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Mega Edition: Bryan Kohberger And The Knife Authorties Say He Used During The Murders (8/13/26) · Beyond The Horizon

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome back to the program. In
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: this episode, we're gonna dive right back into the Moscow
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: murders and a little bit more about the evidence that
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: they have against Brian Coberger and the piece of evidence
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: that the police and the prosecutors definitely wish that they
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: could have recovered. So let's just dive right in and
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: let's see what Newsweek has for us. Headline, the missing
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: Brian Coberger evidence that could make or break the trial.
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: This article was authored by Sean O'Driscoll. They were found
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: lifeless together on the bed Kelly Gonsalvez and her best
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: friend Madison Matty Mogan, both twenty one, and on another
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: floor of the Moscow, Idaho house, police found the bodies
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: of two other students, Xana Kernodle twenty and Kernodle's boyfriend
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: Ethan Chapin, twenty Now. An expert told Newsweek there is
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: one piece of evidence missing that could make or break
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: the Mogan was leaning on Gonsalva's shoulder. Gonsalves had been
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: having a sleepover in Mogan's third floor room on the
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: night of November thirteenth, twenty twenty two, when an unknown
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: killers stab both women to death. On the bed. Beside
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: their bodies, Moscow police officer Brett Paine noticed a tan
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: leather knife sheath with a drop of blood on the
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: button snap. That drop of blood is now central to
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: the case against Brian Colberger, who has been charged with
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: all four murders at the student's house on King Road,
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: and that knife sheath is the glue that ties all
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: of the evidence in its totality together, and that's why
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: Brian Colberger's team has been so adamant to get it
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: all thrown out. They know that this is the evidence
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: that will sink their client, and they know that the
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: sheath is the biggest piece of evidence that the police
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: have the rest of this evidence. If it wasn't for
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: the sheath, I'd be much more inclined to look at
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: it as nothing more than circumst angel Now, even without
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: the knife sheath in the totality of the evidence, it's
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: a lot, but not enough to get a conviction in
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: my opinion. But once you add his DNA to the
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: knife sheath, and this sheath is found next to the
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: two dead girls, well what should we think? I guess
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: you can come up with whatever reasoning you want. For
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: how that knife sheet got there, But remember, you're gonna
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: have to explain that to a jury. The sheath itself
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: is a vital clue. It had k bar USMC and
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: the United States Marine Corps Eagle Globe and Anchor insignia
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: stamped on the outside of it. Officer Payne wrote in
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: a signed statement submitted in court, please speculate that the
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: killer may have been startled to find two women in
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: the bed, and that Gonsalves may have put up a
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: fight during which the killer was slightly injured and dropped
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: the knife sheath in the confusion. And this is the
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: first we're hearing about that. But that's what I've been
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: saying for quite some time. I think that Colberger thought
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: he was going to show up at this house and
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: it was just gonna be Maddie in that bed, and
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: he was surprised to find Kaylee there, and things spun
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: out of control. And that's why you see the quote
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: unquote overkill on Kayley because he was mad that she
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: interrupted his time with Madison Mogen. Now obviously that's my speculation, right,
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't have access to the reports.
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: I'm not there behind the scenes, but when we look
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: at all of the evidence we have, and we look
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: at what we know, that seems to be the likeliest
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: of outcomes. A housemate downstairs, frozen with fear, saw a
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: man wearing a COVID mask over his mouth walk by
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: her and leave the house via the glass door at
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: the back. He was a white male with bushy eyebrows.
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: He wasn't muscular, she told the police, but was slim
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: and athletic. Now there's people that say he was wearing
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: a ski mask, and I had never heard that from
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: any official source. I always assumed that he was just
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: wearing a surgeon And if that's the case, he was
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: just wearing a surgical mask. You could see how Dylan
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: Mortensen could have mistaken him for somebody that was their partying,
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: like has been speculated about in the past. You know,
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: the roommates were having a party, and she thought that
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: this was somebody just leaving the party. My guess is
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: we're gonna learn a whole lot more come trial time.
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: According to Paine's legal submissions, police immediately began a troll
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: of CCTV footage in the area and very quickly focused
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: on a white car speeding down the street. Very soon
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: after the murder. Officer Payne said he knew the Moscow
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: street where the murders took place, and knew that it
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: was quiet and would rarely have traffic on it in
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: the early hours of the morning. And that's definitely a
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: pitfall if you're trying to commit a crime in a
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: small town. There's not that much traffic to blend into.
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: When they put all the video together, a picture began
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: to emerge. The car had no front number plate, which
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: is acquired by law in Idaho but not in some
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: other states, such as Pennsylvania. The police took the video
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: footage to an FBI officer who specializes in identifying vehicles.
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: Not only was the officer an expert on types and
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: makes the vehicles, but he also knew that there was
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: regional differences in the same make of the car. Sometimes
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: a certain part may be used for cars sold in
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: one part of America but not in another. The FBI
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: agent initially identified the car as a Hondai a Lantra
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: made between twenty eleven and twenty fourteen, but after reviewing
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: the footage over and over looking for small clues, he
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: expanded his range from twenty eleven to twenty sixteen. While
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: he was doing that, Moscow police were studying the likely
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: journey the car took after the murders. The car turned
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: onto several other streets and then disappeared from CCTV footage
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: that led them to believe it had turned onto a
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: rat that would lead the driver to a road to
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: Pullman in Washington State, another college town about ten minutes
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: down the road. So when we were talking about them
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: building a digital profile and a digital footprint, this is
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: what I was talking about. They went back and recreated
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: just about every step of Brian Coberger's day that they could.
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: As Officer Payne observed, there were strong ties between the
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: two towns and students often traveled from one town to
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: another to see each other. With that, the massive police
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: search moved to Pullman. A search of the CCTV footage
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: from the college in Pullman and a private residence front
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: porch shows a white Alantra showing up about ten minutes
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: after the suspects of Lantra left Moscow. It drived through
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: several Pullman streets before disappearing from view. Eventually, a Pullman
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: police officer identified a white Alantra belonging to student Brian Cohberger,
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: originally from Pennsylvania. From the driveway, the officer could see
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: that the car had no front license plate. Officer Payne
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: ran a computer search and from Coburger's driver's license photo
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: could see that he was a slim, white male with
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: bushy eyebrows. He also pulled Coburger's phone number from the
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: police computer. Coburger had been stopped for speeding in Moscow
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: and his phone number was in their computer system. From there,
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: the phone company was able to provide phone tower records,
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: which can tell police where a person has traveled. To
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: the police's dismay, the phone showed no record of being
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: near the murder house that night. Pain believed Coburger could
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: have left the phone in Pullman, where it had earlier
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: pinged the local phone towers, or he may have switched
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: it to airplane mode and brought it with him to Moscow.
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: Either way, Pain believed it pointed to someone who knew
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: how to avoid detection. Colburger was placed under covert police
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: and FBI surveillance, and they discovered that he would be
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: traveling back to Pennsylvania in his line. Several teams were
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: instructed to follow him across America and never let him
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: out of their sight. And remember, during this time, there
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: was talk that the surveillance had lost Coburger for a
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: significant period of time while he was traveling from Washington
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: back to Pennsylvania. But then the FBI came out and
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: they refuted that. In an incident that is still clouded
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: in mystery, a traffic policeman stopped Coburger's car and spoke
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: with him briefly. The officer was wearing a body cam,
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: and Officer Pain was quickly able to review the video
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: footage and establish that Coburger had bushy eyebrows. It was
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: important for police to see what he looked like in
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: real life and not simply rely on a driver license photo.
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: We still don't know if this was a genuine police
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: stop or given the speed with which the bodycam footage
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: was recovered, a police ploy to get closer and get
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: a look at Coburger. I'd say it was probably a ploy,
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: but they're not going to come out and admit that
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: the knife sheathed blood came back from DNA analysis and
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: it was from AMEL. The police still didn't have Coburger's
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: DNA to compare to the knife sheathed blood drop and
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: didn't want to arouse Coburger's suspicion, especially as they wanted
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: to see if he would dispose of the knife somewhere
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: on the drive across America. As far as they could tell,
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: he didn't. He got rid of that knife on the
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: way home from the murders, point blank period. There is
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: no doubt in my mind. I've said this from the
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: very beginning. This man had a burn pit. He got
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: rid of a bunch of evidence, and my guess is
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: that evidence included the knife and whatever sort of plastic
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: covering he had in his car. After the murders. When
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: he was back at the family home in Pennsylvania, he
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: remained under twenty four hour surveillance, and police saw him
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: empty out the trash in the early hours of the morning.
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: When he went back into the house, they carefully sifted
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: through the garbage. There was no knife or anything incriminating.
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: Lab technicians did, however, extract the DNA sample from a
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: food sample in the trash. The lab results showed that
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: Coburger's father could not be excluded as the source of
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: the DNA. That may not sound significant, but ninety nine
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: point nine nine nine nine percent of all people could
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: be excluded from the sample. Police were satisfied it was
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: Coburger's father's DNA. From there, police found that there was
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: a family link to the Idaho blood drop. Whoever spilled
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: his own blood in Mogan's room was an offspring of
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: Coburger's father. Coburger was soon arrested and remains in detention. However,
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: there are still significant gaps in the investigation, and Coburger
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: is entitled to a presumption of innocence one hundred percent
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: by the court. There's no rule governing any of us
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: when it comes to our opinions on a court case.
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: So while of course Brian Koberger deserves to have a trial,
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: deserves his day in court, I'm not going to sit
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: here and act like I don't think he's guilty just
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: because he has the presumption of innocence. That's the presumption
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: in a courtroom, not the presumption in society. Police are
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: still stuck on a major question. Where is the knife
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: that was used to commit the murders? Nobody knows? Documents
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: released last week showed that police had been seeking all
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: of Coburger's search records for the word knife, all of
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: his wish lists on online shopping sites and all of
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: his online purchases in the hope of finding that he
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: purchased a knife that matches the sheath found in the
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: Idaho murder house. So if they just find that he
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: purchased this knife, it'll go a long way. Now, it's
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: not as good as having the actual knife, but if
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: they can show the jury that this knife was actually
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: purchased by Brian Coberger, it will go a long way.
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: With the other evidence that they have to get the
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: conviction that they want. Amazon and other tech companies have
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: handed over records, and those are now stored in the
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: Moscow Police Department. Their contents are not yet publicly known.
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: Throughout month after month of this intense forensic investigation, Coburger
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: has stayed silent. He has not spoken to police in
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: interviews and didn't enter a plea when asked to do
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: so in court. Instead, a not guilty plea was entered
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: on his behalf by the Idaho court. According to former
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: federal prosecutor Nemo Rochmani, who is now president of West
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: Coast Trial Lawyers, the lack of murder weapon does not
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: sink the case against Coburger. No, it does not, and
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: that's because they have the sheath with the DNA on it.
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: Prosecutors would love to have the murder weapon, especially any
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: DNA on it, but it's not fatal to their case.
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: They'll argue that Coburger is more sophisticated than your typical
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: accused murderer and probably disposed of it somehow. ROCKMANI told Newsweek, Yeah,
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: I agree, and my guess is they're going to have
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: something along the lines of the same speculation that I have,
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: the fact that he had a burn pit and that
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: he got rid of this on the ride home. He
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: also said that Coburger's likely silence at trial may work
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: against them, even though he is legally entitled not to speak.
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: Even though jurors are instructed that they can infer guilt
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: from a defendant silence implicity, it may have an effect.
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: That's why we're seeing a trend with more defendants taking
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: the stand, particularly in high profile cases like Elizabeth Holmes
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: and Alec Murda. He said, how'd that work out for
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: both of them? Correct me if I'm wrong, But are
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: both of them in prison or no? And that's exactly
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: where Brian Coberger is heading in my opinion, Unless there's
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: some new evidence that pops up or they can prove
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: that there was prosecutorial misconduct short of that happening. I
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: don't see how Brian Cohberger is going to wiggle off
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: this hook. But we're gonna be here every step of
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: the way as this continues to unfold all the way
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: through Brian Kohberger's trial. All right, folks, that's gonna do
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: it for this one. If you'd like to contact me,
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: you can do that at Bobby Kopuchi at Protonmeil dot com.
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: That's Bobby capu Cci at Proton. All of the information
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: that we discussed can be found in the description. Box's up, everyone,
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: and welcome back to the program. The situation in Idaho
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: is evolving, and the police are releasing a little bit
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: of information this morning about the sort of knife that
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: they think was used at this murder scene. And I'm
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: sure most of you are familiar with the knife that
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: they're saying this person might have used, and that knife
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: is the Rambo style knife. You know, the k bar
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: knife has the serrated edge on one side, straight edge
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: on the other you could open it up. It has
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: like a compass on the back of it, you know,
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: has like matches inside of it, basically like a survivalist knife.
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: And if you ever saw the Rambo movies, then you
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: know exactly what I'm talking about. That's the kind of
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: knife that the police are saying might have been used here.
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: So we have an update to the case. Basically, just
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: hot across the wire. As I walked into the studio
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: this morning, this article happened to pop up, So I
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: figured we'd dive right in, get right to it this
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: morning and see where things stand today. This article is
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: from the New York Post, the headline police seek Rambo
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: style knife in probe of Idaho student murders. This article
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: was authored by Yarren Steinbuck. Police investigating the brutal slaughter
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: of four University of Idaho students appear to be searching
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: for a Rambo style knife in the slayings. A local
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: store owner said, So, that's interesting. If they're looking for
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: that sort of knife, you would think that they looked
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: at the body obviously, the bodies obviously forensically, and perhaps
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: traced it back due to the wounds on the bodies.
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: Be my guest, right, unless of course, they have some
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: sort of information about who this person might be. Moscow
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: building supply general manager Scott Judy told The Idaho Statesman
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: that a police officer stopped by the retailer more than
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: once this week to inquire about a possible sale of
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: a k Bar brand combat blade. So that's interesting. I
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: wonder what led them to look for this specific kind
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: of knife. Obviously it wasn't just you know, on a whim.
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: The investigators didn't wake up today and say, oh, well,
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: but I think it's a k Bar knife. There has
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: to be something that led them down this path. They
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: were specifically asking whether or not we carry k Bar
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: style knives, which we do not. Judy told the paper.
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: If we did, we could have reviewed surveillance footage. But
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: it wasn't something I could help them with. So this
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: is a pretty common kind of knife. Could have been
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: purchased anywhere out of state at a local place, could
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: have been purchased, you know, secondhand, whatever. But it's a
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: relatively common knife, he said. The tactical knives used by
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: a US Marines and then nineteen forties are similar to
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: the knife Rambo has, Judy said, referring to the Vietnam
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: Vet character famously played by actor Sylvester Stallone, k Bar
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: is more of a combat knife. It's not really something
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: that we specialize in. At A judy who set his
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: store sells mostly hunting knives. So there's a difference, I guess,
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: between blades, right, each of these blades has a purpose.
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: One knife that's a hunting knife, obviously easier to skin
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: an animal with and gut an animal. And then you
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: have a k bar which is more of a utilitarian
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: type of knife, you know, survivalist knife. You have different
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: things that you can do with it, the serrated blade, lets,
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: you saw some wood, maybe you know all of that.
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: But this gentleman they specialize in hunting knives, where the
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: knives have basically a singular purpose. On its website, Kbar
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: of Olean, New York describes its signature blade as its
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: most famous knife. The knives became so well recognized for
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: their quality and so a bun in number that k
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: Bar became the name by which many referred to this
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: knife pattern, regardless to whether the knife was manufactured by
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: the actual k Bar facility. It says, and I remember
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: as a kid, I had one of these knives, well
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: you know, teenager or whatever. But it was a cool
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: ass knife, you know, I had the compass on it.
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: Thought you were a g I'd go out on my
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: little camping trips and all of a sudden, I thought
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: I was Rambo. Today, the original United States Marine Corps
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: Fighting and Utility knife remains the first choice for many
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: men and women of service who carry it as their
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: personal knife option, the company adds. On Wednesday, Moscow Police
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: Captain Anthony Dallinger would neither confirm nor deny to The
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: Statesman that investigators from the department visited the store or
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: interviewed Judy. I can't speak to that. I don't have
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: any new information to share, he told the paper. Police
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: did not respond to requests for comment on Thursday, and
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: they're not going to They've been very close to the
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: vest thus far, and I expect them to remain that
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: way until they have something to share with us. And
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: I'm not saying I agree with that, but certainly seems
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: to be the way that most of these departments are
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: operating these days. News about the knife comes after a
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: Moscow Chief James Fry, provided an update about the shocking crime,
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: saying a murder weapon has not yet been found. The
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: murders of Ethan Chapmin twenty Madison Mogan twenty one Xana
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: Kernodle twenty and Kaylee Gonkalbas twenty one rocked the school
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: community and prompted many students to vacate campus ahead of
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: Thanksgiving break. No suspect or motive has been determined in
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: the slayings, and that's what really is so scary for people.
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: You know, you have students here who you know, they
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: don't know what's going on. The police say at first, oh,
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: there's no threat to the community. Then they walk that back.
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: So if you're a student here or a parent of
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: one of these students, I would think that the best
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: idea is to bring your kid home until they could
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: figure out what's going on here. Now I'm not saying
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: that we have some kind of you know, psycho serial
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: killer on the loose, but whoever's on the loose, whoever
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: did this, is certainly a deranged individual, and anyone who
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: is capable of killing four people is certainly somebody that
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: I would say anyway, is a threat to the commute
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: duty was. Meanwhile, it has emerged that another incident involving
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: a knife at the University of Idaho occurred in September,
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: when campus security sent out a so called vandal alert
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: to staff in students, Fox News reported, So in September,
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: we get this report here about somebody on the campus
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: brandishing a knife, threatening people. Person isn't arrested. Then fast
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: forward to November, a couple of months later, and we
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: have four people murdered with a knife on the same campus.
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: I'm not Sherlock Holmes or anything, but that seems like
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: something that definitely needs to be investigated. Using subject line
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: threat with knife. The alert from September twelfth thread, the
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: Moscow Police Department received a report that a group of
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: students was walking between the steam planted parking lot lot
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: number fourteen and the Student Recreation Center on Paradise Path
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: and were threatened by a person with a knife. According
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: to the news outlet, no individual was harmed in the incident,
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: but campus community members are advised to be cautious, added
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: the alert, which a concerned parent shared with Fox News Digital.
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: So again, there's no correlation, really, you can't, you know,
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: nothing solid that connects these two incidents. But if you
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: have somebody who was brandishing a knife on the campus
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: and then this happens, it certainly has to be something
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: that the investigators keep in mind, right that they go
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: over that they look at and maybe try and figure
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: out who this person was surveillance whatever. The suspect was
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: described as a man between the ages of eighteen and
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: twenty two, wearing black clothes and a black baseball cap
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: and riding a mountain bike. Police declined to comment the
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: Fox News about the incident, whether the suspect was caught,
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: or whether the incident could be connected to the gruesome
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: murder that occurred about a mile away. And when the
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: cops are so hesitant to give information out, it really
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: causes chaos in the community. Just take a look at
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: what people in this community are saying about not having
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: the proper information. How it's causing chaos, It's causing more fear,
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: and I don't think that that's a great way to
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: go about it, right. Be transparent. Obviously, you hide the
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: stuff that is going to help your investigation, but be
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: as transparent as possible. We have four young people murdered here.
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: People want answers, And again we're talking about a place Moscow,
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: where there is hardly ever anything like this to happen.
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: In the earlier episode, we were talking about how there
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: hasn't been anything like this in a while. In Moscow.
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: So out of the blue, four people get murdered. Yeah,
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: the community is going to have some answers, and they're
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: going to expect a certain level of transparency from the police.
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: I have no information on that at this time, Dallinger
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: told Fox News Digital, which set. A school spokesperson didn't
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: immediately return request for comment. In his update Wednesday, Fry
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: said two roommates were inside the off campus home where
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: the four students were found dead, and that nine to
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: one one call wasn't made until hours later. You know,
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: that just is so weird to me. They're gonna have
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: to explain that how could there be students, there are
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: other people there and not hear what happened. I would
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: think that if somebody's getting stabbed to death, there would
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: be some sounds, right, screaming and yelling, the signs of
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: a fight. But according to police, there was no forced entry,
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: meaning either the door was open or the perpetrators had
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: access to the home one way or the other. So
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: it wasn't like someone kicked the door in. Maybe they
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: left the door unlocked when they came home from the
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: bar or eating. In a small town like this, I
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: could see that I have family in a small town
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: in New York, and forever nobody locked the doors in
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: this little play in this little town, so I could
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: definitely see that in Moscow. He also backtracked about how
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: concerned the community should be about an ongoing threat after
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: authorities originally said the public was not in danger following
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: the quadruple homicide. Well, I don't know about all that,
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: and I said earlier how reckless I thought that was,
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: And I still think it's reckless to say that you
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: don't know if there's a threat to the community. How
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: do you know what this person's capable of. You don't
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: even know who they are, So how can you get
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: up here with any confidence and say to the community
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: as a whole, Hey, don't worry, there's no threat here.
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: So that's definitely a ridiculous statement in my opinion, and
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: hopefully they'll watch their words moving forward. But either way,
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: I just wanted to make sure we were up to
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: date with what was going on here and that there
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: was an incident in September. Now are they connected? Who knows?
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: But like usual, more meat to the bone, more context.
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: That way we can see the whole story as it evolves.
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: All right, folks, that's going to do it for this one.
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: If you'd like to contact me, you can do that
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: at Bobby Capuci at ProtonMail dot com. That's bo Bby
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: c ap you Cci at ProtonMail dot com. You can
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: also find me on Twitter at Bobby Underscore cap Ucci.
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: The link that I discussed can be found in the
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: description box. What's up everyone, and welcome back to the program. Recently,
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: we had a report out from Howard Bloom and in
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: that report he was talking about the knife sheath and
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: how the Idaho forensic Lab didn't find anything on that sheath,
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: so the lab in Moscow had to send the sheath
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: out to a different lab in Texas, and that has
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: been presented as being a bit of a problem for
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: the prosecution. Well, if you look at the actual warrant itself,
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: it says in the warrant that they can send it
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: to any lab or laboratory that they deem fit. So
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: I don't see how this is an issue really. And
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: if we're talking about the lab in Moscow, well we
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: know they're not equipped to deal with stuff like this,
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: and especially with the FBI being involved, you know that
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: they're going to have access to all kinds of other labs,
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: all kinds of technology that they wouldn't have access to otherwise.
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: So they're going to be able to utilize laboratories all
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: over the country to try and help them get this conviction.
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: And remember all of that has been okayed by the court,
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: so Judge Marshall has already said and signed off on
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: the investigators being able to send this evidence wherever they want.
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: So as long as the chain of custody is respected,
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: I don't see being that big of an issue. Now.
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: If the chain of custody was broken and there's some
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: kind of issue with the chain of custody, well I
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: could see that popping up and biting the prosecution in
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: the pants. But besides that, I don't see this being
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: an issue. And if this is the kind of stuff
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: that Brian Colberger's team is going to rely on for
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: his defense, they're as good as finished. Because there's one
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: fact that is indisputable, and that fact is that the
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: DNA was found on the sheath at this lab in Texas.
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: So I don't know how his defense is going to
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: challenge that unless they can say that the chain of
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: custody was broken. Now, if they can prove that the
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: chain of custody was broken, then they might have something
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: to go on. But besides that, I think this story
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: about the knife sheath is pretty much going nowhere. So
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: let's dive into this article from Newsweek and let's see
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: what Kalido Rockman has for US. Headline, knife sheath scrutiny
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: not a big deal in the Coburger case, XFB agent.
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: Like I said, this article was authored by Kalita Rockman
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: reports that a knife sheath found that the scene where
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: four University of Idaho students were murdered was sent out
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: of state for testing. Won't be a big deal, according
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: to a former FBI agent, And I agree with that,
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: like I said in the opening, because the language and
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: the warrant explicitly states that they can send this stuff
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: out of state or wherever they want to the fricking
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: moon if they have to to get confirmation and to
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: get it analyzed. So as long as the chain of
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: custody was respected and not broken, it should not be
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: an issue. Brian Cohberger, twenty eight, is charged in the
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: deaths of Kailee Gonsalves, Madison Mogan, Xana Kernodle, and Ethan Chapin.
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: The four were found stabbed to death in a rental
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: home near the university campus in Moscow on November thirteenth. Coburger,
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: then a graduate student at Washington State University in Pullman,
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: was arrested at his parents home home in Pennsylvania on
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: December thirtieth. According to a probable cause AFFID David, investigators
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: connected him to the crime after matching DNA from a knife.
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: Sheath found that the scene to Coburger's father's DNA, which
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: was recovered from trash outside the family's home. And remember,
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: they did something called a trash pull in Pennsylvania, And
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: what that is is when they sit on somebody's house
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: or somebody's business, wait for them to throw something in
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: the trash, and then they'll go into that trash and
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: try and pull evidence from the garbage and refuse that
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: the person who was their target was throwing out. And
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: a lot of times they'll do that by matching it
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: to DNA, and that's how they were eventually led to
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: Brian Coburger. Coburger has not yet entered a plea to
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: four counts a first degree murder and one count of
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: felony burglary, but a lawyer who previously represented him said
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: that he was eager to be exonerated. A preliminary hearing
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: is set to to begin on June twenty sixth, and
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: we know that at that hearing we have roughly five
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: days that have been put aside for the start of
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: the hearing here and then from there we'll learn a
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: lot more when the child's going to be, how long
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: it might be. All of that stuff will come into
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: focus a little bit better after we get to the
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: prelim portion in June, because as of right now, we're
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: pretty much in a holding pattern. Right we have the
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: gag order that is draped over the case. So besides
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: following along with the blueprint of the court documents, there's
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: really nothing coming from official channels. So we have to
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: try and put two and two together and hopefully we
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: arrive at four. But the prelimbs starting in June, that's
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: going to tell us quite the tale, and it's going
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: to be very very interesting to find out what we
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: learn come June twenty sixth. Journalist Howard Bloom, who is
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: working on a book about the murders, recently reported that
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: the knife sheath was sent out of Idaho to be
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: tested at a startup in Texas because initial testing at
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: the lab in Idaho could not find anything on it. Well,
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: the lab in Moscow doesn't specialize in this sort of work. Now,
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: the lab that they sent it to in Texas, they
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: usually only work on cold cases. However, in this instance
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: they accepted the evidence from an active case and were
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: able to go back and trace the DNA that was
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: on the sheath all the way back to Brian Coldberger's father. Remember,
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: all of these laboratories aren't built the same, right, They
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: don't have all of the same technology or the same people,
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: perhaps you know, manning the labs. So if you have
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: to send it out to a specialist, then that's what
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: you have to do. Mark the lab had only been
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: used for cold cases before Moscow investigators sent the knife
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: sheath for testing, According to Bloom, Legal experts have said that,
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: if accurate, that detail could present a problem for the
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: prosecution and boost Coburger's defense. It's a problem for the
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: prosecution if the reports are accurate and the first lab
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: did not match the DNA to Coburger. Neamo Rochmani, an
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: attorney and former federal prosecutor, told Newsweek, see I don't
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: believe that, and the reason I don't believe that it's
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: going to be an issue, like I said in the opening,
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: is because of the language that we have seen inside
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: of the warrants. If the judge and the court is
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: giving the investigators that permission to send these pieces of
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: evidence out to be tested at any lab or laboratories,
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: remember the wording inside of every one of those warrants
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: that we've been through so far. Well, that's where it
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: comes into play, right. If the judge is saying that
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: it's acceptable, then that means it's acceptable. Now again, we
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: don't know about all of the little minutia in between.
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: We don't know about the chain of custody. We don't
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: know if somebody was smoking dope while they were looking
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: at the evidence. You know what I'm saying. We don't
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: know all of that. But what I do know is
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: the language in those warrants is not open for interpretation.
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: If the judge says and the court says that the
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: evidence can be shipped out to a different laboratory, then
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: the evidence can be shipped out to a different laboratory. However,
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: Jennifer Coffendaffer, a former FBI agent, doesn't believe it will
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: be a serious obstacle for the prosecution. The scientists will
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: explain how they drew the DNA evidence. And I just
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: don't think this is going to be the big deal
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: that it's being made of by mister Bloom, she said
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: on News Nation, and nobody here in this whole article
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: even mentions the fact that the language in the warrants
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: allows for this, So I don't understand what the big
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: beef is. Kofendaffer also said there will be other evidence,
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: including possibly DNA recovered from Coburger's HONDEI A lantra that
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: ties them to the crime. Well, we can't say that
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: definitively right. We think there is going to be more evidence,
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: and with a i'm seen like this, I mean chances
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: are there's going to be all kinds of DNA left over.
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: But we don't know for sure that Brian Kohberger, if
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: he's the man the government's telling us he is, left
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: any evidence. We just don't know that yet. Now we
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: have the knife sheath and they pulled some DNA from that,
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: but that's where it ends as far as what we know.
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: Everything else is just speculation and theory. There's going to
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: be much more DNA evidence and other evidence that's extracted
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: from that vehicle, she said, And my guess is that
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: there will be. But I don't know that for sure,
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: and neither does Jennifer Koffendatfur or anybody else. Now, it's
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: a safe bet to make to think that if there
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: was some DNA to be transferred after those murders, that
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: it certainly would have been transferred on his ride home.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: We know that he took the long route home, and
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: if he's sitting in the car and he's basically a
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: walking Petrie dish of DNA, you know that some of
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: that's going to get into the car, or at least
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: you would think that some of that's going to get
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: into the car. But I'm not willing to say definitively
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: one way or the other that they found evidence in
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: that car, because I don't know, and neither does Jennifer Kofendaffer.
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: In addition, we can't forget the knife or the phone pings,
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: we can't forget the video surveillance evidence. And I think
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: there is going to be a plethora of other evidence
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: that ties mister Coburger, but certainly that knife sheath is
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: very important. Well, there's no doubt that the knife sheath
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: is important. That's how they found Brian Coberger. So if
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: the defense can find a way to get rid of
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: that knife sheath as evidence, that would be a ginormous
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: win for the defense. Now, I don't think they'll be
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: able to do that, but they're probably going to challenge it.
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: What else do they have to lose? Right, we're talking
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: about a man who's literally fighting for his life talking
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: about Brian Colberger, So his defense they're gonna throw up
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: every hell Mary they can possibly come up with. And
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: if they can find a valid argument to go after
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: the knife sheath, so much the better for the defense.
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: Unfortunately for them, in my opinion, that's not gonna be
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: a pathway to victory, and the knife sheath and the
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: evidence that was drawn on the knife sheath will not
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: only be upheld, but will also end up being admissible
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: come trial time. All Right, folks, that's gonna do it
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: for this one. All of the information that goes with
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: the episode can be found in the description box.