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Katie Woolf spoke with Independent Member for Araluen Robyn Lambley · 360 with Katie Woolf

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Well, let's head on down to Alice Springs right now,
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: where we do know that there's been real issues when
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: it comes to crime, particularly uthed crime. And joining me
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: on the line is Robin Lamley, the Member for Ara
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: lun Good morning, Robin.
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: Good morning, Katie Wolf Robin.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: Things are How are things going in Alice? I know
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: it's been pretty horrible the last few times we've spoken.
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: Well, I think things have not changed, Katie, despite the
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: front page of the Anti News this morning telling us
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: that there's been one hundred cases put before the court
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: or something to that effect of juvenile offenders, there's not
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: much evidence of change on the street of Alice Springs yet.
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: But we all remain optimistic. Katie.
• 0:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I guess that's all you can do.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: If you actually, you know, you've set up roots and
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: you're living in Alice Springs, all you can do remain
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: optimistic at this point. I do just want to quote
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: something that the Northern Territory News has reported the Chief Minister,
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: Michael Gunner saying on those stats, so essentially two hundred
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: and seventeen prosecution files have been submitted since October fourteen.
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: Of those, one hundred and twenty two were related to
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: property offenses. One hundred and six were submitted against youth offenders.
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: Now the Chief Minister's told the paper, I'm really encouraged
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: by the process that Strikeforce.
• 1:27
  Speaker 3: Viper is making.
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: It's their job to catch criminals, and that's exactly what
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: they're doing. Tackling crime and anti social behavior is a
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: big wheel that turns slowly.
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  Speaker 3: I know it's frustrating. I'm frustrated too.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: He's told them we've just got to keep working and
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: keep pushing. But Robert, I think we all understand that
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: the issue has never been the police doing their jobs.
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: They do a tremendous job, but somewhere down the track
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: things continue to break down.
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: That's right, Katie. The police have always done a good
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: job in Alla Springs, but when they're under resourced and
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: under pressure and not particularly well supported by their government,
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: that's when things start to fall apart. What I've seen
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: over the years is when a government takes their eye
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: off the ball, stops putting youth crime and any crime
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: as a priority, then the community starts to see the deterioration.
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: And that's what we've seen over the last three years.
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: And I'm not saying this because that's sort of the
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: duration of this government. Literally, it has been over the
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: last three or four years that we've seen things change. Look,
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: I am inspired by those stats, but they're kind of
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: given to you in a vacuum, like one hundred and
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: six youth offenders of you know, like the stats, they
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: all sound good, but this is over the last seven weeks.
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: What happened for the previous seven weeks and the seven
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: weeks before then? What are we comparing this to? Those
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: figures sound great, but there's no context, and that's where
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: the government thinks that they can conness or convince us.
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: You know, we're not stupid. Territorians aren't stupid. Giving us
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: figures without any sort of reference to the past is
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: really quite mischievous. What we've got at the moment, Katie,
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: is several members of the cabinet are in town at
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: the moment. I haven't seen any of them. But apparently
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: we've got the gunner down here, We've got the Police Minister,
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: the Territory Families Minister. They may even have the whole
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: cabinet down here. I wouldn't have a clue. They never
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: come to visit me, despite my invitations that they come
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: down and they've put this out, this media relief out
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: that's sort of splash all over the NT years, trying
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: to convince us all that there's a great change improvement
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: that we're yet to see much evidence of that. And
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: as I said before, that doesn't mean that I'm not optimistic. Yeah,
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: but you know, perception is always greater then you know,
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: it's more, it's more important, Yeah, sax and figures that
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: might be splashed around.
• 4:21
  Speaker 4: Robin.
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: I want to play for you a little bit.
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: Of audio that we caught up with Josh Burgoyne earlier
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: in the week. And I know that you and he
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: have spoken to me on numerous occasions about this issue.
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: Take a listen to what he had to say to
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: me earlier in the week.
• 4:35
  Speaker 4: Two things that I believe can be done the twenty
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  Speaker 4: four to seven new centate and we can't call it
• 4:41
  Speaker 4: twenty four to seven yet because it's only open select days.
• 4:44
  Speaker 4: You know, a little bit more funding to provide that
• 4:46
  Speaker 4: at slightly earlier date than what they planned. We need
• 4:49
  Speaker 4: to bring back breach of bail asm offense. The policy
• 4:52
  Speaker 4: structures are in place at the moment aren't working and
• 4:54
  Speaker 4: we need to be willing to change that. And The
• 4:57
  Speaker 4: police are doing the absolute best they can. I do
• 5:00
  Speaker 4: leave the day, are working exceptionally hard, but we need
• 5:02
  Speaker 4: to back them up with the lawns, with these bail laws,
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  Speaker 4: so the youth that they are arresting are not just
• 5:09
  Speaker 4: constantly going around and around what we call he you know,
• 5:12
  Speaker 4: in this revolving door.
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: Robin, you and I have spoken before about the possibility
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: of a youth curfew in Alice Springs, But what do
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: you think is it time for that youth center to
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: genuinely be twenty four to seven and do we need
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: to seriously look at changing the breach of bail laws
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: and making an offense if you do breach your bail.
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: So, as Josh alluded to that the youth center, which
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: is now open twenty four hours a day just over
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: the weekends, will become a seven day service when the
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: kids go on school holidays. That will be interesting to
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: see how effective that becomes. But already we've got we
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: had a leading stakeholder from the youth sector come out,
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  Speaker 2: I think it was on it was yesterday saying that
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: she was concerned that having a recreational facility open twenty
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: four hours a day, seven days a week was actually
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: attracting kids to town rather than encouraging them to go home.
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  Speaker 2: So there's some criticism sort of starting to build around
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: exactly what the model is that the government settled on here.
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: But look, I am trying to be extremely optimistic and
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: I think that it's worth a go. It's worth sitting
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: back and watching how effective a twenty four hour, seven
• 6:31
  Speaker 2: day week youth dropping center will be in Alice Springs
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: over the school holidays. The breach of bail has been
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: the relaxing of the laws around breach of bail hasn't
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: done any good for the count of Alice Springs in
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: terms of crime. It's consistent with the recommendations of the
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: World Commission into Juvenile Justice and Child Protection, and that's
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: why we've seen that change in legislation implemented by the
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: government large last year that it really has had an
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: adverse impact on our community. One of the unintended consequences
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: of the Royal Commission was the fact that crime has
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: gone through the roof, probably right throughout the Northern Territory.
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: And Robin, I guess you know, a really sort of
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: interesting question is how many, you know, like, how many
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: youths do we have per months? Who are breaching their
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: bail conditions. I'd be really interested, you know, to find
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: that out, whether we have got a situation where there
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: are a number of young people who are breaching their
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: bail conditions, or whether it is just something that we're perceiving.
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: Well, that was the line of questioning that the Opposition
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: was pursuing in Parliament during the last sittings, and of
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: course the government was unable or unwilling to provide that information.
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: We head into Budget estimates hearing next week, Katie, I'm
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: sure the Opposition will be all over this. We want
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: statistics showing us how many kids are breaching BA, how
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: many kids are literally getting locked up and let out
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: immediately on this relaxed system that the government has put
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: in place. Look somewhere in the middle lies the solution.
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: You know, you can't have a completely relaxed system when
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: it comes to how we treat juvenile offenders, and you
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: can't have sort of an extreme situation where you're locking
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: up kids and not treating them well. Like most things
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: in life, there is a point in the middle where
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: we will all be reasonably happy. You know that the
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: child advocates and you know, and the average Joe blogs
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: who's been subjected to crime, relentless crime in Alice Springs
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: and throughout the Northern Territory from these kids. We have
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: to take a sensible and moderate position on these things.
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: Going too far to one all the other is disastrous.
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: All right, Oh well, Robin, it's something we'll continue to
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: talk about. Yeah, it has to be. I think, Hey,
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: I do just want to ask you quickly. I know
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: that you've issued a pressure release this morning saying that
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: the government has scrapped the program that provides alcohol and
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: other drug rehabilitation services across the Northern Territory. So the
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: two point eight million dollar commit program is to be
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: cut within weeks, leaving rehabilitation treatment options in the Northern
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: Territory reduced by an estimated thirty percent and more than
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: twenty jobs cut.
• 9:30
  Speaker 3: I was not aware of this.
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: No, well, of course you're not aware of it because
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: the government won't be talking about that. But yes, this
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: is something I've uncovered over the last couple of weeks,
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: just in my preparation for the estimates hearings next week.
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  Speaker 2: I've discovered this dramatic part in some of the most
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: essential services that we can provide in Northern Territory, alcohol
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: and drug rehabilitation for offenders. It's mainly for people to
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: keep them out of jail. It's also a programmed to
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: stop recidivism rates and get people out of jail earlier
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: than they normally would. So yeah, yes, the government has
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: a lot of questions to answer. This is a government
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: that's been very critical of former governments making cuts and
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: here we have them reducing some services by more than
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: thirty percent in the Northern Territory.
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: Well, i'll tell you what, Robin.
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: It's always it's always interesting when you hear this type
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: of thing, and it's it's you know, you worry about
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: the impact that it's going to have more broadly. We
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: are going to have to leave it there, but we'll
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: catch up with you again next week with estimates taking
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: place to find out exactly what's going on.
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: Good sounds great, Thank you, Robin.
• 10:42
  Speaker 3: Talk soon.
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: See that is Robin Lamley there. She's the independent member
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: for Ara Leuwen. And yes, those budget estimates next week.