Latest / Political Capital with Rob Shaw / Political Capital 175 - Election analysis, BC mental health tragedy, missed climate targets

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Political Capital 175 - Election analysis, BC mental health tragedy, missed climate targets · Political Capital with Rob Shaw

• 0:02
  Speaker 1: Check Podcasts.
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: Hey everyone, and welcome to Political Capital, your source for
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: all the latest INBC politics. I'm your host, Rob Shaw.
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: The federal election has come in thankfully gone. It is over,
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: but the ramifications are just being felt, including here in
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: British Columbia. We're going to take a look at all
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: of that. Plus the tragedy of eleven deaths at the
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: Lapu Laboo festival in Vancouver continues to reverberate around the
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: province with some tough questions to the BC government about
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: mental health. We will pick that subject up and discuss
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  Speaker 2: that to dig into it all. Let us bring in
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  Speaker 2: the panel this week. Jeff Ferrier, longtime NDP strategist, many
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: senior positions, senior positions in government and opposition parties.
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: Are you making old jokes about me?
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  Speaker 3: Now?
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  Speaker 2: I was trying to say way into some reference to Hydrozilla,
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: but I lost the thread. There's one stressed as a
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: Godzilla mascot for the purposes of political tom foolery. So
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  Speaker 2: and Ali Blades, Thank you. Ali, you are back, returning
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: fresh from helping in the federal Conservative war room in
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  Speaker 2: Ottawa during the election campaign. You have returned. We missed you.
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  Speaker 2: Thank you for coming back and Jillian is off this week,
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  Speaker 2: so we're going to dive into the federal election. I'll
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: just set the scene for you, Liberals and Conservatives making
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  Speaker 2: big gains nationally at the expense of the Block and
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  Speaker 2: the NDP. The ADP down from twenty four to seven seats,
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  Speaker 2: losing official party status. The Liberals didn't quite get a majority.
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  Speaker 2: They are forced seats shy at one hundred and sixty
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  Speaker 2: eight seats meeting. They're gonna have to look for some
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  Speaker 2: support or the opposition parties could gang up on them,
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  Speaker 2: maybe force another election. The Conservatives at one hundred and
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  Speaker 2: forty four seats, the Block at twenty three, and the
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  Speaker 2: Greens at one. In BC, the Liberals and Conservatives carved
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  Speaker 2: up the province into an almost tie, Liberals picking up
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  Speaker 2: six seats in Metro Vancouver in the Island to sit
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  Speaker 2: at twenty the Conservatives picking up five on the island,
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  Speaker 2: in rural BC and in Metro to sit at nineteen.
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  Speaker 2: No there are some recounts at play, the NDP dropping
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  Speaker 2: from thirteen to three in BC, and then just finally
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  Speaker 2: on the Island, where the NDP had held six seats.
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  Speaker 2: The vote collapse there cost them all but one in
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  Speaker 2: Courtney Albernie where incumbent gorg John's held on. Liberals picking
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  Speaker 2: up two island ridings, the first island riding since I
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  Speaker 2: think the mid nineteen nineties, winning in Victoria and Esquimalt,
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  Speaker 2: Sanate Souk and the Conservatives winning three seats in North
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  Speaker 2: Island Powell River and I'm a Ladysmith and malahat couchin Langford,
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  Speaker 2: I think, and we'll talk about this some vindication for
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  Speaker 2: Pierre Polyv's many trips to the island. Oh and Green
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  Speaker 2: leader Elizabeth May heading into her fifth term. It's the
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  Speaker 2: soul of Green MP in the country, in Sanich, Gulf Islands. Okay,
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  Speaker 2: there we go. That's the state of the federal election. Jeff,
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  Speaker 2: you were on our election night panel, so I'm going
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  Speaker 2: to go to Ali first. It was a great panel.
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  Speaker 2: Thank you for doing that. But Ali, what happened here
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  Speaker 2: in British Columbia. Do you think what happened nationally? What's
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  Speaker 2: your take on what occurred in the election?
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  Speaker 3: Well, I think for the first time, you know that
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  Speaker 3: the election gets kind of called in Ontario, but this
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  Speaker 3: time around we were waiting to see and a lot
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  Speaker 3: of people stayed up to wait to see what would
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  Speaker 3: happen in BC. So it puts US in a bit
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  Speaker 3: of a battleground state. And we certainly saw that the
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  Speaker 3: map looks significantly different, especially on the island. Now we
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  Speaker 3: have the NDP kind of sandwiched in between Conservative MP's now,
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  Speaker 3: so that's going to make for an interesting potentially four
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  Speaker 3: years for the Vancouver Island dynamics. But then what you
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  Speaker 3: can see within that map, and you know election night
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  Speaker 3: is all about the maps, right, and so what you
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  Speaker 3: can see in the map is the Lower Mainland divide
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  Speaker 3: between what what are more rural areas voted for with
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  Speaker 3: conservative MPs except for that little island in Kologna. Now
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  Speaker 3: that is a liberal seat, So that one's one to
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  Speaker 3: watch because if the Liberals were smart, they might want
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  Speaker 3: to invest in Colonna or even consider a cabinet position
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  Speaker 3: for that loan MP in the Okanagan, and so so
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  Speaker 3: that's very interesting. And additionally, what we also saw was
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  Speaker 3: a bit of a demographic divide within BC. If you
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  Speaker 3: take a look at the numbers, it was overwhelmingly young
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  Speaker 3: people voted Conservative and older folks that were that already
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  Speaker 3: owned their homes were a little less concerned about that
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  Speaker 3: affordability message that Pierre Polyev really pushed and more concerned
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  Speaker 3: about Trump's tariffs in protecting their assets, voted liberal. And
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  Speaker 3: so now we have a few divides on the island
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  Speaker 3: and the urban rule divide within the mainland.
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  Speaker 2: Mm fast. Those two divides are fascinating urban rural, and
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  Speaker 2: now sort of young and old, not to oversimplify it,
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  Speaker 2: but sort of trend lines Jeff, that have big impacts.
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  Speaker 2: When you look at the BC map both federally and provincial,
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  Speaker 2: it's almost the same map when you kind of overlay
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  Speaker 2: it when it comes to the two parties.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, I was just going to say that in another
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  Speaker 4: division is is men and women, and that played out
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  Speaker 4: and you know, women skewing more liberal and men's skewing
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  Speaker 4: more conservative. One of the things that struck me on
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  Speaker 4: election night and now is that the results that we're
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  Speaker 4: seeing federally are very very close to what we're seeing provincially.
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  Speaker 4: You substitute BCNDP with liberals, you substitute BC conservatives with conservatives,
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  Speaker 4: and you see the redrawing of you know, you see
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  Speaker 4: the redrawing of BC's political map, as we did in
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  Speaker 4: the last provincial election. Urban goes NDP young families and
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  Speaker 4: urban centers go DP and there's still folks in rural,
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  Speaker 4: interior and suburban British Columbia that are, you know, frustrated
• 6:23
  Speaker 4: by cost of living, that are frustrated by lack of housing,
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  Speaker 4: by lack of access to healthcare. So now Mark Carney,
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  Speaker 4: the Prime Minister and Premier David eb are you know,
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  Speaker 4: faced with the same population and the same challenge governing.
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  Speaker 1: Divided province of British Columbia.
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  Speaker 2: So what does that mean then for the BC government
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  Speaker 2: both government wise, but also maybe the BCNDP as well.
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  Speaker 2: Jeff will stay with you on this one. The lessons
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  Speaker 2: to learn from that if any you know, they won
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  Speaker 2: the last election, Liberals won their election. A Wayne is
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: a Wayne in politics, but what is a what should
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  Speaker 2: they be kind of flagging for themselves there? And then
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  Speaker 2: also the BC government and the federal Liberal government continuing
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  Speaker 2: to work together. What's the implications of that too?
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think if you're David Eb you're breathing a
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  Speaker 4: little bit easier this week at strategic opening for the province.
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  Speaker 4: With Mark Karney as the Prime Minister, it's one they
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  Speaker 4: can't afford to waste, not just on issues alignment so
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  Speaker 4: Carney and the Premier both on the same page on
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  Speaker 4: housing and economic development in particular, but they're also you
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  Speaker 4: know the temperament. You look at Mark Karney, you look.
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  Speaker 1: At David E.
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  Speaker 4: B technocratic, ambitious and pragmatic and focused on progress. It
• 7:50
  Speaker 4: gives the Premier chance to move forward on some big
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  Speaker 4: files and this is critical. It also exposed risks for
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  Speaker 4: the NDP. As I said, the Conservatives gained a lot
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  Speaker 4: of ground and rural and suburban British Columbia to sign
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  Speaker 4: that despite what the NDP has done since the last election,
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  Speaker 4: voters are still frustrated. They're still you know, that sense
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  Speaker 4: of anger that propelled poorly effort to more seats and
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  Speaker 4: more votes in British Columbia is still there provincially. And
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  Speaker 4: if the NDP is seen as managing the problems instead
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  Speaker 4: of fixing them, it can find itself vulnerable headed into
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  Speaker 4: the next election.
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  Speaker 1: So the impetus for.
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  Speaker 4: Them as partner with Carneie fine common ground, build relationship
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  Speaker 4: and deliver some bull visible improvements or you're in trouble, Allie.
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  Speaker 2: What do you think it means for the BC Conservatives
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  Speaker 2: the similarities and doing very very well in the election
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  Speaker 2: but just not quite getting it over that kind of
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  Speaker 2: finish line, a sort of contraction at the last minute
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  Speaker 2: of kind of what is needed the support to just
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  Speaker 2: kind of close off those last few seats.
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  Speaker 3: To answer that question, I do have to touch on
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  Speaker 3: that federal relationship as well. So what Jeff's saying is
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  Speaker 3: that David EB and the new the Prime Minister and
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  Speaker 3: Mark Carney will have a really good relationship. That is
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  Speaker 3: one hundred percent true. Because Pierre Pouliev I mean, the
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  Speaker 3: audacity of this man to come into BC over and
• 9:27
  Speaker 3: over and over again. Andrew Sheer was in BC as
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  Speaker 3: well during the election. They invested a lot of secondary
• 9:34
  Speaker 3: tour and the tour of the leader in BC y
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  Speaker 3: because public enemy number one where the decisions that David
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  Speaker 3: dB has made. I mean, think about some significant announcements
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  Speaker 3: that were made during the election that the Conservatives did,
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  Speaker 3: the backdrop of Terris with the one and done accelerated
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  Speaker 3: approval for resource projects and then the treatment for compassionate
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  Speaker 3: treatment for a addictions in Richmond. These are big, big
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  Speaker 3: issues specifically chosen in BC to make them. That told
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  Speaker 3: me that he was very serious about BC and if
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  Speaker 3: he had one he would have invested a lot in
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  Speaker 3: BC to make it better because David Ebe just can't.
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  Speaker 3: And so because of that, I think what's going to
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  Speaker 3: happen is that John Rustad's Conservatives will be able to
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  Speaker 3: pick ups from some of that momentum and really hammer
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  Speaker 3: home some of these issues. You know, we're going to
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  Speaker 3: chat about it later on in the show, but we're
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  Speaker 3: you know, thinking about the Mental Health Act and these
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: these primary issues of crime and safety and treatment. And
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  Speaker 3: so I think that that momentum is certainly there and
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  Speaker 3: that's really going to help rust Ad. But the other
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  Speaker 3: aspect of the relationship between the provincial side the federal side,
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  Speaker 3: because I was away, we also miss the by election
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  Speaker 3: results municipally, and I have words that's also going to
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  Speaker 3: have an impact in all of this too.
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  Speaker 1: This is the Vancouver ones.
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  Speaker 3: The Vancouver one. That's it, Jeff, thank you for that.
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  Speaker 3: It's it's the decision made by Vancouver voters that they
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  Speaker 3: need decisiveness. What we've essentially turned into is a two
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  Speaker 3: party system here between the left and the right, sorry Jeff,
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  Speaker 3: with the diminishing of the NDP right and so what
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  Speaker 3: that means is that they're with the municipal election coming up,
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  Speaker 3: we're going to want more decisiveness and strong platform and
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  Speaker 3: announcements made in the lead up to that. That's going
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  Speaker 3: to impact provincially, which will then impact federally. We saw
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  Speaker 3: the the you know, the cross promotion of even you know,
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  Speaker 3: Christy Clark going to door knock in Kelowna. We saw
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  Speaker 3: MLAs from the Conservative Party indorse candidates for the Federal Conservatives.
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  Speaker 3: So these the sides, they like, the armies of both
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  Speaker 3: sides really help each other out and that's really going
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  Speaker 3: to impact the potential success of the Conservatives in the
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  Speaker 3: next election provincially.
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  Speaker 2: It is fascinating to remember the BC election when these
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  Speaker 2: resurgent I don't know where BC Conservatives were picking up
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  Speaker 2: momentum and they were kind of reaching out to the
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  Speaker 2: Federal Conservatives and being like, you know, you know, Polly,
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: I want to help us out, and they were told
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: stop embarrassing us, stop embarrassing the Conservative brand. And now,
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: you know the at the end of the election, the
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  Speaker 2: Federal Conservatives were looking for help from the BC Conservatives.
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  Speaker 2: So now they're on much more equal footing here right Alley.
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  Speaker 2: They're going to be able to build off of each other,
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  Speaker 2: even though they're not connected the same way like the
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  Speaker 2: federal ANDP any thoughts.
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  Speaker 4: I just I just want to speak Well, first of all,
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  Speaker 4: everyone should go on too x formerly Twitter and search
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: Robert Feife and Pierre Pollievra and you'll get a pretty
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  Speaker 4: interesting discret ription of the dynamic on the doorsteps, even
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  Speaker 4: in conservative ridings. I want to talk just a little
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  Speaker 4: bit about the federal NDP. Obviously the result was a
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  Speaker 4: gut punching and there's a time for reckoning for the party.
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  Speaker 4: But it's you know, it's an opportunity to do something
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  Speaker 4: that they've needed to do for an awful long time,
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  Speaker 4: is to take a step back and decide who they are,
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  Speaker 4: what they're offering voters, and you know, what's their value
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  Speaker 4: proposition on the you know, the federal stage. I think
• 13:34
  Speaker 4: there's been a lot of confusion. There's been you know,
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  Speaker 4: the leader and the caucus at odds over what the
• 13:41
  Speaker 4: priorities should be.
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  Speaker 1: It's interesting to see.
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  Speaker 4: Former caucus members from places like Ontario who took the
• 13:49
  Speaker 4: party off in weird directions blaming the jig Meet Sing
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  Speaker 4: for what happened. Well, now all those folks can take
• 13:57
  Speaker 4: a step back, get into a leadership on test and
• 14:01
  Speaker 4: you know, an opportunity to, you know, for once, probably
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  Speaker 4: since you know Jack Layton, to say this is who
• 14:08
  Speaker 4: we are, this is where we're going, and this is
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  Speaker 4: how we hope to get votes. And I hope that's
• 14:13
  Speaker 4: a refocusing on the working class because they've clearly lost
• 14:17
  Speaker 4: them in this selection, the kind of the Conservatives who
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: are the only people who are talking about the issues
• 14:24
  Speaker 4: that you know, cost of living and housing that really
• 14:27
  Speaker 4: mattered to everyday working people.
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  Speaker 2: Moving on to the senseless tragedy of eleven people killed
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: at the Filipino Communities Lapoo Lapoo festival last weekend, there's
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: been major implications for the BC government. Now we don't
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: know the whole story here, We don't know all the
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: underlying causes. Is important to stress that. But the discussion
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: over the last week has involved the man who has
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: been charged his history with police under the Mental Health Act.
• 14:55
  Speaker 2: Vancouver Coastal Health said he was under supervision of their
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: mental health team at the time. There is no indications
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: of violence, and that has put Premier David Ebe in
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: the question seat both at the legislature and amongst media
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  Speaker 2: about the gaps and the mental health system and the issue.
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: We have talked a long time about now involuntary care
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: expanding that and if so, how so what happens in
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: the wake of this tragedy Now the premiere has ordered
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: a review. Is that good enough? Do you think Ali
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: will start with you to address this? And how is
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: it going to how's the public reaction to this tragedy
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: going to affect the government? Do you think well?
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: I think the public response is the rationale for inquiry
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: and action in that I think the time frame around
• 15:51
  Speaker 3: this senseless issue, this event saw a lot of people
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: emotionally impacted, making to decisions based on that, ensuring that
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: we're taking care of the families of the eleven lives lost.
• 16:07
  Speaker 3: All of that being said, there's also a bit of
• 16:09
  Speaker 3: a discussion on is it now safe to attend all
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: of these summer events that are about to happen. We're
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: just on the precipice of these big community events that
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: we celebrate here in the Lower Mainland all across BC.
• 16:23
  Speaker 3: Are families willing to go out? Do we feel safe?
• 16:27
  Speaker 3: That's a big, big red flag, the fact that we
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: could now see less community happening at a time where
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: we really need it right and so that's probably one
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: that we can respond to very quickly. How can we
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: make families safe while attending these events. Now there's a
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: bit of a divide and an argument, of course in
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: the legislature of the type of reports, the type of response.
• 16:53
  Speaker 3: How do we move forward from here. David eb is
• 16:56
  Speaker 3: saying that because there is a criminal investigation that they
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: don't want to get to involve. I understand that I'm
• 17:01
  Speaker 3: going to give some grace to that. But we all
• 17:04
  Speaker 3: know that these criminal cases can take a very, very
• 17:06
  Speaker 3: long time. So I think the amendment of that should be,
• 17:11
  Speaker 3: if we don't have an answer by the end of
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: the year, if we don't have an answer very soon,
• 17:18
  Speaker 3: let's use that full extent of what the government powers
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: and the powers of the law to make sure that
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: we are acting accordingly and providing some solutions because right
• 17:28
  Speaker 3: now we are sad and we are scared.
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: No, it was a good point of Jeff the review
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: of the Mental Health Act. I mean, we've been talking
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: about that for a long time now. John Horgan wanted
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: to do more involuntary carry backed off. Ibe wanted to
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: do it. In his leadership race. He backed off. He
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: proposed it before the election. He kind of slow played
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: that into just for sort of inmates at Surrey pre
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: trial and a Mental Health Act that didn't have to
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: change under his expert and now we are heading into
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: what looks like a larger review. Is is that a
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: good thing to be doing at this time? In response
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: to this strategy? Do we need to do more? How
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: does the government kind of balance the timing issues Alie's
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: talking about there with the sensitivity and the kind of
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: reality of the public wanting some type of action here.
• 18:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah, balance and time in are both important. I think
• 18:18
  Speaker 4: makes a good point on time in and wanting to
• 18:21
  Speaker 4: get to some answers on the policy public policy side
• 18:26
  Speaker 4: around mental health before the end of the year. I
• 18:28
  Speaker 4: think that's reasonable, imprudent, and government should be looking at
• 18:32
  Speaker 4: the Mental Health Act to make sure that all the
• 18:37
  Speaker 4: tools that health professionals, health workers need to address issues
• 18:44
  Speaker 4: where there are serious mental health, whether the person's a
• 18:48
  Speaker 4: danger to themselves and others, where there's brain injury, those
• 18:51
  Speaker 4: those issues that we should take.
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: A look at that.
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  Speaker 4: And you know, as you noted, the government has taken
• 18:57
  Speaker 4: the first step and you know, ten beds for involuntary care.
• 19:04
  Speaker 4: I would point out that in addition to the the
• 19:08
  Speaker 4: you know, the Mental Health aspect of this. There are
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: many layers to an incident like this. You know, what
• 19:14
  Speaker 4: we talked about. Was it a failure of mental health intervention?
• 19:17
  Speaker 4: Was it a deliberate, premeditated act by someone fully aware
• 19:21
  Speaker 4: of their actions? Were their missed warning signs?
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: You know?
• 19:24
  Speaker 4: Were the events security protocols sufficient for size and nature
• 19:29
  Speaker 4: of the crowd. And so these are all things that
• 19:32
  Speaker 4: I think that legislators in the public will will have
• 19:36
  Speaker 4: a look at through a review like this, but also
• 19:39
  Speaker 4: through the criminal investigation and.
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: Prosecution. I will say that I was.
• 19:47
  Speaker 4: It was something to see Premier Eb's public response to
• 19:53
  Speaker 4: these events.
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 19:54
  Speaker 4: First it was you know, the message of care and
• 19:56
  Speaker 4: empathy and being there for the Filipino.
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: Community through this.
• 20:00
  Speaker 4: But he has been out very strong on a law
• 20:05
  Speaker 4: and order message on this. You know, this is to
• 20:08
  Speaker 4: quote him. In my opinion, the suspect is a murderer
• 20:12
  Speaker 4: who spend the rest of his life and custody right'
• 20:17
  Speaker 4: that's you know. I think he's made the calculation that
• 20:21
  Speaker 4: in moments like these, people don't want legal abstractions, they
• 20:25
  Speaker 4: don't want government saying I can't comment on that because
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: there's an investigation underway. I think that's appropriate when government
• 20:32
  Speaker 4: has evolved in the investigation, but less so when it's
• 20:36
  Speaker 4: an external event, and folks want leadership that reflects their grief,
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: their anger and their need for justice. And I think
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: the Premier has in this moment certainly delivered on that.
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: I think the question in question period this week was
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: about how the Premier is able to say that when
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: so many other tragedies have gone by children in care
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: who die, other you know, government tragedies, and the government
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: is hamstrung by being unable to comment because it's before
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: the courts and how and this one is he able
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: to jump out before the courts?
• 21:12
  Speaker 4: I think the difference.
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that's a good point.
• 21:14
  Speaker 4: It's a it's a it's a I think a lot
• 21:16
  Speaker 4: of folks are wondering about that. I think the distinction
• 21:19
  Speaker 4: is that in those cases that you noted, you know,
• 21:22
  Speaker 4: government was part of what was being investigated in that incident,
• 21:26
  Speaker 4: and this one is a criminal investigation involving police and
• 21:29
  Speaker 4: this individual. So in this instance there is more leeway
• 21:35
  Speaker 4: for government to to speak out if government were.
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah it is and the other and the other
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: thing and where we're at a time on it. But
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: the other thing that just strikes me is that it's
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: tough to do a review of the Mental Health Act
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: because of this without knowing why it happened, and that
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: timing issue is going to be difficult for the government.
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: They want to act it quickly, according to the Premieer,
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: but if we don't know how the system failed, how
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: do you fix the act to prevent it? And on
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: what do we do? So there's there's a lot of
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: difficulties ahead for government on this, not just because involuntary
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: care itself is being challenged the current Mental Health Act,
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: but also because of the pressure to respond without knowing
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: exactly how to respond. All right, let's switch to our
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: final topic here some developments on the climate front. The
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: government released its annual report on pollution this week and
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: the numbers show that after seven years and four billion
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: dollars into the Clean BC program, the province is at
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: the exact same level of pollution it was for its
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: baseline two thousand and seven levels. In fact, it increased
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: a little bit slightly. That led to Energy Minister Adrian
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: Dix coming out to say BC will not hit its
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: legislated targets of a forty percent GHG reduction by twenty thirty,
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: maybe we're on track to eighteen percent, but even that
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: is optimistic. As of today, we have achieved zero percent
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: of this target and more all of this years into
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: this and of course it comes as we have just
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: scrapped the carbon tax federally and provincially, and also as
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: the government is moving to scrap ev rebates because Ottawa
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: has moved to end ev rebates. So all of this
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: kind of leading to questions about the Climate Plan. It
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: was a cornerstone of the early days of the NDP government.
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: We've been bragging about it for years. Look at British
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: Columbia fighting climate change. We are, you know, a leader
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: in this area. It turns out we haven't moved the
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: dial one iota the premieer saying that's okay because our
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: population increased a lot during that time. So we've been
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: holding steady is pretty good. I don't know what do
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: you guys think of that. I know that the environment
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: is different now, right like climate wasn't a big issue
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: in the election. The carbon tax became about affordability. Ally,
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: like people aren't talking about climate change and the BC
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: government doesn't seem to be talking about it or not
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: worried about it either anymore.
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: Well, that's exactly it, but maybe not talking about it
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: in the traditional sense as we have in previous elections
• 24:18
  Speaker 3: where there would be sorry, because my mind is so
• 24:22
  Speaker 3: focused still on the federal election where we saw very
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: little in environmental policy. Even in the provincial election we
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: didn't see it too too much, but it's changing. My
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: point here is that when we're talking about the environment,
• 24:38
  Speaker 3: we're talking about it now hand in hand with infrastructure.
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: That if we're building infrastructure, how are we going to
• 24:45
  Speaker 3: mitigate some of the environmental impact so we still have
• 24:48
  Speaker 3: to grow the economy while protecting the environment. That's how
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: we're talking about environmental policies now versus before where it
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: was saved the trees now in I found very interesting
• 25:01
  Speaker 3: in taking a look at all of this is that
• 25:03
  Speaker 3: the BC Greens, as part of their agreement, will be
• 25:07
  Speaker 3: participating in the review of Clean BC, which is the
• 25:12
  Speaker 3: big playbook for how do we protect our environment here
• 25:16
  Speaker 3: in BC. My analysis on this is that the BC
• 25:22
  Speaker 3: Greens would be better off to just focus on this.
• 25:26
  Speaker 3: I've noticed that over the years, even under the previous
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: government under Sonia Personal, that they had deviated into other
• 25:38
  Speaker 3: areas of focus when it came to policy. I think
• 25:43
  Speaker 3: now is the time for our two Green MLAs to
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: just focus on this and really bring it back to
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: the roots and the origins of the BC Green Party.
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: That would be a bigger political win for them in
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: my opinion.
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: M hm. So double down on that then, Is that
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: what you think the Greens should do?
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: Okay, absolutely, and nothing else. Just focus on this and
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: I think it is their obligation at in their namesake
• 26:11
  Speaker 3: of the BC Greens to be able to pull off
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: a win in making sure that the environment is continually
• 26:18
  Speaker 3: talked about in the midst of all of the other
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: issues that we have in BC. We were talking about it,
• 26:23
  Speaker 3: the fact that you know, there's the mental health crisis,
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: the crimate safety and affordability and just a million other
• 26:30
  Speaker 3: things going on. I think that the Greens would be
• 26:33
  Speaker 3: better off to just go back to their roots and
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: focus on this one issue.
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Jeff, what do you think of missing the climate
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: targets and what that means?
• 26:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it is true that the province hasn't hit its
• 26:48
  Speaker 4: twenty thirty targets. They were ambitious. I think it's it's
• 26:55
  Speaker 4: not correct to say that there has been no progress.
• 27:00
  Speaker 4: You look at what government has done through Clean BC,
• 27:02
  Speaker 4: a plan created by the NDP and the Greens together.
• 27:05
  Speaker 4: So methane emissions and oil and gas down forty percent,
• 27:08
  Speaker 4: nearly one four vehicles now and BC is electric leading
• 27:13
  Speaker 4: the country. BC's got one of the largest ev charging
• 27:16
  Speaker 4: networks in the country, lower clean fuel rules, ten new
• 27:24
  Speaker 4: renewable energy projects coming online this year. Transit ridership is rebounding.
• 27:30
  Speaker 4: I could go on and on, but then more and
• 27:32
  Speaker 4: more people would turn the podcast.
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: But does that matter at the end of the day,
• 27:38
  Speaker 2: if the if the whole point is to reduce pollution
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: to save the climate, does it matter what we've done
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: If we don't bring the numbers.
• 27:44
  Speaker 4: Down, it matters because emissions per capita, you know, a
• 27:48
  Speaker 4: key test of whether the climate policy is working that
• 27:51
  Speaker 4: is down twenty.
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: Didn't so that in legislation the government didn't they put
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: they didn't put that in. That's not the goal. They're
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: just using that number now, Like if that was the goal,
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: they should have put it in the legislation. Don't you think, like,
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: why are we talking about that now?
• 28:05
  Speaker 4: Well, we're BC, as you noted, is challenged by the
• 28:08
  Speaker 4: fact that we have record population growth people are coming
• 28:11
  Speaker 4: to BC for the opportunity, like more than anywhere in Canada.
• 28:15
  Speaker 4: There's been a construction boom, you know, housing going up
• 28:18
  Speaker 4: all over the place to meet that demand in a
• 28:21
  Speaker 4: strong job market.
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: All this puts pressure.
• 28:24
  Speaker 4: On on a climate and our targets, and we've got
• 28:28
  Speaker 4: to balance the one with the other. I think one
• 28:30
  Speaker 4: point that you made though early on, is absolutely true
• 28:33
  Speaker 4: is you know climate action used to be popular. Remember that,
• 28:37
  Speaker 4: you know today it seems to come with a cost. Politically,
• 28:40
  Speaker 4: there's climate fatigue. We're past Gretathundberg saying, how dare you know?
• 28:45
  Speaker 4: It's harder to get people to support and move on
• 28:48
  Speaker 4: climate when affordability is tight and anxiety is high. And
• 28:54
  Speaker 4: I would be remiss though if I didn't say that.
• 28:57
  Speaker 4: The point out that the Conservatives climate plan fits on
• 29:01
  Speaker 4: a bumper sticker and there's room despair for more commitments.
• 29:07
  Speaker 4: But this government, you know, it's not meeting it as targets,
• 29:10
  Speaker 4: but it's making progress and at a time when leadership
• 29:13
  Speaker 4: on this file is not popular. Yeah.
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: So the second part of this, because this report came
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: out accompanying the Climate report, is EV's electric vehicles and
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: the latest EV numbers came out and they show for
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: the first time since I think twenty fifteen a kind
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: of decline in the trajectory upwards of EV sales. They've
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: they've leveled off and gone down a little bit, and
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: it for whatever reason, the government chose to also announce
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: the end of the provincial EV rebate with this climate report,
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: because outawais ended their EV rebate. And so the question
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: of the Premiere that I put to them this week
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: is we have a law that the government passed where
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: you can't sell any new gas vehicles at after twenty
• 29:57
  Speaker 2: thirty five. The auto dealer are out saying there's no
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: way we can hit that. We're not even we haven't
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: even moved our climate targets. How are we going to
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: hit that? Do we keep the law in place? Was
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: the question to him, and he said, we're going to
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: review it. What do you think government has to calculate
• 30:12
  Speaker 2: alli in that. I know that that was kind of
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: a political issue that EV sales law has come up
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: in the election, But is that holdable? Is that an
• 30:22
  Speaker 2: argument government can still make? Is there still value in that?
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: Or where do you think the EV issue goes?
• 30:27
  Speaker 3: I mean, at the basic of what you had just
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: explained we incentivized consumers to buy EV and then they
• 30:35
  Speaker 3: didn't even.
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: They did, like, there's like twenty two percent of vehicle
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: sales in the last year we're EV's. It's just we
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: didn't like it hasn't gone beyond that, I guess, but yeah.
• 30:46
  Speaker 3: Right, and so now with the incentivation gone, where does
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: it leave consumers? And I mean, in an affordability crisis,
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: They're just going to go with what's more affordable. At
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: this point, the sixteen year old's first car is not
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: going to be an EV car if it's more expensive
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: than something that is going to be able to get
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: them to and from work. And then there's the bigger
• 31:09
  Speaker 3: conversation of how does this impact the trucking industry, And
• 31:13
  Speaker 3: the BC Trucking Association was very critical of this when
• 31:16
  Speaker 3: it first came out, and so I don't really know
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: where it goes, but it certainly has to be affordable
• 31:23
  Speaker 3: for British Columbians in order to buy in to it
• 31:26
  Speaker 3: all the.
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: Trucking industry, JEFF is responsible for an eighteen percent increase
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: in our emissions and Adrian Dick's point of that out
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: it's like the light the heavy transit part of our
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: province needs to we need to find a way to
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: address that. The transport trucks and that type of thing.
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: So you have that pressure. Then you have the carbon tax,
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: which was supposed to make gas more expensive to push
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: people towards evs. That was the original purpose and now
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: that has been flipped around. It's two people don't want
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: to pay it. They don't want to do that, so
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: you kind of you kind of cut EV's out at
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: the knees a little bit. With the carbon tax gone,
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: the rebate's gone. Is it sustainable to keep the targets?
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: Do you think or what do you think government is
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: going to have to do there?
• 32:10
  Speaker 4: I think government should remain ambitious on its targets. The
• 32:14
  Speaker 4: trouble with big trucks is that the technologies not there
• 32:18
  Speaker 4: for EV trucks at this point. It's expensive and the
• 32:24
  Speaker 4: charge is not sufficient for you know, long range trucking.
• 32:30
  Speaker 4: It's interesting to hear that the US, the car dealers
• 32:33
  Speaker 4: are predicting that it's impossible to shift to EV cars.
• 32:38
  Speaker 4: I guess they have a new think tank where they've
• 32:43
  Speaker 4: determined this. Uh uh so, thank you. We should we
• 32:48
  Speaker 4: should monetize that as a province. I mean that's amazing
• 32:52
  Speaker 4: research and analysis facilities here in b C. I think
• 32:56
  Speaker 4: on the on the subsidy of the cars, I think
• 33:00
  Speaker 4: it's it's a signal to the car manufacturers that there's
• 33:08
  Speaker 4: a you know, almost everyone I talked to and the
• 33:11
  Speaker 4: and the province who's looking for a car is like,
• 33:13
  Speaker 4: I'd really like to get a zero mission vehicle or
• 33:18
  Speaker 4: a hybrid, but the price is too high. We've been
• 33:21
  Speaker 4: able to get one in four folks to buy in
• 33:24
  Speaker 4: based on a provincial subsidy. A smart capitalist car company
• 33:29
  Speaker 4: would look at the situation and say, there's a big
• 33:34
  Speaker 4: demand there and if we can put a car into
• 33:36
  Speaker 4: the marketplace that is more affordable, we can really drive
• 33:43
  Speaker 4: market share and profit, especially with that twenty thirty five
• 33:48
  Speaker 4: rule in place. So let's see the car dealers do
• 33:52
  Speaker 4: something on that. Look at this is this is this
• 33:55
  Speaker 4: is tough stuff. You know, affordability crisis makes it difficult
• 34:01
  Speaker 4: for the the you know, the problems to to you know,
• 34:04
  Speaker 4: bring forward measures like you know, this is a this
• 34:07
  Speaker 4: is going to be tough, but we've got to do it.
• 34:09
  Speaker 4: You know, when you can't afford your house, you can't
• 34:11
  Speaker 4: afford groceries, you can't afford gas. It's a it's a
• 34:15
  Speaker 4: hard sell, but they continue to push forward and they're
• 34:18
  Speaker 4: making some they're making gains, and I expect to see
• 34:20
  Speaker 4: more in the renewables front and other climate solutions from
• 34:24
  Speaker 4: Minister Dixon in the near term.
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: I think a lot of it is going to hange
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: on whether the federal government and some US states, which
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: had put in their own sort of legislative targets on evs,
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: whether they hold them. Because if BC's alone on that,
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: if they start dropping off, car manufacturers aren't going to
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: do anything to help meet our targets, it would become
• 34:44
  Speaker 2: unsustainable for BC to continue on its own.
• 34:46
  Speaker 4: But so far, you know what, but you know what
• 34:49
  Speaker 4: one thing that's driving uh decreased demand is It is
• 34:53
  Speaker 4: that everyone hates Elon Musk. No one must to buy
• 34:57
  Speaker 4: a Tesla. There's people who are driving on Tesla as
• 34:59
  Speaker 4: saying I bought this before Elon Musk became an idiot.
• 35:05
  Speaker 4: So I mean again, there's if you're Ford or chev
• 35:09
  Speaker 4: or Kia or whatever, like the Tesla markets drop like
• 35:15
  Speaker 4: a stone, and here's your opportunity to jump in the
• 35:17
  Speaker 4: market and take that space.
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: One of the things David dB said and when he
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: was asked about this week, is I wanted about ending
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: the rebates. He's like, I wanted to make sure no
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: money was going to Tesla, which was an interesting comment
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: as well because they've also removed the charging stations from
• 35:33
  Speaker 2: the BC hydro rebate program as well.
• 35:36
  Speaker 4: We should have like a five hundred percent tax on
• 35:39
  Speaker 4: cyber trucks and use that money towards public transit.
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, all right, Well, as an interesting we don't talk
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: about and we haven't talked about climate change politics for
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: a while, but it was an interesting week to kind
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: of kick that issue around because it goes in all
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: sorts of different in directions. So all right, thank you
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: Jeff and Ali for being here.
• 36:00
  Speaker 4: Hold on, Yes, there's one thing that you said you
• 36:02
  Speaker 4: were going to mention that you didn't. It's got to
• 36:04
  Speaker 4: do if folks were watching the TV version of the
• 36:06
  Speaker 4: YouTube one, you would have seen Rob with a interesting
• 36:09
  Speaker 4: drinking vessel.
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: I should have done this on the TV show, but
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: someone stole my check mug, and so I rummaged through
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: the deep recesses of the coffee calendar of Coffee Cupboard
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: a check and I discovered a Judy Tayabji mug who
• 36:26
  Speaker 2: apparently had a call in show on Check thirty years ago.
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: I guess I don't know why this mug is still around,
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: but it reminds me of fascinating and interesting political mugs
• 36:38
  Speaker 2: that are out there. And if you happen to have any,
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: if you're searching your cupboard and you find an old
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: Jack Webster mug or an interesting mug from a political
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: campaign provincially even nationally, I'm your guy. Send it, Send
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: it my way, and I'll put it on the show,
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: drink coffee from it, display it. I might even start
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: a little displayed behind me on the legislature, and I
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: may steal. I may steal this mug too. I don't
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: know why I didn't do this in the TV portion.
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: If you're listening in the audio, you're probably bored. Silly,
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: it says Tyabhi on it. I had no idea number.
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: There's a one eight hundred number, which I don't even
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: know if those exist anymore. But fascinating, fascinating little bit
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: of political history there. Yeah, So send me your mugs.
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: If you've got any, hit me up on X or
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: something like that, send me a message. Okay, Jeff Ali,
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: thank you for being here. Jillian's going to be back
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: next week and we will be back as well with
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: all the latest and BC politics here on Political Capital.