Latest / Safe Aerospace Podcast / Test Pilot Watched a 300-Foot Black Triangle Blot Out the Stars Over Edwards | Dan Isbell Part 2

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Test Pilot Watched a 300-Foot Black Triangle Blot Out the Stars Over Edwards | Dan Isbell Part 2 · Safe Aerospace Podcast

0:00
They started winking out in the shape of a huge triangle,
0:03
and it was just blackness.
0:04
The thing had no color to it, no lights, just it blanked out
0:08
all the stars as it went over
0:09
me, and I didn't know if I
0:11
maybe felt a little electrostatic energy from it,
0:13
or it was just chill bumps because this thing was massive.
0:17
Oh, how big was it in your field of view?
0:19
If I put a number on it, I would say maybe.
0:21
Maybe it was 300ft wide.
0:23
So 1980. Now jump to 1990.
0:25
And I'm an instructor at the test pilot school
0:28
and also had a pretty fast motorcycle that I liked to go
0:32
right out in the evening.
0:33
And I would write out there was a road that
0:35
went toward the south based gate this one particular night.
0:37
I'm just watching this beautiful
0:39
canopy of stars over me in from behind me.
0:43
They started winking out in the shape of a huge triangle.
0:47
Very sharp corner on the front.
0:48
Just quietly moved on, didn't accelerate,
0:50
did nothing, but it was going so slow.
0:53
It was shocking.
0:54
And I did have a chance to go talk to George Knapp.
0:58
And when it got to that third one, George Knapp, who sitting
1:02
kind of at the end of the table and Jeremy's here beside me.
1:06
And after that third event that I just described,
1:09
George Knapp leaned in across the table
1:11
and looked me eyeball to eyeball. And he said.
1:27
Welcome back to the
1:28
Safe Aerospace Podcast and part two with my two part series
1:31
with Dan Isbell, former Air Force pilot turned test pilot.
1:36
For the first time, we're bringing you
1:37
all the details of the encounters
1:39
that Dan has been through throughout his life.
1:41
The safe aerospace community has grown rapidly
1:43
over the past couple of months since we started this podcast.
1:46
If you want more of this content,
1:48
please like and subscribe to this channel.
1:49
It really helps us out.
1:51
And now on the part two with Dan.
1:53
So 1980 now jumped in 1990.
1:56
And I'm an instructor
1:57
at the test pilot school of one of my favorite jobs.
2:00
I would have stayed there ten years if they would let me.
2:02
If you've ever been out there
2:03
or maybe a China leg, probably the same thing
2:07
when you're out at night.
2:08
There's no clouds, there's no humidity,
2:10
and you can see the Milky Way like amazing.
2:13
It's like an astronomy observatory.
2:16
And I also had a
2:18
pretty fast motorcycle that I like to go
2:21
right out in the evening.
2:22
And, and I would write out there was a road
2:24
that went toward the south base gate.
2:25
It's a long way down to the gate.
2:27
So it went by the
2:28
classified South base, which is just south of regular,
2:32
and there's also a north base
2:34
that was more NASA, Dryden and classified stuff there.
2:37
Then the main base
2:38
had had more like, okay, not super classified,
2:41
but still maybe some secret stuff.
2:43
And the South Base is where we had tested the B-2 after,
2:46
and I was accidentally caught it on video
2:49
when I was making a movie on the very first flight.
2:52
It took off, and then I got stopped
2:53
by the Aussie after we landed.
2:55
But anyway, the,
2:57
the right
2:58
out there, I would go out and just look at the stars
3:00
for a little while before I went to bed.
3:02
And this one particular night, I'm just watching this beautiful
3:07
canopy of stars over me and from behind me.
3:11
They started winking out in the shape of a huge triangle.
3:15
And it was just blackness.
3:17
This thing had no color to it, no lights, just
3:20
it blanked out all the stars as it went over me,
3:23
and it gave me chill bumps.
3:26
And I didn't know if I
3:27
maybe felt a little electrostatic energy from it.
3:30
Or it was just chill moms, because this thing was massive.
3:34
I can't estimate its full size because I don't know
3:36
exactly how high it was, but it seemed to be pretty low.
3:40
How big was it in your field of view?
3:41
Oh, it took one side to side tip dip.
3:45
Oh, really?
3:45
Yeah, it was out there. It was really, really big.
3:48
So if I put a number on it I would say maybe,
3:51
maybe it was 300ft wide. It was huge.
3:54
Triangular.
3:56
Yeah.
3:56
Perfectly triangular.
3:59
Very sharp corner on the front.
4:02
And here I'm on, I'm on, I'm
4:04
on the government property of the base and the range.
4:08
And so I didn't tell anybody about that one because
4:12
I didn't know if that was something
4:13
we were reverse engineering
4:14
and why we would be flying it there.
4:16
I don't know.
4:17
No sound I assume. No sound. Yeah.
4:20
This one did not have any
4:22
like a luminescence around the edges and all like
4:24
the one I'd experienced in the in the UK.
4:27
So I didn't know what it was,
4:31
but I'd already got kind of in trouble with the ozone
4:34
for one of the Friday nights before that.
4:38
I just always coming up with stuff in my mind,
4:40
and I'd come up with a way to make airplanes
4:43
invisible visually, not just illuminating radar.
4:47
And I kind of thought it
4:48
through mathematically and how it could be done,
4:51
and I didn't think anything about it.
4:53
But we were just, you know,
4:54
having with the students
4:55
who would usually go over to the officer's club
4:57
a little bit and kind of blow off steam on a Friday night.
5:01
And I was just talking to him about it.
5:02
Theoretically, nothing. I knew about it.
5:04
And suddenly guys come up in suits
5:07
and they grabbed me by the shows and said, sir,
5:09
come with miss, come with us.
5:10
And they take me off to a private room.
5:13
And they, they said,
5:16
how do you know about this?
5:18
I said, no, about what?
5:20
And he said, what you were talking about.
5:21
Could you just told me because.
5:23
You just said, I don't know anything about it.
5:25
I just did something in my head
5:27
and they said, don't ever talking about again,
5:29
because we got a program trying to do that right now.
5:31
I said, oh, well, I didn't know.
5:34
So finally, you know, they took that as my word
5:38
because they knew.
5:38
I'm an honorable officer and doing good,
5:41
and I never talked to us all about it again.
5:42
I still haven't told anybody what I was theorizing about
5:45
because because what they said, don't ever talk about it again.
5:48
So I certainly wouldn't go and talk about
5:50
this thing that came over my head,
5:53
especially while I'm doing the favorite job
5:54
I never had teaching test pilot students. That was so much fun.
5:57
My goal was always to make them a better test pilot
6:00
than I ever was.
6:00
If I could achieve them,
6:02
and they could master these flight test techniques
6:04
to perfection. That's what gave me joy.
6:07
And so I really love teaching.
6:09
And I wasn't about to jeopardize that job,
6:12
because if it was something that wasn't supposed to be seen
6:16
and I
6:16
shouldn't have been out there
6:17
and I shouldn't talk about it,
6:19
that would have been a ball of worms
6:21
I didn't want to get into.
6:22
So I already had that experience, that.
6:24
How'd that experience ended?
6:26
It just continue to fly past you and went out of sight.
6:31
Just quietly moved on.
6:32
Didn't accelerate, did nothing. Just.
6:35
But it was going so slow.
6:37
It was shocking.
6:38
Again, like the first experience.
6:40
How does it do that without projecting anything I can hear
6:44
there's nothing there that makes sense to me.
6:48
So there's got to be a different propulsion system to do that.
6:52
And I don't know, you know,
6:53
I've seen some of the stuff
6:54
about tier three B's and some of the things
6:56
they've talked about with doing how that would work.
6:58
And I don't know if any of that's true or not,
7:00
if it's all just stuff, the money, the waters.
7:02
But whatever this thing was doing was very unusual.
7:05
And again,
7:07
this was a perfect triangle and not as small as the one
7:09
I'd seen in the UK, but it didn't have a curved front.
7:13
It had a pointy front and pointy ends, but it was huge.
7:19
So I just decided I'd had enough for that night.
7:22
And I got back on my motorcycle, went back and went to bed
7:25
and didn't tell a soul, didn't
7:26
tell my wife, didn't tell anybody.
7:27
So that's the second one I had.
7:29
And that's really kind of the the full story of it.
7:32
And I know other people have had experiences
7:34
where something just blanks out the stars.
7:36
Yeah, I've heard very similar things as well.
7:38
Yeah, yeah. So I can't say that that's a
7:42
an alien craft or anything like that.
7:43
I don't know what it was.
7:45
It could have been something we were testing
7:46
because we tested lots of other stuff out there,
7:49
but I would have thought
7:50
if it was something we were testing,
7:51
it would probably have been better up at area 51.
7:54
Yeah.
7:55
So again, what was it? No idea.
7:58
But it it really was weirded me out that wait a minute.
8:02
I've had two
8:03
fairly close encounters with these things now. Why?
8:07
Why me?
8:08
Not everybody had it.
8:09
Or at least certainly nobody talked about it.
8:11
If they did.
8:12
Did it go, like right over your head or was it offset?
8:15
Literally? Yeah. Right over me.
8:18
Almost like it was intentional
8:20
because I'm the only thing out there.
8:21
I mean,
8:22
you get far enough down the south based South Gate Road,
8:27
and you just have the dry lake bed and you have
8:30
some mounted desert deserti stuff.
8:33
But the lights of the main base are no longer
8:35
creating a visual problem because, I mean,
8:38
you know, street
8:38
lights and runway and lights and all that stuff.
8:41
You can't really see the sky real good
8:43
unless you get out their ways.
8:45
So I'd always get out there ways where
8:47
now I don't have anything.
8:48
It's just like quiet.
8:50
And that was my favorite place to go.
8:52
Stargaze.
8:53
And I did that pretty often, just kind of in the in the day.
8:55
I've always done that since I was a child.
8:57
Just real quick.
8:58
I mean, the object size that you're talking about.
9:01
I mean, you wouldn't even be able to put that in a hangar.
9:03
No. Right. No.
9:06
So a one test object, I mean, one of my hypothesize
9:10
that it was an inflatable
9:12
in some way, right, with a rigid structure,
9:16
with some almost Vantablack
9:18
type capability, where it's just absorbing as much light
9:21
as as physically possible in order to avoid reflections.
9:25
Right.
9:25
Because even on even on a starlight provides
9:29
more than enough light against a normal object
9:32
to typically be able to at least pick out the skin of it.
9:34
You know,
9:35
coming in the land at a carrier in the,
9:37
you know, the middle of the ocean,
9:39
you know, if you got starlight, that's a bright night.
9:41
But if there's an overcast layer at 8000ft or something,
9:44
it can be like having your eyes closed out there.
9:46
Yeah. For sure.
9:48
So, I mean, you'd need, you know,
9:49
it can't just be a normal black object.
9:51
It would have to really be absorbing as much as possible.
9:55
Or. Or
9:57
it would be utilizing some
9:58
what I call optical stealth technology.
10:01
And maybe, you know, there's two ways of thinking about that.
10:03
Maybe it
10:04
does, you know, operates in a way that you just described
10:08
where you can't see what's behind it.
10:11
A lot of
10:12
optical stealth technologies, other,
10:14
other ways of implementing that, that I could imagine
10:16
would basically still allow you to see what's behind the craft.
10:19
Right?
10:19
You'd basically be,
10:20
you know,
10:20
almost piping the light from behind it
10:23
and ejecting it out the front in some way. Right.
10:25
So you would still see like stars going,
10:28
you know, see the stars behind it.
10:29
If this was a human technology, it would.
10:31
Either have some kind of massive,
10:33
massive hangar system to store or it was inflatable using
10:37
some type of Vanth,
10:38
the black style or optical stealth technology.
10:42
And on top of all that, you know, potentially
10:45
some type of propulsion system that doesn't any any audio.
10:49
So I don't know.
10:50
It's all
10:51
no answers there, obviously, but just kind of trying
10:54
to describe the scope of why that's so weird.
10:56
Yeah, it was weird.
10:57
It definitely gave me chill bumps
11:00
because that was so large, you know, and like.
11:03
Chill bumps or was it, you know,
11:04
some kind of electrostatic field.
11:06
Could have been electrostatic field.
11:07
See, I don't know which because I just know I was tingly.
11:11
My my arms felt tingly.
11:12
And that kind of encouraged me to get on my motorcycle and get
11:15
out of there,
11:17
just go away.
11:18
Because it was
11:18
another one of those things that I didn't want to get caught
11:22
seeing it, and I didn't want anybody to know about it
11:26
for all the reasons we've talked about.
11:28
You got one more, don't you?
11:30
I actually have two. Two more.
11:31
So snap forward now, this time to about 2014.
11:39
I'm living in Silver Springs,
11:42
Florida,
11:44
so now I'm across the country
11:47
and I've got this amazingly secluded property where it's
11:51
like quiet because it's so far away from any kind of lights.
11:55
I'm by the Ocala National Forest and the river
11:59
and out to the back of our place, we had a hot tub
12:02
that we liked to go to that was in a very light,
12:05
quiet place and had an open view of the sky.
12:09
And in November,
12:10
me and my wife, November in Florida.
12:13
Sometimes you have just
12:15
amazingly clear nights in a place like that,
12:18
and you could see the Milky Way again.
12:20
And I used to just sit like lounge back in the hot tub
12:24
and enjoy
12:25
looking at the stars, seeing how many satellites I could see
12:29
because they're very detectable and they're very predictable
12:33
and had seen nothing all that time.
12:35
My wife
12:35
finally she was getting a little shriveled
12:37
on my go in and shower off and get in the bed.
12:40
I said, okay,
12:41
I think I'm gonna stay out a little bit longer
12:43
because this is the perfect night.
12:44
I'm just enjoying stargazing.
12:46
So she went in, I stayed out, and I still didn't see anything
12:50
except an occasional satellite, maybe a
12:52
shooting star here or there.
12:55
And then I decided, okay, I'm getting shriveled.
12:58
So I got out of the hot tub and grabbed my towel.
13:00
And about the time I'm
13:01
telling off, standing right by the hot tub,
13:05
I'm surrounded
13:07
and a perfectly circular beam of a color.
13:11
I would say it's like cyan, but it wasn't fully blended.
13:14
It was a little speckling,
13:15
but it was a bluish greenish light, a beam.
13:19
And at first I'm thinking, is there somebody out here on this?
13:22
Just a nice property that's like trying to pull a prank on me.
13:26
And so I look around horizontally and there's
13:29
nothing anywhere.
13:30
There's no sound, there's nothing.
13:32
And then I start looking at this thing.
13:34
It's encompassing me in the hot tub.
13:37
It's reflecting off these white base rocks we had there onto.
13:41
We had a shed right there,
13:44
but otherwise it's
13:45
like very concentrated.
13:48
And so I realized, well, it's almost perfectly circular.
13:51
So it's got to be coming from above.
13:54
And then when I look up, I'm looking
13:55
right up the beam and it comes to a point.
13:58
But because it wasn't too bright to hurt my eyes, but it was,
14:03
I couldn't really tell anything about the craft,
14:06
but it was something up above me that had just illuminated me
14:11
was no sound.
14:12
Again, it wasn't a helicopter,
14:14
wasn't like a helicopter searchlight.
14:15
That would have really been blinding.
14:17
Yeah, it was like a defocus laser.
14:20
If you've ever worked with lasers
14:21
and you don't have to defocus the beam, it will.
14:24
It won't stay a narrow beam, it'll it'll spread out.
14:27
And you can do that optically.
14:29
And you can size it to be whatever you want it to be.
14:32
Right?
14:32
Because when you defocus it, you can spread the energy around
14:35
it, still collimated, but through optics
14:38
you can defocus it.
14:39
So it kind of reminded me of like a defocus laser, but
14:42
it was not a laser like I and ever worked with.
14:45
And again,
14:46
that's I'm doing that job at this point,
14:48
you know, and teaching about it.
14:50
But so that's probably why that came to mind
14:51
is I'm talking directed energy weapons, high power microwaves,
14:54
high energy lasers.
14:56
But when I had the conscious thought looking up the beam,
15:00
I had a conscious thought. That's a craft.
15:03
Instantly the beam went
15:05
out and in place of it, this thing just like, exploded
15:08
into a a ball of white sphere of light.
15:12
Like the light was originating from.
15:14
Yeah, it just like whatever
15:16
it was, was encompassed by this thing.
15:17
It was pretty large.
15:19
And then in quantum steps.
15:22
So it didn't like gradually increased.
15:24
It went from one to the next and then the next.
15:27
Discrete discrete quantum intervals.
15:30
That thing looked like it went to twice
15:33
its size as a sphere.
15:36
And then moments later it did another quantum leap
15:39
to four times the size.
15:41
And when it did that it was huge
15:44
sphere of this whatever this was.
15:47
And you could see the thing start to move.
15:51
The whole thing of light seemed like it started to move,
15:54
but it was accelerating extremely fast
15:56
and in less than half a second had just disappeared.
16:00
Moving toward the west.
16:02
It didn't leave a trail.
16:04
It did traverse. Though, right?
16:06
Like you could tell it.
16:07
He could tell that initial start of movement,
16:09
that acceleration.
16:10
So I saw it start accelerating very quickly.
16:13
And then it just blinked out.
16:15
It just went.
16:17
And I stood there and absolute shock
16:21
and thinking, oh, my wife's going to be sorry she wasn't.
16:24
She went into early to see this.
16:26
I have a feeling it was waiting for her to go inside.
16:28
Maybe it was because there was something about it.
16:30
You know, this fact that my consciousness.
16:33
Because I didn't say anything out loud, my consciousness said,
16:36
that's a craft.
16:38
And as soon as it soon as I did that, it took off the beam
16:41
that was on me.
16:42
And then it let me see it energized.
16:45
I would say those are quantum
16:47
energy leaps that then caused it to just accelerate so fast.
16:51
There was no watching it move away, going faster.
16:54
It was almost instantaneous.
16:56
I only had that
16:57
little bit of a brief window to see the direction.
17:00
It was starting to move in before it just.
17:03
Was out. Yeah. It was like it just turned off.
17:05
How do you I mean, how
17:08
how do you technically interpret that expansion of that light?
17:11
Was it was it a light or did it more appear like a field?
17:14
It was a field, like.
17:16
A. Plasma. Field similar to the other.
17:18
Yeah. This wasn't this wasn't
17:22
it looked like a ball of plasma,
17:24
but it wasn't ionized in the air.
17:27
For whatever reason, I wouldn't seen any color whatsoever.
17:29
It was pure white.
17:31
When this thing turned into this sphere of light,
17:35
it wasn't a bright light.
17:37
I was just aware that it was this white thing.
17:41
But it also didn't look like a ball.
17:43
It had no movement.
17:45
It had energy, like energetic.
17:48
Okay.
17:48
Oh, almost like what
17:50
a like a ball lightning kind of would look like where it it.
17:54
Yeah. Okay. Yeah.
17:56
So it wasn't like a solid object at that point.
17:58
It kind of had fuzzy edges to it.
18:00
You could tell it wasn't just like a, a two dimensional
18:05
silhouette of like a beam of light that got bigger.
18:08
You interpret it as like a three
18:09
dimensional field around whatever.
18:13
There was no light
18:13
hitting the ground at that point because I looked down as well.
18:16
And now the thing that had encircled me,
18:18
you know, and that beam went out.
18:20
This wasn't lighting up anything.
18:22
I wouldn't get any reflections off the rocks or nothing.
18:24
It was just there.
18:26
I don't know how high it was.
18:27
It was certainly above the
18:30
there
18:31
was some really large, maybe 400 year old
18:34
live oak trees that were in not too far away
18:37
from there, but this open patch of sky,
18:39
it had just parked in there
18:40
almost perfectly over the top of the hot tub at that point.
18:44
Never was aware of it when it came in.
18:46
Whatever. When it came in, it must.
18:48
It might have been there for a little while,
18:50
and I just wasn't aware of it because it picked the time
18:53
when I'm out of the tub and in my bath towel
18:57
with my bathing suit on to
19:00
just light me up. And.
19:03
And so there seemed to me to be a purposeful thing.
19:09
And I did have a chance to go talk
19:11
to George Knapp and and,
19:15
Corbell.
19:16
Corbell.
19:16
Actually, Jeremy Corbell knows
19:19
my youngest stepson is a professional musician.
19:21
He performs all over the world.
19:22
And he also does write scores for Hollywood movies.
19:26
So I don't know which element of that was why he was in LA.
19:29
And and I don't know if Jeremy was his friend
19:32
because of his lack
19:33
in his music or like, and some of his movie work.
19:36
But he and Jeremy Corbell were talking one day
19:40
and Jeremy says, hey,
19:41
by the way, have you ever seen anything strange in this guy?
19:44
And he says, no, I haven't, but I think my stepdad has.
19:50
He said, really?
19:52
What? And he said, I don't know.
19:54
He won't talk about it, just that he's seeing things.
19:57
And Jeremy said, well, our
19:59
he think he'd come out here to LA
20:01
and talk to me and George Knapp
20:03
and he said, I don't know, let me call him.
20:04
So he called me up and he said,
20:06
do you want to come out here and talk to them?
20:08
And this was sometime after
20:10
you and I had talked, so I agreed to do so.
20:13
But when I talked to him, I said, look, I'm not ready
20:15
to be on your weaponized show
20:16
or anything like that at this point
20:17
because I'm still teaching this, this stuff, but
20:20
I'm willing to share with you all I've got to share.
20:23
And when it got to that third one,
20:26
George Knapp, who's sitting kind of at the end of the table
20:29
and Jeremy's here beside me, and they invited my stepson
20:33
to be there to.
20:34
And his eyes were as big a saucer,
20:36
and he was drowning some whiskey because I was like,
20:39
weird to hear these stories from me for the first time.
20:42
But it was a good bonding moment for us after that,
20:45
after that third event that I just described,
20:48
George Knapp leaned in across the table
20:51
and looked me eyeball to eyeball, and he said,
20:54
they're tracking you.
20:56
That freaked me out.
20:57
I never had thought of that,
20:59
but it kind of made sense that maybe, you know,
21:01
maybe they are, maybe whatever it is.
21:04
Or maybe George, he looks serious
21:06
as a heart attack because he hadn't said much.
21:08
They were just taking it in and taking some notes.
21:11
At that point,
21:12
I kind of stunned me, and I didn't even tell them
21:13
about the fourth encounter I had had,
21:16
which happened after we moved to where we are now.
21:20
But yeah, that we kind of wrapped it up.
21:22
It was late at night when we had this, this thing,
21:26
and then since we were in California.
21:27
Anyway, I took my wife up.
21:28
She she was born,
21:30
not born, and she was born in actually
21:32
Dayton, Ohio, but she was raised in Sacramento.
21:34
And she wanted to go back and see the
21:37
the redwood forest up there in the National Redwood
21:41
National Park on the northern coast of California.
21:45
That was one of her favorite forest hiking.
21:47
And so we took another flight up to San Francisco,
21:50
got a rental car and did all that.
21:51
For a while we were out there,
21:53
but we originally just went into LA because
21:56
Jeremy requested I do so, and they they were good about
22:01
they didn't tell about anything I told them.
22:04
And of course my stuff at that point wasn't very recent.
22:06
So it's not like,
22:07
you know,
22:08
it's it's just current as some of the things
22:10
that they've been hearing.
22:12
But I thought it was good since they asked to tell them
22:15
about it.
22:16
And I never had any more contact
22:18
with them after that because, again,
22:20
they're so far beyond anything like that,
22:23
you know, these kind of encounters.
22:25
So the do you want to hear about the last one?
22:27
The fourth one. Absolutely.
22:30
So we bought a brand new house that was being built.
22:32
As we bought the lot.
22:34
They were expanding in the subdivision.
22:36
What year is this was we got the house in 2016
22:41
and sometime in that year.
22:43
So now
22:44
we've gone from 2014 to 2016 and I've just
22:48
changed locations again.
22:50
So I've moved to the North Tampa Bay area
22:53
from Silver Springs,
22:56
and I'm looking at the back lanai.
22:58
We had sliding glass doors
23:00
looking out the back of the night,
23:01
because there was a retention
23:02
pond that made a huge sea around this set of woods
23:06
and this beautiful woods to look at from our backyard.
23:10
And we didn't have a very deep backyard
23:12
because of the banks and the retention pond.
23:13
And of course, you know, retention ponds are pretty
23:16
necessary thing in Florida.
23:18
And it had some water in it at this point
23:22
because it was, you know, wintertime.
23:23
It was a
23:25
I think around
23:28
March of 2016
23:32
and I just haven't gone to bed yet.
23:33
So I'm just looking at
23:34
and kind of admiring the view best I could see it.
23:37
You know, it's kind of dark.
23:37
And what caught my eye, was there something
23:40
that was this white, luminous thing
23:43
that came out of the northwest sky
23:46
on an angle directly down toward the retention pond,
23:50
and I thought the thing was going to
23:52
whatever was going to smash right in the retention pond.
23:55
But it didn't, as it came screeching down from above,
23:59
it just stopped above the retention pond
24:02
and then kind of started moving pretty quickly down
24:04
the retention pond, made the curve
24:06
slowed down, slowed down, slowed down, and stopped
24:09
right behind my house right where I'm.
24:11
And I'm looking at it.
24:13
I'm on the other side of the sliding glass doors.
24:15
I've got them open, but I'm just looking at it
24:17
and it's just stopped there
24:20
and it was probably ten feet.
24:25
Sphere. That's about like that.
24:27
It could have been less five feet,
24:29
I would estimate, just based on knowing if it was over
24:33
the center of the retention pond.
24:34
It's probably 70ft away.
24:37
But I felt really spooked by this
24:40
because it was just like a ball of plasma.
24:44
I never seen that. Exactly.
24:46
Except the thing that turned into plasma before and off
24:51
was that at one point before it had enough energy to,
24:54
to really move away.
24:55
So I, I kind of connected back to that incident.
25:00
But I didn't take time to see how this thing got out of there.
25:02
All I did was closed the door, draw
25:04
the blinds, step back into my living room and say,
25:07
I hope it doesn't come in here,
25:10
because it kind of freaked me out.
25:11
Yeah. I, I.
25:13
Didn't. Know how to think it.
25:14
Well, yeah.
25:15
And then so when George and said that they're tracking you,
25:20
that hit me. That one.
25:22
I dare not even tell them
25:23
about this incident, because maybe they are.
25:26
That's kind of freaky. I don't like that.
25:29
Understandable.
25:30
Yeah, well.
25:31
But yeah, that.
25:33
Was a white light the whole time.
25:34
Yep. Reflecting on the water, perhaps.
25:36
I don't know if you could see it with the burn but.
25:38
Didn't didn't see a reflection.
25:40
It was just it was white in color.
25:43
It was in shape and it was making no sound whatsoever.
25:48
And when that's truly a UAP, right?
25:51
It's an anomalous phenomenon and no idea what it is.
25:56
But ball lightning doesn't travel like that and stop
25:59
at a point and and just kind of almost like it was intentional.
26:03
Yeah.
26:04
But I
26:05
mean, there weren't many houses built yet beyond where we were.
26:08
They were they were in process of building a lot of those. So
26:12
there wasn't a lot of the
26:13
the neighborhood that later got built in place.
26:16
So it was kind of just quiet thing.
26:18
But of all things, it didn't stop.
26:20
And my neighbor to my left, who was already built
26:22
and occupied, didn't stop anywhere else.
26:25
Stop right there.
26:27
So yeah, I don't have any more insight
26:28
than anybody else about what this is exactly,
26:32
but there's no doubt in my mind
26:34
that something
26:37
is interacting with us,
26:40
whether it's ultra terrestrial and been here
26:43
for millions of years, and it's just now showing itself
26:46
something that's concerned about us developing nuclear weapons
26:51
because we could destroy the whole place.
26:52
And if they're living here in mountains under the oceans,
26:57
I've been very intrigued.
26:59
I about the ocean thing, you know,
27:02
because it seems like there's like 6 or 7 hotspots,
27:06
that where they see the most things.
27:10
And if you think of it, if you were,
27:12
if you're trying to
27:12
kind of hide out and you wanted to be shielded from
27:16
things like a micro nova from our sun or
27:19
a lot of other events that might kind of really
27:23
be destructive.
27:25
I'm being under the ocean makes a lot of sense
27:27
if you have the technology to make that survivable place.
27:31
So I don't, I don't know, there's
27:33
there's a lot of theories now, but it is kind of like, well,
27:35
why are there these 6 or 7 spots that seem to be hot spots
27:40
for us,
27:41
and the fact that they
27:42
can come up out of the ocean and not drip and,
27:46
you know, leave water coming off
27:47
like a physical object, but just come out.
27:50
And now they can do airborne, they can do spaceborne.
27:53
So they have this kind of intermedium
27:57
capability to go trans medium from one to another.
28:02
And I know that
28:04
I know you work with Tim
28:06
Allen bet Rear Admiral
28:09
I listened to some of his stuff and I've been reading his book,
28:12
which is excellent.
28:16
So well written and such a career that guys had.
28:19
And I know he's,
28:19
he's on your board and but I've, I've really paid
28:22
a lot of attention to what he's had to say to you,
28:24
because he's really becoming more open
28:27
about a lot of stuff that he knew about.
28:31
And I find it fascinating because it's,
28:34
it's a kind of thing that you can't pinpoint.
28:36
I mean, back in the day,
28:38
like in the 40s and 50s, it's all about flying saucers.
28:41
We don't hear very much about that shape anymore.
28:45
So what does that mean? And
28:48
and is it capable of something?
28:50
Is that a technology that kind of like a, let's say
28:54
they have technology that they can form this stuff
28:56
almost like they grow it from a single crystal and they
29:00
and they can do the out
29:03
if they can do alchemy to the point that they can
29:06
transmute these materials
29:07
and it just grows the craft of, for whatever purpose.
29:10
Maybe a single purpose. Yeah, yeah.
29:12
Maybe a single purpose.
29:13
Maybe that's why we see different kinds and shapes.
29:16
But what is it?
29:18
Why is it I don't know, it's
29:19
the biggest mystery, I think, of our age right now.
29:22
And that's why I'm very much at this point behind
29:25
getting the word out publicly.
29:27
There are lots of other pilots that I know have had encounters.
29:30
I mean, I don't know, but I'm just in my sense,
29:32
the must have had
29:34
none of my encounters were in airplanes, which is weird.
29:36
But then again, we're doing a lot of night
29:38
flying just on the TFR and stuff,
29:40
and the F-111 even had radiation shields
29:43
you could put up in the front and side.
29:44
Curtains come down, and you wore one eye patch
29:48
in case you got nuclear blinded in spite of all that.
29:50
Oh, wow.
29:51
So you could save one.
29:52
I mean, these were
29:54
these were probably one way missions because
29:56
where are you going to come back to if the if the whole blew.
29:58
Up just matter of time at that point.
30:00
So it was horrifying thing to think of.
30:03
But, you know, it was the job that I was,
30:06
I found myself in, I didn't know before I went to NATO that
30:10
that was going to be part of the mission.
30:13
But it makes sense.
30:14
That's what the airplane was optimized to do.
30:16
We kind of already
30:17
answered this, but I mean, do you think you were singled out?
30:21
I have no idea.
30:23
There's been no you know, I don't have telepathic memories.
30:26
To my knowledge.
30:27
I don't have any implants.
30:28
To my knowledge,
30:28
I've never been taken, have not been an experiencer.
30:33
That's that's actually been taken aboard a ship.
30:36
It sounds like you've had a lot of good ideas.
30:39
Well, I've had a lot of years to think about it,
30:41
and I've got a lot of,
30:43
engineering and advanced education after that.
30:46
Master of science, this, master of science that.
30:49
So it's it's something that just this way
30:51
my mind works is always wanting to analyze this stuff.
30:54
I would love to know my curiosity is insane about it
30:58
now. So I've got I subscribed to so many UAP type channels,
31:03
just looking for nibbles of information to come out
31:07
and trying to assess what's credible and what's not,
31:12
but it's
31:12
it's an
31:13
interesting time to live in when we're not completely encased
31:17
in the stigma zone. Yeah.
31:19
Although there's still some of that.
31:20
There certainly is
31:21
especially I mean, for people that are still active
31:23
duty, are still actively flying. Right.
31:25
The the risk reward ratio is still very skewed
31:29
to the reverse side, of course.
31:30
Yeah.
31:32
But that was going to be, you know,
31:34
perhaps one of my parting questions
31:35
here is just kind of
31:36
your interpretation of how things have been evolving.
31:40
And if you have anything to say
31:42
to pilots that are flying now about what, why or,
31:46
or to help them motivate them to come forward.
31:48
Yeah, I, I do want to say to the pilots that are listening
31:52
and probably
31:54
that there'd be a large share of the audience that watches
31:57
your show for the very nature of what it is.
31:59
Americans for Safe Aerospace.
32:02
I do think it's important that people start to come out
32:06
and if not during their active flying, at least come out
32:09
after they've retired, or if they've got a company
32:13
that finally is willing to allow for this to be publicly known,
32:19
that would be wonderful.
32:20
I understand the stigma that they would feel
32:22
about not wanting to lose their flying career,
32:24
so we share that right.
32:26
We loved flying so much that I wouldn't
32:29
have wanted to jeopardize that and I so I get that.
32:32
But the
32:34
the totality of these encounters needs to be known, because
32:39
I think there probably has been I mean, there's
32:42
some stories of where craft have been hit by something.
32:45
And, you know, clearly
32:48
their technology is not perfect.
32:51
I mean, whatever it is. So
32:53
there is this
32:54
potential and we need to have better abilities
32:59
to determine that these things are out there.
33:02
And as you had mentioned with,
33:05
when you're
33:06
actively electronically scanned, array radar got upgraded,
33:10
suddenly you had this resolving power that was pretty enormous.
33:13
And you're seeing these things out in your training
33:15
training ranges on radar.
33:18
Your radar is
33:19
actually picking the stuff up, which before wasn't.
33:23
I know that most airliners don't
33:26
have that degree of radars, mostly for weather avoidance,
33:30
but yet there are so many pilots that have had these
33:33
eyeball encounters with stuff that's very anomalous.
33:36
And I'm very proud of the ones who have shared their stories,
33:41
because this compendium of total knowledge
33:44
helps us better understand.
33:47
And eventually I think we need some kind of disclosure.
33:51
I mean,
33:51
if we've reverse engineered stuff
33:53
and other adversaries are trying to do the same,
33:57
I feel pretty much the same about that being kept,
34:03
dark.
34:04
But the fact that if we're not alone,
34:07
we need to know that mankind needs to know that.
34:11
And I'm hoping we're approaching the day, maybe even this year,
34:15
when that is revealed at the level of
34:18
maybe the president himself talking about it,
34:22
whether or not we ever reach what full disclosure.
34:24
And I don't want us to go to
34:25
catastrophic disclosure because I don't think
34:30
any insights that we've developed,
34:33
it's like, you know, you can
34:34
you can study nuclear physics in a college thing,
34:38
but they don't teach you how to build a thermonuclear weapon.
34:42
And so I think things like that are better
34:45
kept, from spreading too much.
34:48
And so if we have got a new physics
34:52
that replaces the current standard model physics,
34:56
I'd be excited for that.
34:57
I'm a big proponent of the electric
35:00
universe theories and plasma cosmology,
35:04
because I think that as we're seeing
35:07
some of the images coming back from our more advanced stuff
35:11
like the web and other advanced space telescopes,
35:16
particularly the stuff that's in the infrared,
35:20
and the near infrared,
35:22
there is so much
35:25
confirmation that electrical currents
35:28
are doing these Birkeland current things in the galaxies,
35:32
and that stars may be formed by that, not some gravity collapse
35:37
thermonuclear fusion bomb in the middle of every star.
35:40
That theory has never made a lot of sense to me.
35:43
And now that we know, we measured the temperature
35:46
of the photosphere of the sun,
35:49
and that's only about
35:51
5000 degrees Kelvin, and yet they think
35:54
it's 15 million degrees in the center of the star.
35:57
Why is it so cool in the surface?
36:00
And then why does it go to 2 million, 3 million
36:02
degrees, several million miles out in the corona?
36:06
That's fair.
36:06
That's a
36:07
that's a conundrum that standard Model science doesn't explain.
36:12
And I
36:12
think that that we live in an electric universe.
36:16
Not that that's exclusively it, but I think that's an element
36:21
that if we look at Einstein's theory of general relativity,
36:25
and we think about the times when that thought experiment
36:27
occurred to him, it was a time when the Michelson-Morley
36:31
project had assumed that this ether
36:35
was like a gas thing.
36:37
And when that experiment failed,
36:40
they sort of said, well, there's nothing else in space
36:42
besides gravity, the force of gravity.
36:44
And of course, all of general relativity is built on that,
36:47
and that the whole universe is put together by everything
36:50
attracting or moving apart due to gravitational fields.
36:54
It's not that gravity
36:55
doesn't exist,
36:56
but I think
36:56
there are fundamental forces in the electromagnetic spectrum
37:00
that are like we talked before, ten to the 39th power,
37:03
greater than the force of gravity.
37:05
You can take a little tiny refrigerator magnet
37:08
and have a paper clip on your desk right here,
37:10
and it'll jump off the table.
37:12
Even though all of us gravity is trying to pull it down.
37:14
And so that's just the simplest illustration of it.
37:18
If we've learned how to harness some of that to do similar,
37:22
what these craft, if not as elegant
37:25
as these, craft, that in my mind needs to stay
37:29
secret, that
37:30
needs to stay ultra classified.
37:33
Because imagine if you can harness
37:37
things like zero point energy,
37:40
if zero point energy can be harnessed,
37:42
which would kind of make sense that if it did,
37:45
you have this infinite energy supply to power your craft.
37:49
And it's everywhere.
37:50
It's everywhere we go, it's inside of us.
37:52
Even this quantum field vacuum,
37:55
if that's accessible and a meaningful way,
37:59
it makes sense that there wouldn't be limitations
38:02
on what we could do in terms of travel throughout the universe.
38:06
So if these are from another place in the universe,
38:10
then why couldn't they see the speed of light
38:13
if they if they can cancel mass?
38:15
Because then you basically aren't restricted
38:19
by Einstein's equations in his theories
38:22
and not general relativity, but in special relativity
38:24
when he talks about speed of light can't be exceeded.
38:28
Maybe that's not true.
38:30
Yeah.
38:30
I mean, there are examples of the speed of light
38:33
being exceeded.
38:34
The expansion of the universe is expanding
38:36
faster than the speed of light. Right.
38:39
So there's still a lot of, you know, our physics only
38:42
covers so much of the territory right now.
38:44
There's I agree with you.
38:45
There's much to to continue to uncover.
38:47
And it's always frustrating to hear people
38:50
dismiss this conversation because they want to stay
38:53
within the current scientific paradigm,
38:54
which is only existed for about 110 years or so.
38:59
Right. Another 100 years.
39:01
I think there's going to be a lot of additional
39:04
and new physics that are going to make
39:05
what we understand now seem quite silly in comparison.
39:09
Yeah.
39:09
If you look back through history,
39:11
science has always had these hurdles that it hit.
39:15
You think about the time when it was these fears
39:17
and the or at the center.
39:19
And that was that was standard science.
39:22
And the sun revolves around the Earth,
39:24
and the planets were all around the Earth.
39:25
But then they had to invent
39:27
these equations for doing these little micro curves
39:31
that they had to do the loops because, you know,
39:33
they didn't track. Right.
39:35
And so the epicycles that they put into
39:37
that were just more add
39:39
ons and bandaids to try to keep that alive.
39:42
And it was very heretical to say otherwise.
39:45
And so that's what the Galileo stood up against that, you know,
39:48
and he was viewing the moons that at least the
39:51
what they called
39:52
the Galilean moons, the four large ones
39:54
around Jupiter, which has on and 100 something
39:56
moons circling it.
39:58
But he was visualizing that with a telescope, and
40:03
he had already
40:03
decided that, no, there's not the center of anything.
40:07
We were orbiting around the sun and not not otherwise.
40:10
And the church put him in house
40:13
arrest for the rest of his life.
40:14
And we wouldn't have any of his stuff
40:16
because they were going to burn it all.
40:17
But he sneaked out stuff to the guys
40:19
that brought him food under house arrest.
40:21
And that's the only reason we have
40:23
some of his theories persisting.
40:25
So it's almost like we're going through a period
40:28
now about what standard physics is guarded and
40:31
and they keep adding Band-Aids to it.
40:34
The first time they came up with a black hole theory,
40:37
even Eystein said, that's an abuse of my equations.
40:42
Relativity. Because you are,
40:43
you allow yourself to divide by zero.
40:45
Yeah.
40:45
So you have an infinitely small mass
40:48
or an infinitely large mass and an infinitely small space,
40:52
this whole center of the black hole thing.
40:54
And again,
40:56
if it is actually just a plasmoid of energy,
40:59
electromagnetic energy, and we can create plasmids
41:03
and in a laboratory now and so we know what those are.
41:07
If each galaxy of the A center has a plasmoid, it
41:10
would be dark to us
41:12
and the electromagnetic energy would be radiating out.
41:15
And it seems to do that.
41:16
And the James Webb telescope is showing us images
41:20
that mainstream science can't explain.
41:22
And, and also
41:23
fully formed galaxies way beyond this whole thing.
41:26
So when they came up with the.
41:28
Oh, it's 13.8 million billion years old.
41:31
And then the whole universe was born of this
41:35
explosion when there was nothing.
41:37
Another infinity inside. Right?
41:39
And then they said, oh, well, now we got to fix that.
41:43
So now there was we had to have expansion
41:47
because it had to it had to move out
41:50
greater than the speed of light initially
41:51
because it couldn't explain things otherwise.
41:54
And then when Vera Rubin started looking at distant galaxies
41:58
and noticing, measuring the speed of stars
42:00
because takes a long time to figure that out,
42:02
keep looking at the same galaxy and came out with,
42:05
well, that's not a band.
42:06
Newton's gravitational pull loss.
42:08
So there must be more gravity. Yeah.
42:10
And then they invented not only now we had black holes,
42:14
we had this explosive expansion of the universe.
42:18
We had
42:20
another thing that they were
42:21
doing, which was to take the infrared signature.
42:24
And assuming that's always going to represent Doppler velocity,
42:28
it is. Consistently across time to write.
42:31
It could be variations in these forces.
42:32
There's more than that.
42:33
When every time that a quasar
42:35
is burped out of the center of a galaxy,
42:38
that huge chunk of plasma energy, the quasar
42:42
starts orbiting its parent galaxy.
42:43
But when it comes out, it has an inherent
42:48
signature that's a very huge redshift.
42:52
And then as it ages and becomes more and settled,
42:56
orbiting the galaxy
42:57
like we have, the Large and Small
42:59
Magellanic Clouds are just pair of them
43:01
that we know of orbiting the Milky Way.
43:04
As those become settled out, their redshift
43:07
eventually comes down to exactly
43:09
the galaxies redshift that they were born from.
43:12
So there are these inherent redshifts.
43:15
And even when Hubble was the first to use
43:17
the spectroscopy on a telescope to start
43:21
figuring out these shifts, and that we had the Andromeda
43:24
Galaxy wasn't a star cluster in our galaxy, but something
43:28
far away from us. A couple of what is it?
43:31
2.5 million light years away
43:34
when they first started talking about that,
43:36
we can measure the speed of every galaxy
43:39
by just its redshift, he said.
43:40
I think that's not true.
43:42
That's just that's
43:43
a, I think a misuse of an over categorization of the redshift.
43:48
So he had a guy that was a partner with him
43:51
named Halton ARP
43:54
who went with that, and he started really focusing
43:57
telescope time and showing these quasars that
44:01
that the current theory said, oh, well, there
44:05
they've got to be, you know,
44:07
14 million light years away.
44:11
And this galaxy is like, you know, 4 million
44:14
light years away, but it's in front of the galaxy,
44:16
still kind of tied to the galaxy
44:18
because it had an inherent redshift.
44:21
And when you interpret that always has distance.
44:25
And then when you say, and we can look at the redshift
44:28
and say, okay, and that's that also can tell us speed.
44:31
So we don't really know any of that because
44:34
it depends on that assumption.
44:37
And so then when you say
44:38
well these stars are not rotating correctly.
44:41
So there must be extra mass, extra gravity.
44:44
So they invent a dark energy.
44:47
And what have we been like 20 something years.
44:50
And they have spent $19 billion trying to find out of
44:55
30 different theories of what dark energy is,
44:57
and they've never confirmed any of it.
45:00
And yet we stick with that.
45:02
Well, if you look at if you look at the universe
45:05
and how it would behave if it was an electric universe,
45:09
you don't need any of that because an electric universe,
45:12
actually, when you model it makes galleries, galaxies
45:16
do what they do,
45:17
and the spiral arms develop because that's
45:19
where the Brooklyn currents are spiraling out.
45:21
So I think there's some stuff to be studied there.
45:24
Not that that that's perfectly sound right now, but
45:28
a kind of abandoned mainstream science up quite a few years ago
45:33
and have been really looking for better answers
45:36
and better fits.
45:38
So part of why we're not making out
45:41
rapid progress is that our current science
45:44
makes all this impossible, which makes it impossible
45:48
to believe it's really happening.
45:49
You can't believe your own.
45:50
Eyes and impossible to progress.
45:52
You know. Exactly.
45:53
Well, this has been absolutely fascinating.
45:56
I really want to thank you
45:57
for being willing to finally share these stories.
46:01
I know
46:01
it's been some time coming, even after you came forward to us,
46:05
but I'm really happy
46:06
we could provide you a platform for this. And,
46:09
you've been able to set
46:11
an incredible example, I think, for others
46:12
who I'm sure no doubt
46:14
there are
46:15
probably many thousands of other people
46:16
not like yourself who have similar things to share,
46:19
just haven't been willing to come forward yet. And so.
46:21
I think there are.
46:22
Yeah.
46:23
I look forward to hearing their stories,
46:25
hopefully on your show. Well.
46:27
If you have something to report courage
46:29
you go to Safe aerospace.org submit a report.
46:32
We'll reach out to you.
46:34
And we'll continue to piece this puzzle together
46:37
and not be ashamed to look at things that don't
46:40
fit inside our current paradigm quite yet.
46:43
Well. Again, thank you for inviting me.
46:45
It was a pleasure to finally meet you in person and mind meld
46:49
with you a little bit before we started the show,
46:51
because you and I, you and I share a similar kind of a brain,
46:55
and we have a similar kind of background
46:57
flying fighter jets and loving it.
46:59
So yeah, I, I was a pleasure to to fill the brotherhood here.
47:03
So thank you so much. Thank you. Dan.