Latest / Voddie Baucham Sermons / Voddie Baucham - Not of This World Session 4_ Q&A w Costi Hinn

Transcript

Voddie Baucham - Not of This World Session 4_ Q&A w Costi Hinn · Voddie Baucham Sermons

• 0:08
  Speaker 1: My name is Kevin Hay.
• 0:09
  Speaker 2: I get to be the pastor of discipleship at Shepherd's
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: House Bible Church. Get to serve alongside Kosti and just
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: a great team of pastors and elders.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: Joined, of course, by our speakers.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: And of course, for the gospel, this is all about,
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: you've heard it today, sound doctrine for everyday people. And
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: so we've been collecting your questions both yesterday and today.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: Through social media. We've compiled those.
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: We're just going to ask these guys some questions, how.
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: We can apply the things we've heard.
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: And let me even just start by saying, me personally,
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: I've been both convicted and encouraged today.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: Can you all say amen to that?
• 0:47
  Speaker 3: Amen.
• 0:48
  Speaker 4: So good.
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: So good.
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: So the way this will work, I will lob a
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: question to one of these gentlemen, pretty much connected to
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: a sermon they've preached today, and then the other one
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: can add to it, and we'll kind of just work
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: our way through that.
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: So I'm going to.
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: Start with Kosti. Brother, your sermon was so helpful. What
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: are you living for? In particular, the fourth point, remember
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: the power of the gospel. Maybe help us with some
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: practical tips for sharing the gospel.
• 1:19
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so I talked to a couple this morning, actually.
• 1:22
  Speaker 5: They came up and said, we're not really extroverted, and
• 1:26
  Speaker 5: sometimes we struggle, and there's a lot of fear, and
• 1:28
  Speaker 5: we get nervous with sharing the gospel. Do you have
• 1:31
  Speaker 5: any tips? So it's actually a preemptive question. And I
• 1:34
  Speaker 5: said to them, what I'll say to you all, I said,
• 1:37
  Speaker 5: just be normal.
• 1:38
  Speaker 4: And they were like, oh. And I said, you know,
• 1:40
  Speaker 4: you ever watch Ray Comfort? They're like, yeah.
• 1:43
  Speaker 5: And I said, yeah, you don't have to be Ray Comfort.
• 1:47
  Speaker 5: I'm glad Ray is Ray.
• 1:48
  Speaker 4: And Ray's awesome. We love Living Waters.
• 1:50
  Speaker 5: But I said, just be normal. So weaving into conversations.
• 1:54
  Speaker 5: And I used a couple of examples. And one of
• 1:56
  Speaker 5: the most fun was the fact that a couple of
• 1:59
  Speaker 5: our team members here and different guys, one is my
• 2:01
  Speaker 5: neighbor who's here.
• 2:02
  Speaker 4: Now, he's already a believer.
• 2:04
  Speaker 5: But I told them five years ago, I moved into
• 2:05
  Speaker 5: my neighborhood, just started talking to people.
• 2:07
  Speaker 4: You act normal. You're out on the street.
• 2:09
  Speaker 5: And it's like, I don't slip them a track and go, now.
• 2:13
  Speaker 4: Listen, where would you go if you died right now?
• 2:15
  Speaker 4: You're like, you could.
• 2:17
  Speaker 5: There's nothing wrong with that. But you're just talking. And
• 2:19
  Speaker 5: as you're talking, you might say, like we just live
• 2:22
  Speaker 5: our life really normally. And I might say like, oh yeah,
• 2:25
  Speaker 5: I was just talking about the same thing. I was
• 2:27
  Speaker 5: laughing with a buddy from church the other day. I'm
• 2:29
  Speaker 5: just talking like I would.
• 2:30
  Speaker 4: Or Oh, yeah, man. Yeah, my kids are, yeah, they're hilarious.
• 2:34
  Speaker 4: You know, God's been good to us.
• 2:36
  Speaker 5: You know, there's been some challenging seasons with miscarriages here
• 2:38
  Speaker 5: and there, but the Lord's really blessed us.
• 2:40
  Speaker 4: I just live normal.
• 2:41
  Speaker 5: And then that person, usually, I find this all the time,
• 2:45
  Speaker 5: will grab the bait if they want. Other times they'll
• 2:47
  Speaker 5: be like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'd be like, yep,
• 2:51
  Speaker 5: you're one of those. I'm going to back off. And
• 2:53
  Speaker 5: one of the reasons that my neighbor is such a
• 2:55
  Speaker 5: really good friend, they're at our.
• 2:56
  Speaker 4: Church, is just talking normally.
• 2:58
  Speaker 5: And there's other times where people, I met a guy,
• 3:01
  Speaker 5: A while ago, a husband and wife, we were at
• 3:03
  Speaker 5: the San Diego Zoo.
• 3:04
  Speaker 4: We were on a vacation. And they saw we had
• 3:06
  Speaker 4: a lot of kids. And I do this.
• 3:07
  Speaker 5: This is one I love to do. And the husband
• 3:09
  Speaker 5: and wife were there. And the wife went to the restroom.
• 3:11
  Speaker 5: And the guy and I, like, we caught eyes. We
• 3:13
  Speaker 5: had strollers and, like, kids. And we caught eyes.
• 3:16
  Speaker 4: And he was like, hmm. And I was like, hmm.
• 3:19
  Speaker 4: And he was like, raising them right. Got a little
• 3:22
  Speaker 4: basketball team.
• 3:23
  Speaker 5: And I said, absolutely. In today's world, I'm raising up
• 3:25
  Speaker 5: an army, brother. And he was like, I like it.
• 3:29
  Speaker 5: I like it.
• 3:29
  Speaker 4: What you driving? I said, Honda Odyssey. And he was.
• 3:32
  Speaker 5: Like, we became buddies while our wives were in the restroom.
• 3:39
  Speaker 5: Before I knew it, he's conservative, but didn't fully understand
• 3:43
  Speaker 5: the gospel. And we started talking and I said, hey,
• 3:47
  Speaker 5: and I just left him with some encouraging words about
• 3:49
  Speaker 5: what it means to follow the Lord in this country.
• 3:52
  Speaker 5: And these families need God and these kids need church.
• 3:55
  Speaker 5: And he was like, man. And the wife came out
• 3:57
  Speaker 5: and was like, who's this? And he's like, oh, my
• 3:58
  Speaker 5: new friend. We're getting sprinter vans and having babies. So
• 4:03
  Speaker 5: if you just live normal, you just be you. The
• 4:06
  Speaker 5: fear is you've got to be something you're not. I mean,
• 4:10
  Speaker 5: I've got to be Vody all of a sudden at
• 4:12
  Speaker 5: the grocery store. I don't say it like him. Or
• 4:14
  Speaker 5: I've got to be Costi. Just be you and talk
• 4:17
  Speaker 5: about what God's done. Don't be like, oh, yeah, you know,
• 4:20
  Speaker 5: the It's been a really good year. We've really caught
• 4:23
  Speaker 5: some good luck. No, say, yeah, God has been good.
• 4:28
  Speaker 5: There's been trials, but the Lord's been good to us.
• 4:30
  Speaker 5: And live your life loud and bold, and then invite
• 4:34
  Speaker 5: people to church and share what the root of your
• 4:37
  Speaker 5: joy is. And I think that's one of the best
• 4:39
  Speaker 5: ways to also not maybe get labeled like too much
• 4:45
  Speaker 5: of a weirdo.
• 4:45
  Speaker 4: We are Christians. We are weird, and that's good. We
• 4:47
  Speaker 4: should embrace weird. We're different, period.
• 4:50
  Speaker 5: But you don't need to be awkward. Like you're reading
• 4:54
  Speaker 5: a manuscript, just live loud for Jesus and be normal.
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: Amen. Amen. Bodie, anything you would add?
• 5:06
  Speaker 3: No. Um, I, I agree, especially in terms of finding
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: ways that you connect there and recognizing the fact that
• 5:16
  Speaker 3: that's not going to be everybody. Right. Um, There are
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: going to be times when you just have that instant
• 5:24
  Speaker 3: connection and can go deeper with people. There are going
• 5:27
  Speaker 3: to be other times where there's going to be like
• 5:30
  Speaker 3: an instant stiff arm, you know. And we've just got
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: to be okay with that. And part of being okay
• 5:35
  Speaker 3: with that is, like you said, just be normal. And
• 5:38
  Speaker 3: I think at its core what that means is Christ
• 5:43
  Speaker 3: is your all in all. You're just reflecting. You're like
• 5:48
  Speaker 3: the guy who loves golf. The guy who loves golf,
• 5:50
  Speaker 3: you talk to him for five minutes, something golf is
• 5:53
  Speaker 3: going to come up, right? And you need to be
• 5:57
  Speaker 3: the guy who loves Jesus and just be normal. And
• 6:01
  Speaker 3: you may not like golf, but if the guy loves
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: golf and he brings up golf, you're not offended. You
• 6:05
  Speaker 3: just see this is what he loves and he brought
• 6:07
  Speaker 3: it up, right? And I think I agree. Just be normal. Amen.
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: And just to go a little further, the second question
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: kind of, lends itself to something you alluded to there.
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: Your first session, Do Not Love the World, very impactful.
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: I was thinking about how we interact with the world,
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: reveals the affections of our heart, especially as we think
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: about wanting to be friends with particular people or the world.
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: So how do we share the gospel? Obviously, no one
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: wants to hear it, but how do we share the
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: gospel with those who explicitly have let us know they
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: don't want to hear it?
• 6:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, it kind of depends on how they let
• 6:48
  Speaker 3: us know. Um, but we've got to let them understand
• 6:55
  Speaker 3: that that's just, that's who we are. Right. And let
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: them make it clear to them that what they're saying
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: is that they don't want a relationship with us. Right.
• 7:07
  Speaker 3: Is that what you're saying that you don't want to realize,
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: you know, because if you're asking me to not be
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: who I am, that's what you're saying to me. Um,
• 7:15
  Speaker 3: And that's what they say. That's what it just has
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: to be, you know. I've said this often. I shared
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: this a lot. But I started Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu in 2012.
• 7:31
  Speaker 3: Our oldest son, you know, we homeschool. And, you know,
• 7:37
  Speaker 3: the end of the homeschool education is kind of where
• 7:43
  Speaker 3: my influence is heaviest and My input is heaviest. And
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: so in the last four and a half years of
• 7:49
  Speaker 3: his schooling, he traveled with me everywhere I went. And
• 7:54
  Speaker 3: we went to 35 states and 14 countries together in
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: that time. And so he finishes up and I just
• 8:01
  Speaker 3: missed him. And so he started doing some martial arts stuff.
• 8:04
  Speaker 3: He started doing this Brazilian jiu-jitsu stuff. And I went
• 8:07
  Speaker 3: and I was like a duck who found water, you know,
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: and I loved it. But what I also recognized was,
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: and this is the irony of asking pastors about evangelism,
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: because I recognize that as I began to do that
• 8:23
  Speaker 3: and get into it, it was the first time in
• 8:25
  Speaker 3: a long time that I had lost friends. If you're
• 8:29
  Speaker 3: in pastoral ministry for a few years, you might run
• 8:32
  Speaker 3: into lost people at the grocery store, but you don't
• 8:35
  Speaker 3: have like friends' friends that are unbelievers. And I started
• 8:39
  Speaker 3: developing actual friendships with, We train together. We do tournaments together. This, that,
• 8:46
  Speaker 3: and the other. Blood, sweat, and tears, literally, right? And
• 8:52
  Speaker 3: there would be some people who would find out, you know,
• 8:54
  Speaker 3: who I was and what I did, and they would
• 8:57
  Speaker 3: just preemptively say, listen, man, you know, I don't want
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: none of that, you know? And I'm like, okay, fine,
• 9:07
  Speaker 3: you know? But what I found is that even in
• 9:11
  Speaker 3: those relationships... There'd be just being, you know, who I
• 9:14
  Speaker 3: am and having integrity and not being willing to be silent, right?
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: I mean, you can say that all you want, but
• 9:20
  Speaker 3: I'm still going to be who I am. When the
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: wheels fell off in their life, guess where they came?
• 9:27
  Speaker 3: You know? They didn't go to the pagans, right? And
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: so I think it's very important for us, even with
• 9:35
  Speaker 3: those people, to let them know, I'm not going to
• 9:37
  Speaker 3: stop being who I am, right? Because that would say
• 9:40
  Speaker 3: to you that what I believe is really not all
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: that's significant to me. I am going to respect you.
• 9:46
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to be a jerk to you or whatever.
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: But I'm not going to stop being who I am,
• 9:51
  Speaker 3: you know. And when you're ready, I'm here. Amen. That's good.
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: Kosti, anything you could add?
• 9:59
  Speaker 3: Amen.
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: All right, so shifting gears just.
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: A little bit to the workplace in particular, when we
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: think about evangelism, sharing the gospel, how can we be
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: bold at work but not turn people away from the
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: gospel but also be thinking about the call to be
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: submissive to our bosses?
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: How do we do that well?
• 10:26
  Speaker 5: Well, I think Vody kind of said it, or didn't
• 10:28
  Speaker 5: kind of. There was nothing kind of about the last session.
• 10:32
  Speaker 5: He said it explicitly. You don't submit into sin. So
• 10:35
  Speaker 5: one of the ways that you're going to submit to
• 10:36
  Speaker 5: your boss is as faithfully as you can, execute the job.
• 10:41
  Speaker 5: I've often said Christians should be the best workers. We
• 10:44
  Speaker 5: should have the best work ethic. because we reflect the
• 10:46
  Speaker 5: glory of God in that, and so we shouldn't be lazy, apathetic,
• 10:49
  Speaker 5: we shouldn't be complainers, we should be can-do, can-do kind
• 10:52
  Speaker 5: of people, and bosses should love their Christian employees, and
• 10:58
  Speaker 5: so there's that, that's one of the ways you can
• 11:00
  Speaker 5: be a witness, and I think beyond that is in conversations,
• 11:04
  Speaker 5: everything he just said, I think is spot on for
• 11:07
  Speaker 5: being a stable, non-anxious presence in the workplace, being honest though,
• 11:12
  Speaker 5: that you struggle, you're not perfect, but knowing where your
• 11:15
  Speaker 5: source is and then reflecting where your source is.
• 11:18
  Speaker 4: So if someone else has a hard day and they're pounding.
• 11:20
  Speaker 5: The whiskey and they're getting drunk or they're cussing up
• 11:23
  Speaker 5: a storm and fired up, you're having a hard day
• 11:25
  Speaker 5: and you're going, yeah, this is really a challenge.
• 11:28
  Speaker 4: I'm really frustrated. And man, I just, I need to pray.
• 11:33
  Speaker 4: I need to get my mind right.
• 11:34
  Speaker 5: I need to make sure I watch my mouth because
• 11:37
  Speaker 5: everything in me wants to fire off, but yeah, I
• 11:40
  Speaker 5: got to give this one to the Lord, man.
• 11:41
  Speaker 4: You know, what do you think? And guy's like, oh,
• 11:43
  Speaker 4: so you're normal. You get frustrated. You have emotions.
• 11:46
  Speaker 3: You have feelings.
• 11:46
  Speaker 5: You're not a perfect little robot, but you give it
• 11:49
  Speaker 5: to that guy or whatever that thing is you've been
• 11:51
  Speaker 5: telling me about. And I lose my mind. So I
• 11:54
  Speaker 5: think once again, being the non-anxious presence, stable eyes on Christ,
• 11:59
  Speaker 5: people see that. And then as far as the work
• 12:03
  Speaker 5: relationships that get really dicey, I was, I, was in
• 12:08
  Speaker 5: a conversation with a particular individual a while ago who
• 12:12
  Speaker 5: was very openly homosexual, but kept remarking about, you know,
• 12:20
  Speaker 5: how orderly in this particular context, you know, our kids were,
• 12:24
  Speaker 5: how polite my family was or what have you.
• 12:26
  Speaker 4: And that opened up some conversation.
• 12:29
  Speaker 5: We are on two sides of a bridge and it
• 12:32
  Speaker 5: is oil and water in a lot of ways, but
• 12:34
  Speaker 5: there was some, I don't know what you'd call that
• 12:36
  Speaker 5: common grace or just those moments, And I used those
• 12:39
  Speaker 5: opportunities to keep seeding truth and saying, you know, how
• 12:44
  Speaker 5: did you get your kids to like, like they just obey.
• 12:47
  Speaker 5: I'm like, well, they're definitely not perfect. I mean, there's
• 12:49
  Speaker 5: a lot of issues, but yeah, we call that old
• 12:51
  Speaker 5: school parenting in our parts of the world. And he
• 12:53
  Speaker 5: was like, oh, y'all church people?
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: Like, yeah.
• 12:57
  Speaker 4: And once again, he's like.
• 12:59
  Speaker 3: All right.
• 13:00
  Speaker 5: But he had to reconcile this juxtaposition of like, well,
• 13:02
  Speaker 5: they're so stinking nice and polite and orderly. But, oh,
• 13:07
  Speaker 5: they probably don't like that I'm gay. And I go,
• 13:08
  Speaker 5: I'll just leave that with you. I never said it.
• 13:11
  Speaker 5: And so, again, stable, steady, look to Christ.
• 13:15
  Speaker 4: So that might be, you know, some of the more
• 13:17
  Speaker 4: practical ends of the spectrum.
• 13:19
  Speaker 5: But I think, you know, voting could probably speak to
• 13:23
  Speaker 5: when you got to light the torch and kind of
• 13:25
  Speaker 5: burn the ships and go, yeah, I'm out of here.
• 13:28
  Speaker 3: I'm a Christian. Why is that my part, man? Why
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: is that my part? Why do I have to blow
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: stuff up, man?
• 13:38
  Speaker 5: Because your last two books were fault lines.
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: And it's not like me.
• 13:44
  Speaker 4: It's not like I'm black. Like, okay, Bodhi.
• 13:49
  Speaker 5: You're like, right now, you're like, you're Batman. And all
• 13:57
  Speaker 5: you're like, if I put the little light thing in
• 13:59
  Speaker 5: the sky, bat signal, red phone, Bodhi, you're on it.
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah. The Dark Knight.
• 14:07
  Speaker 4: Oh, man.
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: Yeah. But no, there are those times. And I think
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: we need to always have an exit strategy. And here's
• 14:26
  Speaker 3: what I mean by that. Not I go to work
• 14:29
  Speaker 3: looking to get fired. But if you don't have an
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: exit strategy, That means you are willing to do anything
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: necessary to keep that position, even compromise that should be unacceptable.
• 14:47
  Speaker 3: That's good. You have to make up in your mind
• 14:50
  Speaker 3: now that there are lines you're not going to cross.
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: You have to make that very clear and start thinking
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: about what you're going to do and how you're going
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: to respond if and when... Those moments do arrive. If not,
• 15:10
  Speaker 3: then because our adversary does not want our acceptance. And
• 15:16
  Speaker 3: these cultural battles, our adversary doesn't want our acceptance. They
• 15:20
  Speaker 3: demand our obedience. They demand our acquiescence. They demand that
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: we worship, right? They demand that we say Caesar is Lord.
• 15:32
  Speaker 3: And so it's not enough. that you do your thing
• 15:35
  Speaker 3: on Sunday and that you keep your head down. That's
• 15:38
  Speaker 3: not enough, especially with some of these things that we've
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: been talking about, right? It's not enough that you find
• 15:47
  Speaker 3: a slick way not to use the pronouns because that's
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: what we do, right? We're like, I'm not using the pronouns.
• 15:55
  Speaker 3: I'll use your name. You know, I'll do this. I'll
• 15:58
  Speaker 3: do that. But that's not enough, right? There are people
• 16:01
  Speaker 3: who come after you for that. Although some of that's
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: changing now. Amen? Amen. We praise God for his mercy
• 16:09
  Speaker 3: in that regard, that some of that's changing now. But,
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: I mean, we do. We need to have that up front.
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: And part of that also is just making it known
• 16:22
  Speaker 3: up front who you are and what you stand for, right?
• 16:28
  Speaker 3: And not being obnoxious about it. but just putting it
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: out there so that you're sort of seeding the ground, right?
• 16:40
  Speaker 3: And preparing yourself for faithfulness and not for this continual
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: and gradual compromise in order to get ahead.
• 16:50
  Speaker 4: So good. Let me add one thing really quick.
• 16:53
  Speaker 5: You reminded me of a conversation I was having not
• 16:55
  Speaker 5: more than a couple weeks ago with a business brother
• 16:57
  Speaker 5: in our church. And he was wrestling through the idea
• 17:01
  Speaker 5: that we need to be bold and let it fly.
• 17:05
  Speaker 5: And the fact that he also knows biblically that in
• 17:08
  Speaker 5: his place of business, he said this. He said, is
• 17:12
  Speaker 5: there an element to this, though, in which we are
• 17:14
  Speaker 5: called to be quiet, stable, steady, but, and then I
• 17:18
  Speaker 5: love what he said. He said, but unflinching when challenged.
• 17:23
  Speaker 5: And I loved it. And the sentiment is, oh, I'm
• 17:27
  Speaker 5: going to be bold as a lion. And yet, I'm
• 17:30
  Speaker 5: not going into work every day when someone has specifically said,
• 17:35
  Speaker 5: you know, my pronouns are they, them. And you're like,
• 17:38
  Speaker 5: you know, what's up, she, her? Like, that's not, that's
• 17:42
  Speaker 5: an edge. But if they said, you need to this,
• 17:46
  Speaker 5: or you need, unflinching when challenged. And you say, that
• 17:49
  Speaker 5: goes against my faith?
• 17:50
  Speaker 3: No.
• 17:51
  Speaker 4: And they say, well, you're fired. You go, well.
• 17:54
  Speaker 3: I'm looking for a job on a foundation. That's right.
• 18:00
  Speaker 4: So good.
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: So this conference is all about living for Christ in
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: the midst of a Christless culture. Votie, earlier your first session,
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: you alluded to Romans 13, right? So one question came in,
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: what should be the government's role in our life according
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: to the Bible?
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: And what about education?
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah, the government's role is really simple. um, to reward
• 18:25
  Speaker 3: and encourage the good and to, and to punish the evil. Um,
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: the government has a really, really simple, um, from a,
• 18:35
  Speaker 3: from a biblical perspective, um, scope and set of responsibilities. And,
• 18:42
  Speaker 3: you know, when it comes to education, um, that's not a,
• 18:48
  Speaker 3: that's not a governmental responsibility. Uh, It's nowhere in the U.S. Constitution.
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: It's just not there. It's not a thing. It's not
• 18:59
  Speaker 3: part of the scope of the government's authority, duty, or responsibility.
• 19:05
  Speaker 3: It's a result of usurpation. Even when it comes to
• 19:12
  Speaker 3: our Constitution, a large percentage of what our government does
• 19:18
  Speaker 3: is far beyond the scope of of the constitution, not,
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: I mean, let alone, you know, biblical truth.
• 19:26
  Speaker 5: So.
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: Cost anything to add?
• 19:29
  Speaker 5: I just think that what he's saying is that parents
• 19:32
  Speaker 5: should be highly involved in their child's education, their discipleship.
• 19:37
  Speaker 5: We say at our church all the time, and at
• 19:39
  Speaker 5: fun for the gospel resources do with parenting parents, you
• 19:41
  Speaker 5: are the primary disciple makers.
• 19:43
  Speaker 4: That is your job. And so in that regard, you
• 19:47
  Speaker 4: don't punt that elsewhere.
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: Amen and thinking about parenting i was doing the math
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: earlier between the three of us we have 24 children so.
• 20:00
  Speaker 5: You're nine they just had nine wow yeah sprinter van pastor.
• 20:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah baby that's right yeah i was yeah i was
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: thinking about you you said uh Honda Odyssey. And I
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: was like, I remember we used to fit in one
• 20:12
  Speaker 3: of those.
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: So in thinking about parenting, how do we appropriately shield
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: children from the world versus overly protective sheltering?
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: And Kosti, I'll start with you for this one.
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: Start with the guy with just six kids.
• 20:37
  Speaker 5: One of the things that I believe the Bible makes
• 20:41
  Speaker 5: clear if I'm the primary disciple maker is I'm going
• 20:43
  Speaker 5: to be teaching and guiding and shepherding my kids. So
• 20:46
  Speaker 5: then application is we have very honest and open and
• 20:50
  Speaker 5: biblical conversations about everything in our house as is age appropriate.
• 20:54
  Speaker 5: So with each child, we don't put stuff under the rug.
• 20:58
  Speaker 5: I don't cross my fingers and hope that they didn't
• 21:00
  Speaker 5: hear that person say what they said. I don't cross
• 21:03
  Speaker 5: my fingers and go, I mean, it should be fine. Like,
• 21:06
  Speaker 5: you know, I, I ask my son about the conversations
• 21:09
  Speaker 5: and we talk about, I'm involved with his basketball team
• 21:11
  Speaker 5: and with different things we do in the world. And
• 21:15
  Speaker 5: we have honest, open conversations. I ask them what they think.
• 21:18
  Speaker 5: I ask them questions. We've been on trips together. One
• 21:21
  Speaker 5: of the things that I do now as early as
• 21:24
  Speaker 5: I can is I'll take my kids on ministry trips.
• 21:26
  Speaker 5: And so they're on airplanes, they're in airports, they're at
• 21:28
  Speaker 5: different restaurants and they're observing. I mean, even, uh, You know,
• 21:33
  Speaker 5: recently my daughter asked me a startling question about the
• 21:36
  Speaker 5: way certain people were behaving at a restaurant. And instead
• 21:38
  Speaker 5: of being like, well, don't worry about that. You know,
• 21:40
  Speaker 5: you're too young to talk about that.
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: She's eight.
• 21:42
  Speaker 5: I said, well, sweetheart, let's talk about that. And then
• 21:45
  Speaker 5: she asked me a bigger question after. She said, have
• 21:47
  Speaker 5: you ever acted like that?
• 21:48
  Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, no.
• 21:51
  Speaker 4: And I said, baby girl, it's time.
• 21:53
  Speaker 3: You're eight.
• 21:53
  Speaker 5: You can handle it. Before I knew Jesus. And she's like,
• 21:56
  Speaker 5: when you believe the false stuff?
• 21:57
  Speaker 4: I'm like, yup. Because they.
• 22:02
  Speaker 4: They know.
• 22:04
  Speaker 3: They know.
• 22:04
  Speaker 5: Once they hit a certain age, they hear stuff. And
• 22:07
  Speaker 5: I said, that's right, sweetheart. I pretended that I was
• 22:09
  Speaker 5: a Christian, and I believed the false stuff, and I
• 22:12
  Speaker 5: acted like that. And she's like, oh, my.
• 22:14
  Speaker 4: I said, yep. And so we talk about these things,
• 22:17
  Speaker 4: and I say, so I.
• 22:17
  Speaker 5: Appreciate God's grace, and I appreciate Jesus, because I know
• 22:21
  Speaker 5: what a sinner I was.
• 22:22
  Speaker 4: So I'm having these gospel conversations. In that, I'm shepherding
• 22:24
  Speaker 4: my daughter, not to.
• 22:27
  Speaker 5: look at those, like, oh, those people, and we're not that,
• 22:29
  Speaker 5: but to realize, like, her father was a sinner, her
• 22:31
  Speaker 5: mother was a sinner, we're all sinners, but I also
• 22:33
  Speaker 5: tell my kids, you know, you don't need to have
• 22:35
  Speaker 5: some big testimony, like, it's not this cool thing, please,
• 22:39
  Speaker 5: have no testimony, have very minimal testimony, but honest conversations,
• 22:44
  Speaker 5: I think that presses in on something that Christian parents
• 22:47
  Speaker 5: struggle with, and we all do, we need to be equipped, they,
• 22:50
  Speaker 5: I don't know if we are as versed as we
• 22:53
  Speaker 5: ought to be in these things, and so then we
• 22:55
  Speaker 5: can't teach our kids, so that's One of the reasons
• 22:57
  Speaker 5: we had your books here in the quantity and in
• 23:00
  Speaker 5: the titles we did, the expository apologetics, so people can
• 23:04
  Speaker 5: actually be armed and dangerous in a good way. But
• 23:06
  Speaker 5: then the other books on family shepherding and those things
• 23:09
  Speaker 5: to realize, parents, you don't outsource. I'm thankful for great
• 23:14
  Speaker 5: people in my church who are involved with my family
• 23:18
  Speaker 5: and friends and small groups and all these things.
• 23:20
  Speaker 4: But in the end, I need to have those conversations
• 23:23
  Speaker 4: with my kids.
• 23:24
  Speaker 5: And so we do. And so far, by the grace
• 23:27
  Speaker 5: of God, we got a long way to go before
• 23:29
  Speaker 5: the jury's still out.
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: They're young.
• 23:31
  Speaker 4: But I'm doing everything I can, and I'm not rolling
• 23:35
  Speaker 4: the dice on any of that stuff. And I've seen
• 23:37
  Speaker 4: a lot. That's from you.
• 23:38
  Speaker 5: A lot of the teaching, a lot of those life lessons,
• 23:41
  Speaker 5: a lot of your books and resources talk about the
• 23:43
  Speaker 5: involvement of a father in the lives of his children
• 23:47
  Speaker 5: as the disciple maker.
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: And I think, too, that we need to be very
• 23:54
  Speaker 3: careful about the scriptures teach us it is inevitable that
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: temptations will come, but woe to the one through whom
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: the temptation comes. I don't need to go looking for it.
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: I need to be ready when these things arise, but
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: I don't need to go looking for temptation for my children.
• 24:18
  Speaker 3: I don't need to be trying to find out how
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: quickly I can expose them to ABC or XYZ I
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: don't want to be the source of that. And I
• 24:30
  Speaker 3: don't want to press that too early. And I want
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: to thank God for every day that he gives them
• 24:37
  Speaker 3: before they have to deal with whatever it is, right?
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: That's one of our, one of the anxious things for
• 24:47
  Speaker 3: us about moving back here is there's a lot of stuff.
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: There's a lot of stuff. I remember this was several
• 24:58
  Speaker 3: years ago. A lot of times I'd come back, and
• 25:03
  Speaker 3: so I would become like a sports junkie because of
• 25:06
  Speaker 3: the time difference. I don't get to watch any kind
• 25:10
  Speaker 3: of sports, right? Baseball, whatever. And when I come back,
• 25:15
  Speaker 3: there'll be some playoff game or something else, and I'm like,
• 25:18
  Speaker 3: it's on live right now, you know?
• 25:20
  Speaker 4: And so I'm just up watching sports, you know?
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: Even sports I don't like. And I remember, this was
• 25:27
  Speaker 3: several years ago, I'm watching ESPN, and a commercial comes
• 25:30
  Speaker 3: on about some HIV drug. And there's a full-on man-on-man kiss.
• 25:37
  Speaker 3: I remember I called Jay. I don't even know what
• 25:41
  Speaker 3: time it was. I'm like, Jay, I just watched the commercial.
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: And Jay was like, yeah, man, you've been in Africa
• 25:50
  Speaker 3: a long time. You know? And I was just shocked
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: by that. And so there is a sense in which,
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: you know, for our kids, that hasn't been, you know, prevalent.
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: And here we come. But I'm grateful for that time
• 26:11
  Speaker 3: that it hasn't been prevalent and also ready for dealing
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: with the things as they come.
• 26:17
  Speaker 4: Can I ask you a question?
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 26:19
  Speaker 4: As a younger dad, what are your thoughts on early
• 26:26
  Speaker 4: like screen time and all that.
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: No, we don't, we don't do the smartphone thing, man.
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: When they, when they, yeah. Um, it, if they, if
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: they're going to be at the age where they're going
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: out and doing something, then they need, you know, that,
• 26:41
  Speaker 3: that or whatever, then, then they can do that. Um,
• 26:43
  Speaker 3: if they're younger and they need a phone, give them
• 26:45
  Speaker 3: a dumb phone. Yeah. Um, so good. Don't give them
• 26:48
  Speaker 3: a smartphone that, that connection. Um, I was, um, Yeah, anyway, no,
• 26:56
  Speaker 3: we just, that's one of those things that we just
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: put off as long as we possibly can.
• 27:01
  Speaker 5: I think that's how it will be weird in today's culture. Like,
• 27:05
  Speaker 5: you have an iPad?
• 27:06
  Speaker 4: Like, not really. You're like eight years old. Like, oh,
• 27:11
  Speaker 4: you got your phone yet? Like, you're 14.
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: Like, no.
• 27:16
  Speaker 5: Just the basics of that are, yeah. I feel like
• 27:20
  Speaker 5: it's like putting a gun in the kid's hand, even
• 27:22
  Speaker 5: with all the controls. Or it's a punt on your parenting.
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 27:27
  Speaker 4: Like stick them in the corner with their iPad and
• 27:28
  Speaker 4: they'll shut up.
• 27:29
  Speaker 5: Yeah. They're like, maybe you should deal with the problem
• 27:32
  Speaker 5: of their behavior and disciple them. And that's what's wrong
• 27:37
  Speaker 5: with them.
• 27:37
  Speaker 3: I was watching a video the other day of a baby,
• 27:40
  Speaker 3: like a baby baby, right? A little baby, like not
• 27:43
  Speaker 3: even a year old. This is, you know, and they
• 27:47
  Speaker 3: were messing with a phone and the parent took the
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: phone and the baby, this is a, infant like not
• 27:55
  Speaker 3: even toddler yet baby just just went nuts and fell
• 28:02
  Speaker 3: out and just threw a full on tantrum I mean
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: it was like all of that and you know baby
• 28:08
  Speaker 3: sat back up they're just you know still at that
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: barely sitting up stage and the parents give the phone
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: back and the child chills and I'm just going I
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: hope they know that that's not funny like you're doing something,
• 28:28
  Speaker 3: that you're creating something. There's a problem when a child
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: that small is exhibiting the symptoms of dependency with an
• 28:39
  Speaker 3: electronic device, you know? Yeah, that's no bueno.
• 28:45
  Speaker 4: Helpful challenge.
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure.
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: As we think about your last session, Vody, biblical manhood, womanhood,
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: roles of husband and wife.
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: We had a question come in.
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: How should a man pursue a woman and how should
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: a woman respond to being pursued?
• 29:06
  Speaker 3: Vigorously. Intentionally. Yes, man should pursue a woman intentionally. Don't
• 29:17
  Speaker 3: play games. And a woman should make sure That a
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: man is pursuing her intentionally and not playing games, you know,
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: enough already of this, you know, five year, 10 year,
• 29:34
  Speaker 3: whatever stuff. No, be be intentional. Right. Um, if, and
• 29:42
  Speaker 3: if you're not at a place where you're ready to
• 29:44
  Speaker 3: be married, we tell our, we tell our kids this
• 29:46
  Speaker 3: all the time, you know, um, if you're not a
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: place where you need to be married, leave them alone,
• 29:53
  Speaker 3: leave them alone. If you're not ready to be married,
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: leave them alone. You know? Yeah. You, you, Entering into
• 29:59
  Speaker 3: those kind of serious relationships before you're ready to be
• 30:02
  Speaker 3: married is like going shopping without any money. Either you're
• 30:06
  Speaker 3: going to leave frustrated or you're going to take something
• 30:08
  Speaker 3: that doesn't belong to you. So good.
• 30:12
  Speaker 4: Is that in one of your books?
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: Maybe.
• 30:16
  Speaker 4: That was good. You should write that down. That was good.
• 30:21
  Speaker 5: I'm going to quote you on For the Gospel on
• 30:24
  Speaker 5: Monday morning.
• 30:24
  Speaker 3: Okay. It's so good.
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: Kosti, anything you can add to that?
• 30:32
  Speaker 4: No, I mean, I heard all the girl claps.
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: Amen. I agree.
• 30:38
  Speaker 3: I agree.
• 30:38
  Speaker 5: I think that men maybe get discouraged sometimes if they
• 30:41
  Speaker 5: pursue and a girl is not responsive.
• 30:45
  Speaker 4: I think there's two options. One, she's guarding her heart.
• 30:48
  Speaker 5: And you need to be clear and winsome and like
• 30:52
  Speaker 5: you said, vigorously. And if you know what you desire
• 30:55
  Speaker 5: and you know you're fit for it and you've talked
• 30:58
  Speaker 5: to your elders and they would say, yeah, you're, you're,
• 31:00
  Speaker 5: you're ready to pursue a godly woman. And you can
• 31:03
  Speaker 5: look at a young woman in the church in the
• 31:04
  Speaker 5: eye and say, listen, I know right now you're, you know,
• 31:07
  Speaker 5: you're kind of weighing your options here.
• 31:10
  Speaker 4: I'll tell you right now, I love the Lord. I
• 31:12
  Speaker 4: think you're amazing.
• 31:13
  Speaker 5: I'm, I'm able to provide, I'm able to guide and disciple.
• 31:19
  Speaker 5: And I just want you to know that, you know,
• 31:21
  Speaker 5: I won't play games with your heart and she can
• 31:22
  Speaker 5: be like all bashful and they go, Oh wow. So
• 31:24
  Speaker 5: forward and go, well, I'm, I won't waste your time
• 31:27
  Speaker 5: and play around like some of these other guys. So
• 31:29
  Speaker 5: I'm not passive. I won't be too aggressive, but let
• 31:32
  Speaker 5: me know. I really think you're an awesome woman. I
• 31:34
  Speaker 5: think there's a lot of women in the church who
• 31:35
  Speaker 5: are like, oh, finally, like just make it clear. A
• 31:39
  Speaker 5: lot of other guys in today's generation, I don't know
• 31:42
  Speaker 5: what it is, but Gen Z, and I'm not being cheeky,
• 31:46
  Speaker 5: like there are all sorts of studies out of this generation.
• 31:50
  Speaker 5: They're low T, like low testosterone, They're scrolling their phones.
• 31:54
  Speaker 5: They play video games. And there's nothing wrong with little
• 31:57
  Speaker 5: NCAA boys. If you have some fun, just take the
• 31:59
  Speaker 5: headset off once in a while and do something useful.
• 32:01
  Speaker 4: But all that.
• 32:03
  Speaker 5: But this generation of guys are very passive and very aloof.
• 32:09
  Speaker 4: And I don't know what it is.
• 32:10
  Speaker 5: But the men with some guts and some godly gusto,
• 32:14
  Speaker 5: they're going to get the women. And So don't wait around.
• 32:18
  Speaker 5: And also, I think, check with your church. Talk to
• 32:20
  Speaker 5: your elders. If someone in your life says, look, you
• 32:23
  Speaker 5: should not be talking to the girls, then don't. Or
• 32:27
  Speaker 5: if a young woman gets warned, like, stay.
• 32:31
  Speaker 4: Away from that one. Like, well, I can change him.
• 32:33
  Speaker 5: Like, no, you don't disciple him or missionary date.
• 32:39
  Speaker 4: It's not how it works. So those would be my thoughts.
• 32:43
  Speaker 4: So good.
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: All right, this seems like a very specific question, but
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: it's one that I have thought of as a dad,
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: maybe not to this particular degree, but thinking ahead to
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: when my daughters are going to be preparing for marriage.
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: The question is, should a father pay for a wedding
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: he doesn't bless or approve of?
• 33:05
  Speaker 4: Man, that's a great question.
• 33:08
  Speaker 3: Thank you. No. Just no. No. No, no. No. No. No. No. Yeah, no.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: Emphatic no.
• 33:40
  Speaker 3: No, that's just a no. Yeah, that's just a no, man.
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: It's just, you know. Because otherwise, what are we communicating
• 33:50
  Speaker 3: as fathers? If we're saying, I'm a gatekeeper, I have
• 33:53
  Speaker 3: a duty and a responsibility, and I'm looking at this
• 33:57
  Speaker 3: and I'm saying, whatever reason, from a biblical perspective as
• 34:01
  Speaker 3: a father, I'm saying, this is a non-starter. This is
• 34:04
  Speaker 3: a no-go. I do not approve. If I'm paying the money,
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: what I'm saying is, I'm going to bow to a
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: cultural norm and ignore a biblical mandate. I can't do that.
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: Are we saying amen, Kosti?
• 34:29
  Speaker 4: I'm saying you should write that down too. Who would
• 34:32
  Speaker 4: come up with this stuff?
• 34:35
  Speaker 3: I'm Batman.
• 34:36
  Speaker 4: I'm Batman.
• 34:44
  Speaker 5: This is the best Q & A panel.
• 34:46
  Speaker 4: I've ever been on.
• 34:49
  Speaker 3: Man.
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: All right, I think we have time for one more.
• 34:54
  Speaker 2: Obviously, we're talking about, again, living for Christ in a
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: Christless culture, but our sanctification, our growth in Christ, as
• 35:04
  Speaker 2: we know, is not to be conducted in isolation, right?
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: So speak to the importance of the local church. and
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: the importance of meaningful church membership.
• 35:17
  Speaker 4: That's good.
• 35:18
  Speaker 3: Really good.
• 35:19
  Speaker 5: I'll just jump in real quick and just think through
• 35:22
  Speaker 5: the means of grace by which God grows and sanctifies
• 35:27
  Speaker 5: and challenges and encourages and comforts and keep going with
• 35:31
  Speaker 5: all of the different verbs that happen because the people
• 35:33
  Speaker 5: of God gather. And that's going to happen through singing
• 35:37
  Speaker 5: and fellowshipping and preaching and receiving and giving and All
• 35:41
  Speaker 5: of the things that we do, all of the New Testament,
• 35:43
  Speaker 5: one and others, that's what God has decreed as the
• 35:47
  Speaker 5: means by which he pours out his power, his spirit
• 35:52
  Speaker 5: onto his people. And together something happens. We're being, you
• 35:55
  Speaker 5: think of Ephesians 2.20 and beyond, we're being built up
• 35:58
  Speaker 5: into a spiritual house on the foundation of the apostles
• 36:01
  Speaker 5: and the prophets. Christ is the cornerstone and we're a people,
• 36:04
  Speaker 5: a temple that God is building up and he does
• 36:06
  Speaker 5: that together. So importance of the local church, is clear there.
• 36:11
  Speaker 5: As far as membership goes, we practice meaningful membership or
• 36:15
  Speaker 5: what we call biblical membership nowadays because in the Bible,
• 36:19
  Speaker 5: there was no need for a membership class because people
• 36:22
  Speaker 5: understood what they were deciding. When you got baptized, everybody knew.
• 36:25
  Speaker 5: I mean, you lost family, you lost friends, you lost income,
• 36:30
  Speaker 5: you lost your identity. If you were a Jew and
• 36:32
  Speaker 5: you were converting to Christianity, if you were a Roman
• 36:35
  Speaker 5: citizen and So there was no need to be like, hey,
• 36:38
  Speaker 5: you should probably come to a class because you've been
• 36:40
  Speaker 5: voting with your feet and floating like a church hopper.
• 36:42
  Speaker 5: And we need to actually teach you what it means
• 36:44
  Speaker 5: to submit to elders and not leave every church because
• 36:46
  Speaker 5: you don't like the coffee or you don't like the lighting.
• 36:51
  Speaker 5: You need to be a part of the body of Christ.
• 36:53
  Speaker 5: Or people say, I love Jesus, I just can't stand
• 36:55
  Speaker 5: the church. Or there's no such thing. So we teach
• 36:58
  Speaker 5: now today meaningful membership to help people understand. Membership in
• 37:02
  Speaker 5: the Bible wasn't, I took a class, I'm on the rolls.
• 37:06
  Speaker 5: it's a spiritual thing. But now people treat the church
• 37:09
  Speaker 5: like a restaurant. I like this one, or I don't
• 37:13
  Speaker 5: like this one. Or I, you know, the Yelp now,
• 37:15
  Speaker 5: church is Yelp.
• 37:16
  Speaker 4: We have a Yelp. I don't even know people.
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: I didn't like it.
• 37:19
  Speaker 5: Like you could have heard a sermon that was just true.
• 37:22
  Speaker 5: And so people are so consumeristic that one guy got it.
• 37:28
  Speaker 5: People are so consumeristic that you have to teach them
• 37:32
  Speaker 5: again what it means to be a covenant people together
• 37:35
  Speaker 5: and to be submitted to elders.
• 37:37
  Speaker 4: But also, and I love this, we talk about this
• 37:39
  Speaker 4: in our class.
• 37:40
  Speaker 5: What it means for the elders to exercise oversight as
• 37:43
  Speaker 5: ones who will be accountable. He brought up Hebrews 13,
• 37:46
  Speaker 5: 17 earlier. We give an account to the Lord. So
• 37:48
  Speaker 5: it's not submit to your elders. And so church leaders
• 37:50
  Speaker 5: are abusive and do what they want. No, we will
• 37:54
  Speaker 5: answer to Christ for how we shepherd the people. So
• 37:57
  Speaker 5: everybody is fulfilling their role with reverence and honor. So
• 38:01
  Speaker 5: Definitely understand the means of grace and what God's using.
• 38:04
  Speaker 5: Don't divorce from the church. And then two, understand what
• 38:07
  Speaker 5: your role is in that.
• 38:10
  Speaker 3: So good.
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: I'm going to give the last word, devotee Batman.
• 38:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I think this one is becoming more and more difficult.
• 38:19
  Speaker 3: And the reason that there's several reasons for that, not
• 38:23
  Speaker 3: least of which is that we've changed the way we
• 38:30
  Speaker 3: consume everything else, right? And we've made it possible for
• 38:38
  Speaker 3: people to even change the way they consume church. I
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: was listening to somebody talking about media. It used to
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: be if you were going to watch the news, you
• 38:52
  Speaker 3: had to be in your house in front of your
• 38:55
  Speaker 3: TV at 9 o'clock, 10 o'clock, whatever. so that you
• 39:01
  Speaker 3: could watch the news. You had to be there. Well,
• 39:05
  Speaker 3: now you just find the people you like, and you
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: subscribe to their YouTube channel, and whenever you're ready, you
• 39:15
  Speaker 3: go to your feed, and you just consume it when
• 39:17
  Speaker 3: you're ready. We also do that with sermons and conferences
• 39:23
  Speaker 3: and everything else, and I think it's a two-edged sword.
• 39:27
  Speaker 3: On the one hand, there's... more wonderful teaching available to
• 39:31
  Speaker 3: people than there ever has been before. But on the
• 39:34
  Speaker 3: other hand, people see less and less value in membership
• 39:41
  Speaker 3: in the local church than ever before. And so I
• 39:47
  Speaker 3: think we really have to drill down on that and
• 39:51
  Speaker 3: help people understand. I mean, we can't fight it. I've
• 39:55
  Speaker 3: said it many times before, and this is many, many
• 39:58
  Speaker 3: years ago, I got outvoted by my elders in my
• 40:01
  Speaker 3: church because they wanted to put our services online. Then
• 40:07
  Speaker 3: it was on sermon audio or wherever. They wanted to
• 40:10
  Speaker 3: record our messages and put them out there, and I
• 40:13
  Speaker 3: didn't want to do that. And anyway, I lost that.
• 40:19
  Speaker 3: It wasn't like I could, you know, chapter, verse, this
• 40:22
  Speaker 3: is whatever. It was more of an opinion. And so
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: we did. And on the one hand, I'm grateful to
• 40:36
  Speaker 3: the Lord for the number of people who've been able
• 40:38
  Speaker 3: to access all of that information. But on the other hand,
• 40:43
  Speaker 3: it worries me. that there are so many people who
• 40:47
  Speaker 3: consider me or you their pastor from thousands of miles away.
• 40:52
  Speaker 3: And I think while all of that is good and
• 40:56
  Speaker 3: true and we need to press in on that, we
• 41:01
  Speaker 3: need to recognize that there are some factors at work
• 41:06
  Speaker 3: that are double-edged swords that are helping us and harming us.
• 41:11
  Speaker 3: And we need to face those head on and figure
• 41:15
  Speaker 3: out how to, on the one hand, be grateful for
• 41:18
  Speaker 3: God's good gifts and take advantage of them, but on
• 41:21
  Speaker 3: the other hand, not allow those good gifts to cause
• 41:27
  Speaker 3: us to compromise and forsake what God has actually commanded
• 41:33
  Speaker 3: for us. Amen. Amen. So good, so good.
• 41:37
  Speaker 1: Thank you, brothers. Let's give them a round of applause.
• 41:43
  Speaker 3: Good night.
• 41:45
  Speaker 5: Just really quick, Vody, you mentioned it earlier and my
• 41:50
  Speaker 5: ears were burning. You mentioned a little something about Brazilian jujitsu.
• 41:54
  Speaker 5: And so we thought as a little thank you, we
• 41:57
  Speaker 5: would do a couple things.
• 41:59
  Speaker 4: First, this is for you. I'd love for you to
• 42:01
  Speaker 4: open it up in front of everyone.
• 42:05
  Speaker 5: And I've gone ahead with some buddies and we've reserved
• 42:09
  Speaker 5: a little private, after you preach the word tomorrow and
• 42:12
  Speaker 5: take a nap, we've reserved.
• 42:14
  Speaker 4: A little private....
• 42:16
  Speaker 2: Nice.
• 42:22
  Speaker 3: Nice.
• 42:22
  Speaker 4: I'm going to take you tomorrow evening, and you're going
• 42:26
  Speaker 4: to beat me up. We're going to go do some
• 42:28
  Speaker 4: jujitsu together.
• 42:29
  Speaker 3: Nice, nice.
• 42:30
  Speaker 5: And we've got a few brothers that enjoy it, and
• 42:31
  Speaker 5: we'd love for you to enjoy that just as a
• 42:33
  Speaker 5: little token of our appreciation.
• 42:35
  Speaker 3: Very nice. Oh, man, this is awesome.
• 42:37
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's your size, too.
• 42:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, this is, yeah. I got it for you. This
• 42:41
  Speaker 3: is awesome. Yeah. You got my belt in here?
• 42:44
  Speaker 4: We thought you'd bring that.
• 42:45
  Speaker 3: I was supposed to travel with my belt, man.
• 42:48
  Speaker 4: Don't you travel everywhere? Purple belt. Purple belt. We're thankful for.
• 42:53
  Speaker 3: You, Odie. Thank you very much. Absolutely. This is cool.
• 42:56
  Speaker 3: Thank you.
• 42:57
  Speaker 4: Thank you.