Latest / Skin Anarchy / Pauline and Johnny Paterson, Co-Founders of Dr.PAWPAW

Transcript

Pauline and Johnny Paterson, Co-Founders of Dr.PAWPAW · Skin Anarchy

• 0:00
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• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's truly a very, you know, clean brand, and there's a lot of cool stuff here to talk about.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_01: So without further ado, I want to introduce you guys to the co-founders for uh Dr.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: Pawpaw's skincare, or I guess Beauty.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: And um, yeah, so Johnny and uh Pauline Patterson, welcome to the show, guys.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_02: Hello, how are you doing?
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_01: Doing very well.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_01: How are you?
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I'm really good.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for asking.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so I would love to get started.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um Johnny, maybe you can get us started as about uh how the whole uh you know um journey really began for the brand and how you guys really came to the um the idea and you know just all the all this good stuff from the beginning.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I'd love to tell you about that.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_03: Sorry, so can we just stop it?
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_03: There was a massive um uh motorcycle that just went by.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_03: Sorry, and we had the window open.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_03: Did did you hear that?
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_01: No, I didn't hear any of it.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_03: Because I I just oh okay, because I just got up to try and stop it.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_03: Right because I well, because I got up to I got up to slam the window, uh to close the window and it slammed, but that's all right, don't worry.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_03: If you just want to no, I didn't hear anything.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't hear anything at all.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, that's right, because it was really loud.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so let me let me get started again though, just so I can like you know, just so you guys are comfortable with that.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_01: So I'll I'll just um I already introduced you guys, so I'm just going to go with the first question I asked.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: Is that okay?
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah, that's fine.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, that's fine.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_03: Thanks.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so Johnny and Pauline, I would love to hear about how everything began for the company and the brand and where you guys really started and the vision and all the good stuff.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: So if you can get us started.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_01: And Johnny, maybe you can uh get us started.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I'd love to tell you about it.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_02: So um my background is PR and marketing.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, had been uh running a PR agency for for many years, so was always on the lookout to create something with with Pauline that we felt that would you know would take the market by storm.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_02: We were either looking for innovation or something that wasn't really readily available, and luckily we found something that wasn't readily available.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um Pauline, obviously, we'll talk to in a second.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_02: Second was uh a hairdresser working for Weller teaching hair colour, and Pauline's actually Australian.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_02: We'd actually been traveling to Australia for for many, many years, uh, had seen this amazing product or products that were out in Australia called Paw Paw Products.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_02: And basically, what happened to our daughter is uh after six months of um uh of being alive, uh she had eczema on the inside of her uh her arms, and um we went to the doctors in the UK and they basically said what you need to do is put on a steroid cream, and we felt that that just wasn't right.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_02: And having traveled to and from Australia for many years, we'd we'd seen and uh saw how these different Paul Paul brands and creams were being used in Australia, and we decided to to give it a whirl ourselves.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_02: Um we uh used it on her skin and it really, really worked.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and we tried to become the distributors in the UK.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um they said no to us, so we decided uh to do it ourselves, but uh of course we wanted to do it different with a different style.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, I wanted uh with my PR and marketing background to change the line of story and the colour and the ingredients and to improve all the ingredients from what we uh originally saw or what we thought could be better, and Pauline had lots of ideas of uh of innovation, and that's where Dr.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_02: Paul Paul was uh started from, uh, because you know we we took it to market, and just so many retailers, as soon as we showed them the concept, what it could do, the multi-use side of it, uh which you know we we didn't really know at the time, but everybody started looking out for multi-purpose products, and we just seemed to hit the nail on the head, and it really took off uh really from the moment we started.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, and and I love that.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: And I and I have uh some something I want to say about that, um, but I want to hear from Pauline as well about it.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um, Pauline, anything you can add on to that?
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_03: Um, well, yeah, we sort of decided to start the brand when I was um uh pregnant with our second child as well.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_03: Um, because it kind of took us three years really from from the idea from you know wanting to launch the Paw Paw Arms here in the UK to actually being able to launch it.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, and I was a little bit wary of starting a business at the same time as having our second child.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_03: But um, Johnny assured me it's like, no, no, we can do it, you know, it'll just be on the side anyway, we're kind of keep our day jobs.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_03: But you know, as Johnny said, you know, the response that we got from buyers um soon meant that, you know, after my uh maternity leave, then I didn't have to go back to my job.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_03: Um I was able to sort of work full-time um for the business.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_03: And then slowly, slowly, you know, we sort of added to it.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_03: So it's started with me and Johnny um pretty much, and um, and his dad helped us with kind of like more of the finances and things like that.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and that now we've grown to a team of 15 uh people, which is you know just incredible to think in that in that short spot, that in that short time, um, you know, what we've been able to achieve.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, I actually I want to add to Johnny's point that um that he made, and I think this is so important to acknowledge because um I recently held a panel discussion about like what clean beauty really means, and the topic came up of you know, how things that are geared towards children uh or inspired from being able to care for a child's skin are things that really truly turn out to be some of the best products because child dermatology and pediatric dermatology is one of the hardest and the most, you know, it it's something that, you know, children, their skin is like in the process of becoming what it is when we are adults, right?
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_01: So that like they're developing their microbiome, they're developing their um their uh immune system and everything, they're they're hypersensitive to everything, you know, that's natural.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_01: So the fact that this began from that that journey that you had with your daughter, um, it says a lot about the brand.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_01: It says a lot about the formulation and how it is truly very a very clean formulation, you know.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_01: So I really I want to acknowledge that because that's very important in this, you know, today, because everyone is saying I'm a clean brand, I'm a vegan brand, I'm you know, but I mean, these are the pillars, right?
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_01: So I I really wanted to focus on that.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, and just to add to that, I think the thing with children's skincare as well is the more natural um the ingredients are, the better uh the results are.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_03: Because again, you know, I'm a big believer in science, meeting nature as well, but a lot of these sort of man-made ingredients, you know, like they really need to be tested, say, on human skin or, you know, on particularly, like you said, you know, still um, you know, growing um, you know, children's skin, and you just can't test on children, you know, you you just can't do that.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_03: And again, being against animal testing, things like that.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_03: So a lot of those new ingredients can't, but natural ingredients are the ones that have stood the test of time that have been available all around the world, and they're the ones that just seem safest and seem to deliver the best results as well, that we've that we've seen as well with our different formulation changes.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely, absolutely.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, the thing is that you know, natural ingredients, it it's it's funny, you know, that you mentioned that because natural ingredients, yes, I agree with you, they're they have to be tested as well, but it's also like finding, you know, I think the industry also needs to focus on like, you know, there are brands like you know, such as yourself that are utilizing natural ingredients and to really start using brands, these kind of brands, and finding out, okay, these are the ingredients that are tried and true and are derived from nature, and we can really depend on them.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_01: So, like that's something that I think um, you know, like your brand is doing, but it's it's like it's almost as if it's it's it's unintentional, but you're doing that, you're adding that to the space, you know, on that level of education and and really like as a resource for you know new entrepreneurs.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_01: But um, I want to shift focus a little bit.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I I know I'm ranting a little bit.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_01: I I want to focus on like really the range because it's such a beautiful range.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, uh last night I was trying on uh one of the lip balms and the and the brown is just stunningly beautiful and it's so amazing for every color, you know.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like every uh skin shade can use it, and it's just such a they're just such versatile products.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_01: So um can we talk about the formula of that and how um everything was when you guys were formulating?
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, let Pauline covered that.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_02: That one's actually the rich mocha, it's a beautiful shade, really, really nice.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's so beautiful.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_03: Oh my gosh.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you, thank you.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and like you said, it is suitable for all skin types.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_03: And I came from the hairdressing background, and I um particularly specialized in colouring people's hair.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_03: So all of my career I was looking at people's eye colour, their skin tone, their natural hair colour, and finding what colours would suit them, but also having the understanding that um, you know, if you pick up a colour, any colour, and you put it on your lips, depending on the colour of your lips, will have a huge effect on the outcome of that colour.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, unless you're going to go for like these solid, sort of matte kind of you know, lipsticks, that it's the one colour that is the same no matter what you put it on, because you know, the colour, the pigment is so saturated.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and then you can't get any variations.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_03: It's like, oh, that looks good on you, but that looks absolutely awful on me.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_03: So and having all of this, you know, sort of yeah, having all of this sort of understanding of how colour works and how colour is affected by not only the product that you put it on, like your lips or your cheeks, but also what's around it, like your skin tone, your eyes, you know, your hair colour.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_03: I really knew that I wanted to create colours that would suit everybody from all different skin tones to all different ages, and also ones that you know you could control how much colour you saw.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_03: Because again, going back to those lipsticks, you know, that just completely cover your lips, you know, it's one shade and that's it.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_03: You know, you can't get different variations, the variations of it.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so that's when working with the chemists, the contract manufacturers that uh made our colours over here.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_03: I was very specific when they'd give me a color.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like, no, that hasn't got enough pigment in it, or that needs more pigment, or that needs more brown in it, or that needs more pink in it, or that needs more red, you know, and really just sort of working on that.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_03: And um, and then again, I just used to test it on everybody.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_03: Again, we're quite lucky, you know, because we've got, you know, sort of quite a few friends, you know, Johnny in his PR and marketing world, he had a big team as well.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_03: So we used to just send it, I go, Look, can you just test this?
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_03: Tell me what you think about it, you know, on your skin tone.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_03: Do you like it?
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_03: Would you wear it?
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, we used to get really good sort of just feedback from from the people um that we knew.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_03: And then that used to always um help me sway as well, because when you see it on different people, and again, we will literally get one shade here in the office, and every single girl will put it on and it looks different on everyone because it is totally adapting to their own skin tone.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_03: And also it depends how much they apply, because if they just apply a small amount, it looks like really natural as if they haven't almost got anything on, and then the ones that really, you know, are quite bold and and you know and confident with their makeup will put a lot on, and instantly you can say, see, but it almost looks like a different color that everybody's wearing because everybody's got different skin tones, hair color, and eye color.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I love exactly, and I love that they're also you know, going back to multi-use products.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I was using like you know, just playing around, and it's like you even if you buy, you know, just one shade, one shade that really resonates with you, you can use that as a blush, you can use it as an eyeshadow, you can use it as a lip.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's really cool.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_03: They definitely can use it as your blush, like your highlighter as well, and contouring.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, like you said, you can either have a little amount on your lips or you can have a bolder look um on your lips as well.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_03: But the beauty of it is because of all the ingredients in there, when the colour wears away, it still feels like you've been wearing your lip balm because it is our original lip balm, but just with colour added to it.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, gone are the days where you have to, if you want colour, you end up having dry lips and you know, and cracked lips afterwards.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_03: This literally feels like you're wearing your lip balm all night because you are.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_03: It's just got that hint of color.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_01: I love it.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_01: I absolutely love it.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_01: Now, I want to talk about this whole idea of like um multi-use products because I think you guys are like the perfect um, you know, founders to really discuss this with because you know, I know a lot of brands claim that and they say, oh, our products are multi-use, but I mean, you I feel like you've created a line that is truly the epitome of multi-use.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you know, even the um, you know, the shower products, like the bath products are very, very multi-used, you know, and it reminds me again of like, you know, pediatric dermatology where baby you can, you know, you can use baby shampoo for all of their needs.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I really want to talk about that and like what that process was like for you, and what are the things you were really trying to stay away from in terms of ingredients and what you really wanted to focus on?
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean, I think once we had created the yellow 25mm original balm, which is our classic size, uh, the one we first started out for, everybody knew as uh as this multi-purpose product.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_02: So when we launched the the first two shades, the peach pink and the ultimate red, they were multi-purpose, you could use for lips, cheeks, and there's uh all the uses that Pauline said.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_02: So I think that really from that point on, it just became a continued story and then a demand whenever we were having our new product product development meetings or MPD for short.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, every time we create something, it has to multitask uh, you know, if you even look at the lip uh sugar and palm scrub, uh yes, it's two separate products, but it's in a duo pot.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_02: So you're getting two action things out of it.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, as we explain in a lot of our videos around the lip scrub, you can use it on your hands, you can use it on all sorts of uh things.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_02: It's obviously it's only eight mil, but it it does a lot of uh use.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, I even was just thinking like our hand creams, you know, we've had we have it doesn't actually say multi-purpose on the hand creams, but in a lot of our literature in the videos that we create, we say, you know, use on your hands, you can use it on your feet.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_02: So we're we're showing people that it's not just one single um use.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, I think it has just become an ethos and a uh a strategy for each product as we create them.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_02: And with the new product development that we have coming over the next 12 months, and we've got a really new, exciting line that we're launching in autumn, uh, everything will be multi-use.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, that's so cool.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I and I really, you know, I know that there's definitely hurdles that come with, you know, multi-use products, right?
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_01: So I I wanna I want to ask you about that.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_01: Like, is has there been any like in terms of working with the chemists or whether it's you know um working with whoever you had to really kind of deal with and especially getting your products into retailers, you know, were there any hurdles that came with um explaining and and really kind of you know going through that journey?
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean in in terms of the retailers, of course, and I think this is where we always like to be open and honest.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_02: When we were talking to retailers and we're saying, like, this is a multi-use purpose, it's a lip balm, it's a skin balm, you can use it on your feet, they'd go, So where am I putting it, Johnny?
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_02: Whereabouts am I putting this in my store?
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_02: So in in fact, we had said this is truly multi-purpose, and almost we'd shot ourselves in the foot by doing so.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_02: So, I mean, now our sales strategy, we either go in as lip balm, which are predominantly a lot of our smaller sizes do, but then once we have the bigger sizes, they're either sitting in like skin or they're sitting in hand creams or as in hair care.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_02: Uh so yeah, I mean, in terms of uh the hurdles of dealing with the retailing, they were definitely there because you're saying this they can do three or four things, they can sit in bath, body, and hair.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, that that that is an issue because they don't know where to place it.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_02: So we generally have to position it for them.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_02: But in terms of the ingredients, I mean, Pauline, do you feel like there was any hurdles we had to come across?
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_03: Well, yeah, I mean, getting the balance right was was definitely challenging because whilst I made sure that I chose ingredients that benefit not just the skin um but also the hair, and again, looking at all the different skin types from very, very sensitive skin to very, very dry, you know, and more mature skin, um, there is definitely a balance that is needed, you know, so that you don't overload the sensitive skin and that there's enough moisture and hydration, you know, for the sort of drier skin.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so it was definitely working with the chemists about, you know, first of all, which products work with the hair and the skin.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_03: So then that narrowed it down to like the aloe vera and the paw poor fruit, uh, you know, also known as papaya fruit.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and then it was just about getting that balance right.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, testing the different products and making sure that what actually determined whether you had enough on sort of uh more sensitive skin versus enough on very dry skin was purely the amount um that you use.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, so again, sort of, you know, with our with our um bath and shower products as well, you know, a small amount um will be enough.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_03: Sorry, did you hear that?
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's okay though.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_03: It wasn't very loud.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, okay.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, okay.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_03: Um so I could start from bath and shower products then, if that helps.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so particularly with our uh hair and body products.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_03: So it was ensuring that the ingredients worked well with the hair and with the skin, but then it's the amount that you use.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_03: So if you've got shorter, finer hair, you know, or more sensitive skin, then you just need a small amount to cleanse that hair and that skin.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_03: But then if you've got sort of drier skin or if you've got longer, thicker, even drier hair as well, then you simply use a larger amount of the shampoo of the conditioner, and then you're getting enough of those oils.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_03: So really it's controlled then by the amount that you use, is is how much you need.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but it was definitely it definitely took longer, probably than than we expected, bringing out those ranges as opposed to bringing out the balms.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I figured, because you know, bath products are are definitely uh more interesting as far as far as you know the use of surfactants and the use of something that is able to like really take off dirt and you know, oils and sebum and all of that.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_01: So that's why I asked that question.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, I I'm really interested though in the papaya fruits uh that you just mentioned, uh, Pauline, because I I want to know that so this was the main inspiration then.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, because I know that you guys had mentioned earlier in the in the recording that um you had seen these products in Australia.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so I want to know a little bit more about that in terms of the actual uh the original what you saw.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_03: So the papaya fruit has exactly the same uh qualities as the aloe vera plant, um, and they've been used for hundreds of years in South America.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_03: Um, when you Google it, you know, again, it's it's as common as sort of what aloe vera is.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_03: But and in Australia, I grew up with pawpaw balms, so different brands using pawpaw as an ingredient in their products as opposed to like an aloe vera balm, you know, that you might find or say like an olive oil um sort of you know based balm.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_03: So I was very aware of the you know the benefits of it, but um, but the benefits of the pulpwore fruit, as I said, is very similar to aloe vera.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_03: So it's not only going to hydrate your skin um and nourishing it and nourish it, which means that the effects aren't only instant, but also.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_03: So long-lasting as well, because it's actually doing good to your skin as opposed to just looking uh good on the outside.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_03: But um, it's also the pawpaw fruit is antibacterial and anti-inflammatory, and that's why it really can soothe um, like we said, even the most sensitive skins, like particularly um, you know, with with our daughter Jasmine as and her eczema.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and the other amazing thing about the pawpaw fruit is it's actually fragrance-free.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_03: So there actually is no smell to it.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, if you eat a papaya fruit, you can taste it.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_03: It's like an avocado.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_03: You can taste an avocado, um, but there's no smell to it, like at all.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so again, naturally that brings out going well with another smell.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_02: Don't worry, I have my hands sanitized.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, great.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's so funny.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but but yeah, it's it's it's natural.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I know, I know.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_01: Papaya is actually one of those fruits that um, you know, I remember uh, you know, my father was going through some GI uh problems and at the time um I think he had like an ulcer developing or something, and and I was doing a lot of homework, it's like just natural things that are good, you know, to eat for just to keep your body in balance, right?
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_01: In terms of fruits and vegetables and whatnot.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_01: And papaya was really on the top of that list.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_01: So um by the way, none of the products are ingestible, so don't do that.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_01: Everyone knows I'm just I'm making a point.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, I'm making a point by saying that yeah, it's a it's truly a wonderful ingredient.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, I think um, you know, I'm a huge advocate for what's in nature is the most inspiration you could ever need, in my opinion.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know, so if you if you really open your mind and you go in that direction, the science will back you up, you know, if it really will, because I thought it would make a difference, you know, in something like gut health for my dad and and to see um now your line that is inspired by the same kind of well, the same fruit, and then seeing all the different applications of it.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, this is it's phenomenal, you know, it's really phenomenal to think about that.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_01: This is how you know nature has a cure for things, and we just have to find the right way and find the right way to utilize that.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I agree, I agree, because if it's safe enough for you to eat, then it must be safe enough for you to put on your skin because if it's good on the inside, then it's gotta be good on the outside.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but yes, you're right, you can't go ahead and eat and eat our palms.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_03: But I definitely am an advocate for eating uh papaya fruit in your in your diet, it is really good.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think I I actually would love to see you go ahead, Johnny.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I was just gonna say there's just one thing that I wanted to highlight in terms of our ingredients.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and again, this was one of the things that we wanted to do to make sure that we were available to to everybody was the fact that like one of our uh key ingredients is castor oil.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_02: So um many brands uh are using different types of uh like barriers, as they would say.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_02: And the one thing that we saw quite early on from the demand from our customers is that they wanted it to be natural and they wanted it to be vegan.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, that was another big search out that we had to do was to find out what that sort of, you know, the barrier or the you know the main uh ingredient that would carry the pork or the olive oil, etc.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_02: And castor oil was was our choice.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um there's a lot of benefits in that product for skin and hair.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and so yeah, I just wanted to highlight that that was one of our key ingredients too.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely, no, absolutely.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_01: I think um, yeah, castor oil, I I've read a lot about it, um, in in terms, not in terms of like uh beauty products, but just in general.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_01: So I I would love to see why do you so wait, why did you go for the castor oil?
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_01: What was the real um motivation for that?
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_03: Because because with the castor oil, um it's able to harden.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so that because otherwise, if we just had to pour oil, the aloe vera and the olive oil, it would just be like oil that would pour out of the yeast.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, yes.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_03: But castor oil is one of the natural oils that can almost like solidified to give us that balm texture.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and when we were testing out sort of different oils that could do this as well, because people were looking at like beeswax is quite a common one or lanolin, but we didn't want to go down that route because we wanted to be vegan.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_03: So, what other brands commonly use, we kind of wanted that point of difference.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_03: And as Johnny said, we soon knew that there was a um a market out there for vegan products that we wanted to stop using.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_03: The so-called like traditional kind of methods and really use something different.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_03: Although, again, castor oil has been around for again hundreds and hundreds of years, you know, and in, you know, and in the African countries as well, where it's actually grown, like that is, you know, a staple again, uh, with a lot of the things that they use.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_03: So we were really sort of, you know, really thinking about all the ingredients that we put in and making the right choices for the right reasons.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_01: And it's very, very powerful.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_01: The oil is very good for you, like it's a very strong anti-inflammatory.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's a very strong, it promotes like a lot of really naturally, you know, beneficial and again, anti-inflammation processes.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_01: So I really I'm glad you guys went with that.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_01: That's really cool.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um, no, I want to talk about marketing because I know that um the brand is very colorful and I absolutely love that because it's um so nice to see that in a market right now where everything is neutral colors and you know everything is you know just like very uh shade of like beige.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's like I see beige everywhere or clear or you know.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_01: So I wanted to talk about that a little bit because it's so it's such an appealing look.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_01: And I um how did you how what was the journey of designing like the packaging and stuff?
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I so I can cover that.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_02: So as what I mentioned earlier, my my background is a PR and marketing, and I um many, many years ago, I used to actually look after a hair electrical uh brand who was a competitor to a company called GHD.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_02: And um this brand that I did the PR for used to receive so much media coverage just simply because they didn't do a black or white hair straighter, they did red, black, let's straighten, gold letter straighteners, they did zebra, they did purple, they did all these crazy colours, but the journalist was always contacting me and said, We want to colour yours because it looks so great on the page, or it looks so great on a website, and this was obviously when dot com just really uh kicked off.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_02: And so when we set about setting up our own brand, I mean, first of all, uh one of our favorite colours was yellow, so we know that yellow is a really popular positive colour with sunshine.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_02: Uh so we started out with that bright colour, knowing that that would look great on page, and then really from that point onwards, we just wanted the colours to reflect what's on the tube on the inside, or for it to complement the original brand colour, but everything has to stand out and look just like something you'd want to have on your bathroom shelf, so yeah, appealing, really.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um or something cute, especially when you for ladies, you know.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sure uh Pauline can comment on this.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_01: We love having um, you know, beautiful little things in our bags, so it's really nice to have yeah, something colorful and pretty and you know yeah.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_01: So I okay, so I can go ahead.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I was just gonna say that even if you just look at the uh our 10ml packaging now, which in in uh holds our little 10ml palms, uh I mean that's really bright and bright and colourful, but you know, we have these beautiful little illustrations on the front of the fruit, the um the fruit that's in the products and palms, etc.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_02: And again, it's just really bright and colourful, and it's just why can't products that do good also be fun to look at?
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um it just uh I mean obviously I understand there's a lot of great, you know, uh ingredients out there, but it all looks sometimes a little serious sometimes, so you know it it can be fun as well.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_01: Well, yeah, no, I that's a great point, and I think that's also um it really feeds into consumerism and how we pick products, and um, you know, I think people just feel more comfortable when they see something colorful because they, you know, you see it and you're like, oh, cool, okay.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_01: Instead of if you go into a store and everything is beige and white and black or you know, whatever, it's like, okay, I really have to read this.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what is this for?
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_01: And why do I need this?
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_01: So, yeah, I completely agree with you.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_01: I think that there's definitely value in you know, exploring why or exploring what really resonates with your brand.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_01: And I think, especially since you guys are such a multi-purpose um brand, and also you're geared towards a huge demographic, right?
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_01: From like, you know, younger audience to even you know, older, like it doesn't matter what age you are, it's important to appeal to everybody.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_01: So I I really like that.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's very cool and it's very beautiful to uh for photography, by the way.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_01: I was taking little videos yesterday and I was like, oh, this is so beautiful.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, it's lovely.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um thank you.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um, I you know, and I want to actually uh move on to expanding the brand and really um you know how that the whole journey has been for you and really getting the name out there, first of all, and also I know you've won so many awards.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it it's truly impressive, you know, and and you've kept the brand at a very um affordable price.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_01: And I just really want to hear your thoughts on that and that journey and and how that's been.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean, I I think uh initially with with the bomb, um I suppose we just had clear vision, and we still do today of a lot of the things that we want to do.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_02: So a lot of the things come naturally, the extensions, the things that we add on.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_02: Interestingly enough, you know, three to four years down the line, once we were in multiple retailers here in the UK, the US, uh in the Middle East, in Europe, uh, more and more demand came from the retailers of the type of thing that they were looking for.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_02: Or uh, you know, Johnny was selling great numbers in this.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_02: Do you ever consider doing uh a set of hand creams because obviously people are using your palms at the moment for some of the hands, but maybe they could have a different creamier uh formula uh with a different ingredient.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and so there has been demand to points where uh retailers have shown us what they would look like, um, so giving insights into what the customers are looking for, and we've created products to to run alongside it, but of course with our ethos, multi-purpose, natural, uh, etc.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_03: But I think in terms of the journey that we've come on, like um in terms of expanding, like I mean, yes, we definitely sort of knew that the UK was going to be sort of like the most competitive and the hardest, but because we'd um were you know sort of from well, Johnny was from the hair and beauty and marketing background, not on the hair, we knew that obviously there was a much bigger world you know out there than just sort of being UK based.
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_03: And we started going to these trade shows, these international trade shows, just to get a feel to see if anybody was interested.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_03: And again, because a lot of these buyers have traveled and have seen these products, say in Australia, you know, or in Korea or anything like that, and they're like, Yeah, we've been waiting for somebody to do it over here because they've been trying to get these products over there, but they didn't want to export or they couldn't export because it meant a change in packaging because of the claims that they made.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, we really listened to everything and took on board everything, and particularly when we're launching in America, you know, we already knew that you had to have some of the packaging um, you know, a certain way, for example, have the net ounces um on there.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_03: And so we'd already been doing that.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, we made sure that we were ready to go, you know, when we went to these trade shows and everything like that, any country that ruined that, we were ready to go.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and I think that that was sort of really impressive for them because they're like, all right, so you've already thought about it and you've already got the packaging right.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_03: And we're like, well, yes, because you know, we just knew that we wanted to expand and the interest that we got quite quickly from Europe, um, America, and as Johnny said, the Middle East was like, Yeah, we're definitely on onto a right track then.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_03: So we just did it, you know, we tried with just Jupiter's in different um countries, but now you've just found that we've got the experience now to deal direct.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_03: So we actually opened up um America Dealing Direct um in lockdown.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_03: Wow, bit of times, yes, but um we've been working with Ulta since 2019, and we had the launch date of April 2020, uh, which they still honored, even though we were in lockdown.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know if you guys were quite in uh lockdown yet by then.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_03: Um but obviously all the stores soon shut and you know we just got all our stock in, so we were only online, um, but we really did manage to keep it and and graduated and then soon after CVS came as well, and so now we've got all our uh well, we've got our 10 mil, which is like our smaller size, um, in you know, lots of CVS stores.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_03: I think it's like over 5,000 CVS stores, and we've got all our 25 mil range um in every Ultra store as well.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_03: So that is, you know, that's been an amazing, amazing time for us.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_01: I really love that you've made it so accessible.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_01: That's so important.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_01: That is so important because, you know, just the other day, no joke, I went into a not a CBS, but Walgreens, and I was like, you know, let me just go because I haven't been to a drugstore in so long just to shop for like beauty brands, right, or beauty care or anything.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I was so shocked.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, wow, there are some high quality products now in drugstores that were not there, you know, 10, 15 years ago.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, this level of accessibility that's added when you choose to uh pick a retailer such as a drugstore or a or a um a store that is more accessible for people, you know, in a wider demographic.
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's very important from the overall viewpoint of just making sure everybody can get these products and and use them, and especially for young moms out there that if it's their first child and they're like, I don't know what to use, you know, or or something happens.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_01: They they there should be brands that you can just trust and and go to and they should be available to everybody.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_01: So I I really commend you for that.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I'm really glad you guys did that.
• 36:45
  unknown: Thank you.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um, I want to actually, you know, I want to close off the episode by asking you guys um one question I have that um it it's a little tricky, but I I think I'm very curious is how you navigate this oversaturated market for vegan beauty.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's a lot, right?
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of brands out there, and there's a lot of um claims and there's a lot of greenwashing, there's a lot of you know false claims.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_01: So being a brand that is very authentic, you guys are really doing things right.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, how do you navigate that whole scene and and um really kind of make sure people understand that you are um really setting the bar on this on this idea of multi-use, vegan, cruelty-free, you know?
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_01: So how do you do that?
• 37:33
  unknown: Yeah.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, if it's just uh vegan itself, I mean, I actually I'm quite surprised by the amount of brands that aren't uh vegan friendly if it if it's uh if it's called that.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and I think you know there is choice for people.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, there's nothing to say that you know vegan, non-vegan brands aren't uh great products.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_02: They have some great products out there, and obviously it is down to people's personal uh choice.
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, if we look at say some of our categories, which would be lip and skin, uh, you know, we are probably one of two or three brands, which you know, and we're talking about like our close competitors who are actually vegan, and the rest of the people in our category are still using animal uh product.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um so yeah, and and I suppose how do we get that across?
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, we we have it written on our packaging so it's clear.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_02: Uh we obviously Peter approved, and obviously with them, obviously it's joined up with vegan as well.
• 38:36
  SPEAKER_02: So it obviously tells everybody that we're vegan friendly uh too.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_02: But it's still probably one of the questions that we get asked every single day through our social media channels, our web channels, uh, and when we're out there selling, are you vegan friendly?
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, definitely that question of uh G test on animals definitely has faded away.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_02: Because I think most people now know that you know it's against the law in in uh in Europe and and most of the world.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_02: So people know that we we don't do that.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_02: Um but the big question is you know, are you vegan uh friendly?
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_02: And uh of course we are.
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, I mean we're we're proud to say that and we try to highlight as much as we can.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_03: Um definitely I think okay.
• 39:24
  SPEAKER_01: No, go ahead, Pauline.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_03: Um, yeah, no, definitely.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_03: I think it's just awareness, you know, sort of we've been telling this story for seven years, it's not something new um to our brand.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, we made those those decisions sort of quite early on, um, and we've always said them.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_03: So I think that anybody, you know, that sort of knew us before or even you know, Googles our brand or looks back onto our brand will know that we've been telling this story from very early on and that it was quite important.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_03: And again, just reiterating um what we're saying as well, you know, again, that's one of the reasons why we went down that route is because we really did want to be inclusive.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_03: We didn't want to just be like a prestige brand that, you know, if you can't, if you can only afford this, then you know, we're sort of in your budget.
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_03: We really wanted to make sure our price was affordable, that we're getting the right ingredients um to everybody, and that all our natural ingredients again were we're inclusive as to whether you're vegan or natural or, you know, sort of, you know, or again, because we kept out some of the nuts oils as well, because in case you have, you know, an adverse reaction uh to nuts, because again, almond oil is a is a big one that's really used in a lot of uh beauty products as well.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_03: But we really did make these decisions, like I said, early on, and we've just always spoken about them.
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_03: They've always been on our packaging and they've always been um on our websites as well, and wherever we're uh sold.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I, you know, I have a request actually, Pauline.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, I would love to see you guys make some sort of like face, because I'm not gonna lie, my favorite skincare or beauty product is a face mask.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not gonna lie.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_01: I would love to see you guys make a face mask or um, you know, something like that, because I think it would be absolutely beautiful, or even like an eye cream, you know.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_01: I think your eye cream would be like miraculous.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm I'm hoping maybe down the line you can maybe refer, you know, fulfill that request I have.
• 41:15
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, yes, yes.
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_03: Well, what watch this space?
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_03: If we do do a face mask, it will definitely need to be a biodegradable um one.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and you know, the technology out there about environmental packaging is amazing.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, me and the other colleague that works with me on MPD, we're just you know uh shocked and amazed how good the beauty industry is reacting to the environmental crisis as well.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_03: And the packaging and the technology that they're offering us is incredible.
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_03: So definitely watch this space, is all I can say.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, no, that's very exciting, and I'm very excited to see everything that you guys come out with next.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_01: I really believe in your brand.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's it's absolutely beautiful, and I'm um, you know, just so glad that I I had the opportunity to host um, you know, just just lines and and brands that I I can say are for everybody.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_01: That's huge for me, you know, for this podcast, because there's you know, in the in the world of oversaturated markets, right?
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's very hard for consumers to sift through.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_01: And and that's really my goal here at Skincare Anarchy is to host um the brands that you can really stand by and you can, you know, all of you out there, you know, Dr.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_01: Papa is a it's a brand that is for everybody.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_01: And if you haven't picked that up, I mean, I'm we've been talking about it the whole time, but it really is, and it's a beautiful line.
• 42:34
  SPEAKER_01: It has not, you know, it's a brand that hasn't compromised on quality just because they're focused on being very, you know, geared towards sensitive skin.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_01: That's the most important part is that you're getting quality, you're getting um, you know, a truly great range of products.
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_01: So I urge all of you, please go check them out.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I'm going to link all of the um the tags and stuff in the podcast art for this episode.
• 42:59
  SPEAKER_01: I would love to hear your thoughts.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, any comments or questions you have.
• 43:03
  SPEAKER_01: I'll definitely pass them along to um Johnny and Pauline's team.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_01: But thank you guys so much for this opportunity to host you.
• 43:10
  SPEAKER_01: It's been really lovely.
• 43:12
  SPEAKER_02: Oh no, thank you so much for having us on.
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_02: It's uh we've been there watching and following your page for a while now and listening to the podcast as well.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_02: And just had so many amazing brands on there, and uh, we're just delighted that you'd give us the chance to talk to you too.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, that's what I was gonna say.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you so much for holding us in esteem with the other brands.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, that that you love and that you hold in such esteem.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_03: It really is a privilege and an honor.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_03: So thank you for having us.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much, and I will be back next time, you guys.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_01: Hey guys, so I hope you love that episode.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_01: Please make sure to hit subscribe if you're tuning in to us on any podcast platform.
• 43:51
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• 43:53
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