Latest / I Hate Talking / The Chaos Episode
Transcript
- 0:30I Hate Talking: All right.
- 0:30I Hate Talking: Welcome back, y'all.
- 0:32I Hate Talking: We are on episode 11 of I Hate Talking.
- 0:38I Hate Talking: And Adam has no idea what we're talking about today or what our word of the day is.
- 0:46I Hate Talking: So how do you feel before we move into this?
- 0:49I Hate Talking: How are you feeling at this moment?
- 0:51I Hate Talking: I'm feeling a bit uneasy, perhaps a bit out of control, and in general, Off kilter.
- 1:03I Hate Talking: Are you gonna delete this episode and I'll never air?
- 1:06I Hate Talking: We could always just have episode 12 air and people would be like, where did episode 11 go?
- 1:14I Hate Talking: That's Stephanie's episode.
- 1:16I Hate Talking: And it would be the mystery episode forever.
- 1:20I Hate Talking: So, sometimes Adam will ask me, do you want to know what we're talking about?
- 1:27I Hate Talking: I'm like, no, just hit record.
- 1:30I Hate Talking: I'll figure it out.
- 1:31I Hate Talking: This is fun.
- 1:31I Hate Talking: So, I love that the tables are turned and you are the one.
- 1:37I Hate Talking: Without the power or knowledge.
- 1:40I Hate Talking: I feel so powerful.
- 1:43I Hate Talking: But I won't keep you waiting any longer.
- 1:46I Hate Talking: Today's word of the episode is a phrase.
- 1:51I Hate Talking: This may be our first phrase, is it?
- 1:54I Hate Talking: It is not.
- 1:55I Hate Talking: Oh, OK.
- 1:57I Hate Talking: Well, good.
- 1:58I Hate Talking: Our phrase is que sera sera.
- 2:02I Hate Talking: So our very first phrase was active listening.
- 2:07I Hate Talking: So if you, if you, if you're paying attention and actively listening, then you would have retained that information unless perhaps you are a visual learner and perhaps uh did not pick up on the phrase of the episode, our very first phrase, active listening.
- 2:27I Hate Talking: So now we have another phrase that we are embarking upon.
- 2:31I Hate Talking: OK Sara sera.
- 2:33I Hate Talking: Yes.
- 2:34I Hate Talking: And I don't even think that's English.
- 2:36I Hate Talking: I think that means it is what it is.
- 2:40I Hate Talking: -- sera -- sera.
- 2:43I Hate Talking: Yes, it means whatever will be will be.
- 2:47I Hate Talking: It is Italian.
- 2:49I Hate Talking: So as I noted, I did indicate that that is not an English phrase.
- 2:55I Hate Talking: And when we've done a little offline research into this, it appears that it is yet again some different languages that are borrowing from one another back and forth because this originated in the Italian language, then became adopted by the Spanish language, perhaps I think even.
- 3:16I Hate Talking: The Spanish language spoken in Spain and not Mexico and then eventually became part of the English lexicon, que sera sera.
- 3:28I Hate Talking: Right, yeah.
- 3:29I Hate Talking: So, um, like you said, when we looked it up quickly.
- 3:33I Hate Talking: Um, I know it from the song from Dorsay, and um.
- 3:39I Hate Talking: Sometimes I've seen it to myself, if I'm frustrated or overwhelmed with something, just knowing that it's, it'll work out in the end, and it's OK.
- 3:48I Hate Talking: But if you just Google it, it will explain that, yes, it's French, it's Italian, it's not grammatically correct.
- 3:58I Hate Talking: So it gets a little overwhelming.
- 4:00I Hate Talking: But I want to discuss today, since I have the power in this hot seat.
- 4:07I Hate Talking: The thought of whatever will be will be.
- 4:11I Hate Talking: And how that applies to us talking to one another or in our internal thoughts.
- 4:21I Hate Talking: Of whatever will be will be.
- 4:23I Hate Talking: And it is an interesting relationship to the phrase that came to my mind when I heard the original phrase of the episode, que sera sera, where I was thinking of it is what it is.
- 4:38I Hate Talking: And that is more of a, I think, historical look or a past perspective on something that has occurred.
- 4:49I Hate Talking: Rather than the actual meaning, which is.
- 4:54I Hate Talking: It will be What it will be, which is more of a future context to it.
- 5:02I Hate Talking: Right?
- 5:03I Hate Talking: I like that you pointed that out because at first glance, it seems very the same or similar.
- 5:09I Hate Talking: As you're thinking about it, it's definitely different.
- 5:13I Hate Talking: What is what is.
- 5:15I Hate Talking: It is a past tense and it's very much, in my opinion, just throwing your hands up, why even and try.
- 5:24I Hate Talking: But whatever will be, will be is looking at the future.
- 5:29I Hate Talking: And Having instead of your hands up, like I give up, your hands are open to accepting what is coming.
- 5:38I Hate Talking: Is it though, or is this yet again fatalism packaged in a cute phrase that we have no control over what will be.
- 5:51I Hate Talking: Do you think I'm a fatalist?
- 5:53I Hate Talking: I think to some degree, we both are.
- 5:57I Hate Talking: Elaborate So I think that one of the things that we touched on in just the very last episode was our similar ideas that we arrived at separately, yet at the same time, and we may even consider those things providential and that we have seen a number of things in our past.
- 6:22I Hate Talking: And in our lives that we would categorize in that same vein as being providential that were completely outside of ourselves in terms of the decisions that we either made or avoided making and that.
- 6:38I Hate Talking: In some form or fashion that is akin to fatalism, though I think there is a key difference there that with the providential nature of our lives, we would attribute that to a higher power, whereas the fatalist for all intents and purposes just attributes that to pure fate that does not have any particular Cognition about it.
- 7:06I Hate Talking: OK, I am thinking in real time what you just said.
- 7:11I Hate Talking: So, Again, like you said, with our podcast, how I was like, hey, I had this idea.
- 7:18I Hate Talking: 2 hours ago, and you're like, yes, I already have this idea and this is what it is, and we're moving forward.
- 7:25I Hate Talking: And I'm like, well, that's in my head I'd call that Providence.
- 7:29I Hate Talking: Yes, that's providential.
- 7:31I Hate Talking: We have to do this.
- 7:32I Hate Talking: Or even in the future, talking about our origin story, our Genesis story.
- 7:38I Hate Talking: of how our relationship is in my head very providential.
- 7:44I Hate Talking: So are you saying that if I didn't classify myself as religious, It would just be fatalism.
- 7:54I Hate Talking: That is, I think the difference that there are many flavors of the same thought process.
- 8:03I Hate Talking: And that There is certainly, I think in my view of also being an absolutist that there is one that is absolutely true and one that is absolutely false and there only can be one view that is right, but that in terms of how you either view your past experience and your future destination will either be providential, fatalist, or Those that would adhere to the theory of chaos.
- 8:39I Hate Talking: Oh, I think you hate that theory probably.
- 8:42I Hate Talking: I do.
- 8:44I Hate Talking: The amount of chaos in our house as it is can be overwhelming for you.
- 8:51I Hate Talking: So, the whole theory on it, I'm sure is nightmare.
- 8:54I Hate Talking: But if a butterfly does slap its wings in another country.
- 9:00I Hate Talking: Do we have a storm here?
- 9:04I Hate Talking: Elaborate So the chaos theory would say yes, but is it also not incorrect to say that the butterfly flapping its wings in order to create that scenario is perhaps the fate of those that experienced the storm or even more so that Providence has Foreordained those people to endure the storm.
- 9:34I Hate Talking: At the cost of the butterfly flapping its wings.
- 9:37I Hate Talking: Do I need to look up what gas there you mean?
- 9:41I Hate Talking: Are you saying that people believe that like if a butterfly flaps its wings, that you get a tornado here in America?
- 9:50I Hate Talking: That is what Chaos theory states that is one of its key tenets that it would describe itself with.
- 10:00I Hate Talking: And I think we have to look no further than the classic movie, Jurassic Park to see the results of the chaos theory in practice.
- 10:10I Hate Talking: I saw a meme today and it said my toxic trait.
- 10:15I Hate Talking: is that if Jurassic Park was real, I would still go to it.
- 10:20I Hate Talking: And it made me laugh.
- 10:22I Hate Talking: So it makes me laugh thinking about it.
- 10:27I Hate Talking: What photo was associated with this meme?
- 10:30I Hate Talking: It was just like.
- 10:33I Hate Talking: Trees burning.
- 10:36I Hate Talking: Interesting.
- 10:37I Hate Talking: So, I'm struggling to understand.
- 10:40I Hate Talking: Can you elaborate more?
- 10:42I Hate Talking: When you said that we are both.
- 10:44I Hate Talking: Maybe slightly fatalist, it definitely brings a bristle reaction to me, like, in my head that's a negative connotation.
- 10:52I Hate Talking: But also when you're talking about the chaos theory, this butterfly in South America affecting my life currently.
- 11:01I Hate Talking: Like, well, whatever that butterfly does if that's affecting me.
- 11:05I Hate Talking: Hey Sarah, Sarah.
- 11:08I Hate Talking: So how are those different?
- 11:11I Hate Talking: Obviously, people are gonna have different opinions, what's better or worse.
- 11:14I Hate Talking: Why am I having such a negative reaction to One thought in theory.
- 11:20I Hate Talking: So based on what I personally know about you.
- 11:25I Hate Talking: I think there is one aspect that I can explain, but maybe for our listeners in general that also have a negative connotation associated with fatalism is a couple of things.
- 11:40I Hate Talking: One, you may be hearing the word fatal, which is deadly and just the sound of the word fatalism.
- 11:50I Hate Talking: Reminds you of death.
- 11:53I Hate Talking: So that may be one aspect that has no relationship to the actual theory of fatalism, but it is calling into remembrance, something that you associate with the word fatal and that being deadly.
- 12:09I Hate Talking: So my brain is instantly just black, -- like that's -- not good.
- 12:13I Hate Talking: That's not good.
- 12:14I Hate Talking: The other thing that I think fatalism indicates is that you do not have control, that your fate is set, you have no impact over it by the decisions that you make and therefore you have no control over what will happen that you will arrive at your particular destination regardless of any decision that you make.
- 12:43I Hate Talking: And again, that lack of control is particularly offensive to somebody that thinks of the concept of fatalism.
- 12:53I Hate Talking: Now, more personally, I think that.
- 12:56I Hate Talking: fatalism in your mind, and you can correct me if I'm wrong, again harkens back to that lack of control and the lack of a particular purpose of your destination, whereas your concept of providence has a certain aspect of having a particular destination in mind for your good.
- 13:25I Hate Talking: That you will arrive at regardless.
- 13:27I Hate Talking: Yeah.
- 13:28I Hate Talking: Um, as I'm thinking about that, I think we're spot on, at least for myself, I don't know about anyone else listening.
- 13:37I Hate Talking: I do not like the idea that everything is laid out and it doesn't even matter.
- 13:43I Hate Talking: Which I choose or what path I take.
- 13:48I Hate Talking: If I'm driving, do I turn left or right?
- 13:50I Hate Talking: It doesn't matter.
- 13:50I Hate Talking: In my head, that's fatalism.
- 13:54I Hate Talking: Uh, maybe a misunderstanding.
- 13:56I Hate Talking: That's what I'm thinking.
- 13:57I Hate Talking: But like you said, when I'm thinking about like a grander purpose, I'm using the word Province, I think it's the purpose of it.
- 14:05I Hate Talking: I purposely chose to drive right, even if I didn't know that was the reason.
- 14:13I Hate Talking: Maybe there's somebody on the side of the road today, we rolled down our windows, we had a grocery pickup.
- 14:18I Hate Talking: And there was somebody with a sign needing help.
- 14:22I Hate Talking: So we just gave him a little bit of the food in our grocery bag, because we are able to do that.
- 14:29I Hate Talking: Yes, I intentionally bought everything we had.
- 14:32I Hate Talking: But our lives are not severely impacted by that loaf of bread and some canned goods we gave him.
- 14:40I Hate Talking: And hopefully his is better impacted by that.
- 14:44I Hate Talking: So my head, I'm thinking, I drove past him with a car full of food, so I can give it to him.
- 14:53I Hate Talking: That is Providence.
- 14:55I Hate Talking: Not Just what it is, and I don't have a choice in that matter.
- 15:01I Hate Talking: Exactly.
- 15:02I Hate Talking: And again, to relate it back to the classic movie, Jurassic Park, how can you determine which way the water droplet will roll?
- 15:12I Hate Talking: Mhm Yeah.
- 15:16I Hate Talking: So, human desire, I think still plays a part in any of these scenarios, whether you subscribe to Providence or fatalism or chaos theory.
- 15:31I Hate Talking: We know that Malcolm's intent in that scene was not to demonstrate the actual aspects of chaos theory, but in an attempt to fulfill his own human desire to engage with the fair doctor.
- 15:52I Hate Talking: Hm.
- 15:53I Hate Talking: I love that y'all.
- 15:55I Hate Talking: Adam did not know 10 minutes ago what we were talking about.
- 15:59I Hate Talking: So that's amazing that you can just pull this from your brain.
- 16:01I Hate Talking: In fairness, -- I didn't know what we were talking about 15 minutes -- ago.
- 16:05I Hate Talking: And that also is a bit of an aspect of fatalism and the theory of fatalism is that it is related to the human condition and that the humanity in their own desire is.
- 16:20I Hate Talking: Destined to their certain fate.
- 16:24I Hate Talking: And circling back to the first phrase, in my head, I hear this often and just the chaos of life comes just hearing the que sera sera.
- 16:36I Hate Talking: And to me that's comforting.
- 16:38I Hate Talking: Like, it's crazy right now.
- 16:41I Hate Talking: I want to pull my hair out or just give up.
- 16:47I Hate Talking: Just accept it.
- 16:49I Hate Talking: And what's gonna happen is gonna happen, and I'm gonna do the next right thing.
- 16:53I Hate Talking: So I think that's the middle ground between um fatalism and chaos theory, saying it's gonna happen.
- 17:01I Hate Talking: But I can still do the next right thing.
- 17:05I Hate Talking: I can still continue to be kind, or I can still continue to plow forward in this.
- 17:12I Hate Talking: Even if I know the outcome at the end is not up to me.
- 17:17I Hate Talking: And I think that would be more aptly described by the theory that you do have your own control over your destiny, that the choices you make do have an impact on your particular experience or the outcomes that you achieve.
- 17:37I Hate Talking: So how would that line up with what will be will be?
- 17:41I Hate Talking: You could easily say, hey, what will be will be if my family wants dinner.
- 17:47I Hate Talking: I'll get dinner.
- 17:49I Hate Talking: I'm just gonna sit on this bed.
- 17:51I Hate Talking: And scroll YouTube.
- 17:55I Hate Talking: But in reality, if you said that, we would not get a paycheck.
- 18:00I Hate Talking: We would not have money to do the grocery pickup order I did earlier thated our family and also fed another family on the side of the road.
- 18:11I Hate Talking: And when you get to the pure concepts of chaos theory, it will actually state that those choices that we make are critical to The output that we experience because if we choose to let the butterfly escape or we crush it, that because of that choice, we can actually impact whether there is a massive deadly storm.
- 18:48I Hate Talking: Or if there is not.
- 18:51I Hate Talking: That's a lot to a weight to carry on yourself.
- 18:55I Hate Talking: We have a uh the house in front of our home.
- 18:59I Hate Talking: But we encourage bees and hope that the honey bees come.
- 19:04I Hate Talking: Uh, pollinate our garden and all the community around us cause we know how important bees are and how they are needed for food and flower production.
- 19:17I Hate Talking: But If we did not have that house, I would not feel an intense sense of guilt.
- 19:25I Hate Talking: Or we were destroying our garden or Our community gardens of produce.
- 19:34I Hate Talking: So by what you're saying, I feel like there would be so much pressure on Any step I take.
- 19:42I Hate Talking: What if I crush that butterfly?
- 19:45I Hate Talking: What if I crush that bee?
- 19:47I Hate Talking: Or that ants, they all, even though sometimes they seem like a nuisance.
- 19:52I Hate Talking: They have purposes.
- 19:55I Hate Talking: Here in our ecosystem.
- 19:57I Hate Talking: And that seems overwhelming that every thought, every step I take is gonna impact our future.
- 20:05I Hate Talking: But does it not?
- 20:07I Hate Talking: I don't want it to.
- 20:09I Hate Talking: And that's why you are a fatalist.
- 20:12I Hate Talking: Are you still a fatalist or are you now more on the chaos theory then as we're discussing this?
- 20:19I Hate Talking: I think we are all meant to do what we are all meant to do.
- 20:24I Hate Talking: OK, what is in between a fatalist and chaos theory?
- 20:28I Hate Talking: I want to be the middle.
- 20:31I Hate Talking: So there may be something in between where that you have the theory of rationalism or the the theory of game theory where certain people's actions are to some degree predictable because they will act in either the most sensible and rational.
- 21:00I Hate Talking: Output or in some form or fashion, the best way that has the best outcome for them or those that they care about.
- 21:11I Hate Talking: So that would be the game theory aspect of decision making as well as the rationalist type of decision making.
- 21:22I Hate Talking: Well, game theory sounds super fancy, rationalist sounds super smart and reasonable.
- 21:30I Hate Talking: So, I like both of those.
- 21:33I Hate Talking: Are these things that based on education, you learn or life experiences?
- 21:42I Hate Talking: Are you pretty much set?
- 21:44I Hate Talking: On one theory or another based on how you were raised.
- 21:48I Hate Talking: Well, I suppose that depends on what theory you describes to because if you are a fatalist, then you will subscribe to the theory that you are predestined to.
- 22:00I Hate Talking: That's funny.
- 22:03I Hate Talking: So, a lot of interesting things that we've discussed.
- 22:07I Hate Talking: I don't know if we've come to any particular conclusions, but that's OK because we are simply discussing these things with the intent to come to further insights and understanding.
- 22:19I Hate Talking: So what did you feel like?
- 22:21I Hate Talking: This episode, not knowing what we're discussing and in all reality, we.
- 22:27I Hate Talking: Moved around slightly But walking into this now, after 20 minutes or so of discussion, how do you feel not knowing what we were gonna talk about?
- 22:40I Hate Talking: Well, I suppose in one sense you could say that whatever we were going to talk about is what we talked about.
- 22:50I Hate Talking: So, from your friends, I, I hate talking.
- 22:53I Hate Talking: Remember, it is only through talking that we begin the journey to understanding.