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Female Firsts: Mabel Ping-Hua Lee · Stuff Mom Never Told You

0:05
Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha. I'm not going to
0:07
Speaker 1: stuff I've never told your protection of I heart radio
0:18
Speaker 1: and it's time for another female first, which means we
0:21
Speaker 1: are once again joined by our good friend, the wonderful,
0:24
Speaker 1: the amazing Eaves. My goodness, it's good to be good
0:33
Speaker 1: per usual. Yes, always good to have you. Anything interesting
0:37
Speaker 1: going on, Eaves, anything of note, anything you're looking forward to? Um,
0:44
Speaker 1: I don't know, is it okay? I don't know. I'm
0:49
Speaker 1: even more comfortable with saying I don't know, and I
0:51
Speaker 1: definitely don't. I don't think they're pretty I feel good.
0:54
Speaker 1: Things are at level. I'm learning every day, something new,
0:59
Speaker 1: something that's always a good thing. Um. Yeah, but yeah, nothing.
1:04
Speaker 1: I don't have much to report, you know. I say
1:07
Speaker 1: that is one of the things that I admire about
1:09
Speaker 1: you as where I just sit, you continue to do
1:14
Speaker 1: new things, learn new things, do things to find yourself
1:18
Speaker 1: that I'm like, Man, you are really motivated, and I
1:21
Speaker 1: feel like you used your time wisely. Maybe I'm projecting
1:25
Speaker 1: because I'm like, I want to be like Eaves. Why
1:27
Speaker 1: can't I be like Eaves? It's very sweet of you
1:29
Speaker 1: to think that I have everything together. That is definitely
1:32
Speaker 1: not the case. Maybe like you at least like exploring,
1:36
Speaker 1: whether it's like you know, relearning meditation or watching movies
1:41
Speaker 1: that I like. We recommend something you like, I'll watch it,
1:43
Speaker 1: and you actually follow through. That's amazing to me. I
1:51
Speaker 1: think you might be selling yourself a little short, because
1:53
Speaker 1: I think one reason that we do this is because
1:56
Speaker 1: our of our never ending curiosity, Like you have to
1:59
Speaker 1: have level of like staying curious about the world and
2:02
Speaker 1: learning new things to be able to delves deep into
2:06
Speaker 1: research and such precurious and intricate topics as you do.
2:10
Speaker 1: You know, And again, I'm very impressed by the people
2:13
Speaker 1: that you bring to us, because it is other people,
2:15
Speaker 1: the women that we've never heard of and or have
2:18
Speaker 1: been neglected for so long that you can do these
2:20
Speaker 1: deep dives. It's been also impressive, and that you're doing
2:23
Speaker 1: the work for us. Thank you. Yes, yes, I was.
2:33
Speaker 1: I was thinking about that. I was like, how does
2:34
Speaker 1: as always find these amazing stories I've never heard? Well,
2:40
Speaker 1: you know, the world is a vast pit of information
2:46
Speaker 1: and overpopulation, notwithstanding people are being born and there are
2:53
Speaker 1: a lot of shows to tail. I mean that makes
2:55
Speaker 1: me really excited, um, and it really puts things into
2:59
Speaker 1: perspective to just know how many small universes have been
3:03
Speaker 1: created that we are able to tap into because we
3:06
Speaker 1: have such a wealth of information at our fingertips. There
3:10
Speaker 1: is a talent to being able to research and research
3:12
Speaker 1: well because I have discovered I'm at the very cusp
3:16
Speaker 1: of like trying to figure it out when we try
3:18
Speaker 1: to find, you know, women around the world that series
3:21
Speaker 1: and finding women and activists who are doing great things
3:25
Speaker 1: that we don't talk about or talking enough about, but
3:27
Speaker 1: it's still like hard to actually figure out where to
3:29
Speaker 1: even start half the time. So I'm discovering that it
3:35
Speaker 1: is a lot. It takes a bit of talent and
3:37
Speaker 1: of course a lot of practice, but like all of
3:39
Speaker 1: those days come together to find good research. So kudos,
3:45
Speaker 1: thank you again. I love this. I love our because
3:51
Speaker 1: it's early morning. I feel like we're starting off with
3:53
Speaker 1: a warm virtual hug that like it's it's honestly just
3:59
Speaker 1: the was to really appreciate because when you really think
4:02
Speaker 1: that down deep into it and you're like, wow, this
4:04
Speaker 1: is kind of amazing. Yeah, I'm done, undone with my
4:09
Speaker 1: squashy guccy stuff. I love it. I love it. We're
4:13
Speaker 1: such Eves fan girls. Yes, yes, I'll take you anything, anything,
4:20
Speaker 1: I'll take it all perfect, perfect, well, speaking of amazing
4:24
Speaker 1: stories and small universes, I love how you put it
4:27
Speaker 1: like that. M who did you bring for us today? Eves?
4:29
Speaker 1: Today we're going to be talking about Mabel ping Huai.
4:33
Speaker 1: So she was Chinese American women's rights activists and she
4:39
Speaker 1: was involved in the suffragist space. Um and I said
4:42
Speaker 1: that she was the first Chinese woman to get a
4:44
Speaker 1: doctor in economics from Columbia University. Yeah. And she has
4:48
Speaker 1: an amazing story, an amazing story with so many historical
4:52
Speaker 1: threads and contexts and nuance throughout. So very very excited
4:58
Speaker 1: to get into this one. Yeah, me too. Uh So
5:01
Speaker 1: let's start. She was born around eight and Gang Joe, China,
5:06
Speaker 1: and in China, she learned English at a missionary school.
5:10
Speaker 1: She lived with her mother and her grandmother. Her mother's
5:13
Speaker 1: name was lie Beck and she was part of the
5:16
Speaker 1: upper class and gone show. Her father Leto which is
5:20
Speaker 1: spelt some different ways in the records, like spelled t
5:23
Speaker 1: o or t o w e. But he was a
5:26
Speaker 1: missionary in the US. He has his own story of
5:29
Speaker 1: coming over to the United States and being involved in
5:34
Speaker 1: the Christian church here, and mabel Leah moved to the
5:39
Speaker 1: United States in the early nineteen hundreds. There are some
5:42
Speaker 1: conflicting days given a lot of parts of her history,
5:45
Speaker 1: but she was there by nineteen o five and after
5:49
Speaker 1: her father had That was after her father had already
5:52
Speaker 1: been in the United States for years, so she spent
5:55
Speaker 1: some time in California and Washington State, and they eventually
5:59
Speaker 1: sold in Chinatown in New York City. The Lee family
6:04
Speaker 1: was part of a movement of Chinese people from the
6:07
Speaker 1: West Coast to the East Coast as opportunities for work
6:12
Speaker 1: decreased and anti Chinese violence increased in the West. So
6:16
Speaker 1: it's not as if like anti Chinese violence wasn't just
6:20
Speaker 1: concentrated in the West. I don't want to make it
6:23
Speaker 1: seem like there were only instances of that in a
6:27
Speaker 1: specific place, because I think we like to compartmentalized regions
6:30
Speaker 1: in the United States, as if certain things only happen
6:33
Speaker 1: in certain places, like racism only happened in the South
6:36
Speaker 1: and didn't happen in the North. And I don't don't
6:38
Speaker 1: want to make it seem like that's what I'm saying here.
6:41
Speaker 1: It's just that that there was some movement from the
6:44
Speaker 1: west to the East. I would also like to take
6:47
Speaker 1: this moment to talk about some of the context around immigration,
6:52
Speaker 1: um that was happening with Chinese people who migrated from
6:55
Speaker 1: China to the United States, and also some that came after,
6:59
Speaker 1: generations came after that were born here in the United
7:01
Speaker 1: States from people who were migrants from China. So I
7:05
Speaker 1: think that we might have talked about this the Chinese
7:08
Speaker 1: Exclusion Act before in Female First and I'm sure that
7:10
Speaker 1: y'all have mentioned it before otherwise, um we did. I
7:14
Speaker 1: remember we did the episode on Aphon Moi, the quote
7:17
Speaker 1: unquote first Chinese Lady, So we might have talked about
7:20
Speaker 1: it before. But of course it's worth a while bringing
7:23
Speaker 1: it up again here because that policy is super relevant
7:26
Speaker 1: because it was active for many years, many decades, which
7:32
Speaker 1: is like so hard to believe how recent this history is,
7:35
Speaker 1: but really puts a lot of things into perspective. But
7:38
Speaker 1: Congress approved the Chinese Exclusion Act in May of eighteen
7:42
Speaker 1: eighty two, which banned Chinese laborers from migrating to the
7:47
Speaker 1: United States for ten years. So as it goes with law,
7:50
Speaker 1: there are so many more rules that go into that,
7:53
Speaker 1: so many more asterisks. The Act was later extended, even
7:57
Speaker 1: though it was initially supposed to be imposed for ten years,
8:00
Speaker 1: and then it was made permanent until the Act was
8:03
Speaker 1: repealed in nineteen forty three with the Magnuscent Act, and
8:06
Speaker 1: even then it wasn't like a full repeal. There was
8:09
Speaker 1: a quota for Chinese immigrants that was set to one
8:13
Speaker 1: hundred and five people, so there were people who were
8:16
Speaker 1: exempt from those rules, like diplomats, teachers, students, and merchants
8:22
Speaker 1: who were allowed to migrate, but they also had to
8:24
Speaker 1: have certification stating that they were qualified to immigrate, which
8:28
Speaker 1: has its own layer of issues. There are stories about
8:32
Speaker 1: people who were affected by the Chinese Exclusion Act who
8:35
Speaker 1: had to go through these these layers of questioning and
8:40
Speaker 1: having to qualify your personal existence and why you're worthy
8:46
Speaker 1: of being in a space, and just imagine how mentally,
8:49
Speaker 1: emotionally how impactful that is in a person. So that's
8:53
Speaker 1: another layer to delve into. But that is something that
8:56
Speaker 1: did come up in mabel Leese life and obviously so
8:59
Speaker 1: many other people UM that were affected by the Chinese
9:02
Speaker 1: Exclusion Act. You'll see it in some of her papers
9:05
Speaker 1: UM and her having to leave the country and come
9:08
Speaker 1: back into the United States because there were rules around
9:12
Speaker 1: how a person could re enter if they were a
9:14
Speaker 1: Chinese migrant trying to leave the country and then come back.
9:18
Speaker 1: Not as if we're unfamiliar with issues around migration right
9:21
Speaker 1: now in the United States, but this was the case
9:24
Speaker 1: in her story as well. So this law wasn't active
9:28
Speaker 1: for many many reasons. There are many layers to it.
9:32
Speaker 1: It was stoked by things like fear, racism, anti Chinese animosity,
9:38
Speaker 1: economic insecurity. So yes, there are a lot of factors
9:42
Speaker 1: that go into the reason. But this is what was
9:46
Speaker 1: a part of Maple Least life as she was moving
9:48
Speaker 1: to the United States. Immigration from China was extremely limited
9:52
Speaker 1: during the period under the Exclusion Act. And they're the
9:56
Speaker 1: people who were already here even before Exclusion Act um
10:02
Speaker 1: was implemented. We're also facing violence from people who had
10:05
Speaker 1: an anti Chinese sentiment. Yes, so, so Lee and her
10:08
Speaker 1: family were able to migrate here, but she was one
10:11
Speaker 1: of few. There weren't that many other people there at
10:14
Speaker 1: the time who were able to make that happen. But
10:18
Speaker 1: so when she settled in New York, she went to
10:20
Speaker 1: Erasmus Hall High School, which was a public school in Brooklyn,
10:24
Speaker 1: and of course people in the United States had their
10:28
Speaker 1: eyes on international efforts for suffrage, so that included China,
10:33
Speaker 1: where there was a revolution in nineteen eleven, and people
10:37
Speaker 1: in China have been organizing for decades for women's suffrage.
10:42
Speaker 1: So I think it's really easy to get into a
10:44
Speaker 1: bubble and think about what's happening here in the United States.
10:47
Speaker 1: And we've talked about women's suffrage in the United States before,
10:50
Speaker 1: but there were also efforts in China, and leading up
10:53
Speaker 1: to the revolution, women's suffrage activists opposed to Ching monarchy
10:58
Speaker 1: which was overthrown and I Tina eleven and they supported
11:02
Speaker 1: the equality of genders, and we're talking about things like
11:06
Speaker 1: advocating for more political participation for women. And they didn't
11:11
Speaker 1: quite get this in the newly formed Republic of China immediately,
11:16
Speaker 1: but women stuff are just in China did remain vigilant
11:19
Speaker 1: in their activism. So because so many white Americans views
11:25
Speaker 1: of Chinese folks were anchored in this racism and xenophobia
11:30
Speaker 1: and ignorance, the four movement of enfranchisement wasn't a good
11:36
Speaker 1: look for the supposedly moral upstanding. These are not my words,
11:41
Speaker 1: but like how the view of from white Americans perspective
11:45
Speaker 1: was of the other. Specifically for Chinese people in this situation,
11:50
Speaker 1: it's like, we're more civilized, we have all our stuff
11:53
Speaker 1: going on, we have more of this forward movement, were
11:55
Speaker 1: more progressive, and they were seen as more lowly by
12:00
Speaker 1: lot they When I say they, I mean like Chinese people. Um.
12:03
Speaker 1: For for people in China, of course we're exot sized,
12:06
Speaker 1: were viewed as the other. We're seen as more lowly,
12:09
Speaker 1: and all the other various stereotypes and things that were
12:14
Speaker 1: and and views that were bred out of racism that
12:17
Speaker 1: came from white American perspective. Um. So, the fact that
12:23
Speaker 1: there was movement when it came to suffrage and enfranchisement
12:26
Speaker 1: for people in China who were supposed to be this
12:29
Speaker 1: less quote unquote lesser version of people was something that
12:33
Speaker 1: didn't look so great to a lot of white Americans
12:36
Speaker 1: who were invested in suffrage. So white suffragists looked to
12:54
Speaker 1: Chinese suffragists in the US to learn more about efforts
12:57
Speaker 1: in China, and also efforts about education in China, because
13:01
Speaker 1: that was also something that women were trying to have
13:03
Speaker 1: for movement on in the United States. In April of
13:07
Speaker 1: nineteen twelve, Mabel and her parents, along with other Chinese
13:11
Speaker 1: people in the community met with white activists who wanted
13:15
Speaker 1: more insight on the situation. But it's interesting because if
13:18
Speaker 1: you read, there was a lot of reporting about Mabel
13:21
Speaker 1: and things that were happening in the suffrage space in
13:24
Speaker 1: New York when Mabel was active, and in this situation
13:28
Speaker 1: of the meeting with parents is positioned in a way
13:30
Speaker 1: where it seems like the white women who were involved,
13:34
Speaker 1: even though the woman who kind of brought this meeting
13:37
Speaker 1: together says that I'm not really the suffragist kind, but
13:41
Speaker 1: I figured it could be good to talk to Chinese
13:44
Speaker 1: people about these issues that are affecting them while they're
13:47
Speaker 1: here in the U S. Issues around education and around
13:50
Speaker 1: women's rights and suffrage. Yeah, so at this meeting, Mabel
13:54
Speaker 1: Lee spoke of her support for gender equality and education
13:59
Speaker 1: for girls and suffrage and she was still young, so
14:03
Speaker 1: she started all of this when she was a teenager.
14:06
Speaker 1: She became known as a person who had oratory skills
14:10
Speaker 1: and who was invested in bringing women's rights to the
14:14
Speaker 1: forefront as a teenager. So this is while she was
14:17
Speaker 1: in high school. She was featured in a couple of
14:21
Speaker 1: New York Tribune articles in April of nineteen twelve. Around
14:25
Speaker 1: that same time, one was called Chinese Girl once vote.
14:31
Speaker 1: So she was positioned as a quote symbol of the
14:35
Speaker 1: new era, when all their women will be free and unhampered.
14:39
Speaker 1: That was a quote from that New York Tribune article.
14:42
Speaker 1: And by their women, they are referring to Chinese women.
14:45
Speaker 1: And there was another article that month in the New
14:48
Speaker 1: York Tribune called Chinatown Awakens, in which she was called
14:51
Speaker 1: the quote progressive Mabel Lee. She was also some sentences
14:56
Speaker 1: later called a hopeless little suffragette. Suffragette itself are ready
15:00
Speaker 1: being a derogatory terminology for someone who was invested in suffrage.
15:04
Speaker 1: So there was I think we definitely talked about this
15:08
Speaker 1: a lot before, because y'all know I love bringing quotes.
15:10
Speaker 1: But how steeped in the languages, in the racism of
15:17
Speaker 1: the day, the views towards Chinese people, And yeah, so
15:21
Speaker 1: you can delve into that and reading that entire article,
15:25
Speaker 1: It's just funny to me because there is a huge
15:28
Speaker 1: contrast between the uplift of who Mabel Lee was, acknowledging
15:34
Speaker 1: that she was progressive, acknowledging that she was helping the
15:39
Speaker 1: white people in this instance learn more about her culture,
15:43
Speaker 1: learn more about the knowledge that she had, so they
15:46
Speaker 1: were coming to her for assistance, but at the same
15:48
Speaker 1: time using language that UH showed how they viewed Mabel
15:56
Speaker 1: and other Chinese people as inferior. So it's a huge
16:00
Speaker 1: the dissonance happening. And then also there was all of
16:03
Speaker 1: the other things that are just outdated language that we
16:06
Speaker 1: would no longer use at all because we know that
16:10
Speaker 1: it's just steeped in stereotyping and things like that. So yeah,
16:14
Speaker 1: it's just interesting to see the contrast and the dissonance
16:17
Speaker 1: happening there. But either way, there were a bunch of
16:19
Speaker 1: articles that came out on her, and it wasn't just
16:21
Speaker 1: in New York. There were articles around the nation who
16:24
Speaker 1: picked up stories on what was happening. And soon after
16:28
Speaker 1: the meeting that I spoke about earlier in May of
16:30
Speaker 1: nineteen twelve, on May fourth, she was involved in a
16:35
Speaker 1: suffrage parade, and there were also articles about this leading
16:38
Speaker 1: up to the time and some of the fanfare and
16:41
Speaker 1: excitement that was happening, and looking forward to this parade,
16:46
Speaker 1: newspapers around the country printed headlines that were highlighting leads
16:51
Speaker 1: involvement in the parade. There was a bunch of hoop
16:54
Speaker 1: lah over how she was riding in on horseback, and
16:56
Speaker 1: she was leading the initial cavalcade that was bring in
17:00
Speaker 1: this ten thousand people for the parade. The newspapers were
17:04
Speaker 1: specifically calling out the fact that she was Chinese as
17:07
Speaker 1: if it were some sort of party trick. She rode
17:10
Speaker 1: on horseback and and there's a picture of her on
17:14
Speaker 1: horseback as well that she can go and look at.
17:17
Speaker 1: But her speaking skills were praised, and her activism at
17:21
Speaker 1: the time connected her to other activists who were in
17:24
Speaker 1: the space, But she was still going through her own
17:28
Speaker 1: educational process. She was the only Chinese student in her
17:31
Speaker 1: class when she graduated from high school, and she began
17:35
Speaker 1: attending Barnard College, which is a women's college in New
17:38
Speaker 1: York City. You can see a lot of her consciousness
17:41
Speaker 1: developing at this time, although she already had it as
17:44
Speaker 1: an aside. You'll see a lot of the articles talk
17:49
Speaker 1: about how her mother's feet were bound and try to
17:52
Speaker 1: kind of position her mother as a symbol of the
17:58
Speaker 1: old while her fad Mabel Lee is a symbol of
18:01
Speaker 1: the news, saying, well, her mom came from this, but
18:05
Speaker 1: she still apports suffrage. Look at that wow, While Mabel
18:08
Speaker 1: Lee as an example of the this new age of
18:12
Speaker 1: people coming up in a contrast to the tradition of
18:16
Speaker 1: what her mom supposedly represented. But either way, she was
18:22
Speaker 1: involved in a lot of clubs and activism during her
18:26
Speaker 1: time in college as well. She was in the y
18:30
Speaker 1: w c A, the Young Woman's Christian Association, and she
18:34
Speaker 1: sometimes spoke about Chinese culture and history for the organization,
18:39
Speaker 1: and during her time at Barnard she wrote a speech
18:43
Speaker 1: called China's Submerged Half, which I just love that name
18:48
Speaker 1: for like some reason. I don't know. It's just something
18:51
Speaker 1: about the words submerged that I find really like. It
18:55
Speaker 1: just draws me into like I wonder what this is
18:56
Speaker 1: going to be about. I feel like that's really that's
18:59
Speaker 1: a really interesting way to title something. Anyway, that's my
19:04
Speaker 1: weirdness about words outside um. I have a quote from it.
19:08
Speaker 1: She said, china Submerged Half has begun to emerge. And
19:12
Speaker 1: when you recall that a battalion of Chinese young women
19:15
Speaker 1: was organized and drilled for service in the Late Revolution,
19:19
Speaker 1: and that a militant woman suffragist used violence towards a
19:23
Speaker 1: deputy of the Nanking Assembly for refusing the vote for
19:26
Speaker 1: woman's suffrage. You will agree with me that a part
19:30
Speaker 1: of that half has emerged with a vengeance, and I
19:35
Speaker 1: love that, um so um. I think the reason, going
19:38
Speaker 1: back to words, I love submerged half because when she
19:41
Speaker 1: says submerged half, she's referring to women, and I think
19:44
Speaker 1: a lot of the time it's a difficulty for me
19:48
Speaker 1: to position things from a way in which self identifying
19:55
Speaker 1: as the inferior, because I think that's what the word
19:58
Speaker 1: submerged can do. It implies that that we're starting from
20:03
Speaker 1: a negative space. It's like you're immediately positioning yourself with
20:06
Speaker 1: negativity in the situation. But I think she flips that
20:12
Speaker 1: on it's head where it's like, Okay, we're submerged, but
20:16
Speaker 1: we're working with so much. You know, there's vengeance that's happening.
20:19
Speaker 1: It's not it's not coming from she's not coming from
20:22
Speaker 1: a meek position, a position in which she feels like
20:25
Speaker 1: she's incapable. Um So. She celebrated progress in terms of
20:29
Speaker 1: things that Chinese women were doing, like establishing newspapers in
20:33
Speaker 1: that speech, but she noted that a lot of things
20:35
Speaker 1: were being said in theory and not done in practice,
20:40
Speaker 1: and that rendering justice was urgent and that she and
20:44
Speaker 1: other girls would have the duties of pioneers um So
20:49
Speaker 1: she considered herself a feminist and she became part of
20:52
Speaker 1: feminist discussions that were happening on campus through groups like
20:57
Speaker 1: the Feminist Forum, and she joined the Debate Club. She
21:02
Speaker 1: was also part of the Chinese Students Club at Columbia,
21:06
Speaker 1: which was associated with the Chinese Students Alliance, in which
21:11
Speaker 1: over the year she held many positions in during her
21:14
Speaker 1: time in college, so one wonders when she had the
21:18
Speaker 1: time to do anything, because she definitely seems like she
21:22
Speaker 1: was involved in a lot. But while she was at Bernard,
21:26
Speaker 1: she wrote for the Chinese Students Monthly, which was the
21:30
Speaker 1: national magazine for the Alliance, and the first article she
21:34
Speaker 1: published for it was in June of nineteen fourteen, which
21:37
Speaker 1: was the meaning of Woman's Suffrage. In August of nineteen fourteen,
21:42
Speaker 1: she went to the CSA's Eastern Conference and competed in
21:46
Speaker 1: an oratorical contest. So she made a lot of friends
21:51
Speaker 1: during her time who were also activist and was heavily
21:54
Speaker 1: involved in the student community. She got a bachelor's degree
21:58
Speaker 1: from Barnard in nineteen sixteen and where she majored in
22:01
Speaker 1: history and philosophy, and she continued on her educational track
22:06
Speaker 1: when she was accepted into the PhD program and the
22:10
Speaker 1: Department of Political Science and Philosophy at Columbia University. She
22:16
Speaker 1: got a scholarship to go there, and that was around
22:21
Speaker 1: the time that the graduate school there had began to
22:25
Speaker 1: admit some i'll be a small number of women into
22:28
Speaker 1: their doctoral programs. During her time at Columbia, she remained
22:32
Speaker 1: active in the Chinese Students Alliance and she worked with Dr.
22:39
Speaker 1: Vladimir Simkovic, who had become her mentor and her dissertation advisor,
22:46
Speaker 1: and he encouraged her to study historical Chinese agricultural policy.
22:52
Speaker 1: Her dissertation was entitled the Economic History of China with
22:57
Speaker 1: Special Reference to Agriculture, which is available to read online
23:01
Speaker 1: if you're interested in such a sort of thing. Yes,
23:04
Speaker 1: So she advocated for a balance between the old and
23:07
Speaker 1: the new, the traditional and the modern, which makes a
23:10
Speaker 1: lot of sense for her, and to not just cast
23:12
Speaker 1: aside what was done in the past as useless. In
23:29
Speaker 1: nineteen seventeen, Mabel also participated in another suffrage parade as
23:34
Speaker 1: part of the Women's Political Equality League, and it was
23:39
Speaker 1: that same year that New York State did enfranchise women,
23:44
Speaker 1: but Mabel, as a Chinese immigrants, still could not vote.
23:48
Speaker 1: In ninete, that was the year she got her first
23:52
Speaker 1: so she became the first Chinese woman to get a
23:56
Speaker 1: PhD from Columbia University. So a path after around this
24:01
Speaker 1: time for moving forward and career was often to go
24:05
Speaker 1: back to teach, but finding employment was difficult for Mabel
24:11
Speaker 1: during her life. She did plan to return to China
24:14
Speaker 1: to live to bring back what she learned um as
24:17
Speaker 1: she didn't have a path to citizenship. It was a
24:21
Speaker 1: path for a lot of women to choose to go
24:23
Speaker 1: back to China to work, but Mabel herself never went
24:27
Speaker 1: back permanently to China, even though she did have some
24:29
Speaker 1: visits in her later years. Her plans, as plans tend
24:35
Speaker 1: to do, didn't go completely as she expected. She continued
24:42
Speaker 1: working at Columbia and then she did go to study
24:45
Speaker 1: in Europe, but she had to make arrangements when she
24:50
Speaker 1: went out of the country. As we spoke about earlier,
24:52
Speaker 1: what immigrants had to do when it came to reentry
24:54
Speaker 1: into the US had to qualify their reasoning for coming
24:59
Speaker 1: back to the United it States and that they were
25:01
Speaker 1: able to do so, and there are papers documenting her
25:05
Speaker 1: process of that. She planned on setting up a business
25:09
Speaker 1: importing Chinese herbal medicine, but her father died in November
25:14
Speaker 1: of nineteen four and she decided to go and continue
25:18
Speaker 1: his work. She decided to start working for the church,
25:21
Speaker 1: and she became director of her father's mission in New
25:25
Speaker 1: York City and started the process of making it her own.
25:31
Speaker 1: The church building was rented, so she raised funds and
25:34
Speaker 1: had a new church built at twenty one pel Street,
25:38
Speaker 1: and a friend of hers, after she was involved in
25:41
Speaker 1: that for many many years, suggested that she go back
25:44
Speaker 1: to her intellectual interest, but she remained invested in a church.
25:50
Speaker 1: She went back to China a few times in the
25:54
Speaker 1: nineteen twenties and the thirties, and but like I said earlier,
26:00
Speaker 1: she never did move back there permanently. UM but some
26:02
Speaker 1: Chinese women were enfranchised and able to vote in nineteen
26:07
Speaker 1: forty three when the Magnusent Act passed, but that still
26:12
Speaker 1: didn't extend to all Chinese women. UM. The Immigration and
26:16
Speaker 1: Nationality Act of nineteen fifty two and the Voting Rights
26:20
Speaker 1: Act of nineteen sixty five did further that process along
26:25
Speaker 1: and moved the needle on voting rights for Chinese Americans,
26:29
Speaker 1: though that didn't solve everything, because US citizens who were
26:34
Speaker 1: of Asian descent still faced discrimination and voting today. But
26:38
Speaker 1: there were no records of Lee herself naturalizing, and it's
26:42
Speaker 1: also not known whether she ever voted in the United States,
26:48
Speaker 1: and she died in nineteen sixty six in New York City. Yeah,
26:52
Speaker 1: this story is so amazing, And I love learning about
26:55
Speaker 1: feminism and other countries and just the history of feminism
26:59
Speaker 1: and their places because kind of like what you were
27:02
Speaker 1: saying earlier, Samantha, with our problem of finding doing the
27:05
Speaker 1: research around women around the world, is a lot of
27:08
Speaker 1: our searches are very like American, not even English, but
27:13
Speaker 1: like very American centered. So it's I really liked learning
27:17
Speaker 1: about this in the context she brought about what was
27:20
Speaker 1: going on in China when it came to suffrage and feminism.
27:26
Speaker 1: And yeah, this was just she really really did so
27:31
Speaker 1: much and she has so much writing um and as
27:34
Speaker 1: someone who writes, I really enjoyed reading some the stuff
27:38
Speaker 1: that she did and I was like impressed and the Yeah,
27:41
Speaker 1: I too, am a word nerd, So I liked a
27:44
Speaker 1: lot of the words that she she used and I
27:47
Speaker 1: thought she used them so effectively, right. I think the
27:50
Speaker 1: line that you read from her really made me think
27:53
Speaker 1: of like superheroes where they you know, pushed their way
27:55
Speaker 1: through out of a situation, whether they're like under debris
27:59
Speaker 1: and have to fly out of that situation essentially, Like
28:01
Speaker 1: that kind of came into mind. Um, because Yeah, that
28:04
Speaker 1: definitely painted a picture with her words, and it was
28:08
Speaker 1: beautifully said and also very inspiring. It's kind of like, yeah, absolutely,
28:13
Speaker 1: we can definitely emerge with vengeance. That's amazing. Yeah, it's
28:18
Speaker 1: the word vengeance. The association was happening there. I just
28:23
Speaker 1: watch that last night. Yeah, she's all about vengeance right now.
28:31
Speaker 1: But yeah, and even the history of the Chinese Exclusionary
28:34
Speaker 1: Act and what it held and the discussion as of
28:36
Speaker 1: laid about Asian hate in general, there's a lot of
28:40
Speaker 1: contexts that really just kind of bring it background of
28:43
Speaker 1: what she possibly went through and trying to understand what
28:46
Speaker 1: it was, because a part of the comments and conversations
28:50
Speaker 1: within those acts actually has to do with a lot
28:52
Speaker 1: of sexism and fetishism of Asian women in general, and
28:56
Speaker 1: this whole idea at the beginning of uh, the exoticism
29:00
Speaker 1: of Asian women, So you have to wonder as she
29:02
Speaker 1: was coming here, especially with a missionary from China. There's
29:07
Speaker 1: so many flips to that that I have in my
29:10
Speaker 1: head because as a person who used to be in
29:13
Speaker 1: the religious Christian Western Christian world, we had all of
29:16
Speaker 1: those stories about missionaries going to China and what that
29:19
Speaker 1: looked like, and of course coming background to be like, oh,
29:23
Speaker 1: that's there's some problematic things with that. But then having
29:26
Speaker 1: that flipped is a different conversation. You really, I really
29:29
Speaker 1: wonder what her background looked like. But then pushing forward
29:34
Speaker 1: with her being an advocate and a stuffer just when
29:37
Speaker 1: it really wasn't necessary. Just for her, it was the
29:40
Speaker 1: beginning building blocks to actually build up to what she
29:45
Speaker 1: had hoped for a better world when it comes to
29:48
Speaker 1: voting rights, when it comes to women's rights. But you know,
29:50
Speaker 1: it's it's really interesting and I have so many questions
29:54
Speaker 1: that obviously I'm gonna have to research about her life. Yeah,
29:57
Speaker 1: and there is still his street of her that exists
30:01
Speaker 1: in public for us to be able to experience her
30:04
Speaker 1: Chinese exclusion at case Foul is in the National Archives
30:08
Speaker 1: in New York City and the post Office in Chinatown
30:11
Speaker 1: was dedicated to her in it's called the Maple Lee
30:15
Speaker 1: Memorial Post Office. Now her work has been acknowledged in
30:20
Speaker 1: the city and that's always a good thing. Yes, that's
30:23
Speaker 1: good to hear. And like I said, I'm always so
30:26
Speaker 1: happy that you bring stories because I hadn't heard of her,
30:29
Speaker 1: and it's I love that there's an information. If you
30:31
Speaker 1: want to know more, there is stuff that you can
30:33
Speaker 1: find online. So that's always nice, right, And I would
30:37
Speaker 1: say as an Asian woman, like I'm not Chinese, i
30:40
Speaker 1: am absolutely Korean, but you know in my mind, like
30:43
Speaker 1: my family name is Lee, so there may be a connection.
30:47
Speaker 1: Not really, but we know, but it is something to see,
30:51
Speaker 1: Like it is nice to see representation like that at
30:53
Speaker 1: the time, Uh that I don't know, I don't know obviously,
30:56
Speaker 1: it makes me said that I didn't know her history,
30:58
Speaker 1: and I really wish I had been to see that
31:01
Speaker 1: as someone that could have been influential, be like, wow,
31:04
Speaker 1: here's someone who at least looked like me a little bit,
31:08
Speaker 1: even though we're not the same ethnicity. That is an
31:11
Speaker 1: inspiration to what has happened and was a part of
31:14
Speaker 1: history and making history happen and continuing to fight in
31:17
Speaker 1: that and being a representative. It's it's nice to see
31:20
Speaker 1: and I'm so excited that you were able to bring
31:22
Speaker 1: that to us because I honestly had no idea about her,
31:25
Speaker 1: and I feel really shame. It's a shame that I
31:27
Speaker 1: didn't know anything about her. Don't feel ashamed, it's I mean,
31:32
Speaker 1: it's not a bad thing to not know about everybody
31:35
Speaker 1: in the world, and it's a good thing that we
31:38
Speaker 1: are able to access this information now. So yeah, I
31:41
Speaker 1: hope that other people as well, um, learn something from
31:44
Speaker 1: our story and able to dig a little bit deeper
31:46
Speaker 1: into it and learn more in general about the history
31:51
Speaker 1: of Chinese Americans in the United States, and about who
31:56
Speaker 1: was involved in the breath and expansiveness of who was
32:00
Speaker 1: involved in enfranchisement, and and the work that people did
32:06
Speaker 1: for gaining more rights and self advocacy in in the
32:10
Speaker 1: United States. Yes, so well said, as always used. Um,
32:16
Speaker 1: is there anything else to add before we wrap up here? No,
32:19
Speaker 1: that's all I got today. Well, thanks as always for
32:22
Speaker 1: joining us and bringing us these amazing stories. Where can
32:27
Speaker 1: the good listeners find you? Y'all can find me online
32:30
Speaker 1: on Instagram at not Apologizing. You can also find me
32:34
Speaker 1: on Twitter at Eaves Jeff co and you can find
32:37
Speaker 1: more of my work at east dot com. Yes, and
32:41
Speaker 1: here on sminty. Many many more episodes, dozens, right, dozens
32:46
Speaker 1: of episodes. Oh, I think we're approaching That's what I'm saying,
32:50
Speaker 1: because I want another celebration. Yeah. So many more episodes
32:56
Speaker 1: of female First where you can learn about other people
32:59
Speaker 1: in history. He did things that we're super important and
33:05
Speaker 1: super meaningful in various histories around the world. Yes, yes,
33:12
Speaker 1: we always love these episodes, so please check them out
33:16
Speaker 1: if you somehow miss them listeners, and if you would
33:19
Speaker 1: like to contact us, you can. Our email is Stuff
33:22
Speaker 1: Media mom Stuff at heart dot com. You can find
33:24
Speaker 1: us on Twitter at mom Stuff podcast or on Instagram
33:26
Speaker 1: and stuff I've Never Told You Things. As always to
33:28
Speaker 1: our super producer Christina, thank you and thanks to you
33:31
Speaker 1: for listening Stuff when Never told you his protection by
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Speaker 1: Heart Radio. For more podcast in my Heart Radio is
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