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Cassandra Worthy: The Bold Power of Change · The Bold Lounge

• 0:07
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bold Lounge podcast.
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: My name is Leigh Burgess and I will be your host.
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: If you're anything like me, you love hearing inspiring stories of people who have gone on bold journeys and made a positive impact in the world.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: This podcast is all about those kinds of stories.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: Every week, we'll hear from someone who has taken a leap or embarked on an extraordinary journey.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: In addition to hearing their stories, we'll also learn about their bold growth mindset that they use to make things happen.
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: Whether they face challenges or doubts along the way, they persisted and ultimately achieved their goals.
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: These impactful stories will leave you feeling motivated and inspired to pursue your own bold journey.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: I believe everyone has a bold story waiting to be freed.
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: Tune in and get ready to be inspired.
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bold Lounge.
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: Today I have Cassandra Worthy.
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: Cassandra enables organizations and individuals to grow through major change and significant shifts by harnessing the power of emotion.
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: Whether undergoing a merger, acquisition, startup, explosive growth or significant contraction, the strategies and tools of change enthusiasm are motivating and energizing workforces worldwide.
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: Her leadership, development and consulting company was birthed from the pain and challenges she overcame as a corporate executive.
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: Cassandra's client base spans the Fortune 500, including Microsoft, google, bank of America, the NFL and Disney.
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: She's a chemical engineer by training and also brings over a decade of M&A experience to silt down to the critical leadership traits required to lead the exception during times of change and transformation.
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: She's the author of Change Enthusiasm how to Harness the Power of Emotion for Leadership and Success.
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: Welcome, cassandra.
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: What it do, lee, and what up listeners, so so grateful to be here.
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much for having me.
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: Absolutely so.
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: I'm excited to jump in to your definition of bold.
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: What does bold look like in Cassandra's world?
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: Oh, what does bold look like in my world?
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: So I think of bold as being this perfect, beautiful marriage between courage and authenticity.
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: It is being able to, in the face of feeling fear, in the face of feeling discomfort, to step into action, to step into a belief that you feel is true and resonant in your heart of hearts.
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: And it takes a bold move, being resonant, being in line with your authentic self, sometimes having to overcome fear, to step into this world to what I feel is necessary to reach true, authentic success.
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: Not that success that the society, your parents, friends, people around you define, but what you define for yourself.
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: It takes a bold individual to achieve their authentic success.
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: Right, really sometimes going against the convention, going against what's expected, having the courage to really pave your path and go for it.
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: So I love that definition, the marriage of courage and authenticity.
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: So when you think about when you have lived that definition, what's a moment, or what is the moment, or you know something that comes to mind for you.
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: Oh, there's been so many moments which I'm grateful to say, yeah.
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: We have a lot of bold moments in all different facets, you know, like of our life too.
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: It's like maybe it's a personal, maybe it's a professional, maybe it's emotional.
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: It's definitely has different layers of boldness.
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: It certainly does.
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: I'll give you a couple and I kind of came back to back, but it's been kind of a pivotal time in my life.
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: Okay, so you mentioned I'm a chemical engineer.
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: I spent 15 years working in corporate and a lot of that corporate career I was doing in parallel with another career of mine, which was my drinking career, and both of them were flourishing in parallel.
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: And so one of the bold moments was when I decided to embrace my alcoholism and say yes to sobriety and embrace that alcoholism was a part of who I am, a part of my authentic person, and it's healthier for me and everyone around me that I abstain from alcohol.
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: And in stepping into that full authentic self and power, it led me to my next bold move, which was listening to that intuition which, in sobriety, became a shout that I could not ignore that there was something different, there's something better that I should be doing to share my gifts and talents with the world.
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: And it was following that path of curiosity that led me to get on a stage talking about this thing that I've now coined change, enthusiasm, this mindset that I've been practicing for years to help me see growth through change.
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: Continuing to step that path of curiosity, which eventually became a path of passion know building my, my speaking business and now creating this leadership and development global consultancy that continues to flourish.
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: And so it was those two bold moves sobriety and stepping into curiosity to think about how could I use my gifts and talents to make the world a better place that has really helped me to co-create and manifest this life that I enjoy every day.
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: So getting real with yourself is definitely hashtag bold, so like saying I have flaws, I'm not where I want to be, or I'm not feeling how I should, or I'm not treating people like I want to.
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: So what does it take, do you think, for someone to get to that point?
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: Because it's kind of that, just do it moment.
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: That Nike moment in our life of like I've just got to go, I've got to change, I've got to take this step, I have to acknowledge I got to be better or I have to do something differently.
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, what do you think happens in someone's life that pushes them or creates that moment of change that's connected to emotion?
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so I'll speak from personal experience, right?
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: So for me it was hitting a brick wall, okay, and I think that happens for many of us.
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what happened to me when I made the change that we talked about.
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure.
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: It's fallen into the hole, it's hitting the brick wall, it's getting slapped across the face with reality hitting rock bottom.
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: That shakes you, that wakes you up and that, for me, that awakening was opening this door and pushing me to step through, turning my curiosity within, just get to know myself a little bit more.
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: Why do I drink all the time?
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: Why do I have this aversion to embracing alcoholism?
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: Both my parents are in recovery.
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: Why am I constantly looking and seeking for that, for that drink or for that drug?
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: And it's having that boldness, really to get to know yourself, because that is a that can be a very uncomfortable journey, but when you can step into it, when you can turn that curiosity within, ask yourselves the whys, the hows, the whats.
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: You know, what am I passionate about?
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: What do I care about?
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: What am I curious about?
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: Why do I respond this way?
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: Whenever I'm talking to this person, what is that thing?
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: That's when I think you can find that that boldness, and I think that's the only way for you to identify what that authentic essence is about you.
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: You can't be authentic unless you know you, and oftentimes it does take falling into that hole or hitting that brick wall for so many of us, but it doesn't have to.
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: It doesn't have to the more that you can commit to staying curious about yourself and asking those questions, journaling a little bit, just staying curious a little bit at a time, you can find those revelations and you can find that boldness.
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: And it doesn't have to come at such an extreme cost, like for me, hitting a brick wall and reaching rock bottom.
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's vulnerable, right, it's a vulnerable place.
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: When you say curious, I hear I need to notice, I need to intentionally see something that maybe I've just gone about my day and noticed it but not paid attention to it.
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: So you know, I think a lot of what you just talked about is like change comes from a place of noticing what you know.
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: You know, you know when you hit a brick wall, you know when kind of reality, like you said, slaps you across the face.
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: For me, like it was a physical thing, my, my eye burst and like I looked in the mirror and I was just like, wow, like it's staring me in the face.
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: I have to do something different.
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: The stress is so high.
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: You know, thinking about that is there a big part of noticing and intentionally taking action when it comes to change, because sometimes I think people see it, they know what they need to do.
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: Like I've heard this so many times, I know what I need to do, what I'm not doing, like where's that, where's that come from?
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: What do we need to like do to shake that?
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: Oh man, that's stubbornness and complacency and being okay with being comfortable.
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: You know, and even if you might be in a situation that you know isn't the best for you, you know, and even if you might be in a situation that you know isn't the best for you, at least you know it Right.
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: You know the difficulty, you know this is a real terrible relationship, but at least I know what I can expect from this awful relationship and somehow, someway that's a sense of comfort for me, because I know what I can expect when you get outside of not being able to.
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: You know when your expectations are not met or you just don't know, there's all these unknowns.
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: That's uncomfortable.
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: There's darkness there and it takes that activation energy to step into the darkness.
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: And for me it takes faith and trust that in the darkness there's opportunity, that in the darkness there's growth.
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: And I will tell you and this is kind of what culminated into this whole mindset of change enthusiasm one of the best resources, tools that we have that can guide us through change, that can help us see the opportunity in the darkness, is our emotion, is that emotional energy.
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: When you have a bit of that anxiety, some of that fear, when you have a bit of that overwhelm or sadness, that's for me.
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: I feel it's divine energy, it's this infinite wisdom that's speaking to you and their guideposts and ultimately it's fuel.
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: So, when you can explore it, like you're feeling a bit of anxiety, okay, what are the thoughts bringing my awareness to the anxiety?
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: What is inspiring that within me?
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: And then start understanding, okay, how can I make this work for me?
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: And then you can start to transform that energy, right, anxiety into anticipation or at least curiosity or intrigue, right, and that's when we get our power back and that's when we can start stepping one foot over the other in the darkness and we start getting a little bit of light and we start seeing the opportunity.
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: But, man, when we can have high emotional self-awareness, when we cannot run from our emotions, there are such promise, such prize, such gift and growth that can be available to us.
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: And, trust me, I spent decades running from my emotion, I spent decades numbing them out with bottle and with drugs, but they are such an infinite resource and it's and it's all available to us.
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what.
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: As you're talking, I'm like man, like I wish I could have done some of the things that I'm doing now with regard to looking at my emotions, understanding where they came from, understanding, like you know, I'll say like, wow, I can't believe I reacted like that in the past and it's almost like I feel shame or embarrassed.
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: Those are really like strong words, but it's okay, cause I'm not that today.
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: I'm not doing that.
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: I didn't have that quick reaction or that harshness or whatever, whatever I named it on, cause I'm pretty hard on myself, yeah, yeah.
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: So how can we learn how to harness and understand and embrace our emotions?
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: Cause you actually say in your book they're a gift and sometimes we run from them, like you said, or we put them in a box or we don't even pay attention to them because we think this is just the way it is.
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's so true, especially in a work context, especially if you're living in a culture where or you've kind of grown up in a culture where you're not supposed to talk about your emotions, or you know as a, as a black woman, you know sit in a marginalized population at so many intersections, if I show up angry, I'm going to get called a certain, a certain way, right, you know, and and so many ways.
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: Vulnerability is a privilege and sharing that emotional energy.
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: But, honestly, you get better at it by practicing it, and this is this is something that when I, when I share it, when I teach it, people will roll their eyes and they're like gosh.
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: Is there not a cheat code?
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't.
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: I don't want to take the time I'm telling you let me scan the QR code on that one QR code to quick emotional process.
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you.
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: Invent that next I you know what if I had, don't you?
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: you know I would be using it.
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: Yes, you would be Because, my goodness I have to run away.
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: I try to run away from my difficult emotions, but no, when we can embrace them, when we can allow ourselves to sit with them, not suppress them, not try to run away with them, their information, their data.
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: And I will tell you I am the biggest student of this mindset that I teach around the world.
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: The first step is about the signal.
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: It's about these difficult emotions.
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: It's about granting yourself the grace to be with them, to allow them to be in your body, recognize they're there, knowing that they're there.
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: Take some grace.
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: I'm human.
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: These are here for a reason.
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: They're here to serve me.
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: I'm going to allow them to guide me where I need to be looking.
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: Explore them, as opposed to no run away.
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: Run away, where's the joy, where's the gratitude?
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: Right, allow them to inform you, explore what that opportunity might be for you and then make the choice on how you move forward.
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: And it becomes an informed choice, right when you start exploring the opportunity.
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: But it's a matter of practice and for me, the way that I put it into practice.
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: I actually take an emotional inventory.
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: I strive to do it on a daily basis, but definitely weekly, and think about okay, what was the emotional energy that kind of flowed through me today or this week.
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: And what inspired that right?
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: What was I doing?
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: What was I thinking about, what happened?
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: And that helps me kind of paint a picture of where there might be opportunity in my day-to-day right, where there might be opportunity to nurture a connection maybe let go of a connection that's no longer serving me to learn or grow in an area where I think I have some area for improvement.
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: Right, if I feel fearful about doing a certain task, well, maybe I don't have enough knowledge about it and so, yeah, it points us in the direction that we have for ourselves to grow and to learn.
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so important word you used in there was choice.
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: So I think change and choice are definitely roommates.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: So you can't really change unless you choose to do something different, to acknowledge the emotion, to see that there's something else possible to get out of that comfort zone.
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: And we have this wonderful, this opportunity, this privilege of choosing and being able to do some things that people in some places can't even do, those types of things.
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: Where do we go wrong?
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: You know what happens between I need to make a change and the choice and I know it's stubbornness and some of those other things but like whether it's an organization, I mean, I don't know how many times I heard this is how we've always done it.
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: You know, one of the most you know.
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: No one wants to hear that when you're coming in to help an organization change or you know we don't have the money or we don't have the skills or we don't have the people, Like, I bet you've heard every excuse possible, Totally Right, Totally.
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: So what creates the catalyst for the choice that has to be made once the change is known that it's possible?
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's such a good question.
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: By the way, step three of change enthusiasm is the choice.
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: And so that is right at the center of this mindset, because it gives us our power back.
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: So often when we're going through change, especially when it's changed that we're not leading for ourselves, but it's that kind of change it feels like it's happened to us.
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: It feels like our power has been stripped away.
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: Right, I have no control in this situation.
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: My manager is quitting, I'm getting this new manager and I've known of this person and they're terrible.
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: I have no control over this.
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: All my power is gone.
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: There's nothing that I can do.
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: Change enthusiasm and the way that you can think about change through this lens puts you back in the seat of power.
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: You have a choice on how you experience this change, how you choose to navigate and step into this new relationship, on how you choose to present yourself, on how you share about you know what worked in this prior relationship, and these are things that I hope that we can move forward with.
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: The way that you share your likes, your dislikes, what you're passionate about, maybe, the way that you share your concerns or your fears right, you have control on your action, your beliefs and, ultimately, that emotional energy that you carry into every room that you step into.
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: And so that's why I love so much reminding people reinforcing the power of choice, because, again, it gets us our power back, especially when we're in those feeling like powerless situations and when we're leading change and difficult to get that catalyst, that activation energy.
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: The choice doesn't have to be like mountain moving.
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: It doesn't have to be incredible, massive, huge choice, right, and I always like to celebrate the work of James Clear and Atomic Habits, right.
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: What is that atomic choice, james Clear at Atomic Habits, right?
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: What is that atomic choice?
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: What is that little baby step that you can make that will slowly begin to transform the energetic signature of what you're feeling, transform that anxiety maybe to a little bit of intrigue, right, a little bit of interest.
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: What's that little bitty choice?
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: And it's these little baby choices that will start moving you forward.
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: And then you get momentum and then, when the momentum is there, the choices can get bigger and bigger, the steps can get bigger and bigger.
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: But just make the next little choice, the next best thing, the little baby, yeah, and then you start building that momentum.
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, start.
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: Start, start.
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you mentioned that only 10% of successful change adoption is about know-how, with the rest depending on motivation and willingness.
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: How do you help organizations and individuals understanding those two important components?
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: leaning upon are outdated and today's reality of change?
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: Right, because so many of them are based on this linear idea of change that there's a clear beginning and a clear end, and we're thinking about human behavior along.
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: We all know about the change growth curve right Along this more linear concept.
• 17:59
  Speaker 2: But that's not today's reality.
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: Right, because change is layered, it's stacked, it's dynamic, it's all the time and it doesn't discriminate.
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: You're dealing with change at work, culture change, new systems, new processes, ai technology, people, structure, onboarding.
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: You're dealing with change in other aspects of life ending a relationship, starting a relationship just gave birth new grandchild.
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: Change is everywhere, and so we have to think about what is the perspective.
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: How are we arming ourselves and our workforce to navigate change at any time and any manner of change?
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: And that's about that willingness, that motivation, the emotional energy that change inspires.
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: And so, for me, it's about that desire, that willingness, and sustainably being able to carry that when moving through such dynamic times where changes hit all the time.
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: Right, and really it's that 90%, because if you don't have the willingness to pursue a change, you can have all the knowledge, all the training, the right processes, the right technology, even the right type of talent in the room but with no motivation you have no fuel to get there right.
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: So I think about mindset change, enthusiasm, the skillset that we bring to be the fuel that goes into the engine.
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: The car that's all beautifully designed, that gets it moving forward through change.
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: You're gonna sit complacent, stagnant, going nowhere without the fuel.
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, what are the habits of change enthusiasm that we need to embrace and have discipline around, because I think sometimes, when it comes to change or not making a change, we've just fallen into habits that are not good or good for us.
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: You know, they're just getting by or, like you said, they might be comfort zone.
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: Are there specific habits that we could start to actually explore and implement into our lives to help us, you know, through this process of change and understanding how it could really change us and our world?
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: For sure.
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: I mean.
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: I always invite folks to always level set with themselves, because so much of how we navigate through change is dependent upon the stories that we tell ourselves right, the narratives, the overarching narratives that we hold our trust and belief in.
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: I suck at change.
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: I'm terrible at change.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: Change sucks, I'm never good at it.
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: Is that the story that you're telling yourself or is it a different narrative?
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: And if it's a story that you want to change, it's important that you identify that.
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: And for me change.
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: Enthusiasm in and of itself is a belief system.
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: It's a belief that the emotions that are inspired when going through change are there for a reason.
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: They're actually there to serve you as guideposts, to welcome you and signal you into a moment of opportunity, so that you can think about how can I make all this work for me as opposed to against me, and to trust that if I'm feeling this way, if I'm feeling the frustration, the overwhelm, the anger, it means something good is hurling its way to me.
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: I have an opportunity.
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: I have an opportunity to practice my practice of grace and self-care.
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: I have an opportunity to share empathy with those that I might know who might be losing their jobs or who might have just lost their jobs.
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: I have an opportunity to learn more about a technology so that I can become better proficient, so that I can teach it or share it with my customers and my client base.
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: And then it's making those choices, making the choices to move yourself the needle right into those what I call growth-sustaining emotions of change.
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: It's the feel-good ones gratitude, joy, anticipation, enthusiasm, right.
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: And it's through that practice, that belief, my emotions are here to serve me.
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: Change always presents opportunity.
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: It's up to me to be able to see it and then choose how I capture it and how I make it work for me.
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: Believe all of that and then that story, which is which is the Greek derivation of enthusiasm.
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: It means divinely inspired, and so change.
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: Enthusiasm is divinely inspired by this emotional energy and you start creating that trust.
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: I'm feeling fearful.
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: That means that if I'm feeling this way, something good it's coming its way to me and I know this because of all the times I've practiced this in the past and how much I've grown and why I've come as far as I have.
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: Right and with that trust, you can get about the business of exploring opportunities and choosing that growth, choosing to maximize the opportunities in front of you.
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: So I think one of the important themes of your book and your work is when there's a negative emotion that comes up like don't run away from it, don't, don't not pay attention, embrace it, learn from it, discover it.
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: And this you know, your example of like I'm fearing, fearful, like something's on its way.
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: You're like, oh man, I'm having.
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: Like every now and then, my family and I would be like, well, so many weird little annoying things are happening.
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: Like either I'm being protected from something this is how I feel or like something incredible is about to happen, and I'm good with both.
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: You know, yeah, I'm telling you that's kind of how we view it.
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: It doesn't mean it's not annoying.
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: It doesn't mean like, oh man, come on, like one more thing, but it's just how you really played it off of, like what is next?
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: It's something awesome, right?
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: Yes, and again, I'm not trying to negate those emotions.
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: It's not a matter of feeling them and then saying, oh, something's good, let me.
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: Let me think about all my good feelings.
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: It's letting it be there, letting it sit with you.
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: This is this first step, right, acknowledging the emotion, letting it sit with you, cause the longer that it can sit with you, the better you're able to see what that opportunity might be and to explore it, as opposed to immediately running away from it and making kneeerk reactions.
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: Right, that might not be the best way to maximize the opportunity that you have.
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: And so it's recognizing they are gift, they're natural, they're always going to be there, and it's a matter of what we do with them, how we use them as data, information and fuel to move us forward.
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, with all your experience and research and all the organizations you work with.
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: When it comes to resilience, which I think it's every now and then I hear like it's getting a bad rap.
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: We shouldn't have to be resilient, we shouldn't practice.
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: You know, we shouldn't give like glory to someone being resilient.
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: But I always get a little confused because I feel like you have to be resilient because everything doesn't always go as planned.
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: So, like what, in your experience, is the relationship between resiliency and our ability to change, and change in a way that moves us forward towards?
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: what we're meant for.
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's such a great question and thank you so much for asking it, because I think this is in the zeitgeist, especially now, given again the very dynamic times of change, and it's only going to get more and more rapid, more and more volatile.
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: I think the pitfall is when we assume that resilience means falling down, getting back up again, moving forward, falling down, getting back up again, moving forward, falling down, getting back up again, moving forward.
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: It's constant and you're always just pushing yourself to keep going, even though you're bruised, even though you're hurt, even though you're disappointed, even though you're frustrated.
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: Keep pushing, keep pushing.
• 24:46
  Speaker 2: That leads to change.
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: Fatigue that leads to burnout.
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: There's a part of resiliency that so many of us fail to comprehend and put into practice, and I like to liken resilience to a muscle right.
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: I was a division one collegiate athlete.
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: I did shot, put and discus, so I lifted a lot of weights.
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: Nice, I did that in high school.
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: Thank you, thank you.
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: Thank you.
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: And so for our physical muscles, I can remember, right, we work out a body, a muscle group on a Monday, break it down, and then the next day we would have rest for that muscle group.
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: We'd work out some other part of the body and then the following day we'd break it down again.
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: So that's what happens in the building of muscle tissue, right, you break it down, you give it some type of a strain or a stress, then you allow it time to rebuild those muscle fibers, those muscle cells that's where the strength is born and then the next day you're bringing it down again so that it can then, you know, get broken down and then get rebuilt back up.
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: The same is true for our resilience muscle.
• 25:45
  Speaker 2: When we're going through a big change or a big devastation, that's the strain, that's the stress, right, and then there needs to be time for rest, for respite and reflection.
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: What have I learned over these past few weeks?
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: What have I learned by going through this big change, this big devastation?
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: How have I learned by going through this big change, this big devastation, how have I grown and then move forward?
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: Because it's that reflection, especially when you can document it, when you journal it, talking about how much you've grown.
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: Those elements, those learnings, is what you can then lean back on when you fall down the next time.
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: And so it's more so falling down, getting back up to understand what you've learned, understanding what you've learned, and then moving forward.
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: Falling down, getting back up to understand what you've learned, and that getting back up again to move forward goes quicker the more that you do it because you know, ooh, there's something here that I've learned, ooh, there's something here that I've learned.
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: And so you want to get back up because you know there's learning, there's growth.
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: That's here, you've seen it in your practice and that's where this resilient strength actually works and that's what can really help us.
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: And moving forward, where we find fulfillment and growth and going through challenging times and, of course, businesses can flourish as well and we can sidestep, avoid, circumvent, change fatigue.
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, do you think people skip the learning part?
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: They just get back up and go at it.
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: They skip the reflection, the rest and the respite.
• 27:08
  Speaker 2: It's just always fall down, get back up, go.
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: Fall down, get back up, go.
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: And that is exhausting.
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: So that's the part that we don't want to glorify or say keep going and getting.
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: You know, you got to learn from it, you got to figure out, kind of, and sometimes you learn things that you apply something to learn, maybe things that help you choose differently or choose in a different way, or maybe that's even a larger learning of like.
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: No, this isn't for me.
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely.
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: And what I often invite teams and executives to do, especially when they're had that concern about their teams feeling that change fatigue is to have time for employees to take a day off and have that day be that day of reflection where the employee is getting time to rest.
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: But also they're thinking about, over the past several weeks, as they've worked through this big initiative, what have they learned?
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: What have they learned that they think could help the team, that they think could help the organization?
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: So then, when they come back, not only are they refreshed, but they also have this list of all these learnings that they want to share with the team so that they can sidestep mistakes, so that the team can be better, and so it becomes this very productive way to pour into the individuals as well as to continue to nurture the team and celebrate learning right and make that a part of the culture.
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: Right, you've done so much with organizations and helping them.
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: You know, like you said, mergers, transitions, you know change in leadership, those sorts of things, and now you're moving to a place where you're helping individuals and I love to hear you talk a little bit about taking some of these tools that have helped major Fortune 500 organizations create the change that they need, and how can I use it?
• 28:43
  Speaker 2: organizations create the change that they need, and how can I use it, little old me in my world as an individual?
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so I will say that all of the work that we do, the mindset and the skill set, it's all focused on the individual.
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: Okay, right, so when you go through our flagship change growth accelerator, it's about pouring into you.
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: It's about understanding those narratives you're telling yourself.
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: It's about understanding your behaviors and shifting that behavior change.
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: I don't think macroscopic change can happen in an organization without microscopic change happening first, and that's what happens in hearts and minds of individuals.
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: So it's all focused at the individual.
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: But up until this point, all of our offerings have been made available through more B2B transactions, right, so we partner with big organizations.
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: They're going through a big change initiative, they're growing really quickly, or they just know change is constant.
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: So I want this to be a part of my core L&D let's make a change, enthusiasm pillar.
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: Get all my teams and all my workforce trained on all of this.
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: Okay, and so what we're doing now is it's so important to me to have accessibility to this knowledge and even though you might not be an individual working in one of these large corporations that we work with, I still want you to be able to get certified to be a change enthusiasm practitioner, and so in the back half of the year, we're actually opening up our change growth accelerator virtual product to the masses, to the public, and we're going to start with a monthly offering.
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: There'll be 20 seats every month and actually we'll provide some information, I'm sure in the podcast episode, but there's right now to get signed up.
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: But I really want this information, this content, to be accessible to everyone, regardless if you're working in a big corporation or not.
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: So it's going to be very, very reasonably priced.
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: Really, it's about getting the goods.
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: It's about enabling you to practice this stuff.
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: You know in your day to day whether it's something you want to bring back home, maybe something you want to practice in a relationship, practice with family, because we're talking about the intersection of change and emotion, right, and that exists regardless of if you're at work or not, or if it's something that you want to bring back into your work so that you can be better at navigating change into your work so that you can be better at navigating change.
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: Fabulous, yeah.
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: So all the information is down in the episode notes for that.
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: One of the things you talk about when we're making individual, like I love how you just said you can't have macroscopic change unless you have microscopic change within the individuals, within a system, within an organization.
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: You talk about choice being a conscious choice and specifically in within disruptive times that happen regularly now and so or maybe they always have, I don't know Sometimes it feels more disruptive than others on certain days.
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: Like how does one really make that conscious choice versus maybe you know what's an unconscious choice, like you know where we're just kind of going with the flow or we're just not really choosing it, we're just dealing with it or accepting it.
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, a conscious choice for me is that you're recognizing the moment that you're in and you've explored the options that are sitting in front of you.
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: You're aware of the emotions that are coloring, or that's painting, the current situation and you've thought about okay, what are the options that I have in front of me?
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: And that's why signal opportunity, choice, that second step, the opportunity.
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: That's why it's about understanding the options and that's where the consciousness comes in.
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: It's not a knee-jerk reaction, it's not just doing things the way that you've always done them, it's not in the subconscious kind of just repetitive nature.
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: This is the way I do things, this is the way I'm gonna do it, it's sitting above that, right, it's about metacognition and understanding.
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: Okay, I'm in this moment of opportunity, what options do I have?
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: I could do this, I could do that.
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: You know what?
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: In fact, let me go talk to a peer, let me talk to a mentor and let them, you know, kind of poke some holes in where I'm thinking about my options or lying, and then, once you understand what they are, then you make that choice.
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: And I know that we don't always have the time to sit and go through a perspectives wheel, which is what we use at Change, enthusiasm, global or options analysis before we make our choices.
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: But the more that we can at least allow our emotions to invite us into a more conscious awareness of what's in front of us, what's happening within our bodies and what's happening outside of us, the choices that we do choose to make in the moment will become more conscious, as opposed to just going through the motions or reacting as fear, acting as anger, acting as frustration.
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: So, if anything, if you can get the first step right, where you're acknowledging the emotion, you know that it's there, and then you're having that metacognition right, separating your conscious thought from that emotional energy, that's going to put you in a much better position to begin with.
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: Got it Okay, wonderful.
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: As we close out, a lot of my listeners are leaders, so they're leaders of change.
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: They're leaders of groups of individuals.
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: What is it that a leader does differently when it comes to change versus someone who doesn't have, like, the direct reports or the responsibilities of you know a division or a group of you know KPIs or whatever it may be?
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: Are there certain things that a leader has to do differently when it comes to change?
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so, and I feel that you can lead from wherever you sit.
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: You don't even have to have direct reports, right A?
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: leader just has the power to influence someone to follow.
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think you know what we have discovered in our research is that leaders who are exceptional at change are those that carry a strong sense of empathy, those that will allow individuals to emote, to share that emotional energy and then have the ability to put them into their seat of choice, empowering them to navigate their opportunity and then choosing how they're going to move the needle of their emotional energy, understanding that they can't control the emotions of that individual, but they can allow them to flow.
• 34:07
  Speaker 2: They can invite them into their own opportunity and then ask what does support look like for me as you're making that choice to maximize the opportunity that you're sitting in?
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: I think leaders also understand the power of communication.
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: We tested a lot of different strategies to help employees navigate more difficult emotions of change.
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: At least for the US, the number one most effective strategy is regular and clear communication on the status of the progress of the change, and so I think really exceptional leaders understand the power of that communication and they will tell you, even when they don't have any new information to share.
• 34:42
  Speaker 2: They'll tell you that Nothing has changed since last week.
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: Here's what I still know, and this is what I can share with you.
• 34:48
  Speaker 2: Trust, as soon as I find out something different, I'm going to let you know that I'm able to share.
• 34:53
  Speaker 2: And so they understand the power of that communication.
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: They flex it often, and then the other thing is just the sense of curiosity, right, the sense of curiosity and a lot of that has to play in resistance, right, when they sense employees that might be resistant to change or peers getting curious.
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: What's driving that resistance?
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: And what we've discovered is usually rooted in fear, whether that be fear of getting outside of a comfort zone, fear of making a mistake, falling down, not knowing what they're doing, getting curious about.
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: If it's based in perception, this is what I think is going to happen or reality.
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: You know, we tried this and we failed, and this is why, regardless, you can work to debunk the perceptions.
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: This is how this is the reality.
• 35:32
  Speaker 2: Let me inform you so that you can debunk those perceptions.
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: Or this is how today is different than that reality that you experienced those years ago, and I actually need your help to make sure that we sidestep those mistakes that were made in the past and enroll those who are feeling resistant.
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: So I think leaders who are exceptional at change, know how to harness the power of that emotional energy.
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: Harness the power of the divine energy that their employees bring to the table to move a change initiative forward.
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: And it takes practice.
• 36:02
  Speaker 2: It certainly takes practice.
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: Wonderful, thank you for that.
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: As we close out and just kind of giving someone some advice.
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: So if someone's kind of at that crossroad of courage and authenticity, you know going back to where we started, and they're ready, they know they need to take a bold move, make a bold step, quietly or out loud, what's your guidance to them?
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: What would be your advice?
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: Like Cassandra, like I really feel like something's got to give.
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: I just can't do X anymore or just doesn't feel like it should.
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: What would be your guidance?
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: I would say I would give them the guidance that I give myself, and it's what I write at the start of every one of my journals.
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: I write out 10 intentions and one of them is, if I hear it three times or more, to listen and respond.
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: If you're hearing that intuition, if you're hearing that voice telling you something's got to give, I got to do something differently, and you're hearing it three times or more, just on repeat, trust you're hearing it for a reason and get curious and explore it and understand what is that next step that you can take in exploring that curiosity?
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: Just know that you're hearing it.
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: You're feeling the tension, you're feeling those emotional cues and those signals for a reason.
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: That's divinity surging through you, that is your infinite wisdom tapping you, telling you yo, there's something different.
• 37:25
  Speaker 2: That I want to, I want to pull you this way and just take the next step, take the baby step and just trust and know that.
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: If you're hearing it you're hearing it for a reason and you have infinite wisdom running through you and don't mute it.
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: Don't mute your infinite wisdom.
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: I'm telling you, man that's how we're going to end it today.
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: Do not mute your infinite wisdom for sure.
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Thank you so much for being on the Bold Lounge.
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: All inspiration giveaways, free stuff.
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: Follow Cassandra, learn about her book and her program that she spoke about in the episode notes.
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for joining us in the lounge my pleasure.
• 37:59
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much.
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: And thank you to all your listeners.
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: Incredible, incredible Thank you for listening to the Bold Lounge podcast.
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: Through the continuum of bold stories vulnerability to taking a leap you will meet more extraordinary people making a positive impact for others through their unique and important story.
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: By highlighting these stories, we hope to inspire others and share the journey of those with a bold mindset.
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: We hope you've enjoyed this podcast and look forward to sharing the next bold journey with you.