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Katie Woolf spoke to Education Minister Lauren Moss · 360 with Katie Woolf

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Now. We spoke a little earlier this week to the
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  Speaker 1: Education Union's Adam Lampey about the situation for teachers in
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  Speaker 1: the remote community of Unbecomber on Grood Island. He told
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  Speaker 1: us teachers had had their houses broken into on several
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: occasions by intruders wielding machetes and axes. Joining us on
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  Speaker 1: the line is the Education Minister Lauren Moss.
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  Speaker 2: Good morning, Minister, Good morning Katie, Good morning to your listeners.
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  Speaker 1: Now, Minister, the situation for teachers in the community sounds
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  Speaker 1: totally unacceptable. What steps have been taken to ensure the
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  Speaker 1: safety of these teachers.
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  Speaker 2: Well, first of all, you are absolutely right. We want
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  Speaker 2: to make sure that teachers feel safe in any setting
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  Speaker 2: that they are working in across the Northern Territory and
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  Speaker 2: any threat to that, I agree, is completely unacceptable. In
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  Speaker 2: terms of the matters we're talking about today out at Unmercumber,
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  Speaker 2: I know that in response to concerns that we're raised,
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  Speaker 2: the Department actually sent senior representatives straight out to talk
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  Speaker 2: to teachers. They've been talking to teachers and the community
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  Speaker 2: and elders pretty much every day alongside territory families and
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  Speaker 2: police to find some local solutions for this, I think
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  Speaker 2: it's really important to note that the local communities, you know,
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  Speaker 2: they obviously value the safety of those teachers as well,
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  Speaker 2: want the school to keep running and want those teachers
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  Speaker 2: to remain in the well.
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  Speaker 1: The education unions calling on the Department of Education to
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  Speaker 1: immediately relocate all of that teaching staff stationed in the
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  Speaker 1: community on Grood Island will at unbecome on Grood Island
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  Speaker 1: to ensure their safety. This, by the sounds of it,
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  Speaker 1: hasn't been done.
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  Speaker 2: So again, the Department of Education have been out there
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  Speaker 2: talking to teachers. I understand that in conjunction with Territory
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  Speaker 2: Families and their housing division, there has been conversations with
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  Speaker 2: teachers who do want to relocate to have a look
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  Speaker 2: at what the options are to be able to do that.
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  Speaker 2: But ultimately our priority we have to have a community
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  Speaker 2: solution to this. Teachers are members of that community. I
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  Speaker 2: know that the elders in that community and families in
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  Speaker 2: that community want to be part of the solution. So
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  Speaker 2: we've been having those conversations. There have been a number
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  Speaker 2: of meetings held with police, Territory Families and Education and
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  Speaker 2: the community and teachers about the way forward. But I
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  Speaker 2: also know that the Land Council, you know, have been
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  Speaker 2: keen to be part of those conversations and hadn't been
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  Speaker 2: part of those concerns when they were raised by the union.
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  Speaker 1: So just to go back to it. Though, those teachers
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  Speaker 1: do still remain in Unbecome at this point in time,
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  Speaker 1: despite the fears for their safety, So.
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  Speaker 2: The department have been working with teachers about what their
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  Speaker 2: desires are. I understand that a number of teachers want
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  Speaker 2: to remain in the community, and we are working with
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  Speaker 2: those who may not want to do that. But ultimately
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  Speaker 2: the focus has absolutely been on making sure that that
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  Speaker 2: is a safe place for everyone, including teachers, including students,
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  Speaker 2: including the community, and making sure that education can continue.
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  Speaker 2: And I think it's really important to say, you know,
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  Speaker 2: these things do happen from time to time. It's not
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  Speaker 2: acceptable that they do happen from time to time. Grout
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  Speaker 2: Island has been a place that has shown incredible leadership
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  Speaker 2: around education and wanting to have local decision making around education.
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  Speaker 2: They really value this for their kids, and they really
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  Speaker 2: value those teachers out there. So we need to make
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  Speaker 2: sure that we're not you know, we have to maintain
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  Speaker 2: safety for those teachers, and we need to make sure
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  Speaker 2: that we are also, you know, having the right solution
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  Speaker 2: for everybody there and maintaining that delivery of education to
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  Speaker 2: those kids.
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  Speaker 1: Well, look, it doesn't sound like it's the right situation
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  Speaker 1: though at the moment. If there is a case where
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  Speaker 1: you've got teachers who are inside their homes in the
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  Speaker 1: middle of the night and there's then you sue, presumably
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  Speaker 1: they've got to teach the next day, coming around during
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  Speaker 1: the middle of the night with axes and machetes like
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  Speaker 1: to me, that just sounds quite unbelievable.
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  Speaker 2: Look, Katie, there've definitely been some unacceptable incidents that have
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  Speaker 2: happened out there. I understand the police have been very
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  Speaker 2: very quick to respond to those incidentss They are working
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  Speaker 2: with families around what has happened, and we are working
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  Speaker 2: to support teachers. I believe that the Department of Education's
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  Speaker 2: actions were swift when those concerns were raised with them,
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  Speaker 2: and I see that each and every day, Katie. I know,
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  Speaker 2: you know, the Northern Territory government can be a big beast,
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  Speaker 2: and people don't necessarily see what's going on, but they
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  Speaker 2: go straight out there and they really have been working
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  Speaker 2: hard to make sure that they are supporting those teachers
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  Speaker 2: well and supporting the community well. Now I understand that
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  Speaker 2: the Lane Council have also written to the Education Union,
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  Speaker 2: and I just want to be really careful as well
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  Speaker 2: that we're only telling one side of the story. We're
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  Speaker 2: talking about a community and we need to make sure
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  Speaker 2: we're talking with the community well about this.
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  Speaker 1: So what is the Land Council written to the teachers'
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  Speaker 1: union about? What are they concerned about?
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  Speaker 2: So I, you know, I don't want to speak for them,
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  Speaker 2: but I am aware that the Land Council are quite
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  Speaker 2: concerned about the way in which some of the concerns
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  Speaker 2: have been raised. The concerns weren't raised with them. They
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  Speaker 2: are a really important partner in terms of education on
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  Speaker 2: Groot Island and particularly the local decision making around that.
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  Speaker 2: You know, they also want to make sure that everybody
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  Speaker 2: who is teaching in that community is safe. They want
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  Speaker 2: to make sure that the teachers are able to remain
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  Speaker 2: in that community, and I know that they're very disappointed with,
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  Speaker 2: you know, the way in which concerns have been raised.
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  Speaker 1: I think though, you know, even the Education Union said
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  Speaker 1: to us the other day when they were on the
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  Speaker 1: show that this is really like a last resort for
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  Speaker 1: them having to go to the media. It's not actually
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  Speaker 1: something that they wanted to do. But they are seriously
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  Speaker 1: concerned about the safety of those teachers.
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  Speaker 2: And I have absolutely no doubt and that is their job.
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  Speaker 2: And you know, the AAU was doing their job in
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  Speaker 2: raising the concerns of their members. They certainly didn't give
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  Speaker 2: me a call, so you know, I know that they
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  Speaker 2: raised concerns with the department and that the department took
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  Speaker 2: immediate action. It then went to that to a media release.
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  Speaker 2: I'm not interested in trading bubs by media release. I'm
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  Speaker 2: interested in the fact the department went straight out to
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  Speaker 2: support those teachers in that community.
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  Speaker 1: In a state. How many teachers are actually based there
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  Speaker 1: at Unbecomer Oh.
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  Speaker 2: Look, I don't have the number in front of me
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  Speaker 2: on top of mind, Katie, but there are a number
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  Speaker 2: of teachers based out there. There will be a number
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  Speaker 2: of local teachers who are also at the school, and
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  Speaker 2: there's a you know, there's a very experienced principle in
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  Speaker 2: there at the moment who's been out on Grout Island
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  Speaker 2: for quite some time now.
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  Speaker 1: I mean, are you concerns though about the fact that
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  Speaker 1: we could wind up with a teacher injured.
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  Speaker 2: Look, I think again, every teacher across the Northern Territory
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  Speaker 2: deserves to be safe in their workplace. That is absolutely
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  Speaker 2: front of mine for us, and we're actually partnering with
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  Speaker 2: the Education Union on a number of initiatives around teacher workload,
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  Speaker 2: around teacher safety, around principal well being, and occupational health
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  Speaker 2: and safety. So we are interested in partnering with everyone
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  Speaker 2: around that, noting there are schools around the Northern Territory
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  Speaker 2: that are dealing with some very complex issues, and so
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  Speaker 2: that's always front of mind and the department. In talking
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  Speaker 2: to my CEO about this issue over the last couple
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  Speaker 2: of days, I can absolutely tell you she takes this
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  Speaker 2: incredibly seriously, because how could you not. We take the
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  Speaker 2: safety of our teachers incredibly seriously. We need to make
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  Speaker 2: sure that we are stepping through this in a really thoughtful,
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  Speaker 2: respectful way, and that we are finding community solutions to
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  Speaker 2: these issues and making sure that everybody is safe and
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  Speaker 2: that education can continue to be delivered.
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  Speaker 1: Now, I know that the Education Union's Javi shrin had
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  Speaker 1: said that more broadly, what we're seeing in Unbercumber is
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  Speaker 1: evidence of a failing strategy by the all the Territory government.
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  Speaker 1: He said, Groote Island is supposed to be the duel
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  Speaker 1: in the Crown of Michael Gunner's local decision making policy. However,
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  Speaker 1: two of the three communities on the island are so
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  Speaker 1: dysfunctional it's not a safe place for public servants to
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  Speaker 1: live there. Does the government need to rethink that strategy.
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  Speaker 2: I'm going to be honest, I actually thought that part
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  Speaker 2: was really really offensive in terms of local decision making,
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  Speaker 2: you know, being government strategy, local decision making and how
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  Speaker 2: that applies in places like Groot Island is actually the
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  Speaker 2: community's strategy as well. This is about the community making
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  Speaker 2: their own decisions about their lives and the way in
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  Speaker 2: which they want services delivered. And I think really to
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  Speaker 2: conflate these issues is quite offensive. And you know, there
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  Speaker 2: are lots of communities across the Northern Territory who I
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  Speaker 2: think would be very very disappointed to see people throwing
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  Speaker 2: local decision making around well cheap political shots. Look, I
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  Speaker 2: get what you're saying.
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  Speaker 1: I get what you're saying, but when you're talking about
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  Speaker 1: you know, I guess at the end of the day,
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  Speaker 1: is it working If teachers are trying to educate young
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  Speaker 1: people in the community and then they're not feeling safe.
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  Speaker 2: I think that there's an issue here that needs to
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  Speaker 2: be dealt with and there's a response to that. But
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  Speaker 2: I think, you know, taking this incident and this set
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  Speaker 2: of concerns as I'm making a sweeping statement that local
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  Speaker 2: decision making across the territory isn't working, I think is
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  Speaker 2: really well. I just think it's offensive, Katie, and I
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  Speaker 2: don't I'm not buying into that. I think there's a
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  Speaker 2: there's a serious issue that needs to be dealt with.
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  Speaker 2: The Department, with other relevant agencies, is working really hard
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  Speaker 2: to try and address that issue.
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  Speaker 1: So following on from every single happened, Sorry, Minister, I'll
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  Speaker 1: just I know that we're in a bit of a hurry,
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  Speaker 1: so I'll just just cut in the just following on
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  Speaker 1: from all the discussion now and all the actions that
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  Speaker 1: you've taken and that the Department has, do you feel
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  Speaker 1: confident at this point in time that the teachers out
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  Speaker 1: at Unbecomber are safe.
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  Speaker 2: I feel confident that the department is working with those
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  Speaker 2: teachers around options for alternative housing if that is what
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  Speaker 2: they want. I am very confident that the Department of Housing,
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  Speaker 2: the Territory Police and the Department of Education are out
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  Speaker 2: there having the right conversations on the ground.
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  Speaker 1: So you are confident, So you are confident that they're safe.
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  Speaker 2: Well, I am very confident that there are really positive
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  Speaker 2: conversations happening on the ground around community safety and safety
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  Speaker 2: for those teachers and those students, and that the department
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  Speaker 2: is doing all that they can to support those teachers.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, I want to talk to you about another issue
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  Speaker 1: which a number of Territorians raised with this yesterday. Are
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  Speaker 1: kids not at school, not necessarily breaking the law, but
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  Speaker 1: doing the wrong thing and behaving badly during those school hours.
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  Speaker 1: We had some listeners contact as saying that kids are
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  Speaker 1: on the streets and also at Casurina, like I said,
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  Speaker 1: behaving badly during school hours. Why are they not pulled
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  Speaker 1: into school or what's the situation if there are kids
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  Speaker 1: that are meant to be at school and they're on
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  Speaker 1: the streets, are inside shopping centers.
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  Speaker 2: So I can speak specifically for Casurina, because that's obviously
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  Speaker 2: my electric Katie, and I know that I have certainly
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  Speaker 2: had the Department of Education out with their engagement offices
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  Speaker 2: in Casarina Square to make sure that they're you know,
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  Speaker 2: obviously having a look at what's happening, but connecting with
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  Speaker 2: those young people and finding out what schools they should
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  Speaker 2: be at. So we do have mobile engagement teams. They
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  Speaker 2: are working on identifying kids that should be at school,
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  Speaker 2: but obviously they also work in with people like territory
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  Speaker 2: families and territory police because for some of these young people,
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  Speaker 2: they're not going to school. You know, is it a
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  Speaker 2: sign or symptom of a whole range of other things
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  Speaker 2: going on that education alone. Can't you know, you could
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  Speaker 2: pick that kid up and take them to school, and
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  Speaker 2: there's no guarantee that that's going to be effective or
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  Speaker 2: or that that child's going to stay. There has to
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  Speaker 2: be a multi agency response.
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  Speaker 1: Has the department seen an increase in the number of
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  Speaker 1: young people that are maybe like you said in your
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  Speaker 1: electronic Casurina as an example.
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  Speaker 2: Have they seen an increase of young people.
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  Speaker 1: Like during those school hours when they're may be meant
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  Speaker 1: to be at school.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, look, I think you know, obviously there's a lot
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  Speaker 2: of work that needs to be done around attendance and
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  Speaker 2: engagement in schools, and that's why we're doing the engagement
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  Speaker 2: strategy work. At the moment, it's why we're doing work
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  Speaker 2: like three year old preschool investing in the early years
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  Speaker 2: so that those good habits are being set. But you know,
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  Speaker 2: I think, to be honest, you know, we've got a
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  Speaker 2: multi agency group set up in the Northern suburbs to
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  Speaker 2: specifically identify these kids and families and work with them.
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  Speaker 2: I think it remains a relatively small group of kids.
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  Speaker 2: Often it's the same group of kids we're talking about,
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  Speaker 2: you know, in different locations, Katie. So really it's got
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  Speaker 2: to be that multi agency approach. So that's why I
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  Speaker 2: think it's a much more coordinated response now with education,
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  Speaker 2: talking with police, talking to territory families and just coordinating
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  Speaker 2: better around you know, what is a relatively small group
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  Speaker 2: of young people.
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  Speaker 1: If it is just a small group of people, you know,
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  Speaker 1: I suppose to some of the businesses out there listening
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  Speaker 1: who've been impacted, or you know, some of those that
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  Speaker 1: are really grappling with this at the moment, they'll be thinking, well,
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  Speaker 1: if it's just a small group of people, why can't
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  Speaker 1: we do more to get them off the streets and
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  Speaker 1: to ensure that they're not behaving badly and hindering businesses
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  Speaker 1: and territorians and even tourists.
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  Speaker 2: We look again, like I think with that multi agency
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  Speaker 2: group that's been set up in the Northern Suburbs, that
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  Speaker 2: was something that I advocated really strongly for Katie for
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  Speaker 2: that very reason.
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  Speaker 1: Yep.
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  Speaker 2: I know that there's a small group of kids and
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  Speaker 2: I know when I stories that, you know, we're often
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  Speaker 2: talking about the same kids and it's incredibly frustrating. It's
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  Speaker 2: frustrating for everyone. It's it's frustrating for us as well.
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  Speaker 2: So getting that group up in the Northern Suburbs, which
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  Speaker 2: includes youth services and others, to make sure that we're
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  Speaker 2: actually having the right conversations about, you know, where the
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  Speaker 2: gaps are and what more we can all be doing.
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  Speaker 2: Because it's not just government either, it's there's a whole
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  Speaker 2: range of people in this space who and we all
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  Speaker 2: need to be accountable to it. So look, there is
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  Speaker 2: work to be done. I will always acknowledge that because
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  Speaker 2: I know how frustrating it is. I know many of
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  Speaker 2: my constituents are frustrated. I know many local businesses are frustrated.
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  Speaker 2: But it is really complex and I know you know
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  Speaker 2: that as well. You know there's a lot of factors
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  Speaker 2: involved here and there's always more that we can do.
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  Speaker 2: I'll be the first to admit that. So we're you know,
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  Speaker 2: we're looking at where the gaps are and trying to
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  Speaker 2: plug them.
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  Speaker 1: Well, look, we are going to be catching up with
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  Speaker 1: the Territory Police in just a little while. So I
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  Speaker 1: do want to move along because there is something that
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  Speaker 1: was announced yesterday which I I reckons a good idea,
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  Speaker 1: and that is the three year old pre school trial.
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  Speaker 1: It started. How many schools is this being rolled out in?
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  Speaker 2: So the current trial, there's two additional schools, so that's
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  Speaker 2: Lamella Primary School and also out at Berry Springs Primary School.
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  Speaker 2: It'll be rolled out in Tennant Creek and in Alice
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  Speaker 2: Springs and Malacc soon. But there's about four well, actually
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  Speaker 2: there's a few more remote primary schools so already doing this.
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  Speaker 2: So this will provide two years of preschool fifteen hours
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  Speaker 2: a week subsidized preschool for those kids. And really I
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  Speaker 2: think this is the greatest leaver that we have to
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  Speaker 2: change the lives of kids is getting them in two
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  Speaker 2: years of pre school, structured learning, you know, educational play,
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  Speaker 2: all the things that we know are really important to
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  Speaker 2: the development of healthy, well connected kids.
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  Speaker 1: I know there'll be some parents listening thinking to themselves, Oh,
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  Speaker 1: three just seems so young for me to have my
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: kids going into preschool. I know, I thought that with
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: one of my kids. The other one, I thought, oh, no,
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  Speaker 1: they're ready to go. I mean, what would you say
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  Speaker 1: to those parents that think, oh, I don't know about this.
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  Speaker 1: Three years old just seems really young.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, look I've got it eighteen months old, as you know,
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  Speaker 2: Katie and I reckon, you know, she might be ten
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  Speaker 2: before I feel like she's ready to go anywhere else.
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  Speaker 2: But no, I think this is about age appropriate educational engagement.
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  Speaker 2: So you know, we're not talking about obviously getting kids
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  Speaker 2: in it's three to learn Tricken on Tree. It's a
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  Speaker 2: very age it's age appropriate work. And really there's lots
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  Speaker 2: of evidence to suggest that that fifteen hours and two
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  Speaker 2: years of preschool really can be a fundamental change for
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  Speaker 2: a lot of kids. It's not compulsory, this is an option,
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  Speaker 2: but I think there's a lot of kids and particularly
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  Speaker 2: vulnerable families across the Northern Territory where this could be
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  Speaker 2: a really massive help for them in their children meeting milestones,
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  Speaker 2: developmental milestones, but also for that family getting a bit
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: more support around them as well.
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  Speaker 1: Well, Minister for Education Lauren Moss, I really appreciate your
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  Speaker 1: time this morning. Thank you so much for speaking.
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  Speaker 2: With us, Thank you very much for having me.
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  Speaker 1: Thank you