Latest / Journey to the Fringe / Little people big world

Transcript

Little people big world · Journey to the Fringe

0:03
From the unexplained to the mundane, come join
0:06
us on a journey to the fringe. Hello and welcome!
0:13
two journey to the fringe the podcast apparently
0:16
according to one anonymous poster does not understand
0:19
what white culture is so we got that going for
0:23
us and that guy's got some things he needs to
0:24
work through yeah anyhow we're your podcast host
0:27
Taylor and Chelsea here today doing something
0:29
completely not that so I hope I didn't scare
0:32
too many people off with that cold open Because
0:36
it is somewhat of a genetic topic, but not really,
0:39
and I'm just gonna get into it. Okay. I'm just
0:43
waiting to hear what this is. There's been so
0:45
much buildup around this episode and the white
0:47
culture. I'm gonna address the first part of
0:49
that statement with the fact that I was inspired
0:52
by an episode that came out this week. Whose
0:55
episode? Ours? I'm just gonna get going with
0:57
it. Okay. Human beings have never been a single
1:00
shape, size, or story. Across our species' history,
1:04
we've come in a remarkable range of forms. Tall,
1:06
short, broad, slight, sometimes forms we didn't
1:08
even know existed until the ground gave up its
1:11
secrets. For instance, in 2003, when on the Indonesian
1:14
island of Flores, researchers uncovered the remains
1:16
of Homo florensis, a small -bodied human relative
1:19
who stood barely over a meter tall. Their discovery
1:21
rewrote what we thought we knew about human variations
1:24
and reminded us that the world has always held
1:27
more kinds people than we expected. But long
1:29
before paleoanthropologists found the so -called
1:32
hobbits of Southeast Asia, cultures around the
1:34
world were already telling stories about small
1:37
human -like beings who lived just out of sight.
1:40
These weren't abstract myths or symbolic creatures,
1:42
they were described as neighbors, sometimes helpful,
1:45
sometimes dangerous, sometimes simply there,
1:47
living in forests, mountains, caves, and even
1:50
the edges of villages. And in many places these
1:52
stories didn't stay in the past. People still
1:54
report encounters with these beings today. Really?
1:57
From the Memegwesi of the Great Lakes to the
2:00
Manahune of Hawaii, from the European fairy folk
2:03
to the mysterious cave dwellers of Ireland and
2:05
Scotland, the idea of little people is one of
2:07
the most widespread and persistent threads in
2:10
human storytelling. It crosses continents, languages,
2:13
and belief systems, and whether these beings
2:15
are interpreted as spirits, ancestors, hidden
2:18
populations, or something else entirely, the
2:20
consistency of descriptions is hard to ignore.
2:22
So in this episode, we're stepping into a global
2:25
pattern, into sightings, folklore, and modern
2:28
accounts that suggest that for as long as human
2:30
beings have been paying attention, we've been
2:32
seeing and sharing the world with something smaller,
2:34
stranger, and far more elusive than we are. Is
2:36
this separate from elves and fairies? Funny enough,
2:39
they kind of f - fall into this category, Chelsea,
2:43
and that it's gonna come in as we get going.
2:45
From my understanding of fairies, it's a catch
2:47
-all term for a wide range of beings you could
2:50
potentially be seeing that span an entire size,
2:54
shape, color, variety. And some of them do fit
2:58
that description. Not all of them, though. Okay,
3:00
fair enough. And from pretty much every continent,
3:03
every part of the world, we do have tales and
3:06
stories of little people. The native peoples
3:08
of North America told legend of a race of little
3:11
people who lived in the woods near sandy hills
3:13
and sometimes near rocks located along large
3:15
bodies of water, such as the Great Lakes. Often
3:17
described as hairy -faced dwarfs in stories,
3:19
petroglyph illustrations show them with horns
3:22
on their head in traveling groups of five to
3:24
seven per canoe. The prior mountains of Montana
3:26
and Wyoming are said to house fairy rings. Other
3:29
legends say that little people, if seen by an
3:32
adult human, would beg them not to say anything
3:34
of their existence and would reward those who
3:36
kept their word for helping them and their family
3:38
out in times of need. From tribe to tribe, there
3:41
are variations of what little people's mannerisms
3:43
were like, and whether they were good or evil
3:45
may be different. One common belief is that little
3:47
people created distractions to cause mischief.
3:49
Lewis and Clark reported in their journals that
3:51
Native Americans in the vicinity of Spirit Mound,
3:54
South Dakota, held a belief in little people
3:55
who inhabited that mound. Clark wrote that the
3:58
local Native Americans could not be persuaded
4:00
to approach the mound as they feared these little
4:02
devils and considered them to be dangerous. Although
4:05
members of Luce and Clark's party visited the
4:07
mound, they did not encounter any unusual beings.
4:09
Across Europe, stories of small human -like beings
4:12
are so old they blur into the bedrock of landscape.
4:15
In Ireland and Scotland, they have the sitae,
4:17
brownies, and the grogach, where these are all
4:20
described not as wind fairies but as people,
4:22
small, elusive, territorial, and tied to ancient
4:25
mounds or artificial caves. Farmers reported
4:27
seeing them at dusk, moving along the stone walls,
4:30
or slipping into openings in the hills. In Scandinavia,
4:33
the Nisa and the Tomta were household -sized
4:35
beings who lived alongside families, sometimes
4:38
helping, sometimes punishing disrespect, and
4:40
in the Alps, the Heinzel Mansion were said to
4:42
work at night, leaving behind tiny footprints
4:45
in flowers or ash. Across the Pacific, little
4:47
people appear not as tricksters, but as engineers.
4:50
In Hawaii, the Menehune are said to have built
4:53
fish ponds, temples, and irrigation undercover
4:56
darkness. Some of these structures, like the
4:58
Alakoko Fish Pond, are real works of ancient
5:01
engineering and local tradition insists that
5:03
they were built by a small industrious race who
5:06
vanished when larger peoples arrived. Oh I did
5:08
know that for Hawaii, which is a weird tie -in
5:10
because the only reason I know it is because
5:13
the Disney hotel there has a thing... About that?
5:17
Like a whole section of the hotel about that.
5:19
There's my random knowledge about why I know
5:22
that. Oh, okay. In New Zealand, Maori traditions
5:26
speak of the Pata Pairerehe, pale, small forest
5:30
dwellers who avoided sunlight and lived in the
5:32
misty highlands. They were not quite human, not
5:34
quite spirits, and encounters with them were
5:35
treated with caution. These stories persist into
5:37
the modern era, with hikers occasionally reporting
5:40
small figures moving through fog or dense bush.
5:43
In Southeast Asia, this is one of the few places
5:45
where folklore and paleoanthropology collide.
5:48
On Flores, the discovery of Homo florensis echoes
5:51
local stories of the Abugogo. tiny, hairy people
5:54
who lived in the caves and stole food from villagers.
5:56
Elders describe them as real, physical beings
5:58
who survived into the recent past. Similar stories
6:01
appear in the Philippines where the duende, small,
6:03
earth -dwelling beings, are still reported today,
6:06
often in connection with anthills, mounds, or
6:08
old trees. Witnesses describe them as one to
6:11
two feet tall, dressed in simple clothes, and
6:13
quick to vanish when spotted. In the Amazon,
6:15
many indigenous groups describe the chula chiqui,
6:18
or the curupira, small forest guardians with
6:21
backward -facing feet. They are said to mislead
6:23
hunters, protect animals, and appear suddenly
6:26
on forest paths. Some modern sightings describe
6:29
small, human -like figures darting between trees
6:32
or watching from branches, encounters treated
6:35
not as myth but as part of the forest -living
6:37
reality. In the Andes, the Mukui is a tiny miner
6:40
who lives in tunnels and shafts, warning or punishing
6:43
miners depending on how they treat the earth.
6:45
Reports from the 20th century describe miners
6:47
encountering small figures deep underground,
6:49
often in moments of exhaustion or isolation.
6:51
Across North Africa and the Middle East, stories
6:54
persist of little desert people. Small, quick,
6:56
human -like beings who live in caves or abandoned
6:59
ruins. Tuareg and Berber traditions describe
7:02
them as ancient inhabitants of the land, predating
7:05
the arrival of larger tribes. In some regions,
7:08
travelers still report seeing small figures watching
7:10
from cliffside openings or hearing tiny footsteps
7:13
in wadis at night. Now across the continents,
7:16
there's a pattern that kind of arises. There's
7:18
small human -like beings living at the edges
7:20
of human territory. Their preferred habitats
7:22
are caves, mounds, forests, and ruins. These
7:25
are described as physical encounters, not symbolic,
7:28
and there's a mixture of fear, respect, and coexistence
7:31
up around them. And in many of these places,
7:33
modern sightings echo the ancient stories almost
7:36
as they're presented. From here, Chelsea, we're
7:39
going to take this episode into more of a...
7:43
People describing encounters with these small
7:46
creatures or at least some I couldn't quite just
7:48
do that Because Hemerson Peters has a really
7:52
good part of his website on just little people
7:54
across Canada. What? Yeah So I'm gonna take a
7:57
few of the ones that are just really close to
8:00
us that he was able to come up Yeah, make it
8:02
real specific to us, please Yeah So specific
8:07
that you can all find us fairly easily First
8:10
part I found from his website is dwarfs and shoe
8:13
swap tradition. Oh, no, I know exactly where
8:15
this is. It's in the Enchanted Forest. Yeah.
8:19
We can never go to. Yes. We can only drive by.
8:21
I can only assume this is why we're not allowed
8:24
to step foot there. Family tradition. West of
8:28
Stony territory is British Columbia's interior
8:30
plateau, whose native interior, Salish, also
8:33
have legends involving little people. Celebrated
8:35
Canadian geologist and surveyor, Dr. George Mercer
8:37
Dawson, touched on the Shushwap version of this
8:40
legend in his 1892 book, Notes of the Shushwap
8:43
People of British Columbia. Quote from this book,
8:57
20 miles down the Okanagan lake on the west side.
9:00
They hunt with bows and arrows, and while represented
9:02
as being only two feet high, yet they are able
9:05
to carry a deer easily. In contrast to this,
9:07
when a squirrel is killed, they skin it and take
9:09
only a part as the whole is too heavy for them.
9:13
The Indians are very much afraid of them." Probably.
9:21
I don't think they had the technology at that
9:22
time and place. Doesn't sound like it, actually.
9:24
Interesting. That's crazy. I love that. I've
9:27
never heard little people's stories around here.
9:29
There was way more, Chelsea. Just, he worked
9:31
his way across Canada for this. I'm gonna have
9:33
to check that out. I just picked out a couple
9:34
because it was, yeah, I'll send you the link.
9:36
In fact, it'll probably be in the notes. Scots
9:38
-Canadian anthropologist James Tate elaborated
9:40
on the Chouchouap conception of the dwarves in
9:42
an ethnological treatise for the 1909 issue of
9:45
memoir of the American Museum of Natural History.
10:07
Quote, Tate later reproduced an old shoe swap
10:11
story in which a young man became lost while
10:14
hunting in the wilderness, despairing that he
10:15
would never again see his family or friends.
10:18
The young man began to weep. Suddenly, the hunter
10:20
found himself face to face with two tiny women,
10:22
who had their hair done up like young girls,
10:24
who inquired into the cause of his lamentations.
10:27
When the hunter explained that he was lost, the
10:28
dwarves laughed and assured him that his village
10:30
was not far away. Little women directed his attention
10:33
to a nearby hill and informed him that he would
10:35
be able to see his people's camp from its heights.
10:37
They warned the hunter not to tell any of his
10:39
fellow band members that they had helped him
10:41
or else evil would befall him. He clearly didn't
10:45
if we know the story. The man did as instructed
10:49
and arrived home in an impossibly short time.
10:52
Quote, the dwarfs had contracted the distance
10:54
so that it was only a short walk, but in reality
10:56
the man had been a long distance from home. For
10:59
a long time he told no one, but one day, describing
11:01
his adventure as the time when he was lost, he
11:04
said, I never should have reached home had it
11:06
not been for two dwarf women who showed me the
11:08
way. End quote. Shortly after saying this, he
11:10
died. The dwarfish ability to contract walking
11:15
distances for human travelers is another element
11:17
which native Canadian folklore has in common
11:19
with the Anglo -Celtic fairy lore of Newfoundland.
11:21
And then the dwarfs of Thompson tradition. The
11:24
Shushwaps' westerly neighbors is the Nalacapamecs,
11:27
or Thompson Indians, have their own dwarf stories,
11:30
some of which Tate reproduced in an ethnological
11:32
treatise for the April 1900 issue of the American
11:35
Museum of Natural History. The upper Thompson,
11:37
whom Tate refers to traditionally, inhabited
11:39
British Columbia's Stein River Valley and the
11:41
Thompson Canyon. while the southerly Lower Thompson
11:44
abode in the Fraser Canyon and the northern Cascade
11:47
Mountains. Quote, The Upper Thompson believe
11:49
in a race of dwarfs who inhabit steep cliffs
11:51
and forests. They are just like men, but their
11:54
skin are pale and their bodies are very gaunt.
11:56
They are only about two feet tall and they wander
11:58
around the mountains, sometimes shouting, groaning,
12:00
or weeping. Their eyes are sunk very deep in
12:02
their heads. They run away from hunters and go
12:04
into inaccessible places. They all wear clothes
12:07
similar to those formerly worn by the Indians,
12:09
but have never been seen with bows and arrows.
12:12
They inhabit low, dense forests or live in dense
12:14
woods in the mountains, and said that they never
12:16
kill, steal, or chase. They were rather fond
12:18
of joking and playing tricks on people." Tate
12:21
went on to explain how some Thompsons believed
12:23
that dwarfs were the spirits of cedar trees.
12:25
Perhaps on account of their arboreal heritage,
12:27
some dwarf men were paradoxically said to grow
12:29
taller than the tallest Indian, a peculiar attribute
12:32
which they share with the elves of Inuit tradition.
12:35
Thompson told Tate, the dwarfs seemed to have
12:37
vanished from the Spences Bridge area on the
12:39
Thompson River sometime in the late 18th century.
12:41
but were once quite numerous in easterly Okanagan
12:44
country. So just really cool if there's somebody
12:47
actually doing the research on that and able
12:49
to find like very specific lore in our neck of
12:52
the woods. Never even fathomed that that was
12:55
even a possibility for something that would exist
12:57
here. I don't know why I've never come across
12:59
it before. Yeah, and it seems it's because it's
13:01
indigenous lore and like there's a ton of tale
13:05
outside of Bigfoot and indigenous lore and even
13:07
including Bigfoot that we just don't really know
13:10
because it's not something we're taught or really
13:12
pushed to learn in this part of the world. That's
13:15
true. It's not shared as knowledge, I guess.
13:18
That's not the word I was looking for. But yeah,
13:21
European folklore is more common and like pushed
13:24
on people than indigenous. Yeah. But enough about
13:28
that. Let's go back on to the little people and
13:30
Chelsea We are getting into actual first -hand
13:32
accounts of sighting now and we're gonna start
13:33
off with your favorite one from our pal Lon Strickler
13:37
Oh good. This story is so great Chelsea, and
13:40
I don't really know how Let's just read it. Hello
13:44
Lon on the night around 930 p .m. November 10
13:48
2014 It's from an H, okay? Okay, it's from an
13:55
H. Something my name does not have any of. I
13:59
was driving home on I -20 heading west. I had
14:02
been in Jackson, Mississippi, visiting relatives,
14:04
and I was heading home to Shreveport, Louisiana.
14:07
I make this trip many times a year, but I saw
14:09
something that night that I cannot explain. I
14:11
was approaching Monroe, Louisiana, near the turnoff
14:14
to Garrett Road. I noticed something on the connecting
14:16
road between the eastbound and westbound lanes.
14:18
Other people noticed it because the brake lights
14:20
on the vehicles were lighting up. As I slowed
14:22
and got nearer, I could see that it was a little
14:25
person running around in a circle with its arms
14:27
extended, like it was imitating an airplane.
14:30
Since it was dark, I couldn't make out any features.
14:32
By that time, some of the vehicles had practically
14:34
stopped, and I pulled off onto the turn -off
14:37
shoulder. I was afraid that it was a child. I
14:39
called 911 and was told that others had made
14:41
similar calls. I got in my car and then noticed
14:43
that a police cruiser was in the eastbound lane
14:45
approaching the little person. I stood at the
14:47
back of my car and watched. The police officer
14:50
pulled into the connecting road. At the same
14:51
time, the little person was running away on the
14:53
grassy median. heading west in my direction.
14:55
It was still difficult to make out the features
14:57
on this little person, but I could see now that
14:59
it was not a child. It was dressed in what looked
15:01
like a long dark colored cloak. It stood about
15:04
three feet tall and it was making a hideous squealing
15:06
sound that reminded me of a scared pig. They
15:10
continued to run west past me. There was another
15:13
police cruiser in the westbound lane shining
15:15
spotlights on this little person. Then suddenly
15:17
a huge brilliant yellow light flashed from above
15:20
this little person. It was blinding and lasted
15:22
less than a second. I loved that story. happened
15:53
that night. I do believe there was lost time
15:55
since I noticed that my clock showed 10 13 p
15:58
.m. For several weeks I was hoping that there
16:00
would be some news about this incident but I
16:02
never noticed anything. I contacted the police
16:04
in Monroe area and there was no record according
16:06
to them of any calls. That was very unusual.
16:09
I know this incident occurred. There were many
16:11
witnesses who lost power to their vehicles as
16:13
well. I have so many comments. Can I comment?
16:16
Yeah, of course. First of all, why did he have
16:18
his arms out like an airplane? I know. Second
16:22
of all, why would he tune into the news thinking
16:26
that it would be on the news? Would you think
16:28
that something like that would be on the news?
16:31
Well, I mean, this is a few years after the Leprechaun
16:34
video went viral. OK. So you got to think. You
16:36
make a good point. Love that. Where was that?
16:41
Not Canada, right? No, it was in Louisiana. Okay,
16:45
that would make a lot of sense for Louisiana
16:47
for some reason. Was the leprechaun in Tennessee?
16:51
It was southern US, I know that. I think those
16:54
are all my comments. Lon did have some notes
17:00
on this one. The witness is a middle -aged man
17:02
who wished to remain anonymous at this point.
17:04
I believe he was a bit intimidated since no one
17:06
had come forward about this incident. I did reach
17:08
him by telephone and we discussed other avenues
17:10
of obtaining information including the local
17:11
media. We talked later in which he informed me
17:14
that none of the media had received any reports.
17:16
I made a few inquiries but to no avail. I hadn't
17:18
seen any reports on the MUFON CMS or Newford.
17:21
BB believes that 10 or more vehicles were affected
17:24
by the bright flash of light. I asked about the
17:26
little person and what his assessment was. He
17:28
was reluctant to go into detail but suggested
17:30
that he felt that the little person was responsible
17:32
for the flash of light. I believe this may have
17:35
been a non -terrestrial encounter of some type
17:37
and there are several scenarios one could make
17:40
for the flash of light but I'll leave it at that.
17:41
to you, Lon. Yeah, I get the same vibes as Lon.
17:45
I don't know, there's a couple of things that
17:47
aren't what you have been describing in the other
17:50
encounters with the little people that made it
17:52
seem not - I know, and especially like the UFO
17:54
part of it, yeah. Yeah, yeah, definitely. I shouldn't
17:57
say UFO, bright light and then disappears. Yeah.
17:59
And the electricity not working. Yeah, it has
18:02
a little bit of a paranormal quality to it, especially
18:05
with the missing, not especially with the missing
18:07
time, but also including the missing time. The
18:10
next one I have comes from a website called Unexplained
18:13
Mysteries from their forums. This was posted
18:16
by a guy named Mark1 on February 26th of 2018.
18:19
He has a few posts that we're gonna go over.
18:22
Oh, he's that lucky, eh? This is a fun story.
18:25
He apparently has a family history. With little
18:28
people? I've decided to share here on the Unexplained
18:32
Mystery Forums some family -related experiences
18:34
with the paranormal that involve what would be
18:37
better described as something to do with fairy
18:39
folk. I'll start with my grandmother's tale.
18:40
Why the Unexplained Mystery Forums? Why of all
18:44
places? Were you gonna post about little people?
18:47
I feel like somewhere different than the Unexplained
18:49
Mystery Forums. I don't feel like it would get
18:52
the most traction there, but I don't know. Maybe.
18:55
To be fair, I scoured Reddit four stories. Yeah,
18:59
sometimes Reddit's no good. Sometimes it's good.
19:01
Searching little people on Reddit did not get
19:04
me what I was looking for. No, that I guess it
19:05
wouldn't. Yeah. Fair enough. I also learned,
19:09
sorry, slightly off topic here. I did learn that
19:12
there's an entire village of people under four
19:15
foot three in China. They'd all decided to start
19:18
living together. Oh, I knew this one too. It
19:20
has nothing to do with - So they can avoid scrutiny.
19:22
But now they all dress up and live in mushrooms.
19:25
I did know this. I don't know how I know this,
19:28
but it has nothing to do with Disney. I'm pretty
19:30
sure. It has nothing to do with Disney. They
19:32
just decide it and then they realize it'd be
19:34
easier to like, they want to just live peacefully
19:36
on their own. The first account, Nan's story,
19:53
takes place in the early 1950s, a few weeks after
19:56
the birth of her first daughter The house where
19:58
it took place had long been associated with the
20:00
paranormal. All who lived there often heard unknown
20:03
footsteps upstairs, strange knocking sounds on
20:05
the walls, and an occasional commotion that always
20:07
seemed to take place after midnight somewhere
20:09
in the kitchen. It always sounded like someone
20:11
or something was shifting things around in there,
20:13
in search of something. Annoyed, late -night
20:15
investigations were always met with a sudden
20:17
chilling silence whenever anyone reached the
20:19
closed kitchen door. The kitchen itself was always
20:22
found to be just how it had been left. before
20:25
bed with nothing out of place. Everyone initially
20:28
suspected rats, but the annoyingly high volume
20:30
of the strange noises plus the lack of any evidence
20:33
all pointed towards something else. The family
20:35
dog was then placed in the kitchen at night.
20:37
But this measure didn't deter the midnight prankster
20:39
and the poor dog became terrified. Many at night
20:41
the household would be awakened to some noise
20:44
and their terrified pet who was both howling
20:47
and also trying to scratch its way through the
20:48
kitchen door. None of this unhinged my Nan. She
20:51
was always a strong woman and in the end and
20:54
she resorted to shouting at whatever it was with
20:56
dire warnings of what she would do if she ever
20:58
caught it. This eventually seemed to do the trick.
21:01
The Kitchen Ghost, or F in Horus, quote, F in
21:05
Horus, end quote. that she nicknamed it somehow
21:09
must have got the message because eventually
21:12
all the stamping and begging stopped. This didn't
21:14
mean everything strange and spooky went away
21:16
though. There would still be other weirdness,
21:18
including apparitions and even her brother's
21:20
old chest, but they are other stories for some
21:22
other time. Nan's close encounter with something
21:25
strange came long after the kitchen spook and
21:27
seemingly left her house. It was evening and
21:29
the house was generally cold. Central heating
21:32
was still something only a lucky few had. Granddad
21:35
was on the nights at the colliery. Nan and her
21:37
baby were alone in the house. She took my mother
21:40
to the bedroom and placed her in the cot by her
21:42
side of the bed. Nan then got under the bed covers
21:44
and then sang sweet songs to her. At some point
21:47
whilst doing this she became aware of strange
21:49
sounds out on the landing. Her first suspicion
21:51
led her to assume it was the dog because the
21:53
tip -tap sounds seemed to be coming from the
21:55
floor. She soon dismissed any concerns about
21:57
the sound because the bedroom door was shut.
21:59
So there she was minding her own business, smiling
22:01
and singing to her beautiful baby daughter when
22:03
something from behind alarmed her. The tip -tap
22:06
sounds were now clear in the bedroom. She felt
22:08
sure that she had closed the door and also knew
22:11
it had not been opened. To prevent upsetting
22:13
her baby, she continued to hum a nursery rhyme
22:15
as her keen and angered ears took notice of the
22:18
weird sounds on the floor. Her only conclusion
22:23
was that there was a rat in the house. It was
22:25
at this point that she felt something trying
22:27
to climb up onto the bed. Now she still had her
22:29
slippers on and her plan was to turn over, ever
22:32
so slowly grab one and then whack whatever it
22:34
was into oblivion. This is when she noticed her
22:37
baby daughter's eyes, which Nan described as
22:39
looking like saucers, old slang for wide open.
22:42
The baby had clearly seen what Nan was soon to
22:44
deal with, and to Nan's horror she suddenly felt
22:46
its pressure on her lower back. That was it.
22:49
Nan was having none of this and quickly spun
22:51
around to keep kill the suspected rat. What she
22:53
actually saw throws her in place with shock.
22:55
It wasn't a rat at all. It was, in fact, a little
22:57
tiny man who is now leaping off of the bed and
23:00
back onto the floor. It was tiny, unclothed,
23:03
and very obese along its squashed looking torso.
23:08
She watched in disbelief as the thing she referred
23:10
to as the potato man. ran for its life back towards
23:14
the closed bedroom door, which it then passed
23:17
straight through. The increased tip -tapping
23:20
sound of his tiny feet could be heard as it ran
23:22
out along the landing and then onto the stairs.
23:25
Nan always used to bring up that tale from her
23:27
past and she never changed her story. As I got
23:29
older and more fascinated with the encounter,
23:31
I used to quiz her about its shape, its look.
23:33
She never saw its face, but did describe its
23:36
hairless head as having a human shape. But the
23:39
arms and legs were described as skinny or bony.
23:41
She even saw its behind and the crease in between
23:44
which she often spoke of wishing she had whacked
23:46
with her slipper. Whatever it was never came
23:49
back. Do you think it was effing hoarse? It might
23:53
have been effing hoarse. Now his mother's encounter
23:58
takes place when she was around six or seven
24:00
years of age, so not that long after that actually.
24:03
It was a sunny summer afternoon. She's been down
24:06
the road playing a game with her friends and
24:08
is now rushing home for her lunch. When she entered
24:10
the house, same one is mentioned in the first
24:12
account, she began to notice a strange atmosphere.
24:14
She recalls the hallway and strange weird feelings.
24:17
As she rushed into the front room, she described
24:19
seeing something sat on the hearth. At first
24:22
she thought it was some peculiar looking doll
24:23
and so briefly turned her attention back towards
24:26
Nan, who was sat near the window with a magazine.
24:28
The thing on the hearth began to move slightly
24:30
from side to side. This is when my mother looked
24:33
back at it and then screamed. Whenever my mother
24:35
has spoken about this experience she has always
24:37
referred to the thing on the - hearth as the
24:39
elf. It was sat cross -legged, leaning forward
24:42
with its face cupped inside its joined hands.
24:45
Imagine a V -shape. Just made it its overall
24:46
size of that of a 3 -4 year old child. Its body
24:49
was very slim and it wore tight looking clothes.
24:52
Its trousers looked like they had been woven
24:54
by a thick line of wool. The colour was dark
24:57
brown or black and it was the trousers that had
24:59
led my mother originally to believe it was a
25:01
toy who someone had knitted clothing for. It
25:04
wore tiny slip -on shoes which also looked dirty.
25:07
The torso of the elf was covered by a long -sleeved
25:09
tunic, its color? Dirty looking burgundy. She
25:12
doesn't recall seeing its belt, and it didn't
25:14
wear a hat. Now whilst its body looked young,
25:16
the face did not. She described its hoard face
25:19
as similar to that of a wizened old man. Its
25:21
dark eyes, which turned to look at her, appeared
25:24
larger than ours. The image below, sorry, he
25:27
includes a photo. The image below of a Lebanese
25:29
elderly gentleman was what my mother had loosely
25:32
matched what she can recall, but has mentioned
25:35
the eyes were larger and the bridge of its nose
25:37
was slimmer than that shown in the image. She
25:40
doesn't remember seeing any hair on its head
25:42
either. And so my mother ran back outside and
25:44
onto the backyard in shock. Dan goes outside
25:46
to see all the fusses about, takes my mother
25:48
back inside, and then finds that the is now no
25:51
longer there and Chelsea I'm just gonna share
25:53
my screen so you can see what she was describing
25:56
yes so she didn't actually like sketch it or
25:59
anything it's just no this is an image they apparently
26:02
found online they're like yep that's it oh okay
26:06
I wasn't expecting that this poor man why is
26:10
he being compared to this I don't think he knows
26:13
don't worry Nobody tell him. But yeah, just a
26:16
very generic old man, I would say. Yeah, I would
26:19
say too. With an Irish cap and a turtleneck on,
26:22
long nose, big ears. Yeah. So yeah, that's the
26:25
unexplained mysteries. I'm intrigued by the fact
26:28
that a haunting of elves, so to say, in a house.
26:32
I think I would rather elves haunting a house
26:35
than anything else. Really? Yeah. Because I know
26:39
they're called the good folk. I don't know. The
26:43
Okanagan Shushwap dwarfs sound like they're the
26:46
ones you want to be interacting with. else can
26:49
go south very fast. Yeah, I don't feel like those
26:51
guys would be haunting a house. I feel like these
26:53
are two distinct peoples is the feeling I'm getting.
26:57
I just go on vibes. That's mostly how I operate.
26:59
Okay. I'm getting different vibes, but I feel
27:02
like if I had a haunting that I suspected of
27:05
little people, if I ever saw a potato man, first
27:08
of all, the vivid image I get of the potato man,
27:12
I can almost like feel him. I really love that
27:16
she clearly saw his ass too, just out there.
27:20
I see him so vividly in my mind's eye, just running
27:23
through the door. But... I feel like there's
27:27
better ways of living peacefully among little
27:31
folk haunting a house than if you had like a
27:35
ghost or poltergeist or something like that.
27:37
I feel like you could live more happily with
27:41
a little person haunting. Elf. Fairy. Look, with
27:45
this, and sorry, that's the whole thing, like
27:47
fairies overall, I don't know, from the stories
27:50
I've read this is not what you want, but the
27:52
little people interactions don't seem that bad.
27:54
Yeah. Like one thinks it's an airplane and one's
27:58
got it's little ass out. You haven't said any
28:04
trickster stories, though there's supposed to
28:06
be tricksters and like hide stuff and stuff like
28:09
that. Other stuff seems scary to me. I don't
28:11
feel like I'd want one of those hauntings. A
28:14
little person hiding something on me, though
28:16
when furiating, I might curse fucking Horus as
28:20
well. I feel like I could live better with that.
28:23
For the record, I don't - know what record I
28:26
don't want a haunting in general for the record
28:29
so just to set the final record now this next
28:33
story it's fairly short it's called the barren
28:36
wisconsin little men encounter it's documented
28:38
by jeremy clark a ufologist 13 year old harry
28:42
anderson saw 20 bald headed little men near barren
28:46
wisconsin one summer night in 1919 harry was
28:49
riding in a car with others in the wisconsin
28:51
countryside when the car ran out of oil it ran
28:54
out of Oil? Yeah, for all we know it's whale
28:57
oil at that time too. Yeah, I can't say that's
28:59
ever happened to me. Ran out of gas plenty of
29:01
times. But oil? Harry walked to a farm to fetch
29:05
some and he was walking back. A farm? When he
29:07
was walking back, he saw 20 little men walking
29:11
along towards him in single file. What's going
29:13
on? They had bald heads and white skin and wore
29:16
leather knee pants held up by blazes over their
29:20
shoulders. What the fuck is going on here? They
29:23
paid no attention to the terrified boy who ducked
29:26
out of sight behind a tree but muttered to themselves
29:28
and sang a little song. Quote, we won't stop
29:31
fighting till the end of war in 1994. End quote.
29:38
The terrified Anderson, quote, heart pumping,
29:40
unquote, continued on his way back to the car
29:43
once the marching dwarfs had passed by not once
29:45
looking back behind him. Where did you get this
29:50
story? It's a good question. I have to look really
29:54
quick to see which of my... You know what this
29:57
gives me vibes of? A dream. It kind of does.
30:00
But like, he was walking to get gas. He was walking
30:03
to get oil from a farm. When does the story take
30:07
place? 1919. Okay, things might have been different
30:11
back then. I mean, little people did roam the
30:14
earth and sing at that time. I think that's around
30:17
the time Snow White was around. Um, that's 1930s.
30:22
Okay, and I actually had to look up where this
30:23
next one came from. Fuck, that was a good story.
30:26
I like that one. That one comes from either the
30:29
W files or Singular 14 are both sources for that
30:33
one. Oh, Singular 14, isn't that Lon? Is that?
30:36
I'm pretty sure it's Lon. I thought he was the
30:37
14. I'm pretty sure it's Singular 14. Oh look,
30:41
you continue. Okay, this next one comes from
30:45
the original one is from Kenneth Arnold's story
30:47
the proceedings of the first international UFO
30:49
Congress This is in 1950s in Oregon Ellen Jorgensen
30:53
a University of Oregon graduate and very intelligent
30:56
person saw a dark -skinned 9 to 12 inch tall
30:58
little man wearing a little romper and sort of
31:01
a plaid shirt Walking with a waddling motion
31:03
across her breezeway pass under the running board
31:06
of a car and disappear. That's the entire encounter
31:10
Lon is not singular 14. Sorry they he has worked
31:14
with them before which is why I'm getting okay
31:16
because they Did collaborate on both men a little
31:19
bit. It looks like okay And this last one here,
31:22
Chelsea, originally came from the book. Well,
31:25
it doesn't originally. I read about it in the
31:28
book Where the Footprints End, the really high
31:31
strageness big foot story written by Joshua Kutcham
31:34
and Timothy Renner. Great book. There's going
31:37
to be a lot of episodes inspired by it at some
31:39
point, but I'm curious to see if you think this
31:42
is a little person encounter. OK, just because
31:44
it doesn't necessarily say it is, but I think
31:47
it is. It all started with a curious, nervy woman.
31:50
named Pat Evans, who found a footprint near her
31:53
slash trash bags and decided to put out greasy
31:55
bacon just to see what would happen. Thus began
31:57
the amazing saga of the lady who fed Bigfoot.
32:00
One Bigfoot became three and they began to venture
32:03
beyond their usual haunts in the Creek Valley.
32:05
Pat's friends from Columbus and West Jefferson
32:07
would come at night and watch from her darkened
32:09
home. Pat said, quote, them suckers was big.
32:12
Tall enough they would burn the tops of my red
32:14
bud trees. My old front yard was burned up by
32:16
these things. Anything they touched died. You
32:18
couldn't believe it. They ruined my beautiful
32:20
yard." As you have guessed, Pat's curiosity and
32:23
boldness had gotten her into a deep trouble.
32:25
Meanwhile, other strange things appeared in the
32:27
triangle. The red glowing, quote, something out
32:30
of mythology, end quote. Half horse, half man
32:33
was one. It had a pointed head and ears, fiery
32:36
slanted eyes, beard, skinny wings. The horrifying
32:39
apparition moved across the yard on long cloven
32:41
feet, leaving hoof prints in the snow. That's
32:43
not the little person part. Even more mind -boggling
32:46
was the brilliant orange balloon that swooped
32:49
down by the back door of the house one nice summer
32:52
morning. It seemed to deliberately go slowly
32:55
so that Pat and her husband ended up within touching
32:57
distance of it. The basket of the balloon had
32:59
three man -like figures in it. One man -like
33:02
figure had on a black suit and the other two
33:05
wore heavy black jackets with fur on them. The
33:07
gentleman in the suit said with a very English
33:09
accent, and a good morning to you too. Then the
33:13
basket rose rapidly. up and out of sight and
33:15
after 18 months the silent triangle again became
33:18
alive with normal night creature sounds and the
33:20
para -apes never returning. I feel like the people
33:23
in the balloon were little people but I don't
33:25
know for sure because they didn't state it but
33:27
just how they describe like they got close within
33:29
touching distance and a balloon swooped down
33:31
I feel like they couldn't be normal size. No,
33:34
I think you're right, and it was the association
33:37
with the Irish? I just feel the normality of
33:40
how the others are treating it is very much in
33:42
line with the little people. I think you're right,
33:44
I think you're right. The bigger question in
33:45
my head at this point is what the fuck is going
33:47
on at this woman's house. But we'll save the
33:52
rest of that for a different time. There's a
33:54
lot of stuff out of that book we'll be talking
33:55
about at some point. Yeah, I think the balloon
33:58
was housing a little person. And those are all
34:00
the sightings I have and the last part I need
34:02
to talk about just because this is the whole
34:05
reason I ended up doing this episode. Now we
34:07
need to address this topic. Psychoactive plants
34:10
and fungi absolutely show up in anthropology
34:12
of little people. but they don't erase the phenomenon.
34:15
They sit alongside it. In some parts of the world,
34:17
little people appear in visions brought on by
34:19
sacred plants, such as ayahuasca in the Amazon,
34:22
amanita, muscaria in Siberia, psilocybin in Europe
34:25
and the Americas, and that mushroom I can't remember
34:27
the name of in China. These substances reliably
34:30
produce visions of small humanoid beings, but
34:32
this doesn't explain the whole phenomenon. Many
34:35
cultures with no psychedelic traditions have
34:37
little people stories, and modern sober witnesses
34:39
describe the same figures. So hallucinations
34:41
may shape some of the stories, They don't necessarily
34:43
cover everything. Which is a question I was kind
34:47
of curious from that episode. You know what,
34:49
I did think about that at the beginning and then
34:51
I forgot about it. bring up everything that I
34:57
was talking about on that mini, but what's to
35:00
say that it's not opening your mind to see a
35:02
reality of something just out of our eyesight?
35:06
You know what I mean? Because what if they are
35:09
everywhere and you just need the mushrooms to
35:11
see them? Maybe they explain itches. They could
35:14
explain a lot of things. They could explain why
35:16
it feels like there's constantly a little potato
35:19
naked man next to you. It's just ass saying it
35:23
helps. Or why sometimes you hear faint singing.
35:31
You know what Chelsea, I'm just going to cover
35:32
this last little bit because it didn't come up
35:34
in our little talk. So there is a height restriction.
35:37
You got to be under four foot three to live in
35:40
this village. Oh, I thought to visit. They have
35:43
more than 120 residents at this point who live
35:46
autonomously with their own diminutive police
35:48
and firefighting force. Wow, what's it called?
35:51
I have no idea. It's in the mountain area of
35:56
Kunming. Oh wow, this is something. Am I offended?
36:01
Yeah. I don't know. They did it to themselves,
36:05
so I don't know if we can be offended. Where
36:09
have I seen this? I don't know. This is crazy
36:12
though. But that's where I had to limit this
36:14
episode and also keep that little bit in about
36:17
the - Do people get sent there? I hope not. No,
36:20
you get to choose to go there. Okay. It's like
36:22
a utopia. It was meant to be, but now it's a
36:25
theme park. Okay, can I have my points now? I
36:31
have points. Yeah, of course. Okay. Is it about
36:33
the village or like the overall topic? The overall
36:35
topic. Are there more voices about the village?
36:38
No. I might talk about the village again. I can't
36:41
get my out of my mind the little like there's
36:43
a fire and they got the ladder and they're all
36:45
going and it feels so bad. No, in my mind. Okay,
36:49
I was about to google little person China fire.
36:52
I hope they don't have fires. It looks like this
36:54
place might be built out of stone. Or asbestos.
36:58
But I don't know for sure. It could be that.
37:00
I would actually bet on that. Okay, my points.
37:02
I was gonna interject, but you're just going
37:04
so well at the beginning. I didn't. First of
37:08
all, backwards feet? I hate that. I know, and
37:11
that's one of those weird ones that pops up a
37:13
lot of places. A lot. Which kind of brings in
37:16
that whole unified theory of weird that George
37:19
Knapp always talks about. How it's weird that
37:22
it pops up so often in different places. In different
37:24
cultures around the world. We were just talking
37:27
about that Oh on ghouls, I think what episode
37:30
was that? Oh the crawler Episode we're talking
37:33
about backwards feet. It comes up with the gin
37:36
I was actually just listening to a podcast on
37:40
one of the podcasts that I listened to and they
37:43
were talking about the lore of Folklore of Trinidad
37:47
and they were talking about don't quote me on
37:50
this something had backwards feet though So it's
37:52
funny that it's coming up here as well. Japan
37:55
as well has I can't remember these but there's
37:58
at least one creature that has backwards peace.
38:00
There is, yeah. Which I find terrifying. I think
38:04
it's that uncanny valley thing where it's like
38:06
human but not, so it just gives you the creeps.
38:09
It's kind of funny that that never came up as
38:11
a thing with black eyed kids because you feel
38:13
like that's one of those things that would just
38:15
be like close but not quite right with them.
38:17
That's true, yeah. Have we done it black eyed
38:20
kids? We've done black eyed kids. I can't remember.
38:22
Have we done black eyed kids? I don't think we
38:24
have to. I don't know. We've done too many freaking
38:26
episodes. We might just start redoing them. Not
38:28
redoing them, but doing them by accident. Just
38:30
by accident, yeah. The other thing, if you saw
38:36
a little person, this is from way back at the
38:39
beginning, if you saw a little person and they
38:41
offered you a reward or something to say you
38:45
didn't see me. I might have the best intentions
38:49
to not tell anybody, but I don't know that I
38:52
could keep something like that to myself. I would
38:55
really want to have an in -depth discussion about
38:57
that contract that's being entered, but I don't
39:00
know in that time and place I'd be able to have
39:03
that. I'd be in like a condition to be able to
39:06
do that. I'd be like, what do you mean tell people?
39:09
What do you mean reward? What's this time period
39:13
we're talking about? I could just see how this
39:16
would go for myself I'd be like holy shit look
39:19
at your little butt it's out your little potato
39:24
man and they'd be like don't tell anybody you
39:28
saw me and I'd be like how could I ever keep
39:30
this quiet I want to tell everybody and he would
39:33
be like please They'll kill my whole family.
39:36
And then I'd seriously be in a really big ethical
39:41
quandary, I think, as to whether I don't tell
39:45
people or not, because I literally I would leave
39:48
and I'd see a stranger and I'd be like, I just
39:50
saw a little person's ass. It was glorious. Like
39:59
I would never shut up about it for the rest of
40:02
my life I don't think if I saw something like
40:05
that I'd tell everyone I'd immediately be texting
40:08
everybody I'd walk into work the next day be
40:10
like yes what I saw yesterday you're never gonna
40:14
believe it and nobody would believe me either
40:17
but they'd be like or they'd be hunting down
40:20
the guy's family and I'd feel so bad because
40:23
like I just it brings up such a Like, ethical
40:27
debate, I guess you could say. They should talk
40:30
about this in ethics classes. Anyhow. They really
40:33
should. And also, they should really elaborate
40:35
more on the reward for not telling anybody. Yeah,
40:38
I wonder what the reward is. Do you think if
40:40
I kept quiet for so long, this is really something
40:43
to talk to a little person about? Yeah, we got
40:46
to get one as a gift. Yeah, we got it. If anybody
40:48
has seen one, please let the gift be - Let us
40:51
know and then let us know what happens. Yeah,
40:53
please. We won't make you tell us about the little
40:57
person just like stuff about the situation as
41:00
best you can and then did I have another point?
41:03
Those are some amazing stories. I love those
41:06
stories I love the weird things where you just
41:08
can't put it together. We had it all on this
41:11
episode We had ass we had little person planes.
41:16
We had a UFO. Maybe we had Just a bunch of them
41:20
going to war? Like a whole bunch of them that
41:22
made a vill - yeah, going to war. Um, singing
41:25
songs. A bunch of real life ones that made a
41:28
village in China. I love this episode. You were
41:31
right. I did love this episode. And to celebrate,
41:36
I might go do some mushrooms to see some little
41:39
people. You got somebody to talk to. Okay. And
41:43
with that, I have been Taylor, here with Chelsea.
41:46
We are Journey to the Fringe. Thank you all for
41:47
listening. We'll see you next week. Bye. Thank
41:53
you for listening to Journey to the Fringe. If
41:55
you have liked what you have listened to, please
41:58
like, share, subscribe, or follow, depending
42:01
on what. venue you are listening to us through.
42:04
Also, please, if possible, leave a five -star
42:07
review, as that really helps us in the algorithms.
42:10
Should you wish to interact with us, please check
42:13
us out on your social media of choice. I bet
42:16
you we are there. And if you really want to communicate
42:19
with us and give us ideas for new episodes or
42:21
tell us that we're wrong and terrible, either
42:23
way, please send us an email at journeytothefringe
42:27
at gmail .com. For now, I'll see you in the next
42:30
episode.