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Scott Brady: Global Overlander and Publisher · The Overland Journal Podcast

0:04
Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to the Overland Journal podcast. I'm here
0:07
Speaker 1: with people named Ashley and Scott. We're going to do
0:10
Speaker 1: something a little bit different today, so we're going to
0:12
Speaker 1: be interviewing another person at this table that has three
0:15
Speaker 1: first names, Scott Alan Brady.
0:17
Speaker 2: Yeah.
0:18
Speaker 3: I'm super excited about this.
0:19
Speaker 1: I mean, I think a lot of people in the
0:21
Speaker 1: Overlin world kind of share the same story.
0:23
Speaker 3: I think I was. I think I was fifteen when
0:25
Speaker 3: I joined x Portal. It's close.
0:28
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I'm like almost nineteen now, but it's you know,
0:33
Speaker 1: it's been it's just been so cool to see, you know,
0:35
Speaker 1: your adventures throughout the years.
0:37
Speaker 3: Thank you.
0:38
Speaker 1: They've been incredibly inspirational to me. I'm sure they have,
0:41
Speaker 1: you know, to a lot of people, and it's been
0:44
Speaker 1: just really cool to see how you've constantly pushed the
0:47
Speaker 1: industry and as the industry has grown and kind of
0:50
Speaker 1: created its own little identity, you know, I mean, because
0:52
Speaker 1: it's not the global travel that it kind of started
0:55
Speaker 1: off as never was going to be, but how you've
0:57
Speaker 1: stayed true to your roots and I think that that's
0:59
Speaker 1: really cool well and something that I've always really appreciated.
1:01
Speaker 3: But thank you.
1:02
Speaker 1: That's those are the last nice things I'm going to say.
1:07
Speaker 3: Bring it on. Yeah.
1:08
Speaker 1: So but here's here's the awesome part about all this.
1:11
Speaker 1: It is Ashley here. See, as we said, I'm the
1:15
Speaker 1: kid that wings it in class. She has prepared notes.
1:18
Speaker 2: I was like, I'm the nerdy one that brings my
1:20
Speaker 2: notes and I'm all organized, and he's like the cool
1:23
Speaker 2: kid that doesn't prepare but still does. Wow.
1:26
Speaker 3: Little world in which I might be a cool kid
1:29
Speaker 3: but I'm not. Yes, well I'm excited, guys. Thank you
1:33
Speaker 3: and a special thanks to Dometic for supporting this week's podcast.
1:37
Speaker 3: It starts with getting out there, but that's only the beginning.
1:40
Speaker 3: We want to make the most of your time out there.
1:42
Speaker 3: You want to stay longer, see more, and experience more.
1:45
Speaker 3: You want to savor the moment and make meaningful memories
1:47
Speaker 3: in the process, whether you're seeking the peace of solitude
1:50
Speaker 3: or connecting with the people who mean the most to you.
1:53
Speaker 3: Our goal at Dometic is to help make those moments
1:55
Speaker 3: and memories possible with products designed to make outdoor living easy.
2:00
Speaker 3: We've been helping people get out there and stay out
2:02
Speaker 3: there longer for decades. Today, Demetic is committed to making
2:05
Speaker 3: the outdoors even more accessible and helping you embrace every
2:09
Speaker 3: moment of your adventure, making memories for a lifetime. So
2:13
Speaker 3: two hosts, one Brady.
2:14
Speaker 2: One hostess. I was just going to say I was
2:17
Speaker 2: hanging out with Paul May recently and asking him a
2:20
Speaker 2: little bit about his history, and he mentioned you coming
2:24
Speaker 2: up to him one day with these pieces of a
2:27
Speaker 2: magazine that you wanted to start. Yes, pieces of paper
2:30
Speaker 2: compiled together in your hands, And I was like, oh,
2:33
Speaker 2: my gosh, I don't know anything about Scott Brady. So
2:36
Speaker 2: I was really inspired to learn more by wolves.
2:42
Speaker 3: Bald wolves, bald wolf. That's why Scott wears a hat.
2:46
Speaker 1: I can't see my ears, but I think there's a
2:48
Speaker 1: lot of people, you know in this industry that kind
2:50
Speaker 1: of got their start through Scott. I mean I was twenty.
2:53
Speaker 1: I think when you first offered me a job. Yep,
2:56
Speaker 1: took a huge chance in me. I mean I wouldn't
2:58
Speaker 1: I would not be who I am today if it
3:00
Speaker 1: wasn't for you, which has been really you are.
3:02
Speaker 3: You are super talented, I found. But why don't you
3:06
Speaker 3: why don't you fire off?
3:07
Speaker 2: Should I go? I'll start my list?
3:08
Speaker 3: Start your list?
3:09
Speaker 2: Okay, let's start with what was your first four wheel
3:12
Speaker 2: drive vehicle.
3:13
Speaker 3: Oh damn, that's what I was going to ask, see you.
3:16
Speaker 2: I prepared, but you were going to wing it, And
3:19
Speaker 2: so I.
3:19
Speaker 3: Have I have a funny story on that. I grew
3:21
Speaker 3: up in southern California and I knew nothing about off
3:24
Speaker 3: road or for al drive. But I had actually seen
3:27
Speaker 3: a magazine cover with a camel trophy on it. I thought,
3:29
Speaker 3: and I was a multi sport athlete at the time.
3:32
Speaker 3: I'm no longer a multi sport athlete, but what sport?
3:35
Speaker 3: So it was triathlons. So I did triathlons for many years.
3:39
Speaker 3: And I see this event called the Camel Trophy, and
3:42
Speaker 3: I was just so inspired by it and I and
3:44
Speaker 3: I realized I wanted to get into fial driving. And
3:47
Speaker 3: buddy of mine had a Jeep and so I went
3:49
Speaker 3: to this dealership and they had this black lifted Zuzu
3:52
Speaker 3: Amigo on the lot and I and I'm thinking this,
3:56
Speaker 3: this is perfect for me. There was two problems. It
3:59
Speaker 3: was a manual train mission, which I didn't know how
4:01
Speaker 3: to drive, and it wasn't actually fuel drive. But the salesman,
4:05
Speaker 3: being a used car salesman, then he was convinced me
4:08
Speaker 3: that for al drive was actually not necessary at all,
4:11
Speaker 3: you know, no it is it is a yeah, a rumor. Yeah.
4:14
Speaker 3: He's like, yeah, he's like, it affects your fuel economy.
4:17
Speaker 3: He's like, look at the tires on this thing. And
4:19
Speaker 3: of course me being I think I was nineteen, Yeah,
4:21
Speaker 3: so uh, it took me about an hour to get
4:24
Speaker 3: it three or four miles home because I didn't know
4:26
Speaker 3: how to drive. I kept stalling in the middle of
4:29
Speaker 3: every intersection on like Ventura Boulevard. So yeah, So my
4:33
Speaker 3: first role drive was not a full drive. It was
4:35
Speaker 3: a tool drive. And that's where I learned the power
4:37
Speaker 3: of momentum, which that was. That was a tough one,
4:40
Speaker 3: but I would say my first, my first true fool
4:42
Speaker 3: drive was an Azuzu Rodeo. So I traded in the
4:46
Speaker 3: Amigo for a thing with Azuzu. I have, I've had,
4:49
Speaker 3: I've had all of these I did. Yeah, they were
4:52
Speaker 3: great cars, names like Ego, Yeahrooper, great cars. They were
4:55
Speaker 3: all super great cars. I wonder if they're still around.
4:58
Speaker 3: So that was my my first foal drive. Would have
4:59
Speaker 3: be and a Zuzer Rodeo. Then you had like a CJ.
5:03
Speaker 3: I did seven when you were in the Air Force,
5:06
Speaker 3: I did. I had actually an M thirty eight A
5:08
Speaker 3: one first, or a very old jeep. Oh yeah, like
5:10
Speaker 3: that the Korean era, Yes, exactly. So I traded in
5:13
Speaker 3: the Rodeo for a Jeep because I figured you had
5:15
Speaker 3: to have a jeep in order to really go off road, which,
5:18
Speaker 3: of course that or jeep was nowhere in nineteen fifty seven.
5:21
Speaker 3: That would have been true. That's true. Yeah, that's true. Yeah,
5:24
Speaker 3: so the Rodeo, of course, could have done that insult better.
5:29
Speaker 3: Well I am, I'm getting there. I'm getting I mean,
5:31
Speaker 3: I'm holding onto my last vestiges of the forties. So yeah,
5:35
Speaker 3: so that's no, that's very true. Yeah. So I had
5:37
Speaker 3: that M thirty eight A one, which I proceeded to
5:39
Speaker 3: ruin by putting too big a tire on and too
5:41
Speaker 3: big of a motor and yeah, yeah, so I did
5:44
Speaker 3: that all wrong. It's like my TJ. Yeah, yeah, exactly,
5:47
Speaker 3: that was my TJ moment.
5:48
Speaker 2: Yeah.
5:49
Speaker 1: So, so born in southern California somewhere after the Civil War,
5:53
Speaker 1: and you were in the Air Force.
6:00
Speaker 3: I was right out of high school just about just
6:03
Speaker 3: after World War Two. Huh. Yeah, So I was fortunate
6:05
Speaker 3: to miss the last of the Great Wars. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, no,
6:08
Speaker 3: but you were stationed in Italy. I was, and that
6:11
Speaker 3: was a big That was a big part of my
6:12
Speaker 3: love for travel, because I had never traveled out of
6:15
Speaker 3: the country. I'd been to Mexico once, I think I
6:18
Speaker 3: helped build a school or something down there in high school.
6:20
Speaker 3: And then I joined the Air Force and the next
6:24
Speaker 3: thing you know, I'm getting sent off to southern Italy
6:27
Speaker 3: during the whole Bosnian conflict in that part of the world.
6:30
Speaker 3: And by the time I had gotten from the airport
6:32
Speaker 3: to the base, I realized, I have no idea what
6:35
Speaker 3: the world is all about. I was so insulated. Twenty
6:39
Speaker 3: years old, twenty Yeah, I celebrated my twenty first birthday
6:42
Speaker 3: in Italy and that's pretty fun. Yeah, especially since I
6:45
Speaker 3: didn't really understand the limits of alcohol consumption at twenty
6:48
Speaker 3: one either, So yeah, no one. Fortunately I didn't end
6:51
Speaker 3: up in an Italian hospital that day. But yeah, so
6:53
Speaker 3: it was it was this experience of going someplace so
6:56
Speaker 3: different but was also so inspiring to me, intriguing, and
7:01
Speaker 3: I felt so curious and open to the idea of
7:03
Speaker 3: learning more about this culture. And being a firefighter in
7:06
Speaker 3: the Air Force, I worked every other day, so I
7:08
Speaker 3: would I would just walk into town, or I would
7:10
Speaker 3: ride a bicycle into town, or if I had a
7:12
Speaker 3: few days off, I would rent a small little car
7:15
Speaker 3: and I'd go drive someplace in Italy. By the time
7:17
Speaker 3: I left Italy, I knew that I wanted I wanted
7:20
Speaker 3: to travel to be a part of my life. I
7:21
Speaker 3: just didn't know how to do it. I didn't know
7:23
Speaker 3: what what I was going to need to do in
7:25
Speaker 3: order to get there.
7:26
Speaker 1: I mean, I think a lot of people kind of
7:27
Speaker 1: go through that same, that same thing as they get
7:29
Speaker 1: they get the first first taste. I think that's always
7:33
Speaker 1: been a misconception. People have always asked me, and I'm
7:36
Speaker 1: sure it's the same things. Assume that because you travel,
7:38
Speaker 1: grew up traveling, Yeah.
7:40
Speaker 3: And I didn't.
7:41
Speaker 2: Yeah, I didn't either.
7:42
Speaker 3: Yeah.
7:42
Speaker 1: I mean I like went to Mexico, like Cancun when
7:45
Speaker 1: I was like seven. Yeah, really familiar with like going
7:48
Speaker 1: to Indiana my dad.
7:49
Speaker 3: My dad always had cool hobbies, like it was hunting
7:53
Speaker 3: or we would go backpacking, and so I was exposed
7:55
Speaker 3: to the outdoors a lot, which I think helped. But no,
7:58
Speaker 3: never travel post air. Tell me about Scotty Post Air Force. Well,
8:02
Speaker 3: that was an interesting it was kind of a frightening transition.
8:06
Speaker 3: I knew I didn't want to stay in the military,
8:08
Speaker 3: and I had completed my four years. I didn't want
8:10
Speaker 3: to go back to southern California either, because I couldn't
8:12
Speaker 3: afford it. I didn't have any money. And so my
8:15
Speaker 3: aunt and uncle had a cattle ranch in Arizona. So
8:17
Speaker 3: they had this huge cattle ranch. There wasn't a lot
8:20
Speaker 3: of the land that they owned themselves. They were mostly
8:22
Speaker 3: leases on the land. So it was fifty something thousand acres.
8:25
Speaker 2: Wow.
8:26
Speaker 3: And my uncle had always been such a positive part
8:29
Speaker 3: of my life growing up. He was the one who
8:31
Speaker 3: taught me how to drive, and I mean really positive
8:34
Speaker 3: part of my life. And so I decided, I'm going
8:36
Speaker 3: to move down and live on the ranch. So I
8:38
Speaker 3: moved down to Arizona. I'm living on the cattle ranch,
8:41
Speaker 3: and I had some chores that I had to do
8:43
Speaker 3: every day. So I'd wake up in the morning and
8:45
Speaker 3: I'd saddle the horse and I'd ride fence line. And
8:48
Speaker 3: we had two Nissan patrols of all things on the ranch,
8:52
Speaker 3: like super old Nissan patrols, and so I'd ride fence
8:56
Speaker 3: line and go check on the cows. And it was
8:58
Speaker 3: actually a wonderful experience. Like I didn't know what to expect.
9:02
Speaker 3: Much like the military, I knew I didn't want to
9:03
Speaker 3: do it forever, but at year and a half that
9:06
Speaker 3: I lived on the ranch was very very special. So
9:08
Speaker 3: I was able to spend a lot of time with
9:10
Speaker 3: my aunt and uncle that I love, and it also
9:12
Speaker 3: I think gave me a very soft landing from the military.
9:15
Speaker 3: And during that period of time, I also had a
9:17
Speaker 3: part time job where I worked security at the Heela
9:20
Speaker 3: Been Auxiliary Field where the very Goldwater Ranges along the
9:24
Speaker 3: Mexican border, El Camino del diablogos right through there. So
9:27
Speaker 3: I worked out there for a period of time doing
9:30
Speaker 3: security stuff out there.
9:31
Speaker 2: Is this a love of vehicles that came gradually or
9:35
Speaker 2: can you look back on early years and point to something.
9:38
Speaker 3: I think that that's an important transition that happened for me.
9:42
Speaker 3: In the very beginning. It was all about the vehicles,
9:44
Speaker 3: and I felt I felt so attracted to the idea
9:47
Speaker 3: of building these trucks up and building these jeeps up,
9:50
Speaker 3: and I worked on them a lot myself. At early
9:53
Speaker 3: and thirty eight a one, I rebuilt it from front
9:55
Speaker 3: to back myself, even though I had no idea what
9:57
Speaker 3: I was doing, but I took the time, and I
9:59
Speaker 3: had people who helped and showed me how to do that.
10:02
Speaker 3: Mike Hancock, one of my earliest friends, showed me how
10:05
Speaker 3: to rebuild things on the jeep. It was very much
10:08
Speaker 3: about the vehicle in the beginning, but I realized by
10:10
Speaker 3: the time I had done that Italy trip that what
10:13
Speaker 3: I was most inspired by was the experience of traveling.
10:17
Speaker 3: That began the transition from me recognizing that I like
10:21
Speaker 3: the vehicles a lot, but I actually at this point
10:24
Speaker 3: in my life, I don't care if I'm walking. I mean,
10:27
Speaker 3: you can't get anywhere very fast walking. So I do
10:30
Speaker 3: still drive vehicles or ride motorcycles, but those two things
10:33
Speaker 3: are really just kind of a magic carpet to those
10:36
Speaker 3: adventures that I want to get to. So that's where
10:38
Speaker 3: that transition happened. But in the beginning I was very
10:40
Speaker 3: much into vehicles. Even all the way through my time
10:43
Speaker 3: in manufacturing, where I was able to afford to go
10:46
Speaker 3: and take courses in driving and do more high performance driving,
10:50
Speaker 3: I focused a lot on speed and driving fast and cars,
10:54
Speaker 3: but I realized that my heart was always being pulled
10:56
Speaker 3: towards the travel side. We call that period corporate Scottie,
11:01
Speaker 3: which it was also an important part of my learning
11:05
Speaker 3: that allowed me to eventually have my own business. So
11:07
Speaker 3: Exhbision Portal was two thousand and five, and before that,
11:11
Speaker 3: when I was actually when I was still working in manufacturing,
11:15
Speaker 3: we made components for airbags, and I was lucky that
11:18
Speaker 3: I had an incredible ass Bob Dewey, that really showed
11:22
Speaker 3: me some insights into leadership. He was such a great
11:25
Speaker 3: teacher about business and he was always so free with
11:28
Speaker 3: thought and information around that. That's when I first started
11:32
Speaker 3: my first blog. So I was just tech savvy enough
11:34
Speaker 3: that I can't even remember where I hosted it, but
11:37
Speaker 3: I started to write a little bit about my trips.
11:40
Speaker 3: The facility closed down because sixty percent of our business
11:44
Speaker 3: was moved to China by the customer. And this company,
11:47
Speaker 3: Lexington Precision, that I worked for, they invited me to
11:50
Speaker 3: go back east and to see their sister division in Rochester,
11:53
Speaker 3: New York, and fortunately for me, they flew me back
11:56
Speaker 3: there in February into Buffalo, New York. Oh love. So
12:01
Speaker 3: imagine living in Arizona, growing up in southern California and
12:04
Speaker 3: coming to negative eight thousand. By the time I had
12:08
Speaker 3: gotten to the rental car ooth, I knew that there
12:10
Speaker 3: was no way I could make that move, and I didn't.
12:13
Speaker 3: I turned down the job, and because they needed to
12:16
Speaker 3: have the building closed down and some transition, I was
12:18
Speaker 3: able to keep some employment, but I didn't have to
12:21
Speaker 3: move to Rochester, New York. And that was when I
12:23
Speaker 3: first started figuring out, like how do I make a
12:25
Speaker 3: living otherwise? And then you started off kind of guiding
12:29
Speaker 3: some trips.
12:29
Speaker 1: I did that was under a lot with Earthromers West
12:32
Speaker 1: Expeditions WES was our first LLC. I was an Expeditions
12:35
Speaker 1: West and yeah you were that's true before we combine
12:38
Speaker 1: the businesses.
12:39
Speaker 3: Yea, yeah, you're right. Yeah. So two thousand and two
12:43
Speaker 3: I bought a land Rover Discovery Too, which was about
12:48
Speaker 3: as big of a mistake as the Amigo. You want
12:50
Speaker 3: to go travel around the world, and let's buy the
12:52
Speaker 3: least rule I mean, and plus I had no idea
12:55
Speaker 3: what I was doing as a traveler, So let's buy
12:57
Speaker 3: the most unreliable land rover ever made. And so I
13:01
Speaker 3: did a trip down to Mexico and barely made it
13:03
Speaker 3: back across the border with the air conditioning compressor almost
13:07
Speaker 3: coming off of the motor. So yeah, that was that
13:10
Speaker 3: was not the best choice. So then I ended up
13:12
Speaker 3: getting that two thousand and four Tacoma, which is when
13:14
Speaker 3: things started to really change. Yeah.
13:16
Speaker 1: I remember that truck it had was it the first
13:17
Speaker 1: truck that had a topographic.
13:19
Speaker 3: Wrap and it was Genie. Yeah, it was Genesis for
13:22
Speaker 3: the overland. It was like I had a top over
13:25
Speaker 3: two thousand and four.
13:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it had a topo map and I remember
13:30
Speaker 1: like I remember seeing this before Exhibition Portal and I
13:33
Speaker 1: saw it Sema or something like, wow, it is a map.
13:38
Speaker 3: It did. It's a map. It's got little lines and
13:40
Speaker 3: top of them totally.
13:43
Speaker 1: And now that's like a horse that's been beat to death.
13:46
Speaker 1: Yeah a thousand times.
13:47
Speaker 3: See. Yeah, it was a great idea. It was the
13:50
Speaker 3: only roof ten at SEMA that year, yeah, which.
13:52
Speaker 1: Is like, I mean now you struggle to not see
13:55
Speaker 1: a roof tent on like a Super Duty with thirty
13:58
Speaker 1: eight inches.
13:58
Speaker 3: On a Super U Yeah, super ud. Yeah, They're everywhere.
14:02
Speaker 3: So so Expedition's West leads to Expedition Portal starting and
14:07
Speaker 3: Expedition Portal was inspired in large part by a forum
14:12
Speaker 3: community called full Drive trips. So there was a group
14:16
Speaker 3: of folks there that I did a lot of traveling with.
14:18
Speaker 3: But the website didn't focus on international travel at all.
14:22
Speaker 3: It didn't it didn't have an international component, and it
14:24
Speaker 3: had a very limited vehicle based component to it, so
14:28
Speaker 3: it was all about planning these trips. So it was
14:30
Speaker 3: about full drive trips and all of my first longer
14:34
Speaker 3: distance backcountry travel was through that forum. I don't know
14:38
Speaker 3: if it's still in existence, hopefully it is, but the
14:40
Speaker 3: people who were on that forum were very fundamental to
14:44
Speaker 3: me learning a lot about this. Having that technology background,
14:47
Speaker 3: I felt comfortable starting my own forum that would include
14:50
Speaker 3: a lot more about vehicles and a lot more about
14:52
Speaker 3: international travel.
14:53
Speaker 2: So it started out as a forum, or it was
14:55
Speaker 2: a forum.
14:56
Speaker 3: There was no editorial on it in the beginning. It
14:58
Speaker 3: was only it was only a community for him, and
15:01
Speaker 3: then I think by the time we hit five or
15:02
Speaker 3: six thousand members, I realized it's probably a good idea
15:05
Speaker 3: to start putting some editorial on there. So at the
15:07
Speaker 3: time I had the website Expeditions West dot com, which
15:11
Speaker 3: was all of my editorial, and I was writing for
15:13
Speaker 3: off Road Magazine, I was writing for four Wheeler, I
15:16
Speaker 3: was writing for other outlets, and I was learning a
15:18
Speaker 3: lot from those folks. I remember when I first got
15:21
Speaker 3: published in Foal Drive and Support Utility, which was a
15:24
Speaker 3: magazine that Phil Howe ran forever, and this guy was
15:27
Speaker 3: He was like a legend to me. I loved his magazine.
15:30
Speaker 3: I loved the way that he emphasized trails and getting
15:33
Speaker 3: out and exploring, and he was also Air Force. He
15:37
Speaker 3: just took a chance on me and let me start
15:39
Speaker 3: writing for his magazine. He was one of the first
15:42
Speaker 3: ones that really helped make that possible.
15:44
Speaker 2: What was some good advice that he gave you about writing?
15:46
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think one of the things that he helped
15:49
Speaker 3: me most was being really organized around the package that
15:52
Speaker 3: I contributed. I found that in those early days that
15:56
Speaker 3: the editors would get most frustrated when things were incomplete,
15:59
Speaker 3: when it didn't have captions, and it didn't have the
16:01
Speaker 3: right images of the right size, and the copy wasn't
16:05
Speaker 3: delivered at the right word county that they asked for.
16:09
Speaker 3: You didn't have a lot of feedback on my writing
16:11
Speaker 3: because I had done a lot of writing in my life,
16:13
Speaker 3: mostly through business. But I think the writing was okay,
16:16
Speaker 3: not great, but it was just it was passable. He
16:18
Speaker 3: was really focused on the packages. So those that are listening,
16:21
Speaker 3: if you want to write for a magazine, deliver a
16:23
Speaker 3: really clean, concise yeah, make it easy on the editor.
16:26
Speaker 3: Matt Maps run magazines in Australia, and I'm sure that
16:29
Speaker 3: you thought, like, you know, this person just delivered me
16:32
Speaker 3: a really tidy package. Thank you, yes for making my
16:34
Speaker 3: life better. You can have the job next time, yeah, exactly. Yeah.
16:38
Speaker 3: Two thousand and six was the start of the or
16:40
Speaker 3: two thousand and five was the start of the Forum.
16:42
Speaker 3: And then in two thousand and six I competed in
16:44
Speaker 3: the Outback Challenge, Yeah, which was the next big step.
16:47
Speaker 1: And you you were the first American to win that. Yeah,
16:50
Speaker 1: and tell us it was the elevator pitch on the
16:52
Speaker 1: Outback Challenge.
16:53
Speaker 3: Well, it started in Australia and it was kind of
16:56
Speaker 3: like the Rebel or kind of like the Dakar in
16:59
Speaker 3: a way, but with more modified vehicles. So it was
17:02
Speaker 3: high speed plus recovery plus very technical terrain and they
17:06
Speaker 3: held it for many years. Also in Morocco, and that
17:10
Speaker 3: was where I competed. A Trese Ryder was my sponsor
17:14
Speaker 3: out of France, and he literally threw me the keys
17:17
Speaker 3: to a land cruiser. They wanted us to go over
17:20
Speaker 3: there and kind of represent the United States. They wanted
17:22
Speaker 3: to have an American competitor, and I don't think that
17:26
Speaker 3: they thought we were to even get our frenchiep. Yeah,
17:31
Speaker 3: so we ended up Nathan Hinman was my navigator. We
17:34
Speaker 3: talked about navigators in the podcast on the Rebel Rally,
17:38
Speaker 3: and Nathan was an absolutely stellar navigator and he never
17:43
Speaker 3: squealed when we were going sideways at one hundred miles
17:45
Speaker 3: an hour down the road, so you know, it was
17:47
Speaker 3: really helpful to have his expertise, and we never broke
17:52
Speaker 3: the truck and we never really got lost, and because
17:55
Speaker 3: of that, we were able to do well in the
17:57
Speaker 3: race and then shortly after that overland. Yes. So by
18:02
Speaker 3: the time Expedition Portal got to maybe twenty or thirty
18:05
Speaker 3: thousand members, I realized like, there's there might be a
18:09
Speaker 3: business here. And I was still working in technology higher
18:14
Speaker 3: education technology at the time to pay bills, but I
18:18
Speaker 3: realized that there might be a real option here for
18:21
Speaker 3: me to make this my life, to finally close that
18:24
Speaker 3: loop on being able to travel. And that was when
18:28
Speaker 3: we started the magazine. So this was late two thousand
18:31
Speaker 3: and six, and I was having a conversation with Jonathan Hansen,
18:37
Speaker 3: and he's one of the most talented writers I've ever seen.
18:41
Speaker 3: And he's also has a lot of specific knowledge around
18:44
Speaker 3: vehicles and overlanding, and he also has like impeccable taste.
18:48
Speaker 3: So yeah, so combining those attributes with my desire to
18:56
Speaker 3: start a publication as well, and we were kind of
19:01
Speaker 3: finishing each other's sentences on what we wanted the magazine
19:04
Speaker 3: to be, and we just went for it. I mean,
19:08
Speaker 3: like I had no idea how to make a magazine
19:10
Speaker 3: and Jonathan had never been a publisher either, so we
19:13
Speaker 3: had the right ingredients and I think maybe it actually
19:15
Speaker 3: helped us that we had no idea what we were
19:17
Speaker 3: doing because we didn't have the we didn't know what
19:21
Speaker 3: you weren't supposed to do, so we just did exactly
19:23
Speaker 3: what we would want a magazine to be.
19:25
Speaker 2: Was it the first so Spring two thousand, Yeah, what
19:29
Speaker 2: was the first issue?
19:30
Speaker 3: Like it was the camp chair one? Right?
19:32
Speaker 2: Was it?
19:33
Speaker 1: Was it the like six hundred dollars because remember from
19:34
Speaker 1: no that was that was in the in journal?
19:37
Speaker 3: Was the six hundred dollars camp Chare magazine? It was?
19:39
Speaker 3: It was Camphares are sitting right there. Actually, yeah, actually
19:44
Speaker 3: it's the same it's the same company. And that's actually
19:47
Speaker 3: a funny thing because it was the six the six
19:49
Speaker 3: hundred dollars camp chairs are the only ones that have
19:50
Speaker 3: lasted for the last fifteen years. Like I still use
19:54
Speaker 3: them on a regular basis. I don't know if it
19:56
Speaker 3: would be a regret, but it was a realization for
19:58
Speaker 3: us that there there is is premium quality and then
20:02
Speaker 3: there's just expensive, and just expensive doesn't have a place
20:05
Speaker 3: in Overland journal. And that was an important lesson for
20:08
Speaker 3: us that we learned from our readers by calling us
20:11
Speaker 3: out of saying like, hey, that's kind of ridiculous, and
20:13
Speaker 3: they were right, it was. It was ridiculous. And there's
20:16
Speaker 3: nothing wrong with featuring something of premium quality that happens
20:20
Speaker 3: to be expensive, because that's what it takes to make it,
20:22
Speaker 3: as opposed to something that's just expensive for being expensive sake.
20:26
Speaker 3: So yeah, exactly, I mean, they're actually still great chairs,
20:31
Speaker 3: but no one needs buffalo hide to accent their canvas
20:35
Speaker 3: sling chair.
20:35
Speaker 2: So do you remember what else was in the Oh
20:38
Speaker 2: my god, I love Cape Buffalo. What was in the
20:44
Speaker 2: first issue? Do you remember, like what kind of articles
20:47
Speaker 2: I do.
20:48
Speaker 3: Graham Jackson had the cover photo and it was Graham
20:51
Speaker 3: Jackson's trip across Africa, and that was an incredible piece.
20:56
Speaker 3: It was a perfect fit for us in the beginning.
20:58
Speaker 3: And then we also had an article in there from
21:01
Speaker 3: Chris Scott, a motorcycle article as well. I don't remember
21:04
Speaker 3: much of the other pieces that are in there. That's
21:06
Speaker 3: actually quite some time ago now that I think about it,
21:08
Speaker 3: but fifteen years ago. So wow, that was before I
21:11
Speaker 3: found Yeah, it was. It was very very early in
21:15
Speaker 3: that smartphone as.
21:17
Speaker 2: Yeah, what did it feel like holding that magazine in
21:20
Speaker 2: your hands? Like the first one printed?
21:21
Speaker 3: Even a little bit better for me was a magazine
21:25
Speaker 3: is printed in Salt Lake by a place called Hudson Printing.
21:28
Speaker 3: And Stephanie Brady, who at my time at the time
21:31
Speaker 3: was my wife now my ex wife, she's still an
21:33
Speaker 3: important part of the business, and we went together to
21:36
Speaker 3: go up to Hudson Printing to go see the magazine
21:40
Speaker 3: come off of the printer and so to watch the
21:42
Speaker 3: pages fly off of this printer at this incredible rate,
21:45
Speaker 3: and to hold the proofs in our hands, and to
21:48
Speaker 3: sit down at their conference room table and proof the
21:51
Speaker 3: magazine and start that relationship with that printer that has
21:54
Speaker 3: continued to today. So Overland Journal is still printed in
21:57
Speaker 3: the United States, and it's still an employee owned business,
22:01
Speaker 3: and it's still all of those things that we started
22:03
Speaker 3: it as. So that was a pretty special experience to
22:06
Speaker 3: see it like they ain't barely dry. Yeah, that was
22:08
Speaker 3: very cool.
22:09
Speaker 2: You've been on a lot of trips and had a
22:11
Speaker 2: lot of experiences. Which one was the most life changing
22:14
Speaker 2: or impactful?
22:15
Speaker 3: Jackie Cheese nineteen ninety two. Yeah, little Billy's birthday. I
22:20
Speaker 3: would say that some of my trips have been very
22:23
Speaker 3: good for me professionally, but they're not always the same
22:27
Speaker 3: ones that changed me personally. I was on a trip
22:31
Speaker 3: and I would say twenty sixteen was a very big
22:33
Speaker 3: year for me and as far as personal transitions. But
22:36
Speaker 3: I had done a trip to Uganda and Kenya. We
22:39
Speaker 3: had some interactions with the Ugandans there that was extremely
22:42
Speaker 3: humbling for me and made me very aware of how
22:47
Speaker 3: fortunate I am in my life in ways that I
22:49
Speaker 3: had never really noticed at that depth before. So I
22:53
Speaker 3: think that was when I started to transition from being
22:57
Speaker 3: a tourist to being more of a traveler. So despite
22:59
Speaker 3: the fact that I had done some very big vehicle
23:02
Speaker 3: based trips prior to that, I felt like I was
23:04
Speaker 3: a stone skipping across the surface of the water and
23:07
Speaker 3: I had never really gotten very deep. So I had
23:10
Speaker 3: managed to cross continents but never really get an understanding
23:14
Speaker 3: of the place, a deep understanding, personal understanding of the place.
23:18
Speaker 3: So that trip to Africa was big for that. And
23:21
Speaker 3: I went on that trip with Brian Bass, who's a
23:23
Speaker 3: great friend of mine. He's been on the podcast a
23:25
Speaker 3: few times, and that was really important to travel with
23:29
Speaker 3: someone like him that sees the world in a very
23:31
Speaker 3: different way, and as an archaeologist and as an anthropologist,
23:34
Speaker 3: he sees it in ways that I would have never
23:36
Speaker 3: been able to see before. And then later that year,
23:39
Speaker 3: I did a motorcycle trip to South America and it
23:43
Speaker 3: was part of a group called Expedition sixty five. So
23:45
Speaker 3: I went down to Peru with the group, and then
23:48
Speaker 3: I left the group in the Andes just by myself
23:51
Speaker 3: on a motorcycle and I worked my way back up
23:54
Speaker 3: to Columbia. So it was the first time I had
23:56
Speaker 3: ever traveled for that long alone, with my own thoughts
24:00
Speaker 3: and very few distractions on a motorcycle because you're fairly
24:03
Speaker 3: really focused on not dying. You don't have a lot,
24:05
Speaker 3: you're not playing with your phone, you just maybe have
24:07
Speaker 3: some music in the helmet. I came to terms with
24:10
Speaker 3: some things that needed to change in my life, and
24:13
Speaker 3: that was like an extremely emotional point for me, because
24:17
Speaker 3: I was all alone coming to terms with all of
24:19
Speaker 3: these things that needed to change in my life, like
24:21
Speaker 3: on the side of the road of Pan American trying
24:24
Speaker 3: to come to terms with the things that I needed
24:26
Speaker 3: to do different. And I think that being on a
24:29
Speaker 3: motorcycle alone is something that it's actually a little bit
24:32
Speaker 3: scary for me to do now because it is very
24:35
Speaker 3: It opens us up to think about our life. Maybe
24:37
Speaker 3: it's meditative in a way. I don't know. I'm not
24:39
Speaker 3: trying to make it sound too esoteric, but I think
24:43
Speaker 3: just being quiet by ourselves at times is a really
24:46
Speaker 3: good idea. And so I had thousands of miles of
24:49
Speaker 3: being quiet and that really resulted in some personal change.
24:52
Speaker 1: And then going back a little bit, I mean, Exhibition
24:55
Speaker 1: seven was a huge thing, a huge accomplishment. But I
25:00
Speaker 1: heard you say that, you know the rock kind of
25:02
Speaker 1: skipping the surface. Yeah, did you did you really enjoy
25:06
Speaker 1: that trip. There were elements that I enjoyed about it
25:08
Speaker 1: a lot. The personal connections that I made. I mean,
25:11
Speaker 1: all that time with Bruce Dorn.
25:13
Speaker 3: And Sinway and you you came along on parts of
25:16
Speaker 3: the trip, and uh, spending time with Greg and his family,
25:20
Speaker 3: and just Kurt Williams now a lifetime friend, and Clay Croft,
25:24
Speaker 3: I mean we you know, we shared the pink room
25:26
Speaker 3: and the brothel in Russia. You know, it's just like
25:29
Speaker 3: you just end up with you just end up with
25:31
Speaker 3: these lifelong friendships and connections. And then if I look
25:36
Speaker 3: at it this way, and and it was actually Arry
25:38
Speaker 3: Andrews that I credit with this shift in my perspective
25:41
Speaker 3: on Expedition seven was I was telling him, like, I'm
25:44
Speaker 3: so focused on all there's all these moving pieces, there's
25:47
Speaker 3: all this that has to happen. I don't feel like
25:49
Speaker 3: I'm really enjoying the travel. And Barry said, that's not
25:52
Speaker 3: what you need to be doing right now. He said,
25:54
Speaker 3: you're going to get a PhD in overlanding by the
25:57
Speaker 3: time you've gone to all seven continents with these vehicles.
26:00
Speaker 3: And I don't mean to assume that I've gotten a PhD.
26:03
Speaker 3: I haven't. I only know five percent what I would
26:06
Speaker 3: love to know. But his mindset was right, is shift
26:10
Speaker 3: the perspective from the fact that you can't be a
26:12
Speaker 3: traveler right now. You're an expedition leader. You have all
26:15
Speaker 3: these people that are counting on you to arrive safely
26:18
Speaker 3: and to accomplish a goal together. So it allowed me
26:21
Speaker 3: to get my focus back on learn everything that I
26:23
Speaker 3: can about going around the world, about Carnes, about shipping,
26:26
Speaker 3: about shipping by air and shipping by boat and shipping
26:29
Speaker 3: by rail. And I got to learn all of those
26:32
Speaker 3: things in great detail because of Expedition seven. So is
26:36
Speaker 3: it the way that I would recommend people see the world.
26:39
Speaker 3: It may be a good way for some people to
26:41
Speaker 3: see it that way, but I would not generally recommend that.
26:44
Speaker 3: I think that you're better off slowing down.
26:45
Speaker 1: It seemed to be a huge transition for you. Is
26:48
Speaker 1: that post E seven or pre seven it was expedition
26:51
Speaker 1: leader Scott. Yeah, post seven, it became traveler Scott, totally desire.
26:55
Speaker 1: It was almost like you kind of ticked the box.
26:58
Speaker 2: Yeah.
26:58
Speaker 1: Probably, you know, on dream vehicle PF scenario this this, this, this, this,
27:04
Speaker 1: and then you just kind of because you pretty much
27:06
Speaker 1: like stopped caring about trucks after that, and you know
27:09
Speaker 1: that's very true perspective.
27:11
Speaker 3: No, that's very true.
27:12
Speaker 2: So what about Greenland then, because that that's the most
27:15
Speaker 2: recent expedition one.
27:17
Speaker 3: Yeah, and Greenland I enjoyed very much because I was
27:22
Speaker 3: in a different role. I wasn't the expedition leader. I
27:24
Speaker 3: had some leadership elements to my role, but it was
27:27
Speaker 3: I was there as a photographer, and I was there
27:29
Speaker 3: as a driver. And also all of us had evolved
27:32
Speaker 3: a lot. We'd all grown as travelers and we all
27:34
Speaker 3: wanted things to be a little different. It was also
27:37
Speaker 3: something that had not only it was it was less
27:39
Speaker 3: of a of like a first in the sense that
27:41
Speaker 3: like Expedition seven was to take the same vehicle to
27:44
Speaker 3: all seven continents, whereas Greenland, like it had never been
27:47
Speaker 3: crossed that way in a vehicle by any means. And
27:51
Speaker 3: there's reasons for that, because it's super difficult to do that.
27:54
Speaker 3: And so that that expedition for me, felt the most remote,
27:59
Speaker 3: the most risk. We had many moments where we recognized
28:03
Speaker 3: that we were at great risk, and that I really enjoyed.
28:06
Speaker 3: I enjoyed that being so far out on the hairy
28:09
Speaker 3: edge that it makes a bunch of things come into focus.
28:13
Speaker 3: And also there were people on the team that were
28:15
Speaker 3: reaching their limits of what they felt was safe, and
28:17
Speaker 3: we were working through that together and there was a
28:20
Speaker 3: lot of trust that we all had to give to
28:22
Speaker 3: each other to continue forward to the goal. The Greenland
28:26
Speaker 3: trip for me was the one of the trips that
28:28
Speaker 3: I've enjoyed the most. It was just incredible to have
28:32
Speaker 3: done that with that group of people, and there was
28:35
Speaker 3: never a crossword spoken despite how intense it was. So yeah,
28:39
Speaker 3: Greenland was different for sure, and I think I had
28:42
Speaker 3: learned a little bit, I had grown a little bit
28:44
Speaker 3: before then too.
28:45
Speaker 2: That was the first that I remember which crossing.
28:47
Speaker 3: It was the first long access crossing access.
28:50
Speaker 2: Okay of Greenland. Yeah cool, Yeah, So.
28:53
Speaker 3: That was really that was amazing. That was really amazing
28:55
Speaker 3: and beautiful.
28:56
Speaker 1: Then you guys did like a double crossing of Oros
28:58
Speaker 1: Sized Shelf and antarcticit su we did.
29:00
Speaker 3: Yeah, So we crossed from the east coast of Antarctica
29:04
Speaker 3: at the Russian Nova severe space all the way to
29:07
Speaker 3: the to the Levertck Glacier of the Ross Eye Shelf,
29:10
Speaker 3: which is the other side of the continent, and then
29:11
Speaker 3: we had to turn around and get back to the
29:13
Speaker 3: other side. So yeah, we ended up doing a double
29:16
Speaker 3: crossing of Antarctica.
29:17
Speaker 1: I remember being in your office that would have been
29:20
Speaker 1: twenty twelve or twenty thirteen, and it's like I just
29:23
Speaker 1: put an anatof on my credit card.
29:26
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, yeah, we literally we needed to hire
29:29
Speaker 3: an Antonov you know. I mean it was actually an
29:31
Speaker 3: ILLUSI an Il seventy seven, so it was what we
29:35
Speaker 3: ended up using. But yeah, amazing, Yeah, amazing And a
29:40
Speaker 3: special thanks to red Arc for supporting this week's podcast.
29:43
Speaker 3: Red arcs toe pro Elite brake controller has been torture
29:46
Speaker 3: tested in the Australian Outback. The dash mounded head unit
29:49
Speaker 3: allows you to switch between proportional for the highway and
29:52
Speaker 3: user controlled for the trails. You may not trust the
29:55
Speaker 3: terrain that you're on, but you can always trust red
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Speaker 3: Ark's toe pro Elite toe with Confidence by Vi read
30:00
Speaker 3: Archelectronics dot com.
30:03
Speaker 2: That's cool to have those experiences, that is, a team
30:06
Speaker 2: on an expedition, but then also contrast with your own
30:09
Speaker 2: personal travel, how you like to travel, plus you know
30:12
Speaker 2: all the other guiding and press trips and that's a
30:15
Speaker 2: lot of experience.
30:16
Speaker 3: It results in a lot of time behind the wheel.
30:18
Speaker 3: I think I finally have let myself be just still
30:23
Speaker 3: enough to start to soak in some of the lessons
30:26
Speaker 3: of travel, and that feels good to me. So like
30:28
Speaker 3: just this sailing trip that I did, being in the
30:30
Speaker 3: middle of the Pacific Ocean, and yeah, I mean that's
30:33
Speaker 3: something drastically Yeah, because of COVID. I mean I had
30:36
Speaker 3: planned on going to Africa. You're going to do an
30:38
Speaker 3: motorcycle yeah, exactly, and all of that was shut down.
30:42
Speaker 3: And Brian McVicker's rusty Ons, who owns the boat, they
30:46
Speaker 3: invited me to come along and just I mean I
30:49
Speaker 3: had no idea what I was doing as far as
30:50
Speaker 3: sailing went, but I learned a lot by the other
30:53
Speaker 3: end of it. Yeah, and then you bought a sailboat.
30:55
Speaker 3: I did buy a sailboat after that.
30:56
Speaker 1: Yeah, she bought a vessel in which you can burn
31:00
Speaker 1: money inside of.
31:01
Speaker 3: The water exactly exactly. I'm learning that very quickly here. Yeah.
31:05
Speaker 3: But no, the sailing is something else, because it is
31:08
Speaker 3: I mean, it's like overlanding, but more difficult. Yeah, and
31:10
Speaker 3: you're more remote. I mean we were a one thousand
31:13
Speaker 3: miles from land at one point in any direction, so
31:16
Speaker 3: you just don't get more remote than that than and
31:18
Speaker 3: being in the middle of the Pacific.
31:19
Speaker 1: Do you see your I mean, so take the Green
31:22
Speaker 1: lind thing and then take the Pacific crossing that you
31:25
Speaker 1: did on the sailboat. Do you see yourself being more
31:27
Speaker 1: driven by more challenging trips in the future, or do
31:31
Speaker 1: you see yourself wanting to travel more and interact more
31:35
Speaker 1: more like your Africa trip in Honda.
31:37
Speaker 3: I think that for me it comes down to or
31:40
Speaker 3: you can do both. Well, in a way, it is both.
31:43
Speaker 3: I find myself wanting to do some bigger motorcycle trips. Well,
31:47
Speaker 3: I'm still healthy, I don't have any injuries or anything
31:50
Speaker 3: like that, and I want there's some things that I
31:51
Speaker 3: want to do on the motorcycle and just really soak
31:54
Speaker 3: up that experience. I'm finding myself less interested in doing
31:57
Speaker 3: something big just because it's big. I want to do
31:59
Speaker 3: something that feels like it would be a learning opportunity
32:02
Speaker 3: for me or the people that I'm traveling with, so
32:05
Speaker 3: that I find myself interested in. I'm also interested in
32:08
Speaker 3: going to places that really haven't been explored that much,
32:11
Speaker 3: just so that we can give a fresh perspective from
32:13
Speaker 3: overland journal and from our own content of a different
32:17
Speaker 3: kind of place than has been traveled to a lot.
32:19
Speaker 3: So I do find myself pretty pretty interested in that
32:22
Speaker 3: kind of thing. Overland Ohio.
32:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, exactly what's on the top of your list.
32:28
Speaker 3: I do want to drive from or ride a motorcycle
32:32
Speaker 3: from probably Cape Town or Johannesburg up to Egypt. I'd
32:36
Speaker 3: like to see that part of Africa. I've seen chunks
32:39
Speaker 3: of it, but I've never kind of strung those along.
32:41
Speaker 3: I've never been to Tanzania, and Matt speaks so highly
32:44
Speaker 3: of that. I'd love to go there. I really liked
32:46
Speaker 3: my time in Kenya and Uganda and South Sudan, so
32:49
Speaker 3: I'd like to continue up that direction a little more.
32:52
Speaker 3: I'd love to see Egypt and the deserts of Egypt.
32:55
Speaker 3: So I'm really excited about that.
32:57
Speaker 1: Sudan's like that northern city area kind of south of
33:01
Speaker 1: the aswan As War and Dan.
33:03
Speaker 3: Yeah, that looks cool and as I understand that the
33:05
Speaker 3: people there are wonderful and I'm just so looking forward
33:08
Speaker 3: to interact.
33:10
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then Ethiopia is also the civil war in
33:14
Speaker 1: the Two Gray region, so.
33:15
Speaker 3: That's that's the way around the Ethiopia problem. Right now
33:18
Speaker 3: is to go through Sudan, So it might be a
33:20
Speaker 3: timing issue. I might need to leave and come back
33:23
Speaker 3: or something like that, but I'll just start the journey.
33:25
Speaker 3: So that's that's a big one for me. There's a
33:28
Speaker 3: good chance that I'll be able to continue on the
33:30
Speaker 3: sailboat through the Northwest Passage or at least part of it,
33:32
Speaker 3: and that sounds that sounds really interesting to me. I
33:35
Speaker 3: would have to say that right now, I'm just really
33:38
Speaker 3: enjoying watching the team produce incredible things. I mean, the
33:42
Speaker 3: team here at Overland International is just they're exceptional in
33:46
Speaker 3: ways that I'll never be exceptional. And to watch them
33:49
Speaker 3: create the content that they're creating at the level of
33:52
Speaker 3: quality that they're creating it and with that level of
33:54
Speaker 3: professionalism and insight is just so fun to watch. So
33:58
Speaker 3: that I'm also enjoying as.
34:01
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, who are these people?
34:04
Speaker 3: Right? So to me, that's another adventure that I'm enjoying
34:08
Speaker 3: is just watching the team rocket.
34:10
Speaker 2: Yeah. What draws you to leadership?
34:12
Speaker 3: I don't know if I'm good at it or not.
34:14
Speaker 3: I do know that for me, it feels natural to
34:17
Speaker 3: be in a leadership role on something like an expedition
34:20
Speaker 3: like that feels very natural to me, and I think
34:22
Speaker 3: that that works works okay with my skill sets. I
34:26
Speaker 3: think that when it comes to leadership within business, I
34:29
Speaker 3: have so much that I would like to do better
34:31
Speaker 3: and be better at. But maybe that's what I enjoy
34:34
Speaker 3: about it, is that I have so much that I
34:36
Speaker 3: can learn about being a better leader and to be
34:39
Speaker 3: a better support to the team in the ways that
34:42
Speaker 3: I can. I have a lot to learn on that front,
34:44
Speaker 3: and I enjoy learning that, So hopefully I'll keep learning.
34:47
Speaker 3: Why overlanding Philly.
34:49
Speaker 2: You kind of answer that already, but.
34:50
Speaker 3: Yeah, we've gone well, I think it is. I think
34:53
Speaker 3: I think that's still an interesting point to explore because
34:56
Speaker 3: when I look at overlanding, to me, it's still should
35:00
Speaker 3: be about vehicle based adventure travel. And maybe that's something
35:03
Speaker 3: that I'm more mindful of now than I have been
35:06
Speaker 3: in years past, is that there's nothing wrong with overlanding
35:08
Speaker 3: becoming big and becoming a big industry and a lot
35:12
Speaker 3: of providing for a lot of families, and it's providing
35:14
Speaker 3: a lot of adventure for people. But I do think
35:17
Speaker 3: that it's important to continue to acknowledge the core values
35:20
Speaker 3: of what that's all about. And even today Ashley and
35:23
Speaker 3: I were in an editorial meeting and we were talking
35:25
Speaker 3: about how do we share information about responsible use and
35:30
Speaker 3: about we're seeing some of the OEMs featuring content that
35:34
Speaker 3: is not just crossing a river, they're driving up the river,
35:37
Speaker 3: and that is not what we want to encourage as
35:39
Speaker 3: an organization or as an industry. So I think as
35:43
Speaker 3: the industry continues to grow, that's an area where I
35:47
Speaker 3: think it is important to remember what Overlanding is about,
35:50
Speaker 3: which is vehicle based adventure travel and overland Journal. When
35:53
Speaker 3: we started it, Jonathan came up with this fantastic tagline
35:57
Speaker 3: that said the environmentally responsible vehicle based Venture Travel magazine.
36:01
Speaker 3: And it doesn't mean that, it doesn't mean anything again esoteric.
36:04
Speaker 3: It just means simply being responsible for these places that
36:07
Speaker 3: we're visiting, taking some ownership in the fact that I'm
36:10
Speaker 3: going to go camping, and let's go in a smaller
36:13
Speaker 3: group so that way we don't expand campsites. Let's take
36:16
Speaker 3: some personal responsibility on Okay, yes, there's some trash in
36:19
Speaker 3: the campsite we just came to. Let's take some ownership
36:21
Speaker 3: over that and clean it up. Let's take an extra
36:22
Speaker 3: five minutes, maybe don't go on to Instagram that morning
36:25
Speaker 3: and take a few minutes to put that trash in
36:28
Speaker 3: a trash bag and haul it away, so that there's
36:31
Speaker 3: some prayer at twenty years from now people will still
36:33
Speaker 3: be able to do this. And so I think that
36:36
Speaker 3: when you talk about what why overlanding, I think for
36:39
Speaker 3: me it was this beautiful confluence for Scott Brady. For me,
36:42
Speaker 3: this beautiful confluence of adventure and vehicles and exploring and
36:47
Speaker 3: the unknown and risk was the combination of all of
36:51
Speaker 3: those things that really fed me.
36:52
Speaker 1: So it's you know, I think, when approached in the
36:55
Speaker 1: right way, overlanding can kind of be that last last
36:58
Speaker 1: element of like the modern days. Yeah, you know, it's
37:01
Speaker 1: like you can be explore or you can play Explore
37:04
Speaker 1: on overland you can have both sides.
37:07
Speaker 3: Sure, right, And there's nothing wrong with that. I mean,
37:09
Speaker 3: I still play explorer. I still go car camping, I
37:12
Speaker 3: still go four wheeling. Still, I still do things that
37:15
Speaker 3: would not traditionally be considered overlanding, and I just call
37:18
Speaker 3: them what they are. Like I'm going to go camping
37:20
Speaker 3: this weekend. Whatever, I'm going to go car camping.
37:24
Speaker 2: So it must be so interesting to see the change though.
37:27
Speaker 2: I know since we started in twenty thirteen, you know,
37:30
Speaker 2: we had a rooftop ten and everybody would come to
37:33
Speaker 2: the campground bye and be like, what is that thing?
37:36
Speaker 2: Can I see it? Like what's going on? And now
37:38
Speaker 2: it's hard not to see a rooftop ten. So I'm
37:41
Speaker 2: curious what you've seen and how everything's changed now and
37:45
Speaker 2: where you think it's going.
37:46
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's been a lot of change. One of the
37:48
Speaker 3: things that's been positive recently is people are using more
37:51
Speaker 3: payload appropriate vehicles. So we're seeing a lot more full
37:53
Speaker 3: sized trucks, which is good. So the traditional choices for
37:57
Speaker 3: overlanding when we were using ground tents was line, but
38:00
Speaker 3: once you load them up with ten thousand pounds of stuff,
38:02
Speaker 3: they're no longer safe for appropriate. So we're starting to
38:04
Speaker 3: see a lot more full sized vehicle So that's been
38:07
Speaker 3: a change. I think that's been positive as well. I
38:09
Speaker 3: also think that we're going to start to see some
38:11
Speaker 3: counterculture around the more stuff is better and people are
38:15
Speaker 3: going to start to realize that they don't need eighty
38:18
Speaker 3: percent of the things that they have on their vehicle
38:21
Speaker 3: and that what did they give up in order to
38:22
Speaker 3: have it? Look that way for Instagram, like what did
38:25
Speaker 3: they give up in their personal life? How much debt
38:27
Speaker 3: did they go into to have that stuff on their vehicle?
38:30
Speaker 3: What trips did they not go on because it's spent
38:33
Speaker 3: so much money on the things that are bolted to
38:35
Speaker 3: their car. So I suspect that there will start to
38:38
Speaker 3: be this clarification of the fact that you don't need
38:41
Speaker 3: any of it to go around the world, and that
38:43
Speaker 3: people have gone around the world with none of it,
38:46
Speaker 3: and it's very feasible to If travel is important to you,
38:50
Speaker 3: then make that be where you put your emphasis. If
38:53
Speaker 3: the vehicle stuff and all the gadgets is important to you,
38:55
Speaker 3: then go for it. Like there's no there's nothing wrong.
38:57
Speaker 3: There's not a right or a wrong. It's just if
39:00
Speaker 3: travel is the most important, just remember that you don't
39:03
Speaker 3: need any of it to go see the world, go
39:05
Speaker 3: around the world. There's been a few times in my
39:08
Speaker 3: travels where a highly modified, modified vehicle was necessary, only
39:12
Speaker 3: a few times.
39:13
Speaker 1: I think the van life thing is kind of becoming interesting. Yeah,
39:17
Speaker 1: you know, they're they're more about I guess the comfort
39:19
Speaker 1: on what's inside.
39:20
Speaker 3: You know, they're not all crazy done up, that's true. Yeah, yeah,
39:24
Speaker 3: there's a lot of us that are just aspiring to
39:25
Speaker 3: be homeless and living someplace really really beautiful. So much
39:30
Speaker 3: not really yeah, you know, yeah, you want to be
39:33
Speaker 3: not in a home in a city. You want to
39:35
Speaker 3: be in your home on wheels out someplace beautiful. Yeah. Yeah.
39:38
Speaker 1: And technology and society is just allowing more and more.
39:41
Speaker 3: People totally facilitates, you know.
39:43
Speaker 1: And we've had the conversation about like Starlink and Tesla
39:46
Speaker 1: and I think Horizon just partnered with Amazon Satellite.
39:50
Speaker 3: Pretty soon you're going to be able to be anywhere. Yeah,
39:52
Speaker 3: and you you can have that.
39:54
Speaker 1: But along with being able to be everywhere comes the
39:56
Speaker 1: equalizer of internet all around the world.
39:58
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that'll be that's a different conversation. Yeah, it's
40:01
Speaker 3: happening right in front of our eyes. Yeah, don't underestimate technology.
40:05
Speaker 3: So well, what's one what's one thing? What's the last
40:08
Speaker 3: thing people should should know about Scott Brady? For me,
40:12
Speaker 3: there is this there's a survivorship bias that I have
40:14
Speaker 3: because I've gone I've done this for twenty years. So
40:17
Speaker 3: it's this idea that the steps that I took along
40:20
Speaker 3: the way resulted in this outcome. But it's literally just
40:23
Speaker 3: dumb luck. I mean, it's it's it's the fact that
40:26
Speaker 3: I stayed tenacious about it, and it's there's a survivorship
40:29
Speaker 3: bias at the other end of it to say like, oh,
40:32
Speaker 3: it's not about the travel. It's I mean, it's not
40:34
Speaker 3: about the stuff. It's about the travel. But that's I've
40:37
Speaker 3: learned that by buying too much stuff about the travel.
40:39
Speaker 3: You heard this here exactly, But I mean I started
40:43
Speaker 3: off with an overloaded Tacoma that I spent too much
40:46
Speaker 3: money on, and so it's I'm looking back on those
40:49
Speaker 3: mistakes that I've made. So it's not like that I
40:52
Speaker 3: have some well of wisdom. It's just like I have
40:54
Speaker 3: a well of failures that resulted in me now knowing that, Like,
40:58
Speaker 3: it's not about the truck, and it's not about the gear.
41:00
Speaker 3: That's because I had the trucks and I had the gear.
41:03
Speaker 3: So maybe if someone listening can hear that, like, to
41:06
Speaker 3: you cut out some of the mistakes that I've made
41:08
Speaker 3: along the way to get to whatever your goal is
41:10
Speaker 3: a little more quickly. I think that might be helpful.
41:13
Speaker 2: A one more question, because you ask this question every
41:16
Speaker 2: single guest, what's your favorite book?
41:20
Speaker 3: Can you read?
41:21
Speaker 2: Turning the table. It's gonna be a hard one. I'm
41:24
Speaker 2: assuming maybe it's gonna be an easy one.
41:26
Speaker 3: I do. I do love to read nonfiction. I don't
41:29
Speaker 3: read much fiction timely to this podcast. One of the
41:33
Speaker 3: few fiction books I read was Doune and that's now
41:37
Speaker 3: the movie, and that's now out and I have not
41:39
Speaker 3: seen it yet and I'm very excited to go see it.
41:41
Speaker 3: But that was, go, we could do it. Let's go
41:43
Speaker 3: a double date. Let's do it. Let's go, let's go
41:46
Speaker 3: a triple date. I was like, why can't I go exactly?
41:50
Speaker 1: I don't know if Theyresians in Sorry Canadians, You're just
41:55
Speaker 1: too nice.
41:55
Speaker 2: November nine.
41:57
Speaker 3: Yeah, So that so the movie's out. So that was
42:00
Speaker 3: on the fiction book, that was one that I really enjoyed.
42:04
Speaker 3: I'm definitely not going to say Desert Solitaire or a
42:07
Speaker 3: Monkey Wrench Gang because I have actually not read either
42:09
Speaker 3: of those. Of the nonfiction books that I like, there's
42:12
Speaker 3: one that I think has been one of the more
42:15
Speaker 3: impactful for me, and it's called Stillness is the Key.
42:18
Speaker 3: It's written by Ryan Holiday. I've listened to it many times,
42:22
Speaker 3: I read it in print many times, and it helps
42:26
Speaker 3: to remind me when I'm traveling to be present, to
42:29
Speaker 3: be as much in the moment as I can, because
42:31
Speaker 3: otherwise it's in my nature to be in the middle
42:34
Speaker 3: of an adventure, a wonderful adventure, and to be thinking
42:37
Speaker 3: of what the next adventure will be, or what the
42:39
Speaker 3: next day will hold or whatever. So that has been
42:42
Speaker 3: a really important lesson for me that I again, I'm
42:45
Speaker 3: only starting to scratch the surface on understanding and learning
42:48
Speaker 3: about that, but finding those moments of stillness, which means
42:52
Speaker 3: being present in whatever you're doing. And if you think
42:55
Speaker 3: about just the word present, it is a gift. Present
42:58
Speaker 3: means a gift, and that moment is a gift for
43:00
Speaker 3: us to be fully aware of and fully present in.
43:04
Speaker 3: And that's what I'm learning to do. So I'm less
43:06
Speaker 3: of a stone skipping across the surface, and I'm going
43:08
Speaker 3: a little deeper in the places that I go to,
43:10
Speaker 3: and that I'm being more present with the people in
43:12
Speaker 3: my life. You know, my mom is struggling with an
43:16
Speaker 3: illness that like every moment that I have with her,
43:19
Speaker 3: it is so important me being a little more still
43:22
Speaker 3: in my life and not always grasping at whatever comes next.
43:25
Speaker 3: That's been an important one.
43:27
Speaker 2: For me, big lessons, big life life lessons.
43:29
Speaker 3: Well, and thank you both too. I mean, you guys
43:32
Speaker 3: have allowed for this podcast to be as successful as
43:36
Speaker 3: it has been. And I would not be here without
43:39
Speaker 3: an entire team of people without again Jonathan's writing skills
43:43
Speaker 3: and his taste, and Stephanie's design and her taste. And
43:47
Speaker 3: we wouldn't be doing this today without Paula and her
43:50
Speaker 3: being the producer that she is the of the podcast.
43:52
Speaker 3: And yeah, yeah, I mean Brian McVicker's was our first
43:58
Speaker 3: employee and he's been a friend the entire time. We've
44:02
Speaker 3: worked together for nearly two decades, so awesome. Yeah. So
44:06
Speaker 3: I have been the lucky recipient of the success of
44:09
Speaker 3: an incredible group of people. So again it's there's that
44:12
Speaker 3: survivorship bias, like I've made it to this other end
44:16
Speaker 3: because of those amazing folks.
44:18
Speaker 1: So well, thank you for coming making the time to
44:20
Speaker 1: come on your podcast. I am your co host. No,
44:26
Speaker 1: but seriously, you know, I think you've changed a lot
44:28
Speaker 1: of people's lives. You've certainly changed thinking, and you know,
44:30
Speaker 1: thanks for all the opportunity over the years. And totally yeah,
44:33
Speaker 1: I think it's it's cool to have a chat so
44:35
Speaker 1: people can get to it's a Scottie Nut, scott Birdie
44:38
Speaker 1: Expedition leader, and on that and on that bombshell Yeah
44:44
Speaker 1: I'm that. Tune in next time. Thank you all for listening.