Latest / Under The Fur / The Flexible Vet Career with Amanda
Transcript
- speaker-0: Thank you for joining us again for another episode of Under the Fur. And I've got another special guest because obviously they're all special and mostly special to me. This is Amanda, aka Sammy, as I'll call her, which is her nickname that I gave you, I believe. And she is also a vet and we graduated at the same time from Cambridge University, 2008. speaker-1: No, where's that time? speaker-0: It's so long ago. It's so long ago. And I thought it would be nice to have you on here because there's, think you're, what you do is, you've got like something a little special in general practice because you have your cardiology certificate. And when we were chatting the other day, I was so impressed by the level of the heart scans that you're able to do. And the other thing I thought was you are a mom and you deal with that and you, you pretty much like, Really hands on there on that side, but you're also managing to stay in general practice. And you love it. Every time we talk, we've got exciting things to talk about. So where should we start? Not in the Costa Rican jungle, because I'm going to come, I'm going to bring that story up in a second. But where, where did you first go from university? speaker-1: I went, I always thought I was going to do mixed practice. And I didn't. I went to a first opinion, a small like privately owned as they mainly were back then, a first opinion center in Belpa. And there were three kind of senior vets and then me and one other like younger vet and the nursing team were like what kept me going, I guess. know, they were the kind of rock of support. speaker-0: in the butt saving day. speaker-1: Absolutely. And you bring things through and you're like, I'm thinking of doing, well, have you thought about doing this? Yes. That's a great idea. So yeah. So I was there for a little while and I think I stayed there when I had my daughter. And then I moved after I'd had my second child. think having kids, I only ever worked part-time after that. So I worked three days when I had one. And then I work two days technically since I've had two, but I do quite love extra. So I'll cover shifts if people are off, if the kids are at school or if I haven't got them, like I'm quite happy to do more. But for me, I guess the work life balance, I want to have the extra time off in the holidays. That's quite important to me, having that, balance to have the family. And I think I really enjoy work and... Probably because I work part time, like even if it's a hard day, it's not four or five days a week. So it's manageable. I think it's good. speaker-0: It's lovely to have a career that you can opt for that because I think I had this conversation with John actually. John's my husband for anyone listening. And I said at some point, cause he does a lot more of the sort of childcare side than I do. And I asked him about, maybe you want to go part time. And he said that wasn't really an option in the work that he did. But he's quite happy because he gets to work from home three days a week. So he doesn't have commuting time and makes it work. But for us, it really is an option to have flexible working. speaker-1: Yeah, I think it's much like when I'm there, I find it much easier to do two like full days, longer days. I think there's always a danger if you do half days, you don't ever quite leave on time because there's the emergency that comes in or like an RTA or a poorly patient that needs squeezing in and it's just so easy just to say yes all the time and stay. So I've always done two like full days and then extras, you know, to cover other people and stuff. But it does, it works well. That works for you. speaker-0: So how did you fall into the cardiology? speaker-1: So I've always wanted to do cardiology, but I think the first place, I think we did have a scanner, but it wasn't a very good scanner. And there was certainly nobody that was looking at hearts. So it wasn't something that had any support really to go with. And then when I moved jobs, I was really hoping that they'd got a better scanner and there were people there that were doing this stuff. And I was like, this is going to be it. I'm going to get the chance. But unfortunately people moved like, the people that were there changed a little bit and kind of once again, I guess there was nobody doing any cardiology stuff. And then I was approached by somebody I had worked with who basically where I work now, the cardiology specialist center had kind of branched out and open a first opinion practice because they wanted a site where they could do interventional procedures. Amazing. In the first opinion site was the theater and they got the fluoroscopy and all of the stuff they needed to do all the heart stuff. And then it was running obviously as first opinion, just doing all the standard stuff, let's say that we do. And so she offered me a job or she said there was a position. So I took that and that's where I did my cardiology certificate because I got the support of the cardiology specialists. So people there that could help me. I had the confidence to see more cases. I got the chance to like see cases jointly with them and stuff. So I was really, really lucky to have that as an opportunity. speaker-0: So how does it work now? Do you go over to them to do some cardiology stuff or are you doing that in your general practice? Both. Yeah. Great. Is speaker-1: Sorry. speaker-0: it cheaper in the general practice just for all the clients out there so can let them know which place to see you. speaker-1: Yeah, general practice is just a completely different vibe. So at the moment I do one day general practice and one day cardiology. General practice, you know, it's kind of 15 minute appointments. We have multiple procedures. The impatience are like anything really that comes in for a scan or workup, x-rays, heart scan procedures. They're all impatience and everything. And so it all gets dealt with slightly differently, I guess. The cardiology center is amazing and the patients stay with their parents. So yeah, there isn't really an impatient thing. That's not what happens. So the way that runs is that the clients will arrive with their pets. You'll see them, you'll chat to them. The scanner is in the room. You scan them whilst the parents are there, know, like reassuring the dogs, the cats, whatever. And then you look at the images, you do everything in that kind of hour slot. So you then give them the feedback. You can discuss what you found, what we need to do and all of it. And then obviously they go away knowing the patients don't have to stay in and it's just really nice. speaker-0: And I found that a lot of pet owners have anxiety about leaving their at the clinic. So that's lovely to be able to offer them that and to stay with them. speaker-1: And they, like nothing is sedated. And for the vast, there's the odd one or two maybe who are better without the parents there or the parents are worried enough they don't want to stay in the room. But like, I reckon 99 % of them will stay and the dogs and cats are much calmer with them. And then the parents are less worried because nothing we're doing hurts. Like we shave some fur and we do an ECG and we do the ultrasound. So there's nothing at all painful. But I think dogs and cats can get vet associated anxiety. Like they're worried when they go to the vets. But it doesn't really feel like they're at the vets. So it's really nice. speaker-0: Great. And that means slower heart rate for when you're scanning. Yeah. speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: And how do you feel having the owners of those animals looking at you while you're doing everything? speaker-1: Yeah, I think you get over it. It is a bit daunting to start with because you feel the pressure. What happens if I haven't got enough information or if they're wriggling or whatever else. But I think on balance, it just works so much better. And if I can't get the views or if the patient's getting really worried or like if the big dog needs to be done standing up and I feel like it's out of my depth, there's always other people there to help. So I'm never by myself. So you know that you've got the opportunity to give that patient everything they need in that visit. speaker-0: So what kind of interventional treatments are being done at a cardiology centre? speaker-1: So they will do, they'll treat PDAs. So basically holes in the heart. They can put little kind of devices in there that plugs that gap and that can fix the condition. They've got stents that they can put in. So if there are vessels that are perhaps or valves that are a bit narrowed, they can kind of put a stent to open that up and they can do balloon procedures to open that up as well. They've also started doing a left atrial decompression. So for some cases that maybe can't have like a valve repair, that's, although that's done, we don't do that. It's still pretty uncommon in this country. But there are other procedures that can be done that can help those cases. So it's so incredible what they do. I don't do any of that, but just it's absolutely amazing. Like when you think about It's done a lot in human medicine. speaker-0: We're lagging behind because it's such a common condition in pets to have cardiac problems. And generally the only thing we've got, well in general practice, the only thing we've got is medication, which is not healing anything, not fixing anything. speaker-1: So some of those, so the PDAs have got to be a favourite because you can fix them. absolutely. you can wave them off and say, you know, we don't need to see you back, which is incredible. speaker-0: And they've gotten a normal life expectancy after speaker-1: Yeah. yeah. speaker-0: that. Yeah. Yeah. And I don't know of any other cardiology specific centers, but I guess they exist. I didn't know about this one until you told me. speaker-1: There are, so some of the cardiology services run out of like multi-disciplinary hospitals. There are a few other cardiology only centers, but they kind of spread around about the country. speaker-0: Yeah, and do they work similarly to the one that you're in? speaker-1: I'm not sure. I don't know if they keep the clients while they do the investigations, if that makes sense. speaker-0: That's the thing I love the most, I think that's really nice. speaker-1: We definitely have some clients who have come to us rather than closer ones because they know they can stay with the pets. It's a big deal for pet owners to stay with them. They're their babies quite often. They're of the family. speaker-0: I often think that like if we take our kids to the hospital where we stay with them, they're not leaving our side. They're going nowhere. speaker-1: And I think they like the fact that they can see. I think on the flip side of that, sometimes, know, some of the vets are really competent. They can scan really quickly and maybe in 20 minutes they've done like a hugely detailed scan. And the owners don't always realize how hard that is to have got all those images and be able to do all your measurements. And I think sometimes they don't always see value for money, but actually the level of expertise and knowledge and like ability. And guess the actual scanners themselves, you know, like the specs on them. speaker-0: they're so expensive. I'm actually just looking at them now because you know, I've got these two new clinics opening and I just look at them. my, so I mean, I don't need the cardiology ones, but the cardiology ultrasound machines are insane. We're talking like a couple of hundred thousand up. speaker-1: Yeah. They are amazing machines though. Like the detail on them is so incredible. Yeah. speaker-0: Yeah, a lot of money. Yeah. Yeah. So, what do your kids think about you being a vet? speaker-1: I think, I don't know. I think they, yeah. I find about it when like, I think for them, it's more important. It like, if I've taken them somewhere or if I bought another packet of sweets on the way home, like that for them is really speaker-0: So I've asked my kids this and, well, and Naira, she says to me, you're always tired and grumpy when you get home. Great. That's what you think of me being a vet. And then I Cassius and he's like, can you buy me some Pokemon cards? Okay. We're not going to get an answer to them. They really don't think about it. speaker-1: No, they, you know, like, and on a long day, especially when they were younger, they'd be in bed. So I wouldn't see them the day I worked like a late or whatever. You finish at seven, don't get home till eight or whatever. They might've gone to bed. Cid, in fact, both of them have been slightly exposed to it. Like I've had to, they've had to come to work on the odd time. speaker-0: I've taken mine in multiple times. speaker-1: And so they've seen things and I guess they're exposed to stuff that probably other kids aren't. I don't think it's all bad. know, we've had sheep at home and stuff and lambing and I guess kind of life and death and those conversations. speaker-0: I remember, was it last Easter when I came to visit you and you said to me, we need to go in the field. Do you want to hold or lamb? I have not lambed for so many years and I was like, all right, you hold, I'm going in. speaker-1: Yeah. And the kids have had a go and Sid loves, loves lambs. Like they've been one of his favorite animals. speaker-0: It's pretty cool. Especially when they're skipping around the field afterwards. Yeah. And is there, so you're balancing it. Do you think you could balance it if you were full time? speaker-1: Not unless I had a house husband is the reality of this. Like you've said, John does quite a lot of the school runs or picking up and everything. So we're lucky my parents will pick them up like one day a week. So that takes the load off. My husband has his own company. So he has the pressures of that. I think it's not an easy job to do full time if you want to do the parenting bits as well, if you've not got someone else's backup. Ours don't really support that. speaker-0: Yeah. So you've really found something that suits you and works for you and it's great that you've been able to do cardiology now. And I guess, so what's the reason you didn't want to go and pursue residency and specialism? speaker-1: like the work life balance is just a, not a thing. You know, so we're really lucky. And one of the other cardiologists has, is doing a residency in house. They had to fight a lot for it, right? You know, like for it to be accredited and approved and stuff. But she is now, she's got to go out and do some medical and like other bits of it, other hospitals, but essentially she's able to do it kind of from the cardiology center. Okay. which has made it accessible for her. But it's still a huge amount of work. And I haven't got time in my life to accommodate that at the minute, not do everything else. speaker-0: Yes. So this is amazing. So this is the route that you found to give you what you want to do and to keep your work life balance. Yeah. speaker-1: Perfect. And I'm so lucky because I've got that support of all those experienced people. speaker-0: Yeah, yeah, amazing. So the Costa Rica story. speaker-1: Go. speaker-0: So Sammy and I, when we were in university, quickly discovered that Cambridge University does give you bursaries to travel. Conservation because we both really enjoy conservation. And so we found a conservation project in the jungle in Costa Rica, saving turtles. we thought, wow, amazing. Let's go and spend our summer there. So we booked the flights and we headed off to the air. We, speaker-1: Airport. Who booked the flight? speaker-0: you were in the room. Okay. So technically I pushed the button to book the flights. What was the name of the airport you remember? speaker-1: It's like speaker-0: No, but whatever it was, there is an identically named airport in California. San speaker-1: Yes, Jose. speaker-0: Jose or San Antonio. Okay. So San Jose airport for everyone that's out there exists in Costa Rica and in California. Both start with a C. But it wasn't until we were air speaker-1: In the air. speaker-0: over like what the Atlantic ocean or something that Sammy turns to me and says, doesn't make sense. And I said, what does it make sense? And she goes, the direction that we're heading. It doesn't make sense that we're flying there. And I was like, it'll be fine. We're getting a connection. I'm sure we just go south from there. And she's like, I'm just going to check. Calls over the cabin crew and she's like, where are we going? And she's like, California. speaker-1: Yep. speaker-0: I very helpfully had hysterical laughter on the flight and we were in fact flying to California instead. And I think I said to you, I mean, it might be nice that it's California instead. And you were like, absolutely not. We're going to Costa Rica to save turtles. we spent the night in Texas. speaker-1: Yeah, speaker-0: We on our suitcases in Texas. Had to buy and now we were broke students. speaker-1: I had to phone home for like, you transfer me some money because we're in the wrong continent? speaker-0: As I explained to our families, we'd gone to the wrong continent. Can they lend us some money? We need to buy a flight down to Costa Rica. Arrived a day later, had to try and contact them to tell them we are coming, wait for us, we'll be there. Finally got to Costa Rica. Do you remember I had that big pink suitcase? speaker-1: some way speaker-0: And it was a one kilometer walk. from the entrance of the park to the site where we were staying and no vehicles and we had to pull the big pink suitcase through the jungle. my God, I'm such an idiot. don't know what has happened, but yeah, I don't know if anybody else out there has flown to accidentally to the wrong continent, but please let me know. I'm not. Yes. speaker-1: you don't feel so bad. speaker-0: Yes. Yes. It's one of those stories. speaker-1: It always, always comes up. Yeah. My parents don't let me live it down either. Pretty speaker-0: You're the wrong continent. speaker-1: much any time we like book something. well, it's not as bad as the time you. speaker-0: my, yes, it's got to die down at some point. apart from that being really, really funny, I thought to myself, one of the things that I love about being a vet is the other opportunities that is given as well. you we went to Costa Rica and did that. gone to, I spent a summer in Trinidad and I also got to go to India and set up the stray Dogs clinics there, like amazing opportunities to travel and to use your skills elsewhere. And I don't know about you, but I always end up operating a dog when I'm on holidays. No? is that just me? I speaker-1: No. No? That's just you. speaker-0: went on a diving holiday for my 30th. I don't know if you remember this story. And we arrived, we went to the, I was doing my open water. It was amazing. I was having the best time. And then they were like, while you're here, There's this dog, it's had string tied around its tail. I think the kids had thought it was funny or something. And the tail was dead. And they were like, could you just like operate on it for us? And I was like, where? And they were like, we've got a room in the back of the dive center and we can get some drugs off the side door. And anyway, I ended up operating on it. And that's not the first time that's happened to me. That's happened to me multiple times while I've been out traveling. speaker-1: Yeah, no, I don't. I don't fall into that one. speaker-0: no, maybe it's places I travel because again, there was nothing around, nothing else around. speaker-1: And then you're a celebrity when you go to those places and then when people find out what you do, they're way more impressed than the kids about, you know, think adults. speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. Talking about the kids. I took my kids in once. It was really late and one of my clients needed a caesarian. So I, was away. We traveled in or whatever. I took them into, watch a caesarian. And I thought, wow, this is amazing. They're going to this. Cassius was like, and I was into actually, she was helping me to revive the puppies and Cass just sort of went, can I watch YouTube? speaker-1: You just think this is such an amazing, like such a special thing. speaker-0: It was too young to appreciate it. So what's future Sammy doing? we happy? Are we going to expand? Are we going to move on? Any more projects? speaker-1: I love the balance of both, honestly. Like if somebody said, people do ask me sometimes, you know, do you want to just stay in first opinion? Do you want to like completely specialize? I just think there's so much to be said for doing a little bit of both. I think I'm lucky that I can do like the way the dynamics, the way it works. I'm lucky that I've got that as an option. I don't think I'll change anything for the moment. I think they're just, They're so rewarding, but so, so, so different because obviously the referral stuff is, you know, it costs more and it's, there's some people can't do that. And you obviously see a subset of like very specific things. Whereas I think in GP land, you never know what's coming through that door. Like it could be anything. Absolutely anything. speaker-0: Yeah. And then before we wrap up, tell me about a case. speaker-1: My, I don't speaker-0: anything you've got. speaker-1: know about favorite case, but I think the thing that like most surprised me was a puppy that I saw. So it came in, they only phoned up. The puppy must have been about, I don't know, four to six weeks. It was quite small, but it was just starting to wean. And she phoned up and she said, I'm really worried. My puppy has got like a load of lumps that's come up around its face, around its jaw and everything. So. She came in and I was checking this little puppy over and I was like, okay, as part of my general examination, I'm gonna check this puppy's temperature. So go to take the temperature, which in dogs is up the bottom. And I can't find any way to put my thermometer. And I look at this puppy, could speaker-0: I can't find anywhere. speaker-1: not find like its bottom, its anus was not there. And I, do you know what? I went around and I went into the nurse's consult room and I'm like, I obviously having a bad morning. speaker-0: I'll find a bumhole. speaker-1: Basically that. So she looked at it and she was like, well, there is someone. And I went back around to the client and I was like, have you noticed anything strange about this puppy? Like genuinely, I know you've come in for this one problem, but I'm struggling to find like it needs a bottom. This is a crucial part of your puppy. And she said, funnily enough, it hadn't been going to toilet since she started weaning it. And so we had a chat with her. And we basically agreed that the puppy didn't have a bottom. so like that's not compatible with living. So I said to her, know, like I've never done anything like this. Do you want me to refer, you know, this puppy? Do you want me to send it to see a surgeon? Because I think that would be a sensible approach. There wasn't- need to create a We need to make, yeah, we need to make this dog be able to poo. Otherwise it can't, the puppy won't survive. So she couldn't afford referral. So me and another experienced colleague who was working with us kind of set to work to fix this puppy. And we did manage to, and she's still fine. And yeah, we made her a little bottom. We fixed her and she carried on growing. Exactly speaker-0: hall and save the life! speaker-1: that. Like some very surprising. think, I think, you know, when puppies have problems that are born with, I don't expect them to be getting to six to eight weeks before I see them. Like I think they'll have faded or died quite young. So I was like, it was super surprising, but yeah, quite exciting. It sticks with me obviously. It's a sticking one. speaker-0: sharing. That's an amazing story. Not what I thought you were going to tell me, but a good one. Thank you so much. I know you were a anxious about coming on my podcast, but I think what you do is really important to share because one of things I wanted to show was you can do it all. speaker-1: Yeah, you can. With the right can find those dream jobs and yeah, balance that suits you. No worries. speaker-0: Yeah, thank you, Sam.