Latest / UK Column Radio / Syria Podcast Episode 8

Transcript

Syria Podcast Episode 8 · UK Column Radio

0:00
The UK has been less happy to welcome Middle Eastern
0:05
Christians into British territory, which is kind of
0:08
interesting. But we're too busy welcoming the
0:11
Tak fairies, yes? Exactly.
0:13
Syria was a linchpin really for the entire global resistance
0:19
axis or the remaining independent countries that
0:25
opposed imperialism and opposed the Zionist occupation of
0:30
Palestine as being a core element of their foreign policy
0:36
positions, right. And, and so that goes from Iran,
0:41
Yemen, through the whole of the Middle East or or West Asia, but
0:46
then also expands into regions of Africa, as we're now seeing
0:51
coming under attack. And of course, Latin America,
0:55
Venezuela was an integral part of the resistance axis.
0:59
So Machado is also pushing this rhetoric that Hezbollah is
1:04
establishing itself in Venezuela, that Iran is
1:07
embedding itself in Venezuela, Hamas is embedding itself in
1:11
Venezuela, and so therefore Venezuela represents a direct
1:15
threat to Israel. And of course, I'm sure that
1:18
this was discussed between Netanyahu and Trump.
1:30
Hello and welcome to Episode 8 of The Syria Podcast.
1:33
I'm joined once again by Vanessa Bailey.
1:35
Welcome to the program, Vanessa. Thank you, Mike.
1:38
And I will just say New Year because I don't think any of us
1:42
can call it a happy start to the New year as expected to a large
1:47
degree. Well, precisely.
1:50
And well, we'll call it, You know, this is the Syria podcast.
1:53
This is the continuation of a series of podcasts that we
1:56
started last year. But actually, we're not going to
2:01
be spending much time in Syria for this one at all because the
2:06
implications of what happened in Syria just over a year ago and
2:11
and the acceptance by most world leaders now of Jelani as the
2:18
head of state of Syria are having massive implications.
2:22
And that's really what we want to focus on for this program.
2:25
Yeah. I mean, there are rumours, by
2:27
the way, that Jelani or Ahmed Al Shahrawaz, he's now known, of
2:31
course, having been rebranded by particularly the MI 6, but the
2:35
entire intelligence card who waged the regime change war
2:40
against Syria since 2011. There are rumors and there are
2:45
images circulating of him after an ambush in which he was
2:50
injured. And he's now in Turkey,
2:52
allegedly. This is coming from social media
2:57
and I think Turkish media accounts and some Israeli media
3:01
accounts. Now, to some degree that
3:04
wouldn't be awfully surprising because the writing has been on
3:07
the wall and we've written about it and spoken about it at UK
3:11
column that Jolani's term in power is not going to last very
3:16
long because ultimately what's going to happen, Syria will be
3:20
carved up into spheres of regional influence.
3:27
I mean, you know, as you said, we we want to expand from inside
3:32
Syria to effectively what the fall of Syria actually meant.
3:37
Syria was a lynchpin really for the entire global resistance
3:43
axis or the remaining independent countries that
3:49
opposed imperialism and opposed the Zionist occupation of
3:54
Palestine as being a core element of their foreign policy
4:00
positions, right. And and so that goes from Iran,
4:06
Yemen, through the whole of the Middle East or or West Asia, but
4:10
then also expands into regions of Africa as we're now seeing
4:16
coming under attack and of course Latin America.
4:19
Venezuela was an integral part of the resistance axis under
4:25
Bashar Al Assad's presidency. There were flights established
4:30
with using Venezuelan airlines to effectively fly from Tehran
4:37
to Damascus and Caracas directly.
4:40
So that gives you an indication. It gives people an indication of
4:43
the importance of Venezuela to Syria and of Syria to Venezuela,
4:48
and of the connection between Venezuela and Syria with Iran
4:52
and effectively the entire resistance axis.
4:58
OK. Well, let's sort of because it's
5:00
been a few months since we've recorded one of these.
5:03
So let's let's start off in Africa actually, because
5:07
obviously since the last recording, we've had a number of
5:11
things happening, the massive ramping up of the conflict in
5:14
Sudan, We've had the attack over just around the Christmas period
5:20
of Nigeria and supposedly Boko Haram by Trump.
5:26
And but as well as that, we've got problems occurring in book
5:32
in Burkina Faso, for example. So, so why do we take each of
5:37
those? I mean, do you feel that there's
5:39
a, a connection between the inflammation of, of what's
5:47
happening in Sudan over the last six or eight months in
5:49
particular? There's a connection with that
5:53
to, to what has happened in Syria or Syria has been a, a
5:56
driver for that. No, I think for sure you, as I
6:01
said, we have to see the fall of Syria as being the opening of
6:05
the floodgates to Zionist expansion, either through proxy
6:11
vessel or client states like the UAE, which is operating inside
6:17
Sudan on behalf of Israel, but also in Yemen.
6:21
You're now seeing the effective isolation of the Antrullo
6:26
resistance government in Northern Yemen with Saudi Arabia
6:30
and UAE, UAE very much as a proxy of Israel vying for
6:35
influence in the eastern territories and southern
6:38
territories of Yemen. So again, Yemen is being
6:43
enclosed by the Zionist bloc within Yemen itself, but also
6:51
from the Horn of Africa. The fact that Israel has also
6:54
recognized Somaliland and is talking about the conditions of
6:59
this, of course, one of the conditions is that it can
7:02
establish military bases, surveillance bases in Somaliland
7:08
and on the coast. And of course, this directly
7:11
poses a threat to Yemen both now and in the future.
7:19
And then yes, you, you have the inflammation, as you said of an
7:23
already very tense situation in Sudan that again has been
7:27
fermented and stoked and maintained by a number of global
7:32
players. But particularly if we're
7:33
talking about Israel by the UAE that is extracting gold and rare
7:40
earth minerals, etcetera, other resources from Sudan itself.
7:45
But then if you come into Burkina Faso and Nigeria, as you
7:50
mentioned, there's also issues of course in Eritrea and in
7:55
Mali. And of course that is also Mali
7:57
is also connected into Burkina Faso.
8:01
Because with Ibrahim Traori, you effectively have a second Thomas
8:06
Sankara, who of course eventually was assassinated by
8:11
the imperialist bloc, because Traori represents a new wave of
8:16
pan Arabism, a new wave of African unity and independence
8:22
and resource nationalization. So again, this aligns with this
8:27
entire resistance block of what had left of independent nations.
8:33
And very recently, I think it was in the new year, Traore gave
8:39
a speech to his people about the incoming dark winter where they
8:44
had to prepare to unite against the forces that we're going to
8:49
try and again break apart the the rising pan Arabism that that
8:55
he is trying to foster in Central Africa.
9:00
And of course, that followed on from, as you mentioned, the
9:03
Trump rhetoric of we have to save the Christians from
9:07
genocide in Nigeria. Of course, they've done nothing
9:11
other than drive out Christians from the Middle East for, for
9:15
decades through their various colonialist, imperialist
9:18
projects. So I, I have very little belief
9:22
in any statements from them claiming to defend Christianity
9:26
in any way, shape or form globally.
9:30
But actually when I looked into the areas they actually bombed,
9:35
so they claimed they were not bombing Boko Haram, they were
9:38
bombing ISIS in Nigeria. So they are kind of two separate
9:43
entities, but cohesive in some of their operations and so on.
9:49
But the reality? IS to Syria again then.
9:51
Yeah, exactly. It's, it's just a branding of
9:55
the various terrorist factions that of course the US is
10:01
sponsoring in these countries to create division and, and
10:05
terrorism. And in fact, the area that they
10:10
bombed was in the north and northwest of Nigeria, which is
10:16
actually, if you like, I don't like to use the word stronghold
10:19
because that immediately creates a negative impression, but it's
10:22
the area where the majority of the Shia Muslim communities
10:28
reside. And that means Sheikh Zakhzaki,
10:31
who's been persecuted by the Nigerian government, the
10:34
Nigerian government, which of course is is a proxy of the
10:38
United States interests very much in Africa, have been
10:44
murdering the Shia Muslim factions in Nigeria for some
10:49
time because of their stance on Palestine.
10:53
There has also been a historic campaign by Christian Zionists
11:01
to infiltrate the Christian communities in Africa because of
11:06
course, you know, historically Africa has been converted to
11:11
Christianity and there are various papers and documents
11:14
detailing the fact that Zionist influences spreading into Africa
11:19
through Christian Zionist influence and and policies.
11:25
Boko Haram and that whole insurgency in that part of
11:30
Africa is again parallels to Syria because we have here, we
11:35
have Islamic extremists created and and funded and armed by the
11:41
West. And then we use those as an
11:44
excuse to, to carry out our policies in in that region.
11:49
But it's very much the same. It's always the same modus
11:53
operandi operating in these places.
11:56
And in the meantime, in the Western press, we're bombarded
12:01
with the narrative that of, of Christian versus Muslim and the
12:05
Muslims are genociding the Christians and, and we've got to
12:08
hit Muslims. And, and so you know this for,
12:11
for the, the, the powers that are, that are manipulating this
12:15
situation. It operates on many fronts.
12:18
Definitely. And I think, you know the
12:21
clearest example of that is in Syria where the war that was
12:28
wage to change regime ended with the emigration of a huge
12:36
percentage of the Christian population, massive percentage.
12:42
And now of course, under Jelani or Ahmed Al Sharad, the HTS and
12:49
Takfiri forces and ISIS elements are carrying out ethnic
12:54
cleansing again of the Christians or putting them in
12:57
positions where they feel so threatened within their very
13:02
isolated communities now that they're leaving voluntarily.
13:06
And of course, it's always been made very easy for Christians to
13:09
get visas to Canada and to even to the US and so on.
13:15
The UK has been less happy to welcome Middle Eastern
13:20
Christians into British territory, which is kind of
13:23
interesting. But we're too busy welcoming the
13:26
tax fairies, yes? Exactly.
13:28
That's that's the whole point. This, this was something that I
13:31
wrote about for some time while all successive British
13:34
governments were saying we're in Syria to protect the Christians.
13:38
But hold on, you're actually preventing them from coming to
13:41
Britain to to as refugees, but you're both fostering, creating,
13:48
radicalizing and exporting tech theories.
13:51
And then you're giving them amnesty, if you remember in
13:53
around 20/16/2018 to return to Britain.
13:57
So, yeah, you know, it's it's sort of extraordinary.
14:01
But this historical cleansing of Christianity in the region has
14:06
been has been a strategy for some time.
14:09
Because ultimately what they want is a war between the
14:15
resistance Muslim factions and the GCC block, which of course
14:20
is very much aligned with the Zionist block.
14:23
They were created by the British in order to effectively protect
14:27
the Zionist entity and to act as almost outreach agents for the
14:33
Zionist entity. I mean, David Miller sent me a
14:35
document that the UAE has released, or it's a secret
14:39
document that has been released in which they're complaining
14:42
that, well, why did we sign the Abraham Accords?
14:45
Because Israel treats us like a, like a servant.
14:49
They don't ask us to do things on their behalf.
14:53
They basically are ordering us to do things.
14:55
And as I said to David, well, they it's a bit late now to cry
14:58
victim because this is 1, why you were created.
15:02
And two, you've benefited from this partnership to expand your
15:06
own reach, both in the region, but also now more extensively
15:11
globally with the backing of the Zionist entity and the movement,
15:17
the entire Zionist movement, which of course then is backed
15:20
and supported by much of the Western Hemisphere.
15:25
Obviously this having a massive impact in North Africa.
15:30
Why? What is the, what is the reason
15:32
for that? Why is the why is there interest
15:34
from Zionism and from the West in this in this region, do you
15:38
think? I think there's a number of
15:42
aspects to this, of course. First of all, as I said, it's
15:45
Yemen positioning Israel to effectively both be able to
15:50
intimidate Yemen, but also to eventually attack Iran.
15:57
Because if Israel has, they already have put air defence
16:02
onto the island of Socotra, South of Yemen, which is sort of
16:07
under the control of the UAE. But effectively that means
16:11
Israel and it's US air defence systems.
16:16
Having control of the Horn of Africa means of course that they
16:19
also have control of the bubble Mandeb Straits which Yemen has
16:25
been using to blockade shipping to Israel resources.
16:32
From an American perspective, having control again or or not
16:37
losing control in some instances in Africa generally means
16:43
excluding China from its soft power, power expansion.
16:49
And that is also mirrored in what's happening in Latin
16:52
America. We can come on to that because
16:56
of course, China to a large degree has a greater foothold
17:00
now in Africa than the United States through its soft power,
17:06
Chinese government subsidised expansion campaigns, right?
17:11
And so much of this move by the Zionists and by the US.
17:18
How I see at the moment is pox Americana, as I call it, Of
17:23
course, Pax Americana is definitely on the decline.
17:27
But what's happening in my opinion, is we're seeing coming
17:30
up behind it and almost in a parasitic way, rioting the dying
17:35
empire in order to expand their own influence.
17:38
Is Pax Judaica the, the Zionist movement expansion economically.
17:45
I know when people think about expansion, they, they think of
17:48
settlement and and military takeovers because that's what
17:52
we've seen for 200 years with the United States, right?
17:58
My belief and my understanding with the with the Zionist
18:02
movement is it's looking to effectively in in it not in the
18:08
same way as China. It is expanding in the sense of
18:13
wanting to settle and impose its policies on those countries
18:17
where it is now increasing its influence.
18:22
But it's also to have economic structures which are to its
18:27
benefit. It's kind of a mix of of I
18:31
wouldn't say soft power because I don't think the Zionist
18:33
movement ever uses any degree of soft power, but let's say
18:36
economic blackmail and capture, right, not necessarily force
18:42
because it relies on the US for the force effectively.
18:45
I mean, if we look at what's happening in Israel now, sorry,
18:48
in Syria now or even in Lebanon beyond bombing, it's very
18:53
unlikely that they're going to be successful in any kind of
18:56
ground invasion. They're only succeeding in
18:58
southern Syria because they have some kind of backdoor agreement
19:04
with Jolani and they always have had that.
19:07
The South would effectively be handed over to Israel.
19:11
The David's corridor would be established up the eastern
19:14
border of Syria, connecting with the Kurdish autonomous state in
19:20
the northeast and then eventually into Iraq also.
19:24
So I, I think we're seeing a massive change in the world
19:29
order, not necessarily of course, an advantageous one or
19:33
far from it. And I think speaking to people
19:37
here, people that, you know, study strategy and so on.
19:42
And and they've said we're going to see some very odd
19:45
partnerships turning up, particularly in Syria, like
19:48
right now Russia, for example, although it is very partnered
19:54
with Israel right now, it's aligning itself and its policy
19:58
more with Turkey and France. So you know what I mean?
20:03
So we're going to see some very odd strategies, alliances and
20:06
partnerships coming up. And I think people need to
20:08
almost sort of strike a line under the geopolitics that we
20:13
know and understand because it's very fluid at the moment.
20:17
It's very volatile and it's going to change shape multiple
20:22
times. Let's move on to, to Latin
20:25
America then, because obviously the big news over the the New
20:29
Year period was Trump's removal from Venezuela of Maduro and his
20:36
wife to stand trial on drugs charges, allegedly.
20:41
But that's not the only thing that's been going on in Latin
20:44
America. The Isaac Accords deal seems to
20:48
have been done between Argentina and Israel.
20:52
And what fascinated me about the rhetoric around that from, from
20:55
the, from the the Jerusalem Post in particular, was the
20:59
suggestion that this actually was a Latin American accord
21:04
rather than just an Argentinian accord.
21:07
So there's clearly something bigger than just a single
21:10
country going on here. Yeah.
21:13
I mean, first of all, just quickly to go back to Burkina
21:15
Faso, because while everything was happening in Venezuela, of
21:19
course, a lot of people were not seeing or not having it reported
21:23
on that France attempted a coup in Burkina Faso, which was
21:28
actually put down very quickly by the people recognizing what
21:33
was happening and rushing to the defence of Traore.
21:36
So, you know, as I said, since Syria, the entire imperialist
21:44
block has been emboldened to to implement its strategy for for
21:51
global dominance. And if we look at just quickly
21:57
also the connection between Venezuela and Syria is not only
22:02
through the resistance access, but in the late 1900s, I think
22:08
there's now something like between 700,000 to 1,000,000
22:11
Syrians living in Venezuela, many of whom emigrated during
22:15
the Ottoman period, when again, the region was struck with
22:19
poverty and lack of future, no jobs, unemployment, etcetera.
22:24
There was a mass emigration to Venezuela.
22:28
But if we look at Argentina, what I find fascinating is that
22:32
Argentina has generated under Mile, who is known to be a
22:36
Zionist supporter. Argentina has generated the
22:42
Isaac Accords, which are the equivalent to the Abraham
22:45
Accords in the Middle East or in West Asia, which of course are
22:49
intended to capture states into the Zionist sphere of influence.
22:56
And Argentina was actually considered as a potential State
23:01
of Israel venue by Theodore Herzl in the late 1800s.
23:08
Argentina was considered and in fact the the Jews established
23:16
huge agricultural colonies in Argentina in the 1880s and
23:22
there's an area of Argentina called Moises Ville, which is
23:27
known as the Jerusalem of Argentina.
23:31
There is also consideration that they were looking to establish
23:36
some kind of sphere of influence in Patagonia and Chile.
23:41
So the fact that that the Isaac Accords emanated from Argentina,
23:46
it should be no surprise really when one considers the history.
23:50
The fact that just as with Cyprus now, where Israel is
23:54
expanding again it's reach and influence in competition with
23:58
Turkey, it's using Argentina, which was it's already
24:04
historically considered area of interest, to expand Zionist
24:12
interests into Costa Rica, Uruguay and Panama who have now
24:17
also all signed up to the Isaac Accords at the same time. the US
24:22
of course is working in its usual election interference,
24:25
most recently in Honduras where they definitely interfered in
24:29
the election to ensure that a fascist right wing government
24:32
was brought to power to counter the remaining socialist
24:39
Bolivarian governments in Latin America.
24:42
So it becomes very clear that this is a campaign to drive out
24:47
again independent countries. Whether you, you know, are a fan
24:51
of socialism, it doesn't matter. These countries are independent,
24:55
they are anti imperialists, they are pro Palestine.
24:58
They are a threat effectively to the Zionists.
25:01
And not forgetting that American think tanks, Israeli think
25:06
tanks, have been putting out this rhetoric for years now,
25:10
being mirrored by Marina Machado, who of course received
25:17
the Nobel Prize and is not at the moment being supported by
25:21
Trump to replace Maduro. I think that might change at
25:25
some point, but WHO has openly voiced support for Israel.
25:31
So Machado is also pushing this rhetoric that Hezbollah is
25:36
establishing itself in Venezuela, that Iran is
25:39
embedding itself in Venezuela, Hamas is embedding itself in
25:43
Venezuela, and so therefore Venezuela represents a direct
25:47
threat to Israel. And of course, I'm sure that
25:50
this was discussed between Netanyahu and Trump when
25:54
Netanyahu came to to Washington just before the kidnap of
26:01
President Maduro. Yeah, I'd like to, I'd like to
26:05
sort of consider this possibility of, of Latin
26:08
American countries being a direct threat to Israel, exactly
26:12
how intercontinental ballistic missiles, what, what threats,
26:18
what possible threat is there to Israel directly of, of an
26:24
independent state in Latin America?
26:28
What I mean, you know, is this, is this about economic power?
26:33
Is it, is it just about having the support in the United
26:36
Nations for, for their policy in the Middle East?
26:39
What, what's, what's the desire for from Israel's point of view
26:43
to to have this blanket support in, in a, a continent that's
26:47
halfway around the world? Well, I mean how they're selling
26:51
it of course to the US is that be careful, you know, Venezuela
26:55
is in your backyard and now Hezbollah and Iranian proxies,
27:00
etcetera, etcetera can now attack mainland US, right,
27:05
That's number one. But the other threat, of course,
27:08
they, and, and it's been talked up by organizing like by the
27:12
Atlantic and, and West Point and all of these major think tanks
27:19
is that Venezuela is providing drone manufacturing facilities
27:24
for Iran, it's providing training camps and so on for
27:28
Hezbollah. So the thought is they will be
27:30
trained and, and recruited and empowered in Venezuela and then
27:36
sent back to fight against Israel, which, you know, if if
27:41
you consider that the world is at war at the moment, it's not
27:44
an unreasonable expectation that members of the resistance axis
27:49
are going to collaborate and cooperate to, for example, end
27:55
the genocide in Palestine and the Zionist occupation of
27:59
territory throughout the Middle East.
28:01
Now it's not only in Palestine. They've extended into Lebanon,
28:06
into Syria, as we know, they're putting pressure on Iraq.
28:11
They're extending into Africa and into Yemen through proxies
28:17
or directly. And so even if this were
28:21
happening, why wouldn't it happen?
28:24
Why wouldn't these countries be defending themselves potentially
28:27
against what just happened? Because it was actually Cuban
28:32
special forces that took the brunt of the attack.
28:35
I think there was something like around 40 Cuban special forces
28:39
that were killed in the attack. Let's, let's just broaden the,
28:46
the, the discussion a little bit because it's, it's something
28:50
that I'm not clear about is, is what are the, what are the kinds
28:54
of discussions that are happening between these
28:56
countries that would consider themselves to be in the
28:58
resistance axis? And the reason I ask that is
29:01
because I, I couple of over the Christmas break, I was watching
29:06
the HBO series John Adams again. And of course, that's talking
29:11
about the the War of Independence and we're just
29:14
coming into the 250th anniversary, the Declaration of
29:17
Independence and whatnot. But some of the, you know, the
29:20
conversations that were going on between the original colonies in
29:25
the United States in their, in, in approaching the decision
29:31
about whether to oppose Britain and they were sort of saying,
29:36
well, you know, Britain wouldn't do that.
29:38
And this these kinds of conversations.
29:39
And I just wonder, I just wonder, are there parallels to
29:42
be drawn here between conversations that might be
29:45
going on between within and between the, the, the countries
29:49
that are that that we would consider to be in the resistance
29:52
axis? Because it does.
29:55
It does strike me that that maybe Venezuela should have been
30:01
a bit more prepared for what happened than they appear to
30:04
have been. Yes, I mean, it's kind of
30:09
interesting to me that it's largely I, it's the British
30:14
press that are that are like the Telegraph that are pushing this
30:18
idea that he was betrayed from within, which to me completely
30:22
mirrors the narrative on Syria. I'm not saying that there wasn't
30:26
betrayal from within in Syria, but there's this parallel
30:31
narrative that in Syria, the Syrian narrative army collapsed
30:35
completely and surrendered. And, and so then why should
30:40
Russia or any of the other allies fight, right?
30:43
The same narrative is being put across now immediately in
30:47
Venezuela, but literally 48 hours after the event and Syria
30:52
one year on, although it's much clearer as to what happened,
30:56
it's still not. We don't have full
30:58
clarification, but one thing I would say in Syria and now what
31:03
is coming out through interviews with former Syrian Army officers
31:10
and soldiers is they didn't surrender.
31:14
They fought to the last man. But what happened on the field
31:18
basically put them into disarray and isolated various brigades,
31:22
right? Even the Jolani 2 hour
31:25
documentary detailing their campaign to reach Damascus,
31:30
which by the way, in my opinion was entirely strategized by the
31:36
British because there's no other country on the planet that would
31:41
have come up with the strategy that Jelani used.
31:44
Nor if you see him in the operations room, I mean, it's
31:49
something that that British military would be proud of,
31:51
right? So this was a massive operation.
31:54
And in my opinion, just as the British were behind the strategy
31:59
of the Hagana terrorist forces in Israel when they conducted
32:05
the Nakba, the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians, they were
32:08
behind Jelani's operation entirely.
32:12
But even in that documentary, they talk about the fierce
32:16
resistance from the Syrian Arab Army in all cities and and areas
32:22
that they attacked. So they didn't surrender.
32:25
They were still fighting long past, you know, when they were
32:29
overwhelmed basically by Jelani's forces and by the drone
32:33
attacks that were not being intercepted, etcetera.
32:36
So I see parallels in this. It's almost like an absolving of
32:41
any responsibility because the army stood down.
32:44
Maduro was betrayed. So no one wants him anyway.
32:47
The same and and the same kind of rhetoric that's been used
32:50
also by by Russia largely regarding Syria and is now being
32:55
used again in in reference to Maduro.
32:59
And so I I find it very interesting this seems to be now
33:02
the new MO is to effectively create a situation which it
33:07
looks like Maduro has been betrayed.
33:09
I'm not ruling out that he was, by the way, but I'm just saying
33:14
it's we need to be very careful about rushing to judgement and
33:18
saying, well, yeah, you know. But coming back to your point of
33:22
should they have been better prepared?
33:24
I think it's very difficult to put yourself in the shoes of
33:28
someone in the position of former President Assad or even
33:33
of current President Maduro and the pressures that that they
33:37
were under and and how they read the situation.
33:42
But I would say that both presidents, as far as I know,
33:45
received warnings and and both presidents maybe didn't do
33:50
enough or maybe didn't expect or were maybe led to believe that
33:53
nothing was going to happen. I find it quite interesting that
33:57
the Chinese delegation were there the day before.
34:01
Now, I think my my interpretation of that is, and
34:06
maybe it's what led to Trump's operation literally the day
34:12
after was because in my belief, China was trying to capture
34:18
Venezuela in a sense. It it was trying to say, OK,
34:21
look, we'll, we'll deal with you.
34:23
We'll take the oil against U.S. sanctions, of course.
34:31
And China has the processing capability for Venezuela's heavy
34:36
crude oil. So, so does the US.
34:41
That's why the US needs Venezuelan oil, because the oil
34:45
that the US is producing, as someone described it, it's a bit
34:51
like putting champagne through a diesel plant.
34:53
It's, it's, it's too light. They actually need the heavy
34:57
crude Venezuelan oil, but so does China.
35:02
And so according to some reports, China was saying, look,
35:06
we'll start dealing in alternative currencies to the
35:09
dollar. We want to become a partner of
35:13
Venezuela in the oil industry. And perhaps they were offering
35:17
investment and so on. And and this because what Trump
35:21
needs is, is that those collateral resources, they're
35:26
worthless at the moment to the US because I think it needs
35:29
something like 40 billion investment into the Venezuelan
35:34
oil industry before it can be viable as as a, as an operating
35:40
oil provider for the US, right? But from AUS point of view, it
35:50
needs to secure that collateral. It can't see it disappear off to
35:54
China, right, Or even to Russia, but kind of to a lesser extent.
36:00
I think with Russia, I think China was the big threat and
36:04
China is the major threat in Latin America also.
36:08
So again, like with Africa, this is also about suppressing
36:14
Chinese influence, and particularly in what the US
36:18
considers to be its backyard. OK, Now, I wasn't suggesting
36:24
any, any direct criticism by the way, in, in what I said earlier,
36:27
but the reason I asked the reason, but the reason I asked
36:30
that question was because, you know, we're talking about a
36:34
resistance axis. But what I'm not saying in that
36:38
resistance axis, and correct me if I'm wrong about this, is
36:42
coordination collaboration in the sense that there that they,
36:46
that there's a recognition of a common.
36:48
I mean, they obviously recognize there's a common, a common
36:51
threat, but they still seem to be operating relatively
36:54
independently and, and which allows the common threat to pick
36:58
them off one at a time. And, and I just wonder, I'm just
37:03
wondering what the conversations are likely to be that are going
37:06
on between them and why they're not cooperating in a much closer
37:12
way. I think geographically for many
37:17
of them it's difficult. I mean, you know, if you look at
37:20
the distance between Iran and Caracas, Venezuela or Cuba, and
37:28
also another aspect which we shouldn't forget is of course
37:31
the power of sanctions. You know, the the fact that it's
37:36
very difficult for them to communicate or even, I mean,
37:39
there was an air embargo on Venezuela, there was a shipping
37:42
embargo on Venezuela. There was something very similar
37:47
on Syria and of course on Iran also.
37:49
But they do find ways to communicate.
37:52
I mean, for example, Iran is still in communication with the
37:56
various members of the resistance axis in West Asia.
38:01
I'm quite sure that Iran is in touch with elements in Africa
38:06
and even in Latin America. But I think a lot of it goes
38:10
below the radar and it isn't reported on because to a degree
38:14
it shouldn't be. It shouldn't be visible because
38:17
then it's it's very easy for what is a predatory imperialist
38:22
complex to to interfere with these communications and also to
38:30
survey these communication. I mean, not forgetting when one
38:35
talks about these kind of intelligence operations and, and
38:41
someone said to me, you know, Trump won't do anything.
38:43
He's too much of A narcissist to do something if he thinks it's
38:46
going to fail. Well, that's not true.
38:49
In 2019, he sent the US Navy Seals to North Korea.
38:57
It's an incredible story. And they were supposed to
39:00
install the listening devices prior to Kim Yong UN's meeting
39:08
with President Putin on nuclear development.
39:12
And what happened was they were supposed to land from the sea.
39:14
It was a complete mess. They ended up murdering Korean
39:19
fishermen who who saw their lights because they'd parked the
39:24
submarine, one pointing forward and one pointing back.
39:27
And at one point, they tried to move one submarine to be level
39:30
with the other one, but they'd left their lights on and, and
39:34
the bubbles from the submarine moving went to the surface mixed
39:37
with the lights. Then the fishermen saw them, so
39:40
they killed the fishermen. They got out of there, but the
39:43
submarine had to come in even closer to to pick them up.
39:46
And then the Korean security services were swarming in the
39:50
area. That's a bit of a diversion, but
39:52
I'm just saying, do you know that there is communication, but
39:59
the problem is that. These countries or states or non
40:06
state actors are constantly under threat of assassination,
40:10
of kidnap. There was 1 Iranian military
40:15
official who came out and said we know that they were planning
40:18
the same thing during the 12 day war that they've just conducted
40:21
in Venezuela. So they're consistently under
40:24
threat of this kind of attack. So the communications have to be
40:29
kept to the minimum and below the radar, but it doesn't mean
40:33
that they're not ongoing. But in that situation, they're
40:38
they must be in a relatively weak position and or is that, is
40:41
that unfair? No, it's not unfair.
40:44
I mean, of course they are. They don't have the resources,
40:46
they don't have the power, They don't have the military
40:48
industrial complex supporting them that the Western
40:53
imperialist powers, colonialist powers have and that the Zionist
40:58
block has basically because they have the backing of that
41:02
military industrial complex and they produce their own, of
41:05
course, also with investment from members of that complex.
41:10
So they are to a degree in a commercial military economic
41:19
basis. They are in a weaker position
41:22
from an ideological position. No, they're much stronger
41:26
because they're fighting for for for their homeland, for a
41:30
belief, for their ideology. They're not fighting for
41:33
supremacy or dominance. They're just fighting to protect
41:37
their own sovereign interests. Let's sort of come back to our
41:41
own countries then for a second, because obviously what happened
41:46
in in Syria and with every regime change operation that
41:50
we've seen in the last 40 years, but particularly with this
41:53
absolutely blatant Venezuelan operation, we see the West yet
42:01
again trampling all over international law.
42:06
And, and, and really, OK, there's been some kind of outcry
42:14
from, you know, people on the, the supposedly global S.
42:19
But for our own populations, it seems that that we are willing
42:24
to accept this kind of behaviour from our leaders.
42:29
And we have been pretty much since Tony Blair in particular.
42:32
So the fact that he's not in prison indicates to me that that
42:39
perhaps it's a lack of awareness on on on our own population's
42:43
part point of view. But but you know, is is the
42:48
first step in fighting against this to to try to educate what
42:53
international law is, what it represents, and why we shouldn't
42:56
be allowing our leaders to just trample over it in the way that
42:59
they are. Yeah.
43:00
I mean, my view to a degree is that the entire international
43:08
law, institutional body, including the UN, including the
43:16
ICJ, the ICC, et cetera, are all captured.
43:21
They're toothless, effectively. And so, you know, when people
43:25
talk about, let's call an emergency meeting at the UN
43:28
Security Council, what does it mean?
43:30
Did it manage? Did the UN manage to bring an
43:33
end to the genocide for two years?
43:35
No, of course it didn't. And so in my opinion, what
43:41
actually needs to happen and that it needs to happen both on
43:44
a macro and a micro level is people need to start those
43:49
people who are genuinely aligned in their ideology.
43:52
In other words, anti imperialist, not necessarily pro
43:56
multi polar, but multi nodal where those countries have
44:00
sovereignty and they have control over who they do trade
44:04
with, who has any influence within their country, etcetera.
44:11
So that there isn't this governance by either a unipolar
44:14
or a multi power, sorry, multi polar still to a large degree
44:21
superpower, which isn't necessarily going to take into
44:24
account the sovereign peoples, the working class and the
44:28
populations of the countries in which they want to gain sphere
44:32
of influence, right? And so those countries that
44:36
genuinely believe in equity and equality globally, an end to
44:41
oppression and so on, should create an alternative
44:44
environment in which they conduct what should be known as
44:47
international law. So they run parallel to the US
44:52
version of international law, but they form a body in which
44:56
they create the environment in which they can talk about
45:00
actions to be taken in response to violation of the
45:04
international law that they could create.
45:07
I know that this is kind of a far off vision, but it's still
45:14
something that we need to look at.
45:15
I remember in 2014, the dissident comedian Giordano in
45:21
France, he was doing exactly this.
45:23
He was creating institutions and organizations like insurance
45:29
companies away from the established insurance companies
45:32
who were basically ripping you off.
45:35
So he wasn't interfering with them, but he was creating
45:39
something on a parallel basis. And that is it's it's some, it's
45:43
a concept which I think all of us need to start thinking about.
45:47
Why are we allowing ourselves to be captured by systems that are
45:51
there to effectively oppress us, censor us punishers for for
45:58
whatever dissident thought we might have against whatever
46:01
policy is is incoming? And you know, I think this is
46:04
absolutely right. I think, I think if you remember
46:07
a couple of years ago, Michael Gove published the new
46:10
definition of extremism in the UK.
46:12
And, and you know, this is still the definition used by the
46:16
Starmer regime. And they introduced this, this
46:20
concept of creating parallel institutions as being somehow an
46:24
extremist act. And, and that should be in that
46:26
should be an indication, you know, as to the direction we
46:30
should be thinking. But my question is, but
46:32
obviously, you know, at some point that needs to happen at a,
46:36
at an international level. And the question is, is, is the
46:39
United Nations such a busted flush that that it could never
46:43
be redeemed from this point of view?
46:45
I mean, obviously there are many aspects to the UN that that are
46:49
worthy of criticism, net zero and, and Agenda 2030 and 21
46:54
being one aspect of it. But if we just, I think with
46:57
the, with the international law aspect of it and the UN Charter
47:00
and the Security Council and so on, is that such a is that such
47:04
a compromised institution at this point that it needs to be
47:08
replaced it? Needs a major overhaul if you're
47:10
going to keep it. But I mean, you would say the
47:12
same about the BBC on a, on a lower level, is it better to get
47:16
rid of the BBC? And for a grassroots, I know
47:20
it's very difficult because then you have the issue of
47:23
infiltration and so on. But it's, it's the same issue.
47:26
Yes, if you got rid of the veto, for example, you might be able
47:31
to, to restore some of, of the kind of equity within the UN,
47:39
but that's going to be as soon as you put through a, a
47:42
resolution like that, it'll be vetoed.
47:44
So this is the point it's at the moment I, I don't see how the UN
47:49
becomes workable, to be honest, I, I really don't.
47:53
And, and I've been watching a lot of sort of interviews
47:56
talking about this very subject and even Ambassador Charles
48:01
Freeman, I was watching him yesterday.
48:02
He was saying the same thing. He said it's completely defunct.
48:05
It's, it's, it's just not workable anymore.
48:07
And even if you turned it upside down and, and rewrite all of
48:12
the, you know, the, the, the rules and regulations, I, I
48:18
don't, he doesn't see, and I don't see how it is going to be
48:23
reversed or, or renovated to be anything which is fit for
48:27
purpose while you still have the dominance of the countries
48:33
within it. But that's the thing.
48:35
That's why I think it has to be something which is actually
48:38
created in competition to the dominant imperialist book.
48:45
And that's going to be, that would be a pretty difficult
48:48
thing to do. Just just looking at it from the
48:50
point of view of, of how sort of how you know, the disparate
48:57
opinions that, that, that are out there, that it's, it's going
49:01
to be extremely difficult to, to sort of end up with getting a
49:05
path that that most people can agree to.
49:07
But that doesn't mean we shouldn't try.
49:10
No, exactly. And I think you know to a
49:13
degree, if it can succeed at a micro level, then then you can
49:18
understand the workings of it. I mean, quite a few people are
49:22
starting to do this kind of thing now.
49:24
They're starting to establish communities, starting to
49:26
establish systems outside of of the central system in order to
49:32
protect their communities, their families and their so on.
49:35
So I think you know, because the problem is you mentioned the
49:42
fact that you were watching. John Adams.
49:48
John Adams yes, sorry. And it's the fact that a lot of
49:53
the resistance countries, everyone is still reliant on
49:56
international law as it is right now.
49:59
And the problem is that creates a kind of prison because you're
50:06
you're screaming into a void. Nothing's going to be done.
50:10
I watched the speech by Vaselina Bencia, who has actually
50:14
maintained a very principled stance both on Palestine and now
50:19
on Venezuela and previously on Syria.
50:23
Great. But it's going to achieve
50:25
nothing. It's not going to change
50:27
anything. Nothing changed on Palestine
50:29
through the UN. Nothing.
50:34
Even with all of of the weapons that potentially the UN has.
50:38
I mean, why didn't it use responsibility to protect?
50:41
Because it would be vetoed by the countries that have
50:43
benefited from responsibility to protect, to overthrow dissident
50:49
nations and regimes, right? Do you think that's because do
50:57
you think it achieved nothing? Because nobody is aware of what
51:01
he said. Actually, yes, you know, that's
51:08
because because the activities on on that forum never get
51:12
reported on in the press. Nobody ever gets to hear what
51:15
anybody says or what anybody attempts to do.
51:18
There's never any criticism of the misuse of the of veto powers
51:22
in, in the Security Council, unless it's Russia or China
51:25
that's vetoing something, you know, an invasion of a country
51:28
or something by the by the US or.
51:30
Petro, for example, from from Colombia, who, who gave a very
51:34
strong speech in the UN and guess what, immediately had his
51:38
visa taken away from him by Tron, you know, so, so this is
51:43
the point. It's, it's almost like you're,
51:45
you're fighting in a gladiator forum, right?
51:50
And, and ultimately the US is the emperor that that puts the
51:54
thumb up or down. That's it.
51:57
I mean, this is completely off topic, but I'm just going to
51:59
throw it in here. But if, if anybody isn't aware
52:02
of what Trump has just done to Mark Kelly, by the way, the the,
52:05
the Democrat senator who former military man who suggested that,
52:10
you know, perhaps U.S. military personnel should not be obeying
52:15
bad orders. This is absolutely a
52:17
constitutional statement. But Trump has just accused him
52:20
of sedition. And, and so, and I mean, this
52:25
is, this is Nazi Germany style suppression of freedom of
52:28
speech. And it's quite, quite
52:31
incredible. But anyway, look, look, we got
52:34
to, we got to finish off what I'd like to, to just finish off
52:37
with is obviously Maduro is in court.
52:41
He's naturally pled not guilty to the charges.
52:49
What do you think is, is going to be the outcome of this?
52:52
And and is this is Iran next or who's next for, for, for this
52:57
kind of treatment, do you think? Well, I mean, you know, they're
52:59
they're basically denying him his right to immunity as
53:05
president. And, and this was the precedent
53:07
sent precedent set by the overthrow of Manuel Noriega in
53:16
1990, where they said basically, I'm paraphrasing, the US didn't
53:22
recognize the government of Noriega and therefore he didn't
53:25
have the right to immunity in an American court.
53:31
And so that precedent is now being used, levied against
53:36
Maduro. But when you talk about the
53:38
craziness of or how Trump is out of control, one of the
53:42
accusations is that Maduro has machine guns and under American
53:51
gun laws, this is shouldn't be allowed.
53:54
And it's just like what? But this is the insanity of, of
54:03
the Trump administration. And I think unfortunately, I
54:10
mean, I, I just had a skim through the charges that are
54:14
being brought against him and even against Killa Flores or
54:18
Chilla Flores, however you pronounce her name.
54:22
And my apologies if I mispronounced her.
54:25
They're accusing her of, of orchestrating kidnappings and
54:29
murders and so on. And they're refusing her medical
54:34
treatment, according to the Telegraph reporter who was in
54:39
the court. And apparently she's covered in
54:42
bruises on her face. She's got broken ribs from the
54:46
actual kidnapping. And they're refusing her medical
54:49
treatment. So of course, and they, they are
54:51
basically out of the norm. They're parading Maduro around,
54:58
right? Which is just disgusting.
55:00
I mean, this is reminiscent, as many people have pointed out of,
55:03
of, you know, the the ancient Roman Empire towards its ends,
55:07
where they were parading or, or massacring Christians, for
55:11
example, and putting their bodies on, on crosses in the
55:14
upper nine way and so on. This is where we're reducing
55:17
down to a level of monstrosity that, as I've said before, it
55:23
signals to me the decline of 1 empire in the rise of another.
55:28
But unfortunately, I think the rise of the other is going to be
55:33
the packed Judaica on the back of the dying American empire,
55:39
which is going to bring it again into competition, particularly
55:43
with China. Because if we come back to Latin
55:45
America, the number of investments and of course, China
55:48
risks losing all of its investments if, for example,
55:52
this strategy is also conducted in other countries where China
55:56
has increased its sphere of influence and its investment.
56:00
I mean, China today has invested around 20 billion into Latin
56:06
America, a lot of that into Venezuela.
56:09
And just very quickly to end with a point which which I think
56:14
demonstrates what I'm talking about, the Venezuela oil
56:19
subsidiary company that was based in the United States,
56:22
Citgo, which basically because the US has been putting
56:27
sanctions on to Venezuela for decades, it couldn't repay it's
56:33
loans. So it was put it into auction
56:36
November last year and it was bought up by Paul Singer under
56:44
his vulture investment fund company, Elliott Investment
56:48
Management through a subsidiary of that called Amber Energy.
56:52
Now the company is worth around 15 to 18 billion.
56:55
It was bought for 5.9 billion. But the interesting thing about
57:00
Paul Singer, not only has he supported Trump's campaign both
57:03
in 2016 and, and his recent campaign for the presidency, and
57:09
he's also supported Trump's campaigns against his detractors
57:14
like Thomas Massie, but he's also a major, I think he's #7 in
57:20
the list of donors to Israel. So again, this demonstrates very
57:25
clearly the Israeli Zionist hand on on what is going on inside
57:31
Venezuela. I think the only other point I
57:35
would make is that people have gone on the streets and if we
57:39
remember in 2002 they kidnapped Chavez and there was a mass
57:45
uprising in Venezuela and and they basically gave Chavez back.
57:50
My inclination is to say under Trump, I don't think that's
57:54
going to happen personally. Yeah.
57:59
OK. Well, let's leave it there for
58:01
today. I'm going to say thank you very
58:02
much, Vanessa, for that has been a fascinating conversation.
58:06
The world is a rapidly changing place at the moment and it's a
58:13
lot change is largely being driven by our leaderships.
58:17
And so, you know, this, this as usual, you know, lots of people
58:23
don't quite grasp why international affairs are their
58:27
problem, but everything that's going on in this world is our
58:31
problem. And, you know, I think it's
58:34
naive to think if it's that they they're they're going to do that
58:39
to those countries, but they wouldn't do that to our own.
58:41
I think we're living through a pace of change in our own
58:46
country where people increasingly don't recognize it,
58:50
but they want to strike out at the, at the immigrant or at the
58:54
Muslim or whatever it happens to be.
58:56
And, and not focusing on who's, who's driving this, these
59:00
policies in the 1st place. I think we've always got to keep
59:03
an eye on who that is. I think the point is, if all
59:05
these independent countries are bought to heal and and
59:10
incorporated into the transnational ruling elite
59:14
complex, then we're next. That's without a doubt, because
59:19
then there's nothing standing in their way.
59:21
There's no distraction from focusing in on bringing their
59:25
own populations under control. Indeed, Thank you, Vanessa, and
59:29
thanks for joining me. Thank you.