Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / SAVANNAH GUTHRIE MOM MISSING: DAY 12

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SAVANNAH GUTHRIE MOM MISSING: DAY 12 · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, Savannah Guthrie's mother, Nancy Guthrie Missing,
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: day twelve. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: want to thank you for being with us. We are
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: an hour of desperation.
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: And we need job.
• 0:22
  Speaker 3: What happened?
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: Was this really a kidnapping? Totally terrifying situation.
• 0:26
  Speaker 3: You don't know what is real what is fake At
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  Speaker 3: this point, this.
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: Criminal did mess up somewhere and they will be taught.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: As we go to air. We have learned that a tent,
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: a forensics evidentiary tint, has been put up outside Nancy
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: Guthrie's home. Let's take a look at this. This was
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: first reported by Matt Finn FNC A tent going up
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: outside the front door of Nancy Guthrie's home. The first
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: comment was someone opining that a body had been found.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: I don't think that is the case, although I understand
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: why the viewer said that. Again, that's from Matt Finn
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: FNC joining me an all star panelt tomic sense of
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: what we are learning right now. Straight out to Brian Fitzgibbons.
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: You and I have been on plenty of crime scenes.
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: Why a tent at this juncture? Outside Nancy Guthrie's front porch.
• 1:34
  Speaker 4: Yeah, what's unique about this crime scene is you've got
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  Speaker 4: not only your standard national media attention or not, I
• 1:43
  Speaker 4: shouldn't say standard, You've got an a credible amount of
• 1:45
  Speaker 4: national media attention, YouTubers, members of the public out there.
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  Speaker 4: This is very likely done to protect whatever those agents
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  Speaker 4: are doing in there. So the equipment they're bringing in
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  Speaker 4: is and being analyzed, the people aren't being photographed as
• 2:00
  Speaker 4: they're working, and that speculation isn't being generated from whatever's happening.
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: But who cares about speculation? Brian? That whatever is speculated
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  Speaker 1: doesn't matter to the FBI. Typically a tent like that
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  Speaker 1: is put up when evidence is being recovered sensitive evidence.
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: Agree or disagree or Fitzgibbons. When the evidence, as I said,
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: was so sensitive you you don't want it. How can
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: I say polluted or destroyed in any way?
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  Speaker 4: I would agree, and I would say that this is
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  Speaker 4: done more for concealment and moreover for the suspect to
• 2:43
  Speaker 4: be aware of exactly where they're looking. So you know,
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  Speaker 4: this is protecting the integrity of what they're doing.
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  Speaker 5: What about it, Scott Iiker, So there's some good equipment
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  Speaker 5: that we can use sent into that little four yer
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  Speaker 5: area and it'll laser measure that whole area, so it'll
• 3:01
  Speaker 5: give us like a model of how tall the arches,
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  Speaker 5: all the bricks where they're at. So it'd be a
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  Speaker 5: very detailed picture using lasers to get that documented. Also,
• 3:18
  Speaker 5: I mean, have we ever seen anybody in there looking
• 3:20
  Speaker 5: for hares? I mean, this guy's stood there for a
• 3:23
  Speaker 5: while working with the door, bringing in shrubbery. Did he
• 3:28
  Speaker 5: shed some hairs, did he shed some DNA? They might
• 3:31
  Speaker 5: be just you know, meticulously looking for anything that's still
• 3:35
  Speaker 5: in that front porch area.
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  Speaker 1: Iiker, could you explain the laser equipment you are describing
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: that would take specific measurements.
• 3:46
  Speaker 5: Yes, it's a device, you said, in the middle of
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  Speaker 5: a room and it takes laser measurements all around to
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  Speaker 5: give you exactly the model of that room. We've used
• 3:59
  Speaker 5: it in numerous different cases, even in the theater shooting
• 4:02
  Speaker 5: in Aurora, Colorado.
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  Speaker 1: You were measuring with your hands when you said you
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: put the device in the middle of a room and
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: it takes measurements all around, and you were making a
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: spiral gesticulation. What does that mean.
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  Speaker 5: Well, the laser has to go all the kind of
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  Speaker 5: rotates around in measuring all the different parts of the room,
• 4:27
  Speaker 5: so you give you a full measurement of how far
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  Speaker 5: this wide it is, how deep it is, how tall
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  Speaker 5: it is. We need measurements on that arch also, right,
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  Speaker 5: One of those things is going to help us give
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  Speaker 5: a height to this gentleman that's walking to the door, right,
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  Speaker 5: because we now can say, oh, when he stood up,
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  Speaker 5: he reached this brick in this archway, so he's that tall.
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  Speaker 5: So there's a lot of information we can get from
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  Speaker 5: these type videos.
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  Speaker 1: So why would they need the tent to do that
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: to block off the arch to get the interior dimensions
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  Speaker 1: of the room of the porch.
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  Speaker 5: Yes, that's correct, and prevent from that laser going further.
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  Speaker 1: Mm hmmm. How does the laser work.
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  Speaker 5: It takes those measurements bouncing it off the wall, making
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  Speaker 5: the measurements of how far that each room is and
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  Speaker 5: how far why it.
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  Speaker 2: Is, how tall it is.
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  Speaker 1: Does it need darkness?
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  Speaker 2: It doesn't have to.
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  Speaker 5: Have darkness, but I think that maybe that tent would.
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  Speaker 5: We don't want the laser to shoot out to the street, right,
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  Speaker 5: We're just trying to get the dimensions of that room.
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  Speaker 3: Nancy.
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  Speaker 6: The tent was taken down after a couple of hours. However,
• 5:45
  Speaker 6: we got a good hint as to what was taking
• 5:47
  Speaker 6: place that we couldn't actually see. When one of the
• 5:50
  Speaker 6: investigators was leaving the scene. He was carrying a forensic
• 5:54
  Speaker 6: height board. This is a tool used to determine the
• 5:58
  Speaker 6: height of a suspect. When you don't actually have the
• 6:01
  Speaker 6: suspect in front of you, you just have marking areas
• 6:04
  Speaker 6: around where that person had been. So the forensic high
• 6:07
  Speaker 6: board giving us a clue as to what was taking
• 6:09
  Speaker 6: place while they had the tent up earlier today and
• 6:12
  Speaker 6: again Nancy it has been taken down.
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: Wow. Okay, now we've heard from Iker, Scott Iiker, we've
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: heard from Brian Fitzgibbons. Eric Fattis, you were mentioning earlier
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: about how the scene was released too soon and various
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: people could go up and take photos of Nancy's blood.
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: I'm going to circle this back to the tent. That's
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  Speaker 1: a problem if there ever is a trial regarding chain
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  Speaker 1: of custody.
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: Oh, that's exactly right.
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  Speaker 7: I mean, in order to enter evidence at a trial,
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  Speaker 7: there has to be a sound chain of custody. There
• 6:50
  Speaker 7: has to be proof that what you're giving to the
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  Speaker 7: jury is authentic, that it hasn't been contaminated, that it
• 6:55
  Speaker 7: hasn't been tampered with, and that is always a significant
• 6:59
  Speaker 7: issue with there is seen containment problems like in this case.
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  Speaker 7: And if they're doing this now, why now and not
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  Speaker 7: twelve days ago? This would seem to be something that
• 7:08
  Speaker 7: would prime scene specialists would do on the first or
• 7:10
  Speaker 7: possibly second day.
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  Speaker 1: Fattus, You're absolutely correct, and that would be a great
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: question for Nanos the sheriff, because twelve days ago, the
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: FBI had not been invited in right, they were not
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: given jurisdiction, So all of these things were just thrown
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: out the window. Nothing happened, no video, no measurements of
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: the area. We didn't need measurements of the area because
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: we didn't have the video of the guy. And it
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: just builds and builds and builds. So you're right about that,
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: Doctor Sherry Schwartz. What about the fact that you heard
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: that's Gibbon say. He thinks the tent is largely for secretiveness,
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: to keep what's happening a secret. I wonder also how
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: it affects the family when they see evidence being carted out,
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: when they realize what's going on. He also mentioned he
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: and Iker both that you don't want to tip the
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: purp off about every single thing that's happening.
• 8:21
  Speaker 8: And all of those are excellent points. But the family
• 8:24
  Speaker 8: is the first group of people that I thought of
• 8:27
  Speaker 8: when we found out that a tent was going up,
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  Speaker 8: because we associate that with finding remains of a person,
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  Speaker 8: and so I can only imagine for them already being
• 8:41
  Speaker 8: in this emotional limbo that they're in and having to
• 8:45
  Speaker 8: wait and see, just like the rest of us in
• 8:48
  Speaker 8: many ways, and how hard this must be for them.
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  Speaker 1: Oh, when you see a tent like that going up
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  Speaker 1: around your mom's home, it's just like the first comment was, Oh,
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  Speaker 1: I pray to God in heaven they're not bringing out
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  Speaker 1: a body, because we're used to seeing that go up
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  Speaker 1: in the middle of nowhere where you've found a body.
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: We've seen it over and over and over. Another development.
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: Dave Mack joining US Crime Stories investigative reporter, I want
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  Speaker 1: you to take a look at some video that we
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: found of this guy in the area in the early
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: morning hours, and this is from a neighbor's security. Can
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: let's see the video, please, Dave Matt, what do we
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: know about this?
• 9:35
  Speaker 3: Well?
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  Speaker 6: Nancy we know very little. But look, you can see
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  Speaker 6: the man's head clearly. You can see what he's doing.
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  Speaker 6: It appears that he's dealing with trash and he's got
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  Speaker 6: another backpack.
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  Speaker 1: Then why isn't he putting it in the trash can?
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  Speaker 3: Well, he's reaching over.
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  Speaker 6: It seems to me somebody's handing him something or he's
• 9:55
  Speaker 6: reaching over far enough to get another bag. And now
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  Speaker 6: here we go past the past the dumpsterree he's walking
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  Speaker 6: back towards wherever he and this was taken a couple
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  Speaker 6: of miles away from the Guthrie home at about the
• 10:11
  Speaker 6: same time.
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  Speaker 3: So, I mean, Nancy, I don't know what.
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  Speaker 6: I don't know what's going on North Tucson, you know,
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  Speaker 6: in the middle of the night, but it seems odd
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  Speaker 6: that we would have multiple people.
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  Speaker 1: That's a backpack. Wait a minute, that's a backpack. At
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  Speaker 1: first I thought it was a trash bag. It looks
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  Speaker 1: more like a second backpack.
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  Speaker 3: It is.
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  Speaker 6: Actually you see the strap hanging down there. Now I
• 10:31
  Speaker 6: didn't notice that either. You can hear the sound of
• 10:35
  Speaker 6: cans in that bag though, you hear something and it
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  Speaker 6: has been submitted to the FBI. This video was turned
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  Speaker 6: over to them right away. Before it was posted for
• 10:45
  Speaker 6: all of us to see.
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  Speaker 3: But again you know where he goes, yeah, trying to.
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  Speaker 1: See it is a second backpack, yep. And he's not
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: getting in the vehicle.
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  Speaker 3: No, And.
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: Is he doing wait watch his Dave. He hangs it
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  Speaker 1: over the side, he reaches over. Something's happening on the
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  Speaker 1: other side of that wall.
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  Speaker 6: There's somebody else over there, Okay, because he's getting something
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  Speaker 6: from somebody or some I mean, why not if he's
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  Speaker 6: he's not reaching far enough over to getting something from
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  Speaker 6: the ground. You see, he's only reaching what three feet
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  Speaker 6: down is all.
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  Speaker 3: He can get to.
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  Speaker 1: Is he trying to get in behind that gate? Trying
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: to reach around to find the latch and get in
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  Speaker 1: And he's not going to the car. So who is
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: he and why is he there? And about what time
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: of the day or night did this take place?
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  Speaker 6: Dave mac We're at one point fifty three am and
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  Speaker 6: this was caught on a ring camera, the ring app
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  Speaker 6: and that's why we're getting just that one angle. But again,
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  Speaker 6: you're talking at one fifty three in the morning, February first,
• 11:57
  Speaker 6: so this is taking place at the same time. It
• 12:01
  Speaker 6: takes you know, six minutes difference between the one forty
• 12:05
  Speaker 6: seven on Nancy Guthrie's front porch. And here we go,
• 12:08
  Speaker 6: not far from her house, a guy walking around with
• 12:10
  Speaker 6: backpacks at the same time within minutes. Again, this just
• 12:15
  Speaker 6: seems beyond strange. You've got a guy with two backpacks.
• 12:19
  Speaker 6: He's handing it over the fence. He's grabbing something else.
• 12:23
  Speaker 3: He saw it.
• 12:24
  Speaker 6: He's got back back in his left arm. He's reaching
• 12:26
  Speaker 6: with his right arm and now he comes back up.
• 12:29
  Speaker 6: He's holding the left back up and reaching with his
• 12:33
  Speaker 6: right He's resting that left bag on that brick wall there.
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: It looks to me that Jackie's right. He looks like
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: he's trying to get in that gate. Guys, this is
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: posted on Ring Neighbor app. It's an app. A lot
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: of people have them in neighborhoods and everybody in the
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: neighborhood can look at it Ring Neighbor app. We're not
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: saying this guy is the purp. The reason it caught
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: our attention is in it's post stood by I Amy
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: Lee on x and it's from the Ring Neighbor app.
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: And the reason Dave, that you and I are so
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: interested in it is it's around two am in the
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: morning of the same night Nancy Guthrie is kidnapped. Starting
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: around one forty seven am two am, there is a
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: spike in her heart monitor, her pacemaker spikes, and in
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: twenty minutes or so, she's gone. This is just a
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: few miles from Nancy's home. Again, we're not saying that
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: this is the purp. I'm saying this was posted on
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  Speaker 1: the neighbor the Ring Neighbor app a few miles from
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  Speaker 1: Nancy's home the night she disappears. Within minutes of her disappearance.
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: Who is this guy? What is he doing? Does that
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: gate lead to a back does it lead to a
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: back road to Nancy Guthrie's house. This has been sent
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: to the FBI, and tonight we are calling on all
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: neighbors everyone. Look at your ring apps, look at your
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: door cams. This is how the case is going to
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: be cracked wide open by someone seeing something, a girlfriend,
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: a wife, a friend noticing something unusual. It's going old
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: school right now in the search for Nancy Guthrie. Also,
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: in addition to that tent going up and the discovery
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: of that video on the Ring Neighbor app, Savannah has
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: just released a heartbreaking, a poignant video. Let's watch she
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: accompanies this with music, and there you see Nancy Guthrie
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  Speaker 1: with her little girls in her youth. That's Savannah and
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: her sister Annie. There's this stial including brother Cameron. This
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: is outside, we believe, the very porch where she was
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: led out of the home, leaving behind blood drops. I
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: believe I know why Savannah released this number one. Her
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: heart is breaking breaking and she's going through all of
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: these videos and photos of her mom, praying desperately. Her
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: mom is still alive and we brought home soon. Pits Gibbons,
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: I think there's another reason she released it.
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean this is this is an incredibly emotional
• 15:48
  Speaker 4: and humanizing video. You know this is going to go
• 15:51
  Speaker 4: like wildfire across the country. This is going to keep folks,
• 15:55
  Speaker 4: as you were talking about earlier in this show, keep
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: people in spy to persevere in this case, what about it?
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: I ker, I agree.
• 16:05
  Speaker 5: And you're also sending a message to the potential kidnappers
• 16:08
  Speaker 5: that this person has family, has kids, is a loved one.
• 16:13
  Speaker 5: You want to humanize this person, not just not being
• 16:16
  Speaker 5: just a victim that you don't care about. Now you're
• 16:19
  Speaker 5: showing she's a mother and has a family. Hopefully that
• 16:23
  Speaker 5: I'll preserve her and make sure that she stays alive.
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: Doctor Sherry Schwartz, this is a desperate hour. I believe
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: Savannah is sending this speaking directly to the kidnapper. I agree, Nancy.
• 16:38
  Speaker 8: She is definitely trying to appeal to whatever scintilla of
• 16:42
  Speaker 8: empathy that the kidnapper may have. But if not them,
• 16:47
  Speaker 8: then somebody close to them who recognizes them, who knows
• 16:50
  Speaker 8: it's them, This may appeal to them, and they might
• 16:53
  Speaker 8: go to the police, hopefully and tell what they know.
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: You know, you said something really important just in Doctor
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: Sherry Schwartz to Eric Fattis. Doctor Sherry pointed out not
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: just to them, but someone that knows them, maybe a
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: mom that knows their son, their husband, their son in
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: law has Nancy Guthrie, and only a mom would really
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: understand this video. The bond between a child and their mother.
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: The last thing you want to do is separate a
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: mother from their child. Eric, I think that's how the
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: case may crack. Someone a girlfriend, a wife, a mom
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: knowing their son, their husband, their ex has Nancy.
• 17:44
  Speaker 7: Someone knows something here that this was not done in
• 17:46
  Speaker 7: a way where only the kidnapper is aware of this.
• 17:49
  Speaker 7: I am relatively certain that somewhat around them, a friend,
• 17:53
  Speaker 7: a family member, an acquaintance, a coworker, somebody knows something.
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: And these videos.
• 17:59
  Speaker 7: Helped to sort of galvanize the community and also speak
• 18:02
  Speaker 7: to the emotional resonance within those people, hopefully so that
• 18:05
  Speaker 7: they would come forward and tell what they know.
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: Late in the evening Eastern time, we learn the discovery
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: of a glove. That's the first thing we learn. It
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: looks amazingly similar to the gloves worn by the perp
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: on Nancy Guthrie's front porch. Look at this guy. See
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: those that. Then we learn not just one glove, but
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: two gloves found found by the side of the road.
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: Now you may think debris. People throw everything out of
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: the cars, everything ends up on the side of the road.
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: But what is significant about the location of these gloves
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: less than a mile and a half from Nancy guthrie home.
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: The crime scene yesterday we saw and let's see the
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: footage of it please. We saw LA law enforcement. It
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: was the FBI out literally beating the bushes in multiple locations,
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: all on road sides. We saw them in Campbell, we
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: saw them in Estrata, out combing the area beside roadways
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: and then wow, what a coincidence. That's what our friends
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: at Fox needs. By the way, what a coincidence. They're
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: looking in multiple locations by the roadway and they find
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: the gloves by the roadway. This as the question arises,
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: CAST Cellular Analysis Survey team with the FBI, they were
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: the ones. I'm telling you we haven't heard it from Cash,
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: but tell we haven't heard it yet. But mark my words,
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: they were the ones that unearthed that porch video. It
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: had to be them, and I'll explain with you, along
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: with a founding member from the CAST team joining us,
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: how they did it. But my question tonight is is
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: their audio? My little ring door cam has audio? Bet
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: this did too? And what about the other cameras in
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: the home and around the home? Is there more to come?
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: Are they working feverishly at this moment to get more
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: evidence and lead us to the identity of the kidnapper?
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: And god willing Crime Stories with Nancy Grace straight out
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: to Dave mac Crime Stories investigative reporter, Go.
• 21:02
  Speaker 6: Dave, you know, Nancy, yesterday we were talking about this
• 21:06
  Speaker 6: incredible search that's going on and how many agents are
• 21:10
  Speaker 6: in the field. We're talking hundreds. We're out searching yesterday
• 21:15
  Speaker 6: and a mile and a half, I mean a mile
• 21:18
  Speaker 6: and a half from Nancy Guthrie's home, on the side
• 21:21
  Speaker 6: of the road, they find a black glove. You saw
• 21:25
  Speaker 6: the video from the porch, and it looks like the
• 21:28
  Speaker 6: pictures were seeing of the glove and Nancy. It's shocking
• 21:32
  Speaker 6: that they told us where they were looking and they
• 21:35
  Speaker 6: found it. So they're operating on tips that we're not
• 21:38
  Speaker 6: aware of. They've been given information or have unearthed their
• 21:41
  Speaker 6: own information to know where to look, and specifically, I
• 21:45
  Speaker 6: mean you're talking about finding a needle in a stack
• 21:47
  Speaker 6: of needles. Here they find a glove just off the road,
• 21:51
  Speaker 6: a mile and a half from Nancy Guthries's home.
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: I want to talk about the possibilities. It just takes one,
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: just one one hair, one little speck. I've touched a DNA.
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: Think about Brian Coburger, no motive, no confession, didn't find
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: the weapon, no connection between him and the victims. But
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: we got DNA. We got d in a Deoxaribo niclay acid.
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: A tiny amount of DNA on the snap, the little
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: button snap on the hilt of a knife, a knife
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: hilt just that much and no, Coburger did not have
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: a record, so you couldn't compare it to DNA already
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: in the system. Another hurdle. Genetic genealogy experts went all
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: the way up his family tree. They staked out his home,
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: They got his d DNA and that information gave them
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: enough to get a search warrant to use to compare
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: his DNA and it was I wrote it down last night,
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: one in five point three seven octillion match to Brian Coberger.
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: It just takes one. Let's talk about the gloves. Now,
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: first we heard there was one glove. Now we are
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: hearing there are two gloves. Dave Mack, which one is it?
• 23:35
  Speaker 6: Two gloves found but not together in separate areas. The
• 23:40
  Speaker 6: one glove was found right off road, that's the one
• 23:42
  Speaker 6: we've been told about about a mile and a half
• 23:44
  Speaker 6: from Nancy Guthrie's home. A second glove found away from
• 23:50
  Speaker 6: where the first glove was found. They're not indicating exactly
• 23:53
  Speaker 6: where that one was found, but we've been told two gloves.
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: Joining me Brian Fitzgibbons. He is the director of Operations USP,
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: a nationwide security He leads a team of investigators to
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: go around the world finding missing people, Fitzgibbons. Don't you
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: know that the purp was hot, not necessarily hot temperature wise,
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: is in the evening, it may very well have been
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: cool outdoors, but from all of those clothes, and it
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: looks like he was wearing layers of clothes. And I
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: got a theory on that, the stress of breaking in
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: her home and getting an eighty four year old woman out.
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: He's got on layers of clothes, including a ski mask
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: or a ballaclava, gloves, the works. He gets in the car,
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: he's got her in the car, and he is sweating bullets, Fitzgibbons.
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: And can't you just see him rolling down the window,
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: stripping off a glove, throwing it, stripping off a glove,
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: throwing it. Hence the separation at where they're located, keeping
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: one hand on the steering wheel. Just play it out,
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: unless of course, someone was driving with him. Go ahead,
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: hypothesize with me for sure.
• 25:15
  Speaker 4: And this is a common theme in a number of
• 25:19
  Speaker 4: violent crimes like this, that perpetrators will discard items of clothing,
• 25:26
  Speaker 4: pieces of equipment that they used, weapons along the roadways
• 25:31
  Speaker 4: around the near the crime scene or a small distance away.
• 25:35
  Speaker 4: We actually had a murder case here locally. That was
• 25:39
  Speaker 4: solved when detectives found a polo shirt five miles from
• 25:44
  Speaker 4: the murder scene that was discarded out the window by
• 25:49
  Speaker 4: the suspect himself. They had DNA and blood from the
• 25:54
  Speaker 4: victim on it. And this was five miles down the road,
• 25:58
  Speaker 4: just on the side of the road, found by a
• 25:59
  Speaker 4: dog walker. So you know, this is very common that
• 26:03
  Speaker 4: they would want to dump those items, especially as he's
• 26:06
  Speaker 4: driving in those moments after committing this crime. He's as
• 26:11
  Speaker 4: he's moving along the roadways, that's some of the most
• 26:14
  Speaker 4: vulnerable time for him because he's wondering has police been called?
• 26:18
  Speaker 4: Are they searching for his vehicle in those moments right
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: after the crime.
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: You know, last night we were having quite the discussion
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: regarding what could be if these are the right gloves,
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: what can be attained from the gloves? There's a lot.
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: Number one. Does anybody remember the name Tott mom Casey Anthony,
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: if you will recall, in the prosecution of Casey Anthony
• 26:42
  Speaker 1: and the murder of her daughter, Kelly Anthony, she was acquitted.
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: We learned well, many people learned for the first time.
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: I learned it way back when in the Atlanta Child
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: murders that plastic such as plastic trash bags and plastic
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: gloves each have a particular molecular makeup, a molecular signature
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: that that company uses to create their product. Unlike any
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: other company, trash bags and plastic gloves can be traced
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: to a batch and a lot down to where they
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: were sent and where they were sold. You ever heard
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: of anything like that? Joining me? Scott Iiker, forensics expert,
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: founding member of the FBI's Cellular Analysis Survey Team. Not
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: only that twenty two years former police officer home in
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: the homicide unit with the Norfolk, Virginia PD. Scott, thank
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: you for being with us. What do you make of that?
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: The fact that they FBI, not local law enforcement, They
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: don't have the facilities, they don't have the wherewithal to
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: do that, nor should they. Really, it can be done
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: and it's not that hard.
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: I totally agree with that.
• 28:07
  Speaker 5: We've It kind of brings me back to the Atlanta
• 28:11
  Speaker 5: bombings because I was working that with the FBI with
• 28:14
  Speaker 5: Eric Rudolph back then, and the bomb components were all
• 28:18
  Speaker 5: individual and we were able to kind of go back
• 28:21
  Speaker 5: and each component we could figure out where was that made,
• 28:26
  Speaker 5: Where was where was that sold? So those are the
• 28:29
  Speaker 5: tracks that the FBIS can be doing with these gloves.
• 28:33
  Speaker 5: What's the composition obviously the DNA and here in the
• 28:38
  Speaker 5: gloves themselves, and then trying to figure out where they
• 28:41
  Speaker 5: were purchased, how long ago were they purchased, trying to
• 28:44
  Speaker 5: get video from where these items were purchased. It is
• 28:49
  Speaker 5: a big deal to find these gloves and hope, hopefully
• 28:52
  Speaker 5: they are related to discut theries, kidnapping or missing.
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: You just gave me a great thought, thank you. You
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: know how tight it is when you rip off latex
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: or plastic gloves that has to take away, that has
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: to rip off some hair on a guy's hand, some DNA.
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: It's not just you putting them on, which is probably
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: enough to get touched DNA because when you look at
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: the gloves he's wearing, they look tight. I wonder if
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: he was wearing gloves under the gloves, which would not
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: be helpful at all, but still the ripping them off
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: aspect from the wrist could very well Scott Iiker rip
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: off hair or definitely touch DNA.
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: I totally agree with that.
• 29:38
  Speaker 5: That's and have you ever tried to put two sets
• 29:42
  Speaker 5: of gloves on in the same hand. I've done that before,
• 29:44
  Speaker 5: but it's very hard because they are sticky, so I
• 29:47
  Speaker 5: doubt he's wearing two sets of gloves. But it sure
• 29:50
  Speaker 5: does look like the gloves that are that were found
• 29:52
  Speaker 5: that are black in color matched the video that we
• 29:54
  Speaker 5: see of him coming up to that front door.
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: This could be the break in the case.
• 29:59
  Speaker 5: I'm so excited and I'm hoping they could get some
• 30:02
  Speaker 5: information off of this.
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: You know, you said something else, Skottiker, and I'm going
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: to follow up with you about what else could be obtained,
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: such as fingerprints. But doctor Sherry Schwartz is joining us,
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: and I want to ask you a question about perseverance.
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: Doctor Sherry Schwartz is a forensic psychologist at Pantherlitigation dot com.
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: She is the author of Criminal Behavior and Where Law
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: and Psychology Intersect Perfect night before last, Doctor Sherry, we
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: were all so bullied.
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: So.
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: Happy that while Nancy was still missing, we had something.
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: There had been a detainee pulled over and was being questioned.
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: The hostage team was a few blocks away, waiting to
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: go in and try to save Nancy. We all checked
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: the news throughout the night and woke up in the
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: morning to find out it was a catch and release.
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: He was not involved, and we were back to square one.
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: I felt so defeated. I felt like somebody kicked me
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: in the stomach, and then I was overwhelmed with guilt.
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: How dare I feel defeated? When Savannah and her family
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: woke up to the same news, it's like day after
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: day they're living in a nightmare. They're away from their home.
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: Savannah lives with her family, her children, and husband in
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: New York. She's out there, she's away from home. Her
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: mother is missing, she could have been killed. It's a
• 31:39
  Speaker 1: race against the clock. Evildoers, trolls are coming out of
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: the woodwork trying to get money and torture them. It's
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: a night mare for her. So how dare we feel
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: like we got a gut punch? How what can you
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: tell us to help us keep going? Sherry? Because you know,
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: doctor Sherry Schwartz, you never know. The FBI certainly does
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: not need us. But what if one thing that you say,
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: or if Fitzgibbons says, or I Kerr or mac or
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: Eric fattis one thing leads to one thing leads to
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: one thing leads to a solution. Give us some encouragement
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: for Pete's sake.
• 32:28
  Speaker 8: Well, the best encouragement that I have is that in
• 32:31
  Speaker 8: a case like this, of course we want resolution, we
• 32:35
  Speaker 8: want to know where Nancy Guthrie is and bring her
• 32:38
  Speaker 8: home safely. But the good news is, and we can
• 32:41
  Speaker 8: look on the positive side, that if this isn't the person,
• 32:44
  Speaker 8: and this person has no idea and isn't a suspect anymore,
• 32:50
  Speaker 8: then they keep looking, and that means there's still opportunity,
• 32:53
  Speaker 8: right because if it is the person, and whatever the
• 32:56
  Speaker 8: outcome is, if it doesn't bring misgus three home safely,
• 33:01
  Speaker 8: then it's over and we're all grieving. But in this
• 33:05
  Speaker 8: particular case, it just means that the investigation continues and
• 33:10
  Speaker 8: everybody needs to stay vigilant because, like you said, Nancy,
• 33:13
  Speaker 8: you just never know. You never know who might hear something,
• 33:17
  Speaker 8: who might see something. Putting this video out there of
• 33:21
  Speaker 8: this suspect is this intruder is excellent because somebody might
• 33:27
  Speaker 8: see this video and recognize this person from the way
• 33:30
  Speaker 8: they walk, the way their body looks. So it's really
• 33:32
  Speaker 8: about staying vigilant, staying engaged, and helping to bring Nancy
• 33:36
  Speaker 8: Guthrie home.
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: Joining me high profile defense attorney Eric Fattus, the founder
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: of the law Offices of Eric Fattus, former felony prosecutor.
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: You can find him at Ericfattesslaw dot com. Eric, thank
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: you for being with us. How do you do it
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: when you're in the middle of a trial and you
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: get a big blow, the judge rules against you, You
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: think the jury is a rule against you, your client
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: is horrible. How do you keep going? Because I'm very
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: curious because yesterday morning, when I got up five point thirty,
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: looked at the news again and saw it was real.
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: The guy was not involved. Back to square one. I
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: had to drag myself. If I didn't have to get
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: breakfast ready for the twins and my mom, I think
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: I would have just, I guess, go back to bed.
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: I don't know. I had to drag myself out. That
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: was a blow, and then I immediately felt horrible that
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: I felt defeated when Savannah is out there just bone tired, exhausted,
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: trying to keeut one foot in front of the other.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: How do you do it when you get a setback,
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: and I.
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: Know you do, sir.
• 34:55
  Speaker 7: I mean, what a rollercoaster of emotions for this family,
• 34:58
  Speaker 7: certainly for Fancy Guthrie. You know, when that happens, you've
• 35:03
  Speaker 7: got to try to remain resilient. I think having a
• 35:06
  Speaker 7: good support system around you is helpful, having a sort
• 35:09
  Speaker 7: of faith in the integrity of the system and the
• 35:12
  Speaker 7: objective of the system to seek justice. You know, it
• 35:14
  Speaker 7: appears that law enforcement is continuing to follow up on leads,
• 35:18
  Speaker 7: being diligent and thorough, although there have been some missteps,
• 35:22
  Speaker 7: and you have to hope that that there are genuine
• 35:24
  Speaker 7: efforts and people who truly care about the outcome of
• 35:27
  Speaker 7: this case and about seeking justice and sort of draw
• 35:31
  Speaker 7: upon that energy, draw upon what they're bringing to the table,
• 35:34
  Speaker 7: and sort of collaboratively trying to reach the best outcome
• 35:38
  Speaker 7: available under the circumstance.
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: I want to go back over Dave mac Well, Eric Fattis,
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: you're right by the way to day make I want
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: to go back to the discovery of the gloves again.
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: It was no coincidence that we see law enforcement side
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: by side all up and down the highways, looking by
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: the road, not just the roads in Nancy Guthries's neighborhood,
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: but all around Estrada. They were in Campbell, they were
• 36:13
  Speaker 1: in Tucson, they were in various areas, and I knew
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: they were all looking by roadsides. I knew that meant something,
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: but I didn't know what it meant. And then, of
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: course there is no coincidence in criminal law, Dave mac
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: gloves are found on a roadside, and that leads me
• 36:33
  Speaker 1: to think possibly someone had called in a tip of
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: having seen something thrown out of a vehicle. Where all
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: were they searching? And Dave, weren't they searching behind sister
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: Annie Guthrie's home and again at Nancy Guthrie's home?
• 36:51
  Speaker 6: You know, Nancy, It's important to point out that when
• 36:54
  Speaker 6: we think about a search with law enforcement, you know,
• 36:56
  Speaker 6: we tend to think of you know, maybe fifteen or twenty.
• 37:00
  Speaker 6: We're talking hundreds here. This was a massive undertaking of
• 37:05
  Speaker 6: law enforcement, FBI, local deputies. We're talking real searching in
• 37:10
  Speaker 6: these areas just off the side of the road now,
• 37:13
  Speaker 6: just era a mile mile and a half away from
• 37:16
  Speaker 6: Nancy Guthrie's house, you know, Nancy, just off the road
• 37:19
  Speaker 6: in this area, it's rugged terrain. We're talking arroyos that
• 37:23
  Speaker 6: go four or five feet deep, a lot of brush
• 37:26
  Speaker 6: and rocks and packed die. I mean, there's a lot
• 37:29
  Speaker 6: going on even that close to the road. So to
• 37:32
  Speaker 6: have this many law enforcement personnel out seeking, they had
• 37:37
  Speaker 6: to have information that put them on this road because
• 37:40
  Speaker 6: look at the results. But going back to Anny Guthrie,
• 37:43
  Speaker 6: you know, this was something that is not getting talked
• 37:46
  Speaker 6: about a lot. But law enforcement went to her neighborhood,
• 37:50
  Speaker 6: Nancy to Andy Guthrie's neighborhood and went door to door there.
• 37:54
  Speaker 6: They looked in the brush, They looked in little backhouses,
• 37:58
  Speaker 6: you know where you stored lawnmowers and things like that.
• 38:01
  Speaker 3: They searched for something or.
• 38:03
  Speaker 6: Someone all throughout that neighborhood, door to door. Now they
• 38:08
  Speaker 6: did the same thing and Nancy Guthries too. They didn't
• 38:11
  Speaker 6: just fan out into the brush at her house and
• 38:14
  Speaker 6: went out from there. They were looking, like I said,
• 38:17
  Speaker 6: they found The first glove they found was a mile
• 38:19
  Speaker 6: and a half from the home, not very far. And
• 38:22
  Speaker 6: we're talking directly across from where Nancy's house is facing
• 38:26
  Speaker 6: look at her front door and goes straight out that
• 38:29
  Speaker 6: way into the brush. That's where this was found. The
• 38:32
  Speaker 6: other glove was found nearby, not far away. As you mentioned.
• 38:36
  Speaker 6: Like if you're taking one off and throwing it, taking
• 38:38
  Speaker 6: the other off and throwing it that's about the.
• 38:40
  Speaker 3: Area where these gloves were found.
• 38:43
  Speaker 6: So again going back to this, we're not talking a
• 38:45
  Speaker 6: couple dozen law enforcement officials spending the day walking. We're
• 38:50
  Speaker 6: talking hundreds in a very structured search of a very
• 38:55
  Speaker 6: specific area and finding what they're looking for a mile
• 38:59
  Speaker 6: and a half from the scene of the crime. I
• 39:01
  Speaker 6: think they had more than just a tip. I think
• 39:04
  Speaker 6: we just don't know what they have yet.
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: Carlo Palazuelos, the individual that bore a general resemblance to
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: the guy on the front porch, is actually a delivery
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: person who delivers not just to Nancy Guthrie's neighborhood, but
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: likely to Nancy Guthrie's home. He was detained and questioned.
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: This is him speaking. He has nothing to do with
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: Guthrie's disappearance, and this statement dashed our hopes that Nancy
• 39:41
  Speaker 1: was this close to being found.
• 39:43
  Speaker 7: They helped me against will remember rise until two hours later?
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: Okay, long my reason?
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: Do you know who Nancy Grie when.
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: Kidnapping? What were you thinking?
• 40:04
  Speaker 8: What about anything?
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: Follow the front porch video emerged? What can we learn
• 40:21
  Speaker 1: from this video?
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: How did this person get in? How did they exit?
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: I'm wondering if there had to be two people.
• 40:27
  Speaker 3: I think this is going to be the tip of
• 40:29
  Speaker 3: the iceberg. We're going to see more and we're going
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: to have a better idea as to what's happened.
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: We'll be back to the glove in a moment regarding
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: the possibility of getting d n A from the gloves
• 40:41
  Speaker 1: and her fingerprints. But I want you to look at
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: a conundrum that we observed after a careful inspection of
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: the photos of the guy on the porch, as we
• 40:52
  Speaker 1: call him. In one clip, in one frame grab, he
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: is wearing a backpack and another he's not. Let's see
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: those now. This tells me a lot. This tells me
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: that very likely somewhere there was a car. We don't
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: see the backpack laying around. Where is it and where
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: did he come from? Okay, Dave Matt Crime Story's investigative reporter,
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: way in.
• 41:24
  Speaker 3: Nancy, that's been the big question.
• 41:26
  Speaker 6: One thing I've noticed, as you see this guy walking
• 41:29
  Speaker 6: up towards the walkway, right, he's kind of got this
• 41:33
  Speaker 6: odd gait, kind of loping as he comes into frame,
• 41:36
  Speaker 6: and then once he knows he's in camera frame distance,
• 41:40
  Speaker 6: he stops, ducks his head and starts with a different
• 41:43
  Speaker 6: kind of a shuffle, and I think see we see
• 41:46
  Speaker 6: him coming from somewhere and you see him loping. And
• 41:48
  Speaker 6: that's why I said, this guy's been here before.
• 41:49
  Speaker 3: He knows what's going on.
• 41:51
  Speaker 6: In knows is where the camera is the angled because
• 41:54
  Speaker 6: he comes at an angle and immediately drops his head.
• 41:58
  Speaker 6: So was his vehicle park down the street? Was it parked,
• 42:03
  Speaker 6: you know, a street over? You know, it's interesting that
• 42:06
  Speaker 6: we've had some sightings of vehicles in the neighborhood. Maybe
• 42:12
  Speaker 6: there was a rehearsal parking in a certain area and walking.
• 42:16
  Speaker 6: I mean, we just don't know because we're not getting
• 42:19
  Speaker 6: that info from law enforcement at this point. But he
• 42:21
  Speaker 6: had to come from somewhere. He wasn't walking around at
• 42:25
  Speaker 6: one forty five in the morning just out for a
• 42:27
  Speaker 6: stroll to you know, get to this location.
• 42:31
  Speaker 3: He had to be nearby.
• 42:32
  Speaker 6: And then Nancy, they still have to get they I
• 42:35
  Speaker 6: think they're talking to people too. We only have one
• 42:37
  Speaker 6: on video, But I don't see how you're going to
• 42:39
  Speaker 6: get an eighty four year old, fairly immobile woman out
• 42:44
  Speaker 6: on your own. This guy doesn't look like he could
• 42:46
  Speaker 6: handle her by himself and maintain control. Her cane is
• 42:50
  Speaker 6: left in the house. You have to her out of
• 42:53
  Speaker 6: the home by either walking with her or carrying her,
• 42:57
  Speaker 6: and that's going to take two people.
• 42:59
  Speaker 3: So where is the vehicle?
• 43:01
  Speaker 6: Was the other person waiting in the vehicle until this
• 43:04
  Speaker 6: guy was able to disable the cameras?
• 43:07
  Speaker 3: We don't know, but he had to be somewhere.
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, that eagle eye Jackie here
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: on the set. Notice, let's see that double photo again. Please,
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: Not only is he missing a backpack? Where's the gun? Okay?
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: Iker former FBI? What about it? Here at my radio
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: producer Jackie had to school the FBI cellular Annaly's a
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: survey team founding member? What about that founding member?
• 43:51
  Speaker 5: She's exactly right. I did notice that in the photos
• 43:54
  Speaker 5: comparison when you showed him up. I'm like, where's the
• 43:56
  Speaker 5: gun and where's the backpack? So where is this later
• 44:00
  Speaker 5: after he's.
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: Put him up? I ker, yes, ma'am, you noticed it,
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: but you just wanted to keep a special secret and
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: not say anything about it.
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: I can keep it, believe it.
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: So what do you make of it? The backpack's not
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: there and the gun's not there?
• 44:23
  Speaker 5: Right, So is this a later time frame? And then
• 44:26
  Speaker 5: that did he's already has been in the house. Now
• 44:28
  Speaker 5: he's moving things around, maybe walking her to a bar
• 44:31
  Speaker 5: or something like that, and doesn't need the gun in
• 44:33
  Speaker 5: the back.
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: He's not walking her anywhere. He's on his way walking
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: back in. Look at the picture. Where's the gun? Where's
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: the backpack?
• 44:42
  Speaker 4: What?
• 44:43
  Speaker 1: Let's analyze.
• 44:43
  Speaker 2: You put it?
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: What else can do you put it?
• 44:45
  Speaker 2: You put it somewhere? Right?
• 44:46
  Speaker 5: Did he leave it in the house while he's moving
• 44:48
  Speaker 5: things around, or did he take it to the car and.
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: Now he's keeping that? Hey, iker, look at the photo
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: on the left and look at the photo on the right.
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: When I was looking at them, at the photo on
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: the right, I thought, wait, is that the backpack over
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: there to the right under that palmetto plant? It's not
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: that is the pot a pot for a plant? Because
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: if you look at the picture on the left, you
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: see two of them. The picture on the left really
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: shows me the background a lot better. If there was
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: a vehicle, I'm sure he parked it away from the home.
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: But wait a minute, that really doesn't make sense. If
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: he's leading her to the vehicle, he would park as
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: close as possible.
• 45:29
  Speaker 5: Right, agreed, agreed, Unless he brings the car around. If
• 45:33
  Speaker 5: there's more than one person. We've got a lot of
• 45:35
  Speaker 5: different scenarios going on here.
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: Another thing, photo on the left. Keep the photo on
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: the left when he drove away. If he went in
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: that direction, that cam may have caught it up. Of course,
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: then he took the cam down, which leads me to
• 45:53
  Speaker 1: another question. Iker. If he removed the cam, would it
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: have kept recording? Is that possible?
• 46:03
  Speaker 5: It's possible if it has its own power source. I
• 46:07
  Speaker 5: have ness cameras and they don't have their own power source.
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: They don't have a battery in them.
• 46:12
  Speaker 5: They have to be plugged in, and as we saw
• 46:15
  Speaker 5: from them removing that camera on the roof, there was
• 46:19
  Speaker 5: a solar panel that gave it the power it needed.
• 46:22
  Speaker 5: Other cameras are hardwired, all minor hardwired, so they have
• 46:27
  Speaker 5: to have a power source. It's usually just the camera
• 46:30
  Speaker 5: and not any batteries in it. So once you take
• 46:32
  Speaker 5: it away, I think it's not going to record anything anymore.
• 46:36
  Speaker 1: M Okay. If it has batteries and you take it away,
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: would it keep recording?
• 46:40
  Speaker 5: Yes, it would for a small amount of time because
• 46:46
  Speaker 5: it's going to lose its Wi Fi connection once it
• 46:49
  Speaker 5: gets away from the house.
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: Okay, here's another question to you regarding the camera. Scott
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: Ker Guys, just so you know, like her is with
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: Precision Cellular Analysis handling criminal defense, civil cases and more
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: at PCA experts dot com and remember founding member of
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: the FBI Cellular Analysis Survey Team. They are the ones
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: responsible forgetting this video. And let me just put it
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: out there right now. Eric fattis joining me. Veteran trial lawyer. Eric.
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: At the beginning, the sheriff, who by the way, buried
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: the lead here, stated late last night that more detainments
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: are likely to occur quickly. He said that nanos. He also, however,
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: said that at the beginning, oh shucks, she doesn't she
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: doesn't have a subscription, no video. We sent it off
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: to blah blah blah and they couldn't pull anything up. Well,
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: blah blah. Law did a crap job because the Cellular
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: Analysis Survey team with the FBI got it after they
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: mined the vast, vast millions and millions of data points
• 48:14
  Speaker 1: from Google. That's a Nest cam. Look at the top right,
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: fattest of the photos. They all say Nest. Nancy Guthrie
• 48:22
  Speaker 1: had the Nest equipment in her home. Google owns Nest,
• 48:28
  Speaker 1: it's all Google. So they either got a court order
• 48:32
  Speaker 1: or a subpoena or a subpoena ducas tacum, or a
• 48:36
  Speaker 1: plain old search warrant is my guess, or Google may
• 48:39
  Speaker 1: have given permission. That said, they weighed through millions of
• 48:44
  Speaker 1: data points, and out of all that a CEE a
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: sea of information they find Nancy Guthrie's porch cam and
• 48:54
  Speaker 1: managed to get this. My point is at the beginning,
• 48:58
  Speaker 1: Fattest Nano says, darny, darn, darn, no video, what about it?
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: Can I trust what he's saying? Now that more detainments
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: are about to happen.
• 49:10
  Speaker 7: Sir Nancy, I thought it was peculiar than the video
• 49:12
  Speaker 7: took so long to be obtained and get public. Usually
• 49:16
  Speaker 7: in these investigations they have it within the same day.
• 49:19
  Speaker 7: You can go to Google, like you said, with a
• 49:21
  Speaker 7: search warrant, production of records requests and they have to
• 49:24
  Speaker 7: respond to that. In addition, there were some scene containment
• 49:27
  Speaker 7: issues and and the STYFF has been criticized for that,
• 49:30
  Speaker 7: and so there have been some missteps, as I mentioned,
• 49:32
  Speaker 7: in this investigation, and I'm not sure the public has
• 49:35
  Speaker 7: full of faith in law enforcement conducting the investigation and
• 49:39
  Speaker 7: reaching an ultimate outcome and finding a suspect here.
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: We also heard from Cash Betail stating as late as
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: last night there are persons of interest, so iker I
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: took us down the garden path there. But regarding the camera,
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: Scott doorcam, it's a ring gives me audio. I can
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: hear what the person is saying, I can hear everything.
• 50:08
  Speaker 1: I can hear the dog barking, can hear everything. Is
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: there audio that we have yet to hear?
• 50:15
  Speaker 2: It's a good possibility.
• 50:17
  Speaker 5: I have several cameras at my house, but only two
• 50:19
  Speaker 5: of them provide sound, So it really depends on which
• 50:23
  Speaker 5: camera that was you at that front door on if
• 50:26
  Speaker 5: it had a sound ability, I'm not sure we would
• 50:30
  Speaker 5: have heard very much of him walking up to that house.
• 50:32
  Speaker 5: But you never know what was possibility there. And I
• 50:36
  Speaker 5: did confirm that cast was once. It kind of worked
• 50:39
  Speaker 5: with Google and obtained this video, and it did take
• 50:43
  Speaker 5: a while because Google had to do a lot of
• 50:46
  Speaker 5: searching and had have the right parameters to get this stuff.
• 50:49
  Speaker 5: So Gus was definitely integral part in that aspect, as
• 50:53
  Speaker 5: in the stopping of the Gentleman a couple of days
• 50:56
  Speaker 5: ago or last night, that was later released that there's
• 51:00
  Speaker 5: one hundred percent possibility that that's cast looking at the
• 51:04
  Speaker 5: tower dump information and seeing that sub that individual's phone
• 51:10
  Speaker 5: come into the area, stayed for a little bit, and leave,
• 51:13
  Speaker 5: And that's exactly what they're looking for in those tower
• 51:16
  Speaker 5: dumps is phones that are not stationary like neighbor's phones
• 51:20
  Speaker 5: or Nancy's phones. They're looking for phones that came in
• 51:23
  Speaker 5: and left around that time that they believed she disappeared.
• 51:26
  Speaker 5: So there's going to be a lot more of those
• 51:29
  Speaker 5: little detainments, just trying to figure out who was allowed
• 51:33
  Speaker 5: to be there or had a reason to be there,
• 51:35
  Speaker 5: and then hopefully narrow down to our suspect.
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: The following me, Yeah, they're following me Marana County and
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: Rana was down here. It's like, come on two and two.
• 51:47
  Speaker 1: And so then when they when they came up on you,
• 51:50
  Speaker 1: what do they.
• 51:50
  Speaker 3: Say, looking, looking, looking, They just told me, what's your name?
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: Gods that's equally in the cop car. Wait two hours
• 52:01
  Speaker 2: in this year anything.
• 52:04
  Speaker 1: As Savannah herself stated, the hour of desperation. With every
• 52:09
  Speaker 1: minute that passes, the hour becomes even more despairing. If
• 52:15
  Speaker 1: you know or think you know anything about Nancy Guthrie's disappearance.
• 52:19
  Speaker 1: Please call one eight hundred two two five five three
• 52:23
  Speaker 1: two four toll free eight hundred two two five five
• 52:27
  Speaker 1: three two four, or if you wish to remain anonymous,
• 52:32
  Speaker 1: dial five two zero eight eight two seven four six
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: three repeat five two zero eight eight, two seven four
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: six three. We remember an American hero, Lieutenant Shirley Lanning,
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: Canadian County Sheriff's Oklahoma, killed in the line of duty
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: after thirty years serving and protecting, leaving behind her grieving husband.
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: American herout in it. Shirley Lanning Nancy Grace signing off
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: goodbye friend,