Latest / Corie Sheppard Podcast / I Thought Achievement Made Me Worthy | Veera Bhajan

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I Thought Achievement Made Me Worthy | Veera Bhajan · Corie Sheppard Podcast

0:00
SPEAKER_07: I I turned into like the two.
0:03
SPEAKER_07: I need to get this in because if I don't uh I could just be that go without asked you know?
0:09
Corie: In your mind.
0:10
Corie: Yeah, yeah.
0:15
SPEAKER_07: You're just gonna love your child.
0:18
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
0:18
SPEAKER_07: But uh there was no form of uh support.
0:24
SPEAKER_07: So those people might just be like, I wanna give you like ten dollars.
0:29
SPEAKER_07: Sorry, what I feel like I'm missing something else.
0:31
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I mean just a couple months ago too when I'm at the negotiation is like, I wanna give you just twenty dollars and you open it.
0:39
SPEAKER_07: I mean, even before that, I was already starting to do stuff with my feet.
0:42
SPEAKER_07: So I would pick up crayons and pencil and started colouring, attempting to write uh kids like peeking through my shirt, like way um kind of thing, like what's going on here.
0:53
Corie: And you're top 100 as well, yes?
0:55
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, like 84 something.
0:56
SPEAKER_07: Almost any kid.
0:59
SPEAKER_07: I don't feel like I had much of a view on it.
1:01
SPEAKER_07: Like my parents, they they weren't so I mean they didn't love it.
1:05
SPEAKER_07: I think sometime last year I was listening to it.
1:08
SPEAKER_07: Just I was with my friend, I was like, hey, you remember the song how we played it.
1:12
SPEAKER_07: I mean he has he has a style.
1:14
SPEAKER_00: That's for sure.
1:15
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
1:16
SPEAKER_07: Um but uh when you say, well, chop off someone's arms, like the person who I am, or the person who achieved X, Y, and Z or who became a speaker coach or attorney is more than just someone without arms.
1:35
SPEAKER_02: You are now applying to us on Cory Stephen.
1:40
SPEAKER_02: Step on Cory, step up podcast.
1:43
SPEAKER_01: Mommy, look on that through don't live with it.
1:46
SPEAKER_01: It's gonna be sexy.
1:52
Corie: Hi, before we get started, we wanted to take a moment to ask you to support the channel for free by liking, sharing, and subscribing.
2:00
Corie: Those are the three things that we realize you're not doing as much as you all say you're enjoying the conversation.
2:05
Corie: So please, we appreciate your support.
2:07
Corie: Let's get into today's conversation.
2:08
Corie: Welcome to the Corey Shepard Podcast.
2:10
Corie: My name is Corey Shepard.
2:11
Corie: Welcome back to everybody who's been listening.
2:12
Corie: Thank you for all the new people who are tuning in.
2:15
Corie: We have with us today trauma coach, attorney, and any other, right?
2:18
Corie: Trauma coach, attorney, yoga instructor too.
2:22
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
2:22
Corie: We have Vera Baja.
2:23
Corie: No, I want to tell the lady behind the scenes story, right?
2:25
Corie: The whole team behind they have their bread helps with that.
2:28
Corie: Doodle this, we can do this on every episode.
2:30
Corie: So we didn't do it, right?
2:32
Corie: We passed the test.
2:43
SPEAKER_08: I am good.
2:43
SPEAKER_08: I feel like I kick it out.
2:44
SPEAKER_08: No, no, no, not at all.
2:46
SPEAKER_08: Yeah.
2:46
Corie: How's everything?
2:47
SPEAKER_08: Good, great.
2:48
SPEAKER_08: Thank you so far, yes.
2:49
SPEAKER_08: Thank you so much.
2:51
Corie: Let me start dinner.
2:53
Corie: Who birthday party you went to?
2:54
Corie: That was a birthday party or something, yeah.
2:56
Corie: Who went to the past?
2:56
Corie: I think that's what it looked like on your stories.
2:59
Corie: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
3:01
Corie: I want to come next time.
3:03
SPEAKER_08: Tell us who's your friend.
3:04
SPEAKER_08: Sure, Taruna.
3:05
SPEAKER_08: What's her name?
3:06
SPEAKER_08: Taruna.
3:06
SPEAKER_08: Tell Taruna.
3:07
Corie: I want to be invited.
3:09
Corie: It looked like we had a good time.
3:10
SPEAKER_08: It was amazing.
3:11
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
3:11
SPEAKER_07: You'll have a good time for real.
3:13
Corie: Friends from long time out, school, friends on the gold.
3:15
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I'm at but I'm at her.
3:16
SPEAKER_07: No, when I started in private practice, she was there as well as an attorney, so we became friends.
3:22
SPEAKER_07: It's very sweet girl.
3:23
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
3:23
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
3:23
SPEAKER_07: So she was celebrating.
3:27
SPEAKER_07: I think I've kind of grown in phase of partying, but like when it's like a private party, like a coast friend, I really have a great time.
3:34
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
3:34
Corie: So most of the time you're inside, you're an inside person.
3:37
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
3:38
SPEAKER_07: I feel like I'm more indoors, maybe like more into like cafes and restaurants as opposed to.
3:43
SPEAKER_07: I think when I was younger, maybe like in my teens, like in my twenties, as I would spend a lot of times like outdoors, like partying.
3:51
SPEAKER_07: Uh but I feel like I'm in a different phase now with my life.
3:54
SPEAKER_07: I kind of outgrow that, yeah.
3:55
SPEAKER_02: In the inside.
3:58
SPEAKER_07: Noise and a lot of crowd and yeah, yeah.
4:01
Corie: Somewhat in your right place somewhat.
4:03
Corie: They always try to get me to be somewhere about is yeah, the people and the noise and things maybe just overstimulated.
4:09
Corie: I hear you're talking in another interview about being an empath as well.
4:13
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
4:13
SPEAKER_07: So I think that probably contributes as well.
4:16
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I love spending a lot of time at home.
4:18
SPEAKER_07: I work from home as well.
4:19
SPEAKER_07: I see.
4:20
SPEAKER_07: And I have been working from home for quite some time.
4:22
SPEAKER_00: I see.
4:23
SPEAKER_07: So, and court is virtual.
4:25
SPEAKER_00: Right.
4:25
SPEAKER_07: Um, unless I'm doing I even coach virtually.
4:28
SPEAKER_07: Most of my clients, I do virtual coaching because I I coach a lot of clients outside of Trinidad and Tobago.
4:33
SPEAKER_04: Right.
4:34
SPEAKER_07: So it's done via Zoom.
4:35
SPEAKER_07: So even coaching is done indoors.
4:37
SPEAKER_04: Nice.
4:38
SPEAKER_07: Um, unless I'm doing like speaking engagements, I would be outdoors.
4:40
SPEAKER_07: But outside of that, in terms of work, I spend a lot of time at home.
4:45
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
4:45
Corie: So most of your time working now is on what?
4:47
Corie: Because you are real jobs, you know, when they send me the bio as if you're doing everything.
4:51
Corie: What where most of your time spent?
4:53
SPEAKER_07: Uh, I think it's uh well, well, full time.
4:56
SPEAKER_07: I'm at Equal Opportunities Tribunal.
4:58
SPEAKER_07: So I'm there full time.
5:00
SPEAKER_07: Um, I serve there as a liaison.
5:02
SPEAKER_04: Right.
5:02
SPEAKER_07: So that's my full eight to four.
5:05
SPEAKER_02: Right.
5:05
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
5:06
SPEAKER_07: And then um part-time, like on evenings, I teach yoga.
5:10
SPEAKER_07: So I have a yoga studio uh in central.
5:13
SPEAKER_04: Right.
5:14
SPEAKER_07: Uh so four days per week I would teach yoga.
5:16
SPEAKER_07: I have four classes running per week.
5:18
SPEAKER_07: Um, and then I would do like one-off, maybe uh like retreats, yoga retreats, wellness retreats that happens.
5:24
SPEAKER_07: I have like a monthly offering each month, and then I may do like quarterly retreats and so on.
5:29
SPEAKER_04: Right.
5:30
SPEAKER_07: And then coach and but coach and happens part-time as well, like on weekends or evening times.
5:34
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
5:35
Corie: So you're rest?
5:36
Corie: What about because this song is like a lot, like there's a pack schedule.
5:39
SPEAKER_07: Um, no, I yeah, I I have time to rest.
5:43
SPEAKER_07: I I prioritized rest.
5:44
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
5:45
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I I love, I love sleeping, so I I get my full eight hours.
5:48
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
5:49
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I I need that.
5:50
SPEAKER_07: So yeah, I don't really play much with with rest and sleep because it's important to rent.
5:55
Corie: Gotcha, gotcha, gotcha.
5:57
Corie: And the coaching part, the coaching part, you said it's virtual, you do it online, and you said trauma coaching, right?
6:02
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yes.
6:03
Corie: How come trauma coaching?
6:04
SPEAKER_07: Uh, I think my own uh personal journey, like my own healing journey, sort of took me there very naturally.
6:12
SPEAKER_04: Right.
6:12
SPEAKER_07: It's not something so like as a child, I always had this dream of being an attorney.
6:16
SPEAKER_07: Like that was my my thing.
6:18
SPEAKER_07: Like just uh being able to be in court and and be uh uh in the justice system.
6:28
SPEAKER_07: That was like basically my dream from a very young child.
6:32
SPEAKER_07: I think over time, like specifically with coaching and yoga and stuff, that was not so much uh a dream or something that I intentionally had in mind.
6:42
SPEAKER_07: It sort of unfolded very naturally, I think, based on how my life itself and my own journey started unfolding, particularly in my early 30s.
6:52
SPEAKER_07: So I think because I devoted a lot of time in my titties towards my own growth and healing my own traumas from childhood.
7:00
SPEAKER_07: Uh naturally I started, well, I first started with yoga because I had such a love for yoga.
7:06
SPEAKER_07: Um and just practicing yoga, I wanted to learn so much more about it.
7:10
SPEAKER_07: So I did the training, not with even with the intention of teaching at all.
7:13
SPEAKER_04: Just for yourself?
7:14
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, just for myself.
7:15
SPEAKER_07: And then I was like, maybe I had part of the training involved like practicing on others.
7:20
SPEAKER_07: So I would practice with my family, like, hey, you all wanna just come to the house.
7:24
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
7:24
SPEAKER_07: So they was like, y'all wanna just come to my class?
7:26
SPEAKER_07: And then they started like being so uh amazed by how well they like the benefit of the class itself, and they was like, you, this is something they feel like I could do.
7:36
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
7:36
SPEAKER_07: So that's when I built the studio, and then from there I started uh coaching.
7:41
SPEAKER_07: Well, of course I became certified, so I spent like a two-year just in training and becoming certified.
7:47
Corie: And it's not a share and brand kind of coaching and thing, just ignore that part, right?
7:52
SPEAKER_07: No, it's more, so it's more, yeah, it's more uh so I'm a certified transformative coach, and then I also certified and more trauma coaching.
8:00
SPEAKER_07: So it really, it really kind of works, it's it's very different from life coaching in that we I work with clients on a much deeper level.
8:08
SPEAKER_07: Like we look at your patterns, we look at what you um, your responses to life, we look at how you respond to yourself, how you view yourself, how you view life.
8:16
SPEAKER_07: So it's almost like we're taking the attention inward.
8:19
SPEAKER_07: Um, so the transformation starts happening within yourself, and then very naturally things outside of you start to shift.
8:27
SPEAKER_07: Because things within you know, yes, correct.
8:31
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
8:31
Corie: So that's where they're maybe selfish questions because I have a team of people here, we wouldn't call names, right?
8:37
Corie: But when I finish here and I'm exhausted after every interview, they say, What are you tired doing?
8:41
Corie: You're not talking.
8:42
Corie: So I learned the word empath really later in life, right?
8:44
Corie: And I start to realize, well, wait, that might be what's happened to me.
8:47
Corie: Because when when people talk, you know, people share and something.
8:49
SPEAKER_08: Of course, yeah.
8:49
Corie: I go to the places they're talking about.
8:51
Corie: So it feels like when you talk to people who well traveled, it's the most exhausting episode.
8:54
Corie: I feel like I travel the world while we talk.
8:56
Corie: Yeah.
8:56
Corie: So I wonder for you as an empath with trauma coaching, do you take on some of the things that people talking about in the sessions?
9:04
SPEAKER_07: Uh surprisingly, no, I don't.
9:05
SPEAKER_07: I think before I became certified, so as a even like as a child, as a teenager in my 20s, I just had this very natural listening ability.
9:16
SPEAKER_07: So I found like people would uh I'm like in my family, I'm the person, I'm like the go-to person.
9:22
SPEAKER_07: You know, the person you would come to um to share something.
9:26
SPEAKER_07: There was a sense of comfort and safety that I think people naturally felt with me.
9:29
SPEAKER_07: Um, I think I I would say like in the past, I would absorb it.
9:34
SPEAKER_05: Right.
9:35
SPEAKER_07: I would have for sure.
9:36
SPEAKER_07: Now it's very different because when I sit with someone, it's like I see this person as whole, as resourceful, not as broken, as someone committed to their own growth, as someone having their own journey.
9:49
SPEAKER_07: So they are sitting before me, they are in their own, walking their own path.
9:52
SPEAKER_07: I am my role is not so much to take on what they are experiencing or absorb it, but to really walk alongside them as they move through their challenges and their experiences.
10:04
SPEAKER_07: So I'm able to separate myself in that sense.
10:06
SPEAKER_07: So that my role is not to fix you or to change you.
10:11
SPEAKER_07: That's your job.
10:12
SPEAKER_07: I'm simply asking you the right questions and guiding you as you take on that part yourself.
10:18
SPEAKER_07: So it's a bit different in that sense.
10:19
SPEAKER_04: I understand.
10:20
SPEAKER_07: Because I think in the past I took on that role, even like from childhood, um, like with my own parents, and just taking on this role of having to be the one that fixes things at the groom, which is I think a lot of us as adults we would have grown up, like taking on the challenges of our parents, um, just believing that we our purpose is to help and fix and take and care for in a way that it leads more to like abandoning ourselves as well.
10:48
SPEAKER_07: So it I think as a coach or as a professional, um, my perspective on that has changed a lot.
10:54
SPEAKER_07: So it's not so much absorbing, but it is an exchange of energy.
10:58
SPEAKER_07: Like you and I speaking right now, we're exchanging energy.
11:00
SPEAKER_07: It's two energies showing up, and we uh we are exchanging, like you, I'm speaking, you are listening, and then then we exchange.
11:07
SPEAKER_07: So it is a form of energy exchange, but I've learned like how to separate that.
11:12
Corie: Gotcha.
11:12
Corie: Yeah.
11:13
Corie: I remember the first time, and I don't know if it's a male thing, but going to a therapy session, I know it's a little different to coaching, but it's the closest parallel I could draw because sometimes I'm struggling with all different things in life, right?
11:23
Corie: And now I have to go and tell a stranger.
11:25
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
11:26
Corie: Here was the scene.
11:27
Corie: I struggle with things I've not told anybody else in my life in any other space.
11:31
Corie: And I just remember, well, the session lasts about five minutes, right?
11:35
Corie: It's supposed to be an hour.
11:36
Corie: Because I say, Here okay, though, I was at a car parking.
11:39
Corie: Um Pizza Hart and Shogunus is in that plaza where we're moving.
11:43
Corie: Price Plaza.
11:44
SPEAKER_04: Price Plaza.
11:45
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
11:45
Corie: And I park up under there and I just decide I go on my phone as virtual as well.
11:49
Corie: And for the five minutes that I had, I just blitz out everything that I hang up the phone.
11:53
Corie: I say, all right, next week for you.
11:55
Corie: But did find it really, really interesting that when I went back to the session the next time, like she remembered.
12:02
SPEAKER_07: Of course.
12:03
Corie: Yeah, because you're you're all good.
12:04
Corie: That's part of the situation.
12:05
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I would remember something you said in a we'll be 10 sessions in and remember what you say.
12:10
SPEAKER_07: Of course, of course.
12:12
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
12:16
SPEAKER_07: And then you pick up on the things that that um you you think is most important that you need to remember.
12:22
SPEAKER_04: Right.
12:22
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I think especially for, I mean, as you as you mentioned, man, I I think sometimes, but but generally, not just men, I think people only who will have this sort of stigma around therapy or sharing themselves, or is really around being vulnerable, right?
12:36
SPEAKER_07: Because you're being vulnerable.
12:37
SPEAKER_07: That's right, that's right.
12:38
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, because many people call my sessions, so it feels a lot like therapy because you're actually expressing your innermost self.
12:44
SPEAKER_07: Things, as you said, things you have not shared.
12:46
SPEAKER_07: And many times their clients would say to me, like, this is the first time I'm actually able to say this out loud to someone.
12:51
SPEAKER_07: Sometimes they're not even able to say it out loud, they might have to write it down.
12:54
SPEAKER_04: Oh.
12:55
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
12:55
SPEAKER_01: I should have talked to that.
12:56
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, you shouldn't have to show you.
12:57
SPEAKER_07: Yes, yes, yes, yeah.
12:59
SPEAKER_07: Because sometimes when they aren't able to say it out loud, I would say, Well, can you write it?
13:02
SPEAKER_07: Like, can you can you write it out?
13:03
SPEAKER_07: You can write, like I would have, like they could text me or they could type it out.
13:08
SPEAKER_07: Um, so yeah, because I think for a lot of us, we we never have that space where where we could show up as ourselves and show up um with our emotions, even as children, and have that be held very safely and and in a way that feels connected and safe.
13:24
SPEAKER_07: So when you sit in a room with someone, it may very well be the first time that you're actually.
13:30
Corie: I would say, especially as children, because if you never had this space as a child, yeah, yeah.
13:34
Corie: Something I work through a lot in therapy.
13:36
Corie: So I went to what I know in the end to be trauma coaching, right?
13:40
Corie: Yeah, I didn't understand because it's better help as the app, right?
13:43
Corie: And I would go on to the app and I have the therapist.
13:45
Corie: So I do that for some years on stuff.
13:46
Corie: Then you need to deal with David Way, so you gotta go to therapy and so on when you've done it.
13:50
Corie: But um there was one time I'd I talk about it here.
13:53
Corie: We have a sister who was in an accident, right?
13:55
Corie: And it was tough, you know.
13:56
Corie: That was chaotic.
13:57
Corie: I I'm not sure what to make of this, you know, sleeping in and eating and stuff, and I say, you know what, I need to start back therapy.
14:02
Corie: But in my mind, it's going to go the way the initial sessions went.
14:06
SPEAKER_08: Right.
14:06
Corie: So I see this little white lady, I'm a partner now, but boy, listen.
14:10
Corie: And I remember talking for an hour because now I'm accustomed to it, it's a stranger, but I did with it.
14:15
Corie: And she never said anything, she never said much.
14:18
Corie: She thing and she said, Laura, see you next week, and she checked in at the next.
14:21
Corie: And I find after three weeks, I said, but this woman is telling me nothing.
14:23
Corie: Yeah.
14:24
Corie: I'm trying to tell me what to do with my sister.
14:26
Corie: Yes.
14:26
Corie: Is it a lot like that?
14:27
Corie: Is it more listening than Yeah, it is.
14:30
SPEAKER_07: It is.
14:31
SPEAKER_07: Because I I think so.
14:32
SPEAKER_07: I I do feel like sometimes clients are kind of like, but can you tell me what to do?
14:37
SPEAKER_07: But I I think a real uh therapist or coach, um how's it?
14:43
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, they wouldn't so much give you the answers, but they sort of guide you so that you could find the answers within yourself.
14:49
SPEAKER_07: Because they are there.
14:50
SPEAKER_07: Like you have the wisdom, you have the intelligence in your, not just in your mind, but in your in your body, like in your own spirit, that you you have the answers that you need.
15:00
SPEAKER_07: You simply need someone to guide you and take you.
15:03
SPEAKER_07: There's sometimes a therapist.
15:04
SPEAKER_07: Like for me, I might say like three lines in an hour.
15:07
SPEAKER_07: And that's something that would stay with the client.
15:09
SPEAKER_07: Like they would text me years late, like months later, and be like, hey, I remember when you said that one line, adapt me variable, you'll be the one thing that I said for the entire hour.
15:16
Corie: Yeah, just to unlock something or something.
15:18
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, but um I think it's more not so much giving the answers, but just awakening a personally the possibility that they can find it within themselves.
15:26
Corie: I understand.
15:27
Corie: Yeah.
15:27
Corie: And where do clients come from?
15:28
Corie: How do you always get clients in this line of work?
15:31
SPEAKER_07: Uh I think interestingly, like I've access to my clients, especially outside of Trinidad, because like, how are you all?
15:37
Corie: Oh, it's not just local.
15:38
SPEAKER_07: No, no, I have like clients from like Australia, the states, um, Europe.
15:43
SPEAKER_07: And I think they mostly found me through Instagram, Facebook, through my website, reach out to me through my website.
15:48
SPEAKER_07: And um, yeah, it's been going great.
15:51
SPEAKER_07: I love it.
15:51
SPEAKER_07: I love it.
15:52
SPEAKER_07: I love it.
15:52
SPEAKER_07: I enjoy it.
15:53
SPEAKER_07: I love it.
15:54
SPEAKER_07: It's there, there is, I feel like there is no greater honor in my life.
15:58
SPEAKER_07: Um putting aside like certificates and degrees and you know, like law degrees and masters and all these things.
16:06
SPEAKER_07: I feel like my greatest honor is just being able to sit with someone like in their pain and sit with someone in their in their hurt, um, in their shame, in their anger, and just be that space where where they they can they can feel comfortable and safe enough to express and be with themselves in a way that they never had in their entire lives, and just watch the way their their life um and their energy begins to shift over time.
16:40
SPEAKER_07: Uh, I think that is like one of the I feel like I feel very called to do that.
16:44
SPEAKER_07: I feel like it's something beyond just me or who I believe I am.
16:51
SPEAKER_07: I feel like there is a calling that is much deeper than that.
16:54
SPEAKER_07: Um, even for speaking as well.
16:55
SPEAKER_07: Like I enjoy being a speaker.
16:57
SPEAKER_07: Really?
16:57
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
16:58
SPEAKER_07: So I recently started doing a lot more speaking engagements, um, just showing up and sharing my story, sharing my challenges.
17:05
SPEAKER_07: Um and for many different audiences, uh that's something that lately I feel um very honored and called to do as well.
17:15
Corie: Yeah, even though that wasn't initially.
17:17
SPEAKER_07: No, no, no, yeah.
17:18
SPEAKER_07: But I think for years being an attorney, I felt like there was this um how to say, like there was this nagging feeling inside of me.
17:29
SPEAKER_07: Like there was, you're like, you know, when you feel like there might be more to your life than than what you're actually living?
17:34
SPEAKER_07: Like there may be more to your to what you can actually do or achieve or or more or serve.
17:40
SPEAKER_04: Of course.
17:41
SPEAKER_07: And um, I couldn't quite find what that was.
17:44
SPEAKER_07: Um, so there was this longing, this sort of emptiness that I was feeling, but yeah, I I couldn't figure it out, at least intellectually, what that might be.
17:52
Corie: Gotcha.
17:53
SPEAKER_07: But I think life kind of naturally took me there.
17:57
Corie: I understand.
17:58
Corie: And you spoke about all these certificates and things.
18:00
Corie: I want to get into that, right?
18:00
Corie: Because you accomplished a lot in the book will.
18:03
Corie: But in terms of motivational speakers, well, first I'd ask you if everybody was like me.
18:07
Corie: How much people is like say, hi, does it happen often or is it just me?
18:10
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, no, no, it happens.
18:11
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
18:12
SPEAKER_07: It happens even with my own friends, and yeah, like sometimes they kind of forget, like, oh wait, you do have arms, like after it's done.
18:18
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
18:19
SPEAKER_07: But um, yeah, I think I think I guess it's just like a natural people just you, you know, operate very in autopilot, so it's a natural thing to just say, yeah.
18:29
Corie: Um so don't it's bother you or you're just used to it?
18:32
SPEAKER_07: No, I'm just I'm just used to it.
18:33
SPEAKER_07: I feel like as a child, of course, like I even growing up, I was subjected to a lot of stares, and it's just something that I guess I've learned to to kind of work with and accept.
18:46
SPEAKER_07: Um now it's it's it's actually a lot more intense, I would say.
18:52
SPEAKER_07: So yeah, like not in terms of like people shaking my hand or hinting, well, not my hand, but but in terms of like the stairs or people approaching me.
19:01
SPEAKER_07: Um, but it's not from a place of like it's from a good place, you know, from a place of respect and a place of like they are inspired and um they just wanted to say hello, but but it happens a lot.
19:12
SPEAKER_07: Like I I feel like it's difficult to step out of my house and just not have to like you know interact with people and just yeah, but I I've gotten I've gotten used to it.
19:22
Corie: But it doesn't seem like you're enjoying that part too much because the the interaction.
19:25
Corie: Like when people wanted to come because that I I suppose that you have been um public in a lot of ways over the years.
19:31
Corie: So people happy to meet you, I suppose.
19:34
Corie: Yeah, they uh I guess your mood is always not always.
19:37
Corie: Well, I mean a human, right?
19:38
Corie: Yeah, a human, right?
19:39
SPEAKER_07: So not every, not always you'd be in that mood to be like, yeah, but I have to be because I I don't because I I know for sure when people meet me, it's like a a wonderful moment for them.
19:51
SPEAKER_07: And you know, you don't wanna you don't wanna be like um showing up in a way that people feel like they're they're being dismissed in any ways.
19:58
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
19:58
SPEAKER_07: So um I'm fine with it.
20:00
SPEAKER_07: I actually enjoy it a lot more now than I did, but I think that's because mentally I was probably in a different place, like in my 20s and stuff.
20:07
SPEAKER_07: And I also saw myself differently.
20:09
SPEAKER_07: So if you came up to me and be like, oh, I'm so inspired, but yeah, I'd be like, inspired by what?
20:14
SPEAKER_07: Like, what do you even mean?
20:15
SPEAKER_07: But now I'm beginning to have a deeper sense of appreciation of like what I um represent or how I've impacted people just based on their responses to me.
20:27
SPEAKER_07: That's not something I was able to see before acknowledge.
20:30
Corie: Yeah, life is life, you know.
20:32
Corie: I always remember I was in a meeting with a guy very inspirational to me, a fellow named Calvin Bijou.
20:37
Corie: He was uh marketing at RBC at one point in time.
20:40
Corie: And I remember Calvin talking about he might have been in his 50s when I was in my 20s, 30s.
20:45
Corie: I hope I agree in Calvin too much, but I always remember him talking about being this boy growing up in St.
20:50
Corie: James and not almost in disbelief of how much he's accomplished.
20:54
Corie: Right.
20:54
Corie: And I remember in my 20s thinking, well, that was arrogant.
20:57
Corie: You know, I remember thinking like I would never see myself as that.
21:00
Corie: But yeah, boy, when time passes, uh enough time passes and you start to look back at it, sometimes you see you could see maybe what other people see and saying.
21:07
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah, but that took me a long time to to see that.
21:10
SPEAKER_07: But I and I always used to like call that humility like, oh, I'm humble, I it's no, it's no big deal, like yeah, I'm doing just what anybody would do if they didn't have arms.
21:19
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, but I think when I even when I started therapy too, like just being able to acknowledge the way I like I don't see myself at all.
21:26
SPEAKER_07: Like, like I was so disconnected from who I was um that I didn't have the capacity to even witness like where I've come from and who I am now.
21:36
SPEAKER_07: And you know, just recently, just yesterday, I was at um I spoke at Princess Elizabeth Center, which is a school for special gatering.
21:43
SPEAKER_07: Uh and when I was five years old, I started, I started basically my education there.
21:50
SPEAKER_07: Um my parents had attempted to get me enrolled into like a regular preschool, and I was rejected basically because they said, well, they um basically disabled.
22:00
SPEAKER_07: So they don't know how to do that.
22:01
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, they don't know how to.
22:02
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
22:02
SPEAKER_07: Um, so I went there for like three months, and that's where I started like really.
22:07
SPEAKER_07: I mean, even before that, I was already starting to do stuff with my feet.
22:11
SPEAKER_07: So I would pick up crayons and pencils.
22:13
SPEAKER_07: I started colouring, attempting to write.
22:15
Corie: Uh, it was just you say this happened instinctually, right?
22:17
Corie: So for those who don't know, you were born without arms, so you just naturally tended towards it.
22:21
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, it just came very natural, which which just shows like the ability and like how amazing the human body is that we tend to take for granted.
22:29
SPEAKER_07: Of course.
22:29
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
22:30
SPEAKER_07: Um, so that just started to happen very naturally.
22:32
SPEAKER_07: But then the three months that I spent there was when I really started acquiring the skill of using my tools, like for eating and just every regular daily activities.
22:41
Corie: Like, and the help of the people are the institution.
22:43
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
22:44
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
22:44
SPEAKER_07: But um, but when I went back there yesterday, like it was just it just felt just walking through the hallways and just going back to my old classroom.
22:53
SPEAKER_07: I met one of my old teachers, but just acknowledging like my five-year-old self would have never imagined that I would be back there years later, you know, um as who I am now.
23:05
SPEAKER_07: Like it, it, it was such a yeah, it was such an emotional experience because I there's no way like I would have, because at five, I was just in such a different place.
23:15
SPEAKER_07: Like I just remember being there, just being so unhappy and in such a a lonely, dark place.
23:21
SPEAKER_07: And it had nothing to do with the institution itself.
23:23
SPEAKER_07: Like they were amazing.
23:25
SPEAKER_07: But it's just not knowing or just not understanding like what is good, like why am I like this?
23:32
Corie: Like, so you had this sense of normal school versus schools for people with disabilities.
23:37
Corie: Yeah, you had that sense as a child?
23:39
SPEAKER_07: Um, well, I know I was really excited to start school.
23:42
SPEAKER_07: So I was dressed and ready to start school, and then I had I was turned away.
23:46
Corie: Oh, I see.
23:46
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, so my cousins and I, we were going to we were around the same age, so we were all going to school on the first day.
23:51
Corie: And I guess home is just you all, it's just a group, it's just your family.
23:55
Corie: There's no separation.
23:56
SPEAKER_07: But it's all right.
23:57
SPEAKER_07: And then, well, I was told that well, we can't have you here.
24:01
SPEAKER_07: So um, that's when I started at Princess Elizabeth.
24:06
SPEAKER_07: But I only spent three months here because then they were like, Well, we don't want you here either.
24:10
SPEAKER_07: Because you we feel like you should be in a regular school.
24:13
SPEAKER_07: We should be like you should be in a mainstream school.
24:15
SPEAKER_07: We feel like you are being kept back.
24:17
SPEAKER_02: Cognitively then.
24:18
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, so I had one school saying, like, uh, we can't have you, then I had another school saying, Oh, we can't have you either.
24:23
Corie: Oh, wait, Princess Elizabeth thing has like a plus or you read another rejection too anytime because you did three months.
24:29
SPEAKER_07: No, no, no, I think I was excited.
24:31
SPEAKER_07: I think I was happy because I wanted to.
24:34
SPEAKER_07: No, and of course.
24:37
SPEAKER_07: Oh gosh, no, but I was um, yeah, I think I I was excited, and that's when I started um primary school, Felicity Hindu School.
24:45
SPEAKER_04: Right.
24:45
SPEAKER_07: So they decided they'll just skip me for like three months until see how it was.
24:50
SPEAKER_07: Like I said, a trial period, I guess.
24:52
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
24:52
SPEAKER_07: And I was like, not again.
24:55
SPEAKER_07: But um, this time it worked out, yeah.
24:58
SPEAKER_07: This time it worked out, I was well behaved.
25:02
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, so they um I spent, well, until I was 10, I wrote common entrance at 10.
25:07
Corie: Right.
25:07
Corie: But how much of an adjustment was it when you went to the school?
25:10
Corie: Because one of the, like I had Glenn Niles here, right, who advocates on behalf of people with differently saying.
25:16
Corie: And he speaks a lot about the fact that we don't necessarily build buildings that are accessible.
25:20
Corie: We don't train the people who are responsible for our children to deal with people who need accessibility.
25:25
Corie: So was it was it a big shift?
25:27
SPEAKER_07: You mean when I shifted to the regular primary school?
25:29
Corie: Yeah.
25:30
SPEAKER_07: Um, not particularly uh for me in terms of like how I operate in a classroom or even an office, uh, as long as so I have to use my legs.
25:39
SPEAKER_07: So as long as I have a desk that's like sort of matches the the height of the chair.
25:44
unknown: Okay.
25:44
SPEAKER_07: Like, for example, it'd be difficult for me to write on this table because it's higher than the chair, right?
25:48
SPEAKER_07: But but yeah, it's just really like a lower desk.
25:52
SPEAKER_07: Outside of that, like by the time I started school, I was able to like feed myself so I could eat my own lunch.
25:57
SPEAKER_05: Right.
25:57
SPEAKER_07: But I I I was so blessed.
25:59
SPEAKER_07: Like my teacher, she literally took me on as her own child.
26:02
SPEAKER_07: Like she like she was amazing.
26:05
SPEAKER_07: Like up to this day, like two weeks ago, I met her, and she was like, Oh, yeah, it's just she was just so such a lovely soul.
26:12
SPEAKER_07: And I live close to home as well.
26:14
SPEAKER_07: So um, like sometimes my parents would check on me.
26:18
SPEAKER_04: People know you.
26:18
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
26:19
SPEAKER_07: It's it's like walking distance from home.
26:21
SPEAKER_07: So everyone, like, and then my cousins were also there.
26:24
SPEAKER_07: My sister, who is two years ahead of me, she was also in the school.
26:27
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, so I had a lot of family.
26:29
SPEAKER_07: Even when I went to SAGs, my sister was there.
26:31
SPEAKER_07: When my sister left, my cousin came into the school.
26:33
SPEAKER_07: So I always had, and then I built really close friendships in SAGS as well.
26:37
SPEAKER_07: So if I needed assistance in any way, um, you know, I had my friends there and I had lovely teachers as well.
26:43
SPEAKER_07: So I think throughout my education system, I was always blessed in that regard.
26:48
Corie: Um was it a mean place?
26:50
Corie: Like school could be mean, you know, primary school in particular.
26:52
Corie: Was it a mean place like people teasing and things like that?
26:55
Corie: So you didn't even go into much, you know?
26:57
SPEAKER_07: Uh I think when I first started, yeah, there may be kids like peeking through my shirt, like, where your arms kind of thing, like what's going on here?
27:06
SPEAKER_07: And I just kind of like, well, I don't, I also don't know.
27:10
SPEAKER_06: Like I also don't know when my answer is like what?
27:14
SPEAKER_06: Like what do you mean?
27:16
SPEAKER_06: Like, I'm trying to figure out what to dude.
27:23
SPEAKER_07: But um outside of that, I can't say like I faced uh you know, like bullying.
27:29
SPEAKER_07: I I think the most it would be it is not expressed.
27:32
SPEAKER_07: Oh yeah.
27:32
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, that's not yeah, it's not um expressed.
27:37
SPEAKER_07: I I would say simply, like with steers, mostly staring.
27:40
SPEAKER_04: Right.
27:41
SPEAKER_07: Mostly I wouldn't say like I had moments where because like we don't want to play with you kind of thing.
27:46
SPEAKER_07: Um yeah, I had friends.
27:49
SPEAKER_07: I it was lovely.
27:50
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, it was a nice experience.
27:52
SPEAKER_07: I think I struggled more in adulthood.
27:55
SPEAKER_06: Yeah, believe it or not, believe it, which is insane.
27:58
Corie: If you're a business organization or brand looking to reach an engaged and growing audience, the Corey Shepherd Podcast offers opportunities to sponsor, partner, and advertise.
28:07
Corie: You could check out the email address in our YouTube description or via the link in our bio on Instagram.
28:14
Corie: We need the money.
28:16
Corie: Like uh Max and House, you remember that?
28:19
Corie: It's funny you say that in adulthood, right?
28:21
Corie: Because I saw you say in an interview that people stare but they don't see you.
28:26
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
28:26
Corie: That's that's how you feel.
28:27
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, well, I I I I feel like now because I'm showing up differently, like on social media, or even right now with you, um, I'm sharing parts of myself or my life that I probably didn't share before.
28:41
SPEAKER_07: So I think what people knew before was this is an armless girl, she wrote exams, she writes with her feet, and she became an attorney.
28:47
SPEAKER_07: Um, this is great.
28:50
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
28:51
SPEAKER_07: So I feel like a lot of times when people, but even now as well, when people look at me, what they might see is someone harmless.
29:01
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I've learned that people would see you or meet you based on their capacity to see and meet.
29:09
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
29:10
SPEAKER_07: I can't expect someone to see me on a deeper level, especially if they have not met themselves or see themselves on a deep level.
29:18
SPEAKER_07: Correct, yeah, yeah.
29:19
SPEAKER_07: Even sometimes I meet people and they have so much, like they would look at me with pity.
29:24
SPEAKER_07: Um, I think that like in the past that would bother me a lot.
29:28
SPEAKER_07: Like sometimes people might just be like, hey, like I want to give you like$10.
29:32
SPEAKER_07: I want to give you like$10.
29:33
SPEAKER_07: Sorry, but I feel like I'm missing something.
29:35
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I mean, just happened a couple months ago, someone I'm at Tony Gosh and he's like, I want to give you this$20.
29:40
Corie: And you open 20.
29:44
SPEAKER_07: Um no, but interesting enough, you know.
29:46
SPEAKER_07: I think it passed I would have been like, no, I don't like no, it's okay.
29:50
SPEAKER_07: I I don't I don't need it.
29:51
SPEAKER_07: Um I actually I accepted it.
29:54
SPEAKER_07: I accepted it.
29:55
SPEAKER_07: Don't let me tell you why.
29:58
SPEAKER_07: I accepted it because I felt like it brought him so much joy.
30:02
SPEAKER_07: I see.
30:02
SPEAKER_07: And I'm like, why would I take this away from this person because of my own ego?
30:07
SPEAKER_07: Because I'm like, I don't need$20.
30:09
SPEAKER_07: Like, oh my god, like it's it was just I saw it as a kind gesture.
30:13
SPEAKER_07: I don't need it, genuinely, I don't.
30:15
SPEAKER_07: But and my mom was there too, and I said, and she was also uncomfortable because people did that to us a lot like when I was younger.
30:21
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I was like, you know what, yes, thank you.
30:24
SPEAKER_07: And I accepted it, and he was just so he was overjoyed.
30:29
Corie: You know, it's funny he remembers well.
30:30
Corie: At the time, I used to work TST on Park Street, and it's very so similar, I remember.
30:34
Corie: Very old fellow.
30:36
Corie: His whole phone bill could have been$45.
30:39
Corie: Yeah.
30:40
Corie: And he fighting up to pay this$45.
30:42
Corie: I always remember, you know, I mean, I'm young and no going Yu E and thing, I alright, you know?
30:46
Corie: And I always remember him wanting to give me like$10 when he does.
30:49
SPEAKER_00: And I used to say, No, why would you give me?
30:52
Corie: But but I understand what you mean.
30:53
Corie: And I always remember him saying to me one time, he said, he's see me as a child.
30:57
Corie: He says, son, don't ever refuse your blessings.
31:00
Corie: Of course.
31:01
Corie: And it's it stuck with me.
31:02
Corie: That's staying with me over the years.
31:04
Corie: Yeah, yeah.
31:05
SPEAKER_07: So I think my perspective changed over time.
31:07
Corie: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
31:08
Corie: So you're navigating that primary school.
31:10
Corie: I remember you came to uh national fame when they say we're a badger, and like everybody know these stories.
31:15
Corie: I always wondered what that was like for you because you have achieved a lot, and you've had you've achieved a lot for somebody who had no limitations or any limitations, or all limitations a lot is something you could be proud of.
31:29
Corie: But at 10, 11 years old, I get the sense from you that even in your school experience, as far as you're concerned, you're just you are one of the children and you've done well in common interests.
31:38
Corie: Was that how you were feeling?
31:39
SPEAKER_07: Or you yeah, yeah, yeah.
31:41
SPEAKER_07: It really was not any, I guess, a big deal, so to speak.
31:46
SPEAKER_07: Um yeah, I was just I was just carrying on, doing what I needed to do.
31:51
SPEAKER_07: Um but I did notice as like as a child, um maybe like when I started primary school, uh, I felt like there was this sense of and this is a bit my parents shared as well, like there was a sense of ease that they didn't feel from probably since put uh up until I started school.
32:15
SPEAKER_07: A sense of uh a relief, I guess, or a sense of ease that like I I could be okay because um, you know, I could function well.
32:24
SPEAKER_07: Uh so I I I sort of took that on to mean, and as children we absorb things, right?
32:30
SPEAKER_07: So I took that on to mean that I I am valued or I I others would find value in me based on how well I do with school, how much I achieve.
32:42
SPEAKER_07: I I turned into like the over high achiever.
32:45
SPEAKER_07: I need to get this A.
32:47
SPEAKER_07: I yeah, because if I don't, I could just be that girl without arms, you know?
32:52
SPEAKER_04: In your mind.
32:53
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
32:54
SPEAKER_07: Um which is I don't think it's something peculiar to me.
32:57
SPEAKER_07: I think I think a lot of children feel very loved and accepted and validated when they bring home an A as opposed to so they learn that if I if I achieve well, I I could keep connection with my parent.
33:08
SPEAKER_07: I could continue to be loved by my parent, I would be seen by my parent.
33:11
SPEAKER_07: Um and that's why we we now grow up as adults and we're all very high functioning and we we're achieving the most and we co-op climbing the corporate ladder.
33:20
Corie: But still trying to make mummy and daddy broke it.
33:22
SPEAKER_07: Yes, yes, yes.
33:23
SPEAKER_07: Which I I think I it's really until my late 30s when I started my own like healing, then I realized how much of my life was just so performative.
33:34
SPEAKER_07: Like it was not the truth of who I was.
33:37
SPEAKER_07: Like now, like my path has shifted so much.
33:40
SPEAKER_07: Like I just want an easy life.
33:42
SPEAKER_07: Like I'm not into this time in this corporate ladder, this rat race.
33:46
SPEAKER_07: Like, pull me out of this rat race, please, please pull me out, save me.
33:50
SPEAKER_02: We need same boats.
33:52
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, like I just wanted to wake up and feel at ease and and just take, just just have a day that I'm fully in control of.
34:00
SPEAKER_07: And um, yeah, this hustle culture.
34:03
SPEAKER_07: I think we've we've been sold a hustle culture.
34:06
SPEAKER_07: Like, if we're not hustling, we we're not doing okay.
34:08
SPEAKER_07: Of course.
34:08
SPEAKER_07: We will not, yeah, we're not, if we're not achieving well, what you're really doing.
34:13
Corie: Yeah, like I'm saying, like if you're sleeping as close to death and you shouldn't sleep anymore.
34:18
SPEAKER_07: Like you actually feel guilty to rest.
34:21
SPEAKER_07: Like if you if you take a nap, if you have the time, like around 3 p.m.
34:24
SPEAKER_07: to just take a short nap, it's like, oh you can't do this because it's not even allowed.
34:28
SPEAKER_07: Like, what would society take?
34:30
SPEAKER_02: All anxiety, okay.
34:31
SPEAKER_02: Nobody will study it.
34:32
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
34:32
SPEAKER_07: It's true, it's true.
34:33
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, so I think, yeah, I so I definitely think for me, like all of that achievement and so on was great, excellent.
34:42
SPEAKER_07: I I'm not saying that I I am not all for ambition and meeting goals, but I just think I'm in a space now where it must not come at the cost of my mental health and my my sense of calmness and my regulated nervous system.
35:01
SPEAKER_07: Like it can't be like I can't be abandoning myself to climb any ladders.
35:06
Corie: That is inspirational because it feels even that shift you're talking about there.
35:10
Corie: There's some you're saying it, and I feel in anxiety, all of it welling up is like, uh I don't know, sure, you know, because I guess as you say, we we kind of taught to do it.
35:18
SPEAKER_07: Yes, of course, yeah, yeah.
35:19
Corie: And I suppose at that time, going back to primary school, you propelled into this world at an 11-year-old.
35:25
Corie: So, like I look at my son, I watched his journey and he went to San Fernando Boys and a small school in Shagonas for a while when we moved there.
35:33
Corie: And by the time he was in standard four, you knew he was gonna do well in common entrance.
35:38
Corie: Oh, SC, you know?
35:39
Corie: You know he was gonna pass for his first choice.
35:41
Corie: So it would be like this would be the same for you, where you're you're doing well in the class.
35:45
Corie: Yeah, progressively, yeah.
35:47
Corie: Of course, of course.
35:48
Corie: So it's not a surprise to you that you pass for SAGs, right?
35:50
Corie: What what what you're feeling when newspapers calling and people like David Way suddenly coming to take picture?
35:55
Corie: And what were you feeling then as a child?
35:58
SPEAKER_07: I think I was excited.
35:59
Corie: Okay.
36:00
SPEAKER_07: Um, I think I was more excited like for my parents too.
36:02
SPEAKER_07: Like they they were overjoyed, they were excited.
36:05
SPEAKER_07: Um, so there was excitement.
36:08
SPEAKER_07: It I I guess it was well, it's a new experience.
36:11
SPEAKER_07: I was really not really out in the newspaper.
36:14
SPEAKER_07: I think maybe once or twice, maybe when I was born, and then maybe once during primary school, I remember that the media house came into um my primary school.
36:22
SPEAKER_07: But outside of that, like being in the limelight, that would have been the first big big deal, you know.
36:29
Corie: Yeah, and they're big enough to assess it too at that point.
36:31
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
36:32
SPEAKER_07: So it was, yeah, I think I was, I think it was excited.
36:36
Corie: Um and you were top 100 as well, yes?
36:38
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, like 84 to something.
36:40
SPEAKER_07: Almost I make it.
36:54
SPEAKER_04: But yeah, yeah.
36:56
Corie: Yeah, top 100.
36:57
Corie: So proud moments, I'm sure the whole family, the community probably probably coming together at that point in time.
37:01
SPEAKER_07: Yes, yes, yes.
37:02
Corie: So going into SAGs, uh at that at that point in time, you a lot of your friends went to SAGS with you?
37:07
SPEAKER_07: Close friends, no.
37:08
SPEAKER_07: Oh, okay.
37:09
SPEAKER_07: Um, I had one one friend close to where I live, so we started school together, we would go to school together.
37:14
SPEAKER_07: Um, so I had that um comfort of having her around.
37:18
SPEAKER_07: Right.
37:18
SPEAKER_07: And then my sister was there palm tree.
37:22
SPEAKER_04: Right.
37:23
SPEAKER_07: And um but yeah, I think every with every change uh I experienced, of course, there was like fear.
37:30
SPEAKER_07: Very naturally, there is this um reservation, there is this concern of how I might be perceived, if how how this is gonna work out is like new classroom, new students, new girls, um, you're stepping outside of your comfort zone.
37:48
SPEAKER_07: And that I think that applied like throughout my life, not just with school, but even changing jobs and yeah, throughout your life.
37:55
SPEAKER_07: And I don't I don't feel like it's something peculiar to me.
37:57
SPEAKER_07: I think everybody once in a comfortable space, they they enjoy being there because yeah, you you do you you you love that comfort.
38:04
SPEAKER_07: But um so starting SAGs or university and even moving to Barbados to study because I I I did one year in Trinidad, two years in Barbie.
38:14
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, so all of that yeah, change brought its own sense of fear.
38:21
SPEAKER_07: Um but it's I guess it's not like fear would stop existing.
38:26
SPEAKER_07: It's just I've learned like fear would always be present.
38:29
SPEAKER_07: Um, but it's just the willingness to act and move through it although it's there.
38:35
Corie: Makes sense.
38:36
Corie: So SAGs, you're doing well and all that too academically.
38:38
Corie: Because somebody went SAGs tell me it wasn't everything in the Zivy and missing activity, the Zivia outside.
38:46
Corie: I know.
38:46
SPEAKER_07: I just yeah, I I enjoyed, um thoroughly enjoyed my experience there.
38:52
SPEAKER_07: It was amazing.
38:53
SPEAKER_07: I would say high school was definitely one of my best experiences.
38:56
SPEAKER_07: Like I made friends.
38:58
SPEAKER_07: I remember like my best friend right now, on the like on the first week of school, my teacher, who's also amazing, like such a lovely soul.
39:06
SPEAKER_07: She asked, like, if anyone would like to sit next to me, even in the event that I may need something, or you know, like any sister and so um yeah, and I remember Leah just standing up real quick, like she didn't even wait for the teacher to finish.
39:20
SPEAKER_07: She's like, I will, I will, I will sit next to her.
39:23
SPEAKER_07: And we just became such close friends, and she's she's migrated now.
39:27
SPEAKER_07: Um but even as long distance friends, like she's amazing.
39:31
SPEAKER_07: Like, I'm visiting her in August.
39:32
SPEAKER_07: We try to see each other each year.
39:34
SPEAKER_07: But uh yeah, I've made friendships throughout my life, not just in SAGS, but university as well.
39:40
SPEAKER_07: Um friends who were just so supportive, so so lovely.
39:44
SPEAKER_07: And even in adulthood, I met friends as well uh who really was able to pull me out of like dark places I would have been in, like such depressive states.
39:56
SPEAKER_07: Like friends who would, you know, come and just lay with you in your bed because you can't get up.
40:01
SPEAKER_07: You know, like you're like I've had moments and phases of my life where I I felt like was literally so so depressed and so broken that that you you can't even face the world.
40:11
SPEAKER_07: Yeah but you have people around you who you know who would sit with you in that and yeah, I've had I've had that.
40:18
Corie: Yeah, in an interview talking about that being at 19 or so yesterday went into that place.
40:22
SPEAKER_07: No, no, much older.
40:24
Corie: Older than that.
40:25
Corie: Yeah, I see.
40:25
SPEAKER_07: I think maybe no, as a teenager, no, no, not as a teenager.
40:29
SPEAKER_07: That darkness came like early 30s.
40:32
Corie: Right.
40:33
Corie: And how you'll be able to work through that because it did, I mean, when you describe it, it sounds like I know, all right.
40:40
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, it was, it was so I think I think at that time I like for a long time in my twenties, as I said before, I felt this sense of like emptiness.
40:53
SPEAKER_07: Um, but it was slowly building.
40:55
SPEAKER_07: So like uh from the moment I hit it tity one, it's almost like I couldn't stand um just the the the way that I I guess was existing in life.
41:10
SPEAKER_07: Um like nothing, literally nothing, brought to me any sense of meaning, any sense of joy.
41:16
SPEAKER_07: Um like even my career that I would work so hard for, like I literally just didn't feel like it it was what I wanted to be or who I where I needed to be.
41:28
SPEAKER_07: Um there was just this sense of broke.
41:31
SPEAKER_07: I think I think it stemmed from like everything over the experience, from boot to to it should it just sort of creep up on me.
41:37
SPEAKER_07: Um I think it's what like people would call like the dark night of the soul.
41:41
SPEAKER_07: Like it was just complete darkness um that I really couldn't get out of.
41:46
SPEAKER_07: Like I I had this curiosity of like who am I beyond who I needed to be to survive in this world?
41:53
SPEAKER_07: Because I felt like I spent the years of my life just so much in survival.
41:58
SPEAKER_07: Like my I was constantly living in a state of emergency, like a state of survival, like and I guess it's the survival, right?
42:07
SPEAKER_02: In this environment, it can't say constantly in a state of emergency.
42:11
SPEAKER_07: And um I like there was this deep desire to know myself beyond that.
42:19
SPEAKER_07: Um and that is where I think practices such as a yoga.
42:26
SPEAKER_07: So, like a friend of mine, a good friend of mine, he was kind of like, but you can't keep living like this, like this has to stop.
42:32
SPEAKER_04: Right.
42:33
SPEAKER_07: And he suggested that I try like yoga, uh, maybe meditation, um, maybe those practices.
42:39
SPEAKER_07: Because I used to do yoga in my teenage years, but that was mostly for like flexibility, just to maintain mobility, flexibility, because I have to use my my legs like throughout my life, right?
42:49
SPEAKER_07: Um and then I stopped for some time.
42:51
SPEAKER_07: So when I like in those moments, I decided like maybe I'll try it again.
42:56
SPEAKER_07: And so I started practicing yoga each day, um, meditation.
43:00
SPEAKER_07: Um I started therapy.
43:03
SPEAKER_07: And I think a combination of like soft therapy.
43:07
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, gotcha.
43:08
SPEAKER_07: A uh like psychology mixed with like what we would call spirituality, because that's what yoga is, that's what meditation is.
43:16
SPEAKER_07: I think merging those two really brought me to a deeper connection with myself of like who I am beyond having no arms or who I am beyond being an attorney.
43:29
SPEAKER_07: Like, who am I truly and how do I really want to show up in the world?
43:32
SPEAKER_07: Because I feel like I was wearing this mask.
43:34
SPEAKER_07: And um when that mask slowly started like cracking open um the reality of who I was emerged.
43:44
SPEAKER_07: But not just like the real authentic me, but what showed up was all my pain and my shame from childhood, even like from boot and my fear, uh, my anger, like every emotion that I would have buried from.
44:00
SPEAKER_07: My past just slowly began showing up.
44:04
SPEAKER_07: Um, and then yeah, through those practices, I really was able to come back to my truer self.
44:10
Corie: Yeah, yeah.
44:11
Corie: I hear you talk about yoga, and for me, yoga is like Apple fitness, right?
44:15
Corie: You do two things and a thing and you twist a couple of times, and you see when you see your hands too tight, you do a couple of them things and you reverse upward dog or downwards called it.
44:24
Corie: A cutko, cutko.
44:26
Corie: You do two cutko and I outside, you know what I mean?
44:28
Corie: But I hear you talk about it as a more holistic practice and more understanding.
44:31
Corie: It is, it is.
44:32
SPEAKER_07: It's it's not just a physical.
44:33
Corie: It doesn't feel very um spiritual to me, it feels very difficult, like painful.
44:37
SPEAKER_07: Maybe then don't twice.
44:39
Corie: If something falls here.
44:41
SPEAKER_07: Well, then you need to come to my class.
44:42
Corie: Oh my god.
44:43
Corie: Here we go.
44:44
SPEAKER_07: I have to try a class.
44:45
Corie: Let me tell you a joke, right?
44:47
Corie: Let me tell you this.
44:47
Corie: It's that time I need German um C3 in San Fernando.
44:52
Corie: And they have an instructor there, he's done Jacob family, Ludwin Jacob, I think is his name.
44:57
Corie: And this man has a yoga class.
44:58
Corie: So when he comes out, everybody done left weights.
45:00
Corie: He said, Come strong men, all of you come in in yoga.
45:02
Corie: And I say, so I see them in yoga, right?
45:04
Corie: And I say, all right, well, there's a nice light stretch after you done left weights.
45:07
Corie: And I could not, I never shake.
45:09
Corie: So in my life, that that is not uh I get that fun.
45:12
SPEAKER_07: I get that, yeah.
45:14
SPEAKER_07: Most most men who ever came to my class would express the same thing, like they would say, This is the hardest thing.
45:21
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, no, no, no, for sure.
45:22
SPEAKER_07: So it's it's mostly um females that would now come to class.
45:27
SPEAKER_07: I have one or two.
45:28
Corie: Oh, the men run.
45:28
SPEAKER_07: They run, they be trembling, and honestly, they're kind of noisy in class, too.
45:36
SPEAKER_07: Noisy, noisy.
45:38
SPEAKER_08: Oh my god, it's breathing and breathing loud.
45:46
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, so it's like um but yeah, no, but it's so much more than that.
45:50
SPEAKER_07: I guess once you like have a consistent practice, you see that it's so much more than just a physical because I too started as a strictly physical practice, but it um when I began noticing shifts in like how I breathe, or shifts in how I respond or react to to the world, um, I became so less reactive.
46:12
SPEAKER_07: I became so detached, but not in a way that I like I just no longer care.
46:18
SPEAKER_07: But just in a way that I it helped me so much to come back to myself and stay anchored in myself and stay very present as well because I had I struggled a lot with being present because I was so identified with my mind, like I lived in my mind for years, like I there was no separation between who I am and what is happening in my mind.
46:38
SPEAKER_07: Um, and yoga and these practices help me to separate, create that separation so that I can now like witness my thoughts, I can now recognize negative self-talk as opposed to being merged in it, believing.
46:52
SPEAKER_07: Because sometimes we say, I am, even with our emotions, like we we we we become one with it.
46:57
SPEAKER_07: Like we say, I am sad, I am afraid, as opposed to witnessing your sadness as something separate from who you are, as uh an emotion that is moving through you that you could could witness and worked with as opposed to becoming it.
47:10
SPEAKER_07: Okay, even with my challenges and stuff, I like yeah, having to deal with them in the past, I would be so caught in it, you know.
47:20
SPEAKER_07: Um but now I I think these practices really help me, not just physically.
47:25
SPEAKER_07: I think physical is like maybe 5%, 10% of the practice.
47:28
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, you're already using um you're already using those poses to get into your body, to get into your inner inner space, you know?
47:37
unknown: Yeah.
47:38
Corie: If you want to support the show and ensure that we gain the best guests here telling the best stories and we gain a little bit of back and all out to all of them, you could support for free by liking, sharing, and subscribing on YouTube.
47:48
Corie: But you could also join our Patreon, it's just file us to ensure that we could continue to get stories that inspire, educate, empower, inform, and all the other in things that these people behind the scenes tell me to say.
48:00
Corie: So go and do it now, and then we could jump back into the episode.
48:04
Corie: Bang.
48:05
Corie: For me, like it's difficult for me when I go to class to see how all this lack of flexibility could lead to some kind of inner peace.
48:13
Corie: Because for instance, when the class is done, right?
48:15
Corie: Well let's go, like, see, I still say done.
48:17
Corie: There was a point in time that they do this what you call flow, whatever these things, right?
48:20
Corie: Yes.
48:21
Corie: And the balance, a few times, balances are messed too, right?
48:24
Corie: And then when we are done, we're just sitting there.
48:26
SPEAKER_07: Right.
48:27
SPEAKER_07: You could either sit there or like lay on stage.
48:31
SPEAKER_07: It's called deep relaxation.
48:33
SPEAKER_07: Oh my god, that's the best part of the class.
48:35
SPEAKER_07: I know why you don't like that part.
48:37
Corie: Why?
48:38
Corie: Let me see how good it is here because I know why I don't like your song.
48:41
SPEAKER_06: Why you don't like it?
48:43
Corie: I found that the silence.
48:45
Corie: So there's a silence.
48:46
SPEAKER_06: A lot of people are uncomfortable with silence.
48:48
Corie: It's uncomfortable for me, I can tell you that.
48:50
Corie: Because the room has some moments, that mental so you know that's noisy.
48:53
Corie: And but there was a point in time where it just became dead silent, and it's difficult for me to sit.
48:58
Corie: Because my mind, what you're describing is what I that's what I think everybody goes through.
49:04
Corie: My mind does not stop.
49:05
Corie: Right.
49:05
Corie: I think there was one point in life where I felt like I could separate my mind and the activity from myself.
49:10
SPEAKER_07: Right.
49:11
Corie: I'd read a book called I Power No.
49:13
SPEAKER_07: My favorite.
49:13
SPEAKER_07: You know it's I love it.
49:15
SPEAKER_07: That was the very first book I read when I started my journey.
49:18
Corie: Me too, but my journey stopped.
49:19
SPEAKER_07: My journey starts.
49:21
SPEAKER_07: I love that.
49:21
SPEAKER_07: That was what I read it.
49:22
SPEAKER_07: I read it every year.
49:23
Corie: Yeah, but I think that and the roadless travel make me really change the way I look at life.
49:27
Corie: But I know had some it was mind-blowing, right?
49:31
SPEAKER_07: It was, it wasn't thinking about it.
49:33
SPEAKER_07: Of course.
49:34
SPEAKER_07: I love, I love, I love that one.
49:36
Corie: And in that, in that, the ability to access that present moment.
49:40
unknown: Yeah.
49:41
Corie: But boy, when when that yoga class gets quiet, I don't know if my present moment I feel like what?
49:45
Corie: I really had all the way.
49:46
Corie: I feel like everybody else can be a man.
49:51
Corie: Oh, yeah.
49:51
Corie: And everybody else looking still it.
49:55
Corie: So it's the same for you, like that part of it is what helped you to get out to that period.
50:00
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, for sure, for sure.
50:01
SPEAKER_07: So, like just sitting in meditation each day.
50:04
SPEAKER_07: Um and it's not so much about stopping your thoughts.
50:07
SPEAKER_07: I think many people think it's about stopping your thoughts.
50:09
SPEAKER_07: It's just recognizing that you're not them.
50:11
SPEAKER_07: So I could be thinking about anything, and in any given moment, I know I'm not that.
50:15
SPEAKER_07: And it could, my mind could run at any pace it wishes to run.
50:19
SPEAKER_07: But uh, as long as I am anchored as that witnesser beneath the mind, then then it's fine.
50:25
SPEAKER_07: Like you could be thinking anything.
50:27
SPEAKER_07: Like that does not concern me.
50:29
SPEAKER_07: Because I am not that toward that is coming in my mind.
50:32
SPEAKER_07: So it's not really about stopping the towards that or stopping, stopping your mind, but just kind of noticing that you're not that.
50:39
SPEAKER_07: So you're not living from this place of so it's like you're no longer a slave to your mind, you know?
50:45
SPEAKER_07: Like you take your power back in that.
50:47
SPEAKER_07: That's how I I think I was able to take my power back to myself from my mind.
50:52
SPEAKER_07: Um, but yeah, those are a lot of people, myself included, felt very uncomfortable and silent.
50:57
SPEAKER_07: Because we kind of live in with to to distract.
51:00
SPEAKER_07: We have to find something to be doing um as opposed to sitting with ourselves.
51:05
SPEAKER_07: Because facing yourself is probably like one of the hardest things.
51:08
SPEAKER_07: I know it's one of the hardest things that I had to do.
51:10
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I'd rather do anything than watch myself.
51:12
SPEAKER_07: I can rather do anything than watch my peel.
51:14
SPEAKER_07: Like, no, no, no, no.
51:15
SPEAKER_07: I can't, I can't, yeah.
51:16
Corie: Yeah, so thank God for Steve Jobs on them because they make these little things called airpods, you know that?
51:20
Corie: Yeah, I could put that in, yes, listen to our podcast, and that I know, but I guess as you say, it's more distraction than because the thought the the thoughts or whatever the thing is, or yourself, you can't really get away.
51:32
Corie: I guess it's always there.
51:32
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, you can't.
51:33
SPEAKER_07: We think I think sometimes we think we might be suppressing, even like with emotions and stuff.
51:37
SPEAKER_07: We think like we could suppress it, but it is it is going with you anywhere you go in, it is it's it it's coming with you.
51:43
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
51:46
SPEAKER_07: And it's gonna show up in your life, it's gonna show up in the way that you meet life.
51:50
SPEAKER_07: It's gonna show up in the workplace, it's gonna show up in the way you lead your life, the way you lead organizations, the way you show up in your relationship, the way you parent your kid.
51:57
SPEAKER_07: You you think it's not, you think you bury it, but uh-uh.
52:00
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, it is being reflective because everything that's happening outside of you, of course, is a reflection of your inner space.
52:07
SPEAKER_07: So um, if you're not paying attention to that, then then you're existing very, I would say, unconsciously, which I know I existed for years.
52:15
Corie: Right, right.
52:16
Corie: And you felt like that would getting into that inner space uh propell it really to a different different place, no, because you went on not just to practice, but you teach you where you have your own sessions, you have your own studio.
52:26
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I I think because I was kind of like people need to know this.
52:30
Corie: Yeah.
52:31
SPEAKER_07: Like I can't, I can't, yeah, I can't get keep.
52:34
SPEAKER_07: Like, no, no, they need to know.
52:36
SPEAKER_07: Everybody needs to know the the beauty of this practice.
52:38
SPEAKER_07: And I've seen, like, I've had students with me for five years, I've been practicing.
52:44
SPEAKER_07: That's when my studio was open.
52:46
SPEAKER_07: And students have been with me consistently, and like just being able to witness the the changes in how they respond to life is is amazing.
52:54
SPEAKER_07: Like just hearing them speak of the way yoga has changed their their lives is is lovely.
53:00
Corie: So you're enjoying that too.
53:01
Corie: I love it.
53:01
Corie: Yeah, yeah.
53:02
SPEAKER_07: I love it, I love it.
53:03
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I I could teach yoga every day.
53:04
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah, I could yeah, I I practice um dearly, but I also feel like I could share that with others.
53:10
SPEAKER_07: Like I love absolutely I love it.
53:13
Corie: There's something I wanted to read that CRIs here, right?
53:15
Corie: I'm gonna see if I can read here now.
53:17
Corie: This is where the things get challenging, you know.
53:19
Corie: Should I drink a little more?
53:24
Corie: You said I was born without I'm in Trinidad and Tobago from a very young age.
53:28
Corie: I became aware of how the world often defines people by what they lack rather than what they carry within.
53:34
Corie: Uh that still out when I saw that.
53:36
Corie: I think it was on your website.
53:37
Corie: Yes.
53:38
Corie: What you meant when you say define people by what they lack?
53:41
Corie: You can explain that?
53:42
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I think um what I meant by that is specifically in relation to going all the way back from like the moment I was born.
53:52
SPEAKER_07: So I I think at that time, and possibly even now as well, like we exist in a world where people really understand limitation and they also focus, myself included, I've been doing that for a long time, on what we what we don't have or what we may be lacking as opposed to what may be possible for us.
54:18
SPEAKER_07: Uh, I think when I was born, you you you know, like we have this culture where where something happens in the country, everyone suddenly becomes an expert in it.
54:27
SPEAKER_07: No idea.
54:27
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
54:28
SPEAKER_07: So everybody was kind of like expert on what is going to become of this child without arms, you know, like she won't be able to do X, Y, and Z.
54:36
SPEAKER_07: She may not even be able to walk because according to the experts, like you need arms to walk.
54:40
SPEAKER_00: Oh, I see.
54:40
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
54:41
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I really didn't walk until I was maybe like close at the tree.
54:45
SPEAKER_07: I took, I took some time.
54:46
SPEAKER_07: Okay.
54:46
SPEAKER_07: Because like to stand up and then you, you know, you would use your arms as children to see.
54:50
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
54:50
SPEAKER_07: So I didn't, it took me some time, but I did.
54:52
SPEAKER_07: Like, um, but so I think a lot of the focus, and it's of course it's not in a way to blame anyone.
55:00
SPEAKER_07: People were really operating from what they knew, right?
55:04
SPEAKER_07: Um, and at that point, um resources even for my parents were not available.
55:08
SPEAKER_07: Like therapy, like they were like, I'm surprised, like when I asked my parents like if they've been, like, if they received any form of counseling.
55:14
unknown: Nothing.
55:15
SPEAKER_07: No, like my mom was just like, even yesterday when we were on our way, so for instance, I've been my mom was like, you know, she remembered when I was born and the nurse just saying to her, like, you know, just go home and love your child.
55:25
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
55:26
SPEAKER_07: And um, well, she did that so well.
55:30
SPEAKER_07: Um, both my parents did, but uh there was no form of um support.
55:37
SPEAKER_07: I think my parents' support was really just like immediate family, and um, but even the community supported.
55:44
SPEAKER_07: And uh I think faith and prayer is what really helped my found.
55:48
SPEAKER_07: Even my dad, like when I was born, he he like his state of anxiety and depression, which he struggled with even before I was born, just um intensified and showed up so much in his body, like like he was literally shut it down.
56:03
SPEAKER_07: Um, but he also didn't have the resources, like I'm just so amazed by that.
56:07
SPEAKER_07: Um but there was so much focus on like what I didn't have.
56:12
SPEAKER_07: And and of course, in the moment, in any given situation, it's very challenging to look on the bright side sometimes, depending on what situation we're faced with.
56:21
SPEAKER_07: Um so this is not to cast shame or blame on anyone.
56:24
SPEAKER_07: Sure, sure.
56:25
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I do feel like four years from birth all the way up, like it was very difficult to see beyond not having arms.
56:33
SPEAKER_07: And I I guess over time now I feel like with my ability to see myself beyond that, because there can't be this expectation for others to see what I have or what I don't lack when I don't.
56:45
Corie: Yeah, I was wondering about that because when I read this statement, it slowed to me so much because I started to think it's like Corey Wait, no, I'm I define in myself by my limitations.
56:54
Corie: Yeah, you know, more so than what other people say.
56:56
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
56:57
Corie: You know, and sometimes we do.
56:59
SPEAKER_07: Of course, yeah.
57:00
SPEAKER_07: I think sometimes even our mind, our brain is kind of designed to focus on the negatives as opposed to the positive.
57:06
SPEAKER_07: And I think we have so much potential as humans and so much power within ourselves that we uh bury that we have lost touch with.
57:17
SPEAKER_07: Um so yeah, it's really about going back to that place.
57:22
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I with you, I with you.
57:24
Corie: And even as you talk about your parents, because it's so, it's so um, it's almost cliche, right?
57:28
Corie: When you talk about people with parents, you see it in movies all the time where they have a child that's going to be born, and the first thing you're looking for is ten fingers and ten toes.
57:35
Corie: You see it all the time.
57:36
Corie: So I can't imagine that we live in a society.
57:38
Corie: I mean, I hope it changes now, where yeah, the hospital, I mean the nurse doing the best of what she has, right?
57:45
Corie: It's not on her.
57:46
Corie: But I wonder if we have these systems in place and the support, because to send somebody home who doesn't have the emotional where it's all sometimes or the tools, but also physically, like what we're gonna do now.
57:55
Corie: We have to figure it out.
57:56
Corie: You talking about a time where it's had no chat GPT.
57:58
SPEAKER_08: Correct.
57:59
Corie: Now you could kind of charge PC and work your way through some of these things.
58:02
Corie: I wonder if they're in place now.
58:04
SPEAKER_07: I'm not I'm not certain, but I would like to think so.
58:06
SPEAKER_07: I I feel like we have been evolving.
58:08
SPEAKER_07: I think um even you even see it like in organizations and uh I feel like people are more aware of the importance of like mental health and mental well-being.
58:20
SPEAKER_07: So I would like to think if if in that instance there would be support available.
58:26
SPEAKER_07: I I would hope so.
58:27
SPEAKER_07: I would hope so.
58:28
Corie: It must have come a little bit way, right?
58:29
Corie: It must have come a little bit.
58:30
SPEAKER_07: I would hope so, yeah, because it's so necessary.
58:33
Corie: People need people need people, they need support, they need and and life, life could be all all types of things happen in life.
58:39
Corie: Like I was telling you when me did the quality first time, uh full disclosure, I had a gentleman here last week by the name of Kro Kro Western Rollin.
58:45
Corie: You know the fellow?
58:46
Corie: Yes, it's about him now.
58:48
Corie: So I I know at the time when this article came out and everybody got to know your name, his response to it.
58:54
Corie: I suppose uh to put it in a natural his song definitely uh is kind of structured in his own way, which is very direct and could be crude, to say, hey, you're not doing well, and look at this girl with no arms who's doing well, which I think to be honest is uh maybe maybe old school, but very trendy thing to say.
59:14
Corie: Like is that thing you hear in households?
59:16
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I get it all the time too.
59:17
SPEAKER_07: Like sometimes parents would come up to me with their kids, but it's almost like they're also schooled, and they could like look at her, like you gonna be company then people saying this to you.
59:26
SPEAKER_07: And to their children, and I I feel like it's um yeah, they would say like in a way that it's not uh not understanding or empathetic, but more like a comparison, um, which I I don't always appreciate because I feel like we all have our special gifts and talents.
59:45
SPEAKER_07: I don't know if it's useful, exactly, yeah, exactly.
59:49
SPEAKER_07: Um, and even if a child is not academically inclined, it doesn't mean that they they they they aren't inclined in some other way, right?
59:57
SPEAKER_07: So um but even my own life is showing that like I enjoy teaching yoga more than I enjoy being an attorney.
1:00:05
SPEAKER_07: Um so so so so does it um is it really all about straight A's and and scholarships and as opposed to finding what feels most aligned and true to you.
1:00:21
SPEAKER_07: And I think I shared about that too, like I did an open letter recently that received a lot of um uh I got a lot of feedback because so many people were experiencing what I shared.
1:00:32
SPEAKER_07: Like my titties just being a time where you realize the life that you're living uh is probably not really you're living a script that maybe was never really yours.
1:00:42
SPEAKER_07: So so when you when you compare yourself to others, which I I see parents do with even myself, um, you know, it's not always I don't think it's always helpful.
1:00:54
Corie: Yeah, yeah, I I I'm not sure if it's ever helpful or useful to be honest.
1:01:00
Corie: It's children, it's children, you know, and and and we sometimes forget with things like common interests, it's 11 me as well.
1:01:06
Corie: It's like when you look at someone.
1:01:07
SPEAKER_06: Just a baby, like what?
1:01:09
SPEAKER_06: Oh my god, like something about SCA doesn't sit well with me.
1:01:14
SPEAKER_07: Because I've seen like even for myself, I have listen, I would I am much older than when I wrote like years have passed.
1:01:22
SPEAKER_07: And if I see my now he did a great job, but if I see my prime my standard five teacher now, like today, like like I would feel like like I might just sort of sweat on my heart, but that stayed with me.
1:01:34
SPEAKER_07: Like, oh my god, this pressure is too much.
1:01:36
SPEAKER_07: I was just a baby.
1:01:38
SPEAKER_07: Like, what is this?
1:01:39
SPEAKER_07: I was just 10 years old, like what is all this pressure?
1:01:42
SPEAKER_07: And I I see even with my my nieces and nephews, like they like just the education system literally like just like sucking the joy out of kids, man.
1:01:52
SPEAKER_07: Like, oh my god, they just need to be, there need to be this healthy balance, you know?
1:01:57
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
1:01:58
Corie: Like um, it could be, if it's not this week is last week, we went to a meeting.
1:02:02
Corie: My wife and I were small son, like a small.
1:02:05
Corie: And so we have daycare meeting on things, which apparently I had to go and realize.
1:02:08
Corie: I thought we evolved beyond this thing with the father had to be in a daycare meeting, no, but I was there, and um it was strange because he's four months, David.
1:02:17
Corie: Make me say the right thing, right?
1:02:19
Corie: Four months, right?
1:02:20
Corie: Don't put don't put it at the wrong age out there, you know.
1:02:21
Corie: You correct that for me, right?
1:02:23
Corie: Okay, three, four months, right?
1:02:24
Corie: Baby.
1:02:25
Corie: And she's in the meeting.
1:02:26
Corie: God, I mean, she God bless the woman.
1:02:28
Corie: She was great, she was very, very kind.
1:02:29
Corie: But she's asking what plans we have for primary school.
1:02:32
Corie: I'm thinking this man cast it up, you know, maybe we should take the stage just to do it.
1:02:37
Corie: You know, so it's strange, but we do have a society that tends to even if informally reward the doctor, lawyer, engineer, like you have to you have to go through those things.
1:02:48
SPEAKER_07: The entire education system, I think, is designed in this way to, yeah.
1:02:52
SPEAKER_07: And it's designed to just kind of like I think keep us away from ourselves.
1:02:56
SPEAKER_07: Like if we yeah, like spend all this time just bringing our heads down into a book, you know, as opposed to finding what our true talents might be or true joy might be.
1:03:10
SPEAKER_07: Um, that could be something entirely different from what we believe or what society has conditioned us to believe it, it should be, or even our parents.
1:03:18
Corie: Makes sense.
1:03:18
Corie: Makes sense.
1:03:19
SPEAKER_07: Um but yeah, if we if we truly spent a lot of time, even as children, just discovering what those things are, I think that creative side of us would not be buried.
1:03:29
SPEAKER_07: Like I'm now exploring creativity, like I'm now exploring what it is to be creative, what it is to have my own brand, you know, as a speaker, as a coach, um and being creative in the way I show up on social media, like with how I write, or um, yeah, because we are creative beings.
1:03:48
SPEAKER_07: I I think a lot of time I think I was feeling that sense of depression and anxiety because I had buried that sense of creativity within me.
1:03:55
Corie: Well, school, school helps with that a lot because school itself, we are either good at maths or we are creative or sciences and you know, it does that a lot.
1:04:03
Corie: So, I mean, going I always always wanted to meet you to ask you about that.
1:04:07
Corie: I wonder what your 11-year-old self is thinking when you hear the song play and people playing the song and stuff.
1:04:12
Corie: You had thoughts about it or you didn't care about it, or you didn't know.
1:04:14
SPEAKER_07: I think I was a bit older.
1:04:15
SPEAKER_07: I wasn't Oh, you did it long after?
1:04:17
Corie: Yeah.
1:04:18
Corie: So what was your thoughts?
1:04:20
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
1:04:20
SPEAKER_07: I'm not sure if that was maybe when I wrote CX.
1:04:23
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I feel like I was a bit.
1:04:24
SPEAKER_07: It was 99.
1:04:25
SPEAKER_07: Well then.
1:04:25
SPEAKER_07: Was it?
1:04:26
SPEAKER_07: Nah.
1:04:26
SPEAKER_07: I feel like I well, I was in SAGs.
1:04:28
SPEAKER_07: I know I was in SAGs already.
1:04:29
Corie: Alright, so you're big enough.
1:04:30
Corie: You know what you know about it.
1:04:31
SPEAKER_07: Um I don't feel like I had much of a review on it.
1:04:35
SPEAKER_07: Uh I know like my teachers, my principal at the time, my parents, they they weren't so I mean, they didn't love it.
1:04:43
SPEAKER_07: Um now, I think sometime last year, I was listening to it.
1:04:47
SPEAKER_07: Just I was with my friend, I was like, hey, you remember the song?
1:04:50
SPEAKER_07: And we played it.
1:04:51
SPEAKER_07: And I was just, I mean, now that I'm much older, like I'm able to really um have maybe have a view on it or a perspective.
1:05:02
SPEAKER_07: Uh and I I guess I mean he has he has a style.
1:05:06
SPEAKER_00: That's for sure.
1:05:07
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
1:05:08
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I think uh because mentally I've created shifts within my own.
1:05:17
SPEAKER_07: So it's like I see myself beyond just like someone without arms.
1:05:20
SPEAKER_07: So when you say, well, chop off someone's arms, like it's not really a reflection of what might be of assistance to them because the the person who I am, or the person who achieved X, Y, and Z, or who became a speaker, coach, or an attorney, is more than just someone without arms.
1:05:41
SPEAKER_07: Like, like it's not an armless person doing this.
1:05:44
SPEAKER_07: Is a is a there is a force that is that I believe within myself that is driving and supporting and guiding me throughout my life.
1:05:53
SPEAKER_07: There has to be.
1:05:53
SPEAKER_07: Like, I don't believe there's any way that I'm just surviving on this world.
1:05:56
SPEAKER_07: Like I'm not self made.
1:05:58
SPEAKER_07: And there is no way I think.
1:06:00
SPEAKER_07: I'm able to thrive in the way I have without that for and call that force sanity in God, energy, consciousness, whatever it might be.
1:06:09
SPEAKER_07: But it just showed that again, as we spoke about what people see is really just on the outside.
1:06:14
SPEAKER_07: So the answer is, well, if you're armless, maybe you you you would do it.
1:06:18
SPEAKER_07: You know, yeah, but but I I think it's uh it's harsh in a sense, though, and my style is not really, really harsh.
1:06:25
SPEAKER_07: Um, but yeah, I felt like it was a bit a bit much.
1:06:29
Corie: Yeah.
1:06:29
Corie: I'll help you be a bit much.
1:06:31
Corie: I can read more from your website.
1:06:32
Corie: As you said that there was something else I saw, and and and you said the letter for you, yes?
1:06:37
SPEAKER_07: The open letter?
1:06:38
Corie: Yeah, yeah.
1:06:38
Corie: He says, I walk alongside you, does it?
1:06:40
SPEAKER_07: Nah.
1:06:41
SPEAKER_07: I'm talking about, I think that I'm not sure if that's on my website.
1:06:45
Corie: This now is from your website.
1:06:47
Corie: I'll read it, right?
1:06:48
Corie: It says, as I walk alongside you, my intention is simple to be a mirror.
1:06:51
Corie: A mirror not only to your challenges, but of your power, your resilience, and the truth of who you already are.
1:06:57
Corie: Beneath the layers, beneath the layers of striving and survival, you carry strength, wisdom, and wholeness that's un untainted by any obstacle you face.
1:07:06
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
1:07:06
Corie: It's to do with your coaching, your one-on-one session.
1:07:09
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
1:07:09
Corie: So your your role really is to help people see because I think you when you talk about the times of shame or darkness or whatever brings you to that session.
1:07:16
Corie: Yeah.
1:07:17
Corie: Yeah.
1:07:18
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, because there is a I I believe a part of us, not just I believe, but I know because I've been there, that I I believe is untouched by anything we would have experienced.
1:07:29
SPEAKER_07: I think there is a a part of me meaning the the source of who I am that is untouched by being harmless.
1:07:35
SPEAKER_07: You know, that is untouched by my disability, that is untouched by the traumas I experience in life or um the opinion of others.
1:07:45
SPEAKER_07: And that is the the part of me, like that, that true authentic self that I was able to get in touch to with um through therapy and so on.
1:07:57
SPEAKER_07: And now when I show up as a coach, it's it's a place that I want to take my my client, you know, because it's it's very it's not just working through what we might call the negative things, you know, like the heavy emotions or the tough places, but also acknowledging that everything that you need and ever need is is right within you.
1:08:17
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, it's so so it's developing that capacity to get in touch with that place so you don't have to go anywhere outside of you to find anything.
1:08:25
SPEAKER_07: Um, it sort of happens very naturally and organically.
1:08:31
SPEAKER_07: Um once you you're showing off from that place.
1:08:35
SPEAKER_04: Right, right.
1:08:36
SPEAKER_07: You know, like like yeah, it's just about so much not changing who you are, but just kind of reconnecting with that space.
1:08:44
SPEAKER_07: Uh and I think for me, when I when I got there is when I think life became a lot less effortless, like it was softer.
1:08:51
SPEAKER_07: Um there wasn't this hustle or this this constant chase, you know?
1:08:57
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
1:08:57
SPEAKER_07: Even like being here right now, like I would share a story with you.
1:09:00
SPEAKER_07: Like when I was developing my website with with the guy, he we were talking about podcasts and stuff.
1:09:05
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:09:06
SPEAKER_07: Because I've never really, uh maybe once I did like a video podcast.
1:09:10
SPEAKER_07: Um and then, but I was like, now that I'm coming, um like building my brand as a speaker, as a coach, I would probably want to do more of these kind of things, right?
1:09:20
SPEAKER_07: And he's like, um, yeah, maybe you should like pitch yourself to Corey.
1:09:25
SPEAKER_07: So I was like, I was like, oh yeah, I love it.
1:09:27
SPEAKER_07: Because I was following you anytime.
1:09:28
SPEAKER_07: So I was like, yeah, I could um, I could probably do that.
1:09:31
SPEAKER_07: And I was like, okay, well, that was at the end of last year.
1:09:34
SPEAKER_07: So I was like, okay, so January, I would reach out to you.
1:09:36
SPEAKER_07: I would pitch myself, right?
1:09:37
SPEAKER_07: I don't know if it would it would happen if we don't.
1:09:39
SPEAKER_07: And then like around early January, I saw you followed me on Instagram.
1:09:45
SPEAKER_07: So I was like, okay, well, this might be easier than that.
1:09:48
SPEAKER_04: This might be easier than that.
1:09:50
SPEAKER_07: And then I was like, okay, I'll message you like an adult.
1:09:53
SPEAKER_07: Let me give you like a two, three days.
1:09:55
SPEAKER_07: But I already saw you without following me.
1:09:57
SPEAKER_07: I was like, hey, like this, this might work out.
1:10:00
SPEAKER_07: And then before I could reach out to you, like I saw a message come through my phone and it was from you.
1:10:06
SPEAKER_07: And and I was like, oh, like this actually works.
1:10:09
SPEAKER_07: Like, like, like if like I was I I kept thinking, like it happens so naturally and effortlessly.
1:10:16
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, like it really shows that what you are seeking and the opportunities that you are seeking um may also very well be seeking you.
1:10:23
SPEAKER_04: I suppose.
1:10:24
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
1:10:25
SPEAKER_07: And um there isn't much that you you need to force or chase because the things that are meant for you, the rooms that you're meant to be, and the places that you're meant to be, the the people you're meant to meet, they will naturally gravitate towards you because you're like you're now, it's almost like you become a magnet to the things that you desire in life.
1:10:42
SPEAKER_07: Um, but many times we even for me too, I like I want certain opportunities, I want certain things for myself, but I'm not willing to let go of the parts of me that that I can't can't comfort me.
1:10:53
SPEAKER_07: So there are parts of me that can't be in this room here sitting.
1:10:56
SPEAKER_07: I probably wouldn't be able to share as much as I am or be as vulnerable as I am years ago as I'm able to now.
1:11:02
SPEAKER_07: But it was just an example of like opportunities just flowing very naturally to you when you become like a match to what you're actually designing.
1:11:11
SPEAKER_07: Many of us we we want certain things, but we we're holding on to um motions and beliefs that are not in alignment with them.
1:11:19
Corie: And might even be real, you know.
1:11:21
Corie: We create them ourselves, we create them ourselves.
1:11:23
SPEAKER_07: I don't know how we got here, but I just wanted to do that.
1:11:25
Corie: No, exactly.
1:11:26
Corie: Because the thing is, I remember when I reached her, when I saw it, I was like, the first thing I saw was motivational speaking.
1:11:31
SPEAKER_00: Right.
1:11:31
Corie: And I was like, this is interesting.
1:11:33
Corie: Like I wanted to know more about like why because I uh you know, even in maybe how I define myself, I am the king of boxing people, and I try to simplify life, right?
1:11:41
Corie: So is our two.
1:11:43
Corie: So final, yeah.
1:11:45
Corie: So when I saw motivational speaking, it felt like a little bit of a departure from what I knew it to be.
1:11:50
Corie: So what led you there to do any motivational speaking?
1:11:52
SPEAKER_07: So I I think even in my 20s and stuff, I I would do speeches, but that was more like gradations, um, speaking to young adults, kids, um, like primary school graduations or um even like secondary schools and so on.
1:12:09
SPEAKER_07: In my later twenties, I just started I started not picture myself like I would just receive calls, maybe like from insurance companies, banks and so on.
1:12:19
SPEAKER_07: Um, yeah, banking institutions, just that type of industry to do um like speaking engagements with their employees and stuff.
1:12:28
SPEAKER_07: Uh and then from there, so it's amazing, but like it all started kind of piecing together, like speaking together with coaching together with yoga.
1:12:36
SPEAKER_07: I just kind of formed this entire brand that I had no idea was coming together over the years.
1:12:42
SPEAKER_07: Right.
1:12:42
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I think with with speaking, I feel like it's an opportunity for me.
1:12:48
SPEAKER_07: So I always um felt like there is a message.
1:12:53
SPEAKER_07: Well, I feel that now, not always, but um, that it uh ought to sort of come through me and through my life.
1:13:02
SPEAKER_07: Um so what I share when I'm on a stage is really just my personal journey, um, my challenges, and um and it it could apply, you know, for many different audiences.
1:13:15
SPEAKER_07: Like a month ago, I I spoke in Panama at a a congress.
1:13:20
SPEAKER_07: And um I remember the the night before, just with there there was like this welcome cocktail.
1:13:25
SPEAKER_07: But just saying so many um individuals who I felt I was like, oh my god, like I may be really young to be here.
1:13:34
SPEAKER_07: Like not judging the age of anyone, but just thinking, oh my god, like I hope I could relate to, or they could relate to me.
1:13:40
SPEAKER_07: Like I felt a bit nervous about that.
1:13:42
SPEAKER_07: Right.
1:13:43
SPEAKER_07: And then it was amazing, like when I stood on stage, like just witnessing grown up grown men CEOs in a suit just wiping their tears.
1:13:52
SPEAKER_07: Um, but just being able to connect with people by sharing your lived experience, I think uh um that is also something that I feel is a huge part of part of my journey.
1:14:07
Corie: So if I'm enjoying that, no, you enjoying that.
1:14:10
Corie: You do.
1:14:10
Corie: You do.
1:14:11
SPEAKER_07: Love it, love it.
1:14:12
SPEAKER_07: Like any speaking and get any opportunity I get to speak.
1:14:14
SPEAKER_07: I am I am taking it on.
1:14:16
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, like I love it.
1:14:17
SPEAKER_07: And I I just also feel like I'm able to speak at you know, many different audiences.
1:14:22
SPEAKER_07: So I love speaking to kids.
1:14:24
SPEAKER_07: Um, as I said, I love speaking at like organizations, um managers, senior officials.
1:14:31
SPEAKER_07: Um, just two weeks ago or last week, I spoke at an Alcoholic Anonymous convention.
1:14:37
SPEAKER_07: And I grew up in alcoholism from my grandfather and my father.
1:14:41
SPEAKER_07: Um, so I was able to share as well, not just what I might have read.
1:14:46
SPEAKER_07: Oh, because I work with addicts as well as a coach.
1:14:50
SPEAKER_07: And um, but just standing there and sharing what my experience has been like.
1:14:55
SPEAKER_07: And against looking at grown men, you know, wiping their tears, and yeah, yeah.
1:15:00
SPEAKER_07: Um really uh made me realize, and people would always say to me, like, don't ever stop sharing.
1:15:07
SPEAKER_07: Because it also helps people as well who may be varying their own story.
1:15:13
SPEAKER_07: We all have a story to tell, I believe.
1:15:16
SPEAKER_07: And um being that space where people feel encouraged, like I could also share.
1:15:23
SPEAKER_07: Like, even when I share stuff on Facebook, like it's not speaking, but it's sharing about your life, and it gives people the the openness to also share what they might so people exchange a lot about themselves just through messages and um yeah, just being vulnerable and opening up yourself in that way, I I think is it's amazing.
1:15:43
Corie: It's interesting because it sounds like the connection there between the coaching and that motivation speaking to get people to respond.
1:15:49
Corie: Yeah, I just want to let you know that if you watch or you listen to this episode to this point and you didn't subscribe yet, you're wicked in real life.
1:15:56
Corie: You have a wicked spirit.
1:15:58
Corie: Do it now, and here now, only wicked to tell people the episode and them ain't long enough, you know.
1:16:02
Corie: Only saying the episodes are long enough, and then when I check it, you're not subscribed to the channel.
1:16:06
Corie: How it could get longer?
1:16:08
Corie: How you're gonna get part two?
1:16:09
Corie: These people are not cheap to bring out here, and all these people behind the cameras, they're expensive.
1:16:14
Corie: If not in cash, on my psyche, they're very, very expensive.
1:16:19
Corie: So there's the thing, right?
1:16:20
Corie: We we agree that we're in a doctor, lawyer, engineer society, right?
1:16:24
Corie: But when I see you talk about yoga, you light up.
1:16:27
Corie: And then motivational speaking, it lights up, and then coaching, it lights up.
1:16:30
Corie: So you have to any partner.
1:16:32
Corie: You lighting up there still, I know that at when you left SACs, you went straight into UE to do law.
1:16:37
SPEAKER_07: Yes.
1:16:37
SPEAKER_07: So I started at yeah, first year in Santa Gustin.
1:16:43
SPEAKER_07: And then two years at uh Barbados.
1:16:47
SPEAKER_00: Right.
1:16:47
SPEAKER_07: And then I came back to Trinidad for the LEC, which is at Hewiden Law School.
1:16:52
Corie: Gotcha.
1:16:53
SPEAKER_07: So it's a five-year program.
1:16:54
SPEAKER_07: Then you call to the bar.
1:16:55
Corie: Well, I assume at that time you still have that desire building for law you wanted that.
1:16:59
Corie: So that's where you wanted from small, right?
1:17:00
Corie: Yes, yeah.
1:17:01
SPEAKER_07: Like maybe like I was five, six around six years.
1:17:03
Corie: Oh, as early as that.
1:17:04
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, really early.
1:17:06
SPEAKER_07: Um so yeah, I was having a great time.
1:17:09
SPEAKER_07: I think in my 20s, I loved it.
1:17:10
SPEAKER_07: I still love it.
1:17:11
SPEAKER_07: Like I'm currently at Equal Opportunity Tribunal.
1:17:14
SPEAKER_07: I I love being in court.
1:17:15
SPEAKER_07: I love serving um in the justice system that you know I worked all these years in.
1:17:21
SPEAKER_07: Um I love being in a courtroom.
1:17:24
SPEAKER_07: I still enjoy it very much.
1:17:26
SPEAKER_07: Um, but it feels it's a different, I think it's a different feeling.
1:17:31
SPEAKER_07: Um and I'm able to sense into that because I I I've been in different spaces, meaning at the same time I'm I'm an attorney, but I also like so, for example, I may have court on one day and in the evening I may coach somebody, I notice a difference in how I feel.
1:17:46
SPEAKER_07: You know, the sense of joy or fulfillment, it's it's very different.
1:17:51
SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
1:17:52
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I I continue to serve because I enjoy it, I I love it, I I'm committed to it.
1:17:58
SPEAKER_07: Um but yeah, I was in private practice some years, which I think was the most stressful years.
1:18:03
SPEAKER_02: It was.
1:18:04
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, it was.
1:18:04
SPEAKER_07: I mean, at I first started at the police complaints authority, and that was pretty, that was decent.
1:18:08
SPEAKER_07: It is?
1:18:09
SPEAKER_07: That was lovely, yeah.
1:18:10
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, it wasn't as as stressful, I would say, as when I decided to take that step out into private practice.
1:18:15
SPEAKER_07: I was six years cold at the time, so coming out into private practice, it's a completely different space, a different environment.
1:18:23
SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
1:18:23
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I managed well because uh I was a lot in survival then.
1:18:28
SPEAKER_07: So when you're in survival, yeah, yeah, yeah.
1:18:30
SPEAKER_07: So it goes, right?
1:18:31
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, you're you're enjoying it, you love it, yeah.
1:18:34
SPEAKER_07: So um, but then as I said, when I had that complete break-in moment was where I feel like I couldn't couldn't live that way anymore.
1:18:42
SPEAKER_07: Like that just didn't feel aligned to who I wanted to be.
1:18:46
SPEAKER_07: And I was shifting as a as I was shifting away from that, that's when I I in 2021 when I received that appointment from the former uh president to serve at Equal Opportunity Travula.
1:19:01
SPEAKER_07: And that's when um my work deepened, not as an attorney, but my inner work deepened because I I I was stripped of my job and stripped of my salary.
1:19:13
SPEAKER_07: And um every feeling of of rejection and I'm not saying that was done to me, I'm saying that's how I felt, yeah, of rejection and of um shame and fear and the sense that I didn't belong in a specific place, although I had I had the appointment.
1:19:34
SPEAKER_07: Um which again stemmed from my childhood, from Azalea's boot.
1:19:39
SPEAKER_07: So that experience brought me back to yeah, all the way back.
1:19:44
SPEAKER_07: It was horrifying.
1:19:45
SPEAKER_07: Like the most painful experience.
1:19:47
SPEAKER_07: It was very public.
1:19:48
SPEAKER_07: And to the public, I wasn't.
1:19:51
Corie: So I have people here who other attorneys might be Lou Lyons from Freezer and Collective, Wendy Fitzwilliam.
1:19:56
Corie: They are public, like they went, they chose to be in a life that is public.
1:20:01
Corie: Oh no, it is for you every time you're gonna be able to do it.
1:20:02
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I definitely didn't choose it.
1:20:03
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
1:20:04
SPEAKER_07: Actually, I had no idea that that would even be publicized.
1:20:06
SPEAKER_07: I had no idea.
1:20:07
Corie: I like I was like, Well, at this stage, you had a nose.
1:20:12
SPEAKER_07: I was literally in my bed scrolling, like on my phone.
1:20:14
Corie: Oh.
1:20:15
SPEAKER_07: And it was just after 12, and I I saw the front page of the newspaper, but it was me.
1:20:21
SPEAKER_07: It was me with this huge headline, give me my job.
1:20:24
SPEAKER_07: I had no idea that that was going to be out.
1:20:26
SPEAKER_07: Like I have not whatsoever.
1:20:28
SPEAKER_07: Um, and then it became public knowledge that I received the appointment, but I was not actually actively serving.
1:20:36
SPEAKER_07: Um, so to the public's eye, that was almost like a battle between me and, you know, the establishment.
1:20:44
SPEAKER_07: But for me, it was more of an internal battle because I was battling with my own wounding and my own, like what that brought up for me.
1:20:52
SPEAKER_07: I like I recall when I first received that letter basically saying that like we can't have you here, we we aren't able to support you, we don't have the resources for you.
1:21:01
SPEAKER_07: Um, I mean, that letter was drenched in tears because it it was not so much about what was happening in in that moment, like the present circumstance, but it took me back to a very old ancient pain I had that I didn't even know existed in me, you know?
1:21:17
SPEAKER_07: Um, but that situation I think it was meant to unfold the way it did, because it it brought me to who I am now.
1:21:24
SPEAKER_07: It brought me to this space, to this room, to being here and able to have the capacity to now speak like it helped me to find my voice because it literally felt like I was being silenced.
1:21:37
SPEAKER_07: And um that's something that I had not found any for all my life.
1:21:41
SPEAKER_07: Like I my voice was basically buried.
1:21:44
SPEAKER_07: Um so making a decision to, you know, to take legal action and speak up.
1:21:50
SPEAKER_07: But it was more just not just about me, but just like the message that we sent to society of who belongs in what places, you know.
1:21:57
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I needed to believe that I belonged there too, because I didn't.
1:22:01
Corie: It's a strange thing because as a lawyer by this time, you're advocating for people all the time.
1:22:04
Corie: This is your thing.
1:22:05
SPEAKER_07: Oh, and oh of course.
1:22:06
SPEAKER_07: We we we master as you, not even as though as anyone is sometimes we say, like, I it's so easy for me to advise someone else or stand up for someone else, but when it comes to myself, like I can't.
1:22:17
SPEAKER_07: Because, and again, that comes from from child, that in itself is a trauma response, like being able to seek out um or uh guide others, but just at the expense of your own self, abandoning your own self because you learn somewhere along the lines that your needs aren't really that important.
1:22:34
SPEAKER_07: You know, so having yeah, that experience and even just being placed on the job thereafter was in itself another experience because you're now working in an establishment where you know, like um you just carry so good.
1:22:47
SPEAKER_07: Correct.
1:22:48
SPEAKER_07: So it's uh it's yeah, it was not an easy task, an easy time, but um yeah, but I I think now when I'm faced with any challenge, it's like you know, what is my work here?
1:23:03
SPEAKER_07: What am I needing to to look within myself?
1:23:06
SPEAKER_07: How like what's happening for me as opposed to what's happening outside?
1:23:09
SPEAKER_07: Like it was uh it was a really dark time, but I think that darkness brought forth my light.
1:23:15
SPEAKER_07: It did.
1:23:16
Corie: How about you?
1:23:16
Corie: How about you?
1:23:17
Corie: Are you enjoying it now?
1:23:17
Corie: You're still in it?
1:23:18
SPEAKER_07: Yes, I am there, and I I mean I was committed from from the very first moment I was appointed, and I continue to be.
1:23:25
SPEAKER_07: And um, I I enjoy it.
1:23:27
SPEAKER_07: I'm there, yeah.
1:23:28
Corie: So you're gonna stay doing this or you're gonna turn yogi and motivational speaker full-time and say, Oh, I want to say that I like it.
1:23:34
Corie: Just ask him.
1:23:34
Corie: Just ask him.
1:23:36
SPEAKER_02: I think you're like the friend of like this abundance of them things versus this thing.
1:23:41
SPEAKER_07: Um, I think ideally, I so it's very difficult to meet.
1:23:44
SPEAKER_07: Like sometimes people ask, like, what's your five-year plan?
1:23:46
SPEAKER_07: Where do you see yourself in five years?
1:23:48
SPEAKER_07: I think because five years ago I would not have seen myself where I am now, it's very difficult for me to say where I might be five years.
1:23:55
SPEAKER_07: Because um I think my sincere desire and uh my sincere prayer has always been like, um, like whatever I'm in whatever way I'm meant to serve or how I'm meant to live, like I my sincere desires that that would come through me.
1:24:11
SPEAKER_07: And I think because I've asked for that so sincerely, the the ways that I'm meant to serve has been literally coming to me and unfolding.
1:24:19
SPEAKER_07: But intentionally, I would say my plan is really to build my personal brand.
1:24:25
SPEAKER_07: Um, because it's where I feel most called.
1:24:29
SPEAKER_07: Um and I do feel I could strike that balance between being in the courtroom as I currently am and serving in those ways as well.
1:24:38
Corie: For you personally, you could finally.
1:24:40
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
1:24:40
SPEAKER_07: I I do I maybe perhaps in years to come, I would be full coach, full speaker, full yogi.
1:24:48
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:24:50
SPEAKER_07: Um, I could see that as a genuine possibility as well.
1:24:54
SPEAKER_07: Um but I, you know, I'm taking it one step at a time.
1:24:59
SPEAKER_07: But yes, my focus has been on building this brand and really showing up in a way that I believe I'm meant to show up.
1:25:07
Corie: Oh, which for building the personal brand.
1:25:09
Corie: We find it, you know what I mean?
1:25:10
Corie: It's nice to nice.
1:25:12
Corie: But I have to ask you before we wrap up, I don't find all this police complaints authority thing.
1:25:16
Corie: Because when I hear that, that those songs like fun, those songs enjoyable to me, it's like it feels like a place where there's a litany of woes.
1:25:24
Corie: Like, I don't see what what comes through the police complaints authority that you have to do.
1:25:27
Corie: Is it the public complaints?
1:25:28
SPEAKER_07: Yes, yes, yes.
1:25:29
SPEAKER_07: So we so I was there for six years as a as an attendant.
1:25:33
SPEAKER_07: That's when I that's my very first job.
1:25:35
SPEAKER_07: Um, so yeah, they're it's an independent body and they bring they basically um on the legislation they are designed to treat independently with complaints that come forth from the public against police officers.
1:25:50
SPEAKER_07: And this could be uh uh criminal offences that maybe they may be committing.
1:25:58
SPEAKER_07: It could be something as simple as you know, as neglect.
1:26:01
SPEAKER_07: Um they deal with a lot of police shootings.
1:26:04
SPEAKER_07: Um I mean, I was in there for a long time.
1:26:07
SPEAKER_07: I have I I'm not certain how they have evolved, uh, but I know they had changes to legislation and so on.
1:26:13
SPEAKER_07: So, but when I was there, I would say um we did get a lot of complaints and um but I think the the final result in terms of what the establishment could achieve um was a bit limited in terms of um how officers could be disciplined and so on.
1:26:34
SPEAKER_07: That I'm not sure how much that has shifted because I already was not paying attention.
1:26:38
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
1:26:38
SPEAKER_07: But um, but I knew when I was there that was a bit limited.
1:26:42
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:26:42
SPEAKER_07: But I enjoyed doing it.
1:26:44
SPEAKER_07: I I enjoyed my time there, but I was ready for for some change, you know?
1:26:47
Corie: Yeah, I really asked because of the same thing you said.
1:26:49
Corie: Like I've seen, I mean, I'm not the best at keeping up with current affairs, but I tend to see, and maybe it's just not me paying enough attention, I tend to see issues go into police complaints authority publicly.
1:26:59
Corie: Like you'll see everybody down.
1:27:00
Corie: Yes, they're investigating that.
1:27:03
Corie: It's not a we in a space with the police and the public now where lack of trust might be a bit all there on both on both ends.
1:27:13
SPEAKER_02: Yes, yeah.
1:27:14
Corie: Especially, I mean, just this morning before we came here looking at this thing where this young lady is back in the country.
1:27:20
Corie: Yes, they'd give me assurances.
1:27:21
Corie: You all say assurances a lot, you know, Tunis.
1:27:23
Corie: You say good assurances a lot.
1:27:25
SPEAKER_08: I didn't say it for the last, I don't know how long we've been here.
1:27:31
Corie: But she said, and then and then when she came, she found all the girls already arrested.
1:27:34
Corie: So that that erosion of trust between the public and the police.
1:27:37
Corie: And the police are such an important institution in the country.
1:27:39
Corie: Yes.
1:27:40
Corie: So you see, when people make complaints, it goes in.
1:27:42
Corie: It's a big public thing.
1:27:43
Corie: But I have not seen a lot of resolution.
1:27:45
Corie: So it's not like if I see, okay, we made this complaint and now, hey, we get this thing resolved.
1:27:49
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I think the view generally is that the authority may be a bit toothless in that sense.
1:27:53
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I know they will.
1:27:56
SPEAKER_07: I'm not sure if it happened already, but they're there meant to be changes to the In that regard.
1:28:02
SPEAKER_07: So yeah.
1:28:03
Corie: Okay.
1:28:03
Corie: Sorry with you.
1:28:04
Corie: So having done all this in as as life of utility or many, many things in terms of future for you, it's on building your personal brand, keeping keeping that.
1:28:16
Corie: And it's not private practice, case.
1:28:18
Corie: Oh, I'm never.
1:28:20
SPEAKER_07: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
1:28:22
SPEAKER_07: I just tell you I want an easy life, dude.
1:28:24
SPEAKER_07: I don't know.
1:28:26
SPEAKER_07: Nothing about that is that.
1:28:27
Corie: What kind of thought was it was corporate law or what?
1:28:29
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, well, I did my master's in corporate and commercial law.
1:28:31
SPEAKER_07: Right.
1:28:32
SPEAKER_07: So I did corporate work, but I also did civil.
1:28:34
SPEAKER_07: I I've never done criminal matters.
1:28:37
SPEAKER_07: But I would do mostly uh civil matters.
1:28:40
SPEAKER_07: I did non-contentious, like probe, swill.
1:28:43
Corie: Yeah, land.
1:28:45
SPEAKER_07: If I got joy, joy in that uh I I well I genuinely enjoyed it at that time.
1:28:51
SPEAKER_07: I I just can't see myself being there again.
1:28:53
SPEAKER_07: No, no, no, no, no, please.
1:28:55
SPEAKER_07: No, no, no, no.
1:28:56
SPEAKER_07: I can't go back to that life.
1:28:58
SPEAKER_07: Like, I can't go back to that life.
1:29:00
SPEAKER_07: Listen, no, no, no, no.
1:29:04
SPEAKER_07: I can't.
1:29:05
Corie: It's a personal brand it is.
1:29:06
Corie: And the five jobs.
1:29:08
Corie: Do you have anything else to add to this?
1:29:10
Corie: Do you have any other pursuits that we should look forward to from you?
1:29:13
Corie: Any that you can identify?
1:29:14
SPEAKER_07: No, I mean I'm doing voca classes, but I don't turn on being like a professional singer, but I love singing.
1:29:19
SPEAKER_02: Can you release a song come true?
1:29:21
SPEAKER_02: Stop! You can book this again one time.
1:29:24
SPEAKER_07: I um I used to sing a lot like as a child.
1:29:27
SPEAKER_02: Right.
1:29:28
SPEAKER_07: And then I just stopped because, of course, as I said, life just sucked the joy out of me.
1:29:35
SPEAKER_06: I was just like frightened to survive.
1:29:38
SPEAKER_06: So I just kind of lost, as I said, like I lost my voice literally.
1:29:41
SPEAKER_07: Like so I just kind of stopped singing.
1:29:42
SPEAKER_07: I stopped doing things that felt or brought me joy.
1:29:47
SPEAKER_07: And uh like I think when I started back therapy, my therapist was kind of like, what did you enjoy doing?
1:29:52
SPEAKER_07: Like just to being able to connect with your younger self a bit more, and then I started singing.
1:29:56
SPEAKER_07: But it's amazing how like my own spiritual journey like changes even in in my voice, like my voice changed.
1:30:02
SPEAKER_07: Even like in for yoga, like uh like I now sound different.
1:30:08
SPEAKER_07: And um, so yeah, I recently started like vocal classes.
1:30:13
SPEAKER_07: I enjoy singing.
1:30:14
SPEAKER_02: So please don't ask me to say quiet.
1:30:19
SPEAKER_08: I realize you realize I suited it.
1:30:22
Corie: Pressure only means it no, thank you.
1:30:26
Corie: Whatever you're working on, we have an open space.
1:30:28
Corie: You can come in anytime whenever you release a song.
1:30:31
Corie: No pressure whenever you do it.
1:30:32
Corie: But before we we're gonna invite Vera back, right?
1:30:35
Corie: But before we do, I'm committing myself and David West to come to one year.
1:30:39
Corie: No way.
1:30:40
Corie: We're coming on, we're coming on David being that.
1:30:42
SPEAKER_07: Don't make promises you can't keep.
1:30:44
Corie: Uh no, I always make promises I can't keep.
1:30:46
Corie: That's what we're doing.
1:30:47
Corie: No, no, no, no, no.
1:30:48
Corie: I just make a whole lot of promises.
1:30:49
SPEAKER_06: I will send you back to therapy.
1:30:51
SPEAKER_06: I will make you sit back.
1:30:53
Corie: I don't choose which one of these things I could connect with you on because the attorney ain't doing private practice.
1:30:57
Corie: I'm not sure if it's situated coaching sessions, Rogers.
1:30:59
Corie: I don't tell my looking terrier either and hold it together.
1:31:02
Corie: So the yoga it is.
1:31:05
SPEAKER_06: I am holding you.
1:31:07
SPEAKER_06: I'm holding that.
1:31:09
SPEAKER_06: You're gonna be breeding louder.
1:31:10
SPEAKER_06: I feel like you might you might be the loud breeder.
1:31:14
SPEAKER_01: 100%.
1:31:15
SPEAKER_01: But thank you very much.
1:31:16
SPEAKER_01: This was a pleasure.
1:31:17
SPEAKER_06: It was lovely.
1:31:18
SPEAKER_06: Thank you so much.
1:31:18
SPEAKER_01: Ladies and gentlemen, it's very.