Latest / Buckeyes TomOrrow Morning / Ohio State Linebacker Greats, Concerns for 2026 LBs, and James Laurinaitis' Future

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Ohio State Linebacker Greats, Concerns for 2026 LBs, and James Laurinaitis' Future · Buckeyes TomOrrow Morning

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  Speaker 1: Welcome to Buckey's Tomorrow Morning for Sunday, June fourteenth. I'm
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  Speaker 1: your host, tom or the ball State game in eighty
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  Speaker 1: four days, the game against Michigan in one hundred and
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  Speaker 1: sixty eight days. Thanks to our friends at Jeff Ruby's
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  Speaker 1: Today today you're getting a bonus episode of the Time
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  Speaker 1: in Change will surely show. That is Tony Gerderman and
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  Speaker 1: Juck Maletti of Buckeye Insiders dot Com, a new show
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  Speaker 1: that they just launched a couple weeks ago. This is
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  Speaker 1: the second episode. It looks at the past, present and
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  Speaker 1: future of a topic involving the Ohio State program. Today
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  Speaker 1: they're looking at the linebackers, so looking back at some
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  Speaker 1: Ohio State linebacker greats, looking at some potential concerns for
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  Speaker 1: this year's linebackers, and then what the future could hold
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  Speaker 1: for former Ohius Date linebacker current Ohouse Date linebackers coach
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  Speaker 1: and future or I don't know, maybe Ohio State head
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  Speaker 1: coach James Laura Nidas. So Tony and Juck will break
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  Speaker 1: all that down in this episode of the Time and
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  Speaker 1: Change will surely show. If you enjoy this one, go
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  Speaker 1: ahead and just search. Time and Change will shortly show
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  Speaker 1: in whatever podcast platform you're listening to Buckeyes tomorrow morning
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  Speaker 1: in and subscribe to that.
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  Speaker 2: There, Hello, and welcome to the Time and Change Well
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  Speaker 2: Shirley Show. I'm Tony Gerdaman here with Juck Malutty as
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  Speaker 2: we discussed the past, present, and future of Ohio State football.
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  Speaker 2: Every week we take one topic and look back, look
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  Speaker 2: at today, look at the future of that topic as
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  Speaker 2: it relates to the Buckeyes. This week we are talking
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  Speaker 2: the Ohio State linebackers. Plenty of history to look forward to,
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  Speaker 2: plenty of present to talk about, and with James Laura
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  Speaker 2: Nidas as the position coach, certainly a very good future
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  Speaker 2: to discuss as well. So, Juck, how are you doing?
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  Speaker 3: Fantastic? Buddy? My favorite position always has been I just
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  Speaker 3: love linebackers, have affinity for linebacker play, and it's just uh,
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  Speaker 3: it's what I dig. You know, if you look back
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  Speaker 3: on my jersey wall. I think linebackers probably represent more
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  Speaker 3: than anybody else, and that's for good reason.
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  Speaker 2: Especially a place like Ohio State where the history is rich,
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  Speaker 2: just like it is with running backs, just like it's
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  Speaker 2: become with with receivers, and but linebacker. I think for
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  Speaker 2: me growing up, that was always that's the number one thing.
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  Speaker 2: And for me, I'll just tell you, like Chris Bielman,
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  Speaker 2: was it for me as a kid? That was that
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  Speaker 2: he was He was my Buckeye. He was Ohio State
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  Speaker 2: for me. So when we talked about linebackers, like who
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  Speaker 2: is the guy that is that for you? Like the
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  Speaker 2: first linebacker that you really remember as a Buckeye.
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  Speaker 3: So the first one that I really fell in absolute
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  Speaker 3: love with for me was Ajhawk. But Bielman, I'm a
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  Speaker 3: little younger than you and always had that same reverence
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  Speaker 3: for him growing up. Yeah, I would take that back.
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  Speaker 3: The first one I really fell in love with was
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  Speaker 3: Katzmore for sure, definitely kats Burn, But I loved hawkmore
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  Speaker 3: when as he came round. But Spielman a little bit
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  Speaker 3: before my time in actually seeing all his exploits. But
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  Speaker 3: I'm from northeast Ohio and his legend is so big here,
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  Speaker 3: particularly when I was a kid and first kind of
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  Speaker 3: becoming a Buckeye fan. That was actually like paying attention
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  Speaker 3: to games. It was so large, and it's just to me,
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  Speaker 3: he's always going to be, you know that dude. I
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  Speaker 3: wish I could have seen him more. I wish you
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  Speaker 3: could see more highlights from back then. It's tough to find.
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  Speaker 3: You can find some clips of whole games and watch
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  Speaker 3: the whole games, but you can see when he was
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  Speaker 3: playing for the Lions. But you know, I watched him
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  Speaker 3: a ton, and you know, watching the Lions with him
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  Speaker 3: and Barry was always just such a joy.
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  Speaker 2: I didn't I don't remember a lot of watching him
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  Speaker 2: because I don't also don't remember many much of his
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  Speaker 2: teammates in terms of watching them. But I have memories
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  Speaker 2: of him, like what interception against Texas A and M
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  Speaker 2: and he did some summersault on the sideline as he
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  Speaker 2: got tackled the girl Bruce stuff like I have specific
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  Speaker 2: memories of him growing up. And that's just and then,
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  Speaker 2: as you said, watching him with Detroit and watching him
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  Speaker 2: be an all pro and everything he stood for. Yeah,
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  Speaker 2: for me, he's like that guy. So I want to
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  Speaker 2: start this one. Let's do a fun common thing. Let's
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  Speaker 2: talk about our Mount rushmorees of Ohio state linebackers. And
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  Speaker 2: I'll give you my first three and then I'll let
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  Speaker 2: you go because I still think I have to decide
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  Speaker 2: on my fourth. But and this is terms of the
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  Speaker 2: four linebackers that we're gonna put on in my Mount
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  Speaker 2: Rushmore that we watched, that we saw because I didn't
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  Speaker 2: see Tom Kuzno come up with two hundred and forty
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  Speaker 2: four tackles in nineteen seventy eight, but it sounds awesome.
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  Speaker 2: You know, I didn't watch Marcus Merrick before Chris Bielman.
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  Speaker 2: But for me, the three guys that always goes comes
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  Speaker 2: down to you, the three best that I can remember
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  Speaker 2: or saw or no, that's Chris Bielman, A J. Hawk,
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  Speaker 2: and Ryan Shazier. Now, I was in college at the
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  Speaker 2: same time as Andy Katzimore, and that freshman year was incredible.
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  Speaker 2: I think James Laurnitis is a three time All American
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  Speaker 2: certainly bears some consideration, But those three, for me, A J. Hawk,
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  Speaker 2: Ryan Shazier, Chris Pielman. I could throw anybody out there,
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  Speaker 2: and I'm gonna feel good about this monument of rock
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  Speaker 2: that I've got in my backyard.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, I feel very good about your monument of rock.
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  Speaker 3: My Mount Rushmore is Chris Spielman, a J Hawk, James Laurniitis,
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  Speaker 3: and Ryan Shazier. Fifth is Andy Katsenware. I thought my
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  Speaker 3: Ryan Shazer pick would be a little out there, but
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  Speaker 3: you're right there with me. That dude is just a
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  Speaker 3: different animal. And I think he kind of for some reason,
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  Speaker 3: I don't know if it's the era, but doesn't get
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  Speaker 3: brought up as much as these other guys. The speed
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  Speaker 3: that he played with, the intensity, the power that he
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  Speaker 3: generated with me, you know, a relatively lightweight compared to
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  Speaker 3: some of these guys, and leadership, everything about him. We
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  Speaker 3: saw him at the Student Appreciation Day scrimmage and I
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  Speaker 3: was just in awe the first time I'd ever seen him. Say,
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  Speaker 3: oh my god, it's Ryan Shazier. It's crazy, but yeah, man,
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  Speaker 3: the guy was in it. That Wisconsin game, Oh that
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  Speaker 3: Wisconsin hit. Like memories, there's a lot of them when
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  Speaker 3: it comes to Schasier.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, we're in a different jersey. He gets Penn State
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  Speaker 2: to honor our friend, He gets a pick six and
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  Speaker 2: runs it back with that. Tom and I did a
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  Speaker 2: recent We've recorded a Bucky Weekly where we talked about
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  Speaker 2: the We were asked about the best individual seasons in
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  Speaker 2: Ohio state history, and one that I didn't get to
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  Speaker 2: that I wanted to is Ryan Shazier's twenty three team
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  Speaker 2: with one hundred and forty four tackles, twenty three and
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  Speaker 2: a half tackles for loss, seven sacks of just four
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  Speaker 2: forced fumbles. He was awesome and he was completely over
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  Speaker 2: He was overshadowed by Mantiteya, which still annoys me to
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  Speaker 2: this day. And I would I would spend my time
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  Speaker 2: online defending him, fighting for him because not enough people
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  Speaker 2: were talking about him. But he was certainly incredible. And yeah,
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  Speaker 2: my fourth is is James Lord Nidis and the fifth
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  Speaker 2: for me would also be Andy Katsonware. And not that
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  Speaker 2: there are other I think other linebackers better than Andy Katsenware,
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  Speaker 2: but there are certainly other presidents better than Theodore Roosevelt.
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  Speaker 2: So there's yeah, I think if you know, you look
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  Speaker 2: at the actual Mount Rushmore, you're like, well, you know,
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  Speaker 2: it's certainly not the four best presidents, it's for the
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  Speaker 2: big ones. And then certainly you know what it was
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  Speaker 2: being put together Teddy Roosevelt was well known, but I like,
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  Speaker 2: I think those four fit. It's hard to go against
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  Speaker 2: James lord Nidis because he was three time All American.
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  Speaker 2: He got all of the same awards that Andy Katzimware did,
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  Speaker 2: and and he did it very very well. Now I'm
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  Speaker 2: gonna throw up all.
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  Speaker 3: Before you move on number one. Last week we went
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  Speaker 3: uh the same order one to four, and quarterbacks, we
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  Speaker 3: just had the same top five linebackers almost in order
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  Speaker 3: as well. This one surprises me as much as the quarterbacks,
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  Speaker 3: because there are maybe more than the quarterbacks, because there's
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  Speaker 3: so many here that I think we could ask five
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  Speaker 3: other Buckeye fans and have a couple of different names
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  Speaker 3: in here and be like, yeah, all right, that's cool.
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  Speaker 3: Uh So that's pretty interesting. But I want to talk
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  Speaker 3: about James Lorenitis for a second, just in terms of
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  Speaker 3: as a player, and maybe we'll talk about him as
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  Speaker 3: a coach a little later on in his legacy and
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  Speaker 3: everything else, but just in terms of as a player.
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  Speaker 3: I'm getting the feeling from you that you don't quite
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  Speaker 3: have him in that upper upper tier, and I've feel
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  Speaker 3: the same way. It just never quite registered for me
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  Speaker 3: the way it did I think for most others because
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  Speaker 3: I think when we look at all the accolades and
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  Speaker 3: everything he wanted, as great as he was, I think
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  Speaker 3: that there's you know, put a couple other people in
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  Speaker 3: that era on the defense in the same role and
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  Speaker 3: they're bringing home the same awards. And as much as
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  Speaker 3: I loved him, he never measured up to Hawk.
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  Speaker 2: For me, never, No, And I would agree with that.
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  Speaker 2: I think maybe for me it's maybe there's not as
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  Speaker 2: much action in the backfield for me with James Lauronidis
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  Speaker 2: because Aja Hawk had double digit tackles for loss in
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  Speaker 2: a couple of seasons. James laurd Niis had eight and
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  Speaker 2: a half as a sophomore, eight and a half as
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  Speaker 2: a junior. Seven as a senior. He found the ball.
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  Speaker 2: He had five interceptions as a sophomore too. The next
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  Speaker 2: year to the next year, Sacks topped out at five
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  Speaker 2: as a junior. I think he had that huge Texas
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  Speaker 2: game as a sophomore and he didn't that, but he
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  Speaker 2: because he continued to play well. I mean, Ohio State
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  Speaker 2: was the number one team in two thousand and six
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  Speaker 2: for a very long time, played for a national title
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  Speaker 2: in two thousand and seven and did what they could.
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  Speaker 2: They made a BCS Bowl game with a true freshman
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  Speaker 2: quarterback in two thousand and eight. And I think another
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  Speaker 2: thing for me is when you look at James learned
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  Speaker 2: niis he'd always have more assists than solo tackles as well.
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  Speaker 2: And so I'm not trying to push back or anything
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  Speaker 2: like that, because he was still very productive over his time,
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  Speaker 2: but I don't have him up there with those other
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  Speaker 2: three because I think those guys just they made bigger
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  Speaker 2: impacts in terms of in the backfield. And I think
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  Speaker 2: that's something that I also consider when when I look
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  Speaker 2: at this kind of list, and Andy Katimore as a
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  Speaker 2: true freshman like twelve and a half sacks, like twenty
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  Speaker 2: four tackles for loss as a true freshman just basically
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  Speaker 2: point and shoot into the backfield. And maybe it's just
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  Speaker 2: different kind of defense, so you don't need your linebacker
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  Speaker 2: doing that. But yeah, I'm with you. Why why do
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  Speaker 2: you have him kind of just a little bit distance
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  Speaker 2: from everybody else?
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  Speaker 3: Honestly, I feel like it's just it's just the feel,
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  Speaker 3: you know. I can't really point to point to a reason.
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  Speaker 3: I think much of it is that I was so
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  Speaker 3: obsessed with aj Hawk that when he it could have
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  Speaker 3: been that, you know, he came in and people I
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  Speaker 3: felt like were kind of annointing him maybe a little early,
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  Speaker 3: and I might have resented that a little bit, like, here, look,
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  Speaker 3: we just replaced Hawk, Like, no, you didn't. It could
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  Speaker 3: have been some of that, because I am a little
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  Speaker 3: bit like that at times, but it just never resonated
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  Speaker 3: in the same way for me his his play as
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  Speaker 3: Hawks did, and coming right after him also probably you know,
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  Speaker 3: maybe if they were separated a little bit, I might
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  Speaker 3: feel different. I don't think so, but I might, but
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  Speaker 3: just that it was so back to back, one after
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  Speaker 3: the other, and I just I just always felt Hawk
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  Speaker 3: was just a different Alibra player.
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  Speaker 2: Well so did the NFL. I mean, they were both
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  Speaker 2: very good in their their respective for their respective franchises,
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  Speaker 2: but one was what the number five pick and the
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  Speaker 2: other was right at the top of the second round.
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  Speaker 2: Is there a portion of view that you saw Ohigo
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  Speaker 2: State struggle defensively in two thousand and six and two
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  Speaker 2: thousand and seven against Florida and LSU, and there's some
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  Speaker 2: like is there there a little bit of pushback because
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  Speaker 2: of the way those seasons.
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  Speaker 3: Ended, all it could play a role. It might just
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  Speaker 3: have part of that, you know, that overall feel that
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  Speaker 3: I have for it in the way that I came out,
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  Speaker 3: I'd imagine it probably does play a role. And that's
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  Speaker 3: that's true that aj played on some amazing defenses and
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: had a great supporting cast. James had a lot of
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  Speaker 3: guys too. But yeah, they dropped the ball a couple
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  Speaker 3: of times for.
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  Speaker 2: Sure, especially when in one they were a big favorite.
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  Speaker 2: Uh So, like the last show, the Quarterback Show, where
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: I used math to tell everybody who the best quarterback
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  Speaker 2: was of all time at Ohio State, we know firmly,
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  Speaker 2: without question it was J. T. Barrett. I've done the
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: same thing with here. I guess some propriet proprietary formulas
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  Speaker 2: which I don't need to get too far into, solo tackles, assists,
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  Speaker 2: tackles for loss, the yards that were lost, interceptions. I
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: didn't use sacks because that's kind of a sometimes a
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: metric of how aggressive the defensive coordinator is. All Big
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  Speaker 2: Ten selections, all American selections, Chris Pielman number one, Tom
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  Speaker 2: Kuzeno number two, Marcus Americ number three. I think those
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  Speaker 2: might be the top three tacklers as well. The first
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  Speaker 2: guy that we watched that gets put on this list
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  Speaker 2: is a j hawkt for Steve Tovar is I think
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  Speaker 2: a two time All American. He was, he was in
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  Speaker 2: school around the same time that I was. And for me,
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  Speaker 2: number fifty eight, Steve Tovar, big neck roll. He's another
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  Speaker 2: guy that does not get enough love.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, we don't hear much about Tovar at all, and
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  Speaker 3: I totally agree, though I am surprised to see him
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  Speaker 3: at number five on the list here.
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  Speaker 2: And I will say, and I told you this before
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: the show. For some reason, Tommy Eickenberg didn't make it
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: on this list. He should actually be number twenty, number twenty,
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: between Ross Holman and Nil Diggs. Basically, what I did is,
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: these are the top ten top twenty tacklers in Ohio
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: state history. And then I, you know, went and found
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: some other guys like Arval Reese is not number twenty four.
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: I just wanted to see where he was and give
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: some perspective on him, because he's going to be a
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: topic of conversation I'm sure as well. But a pretty
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: good look at some of those guys. Andy Katsmore down
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: there at nine, Randy Gratish, everybody knows Matt Wilhelm another
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  Speaker 2: kind of overlooked All American because that two thousand and
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: two team had so many other guys that were you're
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: just completely focused on, But overall a pretty darn good
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: list of linebackers.
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  Speaker 3: There.
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: We see Lorenzo Styles at sixteen. Some of these guys,
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: like I wasn't familiar with Kelton Danzler, he was an
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: All American, and you see some history here as well.
• 15:05
  Speaker 3: I've never heard of Calton Danzler. As we look at
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: one to twelve, any orders or any guys that finish
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: in the top twelve that surprised you. I do think
• 15:14
  Speaker 3: I'm surprised that gratischar is at number ten again, a
• 15:19
  Speaker 3: guy that I never saw a play, But boy, everything
• 15:22
  Speaker 3: you hear and the stats and everything you put up,
• 15:25
  Speaker 3: the guy's an NFL Hall of Famer. I would have
• 15:28
  Speaker 3: assumed he would be a little higher on the list.
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: But cool to see Pepper there. Pepper, I didn't get
• 15:35
  Speaker 3: to see him at Ohio State, but sure watched a
• 15:37
  Speaker 3: lot of him with the New York Giants. And I
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: remember the day I found out, wait a minute, that's
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: a buck eye. I had no idea, and I was
• 15:44
  Speaker 3: all excited, and then I think he had a little
• 15:47
  Speaker 3: stop at the Browns at one point too, which was cool.
• 15:51
  Speaker 3: But yeah, Willhelm, I'm with you. Underrated, He's so long.
• 15:54
  Speaker 3: As a matter of fact, I just saw him in
• 15:55
  Speaker 3: person for the first time. I could not believe how long.
• 15:59
  Speaker 3: This guy is just enormous. But yeah, awesome, awesome final year.
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  Speaker 3: I mean he was just everywhere making plays and of
• 16:07
  Speaker 3: course the National Championship game. So that stands out to me.
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  Speaker 3: In the top twelve. And we go to the second
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  Speaker 3: side of this graphic here, I've never heard of Calton
• 16:16
  Speaker 3: Dancer Tony ever even heard of him?
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: No, And I think the only reason I've heard of
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: like Ed Thompson and other names is because I've I'm
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: in the record books a lot looking at stuff, so
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: that Calton Danzler is the only name that I wasn't
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: familiar with. But Ray Kwan McMillan, the two times second
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: team All American, Joshua Perry had a bunch of tackles
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: as a senior in twenty fourteen, Ross Homan was just solid,
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: and like we were talking about before the show, Nile
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: Diggs was a forgotten guy and he shouldn't be.
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: So we're a couple of We're a couple of big
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: Nile Diggs fans, and that guy was an absolute animal.
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  Speaker 3: He was an animal. He was everywhere. He was a
• 16:56
  Speaker 3: total dog and played in an era that I don't know,
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  Speaker 3: oh Man, a lot of dogs on those teams, and
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  Speaker 3: for some reason we just we never really get into him.
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: I believe I talked about him with my brother not
• 17:07
  Speaker 3: too long ago, how much we how much we enjoyed
• 17:10
  Speaker 3: watching Niall Diggs play. And I had some time in
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: the league as well. Really really good player. But nice
• 17:18
  Speaker 3: to see Eric Kumero there that the Boses uncle makes
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: a top fifteen on the list.
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: I think he was the number twelve overall draft pick
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: his year, which wo've been like nineteen eighty seven or
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: something like that, as an outside linebacker. Didn't work out,
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: but no, no, not quite. So then we're talking all
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: of these old school linebackers. I wanted to get into
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: an old school linebacker lineup and go with I wanted
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: us to each pick a three to four of any
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: Ohio state linebackers you want. You want two inside linebackers
• 17:47
  Speaker 2: and the two intimidating outside linebackers that will rush the passer,
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: and my two inside linebackers I'll just let you know.
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: I'm going with Ryan Shazier and aj Hawk and I'm
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: not going to apologize for it. And then I've got
• 17:59
  Speaker 2: on the outside Nile Diggs. And then I'm gonna throw
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: r Vl Rees out there because he's big. He's what
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: that pass rush linebacker position looks like. I did think
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: about Alonzo Spelman, who is one of the most incredible
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: athletes to ever come through Ohio State, played legitimately played
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: outside linebacker in the three four for Ohio State, and
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: then within like eight years as a note, is playing
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: defensive tackle for the Cowboys. That's how big that guy was.
• 18:28
  Speaker 2: But I'm going Shazier and Hawk on the inside, Rvel
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: Reese and Nile Diggs on the outside, and I feel
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: just fine about that.
• 18:38
  Speaker 3: So I put this together, thinking, all right, if I
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: want to play in today's game, then I can put
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: my best four together to fit these spots. How am
• 18:48
  Speaker 3: I gonna go about that? And I went with Ryan
• 18:51
  Speaker 3: Chasier standing next to Sunny Styles, and I have got like,
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: you can't run on these guys, you can't pass on
• 18:59
  Speaker 3: the these guys. You've got the two surest tackles, you've got
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: the size dynamic, the mix up between the two of them,
• 19:06
  Speaker 3: and then rushing on the weak side. In that three
• 19:09
  Speaker 3: four I've got rbl Reese. I think that when we
• 19:12
  Speaker 3: look at this cast of characters, he is the absolute
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: best suited of any one of these guys to take
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: on that role on the other side. This is where
• 19:21
  Speaker 3: I had some options here, and ultimately I chose to
• 19:24
  Speaker 3: go with katzen Weer. I think katzen Weer over there
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: in that system could take on anybody you know coming
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: out to try and block him and make plays all
• 19:34
  Speaker 3: over the place, and that for right there, I feel
• 19:38
  Speaker 3: incredibly solid could dominate college football, you know.
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: I think, yeah, as a junior, if I recall correctly,
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: they were listing kats and where at like two hundred
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: and sixty pounds, and it was too big at that point.
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: But when we did an episode of Bucket Weekly where
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: we're picking guys from each from the Trestle era, from
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: the the Urban Meyer era, and the Cooper era to
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: add to this team, and when it came to Katsu
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: where I'm like, well, I don't know if I want
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: him playing inside linebacker in today's game, but I'll put
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: him on the outside. I'll let him be the r
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: VL Reese in Matt Patricia's defense, that sort of thing.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: I got no problem with that. I'll let him set
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: the edge and do what he absolutely and with your
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: picks there, Sonny can also do the edge, Yes, you can.
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: You can move guys in and out and around.
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: So I like, I'll tell you, though, Tony, I was like,
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: I'm sitting here thinking, like, am I being too recency biased?
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: Like I've got Rvel and Sonny in this list, But
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: I honestly think that they're just the two best suited
• 20:37
  Speaker 3: for today's game, and just luckily they came around at
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: this time, and who knows, they'd probably don't play linebacker
• 20:42
  Speaker 3: back in the day, and you know, maybe we would
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: have seen other guys, you know, fill that role if
• 20:48
  Speaker 3: the game was different further back. But uh, yeah, man,
• 20:52
  Speaker 3: I don't think I'm being recency biased here. I think
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: that they think that they're really the best suited for
• 20:56
  Speaker 3: those roles.
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I would agree, because I mean, just look at
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: the NFL in their draft selections as well, with those
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: two guys, and they are both all Americans. If you
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: don't if you don't go with one of those guys,
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: if you just completely ignore them. That's more bias to
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: me than picking them where you're like, well, I don't
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: want to fall for the recency bias, Like well, I mean,
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: did you watch them? They're pretty good, They did some
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: pretty good things. They'll probably help your defense if you
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: go ahead and get.
• 21:26
  Speaker 3: The speaking of that. Then I haven't talked to you
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: about this, but I was kind of going over my
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: top ten and as I'm going down the list, I'm
• 21:36
  Speaker 3: going pretty far before you know, wait, well past ten,
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: before I'm considering rvil Reese. And this is a guy
• 21:43
  Speaker 3: who just went so high in the draft and had
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: a you know, unbelievable plays at Ohio State at certain times,
• 21:54
  Speaker 3: unbelievable skill set and tool set. But if we're just
• 21:57
  Speaker 3: talking about, you know, greatest linebackers in Ohio State history,
• 22:01
  Speaker 3: I've got to see some more production. It's just it's
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: not there. Also, I don't think he was utilized a
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: whole lot in the way you would have liked to
• 22:10
  Speaker 3: have seen him be utilized. His you know, one kind
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: of one and done year. Well, he's not too high
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: up on that list for me. And then Sonny. When
• 22:20
  Speaker 3: we look at Sonny who started two years, I think
• 22:23
  Speaker 3: people you know, looking back. Might you know, even as
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: recently as it was, might not remember that his junior
• 22:30
  Speaker 3: year wasn't great. He got better every week, but the
• 22:33
  Speaker 3: jump from junior year to senior year was exponential. Coming
• 22:38
  Speaker 3: out of his junior year, if you'd entered the draft,
• 22:40
  Speaker 3: we heard people talking about potential fifth round, great athlete,
• 22:44
  Speaker 3: et cetera. What he put together his senior year cemented
• 22:48
  Speaker 3: his legacy. When we look at so many of these
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: other guys, they were dogs as juniors and seniors. And
• 22:52
  Speaker 3: sure he switched positions, we understand totally, but it is
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: what it is. Nonetheless, I mean, he only had one
• 22:58
  Speaker 3: great year.
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, graduated early from high school and played safety for
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: a year and then nickel and then two years as
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: a linebacker, one of those learning the position on the fly,
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: and then you finally saw the finished product. And he'll
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: say he's not a finished product. And I understand that,
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: but as far as the college guy, that that's pretty finished.
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: And RVL Reese a season and a half really if
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: you consider him being the third linebacker in twenty twenty four,
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: but even the second half of this past season last season, like,
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: where was the production? And it is that his fault
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: is that Matt Patricia asking him not to do certain
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: things are not only asking him to do something. So
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: I don't think I would have him in my top
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: ten either, Like I can't have him again over Matt
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: Wilhelm or maybe even Nail Diggs. Like there's a bunch
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: of guys who were productive for multiple seasons that I
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: would have ahead of him. And if you're throwing him
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: in there, it's not because of production. It's because of
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: other reasons. And I guess that's and they're fun reasons.
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: He's fun to watch, and I will say, like I'll,
• 24:03
  Speaker 3: as much as I like my pieson Matt Patricia, will
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: forever resent him for the underutilization of Arvel Reeves because
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: football is fun and I wanted to see that guy
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: have more fun out there. You know. I'll also say
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: that it is fun for us as Buckeye fans to
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: look back and have these very clear cut, similarly timed
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: eras of coachings. You know, when we can go back
• 24:29
  Speaker 3: and look from the Cooper era, the Trestle Ara, to
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: the Urban era to the Day era, and they're all like,
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: you know, there's a good chunk of time there. There's
• 24:38
  Speaker 3: full cycles that have come through and tons of great
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: players for everybody. So it's always fun to talk about
• 24:46
  Speaker 3: the best from this era, and these types of conversations
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: I enjoy.
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: So let's move to this era the present day. And
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: if you're watching on YouTube, please hit that thumbs up
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: subscribe to the Buckeye Insider's channel if you've not yet
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: done so.
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: I got a shirt, Tony, look at this.
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm going to have to get some swag as well.
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: Click on Juck's shirt. See if that then I just
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: paused the video though, so just be careful with that.
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: But as we're talking president day with buck Eyinsiders and
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: also present day with the Ohio State linebackers.
• 25:20
  Speaker 3: What's your concern level?
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: Because you've you've said goodbye to Sunny Styles, You've said
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: good bye goodbye to Arval Reese, You're saying hello to
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: a new middle linebacker. Oiostat has said a first team
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: All Big Ten linebacker each of the past four seasons.
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: Can Peyton Pierce continue that legacy? What kind of addition
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: is Christian Alegro, the unproven nature of TJ. Alfred and
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: Riley Petty John, and you can throw in Garrett Stover.
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: There's a bunch of young talent, but the only proven
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: player at this point in the Ohio State defense is
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: Peyton Pierce, and he's only proven as the third linebacker.
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: So what kind of concerns do you have this year
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: as far as Peyton goes.
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: It's like, my gosh, man, the way we heard and
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: continue to hear James Laurnitis talk about him, it just
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: feels to me like with you know, an additional Now
• 26:11
  Speaker 3: he's got that experience another offseason. Peyton knows not just
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: his role, all the linebacker roles and what everybody else
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: on the defense is supposed to be doing. He was
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: into that, like you know, early on in his second year.
• 26:24
  Speaker 3: He was already had the linebacker spots mastered and was
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: going through that. And despite the physical limitations when compared
• 26:33
  Speaker 3: to Sonny, you when you know things that well, and
• 26:37
  Speaker 3: we've heard Laurenitis talk about this one hundred times, you know,
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: when you don't have to think about it, when you
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: see all your keys and you're just reacting, you're actually
• 26:46
  Speaker 3: playing faster than a guy who's faster than you, who's
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: not as smart as you. Up here, when we see
• 26:52
  Speaker 3: that twinkle in Laurenitis's eyes when he talks about Peyton
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: I think it's about that, the toughness and that right there,
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: because that's how James had to master the spot and
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: he was so good at it that he sees so
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: much of that from himself in Peyton. So that said,
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: with his physical gifts that you know, he's no slouch obviously, Yeah,
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: but he is a little limited. But I am really
• 27:18
  Speaker 3: confident in him as a as a leader of the defense,
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: the point, the point guard, the Cody Simon. I think
• 27:25
  Speaker 3: he's gonna do really well in that spot. When we
• 27:27
  Speaker 3: talk about a legro, a guy who you know, shows
• 27:33
  Speaker 3: a lot of stuff that it's positive, but there is
• 27:37
  Speaker 3: part of me that's like, man, he was kind of
• 27:39
  Speaker 3: getting pushed out for two freshmen at Wisconsin. Luke Fickel
• 27:44
  Speaker 3: knows linebackers very very well, coach him for a long time.
• 27:47
  Speaker 3: That's his spot, and there is some of that that
• 27:50
  Speaker 3: concerns me. But then he comes over and now he's
• 27:53
  Speaker 3: working with, to me, the best linebacker coach in the game,
• 27:57
  Speaker 3: one of one of the two best in all of
• 27:59
  Speaker 3: college football, and that should certainly increase what he's going
• 28:04
  Speaker 3: to do. As far as physical gifts. He's big, he's long,
• 28:08
  Speaker 3: he's fast, he's not not the quickest, you know, you know,
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: redirecting in things of that nature at the twitchiest guy,
• 28:18
  Speaker 3: but we've seen him plant tackles on their butts. He
• 28:21
  Speaker 3: can rush, so I feel pretty good about that as
• 28:24
  Speaker 3: a one two combo. When we talk about the unproven guys,
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: TJ seems to be really coming around. Really unfortunate that
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: Riley missed, But when it comes to the two of them,
• 28:36
  Speaker 3: I am just I really like TJ. Always liked TJ.
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: I love what he brings. But to me, I think
• 28:43
  Speaker 3: Riley has a chance to be special, and I think
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: he's special up here too, And I think that if
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: we're just talking about, you know, productivity, I think that
• 28:52
  Speaker 3: maybe that starts with a little more TJ. But maybe
• 28:56
  Speaker 3: Riley just catches right up in the fall quickly and
• 28:59
  Speaker 3: surpasses him.
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: I think you're the coaches are hoping that, And I
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: remember asking, I think Ryan Day about this in terms
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: of not even Riley Petty John catching up with the defense,
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: but them catching up with what Riley Petty John can
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: do because they only know so much and they didn't
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: get to find out anymore in the spring, which is unfortunate.
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: So I'm like trying to figure out. And one of
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: the questions I have here is, so who are the
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: top three tacklers. I fully expect Peyton Pierce to lead
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: the team in tackles, like he's a Texas tackling machine.
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: You go look at his high school numbers, and I know,
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: high school whatever, but I'm always more encouraged by the
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: linebackers that put up a ton of numbers in high
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: school than the ones that they're ranked highly. But you know,
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: why did you only have fifty four tackles? What's that about?
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: And usually there's reasons for that and it's not because
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: of system or anything like that. But he's a machine.
• 29:56
  Speaker 2: He's like Derreck Henry in terms of high school carries.
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: That's that's Peyton Piers with tackles. And then I sided
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: with like Christian Legro being the number two tackler, But
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: I don't know that that's actually going to come to
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: fruition because who knows what they're going to be asking
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: him to do. If they want him to be a
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: little passive as an edge setter that sort of thing,
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: then you know there probably won't be a ton of
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: tackles there. I'm you know, I'm fascinated to see how
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: they use Riley Petty John. If it's differently, I guess
• 30:28
  Speaker 2: it has to be differently than TJ. Alfred as like
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: a will linebacker at this point. But we just we
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: don't know. And so I wouldn't be shocked if you've
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: got ninety tackles for Peyton Pierce and like forty five
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: for three other guys.
• 30:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that you could be honest something. So
• 30:49
  Speaker 3: what I had in the breakdown was, you know, looking
• 30:52
  Speaker 3: at last year, it was it was pretty defined as
• 30:56
  Speaker 3: as a one two three with Sonny Rvel Peyton, and
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: there was a pretty pretty decent split. I had a
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: written down and somehow I've lost it in my stack
• 31:07
  Speaker 3: of papers here. But when we look at this year,
• 31:12
  Speaker 3: if you went Peyton Pierce leading tackler by a good margin,
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: then a Legro then maybe dropped down quite a bit,
• 31:21
  Speaker 3: and had Riley and TJ in a similar range, that
• 31:26
  Speaker 3: to me seems like probably pretty likely because I do think,
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: you know, as good as I think Riley's going to be,
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: I think you really want to play TJ. You want
• 31:36
  Speaker 3: to get that guy involved for sure, and he can
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: do it. And also just one dude of the week,
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: one of the three Dudes of the Week, So he's
• 31:44
  Speaker 3: clearly putting in the work and making them happy. That's
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: you know, that's the big honor this time of year,
• 31:49
  Speaker 3: is giving him the Dude of the Week. And his
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: neck is looks like sun now it's it's gone this direction,
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: both both ways. So he's looking here huge, he's looking massive,
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: and he's becoming a favorite. I just don't think he's
• 32:04
  Speaker 3: as skilled is Riley, and I just in the way
• 32:10
  Speaker 3: they're going to use those guys I've never known. Now.
• 32:13
  Speaker 3: I've heard a lot of talk about TJ as to
• 32:15
  Speaker 3: where they're gonna use him. I don't even know where
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: he fits best yet. Don't think we've seen him enough.
• 32:19
  Speaker 3: You know, we saw him a little bit playing on
• 32:22
  Speaker 3: the edge, I think last year, and I thought he
• 32:26
  Speaker 3: looked pretty dog one good playing down there at the edge,
• 32:29
  Speaker 3: and he's a little small for that. But it's just
• 32:33
  Speaker 3: it's so unknown with those two. And you look back
• 32:36
  Speaker 3: in that transfer portal. If they didn't bring in a
• 32:39
  Speaker 3: leg gro like, what we'd be looking at right now
• 32:41
  Speaker 3: would be such a total mystery that it would kind
• 32:44
  Speaker 3: of be terrifying, really, but.
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: It'd be but we we'd we'd have a bigger question,
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: but there'd be fewer questions you know where you know,
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: you know who the three are. But I would say,
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: let's not forget about Garrett Stover, who was the number
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: two middle linebacker in the spring. Now is he the
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: number two middle linebacker if Riley Penny John is back?
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: And I don't even I don't even know if Riley
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: Petty John's a middle linebacker at that any point, we
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: saw t J. Alfred playing will We saw him on
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: playing the sam on the edge like r VL Reese
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: at times last year. So that's also one of the
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: confusing parts about spring is you get to see all
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: these different guys in different spots. Peyton Pierce, I don't
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: think I ever moved from where he was, and there's
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: a reason for that because that's his you know, he
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: is that guy. He is that middle linebacker. He's the
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: green dot. No need to move him around. But other
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: than that, when you're talking about over the past what
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: four seasons, there's always been five seasons or so, there's
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: always been this is the third linebacker. For two years
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: it was it was Cody Simon, then it was rvel Ree,
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: last year it was Peyton Pierce. I have no idea.
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: I could not tell you whether that's gonna be tj
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: Alford or Riley Petty John. I assume it's going to
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: be one of those two, but I don't know that
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: a complete coin flip in my mind as to who
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: it will be. And I don't like dismissing tj Alford
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: because Riley Petty John is the higher ranked guy. And
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: I don't like dismissing Riley Petty John because he missed springs.
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: So I'm just gonna pass it on to you.
• 34:18
  Speaker 3: It's true. And when we took I mean Garrett Stover
• 34:21
  Speaker 3: is part of the conversation. I was surprised that Garrett
• 34:24
  Speaker 3: Stover was running number two, behind behind Peyton Pierced. And
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: it was not so much, not so much. I mean,
• 34:37
  Speaker 3: he has pedigree. He was a top one hundred guy
• 34:39
  Speaker 3: coming in. It's not like he was some bum coming in.
• 34:41
  Speaker 3: He's got pedigree, one of the faster guys on the team.
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: We heard that from everybody last year. And he even
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: made the board. I think he was, you know, the
• 34:51
  Speaker 3: miles per hour board. He was up there like number
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: three or something on the entire team, which is pretty incredible.
• 34:57
  Speaker 3: But Tom took a picture last year Tony, and I
• 35:00
  Speaker 3: can't get it out of my head. It's Garrett Stover
• 35:04
  Speaker 3: standing next to r bel Reese and thinking that those
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: two guys play the same position is like, dude, that
• 35:10
  Speaker 3: guy can't be on the field. Are you kidding me?
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: I mean, it was incredible the difference in size. I
• 35:16
  Speaker 3: just I wish I had the picture. It was just like,
• 35:18
  Speaker 3: no way, no flipping way, And that scares me. And
• 35:24
  Speaker 3: then I look at sincere and I watched this kid
• 35:27
  Speaker 3: move around. We watched him in the spring game, and
• 35:29
  Speaker 3: it's just like, wow, man, sure he's got a lot
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: to learn, but my gosh, that talent is undeniable. And
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: I wonder how long a guy like Stover can hold
• 35:38
  Speaker 3: him off because he's a force of nature and he's
• 35:41
  Speaker 3: coming well.
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: And Eli Lee was the most middle linebacker in the game.
• 35:47
  Speaker 3: Let's not forget Eli. So I think.
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: We know there are questions. I think they're going to
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: be okay, though, because there's a lot of answers, and
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: there's veteran answers in terms of Allegro and Peers, and
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: there's athletic answers in terms of everybody else. So I
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: think I think they'll find their way. And if they've
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: only got two linebackers that are good enough to play,
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: good news you play, you play a nickel defense, So
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: I think you're gonna be okay. And that five man
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: front that he likes, that's usually got one linebacker and
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: then one linebacker in back, so I think they're gonna
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: be okay there.
• 36:25
  Speaker 3: They have a lot of comfort in the coach I
• 36:28
  Speaker 3: think when I when I feel that certain kind of
• 36:30
  Speaker 3: way about a coach, and I really think James loriniis
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: and Glenn Schuman of the two best linebacker coaches in
• 36:35
  Speaker 3: the country, I just trust him. I just trust him
• 36:39
  Speaker 3: that his unit is going to be really solid, to
• 36:41
  Speaker 3: really really good.
• 36:44
  Speaker 2: It's I mean, when hasn't it been. And even as
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: a GA when he when it was his room and
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: Jim Knowles was a defensive coordinator, but he was a GA,
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: they were they were really good, and they continue to
• 36:55
  Speaker 2: be really good. And there's no reason to expect with
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: his tea, his development, his recruiting that suddenly you lose
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: your two top ten picks and now now they go
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: to hell, They're not gonna go They're gonna be They
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: should be just fine. They might be a lot better
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: than just fine. The fact that they went into the
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: portal is interesting, but I think that's more a result
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: of we need to continue to try to get older,
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: or let's let's try to stay the same age that
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: sort of thing, rather than these guys can't play because
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: they want to play. Tj Alfred and Riley Petty John.
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: They played them last year because they don't want to
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: lose them, So they're gonna try to give them some snaps.
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: And you're not bringing in somebody so that those two
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: guys can sit. You're just trying to make sure you've
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: got enough options. And then the job of Matt Patricia
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: and James Lord Nidas is to make sure that those
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: guys feel like they've got a spot, they've got a role,
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: and that they can produce in that role, because one,
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: you're paying them to produce. Two, you don't want to
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: lose them when you had plans for them, and you've
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: got to figure out, well, what are we going to
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: do now, because the one thing they don't want to
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: lose is you know, you lose Christian Legro after the season,
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: and then you lose one of Riley Penny John or
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: tg Alford because they want to go play somewhere or
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: get more money, and now you're in a position where like, well,
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: now we've got to bring in somebody else, and then
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: Sincere Johnson's like, well what about me? And then it's
• 38:18
  Speaker 2: just this perpetual thing. And I one hundred thousand percent
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: believe they want to get their young guys on the field,
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: and so if you do, then do it and don't
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: wait until well, you know, we just we just didn't
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: have enough of a lead to get these guys out
• 38:33
  Speaker 2: there as much as possible.
• 38:34
  Speaker 3: You know, this has been I think the fan base
• 38:37
  Speaker 3: in general, the sentiment one of the biggest complaints throughout
• 38:41
  Speaker 3: Ryan Day's tenure is not getting the young guys out
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: early enough. And people want to see it. But now
• 38:45
  Speaker 3: it's obviously, like you said, it's more important than ever.
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: It's kind of like you gotta do it. But then
• 38:50
  Speaker 3: you look at the schedule this year, boy, not too
• 38:53
  Speaker 3: many games, look like you're gonna have this layup lead.
• 38:56
  Speaker 3: Like last year was such the perfect year for these
• 38:59
  Speaker 3: young dudes to be playing a ton and it didn't
• 39:02
  Speaker 3: happen as much. But when we look at guys like
• 39:06
  Speaker 3: a Legro, if they enact the five for five thing
• 39:10
  Speaker 3: that you know that's a guy that could potentially stay.
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: There's a couple of guys like that, and then they
• 39:14
  Speaker 3: kind of throw off the map and as we look
• 39:17
  Speaker 3: at that could be pretty advantageous for Ohio State in
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: a lot of spots. It also makes coaches in some
• 39:24
  Speaker 3: time some decisions, right, Like, you know what you got
• 39:27
  Speaker 3: with this guy, right, he's solid, solid to good. Now
• 39:31
  Speaker 3: he's a year older, and sometimes that keeps you from
• 39:35
  Speaker 3: taking that risk with the younger guy and letting him
• 39:38
  Speaker 3: go out there and really get his feet wet, take
• 39:40
  Speaker 3: his lumps, and then potentially emerge into a superstar who
• 39:45
  Speaker 3: would be much better than this guy who's safe. So
• 39:48
  Speaker 3: I don't really like the conundrum that puts you, and
• 39:50
  Speaker 3: I think all in all, I originally thought that was
• 39:52
  Speaker 3: gonna be a net positive, and now I'm starting to think,
• 39:55
  Speaker 3: you know, this might balance out like anything else.
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the five for five is gonna cost some miss
• 40:00
  Speaker 2: use because if you're if it creates a situation where
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: you've got guys that are staying longer than anticipated, then
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: you've got the young guys that you've recruited are like,
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: so I'm gonna be here an extra year before I
• 40:13
  Speaker 2: really get to play, So you're gonna it's the same
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: thing we talked about on the last show. When if
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: Julian Saying comes back, what is there without winning a
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: national championship? What is the decision making process between Julian
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: Saying and Tavian Saint Clair When you know how far
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: you've made it with one guy and you don't know
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: how far you could make with the other, but you
• 40:33
  Speaker 2: should like to find out as opposed to letting somebody
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: else find out. And the five for five is going
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: to create the same thing at positions that maybe aren't
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: ready to leave for the NFL or more developmental positions.
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: So I think that's gonna be high drama and the
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: Internet will not be happy about whatever happens. How could
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: you let a two year starter leave? And then if
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: you don't, then it's like, how could you let an
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: unproven young linebacker leave a four or five star and
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: now he's going to go somewhere And it's like, these
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: are all great things for teams and players and coaches,
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: but it just creates another issue that coaches have to
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: deal with. And they've got for all the money in
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: the world that they make, they've got a lot of
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: issues that they've got to deal with right now, and
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: this is just gonna be another one.
• 41:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah. For as much as we you know, I mean,
• 41:25
  Speaker 3: as fans of college football kind of lament a lot
• 41:28
  Speaker 3: of the changes that have happened, it sure makes it
• 41:30
  Speaker 3: so much more complex and interesting, and roster management is
• 41:34
  Speaker 3: just the possibilities are endless. What's the right strategy? I mean,
• 41:38
  Speaker 3: it's all so much fun to discuss. I really love. Yeah, definitely,
• 41:43
  Speaker 3: that's going to be a wild one. When they enact
• 41:44
  Speaker 3: the five for five we're gonna see I mean, and
• 41:46
  Speaker 3: not just at Ohio State, everywhere. So then the options
• 41:49
  Speaker 3: open up to potentially bring in some guys you missed
• 41:51
  Speaker 3: on the recruiting trail to backfill.
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: Speaking of the recruiting trail, so let's move to the
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: future of the Ohio State linebacker situation and having James
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: Laura Nidas as that guy that is putting everything together,
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: I think is as good as you could hope for.
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: It's advantageous. It's he's got a good eye, he's got
• 42:16
  Speaker 2: good teaching, he's got a good place to sell, and
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: he's doing a very good job of that. I think
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: fair to say yes or no, he is the best
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: recruiter on the roster. I mean, Larry Johnson's doing a
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: bang up job right now in terms of interest and stuff,
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: But is he the best recruiter on the staff right
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: now in your opinion?
• 42:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah? Absolutely absolutely. You know, when we look at this era,
• 42:42
  Speaker 3: it's so much more different and maybe not as consequential
• 42:46
  Speaker 3: for guys to be great recruiters as position coaches and
• 42:49
  Speaker 3: you but you can really tell the ones that are
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: really you know, they're working and doing a great job
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: in having a great class because they decided that they
• 42:59
  Speaker 3: were going to invest in this position this particular cycle
• 43:03
  Speaker 3: for whatever you know, whatever that is, or the ones
• 43:05
  Speaker 3: who are just gonna get it done regardless, and you
• 43:09
  Speaker 3: can just see the difference. And James is always going
• 43:12
  Speaker 3: to get it done regardless.
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: And it helps that Glennville is now back and has
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: been back for a handful of years because for a
• 43:21
  Speaker 2: while things were quiet there and now you're continuing to
• 43:24
  Speaker 2: see like that. That's beneficial. Frankly Pickerington as well. You
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: can throw the fact that Pickerington has blown up. It
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: has helped Ohio maintain some level of talent. So if
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: I call him the new Brian Hartline in terms of
• 43:39
  Speaker 2: the ace recruiter of the staff. I think that's, you know,
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: maybe something for people to think about. But I will
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: tell you this, and I know how much you you love, love,
• 43:49
  Speaker 2: love all Big ten teams and the people who make
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: those teams and they come up with them. If I
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: tell you that Brian Hartline, of the twenty four players,
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: the twenty four receivers that he signed in his time
• 44:02
  Speaker 2: at Ohio State, only four of them were first team
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: all Big ten. Does this sound like a successful recruiter
• 44:08
  Speaker 2: to you.
• 44:09
  Speaker 3: No, No, that does not seem like a very high
• 44:12
  Speaker 3: hit rate. If I told you, never mind, I'm not
• 44:14
  Speaker 3: going to get into it. But everybody gets mad at
• 44:17
  Speaker 3: me if I point out Cortes Ankton's resume.
• 44:21
  Speaker 2: And we will eventually talk about receivers and we will
• 44:24
  Speaker 2: be talking about that. But yeah, of those those four,
• 44:29
  Speaker 2: that does not include Jackson Smith and Jigba or a
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: Mecca a Buca, who are just just finely.
• 44:34
  Speaker 3: Those guys aren't all Big ten calorer, right.
• 44:38
  Speaker 2: But there's there's the ideal of what Brian Hartline was
• 44:43
  Speaker 2: and then there's the reality. And I think James Lowerannidis
• 44:46
  Speaker 2: is somewhere in the middle of that, which is perfect
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: because it's it's hard to land five star after five
• 44:54
  Speaker 2: star when you can only afford one, and then you've
• 44:56
  Speaker 2: got to get a four, and then you get a three.
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: And that's kind of the way the receiver situation is
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: at this point. If you get two five stars, you
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: may be getting a deal with someone because you just
• 45:07
  Speaker 2: there's only so much money to go around. So it's
• 45:10
  Speaker 2: the importance of recruiting and the importance of having great recruiters.
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: I think it's still yes, you want though, yeah, but
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: you can only do so much. So it's almost easier
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: nowadays for say a guy like James Lord. Now you've
• 45:27
  Speaker 2: got a lot of pressure, but your coaches, your head
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: coach and your general manager know, like, I'm only giving
• 45:34
  Speaker 2: you so much leash to go, and I'm only giving
• 45:36
  Speaker 2: you so much somebody such a big bag of McDonald's
• 45:38
  Speaker 2: cash to go and get guys. So make sure you
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: get one and then whatever else after that. You know,
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: this is where the scouting and all of that, the
• 45:48
  Speaker 2: eye for the talent comes into play. And that's not
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: just the position coach, that's also the general manager. That's
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: also the defensive coordinator who get put into that. But
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: overall with orniis and we'll see how much longer he's
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: at Ohio State. How do you feel about the future
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: of the linebacker position?
• 46:06
  Speaker 3: My gosh, I feel so unbelievable about it, especially with him.
• 46:10
  Speaker 3: And boy, you want to talk about scouting, you know,
• 46:13
  Speaker 3: when we look early in a class at whatever list
• 46:18
  Speaker 3: of you know, Okay, here's the top ten linebackers in
• 46:20
  Speaker 3: the country. Those guys are so coveted, they cost so
• 46:24
  Speaker 3: much money, they're so hard to get, they're so hard
• 46:27
  Speaker 3: to land. And this dude landed a top ten linebacker,
• 46:31
  Speaker 3: one that whenever it was all said and done, who
• 46:35
  Speaker 3: was committed to wake Forest and only had a wake
• 46:37
  Speaker 3: Forest offer, And James Lornight has got him meat Ohio
• 46:40
  Speaker 3: s date, and that to me is one of the
• 46:42
  Speaker 3: all time, Like, wow, he just got this basically like
• 46:46
  Speaker 3: free top ten linebacker who's six foot five, two hundred
• 46:49
  Speaker 3: ten pounds. I'm talking about Brax and rembered of course,
• 46:52
  Speaker 3: and then followed that up with Prince Goldsby, another top
• 46:55
  Speaker 3: ten linebacker with the same build. And it's very clear
• 46:59
  Speaker 3: what he after here with these type of guys. He's saying, Okay, well,
• 47:03
  Speaker 3: we had rvel here in this nice tidy package for
• 47:05
  Speaker 3: me to move and bring him up and do this
• 47:08
  Speaker 3: with him. Let's let's get him when they're pupps and
• 47:11
  Speaker 3: grow them into that. And these guys both are just
• 47:15
  Speaker 3: crazy fast, crazy long, couple of those body types. And
• 47:20
  Speaker 3: then you find the guys just you know, hanging out
• 47:23
  Speaker 3: of Glenville Kaylin Bailey three star, number seven fifty in
• 47:26
  Speaker 3: the country, and I think that recruitment is one that
• 47:30
  Speaker 3: the Buck guys will win. This kid is absolutely a
• 47:34
  Speaker 3: blue chipper, forget that ranking, so explosive, so twitched up,
• 47:40
  Speaker 3: you know. I think he'll definitely be a factor in
• 47:42
  Speaker 3: this defense moving forward. So really love this class. Obviously,
• 47:46
  Speaker 3: Quintin Sipher was one of his number one picks. And
• 47:48
  Speaker 3: if you're one of James Loernii's number one picks, I
• 47:50
  Speaker 3: know you're going to be a star. It's just like,
• 47:53
  Speaker 3: I have so much confidence in everything this guy does.
• 47:56
  Speaker 3: When we talk about Buck guys who've gone into coaching,
• 48:00
  Speaker 3: there's a lot of them. You know, Eddie George, we
• 48:02
  Speaker 3: could add him to the list, and there's a lot
• 48:03
  Speaker 3: of the there's none that I would rather lead the
• 48:06
  Speaker 3: program as the head coach. In a totally different discussion
• 48:09
  Speaker 3: than James Laurnitis being in a room when James Laurniis
• 48:13
  Speaker 3: walks in. It's that old quote my dad used to
• 48:16
  Speaker 3: say it, you know, like guys want to be him
• 48:19
  Speaker 3: and girls want him or something like that. Like he's
• 48:21
  Speaker 3: just got this presence about him that is so different
• 48:25
  Speaker 3: than anybody I've ever been around. I mean, it's just
• 48:27
  Speaker 3: like this dude is that dude? And gosh, if he
• 48:31
  Speaker 3: was leading Ohio State, I would feel so comfortable with it.
• 48:34
  Speaker 3: But of course, you know he's going to have to
• 48:37
  Speaker 3: things will happen Before that ever happens, He'll move around
• 48:40
  Speaker 3: and go somewhere else. I'm imagining, Well, they don't know,
• 48:44
  Speaker 3: I see.
• 48:45
  Speaker 2: I think he will eventually be Ohio State's head coach.
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: I I don't know that he needs to go somewhere
• 48:54
  Speaker 2: to do that. I think, you know, because we saw
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: Ryan Day. His first head coaching job was Ohio State
• 49:00
  Speaker 2: and he was the Ohio State assistant. So they've shown
• 49:03
  Speaker 2: that that's not necessarily the case. However, it's going to
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: be almost impossible to keep him while Ryan Day is still,
• 49:12
  Speaker 2: you know, happily employed at Ohio State.
• 49:15
  Speaker 3: So yeah, I.
• 49:20
  Speaker 2: Will he go somewhere, Like who knows how long Matt
• 49:22
  Speaker 2: Patricia will be around. Matt Patricia is grooming him to
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: be a defensive coordinator, and then you know, you know
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: what's going to happen after that. But you know, will
• 49:30
  Speaker 2: that defensive coordinatorship be somewhere else? I feel like this
• 49:34
  Speaker 2: is a guy that Ohio State will always have the
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: opportunity to bring back home. Now we can say the
• 49:40
  Speaker 2: same thing about Marcus Freeman. I don't know if that's true.
• 49:42
  Speaker 3: I don't think that's true. There you go.
• 49:47
  Speaker 2: I don't see that happening with James Lorinidis, but we
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: shall see. The recruiting aspect of it, and the size
• 49:56
  Speaker 2: of the players remighted me of the fact that Asa
• 49:58
  Speaker 2: Birch the one of the top ten edge rushers in
• 50:02
  Speaker 2: the nation twenty twenty eight and more for More in
• 50:05
  Speaker 2: Ohio For More in Ohio. He was working with the
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: linebackers this past week at camp to give you an idea.
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: He's big, sixty five to twenty, the son of former
• 50:14
  Speaker 2: Wolverine Alfie Birch, which would be interesting to see if
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: you can go ahead and bring in a Michigan legacy
• 50:21
  Speaker 2: if you want to, if you want to prove your
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: recruiting chops that sort of thing. But do you think
• 50:28
  Speaker 2: let's talk about James Lorditis's future. What I feel like,
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: if can he can he and Matt Patricia coexist for
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: more than a couple of years before somebody's gonna throw
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: a lot of cash at James Lordidis.
• 50:46
  Speaker 3: No way somebody's coming with that wad of cash. But
• 50:50
  Speaker 3: I'll also say a couple of things. And number one,
• 50:52
  Speaker 3: I don't feel like Patricia is a long term Ohio
• 50:56
  Speaker 3: State guy by any so I don't think that. I mean,
• 50:59
  Speaker 3: I think one more year out of him, I'll feel grateful.
• 51:03
  Speaker 3: It was pretty clear that he was willing to leave
• 51:08
  Speaker 3: and listening to offers in the offseason and he didn't
• 51:12
  Speaker 3: get the one that he wanted. These contracts mean absolutely
• 51:16
  Speaker 3: nothing with these guys anymore. And if he gets that
• 51:18
  Speaker 3: right offer, and that'll probably come if he does a
• 51:22
  Speaker 3: really good job this year with a much less talented crew,
• 51:25
  Speaker 3: in the eyes of the NFL front offices, that Matt
• 51:27
  Speaker 3: Patricia has totally resurrected his career. Time to give him
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: a new opportunity, and I could absolutely see him leaving
• 51:35
  Speaker 3: at the end of this year, like no doubt about it.
• 51:37
  Speaker 3: Maybe one more year. I just don't think he's long
• 51:39
  Speaker 3: for Ohio State. But I'll also say this, I feel
• 51:43
  Speaker 3: like offensive and defensive coordinator are such highly specific specialized
• 51:50
  Speaker 3: positions this day and age in college football, and I
• 51:53
  Speaker 3: don't think the skill set that it takes to be
• 51:56
  Speaker 3: an excellent head coach, which James Lornidis has that skill set,
• 52:00
  Speaker 3: that is his skill set, that is Brian Hartline's skill set.
• 52:04
  Speaker 3: I think it's a totally different skill set from being
• 52:07
  Speaker 3: a coordinator and calling plays, and I just don't and
• 52:11
  Speaker 3: I think people are in head offices are recognizing this. Now.
• 52:15
  Speaker 3: I don't need this guy to be the guy that
• 52:17
  Speaker 3: does that or even have experience with that. I need
• 52:20
  Speaker 3: him to be able to hire the guys that do
• 52:22
  Speaker 3: that and delegate and be the CEO of the program.
• 52:26
  Speaker 3: That is the Heartline skill set. That's the Laura and
• 52:29
  Speaker 3: Iitis skill set, that's the Ryan Days skill set. He
• 52:31
  Speaker 3: just also happens to be a great offensive mind as well,
• 52:35
  Speaker 3: and that's how he came up through it. But I
• 52:38
  Speaker 3: just don't ever see the need anymore moving forward to
• 52:42
  Speaker 3: say we got to cram this guy into this hole
• 52:45
  Speaker 3: that he doesn't fit in, like Heartline, before he can
• 52:47
  Speaker 3: be that head coach. We're gonna make him have this
• 52:49
  Speaker 3: crappy year call and plays and it's just not what
• 52:53
  Speaker 3: he done. Is it's just a special set? No?
• 52:56
  Speaker 2: I like that. That's I mean what John Harbaugh was
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: a special team's core before he went and became a
• 53:01
  Speaker 2: head coach. You're looking for the idea that you have
• 53:04
  Speaker 2: to climb each of these specific wrongs of this ladder,
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: and you've got to spend time with this coordinator. Wrong?
• 53:11
  Speaker 2: Is I think it is becoming antiquated with the way
• 53:16
  Speaker 2: that you know, analytics has taken over and all of
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: these other things. Just the way that you look at
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: things is different in terms of gms and owners and
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: putting stuff together team presidents. That the idea of like if,
• 53:30
  Speaker 2: so what if you've never called plays? You know, can
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: you can you run? Can you run this program? Can
• 53:35
  Speaker 2: you keep it organized? Can you get the most out
• 53:38
  Speaker 2: of players? Will they follow you? And if all of
• 53:40
  Speaker 2: those answers are yes, But you've never called a game before,
• 53:44
  Speaker 2: are you going to be calling in the game when
• 53:45
  Speaker 2: you're the head coach?
• 53:46
  Speaker 1: No?
• 53:47
  Speaker 2: So what does it matter? So? I don't think it's now.
• 53:52
  Speaker 2: If you can do all of that, that's fine, And
• 53:54
  Speaker 2: I'm I wouldn't mind seeing what he can do as
• 53:57
  Speaker 2: a defensive courts and we when we say coordinator, that's
• 54:01
  Speaker 2: just another way of saying a guy calling the plays,
• 54:04
  Speaker 2: and you know I wouldn't mind seeing him do that.
• 54:07
  Speaker 2: I have no idea what it would be. I think
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: it depends on a lot of this is philosophy. What
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: does the head coach want? But also I don't know
• 54:15
  Speaker 2: that it's necessary. And that's why, like there, I know
• 54:21
  Speaker 2: there are coaches don't Ohio state that they don't necessarily
• 54:24
  Speaker 2: want to be a coordinator, but they do want to
• 54:25
  Speaker 2: be a head coach and those opportunities will become available
• 54:29
  Speaker 2: to them. And for lord Nis, I don't know that.
• 54:36
  Speaker 2: I'm sure he would like to be a coordinator. I
• 54:39
  Speaker 2: would agree with you. I don't know that it's necessary,
• 54:40
  Speaker 2: but it feels like, well, that's that's just the next
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: job you have to get to be a head coach,
• 54:45
  Speaker 2: unless you want to take a lower job like Urban
• 54:47
  Speaker 2: Meyer going from receivers coach to head coach at Bowling Green.
• 54:50
  Speaker 2: Does James lord Ninis want to do that?
• 54:52
  Speaker 3: I don't know.
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: I think you get once you're you have a taste
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: of big time college football and James Lord Ninis has
• 54:59
  Speaker 2: had that both Notre Dame and Ohio State. It's a
• 55:03
  Speaker 2: lot to ask to take a step down to go
• 55:06
  Speaker 2: be a head coach rather than I guess I'll just
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: go be a defensive coordinator somewhere just as big.
• 55:12
  Speaker 3: You know. I was. Yeah. I was talking to an
• 55:15
  Speaker 3: Ohio State staffer on Tuesday and going through his past
• 55:19
  Speaker 3: resume at all his different jobs, and he was like
• 55:21
  Speaker 3: you And then I was at Akron. He's at the
• 55:22
  Speaker 3: University of Akron, and his next stepping stone was a
• 55:27
  Speaker 3: step backwards to one double A and he was just
• 55:29
  Speaker 3: so offended by it. And I'm thinking, like, you know,
• 55:32
  Speaker 3: to anybody else on the outside looking at going from
• 55:35
  Speaker 3: Akron to Youngstown State, that's even Stephen. But but yeah, man,
• 55:38
  Speaker 3: you know you're you're dropping back. There's there's something to it.
• 55:41
  Speaker 3: They don't want to do it, and I feel like
• 55:44
  Speaker 3: Heartline did the offensive coordinator out reluctantly. I don't I
• 55:48
  Speaker 3: don't think. I mean, I think he wanted to learn.
• 55:51
  Speaker 3: I don't think he ever felt like, yeah, this is
• 55:53
  Speaker 3: what I want to do. I do feel like James
• 55:55
  Speaker 3: is interested in getting into that. He does want to
• 55:58
  Speaker 3: call a defense it just felt like this is just
• 56:01
  Speaker 3: part of the stepping the stepping stone to be a
• 56:03
  Speaker 3: head coach. But James, I do also think that he
• 56:07
  Speaker 3: is interested in that as well, because he is kind
• 56:10
  Speaker 3: of uh, he just seems to me like that that
• 56:13
  Speaker 3: is more something that he is interested in.
• 56:16
  Speaker 2: But yeah, he doesn't have to be dragged along into
• 56:18
  Speaker 2: the defensive meetings too, and he is willingly putting his
• 56:22
  Speaker 2: input in, and you know, sometimes it's I want all
• 56:24
  Speaker 2: three linebackers on the field, those sorts of things like
• 56:26
  Speaker 2: he's very short.
• 56:28
  Speaker 3: He wants it.
• 56:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's great. And so any other thoughts on
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: lord Edis's future or anything else before we get out
• 56:36
  Speaker 2: of here, because I do think overall Ohio States and
• 56:40
  Speaker 2: a good spot now Ohio States and a good spot
• 56:42
  Speaker 2: down the road, I do wonder how long he's going
• 56:45
  Speaker 2: to be here, but I do think he will be
• 56:46
  Speaker 2: back at some point down the road. And I'm again,
• 56:50
  Speaker 2: I don't think he has to leave to eventually be
• 56:52
  Speaker 2: the head coach at Ohio State.
• 56:54
  Speaker 3: But I would say, look, I know there's a lot
• 56:57
  Speaker 3: of people, and I talked to a lot of Buckeye
• 56:59
  Speaker 3: fans that are kind of under this impression that Ryan
• 57:01
  Speaker 3: Day is gonna be some twenty year head coach at
• 57:02
  Speaker 3: Ohio State. And I don't think that I would be
• 57:05
  Speaker 3: surprised if this doesn't go on for another five years
• 57:08
  Speaker 3: with Ryan Day. And if that's the case, there's no
• 57:11
  Speaker 3: other guy walking planet Earth that I would rather be
• 57:14
  Speaker 3: the head coach at Ohio State. James laurniis And if
• 57:17
  Speaker 3: that happens, Man, I'll be the happiest little Juckie Bucky. Ever.
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: It's funny because thirty odd years ago, I wanted Chris
• 57:28
  Speaker 2: Pielman to be able to do I want Chris Bield.
• 57:32
  Speaker 2: Chris Bielman will eventually be the head coach. My plan
• 57:35
  Speaker 2: back then was, you know, you get rid of Cooper,
• 57:37
  Speaker 2: You let Fred Pugage have it for a couple of
• 57:39
  Speaker 2: years while Chris Bielman is a defensive coordinator learning, learning
• 57:41
  Speaker 2: the robes, and then he will take them on and
• 57:44
  Speaker 2: for the next thirty years after he's done playing. And
• 57:47
  Speaker 2: then you see Chris biel in his one year as
• 57:49
  Speaker 2: a Columbus Destroyer's head coach, go like oh and sixteen
• 57:52
  Speaker 2: you're like, well maybe not maybe, maybe we'll just stick
• 57:56
  Speaker 2: with coaches and that and that's and James Lord ninis.
• 58:01
  Speaker 2: He got into coaching for a reason, and he's done
• 58:03
  Speaker 2: very very well with it. It has suited him. I
• 58:07
  Speaker 2: remember watching Brian Hartline talk and a coach's clinics, saying
• 58:10
  Speaker 2: he had no intention of doing this, of being a coach,
• 58:13
  Speaker 2: but then it became a calling. And everybody knows the story.
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: Eleven years ago to twenty sixteen, preparing helping the the
• 58:20
  Speaker 2: Ohio State Buckeyes prepare for the playoff game against Clemson,
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: working on the scout team as a receiver, which was
• 58:27
  Speaker 2: a thing that old Buckeye's, former Buckeyes would come and do.
• 58:29
  Speaker 2: They'd come and practice, put the pads on. Urban Meyer
• 58:33
  Speaker 2: invited him back for the next year just as you know,
• 58:36
  Speaker 2: just hang around as an intern. And it's like, now,
• 58:38
  Speaker 2: I don't want to do that, but eventually did and
• 58:40
  Speaker 2: essentially never left. And he, you know, for the longest
• 58:44
  Speaker 2: time he's like, I'm happy just being a receivers coach.
• 58:46
  Speaker 2: And I'm saying just being a receivers coach's he would
• 58:49
  Speaker 2: never say just being a receivers coach. I am happy
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: being a receivers coach, putting you know, putting things together,
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: giving people, giving these players tools, better lives, all. That's very,
• 59:00
  Speaker 2: very rewarding. But then I guess at some point it's like, well,
• 59:06
  Speaker 2: there's got to be more, because if you're only doing this,
• 59:10
  Speaker 2: then you're not doing enough. And ask Larry Johnson if
• 59:13
  Speaker 2: he's doing enough. You know, ask there are some lifers
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: as assistant coaches, and I know Larry Johnson wanted to
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: be a head coach at one time. But you can
• 59:22
  Speaker 2: do it a hell of a lot of good as
• 59:24
  Speaker 2: a position coach for as long as you want. Just
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: ask Billy Davis. You can a linebacker coaches. Okay, So
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: if you can have any two linebacker coaches, you're picking
• 59:38
  Speaker 2: between two linebacker coaches to be the future head coach
• 59:40
  Speaker 2: at Ohio State. I'll give you Billy Davis, I'll give
• 59:43
  Speaker 2: you James Lord Nidas. You get the last word.
• 59:45
  Speaker 3: We're gonna go with thirty three, the future coach of
• 59:49
  Speaker 3: the Ohio State Buck guys, says Tony Gerdaman, And boy,
• 59:52
  Speaker 3: I hope he's right.
• 59:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean he's my pick right now in terms
• 59:58
  Speaker 2: of out of names out there, and Matt Patrice should
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 2: be right behind him. And but again these are you know,
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 2: who knows if they win it all this year Because
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 2: Ryan Day. Ryan Day wants a second national championship. You
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 2: know that's something that he definitely wants.
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 3: Can I say, Tony, I like that he's been public
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 3: about that. I like that he said that. I think
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 3: it's awesome to put your goals out there and not
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 3: not hide from him. We're just one day at a time. Crap, No,
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 3: put it out there. What he harries is the only
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 3: other coaches won multiple national championships at Ohio State, and
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 3: I want to do that too. I like that.
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 2: You should want you should want your head coach to
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 2: be that confident. And it's not just confidence, it's just
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: I'm telling you what I want. I'm telling you because
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 2: you know, they want to beat Michigan, they want to
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 2: win a Big Ten, they want to win a national championship.
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 2: And in the fact that he has a a personal
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 2: goal that is also a team goal, I think that's healthy.
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 2: I think that's good for everybody to see. Get behind
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 2: it and in the root for it if you're a
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 2: Buckeye fan. So that will do it for this episode
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 2: of the Time and Change Will Shirley Show. If you're
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 2: watching on YouTube, hit that thumbs up subscribe to the channel.
• 1:01:07
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• 1:01:10
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• 1:01:14
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• 1:01:17
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• 1:01:20
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• 1:01:23
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• 1:01:25
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• 1:01:28
  Speaker 2: That will do from here. Thank you all very much
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 2: for tuning in, and we will talk to you all
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 2: later