Transcript

Credlin | 12 May · Credlin

0:02
Speaker 1: Peter Krandland live on Sky News Australia.
0:08
Speaker 2: Good evening, Welcome to the program. Big week ahead, convulsions
0:12
Speaker 2: going on inside the parties. Used from the Prime Minister today,
0:14
Speaker 2: it's all coming up to night on credline in that
0:17
Speaker 2: vein the PM and veiling his new little cabinet today.
0:19
Speaker 2: Factional fighting continues though to plague the Labor Party. Now
0:23
Speaker 2: he's made some interesting choices. We'll discuss those. We'll have
0:25
Speaker 2: a look at who's been demoted or cut all together
0:28
Speaker 2: as well. This afternoon two the National Party had their elections.
0:32
Speaker 2: They re elected David littlprowd Tomorrow the Liberals will meet.
0:36
Speaker 2: The numbers are tight between Susan Lee and Angus Taylor
0:40
Speaker 2: Key In all of this is the direction the Coalition
0:43
Speaker 2: takes on big issues like nuclear energy. Chris Yilman with
0:47
Speaker 2: more class sets, not all about Canberra. Farmers and fires
0:51
Speaker 2: in Victoria making their voices heard over a new tax
0:54
Speaker 2: at risks, sending regional communities bus They're suffering with the drought,
0:58
Speaker 2: but this is huge. Big protests on Friday, more protests
1:02
Speaker 2: set for tomorrow. I'll speak with one farmer tonight who
1:04
Speaker 2: says enough is enough and in a very clear message
1:08
Speaker 2: to some left leaning liberals. I think nuclear powers on
1:11
Speaker 2: the policy shopping board, the Nationals declare they are not
1:16
Speaker 2: for turning.
1:17
Speaker 3: We've had the courage on nuclear energy, something that our
1:20
Speaker 3: party room has believed in for a very long time,
1:23
Speaker 3: and all renewables approach won't work.
1:28
Speaker 2: Here here for the Nationals. With first the PM today
1:30
Speaker 2: announcing his second term ministry, all individuals are remind everyone
1:35
Speaker 2: chosen by the factions, with the PM left only to
1:38
Speaker 2: allocate the portfolios over the weekend. Now I'll get to
1:42
Speaker 2: that announcement in detail in a moment. But while he
1:45
Speaker 2: was doing all of that, the coalition parties, well they've
1:48
Speaker 2: been working the phones, making calls and taking calls as
1:53
Speaker 2: they elect their new leadership teams. This afternoon, of course,
1:56
Speaker 2: that was the Nationals who met at three pm in
1:58
Speaker 2: Canberra to re elect David little Proud as leader. Kevin
2:02
Speaker 2: Hogan elected as the new Deputy. I'll get into that
2:06
Speaker 2: result a little later with my panel. But Little Brow's
2:09
Speaker 2: reinstatement of his party's position on nuclear well it was unequivocal.
2:16
Speaker 3: We've had the courage on nuclear energy, something that our
2:19
Speaker 3: party room has believed in for a very long time
2:22
Speaker 3: and all renewables approach won't work. But it was our
2:24
Speaker 3: party room, from many people before us that had the
2:27
Speaker 3: courage to come forward, but it was us.
2:28
Speaker 1: It was our party room that delivered it.
2:32
Speaker 2: Now, that clear position on nuclear from the NATS is
2:34
Speaker 2: important as to where the coalition goes now, and I'll
2:37
Speaker 2: explain that in a moment. Tomorrow, of course, it'll be
2:40
Speaker 2: the Liberals who meet to elect their new leadership team,
2:43
Speaker 2: and unlike the Prime Minister, the new Liberal leader will
2:46
Speaker 2: also choose their shadow ministry as well as allocate the portfolios.
2:51
Speaker 2: But regardless of who wins tomorrow's Liberal leadership contest, the
2:55
Speaker 2: real issue is whether the Liberal Party will be a
2:57
Speaker 2: strong and clear alternative to the Albanezy government. That's why
3:02
Speaker 2: the recent election was lost because on too many issues
3:05
Speaker 2: the Liberals were not a clear alternative, and on those
3:10
Speaker 2: issues where they were a clear alternative, they didn't put
3:14
Speaker 2: up much of a fight. Like you, I cheered when
3:17
Speaker 2: Peter Dutton committed the coalition to ending the band on
3:20
Speaker 2: nuclear power, because if Australia really does have to get
3:24
Speaker 2: to net zero, the only way to do so and
3:26
Speaker 2: keep the lights on is via a missions free nuclear
3:30
Speaker 2: power Sadly for our country. Having made that commitment, the
3:34
Speaker 2: Coalition failed to win the argument. Indeed, it hardly even
3:39
Speaker 2: prosecuted it. Peter Dutton never once did a media event
3:42
Speaker 2: outside the Lucas Heights nuclear reactor that's been operating very
3:46
Speaker 2: safely in Sydney's South for nearly seventy years. Nor did
3:51
Speaker 2: he ever do a media event outside a medical diagnostic
3:55
Speaker 2: facility when nuclear medicine is a vital part of detecting
3:59
Speaker 2: and treating cancers for millions of Australians. Nor did he
4:02
Speaker 2: push hard with the example of Ontario in Canada, which
4:05
Speaker 2: gets some fifty percent of its power from nuclear energy,
4:08
Speaker 2: and where power costs there are about half of what
4:12
Speaker 2: Australians pay. Indeed, once the Coalition had made its nuclear announcement,
4:18
Speaker 2: the only people talking about nuclear power with a Labor.
4:22
Speaker 4: Party this time they need to find six hundred billion
4:26
Speaker 4: dollars to pay for their nuclear reactors and a six
4:30
Speaker 4: hundred billion dollar nuclear plan.
4:34
Speaker 2: You say it's not you know it's not. You know,
4:37
Speaker 2: I know it is now. That six hundred million dollar figure,
4:42
Speaker 2: as I've said before, didn't come from a reputable expert.
4:45
Speaker 2: It was cooked up by something called the Smart Energy Council,
4:48
Speaker 2: a renewable industry lobby group stacked with ex labor insiders
4:53
Speaker 2: and on the board at one time Climbate two hundred
4:55
Speaker 2: founder the Teels puppet master Simon Holmes, a court if
5:00
Speaker 2: Labour's lies about the costume nuclear power. Let's look at
5:03
Speaker 2: the objective electoral facts from last week in because now
5:08
Speaker 2: that the results are clear, what's evident is that the
5:12
Speaker 2: seats where nuclear power stations might have been located will
5:16
Speaker 2: showed there was no rejection of the coalition, indeed, far
5:20
Speaker 2: from it. In most of these seats, the Coalition actually
5:24
Speaker 2: improved its position despite going backwards. On a national scale.
5:29
Speaker 2: Marina at the side of the Tawong power station, David
5:33
Speaker 2: Little proud Well he got seventy one percent of the
5:35
Speaker 2: two PP vote. In Flynn the side of the Khalid
5:39
Speaker 2: power station, Colin Boyce Well, he got a six point
5:42
Speaker 2: seven percent two party preferred swing in his favor. In Hunter,
5:46
Speaker 2: the side of the Ladell power station. There was a
5:49
Speaker 2: big swing to Labor, but none no greater there than
5:52
Speaker 2: the national swing. In Claire the side of the Mountain
5:56
Speaker 2: Piper Point a power station, the ex National Independent he held on,
6:01
Speaker 2: but he did not campaign against nuclear power. In Gray
6:05
Speaker 2: the side of the Port Augusta power station, there was
6:08
Speaker 2: an antiliberal swing, but this was also two a range
6:11
Speaker 2: of factors. There was the retirement there of the incumbent
6:14
Speaker 2: long standing Liberal and also a strong Teal campaign. Despite that,
6:19
Speaker 2: all though the Libs held the seat. In O'Connor the
6:22
Speaker 2: side of the Collie power station, Rick Wilson got a
6:25
Speaker 2: seven percent two party preferred swing in his favor, unlike
6:29
Speaker 2: many other Liberals in WA. And finally in Gippsland's side
6:33
Speaker 2: of the loy Yang power station, Darren chester Well he
6:36
Speaker 2: got seventy percent of the two PP vote. Now, despite
6:40
Speaker 2: the fact that the British Labor Party, the Democrats in
6:43
Speaker 2: the United States, and the Canadian Liberals their equivalent of
6:47
Speaker 2: our Labor Party here, so all of the Anglo spheares
6:50
Speaker 2: leftist parties, despite the fact that all of them support
6:54
Speaker 2: nuclear power. Here in Australia, the Labour Party remains fanatically opposed.
7:00
Speaker 2: And then there's now this strong campaign to get the
7:02
Speaker 2: Liberal Party to back Labour's energy policy, the policy that
7:06
Speaker 2: finnels billions and billions of dollars of subsidies to anyone
7:10
Speaker 2: in the renewable sector. Here's the website for Premier State,
7:14
Speaker 2: the lobbying firm controlled by Liberal factional manipulator Michael Photius,
7:19
Speaker 2: along with numerous green energy firms. Smart Energy Council is
7:24
Speaker 2: a Premier State client and now a Photius supported Liberal
7:29
Speaker 2: senator Maria Kovicheck is calling for the Liberals to drop
7:33
Speaker 2: their support for nuclear energy.
7:36
Speaker 5: This is a policy that went to an election. The
7:39
Speaker 5: election result was devastating, so the message from the community
7:44
Speaker 5: is very very clear, and that's why I believe that
7:47
Speaker 5: this nuclear policy has to go.
7:51
Speaker 2: Well, Phipps to her. I mean, the response from the
7:54
Speaker 2: community is very much in favor of nuclear if you
7:57
Speaker 2: look at the seats where the nuclear paur plants were
8:01
Speaker 2: identified and would have been built if the coalition was elected. Plus,
8:07
Speaker 2: there's been a high rotation ad campaign on this station
8:11
Speaker 2: and others by something called Liberals against Nuclear, urging the
8:15
Speaker 2: defeated party to adopt Labour's energy policy. And we can
8:19
Speaker 2: be sure that Liberals against Nuclear are being funded by
8:22
Speaker 2: big wind and big solar, people who will make millions
8:26
Speaker 2: and millions out of more and more renewables. Make no mistake,
8:30
Speaker 2: there will be massive pressure brought on the new leader
8:33
Speaker 2: to drop support for nuclear power, especially if Susan Lee
8:37
Speaker 2: is the leader, because her support comes from factional players
8:41
Speaker 2: like Photius. Make no mistake who drives all of this.
8:46
Speaker 2: It's a campaign by Cashta Renewables energy vested interest to
8:50
Speaker 2: protect their subsidy harvesting business model. This is not about
8:54
Speaker 2: helping the Liberal Party. It's about helping labor because it's
8:59
Speaker 2: labour policy that's patting the profits of these greensillionaires. And
9:04
Speaker 2: it also has the potential to split the coalition too,
9:08
Speaker 2: given how strongly the national support nuclear power for coalition
9:12
Speaker 2: has split. Well, that's goodbye to government for a generation.
9:17
Speaker 2: This is what's driving the anti nuclear campaign. It's not
9:22
Speaker 2: about cheaper power for you or industry. It's about nothing
9:25
Speaker 2: more than the millions and millions in profit that all
9:28
Speaker 2: of these players can make out of taxpayer subsidies. This
9:33
Speaker 2: is why where to now for the Liberals matters as
9:38
Speaker 2: much as it does. All right, let's go to Cavan
9:45
Speaker 2: now for the headlines that Sky News political reporter cam Reddin.
9:49
Speaker 6: Good evening, the Prime Minister has unveiled his new lawk
9:52
Speaker 6: ministry with senior colleagues handed new responsibilities.
9:56
Speaker 7: I've got people who are I think in the best positions.
10:00
Speaker 6: Tanya Plipasek has been moved to Social Services, with Murray
10:03
Speaker 6: Watt taking over the Environment portfolio. Amanda Rishworth takes on employment,
10:08
Speaker 6: while Annika Wells picks up communication and Tim Ayres replaces
10:12
Speaker 6: the dumped Industry Minister Ed Husick.
10:15
Speaker 7: That's a system that it's one that Ed and others
10:18
Speaker 7: have supported for a long period of time.
10:21
Speaker 6: Also sidelined Attorney General Mark Dreyfus, Michelle Roland will take
10:26
Speaker 6: his place. Health Minister Mark Butler adds the NDIS, while
10:29
Speaker 6: new Minister Sam Ray takes on aged care. National's leader
10:33
Speaker 6: David little Proud has survived a challenge to his position
10:36
Speaker 6: from Senator Matt Canavan.
10:38
Speaker 3: And there'll be some big questions that we'll have to
10:40
Speaker 3: move forward on, but we'll do that in a calm,
10:42
Speaker 3: methodical way.
10:43
Speaker 6: But internal pressure is mounting to revisit his commitment to
10:46
Speaker 6: net zero by twenty fifty.
10:49
Speaker 3: I don't make Captain's calls. I draw on the experience
10:52
Speaker 3: of those in that party room to be able to
10:54
Speaker 3: determine the policies that we take forward.
10:56
Speaker 6: Cameron Reddin's Sky News Canberra.
11:00
Speaker 2: No, all right, still a few electrics tonight that remain
11:04
Speaker 2: too close to call. We'll ten days on now from
11:07
Speaker 2: the election. Let's get that update now with our chief
11:10
Speaker 2: election analyst, Tom Connell.
11:13
Speaker 8: This is the state of the House where three seats
11:15
Speaker 8: still undecided. You can see Labor on ninety three, the
11:18
Speaker 8: Coalition forty two. The Greens will end up on one.
11:21
Speaker 8: No more seats, they've gone from four to one, and
11:24
Speaker 8: Climate two hundred backed independence the Teal color there are
11:26
Speaker 8: on five. Remember they started off on six. So where
11:29
Speaker 8: are the undecided seats and which way are they likely
11:31
Speaker 8: to go? So it's Bradfield, Callwell and Longman. These two
11:35
Speaker 8: tiny margins. Call Well explain why there's no margin.
11:38
Speaker 6: On there at all.
11:39
Speaker 8: When we take a look at the seat of Bradfield,
11:42
Speaker 8: this has been a cliffhanger right now. If we look
11:45
Speaker 8: at the margin crucially between Giesel cap Darian and Nicol
11:48
Speaker 8: lit Buller, you can see that the margin is just
11:50
Speaker 8: one hundred and eighty votes. Now, the current projections we
11:52
Speaker 8: have on the rest of the absent vote is for
11:55
Speaker 8: the Liberal Party to win this seat by about the
11:57
Speaker 8: same margin one hundred and seventy to one hundred and
11:59
Speaker 8: eighty votes. But if there is a change the way
12:02
Speaker 8: some of that vote has flowed, and there was a
12:04
Speaker 8: little bit of a change today in one type that
12:06
Speaker 8: margin could close. Remember, under one hundred votes as well
12:09
Speaker 8: does trigger a recount. So for now that remains too close.
12:13
Speaker 8: You'd rather be in the Liberal Party shoes. They are
12:15
Speaker 8: in the box seat considering the flow we have seen
12:18
Speaker 8: of that remaining absent vote. The other seat, of course,
12:21
Speaker 8: too close to call for now is the seat of Longman,
12:24
Speaker 8: So this is a more straight up contest between the
12:27
Speaker 8: L and P and the Labor Party.
12:29
Speaker 2: Again, this is a really small margin.
12:31
Speaker 8: Again, it's the L and P in the lead here,
12:33
Speaker 8: as you can see at the moment by two hundred
12:35
Speaker 8: and thirty six votes. Labor, though, is favored in the
12:38
Speaker 8: remaining absent votes in the way they have been flowing
12:41
Speaker 8: so far. Again, there was a slight slow down today
12:44
Speaker 8: in the catch up for Labor.
12:46
Speaker 2: There's a chance the L.
12:47
Speaker 1: And P hang on.
12:48
Speaker 8: At the moment we have the margin at about one
12:50
Speaker 8: hundred and fifty to Labor if the rest of the
12:53
Speaker 8: vote flows as expected, But it's very tight. So again
12:56
Speaker 8: that one is too close to call, and the final
12:58
Speaker 8: one is call well, this will be too close to
13:01
Speaker 8: call for the next couple of weeks at least. Why
13:03
Speaker 8: is that it's the primary vote. It is totally unclear
13:05
Speaker 8: who finishes second. At this point you can see very
13:08
Speaker 8: low primaries, so we need preferences to be distributed right
13:11
Speaker 8: all the way down to the bottom. You can see
13:13
Speaker 8: a lot of different votes, some more independent, one nation,
13:15
Speaker 8: and so on to see whether a liberal party finish
13:18
Speaker 8: a second or another candidate, and then whether enough preferences
13:21
Speaker 8: combined to have laborhead or another party.
13:24
Speaker 2: So for now that does mean.
13:25
Speaker 8: The State of the House has likely Labor on ninety
13:28
Speaker 8: four or ninety five and the Coalition likely on forty three.
13:34
Speaker 2: Very interesting, isn't it. That's got out of the announced
13:37
Speaker 2: with the PM's second term ministry this afternoon. So interesting
13:40
Speaker 2: choices promoting Marray what into environment, shunting tan your pleba
13:44
Speaker 2: sec out of environment into social services gig which is
13:47
Speaker 2: a sort of going nowhere job unless reforms on the table.
13:51
Speaker 2: Reforms not on the table. This is now just about
13:53
Speaker 2: handing out welfare payments, not much else. So she's been
13:56
Speaker 2: certainly sidelined. Interestingly, despite Labor criticizing and unwinding the Morrison
14:01
Speaker 2: era changes to the Home Affairs portfolio. A whole lot
14:05
Speaker 2: of them have been added back in aso the Federal Police.
14:08
Speaker 2: All of those will now stay with Tony Burke. He
14:10
Speaker 2: stays in that gig. Surprisingly to here the ndies, Well,
14:14
Speaker 2: that'll move from the Social services area again gutting the
14:18
Speaker 2: job that the Prime Minister has given pleversc and it'll
14:21
Speaker 2: move over to health where it will grow to be
14:23
Speaker 2: an even bigger portfolio under the current minister and would
14:27
Speaker 2: be leader leadership asperent from the left Mark Butler on energy.
14:32
Speaker 2: No hope here for the country because it will stay
14:34
Speaker 2: with the hapless Chris Bowen, Jordan men now Sky and
14:37
Speaker 2: is political contributor Chris Yulman, Chris a fair amount of
14:41
Speaker 2: factional payback here. A number of MPs dumped by their faction.
14:46
Speaker 2: And this wasn't the Prime Minister's doing. This was the faction.
14:49
Speaker 2: In the case of Eve Husick, it's the right that
14:53
Speaker 2: dumped him, but also some political squaring off and this
14:56
Speaker 2: was under the pen of the Prime Minister. The way
14:59
Speaker 2: in which he's really treated Tanya Pleversec it's a colder sack,
15:04
Speaker 2: if I can call it, that Social services portfolio of
15:07
Speaker 2: no reforms on the table. What did you make of today.
15:12
Speaker 9: Yeah, Well, Asides said, Husick was concerned it was a
15:15
Speaker 9: fight between two parts of the right, the Victorian Right
15:17
Speaker 9: in the New South Wales Right, and it was the
15:19
Speaker 9: Victorian Right that won in the end. I was a
15:22
Speaker 9: little surprised about the way that ed Husick dealt with that.
15:24
Speaker 9: I didn't think that throwing all the toys out of
15:26
Speaker 9: the cot, which he clearly did in days after that,
15:30
Speaker 9: and his appearance on Insiders and getting the former Prime
15:32
Speaker 9: Minister Paul Keating to write in his favor, and Paul
15:34
Speaker 9: Keating saying in the midst of that there wasn't any
15:36
Speaker 9: intellectual grunt in the Victorian Right. Well, I think that's
15:41
Speaker 9: belied by some of the people who are coming in.
15:44
Speaker 9: If ed Husick wanted to long stay in the party
15:47
Speaker 9: and a top job in future, that I think he's
15:49
Speaker 9: put his cause back with the way he's behaved. And
15:52
Speaker 9: I think of all the people Peter who lost their
15:54
Speaker 9: jobs and lost their jobs and lost their place in Parliament,
15:57
Speaker 9: and all the people in this building at the moment
15:59
Speaker 9: who are clearing out their desks. Ed Hughesy gets to stay,
16:03
Speaker 9: he should probably look at the way that Keith wallerhan
16:05
Speaker 9: dealt with the way that he left Parliament with real
16:08
Speaker 9: dignity and grace, and I think that there are a
16:11
Speaker 9: lot of people hurting at the moment. Losing your ministry
16:13
Speaker 9: is not as bad as losing your job in parliament.
16:15
Speaker 9: As far as Tanya Plip, your second's concerned us, no
16:17
Speaker 9: secret at all. Of course, at the Prime Minister and
16:19
Speaker 9: channel for the second beIN rivals for a long time.
16:22
Speaker 9: She had to stay in cabinet. She has the talent
16:24
Speaker 9: to do it, she's got the support inside the party.
16:25
Speaker 1: To do it.
16:26
Speaker 9: But yes, at the moment, under this Prime Minister, her
16:29
Speaker 9: career is on a hold.
16:33
Speaker 2: You mentioned there're some bright young things, and I want
16:36
Speaker 2: to mention a couple of those. Doctor Andrew Charlton. He's
16:39
Speaker 2: now the new Cabinet secretary. That means he'll have a
16:41
Speaker 2: role in policy development.
16:43
Speaker 6: Now.
16:43
Speaker 2: I think this is a really good thing. I had
16:45
Speaker 2: a bit to do with him when he was in
16:46
Speaker 2: Kevin Rudd's office as the Chief Economist, and a bit
16:49
Speaker 2: later on outside the Parliament before he stood obviously for paramatter.
16:52
Speaker 2: I think he's got a good brain, a big brain,
16:55
Speaker 2: and I think that he will at least provide I
16:57
Speaker 2: hope some contestability around the cabinet table to all the
17:02
Speaker 2: usual dumb ideas that get thrown up by department and
17:05
Speaker 2: that weak ministers then just regurgitate and try and get up.
17:09
Speaker 2: You need someone to knock some of that out. Also
17:12
Speaker 2: from Victoria Victorian right is Dan Melino, now hughsic saying
17:17
Speaker 2: or keeping saying, there's not many smart people. This bloke
17:20
Speaker 2: has got an economics PhD from Yale. I don't know him,
17:25
Speaker 2: but I suspect that's pretty telling. That says he's pretty clever.
17:28
Speaker 2: So I hope you're going to see some some intellectual
17:30
Speaker 2: pressure here and some political pressure on people like Jim Chalmers,
17:34
Speaker 2: because I think we've got some really difficult decisions coming forward,
17:39
Speaker 2: not just an energy obviously, but in the broader economy.
17:43
Speaker 9: Well, Andrew Shelton's credential speak for themselves. I don't take
17:47
Speaker 9: a claim to know him well. I knew him from
17:49
Speaker 9: the time on you him when he was around the
17:50
Speaker 9: right government. But then he went out and made an
17:53
Speaker 9: absolute fortune for himself in the private sector, and good
17:55
Speaker 9: luck to him on that front. He's well credentialed in
17:58
Speaker 9: the economic area. Dan Molino I do know well, and
18:02
Speaker 9: is a really decent man, a highly intelligent one. Bought
18:05
Speaker 9: to write a book called Safety Net, which runs to
18:08
Speaker 9: I think, you know, maybe a thousand pages. So I
18:10
Speaker 9: promise him I will read it one day. So he's
18:12
Speaker 9: an intellectual powerhouse, a really decent man. And can I say,
18:15
Speaker 9: by the way he stood for a couple of weeks
18:17
Speaker 9: on Prepole, he was subjected to the same abuse that
18:20
Speaker 9: a lot of Labor right candidates were subjected to by
18:24
Speaker 9: volunteers from the Socialist Alliance, Muslim Votes and the Greens.
18:29
Speaker 1: Although the Greens that I spoke to deny that they
18:31
Speaker 1: were part of that.
18:32
Speaker 9: But there were some very ugly stuff that happened on
18:35
Speaker 9: the campaign on those Prepole booths from the right and
18:38
Speaker 9: the left.
18:39
Speaker 1: I do have to say, and I hope that in
18:40
Speaker 1: future we don't see any more of that.
18:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, at any given time, I used to say this
18:46
Speaker 2: obviously as a Liberal staffer, I'd say this to people
18:50
Speaker 2: I work with. Our mob's going to be out. We're
18:52
Speaker 2: going to be an opposition, so we want the best
18:54
Speaker 2: possible labor party in there when they are governing. I
18:57
Speaker 2: want them to gather well, I want them not to
18:59
Speaker 2: waste down and all the usual things, because too often
19:02
Speaker 2: the leaves have to come in and clean up the mess.
19:04
Speaker 2: So I am pleased to see more people coming in
19:07
Speaker 2: with what i'd give I'd call policy grunt smarts, and
19:13
Speaker 2: not just demonstrated paper smart. It's not just a degree
19:16
Speaker 2: or a PhD, but evidence that they care about where
19:19
Speaker 2: the country is going, that they want to get into
19:21
Speaker 2: the policy debate, that they're more about long generational solutions,
19:27
Speaker 2: if I can call it Chris as opposed to a
19:30
Speaker 2: hit in question Time or something to get on the
19:32
Speaker 2: front page of the Telly tomorrow. That they want to
19:34
Speaker 2: fix the problems our country's facing.
19:38
Speaker 9: Absolutely, And the other thing too, is that I got
19:40
Speaker 9: to pick people. I picked policies, and the only thing
19:43
Speaker 9: I would say, it's a labor party about the policies
19:45
Speaker 9: it's got on energy.
19:45
Speaker 1: At the moment, they're entirely wrong.
19:47
Speaker 9: That's really my major beef with where this party is heading,
19:49
Speaker 9: and that I believe that the economy is intimately tied,
19:53
Speaker 9: in fact completely tied to energy in the way that
19:56
Speaker 9: energy is produced, and if we continue on the path
19:58
Speaker 9: that they put us on, then we're on the road
20:00
Speaker 9: to poverty.
20:01
Speaker 1: It will be an absolute disaster.
20:02
Speaker 9: And the signs of that are already here, and they're
20:05
Speaker 9: everywhere else where the similar policies have been pursued. So
20:08
Speaker 9: that's my main beef. There are really good people on
20:10
Speaker 9: all sides of politics. I think one of the problems
20:13
Speaker 9: that we've had in recent years is that we too
20:16
Speaker 9: often descend into personal abuse about people rather than just
20:19
Speaker 9: looking at the policies that are on offer. I have
20:21
Speaker 9: a big beef with a Labor Party's energy policy. I
20:25
Speaker 9: have real concerns about its defense policy, and I have
20:29
Speaker 9: some concerns about its economic policy.
20:31
Speaker 1: That's where my concerns lie.
20:32
Speaker 9: But as far as the people go, if you get
20:34
Speaker 9: Dan Malino into Parliament and into a position of power
20:38
Speaker 9: inside the Labor Party, then you've got a very, very
20:40
Speaker 9: sensible person who's going to be arguing for the right
20:43
Speaker 9: kinds of things for Australia.
20:44
Speaker 2: I think, Look, I agree, there's Assistant Treasure two. I
20:49
Speaker 2: don't think I mentioned that before. I want to pick
20:51
Speaker 2: up some comments. So David little Proud's been re elected
20:54
Speaker 2: to the National Party leader. I want to pick up
20:56
Speaker 2: some colleagues as some comments that my colleague Chris Kenny
21:00
Speaker 2: got out of him a moment ago when he interviewed
21:03
Speaker 2: him and they discussed net zero, have a listen.
21:07
Speaker 3: That's up to the party room. The leader doesn't make
21:09
Speaker 3: the determination in our party room. We draw on the
21:12
Speaker 3: collective of the wisdom of the entire party room. We'll
21:15
Speaker 3: have that conversation and all our policies are up for review.
21:22
Speaker 2: So the point here Chris Yeoman is that the net
21:24
Speaker 2: zero's up for grabs. He's not saying that that's now
21:27
Speaker 2: the policy. He's saying that there'll be a wholesale review
21:30
Speaker 2: of everything and it'll be a debate inside the party
21:32
Speaker 2: room whether they continue with net zero or whether the
21:35
Speaker 2: National Party drop it.
21:38
Speaker 1: Absolutely.
21:39
Speaker 9: And look, I think that there's an intellectual hegemony which
21:41
Speaker 9: is happening in Australia at the moment when the Liberal
21:43
Speaker 9: Party is going to perhaps be pushed into which is
21:46
Speaker 9: that everyone should sign up to the policy of net zero.
21:49
Speaker 9: But I would say read the room outside Australia, the
21:53
Speaker 9: United States is not signed up to it, China is
21:55
Speaker 9: not signed up to it, Russia is not signed up
21:57
Speaker 9: to it, India is not signed up to it. That's
21:59
Speaker 9: sixty percent of the world's emissions are not doing net zero.
22:03
Speaker 9: So the answer to the question then has to be
22:05
Speaker 9: what on Earth are we doing the policy that we've
22:08
Speaker 9: signed up to, and we've only just seen the beginning
22:11
Speaker 9: of it in the transition of the electricity system. The
22:14
Speaker 9: harder part is yet to come, which is how do
22:16
Speaker 9: we make concrete, how do we make.
22:18
Speaker 1: Steel, how do we make plastic?
22:20
Speaker 9: And how do we make ammonia which feeds half the
22:22
Speaker 9: world's population. That stuff has yet to be settled in
22:26
Speaker 9: any way that can be commercially applied. So to try
22:29
Speaker 9: and get to net zero means that you will see
22:32
Speaker 9: COVID level interference in people's lives from now on. Now,
22:37
Speaker 9: I think there's a really good liberal argument that you
22:40
Speaker 9: can make against that, which is that we don't want
22:42
Speaker 9: to see that level of interference in our lives, and
22:44
Speaker 9: we should let the market decide the kind of energy
22:47
Speaker 9: that we need to use. And of course, if you
22:49
Speaker 9: are determined to try and cut carbon emissions, there is
22:52
Speaker 9: only one source of power apart from hydro so one
22:55
Speaker 9: source of power that burns fuel that's capable of doing that,
22:59
Speaker 9: that is nuclear energy. That's a perfectly reasonable argument.
23:05
Speaker 2: We will leave it there, beautifully, said Chris Human. As always,
23:08
Speaker 2: all right, after the break, we're going to get into
23:10
Speaker 2: some issues in relation to farmers and fire fighting. It's
23:14
Speaker 2: a huge issue. Protests in Victoria Friday and again tomorrow,
23:19
Speaker 2: plus the push to legalize cannabis. I'll speak with a
23:21
Speaker 2: health expert about why this isn't it's as harmless as
23:25
Speaker 2: some would have you believe. Welcome back to the come
23:31
Speaker 2: the factional brawling inside the Liberal Party and why it
23:33
Speaker 2: needs to stop as more members leave. But first is
23:38
Speaker 2: growing outrage across Victoria's farming communities as we've seen a
23:42
Speaker 2: sharp rise in the state's fire services property levy hitting
23:47
Speaker 2: already struggling landowners. Farmers say they've bench forced a shoulder
23:51
Speaker 2: the cost of a broken fire system, one which has
23:53
Speaker 2: seen Victoria's once proud volunteer fire fighting force shrink to
23:58
Speaker 2: record lows while the bill for paid staff continues to soar.
24:03
Speaker 2: The problems first started with the forced merger of the
24:05
Speaker 2: state's volunteer fire brigade, the Country Fire Authority the CFA,
24:10
Speaker 2: with the Metropolitan Fibering Brigade the MFB, to form Fire
24:14
Speaker 2: Services Victoria. And this was all part of deal done
24:17
Speaker 2: between Daniel Andrews and the powerful Firefighters Union, the end
24:21
Speaker 2: result being a very frustrated and demoralized force fractured trust
24:27
Speaker 2: and now a fight back which is filled under the
24:29
Speaker 2: steps of the Victorian Parliament. It's all about a new
24:32
Speaker 2: and rebadged fire services levee that will force farmers to
24:36
Speaker 2: pay millions and millions of dollars to cover the cost
24:39
Speaker 2: of the state's merged entity. Now on Friday, farmers and
24:42
Speaker 2: volunteer firefighters made their way to Spring Street and the
24:45
Speaker 2: Premier's office in Bendigo, demanding a rethink of this new
24:49
Speaker 2: firefighting levee before farmers are pushed over the edge. For
24:54
Speaker 2: many farmers, the cost of this levee is in excess
24:58
Speaker 2: of eighty thousand dollars each. They say they're paying more
25:01
Speaker 2: for less and a calling for a return to the
25:04
Speaker 2: volunteer led model that's always served the bush best. In
25:09
Speaker 2: the Parliament, the Upper House is expected to vote on
25:11
Speaker 2: the controversial new tax as soon as tomorrow, with another
25:15
Speaker 2: rally set for the strips of Parliament to keep up
25:18
Speaker 2: the pressure. Rob Armstrong he's a farmer from a rat
25:23
Speaker 2: and he will be hit by this tax. He helped
25:25
Speaker 2: organize Friday's rally and he joins me now, Rob, thank
25:29
Speaker 2: you for your time. But you spoke at the rally
25:32
Speaker 2: on Friday. You say you'll be back at the Parliament
25:34
Speaker 2: House buildings tomorrow. I don't know. I'm calling it a levy,
25:38
Speaker 2: that's what the government's calling it. But this is a tax.
25:42
Speaker 2: Why are you paying this tax when we all know
25:44
Speaker 2: the farmers are the ones who fight these fires in
25:48
Speaker 2: regional communities anyway.
25:53
Speaker 10: Yes, it's a very horrible thing and the impact is
25:57
Speaker 10: mash up massive financially mostly and morally for farmers. This
26:03
Speaker 10: isn't a matter of a few hundred dollars. It's tens
26:05
Speaker 10: of thousands of dollars. In my community just around the here.
26:10
Speaker 10: Some people are facing bills at seventy thousand and up
26:14
Speaker 10: to five hundred thousand. It's not it's just devastating. If
26:20
Speaker 10: this tax gets through, it will destroy livelihoods. It will
26:24
Speaker 10: rip millions out of our rural towns, our businesses, sports clubs,
26:29
Speaker 10: local shops and services, and the knockron effect will be massive.
26:36
Speaker 10: We love farming, it's in our blood. But to be
26:39
Speaker 10: hit with one hundred and eighty nine percent increase on
26:41
Speaker 10: this levy, well it just feels like extortion. It's just
26:46
Speaker 10: bloody ol. Farmers are the first responders to nearly all.
26:51
Speaker 2: Sorry, no, I'm just going to make that point you're
26:55
Speaker 2: about to make. I mean, farmers are the ones who
26:57
Speaker 2: go out to fires and fight those fires off with
27:00
Speaker 2: their own equipment in their local areas. How does the
27:02
Speaker 2: government justify jacking up this levee by close to two
27:07
Speaker 2: hundred percent.
27:09
Speaker 1: Well, that's a very good question.
27:11
Speaker 2: But like.
27:15
Speaker 10: Most of us all fight the fires, Like for example,
27:19
Speaker 10: me and other fires and plenty of other farmers spend
27:22
Speaker 10: Christmas Day on a fire truck. It's no funding, no fuss,
27:26
Speaker 10: just doing what we had to get done for our community.
27:29
Speaker 10: We miss out on a lot of things to be
27:31
Speaker 10: on call twenty four to seven for our community. In
27:36
Speaker 10: our region, for example, there's a million acres, it's got
27:39
Speaker 10: nine mc f A trucks and over four hundred and
27:42
Speaker 10: fifty private units. That means over ninety five percent of
27:47
Speaker 10: fire units in our region are privately owned, paid for,
27:51
Speaker 10: and maintained by the farmers. Without us, rural fires would
27:56
Speaker 10: be so much more devastating.
28:02
Speaker 2: Is this all because of that merger? I mean, that's
28:04
Speaker 2: what's been said to me, Rob, that the merger of
28:07
Speaker 2: the CFA has broken the heart of the CFA volunteers,
28:11
Speaker 2: that the new merger is not working. This is the
28:14
Speaker 2: government in Victoria that's basically belly up bankrupt. It requires
28:19
Speaker 2: increases to all of these levees and all to fund
28:23
Speaker 2: fire services in the state.
28:24
Speaker 10: Now, yes, it appears that we're funding a lot of people,
28:29
Speaker 10: doesn't it.
28:30
Speaker 2: But the.
28:33
Speaker 10: Problem is it's all been taken away from us yet
28:39
Speaker 10: we are the first responders. But in your question about
28:43
Speaker 10: the merger, I'm probably not the person who answered that question.
28:46
Speaker 10: I'm not familiar enough with it.
28:51
Speaker 2: Right. I'm going to come back and talk to you
28:52
Speaker 2: again after this rally. I wish you all the very best.
28:54
Speaker 2: And just before we go, Rob, I know people out
28:58
Speaker 2: your way are doing it very tough. I mean, it's
29:01
Speaker 2: drought conditions. I don't know that we formally call it
29:03
Speaker 2: a drought yet, but I know the rainfall has been
29:05
Speaker 2: non existent. Can I get a sense of how it's
29:07
Speaker 2: been for you, Well.
29:10
Speaker 10: If you look down a gravel road, that's exactly what
29:13
Speaker 10: the whole farms look like in this area. It's well,
29:18
Speaker 10: I've been a farmer for well sixty years and this
29:22
Speaker 10: drought now is worse than nineteen sixty seven droud. It's
29:27
Speaker 10: it's devastating how bad it is. Like I'm not sure
29:30
Speaker 10: the farmers can't afford this tax in the first place
29:33
Speaker 10: at all.
29:35
Speaker 11: But if we have another drought like last year, there's
29:38
Speaker 11: going to be a lot of farmers aren't going to
29:40
Speaker 11: be able to pay, probably even their rates bill. Littlelone
29:43
Speaker 11: a farm Leavy that we shouldn't be paying in the
29:45
Speaker 11: first place.
29:48
Speaker 10: It's going to take it, take it.
29:49
Speaker 1: I hate to leave it there, Sorry.
29:54
Speaker 2: Rob, I hate to leave it there. I'll move on
29:56
Speaker 2: to other things, but I will promise you I'll come
29:57
Speaker 2: back tomorrow night to get a wrap of how this
30:00
Speaker 2: protest has gone. And I want to put some wood
30:01
Speaker 2: on the opposition to get very clear from them their
30:05
Speaker 2: position on this. Thank you for your time. I'll come
30:07
Speaker 2: back to the issue of the drought as well, because
30:08
Speaker 2: I'll tell you what, when Chris Bowen goes to those
30:11
Speaker 2: next round of climate targets, what is absolutely front and
30:16
Speaker 2: center is agriculture. That is that square the circle when
30:20
Speaker 2: you look at what farmers are facing. Now let's go
30:22
Speaker 2: to some other issues. As I said, they want to
30:24
Speaker 2: legalize cannabis in Victoria. It's certainly a push to around
30:29
Speaker 2: the country, but Victoria, like with so many things, is
30:32
Speaker 2: ground zero. It's been something that the Greens have pushed
30:35
Speaker 2: hard for in the parliament. Of course, we know the
30:38
Speaker 2: Greens now federally are decimated, but legalize cannabis the party, well,
30:43
Speaker 2: it's got plenty of influence and Victoria also is in
30:48
Speaker 2: a very poor debt position. So one of the biggest backers,
30:52
Speaker 2: as we know from Climate two hundred, the millionaire share
30:56
Speaker 2: trader Rob Keldoulis well he bought a Tasmani in cannabis
31:00
Speaker 2: farm in twenty twenty two, is also a high profile
31:04
Speaker 2: backer of the legalized cannabis party. This is a preference
31:07
Speaker 2: harvester in my view, and many of the to your races,
31:11
Speaker 2: all of this is a big concern. Then you add
31:13
Speaker 2: in the serious mental health worries that people have, particularly
31:17
Speaker 2: in relation to young people and the use of cannabis.
31:21
Speaker 2: Joining me now, Brain and Mind Center psychiatrist at the
31:24
Speaker 2: University of Sydney and Professor Ian Hickey. Professor Hickey, you're
31:29
Speaker 2: an expert on mental health. I'll ask you about that
31:32
Speaker 2: in a moment, but I think from the outset, let's
31:35
Speaker 2: be clear, there is a difference, isn't there between the
31:37
Speaker 2: decriminalization of cannabis use or any drug and the legalization
31:43
Speaker 2: of cannabis.
31:46
Speaker 7: Absolutely, and it's very important you make that distinction. Lots
31:48
Speaker 7: of people want to see the criminal element removed and
31:51
Speaker 7: not have people chased around by the police around minor
31:53
Speaker 7: issues of drug use and the legalization, and what follows that,
31:57
Speaker 7: which you've just highlighted, is the commercialization. And then you
32:01
Speaker 7: get into the problems that now running in Canada and
32:02
Speaker 7: the US of the commercialization, which itself creates all sorts
32:06
Speaker 7: of other difficulties, often people seeking tax revenue, as you
32:09
Speaker 7: point it out, but often there ends up being in
32:11
Speaker 7: an illegal market in addition to the legal market, So
32:14
Speaker 7: you don't actually solve the problem you set out to solve,
32:17
Speaker 7: and most important, you expose a whole lot more people,
32:19
Speaker 7: particularly young people, to the adverse effects, particularly the mental
32:23
Speaker 7: health effects of excessive cannabis use.
32:27
Speaker 2: Yeah, Professor Igi. One of the arguments in favor of
32:30
Speaker 2: legalization is that it will take the illegal trade off
32:34
Speaker 2: the streets, it will create a regulation environment, it will
32:39
Speaker 2: create a legal trade, and there'll be a clip of
32:41
Speaker 2: the ticket for the tax payers. But that's not the
32:43
Speaker 2: case or the experience overseas, is it. No.
32:46
Speaker 7: In fact, i'd suggest if anyone's been in New York
32:48
Speaker 7: City recently, you'll see legal cannabis shops and outside you'll
32:51
Speaker 7: see illegal cannabis being solved, and there's Sonibian criminal ailment
32:55
Speaker 7: along with the legal element. It's just like we now
32:57
Speaker 7: see in the tobacco trade around Australia the legal bit,
33:01
Speaker 7: and because of price and competition, there's the illegal bit.
33:03
Speaker 7: So the notion that legalization will entirely remove the criminal
33:06
Speaker 7: element just basically isn't true. And the supply issue is
33:10
Speaker 7: really the issue here. As you pointed out, there are
33:12
Speaker 7: many people who've invested or want to invest in the
33:14
Speaker 7: commercialization of cannabis because there will be a large market,
33:18
Speaker 7: but there will also be inevitably large negative health effects,
33:22
Speaker 7: particularly on mental health and particularly on the young people.
33:24
Speaker 7: So the associations with psychosis with a motivational states, as
33:28
Speaker 7: well as with accident injury due to intoxication are pretty
33:31
Speaker 7: clear cut. And my colleagues INABA, in Canada and the
33:34
Speaker 7: US states that have done this in particular have seen
33:36
Speaker 7: exactly that increased presentations to emergency rooms increased rates of psychosis.
33:41
Speaker 7: And this is one of the things we can control.
33:42
Speaker 7: We don't have to make the problem worse.
33:47
Speaker 2: I've been told a lot of this impacts our young people,
33:48
Speaker 2: particularly young men, and given how tough it's been for
33:52
Speaker 2: so many of them coming out of COVID, given our
33:55
Speaker 2: suicide rates in Australia, given that sort of the desocialization,
33:59
Speaker 2: I think it's fair to say that the devices have
34:02
Speaker 2: brought some young people, not all young people, but some
34:04
Speaker 2: young people. If there was ever a time to do it,
34:07
Speaker 2: it'd almost say this is not the time.
34:10
Speaker 7: I think that's a fair point. The worst thing mental
34:12
Speaker 7: health in young people with recognized by most major parties
34:16
Speaker 7: just before the election, were going to see new investments
34:18
Speaker 7: in mental health services for young people. The last thing
34:22
Speaker 7: we need at the moment is another element in society
34:24
Speaker 7: which potentially increases the rate, and not just the rate,
34:27
Speaker 7: but the rate of severe mental health problems which are
34:29
Speaker 7: then enduring. And that seems pretty clear cut also in
34:31
Speaker 7: the medical literature. Now it's not just that there's one
34:34
Speaker 7: episode of problems that this often precipitates in the illness
34:37
Speaker 7: which then persists and is life changing. So most people
34:41
Speaker 7: in the mental health area, and I think the health
34:42
Speaker 7: area in general, they favor decriminalization. As you pointed out,
34:46
Speaker 7: they don't favor legalization and widespread commercialization, which has really
34:51
Speaker 7: been behind a lot of the push in Australia, or
34:53
Speaker 7: of the push behind meddictional cannabis and a lot of
34:55
Speaker 7: the issues that have gone on where Australias had a
34:57
Speaker 7: pretty liberal attitude to medicinal cannabis as well. He's really
35:00
Speaker 7: driven by commercial interests. And you know we've had great
35:03
Speaker 7: trouble with tobacco, alcohol, other substances. We don't need to
35:06
Speaker 7: add this to the mix.
35:10
Speaker 2: You are a voice of reason, professor. He he had an
35:11
Speaker 2: expert obviously, thank you for your time up the break
35:15
Speaker 2: WHI a state factional brawl is causing thousands of Liberal
35:18
Speaker 2: Party members to leave the party. Plus speaking of leadership,
35:22
Speaker 2: it might not be smooth starting for the ALP, according
35:24
Speaker 2: to one labor store ward today or of that in
35:27
Speaker 2: a moment welcome back still to come. Why the ABC's
35:34
Speaker 2: election campus review must include a reference to bias. We'll
35:39
Speaker 2: see if that happens, won't we My next guesse now
35:41
Speaker 2: is well acquainted with factional infarting and turmoil within the
35:44
Speaker 2: New South Wales Liberal Party, having been appointed as a
35:47
Speaker 2: special administrator last year to help the party get back
35:50
Speaker 2: on track. So with the leadership contest playing out tomorrow
35:53
Speaker 2: federally of course, and plenty of factional tensions on display,
35:57
Speaker 2: it's timely to get some thoughts from former Howard government minister,
36:00
Speaker 2: former Victorian Liberal Party president, I might add, and former
36:03
Speaker 2: boss to Peter Kredline, which at Austin I might even say,
36:06
Speaker 2: also a communications minister, I'll ask you about the ABC
36:08
Speaker 2: and their election coverage in a moment, just just at
36:11
Speaker 2: a top level, as someone who was a warrior effort
36:13
Speaker 2: for the Howard government for so long, your reaction to
36:17
Speaker 2: the thumping and the limps got in the election.
36:20
Speaker 1: Look, I think it's.
36:21
Speaker 12: A bit misleading. We went into the election in front
36:25
Speaker 12: of the polls. Some people would say Trump comes along,
36:30
Speaker 12: everyone goes for the dinner and and what to change?
36:33
Speaker 12: You know, we'll stick with the devil. We know that's
36:37
Speaker 12: part of the answer. But fundamentally it was a very
36:40
Speaker 12: poor campaign. Clearly they hadn't done their homework on policy,
36:44
Speaker 12: which should have been locked away months beforehand, and here
36:48
Speaker 12: they were two days out, they did defense, three days
36:52
Speaker 12: out they did an educationist How can you expect anyone
36:56
Speaker 12: to take you seriously? So I think we should not
37:00
Speaker 12: see this as a complete devastation it's obviously a setback
37:05
Speaker 12: because of the margin. But most people thought that the
37:10
Speaker 12: alban eazy government didn't expect doesn't deserve to be returned.
37:14
Speaker 2: That's true.
37:15
Speaker 12: So can you imagine them suddenly doing all the right things. No,
37:19
Speaker 12: So I think next time around will be a very
37:21
Speaker 12: good opportunity for us if we can get our actic.
37:25
Speaker 2: Pedicostella was critical because he said there was just no
37:27
Speaker 2: economic agender. Is that fair? Yeah?
37:31
Speaker 12: I think so.
37:31
Speaker 1: Yeah.
37:32
Speaker 12: I mean you've got to have a couple of big policies.
37:35
Speaker 12: You've got to you've got to understand economics. You can't
37:38
Speaker 12: just sort of blow the budget out and spend endlessly.
37:43
Speaker 12: It all comes back to haunt you. So yeah, I
37:46
Speaker 12: think economics is key if you if you don't understand economics,
37:50
Speaker 12: then you're probably not going to be a winner.
37:52
Speaker 2: What about this whole fight that it inevitably happens, you know, Oh,
37:57
Speaker 2: they were too far to the left, the leaves to
37:59
Speaker 2: not far an to the right. If you look around
38:02
Speaker 2: at all the state oppositions. Every time we've had a
38:05
Speaker 2: left wing agenda, we've tried to cuddle up to labor.
38:08
Speaker 2: We're almost in permanent opposition. What do you make of
38:12
Speaker 2: this carry on.
38:13
Speaker 12: It's a very lazy media line. Any fool can write
38:17
Speaker 12: an article about someone wants to go left, some don't.
38:21
Speaker 12: That's complete nonsense. I mean, the reality is people want
38:24
Speaker 12: good policy. It's not a left or right thing. Some
38:27
Speaker 12: people can deliver it, and I mean there are labor
38:29
Speaker 12: premiers who can deliver it. So I just don't waste
38:34
Speaker 12: my time thinking in terms of left and right anymore.
38:37
Speaker 2: What about the insights you've had now in your time
38:41
Speaker 2: as a steward of the New South Wales Liberal Party.
38:44
Speaker 2: I know you've had a history in the Victorian Liberal Party.
38:46
Speaker 2: What are you finding in the statistics in New South Wales?
38:50
Speaker 2: What has shocked you?
38:52
Speaker 12: Well, it's hard to believe actually, because there are six
38:55
Speaker 12: hundred and eight people who have been refused membership of
38:59
Speaker 12: the party. There have been four and a half thousand
39:02
Speaker 12: people who have let their membership lapse in the last
39:05
Speaker 12: few years. No new branches have been created since twenty sixteen.
39:09
Speaker 12: It's just appalling, and it's because the factions collude. Factions
39:16
Speaker 12: are okay, you're always going to have left and right, progressive,
39:19
Speaker 12: moderate conservative whatever as how it said broad Church. But
39:23
Speaker 12: when they get together and exclude people you know, mother
39:28
Speaker 12: Teresa turns up says she's available. I'd say, sorry, you're
39:30
Speaker 12: not in the right faction.
39:31
Speaker 2: And that's so people at home can follow. That's because
39:34
Speaker 2: those there have already carved up the spoils and even
39:38
Speaker 2: though they hate each other factionally, they know exactly where
39:41
Speaker 2: they are. They've got the position to suit themselves. They
39:44
Speaker 2: don't want talent, they don't want new numbers to come in.
39:46
Speaker 2: They don't want people to come in that they can't control.
39:49
Speaker 12: They take it in turns. Actually that's what happens. You know,
39:52
Speaker 12: you're not in my faction, but if you do the
39:54
Speaker 12: right thing, we'll put you on the list. Someone complained
39:57
Speaker 12: to us, you know she was supposed to factions that
39:59
Speaker 12: she said, it's outrageous because I was next on the list.
40:03
Speaker 12: So it's not about talent at all. It's about payoffs
40:07
Speaker 12: and trading and it's very unhealthy. You can't possibly say
40:13
Speaker 12: that New South Wales can get back in the sensible government.
40:17
Speaker 12: I mean the catalyst was the local government fiasco when
40:21
Speaker 12: almost one hundred and fifty candidates weren't selected, but that
40:24
Speaker 12: was the last straw. This has been around for years
40:27
Speaker 12: in New South Wales. That's why the federal executive unanimously
40:30
Speaker 12: said on two occasions we must have interventions. And they
40:33
Speaker 12: said to us, you must fix the problem, and that
40:36
Speaker 12: involves writing a new constitution. And we're in the process
40:39
Speaker 12: of doing that right now.
40:40
Speaker 2: And is that how you fix it? You have a
40:42
Speaker 2: new constitution, surely you got to have a clean out
40:45
Speaker 2: across the board. A factional willlords Well.
40:49
Speaker 12: Yeah, I wouldn't focus on the world, focus on giving
40:53
Speaker 12: ordinary members access rights. So instead of being yes, well,
40:59
Speaker 12: instead of being not back by the branch president who's
41:02
Speaker 12: in on the deal to fix you, allow the application
41:07
Speaker 12: to go through and then if people have a genuine objection,
41:11
Speaker 12: they can lodge that with a panel. So that's a
41:14
Speaker 12: much more sensible way of opening the party up. Clearly
41:18
Speaker 12: people want to join the party, but they're not going
41:20
Speaker 12: to until reform has been put in both well.
41:24
Speaker 2: It'd be something I know we're going to talk about
41:26
Speaker 2: a lot, Richard, but if you can get it right
41:28
Speaker 2: in New South Wales, maybe other states will follow.
41:30
Speaker 12: I don't think other states needed fundamentally, you know, they've
41:34
Speaker 12: got to get things right, but they don't need reform
41:37
Speaker 12: in the way that New South Wales. New South Wales
41:40
Speaker 12: is rotten on the inside. I wouldn't say that about
41:42
Speaker 12: any other states. I mean, wa, you know, I've only
41:45
Speaker 12: got a handful. It's going to be very difficult to
41:48
Speaker 12: make a comeback there. New South Australia is just as
41:51
Speaker 12: bad as I think, but you know, you're up against
41:54
Speaker 12: some competent people. But New South Wales is far and
41:59
Speaker 12: away the biggest problem, and it's the biggest state.
42:02
Speaker 2: Ye thank you, Richard. Just a quick on ABC bias
42:08
Speaker 2: reform and a review.
42:11
Speaker 12: I thought Kim Williams was going to do something serious
42:14
Speaker 12: about this, but I don't see any sign of it really.
42:18
Speaker 12: I mean, I knew him quite well. I think he's
42:21
Speaker 12: capable of being sensible about these things. But it's just
42:23
Speaker 12: too hard. You know, if he tries to do something
42:27
Speaker 12: like this, they can all leak on him. The staff
42:29
Speaker 12: appointed director goes mad, you know.
42:32
Speaker 2: So they just kept losing audience ship.
42:35
Speaker 12: The only way to do it is in terms of
42:38
Speaker 12: the money. You have to attach conditions to the money
42:41
Speaker 12: they get, and they have to then be forced to
42:44
Speaker 12: fix themselves. The trouble is they're a monopoly, you see,
42:47
Speaker 12: and monopolies get fat and lazy. They don't need to reform.
42:51
Speaker 12: They don't need to cut, they don't need to win,
42:53
Speaker 12: they don't need to raise money.
42:55
Speaker 1: How good is that?
42:57
Speaker 12: What would you want to go?
42:58
Speaker 2: Well, Scott newsed love to get a billion dollars every
43:00
Speaker 2: year to run the show. We'll have to worry about ratings,
43:02
Speaker 2: but we do, and we'll take a break so we
43:04
Speaker 2: can get paid for our job. Richard Austin me, all right,
43:07
Speaker 2: after the break, we'll get to a whole lot of
43:09
Speaker 2: stuff about the Liberal leadership in a moment. Welcome back.
43:18
Speaker 2: Has a lot of my viewers that reminded me to
43:20
Speaker 2: Richard Austin was the last Liberal Minister for Communications that
43:24
Speaker 2: took on the ABC and he certainly did that. All right,
43:27
Speaker 2: let's get into the panel. Now, let's welcome my next
43:29
Speaker 2: two guest Page Research Center chief Jared Holland and senior
43:34
Speaker 2: fellow at the Men'sies Research Center, of course columns for
43:37
Speaker 2: the Australia Nicator. Gents, welcome. I want to pick up
43:40
Speaker 2: some comments. Well, we've all been navel gazing about the
43:42
Speaker 2: Liberal Party, but I want to pick up some comments
43:45
Speaker 2: from the ALP current president former Treasurer of Wayne Swann,
43:48
Speaker 2: who's warn party supporters at the party's base is aging
43:52
Speaker 2: that the membership is too small and that the most
43:55
Speaker 2: focus on winning over working class voters, which says they've
44:00
Speaker 2: lost them or they will risk further decline. This is
44:04
Speaker 2: a very interesting comment here, Jared.
44:09
Speaker 13: Yeah, I mean, I think he's right just to put
44:12
Speaker 13: Labour's win into context. If you look at the Hawk
44:14
Speaker 13: or the Keyting or even Kevin Rudd's big win in
44:17
Speaker 13: two thousand and seven, these were on primaries in the
44:19
Speaker 13: mid forties. I think Keating reach as high as forty
44:21
Speaker 13: eight or forty nine percent some of his high points.
44:24
Speaker 13: Albanezy one with the primary of just thirty four percent.
44:28
Speaker 13: So this wasn't a resounding recognition and celebration of what
44:31
Speaker 13: Labour brought to the election. It was a rejection of
44:34
Speaker 13: what the Coalition had on offer. And particularly if you
44:36
Speaker 13: think about working class families, what do they have in
44:38
Speaker 13: store over the next couple of years. Well, they're going
44:40
Speaker 13: to get slapped with the utax that's another twenty five
44:43
Speaker 13: percent or more on the family car or all the
44:45
Speaker 13: people mover. They're going to see their energy bills continue
44:48
Speaker 13: to spiral as that grid is out of control and
44:50
Speaker 13: not going anywhere soon. They're going to see another one
44:52
Speaker 13: or two million people come into the country, putting more
44:54
Speaker 13: pressure on housing and cost of living, and so I
44:57
Speaker 13: think they're going to be looking around saying, well, hang on,
45:00
Speaker 13: who represents us? And it's this constituency that holds the key,
45:03
Speaker 13: I think to either rebuilding for the coalition or Labor
45:07
Speaker 13: actually cementing themselves back in their working class roots. And
45:10
Speaker 13: this is the constituency that has been ignored and forgotten
45:13
Speaker 13: for a good decade or so.
45:14
Speaker 2: Now, yeah, it's a good point to make because if
45:18
Speaker 2: you look at the high looks like it might be
45:21
Speaker 2: ninety four seats in the House. That's a thumping majority.
45:24
Speaker 2: That's sort of what it is. It is if they
45:26
Speaker 2: get to ninety four what John Howard had nic Cata
45:28
Speaker 2: in nineteen ninety six. But if you look at Labour's
45:31
Speaker 2: primary vote that's got them those ninety four seats, the
45:35
Speaker 2: primary vote at this election under Alberan Easy is actually
45:38
Speaker 2: lower than the primary vote that Bill shortened Goss in
45:41
Speaker 2: twenty sixteen when he lost to Malcolm Turnbull. So that
45:46
Speaker 2: puts it into some perspectives. So, yes, Labor have done
45:49
Speaker 2: very very well, but more because the Liberals and others
45:52
Speaker 2: did very very poorly. And also the preference flows and
45:56
Speaker 2: the preference harvesting that happens on the left are making
45:59
Speaker 2: it nine impossible for the conservative side of politics to survive.
46:05
Speaker 4: Yeah, I was interesting to see that bit of truth
46:07
Speaker 4: telling from Wayne Swan. I think is onto something here.
46:10
Speaker 4: I think, you know, it looks like a thumping win, right,
46:14
Speaker 4: it could even be the biggest number of MP's Labor
46:17
Speaker 4: have ever had in a parliament. But underneath there's clearly
46:21
Speaker 4: the same problems in the Labor Party as there is
46:24
Speaker 4: in the Liberal Party. Young people are not joining. Their
46:28
Speaker 4: politics is conducted by other means on Facebook and Instagram
46:32
Speaker 4: and all those sort of things. They're not tending to
46:35
Speaker 4: go with the major parties. So you get this one third,
46:38
Speaker 4: one third and then one third none of the above,
46:41
Speaker 4: which is entrenched. Interestingly, I would point out on that
46:44
Speaker 4: I think the solution to that where you just look
46:46
Speaker 4: what happened in Canada. You'd be well aware of this
46:49
Speaker 4: Peter that used to be this one third, one third,
46:51
Speaker 4: one third right to the two major parties one third
46:55
Speaker 4: each or roughly that, and then one third went to
46:57
Speaker 4: the independence, the Block, kuberc and others. But this election
47:02
Speaker 4: they've come back to the main parties, eighty four percent
47:06
Speaker 4: I think, or eighty five percent voted for the major parties.
47:09
Speaker 4: Why because both major parties were standing up for their
47:12
Speaker 4: country for firm values thanks to Donald Trump, and that's
47:16
Speaker 4: what brought people running back. So I don't think this
47:19
Speaker 4: is terminal. I think both parties have got to work
47:21
Speaker 4: on this, but it's not terminal.
47:25
Speaker 2: Jared, do you run a national party think tank or
47:29
Speaker 2: I think tank connected to the National party and affiliations there?
47:32
Speaker 2: Certainly there was an interesting moment today where there was
47:35
Speaker 2: a debate about net zero and your new leader or
47:38
Speaker 2: re elected leader, David Little prowd says, I'm not backing
47:41
Speaker 2: it in. I mean, we've got to have a debate
47:43
Speaker 2: about this. We're going to review the election and it's
47:45
Speaker 2: on the table for the party room to debate. Now.
47:49
Speaker 2: The Libs, I don't think we'll move away from net zero.
47:52
Speaker 2: There's debate about whether they'll ever move away from nuclear power.
47:55
Speaker 2: Your leader backed in nuclear power, but net zero is
47:58
Speaker 2: something I think that will be discs asked, that's very
48:01
Speaker 2: very interesting.
48:05
Speaker 13: Well, I think what's interesting about net zero is you
48:07
Speaker 13: can only sort of allow it to make sense if
48:09
Speaker 13: you think about it through the lens of a global movement.
48:11
Speaker 13: But of course the US isn't committed to net zero. Now,
48:14
Speaker 13: China isn't, India isn't. South Africa isn't. Russia isn't, Argentina isn't.
48:19
Speaker 13: The Middle East aren't committed to it, and on and
48:21
Speaker 13: on and on, and you're looking at over sixty percent
48:23
Speaker 13: of the world now who are not even in Paris,
48:26
Speaker 13: if not meaningfully working towards it. So the fact that Australia,
48:29
Speaker 13: or the idea that Australia should go it alone when
48:31
Speaker 13: we're one percent of the world's emissions, when we export
48:34
Speaker 13: five hundred and ten teraworld hours of coal for other
48:36
Speaker 13: people to burn, I just don't think that that really
48:39
Speaker 13: holds water anymore. And I think as we're seeing these
48:41
Speaker 13: cost pressures rise, Australians won't have the appetite to keep
48:45
Speaker 13: stomaching this. And I think it's an issue that does
48:47
Speaker 13: have to keep coming up, does have to keep being
48:50
Speaker 13: looked at, because we aren't getting any closer to achieving it,
48:53
Speaker 13: but we're getting ourselves into a whole lot of economic
48:55
Speaker 13: and social unrest because of it.
49:00
Speaker 2: Nick just quickly the last time there was a debate
49:01
Speaker 2: about quotas and targets and women inside the Liberal Party.
49:05
Speaker 2: You were leading up the Liberal Parties think tank. Can
49:07
Speaker 2: you write a very comprehensive review. What would you say
49:10
Speaker 2: to this thing now?
49:13
Speaker 4: Well, I think quotas is absolutely ridiculous. That's not what
49:18
Speaker 4: we argued in our report, and why because liberals believe
49:21
Speaker 4: that everybody should have equal opportunity. I think the real
49:24
Speaker 4: problem here, Peter is when you look at the members
49:26
Speaker 4: of the party, there are very few women joining the party.
49:30
Speaker 4: Interestingly fewer still, the most worst ratio is at young
49:35
Speaker 4: Liberal level, and until we fix that, we're not going
49:38
Speaker 4: to have any hope of getting people standing for parliament.
49:42
Speaker 2: You're not wrong there, but you have targets with teeth.
49:45
Speaker 2: You don't go near quotas. Gents, I'll leave it there,
49:46
Speaker 2: thank you very much, see you tomorrow night. Here's Andrew