Latest / The Goo Crew / How to Improve Your Paint Finish (& Get More Jobs) | The Goo Crew #10

Transcript

How to Improve Your Paint Finish (& Get More Jobs) | The Goo Crew #10 · The Goo Crew

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Good morning, brother.
• 0:01
  SPEAKER_00: How you doing this morning?
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_00: Morning.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_00: Cool.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_00: Hanging out.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_00: Josh is alive and well, as am I.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_00: And today I'm gonna uh chat a little bit about something that I've seen in the comments as well as uh just things I've noticed in the DIY, particularly in tutorials on YouTube that are more geared towards DIY folks, and something that I don't think gets talked about enough as far as uh the actual work of contracting, which is finish quality and how to get better at that.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, we've talked a lot about uh in the last couple episodes, like uh how to kind of cultivate feeder accounts and do work for like uh generating leads and doing estimates and all of that stuff.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and then one of the things that I think gets neglected a lot, particularly in some of the other online things that are for painters, is that I haven't heard anyone really mention or talk about finish quality, like actually doing a good job and like where your standards should should be.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_00: And then like that to me is a huge uh element of whether or not you're going to get more work.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: Like it's it's like a very efficient strategy for lead generation, particularly that you you want to be geared towards uh generating word of mouth, like eventually.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_00: That's really where you want that's like one of the best lead gens is word of mouth.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: The way you get good word of mouth and reviews and everything is actually by doing excellent work.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_00: So, does that make sense?
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_00: What I'm saying?
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think I have a good example for you.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_01: They come was re somewhat recent.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_01: So last year we were working for one of the renovators.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: We worked behind a decent size, like master suite, bunch of bedrooms, and uh a lot of times they'll do walkthroughs of the um the job, like with the home with the homeowner with the client later.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: And we were working a little bit after they did that, and they came in to us like, and this is our the renovator work, oh wow, you guys do such great work, this is amazing.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_01: Because we just did this walkthrough at this other job, and they brought in their own painters, and it was one of those, it's like a bigger operation where they have, I don't know, 15 or 20 guys, and they did the worst job you could ever do.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_01: And then uh our you know, our builder we work for was just like the walls were were crap, there was stuff everywhere, the lines were terrible, they did zero prep work, and it was like the biggest butch job ever.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_01: He's like, We just walk around your guy's job, and like I just touched the walls.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like, oh, it just feels good, and he just said, So he's just like, I appreciate you, and we thank you.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, because we try to have high finish quality, yeah, but you more notice it when someone doesn't have high uh finish quality.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so you can do there's a lot of weight, like that's probably a good way to frame this.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: Is so that the company that did that job, I've heard the rid the telling of that tale from several angles of people that actually saw the work, and and the GC that was there that watched the guy that they sent over to do it.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: And uh he came and I think he's like an 18-inch roller with some crazy thick nap.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_00: He did no cutting in and just started rolling.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: I think maybe he was supposed to be rolling primer, maybe.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_01: It was kind of you do a prime and first coat, and then you come in and then they and then uh I think the GC asked like, are you guys gonna prep?
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_01: He's like, Oh no, we'll do it the next step.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_01: And there was always the next step, they were gonna do whatever you know the they needed them to do.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think they kept kicking the the bucket down the line as far as different guys would show up for each step.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, and the first the and the first fella really kicked it off with a bang where he he just rolled over the outlets, which I don't think he took anything off, he just rolled right over it.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and then a lot of this is new construction, so I think uh one of the things that my buddy was saying is that he rolled right over um, you know, like the cutouts for the returns?
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, how it's got like kind of feathered drywall, like he rolled right over that, it picked up all those little bits of drywall and then just rolled it right into the finish.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: Makes it look nice in that uh speckled look, right?
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that nice chunky look everyone's so uh so into.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_00: And then um usually with crews like that as well.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: First off, this was a very nice house that they were working in.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_00: It wasn't like a shithole, like it was it was very nice, and uh a lot of times they're not like putting tarps down, they're getting paint on things that they shouldn't, they're getting paint on the floor, they're getting paint on other things that shouldn't be painted.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and then it's a ri if you do so like I don't think anyone that's in the goo crew or interested in this kind of stuff wants to do that type of job.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_00: That's just like a pretty a pretty good example of what not to do.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then I was I was talking to uh the other company that we work behind, their uh their new project manager, and I was we were just talking about like finish quality and different things, and I was like, yo man, I think it's bizarre that some homeowners will pay you guys to do a bathroom or a kitchen, and then like we'll try and paint it themselves, and they're doing like a you know an$80,000 kitchen, and then they just say, like, I'm gonna paint it myself.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, dude, he's like, We have had a couple recently where they're like, Oh, we'll do our own painting, and he's like, It makes the guys crazy because they're just getting paint all over the cabinets.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like the one homeowner just started rolling the walls immediately, like just took a roller out and didn't tarp the cabinets off, didn't tarp off the new countertops, no floor stuff, just like just started ripping paint, and you're like, oh, and that that stuff gives me like the heebie jeebies.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: So um, but uh one of the things that I'm I'm because I've made a lot of videos trying to explain some of this stuff to the you know on uh the other channel, the Paint Your Home Now stuff.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I a lot of professional painters do watch some of those tutorials as well as homeowners.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_00: And then what I've noticed about some of the other tutorials on doing things is there's no first off, the some of the DIY stuff, they're like, anyone can do this.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, no, they can't.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: Like, have you ever worked with someone like we've tried to train people to paint that earnestly wanted to figure it out and do it, and they could not do it.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I don't know how much longer we would need to take with them to get them, but some people just don't have whatever that is that they need to produce a good finish quality.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_00: Like, they can't look at something and be like, We're like, do you think that looks good?
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_00: And they're like, Yeah, you're like, okay, I don't even know where to begin of like how bad this looks.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_01: We used to think anyone could do it.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: This is not ratatouille, everyone can cook, sorry.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_00: But it's like not acknowledging that if you are gonna be a professional painter, you need to uh like it's a stacking of skills over many years and many repetitions where you're refining your your technique, how and then it's basically like what what finish quality are you capable of producing on the jobs that you're on?
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_00: And then when you go on a you want to be in my this is just my hot take of what I think is a good idea for guys that are out on their own and and working and then trying to like do a good job and then move forward and try and get better and better work.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_00: You want to keep pushing your finish quality and get it as good as you can.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_00: And what I mean by that is you're you're uh from the ceiling, the trim, the walls, the doors, you're producing uniform looking finishes, and the room looks like objectively correct just from the laying down of the actual paint.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_00: Like, are your cut-ins straight?
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_00: If you're brushing rolling, like are you do you have any picture framing on the walls?
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_00: So, like, are your cut-ins blending into your rolling uh for your trim?
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: Are your brush lines at least uniform?
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_00: And like if you're painting uh you know, crown molding, are they all like you have horizontal brush strokes?
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_00: It should look like one long brush stroke that has leveled out somewhat where it's not looking crazy brushy and having like you know, you shouldn't be able to see every single spot where your brush hit the trim.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_00: So, like uh, you know, same with like six-paneled doors.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like, does that have you have you laid down, do you do two coats on the trim where it's you're giving that second coat a chance to level out?
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_00: And part of it is technique, part of it also is using higher quality products like better paints that are gonna do the things that you want them to do.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: Another one is using the correct paint for the application.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_00: So are you actually getting a good bond to the surface so that it's not just scratching off the first time you touch it?
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so that's like uh you know what we're those are all the things you've got to like stack together and things that you're gonna learn over time as you do more and more jobs is like, okay, if I'm gonna do this type of if I'm gonna convert uh stained handrail to painted, what primer do I need to use to make sure, like what's the prep that I need to do to make sure that that's gonna turn out well and be a durable finish for how the client's gonna use it.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: So it's like a practical side, and then also just the actual visuals of what does your what does a painted room by you look like and what does it feel like when you look at it, when you touch the walls, when you're interacting with that space.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_00: So I think the proper reacting one is when the client goes, oh wow, this looks amazing.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right, which we uh we did that yesterday.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we did, and we got it.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_01: She gave us a couple hundred dollar tip, which is pretty awesome.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_01: So it's pretty sweet.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, after they pay you thousands of dollars for uh the job is pretty cool.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it's also a um like a stacking of small details, especially if you and a good way, I think, to like gauge your finish quality and the mistake that that one company made amongst a the bevy of mistakes they made, is no one actually owned the job.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_00: They had different crews showing up multiple times, so no one actually took ownership of the whole space.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_00: And so they had a different guy that basically didn't do the prep, a different crew that did the next bad job, and then they had like their like kind of chief schlub come in and try and fix it who was unable to, and the homeowners ended up bringing in their like old painter to like he had to redo it all, like unf all of that stuff.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_00: He had to re did it, he completely redid the job.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: So it's uh and I'm not saying I can produce the best finish quality of like any painter ever.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um that's not what I'm saying.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_01: But you're you're probably in the top for because we worked with a lot of different crews, yeah.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_01: Top 10% easy.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_01: That's I'd say so.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_01: Well, they're also you're looking at are you getting better over time?
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_01: Are you stagnating or are you getting worse?
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_01: And so you can get better by a few ways of just picking better products, that's one of the fastest ways, and then you're actually skill of doing it, and then also okay, is it gonna be durable?
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: And then there's a speed factor too.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_01: Can you produce the same quality a little faster?
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_01: Because that you can but if you're working on a few of the one or two of the things and you're getting slightly better over time, you're gonna get better and better versus someone who just stays the same.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_01: It just goes for workers or guys that you hire as well.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_01: If you're just sitting still and they're not getting better and they're not trying to advance, they're just that's them forever until they get too old to do it.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and you you kind of it and I think what at least what happened with us is I like we've pushed our we've been on some like really tricky jobs where that and sometimes the job forces your finish to come up.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like we did the one uh where they they installed that elevator in the house.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah, and we had and we had to use I think we had to use like a Benjamin Moore trim paint, which is very prone to like flecking off your brush, and we and the walls were wallpapered with like really high-end wallpaper.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: So we could we were doing all the things.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: All these huge rooms, crown and baseboard, and we couldn't get any on the walls.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_00: You couldn't, yeah, you couldn't touch the walls or even have a drip hit the wall.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: And so we like sheeted it off in plastic, and a lot of a lot of stuff is like how good is your prep out?
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: Like, are you prepping everything proper?
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_00: That contributes hugely to your overall finish quality, uh like on the on the walls or whatever surface you're working on.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_00: And then also are you just putting drop cloths down?
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_00: Are you masking things off?
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like one of the things that we've been doing a lot is using our masking guns that lay down like the you know, it's basically if people don't know it, like you it's got a tape that unspools on the top and it's connected to like huge plastic sheeting that's like 90 inches long, so you will like unfurl it, and that way you can like really wrap cabinets tightly, vanities, things like that.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: It just makes it where no paint is gonna get where it shouldn't go.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_00: Or if you're just painting a ceiling, you can't get any on the wall.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: It's fantastic for that, too.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_00: And you can like mask it out really quickly.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: So if you once you kind of get the hang of it.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_01: So you you headed up that project.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_01: I was slow to adapt the tape gun.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_01: It'll make them for lefties, man.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, make them for righties.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_01: It's Josh's vein of everything.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_01: Everything's made for righties.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_00: These scissors aren't made for left-handed people.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_00: All right, Flanders, settle down.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_00: They're not.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't work.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_01: I have to do it right.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: I have to do so many things right-handed.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_01: I know, I know.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: You're a capable man.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but uh yeah, so like a good uh some of the comments that I get on the YouTube channel whenever I show something is like are pretty crazy where you could kind of guess the guy's finish quality based on just how he commented.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_00: I remember I showed like how to tape off a vanity with that masking gun.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_00: The guy's like, if you don't know how to not get paint on like that small bathroom, like like you're doing it wrong basically.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, wait, so you don't use drop cloths or anything?
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_00: Like, who what are you talking about?
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_01: We've we've uh hired subs that have done that before.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: You end up having to peel all the paint off the vanity or the cabinet, and that is what they do.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_01: They just don't use drop cloths, I'll just clean it up later, and they kind of clean it up later.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_00: That there's just no way.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_00: There's no way if you roll a ceiling, I don't care what ceiling paint you're using or whatever, like it's gonna fleck somewhat, or you might just have a stray come off like the build up on the edge of the roller or whatever, and it's like, dude, what are you talking about?
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_00: That's nuts.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_00: Like you're and I think and then the other thing too that a lot of guys are moving towards is like you know, what do you spray versus what do you brush and roll?
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_00: And you're kind of like a video game character of like how how have you built out that strength set or that skill set?
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_00: So if you are some guys get insanely good at spraying and they're fast at the setup, and they've had a lot of jobs and reps where they've done that, and then they can do it in like a residential setting where they they know how to set up a fan and have a good draw, and they kind of booth things off, and you know, there there's certain like I would say the the for sure the thing to spray most of the time is like kitchen cabinets, and that's something the guys tend to specialize in.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: Because if you get a couple of those jobs and you get your setup right, and you have like the drying racks and you can set up a booth in the basement, that's what a lot of guys tend to tend to do, or like spraying a bunch of doors, uh like that makes a lot more sense.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas if you're in a more a house that's already up and functioning and full of furniture, that can be harder to mess things off and spray everything and then that's your system to spray.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_00: I think we know of painters that spray trim.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: Spray, yeah.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: There's a couple, and then they don't do it every time.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: So we've even talked to like our buddy Nick, who's got a ton of sprayers and like 20 guys working, and we're like, How much spraying are you doing?
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, not much, man.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_01: It's like mostly I think Dennis and his crews uh from last I heard they spray our trim.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_01: Or they try to.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they generally come in and spray, and that that's and that's something where uh a lot of the older guys who like will throw shade on using tape.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, dude, do you know any crews that spray?
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: Because like you have to tape, you have to mask things out.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_01: That's just well the tape used to not be as good either.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_01: It used to be all the old white masking tape, yep, which didn't work, so that would make sense not to use it.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_01: But then uh technology changed.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and for a few bucks you can buy the best tape on the market.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, there's been some updates.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so well, same with painting, like the uh like oh, you have to have a wet edge or you have to do this, like not as no, not anymore.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, you can, but you don't have to.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_01: Remember, we got hired, and then the guy was yawing at you to uh keep a wet edge, keep a wet edge.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, as we were seasoned painters and we were like, we're better than you, bro.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I was like, I've seen your finish quality, relax.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_00: He was yelling at me up on a boom lift, and it was it was in a that was an odd scenario.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because I was like, I I was probably like mid-20s, and I was the good enough to know.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_01: We were married.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_01: Was I married?
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_01: Uh he might have been late 20s, but yeah, we were married and we were working and I was working with Mark.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_01: And uh yeah, because yeah, we were all married.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I was I was we we were we're seasoned at that point.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_01: I was getting upset, and not supposed to be yelled at for doing it correctly.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, and then I think he way overbought the paint, so there's like a hundred extra gallons.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it was some obscene amount of of product that he overbought.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, what are you?
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: And they already tenanted it and everything, so I was like it's like well, I hope you guys will you have plenty for touch-ups, yeah.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_00: And and that's and so yeah, I just um because the way that I have ended up orienting, like if you have jobs that push your finish quality up where you're like, everything's really tight, I've got the prep has been dialed, I'm doing my patching is getting better, my th my my surfaces are nice and smooth before I apply them, I know how to lay down good finish coats.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_00: You wanna you wanna push your finish quality well beyond the expectations of your clients so that when they like it you want a room to meet your standards, and then your standards should be above where the client's expectations are.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_00: That way when they come in, they're like, Whoa, like this looks awesome.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, and you kind of the how I always always feel about it now is like yes, because it no longer bothers me.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: So like this room is done.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_00: And uh that's kind of been my like you that I think that's a good strategy to like push your expectations of the work that you want to see from yourself and your crew beyond your client's expectations.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_00: So then if you run into like a hard client, you already know you're you're good and you're not like uh and sometimes you're gonna have to reach for it.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like sometimes it might be a little bit out of your wheelhouse, but that's how you grow and get better.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: And we took on, especially when we first started, we were taking on stuff that we had.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, stuff we probably shouldn't have.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: But it worked out.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: We learned a lot, and then you you know you take it under, you're like, all right, how did that go?
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_01: But also it's good to be uh it's like when you've done a good job this past year or two where you're someone like hey, try this way or this type of roller or this type of like and then we'll give it a shot, this type of brush.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_01: Because sometimes you'll discover something that's great, and sometimes, but sometimes, nah, I liked it the older way I did it.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_01: But if you just stay with the same everything forever, you're just that's as good as you're gonna get, unless you're like, I'm trying to, but it's like let's try this mini roller, let's try this, like using mini rollers on ceilings, yep.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then just be like all right, what's what's changed to 14-inch rollers instead of nines, like that was years ago.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_01: Let's try an 18.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, that didn't work well for this job.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_01: And as long as you're like, let's try this type of sandpaper, let's try it, like if you can switch a product or make us try something a little new and just see how it goes, and it might not go well.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_01: So you do it in a low risk area, yeah.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: But then it's like, you know, when we use Fresh Start for the first time, we were using Ben Shellac for any type of oil trim.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: Like if there's oil trim and we were trying to convert it to latex, we're like, dude, this sucks.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: Because then we didn't want to do it anymore, right?
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_01: But then we're like, hey, we'll try this Fresh Start stuff from Benjamin Moore, and now we're like, oh, we can just use a latex product and it works just as well.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_01: You're like, okay, we just need to scuff sand the surface so it grips, yeah.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: And then we were getting away from doing um like exterior painting.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_01: Remember, like when there was no good paint that we liked, and then we tried a new paint from Benjamin Moore, like, oh, this one's great.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_01: And now you make tons of money painting shutters.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, shutters and front doors.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_01: Front doors, yeah.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_00: So and the the um yeah, so I've just been thinking more about that, and then like what actually makes up a high quality finish, and then how do you kind of pursue that?
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the things that's uh that I will give the internet a good amount of credit because if you are curious if you're doing something wrong, just make a video recording however you do, whatever you do, post it on YouTube, and then somebody will tell you everything you're doing wrong, or multiple people, even if you think you did it correct.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_00: So I've gotten the I have a good one from for you.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_01: Go for it.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_01: Because you did an early video about uh caulk gun, and then you said, you know, when you get a new tube of caulk, you have to poke it right with a little poker and the a caulk the caulk gun.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_01: And the guy's like, first he called you, you look said you look like a lumberjack, and then uh he's like, Yo, you don't have to poke a caulk tube.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, what?
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_01: I thought you had to poke it, because you used to have to, but you don't.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_01: Or in a brand new caulk tube, yeah, you don't have to like shoot the poker in there because it's already.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_00: I I believe he also made some comments as to my sexual orientation as well.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_00: Uh yeah, that too.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_00: So but so it was kind of fun.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_00: Uh but as it turns out, uh so with acrylic caulks, they don't have they're not sealed.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_00: With more um if you have uh the other types of caulks that are like more more going on that aren't acrylic, that are like some of the ones that you use in like bathrooms and stuff, those are sealed.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_00: So you do have to puncture them.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: So but like the latex based caulks that we use are open, but then you do have to poke it if you've used it before and then it dries, then you do have to think of all the time that guy saved us.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_00: We don't have to poke new tubes.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe 40 minutes.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_00: But but I've gotten made I've gotten like b just blasted.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: It online with any pick a thing, and yeah, and and guys will land on either side.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_00: You'll do one thing and be like, you should have done it this way, and the other guy's like, No, you should do it this way.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, okay, well, all of all the ways we've done it work.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_01: So well, the nice benefit is we've worked with over a dozen different crews because we'll bring them on for bigger projects.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_01: So we've seen fully fully trained painters or painters who've done it for longer than us and how they do things, and everyone has a different way to do it.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, there's and there and different size brush, three-inch brush, two-inch brush.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_01: I've seen a guy with the two-inch brush just fly, and a guy with the three-inch brush be terrible, and vice versa.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: That's another highly contentious subject because we uh we weren't really trained by uh our boss was a really good painter, but he hated painting, so he didn't really show us how to paint, he just yelled at us when we did it wrong.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: So uh we Josh and I just kind of were trying, we were very we just tried shit to see what would work and what didn't work, what we liked.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_00: And then like we landed on using a two and a half inch Corona Cortez for most most of what we did because it's a sash brush, so it's easier to do tricky cut-ins.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_00: And when we were working at Rydal Park, there was things that you really couldn't take off, you just had to cut around them, you couldn't get them off the wall.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_00: So we were like having to do these things, and we just found it easier to work with these brushes, so we got used to them.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_00: And then when I posted about what brush I used online, people were like, You should be using a squared off brush for you know cutting in ceilings and cutting in walls and things like that, and then the sash brush is for trim work and whatever.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_00: So you're like, okay, so then I tried I tried a bunch of different brushes.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_00: Some guys like these oval sash brushes, and other guys like I was like, all right, I'm open to it.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_00: So I tried like the squared-off brush, and I've just had too much time with a Corona Cortez in my hand where I'm like, I'm slower with this, I'm not used to the weight, and just like and we tried different brushes of the same size by the same brand, just like a different like hey, a lot of the guys like this for the I think the Vegas brush for trim.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, then we all found out we're all painting trim slower.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: Well, the and so that that brush is great, it produces a really good finish quality, but the problem is it drags so much with the hybrid paints that are thicker, like advance and like emerald urethane, it doesn't have enough stiffness in it to keep the product moving well.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_00: And if you're just like slow, that's fine.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_00: But if you are like trying to get I can get as good a finish quality out of a Cortez as I can a Vegas.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, the if you just lay the trade-off of going slower versus higher finish, like no, our finish is good enough.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_01: This is not helping.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, this is actually making it, we're making less money now.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_00: So, but I I think it's good to kind of be a psychopath about getting your finish quality like as near to perfect as you can, and then what you will figure out is when you go and look at a job, you're like, okay, what what's the potential of this room?
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_00: You kind of get a vibe for it as soon as you come into somebody's house, like what is their expectation of how this should look, and then you can always like dial back your effort to make something.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you were even talking about it when uh that dude was doing like apartment painting or like on Todd's job where it was like a real shithole that he was working on.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, okay, that's not gonna be uh like the Sistine Chapel when you're done.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's gonna be a better version of whatever.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_01: You can go too slow for a job, like I'm gonna make this look perfect.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you don't have to get every single little burr in the wall, just kind of good enough.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_01: In some circumstances, like look away, let's be a few feet off the wall, look at it, be like, all right, this is good.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so as far as actionable things that I would say that just would that can make a difference, uh, one is consider doing some touch-up patching after your first finish coat.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're doing uh two coats on the walls of whatever color, uh a lot of times if you're doing, especially if you're doing like a big color shift in the room, when you roll your first finish coat on the ceiling or or on the walls, you're gonna you're probably gonna notice some things that you didn't notice when it was like before you started.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: And then that happens to us all the time, where then we'll do like we'll skim coat, you might have some spit with pinholes or whatever, you just take some joint compound or whatever filler you need to do, patch those areas, sand them down smooth, prime them, put one other coat of finish paint on them, so everything's back up to one coat, and then roll your you know, roll your second or how many coats you need to do to bring it up to to finish.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: So that's one thing.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: The other thing is when you pull tape and you are like actually go back through the room and do touch-ups.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: That's something that I think some guys, which we've seen on from not good crews, they don't go back and do that, they just pull tape and then send it.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_00: I'm good, yeah.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: I'm good.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so that's another detail thing.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_00: And then uh I'll tell you one that we don't do all the time.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: What's that?
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_01: Sandpole.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_01: So if to if the walls feel you know you put your hand on and it feels rough, or you get those what do you call them?
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_01: The little things up stick out, what do they call them?
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_00: Fish eyes, or someone has something, some like well, you've got like raspberries or like heavy build spots, you've got leftover nap from when it was real poorly before.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_01: It just doesn't feel smooth.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_01: So if you use like one of those big sanding discs, yeah, the 360 sand.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, especially kind of in the area that people would actually kind of touch or see, yeah, like closer, uh, that helps.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_01: Josh is probably the most diligent at doing that.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I am.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_01: The sanding pole is 50-50 on most of our jobs.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_01: Depends on the job.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_01: But you guys, I like doing the touch-ups though.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_01: I do like doing touch-ups.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so like touch-ups are good, and then um also particularly when you're starting out, is sticking with patterns.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_00: So if you move move clockwise around a room, then stick with that, and then vice versa.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_00: You like to use you go counterclockwise from the left around a room.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_00: Right to left, yeah.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_00: And then that's a big point of contention too online, which way you should go.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_00: Apparently, a lot of righties.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_00: As long as it gets good at the end.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_00: But you just want to make sure the room's complete.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_00: So if you said you're gonna do, especially if you're you know, you did the quote, did you actually do two coats on all the trim and doors?
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_00: Did you actually do two coats on the ceiling?
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_00: Did you do two coats on the walls?
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_00: Like, is everything coated that you said was gonna be coated?
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_00: And is it and then have you inspected it?
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_00: Have you looked at all the lines?
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_00: Have you looked at yeah, just a scan of each room that you completed?
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, you want good lines and particularly good 90-degree like corners where like trim goes into itself, what are your corners look like, that kind of stuff.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_00: So anyway, that's my my little rant as I've been watching some other tutorials where they're just like, anyone can do it.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, dude, the the what you just did took takes years to train someone's hand to be able to have that good a brush control to do this thing, and you're just telling, like, you know, Billy homeowner that he can do this on a weekend.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_00: You're like, they they're gonna struggle, man.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they they might be able to do it, just how it looks.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_00: Are they Mennonite?
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_00: Because if they are, they're gonna be fine.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_01: If they're some if they're a turd, they're not gonna be able to do it.
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, they've never done anything with their hands before, it's not gonna go well.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, as we have verified.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so uh, but yeah, so anyway, that was my my little soapbox rant today.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_00: But just focus on the finish quality.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_00: If you can do a good job and you keep pulling those off, and then you'll eventually get it where you can make money on those things, uh, and just have your standards be above your clients, and then that puts you in a really good spot because then you come in and you look at jobs, you're like, I can do this, I'm gonna make it look awesome.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: And the the reason that I'm able to close the amount of bids that I can close is because I know the finished quality we can produce.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm very confident with what our crew crew can produce every single time.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_00: And so when they ask me something, I'm like 100% we can do this, or no, we cannot.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and like, and that's it's it's good to know your limits as well.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you're like, I'm not gonna do a good job with this, and then just be like, all right, I'm not in unless you really want to get into that type of work.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, but if you're like, oh, this is in my wheelhouse, I'm gonna crush this, then then have at it.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_01: So and if you want to keep up in your finish quality and getting better and better, join the goo crew.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_01: Uh link in the the uh description.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I did actually release the pricing module.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_01: And hopefully by the time this comes out, we'll see.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_01: Uh should have some other things out too.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so there's actually stuff in the classroom.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_01: There's stuff in the classroom.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_01: There will be more.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: So alrighty.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_00: Well, until next time, y'all take it easy, work smart, and have a good one.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_00: Peace.