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The Bible is a Complete Unit · The Rhett Palmer Show

0:00
SPEAKER_00: Is the great I am.
0:02
SPEAKER_00: His first friend was Abraham.
0:05
SPEAKER_00: Surely said to Abraham.
0:08
SPEAKER_00: I am that I am.
0:14
SPEAKER_00: Hallelujah.
0:17
SPEAKER_00: Hallelujah.
0:19
SPEAKER_01: Hallelujah.
0:22
SPEAKER_01: Hey, you're invited right now to join us for a cup of friendship.
0:26
SPEAKER_01: And I have my friend Mike Bagby here.
0:28
SPEAKER_01: He is educated in Europe, uh, with history.
0:31
SPEAKER_01: He's the father of four.
0:32
SPEAKER_01: He's a missionary to South America and also owns coffee shops, two of them in the USA, that's uh that uh support financially uh his missionary with his beautiful bride.
0:42
SPEAKER_01: And we are um we're getting into the Bible and the truths that are hidden thereof.
0:46
SPEAKER_01: And we decided to name it Cup of Friendship because coffee is a friendship drink.
0:51
SPEAKER_01: And we now have a specialty coffee called Cup of Friendship.
0:54
SPEAKER_01: If you want to order some, I'm sure you'll figure it out how to get some of this delivered right to you.
0:58
SPEAKER_01: Ooh, it's so good.
0:59
SPEAKER_00: Ooh.
1:02
SPEAKER_01: It is good.
1:03
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
1:04
SPEAKER_01: I stole that from Mr.
1:05
SPEAKER_01: Food, who originated in Albany, New York.
1:08
SPEAKER_02: So what what we're drinking uh today is a combination of beans from the island of Timor, which is uh kind of at the end of the Indonesian chain, close to Papua, New Guinea, that area.
1:20
SPEAKER_02: Cool.
1:20
SPEAKER_02: Uh also from uh the region in Mexico, Chiapas, which is right next to Guatemala.
1:27
SPEAKER_02: And uh also we have some uh coffee from uh Yurgoshef, which is uh in the southern part of Ethiopia.
1:34
SPEAKER_02: It's a nice combination of what we're drinking this morning.
1:36
SPEAKER_01: So as we have our cup of friendship together, folks, and you can order some and then you can join us in the future and have a cup with us, too.
1:42
SPEAKER_01: Um what are we gonna talk about today?
1:45
SPEAKER_01: Well, I don't know what the bell means.
1:51
SPEAKER_02: The gong show, remember?
1:54
SPEAKER_02: If I get too loquacious, boing.
1:58
SPEAKER_02: So uh Red, uh we've been uh in our last uh weeks of doing this, we're trying to get back to getting wisdom for our life, and where do we go for wisdom?
2:10
SPEAKER_02: The most significant and secure source is the Bible, the Word of God.
2:15
SPEAKER_02: The most published book in history.
2:17
SPEAKER_01: Also the most stolen book.
2:19
SPEAKER_01: Did you know that?
2:20
SPEAKER_01: The most stolen book?
2:21
SPEAKER_01: More Bibles are stolen than any other book.
2:24
SPEAKER_01: Is that crazy?
2:25
SPEAKER_01: Thou shalt not steal.
2:27
SPEAKER_01: Oh well.
2:28
SPEAKER_02: Well, at least maybe they're reading it and they might read those verses in Exodus 20, or suddenly I'm convicted.
2:35
SPEAKER_02: Uh 2.6 billion Bibles have been printed.
2:38
SPEAKER_02: 2.6 billion.
2:40
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
2:40
SPEAKER_02: And I uh did a calculation one day.
2:44
SPEAKER_02: You stack those Bibles up one on top of another end to end.
2:47
SPEAKER_02: How high would that be?
2:49
SPEAKER_02: Wow, how high?
2:50
SPEAKER_02: It's one-third the way to the moon.
2:52
SPEAKER_02: Oh, really?
2:53
SPEAKER_02: Really?
2:54
SPEAKER_02: It's that far.
2:55
SPEAKER_01: Uh you want to hear an amazing Bible story?
2:56
SPEAKER_01: I'll make it real short.
2:57
SPEAKER_01: There's a friend of mine in town here.
2:59
SPEAKER_01: He helped start the annual uh uh prayer uh breakfast with uh John Bona.
3:04
SPEAKER_01: I forget the fellow's name, but he was a realtor.
3:06
SPEAKER_01: Oh, limited stuff.
3:09
SPEAKER_01: Anyway, he gives he gives a Bible, his Bible with his name's imprinted on it, to a group of missionaries.
3:17
SPEAKER_01: And I guess they go, I don't know, but South America, where they end up.
3:19
SPEAKER_01: Anyway, so it's years and years later, he ends up becoming a one-time missionary, short-term, one, two weeks, and he gets on uh the Zambezi or whoever he is, he's going down in a canoe to wherever, and they go to this little village and they're gonna have a Bible study.
3:33
SPEAKER_01: So they pass out Bibles.
3:35
SPEAKER_01: Guess what Bible they passed to him?
3:37
SPEAKER_01: The one he gave.
3:38
SPEAKER_01: Is that amazing?
3:39
SPEAKER_01: Isn't that good?
3:40
SPEAKER_01: Um in other words, folks, there's nothing.
3:43
SPEAKER_01: It says this the sp he says, not a sparrow falls from the heavens without the Father's permission, for the very hairs on your head are counted.
3:50
SPEAKER_01: That's how much you're loved.
3:51
SPEAKER_01: Now we're gonna talk about it.
3:52
SPEAKER_02: What a coincidence that was.
3:54
SPEAKER_02: It was just random coincidence, of course, that he would end up in that place with that particular Bible that years before he sent down.
4:00
SPEAKER_02: What a coincidence.
4:02
SPEAKER_01: What's the title of today's show?
4:03
SPEAKER_02: Well, uh today, uh since we're talking about the Bible, what I notice among my friends, and if I probably took your Bible and looked at it, um, I would notice that probably the last one-third of your Bible, the pages are more worn than maybe the first two-thirds.
4:20
SPEAKER_01: A little dog-eared, yeah, from you.
4:22
SPEAKER_02: Uh that um maybe there's some uh parts of that Old Testament that maybe the pages are still kind of stuck together because you never uh open them.
4:32
SPEAKER_01: Well when I do, they kind of scare me.
4:36
SPEAKER_02: So I I think if I think a lot of uh Christians now uh focus their reading and study on the New Testament.
4:44
SPEAKER_02: And um it's because in America we have this idea that old is simply out of uh date and old is new is better than old.
4:54
SPEAKER_02: I mean, if you walk down the uh aisles in the supermarkets, laundry detergents, and many other products on the label, new and improved.
5:05
SPEAKER_02: Because that's what we Americans want.
5:07
SPEAKER_02: We want the new and improved version.
5:09
SPEAKER_02: So when it comes to reading the Bible, we want the New Testament, not the Old Testament, all right?
5:17
SPEAKER_02: Um we think it's actually is a new and improved version, and the Old Testament is just an archaic document that no longer is applicable to our society.
5:27
SPEAKER_02: But the reality is quite the opposite.
5:30
SPEAKER_02: See, the Bible, I think, is one continuous revelation of God to mankind.
5:36
SPEAKER_02: And I think there's a lot of times when we study the New Testament that it's hard to really appreciate what God is doing in the pages of the Christian scriptures, as I call the New Testament, uh, if we don't really understand what happened in the Hebrew Scriptures, which is a better term, I think, for the Old Testament.
5:58
SPEAKER_02: Not because the writers of the Christian scriptures, they assume that we understand what happened in the pages of the Old Testament.
6:06
SPEAKER_02: I'll give you an example.
6:08
SPEAKER_02: You read in Acts chapter two when Luke says, And when the day of Pentecost had fully come, they were all in one accord and in one place.
6:17
SPEAKER_02: Acts chapter two.
6:18
SPEAKER_02: And so the story now tells us of a mighty rushing wind of tongues of fire on their heads.
6:26
SPEAKER_02: They began to speak in unknown and known dialects, and people around them were uh accused of them of being drunk, you know.
6:35
SPEAKER_02: But of course, Peter says it's uh early in the day, and we Galilean fishermen, you know, we're not drunk because after we fish all night and we take our fish to the market, you know, we don't start drinking until noontime.
6:48
SPEAKER_01: He did not say that.
6:50
SPEAKER_01: Well, if you're a fisherman, hey Poppy, you're adding a little bit to the scriptures.
6:54
SPEAKER_02: If you're a fisherman, Rhett, and you're fishing all night, and you get ashore at dawn and you're sorting the fish and you get to the market.
7:02
SPEAKER_02: You've been in the farmer's market, maybe at Humlston Park, okay?
7:05
SPEAKER_02: It's pretty busy, and around noontime, it's over.
7:08
SPEAKER_02: Now's the time to go back, take a shower, chill out, get some rest, because you're going to go fishing uh at about 10 o'clock that night, right?
7:15
SPEAKER_01: So that's that afternoon nap in.
7:19
SPEAKER_02: So Peter says this is what the prophet Joel prophesied that in the latter days I'll fill my spirit and people will, and he quotes that.
7:29
SPEAKER_01: And that God will write the truth on people's hearts.
7:33
SPEAKER_02: Right.
7:33
SPEAKER_02: And the people hear the message and their hearts are broken, and they ask, What should we do?
7:37
SPEAKER_02: And Peter says, Repent and be baptized for the ri remission of your sins.
7:42
SPEAKER_02: And we know Luke records three thousand people got saved that day, were added to the church.
7:48
SPEAKER_02: And by saved you meaning He got added to the church, okay?
7:53
SPEAKER_02: So he's telling us a wonderful story, but he's making the assumption of what happened in Jerusalem was somehow connected to the first Pentecost.
8:02
SPEAKER_02: Because he's mentioning when the day of Pentecost had fully come.
8:06
SPEAKER_02: But what was Pentecost?
8:08
SPEAKER_02: Remember?
8:09
SPEAKER_01: First fruits.
8:10
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
8:15
SPEAKER_01: What was that for?
8:16
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
8:17
SPEAKER_02: Remember that the Passover was initiated in Egypt when the angel of death passed over all the homes and killed the firstborn.
8:27
SPEAKER_02: And unless you took a lamb or a goat and uh put the blood over your door, the angel of death would not pass over.
8:35
SPEAKER_02: This is what Passover is all about.
8:36
SPEAKER_02: Well, the scripture says that fifty days later, after they cross the Red Sea, they come to Mount Sinai.
8:44
SPEAKER_02: Fifty days later, this is this is the first Pentecost.
8:48
SPEAKER_02: Fifty days later.
8:50
SPEAKER_02: And it's Moses goes up on the mountain to meet with God.
8:55
SPEAKER_02: There's strange weather.
8:57
SPEAKER_01: Does it ever say why he took this uh this trek up the mountain, this boy?
9:00
SPEAKER_02: Because God told him to come up, because he's gonna give him the law.
9:03
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
9:05
SPEAKER_01: Had he already met God before this?
9:07
SPEAKER_01: At the burning bush.
9:09
SPEAKER_01: That had already taken place.
9:10
SPEAKER_02: This is uh that's that's Exodus chapter two.
9:15
SPEAKER_01: I want you to come back here, and I got some news for you.
9:18
SPEAKER_02: Well, he actually says when Moses saying, Well, who shall I say sent me?
9:23
SPEAKER_02: I tell him I am who I am send you.
9:25
SPEAKER_02: And then and uh and then he said, How will I know that you're leading me while I'm doing this?
9:33
SPEAKER_02: And God says, When you get back to this place and worship me, you will know that it was me leading you.
9:42
SPEAKER_02: Okay?
9:43
SPEAKER_02: When you get back to worship me.
9:46
SPEAKER_02: So they're back at the mountain worshiping him.
9:49
SPEAKER_02: He looks back and he sees, yes, it was God leading him.
9:53
SPEAKER_01: So this is a great heard that before.
9:55
SPEAKER_01: What's the insight in that?
9:56
SPEAKER_01: Well, they worship.
9:57
SPEAKER_02: So when we worship, no, the insight, I believe, is this is always going to be a walk of faith that you're never going to be sure and precisely exactly knowing that what God is doing until you look back on faith.
10:14
SPEAKER_02: Moses could look back and say, yes, it was definitely God leading them.
10:17
SPEAKER_01: Why was why uh Dr.
10:18
SPEAKER_01: Norman Vincent Peel, before he passed, the power positive thinking author, in '96, he said, I believe the whole of it.
10:24
SPEAKER_01: The whole purpose of us being here is to learn faith.
10:28
SPEAKER_01: Why does it say, without faith, it's impossible to believe God?
10:31
SPEAKER_02: I think from the very beginning we see in the second book of the Bible, we see a man called to do something, a mission that God has given him.
10:39
SPEAKER_02: And he says, You must do this in faith that I am leading you.
10:44
SPEAKER_02: Because the question Moses said, how will I know it's you that's leading me back to Egypt to do all these things?
10:51
SPEAKER_02: And God says, You'll only know when you get back to this mountain and worship me.
10:55
SPEAKER_02: You'll look back and see it was me leading you.
10:58
SPEAKER_02: It has to be a walk of faith.
10:59
SPEAKER_01: Just like with Abraham, it is written that Abraham's faith was accounted to him as righteousness.
11:04
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
11:04
SPEAKER_01: When Mary believed the angel, it was accounted to her as righteousness.
11:08
SPEAKER_02: Right.
11:08
SPEAKER_02: So Moses is up on the mountain.
11:11
SPEAKER_02: It's the first, it's the first Pentecost, fifty days after the Passover.
11:15
SPEAKER_02: He's getting the law, and he comes down off the mountain, and he notices while he's gone, the people are wondering where Moses is, because he's up on the mountain 40 days.
11:27
SPEAKER_02: They think maybe he's died.
11:29
SPEAKER_02: They say, Aaron, would you just make us an image?
11:33
SPEAKER_01: And Moses, where is he?
11:34
SPEAKER_02: He's gone.
11:35
SPEAKER_02: Moses.
11:35
SPEAKER_01: Moses.
11:37
SPEAKER_02: And so Aaron decides to uh they say, make us an image of the God that we're serving.
11:43
SPEAKER_02: And so Moses collects gold and he melts it.
11:46
SPEAKER_02: Moses?
11:46
SPEAKER_02: No.
11:47
SPEAKER_02: Excuse me, Aaron.
11:48
SPEAKER_02: Aaron, uh, thank you.
11:50
SPEAKER_01: Aaron Important distinction here.
11:53
SPEAKER_01: Aaron, why a calf?
11:55
SPEAKER_02: Well, he makes a golden calf.
11:57
SPEAKER_02: Now, the good question, why a calf?
11:59
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
12:00
SPEAKER_02: Well, the remember, these are people who've lived in Egypt for their gen generations.
12:05
SPEAKER_02: They're Egyptians in their thinking.
12:08
SPEAKER_02: And this is why God is taking them out to bring him into the land.
12:12
SPEAKER_02: Now, in Egypt Egyptian culture, there was a goddess named Hatur, H-A-T-O-R.
12:20
SPEAKER_02: Hattur was always represented by an image of a calf.
12:25
SPEAKER_02: Hatur was the god of slaves and the god of travelers.
12:30
SPEAKER_01: Oh, so here they are traveling, former slaves.
12:32
SPEAKER_02: Former slaves, so they make Hatur.
12:35
SPEAKER_02: Now, when you worship Hattur, you do it in sometimes sexual ways.
12:40
SPEAKER_02: Oh.
12:41
SPEAKER_02: So Moses comes down the mountain and he he sees this uh party going on, and there's some obviously something going on there.
12:48
SPEAKER_02: Moses gets angry.
12:50
SPEAKER_02: He tells the uh Levites, put on your sword and kill all of those people that are engaging in this worship.
12:57
SPEAKER_02: And the text says three thousand people died.
13:02
SPEAKER_01: Well, they I didn't know I don't remember this.
13:03
SPEAKER_01: Wow, they killed.
13:04
SPEAKER_01: So who are these who are these who would he be?
13:07
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
13:07
SPEAKER_02: So the first Pentecost, fire, smoke, all sorts of natural things.
13:13
SPEAKER_02: Moses goes up on the mountain, the law comes down, people recognize their sin, three thousand people die.
13:20
SPEAKER_02: The second Pentecost, you got fire, you got wind, grace comes down, the people recognize their need for a savior, three thousand people live.
13:33
SPEAKER_02: Luke thinks you know the first Pentecost.
13:36
SPEAKER_02: So the second Pentecost becomes significant with these uh similar elements.
13:42
SPEAKER_01: Just like Peter with the fire later on and that whole story.
13:47
SPEAKER_01: Jesus makes a fire for him after he denied another another fire.
13:50
SPEAKER_02: Okay, so so the writer of Acts assumes that you know about the first Pentecost, so you can really get the message of the second Pentecost.
13:59
SPEAKER_01: And as extreme Jewish believers, they would all know this.
14:02
SPEAKER_01: They would be they've studied under the rabbis.
14:06
SPEAKER_02: Another example of the connection between the Hebrew scriptures and the Christian scriptures, which is really important if you really want to understand what's going on in the Christian scriptures, is uh Jesus' conversation with Nicodemus.
14:20
SPEAKER_02: It's in chapter three of the Nicodemus was a Pharisee.
14:24
SPEAKER_02: A man named Nicodemus, Jewish religious leader, was a Pharisee, comes to speak to Jesus after dark.
14:29
SPEAKER_02: Rabbi, we know that God has sent you.
14:32
SPEAKER_01: Don't tell anybody I'm here.
14:34
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
14:34
SPEAKER_01: What's going on here with you healing people and stuff?
14:36
SPEAKER_02: Okay, so Nicodemus recognizes that Jesus is doing some miraculous signs.
14:42
SPEAKER_02: We know God is with you.
14:44
SPEAKER_02: Jesus gets to the point.
14:45
SPEAKER_02: He says, I tell you the truth, unless you're born again, you're not going to see the kingdom of heaven.
14:50
SPEAKER_02: And Nicodemus says, What do you mean, born again?
14:52
SPEAKER_02: How can an old man go back into his mother's womb and be born again?
14:55
SPEAKER_02: Now, remember, this is the teacher of Israel.
14:58
SPEAKER_02: He's one of the most religious guys.
15:01
SPEAKER_02: Okay, the head, probably head Pharisee.
15:04
SPEAKER_02: Jesus says, No one can be born of the kingdom of God without being born of water and spirit.
15:09
SPEAKER_02: Okay?
15:10
SPEAKER_02: Don't be surprised that I say you must be born again.
15:13
SPEAKER_02: The wind blows where it wants.
15:15
SPEAKER_02: You can hear the wind, but can't tell where it comes from or where it's going.
15:18
SPEAKER_02: You can't explain how people are born of the spirit.
15:22
SPEAKER_02: How can these things be possible, Nicodemus asks?
15:26
SPEAKER_02: So here's this learned teacher of the Jews coming to speak to Jesus tonight.
15:30
SPEAKER_02: Jesus tells him to be born again.
15:33
SPEAKER_02: And he's very confused, and Jesus says, No, I'm talking about spiritual things, and I'm talking about a spiritual birth.
15:41
SPEAKER_02: So he replies, You're a respected Jewish teacher, and yet you don't understand these things?
15:46
SPEAKER_02: I assure you, we tell you what we know and have seen, but you don't believe our testimony.
15:52
SPEAKER_02: But if you don't believe me when I tell you about earthly things, how can you possibly believe if I tell you about heavenly things?
15:59
SPEAKER_02: And then the next line out of Jesus' mouth No one has ever gone to heaven and returned, but the Son of Man has come down from heaven.
16:10
SPEAKER_02: And as Moses lifted up the bronze snake on a pole in the wilderness, and the Son of Man must be lifted up, so everyone who believes in him will have eternal life.
16:20
SPEAKER_01: Now we leave a little part of the story out here.
16:22
SPEAKER_01: Why did Moses put the Wait?
16:24
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
16:24
SPEAKER_02: I'm giving you the context, verse 13, 14, 15.
16:29
SPEAKER_02: For this is how God loved the world, he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes him will not perish but have eternal life.
16:35
SPEAKER_02: Okay?
16:36
SPEAKER_02: We all know that verse.
16:37
SPEAKER_02: But the preceding verses are references to bring this learned teacher to a place of understanding.
16:46
SPEAKER_02: He gives him two references from the Hebrew scripture.
16:50
SPEAKER_02: The first one is Proverbs chapter 30, verse 4, which reads, But who but God goes up to heaven and comes back down?
16:59
SPEAKER_02: Who holds the wind in his fist, who wraps up the oceans in his cloak, who has created the whole wide world.
17:06
SPEAKER_02: What is his name and his son's name?
17:09
SPEAKER_02: This is Proverbs chapter 30, verse 4.
17:13
SPEAKER_02: Jesus says, No one has ever gone to heaven and returned, but the Son of Man has come down from heaven.
17:19
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
17:20
SPEAKER_02: He's giving a marker for Nicodemus who knows these things.
17:24
SPEAKER_02: All of a sudden, Nicodemus goes, Wait a minute.
17:27
SPEAKER_02: This is Proverbs chapter 30.
17:29
SPEAKER_02: Jesus is referencing someone coming down from heaven, and what's his name, and what's his son's name?
17:37
SPEAKER_02: And then the next thing Jesus says in verse 14, and as Moses lifted up the bronze snake on a pole in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up.
17:46
SPEAKER_02: Okay?
17:47
SPEAKER_02: What could possibly he be referring to there?
17:52
SPEAKER_02: Just as Moses lifted up the bronze serpent.
17:55
SPEAKER_02: Okay?
17:56
SPEAKER_02: Now, he's referring to one of the most bizarre scenes in the Bible that's recorded in Numbers chapter 21.
18:03
SPEAKER_02: This is a time when the people were grumbling against Moses.
18:07
SPEAKER_02: Moses, why have you brought us out here in the desert to die?
18:10
SPEAKER_02: All we're eating is this manna, and we're tired of manna burgers, we're tired of manna souffles, we're tired of banana banana bread, we're tired of all of this.
18:20
SPEAKER_02: Bamana bread, okay?
18:22
SPEAKER_01: To this day we don't know what it was, right?
18:23
SPEAKER_02: Some claim it was a bird or the word uh manna is literally a Hebrew word.
18:28
SPEAKER_02: What is this?
18:30
SPEAKER_02: Okay?
18:31
SPEAKER_02: It's the question.
18:32
SPEAKER_01: But they they prayed and God sent.
18:35
SPEAKER_02: Well, God is sending them this, but they're they they're getting tired of it, so they're grumbling against Moses.
18:42
SPEAKER_01: We want our leeks.
18:43
SPEAKER_01: We want to go back to Egypt.
18:44
SPEAKER_01: We don't mind to be imprisoned if we can have our delicious leeks and uh vegetables.
18:49
SPEAKER_02: Right.
18:49
SPEAKER_02: They want to go back to Egypt.
18:50
SPEAKER_02: Why have you brought us out here to die?
18:52
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
18:53
SPEAKER_02: So this grumbling against Moses, God causes snakes to come into the camp.
18:59
SPEAKER_02: And the snakes now are biting the people and injecting poison in them, and they're dying.
19:05
SPEAKER_01: The ee ores are dying.
19:06
SPEAKER_02: Oh well.
19:07
SPEAKER_02: And so they come to Moses and they say, Look, we're sorry we said these nasty things about you.
19:12
SPEAKER_02: Please go and ask God uh what uh we can do.
19:16
SPEAKER_01: Uh pretty serious stuff.
19:18
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
19:18
SPEAKER_02: So the Lord goes to uh God and said, Can you do something?
19:25
SPEAKER_02: So the Lord told told Moses, make a replica of a poison snake and attach it to a pole, and all who are bitten will live if they simply look at it.
19:34
SPEAKER_01: Just look at it.
19:35
SPEAKER_02: So Moses made a snake out of bronze, attached it to a pole, and then anyone who was bitten by a snake could look at the bronze snake and be healed.
19:44
SPEAKER_02: This is Numbers chapter uh twenty-one, verse nine.
19:49
SPEAKER_01: Faith.
19:51
SPEAKER_02: Right.
19:52
SPEAKER_02: So Moses makes the snake, those who have faith that God can heal them look at the pole with the snake on it, and then God, because of their faith, takes out the snake poison in their bodies, and they return to health.
20:09
SPEAKER_02: Now, of course, the snake on the pole, we see that in our culture.
20:12
SPEAKER_02: Where do we see that?
20:13
SPEAKER_01: In the MDs.
20:14
SPEAKER_01: They're a snake.
20:15
SPEAKER_02: The uh caduces.
20:16
SPEAKER_02: It's uh on ambulances, it's a symbol of the medical profession, right?
20:20
SPEAKER_01: The vow of uh healing, whatever it is that's right.
20:24
SPEAKER_02: You see how Nicodemus is confused.
20:27
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
20:27
SPEAKER_02: So so Jesus gives him a couple reference points.
20:31
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
20:32
SPEAKER_02: Someone coming down from heaven, what's his name, what's his son name, Proverbs 30, and then this Numbers chapter 21, um, this bronze snake in the desert.
20:42
SPEAKER_02: And basically what he's saying is just as Moses lifted up the serpent in the desert, Nicodemus, I, the Son of Man, will be lifted up so that anyone who looks upon me with faith will have that poison called sin removed from their body, and they will have eternal life.
21:01
SPEAKER_01: At this point, Nicodemus, the learned rabbi, is kind of gonna go, okay, this sounds a little strange.
21:06
SPEAKER_02: But remember, Nicodemus was the one who came and claimed Jesus' body.
21:11
SPEAKER_01: Later on, yes.
21:12
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
21:13
SPEAKER_02: So here's the point is how can we read this passage from the book of John and appreciate what Jesus is doing on the cross unless we understand this picture that God gave to his people a thousand years before.
21:27
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
21:28
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
21:29
SPEAKER_01: So just like Abraham, sacrifice of Isaac, w the God stopped him, but was willing to do it by faith, that was a foreshadowing.
21:37
SPEAKER_01: Right.
21:37
SPEAKER_01: He was willing to give his son, and God stops him and says, No, no, here's a ram, you don't have to do it.
21:42
SPEAKER_01: But four thousand years later on that mountain, God did sacrifice his son.
21:46
SPEAKER_02: Right.
21:47
SPEAKER_02: So so the point I'm I'm trying, I think, to m make here is how can you appreciate what's going on in the Christian scriptures unless you know what happened in the Hebrew scriptures, right?
21:58
SPEAKER_02: And the and the uh it's all kind It's all connected.
22:02
SPEAKER_02: It's imperative that we understand the Hebrew scripture so that we have a full appreciation of what's actually being communicated.
22:11
SPEAKER_02: If we don't, we're going to lose the flavor.
22:14
SPEAKER_02: We're going to not have a great appreciation for what God wants us to have.
22:18
SPEAKER_02: And in the worst case, we might get off on some weird doctrine, which has happened many times to those who don't really understand the historical and cultural context of a passage of Scripture.
22:30
SPEAKER_02: Now, Jesus in his famous Sermon on the Mount tells his disciples there to be salt of the earth.
22:38
SPEAKER_02: Right?
22:39
SPEAKER_02: Yep.
22:39
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
22:41
SPEAKER_02: And when Randy Smith in 1997 took us uh on our study tour.
22:48
SPEAKER_01: What year?
22:48
SPEAKER_02: This was uh 97.
22:50
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
22:52
SPEAKER_02: Uh Randy uh asked us a question, and our group was three guys from the Coca River, Mosquito Indians, Truman, Auguston, and Ofre, and Craig and Kathy Ingler, and Laura and I, four of us from Hawaii.
23:05
SPEAKER_02: He said, What did Jesus' disciples think when he said you're to be the salt of the earth?
23:11
SPEAKER_02: He looked at us Hawaiian Americans.
23:14
SPEAKER_02: He said, You have salt on your table, and so you use it to flavor your food.
23:20
SPEAKER_02: So maybe you think that Jesus is uh telling you to be the flavor of your culture.
23:25
SPEAKER_02: We said, Yeah, that's pretty much it.
23:28
SPEAKER_02: Then he looked at my three mosquito friends.
23:30
SPEAKER_02: He said, Where you live, you don't have electricity or refrigeration.
23:33
SPEAKER_02: You put salt on your fish and on your meat to preserve it.
23:37
SPEAKER_02: Maybe you're thinking Jesus is telling you to be the preservative of your cultural values.
23:43
SPEAKER_02: And they nodded their head.
23:44
SPEAKER_02: And I stood there and watched that and went, wow, two different cultures, two different understandings of what salt means when Jesus says, be salt of the earth.
23:59
SPEAKER_01: But if the salt loses its saltiness, what good is it except to be underfoot, thrown out the door?
24:04
SPEAKER_02: Right, right.
24:05
SPEAKER_02: Um in that area of uh Israel, salt is c is collected down at the Dead Sea.
24:15
SPEAKER_02: You can walk along the Dead Sea and you can pick up clumps of salt that are kind of mixed up with dirt.
24:21
SPEAKER_02: And many times my kids and I, we've been there, and I've got a great picture of Mick and Luke piling up clumps of salt.
24:26
SPEAKER_01: They kind of floated in the Dead Sea.
24:28
SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
24:29
SPEAKER_02: But it's it's a high mineral content.
24:31
SPEAKER_02: So we would take those clumps of salt and we'd take them back to our home and we would have them on a bowl in our table.
24:39
SPEAKER_00: Uh-huh.
24:40
SPEAKER_02: And we would kind of crumple them up with our fingers, like we do in Central America, because it's so humid there, we don't have salt in shakers.
24:48
SPEAKER_02: We have it in a bowl, and we just take portions of salt and just sprinkle it on our food with our fingers.
24:53
SPEAKER_02: And we do that in Hebrew culture with a clump of salt that's sort of mixed up with dirt.
24:59
SPEAKER_02: And at a certain point, there's more dirt in the bowl than there is salt.
25:03
SPEAKER_02: And so at that point, you take the bowl of salt and you walk to the door and you throw it out and you put a fresh clump on.
25:10
SPEAKER_01: So the salt at the bottom would be mixed up with too much dirt.
25:12
SPEAKER_01: You don't want to put that in your food.
25:14
SPEAKER_02: So now it's outside the door, and as Jesus says, it's fit only to be walked upon.
25:20
SPEAKER_02: Archaeologists can identify the streets of an ancient community by the salinity content of the dirt.
25:27
SPEAKER_02: This is a common practice.
25:28
SPEAKER_02: So you just take the salt, throw it out the door, put a new clump on.
25:32
SPEAKER_02: Okay?
25:32
SPEAKER_02: So that's what Jesus was saying.
25:35
SPEAKER_02: But look at the references to salt in the Hebrew scriptures.
25:39
SPEAKER_02: First of all, God makes a covenant with the Levites, and he says, all the offerings of the gifts, the sons of Israel, from the sons of Israel are going to give you will be a perpetual allotment.
25:52
SPEAKER_02: It's an everlasting covenant of salt before the Lord to you and your descendants.
25:57
SPEAKER_02: A covenant of salt.
26:00
SPEAKER_02: It lasts forever.
26:02
SPEAKER_02: Salt doesn't change.
26:03
SPEAKER_02: You know, you can try to dissolve salt in water and you evaporate it, it returns to the same crystalline structure.
26:09
SPEAKER_02: You can try to burn it, but it doesn't burn.
26:11
SPEAKER_02: Salt does not change.
26:15
SPEAKER_02: When God makes a salt covenant with the Levites, he says it lasts forever.
26:20
SPEAKER_02: It doesn't change.
26:21
SPEAKER_01: So what do you mean the salt covenant?
26:23
SPEAKER_02: That's what he calls it.
26:24
SPEAKER_02: He's referring to something that doesn't change.
26:27
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
26:28
SPEAKER_02: Okay?
26:29
SPEAKER_02: He makes a salt covenant with David.
26:31
SPEAKER_02: Your your descendants will be on the throne of Israel forever.
26:35
SPEAKER_02: Leviticus chapter 2, he says, Take salt and sprinkle it on the offerings you bring me as a sign of our relationship.
26:43
SPEAKER_02: It doesn't change.
26:45
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
26:45
SPEAKER_01: And God is not a man that he should lie.
26:48
SPEAKER_02: So Jesus helps us understanding the significance of salt that we see in the Hebrew scriptures.
26:56
SPEAKER_02: He says this in Mark 9: Salt is good for seasoning, but if it loses its flavor, how do you make it salty again?
27:02
SPEAKER_02: You must have the qualities of salt among yourself and live in peace with each other.
27:08
SPEAKER_02: See, in biblical culture, salt means relationships that don't change.
27:14
SPEAKER_02: These are loyal relationships.
27:16
SPEAKER_02: These are unoffendable relationships.
27:19
SPEAKER_02: These are faithful friendships.
27:22
SPEAKER_02: God is Jesus is calling us to be known as people that are loyal, faithful, unoffendable friends.
27:29
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
27:30
SPEAKER_02: Now we would not get that from the Christian scriptures.
27:35
SPEAKER_02: We wouldn't get that from the Christian scriptures unless we understood these things from the Hebrew scriptures.
27:41
SPEAKER_02: And even uh Paul writes uh to his friends in Colossae, let your speech always be with grace, as though seasoned with salt, so you will know how to respond to each person.
27:52
SPEAKER_02: You see the connection of what salt means to biblical people?
27:56
SPEAKER_01: Expound a little bit on that.
27:58
SPEAKER_01: Because you and I were both healed within days of having had a conversion to Jesus when we were younger.
28:04
SPEAKER_01: I'm out in my backyard living in the ghetto of Troy, New York, as a struggle of this songwriter, and I went, Oh my word, I'm not swearing.
28:11
SPEAKER_02: Well, see, the the the But I went back to it later on, but not fully, but you know, I think the point here is Jesus is commanding us to be the salt of the earth, the light of the world in Matthew chapter 5.
28:24
SPEAKER_02: What does that mean?
28:25
SPEAKER_02: When Randy Smith asked us the questions, people from a Central American indigenous culture said it must be preservative.
28:33
SPEAKER_02: We must mean that we're the preservatives.
28:36
SPEAKER_02: To our American culture, we flavor our food with salt, so it must mean we're supposed to be the flavor of our culture.
28:43
SPEAKER_02: But to biblical people, to them it meant be loyal, faithful, unoffendable friends that don't uh relationship that lasts forever, because God makes covenants with salt that last forever.
28:56
SPEAKER_02: Okay?
28:57
SPEAKER_02: So this is the connection between the Hebrew scriptures, the Old Testament, and the New Testament, the Christian scriptures.
29:04
SPEAKER_02: And so Jesus is telling us how we're to behave, but he's referencing the Hebrew scriptures.
29:11
SPEAKER_02: So my point here is the Old and New Testament are connected.
29:14
SPEAKER_02: You can't really have one without the other.
29:17
SPEAKER_01: Someday I'd like to go in depth and have a show that's focused in on behaviors.
29:22
SPEAKER_01: You know, like Paul saying we should esteem others greater than self, giving dignity, honor to others.
29:28
SPEAKER_02: So um what about then even the name, the Old and New Testament?
29:34
SPEAKER_02: Well, I did a research on this a few years ago, and I found that the first reference to the Hebrew Scriptures as the quote Old Testament comes from an unnamed Egyptian writer in a second century document.
29:48
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
29:48
SPEAKER_02: Now remember, the church in Alexandria was very much influenced by Greek culture.
29:55
SPEAKER_02: Okay, so uh we uh a very strong apostolic church was founded in Alexandria.
30:02
SPEAKER_02: Remember, it was Alexandria, Antioch, Constantinople, uh, Rome.
30:07
SPEAKER_02: Um these were uh some of the places where there were bishops and patriarchs that were uh and the uh the church in Alexandria was uh a Greek church.
30:19
SPEAKER_02: It was uh heavily influenced.
30:21
SPEAKER_02: This this was the first place where Christians started allegorizing the Hebrew scriptures.
30:28
SPEAKER_02: They're just allegories, they're not really stories that happen, these are word picture stories to tell us, and this is kind of the trend that started uh in Alexandria.
30:38
SPEAKER_02: And so the first reference to the Hebrew scriptures as old comes from an Alexandrian writer in the second century.
30:47
SPEAKER_02: So this was kind of a trend.
30:49
SPEAKER_02: You see, uh Randy Smith pointed out to us many times.
30:54
SPEAKER_02: He said, The name Old Testament is a misnomer.
30:58
SPEAKER_02: This is why I call them the Hebrew Scriptures, because when you say old, you suggest something is out of date.
31:05
SPEAKER_02: Uh actually the term comes from Hebrews chapter 8, verse 13, where the writer Hebrew says, When God speaks of a new covenant, it means he has made the first one obsolete.
31:18
SPEAKER_02: It's now old and out of date and ready to be put aside.
31:22
SPEAKER_02: Now, why would the writer of Hebrews say that?
31:25
SPEAKER_02: What is the point of the book of Hebrews, this letter?
31:28
SPEAKER_02: What is it?
31:30
SPEAKER_02: Well, Jews, Hebrews, it's written to Hebrews, right?
31:35
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
31:36
SPEAKER_02: And Jews were still going to the temple and offering sacrifice for their sins.
31:41
SPEAKER_02: And the writer of Hebrews is saying, you don't need to do that anymore, because Jesus went to the cross.
31:47
SPEAKER_02: He has paid for all your sins, now and forever, so you don't need to do this again.
31:53
SPEAKER_02: This part of the Hebrew scriptures is old and out of date because there's no longer a need to offer sacrifice.
31:59
SPEAKER_01: And God has the perfect guy because Paul had signed death warrants for the Christians until he had this miraculous conversion as a Pharisee, and he knew the letter of the law, and now he's on the other side.
32:10
SPEAKER_01: God has shown him love and grace.
32:13
SPEAKER_02: Right.
32:13
SPEAKER_02: So the point to the uh to the Hebrews is you don't need to go sacrifice.
32:21
SPEAKER_02: It's that portion of Scripture has been superseded by Jesus' death on the cross.
32:26
SPEAKER_02: And of course, in 70, Titus comes with his legions, and they destroy the temple, and there has not been a sacrifice offered for sins since then.
32:35
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
32:36
SPEAKER_02: All right.
32:37
SPEAKER_01: So uh Where's the Lamb?
32:40
SPEAKER_02: Right.
32:41
SPEAKER_02: So I think both scriptures are alive and well.
32:44
SPEAKER_02: It's not old and new, okay?
32:47
SPEAKER_02: But some people think there are differences between the Hebrew scriptures and the Christian scriptures, other than just the time and the location and one written in Greek, one written in Hebrew.
32:58
SPEAKER_02: Many think so.
32:58
SPEAKER_02: Like one example is people seem to think there was a difference in the character of God.
33:04
SPEAKER_02: They think the Old Testament God is an angry God that's uh standing with a stick in his hand and he's drawing a line in the sand and then uh always thought as a child, right?
33:15
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
33:16
SPEAKER_02: And this uh kind of idea that there was a different God in the Old Testament than there is in the New Testament was started by a guy named Marcion uh of Sinop, who uh he taught that there was a dualistic personality of God in the Hebrew scriptures that was different from the Christian scriptures.
33:38
SPEAKER_01: Well, okay, but lest they be a thorn in the side of Israel forever?
33:42
SPEAKER_02: Right.
33:42
SPEAKER_02: But now what you're doing, Red, is you're taking Scripture out of context and not laying it alongside the rest of the things that God said in the Hebrew Scripture.
33:52
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
33:52
SPEAKER_02: So according to Marcion, the God of the Old Testament was a harsh, mean, vengeful character who demanded obedience from us and was ready to quick to deal out judgment.
34:05
SPEAKER_02: But this character was very different from this graceful, familial, loving God of the New Testament who says, Call me daddy, Abba.
34:13
SPEAKER_02: And he's always ready to forgive our sins.
34:17
SPEAKER_02: So, you know, as I read, like for example, Deuteronomy chapter 28, this uh section of where Moses is re-giving the law for a second time, and it's the blessings and curses.
34:32
SPEAKER_02: If you follow God's laws, these good things will happen.
34:36
SPEAKER_02: But if you don't, these bad things are going to happen.
34:39
SPEAKER_02: If I read that section, maybe I might think there's a different God of the Old Testament.
34:44
SPEAKER_02: But then I read Psalm 103.
34:48
SPEAKER_02: Old Testament, right?
34:51
SPEAKER_02: Let all I am praise the Lord.
34:53
SPEAKER_02: I can never forget the good things He's done for me.
34:56
SPEAKER_02: He forgives my sins, he heals my diseases, he redeems me from death, he crowns me with love and tender mercies, he fills my life with good things.
35:05
SPEAKER_02: My youth is renewed like the eagles.
35:08
SPEAKER_02: The Lord gives us righteousness and justice to all who are feeded, treated unfairly.
35:14
SPEAKER_02: The Lord is compassionate and merciful, slow to get angry, filled with unfailing love.
35:20
SPEAKER_02: He will not constantly accuse us nor remain angry forever.
35:23
SPEAKER_02: He doesn't punish us for all our sins.
35:26
SPEAKER_02: He does not deal harshly with us as we deserve, for his unfailing love toward those who fear him is as great as the height of the heavens above the earth.
35:35
SPEAKER_02: He's removed our sins from us as far as the east is from the west.
35:39
SPEAKER_02: The Lord is like a father to his children, tender and compassionate to those who fear him, for he knows how weak we are, he remembers we're only dust.
35:49
SPEAKER_02: Okay, so let's lay this passage of Old Testament scripture alongside what you quoted.
35:56
SPEAKER_02: And it's very obvious that people in the Old Testament times viewed God as a merciful, loving, and giver of all good things.
36:06
SPEAKER_02: And even in Psalm 84, for the Lord God is our light and our protector.
36:11
SPEAKER_02: He gives us grace and glory.
36:14
SPEAKER_02: No good thing will the Lord withhold from those who do what is right.
36:18
SPEAKER_02: O Lord Almighty, how happy are those who trust in you.
36:22
SPEAKER_02: So did God really change somewhere between the last chapter of Malachi and the first chapter of Matthew?
36:30
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
36:30
SPEAKER_02: Are there two distinct gods as Marcion believed?
36:35
SPEAKER_02: Well, as it turned out, Marcion was excommunicated by the church in 44 AD because of his heretical beliefs.
36:44
SPEAKER_02: But regarding the perception that the God of the Hebrew Scriptures is the one who demands obedience, it's the God of the Christian scriptures, Jesus, who said, If you love me, obey my commandments.
37:00
SPEAKER_02: Okay?
37:01
SPEAKER_02: Notice the order, though.
37:03
SPEAKER_02: If you love me, if you have a relationship of love with me where you trust me in everything, and you know that I have your best interests at the center of my heart, I will do anything for you, even die for you, then obey the things that I tell you to do.
37:19
SPEAKER_02: It's not obey me and I'll love you more.
37:22
SPEAKER_02: It's if you love me, if you know who I am, if you realize what I've done for you, if you embrace it, then do the things that I tell you.
37:31
SPEAKER_02: If you're gonna want to.
37:32
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
37:32
SPEAKER_01: So in this imperfect world, of course, you know.
37:36
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so uh God has always been about t telling us what things are going to work best for us.
37:43
SPEAKER_02: And if you read the book of Deuteronomy, there's probably seven or eight or nine different times where God says, if you do these things, all will go well for you when you enter the land.
37:56
SPEAKER_02: These are the things that are going to benefit you.
37:58
SPEAKER_02: And as a father, I taught my children to obey me because I was the wise one in the family that knew what cars could do to kids that walked out on a street.
38:10
SPEAKER_02: So I took my kids down to the end of uh 39th court and I took them to 4th Street when they were about three or four years old.
38:18
SPEAKER_02: And I stood there and there's a white line going down the side of 4th Street, and I said, Don't you ever walk across this line and out into that street?
38:26
SPEAKER_02: And they look at me and I go, Why?
38:28
SPEAKER_02: And usually on the road there was a smashed frog or some animal, and I'd say, You're gonna end up like that smashed frog.
38:36
SPEAKER_02: And one day there was a cat there that was like a tortilla.
38:39
SPEAKER_02: And they all looked at that and they went, Oh, okay, for your own good, don't walk away from the house and walk down here and cross this road because that could happen to you.
38:51
SPEAKER_02: You see, there's consequences to our actions.
38:56
SPEAKER_02: And uh my son one day, uh, as we were talking about something that he had done and there were going to be some consequences, he looked at me and he said, Poppy, I don't like consequences.
39:08
SPEAKER_02: It caused me to laugh.
39:10
SPEAKER_02: I said, I said, Lucas, uh, neither do I.
39:14
SPEAKER_02: But Jesus tells us, unless we have a true love relationship with him, we won't understand why we should obey his commandments.
39:21
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I don't like accountability, right?
39:23
SPEAKER_02: But the reality is this, Rhett.
39:25
SPEAKER_02: Some of us learn from experience, others learn from instruction.
39:32
SPEAKER_02: Um what I noticed is my two youngest children watch the actions of my two oldest children.
39:42
SPEAKER_02: Who the oldest children, my uh my oldest were always pushing the boundaries.
39:48
SPEAKER_02: My youngest were observing, and they learned by instruction.
39:55
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
39:56
SPEAKER_01: Blessed is he who can learn from instruction instead of having to fall into the hole to realize you don't want to fall into the hole anymore.
40:02
SPEAKER_02: Right.
40:03
SPEAKER_02: So the question is what kind of uh learners are we?
40:05
SPEAKER_02: Experience or instruction, okay?
40:07
SPEAKER_02: Also, there's also confusion on how a person in the Old Testament was saved.
40:11
SPEAKER_02: And I've heard many of the uh teachers say that it was by keeping the law.
40:16
SPEAKER_02: Uh when I hear that, I go, wow, they're super selective in their reading.
40:20
SPEAKER_02: They don't really have a holistic understanding of the Bible.
40:23
SPEAKER_02: They they read very selectively.
40:25
SPEAKER_02: Because listen to what David says in Psalm 40.
40:28
SPEAKER_02: He said, You take no delight in sacrifices or offerings.
40:32
SPEAKER_02: Now that you have made me listen, I finally understand you don't require burnt offerings or sin offerings.
40:38
SPEAKER_02: Then I said, Look, I have come, and this has been written about me in your scroll.
40:43
SPEAKER_02: I take joy in doing your will, my God, for your law is written on my heart.
40:50
SPEAKER_01: Just like it written in Joel.
40:52
SPEAKER_01: Right.
40:54
SPEAKER_01: What on their hearts?
40:56
SPEAKER_02: Um in Ezekiel, uh give you a new heart and a new uh uh and I'll write my w words and you'll have no need, okay.
41:04
SPEAKER_02: Um To David it was obvious this was all what was going on was about his heart relationship with God.
41:11
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
41:12
SPEAKER_02: Uh his outward actions were only the reflections of what was going on in his heart.
41:20
SPEAKER_01: You gotta do thus and such, you gotta do this, you can't wear this, you can't play music like that, blah, blah.
41:25
SPEAKER_01: All these I can't just tell you going, no, no, no, no, no.
41:27
SPEAKER_02: Well, um, the writer of Hebrews says God was really never satisfied with the bloods of bulls and lambs and goats, you know.
41:36
SPEAKER_02: Um for the law is only a shadow of the good things to come.
41:41
SPEAKER_02: Uh it's impossible for the blood of goats and bulls to take away sin, okay?
41:46
SPEAKER_02: The Bible always referred to these sacrifices as as a covering for s a sin.
41:52
SPEAKER_02: But it wasn't the covering that maintained the relationship between God and the Old Testament believer and turned away wrath.
41:58
SPEAKER_02: What what it was, you see, God was always concerned about what's going on in your heart.
42:04
SPEAKER_02: And I think the Old Testament believer and the New Testament believer are on the same path.
42:09
SPEAKER_02: It's a walk of faith.
42:13
SPEAKER_02: Proverbs 21 says, People may think they're doing what's right, but the Lord examines the heart.
42:20
SPEAKER_02: The people is the Lord is more pleased with what we do than what is just and right than when we give him sacrifices.
42:28
SPEAKER_02: You see, a lot of people think that keeping the law got people saved.
42:31
SPEAKER_02: Well, listen, keeping the law never got people saved.
42:34
SPEAKER_02: It was walking with God that got people saved.
42:38
SPEAKER_02: And when God gives us his w words and his laws, then we have a means of uh demonstrating our faith by keeping those laws.
42:48
SPEAKER_01: What if what if we're we're so we're adopted into what God adopts us?
42:52
SPEAKER_01: Uh we are born again as Jesus instructed.
42:54
SPEAKER_01: Now uh he has made a covenant relationship.
42:57
SPEAKER_01: Uh so what if you willfully though go out and sin?
42:59
SPEAKER_01: Now, all most a lot of us can say we have willfully sinned.
43:02
SPEAKER_01: I've definitely willfully sinned.
43:04
SPEAKER_01: I've gone in, I've gone out, I've gone out, I've gone in.
43:07
SPEAKER_02: Well, um, Rhett, uh John writes in his first letter in chapter one that if we call ourselves Christians and we say we never sin, we're deceiving ourselves.
43:19
unknown: Okay?
43:20
SPEAKER_02: Because we're in a fallen world.
43:21
SPEAKER_02: We're in a fallen world and we're dealing with the power of sin over our lives.
43:26
SPEAKER_02: We're we're freed from the curse of sin, but the the power of sin is still there.
43:30
SPEAKER_01: And uh Be ye holy from holy.
43:33
SPEAKER_01: What is holiness?
43:34
SPEAKER_02: It's uh demonstrating a morality that's different from the culture around you that comes from God.
43:39
SPEAKER_02: Okay?
43:40
SPEAKER_02: So 1 John chapter 1 gives us the answer to your question, and we can talk about this at another time.
43:47
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
43:48
SPEAKER_02: Because John says as Christians, we're gonna sin, and we have a Savior that if we confess our sin, He's free to forgive them.
43:57
SPEAKER_02: But if people say they're Christians and they continue Keep sinning and do and we don't see any change.
44:03
SPEAKER_02: Well, probably they didn't get it.
44:05
SPEAKER_02: Probably they don't have the Holy Spirit in them, and there's really no forgiveness of their sins because they really are not with us.
44:12
SPEAKER_01: Well, I've seen a lot of good changes in me, but I've also seen some things where I've had uh what is it, a besetting sin in some instances.
44:27
SPEAKER_01: Because didn't you see somewhere in the scriptures you go in, you go out, you go in, you go out, but one day you'll come in and that's gonna be it?
44:32
SPEAKER_01: He's gonna shut the door on all this mischievousness and annoyiness.
44:38
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
44:39
SPEAKER_02: But back to the question, how were the Jews in the Old Testament saved?
44:43
SPEAKER_01: How were the Jews in the Old Testament saved?
44:45
SPEAKER_02: There's a lot of confusion.
44:46
SPEAKER_02: People think the Jews were saved by keeping the law.
44:49
SPEAKER_02: But listen to what the prophet Micah, Old Testament, says.
44:52
SPEAKER_02: What can we bring the Lord to make up for what we've done?
44:55
SPEAKER_02: Should we bow before God with offerings of yearling calves?
44:58
SPEAKER_02: Should we offer him thousands of rams and tens of thousands of river of olive oil?
45:04
SPEAKER_02: What would please the Lord?
45:05
SPEAKER_02: Should we sacrifice our firstborn children to pay for the sins of our souls?
45:10
SPEAKER_02: Would that make him glad?
45:12
SPEAKER_02: No, O people.
45:14
SPEAKER_02: The Lord has already told you what is good, and this is what he requires that you do what is right, that you love mercy, and you walk humbly with your God.
45:24
SPEAKER_02: You see, the Old Testament believer and the New Testament believer were always saved by grace through faith.
45:32
SPEAKER_02: Remember, God makes a promise to Abraham.
45:35
SPEAKER_02: We talked about this uh a couple uh weeks ago.
45:39
SPEAKER_02: And he took him out and he said, Look at all the stars in the heavens, so shall your descendants be.
45:45
SPEAKER_02: And Abram said, and Genesis 15, chapter 6, says, And Abram believed the Lord, and God declared him righteous because of his faith.
45:56
SPEAKER_02: It's always been about a faith issue, okay?
46:00
SPEAKER_02: And um it's all about what's been going on in our heart.
46:06
SPEAKER_02: There's no difference between the God of the Old Testament and the God of the New Testament.
46:10
SPEAKER_02: He's the same God.
46:12
SPEAKER_02: There's no difference in the relationship between God and mankind.
46:15
SPEAKER_02: It was always a walk of faith and it was God's grace.
46:18
SPEAKER_02: And if you don't understand what happened in the Hebrew scriptures, you're not going to get the full revelation and full experience of reading the Christian scriptures.
46:29
SPEAKER_02: They go hand in hand.
46:33
SPEAKER_02: So I would encourage those of you that are really wanting to hear from God to really understand Him and His character.
46:41
SPEAKER_02: So much of that is revealed in the pages of the Hebrew Scriptures, his interaction with people.
46:46
SPEAKER_02: They're just like us.
46:48
SPEAKER_02: Well, they're flawed human beings, and God is interacting with them.
46:52
SPEAKER_02: And we see them doing mighty and courageous things, but we see them doing kind of stupid things too.
46:59
SPEAKER_02: And it's it's written for our example, as Paul tells his friends in court.
47:04
SPEAKER_02: These things were written for your example to show you how previous interactions with God have taken place so that we'll learn from them.
47:12
SPEAKER_02: And I want to encourage you all.
47:16
SPEAKER_02: The Hebrew scriptures contain the wisdom of God, contain the story of mankind with God.
47:22
SPEAKER_02: They tell us some exciting stories of God's champions, they show us dismal failures by God's people that resulted in horrific consequences.
47:33
SPEAKER_02: We see words giving of a coming Messiah of what was going to happen and how he was going to redeem mankind.
47:40
SPEAKER_02: And we see lots of uh direct messages to us as to how we should be walking it out on a day-to-day basis here in the 21st century.
47:51
SPEAKER_02: You can't have a fully experiential knowledge of God, I believe, unless you understand what he did in the pages of the Hebrew scriptures.
48:01
SPEAKER_02: So you can really appreciate the messages that we're getting in the Christian scriptures.
48:05
SPEAKER_01: Well, it's a perfect guy.
48:06
SPEAKER_01: This guy, Paul, uh, is a uh uh, I don't know if he's a Sadducee, but a Pharisee, whatever, highly learned.
48:13
SPEAKER_01: He's also a citizen of Rome.
48:15
SPEAKER_01: He's a Jewish guy, and he knows the law, and he's out signing death warrants for the Christians and uh very hateful, obviously, towards the Christians.
48:23
SPEAKER_01: And suddenly he's riding on his horse.
48:25
SPEAKER_01: We don't know if he fell off or was pushed off or what the heck happened, but he ends up on the ground, uh blinded by the light.
48:31
SPEAKER_01: And uh Jesus said, Why do you persecute me, Paul?
48:35
SPEAKER_01: Saul, and he says uh his name would later become Paul.
48:38
SPEAKER_01: Uh why do you persecute me, Saul?
48:40
SPEAKER_01: You know, and uh uh who are you?
48:42
SPEAKER_01: Who are you?
48:42
SPEAKER_01: I am Jesus of Nazareth, the one you persecute, and uh you know, blah, blah, blah.
48:47
SPEAKER_01: And so you're gonna go into this town, you're gonna be blind for three days, and you're gonna see this man, and he's gonna come and you'll get restored of your sight.
48:55
SPEAKER_01: I mean, but he's the perfect guy because he was a man, the letter of the law.
48:59
SPEAKER_01: The letter of the law kills the spirit of the law, gives life.
49:02
SPEAKER_01: And so many people want to create religions.
49:05
SPEAKER_02: Right.
49:05
SPEAKER_01: We can't sing like this, we can't dress like this.
49:08
SPEAKER_01: Ghetto, don't let men encumber you.
49:10
SPEAKER_01: Don't get he says don't get tangled up again.
49:12
SPEAKER_02: Well, the Paul says, the thing that people read is Paul says we're not under the law to the letter in the Galatians.
49:21
SPEAKER_02: But he also says in the book of Romans and other places, the law is good if it's used properly.
49:28
SPEAKER_02: And so the law shows me the character of God.
49:30
SPEAKER_02: It shows me what's going to work best for me as a human, and it's part of my experience with him.
49:38
SPEAKER_01: What about if you're a Christian though and you continue to sin on and out, this you've been here, then you go back, back and forth.
49:43
SPEAKER_01: I mean, doesn't it say somewhere that God will not wrestle with man forever?
49:46
SPEAKER_01: Is that applicable?
49:47
SPEAKER_01: Or do you think once you're saved, truly saved, if you've been born again and you know it, are you in?
49:53
SPEAKER_01: Except for blasphemy.
49:54
SPEAKER_01: He said, Jesus, didn't Jesus said to He said, All sin shall be forgiven man except blaspheme against the Holy Spirit.
50:01
SPEAKER_01: Attributing the things of the holiness of God to this Belzebug guy or whatever.
50:05
SPEAKER_02: Right, right.
50:06
SPEAKER_02: That was the context.
50:07
SPEAKER_02: See, blasphemy is a report that gives someone a false reputation, a bad reputation.
50:14
SPEAKER_02: Uh blasphemy happens.
50:15
SPEAKER_02: Uh you say something nasty about me, that's you're blaspheming me if it's false.
50:21
SPEAKER_02: Cost of kills.
50:22
SPEAKER_02: And the context, the context of that statement by Jesus was he had just done many miracles, and the religious authorities were saying, Well, you're doing it by the power of the devil.
50:33
SPEAKER_01: Watch out.
50:33
SPEAKER_02: Watch out for the home.
50:36
SPEAKER_02: You're saying that I'm part of Satan's team.
50:38
SPEAKER_02: And if you're saying that, you're never gonna make it into the kingdom.
50:43
SPEAKER_02: It's an unforgivable sin.
50:45
SPEAKER_02: But it's the context of taking what Jesus is doing through his miraculous powers and attributing it to Satan, you're not gonna become a believer in the world.
50:54
SPEAKER_01: Oh, I see.
50:54
SPEAKER_01: So he's not keeping a record.
50:56
SPEAKER_01: He's saying you won't enter if you keep on with that thought.
50:58
SPEAKER_02: If you think that I'm from Satan, you're not gonna enter the kingdom of heaven.
51:04
SPEAKER_02: Okay, so just remember that that the context, this is uh something we're gonna talk about uh, I think in our next uh uh session, is we're gonna talk about context.
51:14
SPEAKER_02: Uh what's in front of the scriptures, what's behind it uh that helps us understand it.
51:19
SPEAKER_02: What what uh cultural uh things uh affect our understanding?
51:24
SPEAKER_02: What geographical things, what political things?
51:27
SPEAKER_02: Uh there's so much that if if we try to get in the room and put on the mindset of a uh a first century Greek or Roman, and we're listening to a letter that's being read to us, it's gonna have a different meaning than us Americans reading it in the 21st century.
51:42
SPEAKER_01: And mankind is interpretation.
51:44
SPEAKER_01: I remember when I first heard years ago I became a Christian at the age of 29.
51:48
SPEAKER_01: And uh I remember uh it said uh be um be thankful in all things.
51:52
SPEAKER_01: Well I thought it was a harsh voice, be thankful in all things.
51:56
SPEAKER_01: This is the will of God for you.
51:57
SPEAKER_01: And then later on it took years for me to learn No, Rhett.
52:00
SPEAKER_01: Uh it put on a loving voice.
52:03
SPEAKER_01: Be be thankful in all things.
52:05
SPEAKER_01: But this is the will of God for you.
52:07
SPEAKER_01: Life goes better if you're thankful.
52:10
SPEAKER_01: Well have gratitude.
52:12
SPEAKER_02: Right.
52:12
SPEAKER_02: And if you understand, have an eternal perspective on your life, and you know where your life is going to end is in paradise or in the new heaven and earth with the Lord, then whatever happens here, uh the significance of it should not cause us to be sorrowful.
52:30
SPEAKER_02: But knowing that we have cheated death and we have we're gonna spend eternity with Jesus, and we know God's working out all things to work out to his good, then we couldn't we can have joy in our logical thought process.
52:42
SPEAKER_01: It's hard for those of us who are vocally abused as children, though, to not think of God as that, as this hard, harsh figure.
52:49
SPEAKER_01: And then it's just taking me years to learn by his love.
52:53
SPEAKER_01: Oh, he's not speaking with a love of I mean uh with a with a tone of of anger, he's speaking with a tone of of love.
53:00
SPEAKER_01: And even the Bible says it's it's your it's it's his kindness that leads us to repentance.
53:07
SPEAKER_02: Right, right.
53:08
SPEAKER_02: So pretty married.
53:09
SPEAKER_01: It's all a love story, isn't it?
53:10
SPEAKER_02: So I think we can sum it up by saying that the Bible is a complete unit, right?
53:15
SPEAKER_02: The Hebrew scriptures and the Christian scriptures go hand in hand.
53:18
SPEAKER_02: You can't really understand what's going on in the Christian scriptures unless you understand the background that the writers are often referring to from the Hebrew scriptures.
53:27
SPEAKER_02: God is the same in uh both sections of the Bible.
53:31
SPEAKER_02: Uh man was saved by a faithful, obedient walk and uh a belief in God.
53:37
SPEAKER_02: Uh and we are obedience is always the result of our faith in him.
53:42
SPEAKER_02: And uh it's an incredible book.
53:44
SPEAKER_01: What did Jesus say?
53:45
SPEAKER_01: I no longer call you this, but I call you friends.
53:48
SPEAKER_01: What's the full scripture?
53:49
SPEAKER_01: Do you remember?
53:50
SPEAKER_02: That's in uh John chapter 16.
53:52
SPEAKER_02: I no longer call you if you obey me, you're my friends.
53:55
SPEAKER_01: I no longer call you something or I call you friends, yeah.
53:59
SPEAKER_01: So in other words, this so we got a friend, uh, a cup of friendship here, and that's what we're offering you here, folks.
54:05
SPEAKER_01: Uh not uh proselytizing necessarily uh with the negative pejorative side of that or yelling at people or commanding, but delving into the scriptures with our historian here, our our historian, which is Michael Bagby, who studied history in Europe.
54:20
SPEAKER_01: You've been to Israel, what, 17 times or a whole people bunch, or whatever it is.
54:24
SPEAKER_01: It doesn't really matter.
54:26
SPEAKER_01: 217 times.
54:28
SPEAKER_01: Why don't we pad the thing here, you know?
54:30
SPEAKER_01: No longer slint of the kingdom of God.
54:32
SPEAKER_01: Okay, I have a friend.
54:33
SPEAKER_02: At least 217 days, okay.
54:36
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's that.
54:37
SPEAKER_01: Okay, great to see you.
54:39
SPEAKER_02: All right.
54:40
SPEAKER_02: Uh thank you guys for listening to us today.
54:43
SPEAKER_02: I hope you enjoy uh our cup of friendship and come to our site and uh purchase a couple of our blends, and we'll have them delivered right to your door.
54:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, when you listen to us, you can be having your cup of friendship with our cup of friendship.
54:56
SPEAKER_02: Uh so aloha from us here in Vero Beach.
55:13
SPEAKER_01: I hope that's something that's not me singing.