to the Wheel of Time
• 5:33:01
  Speaker 1: Spoilers podcast. Rate us in the Apple podcast app, or
• 5:33:04
  Speaker 1: support us on Patreon.
• 5:33:08
  Speaker 9: Was like good enough,