Latest / Wedding Pros who are ready to grow - with Becca Pountney / Stop hiding - get visible with Renée Dalo

Transcript

Stop hiding - get visible with Renée Dalo · Wedding Pros who are ready to grow - with Becca Pountney

0:00
Renee: You can't be successful in business if you're hiding behind anything.
0:04
I think because it's not authentically you.
0:07
It's not authentically who people want to do business with.
0:10
You know?
0:10
Especially now, especially Gen Z, like they want to know you.
0:17
Becca: I am Becca Pountney wedding business marketing expert,
0:19
speaker and blogger, and you are listening to The Wedding Pros
0:22
who are Ready to Grow podcast.
0:24
I'm here to share with you actionable tips, strategies, and real life
0:28
examples to help you take your wedding business to the next level.
0:31
If you are an ambitious wedding business owner that wants to take your passion
0:35
and use it to build a profitable, sustainable business doing what you
0:38
love, then you're in the right place.
0:40
Let's get going with today's episode.
0:44
Today I'm talking to Renee dalo.
0:46
Renee is a wedding planner, industry educator, and a certified life coach.
0:50
She's passionate about helping event professionals boost their self-confidence
0:53
and increase visibility and become bold, empowered entrepreneurs.
0:58
I can't wait to talk with her.
0:59
Renee, welcome to the podcast.
1:01
Renee: Hi.
1:01
Hi.
1:02
Thanks for having me.
1:03
Becca: You are so welcome.
1:05
It's great to have you, and I just love that tagline that you wanna help people
1:08
become bold, empowered entrepreneurs.
1:10
I'm all about that.
1:11
Renee: Mm-hmm.
1:12
. Oh yeah.
1:14
. Becca: So good.
1:15
So before we get going, why don't you just tell people where your base
1:19
Renee: Well, I live in Los Angeles, but I'm pretty much always on a plane.
1:24
Last night I came back from Denver.
1:25
I'm home for like three days, then I go to San Francisco.
1:28
So I'm, I'm like a, I'm a citizen of the world, but my home is in Los Angeles.
1:33
People get very confused when they meet me.
1:35
They're like, you live in New York?
1:36
I'm like, no, people just,
1:38
Becca: you just travel.
1:39
Renee: Yeah.
1:39
People just pick a random city and they're like, I thought you were in Chicago.
1:42
I'm like, no, la.
1:44
So yeah, I just say I live on a plane at this point.
1:47
Becca: Nice.
1:48
Well, right above my piano downstairs in my house, I have
1:50
a map of the United States where I've scratched off the states.
1:53
I've been to.
1:54
I feel like you just smashed it.
1:57
Renee: a little bit, although, yeah, no, I, I've been to every
1:59
single state except for Hawaii.
2:02
Becca: Well, there we go.
2:03
That's on the bucket list for next year.
2:04
I've got a lot of states left to scratch off , but I'm planning to do it before I'm
2:09
50, so I've got about 15 more years yet.
2:11
Renee: Love it.
2:12
Love it.
2:13
Becca: Okay, so let's get you introduced to people then.
2:16
So I mentioned that you're a wedding planner.
2:18
Take me back.
2:19
How did you end up in the wedding events industry in the first place?
2:22
Renee: I was basically the friend in, in my friend group that hosted all the.
2:25
You know, I was the one if it was like the Oscars or like someone's birthday or
2:29
like we had a divorce party once, like anytime anyone had anything, they're like,
2:33
let's go to Renee's, Renee will do it.
2:35
And so then when my friends started getting married, it just be, became like
2:39
sort of the natural extension of my, my role within my friend group to be like,
2:43
well, Renee can help you . And at, at the time it was like when I was in my early
2:47
twenties, it was like, can I help them?
2:49
I don't know.
2:50
But like everything else, you sort of figure it out.
2:51
And what ended up happening is that, you know, I used to be an actor.
2:54
So when you're an aspiring slash unemployed actor and you're getting
2:58
married, you don't have a lot of money.
3:00
Right?
3:00
So I was helping a lot of my friends.
3:02
Throw these like super budget weddings.
3:04
And then what would happen is our friends would come and be guests,
3:07
then they would get engaged.
3:08
They'd say, wait, who helped you plan that?
3:10
Oh, Renee did email Renee.
3:11
So I ended up sort of developing a hobby, like a very, I was gonna say
3:16
busy hobby, but it, it was, I, I was doing it as a hobby and not taking
3:19
any money for it for a long time.
3:22
And then I finally made the leap into owning a real business after I got
3:26
married, actually, because my husband and I met in Los Angeles, even though
3:29
we're both from the east, of the US and then we got married on the east coast.
3:33
My wedding planner said to me, I have no idea why you're not a wedding planner.
3:36
Like, what are you doing?
3:37
And I said, well, there's a million wedding planners in in Los Angeles.
3:40
She goes, who cares?
3:41
And I don't know what it was about that moment of having her just give me the
3:45
permission, you know, to like, it doesn't matter if there's a hundred other people
3:48
doing this, like you're you and people are gonna wanna come to you because you're
3:51
you and you're very capable of this.
3:52
And like she actually said, you needed me less than anyone who's ever hired me.
3:56
I actually feel bad taking your.
3:58
I love that.
3:59
Meanwhile, I felt very comfortable giving it because I was like, oh,
4:01
she knows so much about Philadelphia.
4:03
That I don't know.
4:04
Anyway, it just, it allowed me, you know, she really opened a door in my
4:07
mind of like what was possible for me.
4:10
And then pretty shortly after that, a couple of months after that is, , when
4:13
I launched my, my first website.
4:15
And I hate telling this story cuz I think it gives people such false hope.
4:18
But like, I launched my website on April 1st, and I coordinated
4:22
my first wedding, April 7th.
4:24
Becca: Wow.
4:25
How did that happen?
4:26
Renee: I know.
4:27
Well, cuz I had made some friends with established wedding planners in la.
4:31
One in particular, Liz Coopersmith, who was a friend of mine, we met at a, at
4:34
a conference, at a blogging conference.
4:36
She sort of knew that I was just getting started.
4:38
She actually named my business.
4:40
She told me when I was getting started.
4:41
She's like, I will take you, you know, take me out to dinner.
4:44
You get two hours, ask me everything.
4:46
And I was like, okay.
4:47
So I sat with her and I said, I don't know what to call it.
4:49
And she's like, and I had this blog called that Bride's Got Moxie.
4:52
And she goes, well, it has to be something with Moxie.
4:54
What should it be?
4:55
And we kind of brainstormed and she said, bright Moxie.
4:57
And I was like, no, that feels weird.
5:00
And then I was like, well, what about Moxie Bright?
5:02
And she's like, . That's good.
5:03
And I mean, it's sort of a nonsense mashup of two words really.
5:07
But then it just sort of stuck and I was like, okay, it'll be Moxie
5:09
Bright and like all these years later, no, it's still Moxie Bright.
5:12
So yeah, she, she knew that I was ready to get started and someone reached out
5:16
to her to say, Hey, I know this is last minute, but are you available on Sunday?
5:19
And she's like, no, I'm definitely not, but my friend is.
5:24
Becca: There is so much I love about this story.
5:26
I love that it came through a connection.
5:28
Yes.
5:28
One of the things I love talking about in my community is the power of
5:31
connections, the power of collaboration, the power of putting yourself out there,
5:35
the power of taking opportunities.
5:36
And I feel like all of those things came together in that moment.
5:40
Yeah.
5:40
And helped you land that first wedding.
5:42
So it was no coincidence.
5:42
Renee: Yeah, no, it wasn't a coincidence, but it was a weird like alchemy of
5:46
events, you know, that like I just, I happened to have had a website launch,
5:50
so these people had something to go look at that was like, okay, she's legitimate.
5:53
Like had I not had that one piece, it might, they might not
5:56
have wanted to meet with me.
5:57
Then I met with them at Starbucks, talk to them for about an hour.
6:00
At the end, like literally at the end of the conversation they were
6:02
like, okay, you're hired, and they handed me, Like cash, like 600,
6:06
they handed me $600 and that, that's what I got for that first wedding.
6:09
And and I was like, oh, I don't, and I thought like, oh God,
6:13
I don't even have a contract.
6:15
I didn't have a contract.
6:16
I was just like, okay, let's do it.
6:18
And I learned a lot, right?
6:19
Because I actually, I almost, I also did their flowers cuz
6:22
they didn't have a florist.
6:23
And they were like, can you do flowers?
6:24
I was like, I mean, well not professionally, but like, I can
6:26
put flowers in a vase and like that's, I had my assistant.
6:29
Christie, who's been my assistant since day one, literally come, you know,
6:32
come to the mart with me and we bought a bunch of flowers, like we did every
6:35
wrong thing you could have done at a wedding like we did for this wedding.
6:38
But also like that is how you learn.
6:40
So it's funny, as an educator now, I spend so much of my time trying to like,
6:44
think about what my students need so that they don't have to make those mistakes.
6:47
But then also like, there is such a, there is power in making, in
6:50
having that experience, right?
6:52
And going like, okay, what did I learn from this and
6:54
what do I not wanna do again?
6:56
Becca: Yeah.
6:56
That is so true.
6:57
We do learn from our mistakes.
6:58
Now I know there's gonna be people listening who are gonna resonate
7:01
with what you said right at the beginning, that they still do stuff for
7:04
friends, therefore they do it cheap.
7:05
Yeah.
7:06
And they know that they need to start taking it seriously, but they
7:08
find it hard to know how to have the confidence to take that leap.
7:12
Was it just the influence from the other person that made you do that?
7:15
Or was there some inner work you had to do?
7:17
Renee: Oh God, there's always inner work, right?
7:18
I think the inner work is like never done
7:21
It's just, it's just a different level of things.
7:23
Yeah.
7:23
I mean there, you know, there was a lot of.
7:25
There was a lot of work I had to do on charging for my services because
7:30
I was of the opinion back then that if it came naturally to me that it
7:34
wasn't valuable, which is complete bs.
7:38
I know that now, all these years later, but back then I was
7:40
like, well, this is easy for me.
7:42
Like i, and I said to my husband and I remember saying like, well, I don't charge
7:45
people when they come over for dinner at our house, and I'm an excellent cook.
7:48
And he's like, yeah, it's different though , right?
7:50
Like, but you but people, but you pay you know, you pay to go to a restaurant.
7:53
And I was like, Yeah, that's true.
7:55
And I really had to come to terms with the fact that just because it's
7:59
easy for me and therefore I don't value it as much for me, it doesn't
8:04
mean that other people don't value.
8:05
Like wedding professionals, we have a certain skillset that not everyone has.
8:09
And above and beyond that we have a.
8:11
Certain temperament that not everyone has, like this work isn't for everyone.
8:16
And that's the piece that I had to really sort of work on valuing
8:21
enough that I could monetize it.
8:22
Right.
8:22
And this was like, it took me like two years really to come to terms with
8:25
like, okay, I, I need to be charging like actual real livable money here.
8:30
Yeah.
8:30
That, that was.
8:31
. It was a lot, and I, I don't wanna, it wasn't just one thing, right?
8:33
I had to look at how I thought about what I spend money on myself and like
8:37
what I value and what I will pay for.
8:39
Then I also had to do the work.
8:41
on recognizing that I am not my client.
8:43
I am not my client, and I feel like a lot of teaching out
8:46
there sort of leans into that.
8:47
Like, well, you are your ideal client just amped up a bit and it's like, Maybe not,
8:51
and maybe that's okay because there are things that I won't pay for that I know my
8:54
clients will, and there are totally things that I'll pay for that my clients won't.
8:57
So it's kind of figuring out where that intersects and where that diverges and,
9:01
and being okay with it, and then also knowing what you're worth, what your
9:04
experience is worth, and all those years of experience where I wasn't getting paid.
9:08
That's still experience and, and people pay me for it now, thankfully,
9:13
Becca: Yes, there is so much in there, and I know that there's gonna be
9:16
listeners that will need to hear that because they struggle with knowing
9:18
their worth and knowing that they can just step out there and charge.
9:22
But ultimately that's what they need to do.
9:24
Now the thing that I wanna dig into deeper with you, Renee, and I know it's something
9:27
you love to talk about, is visibility.
9:30
Now again, I know immediately some of my listeners I can imagine them now
9:33
are gonna be recoiling and thinking, I don't like talking about visibility.
9:37
I like hiding.
9:38
I like hiding behind my brand.
9:40
Yeah.
9:40
So why does it matter?
9:42
Why is visibility something worth talking about?
9:44
Renee: The biggest, the most high level answer I can give you is this.
9:47
I'm a middle-aged white woman.
9:48
Right?
9:49
And that's a time societally where women start becoming invisible.
9:53
Right.
9:53
And I don't know if this is like this in the uk, but certainly in America,
9:56
we, we value youth here, we value the new, and I think that's bullshit.
10:01
I really, I really hate it because I feel so much more wise and valuable now
10:07
at 46 than I ever did when I was 26.
10:10
And so this visibility mission that I have is about owning our
10:14
own value and worth, but also not being afraid to be seen.
10:19
Because that's another thing, right?
10:20
It's like you have to own yourself, but then you have to be okay with
10:23
other people really seeing you.
10:25
And that's the piece that I think is almost harder for people, right?
10:29
It's like, you know, we talked about knowing your worth.
10:30
It's like that's inner work that you have to do and that, you know,
10:33
it's like a rollercoaster, right?
10:34
Like some, some weeks you're feeling great, then the next week
10:36
you're like, Hmm, not so much.
10:38
Visibility is the same way.
10:40
It's not like you're always gonna be ready on, ready to be seen, ready to be heard.
10:44
But if you never get on the rollercoaster of it, then you're just hiding and
10:48
people don't get to really know you and they don't get to really see you.
10:51
And therefore, it does affect not just your life, but your business.
10:55
Becca: Yeah.
10:55
And one thing I've been talking about quite a lot recently is people being
10:59
unapologetically themselves and not trying to be this perfect wedding pro.
11:03
Yes.
11:04
Whatever that is in their head.
11:05
And just realizing
11:05
Renee: there is no such thing as a perfect anything.
11:08
Becca: Absolutely.
11:09
And how they can just be themselves and being themselves is their superpower.
11:12
And I know that that's definitely what you're about as well, so, okay.
11:16
So they've got on board with that.
11:17
They're thinking, yep.
11:18
I wanna be more visible.
11:19
I'm understanding.
11:21
These guys are saying, how are they gonna do that in their wedding business?
11:24
What does visibility look like?
11:25
Renee: So I like to say that there are three levels of visibility and this,
11:29
we have a guide for you that it's, this is gonna be in the guide too.
11:31
So if, if you lose me somewhere along this explanation, you can
11:34
be like, just look at the guide.
11:35
But level one visibility is like baseline visibility.
11:38
And that's someone who is, you know, kind of maybe sort of posting on
11:42
Instagram, but maybe not regularly.
11:44
Or they're posting on Instagram, but not really photos of.
11:48
Right.
11:48
They're, they're posting their work, but not them.
11:50
They're, they're really unlikely to turn the camera on themselves and
11:54
do like a story talking to camera.
11:56
It's really like sporadic and kind of like, if they're
11:58
forced to, maybe they'll do it.
12:00
These are people who've never been on a podcast may, who might
12:03
have the desire, but but are too afraid to, and it's literally just
12:06
kind of like the bare minimum.
12:08
And for some people when I talk about this, they're like, that's all I got.
12:11
That's all I could do, or I'm not even doing.
12:14
And I'm like, okay, then let's just get you to baseline, right?
12:16
Let's just get you to a place where you're consistently
12:18
posting and showing your face.
12:20
That's the key part here, because you can show your work.
12:22
Any of us, listen, we all wanna show our work.
12:25
, you should be proud to show your work.
12:26
I'm talking about showing you, are you showing you level two visibility?
12:32
Midline visibility.
12:33
Right?
12:33
That is someone who is posting consistently, who is comfortable with
12:36
turning the camera on themselves, talking directly to, you know, Instagram stories,
12:41
saying, Hey guys, here I am at my wedding.
12:43
Let me show you behind the scenes.
12:44
They're a little, they're okay with that, right?
12:46
They're They've done it enough that it's, um, it doesn't seem like a panicked, make
12:51
sweaty, sort of like, ooh, force thing.
12:53
They're just like, it's.
12:54
They are probably, maybe they've guessed it on a podcast or two, right?
12:57
Maybe they've written blog posts for other publications, or they've been quoted in
13:01
other publications as themselves, but they know that there is more out there, right?
13:05
They're like, well, but maybe I, maybe I could.
13:08
Who knows?
13:10
Now, level three is like game changing visibility.
13:13
Level three is like, they have their own podcast.
13:16
They're You know, very well known in their market or nationwide or internationally.
13:22
They are totally comfortable on camera.
13:24
Maybe they have a YouTube channel.
13:26
Maybe they're great at reels or TikTok.
13:28
Like they're very much putting themselves out there and feeling creative and feeling
13:32
like empowered by that sort of work.
13:34
Not like it's a struggle, but like, oh, this is another avenue
13:38
I have to communicate lets do it.
13:39
Maybe those folks who are in that level three, maybe they aspire
13:42
to something even bigger, right?
13:44
Maybe they're like, get me on a morning show.
13:46
I wanna write a New York Times bestseller.
13:47
Get me a TV show, right?
13:49
Like they're thinking of what's next.
13:51
There's always another level.
13:53
But oftentimes when I talk about visibility, especially when I
13:55
present this in person, I have people who are barely doing baseline.
13:59
Saying things to me like, oh, I wanna write a book and
14:02
go on Good Morning America.
14:03
And I'm like, where are you on your socials?
14:05
Even like there are, it's a ladder, I believe.
14:08
So you don't have to go from nothing to hosting your own podcast.
14:12
There are steps.
14:13
Becca: I love thinking about it like a ladder.
14:15
And that is so true.
14:16
There's definitely those people that are barely showing up and want the world.
14:19
So would you say then that the best thing, if people can identify themselves
14:23
on the ladder, you've just explained and they're a little bit hungry for
14:26
more, would you just encourage them to try and just take one little step up
14:30
Renee: Yeah, I mean, it's baby steps, right?
14:31
It is absolute baby steps.
14:33
And I think everyone wants that like magic bullet, right?
14:36
That's gonna be like, okay, I'm scared to post, but you know, now
14:39
I'm gonna be posting every day.
14:40
And it's like, there.
14:42
Actually like incremental steps there.
14:44
Make, make a goal for yourself.
14:46
You know, here's something I did, right?
14:48
It's funny now, like in 2020, we're recording this at the end of 2022,
14:52
back in the start of 2020, before the world came crashing down.
14:56
I had made a commitment to myself that I was going to pay for or somehow barter
15:02
for a mini photo shoot every month in 2020 because I knew that I wanted to
15:08
be more visible in my education brand.
15:10
I wanted to speak on more stages.
15:11
I wanted to grow my podcast, and I knew the way to do that was to show up.
15:16
, but I was someone who hated having my photo taken.
15:19
Like hated it, Becca.
15:20
I would procrastinate about it.
15:22
I would like half-ass my makeup and hair.
15:24
I'd be like, Hmm, I don't care.
15:26
I just, I wanna be natural.
15:27
I don't wanna care so much about it.
15:29
And then I would get photos taken and I would hate them.
15:31
I was too fat.
15:31
I was too tall.
15:32
I was too short.
15:33
I was too round.
15:33
I was, you know, all the things.
15:35
I was too purple.
15:35
Like it doesn't, I just had a lot of feelings about photos and me.
15:39
So because I'm, because I'm me and I love to push myself, I was like, Every
15:43
month, I'm just gonna make myself do it because if I do it every month, then at
15:47
least I'll have some kind of content.
15:49
I mean, you can't hate every photo ever taken of you, right?
15:51
Like there's gotta be one or two winners in there.
15:53
So that was my goal, and I did it in January and I did it in February,
15:57
and then of course the world stopped.
15:59
But in this year, in 2022, I haven't done it every month, but
16:02
I think I've maybe done four.
16:04
I've done four photo shoots this year for myself.
16:08
For no reason.
16:09
It's like, what are you doing it for?
16:10
I'm like, I don't know.
16:11
When we get the photos, I'll figure out what to do with them.
16:13
And people are like, that's crazy.
16:15
I'm like, well, but I need to, to strengthen that muscle of allowing
16:20
myself to be seen in that way.
16:23
And also, if you're listening to this and you're like, she's a crazy narcissist,
16:26
I want you to consider this one.
16:28
No, I'm not two, it's for my business.
16:30
And three, I've just decided that photo shoots are a collaboration between
16:35
me and the photographer to create a piece of art that I just happen to be.
16:41
Becca: Oh, I love that way of thinking about things.
16:43
So interesting.
16:45
And I think the thing that's interesting is actually the more we do something,
16:49
the better we get at it for a start.
16:51
Yes.
16:51
So if we're scared about being in front of the camera and then we challenge ourselves
16:54
to be in the front of the camera more and more and more, we get better at it.
16:57
Like I remember back to my first brand shoot and the
17:00
photographer might even be, listen.
17:01
Listening to this, and I felt so awkward and uncomfortable, and I was so wooden.
17:05
And if I look back at those pictures now they're awful.
17:08
But since then, I've had photo shoot after photo shoot, after photo shoot,
17:12
and now I can relax and be myself, and I've got used to the photographer.
17:15
. And just like everything else, being visible is the same.
17:17
Right.
17:17
We need to practice it.
17:19
And the more we do it, the better we get at it.
17:21
Renee: And even if it's like, I've never done an Instagram story
17:23
where I talk to camera, okay, well do one today, do one today.
17:26
Because they, first of all, they disappear.
17:29
And you don't have to be perfect.
17:30
You can rerecord them if you don't like what you said.
17:33
But then also, don't take it all so seriously, right?
17:36
I mean, like, unless you say something catastrophically awful, which you
17:39
probably won't, no one's gonna be like, oh my God, did you hear what
17:42
Becca said on her Insta story?
17:43
Like no one is paying that close attention to us.
17:46
They really aren't, right?
17:47
So, so why not put your ideas out there?
17:49
Why not talk directly to camera, right?
17:51
Why not just say, Hey, I got this sweater that I like.
17:54
I want some photos.
17:56
And barter with someone you know who's a photographer.
17:58
I mean, first of all, I think you should pay your photographers, but if,
18:00
if the hesitation is, is financial, there's always a way to work it out.
18:05
Becca: Yeah, there's always a way.
18:06
Okay.
18:06
So the first thing that people are gonna be saying to me is, well that's
18:09
great Becca, for you and Renee, cuz you're confident people, and I
18:13
know you've just shared your story.
18:15
So if they're there and they're thinking, I'm not confident, I don't
18:18
like the way I look, I don't wanna be seen in front of the camera.
18:20
Have you got any encouragement?
18:22
For them of how to get out of their own way.
18:24
Renee: Yeah.
18:24
I mean, I didn't come out of the womb confident . And I don't wake
18:29
up every day feeling confident.
18:30
I don't.
18:30
But I think that what allows me to appear confident is that I am willing
18:37
to risk, I'm willing to take the risk.
18:39
And I think as entrepreneurs, I'm assuming most people listening
18:42
are probably entrepreneurs.
18:44
You know, I think we have to give ourselves a little more credit for how.
18:47
Open we are, and available we are to risk.
18:50
I think it's something we don't talk about a lot.
18:51
We're just like, well, we're just going about our business,
18:53
but like every single day in our business is a risk, so, so what?
18:56
Put yourself in front of the camera.
18:57
That's a little bit of a risk.
18:59
I will say for me, what helps me show up?
19:02
is, I am someone who feels more comfortable with a
19:04
little hair and makeup done.
19:05
I feel more comfortable when my hair is blown out and I have a little lipstick
19:08
on, and maybe that makes me shallow, but it makes me feel more ready to
19:12
be visible, to be seen, to be heard.
19:15
It just makes me feel more prepared.
19:16
But then also, there's no harm in actually preparing, right?
19:20
Like if it's something that you're, if it's a podcast episode that you're
19:23
doing, make notes before you start.
19:25
Journal out your ideas on paper.
19:27
If you wanna do an Insta story where you're talking to.
19:29
Write out a little script for yourself.
19:31
You don't have to follow it exactly, but I think there's an idea out there
19:34
that those of us who do these things just sort of walk into them like
19:38
fully knowing and aware and perfect.
19:41
And that's never the case.
19:42
It's just you guys are only seeing the parts we wanna show you.
19:45
You're only seeing the 10th take when we finally get it right.
19:48
you know, and i, and also for like, for photo shoots and stuff,
19:51
I hire hair and makeup now.
19:52
Like, I'm not even messing around.
19:54
Like, I'm tired of like being like, oh, these photos would've been so
19:56
good if my eyeliner wasn't so stupid.
19:58
Right?
19:59
Like, just pay people.
20:00
I, I mean, at this point, I, I just pay people to help me do it.
20:03
And I'll say, I'll tell you this.
20:04
We did a, a photo shoot in New York for my new website that
20:07
just launched a couple days ago.
20:08
It's just, it's my Renee Dallas site, it's my education site.
20:10
But I had been using this horrible old template.
20:13
Point where you're like, this website is horrible.
20:15
I don't want anyone to see it.
20:16
That's where I was.
20:16
So we redid it.
20:17
So we're in New York in this hotel room doing photos and I had hired
20:20
a makeup artist who I didn't know.
20:21
I found her on Instagram and when she was doing my makeup, I was telling
20:24
her how bad I am at taking photos.
20:26
She was like, why?
20:27
What are we doing?
20:27
And I was like, well it's for my new website.
20:28
And I was like, but Justin's my friend, the photographer.
20:30
I'm like, I feel really comfortable with him cause I'm not really good at
20:32
photos and I don't really like, you know, I get really, like you said,
20:35
I get really wooden and like Justin arrived, we started shooting and like 10
20:38
minutes in, she yells from the corner.
20:40
You're much better at this than you said.
20:44
Becca: I love that.
20:45
That's so good.
20:46
We're our biggest critic.
20:48
Right?
20:48
Renee: Right.
20:49
And so that I saw, I tell you that anecdote to say.
20:52
You are likely judging yourself so much more harshly than is
20:56
the reality of the situation.
20:58
Like we all think that, I mean, listen you, any photo of me that
21:02
you show me, I can pick out like 15 things that I would change.
21:06
That's just our brains.
21:07
That's just human nature.
21:09
We can't let that get in the way of our work and our mission and our core values.
21:14
We just can't let it get in the way.
21:15
You just have to go.
21:16
Yeah.
21:16
Okay.
21:17
That's what my nose looks like.
21:18
Moving on . You know, it is what it is.
21:21
Becca: Yeah, and I could look at the same 15 pictures of you and think
21:24
they were all beautiful and perfect because we don't judge each other in
21:27
the same way we judge ourselves, right?
21:28
Renee: And yes, 100%, and also no one is thinking about us the
21:32
way that we're thinking about us.
21:34
Everyone's just thinking about themselves.
21:36
really, I mean, it's bizarre to think of, but really it's like we
21:39
spend so much time picking ourselves apart and nobody else is doing.
21:43
Becca: Yeah, it's very, very true.
21:45
Okay, so people are thinking, right, yeah, I'm on this.
21:48
I'm gonna be visible.
21:49
I'm gonna put my face out there.
21:51
What difference does that make to them in their wedding business?
21:54
Is that gonna result in more clients?
21:55
Is it gonna result in a better client relationship?
21:57
What's the positive spin on this?
21:59
Renee: Honestly, there I, to me, there is no deterrent.
22:01
There's no, there's no.
22:03
Nothing in the con, you know, column here.
22:05
One, it's going to help you attract the right kind of clients.
22:08
And that's different for everyone like that.
22:10
That what makes up that right client is gonna be different for everyone.
22:13
But when you show up, when you show people who you are, you're
22:17
going to naturally attract.
22:18
But then also you're gonna naturally repel some people too.
22:22
And honestly, Good repel people because what you don't want, and what's so
22:28
funny, every time I talk, I talk to my students about this, they're like, well,
22:30
but then I won't get as many inquiries.
22:32
And I'm like, I'm sorry.
22:33
Are you getting a thousand inquiries a week that there's, it's too much.
22:36
You can't, you can't handle like you're going to, you're gonna get
22:39
the people that are meant to find you and you're, and the amount of
22:43
inquiries won't matter because the quality of them will increase.
22:46
Right.
22:47
Also, you're going to be attracting better vendor partners.
22:52
Because people are going to feel like they can refer you if they feel like they
22:56
know you, whether or not they actually know you, because they're going to be
22:59
like, oh, I know what Becca's about.
23:01
Okay.
23:01
No.
23:02
I have a client who I think
23:03
would be perfect for Becca, even if they've never spent
23:05
time with you on social media.
23:07
It's a weird thing, but our brains index that time we spend watching
23:10
each other on video as real time.
23:12
Now, welcome to our 2023 Brains, right, and then also we are
23:17
going to get more confident in.
23:19
Rising to the level of expert we need to be to then charge more money.
23:25
Becca: So there is no, con is all a positive.
23:27
Renee: There's no con.
23:28
I mean, listen, is someone sometimes gonna be not in agreement with what you say?
23:32
Yeah, of course.
23:34
But also who cares about them?
23:35
They're not paying your bills.
23:37
Becca: Yeah, that's very true.
23:38
Now.
23:39
Now that brings me onto my next question actually, because one of the things that
23:41
came up in my community very recently when we were talking about visibility
23:45
and reels is their fear of being trolled, their fear of someone writing something
23:50
underneath them or telling them that they were wrong or just being downright mean.
23:55
Have you experienced any of that yourself in your business since being more visible?
23:59
Renee: Yeah.
23:59
I mean, listen,
24:00
I.
24:00
I speak on stages nationwide, internationally.
24:03
So every so often when I speak on stage, I'll get some emails after the fact.
24:08
Right?
24:09
Or I'll, or, or especially in the podcast.
24:11
I got an email once that was like, I disagree with what you said and you
24:14
need to be more blah, blah, blah.
24:16
And you know, I guess I just always think that those comments have way more to do
24:21
with the person who's giving it, giving that comment than they do about me.
24:24
Right?
24:25
Like a few years ago at Wedding mba, when my first year on stage, I.
24:30
A couple of emails after the fact.
24:31
And it was funny too, when I explained what the emails were like,
24:34
you can kind of go like, oh, okay.
24:36
So I got a lot of emails after the fact that were very positive, blah, blah, blah.
24:39
And then I got three emails from three different people who, now that
24:42
I think about it, probably were all connected, offering me weight loss drugs.
24:47
Becca: Wow.
24:47
Renee: Yeah.
24:47
Telling me that I, I would be so pretty if I had, if I lost a couple pounds,
24:52
Becca: that is awful.
24:54
Renee: It's awful.
24:54
Right.
24:55
And, but what they were doing was trying to sell me on weight loss drugs.
24:58
And of course I ignore the emails because they don't, they don't
25:01
get even a moment of my attention.
25:03
But I tell the story to tell, to say like, you know, I think if I were
25:07
maybe a different person and hadn't worked on myself so much, perhaps those
25:11
comments would be like, oh my God, maybe I should never get on stage again.
25:15
But instead I was like, F those guys, what are they talking about?
25:17
Like, We all deserve to be seen no matter what, no matter what age we are,
25:22
shape, size, race, it does not matter.
25:24
Every single human person deserves to be seen.
25:28
So that email was more about them wanting to sell me something than
25:32
it was about anything wrong with me.
25:34
And that's sort of the same way I feel about everything.
25:36
We did our Black Friday promotion a couple of weeks ago and I sent an email.
25:41
We had scheduled an email to go out like at midnight.
25:44
The night of Thanksgiving, so right as the clock switched over to
25:46
Friday and I woke, I, I was asleep.
25:49
When the email was sent, my team scheduled it.
25:51
I woke up to an email from someone on my email list who I don't know.
25:55
Who was like, how dare you email me on Thanksgiving, this, you know, and it was
25:59
like a, it was an email that was like, here's a bunch of sales from wedding pros.
26:03
Something here might be helpful for you.
26:05
And she was like, how dare you.
26:06
I mean, I could have had the, I could have had the thing about like, oh, I
26:09
know I shouldn't have sent that email.
26:10
Oh my God, this one person out of 12,000 people was really mad about it.
26:13
What did I do?
26:14
But instead I was like, well, she must have been having a bad night.
26:17
Becca: Yeah, it's always more about them.
26:19
That's how I deal with it too.
26:20
It's resilience.
26:21
We have to become more resilient and also realize it's probably
26:24
them having a bad day and not us.
26:26
And actually it's not our problem if they wanna bring that kind of negativity.
26:29
I had a great one recently, so I put on some drinks at a really lovely
26:33
hotel in a lovely city, and it was free of charge for people to come.
26:37
There was free Prosecco cake.
26:39
It was a gorgeous evening, and posted in a.
26:41
Of vendors to say, if anyone wants to come along to this, like you're
26:44
invited, I'd love to see you there.
26:46
And someone commented underneath saying, you're so unprofessional
26:49
because you've made a typo.
26:51
And I was like, if that's what you've got from my generosity, , I
26:54
don't want you to come to my drinks.
26:56
Like
26:58
Renee: I love the typo.
26:59
I love the Typo Police because it's also.
27:02
Do you know how many emails I write a day?
27:04
Do you know how much copy we write a day?
27:06
Like, yeah, of course we try to put it through Grammarly and do our
27:08
best, but wouldn't it be kinder just to say, oh, hey, I don't know if
27:12
you realized you meant to say this.
27:14
Like why would someone not pick the kind option there?
27:17
That clearly tells me that that person has some issues they need to work on.
27:22
Becca: Yeah, and you have to just laugh about it.
27:24
So if you are out there and you're thinking, I'm scared of being
27:26
visible in case I have this, you might have it a little bit.
27:29
I haven't had it a lot, but I have had it a little bit.
27:31
And actually you just gotta let it go and be resilient.
27:35
Renee: Becca that's a great point too.
27:35
Like when you really think about, when I think about how many times I've gotten
27:38
anything negative in all these years and all the things I've done, it's a handful.
27:42
It is not a large, it's.
27:45
It's not really a concern of mine at all.
27:47
So for people who are thinking that, that's the thing, holding
27:49
them back, I say, no, release it.
27:51
Because that's not, it's not real.
27:53
It's not a real.
27:54
Becca: Yeah.
27:55
And going back to what you said right at the beginning, just give yourself
27:58
permission to go ahead and do it.
28:00
Stop holding yourself back.
28:02
So when you look at your own business, your wedding planning business, and
28:05
you think back, what do you think is the visibility strategy that's
28:09
worked best for you in your planning strategy that's worked best for me?
28:13
Renee: I mean, relationships, it's not, it's not a strategy , but relationships,
28:18
I mean, I don't think you can, I don't think you can be successful in.
28:22
in any business without real quality relationships.
28:25
And sometimes those relationships change and grow and morph and, or sometimes you
28:30
outgrow someone and you know what I mean?
28:31
Like, it, it's not, I'm not saying to hold tight and fast to
28:34
relationships that are not working out.
28:35
That's key.
28:36
But I do think, being someone who is interested in other people interested
28:41
in how you can serve other people, help other people lift other people.
28:45
That is going to get you farther.
28:46
I have a, it's not a joke, but it's this funny thing that my husband and
28:49
I always say, do you know Hamilton?
28:51
Did you watch Hamilton on when it was on tv?
28:53
And
28:54
Becca: Oh, I love Hamilton.
28:55
Renee: Love Hamilton.
28:55
So we love Hamilton.
28:56
We're obsessed.
28:56
And there was this moment in the, there was like this behind the scenes thing
29:00
about Hamilton, where lin Manuel Miranda says to Chris Jackson, I have a job.
29:04
You have a.
29:05
I have a job.
29:05
You have a job.
29:06
And we say that all the time.
29:07
It's just like a funny thing cuz people used to be actors, right?
29:10
My husband and I are like, that's so true cuz like, you, you get a job and you want
29:13
other people to get that job with you.
29:15
And so I think of all the time with my favorite vendors, I, I book
29:18
a job and I think I have a job.
29:20
You have a job.
29:21
So it's like, who do you feel that way about?
29:22
Who do you feel so strongly about that you're like, I
29:24
want to bring you up with me.
29:26
Those are the kind of relationships, that's the strategy that we.
29:29
Becca: That's brilliant.
29:30
I love that because I'm all about collaboration and I love it.
29:33
So how did you get yourself in front of people?
29:35
Did you do it online?
29:36
Did you go to in-person networking?
29:38
Where did you do it?
29:39
Renee: Everything.
29:39
I think at, at, at first, my whole thing was to be networking.
29:44
Like I, I used to be networking, like literally for.
29:47
Four or five nights a week.
29:48
Like not, not that's not even an exaggeration.
29:50
There were like, my first two years in business, I was basically like out of
29:53
the house all the time and my husband even said like, what is all this?
29:56
I was like, I just need everyone to know me because I, I have this theory
30:00
and I, and I think I've proved it with my own business, that even if someone
30:03
doesn't know your work, But they see you a lot at social engagements.
30:07
They see you at these industry networking things, and they know
30:10
that you're someone who shows up.
30:12
It instills some confidence in them about your work, even if they've never
30:16
really worked with you, because they're like, oh, well, Renee's at everything.
30:19
She's so, she's such a, you know, she's part of the community.
30:21
She's such a supporter of these organizations.
30:24
That is how I built my business.
30:26
I just made sure that I was sort of everywhere.
30:29
In fact, by the time, like I was five, six years in, I had to like literally
30:32
sit down with myself and be like, you don't need to go to everything anymore.
30:35
People know you, you can relax.
30:37
So at first I just wanted to be.
30:39
Everywhere because I also wanted to know people, right?
30:42
As a wedding planner, like we have to know everyone, or at least I think we do.
30:46
And so that's how that started.
30:48
But then once I started my education brand and teaching on stage, it was
30:53
really important for me to know who I was.
30:56
Educating Right to, to, I only get ideas from the, from the, from the students.
31:00
Like it's not like I'm over here going like, you know what I think they need?
31:03
It's like you have to talk to people.
31:05
And so that very much in the last couple years has all been online.
31:08
So again, I think it's just about all of this that we've been talking about
31:12
from the beginnings of my career.
31:14
To visibility to now this conversation.
31:16
It's like it's all just about showing up.
31:18
You can't be successful in business if you're hiding behind anything.
31:22
I think because it's not authentically you.
31:25
It's not authentically who people want to do business with.
31:29
You know?
31:29
Especially now, especially Gen Z, like they want to know
31:33
you and that might be scary.
31:35
But there's gotta be a way for you to reconcile the real you with the public.
31:40
You, there has to be a little bit of real you in the public.
31:42
You, it has to be authentic in that way because I think the people
31:46
that aren't on board with this will, will not be serving Gen Z.
31:49
You know, they won't be in business that much longer.
31:51
It's changing.
31:52
It's always changing as our clients change.
31:55
Becca: Yeah, that's very, very true.
31:57
Okay, Renee, before we wrap up of this great conversation, which I could carry
32:02
on having forever, I always end my podcast with the same question, which is this.
32:07
What is the one thing you wish you'd known sooner in your own business?
32:10
Renee: Oh, That my business is about me, and I say that in this in this way.
32:15
I spent a lot of time at the beginning of my business figuring out who I was going
32:20
to serve, and I thought, well, because I have an open mind and I'm L G B T Q Pro.
32:27
and I'm, you know, I, I, I'm open-minded more than the wedding
32:30
industry was 12 years ago.
32:31
When I started, I thought, well, of course my clients are going to be
32:34
really offbeat and really irreverent and really non-traditional, and we're
32:38
gonna do these like wacky off the beaten path weddings at these crazy venues.
32:43
I really had this thought in my head that I was going to be this like offbeat bride.
32:46
Remember that blog Offbeat bride, that offbeat bride wedding planner?
32:50
And so that's how I started.
32:51
I, I wanted to appeal to these really offbeat couples.
32:56
So I did my first wedding show, which was, the Lovesick Expo,
32:58
which was hosted by Offbeat bride.
33:00
And I remember the weeks before I was getting really panicked
33:03
because I was like, oh, I don't really look like an offbeat.
33:07
Bride person, right?
33:09
Like I am just me and I, I'm not, I don't have tattoos or piercings or purple
33:13
hair or I don't look like these people.
33:16
So then I literally was like, went to my acting background and I was like,
33:19
well, what would I wear if I were, and I like, bought this outfit and like,
33:23
did my hair all kind of funky and had like a really overly designed booth.
33:27
And I stood there at this expo and I thought, what am I doing?
33:31
This is like not, this is not it.
33:33
This is not authentic.
33:35
Like, where am I in this equation?
33:37
Like, yes, I am here to serve, but I was really trying to put myself in this
33:42
niche that I'm, it's not authentic to me.
33:44
And not, not surprisingly, I was not successful at that show because people
33:48
could tell that I was wearing a costume that I was putting on this idea of
33:53
who I thought they wanted me to be.
33:55
all these years later, right?
33:57
I'm, I'm, me, like, I like bougie, expensive things and I , I,
34:02
I, like, I, I shop at anne Taylor for God's sakes.
34:05
Like I'm just a, I'm just that woman.
34:07
And now my clients come to me because I'm me and they see.
34:11
part of themselves in this authentic me.
34:13
And I'm not trying to wear striped, you know, striped tights and like
34:19
a motorcycle jacket with my hair.
34:20
You know, like that's not the look and I, and that all, that probably sounds
34:24
to some people like quite shallow.
34:26
But I really had to get to the sense of my business is it's me and I have
34:31
to put myself out there authentically to attract the right people.
34:34
And ultimately I wasn't successful until I got to that.
34:38
And it's, it's hard because I, it was easier to hide behind that,
34:41
well, I'm this person in this job.
34:44
But that isn't real.
34:45
Does that make sense?
34:46
I feel like I explained myself into a, into a circle.
34:48
Becca: No, that makes total sense.
34:49
And you know what?
34:49
I would love to see a photo of you at that first wedding show.
34:52
Renee: No, I've burned them all.
34:54
Ridiculous.
34:55
Becca: But it's true, because we just can't pretend to be
34:57
something that we're not.
34:58
It won't last, and people will see straight through it.
35:00
And you're much better becoming happy with yourself and just being.
35:04
Unapologetically you, Renee, it's been such a pleasure to have you.
35:08
I know you're gonna share a guide about visibility with my audience, so we'll
35:11
pop a link to that in the show notes.
35:13
Can you just tell us a little bit more about that?
35:14
Renee: Yeah, so it's a, it's actually a really, it's a long guide.
35:17
Here's the thing.
35:18
I love making these guides, and then once I get started, I'm like,
35:20
it's a book . So it actually has 30 days of visibility prompts in there
35:24
that you can use for any month.
35:26
You can start whenever, but it also has the definition of the three levels
35:29
of visibility and then some helpful.
35:32
Helpful tips and tricks and people to look for, like, you know,
35:35
reference, links for people who can help you take excellent selfies.
35:38
Cuz I know a lot of times we talk about this, I talked a lot about
35:41
photo shoots and you're like seeing dollar signs and I get it.
35:44
I've also taken very many interesting photos of myself on my phone.
35:49
Like, you don't need to invest a lot of money here and there are.
35:52
There's one specific gal.
35:54
Her name is serell and I linked to a lot of her stuff cuz she's sort
35:57
of like a pro at taking a selfie.
35:59
Like really artistic, beautiful photos with your camera.
36:02
It's genius.
36:03
There's no barrier.
36:04
Here is the point and it's all in the guide.
36:07
Becca: Love it.
36:07
So I will make sure I've linked to that guide in the show notes.
36:10
I'll also make sure to link to your Instagram and your website, so if you
36:13
guys wanna hear more from Renee, I'm sure she's happy for you to reach out to her.
36:17
So all of her links will be below.
36:19
Renee: Thanks so much, Becca.
36:20
Thanks for having me.
36:20
Becca: I just love that conversation with Renee.
36:22
I could have listened to her tell her stories all day long, and I just love how.
36:27
Honest.
36:27
She was about how being authentic is so important, but being
36:31
visible didn't come easy to her.
36:33
But over time, she's perfected it, and now she's just unapologetically herself.
36:38
Why don't you try and be a little bit more visible in your
36:41
wedding business this week?
36:42
I'd love you to be accountable to me to do it.
36:44
So why not go ahead post something, do something different in your business, and
36:48
then drop into my inbox on Instagram or Facebook and let me know what you did.
36:52
I'd love to celebrate that with.
36:54
I'll see you next time.