Latest / The Curve / Untangling Shared Property & Wealth After a Relationship, with Sarah Falanitule.

Transcript

Untangling Shared Property & Wealth After a Relationship, with Sarah Falanitule. · The Curve

0:00
Today's guest is very senior at BNZ.
0:04
She manages a team of about 20 to 25 people
0:07
and is helping shape a 60 billion mortgage portfolio,
0:11
a lot of responsibility.
0:13
The conversation started speaking about a career pivot
0:16
or a moment really that gave me goosebumps
0:19
where she realized the trajectory of her career
0:22
was just not where she wanted to be anymore.
0:24
But a huge part of this combo is talking about the idea
0:28
of starting to build wealth alongside someone,
0:31
going through a breakup and then having to untangle assets
0:35
and rebuild wealth on your own,
0:37
to hear someone so senior in their role,
0:40
speak so candidly about what that experience was like,
0:44
how to avoid feeling better
0:46
and to feel completely weighted down by financial stress.
0:50
I think was just such an inspiring,
0:53
amazing representation of how I hope to be
0:56
when I have more experience with investing in my career,
0:59
not being someone who is super senior and acts
1:03
as though they've got it all figured out.
1:05
The lessons that she learned along the way
1:06
and the mindset that she has towards what she thought
1:11
her wealth was gonna look like
1:12
and what she thought her life was gonna look like
1:14
to how it ended up.
1:15
I just think it's so inspiring.
1:17
We also spoke a lot about her approach to property.
1:19
So obviously working in that space means
1:21
she's really schooled up when it comes to buying property.
1:24
So hearing what she would buy again,
1:25
what she wouldn't buy again,
1:27
there were some things that quite surprised me
1:29
and all honesty that I would never have thought about.
1:31
If you're a first home buyer or you know someone
1:33
that could be a first home buyer,
1:35
Sarah explains why she thinks it's an amazing time
1:37
to be buying especially if it's your first home.
1:40
There was some practical gold
1:42
and I mean about insurance rates having a buffer
1:45
when it comes to buying property.
1:47
Stuff that we don't often speak about
1:50
but if you've bought lots of property
1:51
you totally understand and can pass that on
1:53
so that was really golden advice.
1:55
And then we actually ended on a poem
1:57
which sounds kind of bizarre
1:58
but it was really such a beautiful way to wrap up
2:02
the wisdom that Sarah shared in this episode.
2:05
I genuinely loved this conversation.
2:07
I think that there is just so much to be learned
2:10
from each other and this is such a great example of,
2:14
sometimes I mean I saw the stat the other day
2:16
and it was about how people are less and less interested
2:19
in celebrities and I think that this conversation
2:22
with someone who just has every day experience
2:25
and every day advice and every day insights
2:28
that can be so incredibly helpful
2:30
that to me is just so much more interesting
2:32
than listing or watching or learning
2:34
from someone who has millions of followers on Instagram.
2:36
So yeah, to me this was a really real conversation.
2:40
I think that you'll love it.
2:41
And yeah, we would really appreciate if you listen to this
2:44
and you have feedback or thoughts,
2:46
please comment wherever you're listing
2:48
because I know for Sarah this was the first time
2:50
she'd done something like this
2:51
and that can be kind of scary.
2:52
So I'm sure she would appreciate the feedback.
2:55
But without more rambling,
2:57
I'm sorry for the longest introduction ever.
2:59
Here is my conversation with Sarah.
3:02
Welcome to another episode of the Property Podcast.
3:06
I am loving the series.
3:09
It's so fun to be able to talk about a different asset class.
3:11
I mean it's been years that we've spoken about the stock market
3:14
so to be able to really dive into property, I'm loving.
3:18
We just wanted to share a message from our partners
3:19
being shared who know that home ownership is not a straight line.
3:23
Sometimes life just does throw you curveballs
3:25
and there's actually nothing you can do about it.
3:28
You just have to remember that they're all about supporting you
3:30
through the hard stuff, not just the highlights.
3:32
So if you are in a position where you're having a total meltdown
3:36
or something's not on to plan,
3:37
just remember that the sooner that you talk to the bank,
3:39
the more options that you will have.
3:41
And it is never too late no matter how dire things feel
3:44
to reach out, they are always there to help and not judge.
3:47
So whether you're at the start of your journey
3:49
or you're rebuilding whatever is gone wrong,
3:52
remember that BNZ has got the tools and the people
3:54
and they're ready to help you find a way.
3:56
Thank you so much to BNZ for empowering this podcast
3:59
and let's get into it.
4:03
I was actually just gushing about Sarah's career
4:06
before we started recording.
4:07
Sometimes I have these moments where I'm like,
4:10
I'm kind of a little bit blown away
4:12
that I have the opportunity to speak to people
4:13
who have had such interesting amazing careers.
4:16
So thank you so much for being on the podcast.
4:18
Before we record podcasts,
4:20
just as a quick peep behind the curtain for people
4:22
who don't know, we always speak to our interview guests
4:25
before we do the actual interview
4:27
because otherwise honestly, you could record
4:28
for like 70 hours.
4:30
You know, you kind of go in circles,
4:31
find the things that you want to talk about
4:33
and then, you know, we've chatted a lot off Mike.
4:36
We have, it's been good, it's been great.
4:39
But we know exactly what we're talking about today
4:41
and there's gonna be everything from Sarah's journey
4:44
within the financial industry
4:46
and what she's achieved as well as learnings from
4:50
being in a situation where you're building wealth
4:52
alongside someone and then you're now
4:55
in a new position where actually you're building wealth
4:57
by yourself and having to go through
4:58
the untangling of assets, which I think particularly
5:01
a lot of New Zealanders have been through
5:03
because a lot of us get married
5:05
or engaged quite young.
5:06
Totally.
5:07
Yeah, there's so much to talk about,
5:08
particularly just the idea I guess of like
5:11
how women can think about wealth building
5:13
in a slightly different way
5:13
and how we actually have to think about it
5:15
in a different way because biological clocks, et cetera.
5:19
So I would love to ask you,
5:23
firstly, you had an experience when you worked at Ernest
5:26
and Young when you first kind of left university
5:30
and then there was a moment where you thought,
5:32
oh, dear God, I need to get out of this industry ASAP.
5:35
Can you just explain what happened
5:37
and what that moment was that propelled you into banking
5:39
in a completely different career path?
5:41
Yeah, so I left,
5:44
I did a law degree at university
5:46
knew really early on
5:48
that I wasn't really interested in going into a law firm,
5:51
but the options were a few and so I ended up at EY
5:55
and it was great, like I loved working there.
5:58
By the time I'd been there for like five years,
6:00
I was putting on some really long hours.
6:03
What kind of hours are we talking?
6:04
It wouldn't be unusual to like start it, like eight,
6:08
but you'd be going to ten
6:09
and sometimes you were working weekends
6:11
and you would do that for weeks on end
6:14
because you had a deal that just had to get over the line.
6:16
So you were working with really tight time frames,
6:18
you were working in lots of different jurisdictions
6:21
so you were working at funny hours.
6:24
But then there was this moment where we were working
6:27
on a deal and we got called into the kitchen
6:30
and the partner who we had been doing the deal with
6:34
who wasn't even 40 had died of a heart attack,
6:38
had just dropped in and I was like,
6:40
well, is that what my life is now?
6:44
And that didn't happen at the office to this.
6:46
No, I think God.
6:47
Oh my gosh.
6:48
It's so awful.
6:49
Yes, really awful and it was a horrible experience
6:52
because you didn't really know
6:55
what you were going to do next.
6:57
It felt really confronting to know
6:59
that actually your life could end up being that
7:02
and it was one of those moments where you either,
7:05
like I think you either double down
7:06
and you decide that that is what I'm going to do
7:07
for the rest of my life or you pivot.
7:09
You had a real almost cross road moment
7:11
if I could continue doing this
7:13
but I can kind of see what's ahead of me
7:16
and do I want it.
7:17
Yeah and I didn't.
7:19
And like lots of my friends are still in that industry
7:21
and they love it and it's great for them and it works
7:25
but for me that kind of, that just wasn't what I wanted.
7:27
And so I quit without a job to go to
7:33
which in itself at the time freaked my parents out
7:36
probably more than it scared me.
7:38
But it was one of those moments where it was like
7:41
you either leave or you continue on
7:44
and you just never know when you're going to leave.
7:46
And so I just, I left without anything to go to.
7:49
Thankfully I had lots of friends
7:51
who were in lots of different places
7:53
and one of them was working at a bank
7:55
and she said, well, I can get you an interview.
7:58
Do you want to come and have an interview
8:00
at National Bank at the time?
8:01
I did, I got the job and I've been in banking ever since.
8:05
And now you're in a position
8:07
where you're managing sort of 20s to 25 people
8:10
and responsible for a 60 billion more vegetable fun.
8:15
Honestly, I say that and I'm like, holy shit.
8:19
Excuse my language, sorry.
8:20
But I mean, that's an enormous role
8:22
and a huge evolution from where you started.
8:25
What is, what actually is your role?
8:28
Like what does that actually mean?
8:29
I mean, I hear 60 billion more gauge portfolio
8:32
and I'm, yeah, I don't really understand it.
8:35
And like in the grand scheme of things,
8:37
it's actually small, which is also mind blowing.
8:41
But New Zealand's a small market.
8:43
We're not that big as player
8:44
and the mortgage market in New Zealand.
8:46
So my current role is looking after the product side
8:50
of their business.
8:51
So making sure that when you come
8:54
and you want to get a home loan with BNZ,
8:56
I've got something to offer basically.
8:59
How do I kind of make that compelling to customers
9:02
but also make it something that you can be in control of?
9:05
But it's more about how do I help New Zealanders get into a house?
9:10
How can I help them with whatever that aspiration looks like?
9:14
And that's the part that's more fun than anything else.
9:17
I would really love to speak to you about something
9:19
that I know is probably not the average conversation
9:24
that you would have publicly,
9:25
but it's really around the idea of building assets
9:31
and building wealth when you're in a relationship
9:34
from being quite young and you grow together
9:37
and you grow your assets
9:38
and you're on a certain trajectory as a team.
9:41
And then you find yourself in a position
9:44
where you're having to untangle all of the wealth
9:47
you've created together and go separate ways
9:49
and become your own asset without that person.
9:53
It's a really common experience for so many people.
9:57
And it's not something I've experienced,
10:00
but I imagine that the amount of,
10:02
I don't want to say bitterness or emotional attachment
10:05
to that, but money is emotional.
10:06
And when you've spent a long time building something
10:10
to then have it separated,
10:12
be really hard experience, not feel bitter or overwhelmed
10:16
or a huge amount of emotion towards.
10:18
What, I guess what was that journey for you?
10:22
How did it happen?
10:24
And where have you now landed?
10:25
From like, I guess a mindset and also actually
10:27
from a wealth perspective after that.
10:30
Yeah, so I was in a relationship,
10:32
it was great we accumulated properties together
10:36
and you don't really kind of go into those types
10:39
of relationships thinking that they're not going to work out,
10:42
but when they don't and you have to then separate those assets,
10:46
yeah, you're right, it's emotional.
10:47
You get kind of tied up more in the,
10:50
I contributed this, so why aren't I getting that out of it?
10:53
But if I reflect back now on what that means for me
10:57
and how I might have done that differently
10:59
if it happened again, it does kind of become a bit transactional
11:03
and I think that's fine in the moment,
11:04
but it's also better to kind of rip that bandaid
11:07
and get it done fast so that you are then in control
11:12
of what your, I guess your final position looks like
11:16
and you aren't kind of tied into,
11:20
well, if I split it this way,
11:22
then I might get this out of it
11:24
or rather than scenario planning
11:27
and think about every possible outcome,
11:30
are you saying it's almost better to just go like,
11:33
not boss the war, what's a feminine way of saying that?
11:35
Oh, I don't even know, just grip it and rip it
11:37
and just become quite transactional
11:40
and try and be as unemotional as you possibly can,
11:44
which is incredibly hard when you're going through
11:46
a break up with somebody who you cared about,
11:49
but I think if you can get yourself to a point
11:53
where you're both happy to kind of just dissolve
11:56
that financial aspect of your relationship,
11:58
the sooner you do it, the better.
12:00
And what I have noticed in my friends have also gone
12:04
through separations and whatever that kind of looks like,
12:09
the more you kind of hold on to,
12:12
I want more out of this, it doesn't pay you anymore.
12:15
And what you want to be getting yourself into
12:17
is a position where you're in control of that money
12:20
and then you can do whatever you want with it
12:23
because it's yours at that point,
12:24
you're no longer commingled with a person.
12:27
Comming what is such a bad opponent.
12:29
Yeah, and it's yours then, you have the power then over
12:33
how you feel about that money,
12:35
what you're going to do with it.
12:36
It just separates you from this emotion
12:38
that is sort of tied up in the break up.
12:41
And financial freedom, I think,
12:43
becomes a really important part
12:46
of how you take ownership back
12:48
around a really messy part of what's happening in your life
12:52
because you can't control any of that other stuff
12:54
and you can't control other people's emotions,
12:56
but you can control how you determine
12:58
what you will do with the outcome.
13:01
And I might not have covered myself
13:03
in a whole bunch of glory when I did mine,
13:05
but what do you mean by that?
13:07
I just think you probably just get too tied up in it
13:09
and I think I took too long and then,
13:13
because then you have to do stuff with it.
13:16
Am I going to buy a new house?
13:17
Do I not buy a new house?
13:18
Do I invest that money in something different?
13:21
And those conversations with yourself
13:24
or with other people, those take time
13:26
and they're really important.
13:28
So if I did it again,
13:30
I would spend much more time focusing on what I want to do
13:33
rather than the money you're going to get
13:36
and how that's all going to kind of work out.
13:39
But how do you know, hearing you speak,
13:40
it makes so much logical sense.
13:43
Yeah, you're not logical in the moment.
13:45
Yeah, but I'm just putting myself in your shoes
13:48
where, and obviously there's so many different situations,
13:52
where some of my have put in 70% of what's there
13:56
or 90% there's so many contributing factors
14:00
that change that dynamic enormously.
14:03
But is what you're saying, it's kind of irrelevant.
14:07
And actually the best thing you can do
14:09
is accept the fact that you're splitting things,
14:11
find a place that feels the most fair,
14:13
given the circumstances and just kind of deal with it.
14:17
That is what I would do now.
14:19
It's hard, everyone's, like you say,
14:21
everyone's situation is different
14:23
and that might not necessarily be true for everybody.
14:27
But, and I was lucky I don't have,
14:29
there were no kids in the mix, nothing else was there,
14:31
it was just separating assets,
14:32
it should be transactional at that point.
14:36
If you can get yourself to a point
14:37
where you can just kind of extricate yourself
14:40
from that scenario in the cleanest way possible,
14:43
the faster you do that, the better.
14:46
Because the longer you're out of the property market,
14:49
potentially that matters.
14:51
Depending on where the cycle is,
14:53
you might have missed an opportunity to invest
14:55
in a share and a company and that's gone up.
14:57
Like there are so many variables
14:59
that become important and having power over the outcome
15:04
is only ever going to come
15:06
when you've got, actually got the money.
15:08
So basically what you're saying is
15:10
the opportunity cost of missing out
15:11
for making a decision about what to do next
15:14
can actually cost more than fapping around
15:18
with I want more of this.
15:19
I think so.
15:20
That's so interesting.
15:22
Because you spend so much time in thinking
15:24
about what you need to do next.
15:27
All of that is really emotionally taxing on you as well.
15:30
So the sooner you can make choices,
15:32
the sooner you can start moving forward,
15:35
even like with work at the moment,
15:37
you have to make decisions
15:38
in the absence of knowing lots of information,
15:40
but you have to make a decision
15:42
to get more information, to make another choice.
15:45
And if you sit and don't make choices,
15:47
I think that's the most negative thing
15:50
you can do in a scenario like that.
15:52
I mean, I guess if you look at your own personal,
15:55
you know, the wealth once separated,
15:58
comparatively together,
16:00
like is there any part of that
16:01
other than what you've just mentioned
16:02
that you would do differently?
16:03
Like what would you say with the other,
16:05
or maybe it's not even a financial learning,
16:07
but from going through that,
16:09
because I'm assuming throughout that process,
16:11
you're thinking, my God,
16:13
I'm gonna have half the amount of what I had.
16:16
So like the acceptance piece of,
16:18
I now have half of, or 30% or whatever that ends up being,
16:22
because then the decision that you have to make
16:24
is with a lot less than what you are used to.
16:27
Yeah, so my job gives me a really unique opportunity
16:31
to know lots of stuff.
16:33
Which I'm lucky and I'm really grateful for.
16:36
It's also given me an opportunity to meet lots of people
16:40
and find out things that I might not necessarily know about.
16:43
But what I mean by that is that knowledge is power,
16:46
and in that moment,
16:47
I definitely insulated myself from people,
16:51
because it's personal, you feel a lot more vulnerable.
16:55
But what I would say is that you need to really use your network
16:59
to help you figure out what it is that you don't know,
17:02
because not everybody goes through that every day.
17:06
You don't know what you need to do next.
17:08
And so it's really important to keep your network
17:10
or like really tap into parts of that network that you've got.
17:14
And if you don't have somebody who you can talk to about
17:16
the financial impacts of like starting to buy house
17:22
with less money or whatever that might look like,
17:24
you should ask people because there is just a wealth
17:27
of knowledge out there.
17:28
And you will find very quickly that people
17:33
just really want to like kind of roll their sleeves up
17:36
and help you.
17:37
And that's important.
17:39
Do you think the reason people go insular in that environment
17:42
is a level of embarrassment?
17:44
Are people feeling ashamed that their relationship
17:47
hasn't worked out?
17:47
And even though it's, you know what,
17:49
the stats are 50% of marriages end in divorce,
17:51
but yet everyone goes into it thinking
17:54
that that's not going to be them.
17:55
Do you think that it's not just the financial kind
17:58
of shame that people feel of like, oh, I'm losing heaps,
18:00
but it's also, I don't know, people are so worried
18:03
about judgment that they go into a shell
18:06
rather than thinking, right, like I need to pop them solve
18:08
and I need to ask around.
18:09
And do you can almost end up in a worse situation?
18:12
A hundred percent.
18:13
I definitely think that's a really big part of it.
18:16
What I know from like what I, what I do today
18:20
is that a lot of people get into financial difficulties
18:26
difficulties or challenges.
18:28
And usually one or two or three ways,
18:30
it's like you lose a job, you separate.
18:33
Or there is another moment in your life
18:36
that impacts your financial stability.
18:38
And typically you go to ground
18:40
and what you want to do in those situations
18:44
is you get so nervous that someone's going to say,
18:46
no, you can't afford to have another house
18:48
or no, you can't afford to like keep living
18:51
in the house that you're in now
18:52
even though you're on one salary.
18:54
And that fear just cripples people to the point
18:58
where they just don't even ring up and ask
19:01
the most basic of questions.
19:03
And so it's almost like avoiding going to the doctor
19:05
because you're scared of what they're going to say.
19:07
Yes, it is.
19:07
And so it feels so hard to kind of reach out
19:12
on those moments when you're feeling the most vulnerable.
19:15
But it is that point where you really,
19:17
you definitely need to tap in your network
19:19
and ask for advice and for what other things
19:24
you might do that could help you in that situation
19:27
and maybe just give you a little bit more direction.
19:30
It's hard.
19:31
And you don't want to make too many massive decisions
19:34
when you're feeling really overwhelmed by it all.
19:38
I think like hindsight now is so easy
19:40
when you're not feeling quite so overwhelmed
19:43
by the scenario that you're in.
19:46
But what I try to do with lots of things
19:50
when I feel overwhelmed by the situation
19:53
is to think about how you will possibly use
19:58
the money in a moment where actually,
20:02
you might just need a holiday
20:03
and that might actually be the right choice for you.
20:06
And I think financially being able
20:10
to support your decisions in your moment
20:14
is important because buying an apartment
20:16
in that's close to work.
20:18
That might actually be the best outcome for you
20:21
in that moment.
20:22
But that doesn't mean to say that you're not going to end up
20:24
with your dream house wherever that might be,
20:27
or your dream job, somewhere else overseas.
20:30
But in that moment, that decision will support you.
20:34
And I think it's really important to remember
20:36
that you're not tying yourself into something forever.
20:39
It's not a one-way decision or a one-way investment
20:42
and maybe buying the apartment close to work
20:44
isn't the most amazing financial decision.
20:46
But for the next three years, you need stability.
20:49
You want to be central, maybe you don't have kids
20:51
so you can afford to be in the city.
20:53
You have to make a decision based on all of the knowledge
20:56
you have at that time and what's best for you
20:57
in that moment to get to the next step.
21:00
Yeah, exactly.
21:01
And it's not one and done.
21:03
There are easy ways to kind of move through your decisions
21:07
and they change all the time.
21:09
And that's fine.
21:11
Sometimes putting that money aside
21:13
so that you can have a holiday because you need a break.
21:15
That's important.
21:16
Saving up because you want to buy a new car.
21:21
Also important, if that's what is important to you.
21:24
And so having the ability to be able to make
21:28
those financial decisions to support your,
21:32
whatever it is that your dreams are or your outcomes are
21:34
or the needs you have in the year or the moment
21:38
or whatever that might look like, that's good.
21:41
Like for me, that's a really positive outcome.
21:44
And sometimes even now I get so worried
21:47
that I just haven't done enough or I haven't made enough
21:52
of this investment or I haven't invested in the right things.
21:56
Those things never change.
21:58
I think you're always going to feel that way.
22:00
But am I unhappy?
22:02
No, I'm happy with where I am at right now.
22:04
But I bet you didn't feel that in the moment of separation.
22:07
No way.
22:09
It felt so horrible at the time.
22:10
You never feel like you're going to find a way
22:12
through all of that stuff.
22:14
But you make one step in front of the other
22:17
and then eventually it just doesn't feel so heavy.
22:21
And I didn't invest straight away in a new house.
22:26
I kind of waited for a little bit
22:28
until I kind of knew what I wanted to do.
22:30
And was that you kind of have an conversation with yourself
22:32
around, okay, what do I want and what is my next step
22:35
from here and what's going to make me happiest
22:37
given what I now have?
22:38
It was like recalibration before making a decision.
22:41
Yes, and even now when I look back,
22:44
I think, should I wish I'd bought another house
22:47
at a different place or like,
22:49
but I don't regret my choices now.
22:51
But I do sometimes think I waited for something
22:55
that I just don't think was ever going
22:57
to really materialize unless I put in the effort
23:00
and what I mean by that is,
23:02
I thought that I needed to live
23:04
and get my dream house and I needed it immediately.
23:09
But it's like that wasn't ever going to be my reality.
23:12
And even I know that after like doing what I do,
23:16
but the idea of taking a step back
23:18
before taking a step forward almost,
23:19
it's like I need to accept the fact
23:22
that I'm not going to be in sort of a side step
23:25
from where I am.
23:26
I may have to do a bit of a roundabout
23:28
and that's my reality.
23:29
Yeah, and accepting that is a bit of a hard,
23:33
that can be hard, but where I've got to is so much better.
23:37
It's sometimes it's hard to imagine
23:39
that it's all kind of going to work out.
23:40
But it just have to have faith in it.
23:42
I do. It's just exhausting.
23:44
Exactly. Exactly.
23:45
What would you say then you've learnt
23:46
from building wealth in your 20s
23:48
alongside someone, comparatively,
23:50
to now building wealth in your 40s by yourself?
23:54
How is your mindset shifted
23:56
or the approach to financial freedom now
24:00
because the decisions you make when you're in a relationship,
24:03
whether it's financial or otherwise,
24:04
when you're having to consider someone else
24:06
and they're earning
24:07
and it's so different to having the autonomy on your own.
24:10
Yeah, the autonomy is quite powerful
24:14
because you're right.
24:15
You have to consider lots of different things
24:17
when you're investing with another person.
24:19
And now I look at what do I want from my future?
24:24
And not that I didn't consider those things
24:26
when I was younger, but I look at things
24:28
and think, well, I spend a lot of time in this place.
24:33
Should I buy something there
24:35
or I don't want to work for the rest of my life
24:37
or want to retire?
24:38
How am I going to get there?
24:39
Those things which seem like a bit of a victory
24:43
when you're in 20s are real now.
24:46
I want to have as much control over those things as possible.
24:50
Whereas in my 20s, I was happy to kind of
24:53
be a little bit more fast and loose
24:54
with how my approach to investments
24:56
and where I bought them.
24:59
Whereas now I do a little bit more research.
25:04
I am a bit more considerate about it,
25:06
but at the same time, I probably think more lifestyle
25:09
than I think I want to have a rental portfolio, for example.
25:14
You can't, I think sometimes you get a bit paralyzed
25:16
by the thought of, should I need a house or everybody else
25:20
has got a house, this is what I need,
25:21
that has to be my direction.
25:24
And that's just not true.
25:26
And the more I see my friends doing lots of different things,
25:31
the more you realise the opportunities for making money at.
25:35
Are endless, like people say that all the time,
25:37
but it's true.
25:38
And I see friends who live in Singapore, for example,
25:41
and they don't buy houses in Singapore
25:44
because that's just not what you do.
25:46
But so they have thought about different ways
25:48
to invest their money.
25:50
And so we talk about that a lot around,
25:52
what do you do?
25:54
How does that work out for you?
25:55
What can I learn from you in that situation?
25:58
Whereas here people do things quite differently
26:02
because they've got children and they need more stability
26:05
and they want to buy houses that's kind of the key dream.
26:09
But it's not necessarily everyone's pathway.
26:11
And I think that's awesome.
26:14
The thought of being able to make money
26:16
in something that's not property,
26:19
it's more accessible than ever.
26:21
This is a really good turning point
26:23
because one of the things that you've spoken to me
26:25
about not on the microphone yet,
26:28
is feeling a little bit intimidated
26:29
by the idea of investing in shares
26:31
and that you've really spent a lot of your wealth building
26:34
time in the property space.
26:38
Can you just talk to your property portfolio
26:41
where it was, pre-separation, post-separation,
26:43
and then now we are at the diversification piece.
26:46
It hasn't been something you've explored a whole lot.
26:49
Yeah, I definitely started investing in property younger
26:52
before I even when I was in a relationship.
26:54
That was an easier foray, I guess,
26:57
because that's kind of what we all expect to do
26:59
when we live in New Zealand.
27:00
But after that, I still have property.
27:04
I've, instead of having tenants though,
27:06
I've started moving into like Airbnb in my houses.
27:11
Is this recently?
27:12
Yeah, and that's working out really well.
27:16
I like that the turnover is high.
27:17
There's always somebody different in the house
27:19
that gets seen and cleaned consistently.
27:24
It's actually worked out financially better
27:27
than having tenants in it.
27:29
And shares was just not something that I had a big part in,
27:34
I guess, but now I actively do it.
27:36
And my friends will talk about it.
27:38
We talk about what we bought the other day,
27:40
how is it going, what does your portfolio look like?
27:43
And it's just as a stronger part of our conversation
27:46
as property is.
27:48
And I think it gives you so much like freedom
27:54
to make different choices.
27:55
It's not a house that's like, you might invest in Google one day
27:58
and then you might decide that's not working for you
28:00
and you can do something else.
28:01
And it is easy.
28:04
And if it doesn't work,
28:06
like you might lose some money on a share,
28:08
that doesn't matter.
28:09
It's not as much as a deposit for a house.
28:11
Well, I guess it depends how much you're investing, really.
28:14
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
28:15
Do you think maybe it's more just a sign at the time?
28:17
Like, you know, 20 years ago,
28:19
none of us really knew what shares were
28:21
and didn't invest in it because it was a lot more difficult.
28:24
So you started with property.
28:26
It's not to say, you know, I guess if you were to start again now
28:28
and you were 20 now,
28:30
you would probably do it quite differently
28:31
in terms of how much you would diversify
28:33
between different asset classes,
28:35
like property shares, etc.
28:37
Yeah, I think I would do it all.
28:39
Like, there's nothing stopping.
28:41
I would invest in everything.
28:43
But what I mean is that there's nothing stopping you
28:47
from investing $100 in a share now.
28:51
Like, it's so easy to do.
28:53
So if that's all you've got available to you,
28:56
then definitely do something with it.
29:00
It doesn't need to be as scary as I think it used to be.
29:03
But it is important to have people in your corner.
29:06
That's like the most powerful thing you could do
29:10
in terms of asset accumulation
29:14
or just wealth accumulation
29:16
is having a really diversified group of people
29:19
who are in your corner and helping you.
29:22
I sat in my girlfriend's table the other day
29:24
and we were like, got out our shares as accounts
29:26
and were like, what have you done?
29:28
Let's buy this.
29:29
Like, you never, we never did that in our 20s.
29:33
And when I talked to my friends,
29:34
their investment strategies are everyone's different.
29:38
And it's cool to talk about that instead of like,
29:41
not that I don't love all my friends' children.
29:42
But I don't want to talk about their kids all the time.
29:45
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
29:46
And so it's great to talk about other things.
29:48
I've got lots of people who have a really amazing
29:50
like diverse range of jobs
29:52
and you just learn stuff from them every day.
29:54
Debunking, I think, the fear that comes with
29:57
even just buying a house or buying shares
30:00
or however it is that you're choosing to invest your money.
30:02
Talking about that with lots of different people
30:05
even just your closest friends,
30:08
that is what makes it become a little bit less scary every time.
30:12
Also, it makes it kind of fun.
30:13
Like, it's fun to talk about stuff that's not
30:16
what are your prenatal vitamins.
30:18
You know, like, same love all my friends and their kids.
30:21
But it's really nice to be able to share that,
30:24
I think, with girlfriends too,
30:25
because women invest really differently to men.
30:27
So you might be more inclined to talk to men about investing
30:30
because you assume that they're more interested in it.
30:32
But actually, the things that they're investing in again
30:34
and could be a completely different investing strategy.
30:37
And I think when you first start to learn about investing,
30:40
all you want to do is sort of like here
30:41
or copy what other people are doing
30:43
because you think that they know better.
30:45
But the more that you learn, the more that you realize
30:47
that there's so many different amazing investments.
30:51
It doesn't mean it's the one that you should be doing
30:52
just because everyone else is.
30:54
Yeah, absolutely.
30:55
And it was just really nice to hear us.
30:59
We're all having these conversations
31:00
probably internally in our households.
31:03
But to bring it outside and have it in a wider group
31:06
was amazing.
31:07
Mm-hmm.
31:08
It makes it feel like less lonely, less intimidating,
31:13
more fun.
31:14
It changes the feeling you have around investing
31:17
because it's more socialized.
31:18
And I think that's a really fun experience
31:20
for people to have.
31:21
And maybe you're listening to this.
31:23
And you're like, oh, I don't have any friends
31:25
that I can talk to about this.
31:26
That's also fine.
31:27
I mean, come first, say, we can almost
31:29
like set you up with friends within the curve community
31:31
because there's so many people that are learning about it.
31:33
But I think binding your community or people
31:36
you can talk to is really awesome.
31:38
And they don't even have to have the same investing values
31:40
as you.
31:41
It's actually kind of interesting to have people
31:43
that kind of reflect back different,
31:46
whether it be political values or, you know,
31:48
because that is, again, like, we are making
31:51
well-rounded decisions based on what's best for you.
31:53
It's kind of honestly, it all ties back
31:55
to the similar thing that you spoke about
31:56
when you were talking about property
31:57
and making decisions that are right for you.
31:59
When it comes to money and where you put it and how you grow it,
32:02
it is so inherently personal.
32:04
And crowdsourcing and talking to people
32:06
is amazing for not feeling alone, for gathering information.
32:10
But ultimately, feeling like you have the power
32:13
to make the decision that's right for you,
32:15
whether it's this investment or that.
32:17
Yeah, absolutely.
32:18
I think having the ability to just do something
32:22
from your phone half the time.
32:25
Because I remember when I did my first investment
32:28
and I think I had to call up ASB securities
32:30
and I talked to a guy who I felt like was like,
32:35
why are you buying that share?
32:37
And I just felt like, well, Steve, I thought it was a good idea.
32:41
OK.
32:42
Actually, I think it's done really well now.
32:45
And that just in itself was intimidating.
32:49
But now you don't have to worry about that.
32:51
You just get on your phone, you buy this share,
32:53
you look at it tomorrow and hope it's working out for you.
32:56
And if it isn't, be empowered to sell them to.
32:59
It's really easy to just sort of be like,
33:01
oh, it goes back out.
33:03
But you can make decisions to sell and buy.
33:05
Exactly.
33:06
So it's really important that you also sell things.
33:09
And if it's not working with your strategy anymore.
33:12
But I think it's awesome to keep learning about things
33:15
all the time and understanding the system
33:18
that you work within, whether that's the property market
33:22
or she is or whatever the global environment looks like.
33:26
Understanding how you play in that
33:28
is it just gives you such an overwhelmingly big boost
33:32
of confidence.
33:33
Even if you've invested 100 bucks and it's gone to 150,
33:38
that is great.
33:39
Those small ones are what makes all the difference.
33:42
And building your confidence over time
33:45
is a really powerful tool to have in your back pocket
33:51
because confidence is kind of what gets you
33:54
through the door half the time.
33:56
Am I going to buy something?
33:58
Do I do this thing?
33:59
Do I get a new job?
34:00
Like all of those things require you
34:02
to really step out of your comfort zone half the time.
34:05
And you will get really big rewards
34:08
if you have the confidence to do that stuff.
34:11
Have you had in the last 15, 20 years
34:13
knocks to your confidence that have changed the way
34:15
that you respond with regards to your investments
34:18
or money and how did you move through those moments
34:22
of potentially not feeling so confident
34:24
because I think there's probably a lot of people
34:27
who have gone through either wobbles
34:28
or in the middle of a wobble
34:30
and you're reclaiming that sense of empowerment.
34:33
It can be super challenging.
34:36
Yeah, I remember when I bought my house
34:39
that I'm currently here being being.
34:41
I always thought I was going to live in it.
34:43
It was kind of going to be my new little sanctuary.
34:46
And then we came out of the bubble
34:50
and house prices have gone down.
34:53
Like the markets are a lot flatter than it was before.
34:56
And I just wanted to change the way I thought about that
35:01
property and how it was going to make me money.
35:03
And I've decided to pay down that debt
35:08
as fast as possible to accumulate wealth
35:11
in the house, not through property price hikes
35:16
or going up or whatever.
35:17
Do you mean like capital gains?
35:19
Yep, capital gains.
35:21
And doing it through debt reduction
35:24
so that I've got less debt so I can then go out
35:27
and buy another house because I've got equity
35:29
through debt reduction rather than the other way around.
35:32
And that has been a powerful kind of change in my mindset
35:36
because it's really easy to think,
35:38
oh shit, my house isn't going up.
35:40
Like what am I going to do?
35:41
Like you're at the mercy of the market
35:42
rather than actually making an effort to change the value.
35:46
Yeah.
35:47
And so I think about it differently.
35:49
I have structured my mortgage in a way
35:53
that I think is helping me out.
35:55
I like to have a bit of savings,
35:57
which seems somewhat counterinsured of
35:59
when you've got a mortgage.
36:00
But what if my car breaks down,
36:02
or what if I need a new roof on my house,
36:04
I don't want to go back to the bank and ask them for a loan.
36:08
I want to have some savings.
36:10
And so I've structured my debt in a way
36:12
that I'm using my savings to offset my mortgage
36:16
to bring my overall interest rate down
36:19
so I can pay it down faster.
36:21
Oh, can you say that in like slower?
36:23
Or sorry, I feel like that.
36:25
I think this is going to sound very intelligent
36:27
and like a probably a really good tip for people,
36:29
but I might need to expand again.
36:32
Yes.
36:32
So I have got an offset mortgage with Berns-Ed.
36:37
And that means that if I've got any savings
36:40
or money in my account,
36:43
it is used to offset my debt in my mortgage.
36:48
So by having money in there,
36:50
even though it's not actually going against your mortgage,
36:52
it's kind of bringing the total amount of your mortgage down
36:55
because you can show you have that amount of savings there.
36:58
Yeah, so it reduces your overall interest rate
37:01
on your mortgage.
37:02
Oh, OK.
37:02
Yeah.
37:03
So I pay whatever I pay off for my mortgage a month,
37:06
but that is going directly against the principal
37:09
because I'm able to pay more of the money every week.
37:12
And so I'm paying it down faster.
37:14
And that for me means that instead of my money sitting
37:17
in savings and the savings rate, it's OK, but it's not great.
37:22
This is a much more effective way for me to use my money.
37:25
So you're using your savings.
37:28
You've got to, let's just, OK, let's just use numbers.
37:30
It might be more helpful.
37:31
OK.
37:31
Let's say you have a 500,000 mortgage,
37:35
and you have 50,000 in savings.
37:37
Yeah.
37:38
The 50,000 in savings is bringing down
37:41
your 500,000 mortgage to 450.
37:43
Yeah, answer me.
37:44
So then your interest rate that you have to pay
37:46
is kind of slightly less because is that right?
37:49
Yeah.
37:49
So you've got a $500,000 mortgage, 50,000 in savings.
37:54
Yeah.
37:55
So you've effectively, you're going to pay interest
37:58
on a lower amount of your loan.
38:01
So it may be, and this is all hypothetical numbers,
38:03
but we're just trying to prove a point here.
38:05
So the idea is, say you have 50,000
38:08
and your mortgage is 500 for the argument's sake.
38:12
It's almost like you're only paying interest on 450,
38:15
rather than 500, because the other 50s in the bank.
38:18
Is that right?
38:18
Yeah.
38:19
OK.
38:20
Yeah.
38:21
But basically, so when you say like,
38:23
if I'm using my savings to pay down the principal,
38:26
is it almost like you're leaving a lump sum in there?
38:28
Should something go wrong?
38:29
So for example, in a high interest savings account,
38:31
so that if you have to pay for a new roof,
38:34
you have money to do that, rather than having to borrow more.
38:36
Yes.
38:37
And the psychological safety that gives you is great.
38:40
But then also, have I also missed a piece around
38:43
you're using the savings that's being put into the mortgage?
38:47
No.
38:48
Or is it you're paying from your income rather than paying for my income?
38:51
So for example, the way I've set up my home loan
38:57
is I have an amount which I feel really comfortable
39:01
while having there, and I can offset it.
39:03
So it doesn't even have to be a lot.
39:04
Like, it could be 20 grand.
39:07
But you could pay that 20 grand off a lot faster
39:11
if you're offsetting that balance
39:14
with whatever you might have in your accounts day to day.
39:16
So your salary could go into your regular account.
39:21
And you can use that amount to offset your mortgage.
39:24
And it just...
39:25
Ah, so it's like my whole salary could be in that
39:27
and it's being offset rather than it, oh, that's so clever.
39:31
So it's almost connected to your transaction account in a way.
39:33
Yes, totally it can.
39:35
And you can use that money and it can go up and down.
39:38
So you might have, let's just say you've got $20,000
39:41
that you're offsetting.
39:42
You might have $20,000 in an account.
39:44
And it's fully offset for that moment.
39:46
And then you've got to pay your groceries
39:48
and then you've got to pay your mortgage, for example.
39:50
And then instead of having $20,000 offsetting your accounts
39:53
on E15, but it enables you to have a lot more...
39:57
You've got savings.
39:58
So for me, that's important.
40:00
That's just part of my saving ethos
40:03
is to have some money in an account.
40:06
And then it just enables me to pay that down faster.
40:09
So I can pay my debt down.
40:12
And that's important to me too,
40:13
because then I want to have more ability to invest
40:16
in whatever that looks like, whether or not that's a house or not.
40:19
And I can do that if I've got less debt.
40:21
And for me, that's important because I have my single salary.
40:25
And so I want to have as much financial freedom
40:28
to do what I need on one salary.
40:30
So the less debt I have, the better.
40:33
I do find these types of...
40:35
That specific, all those examples.
40:37
Take me a while for that to, like, the penny to drop.
40:40
You don't often hear about it a lot,
40:41
but I feel like it's a really powerful tool to have
40:45
in your setup if that would work for you.
40:49
Because basically what it means is at its essence,
40:52
you're paying less interest.
40:54
So you have to pay less back as basically it.
40:56
That is the essence, yes.
40:58
So why would we not all do that?
41:01
We would be a scenario where that wouldn't work for somebody.
41:03
If you didn't have a lot of savings...
41:07
Right, so if you didn't have a lot,
41:08
it's kind of like, what are saving me $3 a week.
41:10
So my bother, but if you have a decent amount,
41:13
it makes sense because it may as well be somewhere
41:16
where it's helping you...
41:18
But even if you decided to have a small offset amount
41:22
to, I don't know, your everyday account,
41:24
your salary's always gonna go into that.
41:26
So you're going to have a moment
41:28
where you're offset some money anyway,
41:31
every four, nine, or a month,
41:33
or however frequently you get paid.
41:36
So I feel like it's a really good tool to have,
41:40
even if it's a small amount, it doesn't have to be a lot
41:44
to give you some options,
41:46
but it is on a floating interest rate.
41:47
So it doesn't work for everybody.
41:49
If you need certainty,
41:51
maybe it'd be better off being on a fixed mortgage.
41:54
So there are lots of scenarios,
41:56
and just ask some questions.
41:58
There were just people who are willing to help you.
42:00
Well, on that, I would love to ask you a few
42:02
sort of questions on the property market,
42:04
and this doesn't have...
42:07
This is again, it's not advice.
42:08
It's just your thoughts on what might be best
42:10
considering, you know, a lot about property investing.
42:14
So when it comes to first-home buyers,
42:17
first people who have built more of a property portfolio,
42:20
what types of houses do you think
42:21
are best in those two scenarios?
42:23
Oh, that's a tough one.
42:25
Like, I think with first-home buyers,
42:27
it's really important to stay within
42:32
what is going to be financially sound for you.
42:36
Right.
42:37
Point them stretching yourself.
42:38
Yeah, and it's a fine line, I think,
42:41
because when you get a house,
42:43
you forget that there are all these extra things
42:45
that go with that.
42:46
You have to water and rates,
42:49
and you've got to potentially,
42:51
you're going to have a lawn to mow and a garden,
42:55
and a hedge that the neighbors tell you must be smaller.
42:58
You think all of those things,
43:00
and then you've got to fill it with furniture,
43:02
and then something breaks.
43:04
Like, there's always something happens with an asset,
43:08
whether or not it's a house or not.
43:11
So you've got to be prepared for those things.
43:13
I think that is such a good point for first-home buyers,
43:16
and something that so many of us do not know.
43:19
You think that the main thing you're buying is the house,
43:22
and therefore that's where 95% of the money should go.
43:26
If you don't have enough of all those other things,
43:28
how unbelievably stressful to go so close to that line,
43:32
and then not have your buffer for the stuff
43:34
that's unexpected.
43:35
Yes.
43:36
And when you first have your first mortgage payment come out,
43:39
that is like a shock.
43:43
No matter when you get a mortgage.
43:45
So I think it's important to really ensure
43:49
that you've thought about what that means.
43:52
I know that a lot of first-home buyers typically
43:55
buy neighborhoods that they know,
43:56
and I think that's also important,
43:58
because you know how long it's going to take you to get to work.
44:01
You might need to be near a school for your children.
44:05
All of those things are really important
44:06
when you're making a decision about where you buy
44:08
and the type of property that you buy.
44:10
And I think like back to the other conversation we had,
44:14
it's like a moment in time.
44:16
So if buying a unit, a two-bedroom unit
44:20
is going to work for you in that moment, perfect.
44:23
Like just jump right in, and that will work out for you.
44:27
And then when you decide that you need a little bit more room,
44:31
or you might have the ability to buy a three-bedroom home,
44:35
cool, you can look in another area.
44:37
And maybe that area has changed for you in that moment.
44:40
So I've lived in various places,
44:42
and now I live on the shore, and I love it.
44:45
I'm close to the beach, and that's perfect.
44:48
I've got a dog, and she loves it there.
44:50
And so that's important to me now.
44:52
And before living close to the office,
44:55
it's far more important, because I wanted it easier commute.
44:59
As your needs change, so do your investments, totally.
45:02
And that's the thing the same with I can investment property,
45:05
that becomes all about the numbers.
45:07
And if you're going to manage it yourself,
45:09
I think that matters.
45:10
Having something that's on the other side of town?
45:13
Nightmare?
45:15
Well, that is other world.
45:16
Hello.
45:18
Yeah, well, if you're going to get it managed by somebody,
45:21
that also takes money out of your yield.
45:23
So those things become important considerations
45:26
when you're determining what those numbers look like,
45:28
and do they stack up for you.
45:30
I think the such a good point is really the difference
45:33
between the houses that are good for a first home,
45:36
first investment is actually their completely separate.
45:39
First home is its emotional, its lifestyle.
45:42
It's where you're at.
45:44
An investment property is literally what it says in the name,
45:47
which is, it is an investment property.
45:49
So when I was renovating, do I want black curtains from the warehouse?
45:53
No, not if I'm living in it, but I'm not living in it.
45:56
It's an investment property, and I had to make decisions
45:58
on the renovation that we're going to keep it within my budget,
46:01
because that was literally the point of that investment.
46:03
Exactly.
46:04
And people aren't going to necessarily take care of it
46:07
the way you will, and so that's okay too.
46:11
But you have to remember that when you're putting
46:13
your fancy carpet on the in the house or something hardy.
46:17
Is there going to be a drag rustle that shits on that carpet?
46:20
Exactly.
46:21
You know, because if it's not your dog and it's an investment property,
46:23
not a great decision.
46:24
Yeah, exactly.
46:26
What have been some of the best property investments
46:28
that you've made and why would you say they were the best?
46:31
You've bottled and sold a lot of property.
46:33
And there are any that stand out.
46:34
It's like, oh, that's one to highlight.
46:38
I know the ones that I wouldn't buy again.
46:40
So I wouldn't buy anything that has a shared driveway,
46:44
necessarily, if it's like really long,
46:46
if there's too many houses in it.
46:48
Who's going to maintain that thing?
46:49
God, that's so interesting. Never thought of it.
46:52
Yeah.
46:52
Is the section on a flat, is it flat, or is it not?
46:55
Like those things make quite a big difference.
46:57
Like do you have like lots of big trees?
47:00
I used to really crap myself during big ones
47:03
that something was going to fall through the roof.
47:04
Like, I just wouldn't do that again.
47:08
So that's just personal now.
47:11
And they're really expensive to remove.
47:13
So, but like, if I thought about the houses that,
47:17
yeah, I wouldn't buy again,
47:18
it's the stuff that's really high admin.
47:20
When you're going to buy a house that's on a shared title,
47:23
so like a cross lease, really consider what that means.
47:27
And there's like freehold and just one house on a title.
47:31
That's so much easier to control.
47:33
Yeah, a lot of people would never have thought of that.
47:36
And I think until you get to the point where the lawyer's asking for the title,
47:40
is you're like, hold on.
47:41
Why does the title, what does it mean?
47:43
Why is it important?
47:44
Yeah.
47:45
And I would buy cross lease again, but I just would think about
47:49
what that looks like in terms of who's on it.
47:52
And unit titles again, you just have to be
47:56
considerate of what that means.
47:57
I'm not saying don't buy them.
47:58
Just know that those will have different considerations
48:02
that come with them that aren't just as simple as I've got a house.
48:06
What do you think in general about the current property market?
48:08
Like, is it, you know, I was like, is it a buyer?
48:10
Is it a seller's market?
48:11
Like, what's going on?
48:12
And what is your read on where we're at in terms of the property cycle,
48:15
specifically in New Zealand?
48:17
I think it's a great time for first-time buyers.
48:20
Houses have been, they don't sell as fast.
48:23
There's another frenzy in the market.
48:25
You don't hear stories now as much about people competing
48:29
and paying hundreds of thousands of dollars over CV anymore,
48:33
which you heard about, like, let's,
48:35
or three or four years ago, probably.
48:37
Like, that has gone.
48:39
And so it's a really great opportunity for first-time buyers
48:42
to find a house, spend the time, get reports,
48:46
like, not be priced out by...
48:49
Feeling raced, like, the rest of the bottom or having to
48:52
quickly get your ducks in a row.
48:54
Like, you have the time to make an informed, slow ride decision.
48:58
Yeah, and you don't have as many houses selling at auction anymore,
49:01
which also helps first-time buyers.
49:04
And so I think that's a really great...
49:06
It's a great time to buy, if you can.
49:08
And I know that a lot of people are sort of buying and selling,
49:12
like, moving different areas.
49:13
There's just an opportunity to do that now,
49:16
which there wasn't before.
49:18
Yeah, I feel like it's a good time to get in,
49:21
if you've got the opportunity to.
49:24
Have you got any tips or tricks
49:26
or things that people could potentially keep in their back pocket
49:29
when it comes to trying to find the right,
49:32
probably investment, whether it's...
49:34
And I don't know, maybe you have a different tip or trick
49:38
whether it's first-time this investment.
49:41
I would make sure that you have your finance sorted.
49:43
It's always easier for you to go and have a pre-approval.
49:48
And then you have to just come on and you think,
49:50
oh, well, I want that one.
49:51
And you're ready.
49:53
It's better to be ready than to find a house
49:55
and not be ready and lose it.
49:57
I think it's also just important to have somebody
49:59
that you can like talk to.
50:00
So whether or not that is somebody at the bank,
50:04
like a home loan partner, maybe it's a broker,
50:07
maybe it's your friends or your parents,
50:10
just get as many people who you can to kind of be there
50:14
to answer your questions.
50:15
Sometimes you need a build report,
50:17
sometimes you don't,
50:19
you just need to have all of those things ready.
50:21
The other thing I think, very practical,
50:24
you need insurance when you get a house.
50:26
Oh, this is one of the other things.
50:28
It's like when you go to buy and you think like 95% of my money goes to the house,
50:32
no, no, no, do not forget there's quite a big chunk for insurance.
50:37
Yeah, and so now I think, particularly given like all of the flooding
50:42
and stuff that we have now, it's a good idea to see whether or not,
50:47
if you're looking at one, two, three blocks straight,
50:49
what is the insurance on that?
50:50
Is that going to be reasonable for you?
50:52
Like if you got a quote,
50:53
do you want to pay $10,000 a year for insurance on that house?
50:56
Maybe you don't.
50:57
But you just don't have the context for how much that is.
51:01
And I think that's another good point.
51:02
It's like, is this a lot of insurance?
51:04
Is this a normal amount or not?
51:05
And if it's, if it seems super low or super high, like ask why?
51:09
Yeah.
51:09
And so it's get that before you go anywhere near,
51:13
putting in an offer.
51:14
You know what all of that looks like.
51:16
And that's all publicly available information.
51:18
You can get an insurance crop from your current provider or a new one.
51:21
That's all options for you to give you as much information as possible
51:26
before you sign on the dotted line.
51:28
One of the things before we wrap up that I would love to touch on is the idea of
51:34
you speak about this as a woman in finance and particularly
51:38
with relation to your journey with relationships and
51:43
fertility.
51:43
And I would really love to talk about this because I think that
51:46
when it comes to life choices, whether it be marriage or
51:51
considering kids, if that's something that you want
51:54
and how you can think about that in relation to your financial planning,
51:59
what do you think would be really helpful for us to think about, talk about, make more normal
52:05
when it comes to thinking about sending ourselves up financially and personally
52:09
for the type of life that we want?
52:11
Yeah, so I feel like it's really important to know that you have, you do have options.
52:16
But I think we need to start normalising talking about the fact that not everybody gets
52:24
pregnant naturally. And a lot of people have trouble with secondary fertility.
52:31
So they have their first baby, that's all fine.
52:34
But then they go for round two and that can often be a struggle.
52:38
So they need support and none of that's cheap.
52:42
And so I feel like it's important to normalise the fact that maybe pregnancy,
52:49
via natural conception might not be the path for everybody.
52:53
And if you do want to freeze your eggs, get that stuff done early.
52:57
And that is a tricky thing to do when you're possibly in your 30s and you don't have all the
53:02
money in the world. So expensive.
53:05
It's really expensive. And everybody talks about the sooner you do it, the better it is.
53:09
And none of those conversations you have when you're in your 20s because everybody just thinks
53:14
they're going to get married and have children and it's all going to be fine.
53:17
Weirdly I did think about this in my 20s and I think maybe it's because I was
53:21
hyper aware of the fact that I wanted to prioritise my careers and I would love to also be able
53:26
to be a mum. I was really aware of it or maybe I'm just an anxious person,
53:30
happened to think about worst case scenario all the time, but I did think about this,
53:34
but I was never in a position to have that much money when I was 26, 27 when it's the most ideal
53:38
time to do it. Yeah and I think like even in your 30s, I'm no fidelity specialist, but like I
53:44
feel like even then there are still lots of options for you and I've got lots of friends who've
53:49
gone and done this later and it's all worked out great and obviously that's not going to be the
53:55
case in all instances, but I think being able to talk about what that means, how does it work,
54:02
what are your options and having some financial autonomy or what that is is important.
54:08
I'd love to like finish there's a poem that you've shared with me which I think is a really
54:15
nice way to close out of this conversation. Okay, I'm going to I bet you I'm going to have to
54:19
like three takes at this because you know reading poems like to get the sort of like intonation
54:23
writers quite hard, tell me what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?
54:29
We knew hear that. How do you think that we can relate that to our financial choices,
54:36
particularly with regards to yet the the various stages that people might be at whether it's going
54:41
through a divorce, whether it's single and wanting to have kids like how does this poem potentially
54:47
relate to everyone regardless of what their situation is? I think you need to remember that we
54:54
get one shot at this don't have any regrets but live in your moment if that means buying a house
55:00
or taking that power and freezing your eggs like all of that stuff is in your control and we have
55:07
all of the opportunities at our fingertips we just have to take them and you don't want to kind of
55:13
look back and think God I wish I'd done X, Y and Z this is our one chance to have an amazing life
55:21
and having the smallest amount of financial freedom or choices is just that is amazing. That is the
55:28
stuff we have to like really hold on to and so if that financial choice for you is putting your
55:35
money and freezing your eggs do those things you're never going to regret it be confident in your
55:41
choices you will learn from them even if they don't work out you'll still learn from the
55:48
choice that you made in that in itself is progress. Oh my God I feel so inspired and grateful for
55:58
this conversation truly I do thank you because I think it you know it takes a lot of courage to be
56:03
able to talk about the things that have gone well as well as the things that haven't gone well
56:07
and I'm sure you know 15 20 years ago you had no idea that this is the trajectory you've been in
56:13
and you know you're no doubt I hope really proud of where you're at now but there would have been
56:18
times along that that path that you thought this is not what I planned I really don't want to be
56:23
here and it's not but you've you've obviously evolved and changed based on your circumstances
56:29
and created a life that you're really proud of and I think that to be able to share yeah the things
56:34
that you've learned both to help other people as well as the things that haven't gone well
56:39
to help other people is like really admirable not a lot of people feel confident doing that so
56:43
thank you so much did you love the set the size yes have you got property
56:50
front and center in your mind yes so I was like you're a five rock I know now could be the time
56:56
to take the first step towards what it is that you're wanting to buy whether that's your first
57:01
home whether that's a new flat whether it's I don't know buying another investment property
57:07
and thankfully BNZ has the expertise and tools to help you get started and their home loan
57:12
partners are ready whenever you are you can book an appointment you can ask millions of questions
57:18
trust me that is totally fine and you can start turning the property dream that you have
57:23
into a plan and hopefully soon into a reality I know from experience that this can feel quite
57:29
overwhelming but when you're working with experts who can actually help you get there
57:33
it's such a burden off your shoulders know that you've got the advice and the tools that you need
57:38
to actually make it happen we know how hard it can feel and like overwhelming and just you know so
57:45
like a fish out of water when it comes to buying properties so we're so thankful to BNZ to be
57:51
helping us create and empower this podcast so that people can learn and you know we just want
57:58
you all to succeed we want you all to succeed we're all in your corner and this is going to be such a
58:03
game-changing podcast series yes and for anyone that has gone through the process of either buying a
58:09
house or a flat or whatever it is that you're trying to do please leave us know because we would
58:13
love to be cheering you on from the sidelines but thank you so much again to BNZ for empowering
58:18
this podcast okay quickly the curve was created to empower and educate you about investing but we
58:23
are not financial advisors our platform exists for educational purposes only and it doesn't provide
58:29
personalized investing advice for your individual needs and should not be relied upon to make an
58:33
investment or financial decision and always remember to do your own research before making any
58:37
investment or financial decision we're here for any knowledge and support you need but the final
58:42
call is always yours and thanks for being here you got this yeah we know you got this