Latest / I Choose Me with Jennie Garth / I Choose ... to Let Myself Be Loved with Sarah Drew

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I Choose ... to Let Myself Be Loved with Sarah Drew · I Choose Me with Jennie Garth

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: You're listening to I Choose Me with Jenny Girl. Welcome
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: back to I Choose Me. We talk about the choices
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: we make in life and where they lead us. I'm
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: so incredibly excited about today's conversation. My guest is an
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: actress you have loved and cried with for years, probably
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: especially on one of the most culturally dominant shows of
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: our time. But what you might not know is that
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: she's also a director, a producer, a pastor's daughter, and
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: someone who makes profound choices every single day to live
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: a life aligned with her purpose. Please welcome the brilliant, wonderful,
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: and deeply real Sarah Drew. I have so much to
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: talk to you about. You've been so brave in your
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: career and all the choices you've made. You work NonStop,
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: so many credits, I couldn't keep scrolling through them all.
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: It's been what.
• 1:05
  Speaker 3: I feel, so lucky and so blessed, and I you know,
• 1:10
  Speaker 3: I don't. I just I love where I love to work,
• 1:13
  Speaker 3: and I love that there have been opportunities to keep working,
• 1:16
  Speaker 3: and and then I started writing, so then I started
• 1:19
  Speaker 3: making my own work and I love them. It's it's yeah,
• 1:22
  Speaker 3: it's a lot but it's and it's a lot to
• 1:25
  Speaker 3: juggle with kids and everything.
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: It really is it? Really speaking of kids, something you
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: said really resonated with me. I think you said before
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: you had your kids that you were terrified of becoming
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: a mom, because that's it. I mean, I mean, that's
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: the one of the biggest I choose me moments. You
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: can make that choice to become a mother. What what
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: were you so terrified of? And now that you have
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: what a tween and a teen? Yeah, are you so
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: terrified or are you more terrified?
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: It's it's it's gosh, it's just all of the ever thing, right.
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: I think I was really afraid of failing like a
• 2:04
  Speaker 3: as a mom. Just I knew that becoming a mother
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: would require a lot of sacrifice, and I was really
• 2:13
  Speaker 3: content to be pretty self absorbed. Actually, wait, and I
• 2:19
  Speaker 3: think that there was a real fear that I would
• 2:22
  Speaker 3: not be able to rise to the occasion. And I
• 2:25
  Speaker 3: remember writing to my dad. My dad's a pastor, retired pastor,
• 2:29
  Speaker 3: but he is like just a founta of wisdom always
• 2:32
  Speaker 3: for me and I when I was pregnant, it's like
• 2:34
  Speaker 3: I'm not sleeping it. Also, it also took me a
• 2:38
  Speaker 3: while to feel ready to even start the process of
• 2:41
  Speaker 3: trying to get pregnant, like a bunch of my friends
• 2:44
  Speaker 3: had had babies before me. I remember hiding it, like
• 2:48
  Speaker 3: with an anxiety attack in a side room at a
• 2:52
  Speaker 3: baby shower, just because there's so much joy happening in
• 2:55
  Speaker 3: the room, and I'm like, I'm just not ready for this.
• 2:57
  Speaker 3: I don't. I want. I want all these things in life,
• 3:02
  Speaker 3: and I want everything to be all set up. I
• 3:05
  Speaker 3: want the table set, you know, before I embark on
• 3:09
  Speaker 3: this thing that feels so huge. And the reality is
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: that the table is never set in life. You are
• 3:15
  Speaker 3: constantly clearing dishes and resetting the table. That's a good
• 3:19
  Speaker 3: add it just it's if you're waiting for the table
• 3:23
  Speaker 3: to be set for anything, you will never move forward.
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: So true, right, like universal.
• 3:29
  Speaker 3: Yes, absolutely, And I think that knowing that I had
• 3:34
  Speaker 3: to get comfortable in the surrender of it all, in
• 3:37
  Speaker 3: the reality of like, yeah, I'm totally going to fail
• 3:40
  Speaker 3: at times. As long as I can get comfortable with
• 3:45
  Speaker 3: messing up and repairing and taking responsibility and learning from
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: those mistakes, then the sky is the limits in terms
• 3:53
  Speaker 3: of how you can grow and how you can parent
• 3:56
  Speaker 3: and how you can be a partner and you know
• 3:58
  Speaker 3: how you can be an artist the world. You just
• 4:01
  Speaker 3: have to keep throwing shit at the wall.
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: I mean for sure.
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  Speaker 3: No, it's it's like that fear.
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: Though of the unknown. It can stop so many of
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: us from taking action.
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  Speaker 3: Absolutely, absolutely, it was very I remember my dad when
• 4:16
  Speaker 3: I emailed him just to be like, I'm not sleeping
• 4:19
  Speaker 3: at night. I'm so scared of this child coming and
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: then me just like ruining their life or just not
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: enjoying anything any part of it. Like everything about it
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  Speaker 3: is so scary. He gave me a bunch of like
• 4:34
  Speaker 3: lovely Bible verses to meditate on, and then one of
• 4:37
  Speaker 3: the things that really sustayed with me was he said,
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  Speaker 3: I want you to start habit of aggressive gratitude. I
• 4:45
  Speaker 3: was like, what he said, when you are in a practice,
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  Speaker 3: and he called it aggressive because it's like you got
• 4:51
  Speaker 3: to work at it. You got to be on the gratitude.
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  Speaker 1: You got to keep choosing. You had to.
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  Speaker 3: Keep choosing it over and over and over again. Because
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  Speaker 3: it doesn't us fly at your face. I mean it
• 5:02
  Speaker 3: does in like heightened moments of bliss and whatever, but
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: in real life, it's more it's easier to find the
• 5:07
  Speaker 3: faults and of course imperfections, yes, of course. So like, fine,
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: look deciding I'm waking up in the morning and I'm
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: choosing to be grateful for this and this and this,
• 5:18
  Speaker 3: And he said, it's going to feel weird at first,
• 5:20
  Speaker 3: but once you get going with it, you'll start to
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  Speaker 3: see things in your world that just make you go, oh,
• 5:27
  Speaker 3: I was looking for it because I was already in
• 5:29
  Speaker 3: gratitude this morning, and there's something else to be grateful for,
• 5:32
  Speaker 3: something else. And he said, you can't just tell yourself
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: to stop fearing. You have to replace it with something else.
• 5:38
  Speaker 3: So replacing it with this active, aggressive gratitude, it ends
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: up kind of dispelling that stuff that usually never comes
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  Speaker 3: to pass, because that's what fear is, you know, it's
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  Speaker 3: not substantive, it's not real, it's it's just a thought.
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: It's thoughts, and ninety eight percent of the things we
• 6:00
  Speaker 3: freak ourselves out about don't come to pass, right, So yeah,
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  Speaker 3: So I started a practice of doing that, and it really, yeah,
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  Speaker 3: it really transformed like just my heart and my heart
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  Speaker 3: space and just sort of preparing the way for this
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  Speaker 3: child to come and change my life.
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  Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. And that's what happens when you become
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  Speaker 1: a mother. What would you say now to your younger
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: self who was so scared in that moment, or if
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: somebody's listening now that maybe's having their first baby.
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, oh, I would just say, first of all, you
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  Speaker 3: got to want to be a mom a parent, Like,
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: don't just fly into it because everybody else says that
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  Speaker 3: this is a thing you should do. I think the
• 6:48
  Speaker 3: desire needs to be there, and I think maybe a
• 6:50
  Speaker 3: lot of people walk into it kind of going because
• 6:52
  Speaker 3: this is what we're supposed to do, right, We're just
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: supposed to have babies.
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: In the I'm a mom and I take care of family.
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  Speaker 3: It's exactly like, I think there needs to be a
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: real desire there. But if that desire is there, the
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: leap is terrifying. But the adventure is so beyond your
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: wildest dreams. And I don't mean that it's full of
• 7:16
  Speaker 3: bliss all the time. It is hard, and it is
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: oh so painful at times hilariously funny. You know, when
• 7:28
  Speaker 3: they get to the age where they start cracking jokes
• 7:30
  Speaker 3: and they start becoming company instead of work. It's like
• 7:34
  Speaker 3: this magical transformation where you're like, you are funny and
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  Speaker 3: I'm enjoying you.
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: What is it like with the tweeney and the teeny?
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: How is it in your house right now?
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  Speaker 3: It's really fun and really vibrant. Homework has gotten harder,
• 7:55
  Speaker 3: and so there are many tears involved with homework.
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: What is this thing with homework?
• 7:59
  Speaker 3: The homework load is really intense, The managing schedules is
• 8:03
  Speaker 3: really intense. The relational drama has like picked up, and
• 8:07
  Speaker 3: so there's real things that are happening in the kids'
• 8:11
  Speaker 3: hearts and stuff. But also my kids are like musical
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: theater kids, and there's a lot of singing in our house.
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: They're like belting at the top of our lungs. Like
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: my daughter will start singing a song from Dear Evan Hanson.
• 8:23
  Speaker 3: Then my son will pick it up in his room,
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  Speaker 3: and then they'll just be singing across the house in harmonies.
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's so interesting.
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  Speaker 3: So you live in a musical. I live in a musical. Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: There are times when my husband and are like and
• 8:35
  Speaker 3: I are like, if we could just turn the volume down,
• 8:38
  Speaker 3: just like a tiny bit, it would feel better on
• 8:42
  Speaker 3: our nervous systems. But of course, no, don't ever say that.
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: Oh, let them sing, No, let them sing Yeah, is
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  Speaker 1: so true, because there will be a day in their development.
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  Speaker 1: Hopefully it'll be quick when they'll Yeah, I don't want
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  Speaker 1: them to be quiet. Maybe you won't, maybe they won't
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  Speaker 1: ever be quiet.
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  Speaker 3: But I don't no, I will say all of the
• 9:02
  Speaker 3: really deep conversations, like when they really need to talk
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: about something, begin at ten fifteen at night.
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  Speaker 1: That kind of passed my prime.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm already asleep. My face mask is on my head,
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: ready to be shoved over my eyeballs. Oh my god, mommy,
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  Speaker 3: I need to tell you about something.
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  Speaker 1: It's the worst.
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  Speaker 3: You're like, okay, yep, here we go, Here we go
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  Speaker 3: another hour.
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  Speaker 1: God bless the fact that they're coming and talking to you.
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  Speaker 3: I would not trade it for anything. And my son
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: right now is doing a production of a Christmas Carol
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  Speaker 3: and it's like it's a noise within which is a
• 9:38
  Speaker 3: professional theater in East Pasadena. So he's got eight shows
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: a week. He's just had a student matinee today. You know,
• 9:44
  Speaker 3: he is working, working, and also applying for high schools,
• 9:50
  Speaker 3: and so we've been immersed in just time management, which
• 9:55
  Speaker 3: is those conversations are so agonizingly unfun. Not fun.
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  Speaker 1: I mean, it's a lot to juggle. I feel like
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: I always said, like I would take back the diaper
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: years in a heartbeat. Those were so much more easy, so.
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  Speaker 3: Much easier, so much easy, so much more, so much
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  Speaker 3: less emotional weight was there. Yeah, it was just about
• 10:16
  Speaker 3: taking care of something, keeping it a lot, just keep
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: it alive, just keep it, just both.
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: Called it it.
• 10:21
  Speaker 3: You know it, it's crying. What does it need? There
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: are four things it could need?
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: So okay, I want to talk about the cultural giant
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: that was your home for nine seasons. So for those
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: of you listening that don't know, maybe you lived under
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: a rock. You played April Kepner on The Great Gray's Anatomy.
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: What an honor. It really shaped your career?
• 10:48
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, absolutely transformed my life.
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, really really, I want to know how. But I
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: also think, like you know, when you're a part of
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: a big crew like that, it's very easy to kind
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: of find your rhythm and your and things and you
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: kind of your purpose. You know, when you step away,
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: things change. Oh yeah, it's a big transition. We'll talk
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: about that in a second. But how to being a
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: part of that world shape who you are as a
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: person on a personal level? I mean in so many ways.
• 11:23
  Speaker 3: I think one of the biggest ways for me was
• 11:27
  Speaker 3: actually learning how to use my voice on a set
• 11:32
  Speaker 3: in an environment where that was welcome and encouraged. I
• 11:38
  Speaker 3: Sandra oh Is I just love her so much. I
• 11:41
  Speaker 3: have so much respect for her, and she's so talented, incredible,
• 11:45
  Speaker 3: She's so incredible. But what I got to witness with
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: the way that she engaged with the writers, it was
• 11:51
  Speaker 3: such a beautiful thing to see. She would advocate so
• 11:53
  Speaker 3: passionately for her character and her character's storylines, and the
• 11:58
  Speaker 3: writers loved it because it was it was done with
• 12:02
  Speaker 3: such respect and such collaboration, and it was like they
• 12:04
  Speaker 3: were on this journey together. And I was like, oh, man,
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: if Sandra oh can do that, is she can use
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: her voice and advocate for because you sign on to
• 12:14
  Speaker 3: a show and you have no idea where the writers
• 12:15
  Speaker 3: are going to take you, right, and it's so it's
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: every every week is a new episode going, oh, I
• 12:21
  Speaker 3: guess that's who I am? Is that who I am?
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: Oh?
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: Okay? You very much like.
• 12:25
  Speaker 3: Life, very much like life exactly. You're adjusting and recalibrating
• 12:31
  Speaker 3: and and but then as you get to know your
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: character and you start to inhabit your character for a
• 12:36
  Speaker 3: long time, then things start to feel like, well, I'm
• 12:39
  Speaker 3: not sure she would actually go down that road, or
• 12:41
  Speaker 3: maybe she would go down that road in this kind
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: of a different way. And now that I've been living
• 12:45
  Speaker 3: in her skin for a couple of years, like, I,
• 12:49
  Speaker 3: what about if we do it like this?
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: Had you been in environments previously where you didn't have
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: a voice, I didn't.
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: I didn't know that I was allowed to have a voice.
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: I think I think in my previous like, I've always
• 13:04
  Speaker 3: been vocal in terms of like blocking, you know, when
• 13:09
  Speaker 3: we're on set, in terms of oh, oh, is that
• 13:12
  Speaker 3: how the scene is going to go? Oh? Because I
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: was thinking about it from this perspective, but oh, let's
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: try it this way, you know, in that kind of collaboration.
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: But in terms of getting the script and then going
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: is that the trajectory of my character? I don't know.
• 13:28
  Speaker 3: But what about what we did in the scene two
• 13:30
  Speaker 3: episodes ago and when she said this thing? How is
• 13:33
  Speaker 3: that connecting to this? Help me understand? Or is there
• 13:36
  Speaker 3: another way that we can say this that feels more
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: in line with who she was two episodes ago? You know,
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: I just had never I had never known that I
• 13:46
  Speaker 3: could speak into that piece of the collaborative process.
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: Do you think that affected you in your personal life
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: as well? Did that kind of spill into you finding
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: a new sort of.
• 13:59
  Speaker 3: I think it's more that I've always expressed my opinion
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: in life, but I didn't bring it to my work.
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: So it was more about allowing more of like who
• 14:12
  Speaker 3: Sarah is to come into play in the work environment.
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: I mean, I'm an actor but also a people pleaser
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: by nature and an achiever by nature. And so I
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: think I spent a lot of my life just wanting
• 14:26
  Speaker 3: to keep everybody happy, you know. And even if I
• 14:32
  Speaker 3: was like, I'm not sure about that, I'm often will
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: I would often take responsibility for something I didn't I
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: didn't have responsibility for just to avoid the conflict, just
• 14:44
  Speaker 3: to make everybody okay, you know. And so I think
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: in allowing myself to speak but also learn how to
• 14:55
  Speaker 3: navigate in the relationships so that I wasn't stepping on
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: toes and nobody was getting a And it was really
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: about let's craft something gorgeous together, and look at what
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: you're bringing to the table, and look at what I'm
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: also bringing to the table, and how can we find
• 15:13
  Speaker 3: the best idea together. You know, it's kind of hard.
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: To shift from you know, your those years where you're
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: creating the autonomy and figuring yourself out and then finding
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: your stride, and then you meet somebody and you're in
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: a relationship. Yeah, and then that's like screech, tire screech.
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: The funny thing is I've been with my husband for
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: like twenty six years. So we met, I know, we
• 15:35
  Speaker 3: met when I was so, so, so young. And what's
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: very interesting about that is, I feel like you change
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: and grow so much in your twenties and thirties, it's bananas.
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: I feel like we met, we've reacquainted each other with
• 15:49
  Speaker 3: a new version of ourselves every seven months.
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: How old were you.
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: When you met him?
• 15:53
  Speaker 3: Eighteen?
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: Wow? Okay, yeah, it's good.
• 15:55
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So we were babies and we got married. I
• 15:59
  Speaker 3: was twenty one. I was like a month out of college,
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: and so I think I was finding myself while I
• 16:06
  Speaker 3: was already in a relationship. And I'm so grateful that
• 16:11
  Speaker 3: I met him as young as I did. It didn't
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: come without its challenges, for sure, but he's not in
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: the industry, and he is he and he knew me
• 16:21
  Speaker 3: before I had I had found any kind of success.
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: I was a college kid, you know, nothing had happened
• 16:27
  Speaker 3: in micro I was just Sarah, and so we got
• 16:31
  Speaker 3: to kind of take this journey of discovery together. Yeah.
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: I love that. Yeah, because it can be a lonely journey,
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: especially for a woman.
• 16:40
  Speaker 3: Yes, I imagine it is. I mean, I don't know,
• 16:44
  Speaker 3: I don't know, I don't I was just thinking about
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: it today because I mean, so much stuff with with
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: what our kids are going through and my son entering
• 16:55
  Speaker 3: into high school at Applying Price, there's a lot that we're
• 16:58
  Speaker 3: sort of spinning around in our heads and a lot
• 17:01
  Speaker 3: of things we're thinking about. And my husband is so
• 17:04
  Speaker 3: grounded and so level headed, and he he thinks about
• 17:09
  Speaker 3: things from nineteen thousand different perspectives and does research on
• 17:12
  Speaker 3: every single possible thing. Oh, I'm much more so helpful.
• 17:15
  Speaker 3: I'm much more impulsive, much more like, this is my gut,
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: let's just do this, you know. And it's and I'm
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: so grateful to him because he has been I've been
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: in and out of town so much so he's really
• 17:27
  Speaker 3: been the grounded force in our family life. And I
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: was just I was just driving in my car, going
• 17:32
  Speaker 3: thank God that I have Peter. Thank God that I
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: met him when I did, Thank God that he is
• 17:39
  Speaker 3: the father of my children and my partner in life.
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: Like it was just there's that aggressive gratitude.
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: Yes, you can keep practicing, Just keep practicing.
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: Absolutely. So. Your character went through quite a lot on
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: grays Havy.
• 17:54
  Speaker 3: I so much trauma, Yeah.
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: So much trauma, drama, all the things, emotions. I know
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: from experience how that can kind of put you in
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: a certain head space, especially when you're at work doing
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: really I mean, your character was saving lives or not, yeah,
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: and dealing with all of that. How did you turn
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: that off? As your kids were younger? You would go
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: to work I'm assuming twelve hours a day at least
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: at least yeah, and then you would come home and
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: switch gears to being a mom and have to shed
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: all of what you just were.
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: I mean not always successfully, right. I had a really
• 18:33
  Speaker 3: I mean a couple crazy stories, one of which is
• 18:37
  Speaker 3: I played this really traumatic pregnancy storyline while I was
• 18:40
  Speaker 3: pregnant with my daughter. Yeah, I was eight months pregnant
• 18:43
  Speaker 3: with her when when I played this horrible labor delivery
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: and death scene where the baby dies in my arms
• 18:49
  Speaker 3: and I'm Okay, actually that's pregnant. Yeah, And I got
• 18:54
  Speaker 3: home and ten hours later went into premature labor. And
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: she came a month early and was in the nick
• 18:58
  Speaker 3: you for two weeks, like.
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: That's not gonna happen to me.
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, she was like, I'm getting out of here. You
• 19:02
  Speaker 3: started it apparently on set, pretending. So here we go.
• 19:06
  Speaker 3: We're in labor now, you know. So, because your body,
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: when you're going through trauma, you're and you're really entering
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: into the imaginary space in that way of the character
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: of the character, you don't your body doesn't know the difference.
• 19:21
  Speaker 3: Your body's like, oh, yeah, we're adrenaline spiking now, and
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: our cortisol levels are through the roof and you're panicking now,
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: and you're hyperventilating now, and so our heart is racing,
• 19:30
  Speaker 3: and so we don't we don't know that this isn't real.
• 19:34
  Speaker 3: There's a lion that's really chasing us, you know. And
• 19:37
  Speaker 3: so coming out of that was really hard. I do
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: remember when my character was going through a divorce. It
• 19:44
  Speaker 3: was such a dark, sad storyline. And it was so
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: sad too because my friend Jesse Williams, who played my
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: main acting partner on the show. We both loved working
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: together and loved being in this in this on Green relationship.
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: It was so we had we told so many beautiful stories.
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: We had such a fun, delightful friendship, and we were
• 20:08
  Speaker 3: both sad then they were just like splashing pieces, you know,
• 20:13
  Speaker 3: And and I would come home and be like so
• 20:18
  Speaker 3: sad about just how sad April and Jackson were. And
• 20:21
  Speaker 3: I remember my husband being like, you have two living
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: children and you are in a happy marriage. Can I
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: talk to Sarah and not April now, Like, can you
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: let the trauma from your fake life? Just like relax
• 20:36
  Speaker 3: in the corner.
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: Very helpful to like it here.
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: Let's just say I just need to come back to
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: meet Sarah, Like you're too much in April's pain, Because
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: she was in pain every day. I would have to
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: go for like twelve hours and just be in agony.
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: That sounds like so much fun.
• 20:56
  Speaker 3: I mean, weirdly, I'm a bit of a glutton for
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: punishment when it comes to any kind of big emotion.
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: I mean, otherwise why would I.
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: Be an actor?
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: You know, I think emotions are so underrated. Yeah, people
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: just try to hide them. People tell you they're bad,
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: You're too emotional.
• 21:12
  Speaker 3: No, you let a fly. I say this to my
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: son all the time because he he cries, and from
• 21:18
  Speaker 3: the earliest years of his life, I'm like, apps, get
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: that cry out, you express it. Don't ever think this
• 21:26
  Speaker 3: is a weakness. Crying is so good. It feels so good.
• 21:30
  Speaker 3: And whenever he has like a big cry about something,
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: I'm like, yes, yes, let's exercise all of this, get
• 21:37
  Speaker 3: it all out of your systems. Feel so good.
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: I love that.
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: That's a good mom right there, that's a good mom.
• 21:45
  Speaker 3: So Shonda Rhimes, who created the show, famously has.
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: A no jerks policy. Did you ever feel as a
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: female actress, or even just an actor, did you ever
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: feel pitted against other actors or actresses for more?
• 22:00
  Speaker 3: Never?
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: Nothing, Oh my gosh, never.
• 22:03
  Speaker 3: No. I felt so supported and so cared for. And
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: I even remember after my daughter Hannah was born, I
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: had started I'd had some postpartum that I was struggling with,
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: and I was I was finding that whenever I would
• 22:20
  Speaker 3: work second half of Fridays, it always turned into friturday
• 22:22
  Speaker 3: and then I'd get home at four in the morning
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: and my baby would be up at six and I
• 22:26
  Speaker 3: didn't have childcare on the weekends. And then I just
• 22:28
  Speaker 3: couldn't catch up on sleep and I went to her
• 22:31
  Speaker 3: after a couple weeks of doing this, I was like,
• 22:33
  Speaker 3: I'm kind of falling apart, like I can't remember my lines,
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: and I just I need some support. I need some help.
• 22:39
  Speaker 3: If there's any way that I can just like be
• 22:43
  Speaker 3: off of the rotation for second half of Fridays. I
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: could do any other day knowing that I have support
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: coming and helping, and I could sleep, you know, but
• 22:54
  Speaker 3: on Friday nights and She's like done, this is a matriarchy.
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: For the rest of the season, You're never working se
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: have a Friday's Like it was so easy to just
• 23:04
  Speaker 3: she was so supportive, and everybody that comes onto a
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: Shonda show was like, if you want to have babies,
• 23:10
  Speaker 3: do it now to show and do it now because
• 23:13
  Speaker 3: it's like the sweetest environment. Everybody would go on the
• 23:17
  Speaker 3: shows and just have the babies.
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, it's a fertile ground.
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: It's fertile ground.
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: Yes, Oh my gosh. You lived inside April Kaepner for
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: a very long time, and she went so through so
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: many ups and downs. Such a very relatable character because
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: we all go through those highs and those lows. What
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: part of her still is in you today? Oh, that's
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: great question, because playing a character for that long, Oh,
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: she's like always.
• 23:48
  Speaker 3: Going to be a part of me. I mean there
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: were pieces of me that kind of led into her
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: and became her, as well as pieces of her that
• 23:59
  Speaker 3: that all take with me forever. What I what I
• 24:02
  Speaker 3: take from April A couple things. It's really so sweet.
• 24:08
  Speaker 3: Whenever I meet fans who just love April, often there
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: are like shaking in tears. And it's almost always not
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: because they're like, oh it's Sarah Drew. It's because April
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: has gone. April has been on their iPad or on
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: their phone or in their living room or whatever for
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: years and years and years. They've watched the seasons many
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: many times, and they have witnessed this young woman who
• 24:31
  Speaker 3: was mocked and ridiculed when she came on to the show,
• 24:34
  Speaker 3: and the audience hated her too. I mean, it was injured.
• 24:37
  Speaker 3: Wasn't just the other characters made fun of the audience. Oh,
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: she was kind of grating and a bit annoying and
• 24:43
  Speaker 3: a little insecure, and like there just was like she
• 24:46
  Speaker 3: I was only supposed to be there for two episodes. Lately,
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: oh yeah, and then they brought me back and it
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: was this yeah, it's crazy. She then became this other.
• 24:56
  Speaker 3: She blossomed into this whole other, you know, nine years
• 24:58
  Speaker 3: later a person. But what I think so many people
• 25:02
  Speaker 3: connect to is that April felt really lonely. She was
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: really lonely, and then she found her tribe in this hospital.
• 25:09
  Speaker 3: She kind of came into her own. She has this
• 25:12
  Speaker 3: whole episode where she's like her sisters called her an
• 25:15
  Speaker 3: ugly duckling forever, but she's like, I'm not an ugly
• 25:18
  Speaker 3: duckling anymore. I'm a swan. And not just because she
• 25:22
  Speaker 3: had a glow up and looks pretty or whatever, but
• 25:25
  Speaker 3: because she she came into her own in terms of confidence.
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: She works her butt off.
• 25:30
  Speaker 3: To be excellent, an excellent surgeon. She has empathy for
• 25:35
  Speaker 3: her for her patients. That and she has this faith
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: that she has like lived by and is sort of
• 25:44
  Speaker 3: the true north of her life. That I mean. She
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: gets divorced, she loses a baby, she almost dies on
• 25:52
  Speaker 3: the table having another baby, She goes she gets fired
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: twice on the show. You know there. She goes through
• 26:00
  Speaker 3: so much and she has this massive crisis where she
• 26:04
  Speaker 3: loses her faith and goes into this dark space in
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: my final year on the show, and then relentlessly comes
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: back into joy and comes back into life and.
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: Won't give up.
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: She doesn't give up on herself, she doesn't give up
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: on the people that matter to her. She's just relentlessly
• 26:26
  Speaker 3: in pursuit of goodness and joy and hope. And I
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: think so many people who feel lonely or who have
• 26:35
  Speaker 3: been beat up by life a bit, they watch April
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: and they go, if April can do it, I can't
• 26:41
  Speaker 3: do If she can make it through losing a child,
• 26:46
  Speaker 3: then maybe I can get through the miscarriage I just had,
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: you know. If she can get through the pain of
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: losing the love of her life and then come out
• 26:56
  Speaker 3: the other side and go through this twisty turny journey
• 26:59
  Speaker 3: to then find her happiness and her purpose, maybe I
• 27:02
  Speaker 3: can too, you know.
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: So I.
• 27:06
  Speaker 3: That's what I will always take from her. Oh she's
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: such a fighter. She's a warrior, you know, but like
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: an emotional warrior who's relentlessly trying her best to be good,
• 27:20
  Speaker 3: you know, Like not there are warriors that are just like, ah,
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: I'm just gonna win, you know what I mean. But
• 27:27
  Speaker 3: she just is like no, I just want to do
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: the right thing, you know, I don't know. I just
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: I love and respect her.
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: So that is so so good. So leaving a show
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: like that, yeah, can be a big emotional and personal shift.
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: Oh big time.
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, what was that like for you?
• 27:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it was a very big grief because I didn't
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: see it. I didn't know it was coming. It wasn't
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: my decision, and so it was a very big, like wow,
• 27:56
  Speaker 3: shock to the system for sure. I had no idea,
• 28:01
  Speaker 3: and I it was a really interesting journey. And I've
• 28:04
  Speaker 3: spoken to so many of my friends who've gone through
• 28:07
  Speaker 3: losing jobs. There's a weird grief that comes from a
• 28:12
  Speaker 3: job loss that you almost feel embarrassed that you grieve
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: something like a job so deeply. It's like it's not
• 28:19
  Speaker 3: a person, it's not you haven't lost like nobody's lost
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: my life.
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but but you.
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: But there's so many aspects of being in a community,
• 28:30
  Speaker 3: in a work community, doing your life's work with this
• 28:35
  Speaker 3: specific group of people who know you, know your name,
• 28:38
  Speaker 3: you know them, you know you've been on this road
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: for almost a decade and having that and not to
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: mention the identity stuff that goes with it, Like I
• 28:50
  Speaker 3: remember in those early days, right after being written off,
• 28:54
  Speaker 3: I was just like, I've been that girl that's on
• 28:56
  Speaker 3: that show.
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: For so long?
• 28:59
  Speaker 3: Right, who am if I'm not that girl that's on
• 29:01
  Speaker 3: that show? You know, Like Gray's put me into a
• 29:07
  Speaker 3: household name. It gave me notoriety that I had never
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: previously had, and then all of a sudden, I'm not
• 29:15
  Speaker 3: there and they're continuing on without me. You know it
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: is it's a big thief. Yeah, it's a big grief,
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: and I had to kind of give my self permission
• 29:24
  Speaker 3: to feel all the feelings that are associated with it.
• 29:28
  Speaker 3: And sometimes I would, you know, I would, I would
• 29:31
  Speaker 3: say something in an interview, and then somebody would grab
• 29:34
  Speaker 3: a I think somebody grabbed Sarah Likin's getting written off
• 29:42
  Speaker 3: the show to attending her own funeral, which is of course.
• 29:44
  Speaker 3: I was saying it in the context of when you
• 29:48
  Speaker 3: leave something that nobody was expecting you to leave, the
• 29:52
  Speaker 3: love that pours out is so epic. It's like you're
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: listening to yourself being eulogized. It's just just but I
• 30:01
  Speaker 3: know exactly well, and then of course everybody mocks oh yeah, okay,
• 30:05
  Speaker 3: it was like a funeral, like get over yourself. It's
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: so stupid, Sarah. But for me, it's just like in
• 30:11
  Speaker 3: our lives, we don't often tell people how much we
• 30:16
  Speaker 3: love them and why we love them just on a
• 30:18
  Speaker 3: random Wednesday. You know. It usually takes something big for
• 30:23
  Speaker 3: someone to express all of those things, And so the
• 30:26
  Speaker 3: bigness of the moment of being written off ended up
• 30:30
  Speaker 3: bringing all these lovely thoughts and words from people to
• 30:34
  Speaker 3: the surface. So it was so tender and beautiful and
• 30:37
  Speaker 3: gorgeous and like something I never would have experienced if
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: I had just left of my own accord, or if
• 30:44
  Speaker 3: I you know.
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: So it's it took me.
• 30:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it took me a minute. I've totally lost my
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: train of thought, just went of fun.
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: It was about just getting settling into the fact that
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: you're no longer yes that girl from that show.
• 30:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so it took me. It took me a minute.
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: I it was hard to keep watching the show just
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: because I said, oh, that's my family going on. That's
• 31:07
  Speaker 3: a set I haven't.
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: What was the time between like the end of that
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: role and your next role? Do you did it was
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: a lady? Yeah quick?
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: Or it was pretty quick.
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: I did.
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: I went. I did a Christmas movie for Lifetime, I
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: think a couple months later. So yeah, I was oh,
• 31:26
  Speaker 3: actually no, there there was an immediate thing because I
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: was told that I wasn't going to be on the
• 31:32
  Speaker 3: show anymore on a Tuesday, and then my team, you know,
• 31:36
  Speaker 3: reached duiler. Are there any pilots that are still casting?
• 31:39
  Speaker 3: Back when we had a pilot season, are there any
• 31:41
  Speaker 3: pilots that are still casting? And so I wound up
• 31:43
  Speaker 3: testing and getting cast as a lead in a pilot
• 31:46
  Speaker 3: for Cagney and Lacey. So I actually was shooting it
• 31:51
  Speaker 3: literally day one of shooting that pilot was exactly the
• 31:54
  Speaker 3: next Tuesday, like one week later. There's some medicine for
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: your grief. Yeah it was. That was a a lovely
• 32:00
  Speaker 3: little god hug. For sure, it didn't get picked up,
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: but it didn't matter. It was a very sweet moment
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: of feeling like, oh, I'm gonna be okay, Okay.
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: People still want me, like, oh my gosh, it's so true.
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, okay you grew up a pastor's daughter. Yes,
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: that can have you know, you're very proud of it,
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: which is wonderful. That can have a rep you know,
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's got a stigma. My best friend when
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: I was a teenager, was a pastor's daughter, and we
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: got into some trouble. Let me tell you. When I
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: was hanging out for Rohnda Ronda if your little Mironda
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: Ronda and Rex, her brother, we we got in trouble
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: and the pastor would always catch us.
• 32:44
  Speaker 3: Oh that's so funny.
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: Did you ever get into trouble as a past.
• 32:48
  Speaker 3: I was such a goody two shoe I have my
• 32:52
  Speaker 3: I just wanted to do the right thing all the time. So, oh, hi,
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: April Kepner, she is April Keptainer. Yeah and April are
• 33:01
  Speaker 3: so similar. I maybe I wish I'd gotten into a
• 33:06
  Speaker 3: little bit more trouble.
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: Be fun.
• 33:08
  Speaker 3: It would have been fun, but I didn't want to.
• 33:11
  Speaker 3: I was also so driven and so focused. So, like
• 33:17
  Speaker 3: you know, I was acting, and acting was the greatest
• 33:21
  Speaker 3: love of my life, and so and I wasn't I
• 33:25
  Speaker 3: wasn't allowed to do the shows unless I was keeping
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: up with my work, and I didn't have time to
• 33:29
  Speaker 3: get into trouble. If I'm being perfectly honest. My high
• 33:32
  Speaker 3: school was so rigorous that I had to use every
• 33:36
  Speaker 3: twenty minutes. I had to get my homework done so
• 33:38
  Speaker 3: that I could then go to required sports and then
• 33:41
  Speaker 3: scarf some food down my mouth and then go to
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: rehearsal for three hours every night. You know, so I
• 33:47
  Speaker 3: didn't Yeah, I didn't have time to get into trouble.
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: Do you see that repeating with your own kids like
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: that drive? Yes, what do you like? Do you think
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: that's a good thing? Or would you now knowing because
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: you went through it and now and you've come all
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: the way on to the other side of it, Like
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: do you want that for them? Or do you want them?
• 34:07
  Speaker 3: I don't want the stress and anxiety that I remember feeling,
• 34:12
  Speaker 3: and my son is feeling it right now and I
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: and I it's and it's challenging. And also he's like,
• 34:21
  Speaker 3: it's all worth it because I want to do this
• 34:23
  Speaker 3: show so badly. The show is like bring is bringing
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: me so much joy. I feel so alive. I feel
• 34:29
  Speaker 3: like this is what I'm supposed to be doing, and
• 34:31
  Speaker 3: I know I have to get my work done, so
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: this is just what we have to do. We just
• 34:34
  Speaker 3: have to do it.
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: The apple did not find I know what.
• 34:38
  Speaker 3: I just what I don't want what. I want my
• 34:43
  Speaker 3: children to not get caught up in which I think
• 34:48
  Speaker 3: I spent a long time in my life untangling from
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: is if you're not excellent at everything, you're somehow failing.
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: So you know, for instance, math is challenging from my
• 35:01
  Speaker 3: son right now. And he is so brilliant and so
• 35:05
  Speaker 3: special and so incredible, but just his his math is
• 35:08
  Speaker 3: is harder.
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: It's just harder.
• 35:09
  Speaker 3: It's harder for both my kids. In fact, that's where
• 35:11
  Speaker 3: all of the drama from school lies. It's all math
• 35:15
  Speaker 3: for both of them. And oh and he's been practicing
• 35:19
  Speaker 3: for this this this test that is for one of
• 35:24
  Speaker 3: the schools he's applying to for high school. You're require
• 35:26
  Speaker 3: to do this test. And it's been so discouraging and
• 35:29
  Speaker 3: so frustrating, and everything in me just wants to scream
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter, you know. And I
• 35:37
  Speaker 3: could shout it till I'm blue in the face. And
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: he is still deciding that he's failing, you know. And
• 35:44
  Speaker 3: I do that. I do that to my I did
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: that to myself growing up to My parents never demanded
• 35:49
  Speaker 3: that excellent, that excellence from me. They never did, but
• 35:53
  Speaker 3: I did it to myself. And I can see him
• 35:56
  Speaker 3: do that to himself, and my daughter does it to herself,
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: and we don't. We do not demand that they get
• 36:02
  Speaker 3: all a's or anything like that. We just ask that
• 36:05
  Speaker 3: they do their best. That's the only thing that we ask.
• 36:09
  Speaker 3: But I yeah, I can. I can already feel that
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: perfectionism creeping in. I'm not quite sure how to combat
• 36:16
  Speaker 3: it because I'm still trying to figure it out.
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you said you've been unraveling that.
• 36:21
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's been with me. I know. I
• 36:26
  Speaker 3: know this that you're going to ask me the question
• 36:28
  Speaker 3: about what did I do? What have I done for
• 36:30
  Speaker 3: my That's just me choosing me and this relates to
• 36:35
  Speaker 3: what my answer for that is going to be. But
• 36:37
  Speaker 3: it's very, very very difficult for me to do anything
• 36:40
  Speaker 3: in life that isn't achieving something in some way.
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: Okay, so break it down.
• 36:47
  Speaker 3: No, I love this vulnerability. This is very real.
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: People can relate. I can relate.
• 36:53
  Speaker 3: Oh, it's so hard. Even if I'm enjoying time with
• 36:59
  Speaker 3: my friends, I'm like, this is so good because we
• 37:02
  Speaker 3: are forming community that matters and lasts, you.
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: Know what I mean.
• 37:07
  Speaker 3: There's something productive about being in relationship. You know, I
• 37:14
  Speaker 3: can't like cooking release I hate well, you have to eat,
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: it's not fun.
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: Are you perfect at it? Are you perfectionist?
• 37:23
  Speaker 3: When it comes to like, no, I'm not a perfectionist
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: at that. My husband mostly cooks and I do the
• 37:30
  Speaker 3: cleanup usually, But I don't have to be perfect at everything,
• 37:36
  Speaker 3: although I do demand very high quality for my work
• 37:41
  Speaker 3: and stuff, for sure. But my issue is that I've
• 37:46
  Speaker 3: like people have asked me if I have a hobby.
• 37:47
  Speaker 3: I don't have a hobby. I've never had a hobby
• 37:49
  Speaker 3: in my life. My hobby when I was growing up
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: was acting, and then it became my career, and then
• 37:55
  Speaker 3: I remember for many years having seasons of like deep boredom,
• 37:59
  Speaker 3: like waiting for the phone to ring, of when am
• 38:02
  Speaker 3: I going to get the next audition or get the
• 38:04
  Speaker 3: next job or whatever. Now, with my life very full,
• 38:09
  Speaker 3: with both work and children and everything, I don't really
• 38:13
  Speaker 3: have very much time to breathe most of the time.
• 38:16
  Speaker 3: But even if I did, it's very hard for me
• 38:20
  Speaker 3: to do something that isn't even reading a book. Even
• 38:25
  Speaker 3: reading a book is like, Okay, what am I going
• 38:27
  Speaker 3: to learn? How will I expand if I read this book?
• 38:29
  Speaker 3: How will I grow? An empathy? And so growing an
• 38:32
  Speaker 3: empathy is purposeful, so like there's no just just do
• 38:36
  Speaker 3: it because it's fun.
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: M h Okay, I'm going to need you to come
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: back after the kids leave the nest. Yes, and you're
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: in a different phase.
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: I'm going to tell you about all my hobbies. Oh,
• 38:46
  Speaker 3: I'm going to learn how to basket.
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: We please, Okay.
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: Being a pastor's daughter, I do want to know, though,
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: do you think that shaped you? You said your parents
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: didn't demand that anything from you. They just wanted you
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: to do you and do your best, just like you're
• 39:08
  Speaker 1: parenting your kids. But do you think being a pastor's
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: daughter it defined you or shaped you in other people's
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: eyes or in your own.
• 39:18
  Speaker 3: I think what I'm eternally there's two sides of a coin.
• 39:22
  Speaker 3: I'm eternally grateful for the faith that they gave me
• 39:27
  Speaker 3: I have. I have a true north that doesn't shake it.
• 39:32
  Speaker 3: I mean it shakes at times, but it isn't. There's
• 39:35
  Speaker 3: never a moment when I don't, like know, beyond a
• 39:38
  Speaker 3: shadow of a doubt, that I am beloved by the
• 39:40
  Speaker 3: creator of the universe, and that my life is purposeful,
• 39:43
  Speaker 3: and that i'm you know, I'm here for a reason
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: and everything. When something that's hard happens, it becomes what
• 39:53
  Speaker 3: is the what is the lesson? Here? And where? How
• 39:55
  Speaker 3: do I move forward and where do I find the
• 39:57
  Speaker 3: gold in this like that was given to me one
• 40:01
  Speaker 3: by my parents' faith and the way that they live
• 40:03
  Speaker 3: their lives and the way they parented me. There is
• 40:07
  Speaker 3: also on the other side of it, there is a
• 40:12
  Speaker 3: I think, a perfectionism that I that I put on
• 40:16
  Speaker 3: myself in a way my brother didn't, And I think
• 40:18
  Speaker 3: that might be a female versus male thing maybe, But
• 40:22
  Speaker 3: I I took some of the lessons of my faith
• 40:26
  Speaker 3: and they became I'm I'm only lovable. I am loved,
• 40:33
  Speaker 3: but I'm only lovable because I'm really working my ass
• 40:38
  Speaker 3: off to be acceptable to God. My brother didn't get this. Again,
• 40:44
  Speaker 3: it's not it wasn't just that wasn't what was spoken
• 40:46
  Speaker 3: in the household. It's just the way that I received
• 40:50
  Speaker 3: and metabolized what the what I was taught. And so
• 40:59
  Speaker 3: I think for me, that understanding of being loved because
• 41:06
  Speaker 3: you're loved because you're loved, period and full stop, was
• 41:10
  Speaker 3: something I learned in probably my thirties, and I mostly
• 41:13
  Speaker 3: learned it because of walking through a dark season with
• 41:16
  Speaker 3: my husband where we needed to go to counseling and
• 41:19
  Speaker 3: we had to figure some stuff out, and one of
• 41:21
  Speaker 3: the biggest lessons I learned in that was that I
• 41:25
  Speaker 3: felt kind of like I remember sitting in one of
• 41:28
  Speaker 3: my our therapy sessions and saying, I feel like an
• 41:32
  Speaker 3: invalid wife, and the therapist is like, what do you
• 41:36
  Speaker 3: mean by that? I said, well, I feel like Peter
• 41:40
  Speaker 3: didn't know what he was getting himself into when he
• 41:42
  Speaker 3: married me, and now that he really knows me, like
• 41:44
  Speaker 3: really knows me, really sees me, he's so disappointed, but
• 41:48
  Speaker 3: he's too good of Amana walk away. And my husband
• 41:52
  Speaker 3: was like, I don't understand why she thinks this. I
• 41:54
  Speaker 3: don't believe that. I don't feel this way. I love
• 41:58
  Speaker 3: her so much like I And the therapist was like, Sarah,
• 42:02
  Speaker 3: you got a liar living in you. It was just
• 42:04
  Speaker 3: trying to steal your joy at every single turn, trying
• 42:09
  Speaker 3: to tell you you don't deserve love, trying to tell
• 42:11
  Speaker 3: you that God doesn't love you, trying to tell you
• 42:13
  Speaker 3: that your husband doesn't love you, that nobody out in
• 42:16
  Speaker 3: the world loves you unless you're achieving this, this, this,
• 42:18
  Speaker 3: and this. You got to tell the liar to shut
• 42:20
  Speaker 3: the fuck up.
• 42:21
  Speaker 1: Yes, And that was.
• 42:26
  Speaker 3: One of the biggest, most explosive moments of release in
• 42:32
  Speaker 3: my life being able to name that it wasn't actually
• 42:37
  Speaker 3: me that was creating It was just not a voice
• 42:42
  Speaker 3: in my head, but it was. It was, well, the
• 42:44
  Speaker 3: voice I don't know, the voice of culture. Yes it was.
• 42:47
  Speaker 3: It was a voice that I gave way too much
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: credence to and couldn't imagine a world where that voice
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: wasn't true.
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: That voice can be so strong and so loud, and
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: so many of us are minds. I know, I've had
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: that same struggle, and it's very very hard to sort
• 43:07
  Speaker 1: of take the bull by the horns when it comes
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: to that voice, because if it's inside your head and
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: it's very loud, it's constant, it's very dependable messages. You're like, well,
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: then I should it's true, it must be true. Yeah.
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: It keeps saying the same thing, and that.
• 43:25
  Speaker 3: Voice in some way enables you to have some kind
• 43:29
  Speaker 3: of control because if you're if the voice is saying
• 43:33
  Speaker 3: you'll be loved if you do this, this and this,
• 43:35
  Speaker 3: then you can go, okay, I'll just do that, that
• 43:37
  Speaker 3: and that right, and then I'll be loved as long
• 43:38
  Speaker 3: as I'm doing that, that and that, you know, and
• 43:42
  Speaker 3: when you release that and go, I don't need you
• 43:46
  Speaker 3: to give me control of what I really need to
• 43:48
  Speaker 3: do is just surrender to the reality that I I
• 43:52
  Speaker 3: am just I am a loved being. I am a
• 43:55
  Speaker 3: created being, and I am loved full stop. It's but
• 44:01
  Speaker 3: then you go, but why, why what did I do?
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: When you say, I felt like, well what now?
• 44:07
  Speaker 3: I know?
• 44:08
  Speaker 1: Well what do I do? I what do I think? Exactly?
• 44:12
  Speaker 3: It was for me. It was a few days after that.
• 44:16
  Speaker 3: I remember that session so clearly, and I reached out
• 44:19
  Speaker 3: to my community of like faith sisters and my parents
• 44:23
  Speaker 3: and whatever, and I was like, can you guys just
• 44:24
  Speaker 3: pray for me because I don't know how to shut
• 44:27
  Speaker 3: up a liar in my head, Like I don't know
• 44:30
  Speaker 3: how to stop this joy stealing from joy stealer from
• 44:35
  Speaker 3: stealing my joy. I don't know how to do it,
• 44:37
  Speaker 3: and I need help. And I do believe there was
• 44:40
  Speaker 3: some kind of supernatural intervention because I remember a couple
• 44:45
  Speaker 3: days later, I'm sitting at the table and my husband
• 44:50
  Speaker 3: walks into the room and he just looks at me.
• 44:52
  Speaker 3: It's the morning. He's like, I love you, honey, and
• 44:55
  Speaker 3: I swear to you. I felt like chills from my toe.
• 45:00
  Speaker 3: It was all the way up my It was like
• 45:02
  Speaker 3: heat all the way up my whole body, off the
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: top of my head, chills everywhere. And I just looked
• 45:08
  Speaker 3: at him and I was like, I believe you. I
• 45:13
  Speaker 3: have never fully believed you when you have said that
• 45:16
  Speaker 3: to me, And for the first time in my life,
• 45:20
  Speaker 3: I believe you. I'm somebody's favorite person. I'm your favorite
• 45:24
  Speaker 3: person and that's real and that's true and that just
• 45:27
  Speaker 3: is period. And I just burst into tears and there
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: was something that just broke and released and let me
• 45:37
  Speaker 3: go in that moment, and it, yeah, it transformed. That's
• 45:43
  Speaker 3: so much.
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: That's so good, almost crying because I feel like that,
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: I feel that moment for you, Like how profound that
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: must have been. What a breakthrough just in this internal
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: like prison that you were in, you know. Yeah, And
• 45:59
  Speaker 1: what after that happened? How did you stay the course?
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: Because that joy sucker didn't leave forever.
• 46:06
  Speaker 3: No, and it does crop back up now and again,
• 46:09
  Speaker 3: But I swear to you, from that moment it had,
• 46:16
  Speaker 3: it did not have a choke hold on me anymore.
• 46:19
  Speaker 3: You were able to say I couldn't see what it was.
• 46:21
  Speaker 3: I could say, I don't believe you. You're lying, you're
• 46:25
  Speaker 3: a liar, You're a liar. You're not being honest. I'm sorry,
• 46:30
  Speaker 3: but you're not. My husband is always his wife was like,
• 46:34
  Speaker 3: he's just so wonderful. But I remember early in our
• 46:38
  Speaker 3: relationship I wanted him. My parents would always express their
• 46:42
  Speaker 3: love through verbal affirmation. In many they express their love
• 46:45
  Speaker 3: in lots of different ways, but my parents would always
• 46:47
  Speaker 3: be like, I love you because of this, because of this,
• 46:49
  Speaker 3: because I look, you did this, and we're so proud
• 46:50
  Speaker 3: of you. Because because because right and with my husband,
• 46:54
  Speaker 3: he wouldn't give me the laundry list ever, I mean ever,
• 46:58
  Speaker 3: he just was always just I just love you. I
• 47:00
  Speaker 3: just love being with you, I just love being around you.
• 47:02
  Speaker 3: I just I think you're so awesome. I just love you.
• 47:06
  Speaker 3: Sometimes you're like.
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: But why why, I know? Tell me? Can you just
• 47:09
  Speaker 1: tell me why? What is it that you look about me?
• 47:11
  Speaker 3: Tell me why? And I remember asking him once, why
• 47:14
  Speaker 3: don't you tell me why you love me? And he said,
• 47:18
  Speaker 3: because I don't want you to ever feel that my
• 47:21
  Speaker 3: love is going to ever go away if for some
• 47:24
  Speaker 3: reason you stop being able to do one of those
• 47:26
  Speaker 3: things or one of those things that I say, this
• 47:29
  Speaker 3: is why I love you. And then what happens if
• 47:31
  Speaker 3: I say I love you because I love dancing with you,
• 47:33
  Speaker 3: and then you know, you break a leg or you
• 47:36
  Speaker 3: can't dance anymore, your hip goes out or whatever, like
• 47:39
  Speaker 3: I don't want you to ever have in the back
• 47:41
  Speaker 3: of your head. There was a condition to this, and
• 47:44
  Speaker 3: it was because he's like, I just want you to
• 47:46
  Speaker 3: always know that I love you, so period.
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: What that's that's a really I'm so happy for you
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: because that I can know. I know how tortures that
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: negative liar brain can mind can can control.
• 48:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's I mean, it's still there, but it is not.
• 48:03
  Speaker 3: It does not it does not have the choke hold, right, Yeah,
• 48:07
  Speaker 3: and I feel I used to feel like, oh God
• 48:12
  Speaker 3: loves me, but you know he had his son had
• 48:15
  Speaker 3: to die because I suck so bad. It's like kind
• 48:20
  Speaker 3: of correct. Yeah, you know that doesn't exist. That thought
• 48:23
  Speaker 3: doesn't exist in my head anymore. That used to be
• 48:26
  Speaker 3: the thought that I had both prior to so interesting.
• 48:28
  Speaker 1: Because I was going to ask you like your faith
• 48:30
  Speaker 1: as a younger girl and what you learn from your
• 48:32
  Speaker 1: parents and then becoming your own person, your own adult
• 48:35
  Speaker 1: which you've said didn't have until your thirties, where you
• 48:39
  Speaker 1: actually chose to believe what you chose to believe instead
• 48:43
  Speaker 1: of what they chose for you. Even though it was
• 48:45
  Speaker 1: similar or yes, maybe even the same.
• 48:47
  Speaker 3: It's not it's not exactly the same. I mean, I
• 48:49
  Speaker 3: I feel like the biggest transformation for me. I think
• 48:55
  Speaker 3: I was in a bit of a really protective bubble,
• 48:57
  Speaker 3: and so everything in the world felt pretty black and white,
• 49:01
  Speaker 3: like this is correct, and this is incorrect, and and
• 49:05
  Speaker 3: I because I just and I was surrounded by people
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: of faith all growing up, so I didn't really have
• 49:11
  Speaker 3: exposure to other perspectives. And then I enter into Hollywood
• 49:16
  Speaker 3: and my whole world of angels into color. I don't
• 49:20
  Speaker 3: know why they call it the angels.
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: I really don't. Well, they're circling, for sure, circling.
• 49:27
  Speaker 3: But they're circling. They're working hard, They're working very hard
• 49:31
  Speaker 3: over time. But I do I think that for me
• 49:36
  Speaker 3: engaging with a communities of people from every different background,
• 49:42
  Speaker 3: every different belief system. I definitely walked into Hollywood feeling
• 49:46
  Speaker 3: like I'm here to teach everybody about Jesus. You know,
• 49:50
  Speaker 3: that was that was what I thought I was supposed
• 49:52
  Speaker 3: to do.
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: And they lined up around the corner.
• 49:54
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, they really wanted to hear What was amazing
• 49:59
  Speaker 3: is that, like right off the bat in my first
• 50:03
  Speaker 3: couple of jobs, I was just very clearly sat down,
• 50:07
  Speaker 3: not by anyone, because I usually had some semblance attacked,
• 50:12
  Speaker 3: but I was sat down emotionally by witnessing. I have
• 50:16
  Speaker 3: this one really lovely encounter. I was doing a play
• 50:20
  Speaker 3: and I was having an anxiety attack, and I was
• 50:24
  Speaker 3: feeling really overwhelmed in this woman who had a very
• 50:26
  Speaker 3: different background, had very different like partying habits and things
• 50:30
  Speaker 3: like that that I would have, you know, found totally
• 50:32
  Speaker 3: scandalous at the time. And I'm like, oh, yes, she
• 50:35
  Speaker 3: needs to be saved, you know. She she sat me down.
• 50:40
  Speaker 3: She's like, all right, darling, I'm just going to take
• 50:42
  Speaker 3: you through a little meditation right now, and I want
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: you to close your eyes and I want you to
• 50:46
  Speaker 3: breathe deeply. And she walked me through this beautiful meditation
• 50:49
  Speaker 3: that involved getting in a boat. They're no oars, you
• 50:53
  Speaker 3: put your hands in the boat, you breathe in. You
• 50:56
  Speaker 3: know that the river is going to take you where
• 50:58
  Speaker 3: the river needs to go. And it's like she was
• 51:00
  Speaker 3: speaking truth, God's truth to me in a different language language.
• 51:06
  Speaker 3: And I had this It was a total revelatory moment
• 51:10
  Speaker 3: where I was like, Oh, I'm here to sit down
• 51:14
  Speaker 3: and learn and listen. I'm not here to stand up
• 51:18
  Speaker 3: and preach on a box. This is what life is.
• 51:21
  Speaker 3: This is the expression of my faith is sitting and
• 51:25
  Speaker 3: engaging with a community and learning and seeing God in
• 51:30
  Speaker 3: every person's face. That's what I'm supposed to be. It's beautiful.
• 51:34
  Speaker 1: That's beautiful. I want to ask you. There's a couple
• 51:37
  Speaker 1: of things I want to ask you. You and your
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: husband have adopted or established a no sarcasm rule. Oh yes,
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: in your house, and you choose not to speak unkindly
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: to one another, so it's a no meanness rule. Yeah,
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: but sarcasm as well.
• 51:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's funny because now my son and
• 52:00
  Speaker 3: I are pretty sarcastic with its fun. It's fun. It
• 52:06
  Speaker 3: was a It was kind of one of these little
• 52:09
  Speaker 3: nugget like gift nuggets from my husband's mentor who just
• 52:15
  Speaker 3: said one of the one of the things that can,
• 52:18
  Speaker 3: especially in a long term relationship, that can start to
• 52:22
  Speaker 3: dig with It starts as fun and then it can
• 52:26
  Speaker 3: start to get more cutting because the the kind of
• 52:30
  Speaker 3: humor it is is a little bit cutting to begin with,
• 52:32
  Speaker 3: and then as like resentments build that sarcasm. I keep
• 52:36
  Speaker 3: thinking about the movie, the about the emotions.
• 52:40
  Speaker 1: Oh, inside out, inside out.
• 52:42
  Speaker 3: Too, they show sarcasm. It's just this giant crater with
• 52:48
  Speaker 3: one person on this side and one person on this side,
• 52:50
  Speaker 3: and someone tries to say something and then it turns
• 52:52
  Speaker 3: into something else by the time it reaches the other person.
• 52:56
  Speaker 3: This is such a great image for how sarcasm can
• 52:59
  Speaker 3: kind of get in there and create a giant divide.
• 53:03
  Speaker 3: And so we just we were goofy and silly. That's
• 53:08
  Speaker 3: how we express our humor with each other in the household.
• 53:11
  Speaker 3: But just we don't my husband, I don't use sarcasm
• 53:14
  Speaker 3: with one another. We just we were like, that's a
• 53:16
  Speaker 3: great idea. I think we'll I think we'll go by that.
• 53:25
  Speaker 1: I want to talk about another one of your great choices,
• 53:28
  Speaker 1: and that is doing your back on Hallmark for a
• 53:32
  Speaker 1: very fun, cozy, but twisty, mysterious Mistletoe Murders. I have
• 53:37
  Speaker 1: to talk about this because I want to know what
• 53:39
  Speaker 1: made you choose to play Emily Lane.
• 53:43
  Speaker 3: It's such a fun show.
• 53:44
  Speaker 1: I've heard, yes, I haven't seen it yet.
• 53:46
  Speaker 3: Oh, it's so fun. You're going into season we just
• 53:49
  Speaker 3: we just aired season two. We're waiting to see if
• 53:53
  Speaker 3: we get a pickup for season three. Okay, knocking on all.
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: The does it only play around the holidays like it came.
• 54:00
  Speaker 3: Out on Hallmark Plus last year the first season did,
• 54:03
  Speaker 3: and then they aired season one and season two back
• 54:05
  Speaker 3: to back this year on the main home.
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: Jill so good.
• 54:09
  Speaker 3: Yes, it's a really fun I've never done a murder mystery.
• 54:14
  Speaker 3: I've never played a sleuth before, so that was really cool.
• 54:18
  Speaker 3: The script was really amazing when it came across my desk.
• 54:21
  Speaker 3: Was really really, really fantastically crafted mystery. But the thing
• 54:25
  Speaker 3: that really made me want to do this is that
• 54:28
  Speaker 3: Emily has the secret past life and so she there's
• 54:31
  Speaker 3: this duality to her where she's we don't know if
• 54:34
  Speaker 3: she's hiding from someone or running from something, or we
• 54:38
  Speaker 3: don't know if she was good, we don't know if
• 54:39
  Speaker 3: she was missed it. That's the thing. So you have
• 54:42
  Speaker 3: every two episodes, there's one murder mystery that gets solved,
• 54:45
  Speaker 3: and then there's a really delicious romance with her and it.
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: Was always a handsome detective Okay, yes.
• 54:52
  Speaker 3: And then the greater overarching mystery over the course of
• 54:56
  Speaker 3: both seasons so far has been who is Emily Lane?
• 54:59
  Speaker 3: What her backstory? So we play in these flashbacks and
• 55:03
  Speaker 3: we get to, especially in season two, kind of tease
• 55:06
  Speaker 3: out more of her as a high schooler. And then
• 55:09
  Speaker 3: I got to play I got to do like the
• 55:11
  Speaker 3: twenty five year old version of Emily.
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: That's so fun.
• 55:16
  Speaker 3: So it's like it has some alias vibes and soon
• 55:19
  Speaker 3: Kamaras vibes. It's really Oh what a really fun like
• 55:23
  Speaker 3: fe role like fetal, yeah, strong woman.
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: I love that. Does the audience get to kind of
• 55:29
  Speaker 1: try to figure out who Emily is? Oh?
• 55:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, who Emily is? And also who the killer is
• 55:35
  Speaker 3: for the episode? My kids love the show. They're completely
• 55:38
  Speaker 3: obsessed with it. Yeah, and they'll like the whole way
• 55:40
  Speaker 3: through they'll be like, I think it's him. Oh no,
• 55:42
  Speaker 3: I think it's her. Wow, Actually, hang on, what is
• 55:44
  Speaker 3: she doing here?
• 55:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 55:45
  Speaker 3: It's really fun.
• 55:46
  Speaker 1: I know our listeners love to hear like the inside
• 55:49
  Speaker 1: tips of the biz. When you step into a new
• 55:52
  Speaker 1: role and you have the handsome detective relationship that you
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: have to now create this connection and tension and like
• 56:00
  Speaker 1: the chemistry has to be right.
• 56:01
  Speaker 3: How do you?
• 56:02
  Speaker 1: How do you do that? Just such a great question,
• 56:07
  Speaker 1: because I for a while I've said I can have
• 56:12
  Speaker 1: chemistry with a doorknob. Yeah, if I want to, Yeah,
• 56:15
  Speaker 1: you feel the same way.
• 56:16
  Speaker 3: I feel exactly the same. Good I really do feel
• 56:18
  Speaker 3: exactly the same way. No, I think what I I
• 56:22
  Speaker 3: am always on the hunt for loveliness. That is just
• 56:25
  Speaker 3: kind of who I am in the world. And if
• 56:28
  Speaker 3: I have to create chemistry really quickly with somebody, I
• 56:31
  Speaker 3: kind of have this like, like what is lovely and
• 56:35
  Speaker 3: delightful about you? So even if they're difficult, or if
• 56:39
  Speaker 3: they're not whatever, even if they're things that aren't delightful
• 56:44
  Speaker 3: across the board, I can in that moment put the
• 56:48
  Speaker 3: blinders on and just focus. I remember, I have a
• 56:52
  Speaker 3: very this is a good kind of story about chemistry.
• 56:57
  Speaker 3: My first professional show was playing Juliette and Romeo and
• 56:59
  Speaker 3: Juliette at this theater outside of New York, Macarter Theater,
• 57:03
  Speaker 3: and I remember going into New York to do the callback.
• 57:06
  Speaker 3: So I read like balcony scenes with the two different
• 57:10
  Speaker 3: Romeos that they had, and I remember getting on the
• 57:12
  Speaker 3: subway and I was so kind of high on the
• 57:16
  Speaker 3: romance of the scene of like just the heightens the
• 57:23
  Speaker 3: ultimate romance ultimate romantic scene right that I got on
• 57:27
  Speaker 3: the train and I saw this like old probably seventy
• 57:29
  Speaker 3: five year old bearded guy across the way, and I
• 57:31
  Speaker 3: was like, if I had to, I could fall in
• 57:33
  Speaker 3: love with that guy right now. Like I could do it.
• 57:36
  Speaker 3: I could do it because when you when you allow
• 57:41
  Speaker 3: your imagination to go fully into this is my real
• 57:45
  Speaker 3: set of circumstances, and I truly really am in love
• 57:47
  Speaker 3: with this person. When you let your imagination take you there,
• 57:51
  Speaker 3: you could You could have chemistry with a trash can.
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: You really could you? Just because it's just.
• 57:57
  Speaker 3: It's just it's an imagine, it's an imagination exercise, right,
• 58:00
  Speaker 3: and then some coasters are just delightfully easy to play with,
• 58:04
  Speaker 3: and then others take a little more tiding.
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: Yes, we both dealt with that, I'm sure well. Before
• 58:11
  Speaker 1: I let you go, Sarah Drew, what was your last
• 58:15
  Speaker 1: I Choose me moment?
• 58:16
  Speaker 3: Last year, I burned myself out a little bit with
• 58:21
  Speaker 3: work writing, producing while also starring on a show, and
• 58:27
  Speaker 3: I was so exhausted that by the time November hit,
• 58:31
  Speaker 3: I decided to start reading Romanticy.
• 58:36
  Speaker 1: What I did not see this Kiming.
• 58:40
  Speaker 3: Yes, I got so into Romanticy I basically was supposed
• 58:48
  Speaker 3: to be writing all spring all winter and did not.
• 58:50
  Speaker 3: I read forty six books. I had to give it
• 58:54
  Speaker 3: up for lent, Like I was like, I just need
• 58:58
  Speaker 3: to pause because this has taken over my life. But
• 59:01
  Speaker 3: I will say I was saying earlier, it's very difficult
• 59:06
  Speaker 3: for me to do something that is just just brings
• 59:09
  Speaker 3: me joy and delight, that is not accomplishing anything. And
• 59:14
  Speaker 3: reading fantasy and romanticy is like such a delightful traps
• 59:21
  Speaker 3: into another world. I'm not trying to option anything, turn
• 59:25
  Speaker 3: anything into a movie. I'm not trying to grow and
• 59:28
  Speaker 3: expand I'm just trying to find delight. And I I
• 59:34
  Speaker 3: would say that that was a nice moment of choosing me.
• 59:37
  Speaker 3: I love that perfect Thank you so much for being
• 59:41
  Speaker 3: with us.
• 59:42
  Speaker 1: I love Debbie here