Latest / The Scene Projects / Spencer Brill on Indie Rock, Artist Communities, and Navigating the Music Industry

Transcript

Spencer Brill on Indie Rock, Artist Communities, and Navigating the Music Industry · The Scene Projects

• 0:01
  Today, we're joined by Spencer Brill, Brooklyn based singer songwriter with a brand new
• 0:06
  nostalgic sound.
• 0:07
  Think Ben Folds meets Death Cab with witty, heart tugging hooks.
• 0:13
  He's behind tracks like Fair Fight and Hospital Song and plays all over New York City.
• 0:19
  Stick around.
• 0:20
  Spencer's story and songs are something special.
• 0:54
  Welcome in to another exciting episode of the scene.
• 0:57
  I'm your host Bubba Starts, and with me today is Spencer Brill.
• 1:00
  Spencer, welcome to the show, brother.
• 1:01
  Hey, Bubba.
• 1:02
  Thanks for having me.
• 1:03
  Hey, man.
• 1:04
  This is fun.
• 1:05
  For a Midwestern kid, I don't often get to talk to anybody from the big city, so, looking
• 1:10
  forward to having a great conversation.
• 1:13
  Off the top here, I'd like to just kinda give you the floor and let you give us a little bit
• 1:17
  of backstory, and then we'll get into everything you're doing now.
• 1:21
  Yeah.
• 1:21
  Awesome.
• 1:22
  Yeah.
• 1:22
  As as you mentioned, I'm a a indie singer songwriter in in New York and based in
• 1:26
  Brooklyn.
• 1:27
  And I, you know, I've been writing music for a number of years, taking it pretty seriously in
• 1:33
  the last few, have a great band, play all over the city.
• 1:36
  It's like an, you know, a very much like an indie rock vibe.
• 1:38
  It's it's a Weezer, Death Cab, you know, sort of some rage against machine elements, a lot of
• 1:43
  fun heavy riffs, and, you know, catchy hooks.
• 1:46
  And so, yeah, just love writing, love building community, and trying to get as many awesome
• 1:52
  songs and out into the world and, you know, build build an awesome library of of of great
• 1:58
  art.
• 1:59
  So, yeah, that's that's that's what I'm up to.
• 2:02
  Awesome, man.
• 2:03
  Love it.
• 2:04
  I I love the vibe.
• 2:05
  There's not enough indie rock out there right now.
• 2:09
  I feel like rock music has left guys like us.
• 2:11
  That's kinda how I would classify myself.
• 2:13
  I, I classify myself now as more of a country artist because that's where songwriters are.
• 2:18
  Because I grew up loving those, like, Pearl Jams, one of my favorite freaking bands of all
• 2:23
  time.
• 2:23
  Right?
• 2:24
  And because it was songs, it was powerful words and meaning behind that.
• 2:29
  And I just don't feel like rock music is there anymore.
• 2:32
  It's all how heavy can you get and the screaming and the you know, I just it left me a
• 2:40
  long time ago.
• 2:41
  So I kind of, you know, accepted the country moniker.
• 2:45
  I I also live in South Dakota.
• 2:47
  So there there's a lot of room for country, not so much on the rock side all the time.
• 2:53
  But I I missed those sounds.
• 2:56
  Right?
• 2:56
  Bands like the Gin Blossoms and, you know, you mentioned the Weezer and these awesome awesome
• 3:02
  bands into the late nineties that you just don't hear a lot of music like that.
• 3:06
  So I'm glad to know that in New York City, that rock music is being represented once again.
• 3:12
  The the the scene is certainly alive and well here.
• 3:14
  I mean, it's it's a you know, I I feel like in New York at at least, I mean, maybe even in
• 3:19
  more popular culture that, like, that sort of nineties late nineties nostalgia is coming back
• 3:24
  in a big way.
• 3:25
  I mean, you know, I I think that, you know, there's there's certainly like a yearning for,
• 3:30
  like, sort of the pre pre fully digital era where people are, you know, like, taking
• 3:35
  pictures with, like, cameras again and not on, you know, not on their phones.
• 3:39
  And, like, people are like, oh, cool.
• 3:41
  Like, the the fashions of the nineties are sort of, you know, coming back in a big way.
• 3:45
  So I'm you know, all that stuff has been all all that sort of culture and music has been in
• 3:49
  my head and in my soul for the for my whole life.
• 3:52
  And so I'm like, now, know, it feels like it's it's back in a big way, which I'm excited
• 3:57
  about.
• 3:58
  Right.
• 3:59
  And maybe it's just staying alive long enough to see the trends come back.
• 4:04
  Right?
• 4:04
  That must mean that we're we're getting a little older.
• 4:07
  I think just us talking about the music that we like dates us a little bit.
• 4:11
  I'm 39.
• 4:12
  I'll be 40 next May.
• 4:14
  Yeah.
• 4:14
  30 know?
• 4:16
  There's Yeah.
• 4:16
  Chili Peppers and Pearl Jam, Soundgarden.
• 4:21
  Like, those that was my early days.
• 4:23
  Right?
• 4:23
  My first, like, visceral music memories, and one that I talk about a lot.
• 4:29
  I know I've mentioned on the show before, but it was being in the van with my mom, our old
• 4:35
  Ford Aerostar van.
• 4:36
  It's probably circa 1993.
• 4:40
  It, blood sugar sex magic had just come out and hearing that opening lick of Fruschantes and
• 4:46
  under the bridge and just being like, duh.
• 4:49
  That that bell ringing.
• 4:50
  And, like, that memory's never faded.
• 4:52
  That was thirty five years ago, man.
• 4:55
  Right?
• 4:55
  Or, you know, at least thirty.
• 4:57
  And, man, I I think people are ready for that again.
• 5:03
  And I just don't know that you get there with oversynthesized pop music, and, that's what
• 5:10
  rock music really was at, you know, another pinnacle.
• 5:13
  Right?
• 5:14
  Obviously, you have the sixties and seventies rock, a major lull in that probably through
• 5:18
  the, you know, the, the eighties kinda sucked, because it had been commercialized so far.
• 5:24
  No No offense to people that love eighties music, but it was not that good, for the most
• 5:30
  part.
• 5:30
  And I feel like you got back to that, that grunge era music.
• 5:34
  There was a reason it was such a movement and really tapped into something.
• 5:38
  And maybe it's kind of the, you know, the the social turmoil of the last five years at least
• 5:45
  that is kind of bringing that out of people again.
• 5:47
  That angst and anxiety, of early nineties grunge music, I feel, is kinda making a
• 5:53
  comeback.
• 5:54
  Yeah.
• 5:54
  Being being in clubs and, like, watching other bands in New York, it's like people are just,
• 5:58
  like, you know I mean, they're they're playing rock music.
• 6:01
  Some are have you know, some some's heavier than others, and a lot of it is, like, know, I
• 6:04
  think there's a lot of there's a lot of anger, a lot of passion, a lot of, you know, you know,
• 6:11
  all all sorts of sort of just feel I mean, it's full of full of feelings, certainly.
• 6:17
  It's not just like a you know, it's it's it's I love I love folk music.
• 6:21
  I love pop music.
• 6:22
  You know, don't get me wrong.
• 6:23
  I love country music.
• 6:24
  Like, I'm into, you know, all sorts of stuff, but it's it's the, like, you know, seeing the
• 6:29
  sort of the visceral, you know, feelings on stage is is really kind of a fun, you know,
• 6:35
  kind of collective experience.
• 6:36
  And, you know, it's it's hard to fake a good guitar solo.
• 6:40
  You know, it's it's it's gotta you gotta have great players.
• 6:44
  It's it's a it's a it's a lot of fun.
• 6:46
  Yeah.
• 6:47
  That's another thing that we, have lost a lot of is, like, musicianship where, the live
• 6:54
  scenes, I mean, especially through COVID and and just through music changing that, there was
• 7:00
  a lot less stock put into live performances because for the last, I mean, I'd say at least
• 7:07
  ten years, maybe fifteen, as streaming gained in popularity.
• 7:11
  Right?
• 7:11
  And there was just, like, it was all about making records at home that that were gonna be
• 7:16
  pop acceptable and would get playlisted and all of these things.
• 7:19
  And now that we know that that's all bullshit, right, that we're like, oh, you know what?
• 7:25
  I think we're just gonna take our guitars out again, and like, I'll just go play on the
• 7:28
  street corner.
• 7:29
  I don't even care.
• 7:30
  There's you know, I'd rather go play out there and maybe meet a person or two that really
• 7:35
  enjoys what I'm doing than spending all of my time online trying to get someone to please
• 7:40
  listen to thirty five seconds of my song.
• 7:43
  Right.
• 7:43
  Yeah.
• 7:43
  I mean and I mean, perform performing is the most fun for me.
• 7:46
  I love being on stage.
• 7:47
  I love, like, just connecting with people.
• 7:49
  I mean, my you know, we try and play anywhere from, like, you know, five to 10 shows a year.
• 7:55
  You know, it's all within like, the the New York scene is is, you know, as I mentioned, is
• 7:58
  just, like, is is hopping.
• 7:59
  There's a lot of opportunity, a lot of stages, a lot of places to play.
• 8:03
  And, you know, that sort of, like, that interpersonal connection, that that exchange of
• 8:09
  energy on stage is just the most amazing thing.
• 8:12
  It's like, you know, the the high that I've been chasing since I was in high school, and
• 8:15
  I'd I'd abandoned high school and, you know, wrote songs in my bedroom and would, like, play
• 8:19
  them in my hometown.
• 8:22
  And, you know, people would come to shows, and they would know the words of my songs.
• 8:24
  And I was like, this is the coolest feeling ever of, like, people singing the words back to
• 8:29
  me of a song that, like, I, you know, I I had a feeling.
• 8:31
  I wrote about that wrote about that feeling, and, like, it it it, you know, it it resonated
• 8:36
  with other people.
• 8:37
  And so now it's my absolute favorite thing to to to be at a show and just, like, see people
• 8:43
  singing the words back to my songs.
• 8:44
  It's like, holy cow.
• 8:45
  This is this is awesome.
• 8:46
  Like, it's just you know, there's you you can't you can't get that from being like, oh, cool.
• 8:50
  Somebody streamed my song.
• 8:51
  Like, there's another one next to my, you know, my my streaming number is, cool.
• 8:57
  You know, like, that's such a not you know, such a lack of, like, you know, connection,
• 9:01
  which I think is really, you know, what making art does, you know, anyway or should should do
• 9:06
  anyway.
• 9:07
  No.
• 9:08
  I feel you.
• 9:08
  And I think it's our job as people who remember that time before to bring them.
• 9:15
  And we're not so old that young kids that are, you know, teenagers and in their twenties look
• 9:20
  at us and are like, oh, what do you know?
• 9:23
  You know, you were, you know, four and a hundred years ago.
• 9:26
  So we're in a unique position as kind of elder statesman inside of a scene that we can be
• 9:33
  like, no.
• 9:34
  Like, this is what you should be doing.
• 9:35
  Right?
• 9:36
  Like, you should just stop worrying about what your Spotify numbers are.
• 9:39
  Get out.
• 9:40
  Make some real relationships.
• 9:41
  Book some shows.
• 9:43
  Go play live.
• 9:44
  And I'm very blessed to live in the Midwest.
• 9:46
  Right?
• 9:47
  I'm in I'm in South Dakota.
• 9:49
  We've always had a great live music scene no matter where we've been out here because of our
• 9:54
  detachment from the major centers.
• 9:56
  Right?
• 9:57
  And I'm very grateful for that because I came up in an era, you know, in the last fifteen
• 10:02
  years where not everyone has had that.
• 10:04
  And the longer I have this show and I talk to more and more people, that they just don't have
• 10:09
  that.
• 10:09
  And we get paid pretty well to play out here.
• 10:12
  I mean, I very rarely play with the whole band for under a thousand bucks.
• 10:16
  Oh, nice.
• 10:16
  Which
• 10:17
  yeah.
• 10:18
  Well, yeah, which is but, like, most bands are making that out here.
• 10:21
  Right?
• 10:22
  And whether it's right or not, I know in a scene, especially like New York because I go up
• 10:27
  and play in the Twin Cities occasionally.
• 10:29
  I'm about five hours from Minneapolis, and it's just different.
• 10:33
  Right?
• 10:34
  But I can still get paid to play up there rather than paying or having to sell tickets to
• 10:39
  play.
• 10:40
  Although there is that scene up there as well.
• 10:43
  Right?
• 10:43
  Because of my history, I'm able to go look.
• 10:45
  I'm not not driving up for South from South Dakota to play for tickets or the door.
• 10:51
  Right?
• 10:51
  Like, we can work out a deal in here somewhere, but a lot of young bands don't even have that
• 10:57
  know how.
• 10:57
  You know?
• 10:58
  When you're young, you're just so excited that someone will have you.
• 11:01
  Right?
• 11:02
  And I've really been blessed that I never had that.
• 11:05
  You know?
• 11:05
  A little bit, I was out on the West Coast for a few years, but I played busking on Venice Beach
• 11:11
  and was making $2,300 a day busking.
• 11:13
  Yeah.
• 11:14
  So it's like I established that value on the street.
• 11:16
  I was like, if I can stand out there and granted I was playing for, like, six, eight
• 11:18
  hours.
• 11:19
  Right?
• 11:19
  Like, I'm busting my ass all day.
• 11:22
  I mean, to to babes in bikinis and, you know, 85 degree I mean, not the worst job.
• 11:27
  Right?
• 11:27
  But, it it established that value early on that not everyone in every scene has that.
• 11:35
  Right?
• 11:36
  You go to a place like Austin or, you know, even New York City where there's oversaturation
• 11:42
  of bands that you don't nobody's gonna pay.
• 11:45
  Like, why would I pay you when I can get this other band that'll that'll bring their 10
• 11:49
  friends in
• 11:49
  Sure.
• 11:50
  And and I don't have to pay them anything.
• 11:52
  Right.
• 11:52
  Right?
• 11:52
  So it's kind of the give and take.
• 11:54
  I understand what we have, but that's also the essence of why I started the scene projects was
• 11:59
  to allow other artists to come in, build their value by being part of this community.
• 12:04
  And we're not an agency or anything, but just being part of our group and being like, no.
• 12:08
  I've been on this show.
• 12:09
  They're an award winning podcast, and they're having me on their stuff.
• 12:13
  I should be worth a little bit more to you now.
• 12:15
  And that's kinda like the essence of what I've tried to build here and what we hope continues
• 12:21
  to build.
• 12:22
  We've only been at this for, like, eighteen months.
• 12:24
  So imagine where we are in a decade and the cache that the name kinda carries with it.
• 12:30
  Yeah.
• 12:31
  I mean, it it's honestly like, you know, I I intrinsically feel the need to, like, lift all
• 12:38
  ships.
• 12:39
  You know?
• 12:39
  Like, I I wanna, like, help everybody in the scene be the best they can be.
• 12:43
  Like, you know, I I I after, like, basically late twenty twenty, I so I I I started taking
• 12:51
  music more seriously, got in got into more production stuff, and and and, like, a lot of a
• 12:56
  lot of sort of, like, learning about, the the music business side or, like, the the business
• 13:00
  the business side of music, I should say.
• 13:02
  And, you know, there's there's a lot of young musicians that I'm connected with, a lot of
• 13:06
  incredible songwriters in here in New York and, you know, and around the around the Northeast
• 13:09
  that that I really love.
• 13:11
  And, you know, it's like, there are people who are making this incredible art, but are either,
• 13:16
  like, being taken advantage of or, like, being, like, or or don't really know how to, like,
• 13:20
  position themselves in certain ways or don't don't know when they're, like, leaving money on
• 13:24
  the table for different kinds of, you know, shows or performances or whatever.
• 13:27
  And it's like, I I, you know, feel, you know, an imperative.
• 13:34
  I I I I feel I feel a desire and a need to, like, be like, how can I help make sure that
• 13:39
  you are not, you know, suffering or, like, actually making money from the things you're
• 13:43
  doing?
• 13:44
  You know, it's it's like it's just one of those things that, you know, I I just wanna, like I
• 13:50
  feel I feel like if everyone is doing well, we're all gonna do better.
• 13:53
  So it's like, why can't we you know, if we can all help each other out and be like, yeah.
• 13:56
  Cool.
• 13:57
  Here's a way to get through x y z.
• 13:59
  Here's a way to, like, book more shows.
• 14:00
  Here's a way to, you know, like, build community.
• 14:03
  Here's a way to, like if if things are negotiable with with, you know, with shows,
• 14:08
  like, whatever that
• 14:09
  the same way, you know, you mentioned the rising tide, a sinking tide.
• 14:13
  Right?
• 14:13
  An ebbing tide sinks all the damn ships and and leaves us shafted too.
• 14:18
  Right.
• 14:18
  So there's also that where you're like, hey.
• 14:20
  Hey.
• 14:20
  Hey.
• 14:21
  You degrading yourself is devaluing everyone else around you.
• 14:26
  So without us forming a union, right, which inherently is probably gonna become corrupted
• 14:32
  as well, like, why don't we all just, like, work together to try and and educate as many
• 14:36
  people as we can as, like, no.
• 14:38
  This is how you do this.
• 14:39
  And it really comes down to, like, reaching.
• 14:41
  If you're one of the people that are, you know, towards the upper echelon of the scene to
• 14:46
  always be reaching down and to reach out to these younger, you know, these younger artists
• 14:51
  that are coming up and go, hey.
• 14:52
  Hey.
• 14:52
  Hey.
• 14:52
  You have value.
• 14:53
  Right?
• 14:54
  Let let us give you value.
• 14:55
  Whether it's bringing them on a show or it's bringing them on your podcast and teaching
• 15:00
  them, we have a Facebook group we call the Midwest Original Music Organization, which is
• 15:05
  just that for us.
• 15:06
  It's over 600 people strong at this point.
• 15:08
  It's a free group.
• 15:09
  It's a private group because you gotta keep the riffraff out, but it's a way to get people in.
• 15:14
  And then we meet every Wednesday at 7PM central just to talk about what like, what are you
• 15:21
  experiencing.
• 15:22
  Right?
• 15:22
  Where are you at?
• 15:23
  And I think for people who maybe are just starting out to come in and to hear people like
• 15:29
  you and I have a conversation candidly in that kind of space is really eye opening.
• 15:35
  And it's not us telling you what to do.
• 15:37
  It's telling you what we have done that has worked for us.
• 15:41
  And if it works for us, there's no doubt it can work for you.
• 15:45
  Like, I'm no one special.
• 15:47
  And I remember the first time I came back from Oregon where I've been playing for tips with my
• 15:51
  band in a bar tab and coming back to South Dakota, and they were like, yeah.
• 15:55
  We'll give you guys $500 and drink all the liquor you want.
• 15:58
  I was like, what?
• 16:00
  You know?
• 16:00
  And I was able to go and I was playing with, you know, my dad and a bunch of other guys that
• 16:04
  were twice my age essentially, and I was able to pay them each a $100 bill apiece.
• 16:09
  And we all got drunk and partied all night, and I was just like, you know, 22 years old.
• 16:13
  I was like, this is the life.
• 16:14
  Right?
• 16:14
  Like, how do I do this?
• 16:16
  And, you know, inevitably, that led me down a a long and winding road of misery and despair,
• 16:22
  but I was able to come back then, you know, ten, fifteen years later and now be able to go,
• 16:29
  okay.
• 16:29
  I've lived all of that.
• 16:31
  I can I can show you where the pitfalls are, and I can I can help these, you know, 20 year
• 16:36
  olds that are out here wanting this dream?
• 16:38
  And, like, I remember being that.
• 16:40
  I remember having all the energy and the passion in the world, but having no idea how I
• 16:45
  was gonna get anywhere I wanted to be and without charging them a thousand dollars to
• 16:50
  take some music course or, making them outlandish promises that we're gonna make you
• 16:55
  famous.
• 16:56
  It's no.
• 16:57
  Just sit down.
• 16:58
  Yeah.
• 16:58
  Hang out with these group of super, you know, intelligent people.
• 17:02
  And I'm not saying I'm the smartest person in the room, but I will put you in the room with
• 17:07
  some really smart people.
• 17:08
  And that's, I think, how that that's the tide.
• 17:11
  Right?
• 17:12
  It is
• 17:12
  I wanna join those meetings.
• 17:13
  I wanna join.
• 17:14
  You're in, brother.
• 17:15
  It's, yeah, it's open to everyone.
• 17:17
  That's awesome.
• 17:17
  And we'd love to have you because your experience in New York scene is much different
• 17:22
  than what my scene is here in rural South Dakota.
• 17:25
  I live in a town of a thousand people, Spencer.
• 17:27
  There's more than that in your building, maybe, in your apartment.
• 17:30
  You know what I mean?
• 17:30
  Like
• 17:32
  For sure.
• 17:32
  Yeah.
• 17:32
  On my block, a 100 yeah.
• 17:34
  For for sure.
• 17:34
  Yeah.
• 17:35
  Yeah.
• 17:35
  There's probably 12,000 people on your block.
• 17:37
  Like, that's that's us, the next town over, and the next town over where the Walmart is.
• 17:45
  So good.
• 17:46
  Yeah.
• 17:46
  I mean, it's it's a it's really it's it's a great it's a great thing.
• 17:49
  I mean, like, you know, education is is super important.
• 17:53
  So, you know, like and there and there are so so so many people who are so quick to be like,
• 18:00
  how can I take advantage of artists?
• 18:02
  How can I how can I, like, sell a course that's bullshit?
• 18:05
  How can I, like you know, that that's yeah?
• 18:08
  You you'll get quick you'll get rich so quick if you just buy my course, and you'll get a
• 18:14
  bajillion streams, and you'll, you know, you'll make it as an artist.
• 18:18
  And it's like, what the hell?
• 18:19
  Like, none of that stuff is you know, there's just so many so many things that are just,
• 18:24
  like, so sketchy and gross.
• 18:28
  Right.
• 18:28
  Well, go spend $25,000 to get a million streams and get a $1,500 return on that.
• 18:34
  Yeah.
• 18:34
  Right.
• 18:35
  Right.
• 18:36
  What?
• 18:37
  So I I so I'm negative $23.50.
• 18:39
  Right?
• 18:40
  Like, oh, great.
• 18:42
  I I'm glad I spent, you know, half of my income for a year, and that's having a good job,
• 18:47
  right, to to go out and and waste it.
• 18:50
  And I just don't wanna like and that's where we kinda start with everybody is that you're gonna
• 18:54
  work harder on this than anything you've ever worked for in your life.
• 18:57
  It's it's not gonna be glamorous.
• 18:59
  It's gonna be hard.
• 19:01
  But if you want it, there's nothing that can stand in your way.
• 19:04
  And let us give you the tools.
• 19:07
  Right?
• 19:08
  And that's mostly what it comes down to with AI these days and with a lot of these things.
• 19:12
  It's like, you're inspired.
• 19:15
  Use that with these tools and just go build a community.
• 19:19
  And that's what a fan base is, right, as a community.
• 19:22
  Go put your shit out there.
• 19:25
  Let it resonate with who it's gonna resonate with.
• 19:27
  Not everyone's gonna like you, and you don't need everyone to like you.
• 19:30
  Right?
• 19:31
  I kinda subscribe to that old model of a thousand true fans.
• 19:34
  Find a thousand people that are just gonna love everything that you do, and you can make it in
• 19:40
  this business.
• 19:41
  You don't need a million streams.
• 19:43
  You don't need 10,000 monthly listeners on Spotify who half of them are AI.
• 19:48
  And as soon as you eclipse that level, they're gonna pull all your music down anyway.
• 19:52
  Like, I've seen really talented people walk this road or or their social media their social
• 19:58
  media game, you know, all their stuff gets sent down.
• 20:02
  And it's just like to see the devastation in someone's eyes because somebody changed a
• 20:07
  policy Yeah.
• 20:08
  And just lost 15,000 fans.
• 20:12
  Just lost connection with all those people because they never had the tools to get them
• 20:17
  into their email list or into, like, their text list or whatever to do that.
• 20:22
  And we work with all of those kind of tools.
• 20:25
  You know, I got I got the scroll out there right now for our services.
• 20:28
  We have to exist in this world somehow as a business.
• 20:31
  I've spent a year and a half without anything to sell because we were building a brand.
• 20:37
  And I think that's what a lot of people miss out on is that, like, it takes a long time to
• 20:41
  build a name for yourself and to be able to capitalize on it.
• 20:46
  You know, it may take you you know, especially if you're only playing five to 10 shows a year.
• 20:51
  There was points where I was playing over a 100 shows a year.
• 20:53
  I know some guys that are playing 200 plus shows a year.
• 20:56
  The guy's out playing six nights a week.
• 20:59
  It's like, how do you do that?
• 21:00
  And he's like, well, I don't talk at all on Mondays to say my voice, and I was like, god
• 21:03
  god, would my wife love that.
• 21:06
  Right?
• 21:08
  But there's there's different avenues.
• 21:10
  Do you have to go play?
• 21:11
  But, I mean, he's also the major you know, he's the breadwinner for his family.
• 21:15
  Yeah.
• 21:15
  And he doesn't do anything besides play music.
• 21:17
  Like, we all have different goals and different ways that we're gonna go about it.
• 21:21
  You know, I imagine in New York City, you're not making a ton of money when you go out and
• 21:26
  play some of these shows.
• 21:28
  And the mean, you probably need to make 6 figures a year just to exist in Brooklyn
• 21:33
  these days.
• 21:34
  I mean, it's it's I mean, like, if I so we we play all original music, all original tunes at
• 21:40
  our shows.
• 21:40
  And, like, I know that if I wanted to make a full time living as an artist in New York or,
• 21:46
  like, just in in music Anywhere.
• 21:48
  Yeah.
• 21:49
  I I mean, that it would be like, I would I would have to be a wedding band or a full time
• 21:53
  cover band, like, playing so because it's like you know, I I have friends in cover bands who
• 21:58
  are who are drawing, you know, a a ton of people who are it's just like a party, you
• 22:04
  know, all the time, and it's like it's it's a you know, they're making, like, $502,000 a
• 22:08
  night, like, you know, playing playing every every so often in in in venues all over the
• 22:12
  city, you know, all over the place.
• 22:14
  And it's like, you know, my the the shows that we're, you know, we're pulling in some some
• 22:18
  good numbers of people and, like, you know, bringing in, 25, 30 people in a in a in a in a
• 22:23
  space, which is, like, so so awesome and and on, like, a pretty regular basis.
• 22:27
  But, like, you know, after the door, after paying for whatever else, you know, we're we're
• 22:32
  walking away with, like, a $100, a $150 or whatever it is.
• 22:35
  And it's like, you know, there's there's, like, there's venues even that I've seen in the city.
• 22:39
  There are just incredible spaces that have, like, the most intense, like, contracts for
• 22:47
  even being able to play there.
• 22:48
  And it's like, it would be a dream to play in these places, but it also a nightmare if, like,
• 22:51
  we don't fill the space.
• 22:52
  You know?
• 22:53
  It's like, it's not it's just, like, not for us at this point.
• 22:56
  You know?
• 22:56
  It's Right.
• 22:56
  It's gonna end up costing you money
• 22:58
  For sure.
• 22:58
  To go in there.
• 23:00
  Yeah.
• 23:00
  And, I mean, I saw that.
• 23:02
  So when I was in LA, I I referenced Venice Beach a little bit.
• 23:04
  Like, I saw the whiskey, and I saw those places.
• 23:07
  And then I saw that they're like, okay.
• 23:09
  Cool.
• 23:09
  Well, here's 50 tickets.
• 23:10
  You gotta sell all of them or you owe us $500.
• 23:13
  And it was like Yeah.
• 23:14
  I don't have $500.
• 23:16
  Like, I can't commit to that contract.
• 23:18
  Yeah.
• 23:18
  I that's crazy.
• 23:19
  I don't even know 50 people here.
• 23:21
  You know?
• 23:38
  Make the trip, man.
• 23:39
  We'll we'll I mean, that's that sounds great.
• 23:41
  We, Yeah.
• 23:42
  I mean, like, the, you know, the the point you're making about, like, owning your
• 23:45
  audience, I think, is, like, something that's been, like, hearkened to me so so often.
• 23:49
  It's like, you know, that Instagram and and Twitter or x or whatever and, like, like
• 23:56
  Facebook and all these things are, like, are actually ephemeral and don't really will will
• 24:00
  not exist for the long term.
• 24:02
  And, like, getting people into an email funnel or getting people into, a text funnel or, like,
• 24:05
  having, you know, sort of being able to reach directly to to to those people is is is the the
• 24:11
  best way to, like, build a thing for the long term rather than because even on Spotify, like,
• 24:15
  I could have tomorrow tomorrow, I could wake up, and there could be a 100,000 streams on my
• 24:20
  song thanks to this podcast.
• 24:21
  You know, what whatever it it could be there could be, like, huge numbers, and I would not
• 24:25
  know any single one of those people that that that, like, stream my song or, you know, or
• 24:31
  check check this out.
• 24:32
  Like, I I would have no connection to those people.
• 24:34
  And so, like, it's it'd be like a blip.
• 24:36
  It'd be great.
• 24:37
  But, like, at the end of the day, you know
• 24:39
  It would make you no money and not move the needle on your career one bit.
• 24:43
  Yeah.
• 24:44
  So it's like building those you know, there's there's a lot of, like, really interesting sort
• 24:47
  of new strategies building to sort of, you know, get that audience, hold on to that
• 24:53
  audience for the long term, and, like, and really, like, build, you know, as, again, like,
• 24:57
  sort of that that deeper connection with folks, which I I think is really crucially important
• 25:01
  and sort of, you know, becomes part of people's people's identity, you know, which is really
• 25:06
  fun.
• 25:07
  Yeah.
• 25:07
  Well, that's what we're here for.
• 25:09
  Right?
• 25:09
  To be that foundation and that platform that not only have we built for us, but that we're
• 25:14
  building for independent artists around the world.
• 25:17
  And beyond just an education platform or, you know, something like I I don't know if you know
• 25:22
  or aware of Indiepreneur and things.
• 25:24
  They have courses where they teach you a lot of this stuff.
• 25:27
  You know, I'm a big fan of the Creative Juice podcast.
• 25:29
  That's where I've learned a lot of the things that I've done, and they put that out for free
• 25:34
  and just talk game.
• 25:35
  Right?
• 25:35
  I mean, Circa has done so much for independent musicians and independent music, period.
• 25:41
  And they have so many success success stories behind them at this point that, yeah, it's
• 25:47
  that's the way.
• 25:49
  And I'm just trying to introduce people to that same formula.
• 25:52
  Maybe I don't have all the courses.
• 25:54
  If you need the courses, I'll just direct you to them.
• 25:57
  Right?
• 25:57
  But if you just wanna be part of a community and kinda learn it ad hoc by hanging out and
• 26:02
  and doing your own thing.
• 26:03
  I'm not a great school learner.
• 26:05
  So I was just like, well, I'm gonna take what you're telling me, and I'm just gonna go apply
• 26:08
  it on my own.
• 26:09
  And granted that may have taken me a little longer to get here, I kinda have moments in my
• 26:14
  life to use as case studies.
• 26:16
  Right?
• 26:16
  Like, no.
• 26:17
  This worked for us.
• 26:18
  Like, not I'm just telling you that.
• 26:20
  Like, this is how we got from here.
• 26:22
  Last year, I was able to tour, you know, put probably twenty, thirty thousand miles on the
• 26:27
  vehicle just going around.
• 26:29
  And were the shows I was playing huge ticketed events, and were they massive?
• 26:33
  No.
• 26:33
  But I got to go and play in, you know, Minneapolis, Chicago, Saint Louis, Kansas City,
• 26:39
  Austin, Little Rocks, Memphis, all a bunch of cities that I had never been to before in my
• 26:44
  life.
• 26:44
  And were some of them open mics and were some of them little showcase like, it didn't matter.
• 26:49
  I played them now.
• 26:50
  And I know that I could go back there, and there's at least a handful of people there that
• 26:54
  I know that will hopefully come and see me that next time.
• 26:57
  And then each time you go back there, it'll it'll grow a little bit.
• 27:01
  And it's no different in a city like New York or an area like that.
• 27:06
  You know?
• 27:06
  And, it's unfortunate that, you know, so many of the scenes around you are exactly the same
• 27:12
  as the city is.
• 27:13
  Right?
• 27:13
  That it's gonna be the same kind of pay to play thing.
• 27:15
  And when you're brand new to a town, if you don't have connections to other artists that
• 27:20
  you can now collaborate with that can, you know, put you on a show and allow you to build
• 27:24
  a fan base off of their fan base.
• 27:26
  And I think that's where we evolved from that kind of indiepreneur model to say, okay.
• 27:31
  Well, we need a community of artists.
• 27:33
  And and hence the Momo and the scene projects as a public group where everybody can just
• 27:38
  share their art.
• 27:39
  And I think we're just so far ahead of the curve, right, that we don't see the success.
• 27:45
  Like, the fans and the money are all way downstream of the work, and we've been in the
• 27:53
  freaking work.
• 27:54
  Right?
• 27:54
  Mhmm.
• 27:54
  I kind of equated it to to a train, to a long train that we're going around this bend and
• 28:00
  we're the engine.
• 28:01
  When we look back, we can't see the caboose.
• 28:03
  Well, all the damn money's in the caboose.
• 28:06
  Right?
• 28:06
  And, eventually, we're gonna we're gonna end this learning curve, and the road's gonna
• 28:11
  straighten out, and we're gonna be able to oh, it's right there.
• 28:13
  Right?
• 28:14
  That there's there's the money or the fame or the recognition or whatever people need.
• 28:20
  It it's coming right around the corner, and you just have to stay focused on the you gotta keep
• 28:25
  chugging.
• 28:25
  Right?
• 28:26
  You gotta keep chugging along and moving and to attach as many cars to that train in the
• 28:31
  meantime so that when you do hit, there's nothing that can stop that momentum.
• 28:36
  Right?
• 28:37
  That even if I wanted to stop it at this point, we have five hosts, 10 shows, four networks
• 28:42
  that we're running, and we've built all of it inside of eighteen months.
• 28:46
  Mhmm.
• 28:47
  Like, you can't just put I can't just wake up tomorrow and be like, well, that's all done.
• 28:50
  Have I episodes that are gonna run for the next six months whether I shoot another one or not.
• 28:54
  Right.
• 28:55
  Right.
• 28:55
  They're already scheduled.
• 28:56
  Go to our YouTube page and look.
• 28:58
  You'll see them all lined up.
• 29:00
  And and that's kind of where we committed to that, And now it's the turning of the business
• 29:06
  part.
• 29:07
  Right?
• 29:07
  The turning to go, hey.
• 29:08
  This is what we built.
• 29:10
  I'm not telling you something that, like, oh, I'm gonna do this.
• 29:12
  No.
• 29:13
  I've already done it.
• 29:13
  All the work's already done.
• 29:14
  There's our entire programming for the next six months.
• 29:18
  Do you want to sponsor this amazing thing that we've built?
• 29:22
  And, we're right on the cusp of that now.
• 29:25
  And it's, yeah, it's it's cool because it continues to open up the door for conversations
• 29:31
  like this.
• 29:31
  Spencer, I don't know you.
• 29:33
  I didn't know you before we met on camera today.
• 29:35
  I don't know how you found us.
• 29:37
  I don't care.
• 29:37
  We're here.
• 29:39
  And that's the beauty of it.
• 29:40
  And now you got a friend in South Dakota and a bunch of friends in between, and I got a friend
• 29:44
  in New York City.
• 29:45
  You know how cool it would be for a South Dakota kid to go and play New York City?
• 29:50
  I've never been.
• 29:51
  Right?
• 29:52
  You gotta come.
• 29:53
  What's to
• 29:53
  not just go on vacation, right, and to go see the Empire State Building?
• 29:57
  No.
• 29:57
  I got a show in the city.
• 29:59
  Right?
• 30:00
  Yeah.
• 30:00
  That that's a major you know, not just, like, resume tick.
• 30:04
  That's a that's a notch on the belt of life.
• 30:07
  Right?
• 30:08
  That's a putting it up on the mantle.
• 30:10
  And whether I ever make it back to play New York City again, and I know it's not MSG, it
• 30:16
  doesn't matter to me.
• 30:17
  I've played in that city now.
• 30:19
  And I I think that's that's why I started building this thing, and that's why I'm never
• 30:25
  gonna stop is because these these situations are gonna be innumerable.
• 30:31
  They already are.
• 30:32
  I've interviewed over 300 artists.
• 30:34
  Like Awesome.
• 30:35
  Yeah.
• 30:35
  I I can't keep track of everyone.
• 30:37
  That's why I started the Facebook group.
• 30:38
  I was like, y'all just get in here.
• 30:39
  Like, I can't remember all of you by name.
• 30:42
  Jump in here.
• 30:43
  Let's get together every Wednesday, and I hope that you come in and start to join us too.
• 30:48
  Spencer, why don't you tell everybody where they can find you and the band, and I'll let
• 30:52
  you get out of here.
• 30:53
  Yeah.
• 30:54
  For sure.
• 30:54
  Well, Bubba, thanks again for having me.
• 30:56
  This was a great great chat.
• 30:57
  And, yeah, I would love love to see you in South Dakota.
• 30:59
  If you make your way to New York, definitely hit me up.
• 31:01
  We'll we'll we'll catch up in the in the group.
• 31:03
  But, yeah, I'm I'm you can find me on on Instagram at Spencer Brill music at Spencer
• 31:08
  Brill dot com.
• 31:10
  And, yeah, you can stream all my stuff and all the all the platforms under my name, Spencer
• 31:14
  Brill.
• 31:14
  So, yeah, thanks so much.
• 31:16
  Awesome, man.
• 31:17
  Great time.
• 31:18
  Sorry.
• 31:18
  I I felt like I just spent a lot of the time yelling at you, but I get excited, meeting new
• 31:24
  people, and sharing what we've been working on because it's been it's been a long road to get
• 31:30
  here.
• 31:31
  And for so long, I really didn't know what the hell we were doing or what we were building,
• 31:36
  And so much has been realized in the last month, and a conversation like this, kinda
• 31:41
  drives it home for me.
• 31:43
  Right?
• 31:43
  Where all the things that you're saying, the community and these things, like, if it matters
• 31:47
  in NYC and it matters here, then it matters everywhere.
• 31:52
  And I really appreciate you spending a little bit of your day with me, and thank you for
• 31:57
  being part of the scene.
• 31:58
  Thanks, Bubba.
• 31:58
  My pleasure.
• 31:59
  My pleasure.