Latest / Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections / Networking Unleashed: S1E28 An Interview with Dr Kyle Elliott and Michael A Forman

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Networking Unleashed: S1E28 An Interview with Dr Kyle Elliott and Michael A Forman · Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections

• 0:16
  Hello, and welcome to Networking Unleashed, Building
• 0:21
  Profitable Connections. Welcome back to the show,
• 0:24
  folks. I'm your host, Michael Foreman, and you're
• 0:27
  listening to the podcast where networking is
• 0:30
  more than just an awkward handshake at Bad Coffee.
• 0:34
  It's an art and a talent. But here's the twist.
• 0:37
  It's an art and talent you can actually learn.
• 0:41
  Yes, even if you're the person hiding in the
• 0:44
  corner at every event pretending to check emails.
• 0:48
  Networking isn't just a nice skill to have, it's
• 0:51
  a game changer. And when you get good at it,
• 0:54
  you'll wonder why you didn't start sooner. More
• 0:57
  connections, more opportunities, more profits.
• 1:01
  It's like unlocking a cheat code for life. So
• 1:05
  whether you're the life of the party or just
• 1:06
  let me stay at home and text type, we've got...
• 1:10
  Something for you. So stick around and let's
• 1:14
  turn those awkward small talk moments into big
• 1:17
  wins. Now, I've got a wonderful guest today.
• 1:22
  His name is Dr. Kyle Elliott. And he is, let
• 1:27
  me read you his bio. Dr. Elliott is the founder
• 1:31
  and career coach behind caffeinatedkyle .com.
• 1:36
  His expertise is Silicon Valley and high -tech.
• 1:40
  As a result of working with Dr. Elliott, senior
• 1:43
  managers and executives have landed jobs at Meta,
• 1:47
  Amazon, Google, and nearly every other tech giant
• 1:52
  you can imagine. Without further ado, I'd like
• 1:56
  to introduce you to Kyle, and I'll let him tell
• 1:59
  you a little bit more about his background. How
• 2:01
  are you doing, Kyle? I am doing so great. Thank
• 2:04
  you for having me. I'm so excited to be speaking
• 2:07
  about this important topic today. As you said,
• 2:09
  it can be awkward for people to network, and
• 2:12
  I'm excited for us to talk about that, especially
• 2:14
  for introverts, where it can be such a drain
• 2:16
  on their energy. Yes, yes. And listen, I go across
• 2:21
  the country talking about networking and how
• 2:25
  important it is face -to -face, through Zoom,
• 2:28
  through the cell phone. It's why even bother?
• 2:32
  You have to feel the vibe of the person, feel
• 2:34
  the vibe of the room. And extroverts, it's real
• 2:37
  easy. But introverts, this is your specialty.
• 2:40
  What are some common misconceptions introverts
• 2:44
  have about networking and how can they reframe
• 2:48
  their mindset? I find for introverts, they often
• 2:53
  think they have to be super talkative, they have
• 2:55
  to be outgoing, and they have to change themselves.
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  When people see me, they assume I'm an extrovert
• 3:00
  oftentimes, unless you're a fellow introvert
• 3:02
  who really knows what introversion is. People
• 3:04
  assume you have to be talkative, you have to
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  be outgoing. I find instead, I would lean into
• 3:09
  your strengths. If you're someone who's more
• 3:11
  introverted, you're more contemplative, you're
• 3:13
  more thoughtful. I would lean into that. For
• 3:16
  me, it's asking questions. Unless I'm on a podcast
• 3:18
  or doing a speaking engagement, it's asking a
• 3:21
  lot of thoughtful questions. It's having those
• 3:24
  one -on -one conversations. So instead of feeling
• 3:26
  like you have to step way outside your comfort
• 3:28
  zone, yes, there's benefits of stepping outside
• 3:31
  your comfort zone. But can you lean into that
• 3:33
  instead, those strengths that you have? Ask thoughtful
• 3:36
  questions. Have one -on -one conversations. Instead
• 3:38
  of feeling like you have to be the life of the
• 3:40
  party. and going up and sparking tons of conversations,
• 3:44
  focus on that one -on -one and it can be a game
• 3:46
  changer. That's great. And one thing that I always
• 3:50
  keep in mind when, especially I'm an extrovert,
• 3:54
  obviously, but even for introverts, when you're
• 3:57
  speaking with somebody, you remember the word
• 4:00
  form, F -O -R -M. Family, occupation, recreation,
• 4:06
  and a message. So you can start talking about
• 4:10
  family, their husband, their wife, their sister,
• 4:13
  brother, son, daughter, whatever, and have them
• 4:16
  talk because people love to speak and talk about
• 4:20
  themselves. So they can talk and talk. But you
• 4:23
  can move the conversation to occupation, to recreation.
• 4:27
  What do you do? Do you ski? You know, go boating,
• 4:30
  whatever you have. But the whole idea is to because.
• 4:37
  There's a mantra in networking. Know you, like
• 4:40
  you, trust you, then they'll do business with
• 4:43
  you. And that trust factor is so crucial that,
• 4:48
  look, know you and like you. Look, everybody
• 4:50
  knows you. Everybody likes you. Not everybody
• 4:53
  will like you, but it's narrowing the field down
• 4:55
  a little bit. But trust is such a crucial factor.
• 4:58
  And you have 30 seconds, a minute. Five minutes,
• 5:03
  10 minutes to build that trust factor and have
• 5:05
  their wall come down. But instead of me doing
• 5:08
  all the talking, let me ask you another question.
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  What's one simple strategy an introvert can use
• 5:14
  to feel more comfortable walking into a networking
• 5:18
  event? I would have some questions ready, have
• 5:22
  some talking points. I find often going into
• 5:25
  a networking event, people feel, oh gosh, I'm
• 5:27
  going to be on the spot. So I encourage people
• 5:29
  to develop some talking points, some questions.
• 5:32
  It doesn't have to be super lengthy. But having
• 5:35
  some go -to talking points. I love your form.
• 5:37
  I've never heard that before. But have some talking
• 5:40
  points. Are you going to ask people, how did
• 5:42
  you hear about this conference or networking
• 5:44
  event? Or are you going to ask people, how's
• 5:46
  your day going? Whatever those questions or talking
• 5:49
  points are, having some ready can be super powerful.
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  So then if you get stuck. you can then have something
• 5:55
  you can turn to. It's like media training. You
• 5:57
  just have your talking points that you keep coming
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  back to, and that can help alleviate those feelings
• 6:03
  of doubt or nervousness. That's great. Great
• 6:08
  advice also. What I try to tell people, especially
• 6:12
  introverts, but this goes for both extroverts
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  and introverts, do a little preparation work.
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  Before you go to that networking event, there's
• 6:21
  always that networking. meeting first with 300
• 6:25
  people and it's like, oh my God, what do I do?
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  But there's always like tables set up and things
• 6:31
  like that. They usually give out a flyer or something
• 6:35
  about the networking event. Look at that flyer.
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  See the people that you want to go to, circle
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  them, do what you have to do, but you have a
• 6:43
  plan. If you have a plan that gives you a little
• 6:46
  confidence and you know as well as I do, confidence
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  is key. You feel confident with yourself. You
• 6:54
  can take down mountains. Okay. How can introverts
• 6:59
  leverage their natural strengths to build meaningful
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  connections? I would focus on that one -on -one.
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  I remember I was at a conference recently and
• 7:08
  I saw some people standing alone. And I'm like,
• 7:11
  hey, is this the introvert area? So going and
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  having those one -on -one conversations. Asking
• 7:17
  those thoughtful questions and saying, OK, here
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  are my personally one of my strengths is asking
• 7:22
  questions. So I'm going to lean into that. Or
• 7:24
  maybe you like silence. Don't feel like you have
• 7:27
  to fill up every sentence or every kind of silent
• 7:31
  moment. But lean into that instead can be really
• 7:34
  powerful. I also love that research ahead of
• 7:37
  time. If you know there's going to be some certain
• 7:40
  people at the conference or they give out often
• 7:42
  an attendee list or directory, you can reach
• 7:44
  out to people ahead of time. say, hey, I'd love
• 7:46
  to set up a coffee. Don't feel like you have
• 7:49
  to go to every single mingling event. But instead,
• 7:52
  I was at a conference recently. Some people reached
• 7:55
  out to me and I reached out to them and said,
• 7:56
  hey, let's set up some coffee and have conversations.
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  You don't always have to go in and just feel
• 8:01
  like you have to go around the room talking to
• 8:03
  every single person. Sometimes two or three really
• 8:06
  deep conversations can be better than just a
• 8:08
  bunch of 20, 30 second meet and greets. That's
• 8:13
  true. I love what you said when you say, hey,
• 8:15
  is this the introvert's corner? That's a great
• 8:17
  icebreaker. And usually you'll get a laugh out
• 8:21
  of it and that will start you on your way. One
• 8:24
  thing that I say about people walking to a networking
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  event and walking up to a table, the first thing
• 8:31
  that they do is listen. You don't talk. You just
• 8:36
  wait. Listen for the conversation because that
• 8:40
  conversation. may not be suitable for you so
• 8:44
  you haven't said anything yet you quietly bow
• 8:47
  out and you go to the next table because you
• 8:50
  don't have to speak let's say it is a conversation
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  you want to be a part of let the conversation
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  come around to you because remember you are the
• 9:00
  expert in your field so when the conversation
• 9:04
  comes around to you say one or two sentences,
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  hopefully it's intelligent, and you'll spark
• 9:11
  a reaction from two or three of the people, and
• 9:14
  then you'll start your way. Okay, so what are
• 9:20
  some practical ways to start and carry a conversation
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  without feeling awkward? I love the questions.
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  I love what you just said, listening there. I
• 9:30
  just attended a sales training recently and someone
• 9:33
  had the acronym WAIT. Why am I talking? And as
• 9:36
  you're talking, I'm thinking, I think this could
• 9:38
  be good for networking situations. I think sometimes
• 9:41
  people are nervous and they keep talking. And
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  actually just listening can be really powerful
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  or asking a great question. Or if you know someone
• 9:49
  in that environment, can you say, oh, this person
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  and actually call someone else out and point
• 9:54
  to them? Oh, I just heard this person speak here.
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  So actually carrying the conversation instead
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  of feeling like you have to add a bunch of value,
• 10:01
  that one or two sentences can be powerful instead
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  of dominating the conversation. I'm in a lot
• 10:08
  of workshops or meetings, and I notice the people
• 10:11
  who are really memorable sometimes only say a
• 10:13
  line or two, but it's really powerful instead
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  of feeling like you have to fill all this empty
• 10:18
  space. Yeah, no, that's true. Listening is such
• 10:22
  an important skill because you have to learn
• 10:26
  it as well. But let's take a scenario when you're
• 10:32
  sitting down at a table with somebody else and
• 10:35
  you're having the other person speak, talk, and
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  you're listening to them. Don't think about the
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  next thing that you want to say. Think about
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  what they are saying. and respond to them. And
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  when they're talking, there's a pause at the
• 10:52
  end. That pause is so very important because
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  what does that tell them? You were listening.
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  Half of what's going on today, it's just listening.
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  So you're listening and you're responding to
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  what he had said. And whenever you go to these
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  events, I'm going to throw this in, it's out
• 11:13
  of left field, but you always look to give. not
• 11:17
  to receive. Always look to be that referral source.
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  And one thing that I coach my students is I tell
• 11:27
  them at the end of their conversation, before
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  you say what you do, tell them, say to them,
• 11:35
  say, you know something, I like you. I like what
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  you do. I like how you're doing it. How can I
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  make you more successful? How can I be a good
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  referral source for you? It usually blows them
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  away. Yeah. And then you exchange business cards.
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  You say then what you do. And here's a little
• 11:59
  extra tip. When you get that his business card,
• 12:03
  write down the date, the name of the function,
• 12:07
  and something you spoke about. Because during
• 12:11
  your follow -up, which is probably more important
• 12:14
  than meeting the person, the follow -up, it will
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  come in very handy for that. I love that. It's
• 12:22
  that being helpful. I call it serving. How can
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  I serve this person? How can I help them in that
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  moment? I think of it like planting seeds. How
• 12:29
  am I planting seeds here and not expecting it
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  to grow right away, but instead I'm going to
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  cultivate it, water it. I love that. There's
• 12:36
  farmers and there's hunters. Hunters is really
• 12:40
  the way it used to be. You go out there and get,
• 12:43
  how much can I do? How much business can I do?
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  But formers is you go out and you plant the seeds.
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  You say, how can I make you more successful?
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  How can I be a good referral source for you?
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  It changes the whole thing around a little bit,
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  but that's good. Love it. Okay. So how can introverts
• 13:01
  follow up with new connections in a way that
• 13:07
  in a way that feels authentic and not forced.
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  I think you just mentioned that that follow -up
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  is key. I think oftentimes you meet so many people
• 13:15
  at a conference and then people forget to follow
• 13:18
  up. And I think doing it in a way that feels
• 13:20
  natural. I love writing, so it could be a message
• 13:23
  and a thoughtful, customized message. I've been
• 13:26
  to conferences and either before the conference
• 13:28
  or after, both people send a mass message to
• 13:31
  a bunch of people, either you're BCC'd. Or they
• 13:34
  send an individual message, but it's clearly
• 13:36
  just a template. I think it's powerful to be
• 13:39
  thoughtful. I love setting a timer and saying,
• 13:42
  for each person, I'm going to spend 10 minutes
• 13:44
  thinking, what did we talk about? If you took
• 13:47
  notes, that's great. Putting it on their business
• 13:49
  card. Or I keep my phone and say, what did we
• 13:51
  talk about? And I genuinely care. It's not just
• 13:54
  so I can send you a message, but I really want
• 13:56
  to be able to connect. And writing something
• 13:58
  custom to that person and being thoughtful and
• 14:01
  reflective can be powerful. I often find people
• 14:05
  assume it has to be a follow -up call, but sending
• 14:08
  a thoughtful email or a message can be powerful.
• 14:11
  Or if you use LinkedIn or different platforms,
• 14:13
  it can also be a voice memo. You can record a
• 14:15
  voice memo and send something to say, hey, it
• 14:18
  was great talking. Personally, I love snail mail
• 14:20
  too. I love sending people a thank you card.
• 14:22
  If you have their address, sending a message.
• 14:25
  I love coffee, so I have a coaster. I send people
• 14:27
  saying, hey, it was great connecting. Here was
• 14:29
  something that we talked about as well. That's
• 14:33
  great. Now, as a coach, that's one thing that
• 14:36
  I profess. I always say, look, when you come
• 14:40
  back from the event, send them a quick email,
• 14:43
  just thanking them for their time. But the next
• 14:46
  morning, you're ready for this. You write a handwritten
• 14:49
  thank you note. And you just, hey, Dr. Kyle,
• 14:54
  listen, I want to thank you for your time. It
• 14:56
  was great spending time with you. Hope everything
• 14:58
  is well, Michael. That's it. No business, no
• 15:02
  anything. And send it. Because what I tell, again,
• 15:05
  all of my students is imagine being the person
• 15:09
  receiving the thank you note. And who does that
• 15:13
  anymore? Except for my students, of course. And
• 15:16
  it really puts you on top of mind and gives them
• 15:19
  another reason to email or send you a card as
• 15:22
  well. So it's very good. Yeah, it's watering.
• 15:25
  You just keep watering all those seeds and people
• 15:27
  don't water enough. See what sprouts. Yeah. What
• 15:31
  comes up? It can really be fun when you're doing
• 15:35
  it. When you do it right, it's fun. It becomes
• 15:38
  like, oh, this is great. I want to do this again.
• 15:41
  Because you meet so many people and do so many
• 15:43
  things. But in a three or four hour event, I
• 15:47
  used to come home with a shoebox full of business
• 15:50
  cards and say, look how great I did. No, I didn't.
• 15:56
  A three or four hour event. I feel that you should
• 16:00
  come back with about 15 or 20 business cards
• 16:03
  because those are the relationships that you
• 16:06
  started, not a customer, but a relationship.
• 16:11
  And the way that I explained the difference between
• 16:14
  a customer relationship, a customer, if you go
• 16:16
  to a supermarket and one of your customers, you
• 16:19
  say, hi, Kyle, how you doing? Hey, how you doing?
• 16:21
  And you're done. If it's a relationship, hey,
• 16:26
  Kyle, how you doing? How's your? Wife, husband,
• 16:28
  son, daughter, whatever. Oh, I heard he played
• 16:31
  Little League. What position? And you have a
• 16:33
  conversation. And then you move on. And that
• 16:37
  also, hey, your second half will always say,
• 16:41
  who was that? Oh, that was Michael. I met him
• 16:44
  at a conference. Oh, that was very nice of him.
• 16:48
  Whatever. And it just keeps you top of mind.
• 16:51
  So that's a cute little way that I... I love
• 16:54
  that. Yep. Okay. What are some low -pressure
• 16:59
  networking approaches introverts can use, such
• 17:03
  as online networking or small group interactions?
• 17:08
  I love LinkedIn. That's my favorite way to network
• 17:12
  because you can be brave for five or ten seconds.
• 17:15
  You can be watching Netflix or Hulu or something
• 17:18
  and then send a message to someone and say, I'm
• 17:19
  going to reach out to this executive or this
• 17:22
  ideal client and spark a relationship. Oftentimes,
• 17:25
  as I shared earlier, you don't always have to
• 17:27
  be, they're like, oh, do I have to request a
• 17:29
  phone call or Zoom? You could, but it also can
• 17:32
  just be messaging back and forth. I've had clients
• 17:35
  who develop relationships with people and they've
• 17:37
  actually never hopped on. a phone call or a Zoom.
• 17:40
  You can be messaging back and forth. So that's
• 17:42
  one of my favorite ways. A lot of my clients,
• 17:45
  they're tech executives. They're very introverted.
• 17:48
  They're also in Slack communities or Facebook
• 17:51
  groups, or there's blind online community for
• 17:54
  tech people and folks in startups. There's online
• 17:57
  spaces you can be in where you can forge those
• 18:00
  relationships as well. So yes. Going to meetups
• 18:03
  and networking events can be powerful, but there's
• 18:06
  also just online spaces and communities, either
• 18:08
  one -on -one or groups. So when you think of
• 18:11
  networking, it doesn't always have to be in person
• 18:13
  either. Okay, so let me ask you a question. What
• 18:16
  about local networking? What would you suggest
• 18:21
  for local networking? I would find one that feels
• 18:26
  comfortable. Don't feel like it has to be a huge
• 18:28
  event either. Is there a small meetup group?
• 18:31
  One of my clients is in like a tech dad's group
• 18:34
  and it's a small group and they meet up for beer
• 18:36
  every week and grab beer at the bar and it's
• 18:38
  more casual. So I think finding one that feels
• 18:41
  comfortable and then also going with a friend
• 18:43
  or a colleague, that can help break the ice as
• 18:45
  well. So you're not just walking around the room
• 18:47
  alone, but instead is there someone who you can
• 18:50
  go with can be powerful too. And I always suggest
• 18:54
  joining a chamber of commerce because they have
• 18:58
  weekly meetings and you can hone your message
• 19:01
  without really honing your message, without really
• 19:05
  saying in front of everybody. So you have it
• 19:08
  with it, like my chamber of commerce, you have
• 19:10
  45 seconds to say what you do and then you break
• 19:15
  out into breakout sessions and you have two minutes.
• 19:18
  That's not a very long time. And it's very good
• 19:21
  for you just to, you know, keep up and hone your
• 19:24
  skills. And you get into the 30 second elevator
• 19:27
  speech and whether it's five seconds, 10 seconds
• 19:30
  or 30 seconds, but it helps you hone all that.
• 19:33
  So the in -person local meetings is great. But
• 19:38
  as you said, those other groups are fantastic,
• 19:42
  especially if you're introverted. Especially.
• 19:45
  Yeah. What I like about that is there's a purpose
• 19:48
  as well. So for someone who's, oh, this is scary.
• 19:50
  I'm just going in. You know what to expect. You
• 19:52
  can Google it. They have an agenda. Same with
• 19:55
  Toastmasters. You know exactly what to expect.
• 19:57
  So yes, it can be a little nerve wracking talking,
• 19:59
  but you know exactly what to expect. And that
• 20:02
  purpose can make it less intimidating as well.
• 20:04
  Exactly. And the more times you go, the easier
• 20:08
  it becomes. And what I say to people is, listen,
• 20:13
  you want to learn how to network? First of all,
• 20:15
  just go. Just go. The first time, you're going
• 20:18
  to mess up. No doubt about it. The second time,
• 20:21
  you're going to mess up just that much less.
• 20:24
  And the third time, that much less. Fourth time.
• 20:27
  And by the fifth time, it becomes old hat. And
• 20:30
  you know what to say and know what not to say.
• 20:33
  Especially about yourself, about your business,
• 20:36
  about somebody else's business. It's very easy
• 20:39
  to fall into a trap of... things not to say.
• 20:44
  And then for the rest of the night, even though
• 20:46
  that person may have forgotten about it, you'll
• 20:49
  remember it. There's no tomorrow. Okay. What
• 20:53
  about, what are some low pressure network? Did
• 20:56
  I say that already? Okay. How can introverts
• 21:00
  prepare for a networking event in advance to
• 21:04
  reduce anxiety and boost confidence? We touched
• 21:07
  on this before. Yeah, I think practice. I think
• 21:11
  practicing is really key. Having someone you
• 21:13
  trust who can practice with you is important.
• 21:15
  Going over those talking points. I encourage
• 21:17
  people not to have a script. Oftentimes people
• 21:20
  have a script and then they feel like they're
• 21:22
  going to memorize it and they skip a word. I
• 21:24
  recommend talking points instead. Having a word.
• 21:27
  or a few words that are going to guide you to
• 21:29
  go through. Something that you can't memorize,
• 21:32
  it's impossible because it's just words, can
• 21:34
  be helpful and really powerful. Especially if
• 21:37
  you're virtual, you can have those words in front
• 21:39
  of you and then get used to it. And I find that's
• 21:42
  a great way to get used to practicing. And then
• 21:44
  over time, removing the amount of words that
• 21:46
  are guiding you as well. And then videotape yourself
• 21:49
  and watch it back. Oh, that's probably going
• 21:52
  to scare a whole lot of people. Yeah, it's going
• 21:56
  to scare them. I look like that. Oh, I sound
• 22:00
  like that. Oh, no. But you're absolutely right.
• 22:03
  That's the best way for them to get better at
• 22:07
  what they do, for them to hone their skills.
• 22:09
  And talk in front of your parents, your brothers,
• 22:13
  your sisters, your friends. Just give a talk.
• 22:15
  Give a five -minute talk, 10 -minute talk. can
• 22:19
  see by the way that they respond on how you can
• 22:24
  change your talk. It's very interesting. Okay,
• 22:27
  so give me a personal networking success story
• 22:32
  that you overcame discomfort and built a great
• 22:37
  relationship. Two of my mentors who are now friends
• 22:43
  now, I found them on LinkedIn. One of them, I
• 22:46
  just reached out. They were involved in the NRWA,
• 22:48
  the National Resume Writers Association. And
• 22:51
  I was just reaching out to learn more about the
• 22:52
  conference. And it just started with a quick
• 22:55
  question. And now we're really close friends.
• 22:57
  We text every day. I've visited her in Florida.
• 23:00
  And it just started from a quick message. The
• 23:02
  same with another mentor. I was just posting
• 23:04
  on LinkedIn. We had a quick conversation. I was
• 23:07
  on a podcast. We've now met in person. And it
• 23:10
  just started from a quick message on LinkedIn
• 23:12
  and chatting and saying, let me reach out. And
• 23:15
  I think it just takes, at least as an introvert,
• 23:18
  where it can feel uncomfortable at first reaching
• 23:20
  out to a complete stranger, it just takes that
• 23:23
  five seconds of bravery to, okay, let me reach
• 23:25
  out. Let me make it past this discomfort. Okay,
• 23:28
  and then I'm done. And it just takes that. I
• 23:30
  have a client who has an emotional support pickle,
• 23:33
  this stuffed pickle, and they just hold it and
• 23:36
  they're like, okay, I'm going to do this scary
• 23:37
  thing, send, I'm done. And then they move past
• 23:40
  it. And that's what I think. I can just do this
• 23:42
  brave thing for five seconds and then it can
• 23:45
  result in this friendship or this mentor or this
• 23:47
  new client. Great. I want to tell you, that's
• 23:51
  great for building your self -confidence, but
• 23:53
  as well as you're reaching out and you're actually
• 23:55
  making friends. And with today's day and age,
• 23:58
  with LinkedIn and everything else, your friends
• 24:01
  could be anywhere. I do my podcast and I had
• 24:05
  somebody from Australia, somebody from Israel,
• 24:08
  somebody from Canada all in the same day. So
• 24:11
  where can I network and have people like that?
• 24:14
  So it's really an incredible thing. Okay. Very
• 24:17
  important. What are some key body language and
• 24:21
  nonverbal communication tips that introverts
• 24:25
  feel more at ease? I find there's this misleading
• 24:31
  advice sometimes where people always have to
• 24:33
  be making eye contact. They feel like I always
• 24:35
  have to be making eye contact. I don't agree
• 24:37
  with that. I don't think you always have to be
• 24:38
  doing that. I think part of it's cultural. It
• 24:40
  can be intimidating if you're always doing that.
• 24:42
  So I would encourage you to find what feels comfortable
• 24:44
  for you. I think watching back that video of
• 24:47
  yourself can be powerful. And I actually encourage
• 24:50
  people to do it three times. Just watch the video.
• 24:53
  See how you come across. just listen to the audio,
• 24:57
  see what it's like, and then put them together
• 24:59
  and see how you come across. If you notice someone
• 25:02
  who's a good speaker and you go watch some good
• 25:05
  speakers, whether it's a TED Talk or someone
• 25:08
  delivering a keynote, you'll notice they're actually
• 25:10
  not always giving eye contact. They're looking
• 25:13
  around. If someone's giving too much eye contact,
• 25:16
  it can be a lot. So I'd encourage you to do that
• 25:18
  and find what feels natural for you. Yes. There's
• 25:21
  power of stepping outside your comfort zone,
• 25:23
  but you also have to find what feels natural
• 25:25
  for you so you come off authentic as well. You're
• 25:29
  absolutely right. And I started out when I first
• 25:32
  started speaking, going on stages, keynotes,
• 25:35
  I would just pick two or three people in the
• 25:38
  audience. And those are the people I would concentrate
• 25:41
  on. I wouldn't see anybody else. Whether there
• 25:44
  was 10 people in the room or 100 people in the
• 25:46
  room, it wouldn't make a difference. But that's
• 25:49
  how I started. And then I... Got better, of course.
• 25:51
  But that's, again, helped me build the confidence
• 25:55
  and no fear. Give me one piece of advice you'd
• 25:58
  give an introvert who wants to grow their network
• 26:01
  but feels overwhelmed by the process. I would
• 26:05
  set realistic expectations. I feel oftentimes
• 26:08
  people set these huge lofty goals. I'm going
• 26:10
  to reach out to 100 people or something. I would
• 26:13
  set something small and achievable. Maybe I'm
• 26:16
  going to send one message a week. I think of
• 26:18
  it like planting those seeds. Okay, let's say
• 26:20
  you do one a week. That's one of my favorite
• 26:22
  goals to set, regardless of what the goal is.
• 26:24
  When I was starting my blog on my website, I'm
• 26:26
  like, I'm going to do one a week. That's 52 a
• 26:29
  year. Even if you take two weeks off, that's
• 26:31
  50 a year if you reach out to a person a week.
• 26:33
  So I would set a small, achievable goal and then
• 26:37
  find someone to help hold you accountable. Maybe
• 26:38
  it's your partner. Maybe it's a friend. Have
• 26:42
  them hold you. you accountable and say, okay,
• 26:44
  here, I've done it. And then maybe you get ahead
• 26:46
  one week, you send two or three messages and
• 26:48
  you can take the next few weeks off, but it starts
• 26:50
  adding up really quickly. And then what I always
• 26:53
  find powerful is when people respond, when you
• 26:55
  reach out to a stranger and they say, great,
• 26:57
  I'll chat with you and they'll help. I'm always
• 26:59
  amazed. I work with a lot of tech executives
• 27:02
  and I say, sure, let me go reach out to this
• 27:03
  person. And so sure, I'll talk with your client.
• 27:06
  Or I had an executive at a company. I didn't
• 27:08
  know them. I'm like, sure, I'll take your client
• 27:10
  on a tour. I didn't know this person. They just
• 27:13
  took my client on a tour of their headquarters
• 27:16
  and then passed their resume along to hiring
• 27:18
  managers. And it was a complete stranger. So
• 27:20
  people are willing to help. You just have to
• 27:22
  ask. Yes. It sounds you've had so much success
• 27:26
  with introverts, extroverts and placing people,
• 27:29
  helping people get placed. But I want you to
• 27:33
  give me a mistake that you've made and how you
• 27:38
  overcame it. I think one of the biggest mistakes
• 27:42
  I've made is reaching out and just like being
• 27:46
  too direct sometimes. I'm a very direct person,
• 27:49
  but being like, here's exactly what I need, very
• 27:51
  forward and not customizing it and making it
• 27:54
  sound like I was messaging a bunch of people.
• 27:57
  When I was first starting out, sometimes I would
• 27:59
  just send a bunch of messages to a bunch of people
• 28:01
  and not customize it. And when I go and look
• 28:04
  back, I'm like, oh, this sounds like it was AI
• 28:07
  before AI was a thing. So now when I do it, my
• 28:11
  technique for both myself and when I coach people
• 28:15
  is make sure it doesn't sound like AI. Spend
• 28:18
  time customizing it for each person. Because
• 28:20
  when I look back, I'm like, that was not a good
• 28:22
  message. It sounds like a template. And I didn't
• 28:25
  care about this person. I was just transacting.
• 28:29
  That was very good. Very good. I'm glad you overcame
• 28:32
  it as well. That was very sound advice. Kyle,
• 28:35
  how could somebody get hold of you if they wanted
• 28:38
  your services, they wanted to reach out to you,
• 28:42
  or even be coached by you? What's the best way
• 28:45
  for them to reach out to you? Yes, my website,
• 28:48
  caffeinatedkyle .com. And then I spend a lot
• 28:50
  of time on LinkedIn, Kyle Elliott with two L's
• 28:53
  and two T's. Very good. Kyle, I will tell you,
• 28:56
  it's been an absolute pleasure. discussing everything
• 29:00
  with you today. And I'm just sorry we ran out
• 29:02
  of time because we probably would sit here for
• 29:05
  two more hours talking about the same things.
• 29:08
  So I want to thank you again for coming on the
• 29:10
  podcast. Yes, thank you for having me. Well,
• 29:15
  hold on, folks. Don't go anywhere. Let me just
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  to revvedupkids .org. That's R -E -V -V -E -D
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  -U -P -K -I -D -S .org. Well, that's a wrap,
• 30:34
  folks. A huge thank you to our special guests
• 30:37
  for sharing such incredible insights today. And
• 30:40
  of course, a big shout out to you, our amazing
• 30:43
  listeners, for tuning in and spending your time
• 30:46
  with us. Remember, networking isn't about being
• 30:50
  perfect. It's about being present. So take what
• 30:54
  you've learned today, get out there and make
• 30:56
  some meaningful connections. If you enjoyed this
• 30:59
  episode, don't forget to subscribe, leave us
• 31:02
  a review and share it with someone who could
• 31:05
  use a little networking inspiration. Let's keep
• 31:08
  the conversation going. You can find me on Apple,
• 31:12
  Spotify, YouTube or my website. Michael A. Foreman,
• 31:17
  remember, until next time, keep practicing, keep
• 31:21
  connecting, and keep building those relationships.
• 31:24
  This is Michael A. Foreman signing off. Take
• 31:27
  care and happy networking.