Latest / The Overland Journal Podcast / Getting Electric with Rivian, Hummer, and Ford

Transcript

Getting Electric with Rivian, Hummer, and Ford · The Overland Journal Podcast

• 0:10
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Overland Journal podcast. I am your host,
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: Scott Brady, and I'm here with my illustrious co host
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: Matt Scott.
• 0:17
  Speaker 2: I'm here to be opinionated today.
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: Just today. Yeah, So all of the other just all
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: of the other podcast.
• 0:25
  Speaker 3: That nothing, because today we're talking about evs and one
• 0:28
  Speaker 3: of them as a hummer and I've taken my gloves off.
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: So stay tuned, folks. This is it's going to get
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: rowdy on the Overland Journal podcast. And a special thanks
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: to Nimble Vehicles for supporting this week's podcast. Nimble Vehicles
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: has been the leading manufacturer of extreme expedition vehicles since
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: twenty nineteen. The Nimble Evolution is the ultimate vehicle for
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: beginning overlanders and extreme adventurers alike. The proprietary, lightweight aluminum
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: flatbed bind with a luxurious habitat allows you to confidently
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: go where others only dream of. Built on any one
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: ton chassis or larger, with an off roading package seventy
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: five gallons of fresh water, over one thousand watts of
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: solar and over one thousand amp hours of lithium ion batteries,
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: you can expect to be off the grid for extended
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: periods of time. To find out more information, visit Nimble
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: Vehicles dot com online or you can email info at
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: Nimble Vehicles dot com for more information. Thanks again, Nimble.
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: Talk about a couple of things today before we get started.
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: First of all, we like to showcase small businesses on occasion.
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: This is a fun one. So this is high road
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: They make kids pretty much like a fire.
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a firewood carry firewood carrier. Really nice. We
• 1:51
  Speaker 3: took one to Alaska. Actually we bought it at the
• 1:53
  Speaker 3: Northwest Over and rally. We didn't have one. We were
• 1:56
  Speaker 3: under the impression that we were going to have campfires
• 1:58
  Speaker 3: and we didn't know we were walking into bug pocalypse.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 2:01
  Speaker 3: It was floating around in this box on the back
• 2:03
  Speaker 3: that we called the shed for ten thousand miles probably
• 2:07
  Speaker 3: two thousand miles of dirt.
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: Looks great.
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And it has this little skirt almost that you
• 2:12
  Speaker 3: kind of sinch in when you put your firewood in.
• 2:15
  Speaker 3: And it keeps all of the crud from the firewood
• 2:19
  Speaker 3: that you know, like when you're going down the road,
• 2:20
  Speaker 3: like the firewood might just be like let's say you're
• 2:22
  Speaker 3: buying stuff from a gas station, usually pretty clean. You
• 2:25
  Speaker 3: get stuff from the campsite you were just at because
• 2:27
  Speaker 3: you know you're scavenging or whatever, and you do need
• 2:30
  Speaker 3: to be mindful of where you transport firewood.
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: That's a big thing in the West. I should right now,
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: So keep that in mind.
• 2:34
  Speaker 3: But it just keeps all the crud as it's going
• 2:37
  Speaker 3: down the road, you know, stuff little bits and pieces
• 2:40
  Speaker 3: of break off and dust gets created and organic matter
• 2:43
  Speaker 3: kind of goes everywhere, keeps it all together.
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: And it's really nice.
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's And it's made in the USA.
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: It's a small business. It's just kind of a fun story.
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: The guy who started the business, he actually was my
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: sister's neighbor. He meets my sister because he gets her
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: copy of Overland Journal and you walk over to the house,
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: you know, and and so it's just kind of fun
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: to see small businesses like this pop up. You could
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: also use it as a as an entry mat to
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: a tent. Yeah, you could use it as as kind
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: of a rollout matt for working on your car. It's
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: got some cool features, so yeah, high Road, nice job
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: on that. It's a nice, nice little gadget, yeah, totally.
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: And speaking of cool little gadgets, what's what's been new
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: for you recently? Any any interesting little trips or events.
• 3:27
  Speaker 3: Or we went to this Porsche event called COLT. Yeah,
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: and that basically just means air cooled alfa Deutsch.
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: All I heard was cult at the end, Uh yeah, yeah,
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: coolult cooled.
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 3:40
  Speaker 3: So it's put on by Patrick Long, who's a well
• 3:44
  Speaker 3: now former Porsche factory race driver. I think he was
• 3:48
  Speaker 3: the longest serving factory driver for Porsche, started and finished
• 3:53
  Speaker 3: his career with them. The guy eats, sleeps, and breathes Porsche.
• 3:57
  Speaker 3: And this is the eighth Luft and it's basically, I
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: would call it an artistic assembly of air cooled Porsches.
• 4:07
  Speaker 3: And what air cooled Porsches are is they're older Porsches
• 4:10
  Speaker 3: pre nineteen ninety eight, nine to eleven's, nine fourteens, nine twelves.
• 4:16
  Speaker 3: You know, then you get into the race cars, the
• 4:17
  Speaker 3: nine seventeen's, nine e eights and all that kind of stuff. Anyways,
• 4:19
  Speaker 3: that the cylinder is actually cooled by air, so they
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: have little fins on them, and they're really they're this
• 4:25
  Speaker 3: kind of a lot of people would call them, you know,
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: mechanical works of art for sure. They're they're very simple
• 4:32
  Speaker 3: in they're engineering but very elegant, and there's this huge, huge,
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: crazy following for air cooled Porsches. That's my latest thing
• 4:39
  Speaker 3: that I've kind of gone down the rabbit hole on.
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: I mean, the one that you have is just gorgeous. Yeah, yeah,
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: I mean I love that car.
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: So it's so simple too. It doesn't it's not flashy.
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: It seems very honest, and it seems like it would
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: be a good investment. I mean, I don't know anything about.
• 4:56
  Speaker 3: Them, but there's definitely people that you know, play in
• 4:58
  Speaker 3: the automotive investment space and Porsches. I think it's it's
• 5:02
  Speaker 3: a large enough community you kind of have a Porsche
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: for everyone. And I think what it comes back to
• 5:07
  Speaker 3: is that there's still functional vehicles. Old Jaguars are fans,
• 5:11
  Speaker 3: are beautiful, but they don't really work that well. Old
• 5:14
  Speaker 3: Triumphs they don't really Old just British stuff doesn't really
• 5:17
  Speaker 3: work that well from from the period where the German
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: stuff it works.
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: It's still drivable.
• 5:22
  Speaker 3: It's it's very much like almost like the land cruiser community.
• 5:25
  Speaker 3: I feel like people are drawn to land cruisers because
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: they want to actually use the vehicle, not just appreciate
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: it as a as a status item or are a
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: piece of art. Q land Rover in the background.
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: Backdrop.
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: But there's a lot going on. There's a reason why
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: a lot of art.
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: You know, I love land Rivers and I love British
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: cars and all that kind of stuff. But you know,
• 5:48
  Speaker 3: I think, uh, there's just all of these fascinating people
• 5:52
  Speaker 3: that are into air cooled Porsches and it's one of
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: those events that sells out and people are trying to
• 5:58
  Speaker 3: you know, buy tickets off off the partial black.
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: Market or yeah sure or whatever.
• 6:04
  Speaker 3: There's cars that were built in a garage there that
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: people appreciate just as much.
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: As some concourse ready.
• 6:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, So I mean, you know, Bruce Meyer had
• 6:14
  Speaker 3: his he's the chairman of the Peterson Foundation, and he
• 6:18
  Speaker 3: had his new RSR. I think it was a seventy
• 6:21
  Speaker 3: three RSR that Hurley Haywood drove. That's a hugely historic
• 6:25
  Speaker 3: significant car worth I don't even know the squillions, the quillions,
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: you know, and that's on display, and then there's like
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: a portion of nine oh eight there, and then you
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: know you're walking around and you're talking to the people
• 6:35
  Speaker 3: that have history with these cars. You know, there's a
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: few thousand people that go to the event. I think
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: they purposely kind of cap it and boy, it was great.
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: I went with Auto Car Club, my buddy Eli there
• 6:45
  Speaker 3: that owns that, and it was kind of cool to
• 6:49
  Speaker 3: be able to dive into that world with people that
• 6:52
  Speaker 3: have been in it for a while. Yeah, that was
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: super fun. I've never seen morelikahs there. I've never seen
• 6:57
  Speaker 3: well one, I've never seen an event where there were
• 6:59
  Speaker 3: just so many cameras. They kind of one of the
• 7:01
  Speaker 3: guys that helps put it on Jeff Swart is a
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: commercial director photographer, has done a lot of work for
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: Portia and all these things, and he sets the cars
• 7:08
  Speaker 3: up in an almost cinematic way, like he's creating a
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: scene for people to interpret in their own way to photograph.
• 7:15
  Speaker 3: And there's no like competition, there's no whatever. It's just
• 7:18
  Speaker 3: all of these fantastic photos happen from this event. It
• 7:23
  Speaker 3: was cool to see Leiko's outnumber anything else, Like maybe
• 7:27
  Speaker 3: I saw a canon. Yeah, the guy's actually working the
• 7:30
  Speaker 3: show taking real photos. They're the ones that had Cannons
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: and Nicons and Sony's. But yeah, sure, all the other
• 7:35
  Speaker 3: guys that are just there kind of hanging out and
• 7:37
  Speaker 3: it's a passion thing for them for sure.
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: That was really cool. Well, and speaking of that, I
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: think that that's that's yeah.
• 7:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I finally, finally, I finally gave the boot to Canon,
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: not for any particular reason other than the new like
• 7:50
  Speaker 3: A sl too is just.
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: I really like it. It's gorgeous.
• 7:53
  Speaker 3: The lenses are class leading, and I think that's the
• 7:56
  Speaker 3: big thing that I like with Likeika is that you
• 7:59
  Speaker 3: can invest a lens and they raise the prices each year.
• 8:02
  Speaker 3: You can keep a lens for ten I've liked lenses
• 8:05
  Speaker 3: I've had for ten years that I bought for a
• 8:07
  Speaker 3: couple hundred bucks used, but the market is.
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: Kind of always moving up on them.
• 8:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so they don't get this digital The lenses themselves
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: don't get this digital rot. And now I went and
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: I bought a bunch of new Canon ef glass and
• 8:20
  Speaker 3: a five D Mark four for my last camera. And
• 8:23
  Speaker 3: it's like all useless because everything switched R and yeah
• 8:26
  Speaker 3: they have adapters and that kind of stuff, but it's
• 8:28
  Speaker 3: the next best thing, right, So with that l mount alliance,
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: which is Sigma Panasonic and Leika for their mirrorless SLR
• 8:37
  Speaker 3: style cameras, and they're not SLRs, but I mean, what
• 8:40
  Speaker 3: else would you call the form factor? You give your rangefinders,
• 8:42
  Speaker 3: and then you have your this mirrorless camera.
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: They call them mirrorless. You know that kind of gave
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: me the confidence to to step into that system. What
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: do you think of the image quality so far?
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: Fantastic? You know that it's I was impressed with how
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: long of a reach your tellyzoom has. Yeah, so I've
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: seen that number on AI like a class before. Yeah,
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: I mean, I'm sure that they've made them.
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: It's heavy and you could you could. Yeah, it looks chop.
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: Wood with it. It looks like I use it as
• 9:11
  Speaker 3: a hammer. Yeah, you know, I mean I have the
• 9:14
  Speaker 3: fifty one four, which in like a world is a
• 9:17
  Speaker 3: summa lux and it's it's huge.
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: It's huge.
• 9:20
  Speaker 3: I mean it's like the size of like one of
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: the big bean cans, but then taller that lens to
• 9:27
  Speaker 3: seas in the dark, and the way that all of
• 9:30
  Speaker 3: the lenses are apochromatic APO I think, I'm yeah, sure,
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: i think I'm enounciating that right. But it means basically
• 9:36
  Speaker 3: that when you shoot them wide open, the contrast on
• 9:38
  Speaker 3: them is just absolutely wonderful. For me, just taking pictures
• 9:41
  Speaker 3: of Porschas and stuff in my garage and you know,
• 9:44
  Speaker 3: my travels and and my dog. Yeah, I mean the
• 9:47
  Speaker 3: image quality of my dog's Instagram, all five people that
• 9:51
  Speaker 3: in my family that follow it, it has gone up dramatically.
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: So but you want to do more shooting again, Yeah, I.
• 9:58
  Speaker 3: Want to get get back into some of that stuff.
• 10:01
  Speaker 3: So it's about finding the tool that inspires you to
• 10:04
  Speaker 3: actually kind of get out there and do it. They
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: don't make sense, but I'm not looking for something that
• 10:10
  Speaker 3: makes sense, and that's.
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: Like art is art, so art doesn't have to make sense.
• 10:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So that's been kind of my latest rabbit hole.
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: And then finding all of the vintage Remo tropicanic cases
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: for everything to go in. Remoa is now the bougie
• 10:26
  Speaker 3: luggage company, but before they were in many ways kind
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: of like the German Pelican I don't know know how
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: else to say it, and they had this Tropicana line
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: which was you know, cases for cameras and sensitive equipment
• 10:38
  Speaker 3: and whatever. And with the exchange rate being crazy good
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: right now buying stuff out of Europe, I've been snagging
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: these cases for not that much more than what you'd
• 10:46
  Speaker 3: pay for Pelican cases in there.
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: Awesome, it's an incredible camera. Is so neat to see it.
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just simple, like I don't know how to
• 10:55
  Speaker 3: use like the five million buttons that are in the
• 10:57
  Speaker 3: back of the cannon. I use like the menu button,
• 11:00
  Speaker 3: is the play button, and then they have like a
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: function button.
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: There's three buttons in the back of the likea that's it.
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: That's it, It's all you need. That's kind of their thing.
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: Don't overcomplicate them, you know.
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: And also spending most of my time with the range
• 11:10
  Speaker 3: finders and in that like a kind of menu ecosystem
• 11:14
  Speaker 3: or whatever.
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: Just how things work all makes sense to you. It
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: all makes sense. Cool and are nice? What are you doing?
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: What's your what's your gadgety obsession?
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: Well, I would say that in all reality, it has
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: been to reduce the number.
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: Of gadgets that guys around different programs.
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: But that has been my that has been my approach
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: for probably you've been on that for a while, yeah,
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: well definitely, definitely several years. But it just feels like
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: it's ramping up because we we know that when you
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: own something, it owns a part of you too. So
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: the number of vehicles that you have or the number
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: of things that you have, they all require a degree
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: of attention to keep them in good condition and or
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: you feel obligated to use it or.
• 11:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and sometimes if you don't use them, they just
• 11:55
  Speaker 3: kind of like they quickly deteriorate.
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: They really do.
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: Even my my camera hit is is really dwindled down
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: and I've got it into like just a small little
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: zipper case that has everything that I need in order
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: to capture the images that I need, and then a
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: small video production kit that I use when I'm in
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: the field. So that feels good to just have that
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: really minimized. And I've just gotten.
• 12:21
  Speaker 2: Rid of a ton and you're going to get back
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: to traveling, Like.
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: That's the thing for me is I want to be
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: able to leave without those encumbrances. And I mean I
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: really do take an enormous amount of joy out of
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: the sailboat. That's definitely I think I cut my hobby.
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: Stuff is a problem when it doesn't give you experiences.
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, true, so true.
• 12:42
  Speaker 3: So just just like I kind of reversed course on
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: a lot of the like car collecting motorcycle collecting thing
• 12:50
  Speaker 3: that I was on.
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: You know, I made some money on it.
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: Well yeah, yeah, you know, I bought the right stuff
• 12:55
  Speaker 3: at the right time, and you know, like to think
• 12:57
  Speaker 3: I got rid of a lot of the stuff at
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: the right time. But this it didn't serve any purpose
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: because you couldn't really you couldn't go out and you know,
• 13:04
  Speaker 3: put twenty thousand miles on a car or something. You know,
• 13:06
  Speaker 3: you're kind of trying to preserve or increase the value
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: of something. And that's really been a thing. During the
• 13:12
  Speaker 3: pandemic we saw like a frenzy. It was crazy anything
• 13:15
  Speaker 3: automotive of people just collecting stuff. It was crazy to
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: collect stuff because they couldn't have the experiences. And what's
• 13:22
  Speaker 3: the next best thing for serotonin is to have that
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: little quick hit buy in something gadget.
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah exactly.
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So that's it's been good to just kind of
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: realize how little I need and trying to keep working
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: on that. I find that for me that is really helpful.
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: It's really positive for me for me. Yeah, So because
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: time is I realized that time is something that I'm
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: very precious with now.
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: So I mean, we should talk about buying more cars now.
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: We should. In fact, we got to talk about EV's.
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: The whole EV thing somehow has become politicized, which makes
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: no sense to me. It's like how COVID became politicize.
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's like, do you think that the virus
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: cares who you voted for? Yeah, but somehow identity politics
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: are a bit of an issue.
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: It is.
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: And so both you and I feel, because we're both
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: very moderate folks, we both feel like it's very ridiculous
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: that we have to either do a bunch of signaling
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: or a bunch of shaming. The reality is is that
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: evs have now become a politically charged subject, but we
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: really want to talk about how they work. In reality,
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: the majority of people that I've encountered that have a
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: negative opinion of EV's have never driven one.
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: That always makes me very suspect.
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: When you drive one, it is a very unique and
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: oftentimes positive experience.
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: I'll to my I've had some of the nicest pickup
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: trucks you can buy. I've had a t r Rex. I
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: have a prospect Or XL right now, like Thatt a Raptor.
• 14:50
  Speaker 3: The Rivian makes them feel like a horse and buggy. Yeah,
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: it's no question I'm not saying that I'm ready personally
• 14:57
  Speaker 3: for an EV. I've got a tow a trailer with
• 15:00
  Speaker 3: car and that kind of stuff. It just doesn't work
• 15:02
  Speaker 3: for me right now. It will, but the Rivian is
• 15:06
  Speaker 3: really special. Like, for sure, I sat for like a
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: half hour just underneath that car because you can put
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: it into like your highest mode and it has fifteen inches
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: of ground clearance. I don't have that on forty's in
• 15:18
  Speaker 3: my PXL. Yeah, and you can just crawl underneath it
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: and just like look at it and you're like, have
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: you ever looked underneath the McLaren You can.
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: See the same engineers, a lot of the.
• 15:28
  Speaker 3: Same engineers, and how modern the manufacturing is. There's a
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: lot of extrusions, there's a lot of you know, everything's
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: illumine to keep weight down.
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: It's also incredibly smooth, so just something to hit underneath.
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: Something from a practical perspective that I encountered was in
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: the mud when I went with Bruce Dorn and we
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: went up towards the Grand Canyon. We were in this muddy,
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: rutted area and there were times that we were dragging
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: the underside but there is nothing to hang out atch on,
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: so it's just kind of sliding like a like a
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: lead yeah, across any uneven surface or any high point
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: of mud, and it would be the same thing in
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: the snow. It would probably work brilliant in deep snow,
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: as long as you could air the tires down enough. Yeah,
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: because it's heavy. It is a heavy vehicle. You can
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: tell immediately how smooth the undercarriages. There's no no prop shafts,
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: no transfer case, nothing hanging down, no frame rails hanging down.
• 16:22
  Speaker 3: Simpler, I know, there's the technology. And so here's an
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: interesting conversation. Have overlanders are all about simplicity? Yeah, you know,
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: historically that's been the case. We tend to gravitate towards
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: vehicles we can work on ourselves. Maybe that's going to
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: go out the window. But you look at a land
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: Cruiser Africa spec land Cruiser. There are so many more
• 16:44
  Speaker 3: components on that vehicle than on an EV. Yeah, I mean,
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: think of every needle bearing inside of the engine, think
• 16:51
  Speaker 3: of every little component that goes.
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: In, all the sensors, everything, all the fluids that are required,
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: and that you got to keep inside the engine or
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: keep inside a transmission or whatever. Consumer Reports, and this
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: is an important note in this conversation. Consumer Reports is
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: following this closely, and they've already determined, and these are
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: early evs which are not going to be as reliable
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: as once they get to higher production volumes. They're already
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: fifty percent less maintenance in service. Yeah, fifty percent less.
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: I mean an intertal combustion car. It is the future.
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: The Rivian had one fluid to top off, and that
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: was the Winchell wiper fluid.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: Interesting.
• 17:31
  Speaker 3: I know some evs have a like some of the
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: Mercedes evs that I've looked at, they have like a
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: hydronic heating cooling system to heat the batteries and cold and.
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: They do, they do, and they're fully sealed.
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, and you don't have to mess with them.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: There's nothing to check.
• 17:48
  Speaker 3: They're a lot simpler there are. There's like a couple
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: of rotating components. I know that a lot of them
• 17:53
  Speaker 3: have you know, gearboxes, and you know, we're still going.
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: To have some of them do.
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: And that's probably what makes the Rivians so, you know,
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: is that because it has four motors, it really has
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: these four motor drive units and then it has four
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: cvs that have to turn as well, and that's kind
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: of it. Yeah, there's no transmission, no transfer case.
• 18:15
  Speaker 3: It's just it's going to be fascinating to me, Like
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: I think, you know, when you're looking at the truck space,
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: how complicated you know. You have this deaf Injecson system,
• 18:24
  Speaker 3: you have the EGER, you have all of these.
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: To make them viable in a modern environment and world,
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: they've had to overcomplicate these engines so much to the
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: point where they're going to overcomplicate themselves into obsolescence.
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, especially as people realize how simple evs are. But
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: it's also important to note that there are going to
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: be applications even for us as overlanders, where an EV
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: does not make sense anytime in the near future.
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: And that's so.
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: For example, if you wanted to cross the Canning Stock
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: route right now, you couldn't do that in an EV
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: unless you brought along a trailer that had a giant
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: generator in it with a bunch of fuel. You couldn't
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: do it in today's day. In today's age, So people
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: will say, oh, bring a long solar. When you do
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: the calculations of the amount of the solar ere you
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: would have to have, you couldn't carry it, you couldn't care,
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: you couldn't actually bring it in the vehicle. It's so
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: it would be so extensive to charge the vehicle. So
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: there are absolutely applications. Try to cross Africa with an
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: EV You're just not going to be able to find
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: the consistency yet. Yeah, yeah, you know, I think so
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: right now, right now, that's not the case.
• 19:34
  Speaker 3: I think as the cost of ownership on evs goes down,
• 19:36
  Speaker 3: which it will because there's fewer components to manufacture. Yeah,
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: you know, I mean just think of the simplicity in
• 19:42
  Speaker 3: the supply chain. How many components are in a transmission,
• 19:45
  Speaker 3: how many components are in a transfer case, how many
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: components are in a modern think of like like the
• 19:51
  Speaker 3: Ford sixty seven. It's like the most complicated engine. It
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: has two separate cooling systems for different aspects of the engine.
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 19:59
  Speaker 3: I wonder if in ten fifteen years we're going to
• 20:02
  Speaker 3: get the point where people just aren't going to be
• 20:04
  Speaker 3: able to service these trucks. We're arguably already at that
• 20:08
  Speaker 3: point because like that's why we got to take the
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: DF stuff off, and you got to or you gotta
• 20:12
  Speaker 3: take it to because it costs ten grand to replace.
• 20:15
  Speaker 3: You know, by the time you're said and done with
• 20:16
  Speaker 3: your pumps and your filter, you know, and everything, so
• 20:19
  Speaker 3: big Deally expensive, so I welcome it with open arms.
• 20:23
  Speaker 3: And the first time you hit the skinny pedal on
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: a TV, I know, I.
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: Just I just wish anyone that's listening, that's feeling the
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: EV eight please just go for a test drive. Is
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: people think with overlanding, you got to have all of
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: this range, which is absolutely true. But if you look
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: at like the Hummer EV, it has a three hundred
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: and forty mile range. We decided to take one and
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: to drive it across El Camino del Diablo. Now El
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: Camino del Diablo is the longest overland route in the
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: continental the United States. So that means it does not
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: cross another paved road. It doesn't the road name doesn't change,
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: it doesn't go near any incorporated city. Most of the
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: cell coverage that you have along the route is from Mexico.
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: It goes right along the border wall. It's one hundred
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: and fifty miles of dirt. So it's a very long,
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: very remote, multi day adventure across the desert. And we
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: decided to take the Hummer EV and we did. We
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: drove it from we topped it off in Aho. We
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: actually stopped in a little RV park because they had
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: had fifty amp service charged it up overnight while we
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: stayed in a hotel and got some good sleep, and
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: then the next morning we left early in the morning
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: and we drove all day. In fact, we had so
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: much range that we decided to take a couple little
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: bypasses and other alternate routes up to Christmas Pass and
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: we left the AC and the HVAC run in the
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: entire time, So eleven percent of the range was consumed
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: by climate control and keeping the batteries and motor drive
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: units cool because it was quite quite warm. It got
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: to about one hundred degrees when we were crossing El
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: Camino del Diablo, so they.
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: Have to cool the batteries, just heat them. So I
• 22:09
  Speaker 3: know that lithium isn't supposed to charge below freezing. Yeah,
• 22:13
  Speaker 3: it's both interesting.
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: And the motor drive units need to be cooled as well.
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: So we were in deep sand, which the highest consumption
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: that we saw was in the deep sand, which remember
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: this stuff, All of these physics applied to internal combustion
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: engines too, So if you had your land cruiser and
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: you're driving across El Camino del Diablo, your miles per
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: gallon are going to decrease in deep sand approximately the
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: same amount that they decrease for an EV and the
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: same with towing. People say evs can't tow no internal
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: combustion engines vehicles, they have the same towing impact, but
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: you can just stop at more gas stations. And also
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: to the fair point of internal combustion, you can fill
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: up in a few minutes, whereas it even on a
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: rapid charger, you're talking thirty to forty five minutes.
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: Interesting, So I guess there's just so much capacity there
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: because it doesn't the Hummer have like one hundred and
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: thirty It's it's hegante.
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: It is a giant battery pack. And not only is
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: it a giant battery pack, but then they also decided
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: to give it a lot of range, one three hundred
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: and forty miles of range, so it's an even bigger
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: battery pack because of that choice as well. And it's
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: like a brick going down the road thirty five inch
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: tall tires, so yeah, it's it needs all that range.
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: The performance on it looks great, and it is great.
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: It's fast.
• 23:28
  Speaker 3: It is the ugliest car I've ever seen in my life,
• 23:32
  Speaker 3: absolutely terrible. It's the only car that I've ever decided
• 23:36
  Speaker 3: not to drive purely because like I'm just like I'm
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: walking into it, like I already hate.
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: It, Like I'm not even gonna give the chance.
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: The thing that I don't like about the Hummer the
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: most is that angled part of the bed, so it
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: takes away It's like the avalanche thing. It makes zero
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: sense to do that functionally. Now they may do it
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: for some arrow consideration, but it removes it removes the
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: majority of the things that you want to do with
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: a truck bed. You can't put a camper inside it.
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: You can't like what if you wanted to put an
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: at habitat or a go fast camper, or you can't
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: do anything with it. Yeah, they're really I don't understand.
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: And I don't think that the angle thing does anything
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: positive for the look either, because if you look at
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: the suv Hummer, it's a much more attractive vehicle.
• 24:23
  Speaker 2: Do they have an suv Vy? Do they do?
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: It's not out yet, it's coming soon, and there's pictures
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: of it on the internet.
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: It's very it's a lot more handsome.
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: So there's going to be people who really like the
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: way that that looks. Now, for me, the Rivian was
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: it was handsome and it was wasn't offensive. It was
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: just like really elegant vehicle to drive. And it was
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: also it wasn't like soft looking. It also had some
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: handsome characteristics to it. Yeah, and all of that.
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: I think the Rivian is functional but elegant. Like I
• 24:58
  Speaker 3: really like the design of it. The problem Rivian's going
• 25:01
  Speaker 3: to have with their design is it's taken them so
• 25:03
  Speaker 3: long true to get out.
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: They've got to be working on the next one. They
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: have to.
• 25:07
  Speaker 3: It almost feels like the truck is a little I'm
• 25:10
  Speaker 3: not saying that it's outdated, That's not what I'm trying
• 25:12
  Speaker 3: to say.
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: It's it's it's very cool, but.
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: I think for you and I it is because we've
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: been looking at them for a long time.
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: Like when did they launch two thousand.
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they started getting renderings out in It's.
• 25:25
  Speaker 3: Kind of like the thing that happened with the second
• 25:28
  Speaker 3: generation four Draptor. Yeah, is they launched the new F
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: one fifty and they launched visually the Raptor as it's
• 25:37
  Speaker 3: you know, Halo aspirational car, but they didn't come out
• 25:40
  Speaker 3: with it for like two years or something like that.
• 25:43
  Speaker 3: So by the time you actually saw it. You were
• 25:46
  Speaker 3: like that has been on every TV. Ford advertises the
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: F one fifty really well because that's I mean, it's
• 25:51
  Speaker 3: the best selling vehicle in the world.
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: YEP. I wonder if there's a little bit of the
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: going on there with Rivian it could be.
• 25:57
  Speaker 1: I think it's mostly for you and I because yeah,
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: I think it's for people who care about the brand
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: or was interested in the brand from the beginning. We
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: did really pay attention to that. Yeah, I think the
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: average consumer, Like when I meet people on the street
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: when I'm driving the Rivian R one T, they are
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: all just they think it's the coolest thing they've ever
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: seen and they've never seen headlights look fantastic and they
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: and it nailed the premium thing.
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: They did it.
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: I'm telling you it well. And let's put it this way.
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: It's the only time in doing and I've been doing
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: this for twenty years, it is the only time I've
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: tried to buy a test vehicle.
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's cool. It's the only time.
• 26:35
  Speaker 3: And Rivian as a company is cool, like the people,
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: the people behind Rivian, everybody that I've talked to is great.
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: Like I was just on the rebel rally. I did
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: Rebel Rally last year at the whole Ravine and crew.
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: They're all cool people. They all get out there and
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: do it. Like they put their entire engineering staff through
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: Bill Burk's four wheel drive tree. They do.
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: They put all their people through that. Like the vehicle works,
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: it's really fast. I still can't get used to. I mean,
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: this is all EV's. I can't get used to the
• 27:02
  Speaker 3: one pedal driving.
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: I like that. I get I get a little car sick.
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: I've got some inner ear thing going on. And you
• 27:08
  Speaker 2: have to get used to it though, and as soon as.
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: You like, if you if you're at thirty percent throttle
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: and you go to twenty seven percent throttle, that means
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: the brakes are being applied. So you almost from what
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: I found, I didn't drive as much as you did.
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: You almost have to use like the adaptive cruise because
• 27:27
  Speaker 3: it's kind of modulating things in the background that you are.
• 27:31
  Speaker 3: You then don't have to micromanage.
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and you may have had you may have had
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: the vehicle I had in that there's two regions, the
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: standard region, the standard on all right, Yeah, so it
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: does take some time to get used to that.
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it was it was very much. So that's one.
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: That's one that's EVS though, that's not Rivan.
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: That's one plus for the Hummer though. Oh you can
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: turn that off with the Hummer. It drives like a
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: regular tahoe. You get in it.
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: What a compliment you.
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: Get in it. And it's got a regular shifter. The
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: one pedal drive you can turn on and off in
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: the regular drive mode. The regent is very soft. Yeah,
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: so you can. You can't adjust that. Now that we've
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: driven the Lightning, we've driven the Rivin R one te,
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: we've driven the Hummer.
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: The Lightning looks really good.
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: What I like about the Lightning is it's every it's
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: every person's pickup. It is indistinguishable truck, but it's electric,
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: which I think is great.
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: Like I don't I don't need to wave the flag.
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: It's almost indistinguishable from a standard F one fifty. Yeah,
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: like you got to really no F one fifties to
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: know that. The front is different. It just looks like
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: a new F one fifty. It drives like an F
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: one fifty. The interior is like standard forward fare Like
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: if someone hopped in it, they just wouldn't know. But
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: it still goes zero to sixty and four seconds.
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: But also isn't that kind of the future of evs.
• 28:51
  Speaker 3: Of course, you know, we've we've figured out cars pretty well,
• 28:54
  Speaker 3: and I think that we're looking at EV's as this
• 28:57
  Speaker 3: trying to sell this futuristic concept. Yeah, and in reality,
• 29:01
  Speaker 3: it's just a different engine.
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: And if we look historically in the beginning of the
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: automotive age, it was EV versus internal combustion. Yea even
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: back then.
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: So first Mercedes Benz is an electric vehicle, that's right.
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: This content is brought to you by Overland Journal, our
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: premium quality print publication. The magazine was founded in two
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: thousand and six with the goal of providing independent equipment
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: and vehicle reviews, along with the most stunning adventures and photography.
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: We care deeply about the countries and cultures we visit
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: and share our experiences freely with our readers. We also
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: have zero averatorial policy and do not accept any advertiser
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: compensation for our reviews. By subscribing to Overland Journal, you're
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: helping to support our employee owned and veteran owned publication.
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: Your support also provides resources and funding for content like
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: you are watching or listening to right now. You can
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: subscribe directly on our website at Overland Journal dot com.
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: These are the things that I've just kind of fallen
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: in love with On the evs, it's the silent operation.
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: So I do not need to act like a ten
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: year old when I'm out in the dirt off road.
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: I don't need it.
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: I don't need it to scream. I don't need it
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: to scream and howl and growl.
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: I don't like.
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: I like the fact that these cars are essentially silent.
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: You do kind of.
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: Hear the tires of mechanical noise, a.
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: Little bit of tires crunching on the dirt and things
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: like that, but you'll find that you see way more
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: wildlife because it's super quiet. Your fatigue goes down. You
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: just end up feeling more a part of the nature experience,
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: which I really like. So I love the silent operation.
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: They're also incredibly cheap to fill up, so we have
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: the capability of filling these evs here at the office,
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: and to go from twenty percent to one hundred percent
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: costs seventeen dollars and eighty two cents on the Rivian.
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's not bad.
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: If that had a twin turbov six or whatever a
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: car like that would have in it in the modern age,
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: and a twenty something gallon fuel tank. At the prices
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: that we're at today for fuel, you're one hundred and
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: thirty hundred and forty dollars to fill it up. I
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: remember seventeen dollars and eighty cents.
• 31:18
  Speaker 3: I like, added I got, I got the new iPhone, Yeah,
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: which is I mean, it's kind of I don't know,
• 31:24
  Speaker 3: I don't know about that. That's different stright, But I've
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: readded all my credit cards to it, and I realized
• 31:28
  Speaker 3: now that when you go to the gas station, like
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: they used to pre authorize for like fifty or seventy
• 31:33
  Speaker 3: five or maybe one hundred gas prices to go two
• 31:36
  Speaker 3: fifty is what they're authorizing now because it pops up
• 31:39
  Speaker 3: on like the you throughout name or whatever. Yeah, And
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: it's like, yeah, we've got so many factors that are
• 31:46
  Speaker 3: going to push us towards EVS. Right, They're going to
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: be simpler to manufacture once, I mean, the supply chain's there,
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: it just needs to get beefed up. There's just fewer components.
• 31:55
  Speaker 3: They're cheaper to make.
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: Currently half of the service and maintenance costs.
• 31:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah, going to be cheaper to maintain, They're going to
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: be cheaper to fill up. So you're going to start
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: seeing he who makes the first affordable electric car will win.
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: You know, I always use La as this example. People
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: don't leave LA with their cars, not really. It takes
• 32:15
  Speaker 3: hours to do so they are only usually and they
• 32:18
  Speaker 3: may spend hours in their car, but they may be
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: traveling forty miles round trip. None of that makes sense
• 32:25
  Speaker 3: for a gas vehicle.
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 32:27
  Speaker 3: I know that they have some grid problems and whatever,
• 32:29
  Speaker 3: but you know you can power it. Have real grid problem, Yeah,
• 32:32
  Speaker 3: but you know the next thing. You know, people will
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: spend thirty grand to remodel a bathroom these days, like
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: it's nothing. You know, that's what a cost to do
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: a Tesla. We're doing a Tesla home battery and a
• 32:43
  Speaker 3: nine kilowatt hour array. We already have some solar on
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: our house, so we're going to increase it, but we
• 32:49
  Speaker 3: don't need to do as much. I think it's twenty
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: seven thousand dollars. That's a big chunk of money. But
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: for as long as I own that house, I think
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: the panels have a twenty year warranty, I won't have
• 32:59
  Speaker 3: an electric bill that includes charging two evs in like
• 33:02
  Speaker 3: practical normal use. You're not draining them the zero every day.
• 33:07
  Speaker 3: I think that the low cost to fill was really
• 33:09
  Speaker 3: impressive to me. It's just and I also found that
• 33:11
  Speaker 3: there there's so many hotels that you can charge at
• 33:14
  Speaker 3: for free, particularly in the Arizona. There's a lot of
• 33:17
  Speaker 3: aps sponsored charging stations. There's lots of like little the
• 33:21
  Speaker 3: small little towns that you go through a lot of times,
• 33:23
  Speaker 3: like the visitor centers will have chargers on them and
• 33:26
  Speaker 3: they're free, they're free to charge.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: I found that to be the case. The charging infrastructure
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: is still a huge problem though. That's let's just get
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: that out there very clearly. Infrascot it's terrible. Yeah, if
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: you're trying to toe something with one of these EV's,
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: it's a real problem. So like for me, I can't
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: even get to the sailboat and back here because there's
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: no place to charge quickly along the way. So I
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: have to go from here from Prescott to Lake Roosevelt,
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: and then from Lake Roosevelt I have to go down
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: to Phoenix to hit a fast charger to even make
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: it worthwhile.
• 33:59
  Speaker 3: Fast game change, Oh yeah, yeah, they're so fast you know,
• 34:02
  Speaker 3: I think that's one of the things that so fast.
• 34:04
  Speaker 3: You know, there's the range of the vehicle, and then
• 34:07
  Speaker 3: there's then there's how quickly they go from like twenty
• 34:10
  Speaker 3: to eighty percent.
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: To seventy is things start to slow down around seventy
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: percent depending on the car. But if I if I
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: go from ten percent to seventy percent, took thirty three minutes.
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: Thirty three minutes is all it took at the fast
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: charger in Phoenix. So it's again this is my use case.
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: Some people will find that really frustrating. You have to
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: wait thirty three minutes. It is not frustrating to me
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: at all, because I'm sitting there, I can do work.
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: I just break out my iPad, I answer a bunch
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: of emails. It's no problem at all. In your ace's
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: running while you're there, super comfortable. Or I can walk
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: walk in and have a lunch or whatever like that,
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: it's no big deal. The other thing that's really important
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: to note is the performance of these things like mental
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: the Rivian zero to sixty and three and a half
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: is seconds, the hummer ev zero to sixty and three
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: point three seconds. Sometimes you can get a little bit
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: faster in the WATS for Freedom mode, the WTF mode,
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: which I kind of love. It's it's mental fast, like
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: it's it's so fun like it's nine thousand something pounds
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: and it's like literally peeling your face off of your skull.
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: It's so fast. Now, you know fast cars, Matt and
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: I don't so like for me, it feels like it's
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: like my brain is melting it so fast. You've no
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: doubt experienced much faster than that, but it's so fast.
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: It's so fast, it's I think it's to a degree,
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: a little bit of a party trick fast. Like it's
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: a different kind of fast.
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: Because there's no transmission, there's no shifting. It's just like violent.
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: As a pinion of mine, I haven't really found an
• 35:38
  Speaker 3: EV that I enjoyed.
• 35:40
  Speaker 2: To drive, even the Rivian. Huh, yeah, you know, I didn't.
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: It was that one pedal drive there. It was the
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: one pedal drive. I have to say, like I thought,
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: the steering.
• 35:48
  Speaker 3: This is a pickup truck, right, this is not a
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: car that's designed to have you know, it's not a.
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: Porsche now that. The one EV that I actually did
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: like was the tay Can. I test drove one of
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: those it drove like a Porsche. It drove great, it
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: was a electric. I think they focus more on the
• 36:02
  Speaker 2: driving experience. I just think that with a lot of
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: these ones.
• 36:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah they're fast, and it's like, hey, look over here,
• 36:07
  Speaker 3: it's really really fast. Don't focus on otherwise average driving experience. Like,
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: but how much of that is me adapting to evs?
• 36:17
  Speaker 3: Things are different, they are you don't them. How a
• 36:20
  Speaker 3: car drives is just drast How these things drive is
• 36:24
  Speaker 3: drastically different.
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I just found myself absolutely I mean you just
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: want to like stab the gas all the time, and.
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, I just found myself absolutely loving it.
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: I mean you just, yeah, you roll up at a
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: stop sign and here's a guy in a WRX STI
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: and you're just thinking, I really want to raise this
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: guy because he has no idea, what's happen, no idea,
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: And every once in a while they bite and it's
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: just like they don't even stand a chance.
• 36:48
  Speaker 3: Well, like, if we talk about fast cars, right, so, yeah,
• 36:51
  Speaker 3: I've had some fast cars. It's not necessarily the internal
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: combustion engine that has really revolutionized current vehicles to make
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: them super fast. Horsepower helps with lap times, yeah, something,
• 37:06
  Speaker 3: but handling his paramount there and traction and arrow and
• 37:09
  Speaker 3: that kind of stuff. But it's transmission technology that has
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: it's the launch control. So when you see something that
• 37:16
  Speaker 3: does zero to sixty and two whatever seconds, that's like
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: fumbling through modes putting it in a launch control. You know,
• 37:23
  Speaker 3: foot in the brake as hard as you can, revving
• 37:25
  Speaker 3: it up, and then it just takes off like a rocket.
• 37:28
  Speaker 3: You can't just if you just lay on the gas
• 37:30
  Speaker 3: on a lot of these cars, they're going to be
• 37:32
  Speaker 3: nowhere near their quoted times. Now with evs, it's just
• 37:36
  Speaker 3: like I want to go. It's mental just go. You
• 37:38
  Speaker 3: just literally you put the gas down and it goes,
• 37:42
  Speaker 3: you know, I mean, they are.
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: They kind of make you giddy, like like I had
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: my whole family in the ribban and I'm like, you
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: guys got to see this. They were all they couldn't
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: stop laughing.
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: I think a Rivian, like if you put a Rivian
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: on like the you know, the streets of Hollywood or whatever,
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: there's a lot of supercars. I I think just like
• 37:59
  Speaker 3: cash will like, oh boom, we're going to We're going
• 38:01
  Speaker 3: to hit it, We're going to go.
• 38:02
  Speaker 2: I think the Raban is going to smoke a lot
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: of stuff. They're so fast and they're just so fat,
• 38:07
  Speaker 2: so easy. The speed is so easy, sure, but it
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: almost feels like a gimmick. We don't need pickup trucks
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: that do zero to sixty in three seconds. And maybe
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: the pickup trucks that can tow, that can tow, that
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: can work, that have increased range. I'm just curious. No,
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: that's true, and I think engineering works on that.
• 38:26
  Speaker 3: Like there's probably a sweet spot of batteries and engine size, and.
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: They're probably is And I think that's part of what
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: I liked about the F one fifty is it was
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: very good range, it was lower power, Like it still
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: was like four seconds. It's still so fast to smoke around.
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: It's still so fast. It's still so fast. But it's
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: the performance overall. And then for the rivian on the dirt,
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: it is a wonderful vehicle to drive on the trail.
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: So is the Hummer. The Hummer's bigger, so the hummer
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: is wider. It's actually more agile because of the rear steering.
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: So I actually found the Hummer in some instances was
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: easier to drive.
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: Steering. It can be such a gamage.
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: It is it's very cool. The crab walk is super fun.
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: It's totally a parlor trick, but there are times when
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: you can use it. But the rear steering is really
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: critical because of the size of the hummer. But for me,
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: like if you're in the open desert, the humbers perfect.
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: But like I took the Rivian up to the south
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: rim of the Grand Canyon and the trail that Bruce
• 39:26
  Speaker 1: and I needed to take, I mean there were inches
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: of clearance at times.
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: With the Rivis is the perfect side, I would agree.
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: It's first gen Tundra size, Yes, I would agree. And
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: if it's literally the perfect.
• 39:36
  Speaker 3: Size, you go and you're like, that is the pickup
• 39:38
  Speaker 3: truck that you want, Yeah, it's just old now.
• 39:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just literally it's literally the perfect size. I
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: don't remember the width on it specifically, but it was
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: if you look at the dimensions of a Rivian, it's
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: kind of like first gen Tundra, which arguably is like
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: the perfect truck size.
• 39:54
  Speaker 3: So it's a little bit smaller than in all of
• 39:57
  Speaker 3: the you know, the full size trucks now share basically
• 40:00
  Speaker 3: they share a cab. Yeah, so you're really just getting
• 40:03
  Speaker 3: into bed length is kind of a differentiating factor for sure.
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: So the performance on the dirt is actually really nice
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: because the Rivian has four different motors, it has each
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: wheel is controlled by a motor, It has a lot
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: of ground clearance, it has airbag suspension, it's actually fairly
• 40:21
  Speaker 1: long travel. We achieved nearly a five hundred RTI ramp score,
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: which is if you look at the list of stock vehicles,
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: it's in the top twenty five percent. Yeah, so it's
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: really it's not And imagine what they can do to
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: that platform. Like when you sit in underneath it, you
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: kind of realize like, oh, if they want to put
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: thirty seven's on this Yep, how it's designed, it's a
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: matter of where some components are weld in. And it's
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: really cool. Like what if there's a rapture version of
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: the Rivian, you know, like that the go Fast.
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: They'll come up with it.
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: I'm sure.
• 40:51
  Speaker 2: I mean they can't make enough right now because they're
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: selling too many, that's.
• 40:54
  Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, they are making a ton of them.
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: Well.
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: And speaking of tire size, so the one thing that
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: I don't like about the Rivian is the twenty inch wheels.
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: They are too big of a diameter. Even though the
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: tires are actually almost thirty four inches in diameter, which
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: is a big tire. The tire diameter to wheel diameter
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: ratio is not enough, so typically what we want for
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: off road performance is we want the tire diameter to
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: be twice the wheel diameter. So if you have a
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: seventeen inch wheel, you want a thirty four inch thirty
• 41:25
  Speaker 1: five inch tall tire. That's when you start to get
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: into optimal off road performance characteristics, flotation, deformation, all of
• 41:33
  Speaker 1: those things that we really look for off road. So
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: when you end up with a twenty inch wheel, you
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: should have a forty inch tall tire on there, and
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: it's nowhere near that diameter, so you can only air
• 41:43
  Speaker 1: down so much, which is really important in these evs
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: because they're very heavy. So the Hummer got that right.
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: They have an eighteen inch wheel and a thirty five
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: inch tall tire, so they're very close to that sweet spot,
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: so you end up with a lot more deformation. When
• 41:57
  Speaker 1: we did El Camino del Diablo, we actually chose not
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: to air down the whole time to gain some additional
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: range and efficiency, but we could have aired down. In hindsight,
• 42:06
  Speaker 1: I would have preferred to wear down the ride quality
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: would have improved a little bit. I would like to
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: see these larger diameter tires because the Achilles heel of
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: Eve's off road. And this is where everybody listening needs
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: to hear this because it is a real problem is
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: ledges and large rocks. So people talk about the torque
• 42:27
  Speaker 1: of an EV motor, right, the Hummer says it at
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: eleven thousand foot pounds of torque, which is it's a
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: calculation of the torque of the motor and the gearing
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: and everything else like that.
• 42:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I wonder if you did the same thing. I'm like,
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: it's still huge like a diesel truck. It's actually through
• 42:42
  Speaker 3: the transmission.
• 42:43
  Speaker 1: It doesn't make that the Hummer torque number look all
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: that impressive when you compare the two. It has a
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: lot of torque. Yeah, but it doesn't. And they say, oh,
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: develops it from zero. It does not develop it from
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: zero one. That's correct. So getting from zero to one. Now,
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: think about how we normally climb a ledge in Moab
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: or a large rock with an internal combustion vehicle. If
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: we have a clutch, we're modulating the clutch a little bit.
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: We're forcing that front tire to start to deform and
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: press into the rock so it can climb up it.
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: If we have an automatic transmission, we're left foot breaking.
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: We're forcing that tire face into the rock or into
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: the ledge so that it can start to climb straight
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: up it. And the rear tires are pushing the tire
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: face into it, and it's all allowing it to climb
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: up very slowly and controlled over the ledge. And Evie
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: cannot do that. It doesn't work. Anybody who tells you
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: otherwise hasn't driven one. It doesn't work. If you push
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: the tire up against it, if it's a ledge or
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: a large rock, it will go to wat wide open
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: throttle and it will not work. The car like the
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: rear tire might start to spin a little bit or
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: it's a break traction in the rear, but it will
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: not climb that ledge or that rock.
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: It won't do it.
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: So the only way you can get up and over
• 43:57
  Speaker 1: the rock is you got to kind of bounce it.
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: How you are bouncing a nine ten eighty five hundred
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: pound ev up against a rock face and something's going
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: to break. The cvs are going to break, the tirod
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: ends are going to break, the hummer and the Riviana
• 44:15
  Speaker 1: both experienced tirod end issues and rack issues because you
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: cannot slowly climb the ledge or the rock like we
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: would with something with an automatic or something with a clutch.
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: It doesn't work, so you got to bounce it. And
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: when you bounce it.
• 44:31
  Speaker 3: Like the addition of like a like a low range
• 44:34
  Speaker 3: or something would affect that.
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: What my thought was, I'm going to put this out
• 44:38
  Speaker 1: there free to the world. I think I've got The
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: solution is that they need to incorporate a torque converter,
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: and the torqu converter only has to be open unlocked
• 44:48
  Speaker 1: for those situations where you say, like you press rock
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: crawl mode, it opens up the torque converter and it
• 44:54
  Speaker 1: allows the electric motor to spin up so that it
• 44:57
  Speaker 1: can generate power and then help you get up.
• 45:00
  Speaker 3: A certain amount of clutch slipping in a differential difference exactly.
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: Just allow for a little bit of slipping, and it
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: can be in a torque converter, or it could be
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: in a clutch pack that had a lot of durability
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: to it, and then it can get locked back up
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: again as soon as you start moving. But in these
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: rock crawl modes or when you're in rock crawling situations,
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: the evs do not work as well as internal combustion,
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: and it's actually a bit of a liability. It's the
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: same with the Hummer. The Hummer is slightly better at
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: it than the Rivian because the Hummer has a front
• 45:30
  Speaker 1: differential lock interesting and then it has a rear virtual
• 45:33
  Speaker 1: locker which says to the vehicle turn the two rear
• 45:36
  Speaker 1: motors at the same time, whereas the Rivian is trying
• 45:40
  Speaker 1: to be clever and it's trying to figure out, like
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: how much can I send here? The Rivian needs in
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: rock crawl mode at low speeds, it needs to give
• 45:49
  Speaker 1: power to all of the motors to help it kind
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: of climb up and over and the other thing. The
• 45:53
  Speaker 1: other advantage the Hummer has is it has one huge
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: motor in the front yea, so it makes more power
• 45:59
  Speaker 1: when it's getting going. And then they've also tuned it,
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: you know, the Hummer engineers know that this is a problem,
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: so they try to give it maximum current to help
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: it get up and over the obstacles. So the Hummer
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: does work better.
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: We're John one on a lot of these things.
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So that's something that people need to be aware
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: of is that ledges and rocks. I think the other
• 46:18
  Speaker 1: thing too is EV And this might be why a
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: lot of people are frustrated with EV's. They're just not approachable,
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: Like they're you got to spend one hundred and something
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: thousand dollars to get one? Yeah, and then think about
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: like the small family that wants to get an EV
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: and they want to buy one used, so they buy
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: a seven or an eight year old EV. What's the
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: big surprise they're going to have very very soon batteries,
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: battery pack and a battery pack.
• 46:44
  Speaker 3: A lot of these battery packs from my research, I
• 46:46
  Speaker 3: mean they're talking five hundred thousand miles, six hundred thousand miles.
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: I would hope so, But the warranties are only like
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: eight years some ten years. Yeah.
• 46:55
  Speaker 3: I mean, you know, a modern internal combustion engine has
• 46:58
  Speaker 3: no problems going five thousand miles.
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: They regularly do. But you know, at what point.
• 47:03
  Speaker 3: Do you exceed the longevity of so many other components.
• 47:08
  Speaker 3: I think there's a lot of hyper focus on the battery.
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: Maybe it's not an issue.
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: When I looked at it, it made me think, like
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: what about, like right now, if you were to buy
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: a ten year old Tacoma. Yeah, you've got a vehicle
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: that's going to give you probably if you wanted another
• 47:22
  Speaker 1: twenty years of service. Oh yeah, for sure. And there
• 47:24
  Speaker 1: are Erector sets right, So I think the Eve, like
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: you said, the first person that comes out with a
• 47:30
  Speaker 1: low cost accessible.
• 47:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and it'll be it'll be Honda. Well, I mean
• 47:34
  Speaker 3: and already is kind of Handai Kia that kind of thing.
• 47:36
  Speaker 3: I think I thinks'll do well with that. As we
• 47:38
  Speaker 3: see the supply chain mature. Yeah, you know, I mean
• 47:42
  Speaker 3: evs have also become kind of had this this big
• 47:45
  Speaker 3: moment during the pandemic when supply chains are just messed
• 47:50
  Speaker 3: up in general for everybody. Sure, you know, so they
• 47:52
  Speaker 3: can't they can't produce enough cars. I mean, what was
• 47:55
  Speaker 3: it for they cancel off one fifties for They couldn't
• 47:58
  Speaker 3: for a little bit because they couldn't get the bad.
• 48:00
  Speaker 2: To put on the front. You know. It just kind
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: of shows.
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: I think they sold out twenty twenty three model year
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: on the Lightning Yeah, just like.
• 48:07
  Speaker 2: They're just sold hours not taking orders. Yeah, they're just sold.
• 48:11
  Speaker 3: There's a lot of people out there that want them.
• 48:13
  Speaker 3: You know, for us, we want electric cars because we
• 48:16
  Speaker 3: are devoted greyhound parents. And we live in Arizona, which
• 48:20
  Speaker 3: means half of the year it's it's pretty warm. Not
• 48:24
  Speaker 3: as warm as it is in Phoenix for us here
• 48:26
  Speaker 3: in Prescott, but it is warm.
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: It's warm.
• 48:28
  Speaker 3: You can't leave a pet inside a vehicle, I mean
• 48:31
  Speaker 3: even at sixty degrees.
• 48:32
  Speaker 2: It's bad news.
• 48:33
  Speaker 3: Bears have a very sensitive little Yeah sure, these pet modes.
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's super cool that all these things have. It's crazy.
• 48:41
  Speaker 3: You know, you want to go into the shops, or
• 48:43
  Speaker 3: you want to like, you know, go to dinner, or
• 48:44
  Speaker 3: you want to do whatever, boo, press a button.
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: It's climate controlled. You know.
• 48:47
  Speaker 3: A friend of mine was sleeping in the R one
• 48:50
  Speaker 3: st at Rebel. She used ten miles of range to
• 48:56
  Speaker 3: run the air conditioning all night. She just slept in
• 48:59
  Speaker 3: the back of the R one.
• 49:00
  Speaker 2: Yep, that's nothing.
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: It's nothing.
• 49:02
  Speaker 3: I had ac in the earth Roamer, but I'm literally
• 49:04
  Speaker 3: having to idle the engine when it's one hundred and
• 49:06
  Speaker 3: five degrees all day.
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: Everything's hot.
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: It's only eighty degrees at night or something where she's
• 49:11
  Speaker 3: just next to me.
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: And the other thing that's super cool that the Rivian
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: has is camp mode.
• 49:16
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, So that's what she was in.
• 49:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So when you are sleeping in the r n
• 49:20
  Speaker 1: S or when you have like a small roof tan
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: on the back of an R one T like I
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: had it configured, you just push a button and it
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: because it's air four corner air suspension, it levels the car.
• 49:30
  Speaker 1: So like you get into this uneven camp site and
• 49:33
  Speaker 1: you just push the button in it. I mean, it
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: has a huge amount of travel, so I'm sure that
• 49:37
  Speaker 1: it would level even a very awkward angle of pretty impressive.
• 49:42
  Speaker 3: I think that it's just the future of evs and
• 49:46
  Speaker 3: the things that you're able to then do with them.
• 49:49
  Speaker 3: You know, a lot of evs to support the weight,
• 49:51
  Speaker 3: they have air suspension, so they're they're able to do
• 49:54
  Speaker 3: certain things. I think the Ribbane's actually hydraulic, right.
• 49:56
  Speaker 2: It's air. Is it air?
• 49:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's air. Maybe it's air over hydraulic. But you
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: hear the pump running, okay, air pump. Yeah, and then
• 50:02
  Speaker 1: it has a built in air compressor.
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 50:04
  Speaker 3: From a guy that works in the automotive aftermarket, I'm
• 50:07
  Speaker 3: I'm really interested. You know, you're starting to see on
• 50:11
  Speaker 3: internal combustion side and on EV side, these kind of
• 50:14
  Speaker 3: more specifically optioned modified.
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: Vehicles coming straight from the factory.
• 50:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Like I know with the Riving, you can you know,
• 50:22
  Speaker 3: you can air up your tires, it'll it'll stop at
• 50:24
  Speaker 3: whatever PSI you want.
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: I think the Defender does that too.
• 50:28
  Speaker 1: It's super clever, it works great, and the kit's really
• 50:31
  Speaker 1: nice too. Like everything on the Rivian, like all these
• 50:33
  Speaker 1: touch points are like they thought about it. So it's
• 50:36
  Speaker 1: not the like super cheap hose. It's like our heavy
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: duty hose with really good connectors.
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: And yeah, so I think it's rythan they know their market.
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, if I was to put my genie
• 50:47
  Speaker 3: hat on, I would have to think that you know
• 50:49
  Speaker 3: that Riving. They're highly intelligent people and they're going to
• 50:52
  Speaker 3: look at the market and they're going to say, well,
• 50:54
  Speaker 3: for it's going to do an F one fifty and
• 50:56
  Speaker 3: for it's probably going to stick to their plan of
• 50:59
  Speaker 3: make a pickup truck that's electric and you're going to
• 51:01
  Speaker 3: have X amount of levels and they're going to be
• 51:04
  Speaker 3: going after fleet sales and whatever or I think Rivian
• 51:07
  Speaker 3: went after I don't know, creatives, people that are maybe
• 51:11
  Speaker 3: a little bit more aesthetically just a more premium customer.
• 51:15
  Speaker 2: And I think that they nailed it head on.
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: Or somebody who wants to go fly fishing or somebody
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: who wants to it's perfect.
• 51:21
  Speaker 3: I wouldn't say that it's like an overly luxurious interior
• 51:25
  Speaker 3: on it. It's perfect for me, but it's perfect.
• 51:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 51:29
  Speaker 3: I do wish that there was a few more buttons. Yeah,
• 51:33
  Speaker 3: I know that's maybe.
• 51:34
  Speaker 2: That's so sold. That's my gripe.
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: It's like it's just the most simple, elegant.
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: I'm wrong, but I don't. I don't remember like a
• 51:41
  Speaker 2: volume knob.
• 51:42
  Speaker 1: There's not no volume knob. There is a steering wheel though, Yeah,
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: you roll it on the steering wheel and it goes
• 51:47
  Speaker 1: up and down. The passenger just does it on the touchscreen,
• 51:50
  Speaker 1: which did take me a little while to figure out.
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: So there.
• 51:53
  Speaker 1: The The UI on the Rivian does take a little
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: bit of getting used to. And no car play and
• 52:00
  Speaker 1: auto exactly, so we have to bash on the Rivian
• 52:02
  Speaker 1: a little bit to be fair to the Hummer thing
• 52:04
  Speaker 1: no car play, which means no gaya, no on ex
• 52:07
  Speaker 1: is running.
• 52:08
  Speaker 3: It's just kind of like like, I don't they got
• 52:10
  Speaker 3: a problem with their system, but I'm just like.
• 52:12
  Speaker 1: You gotta have car play because it's just like.
• 52:14
  Speaker 3: You know your phone is like an extension of you,
• 52:17
  Speaker 3: and if you can't, I don't know. I mean like
• 52:18
  Speaker 3: it's it's one of the things that you don't necessarily need.
• 52:21
  Speaker 1: I think that, but I use it all the time.
• 52:23
  Speaker 3: But it would be a it would be a ding
• 52:26
  Speaker 3: against the Rivian for me, a pretty big one.
• 52:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think the lack of car play. There are
• 52:32
  Speaker 1: two buttons. There's a hazard's button and there's the SOS
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: button that does like a on star kind of yeah call.
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: And also like again, to be fair, we have to
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: talk about the things on the Rivian on The one
• 52:43
  Speaker 1: thing on the Rivian that's absolutely hilarious is the charge door.
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: It's the most unnecessarily complex. It's like it's like when
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: the Russians needed to write in space, they just used
• 52:52
  Speaker 1: a pencil and we spent we spent billions of dollars
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: or millions of dollars to develop on a zero gravity
• 52:59
  Speaker 1: pen It's the most unnecessarily complex charge floor. Yes, it
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: like like it like goes out and open. But here's
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: the problem is the touch sensitive trigger for it is
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: on the fender flare, which means if you have any
• 53:12
  Speaker 1: trail damage, you aren't going to get your door open,
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: and then and then when mud and other things hit it,
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: Like so I'm going down this muddy trail and this
• 53:21
  Speaker 1: the mud splatters across the fender flare and here comes
• 53:24
  Speaker 1: open the charge door.
• 53:26
  Speaker 2: And then and then you go.
• 53:27
  Speaker 1: Through a car wash charge door charge or is open.
• 53:31
  Speaker 1: Now if you go into if you go into car
• 53:34
  Speaker 1: wash mode, won't it won't do that. It won't do that.
• 53:37
  Speaker 1: And I also like, I'm like, I'm going to end
• 53:39
  Speaker 1: up on YouTube because of this car trying to go
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: through a car button. Well, put a button inside it,
• 53:44
  Speaker 1: but doesn't. It does have like the car wash mode,
• 53:46
  Speaker 1: but it didn't exactly work, Like I activated it and
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: then the thing went back into park and you know,
• 53:51
  Speaker 1: the rollers are trying to get me, and it's like
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: the car's bouncing inside the car wash and I'm like,
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: I'm going to end up dead.
• 53:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, You're gonna drown this.
• 54:02
  Speaker 1: I was just convinced that I was gonna end up
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: on the nightly news of like this car sideways in
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: the aerody.
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: You're gonna end up on Info Wars Electric car tries
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: to kill man.
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So, like the the charge door is so unnecessarily complex.
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: Just put a hinge on it push it in and
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: it pops open and it works. The complexity what about ice, Like, Yeah,
• 54:23
  Speaker 1: that's what I think.
• 54:24
  Speaker 2: I'm from the suburbs of Chicago and we'd remember these
• 54:27
  Speaker 2: ice storms as a kid, where like you go outside
• 54:30
  Speaker 2: and you have like a quarter inch of ice on
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: you car, Like, how is that gonna.
• 54:34
  Speaker 1: Even the windows with the mud they were like starting
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: to stop and go and up and down. And then
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: the center console instead of just having like the most
• 54:43
  Speaker 1: simple mechanical latch, it's got like a button that you
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: push that makes a suggestion to the car that maybe
• 54:50
  Speaker 1: you open the center console or maybe you don't. I
• 54:52
  Speaker 1: can't figure out what you have to do to make
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: it work. Yeah, other than when I'm driving along, it works.
• 54:58
  Speaker 1: It's gadgety. It's gadget and I think avoids Some people
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: like that, but I think for the most part, you
• 55:03
  Speaker 1: got to avoid them for real use scenarios.
• 55:05
  Speaker 2: I mean, you can't buy any of these cars. They're
• 55:08
  Speaker 2: like they're hard to well.
• 55:08
  Speaker 1: I tried to buy one and I couldn't get one.
• 55:10
  Speaker 3: My buddy, my buddy Kevin, put an order in I
• 55:13
  Speaker 3: want to say November, and I think he's looking at
• 55:16
  Speaker 3: like end of next year November of twenty twenty.
• 55:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, sorry, R one s. I'm like, I'm sold.
• 55:22
  Speaker 3: I'd love one, but you pretty much have to buy
• 55:25
  Speaker 3: one used from somebody that's flipping it. And you know
• 55:28
  Speaker 3: you're looking twenty twenty five over sticker, which sounds bad,
• 55:33
  Speaker 3: but I will tell you, in the premium car space
• 55:35
  Speaker 3: right now and now this is waning, that is not unusual.
• 55:38
  Speaker 3: If you want to if you want a new g Wagon,
• 55:41
  Speaker 3: you want a G sixty three. I've seen two hundred oversticker. Yeah,
• 55:45
  Speaker 3: like that was early in the pandemic right now, fifty
• 55:48
  Speaker 3: to one hundred. But it's not even talk Porsches. That's crazy.
• 55:52
  Speaker 3: This is normal. It's a weird way of kind of
• 55:54
  Speaker 3: getting around it. At least they're not overcharging people. How
• 55:58
  Speaker 3: did it work for the Hummer thing? Like they're selling
• 56:02
  Speaker 3: them through GM GMC dealerships, and it was kind of
• 56:06
  Speaker 3: separate from the dealer in a way, wasn't it, because
• 56:09
  Speaker 3: they were kind of.
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: Yep, so they did online ordering, which this is I mean,
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: anybody that's in the car dealership business should be very
• 56:18
  Speaker 1: concerned about their future because.
• 56:20
  Speaker 3: You fifty percent more reliable if there's fifty percent as
• 56:23
  Speaker 3: many problems. The dealer model either runs on just huge
• 56:27
  Speaker 3: volumes or it runs on service.
• 56:29
  Speaker 2: That's right. What happens when your car is more reliable
• 56:31
  Speaker 2: on it doesn't need service.
• 56:33
  Speaker 1: It doesn't need an oil change, there's no reason to
• 56:35
  Speaker 1: come in.
• 56:36
  Speaker 3: How are they going to upsell little old ladies on
• 56:38
  Speaker 3: blinker fluid? You know, one of the stereotypes of millennials.
• 56:42
  Speaker 3: We don't like to talk on the phone. We just
• 56:44
  Speaker 3: want stuff kind of automated. We don't want to have
• 56:46
  Speaker 3: to deal with it.
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: And that's the Rivian. You go onto the Rivian, you
• 56:49
  Speaker 1: go onto the Riva WEBSITEESLA. That's you book your car
• 56:53
  Speaker 1: and when it's done, you can either go to the
• 56:55
  Speaker 1: service center and have a bespoke experience delivery experience, or
• 56:59
  Speaker 1: they can bring it to you on a flatbed and
• 57:01
  Speaker 1: they unloaded in your driveway, they help you set up
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: the charger.
• 57:04
  Speaker 3: I mean, it is what is the car, and you're done,
• 57:06
  Speaker 3: like the future totally, you know, at least at least
• 57:10
  Speaker 3: of new car stuff. And I'm you know, there's there's
• 57:12
  Speaker 3: others that are doing the same thing, like Lucid.
• 57:16
  Speaker 2: Lucid cars are crazy.
• 57:18
  Speaker 3: I've seen those that during Car Week and Monterey and
• 57:21
  Speaker 3: they had them at the Velocity Invitational ran over the weekend.
• 57:26
  Speaker 3: It's the pace car for like f one cars going
• 57:28
  Speaker 3: around Laguna Seca and it's those things don't move slow,
• 57:31
  Speaker 3: that thing, that thing boogies.
• 57:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's the same thing. Order the line shows
• 57:35
  Speaker 2: up to your door.
• 57:36
  Speaker 3: Like, I just don't think people want to play the
• 57:38
  Speaker 3: game anymore, I know, And I.
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: Know it's going to be interesting to see how that
• 57:41
  Speaker 1: all works. And if you look at at Lightnings are
• 57:44
  Speaker 1: sold out. They're all ordered pre order.
• 57:46
  Speaker 3: And didn't afford to a similar thing where you you know,
• 57:48
  Speaker 3: you ordered online and we'll get delivered through the dealer,
• 57:51
  Speaker 3: but the price is already negotiated, you know. I know
• 57:53
  Speaker 3: a lot of these dealers had to do what they
• 57:55
  Speaker 3: had to do to survive.
• 57:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just not going to be that model anymore.
• 57:58
  Speaker 2: It's not going to work.
• 57:59
  Speaker 3: I think electric cars are leading in a lot of ways. Yeah,
• 58:02
  Speaker 3: And I'm just so excited. I'm excited for the future
• 58:06
  Speaker 3: of EV's. You know, there's been a lot of rumors
• 58:08
  Speaker 3: going around in the future of like the ram HD platform, yep,
• 58:14
  Speaker 3: and there's been grumbling. It's about them being the first
• 58:16
  Speaker 3: to come to market with solid state batteries. Right now,
• 58:19
  Speaker 3: batteries are all individual cells, you know, riveted or spot
• 58:22
  Speaker 3: welded or or however they're attaching them together. Solid state
• 58:25
  Speaker 3: batteries is essentially one big thing, and there's been these
• 58:28
  Speaker 3: rumors of it. It's gonna be diesel generator range extender.
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: I be amazing. You get that.
• 58:33
  Speaker 3: You get the diesel dude that can go wherever he wants.
• 58:36
  Speaker 3: He's got a ten gallon tank or twenty gallon tank
• 58:39
  Speaker 3: run in this thing.
• 58:40
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 58:40
  Speaker 3: Geep has just announced their new smaller sub Wrangler that
• 58:44
  Speaker 3: will be an EV. I'm so excited for that because
• 58:47
  Speaker 3: it's like the right size. It's like, it looks like
• 58:48
  Speaker 3: it's Cherokee sized, YEP XJ sized. Interesting to see how
• 58:53
  Speaker 3: they solve them lock ledge problem. Yeah, how Jeep solves it.
• 58:57
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 58:57
  Speaker 3: I wonder if it is through some kind of transmission
• 58:59
  Speaker 3: like Portie on the Tychon actually has a two speed
• 59:02
  Speaker 3: transmission on the rear axle. Obviously higher speeds all wheel
• 59:06
  Speaker 3: drive doesn't necessarily have as much of a benefit. Sure,
• 59:08
  Speaker 3: so that front motor will kind of I don't know
• 59:11
  Speaker 3: how it works if the ones driving the other.
• 59:12
  Speaker 2: But also look at that.
• 59:13
  Speaker 1: So the if you wanted to buy something that was
• 59:17
  Speaker 1: electric that you didn't have to worry about range, you
• 59:19
  Speaker 1: can do that. You can go buy a Jeep Wrangler
• 59:22
  Speaker 1: four by eye a Rubicon. The thing can go on
• 59:25
  Speaker 1: ev only range when you're running around town.
• 59:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, like twenty or thirty miles. And it's more than
• 59:31
  Speaker 3: best selling electrified vehicle in the United States right now.
• 59:34
  Speaker 1: Because it's awesome. For by E, it's awesome. And I
• 59:37
  Speaker 1: had the Grand Cherokee for by E. I absolutely enjoyed it.
• 59:41
  Speaker 1: I was able to drive from home to work and
• 59:43
  Speaker 1: plug in here at the office.
• 59:45
  Speaker 2: I used no fuel.
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: But then if I wanted to go on a road trip,
• 59:49
  Speaker 1: I had a six hundred mile range.
• 59:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That stuff.
• 59:52
  Speaker 3: I'm super interested right now in that that the electrified
• 59:56
  Speaker 3: vehicles and maybe where we are for the you know
• 59:58
  Speaker 3: a lot of the guys that list into this podcast
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 3: is electrified.
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 2: Is here. I have to say, I'm like super tempted
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 2: by a four by e. I just know that cool vehicle.
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 2: We're probably what are we twenty nineteen.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 3: They refresh the Wrangler every five years, I mean going
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 3: back to time at Mortium, that's been their their product cycle.
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 3: So I'm kind of like, I'm curious to see what
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 3: comes next, but we are undoubtedly looking at in the
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 3: next two to three years a totally electric.
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 2: Wrangler YEP, which I can't wait to see.
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 3: How can you imagine just having the top down and
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 3: a Wrangler with half doors in Yellowstone, driving through, seeing
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 3: the animals and there's no noise. I mean, it's perfect
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 3: moab with no like hot because you know, like you
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 3: have the top off.
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 2: And you feel that the heat of the engine and stuff. Like.
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 3: I know I'm being pedantic right now, but to have that, EV,
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 3: the different level of engagement that you would have, I love.
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 2: I'm like, I'm super into it.
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 1: So there we go, guys, we have just given you
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 1: the mat and got brain dump on EV's the four
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 1: f one fifty Lightning not really something you want to
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 1: take off road. The Hummer is the most off road
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 1: capable and technical terrain, and the Rivian in my mind,
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: is the best all rounder by a wide margin, and
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: so much so that I even tried to buy the
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 1: test vehicle.
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 2: It was so close.
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 3: If I could go get a Rivian right now, like
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 3: an R one s perfectly, I'd have one done.
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 2: Deal. Yeah, there you go.
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 1: All right, We thank you all for listening, and we'll
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 1: talk to you next time.