Latest / The Gill Athletics Track and Field Connections Podcast / #192: Erik Jenkins-University of South Florida

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#192: Erik Jenkins-University of South Florida · The Gill Athletics Track and Field Connections Podcast

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  Track and field coach, the ones that point
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  people most every season. He's the voice of reason.
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  Speaking, the growth gotta prep for you carry the load.
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  Talk to the stove. For those of us, stay on the go
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  pop, the handle, staying in the zone.
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  What you packing for the role is more than one way to go taking
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  those tests. And you told it ain't practice
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  it before it became clear. You can't happen to you.
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  Listen with both ears, can't Mentor, without a mentor, kids
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  of experience, you can reinvent those kids.
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  Every plans got to stand and deliver in the price sacrifice,
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  can you give up Hugh its choice and to fight not to win or lose?
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  It's not a boy, but if I see, y'all can make more movies, not
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  about how to All about why you don't know what you're you know
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  who you are inside. Six, many ways to die.
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  She's not absorb. Your faults Finish Line.
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  The work ain't done. So we learn from the experts to.
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  Y'all got to put in the legwork Gil athletic shoes Network.
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  It's all about Connections put together for the profession to
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  every track coach could be blessed.
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  Hey welcome back to the Galapagos connections podcast,
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  the podcast that uplifts and honors coaches from around the
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  world, really. We obviously, we focus here in
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  domestically in the United States but it's amazing.
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  Some of the international coaches that we've been so
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  blessed to have here and really blessed to have today's guest.
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  But before I get to the introduction here, I'm just
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  curious. This is our fifth episode of
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  Season 4. I can't believe we're in season
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  4, by the way. Quite amazing.
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  And it's all because of you being here and listening If you
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  didn't listen we couldn't record any wouldn't it wouldn't matter,
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  but it's a true Testament to the coaches that we have and their
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  Journeys in this amazing profession.
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  So this is episode 5, I'm curious, I'd like to hear more
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  feedback, I've had some feedback, I'd like to hear more
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  feedback from you about our new intro song.
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  This is the first season that we've actually had kind of intro
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  song to the podcast. It's amazing.
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  I love it but it doesn't matter. I don't listen to podcast, I
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  just make the podcast. I want to know what you think
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  about the intro song. So hit me up on At my Cunningham
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  or you can email me, literally just Google.
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  Might Cunningham Galaxy mail and that'll pop my email address up
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  if you don't have it but I'd like to hear from you and what
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  you think about the interest on, okay, enough jibber-jabber about
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  songs and singing, maybe I'll get today's guest to maybe,
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  we'll talk some songs and see what kind of music.
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  He likes to help me welcome from the University of South Florida,
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  the head coach, the director of track and field, mr.
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  Eric Jenkins. Eric, how are you sir?
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  I'm doing quite well. How are you?
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  I am freaking fantastic, you know.
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  I get that question a lot everywhere I go and when you sit
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  back and think about what I do for a living, there is nothing
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  but fantastic to describe it, man.
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  I get to do this. I get to talk to wonderful
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  people like you who choose to do amazing things, as a track and
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  field coach man. So how how does it get any
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  better? There's only one way it gets
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  better, to be you to be natural track coach man.
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  I hung that the the whistle of a long time ago.
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  My friend and left it to better people, man.
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  How how is life in Tampa, man? Hi is Tampa?
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  See is January what, 10th whatever it is today and will
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  probably get up to the upper 70s.
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  So lots of sunshine, Happy People Tampa.
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  So I lived in the Tampa st. Pete area think it was
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  kindergarten kindergarten or first grade.
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  All I can remember is the elementary school.
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  I went to where the Pelicans. That's all.
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  I remember for some reason, I actually tried to go back as
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  down in the area years ago. Now maybe 10 years ago, I tried
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  to find my elementary school and I couldn't find it.
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  It's grown a little bit in the 30 years that I was gone.
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  Yeah, and now my goddaughter, she's from Chicago.
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  She is a freshman at the University of Tampa down there,
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  when she was looking at schools. And I was like, yeah, I was
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  like, I was like, I know what a pretty well, there's some good
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  schools, there is a good place. I told her about the famous,
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  what is it? Roughly 2 o'clock, 3 o'clock
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  every day. Showers the reins at come down
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  for like five minutes and then it's sunny and gone.
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  Yeah, it's beautiful right love. Of it.
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  I love it yet. Well Eric, let's before we get
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  more into Tampa, we're going to learn more about Tampa and
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  University of South Florida and the good things that you're
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  doing there. Let's kind of get in our way
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  back machines and go back. I'm always curious coaching is
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  has been assuming that you were an athlete.
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  Has always for a long time. As you were growing up with
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  something that was done to you. A coach would tell you go do
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  this, go run this, throw this whatever.
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  At some point in your life, the switch had to flip And you were
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  like, wait a minute. I actually, I could be that,
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  like, that could be my job. We're just coaching.
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  Start for you. Coaching started for me,
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  postgraduate. I never wanted to be a coach.
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  I found myself thinking about being Corporate America, corner
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  office, nice suits, big cars, you know, living the life just A
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  corporate guy, but I went to graduate school and my coach at
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  the time, you know, I actually left Kentucky, and was looking
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  for which direction I want to go, as far as grad school and he
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  gave me a call and said, hey, have you made a decision what
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  you want to do? I said, well, kind of narrowing
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  things down and he said, well, what about if I pay you to come
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  back and be my graduate assistant?
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  I was like, well, these place I'm looking at, I'll probably
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  have to pay some money to get a masters.
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  Degree and see how much you're paying coach.
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  He said, I'll take care of you. I was on the first thing,
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  smoking back to Bowling Green Kentucky.
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  And that started my coaching career, helping my coach who has
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  so much respect for, and he done so much for me and my life as a
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  young adult. And I just looked at as a way
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  to, you know, I honestly get a masters degree but just to help
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  coach because I knew coach needed help being able to manage
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  the program or so, in whatever capacity I can help him, that's
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  what I was going to do. And so, as I wrapped up my
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  graduate degree found myself saying, you know what, I kind of
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  like working with these these people.
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  Now I kind of see the headaches that I gave coach, and how to
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  kind of, you know, move through the world and deal with people
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  on a lot of different levels. So it was something that kind of
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  caught me probably like that the end of my master's degree, but I
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  definitely was not looking forward to being coach.
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  I didn't even start running track until my senior year in
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  high school. So track and field was very,
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  very new to me. It was a means to an end but God
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  has continued to lead my path. And here I am.
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  Oh so many years later, the head coach at the University of South
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  Florida. So a lot to unpack there, you
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  know, the name of the podcast is the Gil connections podcast and
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  that was done. Very purposefully we almost
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  called it the shout-out podcast because we want to shout out
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  other people who was this coach that meant so much to you that
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  you were willing to just get right back on the Bus, so to
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  speak, to go back to Bowling Green and help him out.
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  That was dr. Curtis long had been at Western
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  Kentucky. Oh gosh.
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  So when he retired in 2008, he'd been there for 28 years as the
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  head coach, his stops previous to that where the University of
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  Georgia, where he was an assistant in prior to that for
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  the state and unique thing about Coach long and Florida State
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  coach long was one of the long brothers and their dad.
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  I was the head coach at Florida State, Mike loong who track is
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  named after. And so at one point, I believe
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  there was a long at the helm or within that program 450
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  continuous years at Florida State and so I had the pleasure
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  of working with dr. Curtis long at Western Kentucky
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  University in Bowling Green and also had the pleasure of knowing
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  his brother and being able to learn from him and that was
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  Terry long while he was still at Florida State.
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  So I didn't know. I didn't know that connection.
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  I knew the Long's very famously, it in Tallahassee for Florida
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  State. I've known dr.
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  Curtis long for quite a while because when you said his name
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  was like, oh yeah, he was Western Kentucky, try mean,
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  that's when you thought Western Kentucky, Truck, you thought dr.
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  Curtis Lon. I did not put the two and two
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  together that that was family. That's so awesome.
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  So you mentioned going into college that you it wasn't like
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  oh yeah I want to be a coach or specifically I want to be a
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  track coach you just started running your senior year.
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  What did you actually go to West?
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  Kentucky for undergrad. What did you actually end up?
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  Getting your undergrad in mass communication and radio and
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  television broadcasting? Oh yeah, I grew up 10 miles west
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  of Tallahassee, in a little small town called Quincy,
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  Florida. Okay.
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  So, you know, I started running track really on a bed, had a
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  good friend of mine at the time we were in class and, you know,
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  he was on the track team and the high school, I went to the track
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  team was very, very successful. They fight, they just want to
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  state meet previous to that, and Coach Pelham, I believe during
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  his 25 year. Run had never finished under
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  District champion at Quincy, Shanks, high school.
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  So my uncle's ran from everybody in the community ran for him.
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  So he was, you know, a living legend.
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  And so I decided my senior year to go out and very unique story.
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  I try to go out early in the year but coach told me, he
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  doesn't want old. He is in his program.
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  He wanted me young so he could train him through his system.
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  Now I can understand what you mean so one morning I was racing
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  a guy in my class down the middle of the sidewalk.
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  Now we had a rule at a time that there was no running in the
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  hallway sidewall so on and so forth.
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  But I rode the bus at that time and so I remember coming around
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  getting off the bus and I thought a fight was happening.
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  Everybody was standing Around and of course, my classmate was
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  out there talking, and he was like, I told you I'll be waiting
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  for you so on and so forth. So we take off running down the
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  middle of Campus. I beat him by the way, and this
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  was a day when pull, not sure. I assumed you were telling this
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  story if you lost. No, no.
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  I can probably call his name right now.
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  We give him a call, he still remembers but I'll leave that to
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  another day, but Say all that we ran, we happen to run right into
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  the assistant principal who was also the assistant track coach
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  and he gave me an ultimatum. He's like you can do in school
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  suspension, or you can come with me and let's go talk to
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  somebody. Now, let's see.
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  I had cousins who worked in the school.
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  Everybody knew my grandfather, so it was like, this is not
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  going to be good. So, whatever the alternative is
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  I'm going with this, when you Took me out to the track coach
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  and Coach problem turns around looks at me.
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  He said, I thought, I told you not to come out here.
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  I we're full, we don't need anybody else.
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  And my assistant coach, who was coach gay, who was coach, pull
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  them to the side until this day. He won't tell me what he said
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  and Coach Pearl and turns around.
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  Say, alright, I give you a chance.
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  So he puts me on the line in the middle of a time trial, And I
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  have to race some of the guys who own the team previously and
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  I won. So, I don't know. 100 meters
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  from 200 meters, from whatever. I just run a layout.
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  He comes over looks down at me. Keeps me on the first to get up
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  and get on the bus and be back tomorrow.
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  That was my introduction to track and field.
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  So you weren't you said, you don't know, 100, from a 200.
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  So you weren't a track-by-track kid.
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  He didn't know, you weren't reading track and field news.
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  You weren't looking up to, you know, probably around this time.
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  The Carl Lewis and things that none of that you were like, you
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  know, track only because he was in Olympics, if they don't
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  Olympics. You know, you watch the Summer
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  Olympics, right? It was pretty much the extent of
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  track and field. Other than I knew, my uncle had
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  this huge trophy in my grandma, grandmother's house where he won
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  the 300 hurdles at a big invitation, he also won the
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  state meet his mother things. So he had all these things going
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  so I knew that sure. I grew up playing baseball.
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  Yeah. Well, I was going to ask.
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  Yeah. Okay.
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  Yeah, but very, very blessed to have that chance.
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  Encounter. And until this day, I credit my
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  opportunities from me just happened to run into, coche,
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  guay him, taking me over and then during my high school
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  short, high school team because I went out and February
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  statement was an April. Hmm.
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  And so I made the finals or 400 finish second in the long, jump
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  running football for that one, the meat and we actually won the
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  state meet as a team that you're so very very thankful for those
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  opportunities. And the rest is history.
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  You know, today we have the luxury of experience and looking
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  back and you know, hindsight's 20/20 it's amazing to me here is
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  think you said it, you know, chance encounter its this is it
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  easily could have not gone this way.
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  You could have been sick that day and not rode the bus.
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  You could have not raised, you could have lost their race,
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  whatever, right? But because of that, it led to
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  this amazing seeing journey. I mean, this is like, you look
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  back. That there was a small fork in
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  the road and you easily could have taken the other side of the
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  road there. And instead it led to running at
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  Western Kentucky and now a career and I mean, that is to
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  me, that's phenomenal. At the time.
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  You thought nothing of it. You're at the time you're
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  probably thinking I just want to beat the kid.
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  That's that's my only thought, right?
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  Oh and I don't know. I don't want to get in trouble.
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  I don't want to go to in-school. Suspension.
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  Okay. That's all I want to do.
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  How do I get rid of that? I mean, that is, that's really
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  quite phenomenal. Nominal man, that's amazing.
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  Yeah and when you talk about Connections, my high school
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  coach who said I'm quite a few you know athletes to school over
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  the years you know you're getting you know your letters
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  and all those type of things and we had a assistant coach at a
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  time who was a, who had been a professional football player.
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  He also ran track in high school but he would come back and all
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  season help out during track season, when he was, you know,
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  all season and He told me something that still going to
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  this day. He said, go somewhere where you
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  wanted to go somewhere where you can learn.
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  He was like, you getting some of these offers but you're just not
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  ready. And at first, I was like, what
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  do you mean? I'm not ready.
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  He was like, you're not ready. He said, you have a lot to learn
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  and then my coach at head coach at a time.
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  Put me, he said, you really need to go somewhere again where you
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  can learn. I don't like what he and the
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  system must be talking something and several offers came.
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  By and Western Kentucky with the only one that I really didn't
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  entertain. Because I was like, I never
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  heard of that. You know, you heard these other
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  ones, but my coach said, listen, he's a good man, and it's a
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  great place for you to go and continue to grow.
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  And so, Western Kentucky is please.
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  I didn't visit, but I did my research, I did my research on
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  the coach, and when my parents talked to Coach long, They felt
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  comfortable. And the thing that stood out to
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  me about Coach long was coach, long was only person when I talk
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  to Anna. Never talked about going to the
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  Olympics, doing all of these type of grandiose things and
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  track and field. He talked about getting an
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  education from Western Kentucky. He talked about being a his, you
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  know, kids, they will go to West Kentucky and all the time.
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  He just looked at that University.
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  If he's talking about you coming there, he was fully invested and
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  that's something that meant a lot to me.
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  And I went there as a freshman and Gosh, 20 plus years later.
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  I was still in that system at Western, Kentucky University
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  enjoying the benefits of it. Because of that opportunity, he
• 16:27
  took and he and my high school coach were actually classmates
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  at for the state. So, that was their connection.
• 16:35
  That's a heck of a story when you think about recruiting today
• 16:38
  and, you know, I'm obviously pretty influenced and involved
• 16:44
  in Twitter. And so I see a lot of, you know,
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  athletes and coaches. And Why did the kid choose
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  their? Why didn't they choose here in?
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  This will school would have been better and it's like well that's
• 16:54
  that's your reason not the kids reason, you know, the kid has to
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  make the decisions. And so it's interesting to hear
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  that you know, no visit didn't try to pump you up and talk
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  about Olympics and all this kind of stuff.
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  And it was like, hey man, you going to come here, you'll be a
• 17:07
  better athlete and you'll have a degree like, okay, well, that
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  sounds pretty important. It was and for me being so new
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  to the sport, I see this Bureau home, but I feel like we're
• 17:20
  about when I was going to be good.
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  Just give me something because I came from a place where it was a
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  concrete track, it had red clay all over it.
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  So when it rained, it went from being a 3/4 Lane, concrete
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  track, to being about a half a lane, and you had to be really
• 17:38
  good about learn how to run that half a lane.
• 17:40
  Because if you step down that red clay, you probably won't go
• 17:43
  sliding right into the heel. So, so I didn't come from much
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  as far as that. That, but I really appreciate
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  it. The opportunity and until this
• 17:53
  day, I'm very, very thankful for the opportunities that have been
• 17:56
  afforded to me from this sport. So I'm always curious to you go
• 18:00
  to Western Kentucky, you get your undergrad there, and mass
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  communications, you're obviously well on your way into a TV
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  career that for you, right? But you come do you come back
• 18:11
  immediately Into The Graduate assistants program?
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  Or was there any time in between say May or June when your senior
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  season was over and then The fall.
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  You start graduate assistant coaching?
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  Yeah. So it was roughly four months.
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  Yeah. And it was like, all right, this
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  opportunity. I just can't pass it.
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  Let's turn around and go right back to a play.
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  And if anybody knows me for back in those days, I was like, you
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  know what, I'm graduated I am out of Bowling Green, Kentucky,
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  and Bowling Green, Kentucky is a wonderful place, but, you know,
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  just just not the Hub of excitement for young person.
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  So, so for me, it was strictly about working and getting the
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  education and further my education, and then once I got
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  into coaching just coaching, so I'm always curious when an
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  undergrad goes into any kind of, whether it's a volunteer
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  coaching position, assistant coaching position or a graduate
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  assistant position at their alma mater.
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  Because you said about four months.
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  So within four months, you go from hanging with your friends,
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  your buddies, you know, Friday night, Xbox games, whatever 24
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  months later. You can't, you don't, you
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  shouldn't, I guess I should say, do that.
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  You have to. There has to be a separation as
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  you go into coaching. How did you handle that?
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  You know, you go from one day being being, you know, almost a
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  boy. That's how I would say, you
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  know, from Alabama, being boys to, hey, I got to tell you when
• 19:38
  to line up and what times you got to hit.
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  And, you know, if you, if you're late.
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  I got to do something, whatever, blah, blah, blah.
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  How did you handle that transformation for you?
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  They didn't change their still. Undergrads you changed and now
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  coach. How did you handle that?
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  Well, the good thing for me is I had an older experienced coach
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  Alexei, the coach long. It's been there for quite some
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  time, so me coming in and a lot of the guys that I was on a team
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  with, they were graduating out, we'd all graduated out.
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  So it was a very, very young team as I started as a graduate
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  assistant. So, for me, it was, he's the
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  boss guys were going to follow his orders and it was always Is
• 20:18
  kosher. What do you want me to do?
• 20:21
  And I just believe that he was put in that position for a
• 20:24
  reason and it is my job. My opportunity to make him look
• 20:30
  good at what he does. So it wouldn't matter what he
• 20:33
  said do, I was going to do it because he was the boss, this is
• 20:37
  his ship, I was going to be a good soldier.
• 20:41
  So sounds like a lot of guidance from dr.
• 20:43
  Long to his cheese because on a smaller school, which, you know
• 20:48
  what? Your Kentucky especially back
• 20:49
  then would have been considered a smaller school would have been
• 20:52
  roughly. What year was this roughly ha
• 20:55
  ha. So this would have been 2000.
• 20:57
  Yeah okay so I was at Troy University around 99 2000 right
• 21:02
  around there so you know, very small not a lot of full-time
• 21:05
  coaches. So a ga had a lot of autonomy,
• 21:08
  right? In fact, our whole distance
• 21:09
  Squad was always coached at that point by G, A so it was like, go
• 21:13
  whatever you do. You do?
• 21:14
  You know, we got other things, we got to do so, but they're the
• 21:17
  situation. Like a lot of oversight from dr.
• 21:21
  Long with your, your coaching, because he so it sounds like
• 21:23
  almost like he was coaching you to be a coach, not just.
• 21:26
  All right. You, you know what the Playbook
• 21:27
  is? You were here with me for four
• 21:28
  years, go, he really kind of helped you and maybe molded you.
• 21:32
  Yeah. So he helped me in
• 21:34
  administrative side of things and understanding how to work
• 21:36
  with people, you know, I was there.
• 21:40
  But when I got there, we didn't have a spring coach.
• 21:42
  I mean, coach, Mom, did everything in every country
• 21:45
  coach throws code distance coaching.
• 21:46
  So when he Brought me back. He was like, all right, there
• 21:51
  you go, I'll show you how to do it.
• 21:53
  And I spent so much time in his office when he was at
• 21:57
  cross-country practice, I would leave and go to cross country
• 22:00
  price because I just wanted to learn.
• 22:02
  I like being around coach long line again, a lot of people get
• 22:05
  mentors my parents to this day, will say, well that's your
• 22:10
  second dad because I spent so much time around coach long, so
• 22:14
  he means a lot to me and I'm very, very thankful for the
• 22:16
  opportunity to provide me And I think you said even through your
• 22:21
  graduate program, you really not until the end of that graduate
• 22:25
  program was like, okay, yeah, this is what I want to do.
• 22:27
  I want to be a coach. So were you makes it sound,
• 22:32
  like, maybe you weren't doing any kind of formal coaching,
• 22:35
  education programs at this point?
• 22:37
  Because you were still, I mean, you had the informal dr.
• 22:40
  LOM coaching education, you weren't doing a usatf level
• 22:43
  ones, or anything at that point. Now I'm trying to remember where
• 22:47
  my first level one was. Gosh, it's been so long ago.
• 22:51
  I think the most beneficial, when I've done that.
• 22:55
  I can remember vividly. And actually I met quite a few
• 22:59
  people from this one was actually did throws up in
• 23:04
  Colorado Springs. Oh yeah, very interesting me I'm
• 23:09
  sitting in there and you know everybody else is 6 foot 9, 300
• 23:13
  pounds, and here I am and they're all kind of looking like
• 23:16
  what are you doing here? You're not supposed to be like
• 23:18
  this. You lost it, right?
• 23:20
  I know I'm here to do throws and as they started talking, some of
• 23:28
  the people start. Well, I don't know who that is.
• 23:30
  And strangely enough. One of our lungs was one of the
• 23:33
  people they taught on, Jesse Stewart, who was the NCAA champ.
• 23:38
  And at one point, Jesse Stewart at Western Kentucky University
• 23:42
  and Brian Oldfield, who was at Middle Tennessee were two of the
• 23:46
  best floors in the country. Re.
• 23:48
  And so they talked a lot about those guys.
• 23:50
  So, it's very it ingratiating me even more to the content because
• 23:53
  oh, gosh, that's one of our guys, you know.
• 23:56
  But I learned a lot from that and even to this day, most
• 24:01
  people know, I am a throws guy. I really like the throws.
• 24:06
  I've always have like two throws and you can find me probably.
• 24:11
  Just shot at most meats, and only other thing.
• 24:17
  That probably gets me excited. Was the four by fours.
• 24:20
  I like to throws. I've had some very good throws
• 24:23
  coaches. I've worked with.
• 24:24
  And I think they would have tests that.
• 24:27
  Hey, when I'm a person that wants throwers, I like the
• 24:30
  event. And I think even when I'm
• 24:33
  talking to other folks about it from my sprinters are like what
• 24:36
  coach why you always overthrows? I said well you want to come up
• 24:39
  with me. I said do you think you could be
• 24:41
  a ballerina in this area? Oh you know so what do you think
• 24:46
  about a guy who's Alice a 68? Date, you know, 320 and I
• 24:51
  actually showed Wonder guys a video Christian Cantwell, a
• 24:54
  couple years back. I think it was maybe 2004
• 24:57
  Olympic trials, thinkers in Sacramento not mistaken and I
• 25:02
  believe, was Christopher Cantwell, maybe Hoffa Nelson and
• 25:06
  they were just going at it and he was like that big guy.
• 25:09
  I was like, yeah. So you have to look at the
• 25:12
  Artistry behind those individuals in this small
• 25:16
  circle, and Man to see that shot come out of here, whatever
• 25:21
  Implement maybe, there's a lot that goes into it and to
• 25:25
  continue to educate other people outside of just the spring.
• 25:27
  So the jumps with they normal see me around today.
• 25:31
  I mean, even in the fall we kind of have a team, they wear this
• 25:36
  year, they had to learn to throw a javelin everybody last year,
• 25:39
  they did pole vault, we've done shot put, so it's trying to
• 25:43
  bring in a full gamut of understanding for this wonderful
• 25:46
  sport. We compete in You sound like a
• 25:49
  secret. Want to be thrower man who knew
• 25:51
  this sure. But I've got bad knees now, you
• 25:56
  know? But no I like to throw the
• 25:58
  always have loved it. Then no one thought today with
• 26:03
  the people that know you or think they know you were like,
• 26:05
  oh yeah we're gonna have a whole talk about throwing.
• 26:10
  I love it. So let's keep moving forward,
• 26:12
  you finish your graduate assist degree there.
• 26:15
  And Western Kentucky is. So is this when kind The switch
• 26:19
  flipped. It's like oh yeah.
• 26:20
  Oh hold on this. This is what I want to be.
• 26:22
  I want to be a track and field coach.
• 26:27
  Not really, I mean, I liked it but I was still at that point
• 26:31
  trying to figure it out and you know, I had other offers in
• 26:36
  Corporate America to go into and quite honestly, one of my
• 26:41
  fraternity Brothers. At the time, was back in town
• 26:44
  and we were sitting down having early lunch dinner.
• 26:49
  Sorry, just kind of catch up and I remember him saying he said
• 26:53
  man you got a great situation I like what are you talking about?
• 26:56
  He was like man An you know, yeah, I work here.
• 26:59
  I mean he'd been working downtown Chicago.
• 27:01
  He were nationally. Were New Orleans.
• 27:03
  He was like, but you get an opportunity to do something you
• 27:06
  love to do. Yes, right.
• 27:09
  He's like, don't be in a hurry to come to Corporate America.
• 27:11
  He said, because it's not what you think it is, I'm going like
• 27:14
  yeah, you're making this, you're making that you're making that.
• 27:17
  And so from a financial standpoint, I definitely was not
• 27:21
  ingratiated to coaching because I feel like I don't want to take
• 27:25
  the vow of poverty. Say, I'm coaching.
• 27:27
  But if you talk to anyone who's been in this business, they will
• 27:30
  tell you probably very, very quickly.
• 27:32
  I'll probably say 98% of them that you're not going to make a
• 27:35
  lot of money in this. And I remember Terry long
• 27:37
  telling me that early in the career he was like if you want
• 27:40
  to do it and I think you can because like you can't do it for
• 27:42
  the money and I was like, but yeah, but at some point coach we
• 27:46
  got to get paid and he was like, yep, the money will come, just
• 27:50
  do your job and that's what I did.
• 27:52
  I just did my job and so after I graduate, no, wrapping up
• 27:55
  graduation. I kept helping coach long, I'll
• 27:58
  kind of like as a volunteer and then I got my first paid
• 28:03
  position 2500 dollars for a year and you know I wasn't jumping up
• 28:08
  and down about it. I got another job.
• 28:10
  I worked at Best Buy and I actually worked at Fruit of the
• 28:14
  Loom at night to be able to pay my bills quite honestly.
• 28:20
  And so at that point I'm like all right.
• 28:23
  We had some pretty good kids in the program.
• 28:27
  First young man, I ever recruit it actually end up finishing
• 28:32
  sixth in the 100 meters in 70 to 200.
• 28:35
  And then by 2004 and in that same year, I had the fastest
• 28:41
  football player in the country was actually true freshman out
• 28:43
  of Indianapolis Indiana. You ran 1019 400 finish, bloody
• 28:46
  knife that year. So early, one of my coaching
• 28:50
  career I got an opportunity to go out and really work with some
• 28:54
  good young men and young ladies. And so that opportunity just
• 28:59
  blossomed into other things and by that time I was, I was
• 29:03
  all-in. And all right, coach, where we
• 29:05
  going. I'm your guy.
• 29:07
  You mentioned your first paying job part of the career was 2500
• 29:11
  dollars. That was at Western Kentucky.
• 29:13
  So it's like a intern stipend type of position that if you
• 29:18
  want to put it that way. Sure it was I don't know what
• 29:27
  575 in 2005. And I remember when I finally
• 29:31
  became full time, which was like, maybe four or five years
• 29:35
  into it, you know, I was willing to do whatever needed to be done
• 29:41
  to be successful. So that made me working another
• 29:45
  job. And that's what I was going to
• 29:46
  do, but I just felt if I'm going to do something, I'm going to do
• 29:49
  it and when do it to the best of my ability.
• 29:51
  And so I didn't go, you know, big and I need more money.
• 29:55
  I had this kid. Because we were starting to see
• 29:58
  some success, but I just knew there was so much more out there
• 30:01
  that we needed to accomplish, and I just kept working, and
• 30:07
  eventually reasonable salaries came, but by that time, you're
• 30:11
  into it, you're just like whatever it is.
• 30:14
  I'm gonna do it and I'll make do, you know, salaries for
• 30:19
  specifically track coaches, but sport, coaches, in general, and
• 30:23
  specifically, in the college side are a funny thing.
• 30:26
  You know, it It's interesting on the football side, you know,
• 30:29
  when someone signs a contract when Kirby, Smart at Georgia
• 30:33
  signs, a contract, whatever, like it's public knowledge,
• 30:36
  like, you know, signed a five-year extension fact, as
• 30:40
  we're recording this, the championship game, I don't know
• 30:42
  if you could call it that the game that the last game of the
• 30:45
  college season was the last night and as you all know, 65 to
• 30:48
  7, it was amazing. But this morning, when I went up
• 30:51
  to go to the gym, there was a tweet about you know he added
• 30:55
  like 250 thousand dollar. For winning the championship
• 30:58
  game and then it, so that brought his salary for the year
• 31:01
  to 11.6 or whatever. I'm like, within 12 hours, the
• 31:05
  game, we knew how much this man made in one year.
• 31:07
  On track coaching side. It's very interesting.
• 31:10
  I'm not sure. I don't know, because I'm not in
• 31:12
  the football coaching world and baseball coaching World Etc, but
• 31:16
  in the track World, exactly what you said is, what is most
• 31:19
  commonly said? Oh, if they'd pay me a dollar,
• 31:22
  I'd coach tracker. I, you know, we don't do it for
• 31:25
  the money and I Get that I push back against it to be real
• 31:29
  Frank, right? Yeah, but I get it because, you
• 31:32
  know, typically at least all the track coaches, I know they're
• 31:35
  very passionate people, they are in it for the quote unquote,
• 31:38
  right? Reasons the kids.
• 31:40
  I get that. But then I always add, however,
• 31:44
  you have to be taken care of, and not just for you.
• 31:48
  And I think, I think track coach is generally pushback against
• 31:50
  that, because it seems very selfish.
• 31:51
  Like, Oh, I pushed for more money.
• 31:54
  Well, that's about me. Not the kids etc.
• 31:56
  Etc. It's actually not about you.
• 31:57
  Part of it is about you. Sure you need money for all the
• 32:01
  things that you want to buy. But that money also takes care
• 32:04
  of your family, takes care of your passions and interests
• 32:07
  outside of your job of coaching my track and field as well.
• 32:12
  We just simply have to pay coaches more and we have to pay
• 32:15
  them more earlier as well. Like, I don't, I don't believe
• 32:18
  in this my first coaching job, you know, in today's world
• 32:21
  easily could be 17,000, 18,000 20,000, you can't, you can't
• 32:26
  live on the line. Julie can make more the
• 32:28
  proverbial going to McDonald's and flipping burgers jobs, you
• 32:31
  know, we're paying fifteen to twenty dollars an hour there for
• 32:34
  Seventeen eighteen Grand a year. You Ain't Makin you making that
• 32:37
  much, you know, especially the don't even count the hours
• 32:39
  right? Don't even talk about 40 hours
• 32:40
  with you doing 40 hours you doing 4:00, you know, we always
• 32:45
  kind of a pushing back on the you know, I was just happy to
• 32:48
  make this an X and Y and it's like no no no, please like we
• 32:52
  need to stop applying for jobs that are paying 25,000 to be
• 32:54
  real Frank that they pay 25 because They'll get a hundred
• 32:57
  applicants that want metal. Take it.
• 33:00
  Yeah. Yeah, we have to we have to
• 33:03
  stand up for our profession because we have so many great
• 33:04
  people that are giving to our athletes and to get to continue
• 33:09
  getting higher quality and passionate people we have to pay
• 33:12
  them respectfully or will continue to lose them to other
• 33:15
  jobs that are out there and we'll lose the great people that
• 33:18
  should be track coaches that are out there.
• 33:21
  So, all right, I think a big know and to kind of go on it.
• 33:24
  I think a big part. What?
• 33:29
  To stay in that vein. A lot of track coaches,
• 33:35
  especially some of the older ones, like you said, weren't
• 33:37
  willing to push the envelope and, you know, the days of
• 33:42
  coaches stand somewhere for like, 20 30 years, they're very
• 33:46
  there aren't a lot of those guys right now.
• 33:48
  I hope I am one of them, you know, because I had a, I was at
• 33:51
  Western Kentucky, for 11 years as a head coach.
• 33:53
  I certainly hope to have a quality tenure here at the
• 33:56
  University of South Florida. But if a good friend of mine,
• 33:59
  who was probably one of the best football coaches young minds
• 34:03
  around, he told me a long time ago and he's had some pretty
• 34:06
  prestigious stops. He said Eric, you know the
• 34:08
  difference between football coaches and track coaches and I
• 34:12
  said I feel me and please don't like me.
• 34:15
  He says, well, you guys hope to go somewhere and die and he
• 34:20
  said, when football coaches, we hope to go somewhere and get
• 34:22
  fired up. He said, and what I mean by that
• 34:27
  he's like, You go somewhere. If you do a good job, you know,
• 34:31
  your coach might stay there or take you with him or new person
• 34:34
  comes in, you get fired up but you do a good enough job that
• 34:37
  you can move on move on move on. Because a lot of football
• 34:40
  coaches that they are making with Kirby Smart makes right now
• 34:44
  and that's across all levels. So that's obviously a
• 34:46
  misconception because I've seen a lot of football coach.
• 34:49
  I've been around some really good football programs.
• 34:53
  And they don't all make it there.
• 34:55
  Now, obviously, if you meant Georgia and some of the SEC
• 34:58
  schools things already built in and even a big 10 now, but when
• 35:03
  they first start, they didn't start it, you know, had Ohio
• 35:07
  State as the host. So understanding that, but also
• 35:11
  even as the head coach is my responsibility when I do try to
• 35:15
  bring new people into be able to talk to my Administration as to
• 35:17
  why I can't pay this person. Twenty thousand dollars become
• 35:21
  put in you know No umpteen amount of hours just because
• 35:25
  we're not going to get what we need out of, and it can survive.
• 35:28
  And that not survive mean, I've got to go and find a job just to
• 35:32
  be able to do this and she's not getting the best of that person.
• 35:35
  And so I think as we look around the sport now, salaries are
• 35:39
  starting to increase and they're providing more resources outside
• 35:43
  of just the coaches. You got some problems, have to
• 35:45
  director of operations. They've got recruiting
• 35:47
  coordinators, they've got a lot of things at their disposal, and
• 35:51
  I really hope that becomes a norm.
• 35:52
  Love to see him be able provide our school with more coaches
• 35:55
  besides just six. Because when you think about it,
• 35:59
  football has 10 paid coaches, and they'll say, oh yeah, we
• 36:03
  have 115 guys. Okay, great.
• 36:06
  Well, 85, you're responsible for the division.
• 36:08
  One level, but there are a lot of track and field programs out
• 36:13
  there. They have 70 or more athletes,
• 36:16
  men and women combine, and you got, you know, the disparity
• 36:20
  between the numbers. It's not fair.
• 36:23
  So, are we ever going to give a football gets?
• 36:25
  Probably not, but I certainly Only believe as a body.
• 36:29
  We need to be working for to try to provide more opportunities
• 36:32
  for our sport. I mean, wow, 100% there's a lot
• 36:36
  to unpack, what you just said there?
• 36:37
  Eric, let's start with what your football coaching friend said
• 36:42
  that you track coaches. You go to find a job to die.
• 36:45
  There we get, we go to fire up, you know, to get fired to move
• 36:49
  up and things like that. That's really interesting
• 36:53
  concept. You know, speaking with coaches
• 36:57
  on The Press release side track coaches on the non press release
• 37:00
  side. So you'll never see this in a
• 37:01
  press release. I don't think I've ever seen in
• 37:03
  a press release, but when you talk to a coach, it's like, oh
• 37:05
  man, I don't want to leave because I love the kids and I
• 37:07
  recruited them all. Hear things like that.
• 37:09
  Now, again, full disclosure I don't talk to football coaches.
• 37:12
  In personally like I do track coaches but I don't know that
• 37:15
  I've ever heard football coaches say yeah I didn't want to leave
• 37:19
  from Stephen F. Austin to go to TCU because I
• 37:22
  recruited all those linebackers and I love them like family and
• 37:26
  so I stayed at Stephen F Austin. Did and made a lot less.
• 37:29
  I don't hear that. Psycho man had a great time.
• 37:31
  And that, you know, she's those two schools as an example, I had
• 37:34
  a great time so even if Austin, but I'm excited to go to TCU and
• 37:37
  get paid a lot more, you know. So with that earlier in our
• 37:42
  pre-interview, you talked about, you'd listen to music later on
• 37:45
  the podcast here at gil. It's still our number one
• 37:47
  podcast, by the way, by a mile and I recommend everybody listen
• 37:51
  to it. He talked about this kind of
• 37:53
  very topic where he talked about, you know, if you have an
• 37:57
  Go somewhere, especially early in your career.
• 38:00
  He talked about to make more money you should because we
• 38:04
  don't do enough for our future retirements and we don't get
• 38:06
  paid enough anyway. So anytime you can make an extra
• 38:09
  dollar and earlier that extra dollar you make actually
• 38:11
  compounds because the next job should pay more based on
• 38:14
  experience at cetera and then he dropped the bomb that I was
• 38:17
  like, man, who I'm not sure you're supposed to say that part
• 38:19
  out loud. He talked about the air quotes
• 38:22
  here, excuse that we give as track coaches.
• 38:25
  Well, I don't want to leave the kids and Things like that.
• 38:28
  And he's like, he said, I'm paraphrasing here a little bit.
• 38:31
  You got to go back and listen to the podcast to get his exact
• 38:33
  words, but he was like, if you really want to what if you
• 38:36
  really want, what's best for the athletes for the kids?
• 38:39
  Well how do you know that you leaving and the other coach
• 38:42
  coming in, isn't a better coach for them?
• 38:46
  And I was like, man, our ego is doesn't allow us to say that.
• 38:49
  What is our ego say? No, no, I'm the best coach for
• 38:52
  these kids, you know. So I just thought that
• 38:54
  fascinating of just, you know again that's why I push back
• 38:57
  more and more. The, you know, I'm just happy to
• 38:58
  be here. I do it for free and all that
• 39:01
  kind of stuff. And it's like, man, I've never
• 39:03
  heard an accountant, say that they'd be a CPA for free.
• 39:06
  I've never heard of a lawyer saying if you do actually, there
• 39:08
  is some pro bono lawyer. But you know what I'm saying?
• 39:11
  The other thing to unpack there is the number of coaches that we
• 39:14
  have used the football example, which is a great example, right?
• 39:17
  I mean, they've got a tight end Coach at right, tackle, code to
• 39:20
  write car just Center coach. I mean, it's quite amazing for
• 39:23
  all quality control. They got five film, guys.
• 39:27
  I mean, it's It's quite amazing, you know, quality analyst.
• 39:31
  All these kind of weird spots that they've created Bravo to
• 39:34
  them. Basketball is another one they
• 39:36
  got like 15 kids on the team and they've got like four how many
• 39:39
  coaches? They have 45 cause I thought was
• 39:41
  45. Yeah, it's a lot.
• 39:42
  They got like a three to one ratio and it's like, really
• 39:45
  guys, we're dealing with 50. 100 150 athletes of wildly different
• 39:51
  events much like football, you know, receivers different from
• 39:53
  running back, Etc. But we do it.
• 39:56
  A lot of places are doing it with one.
• 39:57
  Coach to coach has three coaches, a volunteer coach.
• 40:00
  If you're fully staffed your 6 with what a ga or volunteer,
• 40:05
  it's not enough. We need more into this
• 40:07
  profession but we got to pay them to get more higher quality
• 40:10
  people into the profession, right?
• 40:11
  I had a young man talk to me a couple weeks ago and he said
• 40:15
  well I really like being here. You know, he had some other
• 40:19
  opportunities and he said, well should I leave?
• 40:22
  I was like, well, you should leave.
• 40:24
  If you believe it's going to put you in a better place.
• 40:27
  When you're Oh man. He's like, yeah, but I've got
• 40:29
  these great kids here. Now, I said and great kid.
• 40:32
  Go coach told me this long time ago, I said, you never stay
• 40:35
  anywhere for the kids. Hmm, I have thoroughly enjoyed
• 40:39
  all the athletes. I've worked with him but I would
• 40:41
  never stay for a kid because guess what?
• 40:43
  Everybody has a terminal date as far as education institution, so
• 40:48
  you bring a junior, college kid in there, you probably got two
• 40:51
  years and they're going to graduate high school kid for
• 40:54
  years ago and graduate transfer having many years.
• 40:56
  So they're going to leave. At some point.
• 40:59
  But if you stick yourself to that Institution for a kid, then
• 41:04
  you're doing a disservice to your future kids.
• 41:07
  Because at some point, you're going to retire, I had a
• 41:10
  conversation, many many many years ago at one of the clinics
• 41:13
  that was being put on with Russ Rogers and Harvey glands.
• 41:17
  Hmm. And at that time both of those
• 41:19
  gentlemen were coming towards the end of their career and
• 41:22
  everybody know what those guys were fabulous golfers and you
• 41:26
  know they lived it, right? Right, and I'm sitting around
• 41:29
  afterwards and they said, listen, make sure you set
• 41:32
  yourself up for the Long Haul. They were like, don't stay
• 41:36
  somewhere just because, you know, you think that's it.
• 41:39
  And they've just taken care of you.
• 41:40
  Like, because you're going to have a family one day and I knew
• 41:43
  that because my parents are taught to me about it before,
• 41:46
  but it was hearing it from coaches who've been there and
• 41:48
  done that and won't that side of their career and saying make
• 41:52
  sure you get Investments know you know what's going on in your
• 41:56
  retirement your stocks and so on and so For.
• 41:58
  And so, ever since that day, I'm very keen aware of what's going
• 42:02
  on with my retirement and also try to talk to other individuals
• 42:06
  about. Hey, put yourself in a
• 42:07
  situation, so when you're in your latter days, as far as
• 42:10
  Retirement, you're good to go and you also want to be able to
• 42:14
  take care of your family. You know, something as simple as
• 42:17
  hey, you had certain States, you can buy into their educational
• 42:21
  system as an option for retirement.
• 42:23
  You can have different tax shelters but also if your kids
• 42:27
  one day one go back to that state and they can have
• 42:29
  opportunity to go there. Like here in Florida, we have a
• 42:32
  program in which you know my kids will be able to go to
• 42:36
  school in the state of Florida where they get a scholarship or
• 42:38
  not because it'll be paid down long before they go to school.
• 42:42
  We haven't talked about this specific topic on the podcast
• 42:45
  for quite a while. Now when you talk about I love
• 42:48
  that statement of you know, I don't want to leave for because
• 42:50
  of the kids and you know I appreciate what you said of like
• 42:53
  hey I'm not going to let a kid keep me there because I always
• 42:56
  wondered kind of side. Our own that always wondered
• 42:58
  like, well, you're going to another institution that there's
• 43:01
  other great kids there to like, so you never think about losing
• 43:04
  out like those kids are going to have you, if you don't go there,
• 43:07
  if you stay for these kids and you're right, the other, their
• 43:09
  time is finite two years, four years, five years, maybe at Max
• 43:11
  there, they're gonna go on, hopefully, they're gonna go on
• 43:14
  if you're doing a good job, right?
• 43:16
  So we haven't talked a lot about is the spectrum of selfishness
• 43:22
  and unselfishness selflessness, right?
• 43:25
  And we think a lot of times As level as track coach.
• 43:28
  It's like, oh man. Can you get any more selfless
• 43:32
  than being a track coach? You are working with other
• 43:35
  people's kids and their peoples 18 to 22 year old.
• 43:38
  You spend so much time with them.
• 43:39
  You're taking phone calls at 9:00 at night, but I don't like
• 43:42
  or agree with, but, you know, you're always there and it's
• 43:45
  like, wow. You're so selfless.
• 43:47
  But we sometimes forget, especially if we have family.
• 43:51
  If we have kids of our own, we're not spending time with our
• 43:55
  partner. We're not spending time with our
• 43:56
  kit which You're being selfish, you're doing your dream of
• 44:00
  living your career and spending time with these kids on your
• 44:03
  team and your kids are missing out on you being at the ball
• 44:06
  game, just being there, in general playing games.
• 44:09
  Going to movies, whatever? Just being a mom or a dad in
• 44:12
  general. So we tend to think of
• 44:13
  selfishness and selflessness is this like you have to be on one
• 44:17
  side or the other one? It's actually got to kind of be
• 44:19
  like in the middle. Like you have to be selfish for
• 44:21
  yourself in your family or you. Yeah.
• 44:23
  Or you are going to not do the right things for your family.
• 44:28
  To do it for some other kids correct balance.
• 44:31
  So I was a person that had to learn that the hard way,
• 44:36
  especially my time at West Kentucky.
• 44:37
  I mean I was recruiting coordinator.
• 44:39
  I coached Sprint's jumps hurdles, I did a lot and you
• 44:45
  find yourself in the office at 6:00 and then all of a sudden
• 44:50
  you look up its eleven twelve. Oh, and by the way, I got to get
• 44:54
  up tomorrow and you know, leave the house at 4:00 to catch a
• 44:57
  flight. Nashville at 6:00 to fly this
• 44:59
  place and then you've got your Meats built in.
• 45:02
  So, I was saying, I have a lot of time for yourself.
• 45:04
  Not at the time, I was, you know, single and all that stuff.
• 45:08
  So, you know, it's different that's different to myself, but
• 45:13
  once I had my oldest daughter, you know, you start really
• 45:16
  saying man, I can't do this because I'm doing this, I can't
• 45:19
  do this and doing that. So, you know, I have a very
• 45:22
  unique spray. I have a daughter, who's 22?
• 45:24
  Just graduated Florida, State and all that type of stuff?
• 45:27
  And moved on and is now living in New York or New Jersey and
• 45:31
  working in New York that have a five year old and a three year
• 45:35
  old. And so some of the, the lessons
• 45:38
  of not being able to do certain things with my oldest daughter,
• 45:43
  have really helped me, focus on. All right, you know what, I've
• 45:46
  hired some really, really good people around me if I need to go
• 45:50
  to this play and I don't have something that is pressing for
• 45:53
  me to be an office. Or I just communicate with my
• 45:55
  staff and say, hey guys, Really need to go see my kids.
• 45:59
  Lion King play this morning. If you need me to do anything,
• 46:02
  text me, I will get to it as soon as I can, but hey, I'm
• 46:05
  leaving, you responsible for this and I've got some very,
• 46:08
  very competent people around me that I feel Comfortable doing
• 46:12
  that when I couldn't do that at one point in my career.
• 46:15
  Let's put a pin in that. Let's make sure I when we get to
• 46:18
  South Florida, let's talk about because what you're talking
• 46:20
  about there is hiring trust. And then also the dichotomy of
• 46:26
  how you're working with your profession and your personal
• 46:29
  life and how you lead your staff to that as well.
• 46:32
  How like I love the example you gave we're going to come back to
• 46:35
  it makes and we're going to see if you are doing that with them
• 46:38
  as well. I have a feeling you, you are
• 46:40
  Our but let's Circle back to that as well as put a pin in
• 46:45
  that come back to that in a little bit.
• 46:47
  So let's keep going with the career here, the path.
• 46:51
  So you go into becoming a full-time assistant, you're
• 46:54
  finally making more than 25 hundred dollars for the year
• 46:57
  Bravo, right? I'm sure your first assistant
• 47:00
  job, you made it all the way up to 25 thousand dollars for the
• 47:03
  year, still not enough. But how long were you in
• 47:06
  assistant and when did you become the head coach?
• 47:09
  And then, let's talk about becoming The head coach, not
• 47:11
  only the head coach, but head coach of your alma mater, right?
• 47:15
  So I became the head coach at my alma mater, in January 1st 2008.
• 47:21
  So grad school, two years. So totality, I spent eight years
• 47:28
  post, graduate to become the head coach.
• 47:33
  So, yeah. It was a, it was a quick ride
• 47:38
  but there's a lot learned and In that scenario within that, you
• 47:44
  know, six to eight year window in which I really had to figure
• 47:48
  out what was going on. And like I said, when I actually
• 47:50
  became a head coach out, I wasn't going into it.
• 47:53
  Like I'm gonna do this so I can become the head coach.
• 47:56
  I felt that was my coaches position and if I was meant to
• 48:01
  go somewhere else to continue my career doubt, that was fine.
• 48:03
  I had opportunities, but Western just kept bringing me back to
• 48:08
  Center again. I won't stand for that.
• 48:10
  Athletes, I will stand for the opportunities.
• 48:12
  Hmmm. I got to learn so much at
• 48:15
  Western Kentucky because we didn't have a lot of resources,
• 48:19
  so I had to learn to be the recruiting coordinator.
• 48:22
  I had to learn to coach a lot of events.
• 48:24
  I had to learn how to do things from an administrative
• 48:27
  standpoint. So, coach long did have to do
• 48:28
  everything himself and I just became a student of the business
• 48:33
  and I think a lot of Coaches in my humble opinion, aren't
• 48:38
  businessman or business women. They want to just go to the
• 48:42
  track and just coach, that's great.
• 48:44
  Trust me dude, that's the best part of my day but I also
• 48:47
  realized I'm the CEO of this business model and so there are
• 48:53
  a lot of things you have to get done well, to be successful.
• 48:58
  Like I said, you don't just show up to the track and have kids.
• 49:01
  If you don't understand how to recruit and you understand how
• 49:03
  to put them in equipment, All these things because once you
• 49:06
  start delegating and you understand what's going on?
• 49:09
  You a better leader but more importantly, a better coaching
• 49:11
  that you know, I just thought about this question as we were
• 49:14
  transitioning from that topic. To now you're becoming the head
• 49:17
  coach there. The hilltoppers?
• 49:18
  Do you think I'm gonna, I'm gonna put you on the spot and
• 49:21
  ask you the question. This is what I'm starting to
• 49:23
  kind of think and kind of formulate my head.
• 49:26
  So I'm going to ask it to you as the question.
• 49:28
  Do you think some coaches use the profession of track coaching
• 49:33
  here specifically? Lee, as an escapism meaning.
• 49:39
  It's easy to get a to get away from the responsibilities of
• 49:43
  being a husband or a wife or being a parent because I got to
• 49:47
  go make recruiting calls. I've got to go see this kid at
• 49:50
  this meet. I've got to go to the office and
• 49:53
  do whatever. There's a tons of things to do
• 49:55
  in the office, but again, it's not a business business in the
• 49:58
  sense of, like, you got a clock in a date and all that kind of
• 50:00
  stuff. Do you think?
• 50:02
  Maybe there's coaches big swath here?
• 50:05
  You know, being very Not fair to the entire body, but you know,
• 50:11
  big swath here. Do you think we maybe use that
• 50:13
  as a as an excuse for an escapism from responsibilities?
• 50:17
  For personal responsibilities, I guess you could.
• 50:20
  If you want to, I will tell you right now, I enjoy coming home
• 50:25
  to my 5 and 3 year old. And one thing I do, I try really
• 50:32
  travel are when I walk in the door.
• 50:34
  So essentially from 615 to 8:00 business stops, unless it's
• 50:41
  something I have to do. The after that 89 recruiting
• 50:45
  calls depends on where they are, might go to 10.
• 50:47
  But unlike you and 9:00, I try to turn things off.
• 50:50
  That's just kind of how I grew up, but you know, it's about
• 50:55
  balance and it took me a while because, you know, once you're
• 50:58
  in it, you're trying to figure out how to win.
• 51:01
  You want to be success. I've got all these great coaches
• 51:03
  around me. Like, you know, when I was in
• 51:05
  early in my career, I had to face Dean Hayes, you know, down
• 51:11
  in Murfreesboro, you know? So if you know the sport, you
• 51:15
  know, Dean was, I mean he Phenomenal.
• 51:18
  Right. And bless his soul and all that.
• 51:20
  He, you know, he's going on. But, you know, I had to study
• 51:25
  him. Like how does he do this?
• 51:27
  I looked at Bill Carson, like what is he doing over there?
• 51:32
  How can I bring this to where I am Northern Iowa and they were
• 51:37
  really, really good. You know I looked at people who
• 51:39
  were other similar ilk and said all right let me build my
• 51:44
  program to this and when you're trying to build it and you're
• 51:47
  and boy, Green Kentucky and you try to reduce printers and
• 51:50
  jumpers and throwers and are going, where are you again and
• 51:55
  trying to sell that. So it's a lot of work and you
• 51:57
  end up some things fall off and I told myself that I'm going to
• 52:02
  work where I can try to keep things as balanced as possible,
• 52:05
  and that goes for me. But also for my staff.
• 52:08
  I mean, I know we're going to get to South Florida.
• 52:11
  Wow! But I have a staff right now
• 52:13
  that I don't have to ask them to work.
• 52:15
  I tell them, you know there. At one point this summer, I was
• 52:18
  like, Hey, listen, go home. You don't have to be in office,
• 52:21
  we look around. We literally don't understand in
• 52:25
  the office, and we're going at a thousand miles an hour, but I
• 52:27
  know they have to recharge. They have families, you know, I
• 52:30
  want them to bring their kids to practice, you know, I want to be
• 52:33
  able to enjoy every facet of what this business can offer.
• 52:38
  Thanks for letting me put you on the spot there, appreciate that.
• 52:41
  As you're talking out that answer there, you know I started
• 52:44
  thinking I kind of maybe unfairly we're On track coaches
• 52:48
  here. So I put that on track coaches.
• 52:50
  But now being in the business side of it, I see the same thing
• 52:53
  in the business side, so maybe it's not necessarily a track
• 52:56
  coach, or a coaching thing of escaping responsibilities by
• 53:00
  throwing yourself 100 hours into a week into the job.
• 53:04
  Maybe that's what we do in general and maybe it comes
• 53:07
  because that's, that's what we see, as a young person.
• 53:09
  You know, when you first get into a job as a 21, 22 year-old,
• 53:12
  and you see again on the coaching side, your head coaches
• 53:15
  in their 10:00 at night and 6 a.m.
• 53:17
  The next day, you know, like, oh well, that must be what it is.
• 53:20
  So maybe we have to do and take the responsibility on ourselves
• 53:24
  as track. Coaches, to set the example for
• 53:27
  our younger coaches of like. Yeah.
• 53:28
  Hey you got to work hard. No questions.
• 53:30
  Asked, you want to be successful at anything?
• 53:32
  You're gonna have to work hard. That doesn't mean it's 24 hours
• 53:35
  a day. It is a job at the end of the
• 53:38
  day. I know we coach track and field.
• 53:40
  We love our Kathleen's, and it's a passion and putting all the
• 53:43
  other buzzwords the day. It's a job that gives us a
• 53:46
  paycheck. Should your job.
• 53:48
  Be number one, in your life? I almost said, I'm not so sure.
• 53:51
  I know it's not supposed to be number one in your life.
• 53:54
  You know. Maybe your faith, your family
• 53:56
  others should be. Oh maybe never one, two, three,
• 53:59
  and four in your life, before your job, your career.
• 54:03
  I think for me you want to be able to hire people who you want
• 54:07
  to tell to go home. Because that means they're I
• 54:11
  have been in a position where that wasn't a case.
• 54:14
  I was pulling hard in One Direction.
• 54:17
  A lot and I had great leadership at the top of certain people,
• 54:21
  that will really wouldn't help. But when you don't want on the
• 54:24
  road, you don't want to do an audit that adds up.
• 54:27
  And so, I hope all young coaches are coaches in general.
• 54:31
  I hope we're at a place where we can have resources, so we can
• 54:33
  spread responsibilities and delegate, and we'd be all in one
• 54:37
  Accord. So we can help each other
• 54:38
  because I want my coaches to spend time with their families.
• 54:43
  You know, I know you're going to do your job, but you also have
• 54:45
  to do your job which most important and It's at home,
• 54:48
  taking care of your wife and kid, whatever it may be, and
• 54:51
  being a part of them. Because again, we spent so much
• 54:53
  time as coaches, what I athletes and other profession that spends
• 54:57
  a ton of time. A lot of people don't give
• 54:59
  credit to our strength conditioning coaches and
• 55:02
  athletic trainers. Oh yeah.
• 55:03
  He put in some serious hours and I often meet person, I try to
• 55:08
  really praise them, give them opportunities because I know
• 55:12
  what they're doing and the same thing.
• 55:15
  There have been times in which we want to do.
• 55:17
  Certain things. And I had to tell my coach,
• 55:18
  like, we're not doing that because coach is here from 5
• 55:21
  a.m. to 7 p.m. every day and sometimes longer because he
• 55:25
  might have a kid out of class conflict, whatever he's doing
• 55:28
  whatever, but he needs a break too.
• 55:30
  And so the same thing is going to trainers trainers long days,
• 55:33
  a traveling. So being able to understand the
• 55:35
  full scope of your program and respecting everyone, I think is
• 55:41
  a major component of success. That's good point.
• 55:45
  How did you know thing real quick?
• 55:47
  Not a cuts off if you go to the US.
• 55:53
  Tfcc see a convention and you listen to the Hall of Fame
• 55:59
  speeches, what's the one thing? You can usually pull out of that
• 56:03
  speech? It's helped a lot of people, but
• 56:07
  I want to say thank you to my spouse or significant other and
• 56:13
  apologize to my kids that I was not there enough.
• 56:17
  And I usually go to the Hall of Fame account in the same group
• 56:22
  and we all kind of wait for that and is usually long tenured
• 56:27
  people who've done it but they just give so much to.
• 56:29
  The institution is so much to student athletes and they're so
• 56:33
  proud of them but they often lose a lot of time with the ones
• 56:38
  at home that love and her daughter at this year's
• 56:40
  convention, I was in the elevator, with Pat Henry and his
• 56:43
  wife and she to me anytime someone says track.
• 56:47
  Your spouse. She's the person that kind of
• 56:49
  like that's the person who represents everybody spouse to
• 56:51
  me because I've seen her forever.
• 56:52
  She's had been at every track me.
• 56:54
  You know, I've been in pet Henry Circle as far as, you know,
• 56:57
  being a track meets and coaching against them and everything for
• 57:00
  a long time during my career. So I always saw her and so we
• 57:04
  were talking in the elevator and I was like, I got the chance to
• 57:07
  tell her. I was like, Miss Henry, I was
• 57:08
  like God bless you as like to me you represent every spouse
• 57:11
  because you're at every track me.
• 57:13
  She's like, oh yeah I've been to a few, you know and and I was
• 57:15
  like I really truly hope that you love track.
• 57:17
  And field because everyone and she's like, I've learned to love
• 57:20
  it. It's like oh my goodness.
• 57:22
  Like God bless you, you're dragged every track meet world
• 57:27
  because of pantorans. Like man, there's so many
• 57:30
  spouses out there that are either doing the equivalent of
• 57:33
  being there and travel and every time or being at home taking
• 57:36
  care of the homestead. The kids the bills, the whole,
• 57:40
  the whole nine. Okay let's let's talk about
• 57:44
  going to become the head coach at Western Kentucky.
• 57:47
  Because I'm fascinated by this for two reasons specifically
• 57:50
  with you one is I always have such a big spot in my heart for
• 57:56
  a lumps of their own program that you know, when you would
• 57:59
  call the recruiter kid and say how great, you know, it is there
• 58:01
  in Bowling Green at Western Kentucky.
• 58:04
  Well, you have the ultimate proof you're like, I went to
• 58:05
  school here, I got it. I didn't go to school somewhere
• 58:08
  else and I'm telling you, this, you know, this is a great school
• 58:10
  and telling you may I went here. This is why.
• 58:12
  I know it's a trade school so I love that.
• 58:14
  Yeah. And the other aspect for you
• 58:15
  specifically, is this is Your first head coaching job taken
• 58:20
  over your alma mater. Were you ready?
• 58:23
  Are you ready to become the head coach?
• 58:25
  Now I was ready for the position but there was still so much I
• 58:30
  had to learn but I wasn't afraid of that because I knew, I had
• 58:36
  good mentors. And I also knew that I could
• 58:38
  pick up the phone and find good mentors because of the tentacles
• 58:41
  that I had within ones that I deal with on a day-to-day basis.
• 58:45
  Like I said, when coach long retired, he had done 28 years at
• 58:48
  Western for years at Georgia and 67 years at Florida.
• 58:52
  State, his dad was a head coach. His brother was head coach
• 58:55
  currently at for the state. So, you know, I knew High School
• 58:59
  coaches, that were very, very successful that I will call
• 59:03
  them. Talk to them about, you know,
• 59:05
  what's the difference? You know, how do I deal with
• 59:07
  this this? And that, you know, I have
• 59:10
  picked up the phone and call, Mike, Holloway I'm the people, I
• 59:16
  could give you a list of that. I've talked to, matter of fact,
• 59:20
  just in general. I'll talk to me Coburn's about
• 59:22
  something in passing. Hey, you know, just there are
• 59:25
  people you can pick up nuggets from but you really need to have
• 59:28
  a central base of people that you can get.
• 59:34
  You can gain wisdom from. And what I mean by that, there
• 59:38
  are a lot of coaches that would just throw you something because
• 59:40
  that's the moment, right? This right thing in the moment
• 59:42
  or they think, no. But you really want to find
• 59:45
  people who intimately know you, but who are also Excited that
• 59:52
  you can be successful where you are.
• 59:55
  And what I mean by where you are not trying to say well if you do
• 59:58
  this, like they did it over here, then you'll be great.
• 1:00:00
  Knowing you have to know that person how they can be
• 1:00:03
  intimately successful where they are.
• 1:00:05
  So, I often tell people be the man where you stand, you know,
• 1:00:09
  it's easy to look at. I was in Kentucky to say, oh,
• 1:00:11
  look what Kentucky is doing a look at what we're doing or
• 1:00:13
  blah, blah, I didn't I looked at, I'm here at Western
• 1:00:17
  Kentucky. What do I have?
• 1:00:18
  And how do I make it the best? And yes, it Is a great
• 1:00:21
  opportunity to be able to talk to people about my Almighty
• 1:00:23
  because I know what it's like not to have indoor track.
• 1:00:28
  I know what it's like to be down and trying to spread on the
• 1:00:31
  basketball court or out shoveling snow on the outdoor
• 1:00:35
  track because you just got to get some work done.
• 1:00:38
  So I knew all of that, so it's a little different from me,
• 1:00:41
  telling them that and trying to get them to believe in it.
• 1:00:43
  Because quite honestly the environment in the situation
• 1:00:48
  we're in the culture we built at Western Kentucky, It was
• 1:00:50
  something that had to be developed over time because a
• 1:00:53
  lot of kids came right into a very talented and they struggled
• 1:00:56
  at first we were like man we don't have this, we don't have
• 1:00:57
  that. And with me tell him and then if
• 1:01:01
  you have some other people who've been through it, a
• 1:01:02
  success, they can say, Amen? Just listen, you get you where
• 1:01:06
  you need to be but you got to do it his way and you always
• 1:01:10
  innovate your weight but you just do the best you can with
• 1:01:15
  what you have. What was the thing that
• 1:01:18
  surprised you the most about because In the head coach.
• 1:01:21
  What was something that you thought?
• 1:01:23
  Or maybe you didn't think he'd like, I mean, I didn't know I
• 1:01:25
  had to do X or I don't have to do why?
• 1:01:27
  Or, I didn't know this would actually be this tough.
• 1:01:30
  It was something that kind of, as you kind of get your feet wet
• 1:01:33
  in the head coaching role you were like, oh man, this is a
• 1:01:36
  challenge. I'm going to overcome this.
• 1:01:38
  Just the day-to-day paperwork. Um, host a meeting rosters
• 1:01:42
  signing up for meet Hotel travel, you know, equipment,
• 1:01:48
  whatever may be managing all of that.
• 1:01:51
  And also learning how to deal with people who weren't on the
• 1:01:54
  same timeframe you own. Because when you're in
• 1:01:56
  athletics, for me, I was still doing all the recruiting.
• 1:02:01
  I was still coaching a big part of the team and now your head
• 1:02:04
  coach that you have responsibilities outside of just
• 1:02:06
  your group. And now I also have to deal with
• 1:02:08
  Administration and these meetings they want and turning
• 1:02:11
  the paperwork and all that. And I didn't have a big staff.
• 1:02:13
  There were only three of us at a time and so still trying to run
• 1:02:17
  a program like that there was just a lot.
• 1:02:20
  Learn and again just learn how to manage people because I'm not
• 1:02:24
  just dealing with the sprinters jump as it hurtles anymore.
• 1:02:27
  I have to now internet deal with the distance Runners and you
• 1:02:30
  know, and throw it or whatever it may be.
• 1:02:31
  So there was a learning curve. But again I was accepting of the
• 1:02:35
  learning curve. I never thought I knew
• 1:02:37
  everything, I still don't think I know everything.
• 1:02:38
  I will ask questions if I see you at a meet.
• 1:02:42
  I'll sit down with you and let's talk.
• 1:02:44
  I believe in talking because you can tell me something.
• 1:02:46
  You experience is when you at Mississippi State or balls.
• 1:02:50
  State you learned something and it's some point in my career is
• 1:02:55
  probably going to be applicable. It's just when I use it.
• 1:02:59
  And also remember one of the things that really helped
• 1:03:01
  prepare me for being a head coach, right?
• 1:03:05
  During the transition, my first conference head coach meeting
• 1:03:10
  and I remember right Waters? At the time.
• 1:03:12
  Said, you guys need to understand you're no longer just
• 1:03:16
  track coaches. And a say you are as our
• 1:03:21
  administrators and you need to really take that on a day of
• 1:03:23
  just coming to the track. And that's all you do.
• 1:03:25
  Those days are over and I'm sitting there saying, well,
• 1:03:27
  you're shaking your head. I'm like going.
• 1:03:29
  Yeah, exactly. And I remember some of the older
• 1:03:32
  coaches in the room, just bristling at death, but I took
• 1:03:35
  that and said he's right. It's a new day.
• 1:03:37
  You got to adapt. You got to understand what's
• 1:03:39
  going on. And from that time on, he said
• 1:03:41
  that to even a time. Now, I'm still adapting
• 1:03:44
  understanding how to be a better Coach within the current
• 1:03:47
  environment. Is the NCAA or where I currently
• 1:03:50
  stand as the head coach. So inversely as you get your
• 1:03:55
  feet wet and started standing up on your own learning to be this
• 1:03:58
  new role of, not just they hate the word, just not being only a
• 1:04:03
  track coach but you're an administrator, it responds,
• 1:04:05
  other responsibilities outside of your own program.
• 1:04:08
  Even what did you find? The easiest, maybe something you
• 1:04:11
  thought was going to be difficult, but you, you know,
• 1:04:13
  you got into it. It was like, it was like, like
• 1:04:16
  chewing gum and you're like Oh man, I don't know why I was
• 1:04:19
  worried about this, it's pretty, it's pretty easy.
• 1:04:20
  I flowed read into this part. Honestly can't say, I don't
• 1:04:24
  know. It was anything that I felt
• 1:04:25
  would be difficult. That was easy.
• 1:04:28
  I looked at everything as a quality Challenge and I want to
• 1:04:31
  master the challenge by. I didn't shy away from any of
• 1:04:34
  it, but I didn't think anything would be very overwhelming
• 1:04:38
  because I asked, was so much responsibility prior to that
• 1:04:41
  because I feel like I'm in it. I need to learn everything and
• 1:04:44
  so coach, long gave me, an opportunity to learn a lot of
• 1:04:47
  these things, but it's just different when I'm taking and
• 1:04:49
  turn in paperwork for Coach long or he's walking.
• 1:04:53
  Will now you got to do paperwork yourself.
• 1:04:55
  You got to have a nano time. So it's different as far as that
• 1:04:58
  going because I had some of the other things.
• 1:04:59
  So I had a healthy respect. I'd have a healthy respect for
• 1:05:03
  kind of one-man, band, coaching staff.
• 1:05:07
  I respect the you mentioned earlier about, you know, calling
• 1:05:12
  a mouse Holloway talking to a MIG burn and Cetera as you.
• 1:05:16
  You obviously care a lot about the circle your that, you
• 1:05:19
  surround yourself with that, you allow to surround you.
• 1:05:23
  What's that book? You are the five people.
• 1:05:25
  You spend the most time with her or what not.
• 1:05:27
  And I believe a lot of that stuff, you know, you are who you
• 1:05:29
  surround yourself with you know, and we kind of talked about that
• 1:05:31
  a little bit in our our pre-interview, what's some of
• 1:05:34
  the as you your first year or two, maybe even three years
• 1:05:38
  becoming the head coach. What's some of the best advice
• 1:05:40
  that you got? You obviously reach out to a lot
• 1:05:43
  of people that you respect. Can you remember just like one
• 1:05:46
  nugget that you're like oh man. This this kind of opens the
• 1:05:48
  clouds part when I heard this and this really helped me I say
• 1:05:55
  so many, it really painted on the Hello, The Situation's.
• 1:06:02
  I got great advice from Cecil Ward, who was the longtime head
• 1:06:05
  coach at Paducah Tilghman, High School about, you know, how to
• 1:06:10
  develop multi-event type athletes and kind of maturation.
• 1:06:15
  But always, you always say, I'm giving you all this information,
• 1:06:18
  but always remember was for was first and foremost in that you
• 1:06:21
  and your family. He said, because these kids are
• 1:06:23
  going to come and go, you do your best, you can with them and
• 1:06:26
  treat them all respect. But remember, your first and
• 1:06:28
  foremost, So, that was great advice, not to this day.
• 1:06:32
  I still talk to coach Ward and ask for his guidance and things.
• 1:06:36
  You know, again, I think I mentioned early Terry, long,
• 1:06:40
  tell me about, you know, you can do coaching, but don't go into
• 1:06:43
  it with thinking going to get rich.
• 1:06:45
  But understanding, if you do your job, good things will come.
• 1:06:48
  I firmly believe that and I think a mistake a lot of people
• 1:06:52
  make right now, they get out of the business too quickly because
• 1:06:55
  they like, Oh, I thought I was gonna get rich because I was at
• 1:06:58
  his school. Well, that's cool.
• 1:07:00
  Might not be your only stop and I'm honestly didn't see myself
• 1:07:04
  leaving Western Kentucky for a long time.
• 1:07:07
  When I left Western Kentucky, I was blessed from 2008, the 2019,
• 1:07:13
  we 130 conference championships in that span quite a few.
• 1:07:19
  You know, when 45 some Triple Crowns in there, you know, we
• 1:07:23
  had top 25 teams my last year that we had a relator when 304
• 1:07:27
  indoors, you know, I mean one by one.
• 1:07:32
  Guns, You Name It. We had it.
• 1:07:33
  But a lot of people also didn't realize in 2016.
• 1:07:36
  Western Kentucky, took a 50 percent budget cut and so you go
• 1:07:41
  from having two teams to just finish in the top 25.
• 1:07:44
  And most of all Americans you win five of the six possible
• 1:07:47
  championships and that your between men and women and you
• 1:07:50
  get your budget cut and so that totally changed a lot of way.
• 1:07:53
  I had to look at things because then it was like, okay well I'm
• 1:07:57
  in it because I want to do this and be successful.
• 1:08:00
  But when it makes it difficult to be successful, then that
• 1:08:03
  changes, no matter what the money is, so life comes at you.
• 1:08:09
  So you got to be willing to move.
• 1:08:11
  And I wasn't stuck to WKU because of an athlete or because
• 1:08:16
  of my alma mater. It was a good situation for me
• 1:08:18
  and once that situation changed, I stayed there for another
• 1:08:21
  couple years into a situation. I feel that I can go and be
• 1:08:24
  successful, man, but I'm forever grateful for the opportunities.
• 1:08:27
  I received at Western Kentucky. One.
• 1:08:30
  How many years were you the head coach and lemon.
• 1:08:33
  So 11 years and I can't imagine the challenge you have following
• 1:08:39
  your second father for crying out loud.
• 1:08:43
  However, in 11 years, you definitely put your own
• 1:08:48
  fingerprint on the program. You did things your way which
• 1:08:52
  was a culmination of what. Dr. Curtis long and other people
• 1:08:54
  poured into you and other experiences that you had.
• 1:08:58
  But how did you How did you talk to us about bringing your own
• 1:09:03
  culture and how you continue to change and improve?
• 1:09:06
  Not change for change sake, right?
• 1:09:08
  But to improve along the program, how did you build that
• 1:09:12
  culture and continue that culture?
• 1:09:14
  And really, you know, you you touched on a few of the many
• 1:09:18
  many successes that you and the staffs that you had their had
• 1:09:22
  during that time. He quite, I don't know if I want
• 1:09:25
  to use the word dominate, but man, come on.
• 1:09:28
  That was an impressive. Seven years, my friend, how did
• 1:09:31
  that go? Bring it in your own culture and
• 1:09:34
  continue to improve the program year after year?
• 1:09:37
  We'll do a coach loans to you. We had a very very strong
• 1:09:40
  distance program. You know, they finished in the
• 1:09:42
  top 10 couple times and at one point the Sun Belt Conference
• 1:09:46
  was distance only so history lesson here.
• 1:09:50
  When coach long took over the job and 80 they move their Sun
• 1:09:54
  Belt Conference from the ovc and which Sun Belt was track on me.
• 1:09:58
  And so he walked into his first year.
• 1:10:00
  The I think they finished 10th in the union and NCAA in Cross
• 1:10:05
  to all of a sudden. Now that's all you do, theirs.
• 1:10:07
  No track. They a couple years before.
• 1:10:08
  They had NCAA champion in the shop, put NCAA Champion, a long
• 1:10:11
  jump. So they were complete team in
• 1:10:13
  the ovc. So for about a 20-year stretch,
• 1:10:16
  it was just distance in. Oddly enough, I was actually one
• 1:10:20
  of the first sprinters to come back when they start putting
• 1:10:22
  money in track and field. And so we weren't a Sprint jumps
• 1:10:29
  down and program even during my tenure as an undergraduate, but
• 1:10:33
  as I started to have opportunities Coach one, get
• 1:10:38
  sprinters jumpers hurdlers and and I started recruiting those
• 1:10:40
  folks and so by the time we got to, you know, my tenure as a
• 1:10:46
  head coach, you know, I had a pretty good direction of how to
• 1:10:50
  have a balanced program. There were a lot of years we
• 1:10:52
  scored in every event except for the Pro Bowl and it was just
• 1:10:56
  because I didn't have a vault coach and that is a vent.
• 1:10:59
  You better spend a lot of time with because of a lot of
• 1:11:02
  different reasons safety concerns.
• 1:11:04
  But it's a very, very technical event and So, I built a program
• 1:11:09
  around having. I wanted to have relays that
• 1:11:12
  could run in more than one event, I wanted to have distance
• 1:11:14
  Runners, not cross country Runners, I want to have distance
• 1:11:17
  Runners, that could be extremely effective in cross country, and
• 1:11:22
  they would come and be extremely affecting the distance of this
• 1:11:24
  and want to be on the track. We had throwers gas who finished
• 1:11:29
  in the top ten percent of all Americans.
• 1:11:31
  So I pride myself on going out and trying to have a balanced
• 1:11:35
  team and knowing that I had to deal with again, being hazed at
• 1:11:40
  Middle, Tennessee, and we will actually give the school's
• 1:11:42
  furthest North. So, when you're talking about a
• 1:11:45
  lot of schools that are in Florida, Texas at the time,
• 1:11:49
  Weezy Anna, Alabama, there were a lot of disadvantages.
• 1:11:55
  We had beer in Bowling Green because of weather and things of
• 1:11:57
  that nature. So you have to be very strategic
• 1:12:00
  in the type of people you brought in to be successful.
• 1:12:02
  There are and I think we got pretty close to 2 Getting that
• 1:12:07
  about, right? A lot of times, what are you
• 1:12:09
  most proud of you have a lot to be proud of, but when you look
• 1:12:13
  back at the specific lead, 11 years was the head coach.
• 1:12:16
  What are you most proud of during that time there?
• 1:12:20
  Well, let's see. My first indoor Championship I
• 1:12:23
  ever won was actually at Middle Tennessee.
• 1:12:26
  And if you know anything about the history of that party
• 1:12:30
  country and all respect to the folks down in Murfreesboro, but
• 1:12:35
  that was our route. I mean, when in doubt about it
• 1:12:39
  and you knew you had to go through them to be successful.
• 1:12:42
  So my first championship was at middle so that was good and you
• 1:12:46
  know we don't want it in fashion with you had to run the football
• 1:12:49
  for to get it done. And that so that was a big one
• 1:12:55
  being inducted into the Kentucky, coaches Hollow for
• 1:12:57
  Kentucky Hall of Fame through the track and field Association
• 1:13:00
  that that was really, really big for me because you know, I went
• 1:13:05
  with Coach long was inducted. I went When Cecil Ward, some
• 1:13:08
  other folks who were inducted at new in the state but to be
• 1:13:12
  nominated for that and to be able to earn that Hall of Fame,
• 1:13:16
  induction meant a lot for me because I feel like I still have
• 1:13:19
  so much to to do within the sport but the people who matter
• 1:13:25
  in the sport thought enough of me to honor upon me.
• 1:13:28
  So I was very, very thankful that and then number 30 was was
• 1:13:32
  was good because I earned my 30th Championship after they cut
• 1:13:36
  our How many people say you know, number 30 was real reason
• 1:13:41
  that you're really looking at your age even to say my 30th
• 1:13:44
  Championship. That's right, that's amazing.
• 1:13:47
  Yeah. So yeah number 30 was special
• 1:13:50
  because remember I'm going back to they cut our budget in 2016.
• 1:13:56
  And so, I mean, when you get your budget cut by 50%, that's
• 1:14:00
  traveled that scholarships, that's, I mean, that's
• 1:14:02
  everything. They, they cut us to the gills
• 1:14:05
  and for us to try to fight our way.
• 1:14:06
  I threw that was was, was, was special and tough and the kids
• 1:14:11
  that stayed after all that, and for them to help us win that
• 1:14:14
  championship in a way, we did it.
• 1:14:16
  I mean I had a young man in that meat who ran 45 five and a
• 1:14:20
  quarter to finish third. He ran 20 point, I think, yeah,
• 1:14:24
  28.58 to finish third and 200. He won the long, jump want to
• 1:14:28
  triple jump, he anchored the 4 by 4 and 45 or three holding off
• 1:14:32
  the really, really good. Half mile Earth at UTEP had Who
• 1:14:37
  run 44 opening those like I forgot.
• 1:14:39
  What is 800 was but he end up winning in ch.
• 1:14:41
  I mean we had to be some really, really good people and so to
• 1:14:45
  have that effort out of those young folks despite would have
• 1:14:48
  been done to the program that one was really, really special
• 1:14:52
  and then just to see folks graduate.
• 1:14:54
  I mean, every time I see someone graduate become in That's
• 1:15:00
  special to me because I know I've tried to help put them in a
• 1:15:02
  position where they can take care of their family and that
• 1:15:05
  hopefully, in that scope of time, they've been there that
• 1:15:08
  institution that they've learned something more about like not
• 1:15:11
  just track because if you only learn track while we do, we
• 1:15:15
  hadn't really done a whole lot for you.
• 1:15:17
  You know all the tell them if you want to talk to me you know
• 1:15:20
  my doors always open but also if you want to pull up hey just a
• 1:15:23
  head coach. Can I talk to you?
• 1:15:24
  Pull me off to the side and let's just sit out here in this.
• 1:15:27
  Whatever weather may be in. Just talk and I got a call from
• 1:15:31
  one of my former limp well, he former hilltopper alums and, you
• 1:15:35
  know, he's multi-time All-American and he and I just
• 1:15:37
  talked yesterday about his three girls he now has and you know,
• 1:15:41
  time at Western and time you know, experiences here and how
• 1:15:45
  it's helped him when he had to go to some of the major meets in
• 1:15:47
  the world. But now he's also transition out
• 1:15:49
  of being that Elite professional athlete to me and most
• 1:15:53
  importantly, himself, dad husband, but also what direction
• 1:15:58
  he should go. Set himself up for when he's an
• 1:16:00
  old man, high could take care of his family.
• 1:16:02
  So those are things that really ingratiate me from my time there
• 1:16:07
  at Western Kentucky, before we transition off of what your
• 1:16:10
  Kentucky and head down south here to Tampa.
• 1:16:12
  What the heck is a hill talker. Yeah, so we are on one of the
• 1:16:18
  highest heels in Kentucky. Yeah, I went to a, you know, my
• 1:16:22
  own daughters Troy and right now, one of the first football
• 1:16:24
  games, I took, well, actually, we had just gotten engaged.
• 1:16:26
  We, she wasn't even, my wife was the Troy at Western Kentucky
• 1:16:29
  game and I'd never been on campus before, but oh my God,
• 1:16:32
  walking through the stadium. I swear.
• 1:16:34
  It was it was going uphill, walk into the stadium and then when I
• 1:16:37
  was going back to my car, it still was uphill.
• 1:16:38
  I don't know how that work there and Bowling Green, but it did
• 1:16:41
  man and he is. So hopefully you were, you came
• 1:16:44
  to the game? We had two sides of our Stadium
• 1:16:46
  because at one point, it was just one side of Stadium two
• 1:16:50
  levels. Very, very yeah, two sides, but
• 1:16:53
  at the end it just build. Yes, there you go, all our
• 1:16:56
  football players would say, Amen.
• 1:16:58
  Into the Cyclops, you know, the play go so very, very unique
• 1:17:04
  place. There, the hilltopper came out
• 1:17:08
  of that mythical party heal. And so if you look at the
• 1:17:13
  earlier sketching it looks like somebody person out of will, you
• 1:17:17
  know, Mountaintop or whatever. And then it has now evolved to
• 1:17:20
  one of the most recognizable. Married country who is Big Red.
• 1:17:26
  Matter of fact, it was a couple years ago.
• 1:17:28
  They got into To legal legal wrangling because I think
• 1:17:31
  somewhere in France, they had a big raid over there and you
• 1:17:35
  know, we had ours first and it became a big deal.
• 1:17:37
  So but no, it very, very popular.
• 1:17:40
  The other thing about Western, we wave a red towel, which is
• 1:17:44
  signature of EA diddle, who was one of the most successful
• 1:17:47
  basketball coaches in division, 1 history at a time.
• 1:17:51
  When, you know, when you were talking about Kentucky
• 1:17:53
  basketball, you had Western Kentucky, who was very, very
• 1:17:56
  good as well as Kentucky. Just throughout that whole
• 1:17:59
  statement Murray State, they have had some very, very good
• 1:18:03
  basketball programs but he stood out and they stuck with that
• 1:18:06
  towel because he chewed a towel, he threw the towel.
• 1:18:09
  That was his thing and so you're always going to see two things
• 1:18:11
  when it comes to Western Kentucky.
• 1:18:12
  The red Tower or big red, Manuel, big red, definitely, one
• 1:18:16
  of the most iconic, like people who have no clue, who, or what,
• 1:18:20
  or where Western Kentucky, is knows that called the big red
• 1:18:24
  blob mascot. That's so awesome.
• 1:18:28
  So, so you do an amazing job and I don't think I realized and I
• 1:18:33
  guess maybe I should have inferred that there was
• 1:18:37
  championships specifically the 30th one.
• 1:18:39
  They're after those cuts in 2016.
• 1:18:42
  I remember when they went down because again, not, you know,
• 1:18:44
  any time we're cutting programs or cutting budgets from
• 1:18:48
  programs, you know, it cuts us beep, you know, just for our
• 1:18:51
  love of track and field and love of track and field coach has.
• 1:18:54
  So, I remember when that was going down because then you
• 1:18:57
  know, you invariably got the rumors of oh yeah.
• 1:18:58
  They're shutting the whole program down and things like
• 1:19:00
  that, right? Or they might as well because
• 1:19:03
  you just basically cut the legs off, you know, things like that.
• 1:19:05
  So how did, you know? It was time to leave?
• 1:19:08
  You'd been there for a long time.
• 1:19:11
  You went there to die, to use other words, earlier, and you
• 1:19:17
  obviously were very highly sought out many.
• 1:19:20
  Many people would have wanted you either on their staffs or
• 1:19:23
  leading their programs. How did, you know, it was time
• 1:19:27
  to go and why South Florida? Yeah.
• 1:19:29
  Well, I tell you, I was hired by a gentleman, by the name of
• 1:19:33
  doctor. Would see the crews.
• 1:19:34
  Now, Daphne, great at Old Dominion, but when he was at
• 1:19:36
  Western, when they hired me and I also had the pleasure of
• 1:19:39
  working with Ross, Bjork, who is now on the athletic director at
• 1:19:43
  Texas A&M but he left Western Kentucky and go to Ole Miss and
• 1:19:46
  then end up going to Texas A&M. So I've been around some good
• 1:19:50
  folks and also within the community of Administrators I've
• 1:19:54
  been blessed to be around some good people.
• 1:19:56
  And when you Are talking to administrators and they're
• 1:20:01
  saying it's time for you to go, you've done everything.
• 1:20:03
  You can possibly do, it's not going to get any better.
• 1:20:07
  I think you have to listen and that's where wise counsel comes
• 1:20:10
  in and so some were telling me hey, as soon as the season over
• 1:20:13
  you, take the first thing smoking, but I knew that wasn't
• 1:20:16
  for me. I wanted to be somewhere where I
• 1:20:19
  wanted to live first and foremost again to all my BG.
• 1:20:24
  Family Bowling Green was a great place.
• 1:20:28
  But for where I was and my life you know there were challenges
• 1:20:33
  just socially. I mean you just there's only so
• 1:20:35
  many times you can go to the Corvette Hall of Fame I know.
• 1:20:38
  Right. Exactly.
• 1:20:40
  And yeah and the restaurants got very old but and you know, and I
• 1:20:43
  was close enough to Nashville that Nashville offered, you
• 1:20:47
  know, more of a life. And I said you know what, if at
• 1:20:49
  all possible I would like to go to three places and I kind of
• 1:20:53
  had my list to live and lo and behold Ncaa's not a good day for
• 1:21:01
  me at the ncaa's I pulled off what goes out and runs 30 too
• 1:21:05
  low. We got the second-fastest time
• 1:21:07
  coming back for the ncaa's and unfortunately we get
• 1:21:10
  disqualified and I'm sitting here going, wait a minute, I
• 1:21:13
  didn't even run my two best guys I thought we really gonna run
• 1:21:18
  and get disqualified next day I go out to the track just like
• 1:21:22
  I'm watching the actual multis and Boss comes across that they
• 1:21:29
  have been a change at the University of South Florida.
• 1:21:32
  Didn't think anything of it, but there are two particular
• 1:21:34
  coaching that turn around saying.
• 1:21:35
  You know what? You will be great for that job.
• 1:21:37
  I'm going. Yeah well whatever you know and
• 1:21:43
  man for the end of the night I got a very cryptic all hey, love
• 1:21:49
  to talk to you about opportunities and And, you know,
• 1:21:53
  obviously had some other opportunities kind of had play
• 1:21:55
  at the time and I just got back and start thinking and my wife
• 1:22:01
  was talking, like, what do we want to do?
• 1:22:03
  And at that point, it was like really what she wanted to do.
• 1:22:07
  Because she's got her own business, she's a professional
• 1:22:11
  and I wanted to be supportive of her because it's coaches.
• 1:22:14
  We think. Oh, I, why supposed to drop
• 1:22:16
  everything, just do what we do. And actually earlier that year
• 1:22:22
  even Admit year. I had an opportunity want me to
• 1:22:24
  come in and do something. I'm just at that time, I felt
• 1:22:27
  like it wasn't the right place, and it wasn't the right time.
• 1:22:29
  And so, he was just the right time.
• 1:22:32
  I mean, to be honest with you, I had visited the school before
• 1:22:36
  because at a time, another one of my friends was the head
• 1:22:39
  football coach at South Florida before he left to go to Oregon
• 1:22:42
  to be the head coach at Oregon and then he came back to Florida
• 1:22:44
  state, which is really taggard. Yeah.
• 1:22:46
  How do you know him? I'd also say, wait a minute,
• 1:22:48
  you're feeling a little cryptic you that you're talking about,
• 1:22:49
  will ya? So Western Kentucky.
• 1:22:53
  So trying to give you the history there, we had two
• 1:22:56
  longtime coaches when I was a student at Western Kentucky,
• 1:23:00
  Louisville, when I'm with dr. Curtis longer had to try and
• 1:23:02
  program but the other one was Jack Harbaugh, really Jack.
• 1:23:07
  Hardball Father, John Harbaugh land and you know, so the hard
• 1:23:10
  balls will not Michigan. You know, their dad was the head
• 1:23:14
  football coach at Western Kentucky with a tagger is a
• 1:23:18
  class of head of me and he's from down in Central Florida.
• 1:23:22
  And so, we knew each other because once you come to a place
• 1:23:25
  like that, you kind of know who to athletes are and where are
• 1:23:29
  you from, right? And we're Florida guys, and
• 1:23:32
  since day one, I've known him at Western Kentucky.
• 1:23:35
  Wow. To this day, we still, you know,
• 1:23:38
  he's a guy, I know and then kick her fine in.
• 1:23:41
  And do you ever so? This is interesting using Willie
• 1:23:46
  as an example and I'll good friends with them and the
• 1:23:48
  success he's had and and you know and definitely a guy and I
• 1:23:51
  mean this in all the Right. This is not since you're friends
• 1:23:54
  with him. This is not a dig at him.
• 1:23:56
  It's easy as a public figure to make Digs at him, right.
• 1:23:59
  But he has certainly gone to places and gotten fired and
• 1:24:01
  moved up. And I mean that in the right way
• 1:24:02
  I mean you know you name the places he's been at me and and I
• 1:24:05
  love the guy I mean I actually think he got some raw deals at
• 1:24:08
  some of the places he was at. But do you ever think like, man,
• 1:24:13
  maybe I should have done football coaching well process
• 1:24:21
  because they have been Hey man, I know you're doing your Trek
• 1:24:25
  theme, but why don't you just come on as a full-time?
• 1:24:27
  You know, strengthened getting ditch or speed guy, right?
• 1:24:30
  Right. It's Nan.
• 1:24:31
  I'm going. Yeah, but I also know, and
• 1:24:34
  understand that football can be very, very fickle.
• 1:24:37
  Sure. And all the success stories, you
• 1:24:39
  see your lot of bodies on the side of the road.
• 1:24:42
  And so you have to understand that.
• 1:24:44
  So my path is tracking for you. Now, if they want to hire me as
• 1:24:49
  a person to work specifically with and pay me more money, I
• 1:24:53
  think I could find some time in my day to do that.
• 1:24:56
  But no, I am passionate about this sport.
• 1:25:00
  I think great sport. They believe in football and
• 1:25:03
  basketball. But this is what I do.
• 1:25:05
  But I mean, just in my tenure alone at Western Kentucky, they
• 1:25:10
  would 5 head coaches. David Ellison, who's at, Purdue
• 1:25:14
  was at Purdue his past year as an assistant, will a tagger came
• 1:25:18
  in. When I program was in the
• 1:25:20
  toilet, he built it in, Recruited.
• 1:25:23
  I mean they're still benefits are benefits of things with
• 1:25:25
  attacking did when he was there. You know, Mike Mike's last name,
• 1:25:31
  he was just the interim head coach at Colorado before Deion
• 1:25:34
  Sanders became bikes answered Jeff brohm who left Western and
• 1:25:40
  went to Purdue and now is it Louisville and in Tyson Helen
• 1:25:44
  who's still there right now, doing a fantastic job.
• 1:25:47
  So been around some good going. Let's not forget Bobby Petrino,
• 1:25:51
  I will do You about a tree no before he went back to
• 1:25:55
  Louisville. So not all of all of them were
• 1:25:57
  good coaches. Not off.
• 1:25:58
  Not all well, figure easy to make shots at Bobby Petrino and
• 1:26:06
  right? Right.
• 1:26:06
  And I certainly understand that but when you talk about, when
• 1:26:09
  you tell my management and all those things, hey that guy
• 1:26:13
  understands that his dream I love.
• 1:26:15
  And and one thing I spent a lot of time around the football guys
• 1:26:18
  because again, they have so many things already built into how to
• 1:26:21
  be successful. You had to use them.
• 1:26:23
  If you want to learn how to use recruiting in some of the
• 1:26:25
  recruiting system they use because I'm a football, new
• 1:26:28
  rules and all that type of stuff taught a football.
• 1:26:31
  They are just 10 times ahead of where we are.
• 1:26:34
  A lot of times as track and field either other sports.
• 1:26:37
  So if you're not utilizing your football staff expertise, then I
• 1:26:41
  think you're doing yourself a dish just as and hopefully you
• 1:26:44
  have a relationship where you can have, you know, those
• 1:26:47
  conversations. Even when I got into South
• 1:26:48
  Florida, I had a very, very great opportunity.
• 1:26:52
  If Charlie Strong, Who the head coach here at the time.
• 1:26:55
  So then we brought in Jeff Scott who was the o.c. at Clemson
• 1:26:59
  before coming to be the head coach here at South Florida and
• 1:27:02
  so now we've just hired a new football coach.
• 1:27:04
  So I hope I'll have the opportunity to work with
• 1:27:06
  coaches. Well, so there are a lot of
• 1:27:09
  positives about the places I've been and people I've been able
• 1:27:12
  to meet. So as you started getting your
• 1:27:14
  feet wet there, at South Florida, what were some of the
• 1:27:17
  differences? Like major not counting the big
• 1:27:21
  budget cuts You had to go through what you're going to you
• 1:27:23
  but just in general, as far as culture style, what were some of
• 1:27:26
  the biggest differences that you had to learn new ways?
• 1:27:30
  You know every it's not I know every trick for meters but not
• 1:27:33
  every track program operates the same in that every athletic
• 1:27:36
  department operates the same. So what were some of the nuances
• 1:27:38
  you had to kind of learn and work your way through there in
• 1:27:40
  Tampa? Well, the big thing is just
• 1:27:43
  learning South Florida. Hmm, at the end of day, attract
• 1:27:47
  me to the trade me. I'm truly a friendly before play
• 1:27:50
  football. Football game is a football
• 1:27:51
  game, but In order to get to that point where you can put
• 1:27:54
  quality people in that sport to be successful, you have to
• 1:27:57
  really learn the environment in which you work in, whether that
• 1:28:01
  be in athletic department, as well as across campus, the city,
• 1:28:05
  you're in there, just so many things that you have to learn
• 1:28:08
  about. And when I got here at South
• 1:28:10
  Florida, they have, they had spurts of success.
• 1:28:15
  You know, Bob Raymond is actually who head coach at
• 1:28:17
  Florida State actually worked at Southwest for a long time and so
• 1:28:22
  Still coming in and seeing some of the stuff that Bob had to
• 1:28:25
  deal with back. Then it was like, we got to make
• 1:28:28
  some changes here and luckily I have a very, very, very Dynamic,
• 1:28:34
  athletic director, Michael Kelly, you know, he came in and
• 1:28:38
  said, listen, I know, we aren't where we need to be, but if you
• 1:28:42
  give me a chance, I will give you opportunities.
• 1:28:45
  And I took a step out on faith, because one I wanted to be in
• 1:28:49
  Tampa. Secondly, I thought this place
• 1:28:53
  has nowhere to go, but up and I felt like he was the right
• 1:28:57
  person to give opportunities and now I'm killing weird.
• 1:28:59
  Good aeds. Leave because like anything if
• 1:29:03
  people want them, but he is generally interested in being
• 1:29:07
  here. And as long as he's generally
• 1:29:08
  generality, interested in being here, then I'm his guy and it is
• 1:29:13
  my job to make him look good. In this realm, we call
• 1:29:17
  University of South Florida and we have a long way to go.
• 1:29:20
  We have not been good across the board whether it be distance,
• 1:29:25
  indoor outdoor track. But there were just so many
• 1:29:28
  things that we had to retool to show them what a successful
• 1:29:31
  program is supposed to look like.
• 1:29:33
  And not just, oh, we have a team there over there, like, no
• 1:29:38
  administrative Lee, we need to have this.
• 1:29:41
  We need to do this. I mean, there's some things that
• 1:29:42
  were in place that I was like, Wow, but there's a whole lot
• 1:29:45
  more that would like we are lacking way behind and to the
• 1:29:50
  coaches will be. Your prior to me I think they
• 1:29:52
  fought a lot of fights and we had a lot of turnover and
• 1:29:55
  athletic director position whenever you have turnover, that
• 1:29:58
  position. Everything is topsy-turvy.
• 1:30:00
  So never really have a clear path.
• 1:30:02
  So we're still trying to forge a path forward here and then you
• 1:30:05
  throw in covid. We came in right back over here,
• 1:30:07
  right? And trying to figure things out.
• 1:30:09
  It was just our first two years. You were very very interesting
• 1:30:15
  because some of the things you want to have, you just couldn't
• 1:30:18
  get it because they'll people being Let go because of:.
• 1:30:23
  We did a very, very good job as athletic department holding on
• 1:30:26
  to their, the very end before they were any budget cuts to any
• 1:30:30
  staff members or anything like that.
• 1:30:31
  So, it being very, very thankful his leadership and I look
• 1:30:35
  forward to working with in his leadership.
• 1:30:36
  At this program, you have a lot of empathy for the coaches with
• 1:30:40
  their, their Assistance or heads that started the fall of
• 1:30:43
  nineteen or even the January of twenty and then covid, right?
• 1:30:47
  I mean, you you already have the daunting task of running a
• 1:30:50
  marathon. With on up the hill because you
• 1:30:51
  get to learn a new program and do recruiting etcetera and then
• 1:30:54
  covid comes and puts like the hundred pound weight vest on you
• 1:30:57
  and says, okay now. Run that killed, right?
• 1:30:59
  Yeah. Now we're that 100 that right
• 1:31:02
  there. So yeah, ton of, you know, all
• 1:31:04
  the plans that you have and goals that you have just really
• 1:31:08
  go out the door and now you start from scratch and you're
• 1:31:11
  delayed on everything that you want to get done.
• 1:31:13
  Whether it's fundraising recruiting coaching and Cetera
• 1:31:17
  for, for the, for the program. How did he go?
• 1:31:20
  The staff. There, you have an amazing group
• 1:31:22
  there. I love them to death.
• 1:31:24
  How'd that go kind of building it from?
• 1:31:28
  I don't know. If it's fair to say from ground
• 1:31:29
  zero right? You'll explain that a little
• 1:31:31
  bit. But how did you go building your
• 1:31:33
  staff? Well, it wasn't from Ground Zero
• 1:31:35
  because the program had been around a while but the structure
• 1:31:38
  of the program I was it had lacked in areas and again that's
• 1:31:43
  not a shot to enter the coaches because when again with Bob was
• 1:31:47
  here, they will cross country and then they started getting
• 1:31:49
  tracked. So As you can see, good coaches,
• 1:31:52
  do a good coach do cuz he's doing an amazing job up in
• 1:31:55
  Tallahassee. And for me, I knew having Done.
• 1:32:02
  A lot of the grunt work at Western Kentucky that I want it
• 1:32:07
  balance in my life. I don't think anybody's going to
• 1:32:08
  outwork me. I'm always going to be
• 1:32:10
  disciplined. We're going to work at it and I
• 1:32:12
  expect you to work, but I knew there was a different way to get
• 1:32:14
  to it. And so I went on a hire people
• 1:32:17
  that I knew got to it. And so my, my Sprint hurdles
• 1:32:22
  coach is BJ, Dean who's been at George Mason.
• 1:32:27
  He's been at Tennessee, North Carolina.
• 1:32:29
  We were able to acquire his talents as South Florida from
• 1:32:33
  North Carolina. You look at the living legend
• 1:32:37
  himself. Don Marsh, who was our high
• 1:32:39
  jump, Koval coach, who matter faggots come in.
• 1:32:44
  Even our team, you, he's had to the people who got it done at
• 1:32:46
  the highest level continuously, but the programs we always say,
• 1:32:49
  we gotta catch up with Coach Marsh, but he's been here now,
• 1:32:53
  24 years, I soft water. So there's a lot of invaluable
• 1:32:56
  experience that he brings to the table and you talk about a guy
• 1:32:59
  who was of his young age and And enthusiasm still has a lot of go
• 1:33:04
  to him every day. He's here.
• 1:33:06
  He's ready to go and he's enthusiastic about coaching up.
• 1:33:09
  Those vultures and high jumpers coach Miriam MK.
• 1:33:15
  As we affectionately call her, she's had stops at Ole Miss
• 1:33:19
  Yukon. She was the five-time NCAA
• 1:33:22
  champion in the shot. Put while they're at University
• 1:33:25
  of Florida. And again, having another
• 1:33:28
  quality throws coach, I also Kind of jumping back.
• 1:33:32
  I had the pleasure of having Ashley Kovacs as one of my
• 1:33:38
  assistant coaches at Western Kentucky and I feel the same way
• 1:33:41
  if I get Miriam the same type of athletes or better, I think that
• 1:33:46
  MK will be one of the best throws coaches in the country
• 1:33:50
  because you tell Mason told someone who understands it and
• 1:33:52
  is a very passionate and communicate with athletes.
• 1:33:56
  She does it, we just got to be a better job of putting people in
• 1:33:59
  her group and again, remind you I like throwers.
• 1:34:03
  So to get yours, my distance, coaches Damon Griffiths, who was
• 1:34:07
  been with. He was at University of Miami
• 1:34:09
  for 13 years, I believe, before he made the transition here to
• 1:34:15
  Temple University of South Florida.
• 1:34:17
  And then I've got one of the best young jumps coaches, multi
• 1:34:21
  coaches. I believe in the country and
• 1:34:23
  Coach Romero Henry who's done it at the division.
• 1:34:25
  One level, the NAIA level junior college level had success in all
• 1:34:29
  of them. So he had stopped at bard.
• 1:34:31
  Many college called real Community College Wayland,
• 1:34:34
  Baptist Western Kentucky. And now here at South Florida
• 1:34:39
  and I again, I am very very happy with his progress as a
• 1:34:43
  young coach and I think he is going to be outstanding, a great
• 1:34:47
  group of people who think goodness are chose the
• 1:34:50
  profession of track and field coaching to be real Frank with
• 1:34:53
  you. I got to see him KJ briefly in
• 1:34:55
  Denver. I think it was just recently I
• 1:34:57
  had to be Denver she's amazing she has been amazing for a long
• 1:35:01
  time. Not just as an athlete, but as a
• 1:35:02
  person Romero, I think you're right.
• 1:35:05
  I think he's, he's just starting to write his book.
• 1:35:08
  He's still writing the introduction of what's going to
• 1:35:11
  be an amazing career? Damon.
• 1:35:14
  Oh my gosh. Love him.
• 1:35:16
  What an amazing person. I'm curious about Don.
• 1:35:21
  Marsh love him. By the way.
• 1:35:22
  This is not a setup because I love worked with Don for a long
• 1:35:25
  time. I thought it was interesting,
• 1:35:28
  you know, when you go into a new program and I don't judge The
• 1:35:32
  coach based on this is going to sound harsh because most people
• 1:35:34
  are going to say, well, no, this is exactly how you're supposed
• 1:35:36
  to judge a coach but I don't judge the coach based on the
• 1:35:41
  program's results because there are a lot of things going on
• 1:35:45
  most of what we Outsiders. So, if you're not in the
• 1:35:48
  program, you're an outsider. Don't even know what's going on.
• 1:35:51
  I'm reminded of the great George Williams and what he says, if
• 1:35:54
  you're not in the Huddle, you don't know the play.
• 1:35:56
  So the people that were there at South Florida, I would see the
• 1:36:00
  exact same things about About what I just said about your
• 1:36:03
  current people, they were amazing.
• 1:36:04
  They are amazing. They've gone on to other places
• 1:36:06
  in their coaching, they're putting their butts off doing a
• 1:36:08
  great job. So I thought it was interesting.
• 1:36:13
  That you keep Don on. I don't know if it was
• 1:36:16
  calculated or not and the reason I say it's interesting is
• 1:36:19
  because a lot of times we go to a new institution, we bring in a
• 1:36:23
  whole new staff. Well, that's staff.
• 1:36:25
  Doesn't Know, Jack about the athletic department, recruiting
• 1:36:29
  their etcetera. They're learning it from zero,
• 1:36:32
  they got their experiences, but they don't know.
• 1:36:34
  They don't even barely barely know how to get to the office
• 1:36:37
  and when they get there, they do, you know where the bathrooms
• 1:36:38
  at? How in the world are they
• 1:36:39
  supposed to go turn in this paperwork, get this official.
• 1:36:43
  It signed off on so they can get up here at cetera but you kept
• 1:36:47
  Don on who's an amazing coach by the way.
• 1:36:50
  But because he'd been there so long, it feels like outside
• 1:36:54
  looking in that. He would have been your compass.
• 1:36:57
  Like, oh, you want to know where True North is ask Don because
• 1:37:00
  he's traveled, this map of before he died on.
• 1:37:03
  How do we get this done? Hey Don.
• 1:37:04
  Who do I see about this? Hey Don who's our academic
• 1:37:07
  person? Because we got to do X, Y and Z
• 1:37:10
  how invaluable was Keeping a guy like Don who had been there for
• 1:37:17
  and I know it's tough because you went into covid, but how
• 1:37:19
  important was he to instead of starting at step one?
• 1:37:24
  It's almost feels like maybe you guys started on step 3, right?
• 1:37:28
  So coach and Marsh. And again that staff prior to
• 1:37:32
  me, they had, they did a good job, they had a lot of beers,
• 1:37:36
  they were dealing with one of the things, most people have no
• 1:37:38
  idea how hard it is to get into the University of Florida.
• 1:37:42
  I M. So you typically between Western
• 1:37:45
  Kentucky and South Florida. First thing I tell you
• 1:37:47
  academics, you know, right now, I think we're ranked 42nd in the
• 1:37:51
  country or public institutions as far as academic rankings.
• 1:37:54
  Is that right? It, you do not walk into South
• 1:37:56
  Florida with just NCAA GPA and barely making it in test scores.
• 1:38:03
  So in another interesting fact, the University of South Florida
• 1:38:07
  is a public institution and although during covid the NCAA
• 1:38:11
  wave test scores For me, period, the State of Florida State.
• 1:38:16
  Pat is still requires public institutions and state of
• 1:38:18
  Florida to have sat. So we talked about our growth
• 1:38:21
  are a lot of things we had thrown at his Kovac.
• 1:38:23
  Oh we don't give a prion. Ask you to just just a lot and
• 1:38:25
  it's hard as who are getting 2 but that de coche Marsh.
• 1:38:29
  When I came in, I evaluate everything everybody from the
• 1:38:33
  top to the bottom. What are we doing here?
• 1:38:36
  And when I looked at coach Marsh, I saw continued success
• 1:38:41
  and his event area. He'd been here through a lot and
• 1:38:45
  I value wisdom, you can bring a lot of people in and everybody
• 1:38:50
  has a right answer when they come in.
• 1:38:53
  But if I was going to have someone stay around, I wanted
• 1:38:56
  someone who had a certain expertise outside of the X's and
• 1:38:59
  O's of track and field. And I think you and I talked
• 1:39:02
  earlier, I like having conversations with coaches,
• 1:39:04
  who've been around, seeing it done it.
• 1:39:06
  So my conversation with Coach marshburn really about oh, I
• 1:39:10
  know you coach this kid and this was All-American.
• 1:39:12
  All They're like coach, let's just talk and the conversation.
• 1:39:17
  We had early solidified, he was the person I need to keep around
• 1:39:22
  to help us. Make a quality transition in a
• 1:39:24
  very, very unique situation. Because on the outside, looking
• 1:39:29
  in people, go watch the south Florida, just wildly successful,
• 1:39:33
  but there are a lot of stumbling blocks that coaches have faced
• 1:39:36
  prior to this. And I'm thankful that I have an
• 1:39:38
  Administration and saying, okay, let's look at this from another
• 1:39:42
  view and how to Give you a chance to be successful as a
• 1:39:46
  coach and development program. And so coach Marshall has been
• 1:39:49
  invaluable to this day. Coach Martian.
• 1:39:51
  I sit down like we sit down and talk man, the stories.
• 1:39:55
  You can tell you about here his days at Michigan State, when he
• 1:39:58
  was an athlete in the time, you ran against a guy who went on
• 1:40:01
  the middle of the four hundred verses his first year here and
• 1:40:05
  building a weight room under the stands at the University of
• 1:40:07
  South Florida track and so on and so forth.
• 1:40:09
  So they're just things that we need to know and he's been
• 1:40:13
  Invaluable and again still enthusiastic still excited to be
• 1:40:16
  here and he's very, very well respected.
• 1:40:20
  I thought it was a brilliant move on your part.
• 1:40:23
  You know, again, not not say anything about the other people
• 1:40:28
  you didn't necessarily keep or what not and maybe they had
• 1:40:30
  other opportunities as well. But when I saw Don, I was just
• 1:40:33
  like, oh man, like I honestly was a reflection of you because
• 1:40:36
  I was like, oh here's a guy who knows that he don't know what's
• 1:40:40
  going on a Tampa, and it'll take him a couple years.
• 1:40:43
  Is really to really understand it or I can have my I don't know
• 1:40:48
  that's going to kill me for this one.
• 1:40:49
  I can have my yoda stay here and it's a hey go do this.
• 1:40:54
  Hey you know we tried this so maybe go this route, you know I
• 1:40:58
  just thought again that kind of that that true north that
• 1:41:00
  Compass man. I thought that was a brilliant,
• 1:41:02
  brilliant move and one that may be more people should consider
• 1:41:05
  when they take over programs. You know, I don't know that
• 1:41:08
  people, you know, I love dispelling myths and one of the
• 1:41:13
  The great stories that we had here was, we had Harless matters
• 1:41:17
  on the conference and hands on the podcast.
• 1:41:20
  And we talked about when Bob took over and Harless also put
• 1:41:24
  in for that job and you know, stereotypically, if I asked
• 1:41:27
  anybody, hey, if someone on the staff puts in for the job but
• 1:41:29
  doesn't get in someone else from the outside, doesn't get it.
• 1:41:30
  What happens to that person on the staff, they leave.
• 1:41:32
  They're gone. Right?
• 1:41:34
  The the new head coach doesn't want to keep them because they
• 1:41:36
  wanted my job and the guy who didn't get the job doesn't want
• 1:41:38
  to be there because he didn't get the job and and, you know, I
• 1:41:41
  asked them a cycle. So how did you guys Work that
• 1:41:43
  out. He's like, oh, we were
• 1:41:44
  professionals. That's how we worked it out.
• 1:41:45
  Is like, I love that institution.
• 1:41:47
  That's why I wanted to be the head coach.
• 1:41:48
  It wasn't time for me and I'm so blessed that Bob didn't feel.
• 1:41:52
  Bob didn't have the ego and feel threatened because that guy also
• 1:41:55
  applied for the job. So the other, you know, the
• 1:41:58
  other myth is that when you take over a program, well, you've got
• 1:42:01
  to cut clean house. You gotta cut all burn it down.
• 1:42:05
  There's a reason why the coach is gone and now you're in
• 1:42:09
  charge. And that's because everybody
• 1:42:11
  else was terrible. That's not Not true.
• 1:42:14
  I think if more nor new head coach has not necessarily your
• 1:42:18
  first head coaching job, you're new to the institution.
• 1:42:21
  Really evaluated the current staff.
• 1:42:23
  I think they would find more good in that current staff than
• 1:42:28
  not good. And really do themselves.
• 1:42:30
  A big favor of starting off again on that step 3.
• 1:42:34
  Not on step one. So again, I just thought Bravo,
• 1:42:36
  move keeping Don, you know, all the things you said times, 10
• 1:42:41
  times 100 as far as the He has from the coaching body, the
• 1:42:44
  respect. He has for me again.
• 1:42:46
  I've worked with them for many, many years.
• 1:42:47
  Just an amazing person and an awesome coach that's very, very
• 1:42:51
  smart. Well, Eric wrap us up here
• 1:42:54
  today. Tell us what's got you excited
• 1:42:57
  about the future. You're kind of really, just now
• 1:43:00
  starting because of covid and all the other junk, I did not
• 1:43:04
  know South Florida. I didn't think South Florida,
• 1:43:06
  was just some, you know, we don't really have a good rival
• 1:43:09
  at Troy because I always want to say like the Rival of Troy
• 1:43:11
  whenever I want to put down in. Institution, but we don't really
• 1:43:14
  have a rival, just not really good, but I didn't think it was
• 1:43:16
  just some, you know, long as you have a 2.0 in a heartbeat you
• 1:43:20
  get in but I didn't know it was that tough to get away and
• 1:43:24
  that's when things coaching. I talked about Coach Marsh,
• 1:43:27
  going back to him, he was like coach you going to learn that is
• 1:43:31
  difficult to get kids in school. Now going back to another point.
• 1:43:35
  We talked about on the first who I'm talking about.
• 1:43:38
  All right, tell me about South Florida football guys.
• 1:43:42
  You can't get them in and then if you go this direction, it's
• 1:43:45
  not going to happen. The time frame, you know, we are
• 1:43:47
  a research institution, so a fifty, one thousand students.
• 1:43:51
  They are really worried about it.
• 1:43:52
  One kid gets and they don't, it's that's it.
• 1:43:55
  When I was at my last institution, they wanted
• 1:43:57
  everybody who could make the general quota that's burning.
• 1:44:01
  So that was a bit different because the timing of being able
• 1:44:04
  to recruit quality athletes, me going to talk to you about South
• 1:44:08
  Florida. So it's a it's not hard, they
• 1:44:11
  hear 10. Were they here?
• 1:44:13
  So other things. So, we've been able to get on
• 1:44:15
  some doors that people probably wouldn't think we will be in
• 1:44:18
  because we work at it first and foremost, but also, now I can't
• 1:44:22
  sell education, and having these type of programs that you can
• 1:44:25
  continue to matriculate through, but talking to those football
• 1:44:30
  guys and have an understanding of what to do.
• 1:44:32
  It helped me really focus. Alright this is going to take a
• 1:44:34
  little more time because there are areas administrative or they
• 1:44:39
  have the ketchup, kind of what we're going to do.
• 1:44:42
  Then of course covid. And then just Don's, God is like
• 1:44:44
  coach Rupp that won't work five years ago, you could get this in
• 1:44:49
  but now because of this, you can't do that.
• 1:44:51
  So we avoided a lot of head ramming against the wall because
• 1:44:55
  of Coach Marsh and say all right, well they've seen that,
• 1:44:59
  let me ask about it. Oh that doesn't work cool.
• 1:45:02
  We can pivot to the right or left very very quickly to try to
• 1:45:06
  get to a place, that's excessive force, all, hmm.
• 1:45:08
  So, what's got you excited this year?
• 1:45:11
  Man's 20? I don't know what yours is. 20
• 1:45:13
  23 you got 20 23 season coming up.
• 1:45:15
  What's got you excited this year?
• 1:45:16
  I'm excited for opportunities. Hmm.
• 1:45:18
  Got we finally starting to get some kids in here that want to
• 1:45:22
  compete and I think we're just starting to scratch the surface.
• 1:45:30
  We got kids who want to compete and I'll leave it at dad, you
• 1:45:35
  got to get it done, it counts in the bright lights, come on, and
• 1:45:37
  do everything, you know, outside of that.
• 1:45:40
  But I'm really, really excited about the racial.
• 1:45:42
  You can go, you know, I like being at the track on Friday and
• 1:45:45
  Saturday when you can be excited about getting there, then that's
• 1:45:51
  that's a big part of it, you know, if you're dreading going
• 1:45:53
  to the meats widget, there have been days.
• 1:45:55
  You like, I like being able boys, gonna be a long weekend.
• 1:45:59
  You finally, to the point where you can go, it still might be a
• 1:46:02
  long weekend, but we can have some fun, you know, and you got
• 1:46:06
  to work hard, you got to be disciplined and you got to be
• 1:46:08
  determined in order to have fun because winning is fun.
• 1:46:12
  And I often tell my team, I want a couple, but I love to win a
• 1:46:17
  few more and I like to do you guys winning is fun, but you
• 1:46:21
  don't get there by osmosis you got to work at it and got to be
• 1:46:23
  disciplined. You got to be determined.
• 1:46:26
  So that's what I'm looking forward to.
• 1:46:29
  I'm looking Forward to just seeing everything is New Year,
• 1:46:31
  has to bring. And I think if nothing else
• 1:46:34
  covid has taught us that man, appreciate the opportunity
• 1:46:38
  because we sat around for a long time.
• 1:46:41
  In 2020, not knowing if we were going to have this opportunity,
• 1:46:45
  And you've got the opportunity, you're hosting conference
• 1:46:48
  championships. This year, there's something
• 1:46:50
  special about it being on your, your track, your hometown, your
• 1:46:55
  house. Well, we're looking forward to
• 1:46:57
  having folks. Come to Tampa, you know, we just
• 1:46:59
  had on track resurfaced and we hosted the NCAA first round here
• 1:47:04
  a couple years and we actually hosted a conference
• 1:47:05
  Championship. Two years ago we had a pretty
• 1:47:07
  decent showing but again is just starting to make it our program.
• 1:47:14
  And we will make an impact in the sport of track and field
• 1:47:19
  here, the University of South Florida and I say that with all
• 1:47:22
  humility, it won't happen overnight but we'll be there
• 1:47:27
  when it counts. Eric first of all, thank you
• 1:47:30
  again for being here. You know, we know when we ask
• 1:47:34
  people to be on the show, you know it's not an easy ask
• 1:47:36
  because this is a, you know, hey, let's do 15 minutes and
• 1:47:39
  right after day. So totally appreciate your time
• 1:47:42
  and time commitment to us here today A you know what's
• 1:47:45
  interesting about you Eric many, many things by the way, because
• 1:47:49
  I could absolutely see you killing it in the corporate
• 1:47:51
  world. Your original goal, you talked
• 1:47:53
  about the corner office and all that I can see You'd Be in the
• 1:47:56
  suit and tie and and running Financial companies or whatnot.
• 1:48:00
  I really do. It's quite amazing.
• 1:48:01
  I'm so happy that you chose the profession of coaching track and
• 1:48:04
  field. What's interesting about you at
• 1:48:07
  this age, such a young age. I mean, you're you know, you're
• 1:48:11
  barely at halftime. If you know, you were quarter
• 1:48:13
  mile, ER your Barely at the 200 meter split of your career.
• 1:48:17
  It seems like you know, if I would say hey I'm gonna have
• 1:48:20
  someone on the show who's got 30 conference championships blah
• 1:48:22
  blah they like oh it's somebody who's probably close to
• 1:48:25
  retirement, you know, they've been in the game 60 years like
• 1:48:27
  oh yeah, no, no. I got a guy who's barely been in
• 1:48:29
  for 20 years. So you're just so early and had
• 1:48:32
  so much success so far in your career, and I think success,
• 1:48:36
  begets success, right? You learn systems and placements
• 1:48:39
  and you have those and now you you enacting them in this new
• 1:48:42
  program here in South Florida, I'm just Excited to see the
• 1:48:46
  second 200 meters, then the second act, you know, I think
• 1:48:50
  what you're doing is unique, I think your leadership is
• 1:48:54
  probably your most, your biggest asset that you have your hell of
• 1:49:00
  a coach. Don't get me wrong, but the
• 1:49:02
  leadership that you show other coaches and your staff, your
• 1:49:05
  other peer coaches. The humility that you have to
• 1:49:09
  quickly pick up the phone and say, hey coach, how did you do
• 1:49:13
  that? I need a little help here.
• 1:49:14
  Hey coach, how, what would you do here, but also be able to
• 1:49:18
  take that information and take it through your own sponge and
• 1:49:21
  what comes out the other end and how it affects you and your
• 1:49:24
  program positively that's a skill as well.
• 1:49:26
  So I'm just so excited like I said we're it's a neat sneak
• 1:49:30
  peek into a career that's like said barely barely at halftime.
• 1:49:37
  You've got a lot to go in a lot of work to do and I have no
• 1:49:39
  doubts that it's going to be 30 more championships.
• 1:49:43
  You already done what most people will never.
• 1:49:44
  Doing their career friend, sorry.
• 1:49:47
  But I think there's going to be you know, at the end of the day,
• 1:49:49
  I think it's going to be quite transformational the rest of the
• 1:49:53
  career and what you do as a whole man.
• 1:49:55
  And so we're rooting for you can't wait to see hosting
• 1:49:57
  conference. That's a big deal and can't wait
• 1:49:59
  to see the fingerprints. Continue to be on the Bulls
• 1:50:03
  there at South Florida. Well, I certainly appreciate it
• 1:50:06
  and appreciate everything you're doing for this body.
• 1:50:09
  I mean, in the coaching body, these are very very informative.
• 1:50:12
  I mean, I found myself I forgot who I was.
• 1:50:15
  I was driving somewhere recruiting and just pop it in
• 1:50:18
  and you know, these are insightful because actually it's
• 1:50:21
  not like 10 or 15 minutes. All you know, how long we've
• 1:50:23
  been on the phone. We feel like we're just sitting
• 1:50:25
  around talking, you know what, getting ready for the fish to
• 1:50:28
  bite, you know, so that's right. These are the type of
• 1:50:30
  conversation, you want to have and I appreciate you for
• 1:50:33
  providing a platform that is very, very easy to engage into
• 1:50:36
  well, thanks man. I can build.
• 1:50:37
  I can provide the platform. But today for people like you
• 1:50:40
  who actually agree to be on you would you be shocked?
• 1:50:44
  Not Mommy says, yes. When I come on, Colin, by the
• 1:50:46
  way, that's an interesting story.
• 1:50:49
  Because, oh, I knew I was trying to get out of here before the
• 1:50:52
  night. You don't have to worry about
• 1:50:53
  me. I was just wondering how many
• 1:50:56
  times I have to jump over my hands waving, hey, I'll do it.
• 1:50:59
  Please talk to me, you know, back in the day when they had
• 1:51:02
  Paola you would have been a prime candidate for Paola you
• 1:51:05
  know but back in the old radio days but no I'm happy, I think
• 1:51:11
  again it's a great platform and you know, much Excessive looking
• 1:51:15
  forward to watching other people, come on and provide, no
• 1:51:18
  quality insight into how they are successful in their journey
• 1:51:21
  in this business. Well, I'm proud to have you on
• 1:51:25
  here finally, I do appreciate it, man.
• 1:51:27
  Alright, thanks a lot. Have a great day and have a
• 1:51:29
  great day for you listening. Again just so thankful, it
• 1:51:32
  doesn't happen without you. I can have the platform, I can
• 1:51:34
  have the guest, but if you aren't here, listening, it's
• 1:51:36
  kind of like, you know, the tree falls in the forest, does
• 1:51:39
  anybody doesn't make a noise? Is anybody here?
• 1:51:41
  And so thank you for being here. We're gonna continue here with
• 1:51:43
  season 4. Or we got some amazing guests
• 1:51:45
  lined up. Got a couple of Olympians, I've
• 1:51:47
  got a huge director of a huge meat coming up here soon, just
• 1:51:51
  continue to bring the value and bring other people's stories so
• 1:51:53
  that we can learn together and connect with them.
• 1:51:56
  Thanks for being here. I'll talk to you next week.