Latest / Project Emerald Collective / Choosing the Hard Thing: Antarctica, "Green Wishing," and Living Intentionally with Sophie Ballagh
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- Sophie Ballagh: Because if I learned after my awareness expanded around my negative impact, and I tried so desperately to eliminate it, and that's when I learned you can't. simply by existing we have a negative impact on the environment. have a negative footprint. It's there by existing. So if that's going to be there, we can minimise it and reduce it as much as we can, but there's still something there. So then I looked to this side and that's where the Honest Maths came from. And I was like, well, what can I do to then make sure that this is bigger than this if I'm going to be here and thinking about future generations and their opportunities in environments and with the planet. So I think it's much nicer to focus on the positive, right? Eve: Yeah. Sophie Ballagh: And take the attention that side rather than sit and dwell on trying to minimise this, chip it away at it. It's very important also, but I think it's far more in the limelight around people and different options of how we can minimise that impact. But I think there's less talk about and options about what we can do to actually create positive impact. Eve: Welcome to the Project Emerald Collective. I'm your host, Eve McIntyre. Every week I sit down with women who have chosen to live differently. Designers, founders, creatives, psychologists, adventurers and change makers. People asking bigger questions about how we live, work, create and connect. These conversations aren't really about fashion. They're about living with intention. finding the courage to be yourself and discovering what becomes possible when you stop living by expectation and start living by choice. If that's the kind of life you're creating too, you're in the right place. Now let's go. today I have the pleasure of interviewing Sophie Ballagh Sophie's a founder, a change maker, and a globally recognised adventurer who's spent more than two decades leading over 20,000 people through some of the most extreme places on Earth, from the High Arctic to Antarctica. Today she brings that experience in leadership, courage, and decision making into business as a founder, investor, and strategic operator. I recently heard Sophie speak at the WCEF National Forum, where she shared two ideas that really stayed with me. The importance of doing the honest maths when it comes to our individual impact on the planet, and a phrase she coined. which everyone loved, green wishing. The gap between wanting to make a difference and actually taking meaningful action. And I think both speak to something we explore so often here, becoming conscious of the choices we're making, recognizing the agency we already have and using it. So welcome Sophie. Sophie Ballagh: Thank you, Eve. Thank you. It's super lovely to be chatting with you. And as much as I enjoyed my time on stage at the Women's Chief Forum, it was so short. And I'm so excited to extend the conversation because it's something we're clearly so passionate about and could talk for hours. So thank you. Eve: Absolutely, before we talk about what you're doing now, I'd love to understand a little more about you. So who is Sophie Ballagh and how did you become the woman that you are today? Sophie Ballagh: sure. It's a pretty big question. I grew up on a farm in New Zealand and was very much bought into the outdoors and outdoor spaces. And I connected from a young age with wild places. And I think that has a big part of who I am today. There's obviously been lots of corners turned and pivotal people in my life and moments that have also shaped it, but I think that has a huge part of it was my upbringing on a farm, my upbringing going on camping missions and holidays. And I truly do believe that that played a big part. So when I was at high school, I actually hated school. I did everything I could to try and avoid it. stay at home and help dad on the farm. But the one part of school I really loved and I begged them to fail me so I could reset the same class the next year was outdoor education. Eve: Mm-hmm. Love that. Sophie Ballagh: And my outdoor education teacher really, really opened up that world to me and helped me realise that you spend a lot of your life working. So you may as well do something you love. And that led Eve: Hmm. Sophie Ballagh: me for at least 10 or 15 years on a pretty incredible journey of outdoor education, teaching outdoor education, whitewater kayaking, rock climbing, leading trips globally. So everything from the Arctic to the Antarctic and many places in between. And then I guess I can thank COVID and I thank COVID. I have a positive relationship with COVID and it gave me the opportunity to embrace something quite new in my life that I had never thought about, never dreamed about, never knew that was possible. And that was starting and jumping into the world of business. Eve: Mm. Sophie Ballagh: Yeah. prior to COVID, I was a global citizen, a nomad. I had no fixed abode. Myself and my partner had been travelling and working and travelling for about 10 years. From one amazing job to another, from one amazing location to another around the world, meeting amazing people, doing incredible things, living the dream. But we knew we wanted to do something different. We knew we wanted to create something and leave a positive impact in the world. In some way, we had no idea what that was or would be. And we had such a good thing going that it was hard to remove ourselves from this good thing, like getting paid to travel the world, literally. It was so hard to extract ourselves from that when we didn't know exactly what it was or where we were going, but we knew there was something more for us to do and fulfil in this life. And so COVID happened and it obviously shut down global travel and we were like, woof, okay, The world is our oyster and we know that now is actually an amazing opportunity to... to work it out, to do whatever it is we want to do and create it. So we used that time to think big and brainstorm what is it we want to do, what is our impact and our legacy that we want to leave behind. And we've tried our hand at a whole bunch of things. I started a personal care product refillable business. We did a bunch of other things, but that's led to Harrington Road now. I guess, COVID was the instigator that opened up this world for us of business. And now it's taken many more turns. yeah, so it's pretty exciting. And I guess therefore, we can be grateful the fact that COVID happened and pivot us into this. We still obviously travel and we still play with the penguins and the polar bears. But... But it opened the door and gave us the nudge we needed to start business and create something bigger than ourselves in this world. Eve: Yeah, I love that. were you always adventurous? Sophie Ballagh: Yeah, I think I was the one pushing the boundaries. Mum can probably Eve: Mm-hmm. Sophie Ballagh: attest to that. At school, I guess it comes from a curiosity. Maybe from a place of having to hold my own as the youngest of four. I don't know where it comes from. Eve: Yeah, right. was there a moment where you realised that you wanted to live differently from perhaps the more conventional path? Sophie Ballagh: That's a great question. I can't recall that there was one moment. But I think... I guess as I was growing from teenage years into a woman, I guess I then realised and felt I don't fit in these boxes that society has for us. Eve: Mm-hmm. Sophie Ballagh: I never had words to be able to articulate it like that question, Eve. And I'm lucky that I had the support and encouragement around me to live that life, to be that person. I feel like I lose the responsibility to help other young girls realise that. Eve: Mm, yeah, absolutely. Sophie Ballagh: Mm. Yeah, nicely summed up. Yes. Eve: what have those experiences taught you about yourself? Sophie Ballagh: I think Wild Places and the Outdoors teaches you or has taught me that you as a human can endure so much more than we think we can. I've felt that and learned that time time again in all sorts of different... adventures, be them big and gnarly and wild or even small and more local, close to home and contemplative. But I've definitely felt that these wild places have built a depth of strength and resilience is such a word that gets thrown around, but resilience in me for my time being in the outdoors. Eve: Mm. Yeah, absolutely. And tell us how did you end up in Antarctica? And how how has that particular place shaped your life? Mm-hmm. Sophie Ballagh: it shaped my life. It's a part of my heart and it won't ever leave. It was an incredible, fortunate circumstance that led me to Antarctica. I had been sea kite guiding in Canada on the West Coast for a season, a summer there with the orca. Amazing. Eve: Mm. Sophie Ballagh: Had the best summer. And on my last trip of the season, A client of mine, I had her for a six day trip, paddling, camping, paddling with the orcas. And as I dropped her off, we finished the trip, we were in the van and I was returning my guests to their accommodation. And she said, Sophie, she said, you've been great. And she said, I know a guy, he's a good friend and my neighbor, and he runs kayaking in Antarctica in the Arctic. And I was like, what? I didn't Eve: Mm-hmm. Sophie Ballagh: even know you could kayak in Antarctica. Like, it had never crossed my mind. It had never... The continent had never even come into my thoughts, to be honest. And I was like, really? And she said, yeah. And she kind of did this. She pointed her finger and she said, I'm gonna get you a job. And I was like, geez. she meant it. And so Eve: Mm. Sophie Ballagh: we exchanged details on like a shitty little napkin or piece of like a serviette, something that was in the Eve: Okay. Sophie Ballagh: van, the only thing that I could find. And two days later, the operations manager of this company rings me, we zoom and and we talked for about two hours, it was incredible. This was the most strange interview for a job I'd ever had, and then he finished with, are you in? And I'm like, do you want to invite me to your team to work, to guide expeditions in Antarctica? And he said, yeah, I need you in Ushuaia, the southern tip of Argentina. I need you in Ushuaia on the eighth of November. And I remember that because it's my birthday. And I said, Aaron, this eighth of November? And he said, yeah. And I'm like, I did a quick bit of math. I'm like, that's in 16 days. And he said, is that a problem? I said, no. Eve: Yeah. Sophie Ballagh: But I didn't say to him that I was actually due back in New Zealand to be my friend's bridesmaid. I didn't tell him that my passport was expired and I was actually due back in New Zealand and all of these other things and I was like, okay, I've got 16 days to work it out because Eve: Yeah. Sophie Ballagh: why wouldn't you? Like this opportunity doesn't Eve: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Sophie Ballagh: come up every day. So I had to ring my friend. She was very understanding. She's a glacier guide. So of anybody who I could bail and ditch being at the wedding, she was going to be the most understandable ever. And that was the start of it, and that was about 15 years ago. Eve: talk us through how it unfolded after that? Sophie Ballagh: Hmm. No, it's now an addiction and it's in my blood. Eve: Mm-hmm. Sophie Ballagh: and it will never leave. the company that I started working for 15 years ago, they run tours in both the Arctic in the Northern Hemisphere summer and the Antarctic in the Southern Hemisphere summer. And I was part of the expedition team. Back then I was sea kayak guide. And I would literally jump from summer to summer, but you're still rugged up in 10 layers of clothing trying to stay warm. and guiding and running, helping run expeditions and helping people explore and connect with the place. Yeah, every year since, other than COVID, I return to the Antarctic, especially I haven't been to the Arctic for a few years now, but the Antarctic is pretty dear to my heart. It's very hard to give it up. Eve: Mm. Sophie Ballagh: But at the same time, I do know that the end that I guess my career in Antarctica will end and I want that to be by choice rather than anything else. Eve: Yeah. What keeps you returning? Sophie Ballagh: aside I think from the obvious of the... the wonder of this place. It's so humbling and it does something to your soul when you let it, when you open up, which I don't think is hard. But when you open up and let it be in you, it does something to you that might sound cheesy. But... One of the main reasons I truly keep returning now, probably for the first few years it was more of a selfish reason, but as the years go on, I truly believe that I have an amazing opportunity, and this is something I spoke to on stage at the Women Chiefs Enterprise International Leadership Forum, is I truly believe these trips and my being there gives me an incredible opportunity to have impact on people. it has an opportunity for me to amplify my positive impact on people and on planet. you mentioned this in your opening and something I talked about on stage was the honest maths of our footprint, Eve: Mm. Yeah. Sophie Ballagh: of our footprint on the planet. And you have to honestly acknowledge what goes in your negative impact bucket, because there is a massive negative impact with traveling to South America and getting on a ship, going to Antarctica, right? Like, there's no denying there's impact. So, Eve: Mm-hmm. Sophie Ballagh: and all the other things in life. My God, we could talk for hours, but what is in that negative impact bucket? But then we talked about a positive impact bucket and that it's not just about reducing our negative impact. We have to simultaneously do some good for the planet and for the world. So what can we do? And there's all sorts of things you can do to put in this positive impact bucket. But I think one way that I choose to fill up that positive impact bucket is have a powerful presence on others. My role in Antarctica, every six days I'm sitting with 70 new people who have come from all around the world. They're often very influential people and we help them as a team of expedition staff. We help them connect with this place. We encourage them to put their cameras down and just be and feel that presence and that connection to place. And then we ask the hard questions and then we get real with them. We don't deny or dodge around the scary conversations around climate change, around impact. And if we can leave knowing that those 70 guests haven't just had a great time and great photos and great memories, but they're now... really driven to go and look at themselves, their impact, how they can use their voice or their vote or their money to go and create positive impact. Eve: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: then I'm winning. Sophie Ballagh: Yeah, so I was saying that's team, I love the people I work with, obviously I love the place, but also I truly believe it's a responsibility. So yes, I have a negative impact in getting there, but I make sure that my positive impact counts. speaker-1: I love the team, I love the people I work with, obviously I love the place, but also I truly believe it's a responsibility. So yes, I have a negative impact in getting there, but I make sure that my positive impact counts. Eve: Mm. Yeah, absolutely. And like honest maths, that asks us to have a look at ourselves as well. And so what happened when you started looking honestly at your own impact? Sophie Ballagh: I got pretty depressed. The more I learnt, the more I became aware, the more I realised what that negative impact bucket looked like. And it wasn't a bucket, it was like a giant, like a black hole. And sometimes, you know, knowledge, too much knowledge is scary. speaker-1: I got pretty depressed. The more I learnt, the more I became aware, the more I realised what that negative impact bucket looked like. And it wasn't a bucket, it was like a giant, like a black hole. And sometimes, you know, knowledge, too much knowledge is scary. Sophie Ballagh: But yeah, I did I went pretty deep and I started making massive changes in my life and my... speaker-1: But yeah, I did I went pretty deep and I started making massive changes in my life and my behavior and everything to try and minimize I've got the Eve: where do you think we underestimate our individual contributions? speaker-1: think it's different for different people. For some people, you mean in terms of our environmental footprint. Sophie Ballagh: think it's different for different people. For some people, Eve: Yeah. Sophie Ballagh: you mean in terms of our environmental footprint. speaker-1: I think for some people they possibly underestimate the negative impact bucket and potentially underestimate the opportunities to reduce. talk and options around that. And so every year that goes past, I feel like that's becoming more and more in people's minds and there's more options for people. Sophie Ballagh: I think for some people they possibly underestimate the negative impact bucket and potentially I feel like there's more and more awareness and talk and options around that. And so every year that goes past, I feel like that's becoming more and more in people's minds and there's more options for people to reduce their negative. I think one area, speaker-1: to reduce their negative. I think one area that is often, Sophie Ballagh: or less talked about, or often not ignored, but less talked about, or known, is how we can actually make positive impact on the planet. Because if I learned after my awareness expanded around my negative impact, and I tried so desperately to eliminate it, speaker-1: less talked about, or known, is how we can actually make positive impact on the planet. Because if I learned after my awareness expanded around my negative impact, and I tried so desperately to eliminate it, and that's when I learned you can't. Sophie Ballagh: and that's when I learned you can't. speaker-1: simply by existing we have a negative impact on the environment. We have a negative footprint. It's there by existing. So if that's going to be there, we can minimise Sophie Ballagh: simply by existing we have a negative impact on the environment. have a negative footprint. It's there by existing. speaker-1: it and reduce it as much as we can, but there's still something there. So then I looked to this side and that's where the Honest Maths came from. And I was like, well, what can I do to then make sure that this is bigger than this if I'm going to be here and thinking about future generations and their opportunities in environment. Sophie Ballagh: So if that's going to be there, we can minimise it and reduce it as much as we can, but there's still something there. So then I looked to this side and that's where the Honest Maths came from. And I was like, well, what can I do to then make sure that this is bigger than this if I'm going to be here and thinking about future generations speaker-1: and with the planet. So I think it's Sophie Ballagh: and their opportunities in environments and with the planet. So I think it's much nicer to focus speaker-1: much nicer to focus on the positive, right? Eve: Yeah. Sophie Ballagh: on the positive, right? And take the attention that side rather than sit and dwell on trying to minimise this, chip it away at it. It's very important also, but I think it's far more in the limelight around people and different options of how we can minimise that impact. But I think there's less talk about and options about what we can do to actually create positive impact. speaker-1: and take the attention that side rather than sit and dwell on trying to minimise this, chip it away at it. It's very important also, but I think it's far more in the limelight around people and different options of how we can minimise that impact. But I think there's less talk about and options about what we can do to actually create positive impact. Eve: Mm-hmm. Yeah, absolutely. And where do we underestimate our individual agency, do you think? speaker-1: I think it comes back to awareness. Eve: Mm. Sophie Ballagh: I think it comes back to awareness. think people possibly aren't aware that we do have these choices, that we can make different choices and decisions. And we live in a fast-paced world. We live in busy lives. speaker-1: think people possibly aren't aware that we do have these choices, that we can make different choices and decisions. And we live in a fast-paced world. We live in busy lives. so, you know, a lot of society Sophie Ballagh: you know, speaker-1: and Sophie Ballagh: a lot of society and the economy is built around convenience, which sadly often adds to our negative imprint. so because we live in these busy, fast-paced lives, convenience is presented and we go with it. We've kind of got to because we've got the next thing to be at and it's all go. speaker-1: and the economy is built around convenience, which sadly often adds to our negative footprint. so because we live in these busy, fast-paced lives, convenience is presented and we go with it. We've kind of got to because we've got the next thing to be at and it's all go. But if we draw ourselves back and open up that awareness, Sophie Ballagh: But if we draw ourselves back and open up that awareness and sit with some honest maths and become aware of that and then go, gosh, we actually do speaker-1: and sit with some honest maths and become aware of that and then go gosh we actually do have that choice. That is our choice and there are other options Sophie Ballagh: have that choice. That is our choice and there are other options but you've got to become aware of them. I wasn't aware of them. You don't know what you don't know. So you've got to become aware of them and by engaging in more conversations and being open to hearing a comment a different way or a new possibility a different way or a new behaviour and being open to that I think is going to help, I guess, bring that agency. speaker-1: but you've got to become aware of them. I wasn't aware of them. You don't know what you don't know. So you've got to become aware of them and by engaging in more conversations and being open to hearing a comment a different way or a new possibility a different way or a new behaviour and being open to that I think is going to help, I guess, bring that agency. Eve: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely, speaker-1: utilize our agents in the moment. Eve: yeah. One of the ideas at the heart of Project Emerald is taking your power Sophie Ballagh: utilize our agency more. Eve: back one conscious choice at a time. Because I increasingly believe that our power isn't necessarily in one enormous life-changing decision. It's more in recognizing the hundreds of choices that we're already making and making better ones. So do you think that we've made sustainability feel so enormous that people have forgotten how much power they actually have? speaker-1: you Super, super question. And again, it's so personal. It's so hard to generalize that because I think there's obviously a group of people who are so, you know, so heightened and aware of it. And then there's probably some who it's not a part of their vocabulary and day-to-day or thought process at all, and then everything in between. So it's going to be so different. But. Sophie Ballagh: Super, super question. And again, it's so personal. It's so hard to generalize that because I think there's obviously a group of people who are so, you know, so heightened and aware of it. And then there's probably some who it's not a part of their vocabulary and day-to-day or thought process at all. And then everything in between. So it's gonna be so different. But. speaker-1: To come back to your question is like to take back the power. Yes, it's an I've heard the conversation, does it come from the Sophie Ballagh: To come back to your question is like to take back the power. Yes, it's in the... speaker-1: top down, like supplier down or from consumer bottom up? And I think it can be both. I don't know the one right answer if it's one or the other, but I believe and have seen it work from both ways. Sophie Ballagh: I've heard the conversation, does it come from the top down, like supplier down or from consumer bottom up? And I think it can be both. I don't know the one right answer if it's one or the other, but I believe and have seen it work from both ways. And there's the power of the collective of our choice and our decisions from consumerism driven up. If we all speaker-1: And there's the power of the collective of our choice and our decisions from consumerism driven up. If we all refuse to... Sophie Ballagh: refuse to speaker-1: something of an example, you know, not refuse the bag, you know, well that's an example, plastic bags at supermarkets. Remember when that was a given, was standard everywhere all the time and now you barely see a plastic bag at a supermarket. Sophie Ballagh: not buy this product that comes in plastic or if we all refuse the bag, you know, well that's an example, plastic bags at supermarkets. Remember when that was a given, it was standard everywhere all the time and now you barely see a plastic bag Eve: Mm. Yeah. Yeah, thank God. speaker-1: Now that's the Sophie Ballagh: at a supermarket. speaker-1: new norm. So it can work from bottom up, consumer up, but I believe it can also work from top down. And collectively, it makes a difference. Eve: Mm-hmm. Sophie Ballagh: Now that's the new norm. So it can work from bottom up, consumer up, but I believe it can also work from top down. And Eve: Yeah. Sophie Ballagh: collectively, it makes a difference. speaker-1: And someone might go, well, that's so small. Sophie Ballagh: And someone might go, well, that's so small. Like, what is my one drink bottle today? You know, if they buy a water bottle, a throw away water bottle, like, it's not, it's one bottle. I need water. But then if we all did that once every day, that adds up, you know? So yeah, speaker-1: Like, what is my one drink bottle today? You know, if they buy a water bottle, a throw away water bottle, like, it's not, it's one bottle. I need water. But then if we all did that once every day, that's a hub, you know? So yeah, it is hard to grasp. Eve: Mm. Sophie Ballagh: it is hard to grasp. speaker-1: the immensity of one small action from one small person, but yet the power that that has and if everybody changes that one behaviour. Yeah. Sophie Ballagh: the immensity of one small action from one small person, but yet the power that that has. if everybody changes that Eve: Yeah, I think it's just about collectively choosing a Sophie Ballagh: one behaviour, yeah. Eve: a better option, just becoming aware that, you have the power to make Sophie Ballagh: Correct. Eve: better choices in your own life and that will then ripple out to your family and then your community and then, your neighborhood and then your state and then, your country and then the world. speaker-1: Totally. Eve: Hmm. So let's Sophie Ballagh: Totally. Eve: talk about green wishing, which Sophie Ballagh: Totally. Yep. Eve: I loved that you came up with that. we hear a lot about greenwashing. Sophie Ballagh: That was fun. Eve: but green wishing feels more human. And so what does green wishing mean to you? Sophie Ballagh: just came to me on last Friday at the panel discussion and we were talking about greenwashing, but how often greenwashing is not necessarily a speaker-1: at the panel discussion and we were talking about greenwashing, but how often greenwashing is not necessarily a purposeful, harmful... Sophie Ballagh: purposeful harm for... speaker-1: movement or action, it can Sophie Ballagh: like movement or action, it can sometimes be someone's aspiration or a business's aspiration or goals or plan to be operating here or speaker-1: sometimes be someone's aspiration or a business's aspiration or goals or plan to be operating here or doing XYZ sustainably. Sophie Ballagh: doing X, Y, Z sustainably. And so therefore maybe the speaking or advertising or the website talks about that, but their actions aren't quite there yet. It's an aspiration. And so there's that gap. And I was like, well, in that essence, it's kind of like green wishing. speaker-1: And so therefore maybe the speaking or advertising or the website talks about that but their actions aren't quite there yet. It's an aspiration. And so there's that gap. And I was like, well, in that essence, it's kind of like green wishing. Like I wish that I could be Sophie Ballagh: I wish that I could be this green instead of green washing, so long as it comes from the right intent, right? So if you have that right intention and that is what you speaker-1: this green instead of green washing. So long as it comes from the right intent, right? So if you have that right intention and that is what you want, then that's your green wish. Eve: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Sophie Ballagh: want, then that's your green wish. And I don't know, it just came out and it didn't seem to stick. And then we got asked the question back, well, what is your green speaker-1: it just came out and it didn't seem to stick. And then we got asked the question back, well what is your green wish? I'd love to hear what's your green wish, Eve. Eve: Yeah. Sophie Ballagh: wish? I'd love to hear what's your green wish, Eve. Eve: my green wish. I have been reflecting on this actually. so I have two. so my first one is that we would just stop producing, the world would stop production for 12 months, just to give ourselves a moment to re regroup and think about like what we're actually doing rather than acting on autopilot. And imagine the creativity that would come with that. And the change in behaviour. I think that that's a really exciting possibility if I was to get my green wish. And my second one, Sophie Ballagh: whole. Eve: in addition to, or maybe like it, you know, it's more achievable to have this one, but just for everyone on earth to learn to pause before they act. So in a sustainability lens as well as everyday life choices that just the pause before you act on autopilot or react to something, every single choice could be more intentional if we just learnt to pause. speaker-1: Mmm, amazing green wishing. Eve: And I think yeah, I think that Sophie Ballagh: Mmm, Eve: that's there's power in that. Sophie Ballagh: amazing green wishes. Eve: Yeah. What's your green wish, Sophie? speaker-1: The green wish when I was asked that during the panel discussion the first thing that came to mind was a greater global awareness. Sophie Ballagh: The green wish when I was asked that during the panel discussion, first thing that came to mind was a speaker-1: If we can just raise that awareness and all of a sudden everyone become aware of their true maths and their impact and their possibilities and opportunities to create positive impact, amazing. The second one which I didn't articulate quick enough on stage is that the speed. We've got, there is movement. There is great movement and awareness coming and you, you know. Sophie Ballagh: greater global awareness. If we can just raise that awareness and all of a sudden everyone become aware of their true maths and their impact and their possibilities and opportunities to create positive impact, amazing. The second one which I didn't articulate quick enough on stage is that the speed. But there is movement, there is great movement and awareness coming and new great initiatives underway and happening and new products becoming available and some differences in purchasing behaviour. But it's so slow. We need to be moving in that trajectory but at a far faster rate. That would be a green wish is that. speaker-1: great initiatives underway and happening and new products becoming available and some differences in purchasing behaviour, but it's so slow. We need to be moving in that trajectory but at a far faster rate. would be a green wish is that the trajectory that we're going is like the direction I guess that we're going is right but it needs to be faster. That's my wish. Sophie Ballagh: The trajectory that we're going is like, the direction I guess that we're going is right but it needs to Eve: Mm. Yeah. Sophie Ballagh: be faster. That's my wish. Eve: I think that's where if we stop relying on, you know, companies or policy to make those improvements in their practices and if we take a Sophie Ballagh: Mm. Eve: the agency to make better choices personally, that's where it would speed up. speaker-1: Yep, but it has to be, that has to be we as in a big giant collective. To force that change. then that's when it comes to bigger and then forcing that change. Yeah. Sophie Ballagh: Yep, but it has to be, that has to be we as in a big, giant collective to force that change, to bigger awareness, greater awareness, and then change. Eve: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Mm-hmm. in your opinion, what actually moves us into action? Sophie Ballagh: Great question. I think of fire in the belly. Knowledge and awareness alone, it may create some small change or action, but generally it's small and or short term. What's going to, what I believe is going to create at long term is fire in the belly. And that can be either passion, speaker-1: I think of fire in the belly. Knowledge and awareness alone, it may create some small change or action, but generally it's small and or short term. What's going to, what I believe is going to create at long term is fire in the belly. And that can be either passion and honestly it could be fear. It could be... Sophie Ballagh: And honestly, it could be fair. could be... For me, I'd come back to connection. If we can connect people, help people connect to place, to wild spaces, to nature, to animals, to whatever it is for them, and so they can see a full circle. speaker-1: For me, I'd come back to connection. If we can connect people, help people connect to place, to wild spaces, to nature, to animals, to whatever it is for them, and so they can see a full circle. If you can't see the full circle, then I think it's going to be hard to create long-standing, big... Sophie Ballagh: If you can't see the full circle, then I think it's going to be hard to create long-standing, Eve: Yeah. speaker-1: big change that lasts rather than, yeah I didn't use a plastic bag this month and know yeah plastic free July you know it can go beyond that you know yeah Eve: Mm-hmm. Sophie Ballagh: big, big change that lasts rather than, yeah, I didn't use a plastic bag this month and, know, Plastic Free July, or, you know, it Eve: Mm. Yeah. Yeah, Sophie Ballagh: can go beyond that, you know? Yep. Eve: that's true. I guess it's about realising your habits and then becoming aware enough to change them. speaker-1: Totally, Eve: Mm. speaker-1: totally. It's also about initiatives like Project Emerald or a little yin and bang, the refillable deodorant paste, like more of these becoming more available in your face so that when people have that awareness and that realization, they've got solutions and alternatives. Sophie Ballagh: Totally, totally. It's also about initiatives like Project Emerald or a little yin and bang, the refillable deodorant paste, like more of these becoming more available in your face so that when people have that awareness and that realization, Eve: Mm. Sophie Ballagh: they've got solutions Eve: Yeah, exactly. Sophie Ballagh: and alternatives. speaker-1: So I think it is so critical too that local business gets promoted and we get out there because it's not just about boosting our business, it's creating, the better the business goes, it means the bigger the impact we're having, the bigger the reach, the more people can make different behaviors. That's why these businesses were created in the first place. Sophie Ballagh: So I think it is so critical too that local business gets promoted and we get out there because it's not just about boosting our business, it's creating, the better the business goes, it means the bigger the impact we're having, the bigger the reach, the more people can make different behaviors. That's why these businesses Eve: Mm, yeah, absolutely. To give people options to participate Sophie Ballagh: were created in the first place. Eve: easily speaker-1: You nailed it. To give people options to participate more easily. Sophie Ballagh: I've you... you nailed Totally. Nailed it. Nailed it. Eve: So you've taken so much of what you've learned in those extreme environments into entrepreneurship. you're a founder and investor across a number of ventures, including Harrington Road, and that's where you're helping families navigate incredibly emotional transitions around aging, deceased estates and property. So what drew you towards solving that particular problem? speaker-1: the basis for trying to solve that problem and be there with families Sophie Ballagh: So speaker-1: during these major life changes, it came from personal lived experience. Sophie Ballagh: The the basis for trying to solve that problem and be there with families during these major life speaker-1: So within a reasonably short time frame, had to, actually it was during COVID, had to up my life here from Tasmania and luckily I could fly back to New Zealand to help my parents downsize. And it came as always, everybody has a story and life always happens all at once. So my dad had prostate cancer and my mum had actually broken her back Sophie Ballagh: changes, it came from personal lived experience. So within a a reasonably short time frame I had to or actually it was during COVID, I had to up my life here from Tasmania and luckily I could fly back to New Zealand to help my parents downsize. And it came as always, everybody's everybody has a story and life Always happens all at once. So my dad had prostate cancer and my mum had actually broken her back and it like and speaker-1: and they were due to move. They'd sold it in this whole process of selling their their property and moving and my family, my sisters in New Zealand or some weren't in New Zealand, they couldn't help so I had to go and downsize them and it's more than just a physical act, right? Like when somebody's lived somewhere for so many years, there's so much story and belonging and emotional attachment and connection to things, to our stuff. Sophie Ballagh: they were due to move. They they'd sold in this whole process of selling their their property and moving. And my family, my sisters in New Zealand, or some weren't in New Zealand, they couldn't help, so I had to look gotta go and downsize them. And it's it's more than just a physical act, right? Like when somebody's lived somewhere for so many years, there's so much story and belonging and emotional attachment and connection to things, to our stuff, and to the house and so and and then the physical doing. So I did that, I helped them move, came back to Tasmania and then had to downsize my partner sorry, move to aged care. My partner's mum and that journey's really hard when you've not navigated it before. You don't know what you don't know. That's like a f speaker-1: into the house and so and then the physical doing so I did that I helped them move came back to Tasmania and then had to downsize my partner sorry move to aged care my partner's mum and that journey's really hard when you've not navigated it before you don't know what you don't know that's like a favorite saying of mine and until you and you don't seek to learn or Eve: Hmm. Yeah. speaker-1: understand it until all of a sudden you need it and that's Sophie Ballagh: favourite saying of mine. And until speaker-1: you need it. And it's a hectic process and again, so now we're faced with trying to prepare her property for market because we've got to fund the aged care and the assets are tied up, the money's all tied up in the asset. Sophie Ballagh: you and and you don't seek to learn or understand it until all of a sudden you need it. And now you need it. And it's a hectic process. And and again, so now we now we're faced with trying to prepare her property for market because we've got a fund of the aged care and the assets all tied up, the the money's all tied up in the asset. speaker-1: And so these lived experiences and then a deceased estate, again sorting a lifetime of belongings while there's grief and emotion and you've got all the other responsibilities of being someone's power of attorney or being someone's executor. And then what we see is Ewan and I used to flip properties. So we'd look for the ugly duckling, the cheek one that had been there for a hundred days. Sophie Ballagh: and so these lived experiences and then a deceased estate, again, sort in a lifetime of belongings while there's grief and emotion and you've got a you know, all the other responsibilities of being someone's power of attorney or being someone's executor. And then what we see is y Ewan and I used to flip properties. speaker-1: my gosh. Sophie Ballagh: So we'd look for the ugly duckling, speaker-1: And then within a short time frame, so we went through a training course to flip this property and within six or 10 weeks, take it back to market, shining this beautiful, beautiful property. So then we put this flipping background with the lived experience and went, there is a better way. Eve: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: Because when we were going through these transitions, there was no one person that could help guide us through it. there's no one to take control of it all or manage it. You have to do it all yourself. All the people you need exist, but you've got to ring them. You've got to go to the property, let them in to get quotes. You've got to follow them up for their quotes. You've got to make sure the work's done. You've got to pay them as we go. They generally need paid. But yet all the money is generally tied up in that asset. That's a pretty common story for Australians. And we put the two together and thought there's a better way. So we know how to use the property as a tool. The business supports individuals and families in these tough transitions. It just so happens that we use the property to create uplift that more than funds that support they need, achieving their goals, emotional, physical and financial. And that's in essence what Harrington Road does. Eve: Yeah. like when you've actually lived that experience, you can see the gaps. why do you think s we've sometimes been taught that purpose and profit have to sit on opposite sides of the table? speaker-1: it's so good because it hits home for me because for a long time, and I guess honestly, probably still today, I work actively on a daily basis to try and bring them back together. But for years, and I think like Eve, you said for many people, we've been brought up to believe that profit and profoundly human and positive impact need to sit separately, but they can absolutely sit together. And more than that, I believe the more wealthy I get, the more positive impact I can even make. So without doing people wrong, you can still run a successful profitable business that is helping people without doing them wrong because you're making a profit. And then you can spiral and do even more great things, powerful things with money, with wealth. trying to change that paradigm, that limiting belief that we may have held for many years, it takes time to reprogram that and to reprogram it to a depth and a level that we truly embody and feel. And then it comes through in our actions. And that's exactly what Harrington Road is. Eve: Mm, yeah, I love that. so Sophie, what does living intentionally mean to you? speaker-1: Hmm. I think living intentionally, again I've harped on about it a lot, it starts with that awareness, but it's more around your operating system and coming back to what you said about your green wish, if everybody could pause and think before an action, before a decision, before a purchasing behaviour, whatever it might be, that to me is the fundamental of living intentionally, I guess another element to it. There's so many things that could fit in here, that alignment of your goals or your aspirations with your actions. You know, if we want something and want to achieve something, but we're not doing things, we're playing small or not building partnerships or networks, whatever it might be to help go this way, then we're not living intentionally. So it can be on so many different levels. There's awareness, there's alignment, what other things that start with A that I could come up with? Eve: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: Lots. Eve: Yeah. speaker-1: I guess choosing hard things on purpose, that's a part of it too. Eve: Yeah. speaker-1: Because often, like we talked about, the convenience of the world that we live in. But sometimes to align with what you want or to live intentionally, means you've got to choose the hard thing. It's so true and that ties back to a question you asked me earlier about what has been in the wilderness and adventuring meant for me. We can do hard things. We can do hard things physically. Our body can take way more than we give it credit We can do hard things emotionally and mentally. We've got so much more in our tank. you know, brain is a muscle. Just like we can work out a muscle, we can work on our brain and we can do hard things. Love that. Eve: Mm, absolutely. What's one area of your life you're trying to make more conscious choices? speaker-1: I've been very focused lately on bringing that intentionality and making conscious choices around inner thoughts, what I'm saying to myself, and making sure that those inner thoughts, what I'm saying to myself, are in alignment with where I want to go. Because if they're not, then I'm not going that direction if they're saying something else. That's something that I've been focusing on lately. Honestly, all this talk and the presentation I gave last week and this conversation, it's given me a kick up the bum and sometimes we need that to look at my own purchasing behaviour and actions. They slip, they don't always, you know, the negative impact bucket doesn't always get smaller, it sometimes gets bigger and so yeah, to take a look at that again. Eve: Mm-hmm. Yeah, absolutely. so if you could sit beside younger Sophie, what would you tell her? speaker-1: Go Sophie, go! Don't hold back. Yeah, truly. To think big, think real big. Younger Sophie, she was curious and she was wild and adventurous but she was still fairly televisioned I think, especially to now sitting here today with multiple businesses. I never. never dreamed or thought about that because it wasn't really in my environment or in my conversations and that's, you know, I'm so fortunate and grateful for my upbringing but I guess that never was incorporated in that so I never really thought about it. So to my younger self, Sophie, think big, real big, Eve: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: real big is what I would tell her. Eve: Love that. Love that. speaker-1: Hmm. Hmm. Eve: So what is one conscious choice you think that we could each make to give us a little more agency over the kind of life and the kind of world we're helping to create? speaker-1: Say that again Eve, so what's one thing I could say to help people get agency to shape the world we live in? Eve: Yeah, that yeah. What's one choice that they could make? speaker-1: I would say be vocal. That's something that I really try to encourage. If you feel strongly about something. whether it's a choice that you don't have in front of you is be vocal about it. It doesn't have to be in a rude or negative way because that conversation and that voice may ripple, it Eve: Mm. speaker-1: may spiral and who knows what comes from that. I truly believe our voice is very powerful in conversations and in what we say and where we say it how we say it. That will ultimately bring agency to us. like that option isn't there okay I'll take this one and sitting quiet on it I would say use your voice Eve: Yeah, I love that. Thank you so much for your time today. It's been a pleasure chatting. where can listeners find out more about you? speaker-1: socials. I have a website. You can reach out to me. I'd happily have conversations. And I thank you Eve for... not just the conversation today, but for this whole series and everything you're doing, using your voice, sharing your passion and encouraging others and bringing it, the collective, bring it together. I really, really appreciate it. Thank you. Eve: Thank you. Before we finish I'd love to leave you with one question. When did you last feel most like yourself? Not the version shaped by expectations, deadlines, or everyone else's opinions, but the real you. Maybe that's something worth sitting with this week. If today's conversation has resonated with you, please consider subscribing, leaving a review, or sharing the episode with someone who may need to hear it. Every share helps us reach more people and grow a community that's choosing to live with greater intention. Until next time, remember, take your power back, one conscious choice at a time. I'll see you in the next episode.