Latest / BBQ Therapy / Chef Ray Sheehan | New name, Same Game !!

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Chef Ray Sheehan | New name, Same Game !! · BBQ Therapy

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You will fail, dust yourself off and get back up and continue to
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move forward. That's probably the hardest one,
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especially being a small business owner and sauce maker
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that some days you're the bird and some days you're the statue.
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Sometimes you get an order from somebody and it's like the
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you're like so happy. Then another day could be you
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won an award and then all of a sudden the phone's not ringing
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and you're doing a tasting somewhere and people are just
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walking by you instead of trying it.
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So it really you just got to have a stiff upper lip and you
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got to just. If you like baseball, Joe Torre,
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manager of the Yankees, said it best.
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Never get too high and never get too low.
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Just stay right in the middle and keep a smile.
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Just keep on moving and just keep it and that's all you can
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do. Mango ham BBQ Ham BBQ Ham BBQ
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Mango Ham BBQ BBQ. Ever notice how the sound of
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sizzling meat and the smell of smoke can silence the noise of
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the world? Now that's BBQ therapy.
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If the fire moves you like, subscribe, share and help spread
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the message because growth, like good BBQ, takes time and
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patience. Welcome to your therapy session.
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Welcome to the BBQ Therapy podcast.
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My name is Tavis Bryant and today I've got Chef Ray Sheehan,
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Hitmaster, KCBS judge, BBQ product maker and author.
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But here's the thing, Ray's story isn't about chasing
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trophies, it's about chasing integrity.
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From bottling clean label BBQ products to writing books that
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capture the soul of BBQ, he's built something to laugh that
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lasts. Welcome to the show.
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I got one rule, make yourself at home.
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I have no sponsors currently so you can speak freely.
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Thank you, Tavis. Thank you for having me.
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I'm gonna start off with an off the wall question.
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Have you been a chef, a judge, pitmaster and writer?
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But if you wasn't in food, what career do you think you'd be
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chasing right now? Oh man, if I wasn't in food,
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that's all I've ever dreamed about was being in food my whole
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life. I'll be a photographer because
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if I'm not creating something beautiful, I'd like to be
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capturing it. That's an excellent answer.
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All right, we're going to take it back.
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Do you remember the very first dish that you made where people
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stopped and said, wait, you made this?
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I think it was probably when I was in my early teens and I was
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aspiring to go to culinary school and I made some off the
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wall pasta dish that took, I don't know, it took me forever
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to make. But when it was done, everybody
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was like thrilled and Oh my God, you can't believe you made this.
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And it was that was probably like the first thing.
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But I was always tinkering and trying to learn from my mom, my
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grandma, my grandfather, and trying to learn from them is I
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like come from a line of like my grandfather was a chef.
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He had a farm in Puerto Rico, so I would spend the summers there.
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So my first hint of BBQ was him cooking over like live fire and
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making his little sauces to flavor the meats and vegetables.
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And I think that was what really started me on that path.
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But then I got away from it and I got into more of the culinary
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arts and then I swung back around eventually and got just
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enamored by it. Just the smells of the wood
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burning, the meats cooking and just made it my life's purpose
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roundabout. Way you share stories about your
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grandfather's farm before, what's 1 lesson or memory from
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there that people don't know? And how does it still show up in
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the way you cook today? I would say to never like to not
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cut corners. Like he did things the old
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fashioned way and he tried to do things, which was like a clean
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way to do it. Like he slaughtered his own
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pigs. He prepared all his own foods.
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He cooked the stuff from the farm, whether it was chicken,
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pork, I mean they had banana trees, mango trees.
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Like he used everything. Years later, when it came time
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for me to create products that I wanted to not cut corners and
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just have integrity with the ingredients that I was using.
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You see a lot of products and there's arguments either way for
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using certain ingredients and for not using them.
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Throughout my career, I got to work at a natural food store and
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I learned a lot about clean ingredients.
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I wanted to create products that were free of high fructose corn
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syrup, free of additives, colors, dyes.
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My son was born premature. He was born at 26 1/2 weeks and
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we tried to give him as many healthful foods, organic when it
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made sense or foods without dyes because we found out he was
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allergic to them. Coming to create products.
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I want it again, how it goes down to integrity of the
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ingredients. Like my sauces have gone up
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against some of the best in the world in some of the biggest
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sauce contests when I had the BBQ Buddha brand.
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Now it's the Chef Ray Sheehan brand of sauces and seasonings,
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but we're still winning awards. Sauce King, NYC Grand Champion,
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American Royal Best Sauce on the planet, 2nd place.
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And those are natural ingredients.
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There's no, there's no MSG, there's no whether you're for it
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or against it. It's just cleaner products and
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stuff that you'd find probably in your cabinet and you wouldn't
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have to go out of your way to make it.
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But it's just having that integrity with the ingredients.
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It's easy to cook corners and try to make sure, but you
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hurting people in the long run versus doing something that you
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can respect and put your name behind, not trying to make a
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quick book. So that's definitely a good
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thing if. You're in the sauce business.
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You're definitely not trying to make a quick buck.
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You got to sell a lot of sauce to make money.
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I'll tell you right now, that's something I learned.
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You really got it. You have to have your brand has
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to be all-encompassing. You see some of the best people
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that are doing it, and they're not just selling sauce, they're
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doing classes, they're teaching, they're contributing to the
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culture of barbecue, and that's what I try to do as well.
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That's excellent. When you started cooking, did
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you went to culinary school and then you worked your way into
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grilling? I did.
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I worked in a lot of restaurants.
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I went to a school which was a Community College for food
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service management, and then I went to a culinary school to
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study culinary arts and pastry. So when I came out of there, I
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worked on, I've had every position from dishwasher up to
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chef to food service director. I was a Baker for a long time
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and I've spent a lot. My career is kind of long, so I
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spent a good amount of time in each position, but I really
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didn't swing back around into grilling per SE.
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Like when I worked in restaurants.
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A lot of times they put me on the grill, but that's not the
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same type. That's a totally different.
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That's no BBQ therapy. When you have 20 orders, 10
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medium, 5 mid, rare, two well done, that's not BBQ therapy.
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My BBQ therapy came later. I was at this time, I was the
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food service director of a natural food store.
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My I kept wanting to get a smoker and I kept saying I don't
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have enough time. I don't have time to, I'm going
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to be out there all day. I don't know what I'm doing.
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And my wife was like, she ended up getting me a book and she's
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just read about it. Just see where you go with it.
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Don't like why are you're putting up a wall before you
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even try? And then I was like, because I
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always had like a charcoal grill that I'd be fooling around with
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or like something like that, but not to the level that when I
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make food or cater parties or I wanted to do the best that I
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could possibly do for the client and make the most beautiful,
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delicious food. I wanted to learn how to do that
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with barbecue. And it was frustrating to start
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out and be like, I'm starting all the way at the bottom again.
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But it was fun too. That was my escape from working
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this job that I was like at this point I was miserable at it.
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I like the people, I like helping the customers, but there
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were certain political aspects about it that I just was not
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fond of and like workplace political, not like political,
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but I just wanted to. So it ended up becoming a
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therapy for me because it was my like time away, like just peace
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and quiet. Just trying to do this smoker,
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trying to and my wife actually got me a smoker for my birthday
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and then and it was an electric smoker.
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I only really had to worry about the time and what temperature it
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was on. I didn't have to worry about
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controlling the fire. And as I was doing that, I
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started creating sauces and seasonings to flavor the food.
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And then I was like, oh boy, I really like this.
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This is great. It was coming out dark and black
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and I was like, I didn't know what I was doing, but the the
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sauces were great. So over time and trial and
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error, I started getting better at it and like you, I started
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taking classes and I started buying books and I was like I'm
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I want to be a student of this type of cuisine and I want to
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learn from the best. One thing I worked for a great
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chef one time and he told me always work for the best and
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you'll always learn. You always want to be learning.
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So when it came time to learn about BBQ, I really wanted to
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learn from the best. So I took a master competition
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class with Tuffy Stone, his cool smoked BBQ class.
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I took a class with Bob Trudnac. He does classes all around the
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world with Big MO Que Song. I wanted to learn and really you
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learn. It's trial by fire.
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It's you doing it is really the where you're really gonna.
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But I tell you what, those classes do help save you some
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steps and some real big you're gonna buy that brisket.
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I know a lot of people that are afraid to go buy a brisket
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because they're like, I don't want to ruin it.
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And I'm like, if you don't try, then you'll never be able to do
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it. Everyone's BBQ journey is
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different and, and it and everyone's coming at it from a
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different angle, from a different place.
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My why is different from your why and the next person's why do
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you do it. And my goal was to create
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terrific BBQ that that people would enjoy, that I would enjoy
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it, and that I would enjoy create the time that it took to
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create it without cutting the corner.
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I read as many of the books as I could and I took the classes,
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but the main thing was just getting out there and doing.
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It, the pellet group pretty much saved my BBQ career because it
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it allowed me to enjoy barbecue and what it does.
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But it's easy to learn and I recommend it for anybody getting
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into it because you can sit it and just focus on what you're
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doing in the kitchen at the moment until you get better.
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And I'm all for it. Oh yeah, it's the gateway.
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You know how else? If you're coming from zero and
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you need you want to learn, it gets you started.
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And you know what? It gets the job done.
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It really I've tried. I've had all different kinds of
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smokers at this point and like one of I we all have our
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favorites, but there's different uses for the different cookers.
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You know, there's a time and a place for a 250 gallon tow
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behind and there's a place for in in my mind, there's a place
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for a Big Green Egg and and a pellet grill.
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It just really depends on your situation.
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There's a lot of people I see at the campgrounds that have either
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a live fire, such a setup, or a pellet grill, just because it's
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easy. Because when you go to the
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campsite you're like, yeah, I just want to throw the pellets
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in, press a button and I'm cooking.
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But so it really just depends on what your goal is.
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If you are the type that likes to just throw a stick on every
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45 minutes and that's cool too. And I don't like the people that
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try to down people based on what grill they use as long as they
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out there barbecuing. That's that's the point.
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It's not about what you use. It's you out there enjoying the
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elements and just cooking meat and forgetting about everything.
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So listen, BBQ is community. BBQ brings people together.
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So why would you want to downplay somebody who, no matter
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what kind of cooker they're using, because the type of food
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BBQ is, it's meant to gather in good times and bad, brings
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communities together. So whatever you want to cook on
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a trash can, I don't care. Just let's just get some food
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and get together. Because never know that their
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food might be better than yours and you're cooking on, so they
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never know who exactly. Have you ever competed before?
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Absolutely. I started taking these classes
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and I was like, you know what, I'm going to try it.
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The only thing that I wish I would have done was do the
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backyard competitions first. I was just like, yes, sign me
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up. I'm like, wait a minute, oh,
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this is going to be a learning curve.
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But I mainly, I have to say I mainly did it.
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I am competitive, but I mainly started doing it to market my
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products. So I came out with these
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products in 2014, the line of BBQ Buddha sauces and
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seasonings. And to promote the products, I
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started sponsoring some teams and I got out there and I was
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doing some competitions. I did not do well in the
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beginning. Let me tell you, I didn't know
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what I mean. Look, I had no idea.
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I was like cleaning the chicken at the competition the night
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before. I was like, oh, it was bad.
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It was so bad. I was like, man, that's a lot of
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work. Then I start talking to some
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people and they're like, oh, you can trim your meats before you
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come. And I was like, oh, oh, I felt
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real stupid. But like I said, everybody, you
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got to start somewhere. And I never begrudge anyone for
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starting because that's the only way everyone started somewhere.
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But yeah, so then I started picking up and doing better and
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then we ended up finishing one of the competitions that was big
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in my area. It was in in Delaware, in the
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Delaware Seashore State Park. It was around Halloween, it's
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called the Bubecue. And the kids could come and
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trick or treat at the different sites.
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And it was one at the time it was one of the biggest KCBS
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competitions on the East Coast. And we got 2 calls.
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We finished 7th overall out of 60 something teams.
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And that was like, that was huge for us.
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So we were like, man, this is some tough teams too.
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Teams that go to the Jack, teams that go to the Royal.
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So it was like, at least we're on the right track.
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But over time I started doing smaller competitions that were
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more charity oriented because I found that I could market my
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products and donate to charities, even though a lot of
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the KCBS are for charity. It's just the cost has gotten so
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expensive by the time you get your meats and everything.
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And I'm not hardcore competitor like I, I'll judge, you know
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what I'm saying, But I don't need to put out a grand for the
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weekend to market. But there's teams that use my
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products currently that like I got a nice note.
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I got an order from someone and they in the order notes, it
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said, Hey, we used your Kansas City sauce and it helped us win
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the grand championship at this KCBS competition.
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And I was like, man, dude, that is like the best note that you
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could get in there because, you know, again, we're with the
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natural ingredients and then these guys are winning.
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But I do like a lot of smaller things, like I'll do the egg
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fest. Like we were the New Jersey Egg
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Fest champion last year, the People's Choice.
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And we did the kids queue. Don't get me started on the kids
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queue. I love promoting the kids queue.
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They're our future. My son was one of the writers
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for future of Queue magazine in it when it first came out.
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And the children are our future. There are legacy and barbecue
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and promoting them and giving them every opportunity and
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encouragement. I'm really grateful for the
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companies that reached out and donated prizes for the kids
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because these are like things that they're going to be like.
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I won this when I was whatever, 1213 years old, and that's what
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got me started in BBQ. If it's that little spark that
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we can offer the kids to get them cooking, that's that makes
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all the difference, then it doesn't matter if I won they we
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already won because we're promoting them.
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It teaches them a skill that they can keep mastering by the
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time they get as you start them young.
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By the time they get to the late teens they pretty much will be
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an expert if they just. Keep at it.
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I I told my son, I said you don't have to do this for a
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vocation, but you have to know how to sustain yourself.
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I'm not going to be here forever.
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So I thought for sure he would go into food, but I think he's
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going to be a rock star. He wants to be, I don't know,
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but at least he can cook a nice steak.
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He can make homemade pasta, he can make pizza, but he loves to
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grill. He's he grills all the time.
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I work with different companies. If they throw me a grill,
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sometimes I'll throw one to him or some kind of thing just to
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keep him engaged. That's.
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Excellent. All right, let's move over to
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Ray's Roadside Kitchen. Let's take it back.
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When did what made you decide to start a restaurant and what year
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did you start at the restaurant? The restaurant started in 22, so
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it had always been my dream is to open a restaurant, but the
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circumstances in which came about really came out of
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nowhere. Like I met up with someone who I
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was already doing business with and they were like, oh, I want
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to back you to do a restaurant. And, and it was, it was, I would
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just say we tried. We did the best we could in our
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community, but the community didn't ended up supporting it.
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It there was it was like homestyle southern food,
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southern fried chicken in in the time that we were there, we won
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best chili in the state. We topped top 30 bowls of chili.
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I think we were like somewhere in the middle, like 13th or
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something, but and then positive reviews from local restaurant
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critics. But it was like I said,
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handcrafted burgers, southern fried chicken, some really great
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sides and BBQ. BBQ was like the specials, but
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as we went on, it's because I'm known for BBQ.
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More and more people thought it was a BBQ restaurant and we're
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disappointed. So when we wanted to flip it and
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make it straight up BBQ, it didn't work out with the
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partners to everybody wasn't on board.
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So it was short lived in that sense.
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Even though we had rave reviews, it didn't work out for maybe
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less than two years. At that time I had my sauce
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business and I sold the trademark to the name BBQ Buddha
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to gentleman, a BBQ guy on Instagram, the BBQ Buddha, Chris
18:44
Sussman. So I sold the name to him and he
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was known as the BBQ Buddha. And I never claimed to be.
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I just was the guy that made the BBQ Buddha sauce I was.
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That was my thing. So I sold it to him and then I
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started making plans to rebrand and to just use my own name.
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When you come out with a product and you have to have your own
19:05
identity, your own name, there's so many names that are so close
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that you'd be surprised that if you try to get the trademark,
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you will get denied because it's even remotely close it.
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Even if the it's the way it sounds.
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If I wanted to make Sweet Baby J's BBQ sauce and my name was
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Jay, they wouldn't put that through 'cause it sounds like
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Sweet Baby Ray's, It's too close.
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Sweet Baby Jay's, Sweet Baby Ray's.
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There's gonna be confusion in the marketplace.
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Just crazy. Right.
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That's what the that's what the trademark attorney told me.
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So when it came time to have a new brand, I was thinking of all
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these different names, like a playoff, my name.
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Then I was like, you know what, I've been in the industry 25
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years. I'm just going to put my name,
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my likeness on there. Of course, the one on the
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bottle. I, I didn't realize I had that
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much less hair than I have now. When the guy did it, he's like,
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how's this look? And I'm like, where's the hair
20:03
man? I'm like, oh, I guess that's
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where we're at these days. But, but the guy that did it,
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Chris Doug Jolly with Red Iron Design, He's done a lot of work
20:13
for BBQ people in the industry and he's in Pensacola.
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He's done work for Big MO Caisson.
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He did our our artwork and created the labels.
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He's did a fantastic job. If anyone's looking for somebody
20:25
to do like labels for their products, Doug is amazing.
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Red iron design, a little plug there.
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Sorry, but I just had to let people know because a lot of
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people are looking for that kind of thing.
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But so trying to go through that whole process again and starting
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all over because that's basically what I did.
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Like here, I won all these awards for my Memphis Mop.
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That's the sauce that we were the most famous for with my BBQ
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Buddha brand. And that's the reason why I got
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the first book deal was because I gave the recipe for that sauce
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and all of our award-winning sauces.
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And so just starting all over. So you need a new look, a new,
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but that's why I try to keep the name like the Memphis Mop that
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people know. I kept that and the recipes are
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all the same. And we ended up getting back
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into most of the stores that we were in the beginning.
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At one point we were in I think about 100 stores locally and in
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the tri-state area. So New York, New Jersey,
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Delaware, Pennsylvania and then some strays couple in Texas, a
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couple in a couple other states, Michigan.
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But it's definitely a lot of work to get that going, to get
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the whole trademark thing and starting over.
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It's been a lot of doing. I do a lot of like demos at
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grill stores and grocery stores that I sell to.
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And once people get to try the foods, once they get to try the
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sauce, it's one step closer to them making a purchase.
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Since we talked about the sauces and rubs, when you start off
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creating your rubs, do you just freestyle it or do you have a
21:57
game plan when you going in to make a rub or a sauce?
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So I typically have a game plan. I would say I, I know I have an
22:06
idea of what I'm going for. And then I'm trying to find the
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ingredients that what's going to make it taste that way?
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What are your, what's your sweet, salty, sour, you know,
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hot? What's going to what's going to
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flip the switch for somebody? And I could go through like 20
22:25
revisions of a sauce and not be happy with it.
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And then just can it for a while.
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I was like, I got to put this away.
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It was a couple years ago, I entered a sauce in the Sauces of
22:35
Honor contest and it was a mustard sauce and we got 4th
22:39
place out of 126 sauces. And that sauce I've been working
22:43
on for a few years and then I just put it on the shelf.
22:48
I'm like, I'm not ready to put that out yet because in my area
22:52
I don't know how much of that I would sell.
22:54
It's a great sauce and I think in some areas it would go great,
22:58
but in the Northeast I think it's a lot more education and
23:01
you're a lot more trying to, it's like a it's, it would be
23:04
like me making a white, the Alabama white sauce.
23:06
Nobody's going to buy it up here.
23:07
People are like, that's mayonnaise, but they don't know
23:10
the sweet tanginess of it and how great it is.
23:12
So for me, it I, yeah, I do know I have an idea of what I'm going
23:17
for, but my thing has always been quality over quantity.
23:22
I only have 6 items in my line. I have two BBQ sauces, 2 rubs, a
23:27
hot sauce and a hot honey. But if I can have it any way
23:32
that I like, I would have probably two or three more BBQ
23:35
sauces and probably at least two more rubs.
23:39
But here's the thing, when you have a small brand, every
23:43
product that you create, you have to like.
23:47
When you do your sauces, the sauce has to go through the lab
23:50
and has to get it approved for bottling, and then they checked
23:54
the pH. It's a whole process and all
23:57
that process cost money. So that part cost money.
24:01
Then you need your nutritionals for the back of the bottle.
24:05
Someone like Doug has to do the label, right?
24:09
You need a label. It's got to be a compelling
24:11
label. It's got to make somebody want
24:12
to pick it up. Then on top of that.
24:15
So my point is a lot goes into it just coming out with one
24:18
product, but then you create this product and then you got to
24:22
be able to keep it in stock. And it's a balancing act because
24:26
you could easily just keep charging and paying for the
24:30
product. It's better to just do it cash
24:34
and just pay it. And so you don't have, you don't
24:37
have stuff piling up. So you do have to be able to
24:40
keep it in stock. And keeping 6 products in stock
24:44
is already challenging enough really the way when you with a
24:49
sauce business or any one of these businesses, people say,
24:52
oh, I'm in all these stores. But where you really make the
24:54
money is when you sell it at places.
24:56
When you go to a farmer's market or you go to a convention or you
24:59
go that's where you make the money.
25:01
You got the most margin right there.
25:04
You go put it in stores, you make a dollar maybe 2 and they
25:09
make $4.00 and all of a sudden your, your sauce.
25:12
That was 599. Someone said you go into one
25:15
store, I saw somebody selling it for 14.
25:17
I'm like, man, ain't that nice. I don't need to get me a store.
25:22
What am I doing? I'm like driving all over the
25:24
place, delivering it, everything and to make what to make.
25:29
So they're doing as many events as you can too.
25:34
Early earlier this year, I had to have, I had a medical issue.
25:37
I had to have a surgery. So that put me off of events for
25:39
a little while. Thank God I'm back now.
25:42
But as a small business owner, that could really be
25:45
detrimental. Like you really have to be
25:48
constantly looking for new customers, constantly getting
25:51
your products out there and, and getting people to try them.
25:55
And the more people try them, if it's good, they're going to get
25:59
hooked, then they're going to be like, man, this is good.
26:01
Or for us, we enter our sauces into different competitions from
26:04
time to time. I don't go too crazy with that
26:06
either because you could definitely spend a lot of money
26:09
entering these these sauce contests.
26:11
But it's good because it's a talking point for your company,
26:14
for your product. And we won a Scovie award for my
26:18
Kansas City sauce. And the reason I bring that up
26:21
is because it won for best first place kid friendly BBQ sauce.
26:26
So when you're doing a demo in a grocery store and here comes mom
26:29
with a kid, you could be like, hey, want to try my BBQ sauce is
26:33
best kid friendly BBQ sauce. So it gives them a reason to try
26:37
some sauces as you taste great out of the bottle.
26:40
Some sauces are really made to be on a protein and not straight
26:45
out of the bottle and their heart, it's harsh when they go
26:47
to sample it just plain, but on a piece of chicken or pork,
26:51
you're like, wow, that's dynamite.
26:52
It really complements the meat. So I'm really trying to make one
26:56
product that does both good out of the bottle and good on the
26:59
meat. Because when you're doing the
27:01
sampling, sometimes people taste it just on a spoon.
27:04
Sometimes we'll do whole chicken because I've done events,
27:07
tastings where people are like, oh, I don't eat pork.
27:09
And I'm like, so this way if I make chicken, most people will
27:13
try it. They'll try the chicken.
27:16
Definitely true. What we're going to do is if you
27:18
can just, we can go through each one of your products and you can
27:21
explain a little bit about it so people can know which of your
27:24
products are all right. You can go with the Memphis mop
27:30
sauce. Sure.
27:31
The Memphis Mop sauce is, like I said, that's our big award
27:35
winner. It's sweet and tangy.
27:37
It's actually lower in sugar than most BBQ sauces.
27:41
Maybe like some commercially bottled ones are like 18 to 20
27:45
grams of sugar. I think we're at like 8 or 9.
27:48
So it's like middle of the road, but it's a lot less.
27:51
And it just has that flavor that like lingers on your palate and
27:55
makes you like want more. You're like, man, what's that?
27:58
I can't put my finger on it. I really want more of that.
28:00
And that's the beauty of Memphis BBQ to me.
28:03
That was one of the first ones I fell in love with was Memphis.
28:06
And this past or not, this year, the year before the first year
28:10
of Smoke Slam, we got to do demos for NBBQA at the Live Fire
28:15
Experience. And, and it was like me when I
28:18
first came out with my products with the rebrand.
28:21
And let me tell you, I was a little bit nervous sampling my
28:26
Memphis BBQ sauce in Memphis for the Memphibians at this at this
28:31
event, but it was very well received.
28:33
We did, we did wings and we did them like with the I have an OG
28:38
rub and I can tell you about that.
28:40
That is like a low sodium all-purpose seasoning.
28:43
It's the OG BBQ rub. And so the OG and the Memphis
28:47
were my first two products when I came out.
28:49
So I released them like 2 at a time and for the 1st 2:00 and
28:53
the OG really complements great with the Memphis because it's
28:56
more savory and it's low sodium. So we did that on the wings.
29:01
Then I grounded into a little bit of a dust and just finished
29:04
the wings with that for the live fire experience.
29:07
And then we have our Kansas City sauce, which is sweet and smoky,
29:11
but it's not overly, it's not overpowering of smoke.
29:15
It just gets like a nice background and with a nice
29:18
little bite at the end. So it's the finish isn't it's
29:20
not all sweet, but it does. It is a sweeter sauce.
29:24
And that when I get a lot of people using that in competition
29:27
BBQ, I have teams that use that on the ribs.
29:30
I have some teams that use it mixed with our hot honey.
29:33
If you like hot honey, our hot honey is like, it's a real
29:37
Clover honey. It's it, you'll get the
29:39
sweetness from the honey when you first taste it, it's like a
29:41
wave. It goes in and then right before
29:44
it's about to hurt you, it starts going back out and it's
29:46
and you're late. It's exciting because you're
29:48
like, oh boy, when's this going to stop?
29:50
And then you're like, so if you mix that hot honey with the
29:53
Kansas City BBQ sauce, that is like a nice real sweet heat on
29:57
ribs, on your pork ribs. And then we have a beef rub,
30:01
which it, I'm just calling it the beef rub because it's the
30:05
beef rub that you need because it's like a seasoned salt.
30:08
It's peppery, it's infused with herbs, really made to stand up
30:14
to a big piece of meat like a prime rib, a brisket.
30:17
You're like a chateaubriand, like a filet mignon.
30:20
You can use it on steaks. We use it on burgers and
30:23
competition. But the two rubs work well
30:25
together because 1 is a low sodium and the other one is a
30:29
seasoned salt. So I'll put like a base layer of
30:32
the beef rub on a brisket and then just top it off lightly
30:35
with the with the OG rub. They work great together.
30:39
And then the hot sauce that I have we that's like a hot sauce
30:43
for people that like a little bit of heat, but it's not like
30:47
gonna ruin your day. It's it would be mild.
30:49
It's a cayenne red pepper sauce with notes of garlic and spice.
30:53
So good on your wings. Good.
30:55
I use it in a rib wrap sometimes or I'll use it as a binder for
30:59
ribs and that one is called Jersey Heat.
31:02
It's the Jersey Heat hot sauce. I appreciate you sending me
31:06
those. I look forward to using them.
31:08
So absolutely, I definitely appreciate it.
31:11
Let's move over to your books. How did you get the idea to
31:14
write books? Were you approached or did you
31:17
just decide on your own? So if you're in the culinary
31:21
world, most people, it's like a dream come true to be able to
31:25
write a cookbook. And I remember years ago on my
31:29
culinary journey, I used to own a fish market.
31:32
Yep, I owned a fish market. I don't even know how, but I
31:35
did. I was a caterer at the time and
31:38
the guy wanted to retire and he's, he made it feasible for me
31:41
to take it over. So one of the customers, his
31:45
wife worked for Simon and Schuster and they had a little
31:48
local book that they were doing about area shops.
31:52
So they wanted to feature my shop in the book.
31:55
So I said, hey, I always wanted to write a cookbook, can you
31:57
hook me up? And then he, the guy looked at
31:59
me and he's, I don't think you're ever going to write a
32:01
cookbook. That's not how it works.
32:03
I was really disappointed. So probably many years later,
32:08
I'm winning all these awards for my BBQ sauce is far removed from
32:12
this fish market thing. And I'm at an, a convention on
32:17
the East Coast in Atlantic City. I, I already started working on
32:20
recipes for a book because I said I was determined I am going
32:24
to write a cookbook if I have to like bang down doors and, and
32:29
reach out to people. I'm gonna do what I can to try
32:31
to get a book deal. And I meet up with a friend of
32:34
mine who's a, a champion BBQ guy, Bill Gillespie.
32:38
And Bill Bill says, hey, Ray, how's it going?
32:41
And I said, oh, it's going great.
32:43
And I said, I'm working on a cookbook.
32:46
And he goes, really? Who's your publisher?
32:47
I'm like, I don't have a publisher.
32:49
He said, I'll introduce you to mine.
32:51
And I'm like, OK, So I was like, really?
32:53
After about a month or two of us throwing some ideas back and
32:58
forth, I guess he must have mentioned something to them.
33:01
And then they reached out and they were like, OK, what's your
33:03
big idea? And I was like, all right,
33:05
here's my idea. And they were like, Nope.
33:07
And I was like shattered. I was like, oh, OK.
33:11
And but they were really cool. They're like, you know what,
33:13
you're the sauce guy. You write you, you have all
33:16
these award-winning sauces. What about this?
33:19
What if we did a sauce book and gave out your recipes for all
33:22
your sauces? And I was like, for my sauces.
33:25
I was like, I don't know. I don't know if that's a good
33:28
idea. And they were like, that's the
33:29
idea. Basically, if you want to do it,
33:33
it's more compelling. If people get an award-winning
33:35
sauce recipe, they're not going to just want some random sauces.
33:38
And I'm like, you know what, some of the best chefs in the
33:41
world give their recipes and it's going to be different for
33:44
everybody. Bring something different to the
33:46
same recipe. So I was like, so then I had to
33:48
make a proposal to them. It wasn't like cut and dry, OK,
33:52
you have a deal. It was like, all right, they
33:55
want to see this book proposal. So I had to come up with a
33:58
proposal and send it in and pray and wait and see what happened.
34:02
And then they're like, all right, now send in this proposal
34:05
with the recipes, some of the recipes, and we're going to test
34:08
them out. It was like a whole thing.
34:09
And then finally, like, I feel like I got like through this
34:13
maze. And they were like, OK, we're
34:14
going to send you a contract. And I was like, OK, it could
34:17
have said a dollar. I would have signed it.
34:19
I was like, OK, but. And so that was the first
34:22
cookbook. And I was really fortunate I got
34:24
to work with Ken Goodman. Ken Goodman is a world class
34:27
photographer and a champion BBQ guy as well.
34:31
So when he was photographing my book, like he knew he was a chef
34:35
for many years. He got burnt out being a chef
34:38
and became a photographer And, and he had an he has a knack for
34:42
it. He doesn't just take beautiful
34:43
pictures, he creates them. So it was like really like I
34:47
couldn't have asked for a better person.
34:50
Like what a good dude, a great photographer to do the
34:52
photography for my book. The book features ten of these
34:57
award-winning sauces and then five ways to use each one in
35:00
grilling and smoking. And you get 60 recipes and the
35:04
book, oh, it's called award-winning BBQ sauces and how
35:07
to use them. And it was BBQ book of the year
35:10
for the National BBQ Association at the Awards of excellence,
35:13
judged independently for book of the year for BBQ News magazine.
35:17
They had an independent reviewer, but so it was really
35:20
like, and at this point I, I'd started writing for BBQ news in
35:25
2017 and I would do like recipes, some articles here and
35:30
there or product review once in a while.
35:33
And I've been doing that since, like I said, so since 2017 with
35:37
them. So just the, I think that
35:39
background of the writing really helped prepare me to write a
35:43
cookbook. Writing a cookbook is no easy
35:45
task, even if you're really like psyched, think about you're a
35:49
Carpenter and you love to be a Carpenter and you're going to
35:53
build a house and you're going to you can't do it by yourself.
35:55
It's a lot of work, right? So even if you love to write,
35:58
it's a lot and recipe testing, there's a lot that goes into it.
36:02
I think. I think it's definitely not for
36:05
the faint of heart. It like the amount of work
36:08
you're not doing it. It's the same thing.
36:11
You're doing it for the art, you're doing it for the culture.
36:13
You're doing it. It's your business card, right?
36:16
In a way that you're not doing it because all I'm going to do
36:18
this, I'm under no illusion that I'm going to be a millionaire
36:21
from doing this cookbook, but it's all those things.
36:24
And for me, it was like so gratifying to accomplish one of
36:27
my goals. We talked before we went on the
36:30
air and we talked about how BBQ is a place for everyone.
36:34
Everyone is welcome in BBQ. There's a place for everyone.
36:37
And for me, I feel grateful that I'm able to write these articles
36:42
and share these different companies.
36:43
I do a gift guide for that. I do for holidays and for
36:47
Father's Day and get some of these brands.
36:50
Some are big and some are not, and some of them just need a
36:52
little light shined on them. Just like the people on your
36:55
podcast. I want to help people and being
36:58
a part of the culture and being able to contribute to that makes
37:02
it makes it all worth it for me. You know, for my second book,
37:06
Big Green Egg Basics from a Master barbecuer, that came
37:10
about because I had some ideas and I brought the ideas to them
37:14
again. And then again they were like, I
37:16
don't think so. They were not.
37:18
They were like, that's not as compelling as a Big Green Egg
37:21
book and but you won a Big Green Egg for so I won Sauce King Nyci
37:26
was the grand champion. My Memphis Mop was the grand
37:28
champion. Not me.
37:29
I should say that. And the grand prize was a Big
37:32
Green Egg. And they're like, so the.
37:34
So yeah, it was amazing. I had no idea.
37:37
I was like, really? I was like, that's phenomenal.
37:40
They were like, you have a Big Green Egg and you won this Big
37:42
Green Egg. It makes for a good story.
37:44
And would you want to do something like that?
37:46
And I'm like, yeah, I would love to do like, I just was happy to
37:50
be able to do another book, to be honest with you.
37:52
I have a book proposal that I'm working on now that, you know,
37:56
I'm excited to get that out there, but you know, you have to
37:59
temper your excitement until if and when.
38:03
And I think we're on to something this time, unlike the
38:05
first two times, I think I can get get this one through.
38:08
But that's the thing. It's not a thing until it's a
38:10
thing. So your drive has to be there
38:14
regardless You it was like when I did the first one, I was
38:18
determined. I was like, I'm going to do
38:19
this. I'm going to find a way.
38:22
And it's not up to me to find the way to define the way.
38:29
It's up for me to say this is what's going to what I'm going
38:32
to do and put it out there and do everything I need to do
38:35
around it to make it happen. But how exactly it works out,
38:39
it's not up to me. I think it's up to a higher
38:41
power. Your job is just to be prepared.
38:44
That's right. That's what I'm saying.
38:46
Yeah, and that's what I try to do when it comes to this
38:48
podcast, 'cause I try to do read as well as watch and get all the
38:54
information I can in case I run into somebody.
38:59
Most people be surprised that you know them and know about
39:02
them and all the information about them that most people may
39:06
not know. And that's how I got into
39:08
contact with a lot of people, just based on doing my homework
39:12
and being prepared for those moments.
39:14
And that's what it all comes down to.
39:16
And once you get the opportunity, you got to make the
39:19
best of it and be prepared. That's what I tell everybody.
39:23
Number one thing, be prepared for any moment because you never
39:26
know when it'll come. You might go to the grocery
39:29
store and run in there and meet somebody or anywhere, a child's
39:33
school, dropping them off from school, you might meet somebody.
39:36
So always be prepared for your opportunity.
39:39
So it's definitely good when an Oprah reader opens your book.
39:44
What do you want them to feel and not just taste?
39:50
I want them to feel like the results that they're after are
39:53
attainable. With the sauce book, when you
39:56
open it up, it gives you an idea of how to make different sauces.
40:00
All there's these recipes are blueprints.
40:02
So you could take this sauce and you can make it your own with an
40:06
addition of something, taking an ingredient out, replacing it
40:09
with something else. I want them to feel that with
40:12
the sauce book that they can create and make results that
40:15
they want. And with the Big Green Egg book,
40:18
I want them to feel comfortable that when they fire up their Big
40:21
Green Egg that they're going to achieve excellent results from
40:25
my instruction, that it's going to make it easy for them.
40:29
You know the the Big Green Egg book, the way it's designed for
40:33
someone who never had an egg or someone who loves to cook on
40:37
their egg because. But if you're someone that never
40:39
had a Big Green Egg or a Komodo style grill, it teaches you how
40:43
to set it up, how to light the fire, how to maintain the
40:46
temperature, how to clean it, how to do everything.
40:50
And the chapters are set up by techniques so hot and fast
40:54
grilling, low and slow smoking, roasting.
40:58
And then there's even 2 baking chapters, 1 sweet chapter and
41:01
one savory chapter. So I was trying to give people
41:04
the tools that you could use this all year round.
41:09
Komodo style grill is an investment.
41:11
It's not a cheap thing if, you know, you go to buy one.
41:15
Yeah, they do have a lifetime warranty, which is great, but
41:18
you're going to put out a little bit of money to get it.
41:21
And so I want to give people as many reasons to succeed and to
41:26
do well cooking on that and reasons to cook on it as
41:29
possible. So you could do, I have recipe
41:33
in there for like Turkey breast, apple, cranberry relish, green
41:37
beans. I'm thinking Thanksgiving, but
41:38
you can also do your pulled pork, you could do your brisket,
41:42
you could do your ribs, You can do different desserts.
41:46
Like I'm doing an event Saturday and we're doing apple pear crisp
41:50
with oatmeal crumb topping. That's from the book.
41:52
So it doesn't have to be straight up, just me in that
41:56
you're giving people different reasons to use it.
41:59
So I want it to be whenever I write.
42:02
I want the recipes to be accessible for people.
42:06
That sounds good because explaining me, some people just
42:09
make the book and I like how you start off by instructing them
42:14
how to light the grill and how to manage the fire and stuff
42:17
like that. Starting from scratch because
42:19
most folks just get the book and they'll open it up and be lost
42:23
because they don't know how to operate.
42:26
And maybe the way your recipe is set up, it has to have the fire
42:31
a certain way. So they won't know that if a
42:33
person doesn't put that in the book.
42:35
So that's good that you were very detailed at doing that.
42:38
Oh yeah, Even so, with the Big Green Egg, the way you control
42:42
the temperature, it's all about the airflow.
42:45
So I even have a guide on there and it tells you how much the
42:48
vents should be open, what percentage they should be open
42:52
to give you, what temperature you're, the temperature you're
42:55
trying to achieve. So I try to be as detail
42:59
oriented as possible. And there's like little Easter
43:02
eggs in there too. There's a recipe for the one for
43:04
the Turkey breast. There's a good recipe for a
43:06
brine, There's recipe for the rubs.
43:08
How many times you buy a cookbook, and I'm not going to
43:11
name names, but you look at the cookbook and it's use my rub and
43:16
there's no other alternative. So if I want to achieve success
43:19
now I got to go back to Amazon or your website and I got to
43:22
order this rub. I'd rather give people an
43:26
option. Here's a recipe for a sweet and
43:28
smoky rub. You could use that for this
43:30
recipe, or you could use it for whatever recipe you like.
43:33
Here's a recipe for just a basic house rub and you can make it
43:37
the way you want it. You give people a thing.
43:40
Now you got to go buy my rub. Go buy it at my sauce.
43:43
I feel as a I'm look, I look at it from the eyes of the reader,
43:47
from the reader. I'm like, man, I bought your
43:49
book. Now I got to go buy.
43:50
Not that I won't buy your sauce, but I don't want to have to buy
43:53
it just to make this recipe. That's my point.
43:55
I want to try to give people the accessibility to, if they want
44:00
to, they could make it and and why else are they going to buy
44:03
the book? You're not buying my book, so I
44:05
could tell you to go buy something else.
44:06
Let's move over to the BBQ News magazine, which you've been
44:10
writing for since you said 2017. And congratulations on the cover
44:15
again #8 number. Eight in the covers.
44:18
I'm, I am. I'm so grateful for that
44:20
opportunity to write for BBQ News and to be a part of that
44:24
family in that regard. There is truly a place for
44:27
everyone in BBQ. It's just look man, when I
44:30
wanted to learn how to cook, I went to the restaurant that
44:34
worked, that was next door to where I worked.
44:36
And I was 15 years old and I worked at a little grocery
44:39
market and I would work from 7:00 in the morning till 4:00 in
44:42
the afternoon, sometimes 5. And I would go next door and I
44:46
asked the chef, I go to the back door.
44:48
I said, can I watch you cook? And the guy would let me stand
44:52
there and he would be explaining stuff as he's cooking and
44:55
plating and you got to want it. Like, I reached out to the BBQ
44:58
News and I said, hey, I got some recipes I'd love to contribute.
45:01
I don't know. They're going to say, yeah,
45:03
they're going to say no, but how do you know if you don't try?
45:06
I want to encourage people. You got to try, man.
45:08
You got. Don't be afraid.
45:09
You got to. I was very fortunate because Kel
45:12
Phelps from BBQ News magazine couldn't have been like a nicer
45:17
guy, couldn't have been more welcoming.
45:18
He said, share me, share with me what you got.
45:20
We'll take a look. And then, sure, he got the
45:24
stuff. Sure enough, he said, you know
45:25
what, we're going to put that. And let me tell you, I went from
45:30
being a subscriber to having my recipes next to Paul Kirk, the
45:36
Baron of BBQ. I almost fell over.
45:39
I was like, Oh my God, Paul Kirk doesn't get any better than
45:43
that. And then so the next month I
45:45
said, I have a couple more recipes, and it's never stopped
45:48
since then. I just kept going.
45:50
I said, I'm just gonna keep sending them recipes.
45:52
And then Kel said, yeah, this is working out good, so why don't
45:55
we keep doing that? And grateful that that him and
45:58
Miss Janet accepted me and let me contribute and be a part of
46:02
it. And it's good for me because it
46:04
keeps me engaged and keeps me creating.
46:07
And it's good for people because then they get to see these
46:09
different mostly it's recipes. Majority.
46:12
Once in a while I'll do an article.
46:14
I've written articles on various products, try to shine the light
46:17
on some hard working people and then a couple product reviews.
46:21
But the main thing now I do like I said at the holiday time and
46:26
at Father's Day, I do the Grill Masters guide to the holidays
46:30
and the Grill Masters guide to Father's Day and the one at the
46:35
holiday time. We feature usually about 12
46:37
products could be sauces, seasonings, thermometer,
46:41
anything BBQ related. I'm always on the hunt looking
46:45
for different products. So if you got products, reach
46:48
out to me because you never know.
46:49
There's no cost to be featured. Now it's not like you get some
46:54
of these guides. It's pay to play.
46:56
If we if I like your product and I want to feature it, I'm a
46:58
feature it and really all I need is a photo of the product and
47:03
some background about the person's company.
47:05
I have been asked to review products but I can't review a
47:08
product I don't have. That's the only thing.
47:10
If somebody wanted me to review a product then but I certainly
47:14
am not like I don't need anything.
47:16
I'm not looking for anything but, but the gift guide has been
47:20
very well received. It's been featured in BBQ News
47:23
magazine, the Smoke Sheet, BBQ newsletter, and then I was, I've
47:27
been a contributor to the Baseball and BBQ podcast for a
47:31
few years. So I go on there, we discuss the
47:33
products and then just recently we started with the Pitlife BBQ
47:37
Podcast talking about the products on there.
47:39
So I don't know, I don't know. I think it's just great to get
47:43
the word out there. It's definitely something that I
47:46
think is unique in that it's not a pay to play thing and it's
47:51
good at there. Like I said, there are big
47:53
companies, but the person that like take a company like Magna
47:57
Chef, they make really great BBQ gloves and now they're on, they
48:00
have cutting boards, they have these BBQ tools and they're
48:03
growing, but but it wouldn't be possible for them to grow
48:06
without having like spreading the word.
48:09
And they're small family run business.
48:11
The products created by a firefighter.
48:13
So what better marketing is it to have BBQ gloves created by a
48:17
firefighter? He knows or that like how to
48:20
create a product that's going to stand up to the heat, but it's
48:25
helping spread the word. That's the community of barbecue
48:28
and it's that's my small contribution.
48:31
I love that because they give other people a chance instead of
48:34
the seeing the same old. There's nothing wrong with the
48:37
same old people, but there's numerous ways to get there.
48:42
There's other companies, other small companies that people
48:45
haven't heard of. It's like sharing the road, just
48:48
giving other people a chance instead of these companies use
48:52
the same people over and over again.
48:54
Some of these other podcasts get the same people over and over
48:58
again as there's so many people, so many rough, so many grills
49:02
and all that out there that people just just haven't heard
49:06
of and got their chance to show it.
49:08
They have. And it's good that some of these
49:12
companies are out there showcasing, like you said, the
49:15
gloves, because most people might not have heard of gloves
49:18
until they listen to this part, the podcast, the podcast, and
49:23
they could say, oh, wow, much. Then they look at their hands
49:26
and see how many times they didn't burn their hands and they
49:28
were like, OK, that's a good idea.
49:31
And the first thing made by a firefighter is going to be like,
49:34
OK, that might be something I could trust.
49:36
So that caused you to do research and look into it and
49:39
see what they're talking about. But just having the same people
49:43
and promoting the same people is not growing the BBQ community
49:46
because like I said, people get frustrated after a while.
49:49
Be like, OK, I'm never going to get my chance where there's
49:53
people that can give them a hand and help them and pull them up
49:56
just to get them out there. Oh, you never know what
50:00
happened. I would much rather lend a hand
50:03
to lift someone up than to step on them.
50:06
When I do these guides, I don't list my products.
50:11
I look for other people that have sauces and seasonings
50:15
because I don't view their success as a lack of my success.
50:20
Like it doesn't mean that there is less in the bucket for me.
50:25
There's a million rubs, there's a million sauces.
50:27
There's people that are going to buy mine regardless.
50:30
There's people that are going to buy yours regardless.
50:33
Like it, but why not? Why not?
50:36
It's hard, man. It's hard having a small
50:38
business, never mind a business that's like in a category that's
50:41
so crowded, I'd rather lift my brother up then step on him to
50:46
get ahead. That's just me.
50:47
And if I don't, if that's the way, if I can live with that,
50:51
you know what I'm saying? And I'd give you.
50:54
For instance, I was in a contest for sauces and the contest
50:58
promoter didn't end up following through with giving out the
51:01
prizes. So I became friendly with one of
51:04
the other sauce makers. To this day is one of my best
51:07
friends because we met that way. He's a sauce maker, he's a rub
51:12
maker. So am I.
51:14
Right Before COVID hit, he built me a website.
51:19
If he didn't build me that website, maybe we didn't get
51:22
through COVID. He didn't charge me a dime.
51:27
Do you understand? This is what you do for people
51:30
now? There was a template, so it
51:33
wasn't like he had to do it from scratch.
51:35
But if he didn't do it, I didn't know how to do it.
51:38
And this guy's a great friend and a great, just a good human
51:41
being. I promote his products all I
51:45
have, no problem. And they're really good.
51:48
It's called BT Lee's, by the way.
51:50
BT Lee's sauces and rubs. Let me tell you, his products
51:55
are all natural now. Yeah.
51:58
Am I on trying to talk about mine?
51:59
Of course. But let me tell you someone
52:01
else's success does not take away from mine.
52:04
Just for me talking about that there's out, there's people that
52:07
are like, I love raised sauces too.
52:09
I'm not it's not you can't live in this world as that is just
52:14
you. We're not put here to just be
52:17
for us. We're put here to say how may I
52:20
serve? So I'm here to serve and I and
52:23
if that means helping somebody else out, what, one day it'll
52:26
come back around. I love that I'm gonna read
52:29
something that you wrote because I loved it.
52:32
You shared this website or magazine, it said.
52:36
Understand that everyone's journey through life is
52:38
different. There is no one particular way
52:41
to achieve your goals. However, I believe that the
52:43
mantras that helped me help guide me to where I am today
52:48
will help others navigate fearlessly.
52:51
Those life lessons are stay focused on what you want to
52:54
achieve and have fun doing it #2 be in service to others.
52:59
Ask how may I help #3 Always work for and with the best in
53:05
your industry #4 Be a lifelong learner #5 Don't be afraid to be
53:11
great. Number six, you will fail.
53:14
Dust yourself off, get back up and keep moving forward #7 if it
53:20
were easy then everyone will be doing it #8 it's never too late
53:26
to be successful. Which one of those lesson were
53:29
the hardest for you to learn? And that was excellent, by the
53:33
way. Thank you.
53:34
We'll see it. You will fail, dust yourself off
53:39
and get back up and continue to move forward.
53:42
That's probably the hardest one, especially being a small
53:46
business owner and sauce maker, that some days you're the bird
53:52
and some days you're the statue. Sometimes you get an order from
53:58
somebody and it's like the you're like so happy.
54:02
Then another day could be you won an award and then all of a
54:05
sudden the phone's not ringing and you're doing a tasting
54:08
somewhere and people are just walking by you instead of trying
54:12
it. So it really you just got to
54:15
have a stiff upper lip and you got to just, if you like
54:20
baseball. Joe Torre, a manager of the
54:23
Yankees, said it best. Never get too high and never get
54:26
too low. Just stay right in the middle
54:28
and keep a smile. Just keep on moving and just
54:32
keep. And that's all you can do.
54:33
Because if you're too up or too high or hanging on every little
54:38
thing, man, you really could mess yourself up.
54:41
But if you're like right in the middle, that's like the sweet
54:44
spot. That's like people in business
54:48
and in life are more attracted to people that are what stable,
54:51
confident that are. If you're sitting there, woe is
54:54
me, oh, nothing's going right. Nobody wants to be around that.
54:57
That doesn't attract people. That doesn't attract business.
55:00
What attracts business is you don't have to lie about your
55:05
business and be like, oh, everything is great, but don't
55:08
focus on the negativity. Focus and be thankful and say
55:12
thank you every day for the things that you do have.
55:15
And that's where I that's something that I had learned and
55:18
I try to live that every day. Yeah, that's excellent.
55:21
All right, I'm going to ask one more question and play a quick
55:23
game with you, get you out of here.
55:25
When people talk about Chef Ray 20 years from now, what do you
55:28
want them to say? I want them to say if it wasn't
55:31
for him I wouldn't be into BBQ. For instance, if it's one of
55:37
these kids at a kids queue and I help spur them on to barbecue,
55:43
then I would feel really great 20 years from now if somebody
55:45
said hey thanks for encouraging me.
55:49
Look at all I accomplished in the world of BBQ.
55:51
Exactly. When I was young, I, I think it
55:54
was like 4th or 5th grade, I had a teacher and he let me borrow a
55:57
book and he said are you done reading the book?
56:00
And I said no, not yet. He said I'm moving to Australia
56:03
Friday. He said if you're going to read
56:05
that, if you're going to finish it, seriously finish it.
56:08
You can keep it and then pass it on to somebody else.
56:10
But if you're not, bring it tomorrow.
56:13
And I said I'd like to finish reading it.
56:15
And I love to read as a kid and I love to go to the library and
56:19
look at all the books. They were either like murder
56:21
mystery or like chef books, cooking books.
56:24
I could not ever get enough of cooking.
56:26
I don't know. It was just that was just my
56:28
passion. It was food.
56:30
So if I could inspire someone in in in any type of way to to get
56:37
out there and light the fire and grill or BBQ, then it's all
56:42
worth it. Definitely.
56:44
We'll see it, see it. All right, that's all the
56:47
questions I have. I got one quick game.
56:49
I play with everybody. College basketball has a
56:51
tournament bracket, so I made a tournament bracket of 16 meats
56:55
that you cook on the grill. And when I give you a match up,
56:58
just tell me which one you prefer to eat and we'll see
57:00
which one is the winner. Match up 1 is brisket versus
57:04
lamb. Brisket.
57:07
All right, match up two smoked ham versus sausage.
57:11
Sausage. All right, next matchup is
57:16
smoked Turkey versus beef ribs. Man, that's might go beef ribs.
57:23
My cardiologist don't like that, but I'm gonna go with that.
57:26
All right, BBQ shrimp versus hamburger.
57:31
Hamburger. All right, next matchup is pork
57:35
chop versus smoked chicken. Smoked chicken.
57:39
All right, next match up is smoked Bologna versus pork ribs.
57:44
Pork ribs all day all. Right, next match up is hot dog
57:49
versus pork belly. Pork belly, that's the first
57:55
seed and the bottom seed. All right, steak versus burnt
58:00
ends. Oh, I'm gonna go burnt ends.
58:05
Wow. OK.
58:08
And next matchup is brisket versus sausage.
58:11
Brisket. OK, next matchup, beef ribs
58:16
versus hamburger Beef ribs. OK me.
58:21
To use chicken. And next matchup is chicken
58:24
versus pork ribs. Pork ribs, OK, Next matchup is
58:32
pork belly versus burnt ends. Burnt ends OK, Next matchup is
58:42
brisket versus beef ribs. I am currently living this right
58:47
now as we speak, deciding whether to make brisket or I'm
58:52
gonna go beef ribs. OK.
58:56
And pork ribs versus burn insurance, pork ribs, All right,
59:02
And come down to the real matchup, beef ribs versus pork
59:05
ribs. Beef ribs.
59:11
All right, Beef ribs is your winner.
59:14
All right, Chef Ray, your therapy session is over.
59:17
If you want to give your website and promote anything, you can
59:20
definitely do that at this time. Thank you.
59:23
My website is Ray sheehan.com. It's RAYSH EE HA n.com and you
59:30
can find me on social media at Chef Ray Sheehan on Facebook,
59:35
Instagram, Twitter X whatever they're calling it these days.
59:40
You can see my articles in BBQ News magazine, occasionally in
59:44
the Smoke Sheet BBQ Newsletter, and as a guest Co host on the
59:48
Baseball and BBQ Podcast. All right, And I want to thank
59:52
you for coming on the show. We're definitely good interview.
59:55
I can tell when the interview goes well because half the paper
59:58
the stuff I have on paper I don't even get to.
1:00:03
It was a pleasure. Thank you so much for having me
1:00:05
on. Yeah, definitely stuff it in
1:00:08
your specialty and just to educate people, but I definitely
1:00:12
appreciate you coming on and giving your time and wish you
1:00:15
the best of luck in everything that you're doing.
1:00:18
Thank you so much. All right, we'll see everybody
1:00:20
next episode. We just wrapped up another
1:00:23
session of BBQ therapy. Remember, stay patient, stay
1:00:26
passionate, and keep that fire burning Hit.
1:00:29
Subscribe, share the good smoke, and pay the secretary on your
1:00:33
way out. Have a blessed day.