Latest / Birth at Work / S2 EP24 | Esther Grubbs: From Classroom to Birth Room, Charting the Next Chapter

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S2 EP24 | Esther Grubbs: From Classroom to Birth Room, Charting the Next Chapter · Birth at Work

• Krislyn Powell: Okay, Esther, we're so excited to have you on the show today. We would love for you to just take a few minutes and share with us a little bit about you, know, personally and professionally and why you decided to join us. Esther Grubbs: Okay, well hi. It's good to be here. So I feel like I kind of have like an unconventional story. I feel like a lot of my situations have kind of been unconventional even if they seem conventional from the get-go. But I am a mother of four. Right now I'm currently doing childbirth education. So we teach like weeknights, sometimes Saturdays. But in the past I have, I started off as an elementary school teacher. So I was actually an aid or paraprofessional for four years before while I was in school. So I'd go to work during the day, work in the classroom, support the teachers, support the kids, especially the kids that need extra help. And then in the evenings I'd go to school. So I did that for about four years and then... started teaching. I taught first grade for four years and then I taught fifth grade for four years and fifth grade I taught as like a part-time. So I did two days a week, I class shared with another teacher so that was kind of unique and unconventional but it worked really well for us. I was having babies throughout that. I left the classroom after I had my third child and I was like I'm gonna do, be a stay home mom. I was excited, but I'd remembered that when I had my first, kind of like, actually even before I was pregnant with my first, had kind of looked into being a doula, was really fascinated with childbirth since the age of probably like 19. So was like, yeah, I wanted to be a doula. Like it just completely spaced my mind. I looked Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: it up and that day I had like signed up and paid for my doula training, which I am not a. spontaneous person, you know, it's like not in my Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: nature, but I was like, this is where this is what I need to do. So I did that. I started out on my own and then I joined a group with other doulas pretty soon into that. And I kind of added in teaching childbirth education in there. The on-call life is really hard with having young kids. And there was some different like dynamics that went into that. Sometimes it was easier than others, but it was just like not a phase of life where I could be on call. So I left being on call and now I just do childbirth education and I co-own Birth Connection with my business partner. Sometimes I do placenta encapsulation, sometimes I don't. So that's kind of been thrown in there as well. But that's kind of my... professional and personal story for the past 20 years. Krislyn Powell: It's so amazing. I love all the twists and turns and we're here for it. I like each person that we bring on the show always has kind of a windy path. And it's cool that you mentioned too that you like had this interest and passion and dream when you were younger and kind of forgot about it. And then when you were looking to pivot again, you're like, yeah, you know, I remember, I remember it. I was actually really interested in that. Like now's the time to do it. So I'm excited to dig into your story a little bit more. Esther Grubbs: Yeah, thank you. Krislyn Powell: Yeah, and so taking it back, you taught elementary school for about eight years. And can you walk us through a little bit about like where you were at in your teaching career and journey when you started having children and and kind of the dynamics of balancing maybe being pregnant and also being in the classroom? Esther Grubbs: Yeah, so I had my first son midway through my first year teaching, which was a little wild. The first year teaching is just kind of a crazy experience. You're getting your bearings, right? So I had him right smack dab in the middle. That actually went great. I think it was the experience I had in the classroom beforehand to kind of see like what I wanted to do, what I didn't want to do. I really felt like I went into teaching with like a really good grasp on the realities of it. and I had a great long-term sub. Being pregnant in the classroom was honestly so fun. I was around a bunch of six-year-olds, right? Who doesn't love a baby? They were so excited about the baby and telling even, we'd come up with fun ways to tell them, the other teachers there, to tell the kids in the class and they were always so excited. The environment was, for the most part, really supportive. I think in a school, it's just pretty commonplace that they have. women having babies, taking maternity leave. there wasn't really issues there. But yeah, so I had my son, my first, that first year when I taught first grade, and then I had my second a few years later. And after I had him, that's when I started, when I transitioned to the teaching fifth grade. and doing the team teaching. So after I had him, I moved into part-time, which I know is like very rare. And it was just kind of like everything fell into place. I know it's not an option for everyone, but there was another teacher that I had worked with. We actually even went to high school together. And we were eight together and she was wanting to go part time and I was wanting to go part time. And so we kind of presented them with this option. Hey, she'll take these days. I'll take these days. She'll have these responsibilities. I'll have these responsibilities. So it really it worked out perfect. I mean we think we team taught for four years and Krislyn Powell: Bye. Esther Grubbs: I don't remember ever even once having like an issue as far as. her and I communicate and we didn't really see each other. You know, it's like we saw each other at the beginning of the year, sat in the classroom and things like that. But once the school year started, it's like she was there on her days, I was there on my days and we'd communicate via email or text. Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: But it was just kind of like the perfect, it just worked out really perfectly. Krislyn Powell: That's awesome that you were able to, it sounds like you, Esther Grubbs: Yeah. Krislyn Powell: you know, weren't, there was no fear of like advocating early on, you know, hey, this would be better for both of us. Let's figure out a way that we can present this and make it work. So I love that. You're very resourceful. And Esther Grubbs: Yeah. Krislyn Powell: then it was after your third child, right, that you decided to step away from teaching. you had your first, then with your second, you're like, okay, let's, you know, figure out a better rhythm here. I have a, I'm going to team teach. And then with your third, can you kind of walk us through the decision and what you were thinking as far as like, okay, this is how my journey is gonna shift now. What did you realize that made you make that decision? Esther Grubbs: Yeah, honestly, at that point when I had moved to part-time, was, so before I was putting my husband through school, and so it was like, I was financially responsible for our household 100%, you know? After I had my second, that's about the time that he graduated. So we were now at a place where we had two incomes, which was incredible. You know, it was just like something we never experienced, right? So even when I had moved to part-time, like looking at the financials, it was like, okay, I'm really not bringing home very much, but it was really kind of an insurance decision. So we saved a ton of money if we were split on insurance rather than like the whole family being on my husband's insurance or the whole family being on my insurance. Krislyn Powell: Mm. Esther Grubbs: We saved a ton with splitting between the two. So really that was the biggest thing is that they still gave me insurance benefits. even if I worked part time. So that was the biggest deciding factor. And that's kind of what kept me there. And just like the, I really loved what I did. I knew it was like a unique situation. And if I left it, am I ever gonna get this opportunity again? You know what I mean? It was unique. And even since we've left, I know other teachers have approached and tried to get a similar situation and they have told them no. I think it's just that we had proven ourselves. We'd been there both for like, I don't know, five to 10 years. And they just kind of trusted us, but starting over again, I don't know if that opportunity would present itself again. So I didn't want to leave for a lot of reasons, but it was honestly, I wasn't bringing it in a ton of money. It was still a lot of work even with it being part-time, right? And there were just a lot of changes in the school system, like politics-wise. most, the biggest reason I left was probably because my boss left. She was incredible and I had gone through different, had, you know, I think she was the third boss that I had in that capacity and I just really loved her. We had taught together and then she had moved up to that like administration role. And she left and the year I stayed for a year after she left and I was just like not loving it You know, I was complaining Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: to one of my good friends and she was like maybe it's time that you quit and That was like a big realization to me I don't know why it never even occurred to me that like I could quit that I didn't have to keep doing this if I didn't want to you know And I knew like I'm not bringing home a ton, right? I'm not I'm not supporting our family on this income. We have these two incomes but it's helping it with insurance. And I was like, okay, you know, let me think about that. And I talked with my husband and we just kind of like talked it out. And that honestly was the biggest reason that I left was because my boss who was so incredible, you know, they say like you work for your boss, not the company, right? It Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: was like, yeah. So her leaving was a big push to leave the classroom. Krislyn Powell: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense too. just like, yeah, I feel like when you get a great manager, it makes a huge, just a world of difference. Because they really are like the person that's directly responsible for the culture you're experiencing. they have, they're the person that you spend often the most time with. that, I love too that you. having this conversation with your friend and she's like, well, you know, why don't you just quit? Like, why don't you think about quitting? You're like, I, you know, I never even thought about that. Like sometimes we just get so kind of set in like, like this is, this is my life. This is what I'm doing. This is the rhythm. Like I have to stick this out. It's uncomfortable, but there are always options, right? And so it's cool to kind of sit with it, even if you're not going to make the decision right away, but just to explore, like get curious, you know, what would life look like if I quit. Esther Grubbs: Yeah, yeah. Krislyn Powell: that's cool that you mentioned that too. And I just want to focus here on too, like you mentioned, you know, it was really cost effective for insurance purposes, but in the reality of it, like at that time, the paycheck and what you're bringing home, sitting with it, you're like, it wouldn't make that much of a difference if I stayed or if I left. And I feel like there is a financial reality that a lot of parents face when both are working and they're trying to communicate and talk openly about what would work best. What was that conversation like between you and your husband when you were curious about quitting and you thought maybe this could be a reality and maybe it would be better? Esther Grubbs: Yeah, it was kind of interesting just because through the course of like both of our professional lives, there was a lot of give and take there, right? Like I put him through school, we had a couple of kids before he was even done with school. And during that time, he was kind of like the default parent, right? If the kids are sick, it's very difficult for a teacher to like, the kid woke up sick. I can't you can't just call out, know, it's like you got to have subplans. You have everything. You have to have everything organized. You don't organize it for yourself like you do for somebody else coming into it, right? So it's very difficult to make sub plans. So he was kind of just pushed in as the default parent, right? Krislyn Powell: Mm. Esther Grubbs: Even when he was still working, he would then work from home. Most of the time he could still work from home. His job was pretty flexible. And so it was kind of he got a new job. where he was gonna be traveling, work was gonna require more from him, he was gonna have more meetings set that he couldn't just not show up to or call out of, right? And so was kind of the shift of like, okay, now I'm becoming the default parent, whereas he had kind of been the default parent. it was kind of just natural, right? Like maybe it's just time to be, for you to just, already. moving into that default parent, whereas he had been before. It didn't make sense for him to leave his job. So it was kind of just like, all right, you're already doing, taking on most of the kid and home stuff. So it made more sense for me to do that. It was also just kind of, it was just, what's the word? It was just disheartening too, to be like, okay, I'm doing all this work and it's really like a couple hundred dollars a month, you know? And I Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: also, did wanna, I kind of fought back against, you know, you hear people a lot say like, okay, once I take out the cost of daycare for my salary, I'm only making like this much, right? And I think it's a cultural thing. Like, why are we only talking about that when we talk about the woman's salary, not the men's? You know, he was Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: never like, but when we take childcare out of my, salary, right? It's only like taken out of mine. And so Krislyn Powell: Mm-hmm. Esther Grubbs: I actively kind of fought against that. That's why I think the insurance thing was a big thing, right? And so I didn't really think of it as like day cares coming out of mine. It was like half of day cares coming out of mine, half Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: of day cares coming out of his, right? But then it's like actually looking at it like, oh, okay, it really is a couple hundred dollars a month. And just looking into other options for insurance as well. So I found a health share. That was a lot more cost effective. I just didn't really have the motivation to kind of look into those other things beforehand that made it more doable. But yeah, it was disheartening. It was disheartening. Just the cost of childcare and like paying these, paying more than I'm making, you know, more than I'm bringing home. It's just disheartening. Krislyn Powell: Yeah, yeah. I echo that sentiment and just the experience and the way that you navigated the conversation with your husband is kind of like what I just experienced this past year with my husband too. But yeah, I mean, that was a big reason. Like I held on to work for so long thinking, you know, with our first like... while half is coming out of his paycheck, half's coming out of mine. Like we're balancing the childcare. And I also was, I was the breadwinner early on in our marriage, close to up until we started having kids and then roles flipped. And then with the second, he has recently gotten a job where he's traveling quite a bit more and it just makes sense for me to be around. I, you know, I wanted to have like a breastfeeding journey that was... Good, not like the first one. Esther Grubbs: Yeah. Krislyn Powell: So interesting though. I echo the sentiment, like you kept saying disheartening. That word was coming up for you, disheartening. It seems like there's not affordable childcare. I mean, truly there's not for kids under five in the US. And that's something that... I think we talk about and we've seen over the course of this past year in 2025, there's just this mass sort of resignation of women from the workforce and in a big way, that's one of the reasons. So just, yeah, that is like a frustrating point, but I feel like you kind of turned it into something that was liberating for you too, because you realize like, this isn't maybe worth my time. let's do something that I'm, I actually am passionate about and you know, want to make it work while I'm spending more time at home. And so let's talk about your dual work. You said that once you realized like that was a passion of yours and you wanted to pursue it again, what, like what was that timeline? I know you said you like signed up for the training right away. You kind of like made it happen pretty quickly. So with that pivot, how did that play out? Esther Grubbs: Yeah, so doula work, the start was pretty slow, right? It's hard to find clients when you're brand new. I had left the classroom, it was actually right during COVID. So after I had my third daughter, I had her in March, March of 2020. We obviously didn't go back in person. So that was like my last, that was when I had left the classroom. And then I wanna, yeah, I know, right? Krislyn Powell: Good timing. Esther Grubbs: I'm gonna I want to I want to say I started my doula training. think it was November that November So I was like pumping at the doula training, all the things Taking births very slowly but births took a while to come in, right? It was like trying to find people that I can get my certifying births with things like that. So that was a pretty slow start And then that following I want to say that next summer as when I joined a group where clients were being brought to me. And that was kind of like hit the ground running at that point. Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: So a little over a year after I'd had my third that I was like hit the ground running. And then before that, it was kind of a slow start for probably six to eight months. Krislyn Powell: Yeah, I wanted to dig into that a little bit more too, because I feel like, you know, not just with doula work, but oftentimes, you know, we're seeing like, and just like on a broader spectrum, I mentioned earlier, like women leaving the corporate workforce, or I guess, paid work in the traditional sense. What typically happens after that is they shift into consulting, contracting work, and in number of ways like that can look like doula work. Like that's, that's... you know, you're owning your own business, you're contracting with clients and customers. It's not necessarily like the flip of a switch that things are successful and it's an overnight like celebration, right? Of just this, okay, yeah, this is the path I'm meant to be on. It takes a little time and effort and legwork. And so if you could give some advice to people who are listening in, Maybe they're not necessarily looking to be doulas, but just with the lens of like shifting from traditional work into owning their own business or bringing in their own customers, what would you say to those women in the early stages when they know that they're supposed to, you know, switch this path and they want to have more time at home, but it might get discouraging in the beginning. Esther Grubbs: Yeah, I would say patience. feel like timing is a lot of it. Like you just need time to build connections, especially with starting your own business, getting your name out there, right? It takes time. And then also connections, connecting with other professionals I think is so vital. And I can't speak to a whole lot of like advertising because I've we've never advertised at all. It's all been based on word of mouth. social media and I'm sure some of that, you know, that's a great tool to utilize as well. But I really feel like connecting with other professionals. Like I remember from the get-go, I left my doula training and I was like, wow, I really feel unprepared to actually support someone in labor. I need more practice. So I Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: like went on Facebook, went on some doula groups and like, hey, I'm hosting like a new doula hangout. I want to get to know some new doulas. can practice like the hip squeezes. We can practice the comfort measures, right? Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: And I hosted multiple new doula meetups and I was like brand new. I hadn't even been to a birth yet, you know, Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: but just getting like the hands-on practice and then the connections and a lot of those doulas are still like some of my great friends and a lot of them have left the birth worlds completely. You know, it's like they never got up and running and I see that a lot too. It is hard to like get up and running in this line of work. It's hard to get your name out there. It's hard to meet people. It's hard to have people trust you to come to their birth, you know, and it's like, you don't have the, like the hustle. does take a lot of hustle. You know, if you don't have the hustle of going to the networking events, having a social media presence, putting yourself out there and hosting a bunch of people in your home, you know, and even sometimes I was like, Hey, let's go meet at this restaurant, right? If I didn't want to have everyone come in my home, it was also during COVID, Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: a little bit later into that, but. hustle, patience, and time. Krislyn Powell: Yeah, that's great advice. And I know you also mentioned that you segued into childbirth education. I think that was, you said, you shifted into a team that would bring you clients. And I think you had the opportunity to not only be a doula there, but also teach. Did you feel like that was more? like you found your footing in childbirth education since you had been a teacher, or did you miss the doula work? Like what kind of prompted that decision? I know you mentioned too with the on-call, like that was a little bit draining and so you were looking for something Esther Grubbs: Yes. Krislyn Powell: different, yeah. Esther Grubbs: Yeah, honestly, the big motivation there was money. It like we were Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: at a point where I did need to bring in some more money and I'm like, hey, you know, I can teach these classes. I can make a set amount of money. Whereas birth work is a little bit more sporadic to make the money for the birth that you're attending, right? So Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: having a steady stream of money. I think teaching elementary school like gave me the confidence that like I can do this, but really there wasn't a whole lot of, I didn't feel like it was similar. I don't feel like it was similar. Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: You'd think it would be similar, but the day-to-day is very different, and teaching is very different. So I think it gave me that confidence, and almost that like, okay, I have this checkbox, like I've taught before, I have a degree in education, but really it didn't, I don't think it, it was a completely different skill set. Krislyn Powell: It's like it's whole other animal, Teaching adults Esther Grubbs: Yeah, yeah, totally. Krislyn Powell: versus teaching children, it's totally different, like subject matter, right? Yeah, Esther Grubbs: Yes. Krislyn Powell: and then you, you know, shortly started your own business, Birth Connection, and you mentioned like... maybe didn't have so much of a passion for the business side of things, so that wasn't like a big motivator for you in the beginning, but what gave you the confidence or the push to go out on your own? Like, what was the light bulb moment that you're like, I can do this, I will do this, I'm going to do this? Like, yeah, this is gonna be successful. Esther Grubbs: Yeah, honestly, just like necessity. So I loved my time working for the groups that I worked for, but they had made some changes where I was like, you know, I'm not, I'm not going to be here any longer. So I quit. And I felt like I needed to, I felt like that's what I needed to do. And I felt good about that. But it was then after initially quitting and being like, okay, I don't really want to be a business owner. I've never wanted to be a business owner. I'm happy to work for the man, right? And I can make a little bit less money, but I get less of the stress and the man can get that from me, right? I'm not someone that's like, yes, exactly. I'm not Krislyn Powell: The man can handle the hustle. Esther Grubbs: someone that's ever really wanted to be a business owner. And so when I quit, was like, originally I'm like, all right, I guess I'm done teaching, right? I guess that's it. I don't really want to do the business side and then just sitting with it for even a few days I was like, you know what? I feel like there would just be like a hole in my life. I really love teaching. I really love meeting cool people, talking to cool people. I just felt like I really wanted to and it was kind of just like, okay, if I want to do the teaching, I also have to do the business side of that. So was just kind of necessity, like, okay, if I have to do the business side, fine. If that means I get to do what I actually want to do, you know? Krislyn Powell: Yeah, yeah, and I feel like you had already experienced early on what it was like to have to create relationships and go out on your own and meet people and bring something to life in the beginning and then had the... support from the organization you were with. So looping back to that was like, maybe there wasn't so much fear there because you'd already kind of done the thing a little bit. So you were familiar with it and you knew what enough about, you you had enough experience, you knew enough about what it would take to go out. And with Birth Connection too, you have a co-founder, right? A partner in business. So you're Esther Grubbs: Yeah. Krislyn Powell: not completely alone in that sense too. So I love that. Esther Grubbs: Yeah. Yeah. That's funny that you brought up fear. really feel like there, wasn't fear. It wasn't like, I don't want to start a business because I'm scared. if it doesn't pan out? was just like, don't want to, like, I don't want to figure out how to do taxes. You know, it was just like, Krislyn Powell: Yeah, yeah. Esther Grubbs: I don't want to, but, but I knew I could. It's just like, how bad do I want it? And I wanted to teach enough to take on that other stuff too. And then yes, I have my business partner and we can kind of split up those responsibilities and that's worked out really well too. Krislyn Powell: That's great. And I know too, this is more leaning towards the subject matter of what you actually teach, but just kind of... popped into my mind when we were talking about this term fear and, you know, in starting a business and talking about what it's like, building families, building careers, there's so many pivots, but you, I mean, this is like what you specialize in, what you're teaching is like how to overcome fear in Esther Grubbs: Yeah. Krislyn Powell: the birth space, but really like we know that we birth the way that we live and that like accepting that truth is allowing... us to open our perspective and see the parallels with how we carry ourselves in life and how we'll show up on that day when we birth. So I'm curious if you would be open to sharing a little bit about what your classes entail and what you've seen from women and their partners who are coming in to these classes. I know you have Daddy Doula So just like taking a moment to explain a little bit about. the concepts so our listeners can get a better idea of what your business offers and specifically like how you support them in understanding how to work through the fear. Esther Grubbs: Yeah, yes, that is a huge part of our classes. We're really, really proud of Daddy Dula. That's something we created completely on our own. I actually had the idea, one of my neighbors, when I was kind of like knee deep in doula work, one of my neighbors was like, hey, we want a doula. It's not really in the cards for us financially. Could you come over and just like teach my husband how to be my doula? And I'm like, like a daddy doula class, right? We were texting back and forth, like this daddy doula class. And I'm like, that's actually a great idea for a class. I was still with the other group that I worked for at that point. But then when I left and teamed up with my business partner, I was like, hey, I really think we need to make this happen. So that's like our baby. We wrote it from the ground up. We created our own workbook. We feel like everything in it has such an important purpose. We still kind of fine tune it here and there. But it is a regular childbirth education class. It is definitely condensed. It's only two nights or one day, like a Saturday whole day. So you're still going to walk away with, you know, basic childbirth education. But it's all about just supporting a woman in labor, physically, mentally, emotionally. It's very, very hands on. We spend lots of time moving around, we use different tools, we practice the birth ball, the peanut ball, robozos, tens units, so it's super hands on. Krislyn Powell: So awesome. Thanks for sharing a little bit more. I just feel like it's important to educate our listeners on that and to understand, you know, not only like your journey and how you are building your business, but also like what your offerings are and why they're important. And yeah, I love it. I think it's so cool too that you were able to listen to a need that came up like a, you know, there was clearly a market fit for Daddy Doula and... that popped into your line of sight and then you're like, okay, there's this yearning for this learning element, there's this need, there's this problem we can solve, how do we do this? And you were creative enough to figure that out, not only that, but go down the trademark path right for it and make it your own offering. So kudos to you for that, that's amazing. Esther Grubbs: Thank you. Yeah, we're really proud of it. Krislyn Powell: Yes. And just a couple questions as we close. I would love for you to kind of lean into what it's like balancing your business now and your family. Because I know part of the reason why you left teaching was not only monetarily, but also because you were growing your family and it made a little bit more sense for you to be the default parent. But now your kids are growing, you have a business that you've started. do you feel that there's been like more rhythms that you've had to unlearn or learn and what has that path been like? Esther Grubbs: Yeah. So you had kind of, you had asked a little bit about like balance, right? You'd said that earlier in your question. And I had heard a definition like probably a decade ago about balance. And it has just stuck with me. So she had talked about balance, like we think of it as like, everything is perfectly balanced in our life. We're spending the perfect amount of time in each area, right? But she was saying like, think about balance like you're riding a skateboard, right? you are not centered on the skateboard the whole time. Sometimes you're leaning this way, sometimes you're leaning that way, sometimes you're turning, so you're leaning your body, right? And so I really kind of took that definition to heart. And I feel like I love the word balance and I really try to achieve balance, but with the understanding of it doesn't mean that there aren't times when I'm gonna lean more into my family life. That's my balance, I'm leaning to this, right? And then there are other times where I'm leaning into my professional life and I might not see my family for a week or I might just be hunkered down getting work done. And then I know that I'm gonna come back to the middle or come back to the other side. So I feel like that perspective shift of, it helped me also get rid of the guilt of those busy weeks. especially like the beginning of the school year, right? So busy when you're teaching elementary school, you've got all the meet the teacher stuff, you're setting up your classroom, you're in meetings, and there was like crushing guilt during that time, right? I don't see my baby hardly at all during this time. But it was a nice perspective shift of like, I can still be having balance, but right now I'm just leaning into my professional life, but that's not always gonna be the case. Then I'm gonna lean into my family life. So feel like right now I'm kind of doing the leaning into the family life. I'm teaching pretty sparingly, usually like once a week. So yeah, I think it's just you lean one way, you lean another way. Krislyn Powell: Yeah, that's a beautiful way to phrase it and to have that picture in mind. It's just like, yeah, we're flowing, right? We're moving one way or another. And you also shared, Esther Grubbs: Yeah. Krislyn Powell: I think throughout this conversation too, a little bit about like how pivots are a good thing. It can be beautiful. Looking back now at the pivots that you've made between teaching, doula work, childbirth education, now to owning your own business. What, you know, How do you feel about those pivots now? Looking back at your journey, I'm sure you are proud of where you've been and where you've come and where you are now, but are there any other words or feelings that you would use to describe your experience and just the journey that you've taken? Esther Grubbs: Yeah, I feel like there have been a lot of pivots and some have felt forced. Like even leaving doula work, leaving the classroom felt easy. It felt like it was something that I wanted to do. Leaving doula work didn't really, you know, it felt like I had to, right? It just Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: wasn't sustainable for our lives. There was like a little bit of resentment there even, you know, and I don't want to be resenting my kids or resenting my husband because I can't do this thing that I want to do, right? Krislyn Powell: Yeah. Esther Grubbs: And I don't feel that anymore, but just like the flexibility and the flow, which is so much a part of labor and birth as well, which is what I teach, I think is huge. Just allowing, even if it's like, okay, if I didn't have kids, if I didn't have a husband, this is what I'd be doing, right? I'm not doing what I would be doing if I had nobody else to care for. But I also think it's beautiful. to lean into it. I also, think something unique about kind of my mindset is I decided early on that I wanted to view motherhood as my job. And so I kind of take a lot of the skills that I've learned and put them into motherhood. And I think that can be really helpful too. So the pivot to of like, no, this is my job right now. You know, like this is my focus. Yes, I'm teaching childbirth education. I'm doing the business side. during nap time or whatever if I have a babysitter. But yeah, I don't know. Krislyn Powell: I like the way that you phrased that. My husband actually refers to that very frequently, even though our roles have shifted so often, but he refers to motherhood as my job. And that used to kind of annoy me, but now I'm like, no, I feel like that he's respecting what I do. And so I appreciate that, but he's saying like, this is my job, you know? And Esther Grubbs: Yeah. Yeah. Krislyn Powell: so I like that. I'm also... I just want to take a moment to acknowledge that there's been a lot of conversation around the label working moms and just like kind of throwing that out the window because we don't say working dads. It's like all moms work, Esther Grubbs: Yeah. Krislyn Powell: all dads work. So before we close, we always end by asking you to... shed a little bit of light on where our listeners can find you, how we can support you, what you're up to. So if you could just share, yeah, where can we find more about Birth Connection? Where can we support Esther? Esther Grubbs: Yeah, so we're online. We're pretty active on Instagram. That's @birthconnectionaz. And then our website is the same, birthconnectionaz.com. That's our email as well, birthconnectionaz@gmail.com So yeah, we're pretty active online. You can find us there. Krislyn Powell: Love it. And then as you look forward to the future, what hope do you have for working parents? Esther Grubbs: What hope do I have for working parents? Hope that something that I wish I would have done differently is to invest in myself. So I hope to give parents like the go ahead, invest in yourself. We even talked about after I had my second son, he was a very, very difficult baby. And that first year was, it was so difficult. in all areas, right? It was really hard on our marriage, our relationship, it was hard professionally. And I wish that I could go back and tell myself like invest in this time, hire an overnight postpartum doula, go into debt if you need to. You know, it is very important that you support yourself during this time. Krislyn Powell: Yeah, 100%. I think that's so wise and I'm just gonna throw out like another kudos to you. I took hypnobreathing twice and with my second pregnancy birth experience, took it with you, took it through Birth Connection and it really opened my eyes and I'm so glad that I repeated that class that I had that, that I made the investment to do that so that my husband and I were Esther Grubbs: Thank Krislyn Powell: prepared and it was really life-changing for us. Love the investment, love leaning in on that. I've really appreciated this conversation. I think you're amazing. So thank you so much for joining us today. Esther Grubbs: You're so kind and as my kids walk in the door from school for a big time. But Krislyn Powell: We're perfect timing! We love it! Esther Grubbs: I'm so glad to hear that we loved having you in class. Krislyn Powell: Yes, thank so much.